00:00:42 -!- orneryostrich has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:00:51 -!- Nightbeer has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:00:58 -!- lobf has joined ##crawl-dev 00:02:18 what if talons were venomous 00:03:12 brutal te^TSO nerfs? also kind of collides with naga tail spikes, but those don't really exist 00:03:25 could work 00:03:34 fine, make them electrified instead 00:03:38 ! 00:03:40 -!- Siegurt has joined ##crawl-dev 00:03:43 that fits the +3 air apt on tengu too! 00:06:59 -!- Twiggytwiggytwig has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:10:53 Unstable branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.16-a0-4074-gf2895d3 (34) 00:12:21 PleasingFungus: A - a scroll labeled KLIT ULLUA 00:12:42 rude...? 00:13:01 <|amethyst> DUNEJY RUDE 00:16:51 there are two parameters to make_name that are only used in one place (the same place for both). can you guess where??? 00:19:09 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.16-a0-4074-gf2895d3 (34) 00:21:28 -!- simmarine has joined ##crawl-dev 00:24:07 hm, the longest jiyva name I can generate is Jerghoburgh (or Jukhlokyrgh, or etc - either way, 11 characters) 00:24:13 it's supposed to be limited to 8 00:24:14 oops 00:24:15 -!- Menche has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:25:42 you can generate Jiyva Jiyva can't you 00:25:54 in principle 00:26:12 yep 00:26:25 quite a few show up, grepping through this just now 00:26:36 a true uniq pro would be able to tell you the odds 00:27:39 update: you have somewhere around a 0.0017% chance of serving Jiyva Jiyva in any given game 00:27:42 good 00:28:33 ~0.0125% chance of serving Jiyva Jiyvaec or Jiyva Jiyvahaph or something like that 00:36:36 <|amethyst> now I'm going to have to check ?/g every single game so I don't miss one 00:36:43 <|amethyst> !gamesbg . 00:36:48 <|amethyst> !gamesby . 00:36:49 |amethyst has played 10337 games, between 2011-08-10 11:04:55 and 2015-02-21 03:23:18, won 2 (0.0%), high score 1318561, total score 22982104, total turns 27618944, play-time/day 1:13:43, total time 66d+3:22:24. 00:37:18 <|amethyst> there's a good chance I had a game with "Jiyva Jiyvafoo" already and just never saw it 00:37:53 about a 15% chance 00:37:55 looks like 00:38:07 oh no that's for jiyva 00:38:14 oh interesting, didn't know it appeared in ?/g 00:38:16 thought you had to worship 00:38:25 for jivyafoo it's... closer to 70% 00:38:31 for you 00:38:34 i just found Jiyfa by downloading a shitload of morgues 00:38:41 heh 00:38:56 (this is also how I filled fuk_da_sac) 00:39:03 (well, in that case it was lsts) 00:39:27 I still can't believe I found ??crawlingbirds 00:39:46 ??crawlingbirds 00:39:47 crawlingbirds[1/1]: !lg crawlingbirds tehu 2 -tv:T42000 00:39:52 !lg crawlingbirds tehu 2 -tv:T42000 00:39:52 2/3. crawlingbirds, XL27 TeHu, T:86589 requested for FooTV: telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org. 00:40:07 !lg crawlingbirds tehu 2 00:40:08 2/3. crawlingbirds the Crack Shot (L27 TeHu of Okawaru), escaped with the Orb and 3 runes on 2012-10-26 02:00:51, with 1546227 points after 86589 turns and 6:35:54. 00:40:22 !gamesby crawlingbirds 00:40:23 crawlingbirds has played 975 games, between 2011-07-28 23:26:40 and 2014-05-03 23:09:12, won 5 (0.5%), high score 6368811, total score 19833513, total turns 5354133, play-time/day 0:21:11, total time 14d+20:56:29. 00:40:26 huh 00:41:15 minmay: !!! 00:41:22 it downloaded 00:41:25 just fyi 00:41:48 no I saw 00:41:50 the artefact name 00:42:36 I missed it 00:42:58 <|amethyst> !lg crawlingbirds tehu 2 -tv:T42000 00:42:59 2/3. crawlingbirds, XL27 TeHu, T:86589 requested for FooTV: telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org. 00:43:52 what I love about this tv is how you can *feel* the player's reaction to it 00:44:22 heh 00:44:23 It's very good. 00:44:29 Okay, then. 00:44:47 completely juvenile but i found it really funny for some reason 00:46:06 -!- Siegurt has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 00:46:20 so do we have any ideas for talons yet 00:46:30 not actually convinced that the venom thing is a bad idea 00:46:43 people would probably insist that you add this to monster tengu, I guess 00:46:48 -!- gammafunk has quit [Quit: leaving] 00:46:50 which seems needlessly complicated 00:47:05 i can think of an easy solution to that! 00:47:10 nooo 00:47:16 tengu reavers are neat 00:47:22 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 00:47:26 that reminds me, why do monster ghouls have rot 00:47:34 verisimillitude 00:47:37 (or generate, but especially why do they have rot) 00:48:07 I wonder if the right solution there is the komodo dragon approach 00:48:38 player ghouls don't have rot and it makes no sense as a melee effect 00:49:20 ya agreedf 00:52:07 really my concern with venom/elec talons is that it may be too similar to ignoring AC 00:52:52 Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.16-a0-4074-gf2895d3 00:53:14 <|amethyst> what about appendage vs spider form? 00:53:18 venom feels like it'd play differently 00:53:24 oh, good point 00:53:26 hm 00:53:28 wait 00:53:45 ok, ya, talons are still in appendage 00:53:52 I always forget which one got removed 00:54:10 <|amethyst> could change it to hooves I suppose 00:54:28 could just make Ds talons different from regular talons 00:54:48 <|amethyst> could not give Ds talons at all 00:54:55 see, that's what he suggested to begin with! 00:54:56 that was my other suggestion yes 00:55:25 (or not give them hooves at all, horns are closer to talons than they are to hooves) 00:56:23 <|amethyst> http://i243.photobucket.com/albums/ff282/ellyanele/flanders_devil-710998.png 00:56:54 what about merging the two 00:57:04 their left foot turns into a hoof and their right foot turns into talons 00:57:51 ! 00:58:00 this is the innovation that crawl needs... 00:59:03 -!- Umbreoni is now known as FaMott 01:01:37 -!- orneryostrich has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 01:03:34 -!- ProzacElf has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 01:09:16 -!- lobf has quit [Quit: lobf] 01:10:35 -!- ProzacElf has joined ##crawl-dev 01:13:10 -!- Xenobreeder has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 01:14:22 -!- Brannock_ has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 01:15:30 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: CADENZA-CLASS CLOCKWORK KNIGHT--OPERATION TERMINATED] 01:16:23 the Ereshkigal tile is very cool 01:17:43 -!- NilsBloodaxe has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 01:23:13 -!- PleasingFungus has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:24:47 -!- PleasingFungus has joined ##crawl-dev 01:41:33 -!- UncertainKitten has quit [Quit: Connection reset by pier.] 01:42:56 exclusions interact badly with water now 01:43:03 they make it look the same as lava 01:43:11 (in console) 01:44:19 also, my sun demon being constricted should not prevent autofight 01:44:32 what 01:44:55 stupid awful demonic guardian makes a sun demon -> sun demon gets constricted by anaconda -> autofight can't swap with sun demon -> autofight won't work 01:45:13 Your sun demon is being constricted! 01:45:13 Your sun demon is being constricted! 01:45:13 Your sun demon is being constricted! 01:45:13 Your sun demon is being constricted! 01:45:21 o 01:45:23 nice 01:45:43 probably this is not actually worth fixing, but i would expect it to treat the unmovable ally as a wall 01:45:50 not fail 01:46:39 sure 02:00:22 -!- PleasingFungus has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:01:33 -!- CcS has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 02:01:56 -!- CacoS has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 02:02:00 -!- orneryostrich has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:10:20 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 02:10:53 -!- FaMott has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 02:14:14 -!- lordseanington has quit [Client Quit] 02:19:26 -!- bitcoinbastard has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 02:21:49 Unstable branch on crawl.beRotato.org updated to: 0.16-a0-4074-gf2895d3 (34) 02:22:22 -!- WalrusKing_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:22:57 FR: allies do not open doors 02:23:13 i just shut a door on a storm dragon with like 10 hp and my demonic guardian opened it again 02:24:37 -!- KurzedMetal has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:24:43 like, honestly, when would you ever want an allied monster to open a door 02:41:04 -!- heteroy has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:41:19 -!- link_108 has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 02:46:34 -!- indspenceable has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:55:22 -!- NilsBloodaxe has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 02:55:33 -!- worldfamousw has quit [Quit: Page closed] 02:56:01 -!- indspenceable has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:58:14 -!- simmarine has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:02:22 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 03:05:31 -!- raskol has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 03:06:41 -!- tabstorm has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 03:09:01 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 03:40:31 -!- moocowpong1 has quit [Quit: moocowpong1] 03:41:55 -!- testingle has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 03:49:26 -!- bitcoinbastard_ has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 03:56:09 -!- Twiggytwiggytwig has quit [Quit: See ya guys later ;)] 04:00:49 -!- indspenceable has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 04:06:46 -!- amalloy is now known as amalloy_ 04:13:35 -!- heteroy has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 04:20:16 -!- orneryostrich has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:25:26 -!- siepu has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:28:18 -!- domiryuu has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:33:18 -!- Bloax has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:33:39 -!- Bloax has joined ##crawl-dev 04:34:43 -!- Tux[Qyou] has joined ##crawl-dev 04:53:58 -!- Wolfechu has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 05:03:18 -!- ketsa has joined ##crawl-dev 05:03:48 -!- dpeg has joined ##crawl-dev 05:07:22 Trying to remove jewellery with melded ring on the macabre finger necklace crashes the game 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=9497 by nagdon 05:07:55 -!- tstbtto has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 05:18:32 -!- ProzacElf has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 05:25:29 -!- orneryostrich has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 05:29:04 -!- Patashu has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 05:32:19 -!- bitcoinbastard has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 05:33:42 -!- caleba has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:40:28 -!- dididi has joined ##crawl-dev 05:40:41 -!- radinms has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 05:40:42 -!- dididi has quit [Client Quit] 05:41:54 -!- dididi has joined ##crawl-dev 05:42:20 -!- caleba has quit [Client Quit] 06:00:14 -!- Aryth has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 06:02:58 -!- MDvedh has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 06:09:01 -!- heteroy has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 06:09:02 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:23:22 -!- motorbit has quit [Quit: Page closed] 06:23:52 -!- st_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:24:28 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 06:26:09 -!- orneryostrich has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 06:36:45 BONGHITZ (L13 SpAs) ASSERT(_valid()) in 'ray.cc' at line 194 failed. (Lab) 06:38:07 -!- edlothiol has joined ##crawl-dev 06:44:58 -!- Twiggytwiggytwig has quit [Quit: See ya guys later ;)] 06:45:37 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 07:07:44 -!- dididi has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 07:08:52 -!- eb has quit [Quit: I quit] 07:19:34 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:22:29 -!- elliptic has quit [Quit: Leaving] 07:24:11 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 07:26:49 -!- orneryostrich has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 07:45:13 -!- Lasty has joined ##crawl-dev 07:49:43 -!- MDvedh has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 08:03:56 -!- Amnesthesia is now known as Unicore 08:04:47 -!- alefury has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:11:57 -!- mauris has joined ##crawl-dev 08:14:42 -!- FlowRiser has joined ##crawl-dev 08:25:23 -!- ClawlessVictory has quit [Quit: Page closed] 08:28:13 -!- orneryostrich has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 08:28:44 -!- FlowRiser has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:32:16 -!- Bcadren has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 08:33:58 Nago asks on the forum whether it (still) makes sense that Dr and Op can get Str on random level-ups. 08:37:16 remove it and give both 1 base str (ignoring class bonuses/penalties) 08:37:19 clearly everyone is happy that way 08:42:36 dpeg: Str still isn't useless for them (it increases melee damage) so it seems fine to me 08:43:04 we don't need every species to get the "optimal" str/int/dex selection 08:45:15 also, I think str actually does something nontrivial to help Op constriction? I forget how constriction works exactly 08:45:54 and str becomes more useful for Dr who are using dragonform, not that people really do that much 08:47:33 ok, thx! 08:58:33 -!- dididi has joined ##crawl-dev 08:59:28 str helps all aux attacks trigger (at the same rate as dex) and, IIRC, significantly improves constriction damage 09:00:10 !next 09:00:15 The RNG decrees that Lasty shall win OpFE next. 09:28:35 -!- orneryostrich has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 09:32:00 -!- Lasty has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 09:33:32 <|amethyst> rkd2003 again suggesting a simple improvement to the Android version 09:33:54 <|amethyst> just replace all the dungeon view with tiles 09:34:45 <|amethyst> I guess that would be webtiles 09:36:04 -!- Brannock_ has joined ##crawl-dev 09:36:47 -!- elliptic has quit [Quit: Leaving] 09:38:06 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 09:39:50 -!- rast has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.91.1 [Firefox 34.0.5/20141126041045]] 09:40:01 -!- ldf has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 09:42:56 -!- Lasty has joined ##crawl-dev 09:44:43 -!- Lasty has quit [Client Quit] 09:48:59 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 09:51:25 -!- radinms has quit [] 09:54:08 -!- hong has joined ##crawl-dev 09:54:17 hello 09:54:36 -!- Crehl has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 09:55:07 i have some problem. please help me 09:55:47 -!- PleasingFungus has joined ##crawl-dev 09:56:10 my webtile server surfer from lag 09:56:29 how to check why this lag happend? 09:57:49 <|amethyst> is everyone lagging or just some people? 09:59:00 <|amethyst> and is it constant lag, or does it come and go? 10:00:28 i think this lagging is about everyone 10:01:23 come and go but it often caused 10:01:51 <|amethyst> hm... it doesn't seem any laggier for me than, say, CPO... but I'm halfway around the world so part of that is the speed of light 10:02:10 and server user num is just ten 10:02:22 -!- Voker57 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:02:28 <|amethyst> when you ping the server, what reply time do you get? 10:02:50 10 ms 10:03:00 <|amethyst> and you have lag yourself? 10:03:07 yes 10:03:36 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 10:03:45 -!- lobf has joined ##crawl-dev 10:04:04 <|amethyst> hm... I'd suggest looking at 'top' and 'iotop' to see if anything is using a lot of CPU or disk bandwidth 10:04:07 this lag happened about 2~5sec 10:04:32 input and output was stoped 10:04:55 i checked cpu and ram usage but 10:05:04 how to check disk bandwidth? 10:05:08 <|amethyst> iotop 10:05:14 <|amethyst> which you might need to install if you don't have it 10:05:32 <|amethyst> you could also look at 'nethogs' for network usage 10:06:41 thank. i just do it and report you 10:07:24 <|amethyst> how much ram and CPU does the server have? 10:09:23 ram is 500mb 10:09:46 cpu i don't know. just minute 10:09:52 <|amethyst> 500mb is kind of low 10:10:15 <|amethyst> what does 'free' say about your memory usage and swap? 10:10:16 how much it neccessary? 10:10:44 depends on the number of users 10:11:08 <|amethyst> each copy of crawl takes anywhere from 15-60 MB on CSZO 10:11:21 <|amethyst> and the webtiles server itself is taking 122 MB 10:11:21 memory usage is just 30percent in my server when this lag happend 10:12:19 <|amethyst> if it's a burst of lag, you might also look in the webtiles logs 10:12:32 <|amethyst> to see if anything notable happened there 10:12:52 <|amethyst> though most likely you'll just see "IOLoop frozen for 500 ms" or something like that 10:13:00 <|amethyst> which isn't terribly informative 10:13:13 <|amethyst> do you have any cron jobs on the server? 10:13:29 <|amethyst> compressing ttyrec, tabulating scores, etc? 10:13:40 just one cron job 10:13:49 ttyrec compressing is manually 10:14:27 this cron job was trunk update once a day 10:14:40 <|amethyst> was that running when you had the lag? 10:15:22 when this job working webtile server was shuting down 10:15:31 <|amethyst> hm 10:16:17 -!- moocowpong1 has joined ##crawl-dev 10:17:20 because i ask this problem. i think no reason of lag. top (mem and cpu) was ok and not another job but lag is happend 10:20:57 thank. i'll check some logs and this util (nethogs and iotop) 10:21:48 i need to time for how to use this tools 10:23:15 -!- rast has joined ##crawl-dev 10:23:44 <|amethyst> all I can think is to have them open all the time and look at them when you notice lag 10:24:01 <|amethyst> but of course top takes a fair amount of CPU so that might be counterproductive unless you lower its refresh rate 10:24:57 <|amethyst> that's how I traced down CAO's persistent lag to running ttyrec compression + scores daemon + updates at the same time 10:25:29 <|amethyst> (then I used nice and ionice on those jobs, and made scores daemon not autocommit every database operation 10:25:32 <|amethyst> ) 10:29:15 -!- orneryostrich has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 10:34:29 thank. i think you are right. i will check it 10:38:10 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 10:38:43 -!- magicpoints has quit [] 10:41:06 -!- edlothiol has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:43:51 -!- lobf has quit [Quit: lobf] 10:44:51 -!- PleasingFungus has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 10:44:52 -!- raskol has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 10:45:05 -!- edlothiol has joined ##crawl-dev 10:45:59 -!- Nerem has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 10:49:02 -!- heteroy has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:00:37 -!- indspenceable has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 11:09:18 -!- lobf has joined ##crawl-dev 11:11:07 -!- debo has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:13:23 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 11:17:18 -!- lobf has quit [Quit: lobf] 11:19:34 -!- Lasty has joined ##crawl-dev 11:19:51 -!- toofou has quit [Quit: Page closed] 11:22:49 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 11:23:40 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.16-a0-4074-gf2895d3 (34) 11:27:19 -!- scummos__ has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:30:26 -!- orneryostrich has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 11:30:53 -!- ProzacElf has joined ##crawl-dev 11:33:52 active trunk branch doesnt display quivered ammo 11:34:29 <|amethyst> UbAh: could you provide more details? 11:34:30 <|amethyst> it does here 11:35:17 getting more details 11:35:20 <|amethyst> !lg ubah x=src,tiles 11:35:20 547. [src=cao;tiles=true] crawlingdrunk the Thaumaturge (L11 DEWz of Sif Muna), slain by a blue devil in IceCv (ice_cave_tombish) on 2015-02-21 04:24:42, with 11399 points after 18768 turns and 2:35:42. 11:35:27 hmm if I watch it i see the quiver 11:36:04 <|amethyst> hm 11:36:13 ok my it shows now 11:36:19 it may have been my browser 11:36:20 <|amethyst> Any javascript errors? 11:36:23 none 11:36:58 <|amethyst> hm 11:37:12 the act of loading it in another window as a spectator and then going back to the play window was enough to fix it 11:37:20 so it may have been a browser issue 11:41:41 -!- PleasingFungus has joined ##crawl-dev 11:49:44 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 11:50:15 -!- SwissStopwatch has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 11:50:22 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: CADENZA-CLASS CLOCKWORK KNIGHT--OPERATION TERMINATED] 11:53:01 -!- lobf has joined ##crawl-dev 11:53:21 -!- gammafunk has joined ##crawl-dev 11:55:12 -!- xen has quit [Quit: Page closed] 11:57:19 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:02:43 !kw recent 12:02:44 Keyword: recent => cv>=0.14 12:04:16 -!- Guest49820 is now known as SwissStopwatch 12:11:02 -!- indspenceable has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 12:14:26 You kill the shadow dragon! 12:14:26 Trog accepts your kill. 12:14:26 The buggy draconian knight returns to its original shape as it dies. 12:14:37 !blame wheals 12:14:37 I pronounce wheals... Guilty! 12:14:49 also, !blame whoever implemented the draconian class system 12:14:53 because man, what a mess 12:15:23 -!- Siegurt has joined ##crawl-dev 12:17:00 it was me, I'm so sorry 12:18:08 !firestorm gammafunk 12:18:09 PleasingFungus points at gammafunk and mumbles some strange words. A raging storm of fire appears! The great blast of fire engulfs gammafunk! 12:18:36 * gammafunk stand defiantly in death's doorway! 12:18:50 -!- dpeg has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 12:19:52 ok so I crashed with morgue file while trying to save 12:20:00 now I am stuck at loading 12:20:16 not sure how to give you good info from this 12:20:39 local or online? 12:20:45 webtiles 12:21:00 <|amethyst> http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/ubah/crash-ubah-20140218-215942.txt 12:21:04 it was running ass slow for inputs so I decided to save and reload chromium 12:21:05 <|amethyst> http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/ubah/crash-recursive-ubah-20140218-215942.txt 12:21:19 dang 12:21:35 it was only a green draconian anyway 12:21:39 a crash while saving sounds like a potentially corrupted save? 12:21:51 <|amethyst> the crash is in get_cell_glyph -> real_colour 12:21:58 <|amethyst> err 12:22:00 <|amethyst> the recursive one 12:22:27 does that give you guys enough to work with? 12:22:29 aren't those crashes old? 12:22:31 <|amethyst> the original crash is in libc, let me see if I can get more details 12:22:38 <|amethyst> oh 12:22:39 <|amethyst> right 12:22:48 <|amethyst> those are february of *last* year 12:22:56 <|amethyst> http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/ubah/crash--20150108-164554.txt 12:23:09 that is also old, no? 12:23:28 <|amethyst> yeah, a month + 12:23:58 I don't see any recent crash files, just ttyrecs 12:24:01 <|amethyst> that one from a month ago looked like a corrupted des cache 12:24:04 would it be useful to just grab his save? 12:24:09 timestamp is the creation time of the file? 12:24:11 since ongoing issues 12:24:56 my save file might be even more fucked, I tried loading and converting it which has me stuck in the loading screen 12:25:14 but my trying to convert it may have changed it from the original crash, unsure 12:25:27 <|amethyst> http://crawl.akrasiac.org/saves/ubah.cs 12:25:40 <|amethyst> loads fine for me locally 12:26:13 <|amethyst> and I can see ubah's game in webtiles 12:26:21 <|amethyst> on D:5, not the loading screen 12:26:34 so maybe it is my browser after all? 12:26:41 <|amethyst> what browser and version are you using? 12:26:45 sounds like some browserside issue probably then? he did say it was running ass slow for inputs so I decided to save and reload chromium 12:26:55 old ass version of chromium 12:27:04 <|amethyst> try a newer ass version of chromium :) 12:27:13 18.0.1025.151 (Developer Build 130497 Linux) Built on Ubuntu 11.04, running on LinuxMint 11 12:27:21 hehe yeah I need to update 12:27:22 <|amethyst> elliptic: and earlier it wasn't showing the quiver but then did when he connected as a watcher 12:27:28 just been being a lazy ass 12:27:47 yeah, same char 12:29:58 ok so if we think its my browser I will move on about my day 12:30:16 -!- ayayaya has joined ##crawl-dev 12:30:19 but if my crash is helpful and you want more info let me know 12:30:22 cribozai (L20 DgTm) ASSERT(agent()) in 'beam.cc' at line 866 failed. (Elf:1) 12:30:35 -!- orneryostrich has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 12:34:09 <|amethyst> !crashlog cribozai 12:34:09 1. cribozai, XL20 DgTm, T:65167 (milestone): http://crawl.lantea.net/crawl/morgue/cribozai/crash-cribozai-20150221-183021.txt 12:35:34 <|amethyst> hm... I'm not sure how reducing the weight of confuse in 68d9c7ee helps? 12:35:57 If Lasty gets on, let him know I said this: I cleared cocytus and dis without fully exploring the level without wuln penance, but when I cleared gehenna, wuln did not want me to go upstairs even after I got the rune 12:36:09 <|amethyst> Wasn't it that, before, 2/3 of fauns would cast corona + slow and 1/3 would cast corona + confuse with the same frequency? 12:36:18 also, had no issues with wuln penance in clearing tomb 12:36:27 -!- Tuxedo[Qyou] has joined ##crawl-dev 12:36:37 %git 68d9c7ee 12:36:37 07MarvinPA02 * 0.16-a0-4071-g68d9c7e: Remove a duplicate faun spellbook (elliptic) 10(19 hours ago, 2 files, 2+ 9-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=68d9c7ee49a6 12:36:39 <|amethyst> and now 1/2 cast corona + slow and 1/2 cast corona + confuse but prefer corona 12:36:52 <|amethyst> s/prefer corona/cast confuse less/ 12:37:15 |amethyst: I don't know about the code but prior to that commit xv on faun showed two duplicate spellbook options 12:37:27 so it was intended to address that 12:37:36 <|amethyst> I guess fauns are pack monsters? 12:37:49 ya 12:37:50 i didn't really bother trying to keep the weights the same as the current state 12:37:51 <|amethyst> so you can average over all the fauns 12:38:00 <|amethyst> I guess that's not so unreasonable then 12:38:06 summa(faun) 12:39:53 <|amethyst> that cribozai crash was a DECj monster killing itself then starting a fire with the same lbolt 12:40:10 -!- Tux[Qyou] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 12:41:00 <|amethyst> not sure what to do there, other than attribute the cloud to nobody 12:42:07 <|amethyst> place_cloud does seem to accept a null agent 12:42:15 -!- WalkerBoh has joined ##crawl-dev 12:42:28 <|amethyst> which results in KC_OTHER KILL_MISC MID_NOBODY 12:42:44 <|amethyst> while a hostile monster's fire would be KC_OTHER KILL_MON_MISSILE 12:43:32 <|amethyst> I guess the result would be wrong if the monster was friendly 12:44:09 <|amethyst> which would matter for qazlites 12:44:15 Tab for a Viable [race] or Viable [background] does not guarantee a viable character. 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=9498 by dornbeast 12:44:18 <|amethyst> but that seems kind of minor 12:45:35 -!- scummos__ has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 12:46:37 -!- lobf has quit [Quit: lobf] 12:49:24 -!- simmarine has joined ##crawl-dev 12:53:14 -!- dididi has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 12:56:25 <|amethyst> for 9498, the "correct" fix would be to remember the order in which they were specified 12:56:50 <|amethyst> however, there is a simpler fix that is right in most cases 12:57:01 heh 12:57:24 <|amethyst> namely, when repeating with Tab a "viable foo" selection, always do the "foo" before the "viable" 12:57:40 <|amethyst> it's not quite right if the player selected viable race, then a background 12:57:43 -!- Zooty has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 12:57:48 <|amethyst> since that was really "random race" 13:07:46 -!- Twiggytwiggytwig has quit [Quit: See ya guys later ;)] 13:08:17 -!- UncertainKitten has joined ##crawl-dev 13:10:38 -!- ophanim has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:10:53 -!- Ladykiller69 has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 13:12:55 -!- mauris has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:13:03 -!- namad7 has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 13:13:07 -!- mauris has joined ##crawl-dev 13:14:52 -!- mauris has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:15:58 <|amethyst> oh, actually 13:16:12 <|amethyst> that "not quite right" case doesn't happen 13:16:23 <|amethyst> because if you pick "viable" first, it remembers it as "random" not "viable" 13:16:24 <|amethyst> yay 13:17:53 -!- ayayaya has quit [Quit: Page closed] 13:19:06 03|amethyst02 07* 0.16-a0-4075-ga6383f7: Give the correct corpse for polymorphed dracos/DS (PF) 10(45 minutes ago, 1 file, 4+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=a6383f7c2229 13:19:06 03|amethyst02 07* 0.16-a0-4076-g03ff99e: Don't assert when a monster kills itself then starts a fire. 10(31 minutes ago, 1 file, 0+ 2-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=03ff99eb9403 13:19:06 03|amethyst02 07* 0.16-a0-4077-gd9f8f63: Repeat viable selections more correctly (#9498) 10(15 minutes ago, 1 file, 8+ 2-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=d9f8f63faa0b 13:19:28 er 13:19:35 the draco/ds thing was minmay 13:19:41 <|amethyst> oh 13:19:50 I just made extremely witty jokes about it 13:20:03 <|amethyst> minmay: doh, sorry 13:20:07 -!- mauris has joined ##crawl-dev 13:20:36 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: you can make up for it by crediting (minmay) the next time you would credit me 13:20:44 the cycle of misattributions...! 13:21:19 <|amethyst> yeah, the problem is then minmay would have to make a commit that credits me when it should credit you 13:21:25 <|amethyst> only then will the cycle be complete 13:22:47 -!- moocowpong1 has quit [Quit: moocowpong1] 13:25:01 so when are we making minmay a dev, anyway??? 13:25:10 He's not?! 13:25:20 <|amethyst> the same day as Chris O 13:25:28 next you'll tell me Chris Oelmueller isn't . . . too alte 13:25:39 /s/alte/late/ 13:25:58 I don't really care about whether I'm credited for hitting a draconian with plutonium sword 13:26:18 -!- Tux[Qyou] has joined ##crawl-dev 13:28:35 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 13:29:01 <|amethyst> actually, maybe in general we shouldn't be using (name) when the person doesn't bother filing a bug report :P 13:29:13 -!- Tuxedo[Qyou] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 13:29:28 <|amethyst> Must create meaningless bureaucratic work! 13:29:53 btw chriso has requested that he not be credited as chriso 13:30:03 -!- Voker57 has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 13:30:17 chrisoelmueller is acceptable but he has requested that we not truncate 13:30:42 <|amethyst> I think it was only you that truncated in commit messages :P 13:30:56 see, that's how I found out! 13:31:36 <|amethyst> well 13:31:41 -!- orneryostrich has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 13:31:42 <|amethyst> I guess I do truncate your nick 13:31:54 -!- bitcoinbastard has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 13:32:01 It's a long nick. 13:32:08 -!- PleasingFungus is now known as PlsFng 13:32:14 <|amethyst> and a short abbreviation! 13:32:20 -!- |amethyst is now known as \a 13:32:24 -!- \a is now known as |amethyst 13:32:28 <|amethyst> oh, that one's registered 13:32:52 I request that I am only credited as "chief justice of the supreme court Lasty" 13:33:28 heretic of the holy order 13:34:24 -!- magipi has quit [Quit: Page closed] 13:39:28 -!- indspenceable has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:40:35 -!- amalloy_ is now known as amalloy 13:42:04 -!- caleba has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:42:57 -!- ProzacElf has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 13:43:30 pf 13:43:43 did the crab content occur? 13:43:50 what is crab content 13:43:54 oh right 13:43:56 -!- PlsFng is now known as PleasingFungus 13:44:03 anyway, what is crab content. 13:45:30 >:I 13:45:39 that which so you promised long ago 13:45:47 some mysterious thing involving crabs 13:45:57 hm 13:46:03 sounds enigmatic 13:46:12 oh I said I would post a dumb macro to the crawl thread 13:46:17 whenever crab chat occurred next 13:46:26 ah 13:47:37 sorry! 13:49:11 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:52:27 -!- Lasty has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 13:52:55 -!- Lasty has joined ##crawl-dev 13:53:11 -!- Lasty has quit [Client Quit] 13:54:46 -!- dididi has joined ##crawl-dev 13:59:13 -!- dididi has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 13:59:19 -!- Phalm has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 14:00:15 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 14:01:07 -!- omnirizon has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 14:01:35 -!- halberd has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 14:01:47 -!- Nightbeer is now known as Steveaccounting 14:01:53 -!- Steveaccounting is now known as AccountingSteve 14:03:33 -!- travis-ci has joined ##crawl-dev 14:03:34 The build was fixed. (master - d9f8f63 #1825 : Neil Moore): http://travis-ci.org/crawl-ref/crawl-ref/builds/51657098 14:03:35 -!- travis-ci has left ##crawl-dev 14:08:10 -!- ophanim has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:16:04 -!- thrig has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:16:05 -!- SegFaultAX has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:16:48 -!- staplegun has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:20:52 -!- bitcoinbastard_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:22:10 -!- Lawman0 has quit [Quit: Page closed] 14:25:55 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 14:26:52 -!- debo has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:32:05 -!- orneryostrich has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 14:35:23 -!- Bloax has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:40:20 lignification should give you some sustenance from the ground 14:40:38 it did originally, sort of 14:40:41 i think every potion should give some small amount of nutrition 14:40:50 ohh must have been during one of my breaks 14:41:04 I know they did way back simmarine 14:41:12 yes, that was a joke :P 14:41:13 but I thought that was removed 14:41:24 it was 14:41:33 possibly my favorite part of that change is that 14:41:35 afterward 14:41:38 ??effo 14:41:38 effo[1/6]: For his first win, he went into hells with no food, got abyssed, ignored a gate, found a rune while starving, drank 13 healing potions for nutrition, and then found a scroll for FOOD ACQUIREMENT. Then went invisible and spooked Asmodeus good. 14:41:45 kb carefully added 40 nutrition back to porridge 14:41:47 I remember sipping fountians for the saltine amount of sustenance at one time 14:42:00 yes, he made sure to not upset porridge balance 14:42:02 because he didn't mean to nerf it!!! 14:42:11 yes i remember fountain quaffing too 14:42:25 rip sparklefountain quaffing 14:42:36 PleasingFungus: you could quaff regular fountains for a very tiny amount of nutrition too! 14:42:39 sparklefountians were fun 14:42:49 simmarine: I know 14:42:51 I played back then 14:47:48 -!- emeraldemon has quit [Quit: emeraldemon] 14:52:18 -!- nicolae- has joined ##crawl-dev 14:55:18 -!- heteroy has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:57:00 -!- theTower has joined ##crawl-dev 14:57:51 -!- theTower has left ##crawl-dev 14:59:14 why might some lua code that checks to see how many atlars a temple was generated with not actually notice how many altars it was generated with 15:00:30 <|amethyst> when it's running at map loading rather than in-game 15:00:52 hm 15:01:16 -!- stevee has quit [Quit: Page closed] 15:02:09 <|amethyst> there's a section in doc/develop/levels/advanced.txt on that general topic, search for "executes" 15:02:13 here's my thing: http://pastebin.com/DXasECSc the conditionals never seem to work, whether i use the numeral as a string (if altar_count == "6") or a numeral (if altar_count == 6) 15:03:47 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 15:04:07 none of the other variable temples have anything like an is_validating check 15:04:53 <|amethyst> nicolae-: what happens if none of those is true? 15:06:19 basically none of the A-R glyphs gets changed and it ends up with an arch, a couple altars, etc. whatever features normally are symbolized by those letters 15:06:52 <|amethyst> I guess nothing broken though 15:06:59 no, it's just a sparse temple 15:07:14 <|amethyst> so what's happening? 15:07:26 <|amethyst> it's generating the wrong version for how many temples there actually are? 15:07:27 i only ever get the broken sparse temple 15:07:43 as if none of the conditionals are matching the value of altar_count 15:08:09 the shopname, which i'm using as a Discount-Version Debug Tool for outputting the value of variables, will display a proper value each time 15:08:45 so altar_count actually has a value, at least when the shop is plopped down 15:09:06 but whether the altar_count is 8 or 9 or 18 the layout doesn't change 15:10:20 should the "Too Many Cooks" randart name be removed now that it looks like it's referencing an internet meme 15:12:17 probably, I guess 15:12:31 do the opposite and reference more internet memes 15:12:45 you see here the +0 long sword for All These Limes 15:12:54 long sword of* 15:13:22 <|amethyst> Donald says, "YOLO" 15:13:41 Natasha meows, "YOLT" 15:13:48 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 15:15:06 -!- Pacra has quit [Client Quit] 15:17:04 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 15:17:43 -!- Siegurt has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:18:27 -!- sanka has quit [Quit: Page closed] 15:18:35 -!- ProzacElf has joined ##crawl-dev 15:20:13 -!- bonghitz has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 15:20:15 PleasingFungus: Your demonic ancestry asserts itself... Your hooves expand and flesh out into feet! Your toenails lengthen and sharpen. 15:20:27 -!- fiddlerwoaroof has quit [Quit: leaving] 15:21:55 hahahaha 15:22:25 what on earth 15:24:44 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 15:26:23 nicolae-: he got hooves as a random mut, but had talons as a demonic mut 15:26:42 ha 15:28:25 -!- Patashu has joined ##crawl-dev 15:29:08 <|amethyst> nicolae-: hm 15:29:19 <|amethyst> nicolae-: looks like subst() doesn't accept commas 15:29:49 -!- Wolfechu has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:30:47 hrm! 15:30:47 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 15:30:56 <|amethyst> likewise nsubst and all the others 15:31:11 -!- MgDark has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.91.1 [Firefox 35.0.1/20150122214805]] 15:31:12 <|amethyst> levcomp.ypp generates one call for each individual specifier 15:31:19 <|amethyst> this means several existing vaults are broken 15:32:31 holy lol 15:32:46 <|amethyst> fheight, ftile, rtile, tile, colour, nsubst, subst, item, mons, chance, weight, subvault 15:33:03 <|amethyst> oh, shuffle too 15:34:08 -!- Patashu has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:34:27 -!- Patashu has joined ##crawl-dev 15:35:47 -!- falu has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.1.1] 15:36:27 -!- tabair has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 15:36:30 well, that doesn't seem to fix this particular problem, good to know though 15:36:36 <|amethyst> oh? 15:36:42 <|amethyst> st_: did you ever have doors appearing in pitsprint where monsters should be? 15:37:33 -!- lobf has joined ##crawl-dev 15:39:18 -!- Siegurt has joined ##crawl-dev 15:39:20 yeah, it's still messing up even separating out the substs, atm i'm trying to figure out what value altar_count has while the conditional is being evaluated 15:40:14 <|amethyst> nicolae-: hm, it works for me when I split them 15:40:40 really? 15:41:11 when you say works, do you just mean it compiles and runs, or that it's putting down the proper number of altars 15:41:23 <|amethyst> the latter 15:41:30 hhhhhhhhhuh 15:41:44 <|amethyst> with == "6" etc 15:42:16 a 15:42:17 ah 15:42:46 aha 15:43:09 i forgot to change my conditions from == 6 to == "6" after splitting the substs 15:43:12 <|amethyst> !tell st_ pitsprint's subst("H = H, I = HI, ...") doesn't work because commas aren't actually supported by subst() 15:43:13 |amethyst: OK, I'll let st_ know. 15:43:14 whoppsy doddle 15:43:46 oh, I guess the , part would be parsing, wouldn't it 15:43:46 |amethyst: I don't remember that happening, unless it's really rare 15:43:46 st_: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 15:44:08 <|amethyst> st_: or the things that should have been Hs turning into harder uniques 15:44:10 <|amethyst> st_: hm 15:44:22 -!- orneryostrich has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:44:53 <|amethyst> oh 15:45:26 <|amethyst> are there HIJKL on the map at all by that point in the subst? 15:45:48 <|amethyst> that line comes before the subst("1 = A:30 H:2") etc 15:46:53 -!- Elynae has quit [Quit: Page closed] 15:51:15 sorry, I'm not sure I'm following things, is there something about that line specifically? 15:52:29 <|amethyst> st_: the line in question is e.subst("H = H, I = HI, J = HIJ, K = HIJK, L = HIJKL") 15:52:43 <|amethyst> that doesn't work, because subst() doesn't accept commas 15:52:56 <|amethyst> so I think it's not doing anything currently 15:53:30 <|amethyst> but I can't tell if it would be doing anything without that problem, since AFAICT the HIJKL aren't generated until later in the chain of substs, just below that line 15:53:42 ah, that's possible, it's a hard thing to catch in testing 15:54:16 <|amethyst> I'm going to remove it for now 15:54:19 also I often mess up the ordering of substs/shuffles too 15:54:37 <|amethyst> if you notice any problems, let me know 15:55:28 <|amethyst> but as I said I think it was never working, and if it wasn't substituting to runed doors (for the "=" in the RHS of what it thought was one big subst) it probably wasn't doing anything 15:56:29 -!- ldf has joined ##crawl-dev 15:57:48 <|amethyst> changing it to how I think it was intended to work (multiple subst()s, after the 1: 2: etc) would make the uniques easier than they have been 15:58:33 yes the way it's always been is fine 15:58:50 I didn't realise it was wrong so it can't have been too wrong :p 16:00:02 -!- Rarn has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.0.1] 16:01:09 03|amethyst02 07* 0.16-a0-4078-g0e80503: Remove a non-functional subst. 10(89 seconds ago, 1 file, 0+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=0e80503c8483 16:12:55 -!- SomeStupidGirl has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:14:45 -!- thrig has quit [Changing host] 16:15:08 is there any purpose for potions of decay existing now? 16:15:34 reform them into a new double edged potion!! 16:16:03 the id game is real, and good, and my friend. 16:16:14 um 16:16:39 do you know the generation rate for decay 16:16:52 it exists just as much as !xp does!!!! 16:16:53 sort of 16:17:03 yes (except it can generate in stacks) 16:17:07 heh 16:17:13 that's why I'm talking about decay instead of degeneration/poison/etc 16:17:24 is there even an etc at this point 16:17:28 we've removed so many bad potions.. 16:17:39 things like cure mutation have the same effect on ID as degeneration 16:18:05 you've removed so many. but you can't remove them all. there'll always be more. always. 16:18:09 (except for losing a more useful potion) 16:24:48 afaik the only reason the potion exists is for mummy curses/curse card and those are gone now 16:24:58 so why keep the potion 16:26:48 the chance of it actually getting drunk is basically 0 16:27:25 I vaguely feel like I might have drunk one once. but maybe not 16:29:53 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 16:30:01 PleasingFungus: do you think -Cast should stay a randart property? it might be better as an unrandart exclusive 16:30:09 hm 16:30:12 I run across them occasionally. last time was several weeks ago though 16:30:40 I'm undecided (wrt -cast). do you have arguments for/against? 16:31:40 PleasingFungus: it doesn't really mean much of anything unless it's on armour or combined with contam, and when it is, it virtually always either doesn't matter or makes the item completely useless 16:32:12 -!- Gressup is now known as gressup 16:32:25 PleasingFungus: sometimes it works well on maxwell's but I can't recall any occasion where I have found a -Cast randart interesting 16:32:38 I think elliptic alluded to this a while ago? 16:32:42 -cast is not very good on randarts yeah 16:32:50 That's also an argument against sword of the dork knight, right? 16:33:04 yes, -Cast on doom knight does nothing 16:33:58 Do you ever worry that you might be oversimplifying? 16:34:20 -Cast on doom knight does nothing unless you are with ashenzari 16:34:34 heh 16:34:37 -!- WalkerBoh has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:34:40 it takes 16:34:41 3 16:34:42 aut 16:34:43 to unwield 16:34:48 it does nothing 16:35:06 balance by UI annoyance 16:35:07 oh I guess it blocks spectral weapon (i try to pretend that spell doesn't exist) 16:35:12 ? 16:35:53 but other than spectral weapon and maybe ashenzari it really doesn't have an effect 16:36:32 Balance by UI annoyance is probably nonoptimal, I admit. 16:36:34 you could try to salvage it with Contam/Curse I suppose 16:36:59 but I suspect it would almost never get used as intended 16:37:11 It's a weird item. 16:37:13 I think elliptic alluded to this a while ago? <- I don't remember talking about this but I agree that -Cast is pretty bad 16:37:55 I wonder if it would be more interesting on some kind of light armour or aux armour. 16:38:45 negatives in general are more interesting on armour because you cant remove it easily 16:38:47 elliptic: btw, I was wonder wrt to aut-based scoring, you had mentioned wecould apply a species-modifier for move speed, but were you thinking we'd have to internally store aut specifically spent on movement? 16:38:48 usually -Cast just makes a shiny randart useless when you find it later on 16:38:56 Or a shield, I guess (revamp of shield of ignorance?) (this is going a little off-topic but I don't have much more to say about -cast randarts) 16:38:56 gammafunk: no not at all 16:39:11 just apply it uniformly, regardless of what was spent on move or not? 16:39:25 gammafunk: the whole point is to avoid having two different turncounts... 16:39:44 gammafunk: yeah (and the multiplier wouldn't be as large as the move speed ratio) 16:40:03 sure, I'm just worried about creating new kinds of tactics to increase score 16:40:04 right 16:40:31 PleasingFungus: it's just not likely that someone is going to find a -Cast item and decide to stop casting their spells to use it, unless it is really ridiculously strong 16:40:42 and/or very early (same diff) 16:40:51 the problem is that most randarts aren't found very early 16:40:56 I guess it'd be hard to really exploit the discrepency if we choose the modifiers correctly 16:41:01 ya 16:41:08 PleasingFungus: it will only make the artefact more interesting for a really, really small subset of characters, and totally useless for a bunch of others 16:41:13 gammafunk: what do you mean by "exploit the discrepancy"? 16:41:29 gammafunk: some species will be better than others for speedrunning regardless, this is already the case 16:41:47 gammafunk: the point of these multipliers is just to keep species a little closer together 16:42:25 elliptic: in that you have a modifier applied to your total aut, but it may be more favorable for your species relative to others to use e.g. translocation movement 16:42:53 gammafunk: you mean like how using translocation movement already saves turns? 16:42:54 for slower species, I'd imagine 16:43:21 minmay: it does, but my "concern" is that it's even more favorable for slow species 16:43:33 I admit it's quite possibly not a legitimate concern 16:43:37 gammafunk: tloc is more useful for slow species even when not speedrunning 16:43:41 so I'm not sure what the problem is 16:43:51 yeah sure 16:44:52 well ctele is also on the chopping block 16:45:24 there's also penalizing score based on moving through e.g. shallow water, but there's nothing that can be done about that and the turns spent moving in water are going to be small anyhow 16:45:39 -!- travis-ci has joined ##crawl-dev 16:45:40 The build was broken. (master - 0e80503 #1826 : Neil Moore): http://travis-ci.org/crawl-ref/crawl-ref/builds/51668337 16:45:40 -!- travis-ci has left ##crawl-dev 16:46:22 !lm . vsdk 16:46:23 1. [2014-11-16 21:25:57] gammafunk the Torchbearer (L1 VSDK of Yredelemnul) began the quest for the Orb on turn 0. (D:1) 16:46:30 DrKe: I'll still find a way to beat you! 16:46:33 !lg * recent won s=crace x=+${avg(aut/turn) 16:46:33 * recent won s=crace x=+${avg(aut/turn) 16:46:42 it's possible 16:46:43 !lg * recent won s=crace x=+${avg(aut/turn)} 16:46:44 8566 games for * (recent won): 262x Naga [13.88], Cherufe [13], 4x Salamander [11.5], 2x Bearkin [11.5], 2x Lacertilian [10.5], 294x Troll [10.3], 246x Octopode [10.14], 310x Formicid [9.87], 175x Ghoul [9.83], 283x Draconian [9.54], 340x Ogre [9.49], 222x High Elf [9.32], 941x Minotaur [9.32], 233x Human [9.3], 638x Demonspawn [9.26], 332x Deep Elf [9.26], 178x Mummy [9.25], 354x Merfolk [9.24], ... 16:47:29 !locate . 16:47:30 op notrious slow species 16:47:30 . was last seen on CAO (DrKe, L1 HODK of Yredelemnul). 16:47:36