00:01:25 <tabstorm> imo let him have his fun
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00:06:35 <gammafunk> PleasingFungus: yeah I knew he didn't upgrade, just wanted to point out how ridiculous his game had become
00:06:44 <gammafunk> all 72 stats, +100 ac, ev
00:07:03 <gammafunk> all his unrands amulets getting called bloodlust
00:08:06 <PleasingFungus> wait, what
00:08:10 <PleasingFungus> re that second thing
00:08:54 <gammafunk> not sure if you can see it in the log
00:08:57 <gammafunk> &dump monsoon
00:08:58 <Sequell> http://dobrazupa.org/morgue/Monsoon/Monsoon.txt
00:09:15 <gammafunk> PleasingFungus: yeah, it's in there
00:09:19 <gammafunk> search bloodlust
00:10:13 <gammafunk> he said one was actually macabre finger, another amulet of air, etc
00:10:26 <gammafunk> but they got turned into that? forget
00:11:45 <PleasingFungus> good bug
00:13:16 <Sizzell> Unstable branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.16-a0-3194-g9356553 (34)
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00:38:02 <chequers> !tell edlothiol I think janitor_commands is Done -- would you mind checking it out? bonus: README rewrite, new dependency and use of PIP for dependency management: https://github.com/alexjurkiewicz/crawl/commits/webtiles-changes
00:38:03 <Sequell> chequers: OK, I'll let edlothiol know.
00:38:45 <chequers> !tell edlothiol the commits aren't clean to merge, but functionally they should be correct
00:38:45 <Sequell> chequers: OK, I'll let edlothiol know.
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01:15:18 <Lightli> gammafunk: yeah that octopode is basically the most OP character ever now
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02:21:07 <Rotatell> Unstable branch on crawl.beRotato.org updated to: 0.16-a0-3194-g9356553 (34)
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02:54:11 <theTower> so I'm going to embed something fun into these logs
02:54:28 <Henzell> ahabkang (L27 TrMo) ASSERT(in_non_diamond_int(r.start)) in 'ray.cc' at line 217 failed. (Pan)
02:54:40 <theTower> I think playing this game to death individually is inching towards killing it developmentally.
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02:55:38 <doy> what does that mean?
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03:01:08 <theTower> it means that this game as much as many other games can't live being played thousands of goddamn times no matter how much randomization there's put into it, resulting in immense amounts of twisted effort just for simple things like "it's bad if a randomly found spell is a straight buff"
03:01:27 <theTower> all driving ourselves into the ground
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03:02:43 <doy> who is saying "it's bad if a randomly found spell is a straight buff"?
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06:51:39 <TZer0> We have an ogre on my service in trunk that has a base int of 2
06:51:47 <TZer0> is this... achievable?
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06:53:05 <TZer0> http://crawl.lantea.net/Tolias.cs
06:53:37 <TZer0> derp
06:53:39 <TZer0> wrong player
06:55:06 <TZer0> http://crawl.lantea.net/flinch.txt
06:55:10 <TZer0> http://crawl.lantea.net/flinch.cs
06:57:59 <TZer0> he used a bunch of deck of wonders
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06:58:06 <TZer0> he started less than two days ago
06:58:13 <TZer0> but he didn't really.. pay attention
06:58:31 <johnny0> TZer0: i'm pretty sure you can get your base in the negative
06:58:43 <johnny0> with enough focus cards
06:58:47 <TZer0> oooh
06:58:49 <TZer0> right
06:59:01 <TZer0> ??deck_of_wonders
06:59:01 <Sequell> deck of wonders[1/2]: Cards: {potion card}, {focus card} (rare), {shuffle card} (very rare, not in plain decks), {experience card}, {wild magic card}, {helix card}, {sage card}, {trowel card} (rare, only in legendary decks). In 0.15, the card list is {focus card}, {helix card}, {shaft card}, {dowsing card}, {mercenary card}, and {alchemist card}
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07:01:43 <TZer0> johnny0: I totally forgot about that :P
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09:30:34 <Cheibriados> 03wheals02 07* 0.16-a0-3195-g02a2dc8: Recommend FeEn (agentgt). 10(4 minutes ago, 1 file, 2+ 2-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=02a2dc8f0ae6
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09:50:00 <wheals> The sling bullet is repelled.
09:50:00 <wheals> _You feel less protected from missiles.
09:50:10 <wheals> i'm wearing the amulet of the air
09:50:40 <wheals> i guess this is because i casted rmsl before putting it on and it didn't ablate till now?
09:50:41 <Bloax> kvality
09:53:21 <|amethyst> wheals:  yeah, ablate_deflection only looks at ATTR_{DEFLECT,REPEL}_MISSILES from the spell, not ARTP_RMSL/distortion field/Qazlal
09:53:43 <wheals> i'm not sure what the behaviour should be
09:54:03 <|amethyst> ablate but give no message?
09:54:47 <wheals> so sometimes when you cast rmsl, put on the "air, and then take it off you still have rmsl, and sometimes you don't?
09:55:34 <|amethyst> hm, I suppose that's inconsistent with (say) flying
09:55:46 <|amethyst> OTOH, I don't know if we want more messes like flying
09:56:22 <wheals> i think i do know :)
09:56:27 <|amethyst> wheals:  what if you had dmsl and put on "air
09:56:50 <|amethyst> I guess the difference there is that you can tell (other than by the message) when the dmsl has ablated
09:56:55 <wheals> i wonder if the best solution is just to change the message
09:57:10 <wheals> "You feel your spell is no longer protecting you from missiles"
09:57:58 <|amethyst> hm
09:58:01 <|amethyst> let me combine those two
09:59:21 <wheals> !tell pleasingfungus having a lot of fun with irradiate :)
09:59:21 <Sequell> wheals: OK, I'll let pleasingfungus know.
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10:14:40 <Cheibriados> 03|amethyst02 07* 0.16-a0-3196-g282d222: Improve expiration message when rMsl effect is still up (wheals) 10(5 minutes ago, 1 file, 16+ 5-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=282d2222f4e1
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10:25:50 <wheals> !tell Grunt i ran into an inner flame necromancer!
10:25:50 <Sequell> wheals: OK, I'll let grunt know.
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10:30:35 <Grunt> !send wheals explosions
10:30:35 <Sequell> Sending explosions to wheals.
10:30:49 <Grunt> !lg * vmsg~~inner_flame s=cikiller
10:30:51 <wheals> Grunt: it died in the explosion, sadly
10:30:53 <Sequell> 4047 games for * (vmsg~~inner_flame): 1764x the player character, 513x a pandemonium lord, 349x, 99x an orc, 78x an adder, 75x a kobold, 64x a jackal, 63x a goblin, 58x a hobgoblin, 54x a rat, 50x an orc wizard, 45x a bat, 41x a sheep, 37x a gnoll, 33x a giant cockroach, 30x a killer bee, 23x orc, 23x an orc priest, 22x a giant gecko, 21x an ogre, 17x a ball python, 16x a giant newt, 16x an orc wa...
10:31:09 <wheals> !lg  * vmsg~~inner_flame
10:31:10 <Grunt> !lg * vmsg~~inner_flame s=ikiller
10:31:11 <Sequell> 4047. kroki the Deadly Accurate (L25 TrAM of Trog), blasted by an acid blob (exploding inner flame) (hexed by the player character) on Slime:6 (slime_pit) on 2014-12-17 12:15:07, with 523900 points after 74581 turns and 4:00:09.
10:31:14 <Sequell> 4047 games for * (vmsg~~inner_flame): 1764x the player character, 504x Xom, 349x, 99x an orc, 78x an adder, 75x a kobold, 64x a jackal, 63x a goblin, 58x a hobgoblin, 54x a rat, 50x an orc wizard, 45x a bat, 41x a sheep, 37x a gnoll, 33x a giant cockroach, 30x a killer bee, 23x orc, 23x an orc priest, 22x a giant gecko, 21x an ogre, 17x a ball python, 16x a giant newt, 16x a hound, 16x an orc warr...
10:31:19 <wheals> !lg  * vmsg~~inner_flame vmsg!~~player_character
10:31:21 <Sequell> 2282. Elynae the Cudgeler (L4 MuCK of Xom), blasted by an adder (exploding inner flame) (hexed by Xom) on D:3 on 2014-12-16 18:22:33, with 159 points after 1976 turns and 0:02:19.
10:31:24 <Grunt> !lg * vmsg~~inner_flame.*hexed_by s=ikiller
10:31:28 <Basil> mm
10:31:28 <Sequell> 2215 games for * (vmsg~~inner_flame.*hexed_by): 1710x the player character, 504x Xom, Jins' ghost
10:31:30 <wheals> !lg  * vmsg~~inner_flame vmsg!~~player_character vmsg!~~xom
10:31:32 <Sequell> 1779. spelunker the Cudgeler (L3 GrBe of Trog), blasted by a black bear (exploding inner flame) (hexed by Jins' ghost) on D:5 on 2014-12-16 17:37:07, with 45 points after 592 turns and 0:01:58.
10:31:33 <Grunt> !
10:31:43 <Grunt> !lg * vmsg~~inner_flame.*hexed_by ikiller~~ghost
10:31:45 <Sequell> 1. spelunker the Cudgeler (L3 GrBe of Trog), blasted by a black bear (exploding inner flame) (hexed by Jins' ghost) on D:5 on 2014-12-16 17:37:07, with 45 points after 592 turns and 0:01:58.
10:31:54 <wheals> !lg  * vmsg~~inner_flame vmsg!~~player_character vmsg!~~xom -2
10:31:56 <Sequell> 1778/1779. Photonic the Conjurer (L4 DECj), blasted by a sheep (exploding inner flame) on D:3 (kb_xom_exploding_sheep) on 2014-12-07 07:51:05, with 107 points after 3334 turns and 0:06:55.
10:32:03 <wheals> sheep!!
10:32:07 <Basil> any idea how much damage hydra form does
10:32:14 <wheals> hexed by Grunt
10:32:45 <Basil> !lm . br.end=vaults -tv
10:32:46 <Sequell> 172. Basil, XL24 OgTm, T:87391 (milestone) requested for FooTV: telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org.
10:33:08 <wheals> http://sprunge.us/dNfG
10:33:13 <wheals> check it out
10:33:33 <Basil> great annihilating truth
10:33:47 <wheals> Lasty roars, "ANNIHILATED!"
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10:34:50 <Basil> hm
10:35:01 <Basil> maybe I should quit with 80x25
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10:36:34 <wheals> A goblin comes into view. It is wielding a club.
10:36:35 <wheals> The goblin shouts!
10:36:35 <wheals> You redirect the goblin's attack!
10:36:35 <wheals> The goblin hits itself with a club.
10:36:35 <wheals> _The goblin dies!
10:36:45 <wheals> oops, wrong channel :S
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10:54:34 <wheals> !tell pleasingfungus xv on a salamander mystic gives a -more- at the bottom but pressing space exits
10:54:34 <Sequell> wheals: OK, I'll let pleasingfungus know.
10:54:57 <|amethyst> wheals:  I've seen a weird extra -more- in webtiles sometimes
10:55:09 <|amethyst> wheals:  or maybe it was local tiles?
10:55:28 <wheals> this is 80x24 online console, i think
10:55:34 <wheals> maybe i'm 80x25, not sure
10:55:49 <wheals> also, couldn't reproduce it with ?/m
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10:58:02 <|amethyst> wheals:  that's probably because ?/m is one line shorter there (it doesn't have the threat level)
10:58:32 <wheals> yeah, i see
10:58:41 <wheals> now that i think about this, the vp A! screen had this problem
10:58:43 <|amethyst> hm
10:58:45 <|amethyst> actually
10:58:51 <|amethyst> it's because space exits in general
10:58:56 <|amethyst> no matter how many pages there are
10:59:02 <wheals> ok, so there are two problems
10:59:25 <|amethyst> you can actually scroll down one extra line
10:59:43 <|amethyst> with downarrow
10:59:56 <wheals> wouldn't that line be blank?
11:00:04 <|amethyst> yeah
11:00:30 <|amethyst> not sure where the blank line is coming from, but it does seem to act as though there is one
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11:01:05 <|amethyst> three problems
11:01:11 <|amethyst> 1. space doesn't scroll
11:01:16 <|amethyst> 2. funny blank line
11:01:41 <|amethyst> 3. It displays -more- so you can scroll the last line, rather than just displaying the last line
11:02:02 <wheals> ... and 1 more problems
11:02:02 <|amethyst> ...and 1 more commits
11:02:05 <|amethyst> :)
11:02:10 <wheals> hi......
11:02:40 <|amethyst> This is probably a general formatted_scroller problem?
11:02:59 <wheals> even #1?
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11:05:07 <wheals> FR: blind monsters sometimes stumble into lava
11:05:13 <wheals> after all, how do they know where it is?
11:06:38 <|amethyst> aha, you're right
11:06:50 <|amethyst> ' ' is special-cased in spell_scroller::process_key
11:07:15 <|amethyst> because of look-for-inexact-match in ?/m
11:15:29 <|amethyst> probably can move that to a different key
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11:15:45 -!- PleasingFungus_ is now known as PleasingFungus
11:15:52 <|amethyst> looks like it would be a bit difficult to know which you're being called from (would have to have the flag as far up as describe_monsters)
11:17:03 <PleasingFungus> Basil: Why do you think hydra form duration is too short?
11:17:08 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds]
11:18:26 <Lantell> Yllodra (L21 SpEn) ASSERT(!(flags & SPFLAG_TARGETING_MASK) || map_bounds(pbolt.target)) in 'mon-cast.cc' at line 4998 failed. (Depths:2)
11:19:25 -!- Basil has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
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11:22:18 <Henzell> Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.16-a0-3196-g282d222 (34)
11:23:00 <PleasingFungus> !tell theTower It's true that the problems with some solutions to the Charms Problem are much less relevant to people who play the game less, but, tbh, so is the Charms Problem generally. I don't think we're going to end up damaging the experience for most players whatever we end up doing, though it's certainly something to be wary of.
11:23:01 <Sequell> Maximum message length is 300 characters. Eschew verbosity, Gladys!
11:23:02 <PleasingFungus> feh
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11:23:44 <wheals> try !tell thelogs
11:23:50 <PleasingFungus> !tell Basil Why do you think hydra form duration is too short?
11:23:50 <Sequell> PleasingFungus: OK, I'll let basil know.
11:24:07 <PleasingFungus> wheals: I tweaked & resent it through /msg Sequell !tell theTower instead
11:25:08 <wheals> !tell Sequell /msg theTower
11:25:08 <Sequell> Sorry wheals, I don't know who sequell is.
11:25:12 <wheals> damn
11:25:14 <wheals> rejected
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11:31:33 <PleasingFungus> aaa
11:31:35 <|amethyst> !tell Cheibriados %git
11:31:35 <Sequell> |amethyst: OK, I'll let cheibriados know.
11:31:39 <|amethyst> %git
11:31:39 <Cheibriados> 07|amethyst02 * 0.16-a0-3196-g282d222: Improve expiration message when rMsl effect is still up (wheals) 10(82 minutes ago, 1 file, 16+ 5-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=282d2222f4e1
11:31:57 <PleasingFungus> I wonder if sequell has chei on ignore
11:32:03 <|amethyst> it does, yes
11:32:04 <wheals> so cruel
11:32:26 <|amethyst> chei and sizzell at least don't ignore any bots
11:32:31 <Bloaxor> !tell Sequell !tell Sequell
11:32:32 <Sequell> Sorry Bloaxor, I don't know who sequell is.
11:32:40 <|amethyst> probably they should, but at least they need to listen to sequell so it can proxy commands for them
11:32:41 <wheals> does that mean you cant !cmd !pup .echo %pup !pup and make an infinite loop
11:32:50 <Bloaxor> he doesn't even say it right
11:32:51 <Bloaxor> boo
11:33:34 <wheals> !seen Sequell
11:33:34 <Sequell> Sorry wheals, I haven't seen sequell.
11:33:36 <wheals> !seen Sequell_
11:33:36 <Sequell> Sorry wheals, I haven't seen sequell_.
11:33:41 <wheals> !seen Cheibriados
11:33:41 <Sequell> I last saw Cheibriados at Tue Nov 26 19:21:35 2013 UTC (about 1y 3w 22h 12m 6s ago) joining the channel.
11:33:47 <wheals> nice
11:33:51 <Bloaxor> !seen Chanserv
11:33:52 <Sequell> I last saw ChanServ at Sat Dec 13 23:36:25 2014 UTC (3d 17h 57m 27s ago) joining the channel.
11:33:57 <wheals> !seen Sizzell
11:33:57 <Sequell> I last saw Sizzell at Tue Nov 26 07:45:52 2013 UTC (about 1y 3w 1d 9h 48m 5s ago) joining the channel.
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11:34:05 <wheals> !seen gret
11:34:06 <Sequell> Sorry wheals, I haven't seen gret.
11:34:13 <wheals> whoa
11:34:18 <wheals> where's gretell? :o
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11:34:25 <wheals> !seen gretell
11:34:25 <Sequell> Sorry wheals, I haven't seen gretell.
11:34:42 <|amethyst> !tell gretell gre
11:34:42 <Sequell> Sorry |amethyst, I don't know who gretell is.
11:34:53 <Bloaxor> hey remember when the various bot functions were spread over various bots
11:35:01 <Bloaxor> instead of sequell and sequell
11:35:12 <wheals> 1learn add Gretell Is not gret, despite what many zealous tabbers seem to think.
11:35:25 <|amethyst> yes, horrible times
11:35:30 <PleasingFungus> Bloaxor: sounds like it'd be difficult to keep track of
11:35:36 <PleasingFungus> chei & sequell are bad enough
11:35:39 <Bloaxor> terrible, terrible times
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11:35:59 <Bloaxor> I'm pretty sure Gretell handled !apt
11:36:05 <Bloaxor> or was that Henzell
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11:36:17 <|amethyst> it was henzell
11:36:28 <|amethyst> then learndb got folded into sequell
11:36:38 <|amethyst> so you can access learndb from queries and vice versa
11:36:38 <Bloaxor> yeah, gretell was @??Rock Troll
11:36:41 <wheals> imagine if there were overlap between bots' recognised symbols
11:36:43 <wheals> would be awful
11:37:06 <|amethyst> %version
11:37:06 <Sizzell> trunk: 0.16-a0-3194-g9356553;  0.15: 0.15.2;  0.14: 0.14.2;  0.13: 0.13.2;  0.12: 0.12.3;  0.11: 0.11.3;  0.10: 0.10.3-19-g6f05415
11:37:15 <|amethyst> !version
11:37:16 <Henzell> trunk: 0.16-a0-3196-g282d222;  0.15: 0.15.2;  0.14: 0.14.2;  0.13: 0.13.2;  0.12: 0.12.3;  0.11: 0.11.3;  0.10: 0.10.3-19-g6f05415
11:37:17 <Bloaxor> $version
11:37:18 <Lantell> trunk: 0.16-a0-3187-geb38783;  0.15: 0.15.2;  0.14: 0.14.2;  0.13: 0.13.2;  0.12: 0.12.3;  0.11: 0.11.3;  0.10: 0.10.4
11:38:09 <|amethyst> there isn't any command overlap between sizzell and chei though
11:38:19 <|amethyst> !cmd !version
11:38:20 <Sequell> No command !version
11:38:29 <|amethyst> !cmd !version .echo 0.0
11:38:30 <Sequell> Defined command: !version => .echo 0.0
11:38:31 <|amethyst> !version
11:38:32 <Sequell> 0.0
11:38:32 <Henzell> trunk: 0.16-a0-3196-g282d222;  0.15: 0.15.2;  0.14: 0.14.2;  0.13: 0.13.2;  0.12: 0.12.3;  0.11: 0.11.3;  0.10: 0.10.3-19-g6f05415
11:38:37 <|amethyst> !cmd -rm !version
11:38:38 <Sequell> Deleted command: !version => .echo 0.0
11:39:03 <wheals> !cmd !whereis
11:39:03 <Sequell> No command !whereis
11:39:08 <wheals> !cmd &whereis
11:39:08 <Sequell> Command: &whereis => .echo $(no_pm $(=whereis.helper $*))
11:39:21 <wheals> !fn no_pm
11:39:21 <Sequell> !fn no_pm (x) (if (= $channel msg) "This command does not work in PM." $x)
11:40:19 <|amethyst> (no_pm isn't the actual access control; it's just there to make the error messages more scrutable)
11:41:11 <wheals> sure, it makes sense that it doesn't work in PM
11:41:18 <wheals> even if you removed it
11:41:59 <|amethyst> I still need to read up on the new Sequell access control stuff
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11:43:12 <Ironfoot_> !messages
11:43:12 <Sequell> No messages for Ironfoot_.
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11:49:50 <PleasingFungus> hm
11:50:00 <PleasingFungus> that strategy seems flawed
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11:56:23 <Cheibriados> Sword of Zonguldrok issues 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=9338 by Berder
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12:05:51 <P> Soguys
12:05:57 <P> I was on 14.0
12:06:04 <P> and i managed to corrupt my save somehow
12:06:06 -!- P is now known as Guest16131
12:06:13 <Guest16131> the error's overlapping blocks
12:06:23 <Guest16131> i'm wondering if naything can be done to salvage it
12:07:04 <PleasingFungus> Do you mean Crawl 0.14, or Ubuntu 14.0, or...?
12:07:42 <PleasingFungus> I mean, I have no idea regardless (I would guess you're out of luck), but I'm curious about "14.0".
12:08:22 <Guest16131> 0.14
12:08:24 <Guest16131> crawl
12:08:27 <Guest16131> yeah my bad
12:09:29 <Guest16131> damn this pisses me off
12:09:35 <Guest16131> even though it's probably my fault
12:09:52 <Guest16131> i was tweaking the init file so the bloody tiles iwndow wouldn't largeass
12:10:06 <Guest16131> but when i tried it out i apparently blasted my save to high heaven
12:10:54 <PleasingFungus> That really shouldn't happen.
12:11:07 <PleasingFungus> Like, there's nothing you can do in the init file that should cause save corruption.
12:11:30 <PleasingFungus> The only thing that should cause save corruption is on the order of "pulling out the power cord in the middle of saving", that kind of thing.
12:11:46 <PleasingFungus> (or force-killing the process while saving, you know)
12:12:58 <Guest16131> all i touched was the init file, the tiles window size
12:13:01 <Guest16131> not only did it not work
12:13:05 <Guest16131> but well, you know. Save broke.
12:13:27 <PleasingFungus> Hrm.
12:13:58 <PleasingFungus> We don't still support 0.14, but I don't remember ever hearing of that bug - if you're able to reproduce it, it would be useful to know, especially if it's still in current versions.
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12:15:55 <Guest16131> I don't want to reproduce that crap
12:16:05 <Guest16131> Well, it was a long shot thinking i can recover the file anyway
12:17:15 <PleasingFungus> Can you paste your initfile, at least?
12:17:51 <PleasingFungus> also, os & whether you're using tiles or console
12:18:54 <Guest16131> tiles
12:19:13 <Guest16131> i wiped everything reinstalling
12:19:24 <Guest16131> not that it worked
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12:20:00 <PleasingFungus> oop
12:20:13 <PleasingFungus> are you on windows, os x, or linux?
12:22:10 <Guest16131> win
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12:24:32 <Guest16131> i'll just get out and cry a bit
12:24:34 <Guest16131> see you alll
12:25:57 <PleasingFungus> Sorry I couldn't help!
12:26:10 <PleasingFungus> best of luck with later chars :)
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12:29:36 <Basil> PleasingFungus: when I was fooling around with hydra form it lasted ~7-15 turns
12:29:50 <PleasingFungus> that's probably an overestimate
12:29:55 <PleasingFungus> unless you have very good spellpower
12:30:16 <Basil> which made it so that if I did a nontrivial amount of repositioning (such as to maximize cleaving!) it would fall off midway through a fight
12:30:23 <Basil> I had 8 heads of spellpower
12:30:26 <Basil> archmagi
12:31:03 <PleasingFungus> it's probably gonna be something like 7-11 turns, in that case
12:31:59 <PleasingFungus> it would be okay if it was slightly longer duration, I guess. I think it being short duration is very good for a lot of reasons, tho. not sure it's necessary to change.
12:32:00 <Basil> it also was sort of awkward to keep a close eye on hydra status each turn when I cast it; I had it fall off once when I was paying more attention to a pack of dudes
12:32:18 <Basil> and losing 50% hp and makh heal was when I started noticing its lack
12:32:28 <PleasingFungus> !lg Basil s=tiles
12:32:29 <Sequell> 419 games for Basil: 297x false, 122x true
12:32:39 <PleasingFungus> idk
12:32:41 <PleasingFungus> set a force more?
12:32:47 <Basil> I guess
12:34:26 <Basil> the symmetry between summon hydra form is sort of neat but it didn't feel very good in practice
12:34:49 <Basil> this was neat though
12:34:55 <Basil> !lm . ogtm br.end=vaults -tv
12:34:56 <Sequell> 2. Basil, XL24 OgTm, T:87391 (milestone) requested for FooTV: telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org.
12:35:11 <PleasingFungus> I think it's good to have short duration - makes spell failure more relevant, among other things
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12:35:22 <PleasingFungus> also makes duration more relevant (obviously)
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12:35:32 <PleasingFungus> idk if any other forms have meaningful durations
12:35:43 <PleasingFungus> beastly appendage, maybe
12:35:59 <elliptic> spider form duration is meaningful early game
12:36:08 <PleasingFungus> aight
12:36:13 <Bloaxor> beastly appendage matters jackshit
12:36:16 <Basil> well, spell fail is relevant due to tmut miscasts being terrible
12:36:27 <Bloaxor> ??transmutation miscast
12:36:28 <Sequell> transmutation miscast ~ transmutations miscast[1/1]: By severity: 1: 1-11 damage or random uselessness. 2: 3-25 damage, 0-18 {contam}, {petrification}, or {confusion} (last two replaced with Weak in 0.16+). 3: Badform for random2(200) turns, 3-20 dmg AND 0-34 {contam}, 5-27 dmg AND delete mutation, 5-27 dmg AND 1-2 bad mutations.
12:36:28 <PleasingFungus> fair point
12:36:33 <Bloaxor> pretty horrifying
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12:37:07 <Basil> I guess hydra is the ""int form""?
12:37:12 <Bloaxor> the only effect it has with hydra form is that it drains your mp a lot
12:37:20 <PleasingFungus> bite (x16)
12:37:21 <Bloaxor> because you recast it every fifth turn just to be sure
12:37:30 <PleasingFungus> mm, 19 heads there
12:37:30 <Bloaxor> 160 spellpower is like
12:37:35 <Basil> since it apparently trashes your defenses and scales more heavily on spellpower
12:37:40 <Bloaxor> 27 transmutations/spellcasting, 40 int and archmagi
12:37:48 <Bloaxor> probably more like 50 int
12:37:55 <PleasingFungus> well
12:37:59 <PleasingFungus> he had enemies chopping his heads off
12:38:07 <Basil> yeah
12:38:12 <Basil> probably started with 8ish heads
12:38:12 <PleasingFungus> bad call on their part
12:38:18 <PleasingFungus> (their parts?)
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12:38:28 <Basil> they got ate
12:38:31 <PleasingFungus> nom
12:38:52 <Bloaxor> well it being anti-humanoid is also pretty hilarious
12:39:23 <PleasingFungus> yeah 'int form' is an interesting way to think of it - I thought of it as the 'spellpower form' but that's obv not far off
12:39:43 <Bloaxor> the problem is just that it's not as attractive as every other form ever
12:39:45 <PleasingFungus> definitely doesn't scale with str/dex in the way BH or dragon form do
12:40:17 <Bloaxor> most of which benefit a lot from str and a single one from dex
12:40:17 <Basil> !lm . br.end=snake -tv:<2
12:40:18 <Sequell> 88. Basil, XL24 OgTm, T:86164 (milestone) requested for FooTV: telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org.
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12:41:00 <PleasingFungus> !source transform.cc
12:41:00 <Sequell> http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/transform.cc;hb=HEAD
12:42:35 <Cheibriados> hydra (09D) | Spd: 10 (swim: 60%) | HD: 13 | HP: 58-86 | AC/EV: 0/5 | Dam: 18 per head | amphibious, cold-blooded, regen | Res: 06magic(60), 03poison, 12drown | Chunks: 09poison | XP: 976 | Sz: Big | Int: reptile.

12:42:35 <Bloaxor> %??hydra
12:42:36 <PleasingFungus> bh is (dex+str)/3, statue is str/3, dragon is str*2/3, spider & ice don't scale off stats at all (well, any more than any unarmed combat does)
12:43:05 <Bloaxor> https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?p=199577#p199577 for future reference i have a nice list here
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12:43:17 <Basil> whoops
12:43:20 <Bloaxor> (also accounts for the 3 base unarmed damage)
12:43:24 <Basil> !lm . rune=serpentine -tv:<2
12:43:24 <Sequell> 87. Basil, XL24 OgTm, T:86558 (milestone) requested for FooTV: telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org.
12:43:45 <Bloaxor> wait a minute
12:43:46 <Bloaxor> ??ice form
12:43:46 <Sequell> ice form[1/4]: +20% HP, rF-, rC+++, rPois. Melds all armour, but gives 5-12 AC (and has synergy with {ozocubu's armour}). 12+UC base damage with freezing brand. Players in ice form can float through water, but get no aquatic bonuses and can't reach submerged items. Found in Books of Changes, Transfigurations, and Beasts, L4 ice/tmut.
12:43:49 <Bloaxor> ha
12:43:56 <PleasingFungus> ?
12:44:26 <Bloaxor> I got ice form wrong.
12:44:52 <Bloaxor> But uh, yeah.
12:44:56 <Bloaxor> Transmutations are pretty hardcore.
12:45:01 <Basil> hm
12:45:06 <Basil> that's six hashes
12:45:24 <PleasingFungus> ??#
12:45:25 <Sequell> spell power[4/5]: Got bars (#)? You have at least 0, 10, 15, 25, 35, 50, 75, 100, 150, 200.
12:45:51 <Bloaxor> probably around 60
12:46:06 <Bloaxor> which is where you'll be floating if you have dragon form (nearly) castable
12:46:15 <Bloaxor> unless you have a ton of int
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12:46:20 <Bloaxor> which is not very good for Tms
12:46:39 <Bloaxor> (certainly not as good as EV from dex or HUGEDAMAGE from str)
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12:47:04 <Bloaxor> that reminds me
12:47:07 <Bloaxor> ??str
12:47:08 <Sequell> str[1/4]: Strength reduces penalties from wearing body armour; see {aevp}. In 0.14 and before has special effects on launcher speed and damage. In 0.15+ has identical, small impact on both melee and launcher damage.
12:47:14 <Bloaxor> er
12:47:16 <Bloaxor> ??str[2]
12:47:17 <Sequell> str[2/4]: *Base* melee weapon or mainhand unarmed damage is effectively multiplied by (39+random2(x-11)*2)/39 if x > 11, and multiplied by (39-random2(9-x)*3)/39 if x < 9. x is between str and (str+dex)/2, depending on the weapon's strength weighting. Anydice program to calculate the multiplier (at perfect str weighting): http://anydice.com/program/4e69
12:47:32 <Bloaxor> that random2() is pretty peculiar
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12:51:21 <Bloaxor> mmh
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12:52:22 <Bloaxor> http://anydice.com/program/4e78 mmm
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13:42:57 <gammafunk> !lg * ikiller=shard_shrike
13:42:58 <Sequell> 2. oryx the Invulnerable (L27 FoFi of The Shining One), slain by a shard shrike on Coc:7 (coc_dpeg) on 2014-11-24 08:02:36, with 889879 points after 69259 turns and 6:43:32.
13:43:03 <gammafunk> !lg * ikiller=mnoleg
13:43:08 <Sequell> 51. Sabathiel the Conqueror (L27 MiBe of The Shining One), mangled by Mnoleg in Pandemonium (evilmike_mnoleg_eyes) on 2014-12-01 01:32:07, with 1364181 points after 140056 turns and 11:18:04.
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13:44:55 <PleasingFungus> !lg * killer=shard_shrike
13:44:56 <Sequell> 6. one1010 the Heavyweight Champion (L27 TrMo of Cheibriados), slain by a shard shrike (created by the effects of Hell) on Coc:3 on 2014-12-05 00:15:03, with 895974 points after 73763 turns and 11:55:45.
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13:45:18 <gammafunk> oh
13:45:26 <gammafunk> well fine, mr. smartypants
13:47:48 <PleasingFungus> just checkin
13:47:52 <PleasingFungus> !killratio robin *
13:47:54 <Sequell> robin wins 12.16% of battles.
13:47:57 <PleasingFungus> !lg * ikiller=torpor_snail
13:47:58 <Sequell> 146. Miyamura the Grappler (L11 TrWz of Qazlal), mangled by a torpor snail (kmap: kennysheep_snail_temple) on Lair:1 on 2014-12-17 18:46:24, with 12126 points after 11464 turns and 0:44:33.
13:48:03 <PleasingFungus> brutal
13:48:06 <PleasingFungus> !lg * ikiller=torpor_snail s=kmap
13:48:07 <Sequell> 146 games for * (ikiller=torpor_snail): 128x, 8x kennysheep_snail_temple, 3x grunt_megastairs_3, 2x grunt_megastairs_2, pf_torpor_hydra, wormcave, grunt_megastairs_1, grunt_megastairs_5, bailey_polearm_5
13:48:38 <PleasingFungus> !lg * ikiller=torpor_snail max=xl
13:48:39 <Sequell> 146. bronies4ever the Eclecticist (L20 DEWz of Qazlal), hit from afar by a stone giant (large rock) (led by a torpor snail) on Depths:1 on 2014-10-02 17:16:16, with 319284 points after 61091 turns and 3:56:23.
13:48:44 <PleasingFungus> heh
13:48:50 <PleasingFungus> !lg * ikiller=ghost_crab swamp
13:48:51 <Sequell> 3. arthad the Severer (L18 FoBe of Trog), slain by a spectral seven-headed hydra (called from beyond by a ghost crab) on Swamp:5 on 2014-12-16 23:51:00, with 171322 points after 30501 turns and 3:16:28.
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13:48:57 <PleasingFungus> !lg * ikiller=ghost_crab swamp s=killer
13:48:58 <Sequell> 3 games for * (ikiller=ghost_crab swamp): a spectral six-headed hydra, a spectral anaconda, a spectral seven-headed hydra
13:49:03 <PleasingFungus> good selection
13:49:04 <PleasingFungus> !vault grunt_megastairs_3
13:49:05 <Sequell> http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/dat/des/variable/float.des;hb=HEAD#l5832
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13:55:32 <gammafunk> !send Grunt megabat_stairs
13:55:33 <Sequell> Sending megabat_stairs to Grunt.
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14:09:08 <gammafunk> |amethyst: entry['dumpURL'] = '../../morgue/{0}/morgue-{0}-{1}{2}{3}-{4}.txt' is how dplusplus hacked his morgue path for the server score page
14:09:27 <gammafunk> |amethyst: if I moved this path template to a per-game config option, would the only thing I'd need in the template be something like %u to replace with the username?
14:10:15 <gammafunk> this matching is being done vs. what records we pull from the score file, which we parse in the score page handler
14:10:49 <gammafunk> but I assume the path option I add wouldn't need to know about the {1}-{4} python format items, since that file format is the same in all versions?
14:13:38 <Cheibriados> Get choice of polymorphs when zapped with wand 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=9339 by nubinia
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14:15:03 <gammafunk> ...
14:15:25 <gammafunk> haha, good bug
14:15:29 <PleasingFungus> ya
14:15:30 <PleasingFungus> might be mine
14:15:53 <gammafunk> I guess it ignored his selection, pity
14:16:00 <gammafunk> I was hoping it was like a list of possible forms
14:16:19 <gammafunk> Do you want to be a: (b)at (r)at (c)at?
14:17:35 <PleasingFungus> ya
14:18:26 <PleasingFungus> !gamesby wheals
14:18:27 <Sequell> wheals has played 3344 games, between 2012-07-11 00:24:00 and 2014-12-17 17:06:36, won 23 (0.7%), high score 13167153, total score 98189188, total turns 24836427, play-time/day 1:18:30, total time 48d+12:35:58.
14:18:45 <Cheibriados> 03Keskitalo02 07* 0.16-a0-3197-g5046a99: Small documentation corrections. 10(15 minutes ago, 2 files, 2+ 2-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=5046a994ed49
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14:19:48 <gammafunk> !lg wheals
14:19:49 <Sequell> 3344. wheals the Tainter (L19 FoVM of Ru), blasted by a salamander mystic (burning poison) on Snake:5 (snake_pit_salamanders_mu) on 2014-12-17 17:06:36, with 181694 points after 50651 turns and 2:09:25.
14:20:05 <gammafunk> rip
14:20:15 <PleasingFungus> that seems
14:20:17 <PleasingFungus> ironic
14:20:31 <PleasingFungus> Keskitalo: thanks :)
14:20:52 <PleasingFungus> missed those when I was changing it from an actor& to a mon_info*
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14:27:48 <|amethyst> gammafunk:  {1}--{4} are the date components
14:27:57 <|amethyst> gammafunk:  you need that to get the right morgue file
14:28:10 <gammafunk> |amethyst: yes, I'm asking about what goes in the toml config
14:28:19 <gammafunk> we need to add a per-game morgue url thing
14:28:24 <gammafunk> that's used as a template for this
14:28:35 <gammafunk> but I'm not sure how general said config thing should be
14:28:40 <|amethyst> ah, yeah
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14:28:59 <|amethyst> ah, just a template for the directory that can have username plugged in
14:29:06 <|amethyst> then something else can be responsible for computing the filename
14:29:15 <gammafunk> ok, yeah that was my thought
14:29:30 <gammafunk> that only the username would be a thing the admin cared about, not any of the other components
14:29:51 <|amethyst> on most systems it wouldn't even need to be per-game
14:29:58 <|amethyst> but on some it might
14:30:03 <|amethyst> depending on whether morgues are split
14:30:19 <|amethyst> hmm
14:30:20 <gammafunk> but you think that's the right approach, specifying this per game definition?
14:30:22 <|amethyst> actually
14:31:28 <|amethyst> hm
14:31:30 <gammafunk> |amethyst: fwiw, this is the commit of dplusplus I started from https://github.com/dplusplus/patched-dcss-webtile/commit/68cc693be9c049957530fb0b12e0c2f674b7f012
14:31:58 <gammafunk> score_handler.py does the morgue resolution part to pass to the top-N.html render
14:32:21 <|amethyst> gammafunk:  you could simplify things somewhat if you are willing to make assumptions about how much will be shared and at what level
14:32:32 <gammafunk> hrm, what do you mean?
14:32:42 <|amethyst> gammafunk:  so there would just be one config option for "morgues URL", and the per-game morgue_path would be appended to that
14:32:53 <|amethyst> gammafunk:  but that might be too much to assume
14:32:54 <gammafunk> oh, I see
14:33:06 <|amethyst> in particular, it does assume that morgue_path is relative
14:33:09 <gammafunk> let me see how lld is actually set up
14:33:13 <gammafunk> since it's using this code
14:33:16 <|amethyst> and I guess on the servers it is usually not
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14:34:21 <|amethyst> it would be nice to have a _url option corresponding to each of  rcfile_path, macro_path, ttyrc_path, and morgue_path
14:34:30 <|amethyst> s/ttyrc/ttyrec/
14:35:00 <gammafunk> |amethyst: well, if I start with a per-game full def. of morgue url, that is certainly flexible enough, and we can generalize it more later?
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14:35:20 <gammafunk> looks like dplusplus uses one dir for morgues for all version
14:35:33 <Ironfoot> When will we get twitch emotes for irc and crawl servers?
14:35:49 <gammafunk> oh no
14:35:51 <gammafunk> he doesn't
14:40:56 <Ironfoot> Has anybody ever used Passwall?
14:41:02 <PleasingFungus> Yes.
14:41:16 <|amethyst> gammafunk:  yeah, per-game URL with a field for user name is sufficiently general, and if it's too general that's not a huge deal
14:42:00 <theTower> passwall: stabbing, formicid escapes, weird vault relationships
14:42:00 <Sequell> theTower: You have 2 messages. Use !messages to read them.
14:42:26 <gammafunk> |amethyst: one last question, dplusplus has a special handler for morgues you can see here: http://lazy-life.ddo.jp:8080/morgue/dplusplus/dplusplus.txt
14:42:31 <Ironfoot> thy for your teachings dev masters
14:42:51 <gammafunk> shows nice links at the top, but I'm not sure if there issues with this in terms of getting the raw morgue
14:43:02 <theTower> man, not even a dinner first
14:43:16 <|amethyst> gammafunk:  yeah, I would use separate paths for that if anything
14:43:23 <|amethyst> gammafunk:  or maybe foo.html vs foo.txt
14:43:27 <gammafunk> alright, I'll keep that in mind, thanks
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15:04:32 <Marbit> If it can be answered simply... which files do I need to modify to make a god that does nothing?
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15:06:05 <read> You can probably just look for the commit that added a recent god.
15:06:11 <read> like the main dith commit
15:06:33 <read> There will probably be a bunch of other related commits but I think all the core stuff is in the first one.
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15:07:37 <doy> %git 2b4cfd2
15:07:37 <Cheibriados> 07Lasty02 * 0.16-a0-2372-g2b4cfd2: Backtracking god initial commit. 10(4 weeks ago, 12 files, 34+ 2-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=2b4cfd280b95
15:08:34 <Marbit> Thanks! thanks read, thanks doy!
15:10:03 <edlothiol> !tell chequers isn't envoy.run going to block the server? and I'd prefer not introducing additional dependencies unless it's really necessary
15:10:03 <Sequell> edlothiol: OK, I'll let chequers know.
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16:48:33 <Nunya> hey guys, what's the best place for bug reports? I've been noticing an issue where the game sometimes thinks I'm holding ctrl when I'm not (this does not happen in other programs, ofc). It started up sometime in the past month, and I've only noticed it in the windows builds so far
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16:51:25 <theTower> ??mantis
16:51:25 <Sequell> mantis[1/2]: To report bugs or submit new content like vaults, patches or tiles, go to: http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/main_page.php
16:52:31 <geekosaur> this starts to sound like sdl2 has some general input handling problem. (which could be anything from bad logic to something uninitialized and random...)
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17:11:56 <Lantell> Unstable branch on crawl.lantea.net updated to: 0.16-a0-3197-g5046a99 (34)
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17:25:22 <Cheibriados> 03|amethyst02 07* 0.16-a0-3198-gf48f3ff: Initialise bolt::can_see_invis and nightvision. 10(4 minutes ago, 1 file, 6+ 7-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=f48f3ffc0298
17:25:28 <|amethyst> There's another valgrind warning:
17:25:29 <|amethyst> ==8908== Invalid read of size 1
17:25:29 <|amethyst> ==8908==    at 0x8F6F9F7: InventoryRegion::pack_buffers() (tilereg-inv.cc:65)
17:25:36 <|amethyst> ==8908==  Address 0x7936968 is 0 bytes after a block of size 72 alloc'd
17:25:40 <|amethyst> ==8908==    by 0x8F6EE24: GridRegion::on_resize() (tilereg-grid.cc:60)
17:26:04 <|amethyst> m_flavour is allocated to be mx*my bytes
17:26:45 <|amethyst> but pack_buffers is indexing it with something that could theoretically be mx*my*(m_grid_page+1)
17:26:56 <|amethyst> at least here it seems to be one over mx*my
17:27:15 <|amethyst> anyway, must be goingt
17:27:20 <|amethyst> s/t$//
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17:38:20 <chequers> edlothiol: oh, I thought tornado was magically non-blocking. so requests are processed in serial? hmmm
17:38:21 <Sequell> chequers: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it.
17:38:45 <Grunt> tornado can go through walls, so it can't be non-blocking...........
17:38:46 <Grunt> <_<
17:38:46 <chequers> replacing envoy is simple enough, so not worried about using Popen
17:40:42 <gammafunk> |amethyst: Unforseen consequence of using a special pre-commit hook, when working on webtiles-changes, which doesn't have -m for checkwhite/unbrace, I get a warning about m being unknown options
17:41:11 <gammafunk> |amethyst: I guess since it's just a warning, it's not a problem, and I'm not sure if there's some general solution to the problem of when your pre-commit hook calls stuff in the repo :)
17:41:25 <gammafunk> or any hook, for that matter
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18:15:53 <travis-ci> The build was broken. (master - f48f3ff #1167 : Neil Moore): http://travis-ci.org/crawl-ref/crawl-ref/builds/44395854
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18:41:39 <Cheibriados> 03Lasty02 07* 0.16-a0-3199-g8dbd366: Fix a Ru typo (fearitself) 10(3 minutes ago, 1 file, 2+ 2-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=8dbd3660273b
18:42:32 <Grunt> ruined.
18:42:39 <Grunt> Lasty: how goes the wayfaring
18:43:58 <Cheibriados> flayed ghost (05W) | Spd: 10 | HD: 11 | HP: 49-73 | AC/EV: 0/14 | Dam: 30 | 07undead, 10doors, evil, lev | Res: 06magic(60), 09poison+++, 12drown, 04rot+++, 13neg+++, 13torm, 04napalm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 710 | Sp: flay [06!sil] | Sz: Medium | Int: normal.

18:43:58 <gammafunk> %??flayed_ghost
18:44:05 <gammafunk> !haunt Grunt
18:44:05 <Sequell> gammafunk casts a spell at Grunt Insubstantial figures form in the air. The freezing wraith hits Grunt! x3 The phantasmal warrior hits Grunt! x5
18:44:10 <gammafunk> Grunt: those are all W
18:44:15 <Grunt> !
18:44:44 <gammafunk> fr: all gods have a god wrath where they summon high-level monsters of their first letter
18:44:53 <Grunt> ha
18:45:10 * Grunt calls down the wrath of Ashenzari against gammafunk. 27 seraphim come into view.
18:45:32 <gammafunk> ...wait do we have two S gods or two T gods?
18:45:36 <Lasty> > caustc shrikes
18:45:43 <gammafunk> the shining one, sif muna, trog?
18:45:45 <Lasty> TSO is "1"
18:45:52 <gammafunk> dang
18:46:18 <Lasty> Grunt: It goes well. I'm just waiting for experimental branch.
18:46:39 <gammafunk> heh, kiku summoning kobolds
18:46:46 <Lasty> Though I still think I may implement the "plant a flag" piety gain
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18:46:52 <ontoclasm> fr a god whose name starts with ;
18:46:54 <Grunt> oh right, I was going to make you a flag-altar
18:46:58 <Grunt> or maybe ontoclasm can do it
18:47:04 <gammafunk> ontoclasm: god that starts with *
18:47:06 <Grunt> or roctavian maybe
18:47:08 <ontoclasm> i can
18:47:38 <Grunt> ontoclasm, did you see the terrible tile I made a couple of nights ago
18:47:43 <ontoclasm> which
18:47:46 <Grunt> dang.
18:47:53 <Grunt> dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/5494313/guess_who2.png
18:47:56 <Grunt> er
18:47:58 <Grunt> http://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/5494313/guess_who2.png
18:48:00 <Lasty> Your tile caused ontoclasm to black out!
18:48:12 <ontoclasm> ...frederick?
18:48:15 <Grunt> correct
18:48:18 <ontoclasm> mm
18:48:34 <Grunt> (it's actually not as bad as I remember)
18:48:36 <ontoclasm> looks good, though i'd try to change the shading on the pants
18:48:39 <Grunt> ya
18:48:52 <Grunt> the earlier version looked considerably more hilarious
18:48:54 <Grunt> (remove the 2)
18:50:13 <ontoclasm> mmm
18:50:20 <ontoclasm> what sort of flag did you want?
18:50:25 <ontoclasm> like... what should be on it?
18:50:38 <Grunt> I kind of envisioned it as ... footsteps
18:50:39 <Grunt> :)
18:50:51 <Grunt> a set of stairs with an X over them >_>
18:51:07 <Lasty> A boot would work . . .
18:51:18 * Grunt gives Lasty the boot.
18:51:20 <Lasty> Travel-stained would also be fine
18:51:31 <gammafunk> Grunt: I like it. Only the cape could maybe be better. I guess the legs are supposed to be some kind of gold chain mail, but yeah you could change that too
18:51:40 <ontoclasm> what color?
18:51:52 <Lasty> Hey, my boot! Where'd you get that?
18:51:52 <ontoclasm> last time i asked it was red white and blue
18:51:59 <Grunt> <gammafunk> Grunt: I like it
18:52:01 <gammafunk> murica
18:52:03 <Grunt> you just like badtiles <_<
18:52:09 <gammafunk> Grunt: it's not bad!
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18:52:15 <gammafunk> it's a pretty clean little tile
18:52:23 <Grunt> hence your obsession with J�rmungandr!!!!
18:52:25 <Bloaxzorro> why frederick
18:52:28 <ontoclasm> and like... what's the theme here, is W an angry god or a friendly helpful god or what
18:52:30 <Lasty> ontoclasm: yeah, specifically the lights forms, blue primary. But we could change the colors to match what you draw.
18:52:31 <Bloaxzorro> when it could instead be harold
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18:52:44 <gammafunk> maybe the boot shading could be tweaked some, but it's a very solid effort
18:52:46 <ontoclasm> Bloaxzorro: i have Plans for harold
18:52:47 <Grunt> Frederick's current tile does not reflect his current upgrades <3
18:53:04 <Bloaxzorro> what are his upgrades
18:53:07 <Grunt> (I also like the idea of Frederick towering over everyone, befitting his status)
18:53:11 <ontoclasm> he's a demigod
18:53:15 <Lasty> ontoclasm: is a non-evil god that likes exploration. Themes include seeing new things, journeys, endurance
18:53:15 <gammafunk> well feddie doesn't have *golden* armour
18:53:16 <Grunt> with Spellforged Servitor
18:53:17 <Grunt> and plate mail
18:53:29 <Grunt> gammafunk: sure he does!!!!!!
18:53:29 <Grunt> <_< >_>
18:53:37 <Bloaxzorro> technically then artifact plate is golden
18:53:44 <gammafunk> Grunt: would be funny if we made an unrand plate armour after him
18:53:51 <gammafunk> do we do that for uniques? hm
18:53:55 <gammafunk> guess we don't really
18:54:00 <Bloaxzorro> ??hat of pondering
18:54:00 <Sequell> hat of pondering[1/2]: +3 hat with {ponderousness}, MR+, +5 int and +10 MP. Sometimes Gastronok is wearing it!
18:54:03 <gammafunk> oh boris' knife
18:54:14 <gammafunk> yeah but the hat isn't named after gastro
18:54:18 <gammafunk> he's just likely to have it
18:54:22 <Grunt> no no no no no
18:54:29 <Grunt> Frederick's artefact is
18:54:30 <gammafunk> I guess even the knife isn't *named* after boris
18:54:30 <Grunt> his monocle
18:54:33 <Bloaxzorro> it's also enchanted to protect against salt
18:54:45 <gammafunk> uh oh, Grunt is adding an eyewhere slot
18:54:49 <gammafunk> I knew it would happen
18:54:52 <gammafunk> *eyewear
18:54:59 <gammafunk> eye? where?
18:55:01 <Bloaxzorro> eyes of the overworld are go
18:55:46 <gammafunk> Grunt: I'm probably going to merge this after testing: https://gitorious.org/crawl/javascript-perf/commit/25416bbd1ca2713709938311134e87018a6900a7
18:55:53 <gammafunk> but I can't do anything with the merge request
18:56:02 <gammafunk> on gitorious, that is
18:56:17 <Grunt> oh
18:56:21 <Grunt> okay
18:56:31 <Grunt> I wonder if I can do anything with it
18:56:40 <Grunt> i.e. can I tell gitorious to merge it
18:57:19 <gammafunk> hrm, well don't do anything quite yet, I just need to test really quick
18:57:40 <gammafunk> travis won't help terribly a lot with testing something like this
18:57:43 <Grunt> yeah, I'm just looking at the interface
18:57:53 <Grunt> looks like I just have the option to open or close it
18:58:03 <Grunt> so yeah, just ping me if/when you do something with it
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19:03:07 <Cheibriados> 03Austin Appleby02 {gammafunk} 07* 0.16-a0-3200-g93d1bf1: Replace a very expensive Object.keys() call with a simple counter 10(2 weeks ago, 1 file, 7+ 6-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=93d1bf15efe1
19:03:12 <gammafunk> Grunt: PINGGGGGGGGGG
19:03:15 <Grunt> gammafunk: pong
19:03:24 <gammafunk> ??gong
19:03:25 <Sequell> GONNNNG!
19:03:25 <Sequell> shield of the gong[1/3]: +18 shield {rElec rN+ MR+ EV-5} This shield will surely be heard!
19:03:47 <Grunt> gammafunk: imo also edit CREDITS.TXT :)
19:03:59 <gammafunk> I guess that is our policy now
19:05:02 * gammafunk recites a lengthy sermon about the long gone days when apostles received entry to CREDITS.txt only after many commits! ##crawl-dev is stunned!
19:05:55 <Grunt> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/5494313/frederick3.png
19:07:12 <Lightli> is he wearing GDA
19:07:26 <edlothiol> chequers: yeah, you have to do the asynchronous stuff using callbacks (or coroutines (rewriting the server stuff to use coroutines is also a TODO)). we even already have a non-blocking version of subprocess.check_output in checkoutput.py
19:07:31 <Lightli> (like the Tiamat of old before draconians lost the ability to wear body armor, forcing her to get a sweet cloak instead)
19:09:07 <Grunt> I should see how this looks in game
19:10:00 <Bloaxzorro> well holidays start tomorrow for me
19:10:09 <Bloaxzorro> so you can probably throw it my way and get something for once
19:10:16 <Bloaxzorro> it's been a while
19:10:21 <Grunt> imo make extremely ugly thing tiles
19:10:21 <Grunt> <_<
19:10:25 <edlothiol> chequers: also, newer versions of tornado have a replacement for Popen
19:10:45 <Bloaxzorro> well unlike extremely ugly things this is actually going into the game!!!
19:11:06 <Bloaxzorro> also why have i been up for 23 hours now
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19:11:27 <Grunt> oh this is amusing
19:11:33 <Grunt> the weapon offset is the same as for the demigod tile
19:11:38 <Grunt> apropos!!!
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19:12:40 <chequers> edlothiol: i'm just reading about tornado.gen stuff now. This sort of coding is new to me so might ping you for help
19:12:55 <Grunt> (and now we will hear about grand plans to make extremely ugly things viable somehow)
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19:18:53 <Grunt> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/5494313/freddie_action.png
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19:20:57 <ontoclasm> legs still look pretty flat, remember that they're basically cylinders so the part facing the light should be much brighter than the rest
19:21:03 <johnstein> almost looks like Duke Nukem
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19:21:25 <johnstein> Frederick says: Come get some!
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19:22:38 <johnstein> pixel art is brutal. I've done a few neat ones (not for crawl) but man it takes me FOR EV ER
19:22:55 <johnstein> and I keep forgetting how Less is More
19:23:16 <ontoclasm> less is morrrrrre
19:23:32 <ontoclasm> do it wth 8 colorrrrrrs
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19:23:41 <travis-ci> The build was fixed. (master - 8dbd366 #1168 : Corin Buchanan-Howland): http://travis-ci.org/crawl-ref/crawl-ref/builds/44401745
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19:29:44 <Grunt> hm let's try a different approach
19:30:25 <Grunt> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/5494313/frederick4.png
19:30:31 <Grunt> feel like it might need more contrast
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19:31:03 <ontoclasm> better, and yeah, more contrast is good
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19:36:30 <Grunt> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/5494313/frederick5.png
19:36:45 <Grunt> the chain is looking more like I imagined it :)
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19:40:24 <wheals> johnstein: i was wondering if i was the only one thinking of duke nukem
19:40:30 <Grunt> It's the hair.
19:40:40 <wheals> the flat head, more
19:40:46 <wheals> i guess that's part of the hair
19:40:47 <Grunt> The hairstyle, I should say <_<
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19:43:22 <wheals> feel like the waist still looks weird
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19:43:29 <wheals> but i'm just a dirty consoleplayer
19:44:11 <ontoclasm> wheals: '@'
19:44:24 <wheals> ontoclasm: perfect
19:44:32 <Grunt> imo make a Donald tile that incorporates an @
19:44:43 <ontoclasm> could put it on his shield
19:44:46 <Grunt> !
19:44:49 <wheals> @ looks kind of like a shield, yeah
19:44:49 <Grunt> perfect
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19:48:04 <claws> where's the pan lord body that looks like a &
19:48:13 -!- claws is now known as theTower
19:50:32 <wheals> need to make wall tiles with # designs on them
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19:53:10 <Grunt> doy: Tar Serpent spotted
19:53:19 <Grunt> (ahabkang on cao)
19:56:05 <Grunt> rip
19:56:50 <wheals> !lm * uniq~~serpent
19:56:58 <Sequell> 6197. [2014-12-18 01:55:05] ahabkang the Heavyweight Champion (L27 TrMo of Makhleb) killed the Serpent of Hell on turn 141019. (Tar:7)
19:57:08 <wheals> aha
19:57:23 <gammafunk> Grunt: when you work on this, do you zoom into mega huge pixels and place individual pixels carefully, then zoom out to see the effect?
19:57:30 <gammafunk> I'm curious about how work on tiles like that proceeds
19:57:50 <ontoclasm> i have it open in three different windows
19:58:05 <gammafunk> ontoclasm: different zooms?
19:58:09 <ontoclasm> yeah
19:58:19 <ontoclasm> 1x, 2x, and like 12x
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19:58:42 <gammafunk> do you always make changes in 1x?
19:58:59 <ontoclasm> other way around, i look at the 1x one and click on the 12x
19:59:13 <gammafunk> ok, the 12x one means huge pixels then?
19:59:20 <ontoclasm> yeah
19:59:20 <gammafunk> yeah, right heh
19:59:21 <gammafunk> that would make more sense
19:59:54 <gammafunk> I keep thinking "it's 32x32, so pixels are big when you open it"
20:00:00 <gammafunk> but those are 32 ordinary pixels
20:00:09 <ontoclasm> mm
20:00:50 <gammafunk> Grunt: the outline I think you added helps with the boots, their shading looks better in general
20:01:35 <gammafunk> maybe it doesn't have *quite* the personality of some unique tiles, but it's no (typical) Grunt tile!
20:01:58 <gammafunk> I guess he could get like better-defined eye colour
20:02:03 <Grunt> !send gammafunk personality
20:02:03 <Sequell> Sending personality to gammafunk.
20:02:10 <Grunt> I was thinking about making the monocle fancier
20:02:11 <gammafunk> do demigods have like golden, glowing eyes
20:02:12 <Grunt> <_< >_>
20:02:18 <gammafunk> oh the monocle, that's why
20:02:33 <gammafunk> yeah sadly you can't really see that it's a monocle
20:02:38 <johnstein> I can't see the monocle
20:02:42 <Grunt> (that head is from the old tile fwiw)
20:02:53 <gammafunk> oh wow, is it
20:04:54 <gammafunk> ok
20:05:17 <gammafunk> we need to draft an official DCSS Developer Team response to this: https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=14446
20:05:40 <gammafunk> No option should be off the (metal) table
20:08:09 <Grunt> Margery and the Hell Knights have all the metal we need.
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20:08:15 <travis-ci> The build was fixed. (master - 93d1bf1 #1169 : Austin Appleby): http://travis-ci.org/crawl-ref/crawl-ref/builds/44403393
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20:08:19 <gammafunk> oh, well I'll delete it then
20:09:06 -!- Zermako_ has quit []
20:09:17 <gammafunk> thanks austin
20:12:50 <Cheibriados> 03gammafunk02 07* 0.16-a0-3201-gcf1f9e8: Add Austin Appleby to CREDITS.txt 10(59 seconds ago, 1 file, 1+ 0-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=cf1f9e8c2818
20:13:18 <|amethyst> gammafunk:  does Austin Appleby use IRC or mantis?
20:13:23 <|amethyst> or tavern?
20:13:33 <gammafunk> |amethyst: afaik, no
20:13:46 <gammafunk> the only communication has been a gitorious merge request :)
20:13:54 <gammafunk> not even sure if said merge request had a message
20:14:06 <gammafunk> so you could say we've only communicated via commit messages
20:14:46 <gammafunk> |amethyst: are you worried about adding real names to e.g.credits, or did you just want to add a mailmap entry if that's relevant?
20:14:46 <|amethyst> tempted to put his gitorious username in the mailmap
20:14:51 <|amethyst> mailmap
20:14:59 <|amethyst> it's just jarring to see real names coming from Chei :)
20:15:04 <gammafunk> ah
20:15:08 <gammafunk> well I say go ahead
20:15:26 <gammafunk> or I guess I could to get a whopping *TWO* commits in today
20:15:35 <gammafunk> coding up a storm over here
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20:17:57 <Cheibriados> PATCH: new option ability_slot 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=9340 by Sandman25
20:18:32 <gammafunk> will the slots never end?!
20:18:39 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev
20:19:27 <nicolae-> well, you know, slots are addictive
20:19:36 <gammafunk> !send nicolae- 777
20:19:37 <Sequell> Sending 777 to nicolae-.
20:19:44 <nicolae-> jackpot!
20:19:59 <Grunt> gammafunk: guess what colour eyes the demigod tile has
20:20:16 <gammafunk> ...goin' with.....BLUE
20:20:19 <nicolae-> i wish there were some way to gamble your money but i guess that would just lead to players dumping coin after coin into the gambling den or whatever
20:20:20 <Grunt> NOPE
20:20:22 <gammafunk> DANG
20:20:24 <nicolae-> WHITE
20:20:28 <Grunt> N
20:20:29 <Grunt> OPE
20:20:34 <gammafunk> YELLER
20:20:38 <Grunt> NOPE
20:20:55 <nicolae-> ULTRAVIOLET
20:20:58 <Grunt> CLOSE
20:21:06 <gammafunk> lightmagenta
20:21:11 <Grunt> more or less
20:21:13 <Grunt> !
20:21:18 <nicolae-> hey, me too
20:21:20 <gammafunk> well, purple eyes
20:21:25 <gammafunk> it's very japanese video game
20:21:33 <gammafunk> give them blue hair imho
20:21:52 <ontoclasm> i've been working to make crawl as anime as possible
20:21:52 <gammafunk> 20XD6!
20:21:55 <ontoclasm> vis: margery
20:22:08 <nicolae-> Goku Form
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20:22:10 <nicolae-> somebody make it happen
20:22:15 <gammafunk> ontoclasm: also ckr helped with orc warlord
20:22:46 <ontoclasm> yes
20:23:19 <gammafunk> yeah phantasmal warriors are kind of anime, also kind of that martian from looney toones though
20:24:09 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund]
20:24:17 <ontoclasm> oh, i forgot phantasmal warriors
20:24:30 <nicolae-> The phantasmal warrior wields the Eludium Q-36 Explosive Space Modulator!
20:26:53 <gammafunk> oh, no! better use my E-tank and then switch to Metal Blade!
20:27:16 <nicolae-> i think we might be getting our references crossed
20:27:26 <nicolae-> also: metal blade was sweet as hell, fr: metal blade
20:27:36 <gammafunk> well we have arc blade
20:27:40 <gammafunk> so why not
20:28:08 <ontoclasm> nicolae-: urand throwing weapon
20:28:28 <ontoclasm> tomahawk of penetration & returning
20:28:33 <Grunt> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/5494313/frederick6.png
20:29:02 <nicolae-> dude's lookin' a little zapp branigan
20:30:49 <Grunt> Presumably his tactics are slightly better <_<
20:31:30 <nicolae-> throws wave after wave of his own men at you until your kill count variable flips over and the game crashes
20:31:35 <Grunt> ha.
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20:31:56 <gammafunk> Grunt: I guess a black monocle outline wouldn't work with a head that small?
20:32:06 <gammafunk> doesn't eustaschio have one?
20:32:22 <gammafunk> oh, nope
20:32:23 <nicolae-> give all uniques monocles
20:32:25 <gammafunk> just a 'stash
20:34:01 <gammafunk> !lg * ikiller=frederick
20:34:01 <Sequell> 645. Tollund the Phalangite (L20 MfSk of Cheibriados), blasted by a spellforged servitor (iron shot) (summoned by Frederick) on Vaults:2 on 2014-12-17 22:18:52, with 276056 points after 45533 turns and 4:42:54.
20:34:05 <gammafunk> DANG
20:34:11 <gammafunk> !lg * ikiller=frederick -2
20:34:11 <Sequell> 644/645. dakillakan the Devastator (L21 DsFE of Qazlal), blasted by a spellforged servitor (bolt of cold) (summoned by Frederick) on Vaults:2 on 2014-12-16 23:39:59, with 362166 points after 72864 turns and 14:14:47.
20:34:14 <Grunt> !!
20:34:15 <gammafunk> my my
20:34:20 <gammafunk> !lg * ikiller=frederick -tv
20:34:21 <Sequell> 645. Tollund, XL20 MfSk, T:45533 requested for FooTV: telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org.
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20:34:29 <Grunt> %git HEAD^{/ervitor}
20:34:30 <Cheibriados> 07gammafunk02 * 0.16-a0-2999-gb69e976: Give Frederick Spellforged Servitor and armour more befitting a demigod 10(11 days ago, 2 files, 2+ 6-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=b69e976af729
20:34:43 <Grunt> !lg * cikiller=Frederick vlong>=0.16-a0-2999-gb69e976 1
20:34:43 <Sequell> 1/6. runewalsh the Sensei (L27 OpTm of Ashenzari), blasted by a spellforged servitor (orb of energy) (summoned by Frederick) on Tomb:3 (tomb_3) on 2014-12-10 03:20:18, with 670596 points after 59188 turns and 5:06:44.
20:34:47 <Grunt> ! ! ! ! ! !
20:35:06 <nicolae-> damn, that spellforged servitor is really working for frederick
20:35:14 <nicolae-> i mean... do we even really *need* frederick at all...
20:35:14 <Grunt> excellent
20:35:15 <gammafunk> tomb:3, nice
20:35:21 <nicolae-> new unique, rogue spellforged servitor
20:35:33 * Grunt kicks termcast.develz.org
20:35:35 <Grunt> let me in!!!
20:36:38 <gammafunk> rip
20:36:48 <Grunt> that damage
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20:37:02 <gammafunk> !lg * cikiller=Frederick vlong>=0.16-a0-2999-gb69e976 1 -tv
20:37:03 <Sequell> 1/6. runewalsh, XL27 OpTm, T:59188 requested for FooTV: telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org.
20:37:05 <Grunt> !lg * cikiller=Frederick vlong>=0.16-a0-2999-gb69e976 2 -tv
20:37:05 <Sequell> 2/6. Schizzik, XL27 GrGl, T:58493 requested for FooTV: telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org.
20:37:07 <Grunt> !lg * cikiller=Frederick vlong>=0.16-a0-2999-gb69e976 3 -tv
20:37:07 <Sequell> 3/6. Photonic, XL20 DECj, T:71081 requested for FooTV: telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org.
20:37:08 <Grunt> !lg * cikiller=Frederick vlong>=0.16-a0-2999-gb69e976 4 -tv
20:37:09 <Sequell> 4/6. nznznm, XL19 DgGl, T:45889 requested for FooTV: telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org.
20:37:09 <Grunt> !lg * cikiller=Frederick vlong>=0.16-a0-2999-gb69e976 5 -tv
20:37:10 <Sequell> 5/6. dakillakan, XL21 DsFE, T:72864 requested for FooTV: telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org.
20:37:11 <Grunt> muhahahahaha
20:37:22 <gammafunk> should have done channel=fredtv
20:37:22 <Grunt> this one is boring
20:38:11 <gammafunk> haha
20:38:35 <gammafunk> I dunno, random tele near death next to freddie
20:38:41 <gammafunk> pretty funny on tomb:3
20:38:48 <gammafunk> not the way you *think* you're gonna go out
20:39:46 <nicolae-> just out of curiosity, what areas could use more non-decor vaults? lately i've been thinking about more vaults with enemies in 'em
20:39:59 <Grunt> nicolae-: make a Spider ending or two or three
20:39:59 <Grunt> :)
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20:40:16 <nicolae-> i've been thinking about that
20:40:40 <ontoclasm> slime as well
20:40:42 <gammafunk> Bad Decisions
20:40:56 <gammafunk> woah, a new slime end?
20:41:08 <nicolae-> i thought the general dev consensus was it's okay for slime to just have one end
20:41:08 <gammafunk> that's No Small Task
20:41:46 <gammafunk> I think if you made a really good map it'd be possible, but it's also hard to imagine what would be substantively different yet as effective
20:41:53 <Grunt> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/5494313/frederick7.png
20:42:01 <Grunt> tried adjusting the colouration around the monocle a bit
20:42:05 <Grunt> outlining it doesn't really work here
20:42:06 <read> why does it have to be substantively different
20:42:11 <read> vs just cosmetically
20:42:38 -!- scummos__ has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds]
20:42:51 <gammafunk> read: if it's cosmetically different we'd have one map and use subst etc to change the cosmetics
20:43:04 <gammafunk> the whole point of a different map is that the map is different
20:43:07 <read> ah, i forgot that functionality existed
20:43:15 <read> yeah, my mistake
20:44:37 <gammafunk> You resist. You die
20:44:40 <nicolae-> well, i'll probably just try spider ends first anyway
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20:51:12 <Grunt> :)
20:51:14 <nicolae-> spider end... with the lernaean hydra
20:51:17 <nicolae-> mind. blown.
20:51:18 <Grunt> . . .
20:51:41 <Grunt> clearly I need to get some of those Spider enemy designs off the ground
20:51:45 <Jafet> The 27-legged Lernaean Spider
20:51:47 <Grunt> spark wasps, storm somethings >_>
20:51:58 <nicolae-> spider that lays corrosive webs
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20:52:05 <nicolae-> er, spins is the verb i'm looking for there
20:53:36 <Grunt> stinging spinners
20:54:59 <nicolae-> spider that raises other spiders from the dead
20:55:31 <Grunt> soul spiders?
20:55:43 <nicolae-> perhaps. perhaps.
20:56:06 <gammafunk> oh, Grunt
20:56:11 <Grunt> ?
20:56:13 <gammafunk> doesn't Gloorx have...
20:56:18 <nicolae-> maybe some weird thing where it lays eggs in a corpse, and the babby spiders make the corpse walk around, and then when you kill the corpse the baby spiders hop out and you have to fight them too
20:56:18 <gammafunk> ....*spider* legs?
20:56:33 <gammafunk> some kind of spider demon thing!
20:56:35 <nicolae-> i get what you're saying
20:56:37 <gammafunk> that's all I have
20:56:39 <nicolae-> put Gloorx in spider
20:56:42 <gammafunk> yessss
20:56:44 <Grunt> clearly Gloorx needs
20:56:45 <Grunt> a chaingun
20:56:53 <gammafunk> rip players
20:56:58 <nicolae-> more like
20:57:00 <Grunt> yeah rip
20:57:00 <nicolae-> rip and tear players
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20:57:39 <travis-ci> The build has errored. (master - cf1f9e8 #1170 : gammafunk): http://travis-ci.org/crawl-ref/crawl-ref/builds/44407788
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20:58:00 <Grunt> !blame travis
20:58:00 <Sequell> I pronounce travis... Guilty!
20:58:02 <ontoclasm> arachnomancer
20:58:21 <Cheibriados> arachnomancer (07e) | Spd: 10 | HD: 9 | HP: 42-57 | AC/EV: 0/13 | Dam: 5 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, spellcaster | Res: 06magic(80) | XP: 698 | Sp: blink, sum.vermin | Sz: Medium | Int: high.

20:58:21 <Jafet> %??deep elf summoner name:arachnomancer
20:58:45 <nicolae-> water strider spider
20:59:04 <gammafunk> camel spiders for the new desert branch
20:59:17 <gammafunk> alternatively caramel spiders for the new dessert branch
20:59:47 <nicolae-> giant mechanical spider
21:00:06 <gammafunk> but the cyberdemon is the real boss amirite
21:00:43 <nicolae-> actually the real boss is yourself
21:00:52 <nicolae-> you must confront your own need to kill
21:01:27 <nicolae-> alternate win condition, meditate and transcend your own need to kill and steal
21:01:40 <nicolae-> You have reached Enlightenment!
21:01:48 <Jafet> GD1G<
21:02:56 * ontoclasm picks up a stone.
21:03:01 * ontoclasm has escaped!
21:03:20 <nicolae-> zen god
21:03:21 <nicolae-> somehow
21:03:45 <ontoclasm> Does this giant newt have the buddha-nature?
21:04:05 <ontoclasm> ru is sort of a zen god
21:04:17 <Lasty> true
21:04:30 <nicolae-> ru strikes me as more of a gnostic god than zen
21:04:37 <ontoclasm> hm
21:04:42 <nicolae-> though i suppose they are pretty similar
21:04:45 <Lasty> The theme for Ru may have come about not long after reading a book about the history of doubt . . .
21:05:32 <gammafunk> fr: god of absolute certainty
21:05:34 <gammafunk> wait, we have trog
21:05:57 <nicolae-> ru combined three ideas i'd been thinking about for gods. gnosticism, sacrifices, and permanent effects even after leaving the god. and in a much better way than i would have thought of. in conclusion i hate lasty forever.
21:06:38 <Lasty> nicolae-: thanks!
21:06:52 <Lasty> Hatred is the sincerest form of flattery
21:07:06 <gammafunk> I dunno, lasty and I agree a lot about gameplay, but maybe we differ on gods
21:07:09 <nicolae-> it's true, you jerk.
21:07:22 <gammafunk> Lasty: what's your top 5 most fun god list (excluding ru/W)
21:08:00 <Lasty> ??gods
21:08:00 <Sequell> gods[1/2]: '?' '/' 'G' for a complete list (in game). Type "??<full god name> reasons" (in IRC) to get a list of reasons which might motivate you to worship that particular god.
21:08:07 <Lasty> er, looking for the list
21:08:12 <read> ??gods[2
21:08:12 <Sequell> gods[2/2]: Ashenzari, Beogh, Cheibriados, Dithmenos, Elyvilon, Fedhas, Gozag, Jiyva, Kikubaaqudgha, Lugonu, Makhleb, Nemelex Xobeh, Okawaru, Qazlal, Ru, Sif Muna, Trog, Vehumet, Xom, Yredelemnul, Zin, the Shining One.
21:08:13 <read> ^
21:08:41 <Lasty> gammafunk: In no particular order, Dith, Zin, Makhleb, Kiku, Chei
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21:08:51 <Lasty> or maybe Oka instead of Chei
21:09:09 <Lasty> I'm excluding Ru from the list
21:09:12 <Lasty> because obv I think Ru is fun
21:09:17 <gammafunk> not listing Trog is a travesty
21:09:33 <Lasty> I like magic.
21:10:02 <Lasty> what's your top 5, gammafunk?
21:10:14 <Lasty> (feel free to include Ru, multiple times if necessary)
21:10:41 <read> im surprised oka is competing for a slot
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21:10:52 <gammafunk> sif trog makky veh in order...I'd have to really think if there is a fifth I'd genuinely want to play more than once or twice ever
21:11:08 <Lasty> I like Oka in that Oka is straight-forward, now has a decent piety gain condition, and gives you the fun of lottery gifts
21:11:09 <ontoclasm> ash doesn't get in on anybody's?
21:11:27 <Lasty> I don't like having my equipment locked down or fussing with curse scrolls
21:11:29 <gammafunk> veh only because he enables a conj build well, he's not super fun but I don't mind him
21:11:46 <gammafunk> I could list oka for the same reason, but tbh I'd probably rather just go trog or makky there
21:11:50 <Lasty> I like Veh in that Veh does something interesting but gets out of your way
21:12:00 <gammafunk> right, veh is just very functional
21:12:02 <Lasty> !lg gammafunk ru / won
21:12:02 <Sequell> 0/2 games for gammafunk (ru): N=0/2 (0.00%)
21:12:12 <read> :(
21:12:13 <Lasty> !lg gammafunk ru / won s=char
21:12:13 <Sequell> 0/2 games for gammafunk (ru): 0/1x NaWz [0.00%], 0/1x CeAM [0.00%]
21:12:50 <gammafunk> for me ru gives costs that I don't much want or I think are not terribly well suited to the game in exchange for generic power abilities that aren't necesarilly that interesting
21:12:59 <gammafunk> but I do need a Ru win to have a more full opinion
21:13:11 <gammafunk> a bit of "too complicated in general"
21:13:18 <ontoclasm> my only complaint about ru is tahat apoclypse is too much like shatter
21:13:39 <ontoclasm> if it did less damage and was more about the status effects it'd be cooler, imo
21:14:05 <chequers> boost the passive chance to like 95% instead of damage
21:14:06 <|amethyst> Zinpocalypse
21:14:07 <Lasty> There's still time for that :D
21:14:08 <gammafunk> lucy is not bad, but I don't like the disto brand very much. dith was ok, but not sure if I like the gameplay enough to play D again
21:14:18 <Lasty> Oh yeah, Lucy
21:14:22 <Lasty> I like Lucy's abilities
21:14:35 <Lasty> but not distortion :p
21:14:41 <gammafunk> lucy is kind of like a good implementation of ely
21:14:50 <gammafunk> at least in some ways
21:15:10 <gammafunk> self heal is not exactly gate to abyss but
21:15:22 <gammafunk> I guess it's a bit more analogous to zin's abilities
21:15:25 <gammafunk> yeah and I need a zin win
21:15:34 <gammafunk> he def. seems the best designed of the good gods at this point
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21:15:40 <gammafunk> s/he/Zin/
21:15:44 <Lasty> By a huge margin
21:15:48 <chequers> pillars of salt > *
21:15:49 <Lasty> the only good god I enjoy even a little
21:15:57 <Lasty> though the food conduct is a bit obnoxious
21:16:08 <Lasty> But the powers and Invo are interesting
21:16:20 <Lasty> Best Fo god imo
21:16:23 <gammafunk> yeah, I mean mashing through extended with TSO is a fun enough thing, so I don't *hate* TSO, but he does just that one thing
21:16:56 <Lasty> yeah, and frankly that's kind of a lame niche: "God of the Victory Lap"
21:17:01 <gammafunk> hehe, yes
21:17:15 <gammafunk> good phrase
21:17:27 <Lasty> You don't like Dith?
21:17:40 <Lasty> Dith is a close contender for my favorite god that I didn't create.
21:18:05 <johnstein> Sif's Hand never became a thing did it?
21:18:14 <gammafunk> Well my first and only spen was of dith, and I felt like the extra stealth was great, but the actives didn't get a lot of use
21:18:23 <Lasty> Oh yeah, I mostly ignore the actives
21:18:28 <Lasty> but the passives are fantastic!
21:18:42 <Lasty> Enhanced stealth/evo, fog blood!!, and shadow mimic
21:18:49 <Lasty> Shadow mimic can make a big difference
21:19:01 <Lasty> and fog blood might be my favorite defensive power
21:19:01 <gammafunk> yeah, I mean stealth is lovely, but that's a bit boring for a god in the end. I guess the shadow mimic has an effect, but I was stabbingg
21:19:14 <Lasty> Yeah, shadow mimic isn't really for stabbers
21:19:17 <Lasty> it's for everyone else
21:19:18 <gammafunk> yeah fog is a cool effect in general, but my dith game it didn't make much different
21:19:30 <gammafunk> yeah maybe for a non-stabber dith would be more enjoyable
21:20:12 <Lasty> I recommend you give it a try. That's where I've had the most fun with Dith -- 2h melee, ranged, or conjurations with Dith. Of course, I did enjoy shadowstepping into the middle of Sojobo's band and murdering them all in their sleep
21:22:05 <Lasty> anyway, gotta run. Have a good night.
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21:26:44 <gammafunk> !lg * current trunk !boring s=god
21:26:46 <Sequell> 149199 games for * (current trunk !boring): 84903x, 16360x Trog, 8043x Okawaru, 4593x Vehumet, 3999x Lugonu, 3631x Xom, 3067x Cheibriados, 2652x Ru, 2615x Ashenzari, 2615x Sif Muna, 2554x Makhleb, 2145x Dithmenos, 2142x Qazlal, 1527x Yredelemnul, 1345x Kikubaaqudgha, 1328x Gozag, 1316x The Shining One, 1161x Elyvilon, 937x Nemelex Xobeh, 754x Fedhas, 697x Beogh, 613x Zin, 202x Jiyva
21:27:11 <gammafunk> !lg * current trunk !boring s=god god!=
21:27:14 <Sequell> 64296 games for * (current trunk !boring god!=): 16360x Trog, 8043x Okawaru, 4593x Vehumet, 3999x Lugonu, 3631x Xom, 3067x Cheibriados, 2652x Ru, 2615x Ashenzari, 2615x Sif Muna, 2554x Makhleb, 2145x Dithmenos, 2142x Qazlal, 1527x Yredelemnul, 1345x Kikubaaqudgha, 1328x Gozag, 1316x The Shining One, 1161x Elyvilon, 937x Nemelex Xobeh, 754x Fedhas, 697x Beogh, 613x Zin, 202x Jiyva
21:27:42 <Grunt> !lg * current trunk !boring !be !--he !dk s=god
21:27:45 <Sequell> 131226 games for * (current trunk !boring !be !--he !dk): 84782x, 8019x Okawaru, 4589x Vehumet, 3983x Lugonu, 3624x Xom, 3051x Cheibriados, 2643x Ru, 2614x Sif Muna, 2602x Ashenzari, 2482x Makhleb, 2138x Dithmenos, 2132x Qazlal, 1340x Kikubaaqudgha, 1323x Gozag, 1198x The Shining One, 1010x Trog, 935x Nemelex Xobeh, 753x Fedhas, 692x Beogh, 582x Zin, 286x Yredelemnul, 257x Elyvilon, 191x Jiyva
21:27:48 <Grunt> !lg * current trunk !boring !be !--he !dk !ak s=god
21:27:51 <Sequell> 127325 games for * (current trunk !boring !be !--he !dk !ak): 84779x, 8018x Okawaru, 4589x Vehumet, 3624x Xom, 3051x Cheibriados, 2642x Ru, 2614x Sif Muna, 2602x Ashenzari, 2481x Makhleb, 2138x Dithmenos, 2131x Qazlal, 1339x Kikubaaqudgha, 1321x Gozag, 1197x The Shining One, 1010x Trog, 934x Nemelex Xobeh, 753x Fedhas, 692x Beogh, 580x Zin, 286x Yredelemnul, 257x Elyvilon, 190x Jiyva, 97x Lugonu
21:27:51 <Grunt> !lg * current trunk !boring !be !--he !dk !ak !ck s=god
21:27:53 <Sequell> 123861 games for * (current trunk !boring !be !--he !dk !ak !ck): 84739x, 8001x Okawaru, 4582x Vehumet, 3047x Cheibriados, 2635x Ru, 2614x Sif Muna, 2596x Ashenzari, 2470x Makhleb, 2128x Dithmenos, 2127x Qazlal, 1331x Kikubaaqudgha, 1317x Gozag, 1194x The Shining One, 995x Trog, 926x Nemelex Xobeh, 746x Fedhas, 691x Beogh, 567x Zin, 343x Xom, 284x Yredelemnul, 257x Elyvilon, 181x Jiyva, 90x Lugonu
21:28:49 <gammafunk> !lg * current trunk !boring s=god% god!=
21:28:52 <Sequell> 64296 games for * (current trunk !boring god!=): 16360x Trog (25.44%), 8043x Okawaru (12.51%), 4593x Vehumet (7.14%), 3999x Lugonu (6.22%), 3631x Xom (5.65%), 3067x Cheibriados (4.77%), 2652x Ru (4.12%), 2615x Ashenzari (4.07%), 2615x Sif Muna (4.07%), 2554x Makhleb (3.97%), 2145x Dithmenos (3.34%), 2142x Qazlal (3.33%), 1527x Yredelemnul (2.37%), 1345x Kikubaaqudgha (2.09%), 1328x Gozag (2.07%), ...
21:29:20 <Grunt> !
21:30:49 <gammafunk> !lg greaterplayers current trunk !boring s=god% god!=
21:30:50 <Sequell> 2411 games for greaterplayers (current trunk !boring god!=): 374x Xom (15.51%), 373x Trog (15.47%), 220x Okawaru (9.12%), 169x Cheibriados (7.01%), 151x Ru (6.26%), 122x Ashenzari (5.06%), 119x Lugonu (4.94%), 119x Makhleb (4.94%), 94x Vehumet (3.90%), 91x Fedhas (3.77%), 81x Yredelemnul (3.36%), 76x Qazlal (3.15%), 69x Gozag (2.86%), 66x The Shining One (2.74%), 65x Kikubaaqudgha (2.70%), 64x Dit...
21:31:40 <gammafunk> !lg centuryplayers current trunk !boring s=god% god!=
21:31:41 <Sequell> 1156 games for centuryplayers (current trunk !boring god!=): 247x Trog (21.37%), 114x Okawaru (9.86%), 100x Xom (8.65%), 93x Ru (8.04%), 84x Makhleb (7.27%), 57x Ashenzari (4.93%), 54x Yredelemnul (4.67%), 54x Lugonu (4.67%), 48x Qazlal (4.15%), 44x Gozag (3.81%), 40x Vehumet (3.46%), 35x The Shining One (3.03%), 35x Cheibriados (3.03%), 31x Elyvilon (2.68%), 24x Kikubaaqudgha (2.08%), 24x Fedhas ...
21:34:00 <gammafunk> !kw recent
21:34:00 <Sequell> Keyword: recent => cv>=0.14
21:34:04 <gammafunk> !kw current
21:34:05 <Sequell> Keyword: current => cv>=0.15
21:34:09 <gammafunk> !kw trunk
21:34:10 <Sequell> Keyword: trunk => alpha !experimental
21:34:39 <gammafunk> !lg * cv=0.15
21:34:40 <Sequell> 168937. osklington the Shield-Bearer (L1 MiFi), quit the game on D:1 (dpeg_arrival_tiny_f) on 2014-12-18 03:32:53, with 0 points after 0 turns and 0:00:12.
21:34:47 <gammafunk> !lg * cv=0.16-a
21:34:48 <Sequell> 169828. Setherick the Chopper (L9 MiMo of Makhleb), slain by an orc warrior (a +0 glaive) on D:8 on 2014-12-18 03:33:04, with 3152 points after 5972 turns and 0:28:09.
21:35:05 <gammafunk> !lg centuryplayers cv=0.15 !boring s=god% god!=
21:35:06 <Sequell> 446 games for centuryplayers (cv=0.15 !boring god!=): 56x Xom (12.56%), 44x Okawaru (9.87%), 42x Trog (9.42%), 28x Makhleb (6.28%), 26x Ashenzari (5.83%), 25x The Shining One (5.61%), 24x Fedhas (5.38%), 24x Yredelemnul (5.38%), 23x Dithmenos (5.16%), 20x Kikubaaqudgha (4.48%), 19x Elyvilon (4.26%), 15x Lugonu (3.36%), 15x Nemelex Xobeh (3.36%), 14x Sif Muna (3.14%), 14x Qazlal (3.14%), 13x Vehume...
21:35:36 <gammafunk> !lg greaterplayers cv=0.15 !boring s=god% god!=
21:35:37 <Sequell> 1220 games for greaterplayers (cv=0.15 !boring god!=): 236x Trog (19.34%), 165x Xom (13.52%), 89x Okawaru (7.30%), 76x Yredelemnul (6.23%), 72x Kikubaaqudgha (5.90%), 71x Lugonu (5.82%), 63x Makhleb (5.16%), 63x Cheibriados (5.16%), 58x Ashenzari (4.75%), 55x Elyvilon (4.51%), 37x Vehumet (3.03%), 34x Fedhas (2.79%), 34x Dithmenos (2.79%), 33x Qazlal (2.70%), 31x Sif Muna (2.54%), 25x The Shining ...
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21:44:07 <Lightli> why is xom so high up there
21:45:21 <gammafunk> I think xom boils down to something like "athiest-like conduct because gods can be not much fun but with cool gifty stuff occassionally"
21:46:08 <gammafunk> mostly good mutations, some useful gifts, but no conducts or abilities to even think about using optimally
21:46:36 <gammafunk> maybe they would characterize it differently, though (the players who go with xom a lot)
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21:49:26 <chequers> mutations and gifts are some of the most random parts of the game in early game, which makes the least fun part of dcss more interesting
21:50:08 <gammafunk> well if the early game was the least fun part of dcss, dcss would be a horrible game
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21:51:02 <chequers> I was just giving my reasons, and I play xom about 10%
21:51:04 <Grunt> hm I'm not really happy with either of these enemies
21:51:08 <Grunt> http://sprunge.us/DChF
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21:51:21 <Grunt> oh and I spotted a typo just as I'm going through this <_<
21:52:17 <read> that's your commit access revoked!!!
21:52:18 <Grunt> http://sprunge.us/HXaE
21:52:22 <read> 0 tolerance for typos
21:52:22 <Grunt> !banish read
21:52:22 <Sequell> Grunt casts a spell. read is cast into Hell!
21:52:47 <read> %git :/nsulation
21:52:48 <Cheibriados> 07Grunt02 * 0.16-a0-2897-g42e50b5: Use the right set of base types for insulation ego checks. 10(2 weeks ago, 1 file, 1+ 0-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=42e50b516535
21:53:21 <nicolae-> storm striders, huh
21:53:55 <nicolae-> are there any creatures that combine air with fire or earth
21:54:10 <Grunt> do petrifying clouds count as air/earth
21:54:12 <Grunt> <_<
21:54:36 <nicolae-> what does your heart tell you, Grunt
21:54:39 <Grunt> yes!
21:54:54 <nicolae-> mmm.
21:55:37 <nicolae-> electricity + a spell to summon a wall right behind you for just a turn so it can get the zap rebound on you too
21:55:49 <PleasingFungus> earlier chat about gambling makes me think about a late-game sink for gold, gambling
21:55:59 <|amethyst> wall mimic with blinkbolt
21:56:05 <PleasingFungus> s/late/extended
21:56:10 <PleasingFungus> which makes me think about our existing fun gambling thing (acquirement)
21:56:35 <read> pan casino imo
21:56:35 <Grunt> !send |amethyst floor mimics
21:56:35 <Sequell> Sending floor mimics to |amethyst.
21:56:38 <gammafunk> so we're going full zelda
21:56:41 <nicolae-> implement a trading card game
21:56:50 <|amethyst> !send Grunt quiver slots
21:56:50 <Sequell> Sending quiver slots to Grunt.
21:57:04 <read> nicolae-: the nemelex re-re-re-re-re-form??
21:57:05 <|amethyst> nicolae-:  Nemelex: the Sacrificing
21:57:26 <nicolae-> exactly
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22:01:43 <ontoclasm> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1000017/crawl/w.png
22:01:45 <ontoclasm> hm
22:02:00 <ontoclasm> (i'm bad at sticking to existing color schemes)
22:02:19 <nicolae-> put a pith helmet on it
22:02:22 <Grunt> ha
22:02:32 <Grunt> put an expensive camera and a hat on it
22:03:02 <ontoclasm> tourist flag
22:03:07 <Grunt> yes!
22:03:11 <PleasingFungus> oh, I like that.
22:03:14 <ontoclasm> i should replace the triskel with a lowercase i
22:03:14 <PleasingFungus> the sprite, not the ideas.
22:03:28 <Grunt> ontoclasm: why not make it
22:03:29 <Grunt> an @
22:03:33 <ontoclasm> !!!!!
22:03:43 <ontoclasm> guild of adventurers
22:05:37 <ontoclasm> what's the description of Ws altar currently
22:05:49 <ontoclasm> c.f. "an ornate altar of Gozag"
22:06:18 <Grunt> a flag-altar of Wulndraste
22:06:25 <ontoclasm> mm
22:06:26 <nicolae-> needs work
22:06:38 <ontoclasm> heraldric
22:06:55 <nicolae-> what if w's altar is just a flag
22:07:00 <nicolae-> no base or nothin
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22:07:32 <ontoclasm> she does some weird thing where you place altars or something right
22:07:49 <Grunt> that's planned, but Wulndraste does not do that currently
22:07:54 <|amethyst> W, god of golf
22:08:04 <|amethyst> guess it depends on what the flags look like
22:08:16 <ontoclasm> Wulndraste roars, "HOLE IN ONE!!!"
22:08:28 <Grunt> You hear the audience applaud!
22:08:37 <gammafunk> Grunt: make donald become a W worshiper
22:08:42 <PleasingFungus> I think I may increase hydra form's duration to blade hands'. Save the ultra-short duration for the "hunger form" I want to play with at some point or another. (Since ultra-short duration and ultra-high hunger while in form work very well together - that's why I originally had the short duration for hydra form.)
22:08:58 <PleasingFungus> gammafunk: hard to imagine donald as the worshipping type
22:09:16 <gammafunk> hard for you maybe!
22:09:16 <ontoclasm> is there a light-green altar yet?
22:09:17 <nicolae-> when you enter a level, two quiet voices describe its layout. "it's a long par 5, with a few water hazards, some sand traps, and a swarm of killer bees. it's going to be a tough drive, jim."
22:09:21 <ontoclasm> fedhas is darkgreen iirc
22:09:36 <PleasingFungus> jiyva?
22:09:41 <ontoclasm> oh
22:09:52 <PleasingFungus> I'm not sure
22:09:52 <ontoclasm> jiyva is ETC_SLIME but yes
22:09:56 <ontoclasm> i.e. lt/dk green flashing
22:10:05 <gammafunk> hrm, how does ...dangit
22:10:11 <gammafunk> silly hydras on D
22:10:13 <PleasingFungus> light green still works, then
22:10:21 <gammafunk> how does hform ac scale again?
22:10:33 <|amethyst> altar colours:  lightgrey, yellow, darkgrey, unholy, random, vehumet, cyan, fire, blue, red, lightmagenta, white, magenta, beogh, slime, green, lightcyan, lightred, dithmenos, gold, elemental, brown
22:10:46 <|amethyst> also, nice comment here
22:10:46 <gammafunk> ??hydra_form
22:10:46 <Sequell> hydra form[1/4]: Strongly spellpower-dependent level 6 form that gives a powerful cleaving attack (when heads >= 2). Your heads can be chopped off, grown, and cauterized just like the monster! Edible foes smaller than you are devoured when killed, healing you based on HD. rPois+, +50% HP. Beware the AC cost...
22:10:51 <|amethyst> ALTAR(DNGN_ALTAR_GOZAG, "opulent altar of Gozag", "altar_gozag", ETC_GOLD), // f
22:10:54 <|amethyst> or the Gold God!
22:10:57 <gammafunk> ??hydra_form[2
22:10:57 <Sequell> hydra form[2/4]: Base damage is 2 + 3*min(heads, 10) + (3/2)*max(0, heads-10). Which means 2 +[3 for every head before the 11th], and +[1.5 for every head past the 10th]. Did I mention that it cleaves?
22:11:03 <gammafunk> ??hydra_form[3
22:11:04 <Sequell> hydra form[3/4]: Unlike with monsters, if you lose your last head, the form simply ends; you don't (necessarily) die. (Also unlike monster hydras, you don't heal when heads are chopped off.)
22:11:11 <gammafunk> ??hydra_form[4
22:11:11 <Sequell> hydra form[4/4]: DEVOUR THY FOES
22:11:20 <ontoclasm> what exactly is etc_elemental
22:11:24 <Grunt> ontoclasm: weird
22:11:24 <PleasingFungus> looks like 6 + power / 20 AC
22:11:39 <PleasingFungus> so at 60 power, 9 AC
22:11:46 <Grunt> ontoclasm: basically it cycles between a variant of ETC_FIRE, ETC_ICE, ETC_EARTH, and ETC_AIR iirc
22:11:54 <gammafunk> yeah, I assume that's 200 max power?
22:11:55 <ontoclasm> huh
22:11:57 <ontoclasm> strange
22:12:04 <PleasingFungus> 200, yeah
22:12:13 <|amethyst> yeah, every 20 turns it cycles to the next
22:12:21 <Grunt> ETC_AIR/ETC_ELECTRICITY
22:12:29 <Grunt> but other than that it's correct
22:12:29 <|amethyst> earth, air or elec, red or brown or lightred, and ice
22:12:52 <gammafunk> PleasingFungus: I assume that hydra form would retain its eating behaviour?
22:13:41 -!- SurpriseTRex has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
22:13:46 <PleasingFungus> I was just going to change the duration, yes
22:14:22 <gammafunk> well, it doesn't seem outright broken in any way, this change
22:14:29 <gammafunk> certainly makes the spell less annoying to use
22:16:24 <PleasingFungus> hrm
22:16:27 <PleasingFungus> hrmm
22:16:29 <PleasingFungus> actually
22:16:31 <PleasingFungus> one problem is the heads
22:16:47 <PleasingFungus> since this would make it more practical to get a bunch of heads chopped off and then go around in 20-headed form indefinitely
22:17:01 <|amethyst> hm
22:17:12 <|amethyst> I just realised... those coinflips in _etc_elemental, and the random_colour() in _etc_random, are no good
22:17:17 <|amethyst> they should be ui_random
22:17:20 <ontoclasm> i kinda like that hydra form is super-short
22:17:25 <Grunt> .
22:17:52 <gammafunk> heh, I read |amethyst response of "they should be ui_random" as a response to PleasingFungus' statement about the problem of hydraform heads
22:18:23 <|amethyst> heh
22:18:24 <Grunt> DEVOUR THY RANDOMNESS
22:18:26 <ontoclasm> !tell lasty https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1000017/crawl/w.png
22:18:26 <Sequell> ontoclasm: OK, I'll let lasty know.
22:18:46 <|amethyst> nondeterministically decouple hydra heads from the rest of the game engine
22:19:15 <|amethyst> hydra heads are based on bits in the md5sum of your crawl executable
22:19:17 <gammafunk> would be a great primary ability for the new (H)ydra god
22:19:20 <|amethyst> s/bits/trits/
22:19:32 <Grunt> !
22:19:35 <gammafunk> ??gods[2
22:19:35 <Sequell> gods[2/2]: Ashenzari, Beogh, Cheibriados, Dithmenos, Elyvilon, Fedhas, Gozag, Jiyva, Kikubaaqudgha, Lugonu, Makhleb, Nemelex Xobeh, Okawaru, Qazlal, Ru, Sif Muna, Trog, Vehumet, Xom, Yredelemnul, Zin, the Shining One.
22:19:41 -!- Fhqwhgads_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:19:41 <gammafunk> oh yes, H is free
22:19:48 <nicolae-> HIPU
22:19:51 <nicolae-> only four left
22:19:53 <nicolae-> get your ideas in now
22:20:06 <Grunt> well if smithgod ever goes anywhere I will be accounted for
22:20:09 <|amethyst> Hugford
22:20:24 <Grunt> |amethyst: Hugsford, I assume
22:20:26 <nicolae-> i was under the impression that smithgod was dead in the manner of, say, a doornail
22:20:29 <|amethyst> oh, that was it
22:20:45 <Grunt> oh it actually was Hugford
22:20:49 <Grunt> (why do I remember the s)
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22:20:52 <|amethyst> no one's working on it, but I really want to see that artefactise ability go somewhere
22:21:02 <|amethyst> the s is more germanic
22:21:04 <gammafunk> PleasingFungus: I guess something like your no. heads just shrinking back to the casted level over fairly short time?
22:21:15 <nicolae-> if you cast it again you start over with the default heads
22:21:20 <PleasingFungus> complex
22:21:22 <ontoclasm> |amethyst: gozaggg
22:21:37 <|amethyst> ontoclasm:  yeah, that's the obvious place
22:21:50 <Grunt> replace Duplicate with Artefactise
22:21:52 <Grunt> i m o
22:21:56 <|amethyst> ontoclasm:  but I don't know how well it would work if the costs were all $
22:22:24 <ontoclasm> well, they don't -all- have to be cash
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22:22:49 <ontoclasm> could add "X dollars" to the list of things it might ask for
22:23:00 <|amethyst> I don't like the idea of gozag abilities using anything but money
22:23:10 <|amethyst> it kind of weakens the whole thing
22:23:11 <gammafunk> PleasingFungus: I dunno, if you want a longer duration, I'm not sure there's another way you can solve that problem aside from downgrading the heads
22:23:13 <nicolae-> well, if gozag's theme is "having many dollars gives you power" it doesn't make sense to need something else to get power
22:23:23 <Grunt> dpeg will probably be able to come up with some design around artefactising if you ask him nicely :)
22:23:28 <PleasingFungus> nicolae-'s solution would probably work
22:23:38 <|amethyst> nicolae-:  having dollars doesn't give you power directly though
22:23:41 <PleasingFungus> nicolae-: you can buy items from gozag's shops to turn into artefacts....
22:23:45 <nicolae-> i mean, maybe you could have an option to summon a Blacksmith shop
22:23:49 <nicolae-> and then the Blacksmith asks for things
22:23:57 <gammafunk> yeah I guess actually that would be fine in practice, wouldn't it
22:24:12 <|amethyst> nicolae-:  it's more "have many dollars, which you can then spend on these powerly services and accessories"
22:24:23 <|amethyst> nicolae-:  hm
22:24:29 <gammafunk> other silly bad idea: "extra head" counter attack if you get hit with edged weapon
22:24:37 <Grunt> The Legendary Gozag's Legendary Smithy
22:25:08 <gammafunk> Your ghostly head bites the vault guard!!!
22:25:09 <Grunt> reminds me of tracking down that really obscure bug with a particular vault placement
22:25:16 <nicolae-> do tell
22:25:26 <|amethyst> The Legendary Smith is taken by a fey mood!
22:25:32 <gammafunk> was that the one with the wierd tag
22:25:34 <Grunt> nicolae-: do you recognise the significance of the shop name I quoted you?
22:25:43 <Grunt> (replace Gozag with whatever)
22:25:44 <nicolae-> yeah, that's one of the vaults in the grated community
22:25:46 <Grunt> yes
22:25:51 <Grunt> so
22:26:03 <nicolae-> i vaguely recall hearing about a bug with it, now that i think of it
22:26:06 <Grunt> It uses make_name() to generate a name for the smithy.
22:26:07 <nicolae-> but i don't remember it at all
22:26:09 <Grunt> And...
22:26:10 <nicolae-> of course
22:26:13 <gammafunk> haha
22:26:16 <Grunt> sometimes make_name() gives you a name with a space
22:26:17 <|amethyst> %git :/shop
22:26:17 <Cheibriados> 07Grunt02 {PleasingFungus} * 0.16-a0-3193-g3ac4056: Mercenary shops. 10(10 months ago, 11 files, 206+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=3ac405611814
22:26:24 <|amethyst> hm
22:26:26 <gammafunk> ho boy
22:26:29 <|amethyst> %git :/strap
22:26:29 <Cheibriados> 07|amethyst02 * 0.16-a0-3067-gcfcf13d: Don't treat a shop with "trap" in the name as a trap (wheals) 10(8 days ago, 1 file, 2+ 3-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=cfcf13dd8b85
22:26:31 <gammafunk> not this bad_idea again
22:26:34 <PleasingFungus> sorry again for breaking that in the rebase
22:26:37 <|amethyst> Grunt:  also see ^^^
22:26:38 <Grunt> !break PleasingFungus
22:26:41 <Grunt> |amethyst: yes :)
22:26:55 <gammafunk> and MarvinPA *just* came back
22:26:58 <nicolae-> Grunt: what happened with the space
22:27:03 <Grunt> nicolae-: well
22:27:09 <Grunt> it parsed the second name as an extra tag
22:27:09 <Grunt> and
22:27:16 <Grunt> the spec didn't like that, so it crashed.
22:27:19 <nicolae-> ah.
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22:27:33 <|amethyst> %git :/kybug
22:27:34 <Cheibriados> 07|amethyst02 * 0.11-a0-2947-g3588bfa: Don't treat "Skybugg" and "Foobola" as buggy. 10(2 years, 5 months ago, 1 file, 4+ 4-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=3588bfac9baa
22:27:35 <Grunt> %git HEAD^{/ommunity}
22:27:35 <Cheibriados> 07|amethyst02 * 0.16-a0-3067-gcfcf13d: Don't treat a shop with "trap" in the name as a trap (wheals) 10(8 days ago, 1 file, 2+ 3-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=cfcf13dd8b85
22:27:37 <gammafunk> would be great if it got some truly bizarre tag
22:27:41 <Grunt> %git HEAD^{/ommunity}^^{/ommunity}
22:27:41 <Cheibriados> 07Grunt02 * 0.14-a0-2988-ge7db1d4: Allow a legendary smithy to space out. 10(10 months ago, 1 file, 2+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=e7db1d4a9bfa
22:27:43 <gammafunk> and like somehow became a branch end or something
22:27:49 <Grunt> good commit message
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22:28:13 <gammafunk> instead of a zot portal, you get legendary smith shop
22:29:07 <nicolae-> fr: legendary tag for shops that makes everything randarts if possible
22:29:13 <Grunt> !
22:29:17 <|amethyst> fortunately it wasn't that kind of tag, but yeah
22:29:19 <Grunt> well
22:29:27 <Grunt> you can do that with other shop syntax already
22:29:41 <nicolae-> true, but have you considered: it's a pain in the ass
22:29:59 <gammafunk> wait, des syntax that's a pain in the ass?!
22:30:13 <nicolae-> you get used to it
22:30:32 <gammafunk> or you start writing lua around it
22:30:38 <gammafunk> !vault goblin_castle
22:30:39 <Sequell> http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/dat/des/variable/large_themed.des;hb=HEAD#l1613
22:30:40 <nicolae-> i don't even see the code
22:30:41 <|amethyst> you know that stuff can be changed, right?
22:30:56 <nicolae-> i just see decor, monsters, terrain...
22:31:22 <|amethyst> we might make you go through existing vaults and change them all if it breaks old vaults, but API deficiencies can be corrected
22:31:41 <gammafunk> |amethyst: well, probably the hardest part of reading des is that a lot of the glyph mojo is just so hard to read and so error prone
22:31:56 <gammafunk> I'm sure you could make some cool symbolic representation that's better, but...seems a hard problem
22:32:08 <|amethyst> yeah, that's one of the things that would be hard to change
22:32:09 <|amethyst> well
22:32:16 <|amethyst> you could allow multi-letter symbols
22:32:24 <nicolae-> des syntax works fine imo
22:32:26 <|amethyst> so you wouldn't have to try to fit everything in what you have
22:32:35 <|amethyst> but I think that would be less readable probably
22:32:41 -!- weezeface has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
22:32:54 <|amethyst> there are several implementables up about changing des syntax in various ways
22:33:01 <nicolae-> yeah, the character limit is annoying but there's not much to do about it
22:33:09 <nicolae-> oh it could use some improvements but it's not too onerous atm
22:33:36 <gammafunk> des syntax is certainly flexible, but elaborate subst/shuffle end up looking like the work of the devil
22:33:52 <gammafunk> ??black_magic
22:33:52 <Sequell> black magic[1/4]: <archl> %git HEAD^{/rod}^^{/rod}
22:33:54 <gammafunk> ??black_magic[2
22:33:55 <Sequell> colours[3/3]: for y in {0..7}; do for b in 0 1; do for x in {0..7}; do printf '\e[%1d;4%1d;3%1dm%1d/%1d ' ${b} ${y} ${x} ${x} ${y}; done; done; printf '\e[0m\n'; done
22:33:56 <nicolae-> what do you have against the devil, gammafunk
22:34:12 <gammafunk> ??black_magic[3
22:34:13 <Sequell> black magic[3/4]: SHUFFLE: qS?tViwYJzOl / tViwYJzOKqS? / wYJzOKqS?tVi / zOKqS?tViwY, y&KpRmsUHvXj / vXjy&KpRmsUH / sUHvXjy&KpRm / pRmsUHvXjy&K, SMViYJOK / MSiVJYKO, &KRmUHXj / K&mRHUjX, QmThWIZk / mQhTIWkZ
22:34:16 <gammafunk> hehe
22:34:20 <gammafunk> has to be hangedman
22:34:25 <nicolae-> that's some good black magic right there
22:34:27 <nicolae-> yep
22:34:33 <nicolae-> i think he simplified that vault a while back
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22:35:17 <gammafunk> I am glad it allows such flexibility, though
22:35:45 <|amethyst> .echo $(base64-decode (ldb-lookup "black magic" 3))
22:35:45 <Sequell> $(base64-decode $(ldb-lookup black magic 3))
22:35:56 <|amethyst> aww
22:36:01 <gammafunk> shame
22:36:14 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.]
22:36:20 <gammafunk> oh, underscore?
22:36:30 <gammafunk> .echo $(base64-decode (ldb-lookup "black_magic" 3))
22:36:30 <Sequell> $(base64-decode $(ldb-lookup black_magic 3))
22:36:38 <gammafunk> or is that base64-decode not a thing
22:36:40 <|amethyst> It actually decodes to  "KIDS, DRINK YOUR OVALTINE AND WORSHIP SATAN" in Baudot code
22:36:57 <|amethyst> base64-decode isn't a thing, and it's not actually base64
22:37:36 <gammafunk> haha, yeah I know it's not base64, but I guess I didn't think how it wouldn't produce anything other than an error
22:37:42 <gammafunk> even if it was a thing
22:38:00 <|amethyst> .echo $(randomcrap)
22:38:00 <Sequell> $(randomcrap)
22:38:08 <|amethyst> .echo $(+ (randomcrap) 3)
22:38:08 <Sequell> 3
22:38:29 <Grunt> .echo /me (=spelltarget |amethyst).
22:38:29 * Sequell (=spelltarget |amethyst).
22:38:33 <Grunt> .echo /me $(=spelltarget |amethyst).
22:38:34 * Sequell gestures at |amethyst while chanting&points at |amethyst and mumbles some strange words&casts a spell at |amethyst.
22:38:41 <Grunt> .echo /me $(=rndspelltarget |amethyst).
22:38:41 * Sequell points at |amethyst and mumbles some strange words.
22:38:43 <Grunt> <3
22:39:20 <gammafunk> I think the stuff in e.g. grunt_runaround_doors_1
22:39:29 <|amethyst> �learn add gertrude_stein Sequell gestures at |amethyst while chanting&points at |amethyst and mumbles some strange words&casts a spell at |amethyst.
22:39:29 <Sequell> Okay, not adding gertrude_stein => Sequell gestures at |amethyst while chanting&points at |amethyst and mumbles some strange words&casts a spell at |amethyst.
22:39:30 <gammafunk> I still don't fully understand that, or I didn't when I last read it
22:39:42 <nicolae-> which one is that, gammafunk
22:39:50 <Grunt> nicolae-: a subvault of grunt_runaround
22:40:03 <nicolae-> !vault grunt_runaround_doors_1
22:40:03 <Sequell> http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/dat/des/variable/d_encompass.des;hb=HEAD#l379
22:40:21 <Cheibriados> 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.16-a0-3202-g5da3999: Change hydra form duration 10(4 minutes ago, 3 files, 34+ 4-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=5da39990279d
22:40:28 <nicolae-> oh, lol, that's a fun one
22:40:35 <nicolae-> that one definitely needed CLEAR to exist, that's for sure
22:40:39 <gammafunk> aka "caustic shrike factory"
22:40:52 <nicolae-> nicolae_caustic_shrike_factory
22:40:55 <nicolae-> everyone will love me for it
22:40:59 <Grunt> nicolae-: you should have seen the original workaround I did for that
22:41:00 <Grunt> it was ugly
22:41:07 <Grunt> nicolae_shrike_strike imo
22:41:15 <nicolae-> yeah, it was... k.map("") or something, wasn't it
22:41:18 <Grunt> ya
22:41:20 <nicolae-> fun times
22:41:31 <gammafunk> Grunt: interesting comment in that vault: #KMASK: 09 = !no_monster_gen
22:41:57 <ontoclasm> fr give iron dragons shard shrike breath
22:41:59 <Grunt> gammafunk: it was pointed out to me that that was meaningless :)
22:42:10 <Grunt> (no_monster_gen only applies at vault creation time)
22:42:25 <nicolae-> oh, that reminds me, i had a question
22:43:33 <nicolae-> does TAGS: transparent mean that every space in the vault must be connected to each other space, or that it must connect to the outside, i.e., would this vault choke and die if it were transparent
22:43:37 <nicolae-> !vault nicolae_swamp_three_paths
22:43:38 <Sequell> Couldn't find nicolae_swamp_three_paths in the Crawl source tree
22:43:45 <nicolae-> !vault nicolae_swamp_triple_paths
22:43:46 <Sequell> http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/dat/des/branches/swamp.des;hb=HEAD#l516
22:44:01 <Grunt> TAGS: transparent extra decor+
22:44:14 <nicolae-> oh, shit, i totally missed that
22:44:17 <nicolae-> huh!
22:44:23 <nicolae-> i don't recall putting that in there
22:44:32 <Grunt> I probably put it there
22:44:33 <Grunt> :)
22:44:49 <|amethyst> nicolae-:   it would not choke and die, as long as the @s ended up being connected outside
22:45:00 <nicolae-> so transparent is external connectivity, not internal
22:45:03 <nicolae-> ?
22:45:04 <Grunt> urd
22:45:05 <Grunt> er
22:45:06 <Grunt> yes
22:45:11 <nicolae-> eeeeeexcellent
22:45:16 <nicolae-> *mr burns finger gesture*
22:46:12 <|amethyst> Grunt, much like European politics of late, has experienced a rightward shift
22:46:48 <Grunt> twa
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22:47:47 <|amethyst> next conlang I do is going to have "twa" and "urd" as two semantically distinct words for "yes"
22:48:12 <nicolae-> next?
22:48:16 <|amethyst> :)
22:48:24 <|amethyst> I've never done a complete conlang, no
22:48:43 <|amethyst> but it was a vague hobby... 10, 15 years ago?
22:48:54 <nicolae-> conlanging is 4 lyfe, man
22:49:00 <Grunt> |amethyst secretly created Latin
22:49:04 <Grunt> he is older than time itself
22:49:08 <nicolae-> latin's not that old, Grunt
22:49:20 <nicolae-> shoulda at least gone with, like, proto-indoeuropean
22:51:39 <|amethyst> Mrtyuh sarvaharascaham udbhavasca bhavisyatam
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22:51:57 <nicolae-> looks kinda like... sanskrit
22:52:01 <|amethyst> yup
22:52:09 <nicolae-> *little fistpump*
22:52:10 <gammafunk> that or a SHUFFLE
22:52:42 <|amethyst> nicolae-:  it's the thing the Oppenheimer mistranslated badly
22:52:54 <nicolae-> aha
22:52:57 <|amethyst> s/the/that/
22:53:15 <nicolae-> i preferred bainbridge's quote, anyway
22:54:20 <|amethyst> heh
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22:59:22 <nicolae-> anyway. night all.
22:59:26 -!- nicolae- has left ##crawl-dev
22:59:47 <Grunt> nicolae_night_all
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23:01:03 <PleasingFungus> oh neat
23:01:06 <PleasingFungus> shoals tides wash away blood
23:02:07 -!- tcsc has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep]
23:02:38 <|amethyst> water and blood aren't allowed to coexist anymore
23:02:47 <|amethyst> too much like lava, they say
23:03:58 <|amethyst> I say make blood set a red background instead, and go back to bloody everything
23:04:00 <Grunt> clearly 256 colour
23:04:11 <Grunt> lava -> brighter reds, blood -> darker reds
23:04:24 <Grunt> lava -> oranges and yellows too
23:04:28 <Eksell> Unstable branch on CRAWL.XTAHUA.COM updated to: 0.16-a0-3202-g5da3999 (34)
23:08:23 -!- Lawman0 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
23:14:08 <Cheibriados> New branch created: shoals-lite (1 commit)
23:14:08 <Cheibriados> 03PleasingFungus02 07[shoals-lite] * 0.16-a0-3203-g0731a9c: Streamline Shoals 10(3 minutes ago, 1 file, 8+ 189-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=0731a9c6d895
23:14:46 <PleasingFungus> ^ opinions wanted
23:15:48 <ontoclasm> 10 times sounds like a lot
23:15:57 <PleasingFungus> it's not as much as you'd think
23:16:21 <PleasingFungus> but the goal is to shift the tides from a strategic effect to a tactical one
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23:16:52 <PleasingFungus> this is probably a huge ilsuiw nerf; not sure
23:18:04 <gammafunk> no, don't think it would be a huge nerf for her really
23:19:15 <ontoclasm> give her waterstrike
23:19:40 <gammafunk> !killratio ilsuiw * current trunk
23:19:43 <Sequell> ilsuiw wins 0.652% of battles against * (current trunk).
23:19:47 <Grunt> . . . . . .
23:19:50 <gammafunk> that's...
23:19:51 <Grunt> brutal.
23:19:59 <gammafunk> !killratio ilsuiw * recent
23:20:01 <Sequell> ilsuiw wins 0.749% of battles against * (recent).
23:20:15 <Cheibriados> Ilsuiw (09m) | Spd: 10 (swim: 60%) | HD: 16 | HP: 150 | AC/EV: 5/18 | Dam: 10 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, amphibious, spellcaster | Res: 06magic(140), 12drown | XP: 1889 | Sp: throw icicle (3d25), call tide, invisibility, blink, sum.water elementals | Sz: Medium | Int: high.

23:20:15 <gammafunk> %??ilsuiw
23:20:27 <gammafunk> ??call_tide
23:20:27 <Sequell> call tide[1/1]: Raises the water level, turning dry land near the water into shallow water and turning shallow water into deep water.
23:21:01 <gammafunk> PleasingFungus: does this actually effect call tide the spell?
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23:21:14 <travis-ci> The build passed. (master - 5da3999 #1171 : Nicholas Feinberg): http://travis-ci.org/crawl-ref/crawl-ref/builds/44416107
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23:21:55 <|amethyst> call tide makes it high tide, and if tide can't turn things into deep water...
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23:22:14 <PleasingFungus> ^
23:23:17 <PleasingFungus> would be sort of neat to make deep water when and only when the tide is called
23:23:24 <PleasingFungus> though I'd lose most of my millimarvins :(
23:24:49 <|amethyst> hm, what about connectivity?
23:25:01 <gammafunk> well I don't think her making that tide is having a terribly impactful effect, as her killratio shows; I've fought her a bunch of times and I didn't even know what the spell does exactly; I think maybe I reacted by casting flight one time or something
23:25:07 <|amethyst> are you supposed to need flight to get everywhere?
23:26:00 <gammafunk> you mean, since those areas blocked by deep water will now never change?
23:26:10 <|amethyst> right
23:26:30 <gammafunk> sort of like orc/slime, but you can see through the walls
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23:28:21 <gammafunk> this feels like a good change overall, and it's probably ok that we have said areas
23:28:50 <gammafunk> I guess you can argue for forcing connectivity; I'd be fine with that as well
23:28:58 <PleasingFungus> |amethyst: the levels start out really connected
23:29:00 <PleasingFungus> test it
23:29:15 <PleasingFungus> I haven't seen one that had anything start out disconnected yet
23:29:17 <gammafunk> well, a valid question is can you get disconnected areas
23:29:18 <|amethyst> yeah, they do seem to be
23:29:26 <|amethyst> connected I mean
23:29:33 <|amethyst> but don't forget existing saves
23:29:48 <PleasingFungus> yeah, save compat is a thing
23:29:56 <|amethyst> hm
23:30:04 <|amethyst> just got some disconnections in Shoals:4
23:30:13 <PleasingFungus> screenshot?
23:30:38 <|amethyst> hm
23:30:42 <gammafunk> I guess those disconnected areas will tend to just be very small....islands, so it'll work less well overall compared to orc
23:30:49 <|amethyst> it's going to be hard to see in a screenshot
23:30:52 <|amethyst> oh, graphical
23:31:02 <gammafunk> time to plug in your graphics card!
23:32:13 <|amethyst> http://s-z.org/neil/tmp/A4.png
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23:32:44 <PleasingFungus> hm
23:32:48 <PleasingFungus> where's the disconnect
23:32:50 <|amethyst> (non-default colours)
23:33:15 <|amethyst> hm
23:33:19 <|amethyst> let me do tiles
23:33:42 <|amethyst> hm
23:33:47 <PleasingFungus> hm
23:33:57 <|amethyst> or is is possible with glyph overrides to see the difference between deep and shallow water in the map?
23:34:25 <|amethyst> (have to build a tiles version of this branch, so it will be a few minutes)
23:34:53 <|amethyst> but the spot I'm standing on is completely surrounded by deep water
23:35:04 <|amethyst> yellow is the reachable stuff, blue unreachable
23:35:15 <|amethyst> and there are no stairs of either kind
23:35:26 <|amethyst> so should I get teleported there without a means of flight...
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23:35:59 <|amethyst> I suspect shoals bypasses the normal connectivity checks because of tides
23:36:16 <|amethyst> or changes them anyway
23:38:17 <PleasingFungus> that's probably changeable
23:38:53 <|amethyst> would be nice to have a kind of snaky layout
23:38:57 <|amethyst> or vertices-and-edges
23:39:16 <|amethyst> so that you can follow a long path on land/shallow water, but flight gives you shortcuts
23:39:21 <PleasingFungus> ya
23:39:47 <PleasingFungus> though tbh being in the middle of a bunch of shallow water without flight
23:39:50 <PleasingFungus> is really its own punishment
23:39:51 <|amethyst> hm
23:39:54 <ontoclasm> |amethyst: magic mapping does not reveal the difference between shallow/deep water (or lava)
23:39:58 <ontoclasm> wizmode mapping might
23:40:01 <|amethyst> dgn_shoals_connect_point could be relevant
23:40:11 <|amethyst> ontoclasm:  yeah, it's wizmode mapped so I know the difference
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23:40:52 <ontoclasm> well, my rc has glyph overrides for that
23:41:06 <ontoclasm> i have shallow on ~ and deep on double tilde
23:41:52 <gammafunk> ontoclasm: lava on the triple tilde?!
23:41:59 <ontoclasm> !!!
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23:47:28 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus:  here's a shoals:1 with the same problem: http://s-z.org/neil/tmp/A1.png
23:47:38 <Jafet> ~͌
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23:48:11 <gammafunk> Jafet: dang
23:48:17 <Jafet> ≈͌
23:48:20 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus:  there is this (barely) disconnected island in the NE, and a (barely) disconnected archipelago in the SE
23:48:37 <gammafunk> there's probably a tendancy for these isolated areas to be so small that maybe it is in fact bad that they exist
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23:49:08 <Grunt> um
23:49:16 <Grunt> the archipelago is connected if you look very carefully.
23:49:25 <Grunt> (at its northernmost edge there is a diagonal connection)
23:49:25 <|amethyst> Grunt:  not to the rest of the level
23:49:39 <|amethyst> hm
23:49:56 <|amethyst> when I looked I swear there was a gap but I guess you're right
23:50:03 <gammafunk> probably if it can get that close to disconnected it can actually get disconnected, though
23:50:07 <|amethyst> I already &^Red the level away so I can't check
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23:50:44 <gammafunk> anyhow, it's not the end of the world, these disconnected areas...oh
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23:50:54 <gammafunk> these won't even have stair necesarilly will they
23:50:59 <|amethyst> right
23:51:09 <|amethyst> so they're teleport closets if you don't fly/swim
23:51:21 <gammafunk> *necessarily
23:51:32 <|amethyst> which might be acceptible in extended but I don't think so in shoals
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23:52:04 <|amethyst> if we want to use the spotty connection algorithm from orc, that's fine
23:52:31 <|amethyst> as you said
23:52:37 <|amethyst> s/said/suggested/
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23:53:51 <Grunt> hm
23:53:58 <Grunt> I wonder which projects of mine I should consider landing
23:54:20 <Grunt> definitely the Frederick tile, probably the iron giant, slightly less likely the crystal colossus
23:54:56 <|amethyst> Grunt:  are you going to commit santaeus and fiendeer?
23:54:57 <Grunt> possibly dicker around a bit more with the spider enemies because I'm not really happy with their current forms, but it would be good cause to land some bits and pieces of the insulation branch
23:55:13 <Grunt> |amethyst: I'm going to be busy at the relevant times of the 24th :(
23:55:38 <|amethyst> but we discovered the solution for that already this halloween
23:55:44 <|amethyst> logic bombs!
23:55:49 <Grunt> .
23:56:11 <Grunt> PleasingFungus is more familiar with that logic than I am :)
23:56:34 <Grunt> (we can clearly rename Cocytus to North Pole while we're at it)