00:01:04 -!- e1999 has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:02:28 -!- CSDCMS has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:02:34 -!- ToastyP has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:04:06 FR: suppress demonic guardian with all gods since it steals your piety for all of them 00:04:36 except like, ash 00:05:35 -!- Keanan has joined ##crawl-dev 00:05:40 Unstable branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.15-a0-1884-gb98b893 (34) 00:06:21 -!- demiskeleton has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:07:29 -!- CSDCS has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:09:31 -!- Keanan has quit [Client Quit] 00:13:36 -!- ruwin has quit [] 00:16:34 -!- Evablue has quit [Quit: Evablue] 00:18:09 -!- giantbat has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 00:18:13 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.15-a0-1884-gb98b893 (34) 00:18:21 -!- ZRN has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 00:21:57 May demonic guardian get reworked and become the new Merc card in terms of complexity 00:25:50 -!- Keanan has joined ##crawl-dev 00:27:28 well, I think it's weird in general that every god that gives piety for kills gives either less or no piety for ally kills 00:27:32 even beogh/yred 00:27:59 except for a few cases, I think if you are with kiku then ally kills of holy monsters give the same piety as your own kills of holy monsters (but not other monsters) 00:28:40 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 00:29:38 hrm, isn't it just consistency with the less xp for ally kills? 00:30:12 yes, but piety gain doesn't increase 5000-fold as the game progresses 00:30:58 yeah, they are rather different systems; for yred I'd be worried that pain mirror would be very spammable 00:31:02 if we gave full piety 00:31:08 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:31:45 I guess the only balance issues at all are potentially yred/beogh/kiku, maybe TSO 00:32:14 it also promotes killstealing a lot 00:32:24 since you don't get 90% piety for doing 80% of the damage 00:33:02 yeah, same problem as with half XP; I think I have that piety reform on my todo, I guess I just need to look at what the resultant piety gain would be for the ally gods 00:33:24 well I don't see how beogh and tso would be balance problems since those gods are awful anyway 00:34:47 no, it's just we don't won't to make them more ridiculous 00:35:22 how would it make them more ridiculous? it would make them (very, very slightly) less bad 00:36:28 I agree yred might be an issue though since yred characters actually get a lot of ally kills and yred is actually strong 00:36:46 beogh and yred are what I'd mostly be thinking of 00:37:26 -!- magicpoints has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 00:38:34 ??tso 00:38:35 the shining one[1/7]: One of three 'good gods'. Provides a number of passive favors as well as active abilities later. Enjoys killing of evil creatures, and forbids poison, evil/unholy magic or items, attacking distracted or sleeping intelligent creatures, and cannibalism. 00:38:36 -!- vivec has quit [Quit: Page closed] 00:38:54 ah right, forgot that TSO only cares about evil monsters anyhow 00:39:16 oh wow 00:39:28 I can't believe I never noticed that piety gain from some kills uses your XL 00:39:39 so trog for humans is worse than trog for high elves 00:39:50 -!- PleasingFungus has joined ##crawl-dev 00:39:54 (or at least, gives less piety) 00:40:36 he's still trog, though 00:40:38 hm 00:40:39 -!- Patashu has quit [Quit: Soundcloud (Famitracker Chiptunes): http://www.soundcloud.com/patashu MSN: Patashu@hotmail.com , AIM: Patashu0 , YIM: patashu2 , Skype: patashu0 .] 00:40:49 I still like the idea of making beogh get decent at 2* 00:40:53 a good line: 00:40:59 or 'remotely helpful', anyway 00:40:59 piety_denom = level + 10 - (is_good_god(you.religion) ? 0 : you.experience_level/3); 00:41:15 -!- UncertainKitten has quit [Quit: Connection reset by pier.] 00:41:22 -!- Patashu has joined ##crawl-dev 00:42:51 anyway, I'm not convinced changing yred ally kill piety_denom from level+10-XL/3 to level+18-XL/2 is that big of a balance issue for the problems it solves 00:42:55 Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.15-a0-1884-gb98b893 00:44:49 imo do that and then nerf yred by making monster ghouls not the worst enemies ever 00:45:21 |amethyst: should dec_min_item_quantity have amount be type 'short'? since quantity is... 00:45:38 and removing them from all generation because ugh species monsters as real monsters 00:45:40 -!- conted has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:45:49 !send minmay orcs 00:45:50 Sending orcs to minmay. 00:45:58 those are not a species monster 00:46:01 eh 00:46:03 remember vanilla octopode monsters??? 00:46:06 weren't those the best????? 00:46:09 askjdlfalskjdfsladkfj 00:46:17 remember that vault that had like 00:46:19 a dozen of them 00:46:26 orcs are explicitly cave orcs!!!! not hill orcs 00:46:30 pfft 00:46:35 semantics 00:46:43 the "elf" monster though. fuck that 00:46:44 frankly, I think you are guilty of Orc Racism. 00:46:55 also the dwarf monster!!! 00:47:01 !send minmay shapeshifters 00:47:02 Sending shapeshifters to minmay. 00:47:02 yes 00:47:11 imo those shouldn't be valid polymorph targets either 00:47:16 did someone finally get rid of that weird oka vault that uses dwarf monsters 00:47:20 I forget 00:47:30 i tried to but someone probably reverted it 00:47:40 or didn't commit it in the first place 00:47:42 o 00:47:44 hm 00:47:56 there's a decent chance it's gone though! 00:48:07 all I see are dwarf skeletons 00:48:11 which seems correct 00:48:24 i think that one was added after my patch 00:51:22 ...why are tengu zombies a normal spawn 00:51:40 dwarf zombies aren't 00:52:04 oh, and elf zombies are too... 00:52:05 -!- Kramin has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 00:55:27 -!- valrus has quit [Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…] 00:56:07 -!- Patashu_ has joined ##crawl-dev 00:56:07 -!- Patashu has quit [Disconnected by services] 00:56:55 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 00:56:59 -!- rossi has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:57:53 -!- Patashu has joined ##crawl-dev 00:59:17 also when did beogh become regarded as underpowered 01:00:29 when you couldn't use powerful PHALANX TACTICS 01:00:31 obv 01:00:54 -!- Patashu_ has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 01:01:29 -!- Patashu has quit [Disconnected by services] 01:01:29 -!- Patashu_ has joined ##crawl-dev 01:01:53 hm. this code is philosophically unsound :( 01:05:07 -!- Patashu has joined ##crawl-dev 01:05:42 -!- Patashu_ has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 01:06:57 -!- tsohg has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:08:44 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.15-a0-1885-g22d3eb9: Constify 10(4 minutes ago, 2 files, 3+ 2-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=22d3eb9efd2b 01:08:46 -!- Evablue has quit [Quit: Evablue] 01:21:44 -!- gammafunk has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:22:22 -!- bonghitz has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 01:23:49 -!- gammafunk has joined ##crawl-dev 01:25:24 -!- ProzacElf has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:27:02 -!- ishanyx has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 01:31:38 -!- Kramin has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:33:58 -!- FlowRiser has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 01:39:18 hm 01:39:29 I wonder if people would be interested if I posted this korean feedback on gdd or something 01:39:34 it's sort of interesting 01:40:02 what is it 01:40:53 I have a friend who is a korean translator 01:41:14 he went to a korean roguelike board and asked them some feedback questions that I provided 01:41:26 just finished translating the answers http://pastebin.com/gr7CRRMN 01:41:49 -!- Keanan has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 01:43:02 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: CADENZA-CLASS CLOCKWORK KNIGHT--OPERATION TERMINATED] 01:47:51 dang 01:47:58 korea really isnt a fan of demigods 01:48:14 clearly a rivalry with japan. japan loves the dgwn, so korea must hate it 01:48:39 haha 01:49:02 I wonder... if they've always hated dg 01:49:27 I like the guy talking about formicid buffs 01:51:35 -!- Keanan has joined ##crawl-dev 01:51:56 lol 01:51:56 oh, is that the guy who really wants them to have four hands 01:52:02 "why cant i wear 4 sets of gloves" 01:52:05 or 2 setst 01:52:07 that is.. 01:52:09 and they should have poison fangs 01:52:17 tbh I think they just need to be rethemed 01:52:24 mountain dwarves can return........ 01:53:12 huh 01:53:13 5. Recently the game focuses too much on speedruns and combat and to me it’s disappointing. It seems the Western playstyle loves speedruns. 01:53:31 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 01:53:49 so both korea & the west think that the other really loves speedruns 01:53:53 yes 01:54:01 I can see that happening for various reasons 01:54:12 For one the scoreboard cares about speedruns 01:54:16 and not about other things as much 01:54:28 tournaments also but they're more evenhanded 01:54:45 Please change the demon spam lategame. For example, have a swarm of 27-headed hydras appear at Hell. 01:54:52 The other thing is just some of the more interesting players or notable players in both groups are speedrunners 01:55:24 lol 01:55:32 ' Please change the demon spam lategame. For example, have a swarm of 27-headed hydras appear at Hell.' now this is a FR! 01:55:43 SwissStopwatch: yeah, that's about what I was thinking. it's interesting 01:55:46 Patashu: agreed 01:55:49 "Okawaru should stop giving me useless crap. " 01:55:49 idk i just 01:55:56 hate 10 runes worth 01:55:57 of demons 01:56:00 i can agree wtih him 01:56:02 I'd really like to see this get posted as a topic, anyway 01:56:03 it gets boring after awhile 01:56:07 go for it 01:56:10 a lot of people feel the same way and have for a long time 01:56:16 imo 01:56:17 I'm going to post it once i finish reading it 01:56:19 have 10 runes 01:56:25 alternate hell/pan 01:56:31 and have pan structed like hell 01:56:37 I think part of the problem is people can't agree on where to cut and how much so nothing gets cut 01:56:39 instead of infinite 01:56:50 And you would realistically like to have some replacement runes ready too 01:56:56 well revamping endgame is a colossal undertaking 01:56:57 my personal thought on pan is maybe turn it into a "boss rush" thing 01:57:03 can we also hve 01:57:06 or remove it 01:57:07 hells not be 7 floors 01:57:08 either/or 01:57:08 Pretty sure nobody has 2 rune branches worth of new material ready to go into testing 01:57:11 well 01:57:16 you dont need new rune branches 01:57:20 just cut the number of runes 01:57:37 15 is not a sacred number 01:57:48 It's not, as long as you can get people to agree to it 01:57:52 I think hells being 7 floors is fine - it's not like you clear them 01:57:57 unless you're with zin and also a huge goof 01:58:08 You would have to redo scoring "probably" but then that's obviously easier than 2 rune branches 01:58:16 but I think that's more of a problem with zin than hell 01:58:31 it's not even a problem with Zin because it's a bad idea anyway 01:58:39 at least not a productive idea 01:58:39 7 floors that you dive through are very different from 7 normal floors that you clear 01:58:52 you should still dive them with Zin really 01:58:53 this is also my position on slime, btw (though more people do clear that, I think?) 01:59:40 There's just as little reason to clear slime 01:59:46 xp!!!! 02:00:06 I don't necessarily think it's relevant that you -can- do it since it's unnecessary and wasteful for most purposes, in both cases 02:01:48 well 02:01:54 can you make the hell maps smaller 02:01:55 or something 02:02:05 idk i wish this game had smaller maps in general 02:08:52 -!- Roarke has quit [Quit: Page closed] 02:13:38 I've occasionally wondered about that too 02:13:50 but I'm too bad at this game to judge the impact the level size has on tactics 02:15:17 -!- Evablue has quit [Quit: Evablue] 02:15:21 -!- Isha has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 02:20:51 stairs are more important than level size for tactics, I think 02:20:57 it's more about how long the game takes to play 02:21:02 how big the game is 02:21:29 Unstable branch on crawl.beRotato.org updated to: 0.15-a0-1885-g22d3eb9 (34) 02:21:57 -!- radinms has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 02:22:30 its not a tactical thing really 02:22:44 i just think id prefer smaller maps since itd make things go a bit faster 02:22:52 less encouters but less chaff 02:23:18 Well what are the branches that "feel right" to you 02:23:55 it's possible we could tweak-down the map sizes and monsters a bit, but anything large would require really different combat in general probably 02:27:22 -!- rchandra has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:29:59 its just down a little bit 02:30:08 maybe like 10-15% 02:30:52 moving ever closer to the dreaded coffee-break crawl future....... 02:30:55 bbut it would be a big change. since i would ideally have less encounters, more xp per dude 02:31:02 and a bit smaller floors 02:32:38 right now we have a lot of fighst where 02:32:41 I honestly don't think you'd notice 10-15% smaller rooms 02:32:44 you arent realistically gonna die 02:32:46 area is like....big 02:32:54 idk i didnt want to say 25 02:32:54 lol 02:32:55 1learn add gammafunk 02:33:18 have you ever thought about 02:33:19 imho 27% smaller 02:33:21 merging crypt and tomb 02:33:27 well I think crypt right now 02:33:29 is just fine 02:33:35 and just having some of the mummies in there 02:33:36 it's okay 02:33:38 i hate tomb so fucking much 02:33:40 tomb is something in particular I'd like to maybe rework but that's a big project 02:33:44 maybe just the death curse thing 02:33:47 there's still torment 02:33:49 thats why i say 02:33:54 just put the mummies in crypt 02:33:58 or rename crypt to tomb 02:34:07 they are fine as occasional threats 02:34:13 but with too many of them 02:34:18 its really dang annoying gameplay 02:34:24 especially with the curses 02:34:41 we could remove death curses and then try MarvinPA's hatch idea 02:34:47 they work well as a dangerous dude onscreen that you need to account for when you fight other dudes 02:34:54 like ancient champions 02:34:55 or whatever 02:35:15 and replace guardian mummies with a powerful melee mummy 02:35:18 POWYRFUL even 02:35:23 mummy knights! 02:35:38 or bone riders 02:35:39 lol 02:37:41 what is the hatch idea? 02:37:57 you only have hatches going down, but they take you to fixed locations 02:38:04 and there are up hatches nearby but not in los 02:38:45 fwiw, I would oppose the removal of death curses on mummy priests & greater mummies 02:38:55 because: 02:39:12 too tired to go over this right now, I've talked about it in the past 02:39:22 this is just a reminder I guess 02:39:24 anywa 02:39:26 -!- PleasingFungus has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90.1 [Firefox 33.0a1/20140621030204]] 02:39:48 oook 02:42:20 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 02:44:15 -!- simmarine has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:48:05 -!- giantbat has quit [Quit: ???] 03:06:45 -!- tsohg has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 03:30:06 -!- tali713 has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 03:33:33 -!- TS__ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:52:37 -!- Keanan has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 03:52:55 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 03:53:28 -!- st_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:54:02 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 03:54:47 -!- ketsa has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:57:47 -!- blabber has joined ##crawl-dev 04:07:02 -!- tsohg has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 04:13:52 -!- Wahaha has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 04:25:10 -!- radinms has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 04:40:03 -!- Zermako has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:40:06 -!- flowsnake has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 04:43:26 -!- Evablue has quit [Quit: Evablue] 04:45:31 -!- nooodl has joined ##crawl-dev 05:08:38 -!- Patashu_ has joined ##crawl-dev 05:08:38 -!- Patashu has quit [Disconnected by services] 05:10:06 -!- st_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:10:08 -!- blabber_ has joined ##crawl-dev 05:10:40 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 05:11:38 -!- blabber has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 05:16:51 -!- nooodl has quit [Quit: Ik ga weg] 05:18:18 -!- flowsnake has joined ##crawl-dev 05:23:37 -!- zxc232 has joined ##crawl-dev 05:30:14 -!- halv has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 05:34:58 -!- edlothiol has joined ##crawl-dev 05:35:29 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:06:17 -!- blabber_ has quit [Quit: leaving] 06:07:03 -!- tsohg has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:14:51 -!- Patashu has joined ##crawl-dev 06:14:53 -!- Patashu_ has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 06:19:31 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 06:23:45 -!- SpongeJr has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 06:29:08 -!- tollymain has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity] 06:34:21 -!- Basil has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 06:37:33 -!- KurzedMetal has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 06:49:17 -!- gammafunk has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 07:04:57 -!- eki has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 07:15:33 -!- Bloax has joined ##crawl-dev 07:16:40 -!- eki has quit [Quit: leaving] 07:23:13 -!- CSDCS has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:31:00 -!- Lasty1 has joined ##crawl-dev 07:42:31 -!- Staplegun has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:46:38 -!- CSDCS has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:50:35 -!- radinms has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 07:50:43 -!- iFurril has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 07:52:33 -!- wat has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:53:07 -!- st_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:53:44 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 08:09:27 -!- CSDCS has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:10:00 -!- valtern has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:10:47 -!- lorinal has quit [] 08:16:50 -!- magicpoints has joined ##crawl-dev 08:21:34 -!- Euph0ria has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:32:17 -!- tsohg has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:32:52 -!- magicpoints has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:33:31 -!- Xiguana has quit [Quit: Page closed] 08:33:48 -!- Evablue has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 08:41:33 -!- agentgt has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:44:42 -!- absolutego has joined ##crawl-dev 08:49:03 -!- kunwon1 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:49:45 -!- Lasty1 has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 08:50:57 -!- kunwon1 has joined ##crawl-dev 08:53:03 -!- Lasty1 has joined ##crawl-dev 08:58:30 -!- rchandra has joined ##crawl-dev 09:03:53 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:04:33 -!- Patashu has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:10:03 -!- debo has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:10:42 -!- Lasty1 has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 09:25:02 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 09:25:11 -!- buki has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:25:35 I can attest that flaying is much more interesting than torment. 09:26:21 it does pretty much the same thing as torment except it rewards you for killing the root of the problem 09:39:26 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 09:39:54 -!- radinms has quit [] 09:41:10 -!- puissantveil has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 09:43:58 -!- tsohg has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:48:52 -!- zercules has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 09:53:57 -!- Beast has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:01:04 -!- debo has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:04:21 -!- Evablue has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 10:04:22 -!- Evablue_ is now known as Evablue 10:05:20 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 10:08:21 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 10:16:23 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 10:19:50 -!- Evablue has quit [Quit: Evablue] 10:22:49 -!- tsohg has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 10:22:49 -!- puissantveil has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 10:29:03 -!- debo has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:48:48 -!- Evablue has quit [Quit: Evablue] 10:54:03 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:55:22 -!- puissantveil has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 10:59:39 -!- PleasingFungus has joined ##crawl-dev 11:00:28 -!- fduas has quit [Client Quit] 11:03:35 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 11:06:46 -!- Kramin has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 11:09:23 -!- tinybat has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:10:59 -!- Ketsa has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.3] 11:13:20 Looks like 9f6866c0 is causing trouble - 'tux[qyou]' in ##crawl reports that every time his friend ascends stairs, he gets "_mgrd at (0,0) points at dead monster DEAD MONSTER" 11:13:26 -!- conted has quit [Quit: Page closed] 11:15:50 -!- MgDark has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90.1 [Firefox 31.0/20140630185627]] 11:16:33 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:18:06 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 11:20:11 -!- Evablue has quit [Quit: Evablue] 11:22:14 This is in Orc. 11:22:25 (And his friend is following Beogh, unsurprisingly.)( 11:29:50 -!- TAS-2012v has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:31:43 -!- ishanyx has quit [Killed (verne.freenode.net (Nickname regained by services))] 11:31:43 -!- Isha is now known as ishanyx 11:33:07 -!- UncertainKitten has joined ##crawl-dev 11:33:57 -!- Vizer has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:33:59 -!- hello_ has quit [Client Quit] 11:35:22 <|amethyst> hm... could you get a copy of the save? 11:36:42 asking 11:39:32 -!- PsiRedEye22 has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:40:45 man 11:40:50 it'd be really nice if webtiles had some way to dump saves 11:40:58 I keep having to walk people through downloading putty 11:41:04 which is a pain for them & for me! 11:49:39 |amethyst: http://crawl.lantea.net/saves/Xiguana-crawl-git-53e602b668-140705-1648.tar.bz2 , probably 11:53:31 -!- Evablue has quit [Quit: Evablue] 11:54:47 -!- scummos^ has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 11:55:03 -!- Staplegun has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:55:43 yep, easy to replicate 11:56:23 -!- Xiguana has quit [Quit: Page closed] 12:03:02 -!- rossi has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:06:46 -!- soadzombi has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 12:08:26 -!- valrus has quit [Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…] 12:09:16 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.15-a0-1885-g22d3eb9 (34) 12:11:30 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 12:17:33 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:21:33 I do not really understand how this blood potion code ever worked at all 12:24:17 <|amethyst> okay, have a fix for tux's problem 12:24:21 <|amethyst> it was something trivial 12:24:36 <|amethyst> I moved the !alive check earlier than the offlevel companion check 12:24:58 <|amethyst> but of course, if the offlevel companion check resets the monster, it is no longer alive 12:25:19 -!- Roarke has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 12:25:33 trivial fixes are the best fixes 12:25:50 -!- nooodl has joined ##crawl-dev 12:26:07 <|amethyst> though I just thought of another potentially broken case 12:26:20 <|amethyst> oh, no, never mind 12:26:56 <|amethyst> it would involve returning to a pan level after visiting another pan level 12:27:32 <|amethyst> which is not possible with current dungeon topology, and would cause other problems anyway if it were 12:28:10 Pan's demonic topology torments |amethyst! |amethyst convulses! 12:29:24 03|amethyst02 07* 0.15-a0-1886-g1757ce4: Prevent DEAD_MONSTER messages for offlevel companions 10(3 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 0-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=1757ce470f8a 12:29:26 -!- simmarine has joined ##crawl-dev 12:31:33 <|amethyst> gah 12:31:36 <|amethyst> "the the" 12:33:06 -!- Lasty1 has joined ##crawl-dev 12:33:17 -!- st_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:33:31 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 12:34:59 hm 12:36:02 I'm trying to constify &source in merge_blood_potion_stacks 12:36:16 since, ideologically, it shouldn't actually be modifying the original stack 12:36:30 <|amethyst> shouldn't it? 12:36:38 doesn't that need to go away though? 12:36:39 <|amethyst> shouldn't it set the quantity to zero? 12:36:51 is that the only thing you need to do to make it go away? 12:36:58 no and no respectively 12:37:00 and also no 12:37:10 let me find the relevant function 12:37:15 yay item duplication 12:37:34 merge_blood_potion_stacks() is called from items.cc:merge_item_stacks() 12:37:40 <|amethyst> ah 12:37:42 which doesn't actually modify the source object 12:37:50 it just merges it into the destination 12:37:57 (I'm also constifying it, among other things) 12:38:10 <|amethyst> ah 12:38:19 <|amethyst> but it does need to remove the timer prop entries 12:38:32 the timer prop entries need to be removed somewhere, yes 12:38:36 <|amethyst> unless that is made the responsibility of the caller, which seems wrong since it's blood-specific 12:38:58 well, it's blood-specific special casing either way 12:39:12 in most cases, it doesn't matter, since the original item is destroyed; there's I think one case where it actually comes up 12:39:20 and in that case I am making the caller handle it, yes 12:40:33 -!- ishanyx has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 12:40:40 -!- Isha is now known as ishanyx 12:41:25 http://sprunge.us/bHei this mostly works, but I don't know what I'm doing with the "timer" variable in merge_blood_potion_stacks 12:41:29 (at the bottom of the diff) 12:42:33 oh, that code is really bad 12:42:34 hm 12:42:40 okay, I think I figured it out 12:43:19 <|amethyst> hm 12:47:47 <|amethyst> FR: things like merge_items_into_inv say in the function documentation that the caller is responsible for decrementing the quantity and/or destroying the original object 12:48:09 const is documentation :) 12:48:12 (but yes) 12:48:34 -!- Basil has joined ##crawl-dev 12:49:04 <|amethyst> hm, if dec_inv_item_quantity popped from the timer vector 12:49:29 <|amethyst> would that eliminate the need for special cases? 12:49:43 <|amethyst> I guess you have to know which end to pop from (freshest or oldest blood) 12:50:00 you'd need to handle it there & in dec_mitm, I think 12:50:03 but that'd be fine 12:50:13 <|amethyst> oh, right 12:50:29 <|amethyst> because everything in a _inv_ function is duplicated in a floor version 12:50:35 :) 12:52:17 and I just guaranteed myself a bunch of fun merge conflict issues 12:52:30 since I touched blood potion code 12:52:32 rip 12:52:53 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.15-a0-1887-gff848d3: Constify 10(2 minutes ago, 6 files, 61+ 63-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=ff848d38072d 12:53:22 ...shoot, I forgot to touch the comment 12:54:55 <|amethyst> - // take a note when picking up... uh... stackable artefacts? 12:55:03 yeah 12:55:18 <|amethyst> But how will we implement Lehudib's Crystal Javelins now‽ 12:55:30 I just moved that call outside :) 12:55:36 since it wasn't const-invariant 12:55:46 <|amethyst> ah, I see 12:56:05 lehudib lives! :) 12:56:20 <|amethyst> hm 12:58:02 -!- bmfx has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:58:26 <|amethyst> I wonder if we should add a way to note every single pickup 12:59:16 as an filer-customizeable thing? 12:59:17 *rcfile 12:59:22 autocorrect 12:59:43 -!- mineral has joined ##crawl-dev 12:59:49 <|amethyst> yeah... you can do that for identification of every object 12:59:57 <|amethyst> and for seeing every monster 13:00:16 -!- valtern_ has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 13:00:25 -!- read has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 13:00:42 <|amethyst> probably no one but a few weird people like me would use it 13:01:16 <|amethyst> and in practice you do have the .lst file, which tells you most of what you need 13:01:39 <|amethyst> 8469 | Lair:1 | Noticed a plant 13:02:56 -!- Arkaniad has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:03:26 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:05:15 <|amethyst> I guess the most important additional logging right now would be food stuff 13:05:30 <|amethyst> Could put eating in action_counts 13:05:33 -!- TS__ has joined ##crawl-dev 13:05:59 sounds reasonable 13:06:00 <|amethyst> I kind of think walking should be in action_counts too 13:06:18 <|amethyst> and resting 13:06:27 sure 13:06:59 -!- surprisetrex has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:07:20 -!- Aule has quit [Client Quit] 13:08:09 03ontoclasm02 07* 0.15-a0-1888-ga413f1d: Cond. shield icon 10(7 minutes ago, 1 file, 0+ 0-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=a413f1dc8091 13:08:14 -!- surprisetrex has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:11:28 more like a condescension shield icon 13:13:05 -!- valtern_ has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 13:13:24 -!- tsohg has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:18:23 -!- tsohg has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:18:59 -!- eb_ has joined ##crawl-dev 13:20:22 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: Oh, you think it should be called condescension shield? Please tell me more about your wonderful ideas 13:20:49 * PleasingFungus applauds, sarcastically. 13:23:08 -!- valtern_ has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 13:26:25 <|amethyst> hm, tracking moving, resting etc. looks non-trivial 13:26:52 <|amethyst> there are so many early returns from _move_player 13:26:57 <|amethyst> and so many different ways to move 13:27:12 were I a virtuous soul, I would refactor that code 13:27:14 <|amethyst> (and _move_player of course might attack instead of moving) 13:27:14 -!- OneEyedJack has quit [Quit: Page closed] 13:27:18 or open a door! 13:27:30 <|amethyst> _open_door might attack too :) 13:27:45 -!- aule_vala has joined ##crawl-dev 13:27:55 and of course they're at least 50% duplicated code 13:27:59 Aha! Genius, he is... not. :) 13:28:03 I will guarantee that there's at least one bug lurking in there 13:28:45 So how does one pronounce |amethyst? 13:29:08 incorrectly 13:29:14 :D 13:29:43 <|amethyst> "through amethyst" I guess 13:29:51 <|amethyst> I used to use \amethyst 13:30:01 <|amethyst> which was pronounced "methyst" of course 13:30:16 <|amethyst> I just say "amethyst" 13:30:31 Thank you. :) 13:31:15 I started playing Crawl a few months ago, first on my PC, then on the WebTiles server. I'm addicted. 13:31:33 -!- valtern_ has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 13:33:06 -!- alefury has quit [*.net *.split] 13:33:38 -!- ZRN_ is now known as ZRN 13:34:17 I want to create a playback device for ttyrecs that incorporates the tiles. I'm guessing I'm not the first with the idea... 13:34:51 <|amethyst> ttyrecs don't store enough information to do that, unfortunately 13:35:12 <|amethyst> what might be easier (still a lot of work) is saving the stream of webtiles messages 13:35:40 <|amethyst> then you could use a modified version of the webtiles client to play it back 13:36:00 <|amethyst> Hm 13:36:17 <|amethyst> it would be tricky when tile indices change 13:36:22 Well, that's a bummer. I just recently cloned the repository, so I haven't read all of the code. But it sounds like you came up with the solution. 13:36:28 <|amethyst> which happens frequently 13:36:49 <|amethyst> aule_vala: I didn't come up with the solution, just an idea :) 13:37:05 I didn't realize the stream was different. I thought the tiles were merely an overlay. 13:37:32 That kinda blows my idea up. 13:37:49 Yours is realistic, you say? 13:38:15 <|amethyst> I don't know... it seems like it would be possible, but there are all kinds of details I haven't thought about 13:38:28 <|amethyst> if you see edlothiol or Medar around, ask them about it 13:38:47 <|amethyst> they know the webtiles code and architecture better than I do (edlothiol wrote it) 13:39:33 I registered this nick, so does that enable you and the others to email me? Or vice versa? 13:39:52 <|amethyst> no, but there is !tell 13:39:54 <|amethyst> !help !tell 13:39:54 !tell: I don't grok. Syntax is !tell PERSON MESSAGE. 13:40:16 <|amethyst> that will have the bot inform them of the message the next time they say something in channel 13:40:23 <|amethyst> then they can !tell you their response 13:41:01 <|amethyst> it works in ##crawl and ##crawl-dev, or by /msg Sequell 13:41:05 I'm here 13:41:17 Yeah, I still haven't read the IRC faq. Just jumped right in. Will learn more, promise. :) You're very kind. 13:41:30 <|amethyst> edlothiol: aule_vala wanted to know about the theoretical feasibility of recording and playing back webtiles streams 13:41:31 Hi! 13:41:49 <|amethyst> whether it's worth spending any effort on 13:41:51 -!- valtern_ has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 13:42:02 -!- rossi has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:42:31 Couldn't have stated it better... :) 13:42:32 it's a lot of data to save, and compatibility would be complicated 13:42:36 -!- Keanan has joined ##crawl-dev 13:43:30 Yeah, when I approached, it was under the assumption that the tiles were merely dressing over the console data. I had no idea they were separate. 13:43:52 just save a webm recording of the entirety of every game ever played. problem: solved 13:44:05 there's a lot more information in the webtiles stream than you can get from a ttyrec 13:44:37 it would maybe be possible to translate tile indices back to tile names, but that doesn't solve the compatibility problems completely of course 13:45:58 it would certainly be very cool to have, especially since there's a lot more things you could inspect (like other map locations, or the player's inventory) 13:45:59 Compatibility is a lesser problem than initial feasibility... 13:47:08 My dream is to be able to click on a player's past games and view it as a webtiles recording, with the option of bypassing real-time for a set playback speed... Just a little thing. :P 13:47:30 well, other than that, it wouldn't be especially hard to do; just save the webtiles stream in the server with some timestamps (and probably compress it) 13:47:40 <|amethyst> edlothiol: I guess synchronization is also a problem if you don't want to start from the beginning 13:48:23 yeah, you'd basically have to start at the beginning (or at a point where a spectator joined) and go from there 13:48:33 Yes, starting from the beginning. 13:48:44 also I have no idea how taxing that would be on CPU and IO 13:48:46 <|amethyst> could dump the spectator-joined stuff on entry to every level, and periodically 13:49:08 No spectator data necessary, right? 13:49:29 Is that saved in ttyrec? 13:49:38 not sure what you mean by spectator data 13:49:41 <|amethyst> aule_vala: what edlothiol means is that, when a spectator joins, the server sends them enough of the game state to "catch up" 13:50:21 <|amethyst> aule_vala: and those messages would also be useful for allowing the viewer to start in the middle 13:50:26 <|amethyst> of the game 13:50:33 -!- valtern_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:50:35 Oh, you are suggesting using the tiles playback concept to augment the spectator experience? 13:50:40 <|amethyst> s/the viewer/playback/ 13:50:49 Got it. Nice. 13:50:55 <|amethyst> more the other way around :) 13:51:02 also, disk space is a bit of a problem if you consider how much space even the ttyrecs take up 13:51:19 <|amethyst> yeah, that is a potential concern 13:51:33 <|amethyst> I wonder what the size of a compressed webtiles stream is compared to a compressed ttyrec 13:52:11 <|amethyst> even if it's the same size, that does effectively double the storage requirements 13:52:38 <|amethyst> meaning CSZO goes from being able to hold about 2 years of ttyrecs to about 1 13:53:02 These are the days of terabyte drives, soon to be petabytes. Need a donation? 13:53:35 -!- UncertainKitten has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:53:39 <|amethyst> CSZO is a rented server so I'd have to pay monthly 13:53:50 <|amethyst> but, yeah, I should up the disk space at some point 13:54:20 hm 13:54:20 <|amethyst> CSZO is not the most disk-limited server, though; I think cbro has less space 13:54:24 -!- tsohg has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 13:54:24 I play on CAO, right now. That's what I found first. Is CSZO the same? 13:54:44 Hi bloax 13:54:56 Hi. 13:55:06 recognize your name from the Tavern 13:55:09 <|amethyst> CAO has more disk than CSZO 13:55:22 <|amethyst> 788 GiB on the chroot partition 13:55:29 Nice 13:55:39 <|amethyst> CSZO has 455 GiB total (all one partition except for /boot) 13:55:54 Seems petite... 13:56:31 <|amethyst> and CDO is bigger (1.1 TiB in /home) 13:57:20 -!- Lasty1 is now known as Lasty_ 13:57:50 Lots of names from there, actually. :) 13:57:55 compatibility would probably be doable if we keep the tileinfo js files for each version and are a bit more careful about changing what the server sends 13:57:56 CSZO also has the best experimental branch 13:58:53 <|amethyst> aule_vala: though to be honest, if I were going to up the amount of disk I would first go for RAID 1 rather than increased storage 13:58:54 So I didn't even know about CSZO, or CDO. I thought I saw a post about CDO servers going down last year... 13:59:14 amethyst: I agree. :) 13:59:38 -!- valtern_ has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:00:24 <|amethyst> aule_vala: anyway, if you want to play around with this, you can run webtiles locally 14:00:36 <|amethyst> aule_vala: see webserver/README 14:02:31 I will do this. And I thank you +edlothiol and +|amethyst, and PleasingFungus for the introduction. Saving this session for reference. ;) 14:02:40 <|amethyst> Hm... eating is uninterruptable, right? 14:03:10 I believe so? 14:03:16 -!- Keanan has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:03:31 if you start eating while a monster is attacking you, you will not be interrupted 14:03:47 Doing a quick little recording of 3 minutes worth of webtiles gets me 12 MB. 14:04:05 <|amethyst> Bloax: before or after compression? 14:04:26 it's a libx264 stream 14:04:33 so obviously after 14:04:35 lessens is currently playing a DD^Iashol. Ballsy, but once he gets to *** it's pretty solid 14:04:48 I royally messed it up though. 14:04:48 <|amethyst> Bloax: oh, you mean an actual recording 14:05:54 -!- Keanan has joined ##crawl-dev 14:07:59 03|amethyst02 07* 0.15-a0-1889-gea682fd: Track eating in action counts. 10(49 minutes ago, 3 files, 8+ 0-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=ea682fd60d41 14:09:05 hey, |amethyst, do you know why "goblin ; sling cursed" is spawning a goblin with a non-cursed sling? 14:09:23 "&%sling cursed" spawns a cursed sling, as expected 14:11:10 <|amethyst> hm, pluses do work 14:13:42 I just went to have a puff and it ovccurred to me that if console and tiles are separate streams, then the storage issue could be solved by only saving the stream for that which was played. Console play is saved as console ttyrec, webtiles play is saved as new recording type. Why save both? 14:14:25 <|amethyst> aule_vala: so that console people can watch webtiles games 14:14:27 <|amethyst> and vice versa 14:14:30 (There's a lot I don't know, obviously)\ 14:14:41 <|amethyst> FooTV for example only works with ttyrecs 14:15:29 Well, it's still got to be a smaller stream than audio or video by capture. 14:15:58 I'll learn more. 14:16:18 Gonna go play a bit, now, though. Thanks again. 14:16:38 Also, kitty's meaowing for lunch. :) 14:16:56 -!- Keanan has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:17:23 -!- aule_vala has quit [Quit: Page closed] 14:19:17 -!- zxc232 has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:20:40 -!- tensorpudding has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:22:55 -!- koil has quit [Quit: Page closed] 14:27:12 -!- schistosomatic has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 14:27:51 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: hm, acquire also doesn't work, and superb works differently from vault items 14:31:22 <|amethyst> (though I guess that difference is irrelevant because you never give monsters an item with a random base type) 14:32:21 I guess you can't do "&Mgoblin ; weapon good_item" 14:32:26 (just tested) 14:32:39 uh, someone needs to remove a tree from evilmike's crypt end 14:32:49 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: it's "any weapon good_item" 14:32:54 the room with the spiders is now impossible for an unspoiled player to find 14:33:06 oh I remember someone was talking about that the other day 14:33:12 I'll do it 14:33:17 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: and that works 14:33:24 <|amethyst> about to push a fix for cursed and damaged 14:33:28 thanks! 14:33:32 that'll help me debug another problem :) 14:33:48 <|amethyst> (superb also works, the only difference from floor superb is that it doesn't change the base type weightings for completely random objects) 14:35:23 <|amethyst> (btw, "mundane cursed" should work already) 14:35:51 -!- HellTiger has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 14:36:49 03|amethyst02 07* 0.15-a0-1890-g428bd8f: Support cursed/damaged items in monspecs (PleasingFungus) 10(47 seconds ago, 1 file, 5+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=428bd8f2e17e 14:37:38 minmay: what was the change that broke evilmike_haunted_forest? 14:37:38 -!- bh has joined ##crawl-dev 14:37:43 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: I left a TODO comment in there in case you start running out of things to refactor 14:37:44 PleasingFungus: ??damaged item 14:37:58 |amethyst: well, that's a clear and present danger :) 14:38:06 damaged_item?? 14:38:11 hm 14:38:13 ??damaged item 14:38:14 I don't have a page labeled damaged_item in my learndb. 14:38:41 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: "damaged" is like "cursed" without the curse 14:38:49 PleasingFungus: opaque trees presumably 14:38:51 ??damaged 14:38:51 wounded[1/1]: 100% not (green); 99-81 lightly (green); 80-61 moderately (brown); 60-41 heavily (magenta); 40-21 severely (red); 20-1 almost dead (red). 14:38:57 %git :/ree 14:38:57 07|amethyst02 * 0.15-a0-1855-g57517b2: Add a lemuel_tele_altar variant. 10(3 days ago, 1 file, 47+ 0-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=57517b2ca831 14:39:05 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: from doc/develop/levels/syntax.txt: 14:39:06 <|amethyst> * "damaged" sets the item plusses to -1..-4. 14:39:06 <|amethyst> * "cursed" gets a curse plus plusses as in "damaged". 14:39:14 ah 14:39:15 ahh 14:39:17 %git 7a9dbbb8cd0f279 14:39:19 07wheals02 * 0.15-a0-2-g7a9dbbb: Remove mangroves, make single trees block LOS. 10(5 months ago, 19 files, 46+ 51-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=7a9dbbb8cd0f 14:40:36 <|amethyst> I wouldn't be surprised if other things like not_cursed didn't work for monspec items 14:41:35 <|amethyst> the specs are created in the same way, and both call items ultimately, but then there's quit a bit of different code in between (and also postprocessing after items()) 14:41:49 <|amethyst> s/items u/items() u/ 14:47:28 -!- MIC132 has joined ##crawl-dev 14:48:00 minmay: I just tested, and spawning goblins with cursed slings, and then killing them, still makes them drop blue glowing slings, as expected 14:48:21 likewise runed 14:48:51 Need quick help 14:48:56 I guess it's possible that the bug only occurs if they pick up cursed launchers and then drop them.....? 14:48:57 getting this when make-ing 14:49:41 "No rule to make target 'mon-stuff.h', needed by 'act-iter.o'. Stop." 14:50:25 <|amethyst> MIC132: rm *.d and try again 14:50:34 Will "make clean" do? 14:50:41 <|amethyst> I think so 14:51:08 The miraculous solution to crawl-compiling0related problems.. 14:51:28 -!- bonghitz has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 14:51:33 Keep It Clean 14:51:53 Downside is now compling will take some time.. 14:52:05 <|amethyst> probably building without inline depgen would do 14:52:20 No idea what that means even. 14:52:23 <|amethyst> but I'm not sure 14:52:37 Not a good sing considering I'm studying IT.. 14:52:45 *sign 14:52:46 <|amethyst> MIC132: by default we generate the .d files (dependencies) at the same time as compiling 14:52:58 <|amethyst> dependency lists that is 14:53:05 Ah, yes. I get that 14:53:12 So you mean to try skipping that? 14:53:25 Or rather, redoing? 14:53:26 <|amethyst> MIC132: make NO_INLINE_DEPGEN=y says to generate the dependency lists in a separate pass 14:53:35 Ah 14:53:43 Well, too late for that now. 14:53:50 We'll see if it compiles 14:53:55 <|amethyst> I don't know whether it would work anyway 14:54:22 <|amethyst> because if make has already loaded the .d files, replacing them before compiling won't matter 14:57:28 looking at 5734. it seems like a reasonable request, given the way that paral works 14:57:53 considering whether it'd make sense to use the same duration 14:58:07 since alternating between paralysis & sleep seems rare but equally shitty 14:58:18 03|amethyst02 07* 0.15-a0-1891-gf33928a: Unspoil the spider room in evilmike_haunted_forest (minmay) 10(2 minutes ago, 1 file, 5+ 5-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=f33928a2895c 14:58:51 o 14:58:54 I forgot to push 14:59:01 the spider room -- you need to burn down a tree to get in? 15:00:01 -!- stanzill is now known as stanzwecha 15:00:01 -!- Roarke has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:00:05 my version is better though 15:00:12 <|amethyst> go ahead and replace it then 15:00:16 -!- WalkerBoh has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:00:28 <|amethyst> bh: my version lets you get it with just shatter or LRD 15:00:34 <|amethyst> s/it/in/ 15:00:40 well. I guess mine makes an actual path, which is less in the spirit of the original 15:00:42 idk 15:00:52