00:00:09 -!- poopfist42 has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:03:13 Unstable branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.14-a0-1361-g0512ea0 (34) 00:06:03 Unstable branch on rl.heh.fi updated to: 0.14-a0-1361-g0512ea0 (34) 00:10:52 -!- ophanim has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:12:23 -!- jbenedetto has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 00:13:41 hello? 00:16:02 -!- Riddim has quit [Quit: Goodbye, World] 00:16:15 -!- Sgeo has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:17:22 http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=brXAJNBu (note: not a serious submission) 00:17:35 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.14-a0-1361-g0512ea0 (34) 00:17:39 -!- Sgeo_ has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:17:39 (although the layout could be used for one) 00:18:47 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 00:25:02 -!- Ragnor has quit [Disconnected by services] 00:35:02 -!- tensorpudding has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:36:08 Unstable branch on crawl.lantea.net updated to: 0.14-a0-1361-g0512ea0 (34) 00:41:48 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 00:42:35 Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.14-a0-1361-g0512ea0 00:45:07 -!- VolteccerJack has quit [Quit: I love my HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <-] 00:46:56 !tell tenofswords did you intend to remove the lair vaults that were added in 1bc176067ecdc? also i really don't see what blink other statues really achieve other than being annoying (also it's pretty bad to have them use the same name and glyph as a statue that you can't actually destroy) 00:46:57 MarvinPA: OK, I'll let tenofswords know. 00:49:39 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.14-a0-1362-g6b180f8: Remove more Lair runed doors 10(28 minutes ago, 1 file, 3+ 3-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=6b180f8e410f 00:49:39 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.14-a0-1363-g4cf5091: Fix Ziggurat default-depth 10(47 seconds ago, 1 file, 2+ 2-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=4cf50910d0f6 00:51:20 <|amethyst> Hm, CLAN trunk (which is on 0.14-a0-1361-g0512ea0) is giving a lua error 00:51:22 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.14-a0-1361-g0512ea0 (34) 00:51:31 <|amethyst> Can't find coords for '|' from places_connected 00:51:39 <|amethyst> but none of the other servers are 00:51:58 odd 00:53:40 <|amethyst> oh 00:53:48 <|amethyst> the second and third time it worked 00:53:51 -!- master_j has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.2] 00:54:47 -!- Chapayev has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:54:58 <|amethyst> oh 00:55:00 -!- inspector071 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:01:04 Lightli: you've never seen dis_grunt, have you. 01:05:25 !tell tenofswords also i really don't see how quicksilver dragons fit in snake zig, also i think 400 orcs on zig:27 might be a little bit excessive (looks good other than that though!) 01:05:25 MarvinPA: OK, I'll let tenofswords know. 01:06:30 03|amethyst02 07* 0.14-a0-1364-g7eec19c: Fix a sporadic error in validating the frog pond. 10(10 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=7eec19c4e80a 01:10:56 <|amethyst> !tell tenofswords it does take quite a few tries to place the frog pond now... should it maybe have a higher shallow-to-deep-water ratio? 01:10:56 |amethyst: OK, I'll let tenofswords know. 01:11:55 -!- xnavy has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 01:15:10 -!- slifty has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 01:18:35 -!- magicpoints has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:20:41 -!- xnavy_ is now known as xnavy 01:21:52 -!- gammafunk_ has joined ##crawl-dev 01:23:34 -!- Zeor has quit [Quit: burp] 01:23:39 -!- gammafunk has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:23:40 -!- gammafunk_ is now known as gammafunk 01:24:29 -!- eith has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 01:25:55 -!- eb_ has quit [] 01:30:35 -!- Zilis has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:40:28 -!- Lawman0 has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:40:31 -!- flappity has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 01:47:53 -!- heteroy has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 01:48:05 -!- heteroy_ is now known as heteroy 01:55:53 -!- Zilis has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:56:09 -!- dacendoran has quit [Quit: irc2go] 01:56:29 -!- minqmay has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:58:10 -!- fusentrap has quit [Quit: Page closed] 01:59:35 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:00:38 -!- pelotron_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:05:37 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 02:05:43 -!- Blazinghand_ has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:18:10 -!- oberstein has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:19:40 -!- Quashie has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:23:19 -!- oberstein has joined ##crawl-dev 02:30:31 -!- Lightli has quit [Quit: Page closed] 02:34:00 -!- oberstein has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:34:40 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 02:36:49 -!- oberstein has joined ##crawl-dev 02:53:09 -!- elliptic has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:55:56 -!- Zeor has quit [Quit: stupid damn crawl] 03:03:35 -!- wack has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 03:05:11 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 03:07:47 -!- dtsund has left ##crawl-dev 03:07:47 -!- blabber has joined ##crawl-dev 03:11:59 -!- flappity has quit [Disconnected by services] 03:15:54 -!- paulsomebody has joined ##crawl-dev 03:17:07 -!- tabstorm has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 03:17:42 -!- _dd has joined ##crawl-dev 03:23:20 Idea — add an umbrella term to be used in search regexps, covering melee and ranged weapons. Currently, as best as I can tell, it does not understand 'melee' or 'ranged'. 03:28:26 When would you use those? 03:31:23 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Quit: Drowning in a sea of anguish] 03:31:27 -!- Blazinghand_ is now known as Blazinghand 03:31:54 When you are searching for branded items, but don't wish to see either kind of weapons. 03:33:38 I guess. I feel like either it's so early that the list is very short, or it's so late you know the weapon school anyway. 03:34:42 Would ranged include throwing weapons? Other missiles? Should elemental staffs be melee? 03:35:10 I think it should include launchers and weapons, yes. 03:35:55 I am not so sure about Elemental Staff, but if it's considered to be a weapon, then it should be part "melee". 03:36:51 -!- simmarine has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:37:27 Oh, you meant magical staves. I am not so sure about them. 03:39:44 I'll keep it simple and just do weapon class. So throwable weapons are not included. 03:40:18 They are not found with "weapon" either and there is already a "throwable" keyword for them. 03:42:26 You are right about the case when you want to find something specific, you will almost always look for either a specific school, or a base weapon type, but I think it would help those who *don't* want to see something, like spellcasters. 03:43:26 -!- Nivim has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:45:25 03Medar02 07* 0.14-a0-1365-g8948931: Handle invalid login cookie more gracefully 10(45 minutes ago, 1 file, 8+ 2-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=8948931c8192 03:45:25 03Medar02 07* 0.14-a0-1366-gcf2f55b: Annotate ranged and melee weapons for search 10(5 minutes ago, 1 file, 6+ 0-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=cf2f55ba06d8 03:45:36 There we go 03:46:10 so 'weapon' will still find both, right? 03:46:17 yes 03:46:30 -!- Nivim has joined ##crawl-dev 03:46:41 very nice, Medar, paulsomebody 03:46:56 -!- rchandra has left ##crawl-dev 03:47:14 Medar: Thank you, it helps. 03:49:21 -!- dacendoran has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 03:51:47 Good. Any other search prefixes that would be useful? 03:53:25 -!- Nivim has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 03:53:54 I'll carefully think over it and then let you know. Adding description of existing prefixes to the '^F?' might help. 03:54:05 -!- Nivim has joined ##crawl-dev 03:55:13 Aren't they already there? Altough maybe a bit out of date. 03:55:34 Cycling through '>' lists mimics by Grandiloquent Gentleman 03:55:46 They are present, but the list is incomplete. 03:57:19 I think an umbrella term covering all axillary armour slots might be helpful, particularly in the early game. 03:58:37 Medar, paulsomebody: does the lua file not cross-reference the help text? 03:58:47 Medar: a way to search for all ego items would be nice 03:59:12 afaik you have to do like [runed|shiny|glowing|whatever] 03:59:19 ego works 03:59:20 ontoclasm: I think there's already 'ego' and 'branded'. 03:59:24 oh, hm 03:59:35 nm, i'm dumb then >.> 03:59:43 the lua file is obviously definitive 03:59:59 I mean unless you replace it with your own function or something ... 04:00:27 Well lua file is not really good end user documentation :P 04:00:43 I know 04:01:04 I'm not sure I knew that there *was* end-user documentation :-( 04:01:16 in fact I think I did not 04:02:14 I was meaning to ask, is there a reason why there are so many double characters in the syntax: !!, <<, >> and ||? 04:02:32 probably because regex? 04:03:01 that is, to avoid clashing with regex syntax too much 04:03:09 Honestly, I think it would be better off not doing regex by default 04:03:28 Enabled regex with first character / or something 04:03:32 could be 04:03:44 but it would be kind of a disruptive change to make ... 04:03:49 Indeed 04:04:32 but at the same time much more subtle than that major overhaul a while back 04:04:42 Medar: What do you think about an 'aux' prefix? 04:05:00 paulsomebody: hmm? 04:05:10 meaning what? 04:05:52 "I think an umbrella term covering all axillary armour slots might be helpful, particularly in the early game." 04:06:07 you can do: armour && !!body 04:06:19 hmm 04:06:40 -!- gammafunk has quit [Quit: gammafunk] 04:06:41 -!- Mottie has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:06:58 -!- Mottie has joined ##crawl-dev 04:07:02 on a side note, you should really use autopickup script for those :) 04:07:17 ??ellipticrc 04:07:17 ellipticrc[1/2]: http://dobrazupa.org/rcfiles/crawl-git/elliptic.rc 04:10:49 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 04:18:49 Could add "autopickup". Wonder there could be performance issues with that. 04:21:15 -!- Foamed has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 04:23:14 Something about identification status might be good too. 04:24:16 Medar: I already use that, but this script has it's limitations. 04:25:41 ...for example, it will not help you if you are wearing +0 boots, is grateful about the AC bonus, but nevertheless want to try out the spare pairs you have found lying around to see if any of them are enchanted. 04:25:53 Sure, I have a bit more involved version. 04:26:06 http://crawl.lantea.net/crawl/rcfiles/crawl-git/Medar.rc 04:26:25 Kind of half assed though :) 04:26:49 But the not body armour part works reasonably well, until you get to zot and your inventory is filled with cloaks. 04:28:50 Thanks, I'll be glad to take a look at your rc file. 04:29:31 -!- stabwound has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 04:29:33 I think you can theoretically autodrop the spare undranded cloak, though. 04:30:59 -!- stabwound has joined ##crawl-dev 04:31:09 -!- stabwound has quit [Changing host] 04:31:09 -!- stabwound has joined ##crawl-dev 04:34:17 I am a bit puzzled about the gap between the default rc files and those of the more experienced players. 04:34:47 Doesn't it mean that the default rc files should be made better, to help facilitate better playing habits? 04:36:10 Sure, but lots of these things are opinions to begin with. And many are confusing if you don't understand them. 04:36:59 Also changing defaults is always a bit tricky, because there are a lot of people who have played for a long time, who will suddenly get a different setting. 04:39:05 Making options easier to discover/edit would probably solve a lot of things. 04:39:51 You are quite right, but some options simply are matters of fact, such as autopickup of "blood" potions. 04:40:42 Sure. 04:40:54 So is a prompt before reading a scroll of Silence, granted that you have either divine abilities, or memorized spells. 04:41:12 -!- oberstein has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 04:44:10 Including an link to the file at the git explaining rc file options at the top of the header should help immensely, as many of the options are not self-explanatory. 04:44:51 -!- oberstein has joined ##crawl-dev 04:45:21 -!- Nivim has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:45:45 -!- heteroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:46:50 -!- Nivim has joined ##crawl-dev 04:48:28 -!- valtern has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:58:55 Medar: Do you think any of the above suggestions are worth taking any further? :p 04:59:45 -!- heteroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:00:14 -!- Nivim has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:00:19 :cn 05:00:40 Wrong window... 05:01:03 -!- Nivim has joined ##crawl-dev 05:01:19 -!- radinms has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 05:02:27 Well, I think potions no longer give nutrition so blood should be probably be marked useless. 05:03:07 blood still gives a small amount 05:03:18 Oh, damnit. 05:04:02 It's very a marginal gain, isn't it? 05:04:59 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 05:05:02 -!- Nivim has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:05:13 Don't know about "dangerous" item confirmations. Pretty much just a preference. Doing inscriptions by default is probably confusing, and if confirm by default then there has to be a new option to disable that (maybe). 05:06:36 yeah that doesn't sound like it should be a default 05:07:04 in general i tell people who ask about configs not to just copy mine/elliptic's whatever, doing that is a bad idea 05:07:45 options_guide.txt link could be added to WebTiles edit rc window actually 05:07:58 Problem is figuring out what URL to use, and where will it be defined 05:07:59 Medar: This was the idea. 05:07:59 since it's not designed to be particularly helpful to new players, it's designed to make the way i play easier for me 05:09:18 One option I would like to see changed in default rc is sort_menus 05:09:35 -!- MP2E has quit [Quit: leaving] 05:12:13 That and pickup_mode 05:12:58 oh yeah default pickup_mode is some kind of terrifying abomination 05:14:22 MarvinPA: I was thinking about changing mine recently. Do you have any suggestions? 05:15:30 well multi is the non-default option 05:15:55 oh i guess there's auto too but that's sort of even weirder than single 05:18:17 MarvinPA: I've been experimenting with that, but it's not intelligent enough to be an improvement. Thanks for the suggestion, I'll try making that "multi". 05:19:37 -!- Nivim has joined ##crawl-dev 05:20:35 -!- eith has joined ##crawl-dev 05:20:45 -!- dagonfive has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:22:45 -!- Ragdoll has joined ##crawl-dev 05:24:31 -!- Psyknux has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 05:27:22 -!- Nivim has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:29:06 -!- Nivim has joined ##crawl-dev 05:30:06 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 05:31:57 -!- Vherid has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:32:38 Is it possible to create an rc file option that would use chunks produced from the creatures with lowest HD first, when eating or dropping? 05:34:07 Maybe in theory, but not really. 05:34:41 It would really help with making Necromancer's life more comfortable. 05:45:29 -!- Xiberia has joined ##crawl-dev 05:46:49 -!- Nivim has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 05:52:31 -!- dpeg has joined ##crawl-dev 05:54:32 -!- inspector071 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:55:02 -!- Ragdoll has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:55:46 -!- Ragdoll has joined ##crawl-dev 06:01:27 -!- Nivim has joined ##crawl-dev 06:01:28 -!- Foamed_ has quit [Quit: Heading to bed.] 06:05:30 -!- Nivim has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 06:09:19 Hi there! 06:09:55 Pekka and I are discussing whether additional Ctrl-F terms could be useful. Any ideas? 06:14:00 dpeg: paulsomebody suggested "aux" for non-body armour earlier. 06:14:35 That can be currently done with "armour && !!body" of course 06:16:43 Regarding "armour slots that are current not covered". Don't really think depending on external factors is a good idea. 06:17:25 pity that :) 06:17:54 I am fine with armour && !!body, only that we then should list it in the help text as an example (I can do this). 06:18:19 That makes sense. 06:19:24 ...cannot think of other really useful cases 06:24:14 Regarding the documentation. While back I added {god gift}, but that's a visible annotation too by default (IIRC), so not sure if it's worth mentioning. 06:24:52 -!- Morg0th has quit [Quit: leaving] 06:25:16 Also I made it so that ego items can be found with the short hand for it's effect. So cloak of poison resistance gets {rPois}. 06:25:26 -!- Sonata has quit [Read error: Connection timed out] 06:25:30 yes, that was really good! 06:25:30 Again, not sure if that needs to be mentioned. 06:25:40 doc space is cheap, I'll do it 06:31:48 -!- scummos| has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 06:33:29 so many god proposals on the forum, it's slightly hysterical 06:39:35 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 06:43:46 MarvinPA: that dragon in a Lair end was behind runed door not because of being an "autoexplore trap", but because of it being spoily 06:44:13 -!- poopfist42 has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 06:44:36 MarvinPA: if there's a nasty fixed enemy in a well-known vault, new players should be warned somehow 06:48:45 03dpeg02 07* 0.14-a0-1367-g8f0a072: An attempt to improve the Ctrl-F help screen. 10(54 seconds ago, 1 file, 16+ 16-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=8f0a072023b5 06:48:47 Medar: you can tell me if I got it right. 06:50:14 Looks good to me. 06:51:11 cool 06:54:02 -!- DrinkMachine has quit [Quit: Leaving] 06:57:23 -!- Bloax has joined ##crawl-dev 06:58:45 -!- magicpoints has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 07:02:53 -!- conted has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 07:21:27 -!- tenofswords has joined ##crawl-dev 07:22:07 of course I should have checked over the last stage more carefully, sigh 07:22:07 tenofswords: You have 3 messages. Use !messages to read them. 07:22:35 -!- eith|2 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:24:07 -!- eith|2 has joined ##crawl-dev 07:24:17 -!- eith|2 is now known as eith_ 07:24:21 no, didn't intend to remove kennysheep's lair vaults 07:25:35 blink other statues in tukima's are more to constrain the dancing weapons by replacing some of the doors, although yes their name should be changed to be different from the indestructable dancing weapon generator also in the wizlab 07:26:22 the timer of that machine might be enough for making the wizlab gimmick "enough" in light of non-Blade dancing weapons getting brands, I will admit 07:27:54 I put quicksilver dragons in snake zig because of their description, "A long and sinuous dragon, seemingly more neck and tail than anything else."; another experimental gimmick for trying to buff a weak zig, not fully necessary with so many extra greater nagas 07:30:13 -!- eith_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:30:26 (the "band" part of the monster definition in orc zigs was me screwing around with an exploit in the zig monster placement thing, again something deserving of removal) 07:30:31 -!- RBrandon__ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 07:30:36 should I prepare a patch for all this stuff? 07:32:54 tenofswords: cannot comment on the tukima wizlab... yes to kennysheep's maps :) 07:33:08 quicksilver in Snake (and snake zig levels) is a good observation! 07:33:45 have no quicksilver dragon Snake branch end level, right? ... should've one 07:37:32 could work 07:42:06 I can also suggest "stash" and "stashed" search prefixes for all items that have been stashed by the player, for the times when you need to list them all, but are unwilling to cycle through waypoints manually. 07:43:42 kilobyte: Maybe runed doors can contain foreboding warnings about what lies beyond them, to be used in such "spoilery" cases? 07:43:56 paulsomebody: Ctrl-F * lists everything on all waypoints 07:44:15 dpeg: Ahh, thanks. 07:45:25 -!- stabwound has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:00:39 -!- Pacra has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 08:03:44 -!- heteroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:09:17 -!- ackack has joined ##crawl-dev 08:17:27 -!- ackack has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 08:17:44 -!- heteroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:24:27 -!- heteroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:32:12 -!- Hailley has quit [Quit: Petra is closed!] 08:38:11 -!- blabber has quit [Quit: Flücht] 08:38:19 -!- magicpoints has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 08:41:43 -!- heteroy has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 08:48:41 -!- ldf has quit [Quit: ldf] 08:49:32 -!- inspector071 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:55:13 -!- eith|2 has joined ##crawl-dev 08:55:50 -!- eith|2 is now known as eith_ 08:59:13 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 09:01:43 HarmlessChicken (L17 TrFi) ERROR in 'mon-movetarget.cc' at line 111: ZotDef: monster fire elemental failed to pathfind to (40,43) (the Orb) (Zot (ZotDef)) 09:07:33 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 09:09:20 -!- Bloaxor has joined ##crawl-dev 09:09:21 -!- Bloax has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:17:31 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 09:17:53 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 09:26:20 -!- tsohg has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:27:14 -!- rossi has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.2] 09:30:50 -!- Daekdroom has quit [Quit: Saindo] 09:31:26 -!- lessens has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:32:52 -!- Bloaxzorro has joined ##crawl-dev 09:32:52 -!- Bloaxor has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:34:59 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 09:38:14 -!- MaxFrost has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:42:15 -!- elliptic has quit [*.net *.split] 09:42:15 -!- paulsomebody has quit [*.net *.split] 09:42:15 -!- Pepe has quit [*.net *.split] 09:42:15 -!- codehero has quit [*.net *.split] 09:42:15 -!- bmfx has quit [*.net *.split] 09:42:15 -!- orionstein has quit [*.net *.split] 09:42:15 -!- tksquared has quit [*.net *.split] 09:42:15 -!- Vizer has quit [*.net *.split] 09:42:15 -!- Wah has quit [*.net *.split] 09:42:15 -!- Lantell has quit [*.net *.split] 09:42:15 -!- Zaba has quit [*.net *.split] 09:42:15 -!- imantor has quit [*.net *.split] 09:42:15 -!- ColdPie_ has quit [*.net *.split] 09:42:15 -!- jarpiain has quit [*.net *.split] 09:42:15 -!- Danei has quit [*.net *.split] 09:42:15 -!- OCTOTROG has quit [*.net *.split] 09:42:15 -!- yokelz has quit [*.net *.split] 09:42:15 -!- johlstei_ has quit [*.net *.split] 09:43:13 -!- Bloaxzorro has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:43:26 -!- Bloax has joined ##crawl-dev 09:44:31 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 09:50:46 Ammo acquirement and throwing god gifts not giving nets. by dck 09:52:45 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 09:54:21 -!- Bloaxor has joined ##crawl-dev 09:54:21 -!- Bloax has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:55:50 Sprint: Thunderdome and Mara's illusions. by dck 09:55:50 Invalid depth defined for Sprint: Thunderdome; monsters stop spawning. by joelsdaman1 09:57:53 -!- Taraiph is now known as Tbigye 10:00:22 -!- Bloaxzorro has joined ##crawl-dev 10:00:22 -!- Bloaxor has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:01:47 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 10:01:47 -!- Bloaxzorro has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:02:52 -!- Bloaxzorro has joined ##crawl-dev 10:03:04 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.14-a0-1368-g07c9527: Arenasprint fixes (#7823) 10(46 seconds ago, 1 file, 8+ 9-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=07c95271abef 10:06:47 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:08:14 -!- paulsomebody has joined ##crawl-dev 10:08:14 -!- Lantell has joined ##crawl-dev 10:08:14 -!- Zaba has joined ##crawl-dev 10:08:14 -!- ColdPie_ has joined ##crawl-dev 10:08:14 -!- jarpiain has joined ##crawl-dev 10:08:14 -!- johlstei_ has joined ##crawl-dev 10:08:22 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 10:19:30 -!- Jebus has quit [Quit: Page closed] 10:21:45 -!- tsohg has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:22:21 -!- radinms has quit [] 10:24:41 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 10:31:06 -!- TAS_2012v has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:33:58 -!- ackack has joined ##crawl-dev 10:35:34 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 10:35:39 -!- tinybat has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 10:37:27 -!- Tbigye has quit [Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- The professional IRC Client :D] 10:43:32 -!- ophanim has joined ##crawl-dev 10:43:49 so im on d:5 and ran into jellies 10:44:08 is splitting really suppose to make encounters this early with jellies require wands and stuff? 10:45:02 -!- Sgeo has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:45:49 -!- heteroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:47:45 -!- Bloax has joined ##crawl-dev 10:47:53 they die more easily than before 10:47:54 i'm a bit confused, why was spider form explicitly made unable to butcher following the recent changes? 10:48:01 this seems like grabbing defeat from the jaws of victory 10:48:20 were the chances to frag gear lowered too 10:48:24 i was excited when i saw the commit until i saw it was doing the opposite of what i expected 10:49:13 -!- Bloaxzorro has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 10:51:50 %git HEAD^{/spider form} 10:51:50 07MarvinPA02 * 0.14-a0-1337-g1537c4c: Let spider form butcher again 10(25 hours ago, 1 file, 0+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=1537c4c4cc36 10:52:06 ackack: that commit came immediately afterwards! 10:52:18 ok, didn't see that one 10:52:33 seemed to me there was a butchery change and then i saw the commit negating it in form_can_butcher 10:53:38 Game crashes after dying by Lorkhan 10:59:03 -!- Nivim has joined ##crawl-dev 10:59:58 -!- heteroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:06:43 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.14-a0-1368-g07c9527 (34) 11:08:08 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 11:17:22 -!- heteroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:18:35 -!- DrinkMachine has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:18:56 -!- rchandra has joined ##crawl-dev 11:19:53 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 11:22:25 -!- jeanjacques has quit [Quit: quit] 11:22:30 -!- stabwound has joined ##crawl-dev 11:23:49 -!- klz_ is now known as klz 11:23:51 -!- klz has quit [Changing host] 11:30:26 -!- heteroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:46:36 -!- Pacra has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:46:37 -!- heteroy has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 11:47:32 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 11:58:17 -!- Adder has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 11:59:03 -!- slifty has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 11:59:14 -!- Ragdoll has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 12:00:11 -!- Ragdoll has joined ##crawl-dev 12:00:24 -!- Aryth has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 12:06:55 -!- ackack has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 12:07:08 cannot figure out the bloody proper syntax in lua for local e = math.min(5, round((you.depth()) / 5) + 4) 12:10:51 <|amethyst> tenofswords: you want to round down, to nearest, or randomly? 12:11:36 down 12:13:07 <|amethyst> you want 4 at depth 1-5 and 5 at everything deeper? 12:13:13 <|amethyst> or did you mean math.max ? 12:13:40 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: ["Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com"]] 12:13:59 <|amethyst> err, at depth 1-4 12:14:18 <|amethyst> anyway, math.floor is what you want 12:14:33 <|amethyst> and if 5 is supposed to be a minimum, you want math.max 12:19:44 -!- slifty has quit [Client Quit] 12:21:18 have... something working now, at least 12:23:41 -!- Aryth1 has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.0.4 Insomnia http://www.kvirc.net/] 12:24:00 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 12:24:42 -!- tsohg has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:29:26 -!- tsohg has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:32:48 ...? the 0s in ziggurat_pillar_center_drop don't place for pan zig theme? 12:34:48 When entering a new level, Wardens can use their Seal ability before you can retreat up stairs by battaile 12:35:48 -!- ackack has joined ##crawl-dev 12:43:12 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 12:43:12 -!- Bloax has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:43:37 -!- Bloax has joined ##crawl-dev 12:44:54 duvessa by minmay 12:46:48 -!- Bloaxor has joined ##crawl-dev 12:47:20 -!- Bloax has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:48:17 -!- ackack has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 12:57:59 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: CADENZA-CLASS CLOCKWORK KNIGHT--OPERATION TERMINATED] 12:58:29 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 12:59:26 -!- Ragdoll has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:59:37 -!- Ragdoll has joined ##crawl-dev 12:59:55 -!- slifty has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:01:26 -!- oberstein has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:06:09 -!- wwwwwwwwwwwwww has quit [Quit: Page closed] 13:10:29 -!- NotKintak has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 13:11:44 -!- NotKintak has joined ##crawl-dev 13:16:25 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:21:26 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 13:25:33 -!- Basil has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 13:31:34 -!- gammafunk has joined ##crawl-dev 13:32:58 -!- oberstein has joined ##crawl-dev 13:34:33 -!- Bloax has joined ##crawl-dev 13:35:35 -!- Bloaxor has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:35:54 -!- simmarine has joined ##crawl-dev 13:37:11 -!- Bloaxor has joined ##crawl-dev 13:37:11 -!- Bloax has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:38:03 -!- Tux[Qyou] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 13:42:42 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 13:42:56 -!- heteroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:46:22 -!- inspector071 has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 13:54:06 -!- evilmike has joined ##crawl-dev 13:54:58 per ##crawl, what about making falchions 2-handed for spriggans so they don't think they'll be able to upgrade without losing a shield? Also, SpFi would not start with the useless skill. 13:55:43 kilobyte: sounds alright to me 13:55:46 I guess this also falls into the "falchion is smaller than a sabre" argument, but that's why I'd would want to introduce dirks and/or cutlasses to remove sabres 13:56:59 i just threw together a weird thing: http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=HFFwmC71 i guess this would be a crawl fork or variant, not a dcss thing 13:57:38 speaking of which: would you prefer 1. short sword->dirk, sabre->short sword; 2. same with s/dirk/seax/ or something; 3. sabre->cutlass ? 13:57:42 -!- ackack has joined ##crawl-dev 13:58:00 -!- Basil has joined ##crawl-dev 13:59:28 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.14-a0-1369-g87da522: Make armours one-handed 10(3 minutes ago, 1 file, 0+ 9-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=87da522de945 13:59:37 -!- Ragdoll has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 14:00:03 -!- slifty has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:00:18 -!- Vizer has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:00:33 MarvinPA: Haha, what? 14:00:38 -!- Ragdoll has joined ##crawl-dev 14:02:08 ackack: as for spider form butchery: first MarvinPA's commit had a message specifying it's code simplification (and indeed, it did remove a massive pile of junk), so altering spiders but not other forms looked like unintentional to me 14:02:35 kryft: you used to be able to wield armours and they were special-cased to be two-handed, i think armour being wielded was prevented a couple of versions ago 14:02:44 all's well that ends well, it's a big improvement to let spiders butcher imo 14:02:49 (but the case to make armours two-handed still existed) 14:03:06 MarvinPA: A small step for MarvinPA, a huge leap for crawl 14:03:26 s/huge/giant or whatever 14:03:29 ackack: if we want realism, could just let them eat corpses outright, no need for Vp-like complexity. The jelly form already does that. 14:03:39 All J and G are supposed to be non-hostile to you under Jiyva, right? 14:03:48 but butchery isn't that bad 14:03:50 MarvinPA: you are crazy :) 14:04:36 making jelly form reasonable or gone is another task, by the way 14:04:55 dpeg: well, we wouldn't have made him a dev otherwise, remember the core requirements 14:05:31 yes, out for player blood and willing to trade sanity for madness at any given time 14:05:58 sanity is overrated 14:07:30 back to removing sabres: while to an old player this seems a busybody change, adding realism + fixing confusion for new players is probably worth a rename 14:07:57 so, would anyone be opposed to it? Which variant would be best? 14:10:14 kilobyte: I am fine with either change, but I don't have a decided opinion whatsoever 14:11:19 -!- Lawman0 has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:12:34 <|amethyst> I think dirk/dagger has many of the same problems as scimitar/sabre (but at least they'd be the same skill) 14:13:41 I don't have much feeling about what names make the most sense, but just renaming sabre -> cutlass does have the advantage of being the least confusing to existing players 14:14:40 Giant Eyeball remained hostile under Jiyva by Sage 14:15:11 cutlass already exists and has custom stats though doesn't it? 14:15:25 yes 14:15:29 <|amethyst> MarvinPA: captain's sabre :P 14:15:31 well, that's just one unrand 14:15:38 i guess captain's cutlass couldj ust be a particularly cutlassy cutlass 14:15:47 the captains cutlass can be better than a normal one, yeah 14:16:08 (or it could be removed) 14:16:15 <|amethyst> captain's rapier 14:16:26 who is this captain anyway 14:16:37 Capt'n Kirk, I always thought 14:16:40 that unrand could have its basedam converted to enchantment, get nerfed or indeed removed 14:16:57 elliptic: a pirate, to anger dpeg :p 14:17:10 <|amethyst> elliptic: the guy whose ship got eaten by a kraken but might be turned into a vault some day 14:17:15 FR: ships 14:18:03 i think it's a neat unrand but that opinion is probably at least partly based on the great bug where it generated constantly 14:18:10 -!- ackack has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 14:18:20 so yeah i have no particular problem with sabre->cutlass and do whatever :P 14:18:38 it's easy to handle the unrand, so it's not a stopper 14:18:54 -!- buppy has joined ##crawl-dev 14:19:16 my problem with sabre->cutlass is that it would be nice to get short blade names reduced, which the other two variants do 14:19:49 reduced? 14:20:01 <|amethyst> "short sword" is not that long 14:20:13 short sword->dirk/seax/..., sabre->short sword 14:20:22 so it would become the longest short blade 14:20:29 <|amethyst> ... 14:20:32 -!- ackack has joined ##crawl-dev 14:20:39 <|amethyst> why does the biggest one have to have the longest name? 14:20:56 |amethyst: consistency with exec axes, clearly 14:21:19 er, are you thinking about a name's length in _letters_? 14:21:39 kilobyte: I think we are both confused by what you meant by "get short blade names reduced" 14:21:52 I meant a name which refers to a long weapon in RL 14:23:09 so you mean that you feel like cutlass is still too long to be a "short blade"? 14:23:50 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 14:24:08 compared to a falchion 14:24:55 * dpeg always wondered if kilobyte did some LARPing in his youth =) 14:24:59 -!- Ladykiller69 has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:25:15 <|amethyst> how about sabre -> rapier, keep everything else as is 14:26:37 |amethyst: rapier is one of biggest one-handed swords 14:26:49 -!- ackack has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:27:14 <|amethyst> kilobyte: right, but it's a narrow thrusting sword, not at all like long blades 14:27:30 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Short_sword for example includes these German names: Katzbalger, Degen --> Reitschwert, Schwert (langes Schwert) --> Rappier --> Bidenhänder. 14:27:42 (no "rapier" on the English category list) 14:28:38 narrow but long and heavy 14:28:45 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 14:29:11 -!- rkd has quit [] 14:29:12 if you want narrow thrusting, you go all the way to estoc 14:30:00 -!- Kaput has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:31:31 hrm, so I see you guys are rooting for ways to keep short swords as-is, suggesting you prefer cutlasses after all 14:31:39 so, cutlass is it? 14:32:26 <|amethyst> sounds like it, and for now either keep captain's cutlass as a big cutlass, or rename it to sabre/rapier/something 14:33:30 ok, next issue: triple sword->claymore, double sword->bastard sword 14:33:43 because I still can't find shrooms bad enough to justify the current names 14:34:03 have you tried just taking more shrooms 14:34:27 ophanim: (actually, I never took shrooms in RL) 14:34:34 but some would be needed for these 14:34:57 that's not really how they work 14:35:21 ophanim: so what would be needed for multiple swords to make sense? 14:35:37 beside liking bad Star Wars 14:36:28 <|amethyst> kilobyte: if you don't like falchion, what about "broadsword"? Kind of a generic name, but no worse than "long sword" 14:36:58 my only comment is that doublesword -> triplesword makes it obvious which is bigger 14:37:15 I guess anyone playing crawl could tell you bastard swords are smaller than claymores? 14:37:18 The backstory for the triple sword is hilarious. 14:37:22 But it's not quite as obvious 14:37:38 I don't suppose this would be a good time to bring back katanas? :P 14:37:53 ophanim: as double? 14:37:57 yes 14:38:01 ophanim: Bastard swords can be used as either one-handed or two-handed weapons, thus the name if I recall right. 14:38:07 but of course this is probably not common knowledge 14:38:50 something like that 14:38:51 http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/KatanasAreJustBetter 14:39:08 It was a bastard because it didn't fall into the strictly one handed or two handed pool 14:39:10 or something like that 14:39:24 imo double/triple swords are fine, sword realism is tedious 14:39:25 kilobyte: tvtropes noooo, what have you done to me :( 14:40:43 a katana can only be generated through being wielded by wiglaf 14:41:06 is wiglaf otaku now 14:43:13 MarvinPA: a double sword would be utterly useless in a real fight 14:43:27 Unless it's a fight vs chin stubble 14:43:34 good thing crawl fights aren't real fights i guess 14:43:43 MarvinPA: you'd need to make it of magical light or something 14:44:13 I thought a double blade was just a normal sword hilt with two blades running parallel 14:44:19 and not some darth maul staff thing 14:45:09 ophanim: two parallel blades means more weight, more air resistance, less control over the blade, less damage 14:45:18 kilobyte: What about a huge two-headed axe? 14:45:39 Or hell, a giant fucking club with spikes. 14:45:46 I didn't say I found it practical 14:46:04 good thing crawl weapons aren't real weapons I guess 14:46:38 bastard sword sort of suggests one-handedness, right? that's another advantage to changing the name 14:47:43 ophanim: yeah, I've been advising people not to look at tvtropes when they have other things they need to get done ;-) 14:47:55 Bloaxor: two-headed axes are worse than single-headed, yes. You have an extra weight on the other side, which kills your swining speed for hardly any gain. At least axes don't rely so critically on weight, though. 14:48:37 The problem is that a slow attack rhythm is a pretty terrible thing in a fight. 14:49:42 kilobyte: triple swords are silly, but it is always easier to remove humourous attempts than to add them... can't we just agree to keep Linley's jokes? 14:51:12 looks like Linley's versions don't have them yet 14:51:26 the name triple sword makes perfect sense! It's a sword with 3 blades, what else would you call it 14:51:39 trisword 14:51:42 I don't think the name is in dispute here ;-P 14:51:45 as for how you actually use it, there's some secret martial art which only crawl characters use 14:51:46 double plus one sword 14:52:22 evilmike: you mean the one that makes toddlers able to punch dragons to death? 14:53:51 Bloaxor: Punching-things-hard-in-mysterious-ways magic? 14:55:00 i wonder if anyone's ever killed cerebov while a pig or something 14:55:10 does anyone have a problem with "quickblade" 14:55:16 dpeg: is there even any humour there? I kind of don't see it. 14:55:32 dpeg: it looks like someone was in love in some infamous parts of Star Wars 14:55:33 I don't really like that name, while we're on topic 14:55:35 !lm * uniq=cerebov s=-status 14:55:36 3052 milestones for * (uniq=cerebov): vitalised,very slightly contaminated,hasted,deflect missiles,fire vulnerable, deflect missiles,regenerating,delayed fireball, silence,levitating,hasted (expires), regenerating,flying,hasted (expires), liquid flames,phasing (expires),flying,hasted, agile,very slightly contaminated,regenerating,hasted,mildly poisoned,repel missiles, deflect missiles,flying (expi... 14:55:56 i like to imagine quickblades are switchblades, dunno why 14:56:06 or maybe butterfly knifes 14:56:32 evilmike: yeah that sort of makes the most sense to me 14:56:57 I thought of them like balisongs but I could also see them as some sort of thrusting dagger 14:56:57 Swiftblade??????? 14:57:04 stiletto 14:57:10 ach ja 14:57:15 been ages since i've seen that word 14:57:33 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 14:59:39 -!- Ragdoll has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:00:13 -!- Ragdoll has joined ##crawl-dev 15:00:21 -!- slifty has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:01:42 dpeg: do you consider these two to be jokes? 15:02:09 or just a movie reference that fails the 300 years rule 15:02:25 -!- gnsh has quit [Quit: leaving] 15:03:10 -!- tsohg has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:05:37 -!- brosephalon has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 15:05:37 -!- valtern has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:05:58 Idea — an unrandart artefact lajatang with cleaving, because that would be awesome. 15:08:28 scythe with cleaving 15:09:10 -!- PsyMar has quit [Disconnected by services] 15:09:52 -!- Fortescue has joined ##crawl-dev 15:12:40 -!- alefury|2 has joined ##crawl-dev 15:12:41 -!- Fortescue|Home has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:12:41 -!- ckyle has joined ##crawl-dev 15:12:42 -!- alefury has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:12:42 -!- tupper has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:12:43 -!- joosa has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:12:44 -!- TZer0 has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:13:24 Scythes don't have the same amount of style. 15:14:18 -!- TZer0 has joined ##crawl-dev 15:27:45 -!- Pacra has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:27:53 -!- Aryth has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.0.4 Insomnia http://www.kvirc.net/] 15:28:49 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 15:29:31 -!- Pacra has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:30:44 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 15:37:19 -!- yogaFLAME has quit [Quit: Page closed] 15:37:27 -!- the_glow has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:40:25 -!- jeffrom has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:43:21 -!- tksquared has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:43:30 kilobyte: I always thought they were jokes, yes -- like death cob and curse toe. (Joke because it seems clear to me that a sword cannot have two or three blades but I am not sophisticated about this.) 15:44:44 i think curse skulls and curse toes might both be references to D&D's "demiliches" 15:54:36 -!- freesalad has quit [Quit: Page closed] 15:55:30 -!- Crehl has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:58:29 is curse skull supposed to be a joke 15:59:35 -!- Ragdoll has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:00:06 -!- Ragdoll has joined ##crawl-dev 16:00:22 -!- Ragdoll has quit [Client Quit] 16:00:38 -!- slifty has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:06:18 simmarine: no idea, but I never thought so. 16:11:24 -!- xxx_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 16:11:46 -!- ckyle has quit [Quit: ckyle] 16:12:24 -!- ark_ has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:12:34 -!- dtsund has left ##crawl-dev 16:12:47 -!- valtern2 has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:13:22 I'll ask this again since I think people were asleep the last time. 16:13:39 Since monster summoners are looked at with increasing disfavor, would either giving Asterion a demon band or giving him a treant-like "spawn demon when hp<50%" ability be an improvement over conventional demon summoning? 16:13:52 so why would multiple swords be? It's just the source that differs. 16:14:19 gammafunk: wasn't aware of the question, sorry. (Btw, you can always send a message to c-r-d!) 16:15:04 Yes, probably should have done that to get a final opinion, since it's often hard for enough people to be in irc 16:15:09 kilobyte: I can put it differently: to made, "double/triple sword" always sounded unrealistic but vaguely cool. However, I've never been held back by realism. 16:15:52 gammafunk: I cannot really say which one is best -- to me, they're all fine :) 16:17:00 things like battlesphere or a bottle of water that magically refills might be weird, but they provide some mechanism. Triple swords have nothing to them but a name. 16:20:37 ever seen an electric knife? :p that said they have more than an eveningstar does... 16:21:12 dpeg: Yeah, perhaps the bigger issue is still whether or not to replace an existing unique. There seems to be a range of opinions about that 16:22:20 Frances is primarily a summoner. Nuff said. 16:22:52 I wouldn't say that 16:22:55 Frances (08@) | Spd: 10 | HD: 14 | HP: 121 | AC/EV: 0/10 | Dam: 29 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, spellcaster, see invisible | Res: 06magic(93) | Chunks: 07contam | XP: 2119 | Sp: throw icicle (3d23), demon, haste, iron shot (3d26) | Sz: Medium | Int: normal. 16:22:55 %??frances 16:23:02 geekosaur: ah, eveningstar is another one of those jokes (I really like that one) 16:23:03 four spells, only one is a summon 16:23:29 anyway, I thought we agreed replacing frederick would make more sense :P 16:23:30 gammafunk: I don't see a problem with just adding Asterion, and waiting with removals until the next great unique purge. 16:24:02 -!- DrinkMachine has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:24:46 i'm still really not a fan of continuing the unique power spiral 16:25:06 -!- ackack has joined ##crawl-dev 16:26:39 MarvinPA: but we can always move uniques some levels up or down? 16:27:07 MarvinPA: good point, being strong doesn't make an unique interesting by itself (see: Lamia). So Asterion should be looked at only from the "is he interesting?" point of view, spawning depths being a secondary concern. 16:27:17 I understand the problem of loot spiral (more vaults/branches ==> more loot), of the xp spiral, and of the threat spiral ... but not with uniques 16:27:31 well i just mean that a lot of recent uniques' thing is just "really big numbers", lamia is an excellent example yes 16:28:06 Yeah, it's easier if the ideal difficulty is decided first before coming up with the interesting ability to differentiate the unique 16:28:44 Is there any level of difficulty that's generally underrepresented wrt uniques? 16:29:12 My game consistently 'S', that is, saves and quits when I try to make a lengthy inscription. Is this a known bug? 16:29:42 we obviously need more uniques to accompany ignacio :P 16:30:49 -!- slifty has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:31:43 paulsomebody, console? does it prompt? (I'm wondering if your terminal emulator is sending control-s [software flow control] for some reason) 16:32:00 -!- Pacra has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:32:01 tenofswords: do you mean, more to spawn in Pan? Or more at his power level? Or just more at being not-so-good design? 16:32:03 I feel the lab minotaur is already a kind of mid-game unique. Another pan unique is possible, but Asterion wouldn't be a good fit there as-is 16:32:13 pan 16:32:20 or "extended" 16:32:43 some other four-form unique to accompany the serpent, obviously 16:32:44 tenofswords: right, only uniques there are Khufu and fixed ones 16:32:58 and the serpent, right 16:33:11 if his theme is the whole makhleb thing then i feel like that's where his threat should come from, rather than from huge HD/melee damage, anyway 16:33:19 sometimes some pushovers spawn in Tomb but they're, well, just that 16:33:36 -!- gnsh has joined ##crawl-dev 16:33:44 it is telling that I didn't even remember dissolution existed 16:33:45 so whatever depth is appropriate for some greater demons to be scary-but-manageable 16:34:00 geekosaur: Web tiles, only happens if I am not using '{'. Does not prompt. 16:34:00 -!- gammafunk_ has joined ##crawl-dev 16:34:12 that is just odd 16:34:16 (does this block e.g. ghoul-ifying metal gargoyles? :P) 16:34:21 !lg . god=nemelex xl>15 x=dam 16:34:22 8. [dam=102] KiloByte the Fetichist (L18 FoAr), worshipper of Nemelex Xobeh, killed themself with a badly aimed orb of electricity on Elf:1 on 2013-11-11 12:28:04, with 140098 points after 33798 turns and 3:04:07. 16:34:33 greater destruction can have nasty effects 16:34:51 from the pov of reaching as many players as possible, we could need more (diverse) early game uniques 16:34:53 -!- tabstorm has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 16:35:06 also true 16:35:14 geekosaur: Have happened to me before, when I was trying to inscribe my sword of Jihad with something cheerful, but I didn't report it then. 16:35:17 however, I really like the idea of giving uniques gods (these wouldn't have to be new uniqes necessarily) 16:35:23 dpeg: yeah, but this doesn't stop talk about late game ones, which are even more lacking 16:35:39 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 16:35:39 kilobyte: is "late" for you extended? 16:36:38 -!- gammafunk has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:36:39 -!- gammafunk_ is now known as gammafunk 16:37:00 His current depth matches sojo; perhaps he could be set to spawn only in tomb and pan? 16:37:28 Add to that perhaps late depths 16:38:04 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 16:38:25 dpeg: Zot for example has just Tiamat 16:38:32 (I wasn't really thinking of asterion specifically when I noted extended lackingness) 16:39:16 Asterion doesn't sound more dangerous that Mara to me 16:39:35 (yeah, this can be easily adjusted up or down) 16:43:27 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 16:48:03 -!- caleba has quit [Quit: caleba] 16:50:14 -!- ackack has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:50:26 -!- RBrandon_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 16:53:23 -!- bh has joined ##crawl-dev 16:53:27 !seen dpeg 16:53:28 I last saw dpeg at Sat Dec 7 22:35:39 2013 UTC (17m 48s ago) saying 'kilobyte: is "late" for you extended?' on ##crawl-dev. 16:53:33 -!- ark__ has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:53:37 bh: Hello mister! 16:53:42 hiya 16:53:54 ha, your presence reminds me... 16:54:16 of my shameful olgreb poisoning death? 16:54:21 ...there was an unanswered email 16:55:03 bh: shameful? Glorious!! Readers all over the world will be thinking: "Why do other people have so cool deaths, and I keep dying in the most mundane manners." 16:55:45 dpeg: I've been thinking of killing the abyss as a proper branch 16:55:53 oops! 16:56:02 Lugonu, my precious!! 16:56:09 -!- Razawaza has quit [Quit: Page closed] 16:56:34 bh: eh? That's the best branch IMO, even if still not perfect. 16:56:38 We don't need to make the game tedious to kill the players. The first thing that popped into my mind is: When you get banished, you're in the abyss. You don't need to find an exit. At some point in the future, the abyss will cast you out. 16:56:41 if this is about the weirdness gap between abyssal rune and banishment that can be solved by just really heavily scaling up by depth and doing weird stuff when people consciously and pur 16:56:55 oh, sure 16:56:56 bh: how would it be tedious? More than regular branches, that is. 16:57:04 bh: I don't think that these deaths are tedious... 16:57:22 ...exasperating perhaps, but always exciting -- the portal could be just around the corner 16:57:28 bh: being timed would be too abusable, I'd say 16:57:32 (now, the rune is a completely different affair -- I could live without that) 16:57:41 kilobyte: Players perceive that they either end up in the abyss and propmtly die, or spend 8000 turns waiting to find an exit 16:57:48 bh: frantically searching for an exit is something you don't find elsewhere 16:57:54 bh: these are the only reports you get 16:58:08 on average, you run around for a bit and die or get out -- as it should be 16:58:20 well, I don't think we need to look at speedruns when designing branches 16:58:30 (something something much more lenient scaling god wrath so more people go lugonu something something) 16:58:40 kilobyte: sure, but we should look at wall time 16:58:51 kilobyte: +1 16:59:01 tenofswords: oh, that too 16:59:06 bh: the abyss is in no way worse than a regular branch 17:00:21 it would be a shame to lose the only place that's not just "waltz in, kill some monsters, rest, kill some more, rest again, fight the branch end, die" 17:00:46 kilobyte: that's reasonable 17:00:47 (preferably preserving the "die" part :) ) 17:00:50 the problem is mostly feeling like there's no sense of progress 17:01:02 again, more can be done with depth and incentivizing going deeper for this 17:01:41 tenofswords: upweighting the exit chance curve? 17:01:47 sure 17:01:57 bh: yes 17:02:22 being easy would remove a good part of the challenge, though 17:02:46 -!- dtsund has left ##crawl-dev 17:02:49 didn't say anything about making it easier 17:03:29 kilobyte: I thought we agree that going deeper in the Abyss should guarantee more exits, at the price of nastier monsters 17:04:13 which it already gives you 17:04:18 !lg * killer=executioner place=abyss 17:04:19 904. finagle67 the Basher (L11 GrFi), worshipper of Okawaru, blasted by an Executioner (nerve-wracking pain) on Abyss:1 on 2013-12-05 19:12:37, with 9701 points after 10945 turns and 0:43:36. 17:04:23 (though that can scale much harder) 17:04:32 (oh hey more chances to use my spread sheet) 17:04:47 randomness of the length of stay is ok, no different from the randomness of spawns. You can get an alich, servitor and executioner as the welcome party. 17:04:48 executioners on Abyss:1 are really the only thing that seriously bug me about the abyss 17:05:02 Executioner (151) | Spd: 20 | HD: 12 | HP: 46-84 | AC/EV: 10/15 | Dam: 30, 10, 10 | 05demonic, 10doors, fighter, evil, see invisible, !sil | Res: 06magic(144), 05fire, 02cold, 10elec, 03poison, 04rot, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 2320 | Sp: b.pain (d14), haste | Sz: Large | Int: high. 17:05:02 %??executioner 17:05:09 'cause speed 20 17:05:30 lich (15L) | Spd: 10 | HD: 20 | HP: 62-101 | AC/EV: 10/10 | Dam: 1513(drain) | 07undead, 10doors, evil, spellcaster, see invisible | Res: 13magic(immune), 02cold++, 09poison+++, 12drown, 04rot+++, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 2773 | Sp: b.cold (3d29), paralyse, greater demon, animate dead, iron shot (3d34), 04esc:teleport self / b.draining (3d27), b.slow, invisibility, throw icicle (3d29), crystal spear (3d40) / b.fire (3d29), confuse, haste, b.draining (3d27), greater demon, 04esc:banishment / mystic blast (3d24), b.cold (3d29), invisibility, animate dead, destruction orb (9d17) | Sz: Medium | Int: high. 17:05:30 %??lich 17:05:40 dpeg: this sounds good: if someone considers Abyss to be "tedious", encouraging them to dive to find the exit earlier would solve the problem 17:05:44 !lg * killer=raiju xl>2 17:05:44 11. Seskara the Vandal (L9 GrAM), worshipper of Makhleb, blasted by a raiju (living lightning) on Abyss:1 on 2013-12-07 09:41:27, with 3144 points after 9567 turns and 1:05:24. 17:05:53 https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjXhStQL2U2fdE00Y3Q0eVdzcU1HRURuTXEyWnFuOXc&usp=drive_web#gid=22 17:05:56 kilobyte: we can up the downstairs spawn rate 17:06:02 kilobyte: we can up the downstairs spawn rate -tv 17:06:04 er 17:06:05 dpeg: so you can choose between regular length, or extra danger but shorter 17:06:07 !lg * killer=raiju xl>2 -tv 17:06:08 11. Seskara, XL9 GrAM, T:9567 requested for FooTV (telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org). 17:06:22 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 17:07:36 -!- dtsund has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:07:50 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 17:09:09 -!- Zilis has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:09:13 -!- tensorpudding has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net] 17:09:28 kilobyte: yes, that is how I always understood it 17:10:21 until recently the only scaling as such was just more monster spawns, though 17:11:45 (disclaimer: I haven't been to Abyss:2-5 so far) A simple way to achieve that goal organically is by having decorative vaults around exits, radius increasing with depth (zero at Abyss:1) 17:12:18 dpeg: we're stuck with a maximum size due to how abyss tiling works 17:12:21 more chances to abuse CLEAR:? mmmmm 17:13:08 bh: a 12x12 exit vault should be a manifold more visible than a lone exit, I think 17:13:14 -!- asdu has quit [Quit: Page closed] 17:13:32 what's wrong with existing exit vaults? 17:14:03 probably nothing -- my point is that keeping them but using a size - depth relation would help on both ends 17:14:45 difficulty: yes, size: I don't understand why 17:15:23 -!- tsohg has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:15:52 -!- vansteen has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:16:03 <|amethyst> kilobyte: larger size makes it easier to find them I guess? 17:16:17 03bh02 07* 0.14-a0-1370-g1101b23: Increase Abyssal Stair Chance 10(7 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=1101b23c15d8 17:16:19 Summons stay hostile when summoner is pacified by Sandman25 17:16:19 kilobyte: easier to spot! It's a different approach to "easier to get out" than "just place more exits" (which is also fine, of course) 17:16:54 bh: you increased in unconditionally! 17:16:59 bad commit! Sucks! 17:17:23 kilobyte: uh? 17:17:25 no? 17:17:41 It's a chance. It increase non-linearly with depth. 17:17:50 -!- rast has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90-rdmsoft [XULRunner 18.0.2/20130201065344]] 17:18:59 you changed it from 2800 - (200 * you.depth / 3) to 2500 - (200 * you.depth / 3) 17:19:15 alright alright alright 17:19:45 isn't this linear? 17:20:21 -!- Vizer_ has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:20:37 The chance is `1 in x` 17:20:59 yes, in other words, linear to stay length 17:21:29 Stay length is Poisson distributed :) 17:22:45 Whatever the case, I think the original formula might be bunk 17:23:09 -!- joosa has joined ##crawl-dev 17:23:40 <|amethyst> bh: still, 2734/2434 is an 12% increase and 2467/2167 is a 14% increase so the change isn't very different between A:1 and A:5 17:23:56 |amethyst: ^ as I said 17:24:44 That formula is probably from 27-level abyss. 17:25:00 <|amethyst> I think you're right 17:26:59 eh, wait, it's the _stair_ chance, not exit 17:27:02 * kilobyte is blind. 17:27:06 <|amethyst> yes 17:27:18 why would it even need to depend on depth then? 17:27:33 <|amethyst> I think if anything it should depend on depth in the opposite direction 17:27:37 I'm basically happy to give players free stairs. They let you escape the party patrol once in exchange for being somewhere bad 17:27:38 * kilobyte is all ok with plentiful stairs. 17:27:38 * Sequell also is all ok with plentiful stairs. 17:27:39 <|amethyst> there should be more downstairs on A:1 17:27:54 * kilobyte spanks Sequell. 17:27:54 * Sequell spanks kilobyte. 17:29:27 in this sense, stairs are like Lugonu altars en miniature? 17:30:37 <|amethyst> altars have a more strategic disadvantage, though 17:31:15 -!- slifty has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 17:31:21 of course, but also a guaranteed short-term solution :) 17:31:34 03kilobyte02 07* 0.14-a0-1371-g7c58881: A whitespace fix. 10(8 hours ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=7c58881104cd 17:31:34 03kilobyte02 07* 0.14-a0-1372-gab21395: Rename "sabre" to "cutlass". 10(12 minutes ago, 64 files, 86+ 133-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=ab21395712af 17:31:34 03kilobyte02 07* 0.14-a0-1373-g41f0587: Drop the base type redefine for captain's cutlass. 10(2 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 4-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=41f05873621d 17:31:59 <|amethyst> dpeg: with stairs the disadvantages (harder Abyss) come before the advantage (quicker exit) 17:32:23 whatever the case, I'm happy to see that formula replaced with a non-27-level version 17:32:35 What that formula happens to be, I know not. 17:32:49 bh: that formula makes stairs _more_ plentiful deeper on rather than the opposite 17:32:51 give me a second 17:33:17 * kilobyte would use just a fixed number. 17:33:17 * Sequell also would use just a fixed number. 17:33:23 -!- kekekela has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 17:33:37 * kilobyte spanks the dumb bot again. 17:33:40 kilobyte: works for me 17:36:42 -!- Tux[Qyou] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:37:41 -!- rchandra has left ##crawl-dev 17:37:56 http://sprunge.us/UEcj - even more abyss scaling 17:38:26 * SamB giggles at Sequell 17:38:26 * Sequell giggles at SamB 17:39:07 (yes I mocked up abyss with a spreadsheet) 17:39:10 !lg neil won 17:39:11 2. Neil the Faith Healer (L27 HOHe), worshipper of Elyvilon, escaped with the Orb and 3 runes on 2011-10-04 20:54:19, with 1318561 points after 99008 turns and 8:11:47. 17:39:24 Sequell: A long time ago, in a universe far, far away 17:39:38 kilobyte: pick a number? 2400? 17:39:43 !lg Sequell 17:39:44 No games for Sequell. 17:39:52 oh man, no one has played under that alt? 17:40:13 bh: actually, 2400 is in the commit I was about to push :p 17:40:43 kilobyte: ship it :) 17:41:07 -!- Brokkr has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 17:41:17 03kilobyte02 07* 0.14-a0-1374-ga57ff3c: Make the abyssal stair chance fixed. 10(60 seconds ago, 1 file, 12+ 18-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=a57ff3c274ee 17:41:49 * tenofswords coughs 17:41:49 * Sequell also coughs 17:42:23 tenofswords: did I break something, or do you have a cold? 17:42:52 <|amethyst> kilobyte: tenofswords doesn't like to paste patch URLs more than once 17:43:27 kilobyte: what's up with the altar chance change? 17:43:49 |amethyst: is his up key broken? 17:43:58 bh: I dropped the pointless _abyss_check_place_feat() call if you're at game start 17:44:07 ah 17:44:26 samb: yes, clearly 17:46:23 -!- RedFeather has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90.1 [Firefox 25.0.1/20131112160018]] 17:46:34 tenofswords: you should bring your keyboard into a keyboard repair shop. I think they'll be able to help you 17:52:16 So I'd summarize the Asterion discussion as 1) he may not be sufficiently interesting and 2) with the demon thing he's perhaps just an overpowered unique. It seems to me that if I found a less dangerous but still makhleb themed ability to replace servant, it could address both points 17:53:22 gammafunk: it's not that bad. He indeed is not that interesting, but still an improvement from Galliae. 17:53:27 -!- bh has quit [Quit: Page closed] 17:54:22 kilobyte: Yes, I agree he's not terrible as-is, just not very exciting. I think exploring some other abilities is good, regardless of whether he gets merged in the near future or not 17:55:10 Especially since the pendulum is slowly lowering over summoning in general.... 17:55:54 * tenofswords coughs again, evidently needing to actually re-paste http://sprunge.us/UEcj 17:56:08 <|amethyst> tenofswords: have patience :P 17:56:25 03HangedMan02 {|amethyst} 07* 0.14-a0-1375-g20e006e: Further lower weakling Abyss monsters by depth 10(23 minutes ago, 1 file, 31+ 33-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=20e006e60925 17:57:07 -!- Lightli has joined ##crawl-dev 17:57:12 rip pearl dragons in abyss 17:57:53 nobody acknowledged anything about the patch beforehand!!!! 17:59:01 -!- Hailley has quit [Quit: Petra is closed!] 18:00:02 does it make abyss:1 easier 18:00:05 no 18:00:05 -!- ShadeTornado has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:00:11 it makes abyss:2-5 harder 18:00:22 no 18:00:53 aside from cutting pearl dragons and giving the weight to hell sentinels, for whatever that's worth 18:01:06 that sounds harder for most characters so 18:01:22 esp since I run into hell sentinels plenty and can't remember seeing a pearl dragon in abyss.. ever 18:01:39 also, pearl dragons are occasionally something I'd care about trying to kill 18:01:43 it was a brief month period of about 0.01% 18:01:53 errrr, 0.02% 18:02:03 tenofswords: I'd rather make fire bats not that boring rather than remove them 18:02:28 they're, uh, no removed, except from abyss:5 18:02:31 tenofswords: ice or sky beasts have no real place in the Abyss, they can 18:02:51 -!- Pacra has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:03:02 tenofswords: yeah, but you're removing them by a bit every update 18:03:36 I was actually going to give more weight from the 5s over to fire bat but that wasn't part of the point of the patch 18:03:54 random question 18:04:05 -!- Nakatomy has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:04:07 why are you still allowed to drink from fountains 18:04:08 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 18:04:30 Lightli: good question 18:05:29 -!- Bloaxzorro has joined ##crawl-dev 18:05:29 -!- Bloaxor has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:05:51 (I was actually thinking about cutting lava worms and replacing them with fire bats) 18:06:05 from crawl? 18:07:59 tenofswords: the current state of fire bats is still boring, I just bumped them so they win vs unseen horrors 20% time solo, 85% band 18:08:02 -!- Bloaxzorro has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:08:17 unseen horror (06x) | Spd: 30 | HD: 7 | HP: 26-52 | AC/EV: 5/10 | Dam: 12 | see invisible | Res: 06magic(28) | XP: 732 | Sz: Medium | Int: animal. 18:08:17 %??unseen horror 18:08:22 fire bat (05b) | Spd: 30 | HD: 4 | HP: 8-20 | AC/EV: 1/14 | Dam: 504(fire:4-7) | sense invisible, fly | Res: 06magic(5), 05hellfire, 04fire+++ | Vul: 12cold, 12drown | XP: 110 | Sz: tiny | Int: animal. 18:08:22 %??fire bat 18:08:41 still better than lava worms, surely 18:08:43 how much stronger do they get now? 18:08:51 lava worm (05w) | Spd: 10 | HD: 6 | HP: 22-45 | AC/EV: 1/10 | Dam: 1504(fire:6-11) | Res: 06magic(24), 04fire+++ | Vul: 12cold | XP: 103 | Sz: Large | Int: plant. 18:08:51 %??lava worm 18:08:58 -!- Bloaxzorro has joined ##crawl-dev 18:09:19 lava worms wouldn't be bad if they weren't stuck in lava 18:09:50 Lightli: need a good fail message for regular fountains 18:10:10 Lightli: you mean, making them lavaphibious? 18:10:29 yes 18:10:42 <|amethyst> lamphibian 18:10:51 kilobyte: is there some other kind of fountain? 18:11:01 glistening and blood 18:11:04 SamB: dry, sparkling, blood 18:11:08 er, sparklin 18:11:10 *parkling 18:11:15 -!- diazepan has quit [Quit: diazepan] 18:11:17 *sparkling 18:11:18 oh, sparkling are still around huh? 18:11:21 yes 18:11:50 SamB: a good source for curing rot if you don't fear random mutations 18:12:31 -!- Morg0th has quit [Quit: leaving] 18:14:53 ??glistening 18:14:53 I don't have a page labeled glistening in my learndb. 18:14:57 ??sparkling fountain 18:14:58 sparkling fountain[1/1]: Grants one of many random potion effects each time you drink, with a chance of drying up. Weighted most towards water, with significant odds of decay and mutation; see http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/item_use.cc#l2194 for the full odds. But don't bother, just ignore them. 18:16:50 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 18:17:58 -!- Bloaxor has joined ##crawl-dev 18:17:58 -!- Bloaxzorro has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:21:46 -!- Pacra has quit [Quit: welp cya] 18:23:15 -!- tsohg has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:27:25 -!- evilmike has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:31:50 -!- slifty has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:35:02 -!- Bloaxzorro has joined ##crawl-dev 18:35:02 -!- Bloaxor has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:36:51 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:40:09 -!- scummos| has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 18:46:26 -!- Sequell has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:49:04 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 18:52:47 -!- Celsitudo has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:53:24 -!- Sequell has joined ##crawl-dev 18:54:38 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 19:07:09 -!- Bloax has joined ##crawl-dev 19:07:09 -!- Bloaxzorro has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:07:11 -!- Tarquinn has joined ##crawl-dev 19:12:35 -!- Bloaxor has joined ##crawl-dev 19:12:36 -!- Bloax has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:13:11 -!- Bloaxor has quit [Client Quit] 19:13:25 -!- Bloax has joined ##crawl-dev 19:17:50 -!- Bloaxor has joined ##crawl-dev 19:17:51 -!- Bloax has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:20:35 -!- Bloaxzorro has joined ##crawl-dev 19:20:39 -!- Bloaxor has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:20:40 -!- Bloaxzorro has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:27:25 -!- Pedjt has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:29:32 -!- Bloax has joined ##crawl-dev 19:29:40 HarmlessChicken (L18 NaGl) ERROR in 'mon-movetarget.cc' at line 111: ZotDef: monster fire elemental failed to pathfind to (40,26) (the Orb) (Zot (ZotDef)) 19:30:14 -!- myrmidette1 has quit [Client Quit] 19:30:33 -!- myrmidette1 has quit [Client Quit] 19:31:35 -!- Flex has joined ##crawl-dev 19:31:44 is it intentional that evil items can spawn as loot in the depths holy vault? 19:32:05 the one with the silver star? 19:32:07 -!- slifty has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 19:32:10 I haven't seen a silver star 19:32:16 cherubs 19:32:19 there are runed doors leading to a complex with a lot of angels and cherubim 19:32:26 and mennas in his own little terrarium 19:32:36 right, it's a silver star if there's no mennas 19:32:53 at any rate it'd be rather complicated for little benefit to block "evil" items 19:33:02 sounds fine to me for there to be evil items there, the holies are guarding the evil items so that people can't use them 19:33:05 just pretend the "good" guys are hiding them away from the mass 19:33:08 what he said 19:33:12 elliptic: can't they just sacrifice them to ely :P 19:33:28 it's a zin temple, not an ely temple! 19:33:35 oh also 19:33:38 they're going to have to wait for a healer to come along and everything 19:33:45 the description for angels says they serve TSO, but they have some zin speech lines 19:33:48 not sure if that's an oversight 19:34:09 there's supposed to be some db_name nonsense for that 19:34:21 clearly this must be fixed with more lua in the description 19:34:32 siiiiiigh, correct 19:35:37 (and why did I think I was joking?) 19:35:38 -!- Bloax has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:35:58 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 19:35:59 -!- Bloax has joined ##crawl-dev 19:36:10 -!- Nightbeer is now known as Ladykiller69 19:39:55 HarmlessChicken (L18 NaGl) ERROR in 'mon-movetarget.cc' at line 111: ZotDef: monster fire elemental failed to pathfind to (40,26) (the Orb) (Zot (ZotDef)) 19:39:55 -!- Bloax has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:40:29 -!- mikee_ has joined ##crawl-dev 19:41:34 -!- tw_ has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 19:42:20 -!- Bloax has joined ##crawl-dev 19:43:31 -!- jarpiain has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 19:44:59 -!- Amilir has quit [Quit: Page closed] 19:47:10 -!- Bloaxor has joined ##crawl-dev 19:47:16 -!- jarpiain has joined ##crawl-dev 19:47:24 -!- Bloaxor has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:47:40 -!- jarpiain is now known as Guest8413 19:48:22 -!- Bloax has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:49:31 -!- Bloax has joined ##crawl-dev 19:49:59 -!- bmfx has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 19:51:18 -!- Bloaxor has joined ##crawl-dev 19:51:18 -!- Bloax has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:51:37 -!- tabstorm has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 19:52:27 -!- Bloaxzorro has joined ##crawl-dev 19:52:28 -!- Bloaxor has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:53:34 -!- ackack has joined ##crawl-dev 19:56:29 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 19:56:48 -!- Bloaxzorro has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 20:06:24 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 20:08:33 -!- jeffrom has joined ##crawl-dev 20:09:01 -!- Ladykiller69 has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 20:09:02 -!- Foamed has quit [Quit: Heading to bed.] 20:11:32 -!- Daekdroom has quit [Quit: Saindo] 20:14:11 -!- ackack has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 20:14:51 -!- dpeg has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:15:02 -!- HellTiger has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:20:33 -!- Sonata has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 20:21:01 -!- ackack has joined ##crawl-dev 20:22:35 -!- reaver_ has joined ##crawl-dev 20:25:19 -!- alefury|2 has quit [] 20:27:26 -!- gammafunk has quit [Quit: gammafunk] 20:29:16 -!- Zermako has quit [Quit: Good night and good luck to all!] 20:31:18 -!- dondy has quit [Quit: ninja kapow] 20:32:40 -!- slifty has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 20:34:21 03kilobyte02 07* 0.14-a0-1376-g4d7012a: Bump up fire bats further. 10(3 hours ago, 2 files, 4+ 3-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=4d7012a27bcc 20:34:21 03kilobyte02 07* 0.14-a0-1377-g17b3b5f: Disallow drinking from regular fountains. 10(63 minutes ago, 1 file, 5+ 9-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=17b3b5fd33d7 20:34:21 03kilobyte02 07* 0.14-a0-1378-gf8e6a88: Don't let Bailey rock masquerade as stone. 10(44 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=f8e6a88c515b 20:39:26 Wielding Zonguldrok and using kiku's corpse drop creates hostile zombies instantly. by dck 20:42:31 Rule42 (L1 MiGl) ASSERT(!crawl_state.prev_cmd_keys.empty()) in 'main.cc' at line 4976 failed. (D:1) 20:43:12 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 20:44:49 -!- Tarquinn has quit [Quit: yes] 21:04:43 Gossamer rune was a mimic, and the rune does not exist in Spider:$ by Sage 21:04:51 -!- gammafunk has joined ##crawl-dev 21:06:19 !lm * crash -log 21:06:20 5755. Rule42, XL1 MiGl, T:0 (milestone): http://dobrazupa.org/morgue/Rule42/crash-Rule42-20131208-024228.txt 21:08:45 |amethyst: looks like bug 7831 will need repair by you? 21:11:48 -!- Zeor has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:11:48 -!- AlsoZeor is now known as Zeor 21:15:28 hehehe ... 21:15:51 Stabbing | | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0/1410790144 21:15:51 Traps | | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0/1410790144 21:16:03 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:23:57 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 21:24:36 -!- pelotron_ has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 21:24:56 why do I get messages on Fedhas protecting my plants from harm. when they're just peaceful 21:28:41 -!- Basil has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:29:18 oh the header was: 21:29:18 Traps | | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0/1410790144 21:29:22 erg. 21:29:30 Name | can_train | train | training | level | points | progress 21:29:52 -!- Basil has joined ##crawl-dev 21:33:03 -!- slifty has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 21:39:24 ... so why was that an assertion failure for Rule42 instead of a friendly "no previous command to redo" message? 21:46:32 -!- tsohg_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:47:49 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 21:51:04 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 21:54:25 -!- thened has quit [Quit: thened] 22:00:34 -!- tenofswords has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:21:39 -!- pelotr0n has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 22:25:07 -!- beef42 has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 22:33:33 -!- slifty has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:50:56 -!- hurdos has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 23:00:14 -!- the_glow has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:00:35 -!- Pacra has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:03:11 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 23:04:03 -!- magicpoints has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 23:21:03 -!- ackack has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:21:23 -!- MaxFrost has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 23:27:08 -!- VolteccerJack has quit [Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- Organize your IRC] 23:31:23 -!- mikee_ has quit [Quit: Try HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <-] 23:33:02 -!- JollyNigra has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:33:45 -!- slifty has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 23:38:44 -!- gammafunk has quit [Quit: gammafunk] 23:42:11 -!- GuraKKa1 has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 23:48:36 -!- Lawman0 has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:49:46 -!- gammafunk has joined ##crawl-dev 23:51:02 -!- eith has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:57:18 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 23:59:35 -!- Graciepp has quit [Quit: Page closed]