00:00:28 Stable (0.12) branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.12-b1-81-g9995331 00:01:24 -!- kekekela has quit [Quit: Page closed] 00:04:37 -!- morik has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 00:05:48 Unstable branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.13-a0-263-gc682783 (34) 00:06:20 -!- Sombrero_Mott is now known as FaMott 00:10:26 -!- Soundlust has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:18:08 -!- CreepingCrawled has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:18:26 -!- iasov has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 00:19:20 caleba: those monsters are only any kind of threat in the extremely early game 00:19:20 mumra: You have 5 messages. Use !messages to read them. 00:19:27 !messages 00:19:27 (1/5) HangedMan said (6h 58m 1s ago): why not just manually lowering the weighting for the three encompass vaults on D:27 when they appear on d:27 if it makes them appear a lot 00:19:48 !tell hangedman what? 00:19:49 mumra: OK, I'll let hangedman know. 00:19:54 !messages 00:19:55 (1/4) bh said (5h 2m 43s ago): I forgot to merge my wrath patch huh? 00:20:00 !messages 00:20:01 (1/3) SamB said (3h 18m 37s ago): should we include the D:27 optimizations in 0.12? 00:20:06 !messages 00:20:06 (1/2) elliott said (2h 17m 1s ago): 00:20:08 !messages 00:20:09 (1/1) nicolae- said (2h 16m 33s ago): is there a bug with the vaults_orient_ tags in Vaults vaults, when i try a vault with vaults_orient_n and vaults_orient_s it still places doors along the other two sides 00:20:34 I was thinking to add some variety into their types. It seems currently orcs are quite dominate, if the monsters mentioned were given some sprucing up it may be better overall? 00:20:57 orcs are quite dominant when? on D:1? 00:21:10 they show up in packs for a large portion of the game 00:21:29 mumra: kilobyte thinks we shouldn't bother backporting the D:27 optimizations 00:21:32 hopefully that will get changed, i.e. orc packs in Vaults aren't very interesting 00:21:52 SamB: why not? 00:22:02 (i should probably just read logs i guess) 00:22:12 i knew that there was some work being down with that, possibly with yaktaurs staying inside vaults etc. if my idea sucks please just tell me 00:22:24 well, okay, he said it *might* not be worth it 00:22:39 caleba: have you even seen Vaults in .12? 00:22:48 i have 00:23:01 right, well that is the work that has been done 00:23:13 but monster weights on different levels and in different branches can still be changed 00:23:44 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 00:24:08 caleba: you haven't really given any ideas tbh; how were you thinking of making these monsters more interesting? 00:24:40 new types, casters, ranged, the same treatment that orcs or elves have received handed down to the lowly popcorn monsters 00:24:47 -!- hurdos has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:25:55 SamB: well tbh the occasional few second delay on D:27 isn't exactly the end of the world 00:25:58 theres already a kobold vault but its just a bunch of kobolds 00:26:13 mumra: yeah 00:26:15 it isn't 00:26:17 caleba: so you want to make them more like other monster groups? 00:26:33 caleba: that actually makes them less diverse 00:26:43 not in packs 00:27:06 I don't think that's true so long as the spells/abilities and such of the types in question differs sufficiently from other species 00:27:18 At least in general terms 00:27:37 caleba: there's a reason why they're "lowly popcorn monsters" and don't get special treatment. it's because they appear early in the game when you can 00:27:43 whjen you can't handle elves 00:27:59 * SamB tries to get mephitic clouds to ID rPois properly ... 00:28:19 i understand, i guess i was looking to improve somewhere that isn't very important 00:28:24 Earlygame doesn't mean that monsters need to lack special abilities - just that those abilities need to be in the range that earlygame characters can handle 00:28:24 DracoOmega: true but i'm not seeing any actual examples of good spells/abilities here 00:28:28 Well, no 00:28:40 But I just mean that making subclasses of monsters does not itself imply a loss of diversity 00:28:49 So long as the subclasses are themselves distinct from others enough 00:29:24 i guess i would just have to put in some effort to template things and get feedback from something more concrete 00:29:47 caleba: if you give a specific example of a spell/ability that you have an idea for ... 00:30:28 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 00:30:51 maybe if it is as simple as changing to spawn characteristics of popcorn, some come with blowguns or slings occasionally. if it was less randomized and instead those guys were given different names would that just be fluff or actually variety? 00:31:04 caleba: look at the new Vaults monsters DracoOmega created and how their abilities complement each other to create interesting tactical situationsm 00:31:07 Well, kobolds already come with blowguns occasionally 00:31:18 that's what i'm saying 00:31:43 caleba: if it's the same monster just with different equipment then it shouldn't have a different name, no 00:31:45 if the blowgun was removed from regular kobolds and given to a new kobold with a different name 00:31:52 ok 00:32:02 Why would this be better? 00:32:19 again, i think i'm looking at something that doesn't really need changed 00:33:15 appreciate the insight at least 00:34:10 Well, one effect of giving blowguns only to a different specific class of kobold is that it changes predictability. Part of the effectiveness of blowguns on kobolds is that you don't necessarily know which are carrying them until they use them (or which have curare, etc.) which is something lost if the type immediately lets you know if they do or not 00:34:28 i hadn't considered that 00:36:46 !tell nicolae- there could very well be a bug i'll look into it... 00:36:46 mumra: OK, I'll let nicolae- know. 00:37:08 -!- caleba has left ##crawl-dev 00:37:10 -!- caleba has quit [Quit: caleba] 00:42:40 -!- bh has joined ##crawl-dev 00:42:48 I guess I forgot to merge my wrath patch. 00:42:56 will it apply, that is the question 00:45:34 What does this patch do again? 00:45:35 is that necessarilywhat we want for _all_ gods (i.e. there was that other idea of tying wrath effects to tension) 00:45:54 but i realise it's a massive improvement on the current situation anyway 00:45:57 DracoOmega: wrath timeout based on XP 00:46:13 mumra: I agree that wrath effects should be tied to tension. I probably tried to patch that about 2 years ago 00:46:24 but the timeout should be xp driven. 00:46:26 SamB: btw i have no idea why kilobyte thinks i have a "sane" sleep pattern ;) 00:47:44 and ooh, ctele nerf! 00:48:01 I'm at GMT+8 and I think kilobyte and I observe a similar sleep schedule. 00:48:05 you say "nerf". MarvinPA secretly removed ctele 00:48:16 Why should wrath be tied to tension, exactly? 00:48:24 Plenty of wrath effects create lots of tension on their own 00:48:52 elliott: just the mutation was removed 00:48:56 at least from circulation 00:49:07 DracoOmega: wrath effects should be able to incorporate tension. If you're fighting some scary stuff, maybe Trog will berserk them instead of sending summons. 00:49:12 SamB: i was making a humour 00:49:34 bh: Oh, I thought you meant only send monsters after you if you're already in high tension or something 00:49:36 DracoOmega: the idea was to stop people hiding in temple or wherever to wait it out. if you hide there there won't be tension so no wrath effects 00:49:57 mumra: Yeah, but plenty of wrath effects are quite sensible when you have no tension 00:50:05 tying it to xp is the solution there 00:50:06 DracoOmega: that's not the point 00:50:07 mumra: XP is more fun. Wrath players at zero tenison! :) 00:50:08 I believe bh already has a patch for it :P 00:50:23 elliott: I'll see if it applies 00:50:24 -!- monqy has quit [Quit: hello] 00:50:30 mumra: It feels a little off to me that gods would only send monsters against you when you were already in a somewhat dangerous fight, for a couple reasons 00:50:34 bh: i assume they don't get any xp for killing wrath summons? 00:50:45 mumra: summons, even durable ones, never give XP 00:50:46 You do not 00:51:32 DracoOmega: if wrath timeout can happen in empty places, that encourages people to wait it out (any tying it to XP also solves this) 00:51:45 bh: i knew that really ;) 00:52:06 Yes, I realize that people wait out wrath, but I don't personally think that only having wrath effects during tension is a sensible solution to this 00:52:12 I am fine with xp, though 00:52:36 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 00:53:32 hrm. how should I deal with patches that don't apply cleanly? 00:55:52 fix them 00:56:14 git am instead of git apply? 00:56:49 ... why are you storing your own patches in files like that? 00:57:00 SamB: I didn't have commits 00:57:09 I had to wipe my harddrive between when that was created and now 00:57:11 bad things happened. 00:57:15 oh 00:57:54 I usually try "patch" when git fails to apply a patch, and then sort out the rejects manually 00:58:44 ack. I should really be applying them on a branch 00:58:45 if git am does something useful, by all means use it 00:59:01 oh well. 2/4 merged 00:59:56 * SamB grumbles something about his GDB requiring strange contortions to detach when quitting ... 01:00:08 * SamB wonders what he might have done wrong in preparing it 01:01:29 SamB: do you maintain the windows build for fun, or do you develop on windows full time? 01:02:16 I do most of my hacking on *nix; I only help with the Windows build because I can 01:02:23 -!- tensorpudding has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 01:02:48 DracoOmega: specifically i was referring to the discussion in this ticket : https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=2126 01:03:01 but i realise that was from years ago 01:03:14 -!- CeleryMan has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:03:21 -!- Vizer has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 01:03:27 and actually kilobyte says in that ticket that it won't work 01:03:53 which i missed on first read 01:05:15 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 01:05:16 yay, I got mephitic clouds to ID rPois 01:07:48 -!- SkaryMonk has joined ##crawl-dev 01:08:20 SamB: nice! 01:08:36 -!- CeleryMan has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:09:00 the problem is that it wasn't IDing resistances when you have full immunity 01:09:28 I mean, that's why just adding that case in misc.cc didn't work 01:09:52 yeah, i saw that poison clouds were in that case but still not iding 01:09:56 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:10:42 my first assumption was that that code was somehow never getting reached, rather than a silly logic error! 01:11:04 -!- Roarke has quit [Quit: Page closed] 01:11:25 SamB: does it still not warn you walking into those clouds with unid'd ring/ 01:11:30 well, depending on what "that code" is, it wasn't getting reached 01:11:41 SamB: i mean the switch in general 01:11:44 mumra: yeah, I didn't look at that yet 01:11:56 well, not seriously I mean 01:12:57 hm.. so should I just push this penance thing to trunk? 01:13:25 it's only four'ish months out of date, and it builds. What could go wrong? 01:13:36 what, without testing? 01:13:56 Does it use the same xp formula as Ash wrath, out of curiousity? 01:14:19 DracoOmega: I think so 01:14:23 bh: my only consideration would be that maybe wrath effects need to be made less harsh to go along with this, but i don't think it can hurt in trunk anyway 01:14:26 SamB: Is there any other way? 01:14:44 ++ for xp-based wrath now! 01:14:46 mumra: Well, if it's the same xp as Ash, in many cases I think this means these wraths will last a lot less time 01:14:57 that's good 01:15:02 I have no idea if this is coinciding with more frequent occurances or not 01:15:14 bh: yes, you could test it first, like I did just now ;-P 01:15:44 i've definitely been finding there's value in testing even minor changes before pushing :P 01:15:46 I'll push it on a branch and give people some time to play with it 01:15:56 (i still managed to completely break sprint but hey ...) 01:16:47 Well, no matter how thorough you try to test, you will probably end up overlooking something 01:16:53 That's been my experience :P 01:17:01 SamB: back to earlier - the D:27 changes should be completely portable _but_ i'm slightly worried i've broken branch placement 01:17:07 Especially since Crawl is such an expansive game with so many interactions 01:17:27 mumra: in that case, I guess we'll just leave it, since like kilobyte said, it's not THAT slow 01:17:47 Yes, I don't consider it a problem in need of an urgent fix for 0.12 01:17:55 and it is a sort of dramatic point in the game, I expect 01:18:24 To be honest, I had never really noticed that it was D:27 in particular that was slow until other people mentioned it. Like, I noticed in retrospect, but at the time I had just assumed it was a nonspecific blip 01:18:30 https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=6894 - this is what worries me, since it comes so soon after i made those changes! 01:18:38 So I don't think it is ruining too many people's fun :P 01:18:49 Yes, that is an 'interesting' bug 01:19:08 DracoOmega: most of the time it took at most a second. just occasionally there would be like a really jarring 10-second freeze 01:19:26 Well, I guess I never personally experienced one of the really bad ones 01:19:33 Hmmm... actually, I think I may have 01:19:42 ok. I just pushed it as xpwrath 01:19:47 But probably didn't think much of it at the time 01:19:50 and this problem could very occasionally happen in other places than D:27 of course 01:19:53 oh, you meant not pushing to trunk 01:20:37 elliott: If it was fresh in my mind, I'd be completely comfortable pushing it. I had forgotten about it until I saw mumra update my bug today 01:20:44 bh: in my experience at least so far, most of the time nobody gets around to testing a branch 01:21:01 whereas now is kind of an ideal time to test more contentious things in trunk 01:21:11 Yes 01:21:11 mumra: sounds about right. This might be dangerous enough to get tested? 01:21:11 not quite now 01:21:14 although this doesn't even seem contentious really 01:21:25 Well, the issue is not it being contentious 01:21:36 The main thing is possibly needing to rebalance duration/frequency, I expect 01:21:48 if you push it to trunk then a thousand ##crawlers will give you feedback in the form of complaints 01:21:50 One change I made is that you don't get penance reduction for doing things your god likes, or for Ely screwing up your fighting 01:21:51 okay, do what you will ;-P 01:21:57 and three of them are even likely to be accurate 01:21:58 * SamB pushed his thing 01:22:13 bh: doing hings your god likes -- does that include, e.g. killing spellcasters under trog? 01:22:33 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 01:22:34 elliott: yes. But you get penance reduction from the XP 01:22:35 or what do you mean? 01:22:38 bh: why not? 01:22:46 elliott: luckily we can just tell those ##crawlers to get back to testing .12 if they don't like it ;) 01:22:51 New branch created: xpwrath (4 commits) 01:22:51 03bh 07[xpwrath] * 0.13-a0-264-g17864d7: Experience Penance Timeouts 10(5 months ago, 2 files, 15+ 2-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=17864d732f65 01:22:51 03bh 07[xpwrath] * 0.13-a0-265-gfdd0d27: Penance and Mollification 10(5 months ago, 5 files, 26+ 7-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=fdd0d274f441 01:22:51 03bh 07[xpwrath] * 0.13-a0-266-g914ee1e: Penance 10(5 months ago, 21 files, 60+ 54-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=914ee1e0002b 01:22:51 03bh 07[xpwrath] * 0.13-a0-267-g467a132: Penance Timeout 10(5 months ago, 8 files, 102+ 57-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=467a1323649b 01:22:55 because it's hard with, say, beogh? 01:23:03 no, wait, you hate beogh 01:23:10 SamB: because the extant examples are a sack of one off penance reducy things 01:23:22 I have no idea how to translate `reduce penance by 1 point` to an XP value 01:23:23 oh, I see 01:23:26 you're removing existing special cases 01:23:42 elliott: they're still present for backward compat. 01:23:54 I kept in the old numerical penance, but it's strictly non-increasing 01:24:16 bh: oh, I would have thought it counted what-would-be-piety or something 01:25:21 bh: i would have thought it worked like "every time xp increases, reduce penance by (xpgained/somefactor)" 01:26:40 rounding might be a killer there 01:27:37 Does stuff like corpse sacrifices and such still decrease penance? Or JUST xp? 01:27:55 03SamB 07* 0.13-a0-264-gcc181de: Fix wear-ID of ring of poison resistance (rPois) from mephitic clouds 10(21 minutes ago, 2 files, 5+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=cc181de27f5f 01:27:55 03SamB 07* 0.13-a0-265-g28c38b4: Don't require juggling to wear-ID delayed-action jewellery like SInv and resists 10(4 hours ago, 1 file, 0+ 48-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=28c38b4c00fe 01:27:56 You know, if you're still with the god in question 01:28:25 DracoOmega: IIRC, just XP 01:28:33 That sounds bad 01:28:52 Stuff that gives piety should still reduce penance, as far as I am concerned 01:28:57 piety gain should still reduce penance, yeah 01:29:00 penance should still be reduced by gaining piety for sure, yes 01:29:04 elliptic: hi 01:29:08 elliptic: i wrote your sentence for you 01:29:12 you can stop paying attention 01:29:15 okay 01:30:09 so long as i don't need to look too closely at the p's and c's to work out who said what ;) 01:30:13 IMO basing stuff on XP only makes sense for penance when you have abandoned the god 01:30:24 Yeah 01:30:34 well, the branch is there. If someone has a good idea for translating piety gain -> penance reduction, either tell me and I'll add it, or add it yourself 01:30:35 it should be: piety if worshipping the god, XP if not 01:30:37 Since otherwise the current system seems far more sensible 01:31:05 -!- Vizer has joined ##crawl-dev 01:31:08 elliptic: what's the exchange rate? 01:31:21 I agree with elliptic 01:31:56 bh: probably something similar to the current exchange rate between ash wrath duration and other wrath 01:32:27 ??ashenzari wrath 01:32:27 ashenzari wrath[1/1]: -4 to all skills and halved xp gain. Also boosts enemy AI: better pathfinding, they're more likely to target you when you're invisible, and they never forget about you. The wrath ends after you've gained two experience levels (or an equivalent amount of xp), not after a certain number of turns. 01:32:45 Really, when you think about it, if xp has ANY effect on penance when still with a god, this means you could mollify Ely by killing stuff 01:32:46 so that is 4 experience levels worth of wrath, I think? (since xp gain is halved) 01:32:50 -!- SkaryMonk has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 01:33:09 Which is really strange, obviously 01:33:20 indeed 01:33:30 and most wrath is 30 or 50 penance currently 01:33:47 so let's say that 1/10 of an xp level is one point of penance reduction 01:33:58 elliptic: it says two experience levels ... 01:34:07 SamB: "(since xp gain is halved)" 01:34:13 oh 01:34:25 how did I miss that 01:34:32 I just ... didn't see it 01:34:33 DracoOmega: I'm fine with that. We're trying to proxy for time/risk 01:34:34 DracoOmega: you get ely wrath! (this is a joke) 01:35:03 bh: the point is that basing it on piety gain already works very well for penance acquired by making your god angry 01:35:04 bh: Well, I am not fine with that. And what is even the need? Penance when with a god works fine as it currently is 01:35:06 so why change it? 01:35:37 -!- eb has quit [] 01:35:58 bh: it makes no sense that you can make your current god happier with you just by going around gaining xp without doing a single thing the god likes... 01:36:22 mumra: weren't you saying this wasn't contentious? 01:36:46 i said it didn't *seem* contentious :P 01:36:48 bh: well I assumed that the point was to change *wrath* 01:37:07 elliptic: the point is to end wrath scumming 01:37:13 What? 01:37:22 bh: you mean resting off wrath, yes 01:37:28 You can't wait out penance at the moment ANYWAY 01:37:30 bh: is that where you get Xom wrath and hope for something good? 01:37:32 bh: wrath and penance while with the god you are in penance with are different 01:37:45 the former should be based on XP; the latter should be based on piety gain 01:37:53 DracoOmega: I think maybe you can with non-good gods? 01:38:03 it isn't very good strategy though 01:38:03 I had no idea the branch did the latter, only the former, which is non-contentious 01:38:17 elliott: hm. let me take another look at my patches 01:38:18 bh: unfortunately they are both tracked by the same markers (maybe they should be separated?) 01:38:26 elliptic: Wait, how? 01:38:31 mumra: I've separated them 01:38:36 DracoOmega: you wait for okawaru to send titans 01:38:41 this probably reduces penance 01:38:42 Oh, haha 01:38:44 repeat 01:38:51 like I said, a bad strategy :P 01:38:57 Okay, so it works but is just obviously incredibly inferior to not waiting 01:38:59 unless you're a mummy 01:39:04 bh: no it is inferior 01:39:12 elliptic: why? 01:39:12 because you would rather just kill a few things 01:39:18 and not get any titans dropped on you 01:39:23 bh: Yes, there is basically no situation where waiting is a better plan unless you are crazy 01:39:40 And you plan is to create amusing tv 01:39:47 bh: this is how oka penance currently works... you run around trying to kill things quickly to make oka happy again 01:39:55 btw can gods just not give wrath while you're under penance 01:39:57 do you get points for good ratings? 01:39:59 they scale so badly and it also seems weird and pointless 01:40:04 I know it was a bug that they didn't, but... 01:40:11 elliott: that's a separate issue really 01:40:22 yes but I felt it worth bringing up while all forms of wrath were being discussed :P 01:40:28 could go wrath be based on your level and/or max piety 01:40:49 its a bit funny that leaving a god early = horrible death 01:40:56 bh: the point is that "gaining piety" is a very good way of measuring duration of something related to your current god 01:40:59 and later on its pretty much manageable 01:41:14 -!- Vizer has quit [Quit: bye] 01:41:18 bh: it just doesn't work when you aren't worshipping the god in question, so we want to use xp instead in that case 01:41:20 elliptic: I agree. Omission isn't disagreement 01:41:38 rast: Well, I think most people agree that some wraths could scale more kindly to low level characters 01:41:55 a lot of wraths already scale by XL 01:42:09 most people don't realize this because the scaling isn't done that well 01:42:12 Hence the 'most kindly' bit. Like titans at any level from Oka is perhaps not that kind 01:42:17 more* 01:42:19 -!- popz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:42:24 but it could certainly be improved, yes 01:42:29 ??okawaru wrath 01:42:30 okawaru wrath[1/1]: ABANDONMENT: 25 penance. RETRIBUTION: 1+XL/5 punishers, chosen from (orc warrior, orc knight, naga warrior, centaur warrior, stone giant, fire giant, frost giant, cyclops, hill giant, titan). Abjurable summons in 0.7, permanent summons in 0.8 (no xp or items). 01:42:30 ask trog for help: get one troll 01:42:38 piss trog off: get 6 angry trolls 01:42:45 rast: not at low xl.... 01:42:48 ??trog wrath 01:42:48 trog wrath[1/3]: ABANDONMENT: 50 penance RETRIBUTION: 50% summoning abjurable, but berserking hostiles from (iron troll, deep troll, rock troll, troll, black bear, grizzly bear, stone giant, hill giant, ogre, two-headed ogre); 33% weakening effect (decay, STR loss, paralysis, slowing); 16% fire miscast. 01:42:56 oh that doesn't say how many you get 01:43:00 Like, it would be nice if switching to Lugonu on a low-level banishment wasn't probably more likely to eventually kill you than save you with many gods 01:43:02 but you certainly get fewer at lower XL 01:43:06 che needs real wrath 01:43:13 also the duration of wrath should be based on piety 01:43:30 max piety, or total piety gained 01:43:58 so if you follow a god for a relatively short time he wont hate you for the next 20,000 turns 01:44:44 some combinatino of piety spent and max piety might be good 01:45:19 for now can we just change wrath to have duration in xp rather than turns 01:45:34 and worry about more complicated stuff after we've tested that a bit 01:46:12 note that a fixed number of XLs will mean fewer turns at lower levels, so it partially addresses these problems anyway... 01:47:24 i don't really see why wrath should scale so much to the character's strength 01:47:41 surely it is a good thing that how strong you are factors into the decision of whether you abandon your big scary mighty god for another one 01:47:56 and it also discourages, like, abandoning $gift_god as soon as you get a really good gift or something silly like that 01:48:03 -!- InternetKraken has quit [Quit: Page closed] 01:48:47 elliott: oh definitely. I think Kiku wrath should get worse with each book. 01:48:50 there are some complicated proposals on the wiki for scaling severity of wrath based on if you got given a bunch of gifts or whatever 01:49:02 but yeah just doing the xp thing for now seems like a very good change 01:49:36 -!- Alexor has quit [] 01:58:18 well, the branch is there. I'm happy to jam it into trunk before we add on piety-for-your-god-is-sad-reduction, or to wait on that 02:02:10 Penance for gods you are still worshipping should remain as present, and I think adding this into trunk would be bad if that is not the case 02:03:23 -!- Blade- has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:03:34 -!- Blade-_ is now known as Blade- 02:04:51 -!- maarek has quit [Quit: maarek] 02:05:34 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 02:05:36 -!- Moredrea1 has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 02:06:42 -!- Svendre has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 02:07:00 DracoOmega: it shouldn't be too hard to retain that behavior. 02:07:53 I split out penance into penance and penance_exp. We could find better names for them, maybe penance and wrath_exp and then leave penance as is 02:08:26 -!- SkaryMonk has joined ##crawl-dev 02:12:23 -!- Soundlust has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:16:42 -!- Thalfon has quit [Quit: Page closed] 02:17:36 -!- bh has quit [Quit: sleep] 02:20:03 -!- madreisz has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:25:18 -!- SkaryMonk1 has joined ##crawl-dev 02:25:25 -!- SkaryMonk has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 02:31:18 -!- madreisz has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:36:42 -!- crate has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:37:03 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: CADENZA-CLASS CLOCKWORK KNIGHT--OPERATION TERMINATED] 02:38:14 -!- crate has quit [Client Quit] 02:38:42 Tile request: evokable ability icons (fog, teleport control) by MarvinPA 02:44:02 -!- nooodl has joined ##crawl-dev 02:44:34 -!- simmarine has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:46:21 -!- Arkaniad has quit [Quit: I've killed the senator.] 02:48:38 -!- nooodl has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 03:00:01 -!- raskol has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 03:00:34 Unstable branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.13-a0-266-g2ecd869 (34) 03:04:24 03mumra 07* 0.13-a0-266-g2ecd869: Allow more than one branch entrance on same level 10(6 minutes ago, 1 file, 2+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=2ecd869e3553 03:05:48 Haha, nice bug 03:06:00 I guess this was the cause of the missing Snake entrance? 03:06:06 yes :S 03:06:07 -!- SkaryMonk1 is now known as SkaryMonk 03:06:56 mumra: dont worry 03:06:57 Well, swift fix anyway 03:07:06 mumra: fcrawl got that exact same bug when i made level generation lazy 03:07:13 you are in TOP COMPANY 03:07:40 hehe :) 03:08:11 ironically the commit that broke it was supposed to make entrance vaults MORE likely to place 03:09:46 Ha 03:10:58 -!- Staplegun has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:11:53 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.13-a0-266-g2ecd869 (34) 03:16:14 -!- jeanjacques has quit [Quit: the 27-headed lernean hydrairc] 03:22:05 -!- Cerepol has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 03:25:27 -!- Pthing has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:28:48 -!- substitute has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 03:31:12 -!- syraine is now known as mikee__ 03:31:17 -!- mikee__ is now known as syraine 03:38:43 -!- minqmay has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:40:16 -!- mikee_ has quit [Quit: Try HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <-] 03:42:08 -!- Isaiah_ has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:53:48 -!- syraine has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:58:14 -!- Tenaya has quit [Quit: Page closed] 04:04:44 -!- Sequell has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:04:57 -!- Sequell has joined ##crawl-dev 04:05:05 03elliptic 07* 0.13-a0-267-g3a629e4: Add short_text for a few statuses, record many more statuses in milestones/logfiles. 10(35 minutes ago, 2 files, 26+ 17-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=3a629e40fde8 04:05:05 Cherry-picked 1 commit into stone_soup-0.12 04:09:23 -!- eiennohito_ has joined ##crawl-dev 04:10:11 03kilobyte 07* 0.13-a0-268-g67dbe9d: Reduce the size of some spiders and their zombies. 10(17 hours ago, 1 file, 4+ 6-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=67dbe9de3061 04:10:11 03kilobyte 07* 0.13-a0-269-g441f643: Implement other planned changes for zombie sizes. 10(17 hours ago, 1 file, 4+ 12-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=441f6435328c 04:10:11 03kilobyte 07* 0.13-a0-270-g8bf01c4: Use FixedBitArray instead of large arrays of bools. 10(8 hours ago, 29 files, 98+ 113-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=8bf01c43c17c 04:10:54 -!- eiennohito has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 04:12:45 Incidentally, one of the reasons emperor scorpions were made go large in the first place was so they would tear through webs instead of getting caught in them. Do they still do that? 04:13:53 hmm, no 04:15:50 could make them an exception and justify is that they cut through with their pincers 04:16:12 Well, what exactly is the harm with leaving them giant? 04:17:40 well, they're not giants 04:18:44 the current value, SIZE_HUGE, makes them as big as a tank 04:20:41 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 04:20:41 I am not sure why it is an intrinsic problem that they be larger than that 04:21:19 -!- magicpoints has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 04:21:23 As opposed to special-casing other things that are necessary for them to play well in their own home 04:22:21 tank is already pretty ridiculously big, no harm in going larger surely 04:22:22 -!- Taco_Princess has quit [Quit: Leaving] 04:22:25 especially since the game never talks about tanks at all 04:23:14 Also, does this imply that yaktaurs are the size of tanks? 04:24:11 -!- SkaryMonk has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 04:24:36 -!- SkaryMonk has joined ##crawl-dev 04:24:36 D&D size system... 04:24:58 kilobyte: you mean SIZE_BIG not SIZE_HUGE right? 04:25:06 yeah, obviously 04:25:15 +2 not +4 04:25:23 03kilobyte 07* 0.13-a0-271-gb3860d8: Make emperor scorpions ridiculously large again, so they tear webs. 10(3 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=b3860d843f61 04:25:42 -!- edlothiol has joined ##crawl-dev 04:26:01 how a size +4 creature can't kill multiple humans a turn just by stepping on them is beyond me 04:26:03 -!- bmfx has quit [Quit: leaving] 04:27:32 This just in: Crawl combat is not to scale 04:27:57 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:28:38 When you have a rat blocking a dragon and taking arrows for it, I think you need to accept a leeway here :P 04:28:47 that _is_ fixable: a dragon doesn't need to be the size of a house, one that can fit in a room can still be deadly 04:29:16 One that can fit in a room is probably still plenty capable of trampling through a rat at its leisure :P 04:29:45 and for rats or spiders, there are fluff messages that for some reason these creatures grow as big as a dog in these dungeons 04:30:05 yeah, but at least to a lesser extent 04:30:23 hmm, actually, you're right, it still makes zero sense 04:31:29 i thought it was just a kind of unspoken chivalry 04:31:58 -!- Blade- has quit [Quit: Page closed] 04:32:16 Well, it IS true that basically everything wants to kill YOU 04:32:27 about triggering wrath, I think the idea is to select the effect depending on tension 04:32:46 not triggering only at high tension 04:33:49 I'd remove as many tension effects as possible, instead of adding even more 04:33:56 btw, can we give some inertia to tension by making it (old_tension + new_tension) / 2 04:33:58 it's inherently gameable 04:35:17 lead a couple stone giants around a small loop, you have max tension for a long time without any risk 04:36:36 Presumably this is AFTER they have unloaded all their ranged weapons at you? :P 04:37:00 galehar: eronarn had some intertia tension formula he wanted for lorcs 04:37:04 it's in the lorc mantis ticket I think 04:37:37 obviously :p Stone giants are not yaktaurs, their ammunition lasts shorter than the time to reach you. 04:37:38 Didn't he just make heat have intertia? 04:37:46 And not tension itself? 04:37:52 DracoOmega: both IIRC 04:38:22 I won't bet my head on my memory here, though 04:38:52 DracoOmega: itw as a separate change that he thought went well with it, IIRC 04:38:55 maybe it wasn't inertia though 04:39:27 kilobyte: btw, how is it max tension for a long time? if new_tension = 0 (because the stone giants are gone), then it halves every turn you're not in los of them 04:45:28 -!- nago__ has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 04:45:41 -!- nooodl has joined ##crawl-dev 04:48:36 elliott: and comes back when they clear the corner 04:49:42 if you can get them at a distance with no ammo, why does that matter? you can keep full tension simply by keeping them in los if you really want to 04:49:48 the smoothing doesn't seem to make it any worse 04:50:17 a monster simply being *in* LOS shouldn't actually contribute to tension: e.g. they should have to move towards you to create it (and moving away from them would lower tension) 04:50:46 somehow i'm wondering if bh's diffusion algorithm could actually work for tension 04:52:46 Why shouldn't it? 04:52:55 There are plenty of monsters more dangerous when NOT moving towards you 04:53:40 if you're maintaining distance from a monster that's not actually a tense situation. if they gain a square on you then that is tense. if they do something like cast a spell or throw something then that adds tension. 04:53:50 i'm just trying to think how to make it more relevant and less gameable 04:53:59 if you have a rat then four aliches in a corridor, the situation is tense even though they can't currently move towards you 04:54:49 this works for what tension has been designed for, Xom 04:55:01 well, some tension has already been created when they originally moved towards you 04:55:13 but as long as they can't move, tension dissipates 04:56:06 if you run away, they step towards you every turn 04:56:29 I think virtually any metric designed to measure 'danger' in any sense will necessarily be kind of wrong in some situations, because this is a very hard thing to measure numerically. There are way too many subtle factors and interactions between these 04:56:44 the idea i'm thinking is that this should be tension-neutral; your situation isn't getting any MORE dangerous if you're maintaining distance 04:56:55 Sometimes a situation is not dangerous because of how it is at the MOMENT, but how it is likely to shift within a couple turns 04:57:08 What if that rat blocking the aliches is a hostile summon about to expire? 04:57:09 DracoOmega: that's what I'm saying. I'd thus not go wild with using tension for other purposes. 04:57:32 Well, I haven't played lava orcs to see how well it works there 04:57:36 mumra: so a wild chase is not tense in your opinion? 04:57:43 mumra: let's play Benny Hill music :p 04:57:52 kilobyte: i'm saying it's not getting any *more* tense than it already was 04:58:17 ie, same as it currently works 05:01:49 well i suppose i was saying it should also dissipate if they're not actually getting closer. but anyway if it's only for xom then this is irrelvant and other things just shouldn't be using it. 05:06:52 -!- dcssrubot613 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:07:41 -!- mumra has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:09:15 -!- mumra has joined ##crawl-dev 05:21:04 -!- Vizer has joined ##crawl-dev 05:31:58 -!- Melum has quit [Quit: Was eaten by a grue.] 05:33:37 does either of you know how stair connectivity checks work? 05:34:19 -!- faz_ has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 05:34:27 No particularly 05:34:29 -!- dcssrubot388 has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 05:34:30 Not* 05:34:34 I'm looking into making it so only one branch exit is created, and it fails on inter-level connectivity 05:34:53 Didn't mumra already do a lot of work on that? 05:35:14 At least, I got the impression that it was mostly functional? 05:35:18 that's why I suspect that if someone has a clue, it's either you or him 05:35:26 Not me, I'm afraid 05:35:58 by the way, comments in that code spell it out in big words that levels need to be created top-down or connectivity will be broken 05:36:21 that assumption can be shafted 05:36:25 Yes 05:36:31 kilobyte: i wrote a patch for it, i only didn't commit because there was a problem in how i dealt with mimics i think 05:36:39 i didn't get around to finishing it 05:37:00 but the way i did it worked, i didn't get any vetos or anything 05:37:20 it was in fixup_branch_stairs, i just picked a stair and eliminated the other two 05:37:55 so did I (mostly), too bad it fails later 05:38:14 hmm, fails as in vetos? 05:39:46 -!- clouded_ has joined ##crawl-dev 05:39:47 -!- absolutego has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 05:40:23 kilobyte: i think that top-down rule might only have been for orc/slime prior to the connectivity changes i made anyway 05:41:06 -!- st_ has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 05:41:28 VETO: Zot:1: Failed to ensure interlevel connectivity. 05:42:04 doesn't happen on D:1 for some reason, even though neither has a previous level 05:42:06 have you tried other branches? i can't remember testing zot 05:42:55 it definitely worked for orc, maybe lair too 05:43:38 zot might have some check left over from when there were 3 entrances 05:44:31 Did the three entrances used to arrive in different places? 05:44:35 At some point 05:45:07 i *think* so 05:57:56 -!- MaxFrost has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 06:01:28 03kilobyte 07* 0.13-a0-272-g7872dfe: Fix a possible infinite loop when dumping. 10(9 minutes ago, 3 files, 5+ 7-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=7872dfe2f1db 06:07:41 it was heat that had inertia, not tension - but tension should have inertia too 06:07:57 the tension change i made based tension on sqrt(HP lost) 06:07:59 -!- DracoOmega has quit [Quit: Leaving] 06:08:04 % HP lost that is 06:08:18 so it would range over ~10x instead of ~2x 06:24:07 -!- SkaryMonk1 has joined ##crawl-dev 06:26:24 -!- SkaryMonk has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 06:30:35 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 06:34:24 -!- nooodl has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 06:35:55 -!- absolutego_ has quit [Client Quit] 06:36:18 -!- Silurio has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 06:36:31 -!- absolutego has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 06:36:55 03mumra 07* 0.13-a0-273-g751b129: Large abyssal terrain layout 10(5 weeks ago, 2 files, 307+ 0-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=751b1299bb99 06:36:55 03mumra 07* 0.13-a0-274-g3a82c47: Forest ProceduralLayout 10(5 weeks ago, 2 files, 119+ 5-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=3a82c472863f 06:36:55 03mumra 07* 0.13-a0-275-g5e0d358: Abyss clamp testing 10(5 weeks ago, 2 files, 4+ 3-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=5e0d358e19fa 06:36:55 03mumra 07* 0.13-a0-276-g0088556: Increase time scale 10(5 weeks ago, 2 files, 10+ 5-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=008855600332 06:36:55 03mumra 07* 0.13-a0-277-g0eab4f3: Cleaning up ForestLayout 10(5 weeks ago, 1 file, 31+ 74-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=0eab4f3c86cb 06:36:55 03mumra 07* 0.13-a0-278-g95c5a40: Implement noise wrapper functions 10(3 weeks ago, 2 files, 146+ 12-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=95c5a40c70f2 06:36:55 03mumra 07* 0.13-a0-279-g104d96d: Abyssal Underworld layout 10(3 weeks ago, 3 files, 76+ 135-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=104d96d01f92 06:36:55 03mumra 07* 0.13-a0-280-gbacb77c: Clean up errors introduced during cherry-pick 10(3 weeks ago, 2 files, 3+ 6-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=bacb77ced63c 06:36:55 03mumra 07* 0.13-a0-281-gd423a14: Make layout morph less quickly 10(3 weeks ago, 1 file, 2+ 2-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=d423a148c8d1 06:36:55 03mumra 07* 0.13-a0-282-gc0e3516: Clean up abyssal underworld generator 10(21 minutes ago, 1 file, 25+ 61-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=c0e35169b45f 06:52:07 -!- DainDwarf has quit [Quit: Dain's default quit message] 06:52:52 -!- syllogism has joined ##crawl-dev 06:56:57 -!- grisovic has quit [Quit: Page closed] 07:05:26 -!- rast has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 07:06:38 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 07:06:58 -!- Wehk has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:13:07 -!- Zifmia has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 07:17:46 mumra: that ForestLayout thing, does it have any relation with the Forest branch? 07:20:06 dgn-proclayouts.cc: In member function ‘virtual ProceduralSample ForestLayout::operator()(const coord_def&, uint32_t) const’: 07:20:08 dgn-proclayouts.cc:294:35: warning: narrowing conversion of ‘(fn.worley::noise_datum::id[0] >> 24)’ from ‘uint32_t {aka unsigned int}’ to ‘uint16_t {aka short unsigned int}’ inside { } is ill-formed in C++11 [-Wnarrowing] 07:20:17 (a crapload of those follows) 07:25:28 -!- syraine has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 07:27:01 // Split the id into four 8-bit numbers to use for randomness 07:27:01 uint16_t rand[4] = { fn.id[0] >> 24, fn.id[0] >> 16 & 0x000000ff, fn.id[0] >> 8 & 0x000000ff, fn.id[0] & 0x000000ff }; 07:27:11 uint16_t and 8 bit? 07:30:10 -!- Kellhus has quit [Quit: Page closed] 07:33:45 oh, you don't use any values other than rand[0] too 07:34:24 -!- Svendre has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 07:37:43 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 08:03:03 -!- clouded_ is now known as st_ 08:03:53 -!- dcssrubot384 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:05:44 -!- substitute has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 08:07:56 Cherry-picked 2 commits into stone_soup-0.12 08:07:59 -!- Zermako has quit [] 08:14:13 -!- popbob has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:17:25 -!- Nightbeer has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:19:26 -!- scummos_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:20:08 -!- SkaryMonk1 has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 08:20:23 -!- kek has joined ##crawl-dev 08:20:57 kilobyte: no nothing to do with forest branch, it's an abyss layer - but you could base enchanted forest layout on something similar 08:21:20 (although i think grunt did some work on that at some point?) 08:21:24 -!- Cryp71c has joined ##crawl-dev 08:21:54 is there a simple way to view a specific abyss layer? 08:22:04 i didn't get those warnings here on windows 08:22:21 no simple way no, but you can shortcut it at the end of abyss_grid 08:22:53 looking around, I see claims that those warnings "have been there forever", and used to be fatal 08:23:53 -!- substitute has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 08:24:09 -!- sbanwart has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 08:24:13 -!- Elynae has quit [Quit: Page closed] 08:24:19 anyway, should I fix them, or are you going to? 08:24:34 same for using only rand[0] 08:26:50 oh so it's only because they're in the {} 08:26:58 i can fix that yes 08:27:28 can't remember what exactly what i planned to use the other bytes for now 08:28:58 oh and why did i use uint16_t ... 08:29:06 why don't i get any warnings here? 08:30:54 does simply changing it to uint8_t fix the warning i do i also need to move it out of the brackets? (i will use the other numbers for something) 08:32:00 yes, an implicit conversion is enough 08:32:15 er, explicit 08:40:44 -!- Lightli has joined ##crawl-dev 08:45:03 -!- Lightli has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 08:45:29 -!- Lightli has joined ##crawl-dev 08:46:14 -!- Elynae has quit [Quit: Page closed] 08:48:29 -!- rast has joined ##crawl-dev 09:18:30 -!- Cryp71c has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 09:18:42 03mumra 07* 0.13-a0-283-g2444626: Prevent a warning, make abyssal forest slightly less homogenous 10(9 minutes ago, 1 file, 13+ 10-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=2444626377ca 09:26:38 -!- Vizer_ has joined ##crawl-dev 09:28:12 -!- Vizer__ has joined ##crawl-dev 09:28:24 -!- Vizer has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 09:31:39 -!- Vizer_ has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 09:32:34 "start out knowing !poison" is a really lame ability 09:32:37 -!- Cryp71c has joined ##crawl-dev 09:33:25 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 09:33:58 -!- dcssrubot286 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:33:59 -!- floatboth has quit [Quit: floatboth] 09:34:31 ?Em[ty 09:34:49 hello 09:49:24 -!- magicpoints has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 09:51:18 -!- Xomination has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 09:53:26 -!- bitsailor has quit [Quit: bitsailor] 09:55:43 Shadowmage952 (L25 MiFi) ERROR in 'dbg-scan.cc' at line 603: enter_abyss didn't get generated. (D:25) 09:57:19 -!- Soundlust has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 10:01:17 -!- Escalator has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 10:01:22 -!- Escalator_ is now known as Escalator 10:02:50 -!- floatboth has quit [Quit: floatboth] 10:03:38 !lm * type=crash -log 10:03:38 4662. Shadowmage952, XL25 MiFi, T:83027 (milestone): http://dobrazupa.org/morgue/Shadowmage952/crash-Shadowmage952-20130409-145542.txt 10:05:00 mumra: this crash is in a version that includes your fix 10:08:18 kilobyte: i've been seeing this for a while, i _suspect_ it's nothing to do with me, i could be wrong of course 10:09:31 the comment on check_map_validity even says: 10:09:33 / These are nearly completely redundant, and should be useless, except for 10:09:33 / some recent Abyss breakage. 10:13:52 -!- dagonfive has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:14:19 03kilobyte 07* 0.13-a0-284-g78ee61a: Fix a warning. 10(7 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=78ee61a5221e 10:14:36 that comment is about looking for DNGN_UNSEEN 10:14:57 and in my stress tests, it _still_ triggers sometimes 10:15:16 the one for Shadowmage952 appears to be real, too 10:15:46 obviously, I'm not saying whose fault it is, just that this assertion failure doesn't seem to be bogus 10:17:22 specifically it's asserting because an abyss entrance didn't generate on D:25 which seems strangely specific 10:17:39 the only way I see for this check to show a spurious failure is to call check_map_validity() before the map finished generating 10:18:13 well, I added that assertion for quite obvious reasons, caring mostly about Pan 10:19:39 just checked: outside of the Abyss, it's called only at the end of _build_level_vetoable(), when all processing should be done 10:21:30 kilobyte: it is possible for the abyss entry to get overwritten by a unique 10:22:33 the only map placed was box_level_dp, which is encompass 10:23:34 kilobyte: oh right, it is my fault then 10:23:48 since abyss entries place as extra vaults 10:23:56 which is something i only just realised 10:24:09 and extra vaults don't get placed now if there's an encompass vault ... 10:24:21 errors like this are exactly why we have asserts like this :) 10:24:41 good point :) 10:25:38 (i was only confused why it was specifically D:25 when other branches don't place like that, but that made more sense when i saw the abyss entry vault) 10:26:11 yeah, it's guaranteed only on D:25 10:33:23 Unstable branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.13-a0-286-g2e44fbe (34) 10:33:46 -!- Zifmia has quit [Client Quit] 10:33:57 -!- Stendarr has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.2.0 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/] 10:34:33 03kilobyte 07* 0.13-a0-285-g0223be9: Remove a comment saying that some asserts are redundant. 10(14 minutes ago, 1 file, 0+ 2-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=0223be9e8cbe 10:34:33 03mumra 07* 0.13-a0-286-g2e44fbe: Allow Abyss entries to place on encompass levels 10(8 minutes ago, 1 file, 4+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=2e44fbeafd90 10:36:18 so apparently they place as CHANCE not extra 10:39:10 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 10:40:22 Unstable branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.13-a0-287-gd3ffa50 (34) 10:41:14 kilobyte: i do think there's still an outside possibility this can happen with a unique overwriting the abyss portal 10:42:08 which makes me wonder if we need a "definitely don't overwrite" flag in addition to MMT_VAULT 10:42:38 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.13-a0-286-g2e44fbe (34) 10:42:59 -!- inpho has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:43:40 we already have is_critical_feature(), perhaps that could be used for that purpose? 10:44:42 03mumra 07* 0.13-a0-287-gd3ffa50: Actually fix abyss entries with encompass vaults 10(6 minutes ago, 1 file, 6+ 4-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=d3ffa50172c1 10:44:49 -!- monqy has joined ##crawl-dev 10:47:38 -!- inspector071 has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 10:48:19 kilobyte: right, i didn't see that function before 10:51:45 -!- nicolae- has joined ##crawl-dev 10:53:19 kilobyte: i think i was being worried about nothing and they can't get overwritten, now i've looked deeper into the code 10:53:31 which does make sense that it didn't happen more often 10:56:00 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.13-a0-287-gd3ffa50 (34) 10:56:51 can anyone help me find where d:27 vaults are? i cant seem to find them in http://gitorious.org/crawl/crawl/trees/master/crawl-ref/source/dat/des 10:57:24 variable/ with the other d: branches i'd expect 10:57:24 nicolae-: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 10:57:32 a message, for me? 10:57:33 !messages 10:57:34 (1/1) mumra said (10h 20m 48s ago): there could very well be a bug i'll look into it... 10:57:44 !tell mumra cool thanks 10:57:44 nicolae-: OK, I'll let mumra know. 10:58:08 (i haven't looked into it yet) 10:58:08 mumra: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 10:58:14 !messages 10:58:14 (1/1) nicolae- said (30s ago): cool thanks 10:58:17 hahaha 10:58:29 -!- simmarine has joined ##crawl-dev 10:58:37 it's okay, no need to hurry 10:58:48 i was nearly going to "!tell nicolae- no problem" ... but that would be silly 10:59:04 faz: encompass.des for the huge ones 10:59:14 or are you looking for zot entries? 10:59:36 -!- MaxFrost has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:01:29 -!- eb has quit [Quit: I quit] 11:01:32 faz: Zot entries are in branches/zot.des. 11:02:04 There are a couple elsewhere (mainly encompass vaults and one other vault that has a D:27 configuration, which is in variable/float.des). 11:02:20 If there's a specific vault you want to find, we can help you find it :) 11:02:41 Grunt: thanks :) not looking for anything specific right now, just poking around and seeing where stuff lives 11:02:43 there's also lemuel_castle.des 11:02:58 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:03:17 lemuel_castle can't currently place on D:27. 11:03:32 oh 11:04:01 not that then :) 11:04:04 -!- dcssrubot115 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:04:12 It might be an interesting tweak, but we do have evilmike_zot_entry_castle already :b 11:04:29 i just remembered it used to place on D:27 11:04:52 because it was quite a memorable encounter ;) 11:04:57 03kilobyte 07* 0.13-a0-288-g3c566b8: Fix a warning when building tiles with clang. 10(18 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=3c566b83be71 11:04:59 It has a DEPTH: for D:27; right now though the PLACE: vaults (i.e. the "branch endings") take priority :) 11:05:01 mumra: monster moat!!!! 11:05:11 * mumra flees in terror 11:06:20 we could give it a zot gate i suppose 11:06:27 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 11:06:40 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:06:58 The easiest way to do it would be to KFEAT: 3 = enter_zot (places it under the "boss" monster), but I don't think KFEAT and MONS interact very well so we'd need to do some more adjusting. 11:07:03 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 11:07:11 (possibly MONS -> KMONS, but that's kind of ugly) 11:07:12 Grunt: i take it you're aware what happened with the PLACE: D:$ thing yesterday? 11:07:15 -!- nooodl has joined ##crawl-dev 11:07:22 I got caught up on it after I got back home, yes. 11:07:35 it was quite spectacular 11:08:00 fr: encompassprint :b 11:08:21 there's probably a better way to fix the issue but it was very quick to just change them to D:27 instead 11:08:45 It sounds like a Sprint vault logic issue to me, personally. 11:09:13 maybe Sprint should be a separate branch under the surface or something 11:09:24 e.g. i assume PLACE: D:1 would have the same problem 11:09:56 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 11:13:34 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:15:47 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 11:17:08 -!- Lightli has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:17:08 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:18:56 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 11:21:42 -!- Isaiah_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 11:21:44 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:22:46 -!- blabber has joined ##crawl-dev 11:24:24 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 11:24:43 -!- nooodl has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:25:11 03Grunt 07* 0.13-a0-289-g6fcd578: Get lemuel_castle placeable on D:27 again. 10(5 minutes ago, 1 file, 7+ 0-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=6fcd5785fed6 11:25:29 -!- CeleryMan has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:25:35 -!- nooodl has joined ##crawl-dev 11:30:08 -!- CeleryMan has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:30:08 -!- ZRN has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:30:22 -!- Stendarr has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 11:32:05 -!- Kellhus has quit [Quit: Page closed] 11:32:25 -!- alefury has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.85 [Iceape 2.0.11/20121208085021]] 11:33:24 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 11:37:36 -!- jeanjacques has joined ##crawl-dev 11:43:23 -!- tophat_ has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:43:23 -!- Silurio has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:52:47 -!- nicolae- has left ##crawl-dev 11:53:49 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 11:54:26 -!- dpeg has joined ##crawl-dev 11:57:39 -!- remyroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:04:18 Stable (0.11) branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.11.2-13-g9771293 12:09:41 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 12:10:32 -!- bmfx has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:15:03 hi dpeg! 12:18:22 -!- bmfx has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:18:37 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.13-a0-289-g6fcd578 (34) 12:24:25 -!- magicpoints has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:24:51 -!- evilmike has joined ##crawl-dev 12:27:02 -!- WesterAlt has quit [] 12:28:00 Hi! 12:28:10 (only here a little bit :) 12:28:39 hello 12:29:38 Okay, while we're here: anyone unhappy with evilmike's cTele plan around here? 12:29:58 marvinpa was kind enough to implement it 12:30:01 I know that galehar, elliptic are up to it, as am I. kilobyte? 12:30:02 dpeg: check the git history :P 12:30:02 MarvinPA: You have 3 messages. Use !messages to read them. 12:30:05 oh :) 12:30:15 -!- dpeg is now known as cavepeg 12:30:27 -!- bmfx has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:30:29 -!- Soundlust has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:30:32 heh 12:30:57 evilmike: many thanks for the long mail, after all. As you saw, it was not in vain (sounded a bit as you'd assume it'd be) 12:32:15 I didnt mean to come across like that, I was just making it clear that this is ultimately up to others. All I do these days is hang around and commentate on stuff :P 12:32:45 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 12:33:20 evilmike: I've been doing that for years! 12:34:08 -!- dcssrubot826 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:35:00 * galehar just commentates on other comments 12:36:46 * cavepeg thanks Trog that kilobyte and MarvinPA occasionally produce some code. 12:37:01 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 12:37:14 -!- bmfx has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 12:38:24 -!- monqy has quit [Quit: hello] 12:39:14 cTele plan? 12:39:36 Havvy: cTele nerf instead 12:39:49 -!- the_glow has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 12:43:02 Havvy: Remove the cTele mutation. Make the ring of teleport control's effect evokable instead of passive. End teleport control duration after a controlled blink or teleport. Make controlled teleports take longer to go off. 12:44:17 Oh. Those all seem fine by me. 12:44:48 Does that also mean that rings of cTele are going to be more common? I never find them. 12:45:31 -!- absolutego has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 12:45:31 No, it means that from now on you can feel less unhappy about not finding them. 12:45:51 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:48:25 ...dpeg has devolved? 12:49:00 -!- cavepeg is now known as dpeg 12:49:26 -!- bmfx has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:49:55 fun crash on request: worship Fedhas, stand at the same place as a plant, abandon, press autofight 12:50:24 -!- MarvinPA_ has joined ##crawl-dev 12:51:46 kilobyte: neat combination, the curse of the plant, eh? 12:53:12 actually, the real cause is a monster standing on the same space as you 12:53:20 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:53:20 -!- MarvinPA_ is now known as MarvinPA 12:53:52 and I learned about this problem not because of a plant, but because somehow a large abomination spawned in the same place as me in the abyss 12:55:16 not limited to the player, apparently: from another run (I've started 6, one per CPU core, before going away), I got: 12:55:19 Floating monster: jelly at (69,57), midx = 301 12:55:22 Also at (69, 57): jelly, midx = 667 12:55:59 * dpeg has sympathy with the jelly. 12:57:01 third crash is a regular DNGN_UNSEEN (ie, feature 0) on an area shift 12:57:18 dpeg is apparently continuing to devolve :b 12:58:08 * dpeg sends Grunt a jelly bean. 12:58:32 * Grunt installs the Jelly Bean on his phone >_> 12:59:33 * kilobyte restarts failed test processes, and goes away, back in an hour with fresh crash dumps :p 13:00:00 -!- bmfx has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:00:06 kilobyte is collecting crush dumps like other people collect jelly beanse! 13:04:09 -!- Duralumin has quit [Quit: Ухожу я от вас (xchat 2.4.5 или старше)] 13:20:45 -!- dosman711 has quit [Quit: http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.] 13:21:12 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 13:22:58 -!- absolutego has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 13:29:38 -!- dcssrubot934 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:41:01 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 13:43:57 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 13:45:10 -!- blabber has quit [Quit: leaving] 13:46:45 -!- eith has joined ##crawl-dev 13:49:19 -!- Stendarr has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 13:50:35 -!- Aryth has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:51:37 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 13:51:45 -!- blackcustard has joined ##crawl-dev 14:01:23 Hype (L20 MiFi) ERROR in 'dbg-scan.cc' at line 603: enter_abyss didn't get generated. (D:25) 14:01:37 o_O 14:02:40 runrest_ignore_poison no longer working by sgrunt 14:02:44 yikes 14:07:20 -!- eiennohito_ has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 14:08:05 !messages 14:08:06 (1/1) mumra said (4h 31m 41s ago): weird, it ided an already known item when I got hit by coldness 14:08:14 * SamB has already been looking into this 14:08:52 I don't really see anything that would have prevented "You are wearing: " messages before I messed with things, either... 14:10:08 -!- hurdos has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 14:11:10 -!- ussdefiant_ has joined ##crawl-dev 14:11:42 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:11:49 -!- ussdefiant_ is now known as ussdefiant 14:13:22 ok, i've had enough 14:13:37 webtiles will need to be turned off 14:14:00 at least until i have time to update the server 14:14:39 it's causing so many page allocation failures in a row that the server has a load of above 15 14:15:19 -!- Crayth has quit [Client Quit] 14:15:35 they have ancient bugs, too 14:19:17 Napkin: announce it on CDO and ##crawl beforehand? 14:20:40 * kilobyte wishes we had shared saves, so folks would be able to continue their games in console or on other servers. 14:21:09 add some buzzwords about cloud storage 14:21:21 I'll probably turn it back on in a sec and disable new character creation instead 14:21:27 so people can finish their games 14:21:49 sounds nice to them, yeah 14:22:31 Napkin: maybe you should just not do webtiles on CDO after that? 14:23:34 or were you going to set things up like on the other two, where the same builds are used for both webtiles and console? 14:24:58 -!- SkaryMonk has joined ##crawl-dev 14:25:43 -!- bmfx has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 14:25:58 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 14:26:44 Napkin: good idea 14:27:37 -!- Vidiny has joined ##crawl-dev 14:27:55 adding something that blocks playing webtiles if there's too much load already might help? not having a webtiles server in europe would suck :( 14:28:31 Why is it so bad for the load anyway? 14:29:05 -!- syllogism has quit [] 14:30:00 -!- Aryth1 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:30:58 -!- voker57 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:37:52 well, probably part of it is that it's updated manually and so naturally tends to get stuck with a version that has performance problems? 14:37:54 -!- bmfx has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:52:33 -!- bmfx has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 14:59:16 done, dpeg 14:59:19 -!- absolutego_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 15:00:19 kilobyte: It looks like #6897 was caused somehow by 8bf01c4; I'm investigating further. 15:00:53 -!- dcssrubot627 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:05:30 %git 8bf01c4 15:05:33 03kilobyte * 0.13-a0-270-g8bf01c4: Use FixedBitArray instead of large arrays of bools. 10(19 hours ago, 29 files, 98+ 113-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=8bf01c43c17c 15:06:52 -!- _D_ has quit [Quit: leaving] 15:07:43 -!- bmfx has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:08:22 %mantis 6897 15:08:36 SamB: don't worry, I already have it figured out :) 15:09:02 * SamB is a curious type 15:09:11 0006897: runrest_ignore_poison no longer working 15:10:10 Unstable branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.13-a0-290-g09d78cf (34) 15:10:27 and how much RAM does this save again ...? 15:12:21 -!- st_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:12:46 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 15:13:08 hmm, C++'s array index overloading wasn't well thought-out, was it? 15:13:16 probably a few KB? 15:13:25 alefury: 1KB? 15:13:27 * Grunt flees in terror. 15:13:36 :) 15:13:48 you mean he would have died without this commit? 15:13:55 03Grunt 07* 0.13-a0-290-g09d78cf: Fix some reversed logic causing initfile interrupts to break (#6897). 10(8 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=09d78cf8c755 15:13:57 Yup!!!!!! 15:14:34 Nice 15:15:00 The fastest way to motivate a dev to fix a bug is to put them in a situation where it hinders their normal operations, gameplay, etc. 15:15:03 :b 15:17:18 -!- substitute has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:17:20 -!- rossi has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.0] 15:22:31 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.13-a0-290-g09d78cf (34) 15:24:30 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 15:25:11 -!- bmfx has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:25:42 -!- santiago_ has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 15:28:40 -!- ark__ has joined ##crawl-dev 15:30:05 -!- Elkan has quit [Quit: Quitte] 15:35:54 -!- Vidiny has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 15:38:00 -!- Vidiny has joined ##crawl-dev 15:38:19 -!- spriseris has quit [Quit: i is an awfulplayer, sorry.] 15:39:05 -!- dpeg has quit [Quit: sleep] 15:39:33 -!- CeleryMan has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:42:38 -!- Cryp71c has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:42:58 -!- Cryp71c has joined ##crawl-dev 15:45:04 -!- Namey has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:45:33 -!- sbanwart_ has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:50:12 ??potion of water 15:50:13 potion of water[1/1]: In old versions (0.11-), 60 nutrition when quaffed (and nothing else), or a cloud of steam that blocks LOS and does minor damage when evaporated. Appears as "a clear potion" until identified. 15:51:49 -!- bmfx has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:52:19 The fact potion of water was removed should have been a clear sign that fulsome distillation was removed. 15:57:48 * SamB is just a bit surprised that it's not listed in itemname.cc, but is still in the enum 15:59:01 -!- Mandevil has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:59:02 -!- Kalir has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:59:30 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 16:01:41 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:02:29 -!- bmfx has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:03:17 -!- ldf has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:05:22 -!- Arivia has quit [Quit: Page closed] 16:06:11 -!- Krakhan has quit [Changing host] 16:06:11 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 16:06:56 -!- ToastyP has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90 [Firefox 19.0.2/20130307023931]] 16:09:32 slimes spawning in vaults in slime6 by deathrot 16:10:58 i spent _far_ too long on this layout when i could have been doing 1,000 more productive things 16:12:11 all at the same time? 16:12:13 wow! 16:12:18 <|amethyst> SamB: shifting all the enums on save transfers would be a pain (and it would be very easy to miss something if they're used in places other than items) 16:12:58 well, I'm particularly puzzled since the gain stat potions are still listed in the same function 16:14:31 <|amethyst> SamB: have potions of stat gain been removed from old saves? 16:14:34 03mumra 07* 0.13-a0-291-g631780c: Fix zonify floor detection 10(11 minutes ago, 1 file, 2+ 2-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=631780c1a87f 16:14:34 03mumra 07* 0.13-a0-292-g4e92341: Improve procedural functionality 10(10 minutes ago, 2 files, 93+ 13-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=4e92341c973b 16:14:34 03mumra 07* 0.13-a0-293-gb9e29bb: Prevent a cave layout in D:27 10(8 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=b9e29bb12244 16:14:34 03mumra 07* 0.13-a0-294-gf2ee5c2: Add a foresty layout (D, Lair and Crypt for now) 10(6 minutes ago, 1 file, 133+ 0-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=f2ee5c2e6b03 16:14:37 -!- Jubjub has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:15:52 <|amethyst> SamB: I guess that's why... potions of water in old saves were replaced with confusion, so there shouldn't be any and it's okay to call them "of bugginess" 16:16:07 ah 16:17:08 <|amethyst> that's also why the code for water but not stat gain was removed from potion.cc 16:17:35 * SamB was experimenting with using "#pragma GCC diagnostic" pragmas to enable "-Wswitch-enum" for a small portion of itemname.cc 16:17:49 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:18:01 -!- Zifmia has quit [] 16:18:17 -!- monqy has joined ##crawl-dev 16:18:24 <|amethyst> hm... 16:19:01 -!- CeleryMan has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:19:44 <|amethyst> You could add #if TAG_MAJOR_VERSION < 34 POT_WATER: #endif just before the default: but that would be ugly 16:19:57 <|amethyst> s/PO/case PO/ 16:20:13 SamB: not just at the same time ... but simultaneously in past, present and future as well! 16:21:36 -!- Krakhan has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:24:29 -!- shachaf_ has quit [Changing host] 16:24:39 -!- shachaf has quit [Disconnected by services] 16:24:46 -!- shachaf_ is now known as shachaf 16:25:02 -!- bmfx has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:30:40 -!- Stendarr has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:30:57 -!- dcssrubot821 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:32:17 -!- edlothiol has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:34:10 -!- Aryth1 has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:39:48 -!- bmfx has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:39:56 -!- Nightbeer has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:46:01 hehe: @@ 2 Sigmund 16:46:16 ??mauricescumming[3 16:46:16 mauricescumming[3/8]: 3 Maurice comes into view. 16:46:37 how does *that* happen 16:46:43 -!- madreisz has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:46:45 I did mine with &M 16:46:45 A long-fixed bug. 16:46:53 Something to do with abyss portals. 16:47:59 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Read error: Connection timed out] 16:48:13 -!- Stelpa has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:48:51 -!- Stelpa has quit [Changing host] 16:49:58 03SamB 07* 0.13-a0-295-gb2beb16: Don't "ID" delayed-action jewellery of known types. 10(38 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=b2beb16e69bf 16:51:58 -!- ldf has quit [Quit: ldf] 16:52:43 -!- partyhat has quit [Quit: Page closed] 16:54:03 -!- Vidiny has quit [Quit: [19:23] don't they have refill machines in ikea [19:24] bet those muricans took their vases to those straight away after paying] 16:55:49 -!- raskol has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 16:58:43 -!- kek has quit [Quit: Kicked by KickServ] 16:59:22 -!- kek has joined ##crawl-dev 17:00:32 -!- Koolguydude has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90 [Firefox 19.0.2/20130307023931]] 17:01:33 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: CADENZA-CLASS CLOCKWORK KNIGHT--OPERATION TERMINATED] 17:02:23 !lm deathrot rune=slimy 17:02:23 4. [2013-04-09 20:10:10] deathrot the Intangible (L27 MfBe) found a slimy rune of Zot on turn 79485. (Slime:6) 17:02:44 !lm deathrot rune=slimy -tv 17:02:44 4. deathrot, XL27 MfBe, T:79485 (milestone) requested for FooTV (telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org). 17:03:07 ...aw, his player glyph isn't ; after all. 17:04:04 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 17:04:12 -!- Isvaffel has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:05:45 !lm deathrot rune=slimy -tv:<2 17:05:45 4. deathrot, XL27 MfBe, T:79485 (milestone) requested for FooTV (telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org). 17:06:58 -!- bmfx has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:07:46 hmm, he wasn't fighting anywhere near the loot vault but the slurps started immediately when he killed trj 17:08:24 !lm deathrot rune=slimy -log 17:08:25 deathrot, XL27 MfBe, T:79485 (milestone) has no matching game. 17:08:32 -!- SkaryMonk has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:09:26 !lm deathrot -log 17:09:26 deathrot, XL27 MfBe, T:80618 (milestone) has no matching game. 17:11:17 i don't think that's actually a bug anyway? 17:12:19 oh huh the vault does actually have no_monster_gen now 17:13:15 MarvinPA: my theory is that that flag doesn't necessarily stop the spawns when you hurt TRJ 17:15:16 and that there was an anomalous spawn well out of LOS i guess 17:16:17 hm, well the spawns shouldn't be able to appear on the other side of walls either 17:16:41 -!- CKyle has quit [Client Quit] 17:17:12 the problem used to be tele traps, dont know if its still the same 17:17:53 ok i know why it started slurping as soon as TRJ was killed: FPROP_NOJIYVA gets removed at that point, prior to which the jelly wasn't allowed to eat anything 17:17:56 so it was already in there somehow 17:18:20 also, no tele into gets removed at that time so it's faintly possible it got teleported in immediately after but that sounds unlikely 17:24:25 !lm deathrot rune=slimy -tv:<2 17:24:26 4. deathrot, XL27 MfBe, T:79485 (milestone) requested for FooTV (telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org). 17:29:51 -!- jeanjacques_ has joined ##crawl-dev 17:32:28 -!- Blade- has joined ##crawl-dev 17:33:05 -!- jeanjacques has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 17:33:05 -!- jeanjacques_ is now known as jeanjacques 17:44:32 -!- alefury has quit [] 17:48:07 -!- ZipZipkins has quit [Quit: Page closed] 17:50:11 -!- bmfx has quit [Quit: leaving] 17:57:18 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 17:59:37 -!- bmfx has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:00:53 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 18:01:03 -!- dcssrubot191 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:03:23 -!- kingbuddyboy has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:06:31 -!- MarvinPA_ has joined ##crawl-dev 18:07:04 -!- bmfx has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:10:36 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 18:10:37 -!- MarvinPA_ is now known as MarvinPA 18:11:55 -!- rossi has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:12:33 -!- NekoRex has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:12:44 -!- ark__ has quit [Quit: Leaving] 18:14:14 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 18:18:56 -!- bmfx has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 18:18:58 hangedman_abyss_exit_choices seems to cause a number of failures 18:19:28 complaints about being unable to connect vault exits, unlinked items 18:21:50 -!- tcjsavannah has quit [Quit: Page closed] 18:22:50 -!- Soundlust has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:23:19 g - a bug-filled silvery potion 18:24:14 is that water? 18:24:28 good question 18:24:36 it was just generated 18:24:44 more likely gain foo? 18:24:44 mumra: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 18:24:48 !messages 18:24:49 (1/1) HangedMan said (54m 2s ago): bleh I cannot give feedback to the d:27 changes because the rss trunk builds suddenly stopped and shenanigans prevent me from building trunk, go fix that so I have more things to yell at you for/with 18:25:00 I guess I will backup the save before drinking in case that ends up being useful 18:25:30 gain foo still has code in itemname.cc, or did when I looked within hours of now ... 18:25:30 it was beneficial mutation 18:28:05 good question, what has happened to trunk builds? 18:28:27 !tell handedman I wasn't even sure what D:27 changes you meant, we just fixed performance problems by making zot entries be included with other encompass vaults ... what shenanigans are you referring to? 18:28:28 mumra: OK, I'll let handedman know. 18:28:35 !tell hangedman I wasn't even sure what D:27 changes you meant, we just fixed performance problems by making zot entries be included with other encompass vaults ... what shenanigans are you referring to? 18:28:36 mumra: OK, I'll let hangedman know. 18:31:17 -!- bmfx has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 18:31:40 elliptic: was the game started before the potion was added? 18:31:44 yes 18:31:54 That's probably the problem, then. 18:33:06 -!- inspector071 has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:34:48 The potion appearance table is initialised at game start, and there isn't a tag or check or anything for games started before the potion was added. 18:35:18 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:36:15 -!- CampinSam has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 18:38:25 Grunt: tags.cc doesn't have a chance to fill in any new entries? 18:41:12 Abyss crash: DNGN_UNSEEN generated by KiloByte 18:43:03 -!- greatorbofeyes has joined ##crawl-dev 18:44:00 -!- rossi has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:44:20 mumra: the shenanigans where a non-zot-entry orient vault used to place alongside the entry vault for d:27, unless I'm mis-reading this 18:50:00 -!- bmfx has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 18:50:19 -!- Fhqwhgads_ has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:50:26 -!- inspector071 has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 18:50:29 -!- Fhqwhgads__ is now known as Fhqwhgads_ 18:51:23 -!- nooodl has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:51:46 -!- nooodl has joined ##crawl-dev 18:52:08 -!- caleba has quit [Quit: caleba] 18:52:16 -!- NekoRex has quit [Quit: "All the vain and ignorant will look up and shout 'Save us!', and I'll look down and whisper... 'Nyo.'"] 18:56:22 -!- xxx has quit [Quit: Page closed] 18:57:12 -!- Wehk has joined ##crawl-dev 19:00:41 greatorbofeyes: well i meant what shenanigans are stopping you from building; but yes, you now only get one big vault on D:27 19:00:49 because trying to place two was causing all kinds of problems 19:00:56 like 10+second delays sometimes 19:02:33 it should never cause delays that long, so something is terribly wrong 19:03:15 those ones were extremely rare; but several seconds at least was fairly frequent 19:03:28 and it was only with the very large zot vaults like evilmike castle 19:03:49 -!- pelotron has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 19:04:57 -!- greatorbofeyes has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:05:00 but yeah, definitely something a bit iffy going on with vault placement there 19:06:06 -!- bmfx has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:06:17 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:07:02 there's no other place that the game ever tries to place two very large vaults on the same level of course 19:07:42 define very large? 19:08:23 uh "bigger than my hand"? 19:08:44 for a given size of screen and a given font size 19:08:48 your hand is how many squares wide and tall again? 19:08:55 -!- Duralumin has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:09:04 SamB: try 30x30ish for a rule of thumb. 19:09:57 there's been a patch for 6635 "unlinked item" bugs on the ticker since last week, i think it's gone unnoticed? 19:10:02 * SamB wonders how hard it would be to extend thins so you can have two primary vaults 19:10:10 -!- the_glow has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 19:10:14 yeah, that's almost a quarter of the level; if it places somewhere in the middle then there's no room for any other mid-sized vaults even 19:10:25 I've an idea. 19:10:30 I'm going to try something. 19:10:51 personally i don't see why we want two primary vaults, unless they're designed to go together, in which case the first one can place the second one in lua 19:11:13 you know, have it pick out two vualts and choose spots for both before starting generation? 19:11:26 (This is an "in case we want to have two primary D:$ vaults" sort of thing.) 19:11:33 if we want to have such big vaults in twos, I mean 19:12:05 like i say, if you designed two to go together, then the first could place the other (using the same code as serial vaults) 19:12:27 only if there was actually room left 19:12:33 blackcustard: there's a number of reasons that can produce an unlinked item 19:12:41 SamB: well that's why they have to be designed to go together 19:12:52 so the first one will place with ORIENT: blah 19:12:57 oh 19:13:02 that would indeed work 19:13:04 so you know it's at the edge therefore you know how much space is left for the other 19:14:14 or, we could even have the first one try to place a second randomly 19:14:41 exactly 19:14:51 serial primary vault secret tech 19:15:11 they wouldn't have to be a matched pair like you made it sound 19:15:41 well, you'd want to know that the second one was the right size to fit in the remaining space 19:15:59 can't you measure? 19:16:05 I don't understand something: there's a limited number of attempts to place the second vault, so why would it take so long? 19:16:21 kilobyte: i think the limited number is about 5000 or something 19:16:37 what, not 9000? 19:16:52 i even saw 10000 in a loop somewhere in vault placement 19:17:26 i think when some of the code was originally written nobody was imagining such large vaults or multiple ones on the same level 19:20:22 -!- rebthor has quit [Client Quit] 19:20:35 -!- st_ has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 19:21:34 Anyway, I think I can be satisfied with the current behaviour if we have enough sufficiently ostentatious Zot entries. 19:21:41 (Which we did to begin with, but still.) 19:21:58 If D:27 gets too busy it starts overshadowing other levels, IMO. 19:22:02 ...such as Zot <_< 19:22:30 <|amethyst> btw, I don't know if rchandra ever reported it, but dgwnrobin got a missing Snake entrance 19:22:40 in _place_extra_vaults there's actually a while(true) { } -- it keeps going until it _fails_ to place a vault 19:22:48 |amethyst: I think mumra caught that bug already :) 19:22:50 <|amethyst> http://dobrazupa.org/saves/dgwnrobin-crawl-git-a95e3249a8-130408-2245.tar.bz2 19:22:55 <|amethyst> oh, okay 19:23:03 |amethyst: yeah, reported then fixed 19:23:40 <|amethyst> excellent... sorry, RL doesn't leave me much time these days 19:25:59 -!- rossi has quit [Ping timeout: 257 seconds] 19:28:24 -!- HellTiger has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.2.0 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/] 19:31:08 -!- dcssrubot324 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:31:13 -!- Cryp71c has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:31:34 -!- ShadeTornado has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:31:39 -!- ZChris13 has joined ##crawl-dev 19:32:33 -!- kek has quit [Quit: Kicked by KickServ] 19:35:48 -!- Cryp71c has joined ##crawl-dev 19:38:12 -!- scummos has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:38:32 -!- bitsailor_ has joined ##crawl-dev 19:40:12 -!- Sovek has quit [Client Quit] 19:45:55 -!- tcjsavannah has quit [Quit: Page closed] 19:59:12 -!- ckyle has joined ##crawl-dev 20:01:30 -!- bmfx has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 20:02:18 -!- Dixlet has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:02:45 -!- smeea has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 20:02:48 suggestion for whomever runs henzell: 20:02:49 -!- herself has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 20:03:04 i think getting pig-ified is interesting enough to announce 20:04:53 * kilobyte oinks. 20:05:48 expecially hilarious when you get pigiefied repeatedly :| 20:09:53 -!- Zermako has quit [] 20:11:20 good suggestion for a Xom bot 20:11:25 announce the funny things 20:11:49 snicker at falling down shafts, laugh at interesting deaths 20:11:56 -!- Isvaffel has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:12:22 -!- ToastyP has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:13:02 -!- browncustard has joined ##crawl-dev 20:13:25 -!- rebthor has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:16:25 -!- blackcustard has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 20:17:14 03kilobyte 07* 0.13-a0-296-gc83a827: Produce some more info on DNGN_UNSEEN validation failures. 10(2 hours ago, 1 file, 2+ 2-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=c83a8276c063 20:17:14 03kilobyte 07* 0.13-a0-297-gca0b060: Get rid of a misplaced prototype, adjust includes. 10(2 hours ago, 3 files, 2+ 3-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=ca0b060e1ef2 20:17:14 03kilobyte 07* 0.13-a0-298-g4aa3aa2: Double the chance for chaos attacks to polyself the attacker. 10(8 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=4aa3aa2a8025 20:19:16 kilobyte: I disagree about polyself being less "annoying" than shafting 20:19:46 shafting is dangerous and can put you in interesting situations, polyself in my experience just means you need to rest off treeform before you can move again... 20:20:04 you're guaranteed to be in combat 20:20:23 often you just killed a monster or are killing something weak 20:20:33 hmm, possible 20:20:51 it lasts only several turns, though 20:20:58 right, but you still need to rest them off 20:21:04 yeah 20:21:09 doesn't matter whether it is 50 turns or 10 20:22:15 shafting causes a lot more annoyance, though, even if the danger is not much higher than a teleport 20:23:14 shafting down 3 levels is rather higher danger than teleporting 20:23:20 -!- Cryp71c has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:23:38 I don't understand what is annoying about it, either 20:25:11 "there are no visibile monsters within range" when there's a skeleton right next to me seems wrong, somehow 20:25:26 -!- ZRN has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:25:43 -!- rossi has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:27:17 yeah, the message means there are no visible monsters not immune to the spell in question 20:27:43 I figured that out but it took me a bit 20:29:01 we should at least make the message more accurate, perhaps even actually check for other monsters in range 20:34:35 -!- CKyle_ has quit [Quit: CKyle_] 20:35:30 -!- bh_ has joined ##crawl-dev 20:35:36 -!- bh_ has quit [Changing host] 20:35:36 -!- bh_ has joined ##crawl-dev 20:36:25 -!- bh_ is now known as bh 20:36:39 !seen dpeg 20:36:40 I last saw dpeg at Tue Apr 9 20:39:05 2013 UTC (4h 57m 34s ago) quitting with message 'Quit: sleep'. 20:36:59 dpeg's around frequently; leave him a !tell if you want to get a hold of him :) 20:37:11 (Or e-mail him, of course.) 20:37:59 mhmm. He had e-mailed me 20:39:57 -!- Sequell has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:40:10 -!- Sequell has joined ##crawl-dev 20:52:38 -!- ckyle has quit [Quit: ckyle] 20:54:38 -!- bh has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:56:42 -!- dcssrubot833 has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:00:41 -!- Kellhus has quit [Quit: Page closed] 21:02:50 -!- sbanwart_ has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 21:06:17 -!- WalkerBoh has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:10:01 -!- inspector071 has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:13:23 -!- s951 has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:14:00 -!- Fhqwhgads_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:15:23 @devs: there may be someone coming in here eventually to ask about a project they run that lets babby coders help OS projects, starting with smaller bugs they can more easily tackle 21:15:51 they get a lot of requests for game development from the students, so i suggested DCSS, since we have a good developer culture 21:23:53 We do? 21:23:54 >_> 21:24:47 Grunt: compared to other random open source projects? heck yeah 21:26:04 impenetrable documentation, obscure bugs that nobody cares about with hundreds of pages of discussion, bugs that people do care about that don't get fixed for years because of ideological purity 21:28:17 -!- evilmike has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:30:07 are those things that dcss has or things that other random open source projects have 21:32:30 the latter 21:33:27 we have obscure bugs that don't get fixed for years and bugs that people do care about that don't get fixed for years with hundreds of pages of discussion 21:37:54 there are a lot of open source projects out there with downright toxic developer cultures, yeh 21:41:57 -!- santiago has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:49:25 -!- magistern has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 21:53:25 -!- nooodl has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 21:54:27 -!- mamga has quit [Quit: Page closed] 21:56:00 -!- MaxFrost has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:56:05 -!- pythonsnake has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 21:56:27 -!- tcjsavannah has quit [Quit: Page closed] 21:58:25 -!- ckyle has joined ##crawl-dev 22:01:33 * SamB wonders why SpEn starts out putting half its skill points into hexes 22:01:45 (and almost none into spellcasting) 22:10:05 -!- Cryp71c has joined ##crawl-dev 22:16:20 -!- ToastyP has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90 [Firefox 19.0.2/20130307023931]] 22:18:53 -!- browncustard has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:21:09 -!- inspector071 has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:25:57 -!- PepeRC2 has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:32:21 -!- ckyle has quit [Quit: ckyle] 22:32:22 -!- CKyle_ is now known as CKyle 22:38:44 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 22:38:49 SamB: do you mean in auto mode, or just the starting skill values? 22:39:31 I don't know how auto mode chooses skill training percentages at game start 22:39:44 -!- Cryp71c has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:41:05 -!- mikee_ has joined ##crawl-dev 22:41:15 -!- faze_ is now known as faze 22:48:17 -!- kekekela has quit [Quit: Page closed] 22:53:04 -!- Boyo has quit [Quit: Page closed] 22:56:56 -!- Twinge_ has joined ##crawl-dev 22:58:26 -!- scummos has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 22:59:33 -!- Twinge has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 23:01:43 -!- ISuckAtDCSS has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:04:39 -!- N78291 has quit [Quit: null] 23:05:19 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 23:05:22 -!- kingbuddyboy has quit [Quit: Page closed] 23:06:30 -!- ldf has quit [Quit: ldf] 23:08:37 -!- pelotr0n has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 23:10:00 -!- Twinge_ has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:11:48 -!- Twinge has joined ##crawl-dev 23:22:19 -!- Pacra has quit [Quit: Pacra] 23:22:21 -!- bh has joined ##crawl-dev 23:22:30 hai 23:24:18 Boulder beetle weirdness (again...) by Swiss 23:25:33 -!- fooobarrr has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:29:21 -!- Arkaniad has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 23:31:37 ??bottled efreet 23:31:38 bottled efreet[1/1]: Summons a permanent efreet. Its chance of being friendly is 50%, plus 5% per 3 levels of Evocations (so 95% at level 27). Always carries a flaming scimitar. 23:33:53 -!- johnny0 has quit [Quit: leaving] 23:34:11 -!- Krakhan has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:34:30 !lg * won god=okawaru 23:34:31 1510. danharaj the Wrestler (L26 TrSu), worshipper of Okawaru, escaped with the Orb and 3 runes on 2013-04-09 17:56:03, with 1496795 points after 81736 turns and 6:19:40. 23:34:39 !lg * lost god=okawaru 23:34:39 No games for * (lost god=okawaru). 23:34:43 !lg * god=okawaru 23:34:44 83300. Stanimator the Shield-Bearer (L6 DsFi), worshipper of Okawaru, slain by an ogre (a +0,+0 giant club) on D:3 on 2013-04-10 04:34:21, with 613 points after 4475 turns and 0:14:20. 23:35:00 !lg * god=nemelex xobeh 23:35:01 27233. Kintak the Sorcerer (L25 DrJr), worshipper of Nemelex Xobeh, splashed by acid on Slime:4 on 2013-04-10 04:30:10, with 473525 points after 83132 turns and 13:25:05. 23:35:05 !lg * won god=nemelex xobeh 23:35:05 511. Roshnak the Grand Master (L27 DsJr), worshipper of Nemelex Xobeh, escaped with the Orb and 15 runes on 2013-04-10 03:05:38, with 17195882 points after 90217 turns and 13:24:22. 23:35:17 -!- rossi_ has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.0] 23:35:25 -!- Boyo has quit [Quit: Page closed] 23:35:29 !lg * won god=sif muna 23:35:30 1097. Tolias the Sorcerer (L27 NaCj), worshipper of Sif Muna, escaped with the Orb and 15 runes on 2013-04-09 23:38:31, with 13543119 points after 117128 turns and 13:25:52. 23:35:33 !lg * god=sif muna 23:35:34 51657. nplus1 the Geomancer (L9 DDEE), worshipper of Sif Muna, shot by Joseph (sling bullet of frost) on D:8 on 2013-04-10 04:08:37, with 3655 points after 10726 turns and 1:19:18. 23:35:49 !lg * god=beogh 23:35:50 26482. jorden the Missionary (L4 HOPr), worshipper of Beogh, slain by a gnoll (a +0,+0 spear) on D:2 on 2013-04-10 02:42:11, with 130 points after 1516 turns and 0:06:53. 23:35:52 !lg * won beogh 23:35:52 126. NumiTroll the Executioner (L27 HOPr), worshipper of Beogh, escaped with the Orb and 3 runes on 2013-04-08 19:30:10, with 1916874 points after 49721 turns and 7:36:21. 23:36:13 !lg * won god=beogh 23:36:13 126. NumiTroll the Executioner (L27 HOPr), worshipper of Beogh, escaped with the Orb and 3 runes on 2013-04-08 19:30:10, with 1916874 points after 49721 turns and 7:36:21. 23:36:18 whoa. Beogh is that bad? 23:37:26 well, keep in mind that beogh is racist ... 23:37:35 VERY racist 23:37:54 !lg * won god=beogh s=crace 23:37:55 126 games for * (won god=beogh): 126x Hill Orc 23:37:59 Awwwww. 23:38:09 what, was there a bug? 23:38:10 I was hoping someone snuck a bug in or something <_< 23:38:16 !lg * god=beogh s=crace 23:38:17 26482 games for * (god=beogh): 26424x Hill Orc, 58x Lava Orc 23:38:32 (clearly we need to land lava orcs at some point) 23:38:38 ... we had lava orcs online? 23:38:54 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 23:38:58 and that's why they're called "lava orcs" and not "salamanders" 23:39:03 It was a test branch on a server. 23:41:51 wait. lava orcs? 23:41:53 oh 23:42:12 why don't we just remove Beogh? 23:42:14 nobody ever won a lorc*beogh? 23:42:22 tragic 23:42:32 -!- rebthor has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:42:34 ontoclasm, :( 23:42:34 ontoclasm: even Demigod of Nemelex has been won! 23:42:44 !lg * won race=demigod god=nemelex 23:42:46 1. 78291 the Acrobat (L27 DgJr), worshipper of Nemelex Xobeh, escaped with the Orb and 3 runes on 2013-04-02 03:39:12, with 1500404 points after 115713 turns and 8:01:52. 23:42:49 bh: because I will put Beogh back if you remove Beogh? 23:43:04 SamB: not if I get there first!!! 23:43:06 SamB: I asked a question. 23:43:16 beogh should accept all worshippers but turn them into orcs as soon as they join 23:43:25 hehehe 23:43:27 0_o 23:43:30 ontoclasm: it should scale with piety obviously! 23:43:34 yes 23:43:46 "You feel more orkie!" 23:43:46 at ** you get orc arms 23:43:52 ontoclasm: you get to draw it, of course 23:43:56 "You smell terrible!" 23:43:57 Your orcish ancestry asserts itself... 23:44:01 onboard 23:44:36 You feel a sudden urge to complain loudly. 23:44:50 You feel a sudden urge to jeer. 23:45:53 should we buff Beogh? 23:46:04 !lg * unwon god=beogh 23:46:05 Malformed argument: unwon 23:46:24 yeah, we've already begun a campaigh to buff beogh haven't we? 23:46:34 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 23:50:50 SamB: 0.4% win rate? :( 23:51:31 just add orc hyperlords 23:51:37 instant beogh buff 23:51:53 orc king!!!!!!! 23:51:57 yes 23:51:59 do it 23:52:43 the problem with beogh isn't being weak 23:52:56 the problem is that there is a ton of room for micromanagement 23:52:57 It's more the logistics of everything. 23:53:01 ...yes, exactly. 23:53:07 which orcs to take with you, what equipment to give them 23:53:20 -!- WalkerBoh has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:53:29 should be made easier 23:54:02 SamB: or made impossible 23:54:13 that doesn't make any sense 23:55:09 unless you are suggesting that it be impossible to leave orcs behind? 23:55:18 well I was thinking more about the second half 23:55:35 or make it so they can't use equipment 23:55:59 we could try to make monsters not switch equipment, yes 23:56:24 or we could make orcs take non-shit gear 23:56:39 -!- ISAIAH_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 23:56:54 bh: ? 23:57:03 -!- faz_ has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 23:57:07 -!- eith has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:57:09 elliptic: make them preferentially collect polearms and crossbows 23:57:47 it's not like orc allies using polearms is at all flavorful 23:58:11 since orcs are supposed to be axes specialists 23:58:18 -!- CeleryMan has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:58:39 and you'd still want to lead them over polearms/crossbows 23:58:53 -!- rzimodnar has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 23:59:07 -!- randomizr is now known as rzimodnar 23:59:44 if you want polearms, worship gneogh