00:00:42 <Sizzell> Stable (0.11) branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.11.2-3-gc26df3e
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00:05:51 <Sizzell> Unstable branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.12-a0-2001-gf599d7f (34)
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01:28:39 <simmarine> Lua error:
01:28:39 <simmarine> /crawl-master/crawl-git-1c1002134a/data/dat/des/variable/grated_community.des:8
01:28:39 <simmarine> 1: No vault found for tag 'grated_community_mu_home'
01:28:39 <simmarine> Lua error:
01:28:39 <simmarine> /crawl-master/crawl-git-1c1002134a/data/dat/des/variable/grated_community.des:7
01:28:39 <simmarine> _5: No vault found for tag 'grated_community_mu_home1' x24
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07:15:03 <Gretell> Stable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.11.2-3-gc26df3e (33)
07:15:39 <Napkin> thanks, |amethyst
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08:24:47 <Napkin> i think the order of these messages is wrong:
08:24:59 <Napkin> You offer a prayer to Trog.
08:24:59 <Napkin> You can now regenerate and be protected from hostile enchantments.
08:24:59 <Napkin> The jackal corpse is slowly consumed by flames.
08:24:59 <Napkin> The jackal corpse is consumed in a column of flame. x2
08:25:02 <Napkin> _Trog is most pleased with you.
08:25:04 <Napkin> ---
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10:10:51 <Grunt> Who do I bother to get the version of crawl fightclub runs updated? :b
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10:38:18 <HangedMan> grunt: greensnark, I suppose
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11:44:58 <Gretell> StoneWall (L20 HOHe) ASSERT(smc) in 'mon-util.cc' at line 1135 failed. (Shoals:5)
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11:56:17 <Gretell> aj12037 (L27 OpFE) ASSERT(!invalid_monster_index(mg.foe) || mg.foe == MHITYOU || mg.foe == MHITNOT) in 'mon-place.cc' at line 1680 failed. (Slime:6)
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12:13:57 <Cheibriados> 03dolorous 07* 0.12-a0-2002-g10ee34a: Constify. 10(15 minutes ago, 1 file, 5+ 6-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=10ee34ac9a8c
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13:28:27 <Napkin> seriously, fuck rng
13:28:41 <nicolae-> agreed
13:28:56 <nicolae-> deterministic crawl
13:29:52 <Napkin> teleportation scroll takes me on the other side of the hydra.. and of course, reading next teleportation the hydra has all lucky hits
13:31:32 <elliott> nicolae-: Danger: High (but deterministic)?
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13:32:11 <nicolae-> sure
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13:54:44 <nicolae-> hi mumra
13:54:55 <mumra> hi
13:54:55 <Henzell> mumra: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it.
13:55:00 <mumra> !messages
13:55:00 <Henzell> (1/1) HangedMan said (2d 1h 11m 20s ago): actually while vaults_rooms_test may be of use it totally should be just part of test.des
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13:57:16 <mumra> HangedMan: the test vaults are of fairly limited use anyway and it's not hard to make up new ones to test a specific feature when needed. e.g. like the empty space tesselation feature i'm totally working on right now ;) (it's almost impossibly hard btw, i hope you realise what you have done to me)
13:57:41 <HangedMan> a masochistic effort, you say
13:57:47 <HangedMan> sounds like playing crawl
13:58:14 <nicolae-> i will reward your efforts by making a bunch of terrible vaults with empty space
13:58:42 <HangedMan> I will reward your efforts by having already made a bunch of terrible vaults with empty space
14:00:09 <mumra> haha
14:00:17 <nicolae-> and that's what collaborative projects like crawl are all about
14:00:21 <nicolae-> people getting together, to make terrible things
14:00:27 <HangedMan> precisely
14:00:46 <mumra> maybe it would be more fun with permadeath. like any time there a bug crashes crawl, all my code gets deleted and i have to start again.
14:01:02 <elliott> mumra: https://twitter.com/bos31337/status/116372971509121025
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14:01:33 <HangedMan> clearly you need god support
14:01:45 <mumra> elliott: nice :)
14:01:47 <mumra> "and source control is savefile scumming"
14:02:18 <HangedMan> of course the only gods that support using layoutcraftingskill are like, greensnark and zaba
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14:04:18 <ontoclasm> mumra: what do we need most vaults-wise
14:04:49 <HangedMan> 41 : 66 : 27
14:05:07 <HangedMan> empty - standard - hard
14:05:26 <HangedMan> odd there are more standard than empty
14:05:31 <mumra> ontoclasm: at this point i'm pretty happy with the general spread of structural stuff
14:05:45 <mumra> yeah, empties tend to be used a little more often so there should be more
14:06:15 <nicolae-> i'll make a bunch then
14:06:51 <mumra> and more smallish rooms is generally good (i would call 15x15 medium sized)
14:07:31 <mumra> i'm considering writing code that will strip monsters from the rooms so the empty/standard distinction can disappear
14:07:51 <mumra> so all vaults could place monsters but they're not guaranteed to be used (basically like stairs)
14:07:53 <ontoclasm> maybe it could be done with lua
14:07:58 <HangedMan> oooo
14:08:00 <ontoclasm> in the vaults themselves
14:08:13 <HangedMan> surely this needs the opposite happening a little though then
14:08:14 <ontoclasm> :if (something) SUBST: 0: .
14:08:19 <mumra> i'd prefer not to have every vault need to call the same lua function
14:08:30 <HangedMan> with placing a bunch of 0s in the empty vaults
14:08:34 <mumra> it will be easy enough to do in the post-processing that already happens
14:08:45 <elliott> seems like you'd need a tag to prevent that
14:08:50 <elliott> for vaults where the monsters are the whole point
14:09:06 <HangedMan> the dangerous singular 0 in a 11x11 vault
14:09:12 <ontoclasm> elliott: you could just give applicable vaults both vaults_empty and vaults_room tgas
14:09:19 <mumra> yep, can do, although i'd like to see an example of a vault that will literally not work if the monsters are removed
14:09:32 <ontoclasm> i.e. "feel free to delete these monsters and use this as an empty vault"
14:09:34 <HangedMan> doorvault
14:09:39 <elliott> ontoclasm: well, mumra just said the empty/standard distinction would disappear
14:09:44 <elliott> but sure
14:09:51 <ontoclasm> mm
14:09:51 <elliott> mumra: any gimmick vault
14:09:59 <mumra> elliott: what gimmick vaults ? ;)
14:10:03 <HangedMan> i.e. vaults_hard
14:10:12 <elliott> any vault that is structured wrt loot and stuff to give some kind of progressio nand would just be weird if mdae empty
14:10:15 <elliott> *made
14:10:20 <HangedMan> elliott: uh
14:10:31 <HangedMan> vaults_room don't bother placing loot
14:10:32 <mumra> vaults_hard will still be a separate tag so those wouldn't get stripped anyway
14:10:39 <elliott> mm
14:10:40 <elliott> well fair enough
14:10:58 <mumra> some vaults_room have predefined loot
14:11:52 <HangedMan> what
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14:12:21 <HangedMan> oh, one
14:12:22 <mumra> anyway, the situation for now is pretty good and i think vault contributions of any type just improves the content pool at this point
14:12:45 <HangedMan> metal_show should be vaults_hard anyway
14:13:02 <mumra> i still haven't ever even seen metal_show
14:13:18 <HangedMan> certainly lots of other branches that could use more vaults
14:13:38 <HangedMan> swamp, shoals, hells, blah blah blah blah
14:18:26 <Napkin> when ctrl+f searching, some found "objects" have a dot at the end
14:18:32 <Napkin> shafts, traps, altars
14:18:40 <Napkin> is that by design?
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14:55:41 <elliott> can something be done about the dpeg_entry_central vault?
14:55:49 <elliott> if you go up to D:1 the gnolls will just kill you
14:55:55 <elliott> unless you are mibe or something
14:56:18 <elliott> I went up, had no relevant consumables (I had only just gotten to D:2 and was stair-dipping upwards, after all), and the only real choice I had was to press >, which killed me
14:56:28 <HangedMan> well there is "only" a 1/4th chance for gnolls
14:56:29 <elliott> and it is spoilery to recognise that you have that entrance vault and be paranoid about D:2 upstairs because of it
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14:56:43 <elliott> HangedMan: a 1/4 chance of your entry vault just killing you outright is pretty bad imo
14:57:02 <HangedMan> but gnoll bands were removed from d:1 for a reason and an open enclosed staircase using them is definitely excessive
14:57:22 <HangedMan> should just s|gnoll|goblin| line 70 of entry/large.des I guess
14:57:25 <elliott> they even had halberds, not just spears or anything
14:59:24 <ontoclasm> so, if i recall correctly, no_rotate doesn't work for nnvvs, right
14:59:58 <ontoclasm> is there some other way i can specify that i don't want my vault rotated (mirroring is okay)
15:00:14 <elliott> I think mumra just hasn't coded no_rotate yet
15:00:17 <elliott> so bug him about it maybe?
15:00:18 <HangedMan> clearly should just get mumra to make that work
15:01:15 <ontoclasm> well wasn't there like... orient_e or something like that
15:01:24 <ontoclasm> i thought i saw vaults with that
15:01:32 <nicolae-> that just means it'll only put entrances on the east side
15:01:38 <ontoclasm> ah
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15:11:05 <ontoclasm> >.> i keep tryingto make vaults_rooms
15:11:11 <ontoclasm> and ending up with way too many monsters
15:11:17 <ontoclasm> and having to make them into hard ones
15:11:32 <HangedMan> well only 27 hard rooms is clearly not enough
15:12:16 <HangedMan> despite that being more unique vaults for swamp and shoals combined cough cough cough
15:12:30 <HangedMan> than for
15:12:41 <nicolae-> well, maybe swamp and shoals don't deserve vaults
15:13:10 <HangedMan> maybe they don't deserve being branches
15:13:29 <HangedMan> just make swamp a random serial vault in D with a rune
15:13:31 <ontoclasm> http://pastie.org/5995866
15:13:38 <nicolae-> maybe we should just have the one branch and save everybody the hassle
15:13:51 <ontoclasm> DCSS:D
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15:14:18 <ontoclasm> CSI:DCSS
15:14:19 <HangedMan> nice randomization in idyll
15:14:26 <ontoclasm> haha
15:14:38 <ontoclasm> use all the letters
15:14:46 <nicolae-> it's vaults_orient_e iirc
15:14:48 <nicolae-> not just orient_e
15:14:49 <HangedMan> I actually used all the letters once
15:14:53 <ontoclasm> aha
15:15:03 <HangedMan> it was painful
15:15:18 <HangedMan> but slaughterboxes is supposedly a Good Vault now so whatever
15:15:31 <HangedMan> if idyll places any islands it should have no_rtele_into
15:15:52 <ontoclasm> ah, good point
15:16:24 <HangedMan> still a good collection in general
15:16:56 <ontoclasm> thanks
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15:19:28 <nicolae-> do runed doors not work in vaults
15:19:39 <HangedMan> runed doors right now are buggy
15:19:46 <nicolae-> ah
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15:20:07 <HangedMan> no sprints, no portals, something about toher placements but I'm sure one of the cores of this is in both
15:20:38 <nicolae-> well they don't work in Vaults-the-branch, either, i mean
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15:25:51 <Cheibriados> Vaults: Legacy vaults (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=6590) by ontoclasm
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16:11:37 <Cheibriados> 03|amethyst 07* 0.12-a0-2003-g7e6e54b: Omit full stops in stash-search feature descriptions (Napkin) 10(6 minutes ago, 1 file, 4+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=7e6e54bba946
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18:38:03 <Cheibriados> 03Grunt 07* 0.12-a0-2004-g6f28006: Keep TRJ, Lernaean hydra, and SoH polymorph name across multiple polys. 10(2 minutes ago, 1 file, 19+ 16-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=6f2800661050
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18:51:00 <Zannick> The 27-headed Royal Jelly
18:51:11 <Zannick> The 27-headed Royal Hydra *
18:51:21 <Grunt> the 20-headed hydra shaped Royal Jelly
18:52:32 <HangedMan> if only we could have the guardian serpent shaped serpent of hell
18:53:10 * Grunt goes to adjust a guardian serpent's holiness...
18:53:14 <Cheibriados> 03kilobyte 07* 0.12-a0-2005-g7da4f03: Keep the SoH polymorph name for SoH flavours other than geh. 10(2 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=7da4f03f5142
18:53:15 <Grunt> <_<
18:54:41 <Zannick> the 27-headed lernaean hydra shaped Royal Jelly
18:55:01 <HangedMan> the 20-headed vampire hydra shaped lernaean hydra
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18:55:34 <Grunt> kilobyte: good catch there.
18:56:00 <Grunt> (You feel a tug on the fishing line! You have caught the Serpent of Hell! The Serpent of Hell roars!)
18:56:30 <HangedMan> snake has always needed stronger magical serpents, clearly add hellserpents to snake
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18:57:04 <Grunt> !send HangedMan hell hounds, hell hogs, and hellephants
18:57:04 <Henzell> Sending hell hounds, hell hogs, and hellephants to HangedMan.
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18:57:26 <Zannick> hellspiders
18:57:35 <Grunt> To hell with that idea.
18:57:38 * Grunt flees in terror.
18:58:13 <kilobyte> hell hound, hell hog, hellephant, hell knight, hellbinder, hellwing, hell beast, hellion, hell sentinel, hell lord (the last is genus-only)
18:58:30 <HangedMan> the hell wave in arenasprint is amusing
18:58:56 * Grunt recalls that terrible vault layout idea of his <_<
18:59:30 <kilobyte> we need that genus just in case you managed to get two hell lords into one level before seeing them for the first time
18:59:55 <DracoOmega> Sounds highly plausible, that
19:00:05 <kilobyte> and then see them together coming into view in a single turn
19:00:23 <DracoOmega> Though I suppose some sprint might do this?
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19:03:11 <HangedMan> uniques floors in zigsprint
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19:03:35 <DracoOmega> Yeah
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19:31:17 <HangedMan> http://pastie.org/pastes/6001435/text http://pastie.org/pastes/6001526/text
19:31:29 <HangedMan> making levels place 12 decorative vaults is fun
19:32:30 <HangedMan> clearly I should just make fifty elf-unique decorative vaults and then elf just places six a level instead of the twelve I'm using here
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19:48:19 <Sizzell> sponng (L7 FeVM) ERROR: range check error (35 / 35) (D:5)
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20:10:34 <HangedMan> http://pastie.org/pastes/6002047/text
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21:15:59 <bh> !messages
21:15:59 <Henzell> (1/3) HangedMan said (1d 5h 23m 41s ago): starcursed mass splitting needs to not have abyss spawn messages alongside the regular splitting message
21:16:04 <bh> !messages
21:16:04 <Henzell> (1/2) HangedMan said (1d 4h 21m 51s ago): also getting all those messages when a vault spontaneously appears in front of me and I get told about bushes emerging from chaos is silly
21:16:11 <bh> !messages
21:16:11 <Henzell> (1/1) kilobyte said (1d 4h 21m 16s ago): there's a bunch of times when monsters spawning in the Abyss give inappropriate messages (starcursed splits, going to a new level, etc) -- what about making that opt-in; I think random spawns are the only case that should give a message, even
21:16:34 <bh> !tell kilobyte Spawn message opt-in sounds good. I'll code it up
21:16:35 <Henzell> bh: OK, I'll let kilobyte know.
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21:49:57 <Cheibriados> 03dolorous 07* 0.12-a0-2006-gc54516c: Typo fix. 10(57 seconds ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=c54516c552cc
21:56:04 <HangedMan> infiniplex's revisions to his gehenna layout look good
21:58:10 <HangedMan> although I did just have a teleport closet place and that seems cruel since teleport scrolls in gehenna
21:59:23 <DracoOmega> Well, one hopefully has a wand by that point, but that's beside the point
22:00:07 <Cheibriados> 03kilobyte 07[bad_forms] * 0.12-a0-1583-g7f4e07e: Fix wands of digging being silent as well. 10(29 hours ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=7f4e07e1fe57
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22:01:45 <elliott> why should wands of digging make noise?
22:02:49 <kilobyte> all other wands do
22:02:50 <DracoOmega> Yes, I personally rather they not (as present), all things being equal
22:03:09 <kilobyte> not zapping itself, obviously
22:06:43 <kilobyte> noise on zaps in general doesn't make sense -- there's too much redundancy and strange interactions between player spells, monster spells and zaps
22:07:08 <kilobyte> usually you have multiple noises from the some spot, sometimes none
22:07:22 <kilobyte> casting causes noise, zap does that too
22:07:47 <DracoOmega> Well, the digging spell WAS silent until you reverted it in this branch (I am still unclear why?)
22:09:45 <kilobyte> earth stuff is among most noisy, this one was shoehorned into tmut because of stalkers
22:10:21 <kilobyte> should be then named "Silently Dissolve" rather than "Dig" :p
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22:10:39 <elliott> I don't see how the abstracted name "dig" implies being noisy at all, really
22:11:14 <kilobyte> not that it's easy to explain how tons of liquid flowing away from a spot next to you could be unnoticeable
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22:11:45 <DracoOmega> Wasn't dig earth/transmutation long before the revised stalker?
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22:12:47 <kilobyte> no, a single commit changed both
22:14:12 <DracoOmega> Oh, it used to be Enchantment/Earth, by the looks of it?
22:14:17 <DracoOmega> No, that's petrify
22:14:18 <DracoOmega> Sorry
22:14:56 <DracoOmega> Well, the commit that changed the book and petrify doesn't seem to have changed the dig spell
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22:15:17 <Cheibriados> 03kilobyte 07[bad_forms] * 0.12-a0-1584-g361a747: Remove a lying comment. 10(7 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=361a747743af
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22:16:43 <DracoOmega> Okay, dig was already transmute/earth when the stalker book came out (and long before). It's just that it lost the trasmute bit when shatter and LRD did, then had this undone a day or two later
22:16:54 <DracoOmega> (Several months after the stalker changes)
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23:49:20 <bh> kilobyte: who's the admin for the listserv?
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23:53:39 <Grunt> DracoOmega, seeing as you seem to have done some CBL work yourself in the past, here's what I'm tinkering with: http://pastebin.com/B3JTAuhr
23:53:49 <Grunt> (anyone else interested can look at it too, of course!)
23:55:53 <bh> Grunt: "Thus, it's moderately more likely to kill what you want it to kill without also killing you in the process." -- that's no fun!
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23:56:25 <Grunt> bh, it's viewed as completely useless for that tendency right now; I'm trying to make it less useless so that people will actually use it and therefore get it to be fun :b
23:56:34 <bh> sounds great! :)
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23:58:33 <DracoOmega> I'll have a closer look and actually test it later, but does this break monster ball lightning?
23:58:41 <DracoOmega> Like, the ones that aren't conjured, but exist on their own
23:58:47 <Grunt> Er, probably. :|
23:59:05 <Grunt> I need to think of a good workaround for that if people want to keep using it.
23:59:12 <bh> hrmph. How do I make _abyss_monster_creation_message opt in...
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23:59:40 <DracoOmega> Also, it looks like you've made monster CBL disappear once they get out of LoS of their caster?
23:59:57 <Grunt> ...not intentionally?