00:05:13 <Sizzell> Unstable branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.12-a0-1213-g038ce0a (34)
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03:55:00 -!- The topic of ##crawl-dev is: Crawl Development | Logs: http://s-z.org/crawl-dev/ | People with +v have commit access. | Please keep general Crawl-related chit-chat to ##crawl. | Dev wiki: http://crawl.develz.org/wiki | Long stuff to pastebin.ca please | Immortal Warwalrus and Crazy Yiuf forever.
03:55:00 -!- The topic of ##crawl is: CAO is back, in time for tournament play! | Play Crawl online now: type ??cao, ??cdo, ??cszo, or ??webtiles for instructions | http://crawl.develz.org | FooTV: termcast.develz.org | ##crawl-offtopic: You got your gender in my peanut butter! Xom thinks this is hilarious!
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05:00:44 <Gretell> OSX builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.12-a0-1209-gd71bc79
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05:13:21 -!- The topic of ##crawl-dev is: Crawl Development | Logs: http://s-z.org/crawl-dev/ | People with +v have commit access. | Please keep general Crawl-related chit-chat to ##crawl. | Dev wiki: http://crawl.develz.org/wiki | Long stuff to pastebin.ca please | Immortal Warwalrus and Crazy Yiuf forever.
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05:13:21 -!- The topic of ##crawl is: CAO is back, in time for tournament play! | Play Crawl online now: type ??cao, ??cdo, ??cszo, or ??webtiles for instructions | http://crawl.develz.org | FooTV: termcast.develz.org | ##crawl-offtopic: You got your gender in my peanut butter! Xom thinks this is hilarious!
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06:30:36 <evilmike> kilobyte: you mean noting them in the player log? they shouldn't be noted at all... there shouldn't even be an option for it
06:30:51 <evilmike> otherwise we might as well start noting every temp status effect a monster casts on you
06:31:06 <evilmike> (we do so for paralysis, but that one is actually noteworthy)
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08:41:46 <elliott> galehar: re https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=6411: iirc the formula was changed at the last minute (intentionally) but the commit message was not updated, or something
08:42:04 <elliott> probability increasing with distance does sound like something got flipped though
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08:59:19 <|amethyst> the formula used in that commit is (prob of blinking) = 1 - 0.8^(1/(max(1, (dist-1) * (dist + 1))))
08:59:36 <|amethyst> the commit message doesn't mention the max()
08:59:48 <|amethyst> but other than that it seems to match
09:02:55 <|amethyst> so the probability is  d=1 0.2  d=2 0.07  d=3 0.027   d=4 0.015   d=5 0.009   d=6 0.006   d=7 0.005   d=8 0.004
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09:13:03 <|amethyst> galehar:  I posted a comment to 6411.  I think the confusion is in part because the commit message gives the probability of not blinking
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09:15:44 <|amethyst> galehar:  The formula in the commit message seems to match the code, other than writing 1/x/y rather than 1/max(1,x*y)
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10:15:32 <galehar> |amethyst: thanks for the clarification!
10:15:43 <galehar> I did not notice the *not* blinking part
10:18:45 <Gretell> hyperpartyhat (L18 TrSu) ASSERT(shop->type >= 0 && shop->type < NUM_SHOPS) in 'dbg-scan.cc' at line 569 failed. (D:23)
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11:03:12 <mrwooster> my very first attempt at map making... any comments? https://gist.github.com/4155517
11:06:32 <Zaba> mrwooster, I definitely like the minimalism
11:07:38 <mrwooster> dont want to get too complicated for a first attempt
11:07:46 <Zaba> it can be very tempting to overthink and overdesign, and it's very important to not do so
11:07:58 <mrwooster> yep
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11:21:10 <Cheibriados> New entry vault mrwooster_entry_arrow (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=6412) by mrwooster
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12:40:08 <faze> would it be ok to made wands evokable in ice form? spider/dragon form and blade hands would remain unable to zap wands
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12:41:00 <faze> if you literally have "ice fists" that you are unable to unclench, i can see not allowing wand usage
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12:46:05 <mrwooster> wow, exploring in debug mode is a real eye opener as to how the game works
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12:52:40 <Cheibriados> 03dpeg 07* 0.12-a0-1214-gfc9f1bf: Many Singing Sword contributions (jwb on tavern). 10(2 minutes ago, 1 file, 225+ 4-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=fc9f1bf4c48b
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13:33:11 <faze> was ely weapon sacrificing after ** piety to prevent strategical/tactical item destruction?
13:33:33 <faze> disabling it
13:34:19 <elliott> i think it was to prevent it being tedious and horrible
13:34:48 <faze> oh
13:35:04 <faze> it was nice to be able to destroy bows/crossbows and their ammo
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14:08:57 <Cheibriados> duplicate silver runes in vault (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=6413) by Tenaya
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14:27:05 <mrwooster> are there any lua functions that can turn an object into a monster on a trigger?
14:27:13 <mrwooster> i.e. statue coming to life
14:27:44 <elliptic> there is a dis:7 vault that makes statues come to life when you kill dispater
14:27:47 <elliptic> you could look at that
14:28:05 <elliptic> (I don't actually know how it works)
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14:28:20 <faze> does ragdoll_tomb_raider work sort of like that too?
14:28:29 <elliott> elliptic: it doesn't, does it
14:28:37 <elliott> at least it didn't for you :P
14:29:07 <elliptic> elliott: huh?
14:29:22 <elliott> oh
14:29:35 <elliott> I read your line as referring to a different vault, never mind
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14:30:19 <MarvinPA> i wonder what the record is for the bug with the most duplicate reports
14:30:31 <MarvinPA> certainly looks like the silver rune is doing well :P
14:30:58 <elliott> release 0.12 with that bug imo
14:31:12 <faze> i assume the bug has been around since the commit enabling the silver rune to be placed in any vault
14:31:24 <elliott> it was introduced by a commit changing how subvaults work IIRC
14:31:24 <mrwooster> thanks elliott
14:31:25 <ChrisOelmueller> well it's certainly one of the bugs i would assign high priority to, and still nobody even bothered to fix it for *months*
14:31:32 <elliott> it wasn't been months has it
14:31:41 <ChrisOelmueller> crawl month, the
14:31:54 <ChrisOelmueller> it was around during the tournament, wasn't it
14:31:57 <evilmike> mrwooster: look at the Dis:7 vault, that's the best example of doing it
14:32:04 <faze> !lm * type=rune rune=silver s=gid min=start
14:32:05 <Sequell> 17088 milestones for * (type=rune rune=silver s=gid min=start): 4x Nomi:cszo:20120917221706S, 4x jspanek:cszo:20121015230735S, 4x pivotal:cszo:20120902164322S, 4x Bloodbeard:cdo:20121024184854S, 4x Poncheis:cao:20121014071556S, 4x Sabaki:cszo:20121004205303S, 4x rubinko:cszo:20121009112209S, 4x Roarke:cszo:20120919145940S, 4x swinepaste:cszo:20120913053816S, 4x Valarioth:cszo:20120915164800S, 4x W...
14:32:06 <evilmike> although that particular trigger is only for a monster dying
14:32:15 <faze> !lm * type=rune rune=silver s=gid x=min(start)
14:32:24 <mrwooster> ye, think I have found it... dis_mu
14:32:29 <evilmike> ragdoll_tomb_raider doesn't actually work like that, since it just removes walls. The monsters already are placed in the map
14:32:30 <Sequell> 17088 milestones for * (type=rune rune=silver s=gid): sevenseve:cdo:20121026082917S [2012-11-26 08:29:17], KareZ:cszo:20121026052043S [2012-11-26 05:20:43], mcevers:cdo:20121026051220S [2012-11-26 05:12:20], Tolias:cdo:20121026050823S [2012-11-26 05:08:23], 3x Kellhus:cdo:20121026032657S [2012-11-26 03:26:57], 4x zigponcheis:cao:20121026025644S [2012-11-26 02:56:44], fishi:cszo:20121026024001S [20...
14:32:31 <faze> i don't think that one is valid
14:32:43 <faze> that isn't right..
14:32:54 <evilmike> but, you could adapt the code in that vault to spawn monsters instead of removing walls
14:33:21 <evilmike> just one thing to note... it's a good idea to remove a solid feature and then place a monster there (like with statues). If you place a monster on floor, it might be occupied, and nothing will spawn
14:33:51 <mrwooster> ah.. found function monster_on_death(pars)
14:34:44 <mrwooster> so my idea was to have a vault with 1 medium monster, 1 easy monster and a set of statues... each time you kill the easy monster, a statue is replaced by the easy monster... unless you kill the medium monster first
14:35:06 <evilmike> faze: btw, that "silver rune in any vault" commit is in 0.11, so it works fine. I don't know what causes it, but elliott is probably right
14:35:29 <faze> ok
14:36:31 <MarvinPA> the mantis issue has some notes, kilobyte figured out which commit caused it
14:37:25 <MarvinPA> "Until the topmost vault of a subvault stack is actually placed, all subvaults are merely scheduled for registering rather than actually registered, which allows them to be used multiple times."
14:37:57 <MarvinPA> sadly fixing that requires actually understanding how subvaults work, which i certainly do not :(
14:38:35 <faze> i can't trick sequell into giving me the info
14:38:51 <faze> can't have a min and max
14:39:04 <faze> !lm * milestone~~found.*silver max=milestone
14:39:07 <Sequell> 17088. [2011-05-01 21:00:28] ShyGuy the Phalangite (L26 DsBe) found a silver rune of Zot {!p!w!f} on turn 106861. (Vaults:8)
14:39:16 <faze> !lm * milestone~~found.*silver max=milestone x=min(start)
14:39:19 <Sequell> 17088 milestones for * (milestone~~found.*silver max=milestone): min(start)=2007-04-07 02:02:40
14:39:20 <faze> this might work
14:39:29 <elliott> ah, kilobyte bisected it to 24f731f88627020b36748b59dd9a4da7118f5f25
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14:39:32 <elliott> which is the commit i was thinking of
14:39:35 <faze> oh
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14:41:10 <faze> my guess is the vault indicates it placed a silver rune, but for some reason, that gets wiped out before the next vault is placed, so it places a rune and so on
14:41:31 <faze> have people found multiples other than 4?
14:41:36 <faze> 2, 3, and 4
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14:42:06 <faze> i have only found 1 or 4, myself
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15:45:16 <galehar> !seen frogbotherer
15:45:16 <Wenzell> I last saw frogbotherer at Sun Nov 11 23:23:25 2012 UTC (2w 1d 22h 21m 51s ago) quitting with message Remote host closed the connection.
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15:45:30 <Cheibriados> New idea for a minivault with statues coming to life (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=6414) by mrwooster
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15:58:22 <scrubnub> ??animate dead
15:58:22 <Wenzell> animate dead[1/1]: Attempts to raise all corpses in LoS as zombies (if they're fresh enough) or skeletons.
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16:36:32 <Cheibriados> 03galehar 07* 0.12-a0-1215-g4533ca7: Updated sdl-android 10(71 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=4533ca7e7cb4
16:36:32 <Cheibriados> 03Translators 07* 0.12-a0-1216-g9c11846: Transifex format fix. 10(70 minutes ago, 7 files, 26+ 24-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=9c118468cd0f
16:36:32 <Cheibriados> 03Translators 07* 0.12-a0-1217-g7cff8c2: Transifex sync. 10(69 seconds ago, 66 files, 9932+ 419-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=7cff8c2ee426
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16:51:47 <Cheibriados> 03Translators 07* 0.12-a0-1218-g19acae6: Transifex format fix. 10(5 minutes ago, 8 files, 59+ 65-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=19acae6cbd05
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16:56:54 <Cheibriados> 03kilobyte 07* 0.12-a0-1219-ga6f795f: Gray out the Repel Missiles spell if you have the mutation or amulet. 10(2 days ago, 1 file, 7+ 0-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=a6f795f5701b
16:56:54 <Cheibriados> 03kilobyte 07* 0.12-a0-1220-g65ade5f: Don't note temp mutations at all. 10(20 hours ago, 1 file, 4+ 2-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=65ade5f033f7
16:56:54 <Cheibriados> 03kilobyte 07* 0.12-a0-1221-g487f367: Don't make a milestone if for any reason you pick up the same rune again. 10(6 minutes ago, 1 file, 5+ 2-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=487f36710125
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17:25:37 <mrwooster> is there a reason for there being no 'church' shaped temple maps?
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17:30:49 <kilobyte> none, I think.
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17:34:50 <Zannick> what is church-shaped anyway?
17:35:03 <Zannick> there's tso_church, iiirc
17:38:38 <monqy> cathedral of pain
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17:45:39 <mrwooster> well, was thinking classical cathedral layout
17:45:52 <mrwooster> basically a big cross with a load of side chambers
17:46:12 <mrwooster> a cathedral typically has around 8-10 alters so would suit quite well
17:51:47 <kilobyte> and a triple main one
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18:13:11 <Cheibriados> Speech Ideas (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=6415) by BezerkerJerseyTinkerBell
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18:23:18 <Cheibriados> 03kilobyte 07* 0.12-a0-1222-g6ff41c4: Fix an infinite loop with teleportitis in the center of Labyrinths. 10(11 minutes ago, 1 file, 2+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=6ff41c46d996
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18:28:13 <ontoclasm> that commit is unnervingly apropos to what i was just watching
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18:48:19 <kilobyte> is there a reason player draconians don't get slowed when hit by weapons of freezing?
18:48:44 <Cheibriados> 03dolorous 07* 0.12-a0-1223-g67e7a24: Add spacing fixes. 10(6 minutes ago, 1 file, 31+ 32-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=67e7a243684e
18:50:18 <MarvinPA> i was wondering about that a while ago when looking at the player/monster versions of expose_to_element, yeah
18:50:50 <evilmike> there probably isn't a reason besides "no one bothered to make that work"
18:51:47 <evilmike> although this isn't the only huge difference between player and monster dracs (breath attacks are vastly different in several cases)
18:52:20 <ontoclasm> well, the monster version of green drac breath would be a touch overpowered
18:52:32 <ontoclasm> free pclouds whenever you feel like it
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18:53:03 <evilmike> yeah players used to have that
18:53:52 <evilmike> there are other differences too... mottled dracs still have ranged sticky flame, black dracs just breathe normal lightning bolts... those are the only others I can think of
18:54:53 <ontoclasm> do player red dracs spawn fire clouds?
18:55:12 <evilmike> I'm not sure, I haven't gotten a red drac since that was changed
18:55:16 <ontoclasm> i guess i have never had a drac turn red
18:55:58 <HangedMan> player red dracs get fire clouds, yes
18:57:45 <kilobyte> !learn edit cold_blooded[1] s/more vulnerable to cold damage/get slowed by a few sources of cold damage/
18:57:45 <Wenzell> cold blooded[1/2]: A flag which makes creatures get slowed by a few sources of cold damage. Includes snakes, lizards, and similar. Not to be confused with hot-blooded, which is a condition where you don't have to read my mind to know what I have in mind.
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19:02:51 <kilobyte> !learn add cold_blooded Only some effects cause slowing: freezing-branded melee, Freeze, Throw Frost, Bolt of Cold, drac freezing breath (direct hit only), Refrigeration, Metabolic Englaciation (extra).
19:02:51 <Wenzell> cold blooded[3/3]: Only some effects cause slowing: freezing-branded melee, Freeze, Throw Frost, Bolt of Cold, drac freezing breath (direct hit only), Refrigeration, Metabolic Englaciation (extra).
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19:04:02 <evilmike> would rC block the slowing effect for player dracs?
19:04:30 <kilobyte> it does for monsters
19:04:57 <evilmike> ah, alright. Was having trouble thinking of cold blooded monsters with rC (it just came to me that white draconians have it :P )
19:06:09 <kilobyte> !learn edit cold_blooded[3] s/drac/monster drac/
19:06:09 <Wenzell> cold blooded[3/3]: Only some effects cause slowing: freezing-branded melee, Freeze, Throw Frost, Bolt of Cold, monster drac freezing breath (direct hit only), Refrigeration, Metabolic Englaciation (extra).
19:10:21 <kilobyte> monster refrigeration code needs to die, it's a bad case of duplication
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19:11:40 <kilobyte> not to mention no tracer, and thus massive friendly damage
19:13:33 <elliott> but the point of fannar is to help you with orc levels!
19:13:58 <Lightli> And lair levels
19:17:56 <kilobyte> after elliptic's change to rods of venom I looked into picking Grunt's implementation of Olgreb's Toxic Radiance, but it's even worse than refrig
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19:23:39 <DracoOmega> Also monster refridge works through glass
19:24:07 <DracoOmega> They won't cast it against you if you're on the other side of glass, but it will hit OTHER targets that are
19:24:16 <clouded_> I am completely on board with giving fannar the fabled axe
19:24:42 <kilobyte> I'm talking about sanitizing the code, not removing him.
19:24:43 <DracoOmega> What's wrong with the man himself?
19:25:00 <elliott> just double his hp and damage or something
19:25:16 <clouded_> but he is not interesting in theme or combat
19:25:29 <DracoOmega> I think refridge is sort of interesting
19:25:34 <elliott> i like the refridge
19:25:48 <DracoOmega> But a little buff might not hurt, either
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19:27:29 <kilobyte> the only other monster with Refrigeration is cocytus-flavoured Serpent of Hell; in that case it'd be unlikely for a tracer to exceed a friendly fire threshold
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19:28:15 <Cheibriados> Fannar (12e) | Spd: 10 | HD: 10 | HP: 80 | AC/EV: 0/13 | Dam: 8 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, spellcaster | Res: 06magic(80) | Chunks: 07contam | XP: 1261 | Sp: b.cold (3d18), refrigeration, armour, ice beast, blink | Sz: Medium | Int: high.

19:28:15 <elliott> %??fannar
19:28:35 <evilmike> he got a reasonable number of kills during the tournament
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19:28:52 <HangedMan> maybe he just needs depth shrinking?
19:28:55 <elliott> some possible changes would be 80 HP -> 95 or 100, 0 AC -> 2, 8 Dam -> 10 I guess
19:29:01 <elliott> it seems like he's dangerous pre-lair but a joke after that
19:29:17 <evilmike> that could be adjusted yes
19:29:40 <HangedMan> DEPTH:  D:10-16, Orc:2-, Elf, Lair:1-5, Swamp:1, Shoals:1, Snake:1, Spider:1
19:29:41 <elliott> could get rid of some of the spells like ozo's armour so he casts more dangerous stuff too
19:30:01 <evilmike> i think people only say he's weak because he's new (and therefore people pay attention to them). no one remembers the handful of uniques we already have, that are utter pushovers compared to him
19:30:12 <evilmike> he's still way less dangerous than many uniques, of course
19:30:25 <HangedMan> old frances
19:30:35 <clouded_> new frances...
19:30:43 <faze> frances should get sgd
19:30:52 <HangedMan> well yes new frances is kind of weird as a frederick with haste instead of invis
19:30:56 <faze> or summon mid-tier demon
19:31:02 <Cheibriados> Frances (08@) | Spd: 10 | HD: 14 | HP: 121 | AC/EV: 0/10 | Dam: 29 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, spellcaster, see invisible | Res: 06magic(93) | Chunks: 07contam | XP: 2626 | Sp: throw icicle (3d23), demon, haste, iron shot (3d26) | Sz: Medium | Int: normal.

19:31:02 <HangedMan> %??frances
19:31:03 <clouded_> fannar "at least he's better than norbert"
19:31:26 <HangedMan> already has common demon
19:31:34 <faze> well, that spellset is much better than orc high priest frances
19:31:49 <elliptic> I think he's fine as-is but he could also be moved up to D:8-13 etc if we wanted him to be more dangerous
19:31:52 <faze> replace common demon with greater servant demons
19:32:21 <Cheibriados> Harold (09@) | Spd: 10 | HD: 9 | HP: 76 | AC/EV: 0/8 | Dam: 12 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, spellcaster | Res: 06magic(60) | Chunks: 07contam | XP: 1238 | Sp: b.fire (3d17), blink | Sz: Medium | Int: normal.

19:32:21 <faze> %??harold
19:32:25 <clouded_> frances is a good candidate for exotic summons like hydra
19:32:29 <HangedMan> well he's certainly not going to really be any dangerous on lair_branch:1
19:32:39 <HangedMan> neither is harold on that same depth
19:32:39 <faze> hydra would be a good summon too
19:32:49 <clouded_> she can be deeper if we want to give her the really good stuff
19:33:04 <evilmike> summon swarm is also a spell that nothing casts, and it can be potentially scary
19:33:05 <elliott> can fannar really spawn in elf? thematic, sure, but...
19:33:08 <elliptic> no need to change frances again so soon I think
19:33:34 <Cheibriados> Joseph (10@) | Spd: 10 | HD: 7 | HP: 66 | AC/EV: 0/10 | Dam: 9 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors | Res: 06magic(46) | Chunks: 07contam | XP: 610 | Sz: Medium | Int: normal.

19:33:34 <faze> %??joseph
19:33:45 <elliptic> HangedMan: harold can be quite dangerous in lair
19:33:45 <evilmike> joseph is fine
19:33:55 <HangedMan> lair_branch:1 isn't lair
19:33:56 <evilmike> joseph is like an early yaktaur with a sling
19:34:03 <elliott> joseph is terrifying
19:34:10 <faze> that's a fair explanation of joseph
19:34:11 <elliptic> oh that is what you mean by lair_branch:1, yes
19:34:46 <kilobyte> Joseph is just wrong: sling bullets of pure murder, then total lack of danger in close
19:34:53 <MarvinPA> giving some unique or other those summons could be cool, frances actually has some flavour though so i stuck with demonsdemonsdemons
19:35:16 <faze> kilobyte: unless he has disto
19:35:20 <HangedMan> erica is really on lair_branch:1 too really
19:35:25 <clouded_> okay new plan: lernaean hydra gets summons hydra
19:35:34 <elliptic> kilobyte: when he gets a branded qstaff his melee can be decent... I do think that the Dam: 9 could be increased to 15 or so fairly safely
19:35:41 <evilmike> that sounds like my terrible "give xtahua summon dragon" idea
19:35:45 <faze> move maud to d:20-d:27, reflavour her as a tso/ely summoner
19:35:54 <elliott> give xtahua summon xtahua
19:35:54 <kilobyte> elliptic: he got 9, even orc warriors have 20, yeah
19:36:09 <elliptic> can we just remove maud
19:36:14 <faze> haha
19:36:20 <kilobyte> forget it!
19:36:36 <clouded_> evilmike: I approve of that
19:36:37 <faze> i thought maud was a reference to the film "harold and maude"
19:36:44 <kilobyte> (not really; removing Maud would be ok)
19:36:51 <HangedMan> can we make blork not an orc wizard with a weapon and psyche not faster slightly later blork
19:36:51 <evilmike> if you remove maud, you need the commit message to be "Who was that Maud person anyway?"
19:36:57 <evilmike> or you must resign permanently
19:37:06 <elliott> elliptic: duam xnaht
19:37:38 <elliptic> HangedMan: blork doesn't feel at all like an orc wizard
19:37:59 <faze> hasted blork with a glaive is scary
19:37:59 <elliptic> having a battleaxe-like weapon and more HP is a pretty substantial difference
19:38:00 <HangedMan> admittedly said weapon is usually mean yes
19:38:13 <elliptic> psyche is lame though yes
19:38:25 <elliptic> I think psyche and maud might be my two least favorite uniques currently
19:38:35 <elliott> where will everyone get their disto from if not psyche
19:38:40 <elliptic> sonja
19:38:46 <evilmike> Psyche has good speech though
19:38:47 <clouded_> everyone should play 4.1.2a some. that is how uniques should be
19:38:51 <elliott> elliptic: shhh
19:38:58 <faze> psyche does have good speech
19:39:04 <elliott> i'm not good enough at 4.1 to get to uniques
19:39:24 <HangedMan> doesn't that end up with somebody teleporting away and then sending summons to where they last knew you were
19:39:41 <HangedMan> alongside maud being a ridiculous damaging lich-like caster or something
19:39:53 <faze> are monsters omniscient in 4.1.2a?
19:40:10 <clouded_> I doubt that is true
19:40:25 <elliott> I hear 4.1 boris does things like teleport away and then spam summons at your previous location
19:40:36 <HangedMan> was wondering who it was
19:40:50 <elliott> haha I typed that before reading your line
19:41:03 <evilmike> there should be monsters that actually use invisiblity like players do... if they hear you coming, they cast it before seeking you
19:41:15 <elliott> monsters use invisibility well in 4.1
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19:41:17 <faze> i bet crawl would be nearly impossible if monsters always chose the optimal action
19:41:42 <elliott> i once saw monqy corner blork (iirc?) in 4.1, who then went invis and escaped completely
19:41:42 <faze> where optimal = killing you
19:41:42 <HangedMan> well 4.1.2a is already torture from speed 15 hydras and beyond
19:41:42 <evilmike> monsters definitely shouldn't do that, since you need to design the whole game around smart ai if you use it
19:41:51 <clouded_> 4.1 honestly has a lot of really fun stuff, that version has such charm
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19:42:28 <evilmike> i want someone to compile a list of gameplay differences in that version
19:42:34 <evilmike> i've never been able to even reach lair in it
19:42:39 <elliott> something about shields
19:42:52 <faze> couldn't you just change some code and never die?
19:42:55 <clouded_> I could try do that, I was actually thinking about it today
19:43:38 <HangedMan> oh, francis is the one with the crystal spear lich set
19:43:42 <evilmike> the only stuff i know about 4.1 comes from the early dungeon, stuff people have told me, and stuff i've learned from browsing through the parts of the code
19:43:51 <faze> does 4.1 have wizmode?
19:43:58 <HangedMan> frances in 4.1.2a still has orc high priest set
19:44:10 <Lightli> 15 speed hydra good god no
19:44:10 <monqy> 4.1 has wizmode but you have to compile for it
19:44:14 <faze> ah
19:44:18 <HangedMan> wayne/wiglaf is a deep elf high priest with hp, mmmmm
19:44:22 <elliott> (it's also useless as an actual wizmode)
19:44:37 <Cheibriados> 03kilobyte 07* 0.12-a0-1224-g4d04549: Slightly buff Joseph's melee damage. 10(6 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=4d045497e6ce
19:45:18 <faze> a humanoid hell sentinel with less HD/AC would be a good late D unique
19:45:38 <faze> or just give frederick hellfire
19:45:55 <HangedMan> lrd unique
19:46:53 <monqy> unique with perm ench disjunction
19:48:02 <HangedMan> arcane marksman unique with portal projectile and cause fear
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19:49:29 <Lightli> God no
19:49:47 <Lightli> Frederick already has an iron shot as strong as Cerebovs
19:49:50 <Lightli> The last thing we need is for him to get BUFFED
19:50:52 <HangedMan> can somebody please please please not make wizmode stealth mode not stealth 27.1 when the game crashes on loading a save with more then 27 skill
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19:58:37 <faze> how about fixing the save loading so it doesn't crash when stealth is >27
19:58:57 <HangedMan> either thing works
19:59:03 <faze> i am looking into it
19:59:10 <elliott> faze: it doesn't crash
19:59:13 <elliott> it (correctly) asserts
19:59:17 <elliott> (because no skills are meant to be >27)
19:59:23 <faze> ah, there's an assertion error
19:59:23 <HangedMan> well crash assert same difference
19:59:35 <faze> well, looking for an assert is easier
19:59:56 <HangedMan> would just need a wizmode check on said assert I guess
19:59:56 <|amethyst> just do the assert only if you.wizard is false
19:59:59 <|amethyst> what HangedMan said
20:00:25 <faze> ah, i was wondering if player had an instance variable for wizmode being on or off
20:00:25 <|amethyst> oh
20:00:36 <|amethyst> ASSERT(you.skills[j] <= 27 || you.wizard);
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20:03:01 <HangedMan> ...huh, must of been fixed a while ago
20:03:23 <Lightli> What about the bug wherein it crashes if you so much as gain ANY exp with stealth > 27
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20:18:22 <monqy> what about the bug whereby wizard stealth is implemented as stealth skill > 27
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20:42:55 <evilmike> more of a hack than a bug. it works though, especially compared to some other things you can do in wizmode
20:44:40 <evilmike> it certainly doesn't crash when gaining "ANY exp"
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