00:00:47 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.11-a0-151-g706c437 (32) 00:07:51 Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.11-a0-151-g706c437 01:30:51 -!- evilmike has quit [Quit: something happened] 01:52:36 -!- Ganrao| has joined ##crawl-dev 01:54:05 -!- Vandal has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 01:54:11 -!- HangedMan has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:01:01 -!- dtsund has quit [*.net *.split] 02:03:11 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 02:11:50 -!- ainsophyao has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 02:11:50 -!- ainsophyao has joined ##crawl-dev 02:29:43 -!- rax has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:29:48 -!- rax has joined ##crawl-dev 02:32:01 -!- ainsophyao has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:57:17 -!- casmith789 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:57:45 -!- casmith789 has joined ##crawl-dev 02:59:39 -!- Ragdoll has joined ##crawl-dev 03:14:30 -!- Pacra has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:19:24 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 03:41:56 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:45:12 -!- syllogism has joined ##crawl-dev 03:56:18 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 04:23:16 -!- monqy has quit [Quit: hello] 04:29:02 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 04:32:50 -!- alefury has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:33:15 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 04:46:50 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:00:06 OSX builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.11-a0-151-g706c437 05:12:58 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 05:17:11 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 05:55:39 -!- jle_ is now known as jle 06:03:43 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 06:05:23 -!- elliptic has quit [Quit: Leaving] 06:40:10 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:58:06 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 07:05:19 -!- MarvinPA_ has joined ##crawl-dev 07:05:22 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 07:08:31 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:08:31 -!- MarvinPA_ is now known as MarvinPA 07:18:50 -!- santiago has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:20:00 -!- stabwound has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 07:55:29 threads.h does not compile on OpenBSD, FreeBSD? (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=5305) by JoachimSchipper 08:19:02 -!- petete has joined ##crawl-dev 08:51:00 -!- Wensley has joined ##crawl-dev 08:52:37 -!- ainsophyao has joined ##crawl-dev 08:56:56 -!- jeanjacques has joined ##crawl-dev 09:01:50 -!- stabwound has joined ##crawl-dev 09:22:22 -!- alefury has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 09:22:24 -!- elliptic has quit [Quit: Leaving] 09:27:08 -!- MarvinPA_ has joined ##crawl-dev 09:28:36 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 09:29:30 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:29:30 -!- MarvinPA_ is now known as MarvinPA 09:34:49 -!- blabber has joined ##crawl-dev 09:37:27 TSO penance from a hog just turned back to human (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=5306) by nagdon 09:57:24 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:57:48 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 10:02:36 Global Notice] Hi everyone. In a few moments, services (nickserv, chanserv, etc) will be restarted as part of some planned maintenance. We expect the downtime to be very short. Please opt-in to wallops for more info as this progresses (/umode +w, /mode yournick +w). Thanks! 10:04:14 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 10:28:37 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 10:33:23 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 10:44:51 -!- MakMorn has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 10:49:31 Error calling monster-trunk: 10:49:31 %??staircase mimic 11:01:55 -!- MakMorn has joined ##crawl-dev 11:10:30 -!- MakMorn has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:24:15 -!- MakMorn has joined ##crawl-dev 11:35:02 -!- evilmike has joined ##crawl-dev 11:46:48 !seen greatzebu 11:46:48 I last saw greatzebu at Fri Feb 10 23:54:23 2012 UTC (17h 52m 25s ago) quitting with message Quit: greatzebu. 11:51:24 -!- Wensley is now known as FR 11:51:51 -!- FR is now known as Wensley 12:06:19 -!- Wensley has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 12:07:28 -!- ais523 has joined ##crawl-dev 12:27:20 -!- Textmode has joined ##crawl-dev 12:30:24 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 12:34:08 -!- st_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:34:39 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 12:35:40 -!- monqy has joined ##crawl-dev 12:51:58 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:52:43 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 12:55:04 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 12:59:36 -!- elliptic has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87 [Firefox 3.6.26/20120128224517]] 13:01:09 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 13:04:56 elliptic: the tournament is still not announced 13:05:09 and it's less than two weeks till it starts 13:06:12 kilobyte: I was hoping for 0.9.2 mac builds, but I can just go ahead and announce it 13:06:59 can add them later... 13:07:27 (if ever, but well, I'm not going to buy a Mac myself...) 13:15:24 okay, the announcement post on CDO is public now 13:16:54 it should also be announced elsewhere I guess? somewhere on tavern? CAO? 13:23:53 -!- Wensley has joined ##crawl-dev 13:25:36 -!- ainsophyao has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:33:53 evilmike will probably announce it on SA 13:34:05 -!- ainsophyao has joined ##crawl-dev 13:34:43 yeah I can do that 13:34:58 I was going to wait until there's somethign on the cdo wordpress 13:36:29 also, is there an eta on 0.10 webtiles? I think if it isn't ready by the 25th, the tournament should be postponed 13:36:54 I dont even use webtiles, I just remember last tournament there were a number of people who didn't play at the start because webtiles was still on 0.8 13:37:55 evilmike: I announced it on wordpress 13:38:27 and also put a brief post on tavern 13:38:36 cool 13:39:14 about webtiles, I don't know what the status is of 0.10 webtiles, but people didn't seem worried about it at all when I originally suggested these dates... anyone know what is happening there? 13:39:28 I agree that we don't want what happened with last tournament and webtiles 13:42:13 I don't remember napkin saying anything about there being a problem 13:46:40 I seem to remember there were some tiles-specific bugs that sounded a bit serious, I guess? 13:46:58 with getting the wrong images for stuff? 13:47:06 That's a pretty old bug iirc 13:47:26 the one 0.10-specific tiles bug I can think of is that question marks aren't displaying properly on the item panel 13:47:55 which ought to be fixed if anyone knows how to do it, but this isn't a major bug 13:48:10 oh, I think I was thinking of that 13:54:04 -!- ainsophyao has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:10:38 made a post on SA, also linked to it on reddit 14:11:34 cool, thanks 14:17:47 all the banner images are broken 14:18:31 because I am still making them! :P 14:18:37 there are like 14:18:40 500 banners to make 14:19:10 (54 banners, actually :P) 14:21:36 only adjacent abominations follow by stairs (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=5307) by ortoslon 14:22:11 it'd be nice if you could upload whatever template you're using for them (xcf/psd/whatever) 14:23:14 that's the plan, and the banners will finally be nice enough this year (vector images!) that I won't feel the need to reinvent them for all subsequent tournaments 14:26:23 sounds great 14:26:54 last year, banners mixing three different designs looked like crap 14:27:54 yeah :\ 14:28:50 oh, and I should document release practices/how to upload to SF/how to make and test Windows binaries, to reduce my own bus factor too :p 14:30:53 provided that template i might assist in creating some banners 14:31:00 do we have an actual deadline for 0.10? Some date before the 25th would be good 14:33:32 I wanted Feb 10th, but there still are some ugly bugs 14:33:47 elliptic suggested Feb 15th, let's call it a hard deadline 14:33:58 I'm just thinking, if not everything is ready on time for the tournament, we should be able to announce a postponement a few days ahead of time. Avoids repeating what happened in august 14:34:13 so I'm thinking of webtiles as well as the proper release of 0.10 14:34:15 no bugs are vital, though 14:34:23 chrisoelmueller: I'm not on a computer with inkscape right now so I won't be able to get you the template until monday, but what would really help would be to figure out some nice two-color color schemes for each god 14:34:42 you can see my banners for the last tournament as a starting point 14:34:48 I wasn't really satisfied with all of the ones I chose 14:35:05 and for a lot of the gods I just used the 0.7 banners so I never devised a color scheme for them at all 14:36:11 there's some unreproducible bug on Mac that made felids get negative xp total if you get xp between dying and reviving 14:36:32 mac players must play webtiles, then 14:36:35 Wensley: going similar to god's altar colours would be the most natural thing 14:36:42 I suspect it's something about a variable being unsigned somewhere, but the stress is on _unreproducible_ 14:37:01 Wensley: these? http://seleniac.org/crawl/tourney/images/old_images/ 14:37:02 (ie, all I have is a save after this bug happened) 14:37:13 st_: that was my starting point, but there are only about 10 colors used for god altars, and coming up with two-colors for each of the 18 gods that are distinct and thematic is tricky 14:37:45 that question mark thingy on the other hand is cosmetic but occurs a lot 14:38:28 Wensley: well, you have 2^24 colours to use :p 14:39:02 chrisoelmueller: the ones that look like this were the 0.9 ones: http://seleniac.org/crawl/tourney/images/old_images/banner_zin.png 14:39:10 having similar colors for two gods should be okay if they are far apart alphabetically 14:39:21 or at least not as bad 14:39:24 yeah i've seen the 0.9 tournament banners, alright :) 14:40:55 the ones this year will be a bit fancier 14:41:16 I am doing a silly thing where the banners will tile vertically to produce an unbroken ribbon 14:41:24 ooh 14:42:10 still have to nail down how I'm going to differentiate levels 1/2/3 for each banner 14:42:15 elliptic: are they just called levels? tiers? 14:42:49 they can be called whatever you want :P I forget what the rules call them but that isn't really important (and could be changed) 14:42:56 plain/ornate/legendary 14:47:30 I understood them to be bronze/silver/gold, but this idea sounds so much better 14:49:25 yes, bronze/silver/gold doesn't work well when trying to use colors to distinguish between gods 14:57:31 03kilobyte * r20092bb18f2d 10/crawl-ref/source/map_knowledge.h: Fix a memory leak. 15:00:33 evilmike: the question marks are pretty major 15:00:47 caused about 3 misclicks for me in this game alone 15:01:08 hrm, I wonder who could be suckered into looking into it then :( 15:01:15 (I know little about tiles) 15:02:05 finding when this started happening would help track it down. This bug doesn't happen in 0.9 as far as I can tell 15:02:34 03kilobyte * r6b1ec8b3d75b 10/crawl-ref/source/threads.h: Drop LinuxThreads support, unbreak BSD. 15:02:41 do you know how to reproduce it reliably? 15:03:06 yeah 15:03:10 it sounds like the question marks are messed up nearly all the time? 15:03:16 create a stack of remove curse in wizard mode, then click the stack 15:03:28 no question marks, even though the scrolls are {tried} 15:04:01 it didnt happen before christmas i think 15:04:04 wizmode pre-identified things you create via &o 15:04:12 apparently you also sometimes get question marks on the wrong scrolls 15:04:13 I'm using &% 15:04:25 also, on potions 15:04:32 when you tried a scroll 15:06:08 its really quite noticeable, so the mantis reports should provide a good estimate for when it started 15:06:54 2012-01-21 00:03 15:07:18 the build i played near the end of december didnt have the bug 15:07:18 which BR is that? 15:07:25 5247 15:07:39 also 5250 15:08:02 44fcce8 looks suspicious 15:08:10 "Fix #5201 (the ?-mark for multiple items in tiles had gone missing)." 15:09:14 maybe not though, I'm just glancing at commits from around that time 15:12:23 44fcce8^ is ok 15:12:52 -!- ZChris13 has joined ##crawl-dev 15:12:53 44fcce8 itself too 15:13:23 hgrmhblah, hate hate hate "git bisect" wanting to run only from the top dir 15:14:05 i usually spawn another shell that only runs git bisect g/b and others to actually check stuff 15:16:01 chrisoelmueller: http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.comp.version-control.git/185850/focus=185865 has a patch 15:16:23 not accepted by git folks, there are some kinks I did not have the time to analyze yet 15:17:12 Works For Me(tm), except the patch is overwritten every time git is updated in Debian (I use unstable on both my devel boxes) 15:20:25 thanks, bookmarked 15:20:47 maybe c04e6d2? 15:21:00 will try that on my working machine at least, where i actually need to rebuild several packages anyways :) 15:38:20 -!- Ragdoll has quit [Quit: Ragdoll] 15:40:08 c04e6d23963aeac83469c2fd807f15016e76bba6 is the cause 16:08:37 03kilobyte * rf0ea86e9fcef 10/crawl-ref/source/ (enum.h itemname.cc items.cc player-equip.cc tags.cc): Fix the "tried" mark in tiles. 16:08:38 well, I've managed to fit 27 rooms into a 70x80 map for sprintzig, 27th is 19x18 which should be enough 16:09:14 neat 16:09:43 got the teleporters working too, so now I think I just need monster lists to get it vaguely playable 16:09:52 pan lord level of course, right? :p 16:10:08 and 26th being holy 16:10:09 of course 16:10:30 the rooms will be random, like proper zig 16:10:34 03kilobyte * r572575fb6891 10/crawl-ref/source/items.cc: Remove a debugging statement (and unbreak non-debug builds). 16:10:38 do you have a title yet? 16:10:50 since it uses teleporters, I suggest "golubria's gauntlet" 16:11:16 I guess 0.10 needs a name also? 16:12:42 "You must be at least this tall to Crawl." 16:13:05 crawl uses names for releases? :P 16:13:05 elliptic: the tradition is to come up with something 20 seconds before tagging, then use something completely different for the release post 16:13:10 elliptic: improvements welcome :p 16:13:39 kilobyte: oh, we need to come up with two names, we definitely need to start brainstorming now then :P 16:13:44 :p 16:13:50 Webtiles of the Octopus King 16:14:21 harr 16:14:25 oh yeah another thing for 0.10: the survey. Is that ready? 16:15:02 no 16:15:30 who is in charge of it? 16:16:20 wasn't dpeg? 16:16:42 tag names: 0.6: Heizölrückstoßabdämpfung, 0.7: "Pacific Pachyderm", 0.8: Rage Cat Is Raging, 0.9: "The XP pool is closed." 16:17:11 hahah, i didn't even know about those last two 16:17:59 what major things have happened in .10 anyways 16:18:02 then i suggest ohjelmistonkehittämiskokemuksia 16:18:28 which beats this heizwhatever by far 16:18:34 -!- ZChris13 has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88 [Firefox 10.0/20120129021758]] 16:19:11 release post names: 0.9 "Victory Valedictory", 0.8 â€œFrantic Frenzied Felinesâ€, 0.7 â€œPacific Pachydermâ€ (matches the tag -- an error!), 0.6: matches tag again 16:19:36 0.10 has octopodes, constrictions, and the abyss 16:19:41 it seems more tentacly than other versions 16:19:42 skill smoothing 16:19:43 should have 'em match, imo :P 16:20:01 Eronarn: that would suggest some forethought 16:22:39 Heavily Armed and Highly Dangerous 16:23:14 -!- blabber has quit [Quit: gn8] 16:23:16 "Hentai Seafood"? 16:23:38 chrisoelmueller: the cool thing about the heizwhatever is that it doesn't have any duplicated letters and being an understandable german word. 16:23:42 perhaps Huggy too 16:23:59 bhaak: is it an actual word? 16:24:06 it is 16:24:42 but not one that has an actual use. but it's completely grammatical and it even makes sense. 16:25:04 Google Translate doesn't know it 16:25:08 for non-plumbers. i don't know if it makes sense if you have technical knowledge :) 16:25:42 http://en.bab.la/dictionary/german-english/heizoelrueckstossabdaempfung 16:25:44 kilobyte: google translate isn't that good with composite nouns. 16:26:18 using "hentai seafood" in the release post would give at least one person the (very) wrong idea, especially if they just found out about crawl 16:26:26 "Heavily armed and highly dangerous" is amusing enough though 16:26:28 especially ad-hoc ones that aren't in real use besides linguistical sports :) 16:26:51 bhaak: or even basic declination. Trying to read Russian text via Google Translate is a pain. 16:27:46 kilobyte: when i have to read russian, google translate works reasonable well. better than with japanese 16:28:23 I wonder if there's something that could 1. have ties with actual changes, 2. be funny 16:28:48 other ones: Eight-Armed Bandit, In Which We Add Crushing Defeat to Crawl, Chapter 10: Harbingers of the Mollusc Lord 16:29:32 Eronarn: <3 16:30:07 "Ascent of the Mountain Dwarves" 16:30:21 Bal-Sagoth song names FTW 16:30:29 i'm afraid of mentioning mountain dwarves 16:30:32 <3 bal-sagoth 16:30:38 official policy should be that they never existed 16:31:16 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 16:31:16 mountain dwarves caught the same race-eliminating plague that devastated hill dwarves back in 0.3 16:31:19 like Squats on WH40k forums, right? 16:31:34 md will be back.... one day............... 16:32:05 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 16:33:19 evilmike: your recent vault changes -- are they bugfixes or regular tweaks? 16:33:43 what about a play on "Save The Pacific Northwest Tree Octopus" 16:34:04 kilobyte: the one to the abyss vault is somewhat of a bug fix. According to hangedman, the changes to abyss morphing made the changes necessary 16:34:15 kilobyte: the swamp one is just a regular tweak 16:51:03 I've hit a bit of a snag, I need 2x as many glyphs as I can use :( 16:51:38 can you use subvaults? 16:52:54 yeah I was going to subvault every room, but I'm thinking probably 3 at a time instead 16:53:20 I need two glyphs for every teleporter unless there's a better way to do it is the problem 16:53:44 ah 16:54:20 not sure if it's possible to teleport from one subvault to another or not, that would make it a lot easier 16:55:04 me neither, you should try and see if works 16:55:35 st_: can you make a teleporter that works one way from one direction and one way from another, and just use math to figure out where to place? 16:55:36 another thing you should take into account, if it's zig like, is the max amount of monsters you can have on a level 16:55:39 this is 700, btw 16:55:50 like +10 y unless y > whatever, then (reset y, +whatever x) 16:56:46 03elliptic 07stone_soup-0.10 * r79d0e93b8374 10/crawl-ref/source/melee_attack.cc: Fix UCC nerfing frenzy to oblivion (rwbarton). 16:56:47 03mtvepsal 07stone_soup-0.10 * ra5d115734b3a 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/portals/wizlab.des: Zonguldrok wizlab door also accepts decomposed zombies. 16:56:47 03kilobyte 07stone_soup-0.10 * rf1fe179d55ac 10/crawl-ref/source/threads.h: Drop LinuxThreads support, unbreak BSD. 16:56:47 03kilobyte 07stone_soup-0.10 * rc2c59cc7188a 10/crawl-ref/source/map_knowledge.h: Fix a memory leak. 16:56:47 03kilobyte 07stone_soup-0.10 * r99d0a225ecee 10/crawl-ref/source/ (enum.h itemname.cc items.cc player-equip.cc tags.cc): Fix the "tried" mark in tiles. 16:56:58 03elliptic 07stone_soup-0.10 * rb738b63f8ff5 10/crawl-ref/source/melee_attack.cc: Fix comment. 16:57:01 03evilmike 07stone_soup-0.10 * r6fcbd9daecc8 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/branches/abyss.des: Tweak hangedman_abyss_rune_flesh_and_stone. 16:57:04 or, oh, i guess you can't go back anyways 16:57:06 duh 16:57:18 that should make it even easier so 16:57:36 its definitely possible to work around, yeah 17:01:04 one suggestion for a title was malnourished mountain dwarves 17:01:12 referring to food reform and md removal 17:02:39 there wasn't food reform 17:02:55 just a couple tweaks 17:03:02 there was in the mountainhomes, and it was so bad that all the dwarves died 17:03:20 "reform" was reformed to mean something completely different 17:03:30 the changes were quickly reverted, but, alas, 'twas too late 17:03:48 and then there was food reform and abyss reform and balance reform and everything reform 17:04:03 oh right, newabyss 17:04:09 Crash when monsters drown from petrifying clouds (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=5308) by MarvinPA 17:04:09 newabyss is cool 17:04:16 uh oh 17:04:23 that sounds like my fault 17:04:26 reform is the word ##crawl uses to mean "slight change" 17:04:28 or at least my responsibility 17:04:30 also see the related word "overhaul" 17:04:35 mountain dwarf reform 17:04:45 i didn't look into that bug or anything, just making sure it's on mantis 17:04:56 since someone was mentioning it on ##crawl but being too lazy and rubbish to report it 17:05:08 the holdwarfmor 17:05:14 please, whoever writes up the release blog post, make sure that the only mention of md is "mountain dwarf reform" 17:05:44 Wensley: why? that seems unfeasibly evil 17:05:48 ??why 17:05:50 why[1/2]: Because Crawl hates you, that's why. 17:05:50 what are mountain dwarves? I've never heard of them 17:06:07 Crawl has always had no mountain dwarves. 17:06:19 Just like we've always been at war with Oceania. 17:06:33 I think a mountain dwarf is sort of like a minotaur, except it can wear a helmet 17:06:43 i can honestly say i dont miss them 17:06:45 haha 17:06:55 i liked them, but i dont miss them 17:07:04 elliptic: actually, I hear that mountain dwarves were sort of like hill orcs, but they couldn't worship beogh 17:07:22 I just dont want any chance of rekindling that stupid drama 17:07:57 evilmike: yeah, I don't think we want to flaunt MD removal so prominently (of course it will be in the list of changes) 17:08:33 we could merely allude to "race reform" 17:08:53 "mountain dwarves" were renamed to "octopodes" 17:09:04 sort of like tengu 17:09:13 oh yeah speaking of the changelog. Does anyone see anything missing from it? 17:09:20 ??changelog 17:09:21 changelog[1/3]: http://gitorious.org/crawl/crawl/blobs/master/crawl-ref/docs/changelog.txt - probably incomplete and/or out of date, see changelog[3] for an exhaustive list of changes. 17:09:24 I can't think of anything major that's missing 17:09:52 i added a few missing god things the other day, didn't notice anything else at a glance 17:10:29 reworked abyss transformations sounds weird 17:11:00 the manual is likely to be woefully outdated 17:11:12 evilmike: could mention that there are many new monster quotes and descriptions 17:11:15 also, is the twisting cavern layout ever used? 17:11:21 alefury: yeah 17:11:31 Wensley: I thought those still weren't added yet? 17:11:33 are custom shops relevant at all? 17:11:39 to someone reading the changelog? 17:11:44 nope 17:11:52 evilmike: the first half of the text improvement has been in for a while, the latter half just got stuck in dpeg's mailbox 17:11:54 well, that someone might be a vault maker 17:12:06 ah 17:12:14 so there are only hundreds of new monster quotes and descriptions 17:12:20 as opposed to double that 17:13:01 what would that go under? Interface, I guess? 17:13:38 alefury: somehow, I haven't seen the twisting cavern in ages 17:13:47 i have never seen it 17:13:53 I got it it one or two games ago. It's just uncommon 17:13:55 but i dont play that much, so... 17:14:33 md removal should probably be near the top of the species changes. like right after octopodes. 17:14:37 evilmike: oh, you did? I got an impression that it used to be common but stopped, possibly due to vetoing or something of this kind. 17:14:52 it looks like youre trying to hide it or something :P 17:14:57 kilobyte: there could be some weird veto thing, but I do remember getting it pretty recently 17:15:40 order in general is a little weird 17:15:58 it looks like stuff just got appended, which is probably what happened 17:16:28 the rP change in particular should probably be a little more prominent 17:16:32 just got a cavern layout to generate in wizard mode on d:15 17:16:41 so it's definitely still possible, just rare 17:17:37 I'll update the changelog 17:18:19 glass change should be further up too 17:18:22 Wensley: is it just new monster descriptions, or are there new item descs as well? 17:18:37 evilmike: just monsters for the moment 17:18:50 actually, would anyone mind applying this other half of the monster descriptions patch for 0.10 17:19:14 I think it's too late for that 17:19:24 that's fine 17:19:26 I just feel bad 17:19:42 even small text related things can have weird problems... for example, back when butterflies made people think they were being mesmerized 17:19:49 chemical compound reform 17:19:50 haha 17:20:03 monk change should be further up too 17:20:25 probably swap with artificers 17:20:51 alefury: I'm not really sure how much the order matters for this stuff 17:21:07 not like anyone will read it anyway 17:21:31 not much for sure, but having important/interesting stuff between lots of less prominent changes is weird 17:22:18 most people reading the changelog will probably read all of it 17:22:39 anyway, iirc dpeg was still working on that survey, so someone should probably write him an email or something? 17:23:30 oh, action_counts is missing 17:23:41 the changelog only has spell_usage 17:23:49 interface section 17:24:56 alright cool, can teleport between subvaults and I only need two glyphs for all of them 17:24:57 also, can that please be enabled by default for 0.11? 17:25:29 it's a good idea 17:25:41 is explore horizon enabled by default in 0.10? 17:25:48 -!- HangedMan has joined ##crawl-dev 17:26:12 I dont think so 17:26:20 that'd be a nice hail-mary interface improvement then :) 17:26:22 gnoll shamans and sergeants being actual monsters is irrelevant to just about everyone 17:26:35 whats explore horizon? 17:26:38 chrisoelmueller: enabled, sort of... as in, shown as space 17:26:52 heh 17:27:36 I don't like explore horizon personally, and I haven't heard many people being excited about it... possibly they just aren't aware of it though 17:28:08 i'd assume it helps those more that are not aware of it than those that are annoyed 17:28:38 after all it's nothing irreversible 17:28:41 should still mention the feature in the changelog 17:29:05 so, the new options to mention are: explore_horizon and action_counts? 17:29:08 whats explore horizon? 17:29:09 disabling stuff is easier than enabling because you know what you look for, more or less 17:29:40 actually never mind, explore_horizon isn't an option, it's something else 17:29:48 I have no idea how to explain it in one line 17:29:48 is that the corner preference option? 17:29:56 alefury: it lets you highlight the edge of areas you've explored on the X map 17:30:00 edges* 17:30:13 its a console thingy? 17:30:16 mainly it just looks pretty and i don't actually use it much 17:30:24 handy for finding unexplored spots in lair or whatever though 17:30:42 i think so 17:30:47 nevermind then ^^ 17:31:46 are the webtiles changes in the changelog actually happening? 17:32:05 for example watching from ssh? 17:33:40 I think so 17:33:45 stuff that only matters to vault makers (such as gnoll actual monsters and custom shops) could be moved to the technical section 17:33:56 ? 17:34:01 oh, oh 17:34:04 alefury: that's what I'm doing yeah 17:34:15 gnoll actual monsters appear in packs in d, at least! 17:34:35 a gnoll shaman random spawn isn't completely ignorable 17:34:46 they spawn randomly? 17:34:49 are you sure about that? 17:34:57 yeah they can lead gnoll packs 17:35:14 i had a D:1 gnoll pack in my current game 17:35:22 alefury: wait that shouldn't happen 17:35:28 I think it can happen over time? 17:35:29 or maybe in a recen tone where i died early 17:35:30 that's a bad regression, are you sure? 17:35:35 probably as part of ood shenanigans 17:35:43 no, it shouldn't happen then either 17:35:44 im not 100% sure 17:35:52 but pretty sure 17:36:00 it may have been D:2, but not D:3 17:36:02 I can't recall seeing any d:1 gnoll packs recently 17:36:06 I killed D:1 gnoll packs a version or two ago 17:36:12 D:2 is fine 17:36:16 big difference there 17:36:23 I'd remove gnoll actual monsters from the changelog at all 17:36:34 yeah, like 2 xl difference 17:36:43 im pretty sure it was D:1, but not 100% 17:36:45 kilobyte: yeah, I'm not sure it is very noticeable to players... 17:36:55 so if youre saying it should be impossible im probably wrong 17:36:56 alright I'll just remove that line 17:37:05 explore_horizon should probably be a commented out line in init.txt 17:37:31 is explore_horizon the actual option? It's not in options_guide.txt 17:37:37 just not sure what glyph to propose. I use â—Œ but that's not in baseline fonts. 17:37:56 feature = explore horizon {â—Œ,,green} 17:38:10 I use a green ' (or maybe it's a `, I can't tell) 17:38:15 alefury: no, I'm worried that the addition of gnoll packs led by non-basic gnolls messed things up 17:38:17 I've seen some people use white, that also looks good 17:38:37 maybe ask in ##crawl 17:39:00 if its possible, surely people have noticed 17:39:30 oh, is that what that is 17:39:33 i thought it was a bug 17:40:11 it looks from the code like it should still be impossible to have a D:1 gnoll pack though 17:40:12 oh, although speaking of map bugs 17:40:21 there is still that bug where out-of-los traps get mapped, i think? 17:40:25 yes 17:40:36 probably i was just seeing things then, or maybe a stair spawn? 17:40:37 i had an ogre with gsc:crush on d:2, does that count 17:41:16 shouldnt gsc:crush be acquirement only? 17:41:32 MarvinPA: I *think* it only happens on the X screen, but I dont think anyone knows what causes it 17:41:37 it's been unfixed for quite a while 17:41:46 also, it was not at full health though i'd just entered the level 17:42:24 why can gscs not generate with brands 17:42:36 are we afraid that maces will be too viable 17:43:53 more a matter of being a bit nicer to the player in the case of gscs, surely? :P 17:44:07 maces and flails are pretty good now 17:44:30 an ettin dual-wielding gscs of flaming and freezing would probably be pretty nasty 17:44:37 alefury: just to check, are you sure it was a gnoll _pack_ ? 17:44:46 that sounds like a nice vault idea :) 17:44:50 singleton gnolls should be able to generate on D:1 17:44:59 it may have been a single one 17:45:03 like i said, im not 100% sur 17:45:04 okay 17:45:12 i wouldnt worry about it too much really 17:45:16 if it should be impossible it probably is 17:45:31 MarvinPA: late oka vault with four ettins each dualwielding a weapon type 17:46:09 not enough monster variety 17:46:19 use two-headed ogres and deep elf blademasters, too 17:46:39 octopus blademaster 17:46:45 heh 17:47:52 octopus unique named musashi wielding eight katanas 17:50:33 iirc musashi was wielding one katana 17:53:21 1learn add dual_wield Japanese business, armed with the knowledge of the five stances a two-sworded man can assume to defend flawlessly against ten thousand one-sword men, grew into a clashing metallic sea of men with two swords. People started, quickly, to lose hands, and eventually entire arms. 17:53:55 I'm going to read through the manual now and see if there's anything missing from it. What is the proper way of updating it? 17:54:05