00:00:50 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.10-a0-2504-gc286621 (32) 00:06:14 -!- timecircuits has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 00:08:14 Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.10-a0-2504-gc286621 00:08:53 elliptic: wrt the servitor thing: i just plain forgot about holy being weird like that 00:09:21 they should be as resistant to holy effects as holy creatures 00:09:37 despite being undead 00:10:16 elliptic: well, that is their gimmick - they are *so* unholy/perverse that holy magic wilts against them 00:11:03 a TSOite should still be able to kill them, but should find them much much harder than other undead/demons (which are a cakewalk) 00:11:36 and if a yredite wants to go to war with holy monsters - he'd want to bring servitors 00:11:38 I was sort of surprised they could be dispelled actually 00:11:49 since I thought they were just evil angels 00:12:02 st_: well, they are still undead - this is only a holiness thing. holy wrath is explicitly holy 00:12:10 yeah, I'd be happier about them being immune to holy magic if they were also immune to dispel undead 00:13:01 elliptic: well, you can do that too if you want :) it's not as thematic, but might seem more consistent to players who don't consider that holy anti-undead and nec anti-undead are different things 00:13:07 I don't particularly care one way or the other though 00:13:48 one other thing with servitors: it would be good to ensure they have messaging to communicate the +holy 00:13:53 i didn't test for that at all 00:13:58 messaging? 00:14:13 that it resists the spell - i'm not sure how holy stuff prints its resistance, currently 00:15:05 dispel undead isn't really holy magic, considering that it's necromancy 00:15:16 it's unholy in the way the regeneration spell is 00:15:26 evilmike: right, I didn't mean to imply that 00:15:41 although i was surprised to hear that dispel works on them. Didn't really think of them as undead 00:16:12 originally they were impaled with demon tridents :P 00:16:15 that got cut though 00:17:46 to be honest, dispel undead working on servitors probably just bothers me for the same reason that dispel undead working on deep qwarf unborns does... they aren't on an undead glyph 00:18:04 hahaha 00:18:25 I was going to bring up unborn too. When I saw someone dispel them on crypt:5 I was like "wtf you can do that?" 00:18:31 unborn deep dwarves could be put on L if that's an issue 00:18:32 that's a bit silly, but there's a valid point there I think... servitors are 'A', so people will expect them to be angelic 00:18:42 evilmike: could do, yeah 00:19:05 @??deep dwarf death knight 00:19:05 deep dwarf death knight (03q) | Speed: 10 | HD: 9 | Health: 54-92 | AC/EV: 2/12 | Damage: 20 | Flags: evil | Res: 06magic(72) | Vul: 08holy | Chunks: 07contaminated | XP: 857 | Sp: animate dead, mirror damage, summon undead, drain life. 00:19:08 maybe a green L 00:19:16 shouldn't they just be a different monster in that case? 00:19:59 undead deep dwarf 00:20:28 well, they're supposed to be some special kind of undead deep dwarf, and they seem more like liches than any other undead monster 00:20:59 @??deep dwarf unborn 00:20:59 unknown monster: "deep dwarf unborn" 00:21:02 right now they're the only dwarf monster that summons, also one of the only monsters in the game that casts haunt 00:21:04 @??unborn deep dwarf 00:21:05 unborn deep dwarf (16q) | Speed: 10 | HD: 11 | Health: 61-90 | AC/EV: 2/10 | Damage: 17 | Flags: 07undead, evil, spellcaster | Res: 06magic(117), 02cold, 03poison, 12drown, 04rot+++, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 1336 | Sp: agony, dispel undead (3d19), mirror damage, animate dead, haunt / b.cold (3d20), b.draining (3d16), animate dead. 00:21:19 they only have the first spellbook now 00:23:40 L is a pretty underused glyph I guess 00:30:01 anyway I was going to just go and make holy wrath check res_holy_energy(), but now I'm wondering whether something should be done about res_holy_fire() also... so I think I'll let someone else take care of all this :P 00:32:17 I can never keep track of which holy things do damage to which enemies 00:32:30 also there are weird things with neutral monsters having rHoly 00:34:37 easiest fix would bo to just special-case profane servitors in the holy wrath code, but having the same special case appearing all over the code makes me unhappy :( 00:49:07 -!- Wensley has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 01:03:22 elliptic: yeah this has come up before 01:03:25 it's rather inconsistent 01:03:36 like how we still don't have a great zin model for what he hates 01:06:25 -!- Brannock has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 01:08:46 also wrt L: put skeleton warriors on it before unborns, jeez 01:08:51 @??ancient champion 01:08:51 ancient champion (08z) | Speed: 10 | HD: 10 | Health: 54-76 | AC/EV: 15/10 | Damage: 25 | Flags: 07undead, evil, spellcaster, 07vault | Res: 06magic(93), 02cold, 03poison, 12drown, 04rot+++, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 813 | Sp: mystic blast (3d15), slow, haste. 01:08:53 see also these 01:11:47 -!- valrus has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:27:24 03neunon * re6ba698a1b87 10/crawl-ref/source/Crawl.xcodeproj/project.pbxproj: Xcode: add USE_TILE_LOCAL for Tiles target 01:31:12 03neunon * rb6246c93d48d 10/crawl-ref/source/Crawl.xcodeproj/project.pbxproj: Xcode: add zlib to linker for Crawl-cmd and Crawl Tiles 01:42:04 -!- HangedEye has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 01:48:21 -!- Pingas has joined ##crawl-dev 01:49:27 -!- monqy has quit [Quit: hello] 01:49:41 03neunon * ra2bf2416a7a6 10/crawl-ref/source/AppHdr.h: AppHdr.h: add ifndef __OBJC__ to skip pointless compile errors with Xcode project 01:51:29 03neunon * r381638d80dd2 10/crawl-ref/source/Crawl.xcodeproj/project.pbxproj: Xcode: update source/resource list to match Makefile targets 02:03:49 -!- agolden has joined ##crawl-dev 02:08:11 03neunon * r78ff5bfd58e7 10/crawl-ref/source/Crawl.xcodeproj/project.pbxproj: Xcode: add Info.plist generation phase 02:08:41 the CIA bots sure seem laggy. I pushed all those commits out like 2 hours ago. 02:27:04 -!- Textmode has joined ##crawl-dev 02:30:36 -!- snoonan has joined ##crawl-dev 02:34:14 -!- neunon has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 02:35:48 -!- snoonan has quit [Quit: Bye!] 02:36:10 -!- neunon has joined ##crawl-dev 02:44:45 -!- Ragdoll has joined ##crawl-dev 02:47:07 cool. mon-util.cc is causing an internal compiler error somehow. 03:02:23 xomscumming (L1 MuCK) ERROR: range check error (-1 / 80) (D (Sprint)) 03:09:11 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 03:12:08 -!- valrus has joined ##crawl-dev 03:16:31 -!- valrus has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 03:26:00 -!- syllogism has joined ##crawl-dev 03:38:15 good god, no wonder mon-util.cc causes so much pain 03:38:26 preprocessed, it's 67,573 lines 03:45:43 answer: mon-util.cc 03:46:11 it's totally breaking the PPC compiler, heh 03:51:49 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 03:54:45 what a bloody mess 04:09:01 the number of stack allocations in mon-util.cc is terrifying 04:10:36 Is it a file that hasn't been edited much? 04:12:16 it's actively edited, it's just growing terribly because of bad design decisions. 04:16:31 ah 04:43:24 xomscumming (L2 MuCK) ERROR: range check error (-1 / 80) (D (Sprint)) 04:57:08 xomscumming (L1 MuCK) ASSERT(feat < NUM_FEATURES) in 'feature.cc' at line 24 failed. (Abyss (Sprint)) 05:11:38 -!- blabber has joined ##crawl-dev 05:14:44 -!- agolden has quit [Quit: agolden] 05:20:31 Getting abyssed from zig with a wild magic card resulst in crash when entering abyss exit (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=5004) by Surr 05:36:27 elliptic, Eronarn: what exactly is the reason in servitors resisting holy? That looks like a glaring bug to me: everywhere else, we say that god attitudes are based on their likes/dislikes, often being majorly hypocrytic, rather than physical properties of the creature in question. 05:36:40 like, TSO loves demons who worship him (angelics) but hates demons who do not 05:37:48 or, Zin hates those who worship evil gods or do things deemed "unclean" by him even when they have nothing inherently bad (unlike silver) 05:50:17 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 05:56:44 03kilobyte * rd6508ab2c101 10/crawl-ref/source/spl-damage.cc: Don't consider the player immune to refrigeration at rC+++. 05:56:51 03kilobyte * r3ba39eb70128 10/crawl-ref/source/travel.cc: A quick hack to recover games abyssed from a Ziggurat. 05:58:07 -!- st_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:02:11 03kilobyte * ra3fed96a8545 10/crawl-ref/source/spl-damage.cc: Fix players taking no damage from Refrigeration. 06:05:17 -!- edlothiol has joined ##crawl-dev 06:05:22 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.10-a0-2512-ga3fed96 (32) 06:23:24 -!- evilmike has quit [Quit: something happened] 06:25:16 -!- petete has joined ##crawl-dev 06:35:02 -!- Pacra has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 06:49:14 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 07:04:45 3.0M mon-util.o 07:04:48 three line change... 07:04:48 1020K mon-util.o 07:07:33 -!- mikee_ has joined ##crawl-dev 07:09:56 xomscumming (L1 MuCK) ERROR: range check error (-1 / 80) (D (Sprint)) 07:11:36 -!- jeanjacques has joined ##crawl-dev 07:13:22 -!- valrus has joined ##crawl-dev 07:23:30 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 07:38:32 Global Notice] Hi everyone. It's time for further ircd upgrades to take place (see blog.freenode.net for details). The servers affected today are pratchett, calvino, leguin and niven. One of our US hubs will also be restarted, so there will be a very large netsplit. Please fasten your seatbelts. I'll send messages directly to affected users and will let you know when it's all done. Thanks! 07:46:57 -!- Pacra has quit [*.net *.split] 07:46:57 -!- petete has quit [*.net *.split] 07:46:58 -!- Wop has quit [*.net *.split] 07:47:01 -!- Lohen has quit [*.net *.split] 07:47:07 -!- SamB has quit [*.net *.split] 07:47:17 -!- mikee_ has quit [*.net *.split] 07:47:17 -!- blabber has quit [*.net *.split] 07:47:19 -!- jeanjacques has quit [*.net *.split] 07:47:21 -!- syllogism has quit [*.net *.split] 07:47:21 -!- Textmode has quit [*.net *.split] 07:47:25 -!- Henzell has quit [*.net *.split] 07:47:26 -!- ncampion has quit [*.net *.split] 07:47:27 -!- due has quit [*.net *.split] 07:47:28 -!- Eifeltrampel has quit [*.net *.split] 07:47:29 -!- CIA-54 has quit [*.net *.split] 07:47:33 -!- rax has quit [*.net *.split] 07:47:33 -!- greensnark has quit [*.net *.split] 07:47:34 -!- jarpiain has quit [*.net *.split] 07:47:34 -!- Napkin has quit [*.net *.split] 07:47:38 -!- Ragdoll has quit [*.net *.split] 07:47:45 -!- Zaba has quit [*.net *.split] 07:47:48 -!- joosa has quit [*.net *.split] 07:47:50 -!- casmith789 has quit [*.net *.split] 07:48:18 -!- krel has quit [*.net *.split] 07:48:19 -!- cbus has quit [*.net *.split] 07:48:19 -!- ZorbaTHut has quit [*.net *.split] 07:48:19 -!- phyphor has quit [*.net *.split] 07:48:22 -!- paxed has quit [*.net *.split] 07:48:26 -!- Keskitalo has quit [*.net *.split] 07:48:28 -!- Gretell has quit [*.net *.split] 07:48:29 -!- bhaak has quit [*.net *.split] 07:48:34 -!- edlothiol has quit [*.net *.split] 07:48:35 -!- alefury has quit [*.net *.split] 07:48:35 -!- neunon has quit [*.net *.split] 07:48:38 -!- Eronarn has quit [*.net *.split] 07:48:39 -!- Xiberia has quit [*.net *.split] 07:48:40 -!- blueDave has quit [*.net *.split] 07:48:48 -!- |amethyst has quit [*.net *.split] 07:48:50 -!- rawrmage has quit [*.net *.split] 07:48:57 -!- ainsophyao has quit [*.net *.split] 07:49:00 -!- Danei has quit [*.net *.split] 07:49:05 -!- Arian- has quit [*.net *.split] 07:49:05 -!- BlastHardcheese has quit [*.net *.split] 07:49:08 -!- jlewis has quit [*.net *.split] 07:49:39 -!- Danei has joined ##crawl-dev 07:49:39 -!- phyphor has joined ##crawl-dev 07:49:39 -!- krel has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:13 -!- rawrmage has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:18 -!- |amethyst has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:18 -!- BlastHardcheese has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:18 -!- Lohen has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:18 -!- Wop has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:18 -!- petete has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:18 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:18 -!- blueDave has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:18 -!- Xiberia has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:18 -!- Eronarn has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:18 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:18 -!- edlothiol has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:18 -!- jlewis__ has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:18 -!- cbus has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:18 -!- ainsophyao has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:18 -!- Keskitalo has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:18 -!- Textmode has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:18 -!- joosa has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:18 -!- rax has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:18 -!- greensnark has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:18 -!- Napkin has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:20 -!- jarpiain has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:20 -!- CIA-54 has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:20 -!- Zaba has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:20 -!- Eifeltrampel has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:20 -!- due has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:21 -!- ncampion has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:21 -!- Henzell has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:21 -!- SamB has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:21 -!- Ragdoll has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:21 -!- syllogism has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:21 -!- blabber has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:21 -!- mikee_ has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:21 -!- jeanjacques has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:21 -!- bhaak has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:21 -!- Arian-_ has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:21 -!- paxed has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:21 -!- casmith789 has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:21 -!- ZorbaTHut has joined ##crawl-dev 07:57:14 -!- BlastHardcheese has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 07:57:25 -!- BlastHardcheese has joined ##crawl-dev 08:02:45 -!- BlastHardcheese is now known as Guest2194 08:02:45 -!- bhaak is now known as Guest8666 08:09:26 Global Notice] Wheeeeee. The main part of this week's upgrades is done. Thanks for your patience and I hope you enjoyed the ride... Our last round of ircd upgrades is next week, so don't miss the fun :) 08:20:50 -!- Gretell has joined ##crawl-dev 08:22:14 -!- Gretell has quit [*.net *.split] 08:31:09 -!- Gretell has joined ##crawl-dev 08:32:41 -!- Guest8666 is now known as bhaak` 09:11:13 -!- Brannock has joined ##crawl-dev 09:49:43 -!- Ragdoll has quit [Quit: Up, up and away!] 10:12:30 -!- Wensley has joined ##crawl-dev 10:13:18 -!- Ragdoll has joined ##crawl-dev 10:16:36 distortion teleports corpses (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=5005) by KiloByte 10:16:37 xomscumming (L1 MuCK) ASSERT(feat < NUM_FEATURES) in 'feature.cc' at line 24 failed. (Abyss (Sprint)) 10:18:06 -!- chrisoelmueller has left ##crawl-dev 10:19:27 -!- Wensley has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:21:22 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.10-a0-2512-ga3fed96 (32) 10:27:55 xomscumming (L1 MuCK) ERROR: range check error (-1 / 80) (D (Sprint)) 10:29:41 xomscumming (L1 MuCK) ASSERT(feat < NUM_FEATURES) in 'feature.cc' at line 24 failed. (Abyss (Sprint)) 10:41:00 xomscumming (L1 MuCK) ASSERT(levels_seen <= (unsigned long) branches[branch].depth) in 'place-info.cc' at line 55 failed. (Lair:10 (Sprint)) 10:42:51 xomscumming (L1 MuCK) ASSERT(levels_seen <= (unsigned long) branches[branch].depth) in 'place-info.cc' at line 55 failed. (Lair:10 (Sprint)) 11:27:39 -!- krel has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 11:30:05 -!- jeanjacques has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:31:26 -!- jeanjacques has joined ##crawl-dev 11:34:37 minmay the Sorcerer (L23 MuFE) ASSERT(y >= 1 && y <= sz.y) in 'libutil.cc' at line 940 failed on turn 98563. (Shoals:5) 11:34:58 kilobyte: everywhere else, we say that god attitudes are based on their likes/dislikes, 11:35:02 ??pda 11:35:03 pearl dragon armour[1/2]: Magical armour made from the scales of a pearl dragon. (AC 10, EV -3, rN+, 40aum). All races but felids, draconians, and octopodes can wear this. Like other holy items it resists curses. 11:35:40 oh wait, i thought that gave rHoly too 11:35:43 -!- jeanjacques has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:35:46 nevermind, i guess 11:41:52 -!- jeanjacques has joined ##crawl-dev 11:48:11 -!- krel has joined ##crawl-dev 11:50:36 -!- monqy has joined ##crawl-dev 12:40:48 The deep dwarf necromancer mumbles some strange words. 12:40:48 trying to cast simulacrum; found hydra corpse 12:40:49 The deep dwarf necromancer casts a spell and a hydra corpse floats close. 12:40:49 The deep dwarf necromancer picks up the hydra corpse and starts butchering it. 12:41:26 not sure how to weasel around monsters butchering corpses in their inventory 12:41:56 people would otherwise make sure to apport or animate them the moment the monster starts butchering 12:57:29 Mutagenic chunks aren't autopickuped for mummy with sublimation of blood memorized (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=5006) by elliptic 13:07:32 Rods can be used with no penalty while confused. (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=5007) by elliptic 13:12:31 -!- Wensley has joined ##crawl-dev 13:19:31 -!- ainsophyao has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:19:49 whoah, they apport and then butcher and then simul? that's awesome 13:22:51 -!- agolden has joined ##crawl-dev 13:24:37 -!- Pingas_ has joined ##crawl-dev 13:24:38 -!- Pingas has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:25:18 -!- agolden has quit [Client Quit] 13:50:04 -!- ainsophyao has joined ##crawl-dev 13:53:00 -!- bhaak` is now known as bhaak 13:54:03 -!- ais523 has joined ##crawl-dev 13:54:10 -!- bmh has joined ##crawl-dev 13:54:23 morning (well, sort of) 13:54:23 bmh: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 13:54:27 !messages 13:54:28 (1/1) kilobyte said (3d 5h 13m 1s ago): valgrind screams a lot about Abyss generation -- this probably explains the bad feature crashes. I don't know that code well, is that something obvious? Or are you way too busy? 13:55:21 !tell kilobyte I'm looking into the Abyss valgrind errors now. 13:55:21 bmh: OK, I'll let kilobyte know. 13:56:06 speaking of abyss, I think it might have too much water/lava 13:57:12 i would agree with that, yeah 13:57:36 me too 13:57:46 i agree 13:57:53 https://crawl.develz.org/wiki/doku.php?id=dcss:brainstorm:dungeon:branch:abyss#abyss1 13:57:59 i also like mumra's suggestion on there 14:00:18 heh, someone in ##crawl had asked for *more* lava and water 14:00:54 I agree with mumra. 14:01:37 yeah, the constant shifting isn't great 14:01:44 it means that everywhere in the abyss feels the same 14:02:26 off the top of my head, I think drawing time between abyss shifts from a Cauchy distribution might be nice 14:03:12 currently, you never have to backtrack 14:03:13 kilobyte: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 14:03:53 which means, there's always a way forward, you need at most to move a couple spaces to the side or wait a turn 14:05:00 old Abyss had some open areas, but also many cramped ones where you hard to walk back and forth a lot if you wanted to proceed 14:05:30 -!- ainsophyao has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:05:45 I found the new Abyss to actually be really scary. I visited with a XL26 character (haste/flight) and it was dangerous 14:06:09 granted, it was a horrendously underpowered HOPr who died in a hilariously failed Orb ninja attempt. 14:06:19 -!- Guest2194 has quit [Changing host] 14:06:19 -!- Guest2194 has joined ##crawl-dev 14:06:30 -!- Guest2194 is now known as BlastHardcheese 14:11:01 kilobyte: what's the recommended way for valgrinding crawl? 14:12:38 -!- ainsophyao has joined ##crawl-dev 14:12:38 I use: alias vgcrawl='valgrind --log-file=vg --suppressions=misc/valgrind-suppress.txt --leak-check=full ./crawl' 14:12:51 there's misc/grind.sh which seems to be almost identical 14:13:05 oh, great! 14:13:06 not sure what "-extra-opt-first grind=true" does 14:13:28 I should be able to write more code after the AI Challenge is through with 14:15:44 -!- ainsophyao has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:16:14 apparently nothing at all, there are no references to any option named "grind" anywhere 14:17:16 so that misc/grind.sh does the same thing as my alias except for "nice -n 7" and logging to "grind.log" rather than "vg" then 14:21:37 kilobyte: grinding is horrendously slow :) 14:25:32 -!- ainsophyao has joined ##crawl-dev 14:29:14 kilobyte: can only spare a moment but i realized i didn't address the issue otherwise - i think having a monster that is 'anti-holy' is flavorful, and that servitors do it without explicitly being 'does more damage to holy stuff' (passively by not being vulnerable to holy magic, and actively by negating haloes) 14:29:34 i definitely don't think there should be many things that aren't vulnerable to gods, but a few things is good, imo 14:30:12 i made them yred-only (as opposed to 50/50 kiku/yred) in part because i wanted to play up yred's dislike of holiness 14:35:06 speaking of gods, how about another Good God? 14:36:56 bmh: what would you suggest? 14:39:10 kilobyte: currently we have a paladin god, a healer god, and a 'purity' god (can we count fedhas in the mix?). What other aspects of goodliness can we drag in? 14:39:48 bmh: i had an idea for this a while ago. if you take: zin = stars, ely = moon, tso = sun 14:40:02 there's one major element of the night sky missing: the darkness 14:40:16 Eronarn: The god of Batman? 14:40:48 bmh: haha, i wouldn't quite phrase it like that - but yes, the idea that it's a god that is holy-but-not-conventionally 14:41:08 god of beards 14:41:25 Eronarn: what about planets 14:41:26 Is Zin purity or inquisition? 14:41:38 this could include stealth, the 'undead reformist' god that has been mentioned, assasination of unholy things 14:42:02 Wensley: planets are just stars 14:42:05 bmh: both 14:42:19 Eronarn: moon is just a star too, then 14:42:42 How about a god in the style of Pope Innocent III, who ordered Beziers slaughted saying that "God shall know his own"? 14:43:01 A god who is good, but isn't really that good ;) 14:43:16 I usually perceive the 'good' gods as sort of upholders of natural order, in an almost sort-of-dharmic sense 14:43:17 -!- Zaba has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 14:43:29 with the 'evil' gods being adharmic 14:43:32 bmh: Zin = mostly organized church. Visible hairshirts, preaching, hypocrisy, gathering gold for the hierarchy. 14:43:53 ie, talking about purity rather than actually doing something there 14:45:02 bmh: Moon is much bigger. 14:45:14 another fun thing: TSO is so close to Beogh 14:45:30 I'm never playing Beogh again. He's so underpowered late game. 14:45:44 (That and I made the mistake of switching to Okie) 14:46:06 Oka is a god you switch from, yeah 14:46:18 Beogh it damn nice up to, say, V:8 14:46:20 i think we should consider something like giving orc priests heal other instead of heal self 14:46:42 well, heal orc, anyways 14:47:31 beogh already gives lifesaving which isn't particularly flavorful, you could remove that and have 'lifesaving' be that if you have priests they might heal you if you get badly injured 14:47:45 (but don't prioritize healing the player any more than healing any other injured orc) 14:49:13 equipping your followers is tedious. It's a lot of herding cats. 14:49:20 then we could grant "heal orc" as a player power and make beogh like ely instead of like tso :P 14:49:34 Wensley: and if we add permaallies to zin, beogh will be like all the gods 14:49:38 holy gods, rather ;) 14:49:55 zin perma-friends? 14:50:11 Wensley: people stupid enough to convert when you preach to them! 14:50:17 oh ha, interesting 14:50:22 would make recite a lot of interesting 14:51:06 kilobyte: from misc/grind.sh, I'm seeing a leak, but it isn't obvious that it's coming from the abyss. Can I see your log? 14:51:24 not more ally gods 14:51:34 allies are pesky. 14:51:53 zin is a pretty good stabber god 14:51:55 i was thinking of something where you: take a monster, remove not-zin-okay abilities, give it a new name depending on what conversions needed to happen (like 'repentant', 'converted', etc.) 14:52:13 there's a reasonable number of monsters that could be converted in this way 14:52:31 some which could be quite interesting - sphinxes are intelligent and not evil, for instance 14:52:54 are dragon intelligent? 14:52:56 but definitely it shouldn't be the main gimmick of zin, because allies are annoying sometimes 14:52:59 no 14:53:00 god what is with my typing today 14:53:01 except for Xtahua 14:53:15 You see here the enlightened Xtahua. 14:53:26 haha 14:53:29 bmh: there should be no leaks AFAIK (but new ones could have sprang up) 14:53:53 bmh: there's a lot of reading uninitialized data, though 14:53:58 i kind of feel like either normal dragons should be intelligent or xtahua shouldn't be 14:54:27 It may contain the following cards: Water, Vitrification, the Map, Dowsing, the Spade, Trowel, the 14:54:27 Minefield. 14:54:27 Drawn card(s): the Trowel, the Trowel 14:54:39 hmm, how many uniques -cannot- open doors? 14:55:38 gastronok, trj/dissolution (but they can eat them), aizul (he lost his hands) 14:55:51 wait, maybe aizul can open doors. that'd be weird 14:56:01 I think he's special-cased not to? 14:56:12 though to be fair to Beogh, Orc High Priests are amazingly powerful. I was wandering around with two of them and they vaporized Aizul and Azrael 14:56:35 do they still have demon summoning because they really shouldn't 14:56:40 and Saint Rokka 14:56:41 @??orc high priest 14:56:42 orc high priest (09o) | Speed: 10 | HD: 11 | Health: 41-68 | AC/EV: 1/12 | Damage: 7 | Flags: evil, see invisible | Res: 06magic(58), 05hellfire | Vul: 08holy | Chunks: 07contaminated | XP: 999 | Sp: pain (d13), demon, smiting (7-17), animate dead, minor healing. 14:56:44 Eronarn: yes, they do. 14:56:45 yeah :/ 14:56:52 what, aizul lost his hands!? 14:56:55 They'd be useless without it. 14:56:55 is that in his description 14:56:55 so many things wrong with that statline 14:57:20 Pacra: when i proposed aizul, he was a powerful guardian naga with a shield 14:57:30 someone pointed out that guardian nagas had stats nothing like other nagas 14:57:32 the hellfire thing in general always seemed silly 14:57:37 they were made into guardian serpents instead 14:57:41 why is an orc priest immune to fire stuff 14:57:44 unfortunately, this meant that aizul lost his equipment (and hands) 14:57:52 he doesnt even have hellfire anymore 14:57:58 ahh, I see 14:58:08 Pacra: I guess because old AI couldn't handle explosion spells 14:58:21 yes, that's the only reason 14:58:25 it should've been removed ages ago :P 14:58:32 i keep bringing it up every several months, but no dice 14:58:37 @??deep elf high priest 14:58:37 deep elf high priest (09e) | Speed: 10 | HD: 11 | Health: 39-62 | AC/EV: 3/13 | Damage: 14 | Flags: evil, see invisible | Res: 06magic(88), 05hellfire | Vul: 08holy | Chunks: 07contaminated | XP: 1043 | Sp: demon, hellfire burst (3d15), minor healing, smiting (7-17), twisted resurrection. 14:58:49 this should lose it too 14:59:07 seems so randomly arbitrary! 14:59:14 (is 'randomly arbitrary' redundant?) 14:59:49 orc high priest spell list should really be like: smiting, heal orc, nothing else (or maybe summon spectral orc) :/ 15:00:05 i agree completely 15:00:07 orc high priests should be able to convert a hopr's followers 15:00:14 @??nergalle 15:00:15 Nergalle (16o) | Speed: 10 | HD: 10 | Health: 60 | AC/EV: 9/11 | Damage: 6 | Flags: evil, spellcaster, see invisible | Res: 06magic(66) | Vul: 08holy | Chunks: 07contaminated | XP: 982 | Sp: b.draining (3d15), spectral orcs, regeneration, dispel undead (3d18), haste other, door. 15:00:21 Eronarn: please don't nerf Beogh :( 15:00:28 ??spectral orcs 15:00:39 there are enough monsters with summon demon as it is 15:00:46 I don't have a page labeled spectral_orcs in my learndb. 15:00:54 bmh: you could make the high priests stronger to account for losing demon 15:01:07 Eronarn: sure. Make them less splatty. 15:01:09 like giving them a bunch more HP 15:01:11 as long as orc sorcerors keep it 15:01:18 Wensley: that's fine, they are spellcasters 15:01:42 it's just really dumb for there to be an 'orc high priest', which is NOT a spellcaster, which uses pain/demon/animate dead 15:02:17 also can we make beogh worship not evil already, thanks in advance 15:02:25 @??orc priest 15:02:26 orc priest (03o) | Speed: 10 | HD: 3 | Health: 9-21 | AC/EV: 1/10 | Damage: 6 | Flags: evil | Res: 06magic(16) | Vul: 08holy | Chunks: 07contaminated | XP: 41 | Sp: pain (d8), cantrip, smiting (7-17), minor healing. 15:02:34 holy vul !?!?!? 15:02:35 haha 15:02:43 could we change Orc AI to prefer pole arms and crossbows? 15:03:04 bmh: a recent valgrind log: http://sprunge.us/TYWg 15:03:07 it really is visible with new recite 15:03:09 it demolishes orcs 15:03:15 because they're almost all flagged as evil 15:03:21 kilobyte: thanks. I wasn't seeing the same stuff in my log. 15:03:22 Vul: zin 15:04:13 bmh: the apply_noises() thing is harmless, an artifact of how greensnark initializes the noise grid 15:05:10 there's a lot of crashes in the Abyss with features out of bounds though, so this smells related to these uninitialized reads 15:05:11 kilobyte: I don't see how that data is uninit at 1071 15:05:43 Eronarn: that's traditional 15:06:55 valgrind allows copying and arithmetics on uninitialized values, and complains only if flow control is affected 15:07:28 X+uninitialized = uninitalized 15:14:02 how about a good god that isn't scummable for piety, so as to allow undead/demonspawn worshippers? 15:17:33 how would demonspawn scum holy piety? also, wasn't the plan to change piety-over-time to piety-by-exploration, thus nullifying the scumming potential of a theoretical mummy of tso 15:19:27 Wensley: that has been scrapped 15:19:41 bmh: are there any scummable good gods, even? 15:19:53 kilobyte: don't you gain piety over time for all of them? 15:20:19 bmh: wasn't that since 0.9 already? 15:20:45 (back in a bit) 15:20:53 a mummy of TSO that scums will lose all piety... and new monsters you could get it from taper off after 20k turns 15:24:00 -!- blabber has quit [Quit: gn8] 15:27:35 bmh: all gods other than Cheibriados have a piety decay; TSO gives piety for seeing monsters ("checking them for evil") and killing evil ones; Zin gives piety for picking up gold (you pay a 10% tax); Elyvilon for pacifying folks (destroying weapons only until *.....) 15:28:40 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 15:30:04 -!- petete has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:30:31 -!- petete has joined ##crawl-dev 15:31:14 kilobyte: ah-ha. I must have been thinking of an ancient version 15:31:21 -!- ainsophyao has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:31:41 well, Crawl's development advances fast 15:41:40 -!- Wensley is now known as Mwensley 15:43:31 -!- alefury has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 15:44:10 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 15:44:52 -!- medgno has joined ##crawl-dev 15:46:05 -!- Pacra has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:47:55 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 15:50:28 -!- Pingas_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:52:07 -!- Mwensley is now known as Wensley 15:59:04 -!- mikee_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:20:30 -!- bmh has left ##crawl-dev 16:23:18 -!- Ragdoll has quit [Quit: Up, up and away!] 16:28:32 -!- capablanca has joined ##crawl-dev 16:28:45 -!- capablanca is now known as mikee_ 16:53:36 -!- HangedMan has joined ##crawl-dev 16:55:05 -!- alefury has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:56:44 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 17:09:45 -!- alefury has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:25:02 03kilobyte * r1dc9e5a843c5 10/crawl-ref/source/ (monster.h spl-summoning.cc): Let monsters drop misc items to free the slot for chunks for Simulacrum. 17:25:10 03kilobyte * r1da4bb99c063 10/crawl-ref/source/ (12 files): Give deep dwarf necromancers Simulacrum (and a kind of Apportation). 17:25:10 03kilobyte * r11e034b7b366 10/crawl-ref/source/ (delay.cc misc.cc misc.h spl-summoning.cc): Fix butchery producing a skeleton but no chunks when mitm[] is full. 17:25:10 03kilobyte * r23b238125fa0 10/crawl-ref/source/ (mgen_enum.h mon-place.cc spl-summoning.cc): Don't say "comes into view" when hostile simulacra appear. 17:25:10 03kilobyte * r26615fd41b32 10/crawl-ref/source/ (14 files): Change seen_context from strings to enums, slightly untangle it. 17:26:17 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 17:31:05 kilobyte: i'm seriously impressed with the simulacrum thing :) haven't seen it in action, but looks like you went above and beyond to make it match the player version rather than being chunks out of nowhere 17:31:45 any chance of giving it to the 'necromancer' monster with bolt of cold, replacing animate dead? 17:31:48 @??necromancer 17:31:48 necromancer (16@) | Speed: 10 | HD: 10 | Health: 26-53 | AC/EV: 0/13 | Damage: 6 | Flags: evil, spellcaster | Res: 06magic(53) | Vul: 08holy | Chunks: 07contaminated | XP: 589 | Sp: b.cold (3d18), b.draining (3d15), animate dead / b.fire (3d18), pain (d13), invisibility, animate dead. 17:33:10 so there are monsters who still have animate dead, surprising :p 17:33:58 hmm, actually, quite a few 17:34:07 kilobyte: orcs should flat out loe it 17:34:13 usually te only thing nearby is orcish remains 17:34:22 raising them is completely against beogh's teachings 17:35:14 then if there are any demons other than hellwings with it, they could probably lose it - would that leave anything much with it still? 17:35:24 lichs 17:35:30 frederick 17:35:36 -!- ainsophyao has joined ##crawl-dev 17:36:06 @??frederick 17:36:07 Frederick (03@) | Speed: 10 | HD: 21 | Health: 159 | AC/EV: 0/10 | Damage: 27 | Flags: evil, spellcaster, see invisible | Res: 06magic(140) | Vul: 08holy | Chunks: 07contaminated | XP: 5373 | Sp: mystic blast (3d25), b.cold (3d30), invisibility, animate dead, iron shot (3d36). 17:36:09 @??lich 17:36:10 lich (15L) | Speed: 10 | HD: 20 | Health: 57-99 | AC/EV: 10/10 | Damage: 1513(drain) | Flags: 07undead, evil, spellcaster, see invisible | Res: 06magic(293), 02cold++, 03poison, 12drown, 04rot+++, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 4052 | Sp: b.cold (3d29), paralyse, greater demon, animate dead, iron shot (3d34), teleport self / b.draining (3d24), animate dead, summon undead, throw frost (3d.. 17:36:22 @??ancient champion 17:36:23 -!- MarvinPA_ has joined ##crawl-dev 17:36:23 ancient champion (08z) | Speed: 10 | HD: 10 | Health: 54-76 | AC/EV: 15/10 | Damage: 25 | Flags: 07undead, evil, spellcaster, 07vault | Res: 06magic(93), 02cold, 03poison, 12drown, 04rot+++, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 813 | Sp: mystic blast (3d15), slow, haste. 17:36:29 ??ancient champion spells 17:36:30 I don't have a page labeled ancient_champion_spells in my learndb. 17:36:34 necromancers could have both 17:36:44 oh, they don't have it anyway 17:36:55 kilobyte: that could be good, if you weight which one they cast by the #/type of corpses 17:36:59 heck, they SHOULD have both -- remember that butchery tends to leave skeletons! 17:37:07 good point :) 17:37:21 crypt elephants 17:37:24 corpse rot does, too - i don't think any monster actually casts that yet 17:37:26 we need a monster with channel :p 17:37:29 bog mummies 17:37:47 not noticable because there aren't giant amounts of corpses one stands ontop of in swamp 17:37:49 kilobyte: things you kill appear as hostile spectrals? 17:37:49 kilobyte: channel only is stuff you kill, though, so it wouldn't matter 17:38:02 st_: yeah 17:38:02 Eronarn: i coded corpse 5rot :) 17:38:02 it could matter for hopr! 17:38:12 due: but bog mummies :( 17:38:23 Eronarn: what's wrong with them? :( 17:38:31 ??bog mummy[2] 17:38:31 bog mummy[2/4]: A brackish-water variant of your average mummy. Instead of canopic jars and copious fluttering bandages, this creature was pushed face first into a bog and left to mummify naturally over hundreds of years. 17:38:32 Eronarn: the only game I used Death Channel was zotdef... kept getting loads of spectrals for oklob/pet kills 17:38:35 ??bog mummy[3] 17:38:35 bog mummy[3/4]: Like a regular mummy, curses your items when killed. Because Swamp wasn't quite annoying enough already. 17:38:39 ??bog mummy[4] 17:38:40 bog mummy[4/4]: Don't fight from on top of your potions. Not that you needed to drop them. 17:38:44 ??bog mummy 17:38:45 bog mummy[1/4]: Soggy mummy. Cold and fire resistant to one level, amphibious (but slow); hits harder (25 to 20; additional AF_COLD touch attack for 4). Slows, throws frost, and casts corpse rot. 17:38:46 -!- ainsophyao has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:38:47 aw 17:38:52 where's the one where it starts and then stops rotting 17:39:06 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 17:39:08 The bog mummy withdraws into it's shell. 17:39:15 kilobyte: death channel is... kind of weird, right now 17:39:23 back when it gave you permaallies, it had a specific niche 17:39:29 now it's not bad, but it's not really fun either 17:39:45 I kind of wonder... there is a problem with my implementation of Simulacrum. Monsters get to butcher from the inventory. 17:40:03 if they used Animate Skeleton instead, we'd have instant butchery without issues 17:40:22 kilobyte: that's a very good idea 17:40:37 i'm sure dpeg will love it 17:40:40 and Animate Skeleton has 100% chunks 100% skeleton, unlike regular butchery which is 100% chunks 33% skeleton 17:40:56 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 17:40:59 so double the efficiency :p 17:41:05 @??necromancer 17:41:06 necromancer (16@) | Speed: 10 | HD: 10 | Health: 26-53 | AC/EV: 0/13 | Damage: 6 | Flags: evil, spellcaster | Res: 06magic(53) | Vul: 08holy | Chunks: 07contaminated | XP: 589 | Sp: b.cold (3d18), b.draining (3d15), animate dead / b.fire (3d18), pain (d13), invisibility, animate dead. 17:41:53 hrm, could be a bit weird again... the monster would get to cast two spells in a row no matter the speed 17:42:01 -!- syllogism has quit [] 17:42:16 apportation+pickup is a bit easier to handwave 17:43:25 kilobyte: what about having them be two separate things for the AI? like: 17:43:53 if there's a corpse in LOS, apport; if you are standing on a corpse, cast animate skeleton; if you are standing on chunks and don't have any, pick them up; if you have chunks, cast simulacrum? 17:44:27 this would be more organic if you interrupt them, slow them, blink them, etc. 17:44:47 also lets you do things like cast corpse rot after they apport the corpse beneath them 17:45:23 I'm afraid everyone would animate the corpse when the necromancer apports it 17:45:29 -!- jeanjacques_ has joined ##crawl-dev 17:45:35 kilobyte: what's wrong with that? only necro types can do that :) 17:46:17 -!- jeanjacques has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:46:18 also, the necromancer monster right now is really 'wizard, but with animate dead' 17:46:34 i'd rather have it be weaker but way more flavorful, personally 17:47:27 hmm right 17:47:48 they could spawn with chunks in their inventory couldn't they? stuff like dragon simulacra are pretty nasty 17:47:53 also, if you wanted to, this would be a good time to implement the 'baleful apportation' spell - rip chunks of flesh from creatures, launching them with a spray of blood to wind up in your hand 17:48:02 @??player simulacra 17:48:03 unknown monster: "player simulacra" 17:48:06 @??player simulacrum 17:48:07 unknown monster: "player simulacrum" 17:48:08 aw 17:48:09 @??player 17:48:15 what if animating skeletons would work at a distance? 17:48:40 Eronarn: Z_NOZOMBIE :( 17:49:10 kilobyte: only because it's a player illusion :) (the base race of most player species will be zombieable) 17:49:47 does simulacrum require you to wield chunks still? or can you cast it with just chunks in inventory? 17:50:09 we have both MONS_PLAYER and MONS_PLAYER_ILLUSION, they're distinct 17:50:13 ah, okay 17:50:24 mons_player has the best comment in the source ever 17:50:26 neither is zombifiable 17:50:55 I_HIGH /*uh huh, sure sure*/ 17:51:07 what happens if you simulacrum, say, xtahua? you get just dragons, not xtahuas? 17:51:39 whereas you get a spectral xtahua with dchannel? 17:52:02 unknown monster: "Xtahua simulacrum" 17:52:07 I think it's a dragon simulacrum with his HD 17:52:18 ah, that would make sense 17:52:18 same as death channel 17:53:25 yeah, dragon simulacra 17:53:25 kilobyte: what about making ranged animate skeleton be a new spell? 17:53:31 rather than just making the existing one ranged 17:54:07 or, a monster-only "apport flesh" 17:54:16 why not just let players butcher from inventory? it seems like a weird restriction 17:54:52 that affects like the one case in every 20 games where you pick up a corpse for some reason 17:55:00 -!- MarvinPA_ is now known as MarvinPA 17:55:14 i like the idea of a single target spell that either rips a skeleton out of a corpse, or makes your skeleton try to fight its way out 17:55:36 (only works on enemies that have skeletons, naturally) 17:55:52 ooh, what about having it be the first earth/nec spell? 17:56:01 then it's very flavorful for dds to have it 17:56:50 and it can easily be justified why it's a) a different spell from animate skeleton cantrip b) not in normal nec books (but could eventually be a player spell) 17:58:06 then it'd look like: cast that (can do it either with a corpse or on the player), if there are chunks in sight apport one over, if standing on a chunk pick it up, if has chunks cast simulacrum 17:58:12 Bone Shards? 17:58:28 03MarvinPA * r1dd8e33bf4f9 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-data.h: Remove fire and hellfire res from some monsters that don't need it 17:58:31 <3 MarvinPA 17:58:53 kilobyte: we should bring bone shards back one day :( 17:59:22 like, explode a skeleton (animated or not) to do an aoe around it 17:59:59 player Simulacrum could be made to use arbitrary chunks without having to wield them 18:00:08 yeah, that would be good, i think 18:00:17 03kilobyte * reb42ef63603b 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-spll.h: Include Simulacrum in MST_NECROMANCER_I spellbooks. 18:00:31 imo wielding stuff to cast should only stick around if it's needed for balance reasons 18:00:34 like sublimation 18:00:39 or sticks? 18:01:12