00:13:20 -!- valrus has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:19:17 -!- Noom has joined ##crawl-dev 00:23:41 -!- upsy has joined ##crawl-dev 00:44:05 -!- Noom has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 00:44:56 -!- ahpla has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:55:56 -!- Textmode has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:03:33 -!- ahpla has joined ##crawl-dev 01:15:00 -!- valrus has joined ##crawl-dev 01:19:38 -!- valrus has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 02:22:50 -!- galehar has joined ##crawl-dev 02:22:57 -!- Zao has quit [Quit: Internets!] 02:23:15 -!- Zao_ is now known as Zao 02:23:21 -!- Zao has quit [Changing host] 02:23:21 -!- Zao has joined ##crawl-dev 03:05:27 -!- valrus has joined ##crawl-dev 03:08:13 moin 03:08:31 moo! 03:08:32 03kilobyte 07zotdef * r10eacd6f5134 10/crawl-ref/source/ (15 files): Formatting fixes. 03:08:43 er, wait, meow. I meant meow not moo. Definitely meow. 03:08:44 03kilobyte 07zotdef * r47cd31aa8c94 10/crawl-ref/source/items.cc: Cull damaged weapons/armour as well. 03:09:52 oh 03:09:53 kilobyte, what do you think regarding #2898? 03:10:01 I fixed up some stuff that I need to push in zotdef 03:12:05 due: if it's an unclean merge and you don't feel like resolving it, just push it to a temp branch, I can do that 03:12:23 it should be fine 03:12:27 it was onlly deck-ralted 03:14:07 Zaba: somehow most of these monster show for me in ?/m 03:14:14 but not all 03:15:23 kilobyte, how are you looking them up? 03:15:48 Pushed 03:15:54 kilobyte, when you look up '.*', how many matches do you get? 03:16:05 03due 07zotdef * re299cd3c0d28 10/crawl-ref/source/ (abl-show.cc decks.cc decks.h): Static functions should use the private prefix "_". 03:18:07 439 in zotdef, lemme recompile master 03:18:58 well yeah, I've no idea about zotdef 03:20:22 437 03:20:33 do you have any local changes? 03:20:44 makes sense, +oklob sapling, +burning bush 03:21:05 because I have clean master here, and I get just 402 03:21:45 or.. wait a minute. 03:21:53 ah! 03:22:15 okay, I know what the issue is now. 03:24:56 kilobyte, see my comment in #2898.. 03:24:58 now brb 03:33:09 Napkin: I noticed that when people post savefiles from CDO on mantis that they are in .tar.bz2 format 03:33:23 there's no reason to use tar anymore as it is a single file 03:33:38 galehar: napkin does not trust the Crawl archiver and has it disabled 03:33:54 the .tar.bz2 contains unpacked save components 03:33:58 galehar: 0.7 games still have a number of files 03:34:03 sorear: no, just the .cs 03:34:39 forgot about CAO 03:34:45 sorear: there's no way to disable the Crawl archiver, you may at most disable compression 03:35:05 sorear: it would be a massive pain to maintain both versions 03:35:43 well, if it is trivial, tar could be disabled only for CDO, but it's really not important. 03:36:14 kilobyte: awesome! I'm glad you were able to convince them 03:38:08 well, corruption due to lack of transactions was quite a pain 03:39:08 that's the main reason for the new format, multiple files are just unwieldy but not a cause of problems 03:45:55 I don't play online, so I often carry my savefile on a usb stick. The single file save is very convenient :) 03:46:55 is sif wrath still temporary? 03:48:40 only Nemelex has some sort of a permanent wrath 03:49:19 and it's finite in amount 03:49:49 and irrelevant if you refrain from using decks 03:54:40 lol, sorear 03:55:13 Napkin: do you have two moments? 03:55:32 -!- monky has quit [Quit: hello] 03:57:07 a player tracer for clouds would be /awesome/ 03:57:20 * sorear thinks about implementing it 04:00:10 sorear: it goes together with tracers for storms, and for those planned shotgun-targetted spells 04:01:43 what do you think about my idea: a common interface which, given a location the player targets, returns for every cell in LOS "affected" or "not affected" 04:02:08 so it could be fed beams (reusing the existing tracer), clouds, etc 04:02:43 also, it would be nice to show cells the beam passes through but doesn't affect -- like for most explosions 04:03:38 mephitic or ice storm are not smite targetted so you need a line of effect to the place you need the explosion to center 04:04:01 kilobyte: I like it, but what about non-deterministic stuff? 04:04:35 do we have those? (I'm not sure about freezing cloud) 04:05:30 in such cases, we could have two degrees: "likely affected" and "possibly affected". This would be great for spells that can miss, too -- anything behind the primary target would be "possibly affected". 04:06:21 so if you have an ally behind the target you'd see what's wrong 04:06:52 well, fire storm has a random radius 04:09:42 oh, I didn't know. That would be handled by the two-tier system too. 04:12:46 Having visitors at work at the moment, kilobyte 04:18:47 Michael Myers has written this paper we're processing now 04:18:56 the name, it distracts me ;( 04:25:46 -!- elliptic has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 04:35:07 I think I'm reasonably sure current zotdef code doesn't break any part of regular games 04:35:31 so while I'm not entirely happy with zotdef proper, it's probably safe to merge it already 04:35:34 any thoughts? 04:36:36 due: do you have any pending fixes, or should I proceed? 04:36:47 kilobyte: I've done no other significant changes 04:36:52 I've got a few stashed 04:36:59 but I can shift them into master without issue 04:38:42 kilobyte: you don't like zotdef? 04:39:07 yay for insane en_US.UTF-8 collate sorting _b before a and c 04:39:59 galehar: I mean, code issues. Like that massive list of functions defining monsters taking part in waves. 04:40:32 kilobyte: What about the increase in max items? 04:41:52 due: it doesn't break saves at least 04:42:36 shouldn't stuff like monsters taking part in waves be defined in an external source? 04:42:55 hm 04:43:01 I didn't get as far as the monster wave code 04:43:13 but I'm guessing that tehre wouldn't be any issues about outsourcing it to Lua? 04:43:27 certainly 04:43:43 there's duplication with the list of uniques per level, too 04:43:47 Perhaps it could even get moved to the vault definition. 04:44:00 indeed 04:44:34 but, should we wait with this before merging? 04:44:44 No 04:47:26 pushed the button... lemme compile and do some last tests 04:56:43 I sent everyone an email about group registration 04:56:50 Would appreciate comments, even just "aweesome idea +1". :) 05:03:13 03kilobyte * r64cee1c08b1e 10/crawl-ref/source/art-data.txt: Remove the stealth malus from Ring of Charms. 05:03:14 03kilobyte * r4ab9f68bb184 10/crawl-ref/source/ (describe.cc tilereg-skl.cc): Whitespace fixes. 05:03:15 due: seems a great idea 05:03:19 03kilobyte * rf694210ff3a5 10/crawl-ref/source/initfile.cc: Allow running directly with "crawl -zotdef". 05:03:31 what is the use of hostmasks? 05:03:32 03kilobyte * r84a49c78835f 10/crawl-ref/source/ (49 files in 4 dirs): Merge branch 'zotdef' 05:04:18 galehar: yes, that's what i thought. 05:10:19 galehar: vanity, basically. 05:10:33 galehar: identification in other places you go to, hides your IP address if you don't already have an unaffiliated mask. 05:12:44 ##crawl would rename to #crawl too, right? 05:13:01 otherwise having ## in one place and # in the other would cause confusion 05:13:32 kilobyte: Well, it's rax's channel. 05:13:53 Her choice really :) 05:16:23 And as always, vanity applies to most people. ;) 05:16:27 * due tickles neunon. 05:19:21 due: That's a wee some idea! 05:23:20 greensnark: :) 05:23:37 But you get to be crawl/unknown/greensnark 05:25:38 what's the second part? 05:26:00 Well, he's not crawl/developer/greensnark. :) 05:26:03 part-time-developer? 05:26:12 crawl/ex :P 05:26:14 project/membership/username seems to be the standard. 05:29:16 crawl/forumtroll/x 05:40:01 -!- ivan has quit [Quit: Coyote finally caught me] 05:40:13 -!- ivan has joined ##crawl-dev 06:00:39 -!- Mu_ has joined ##crawl-dev 06:24:56 -!- hashc has joined ##crawl-dev 06:27:31 -!- ahpla has quit [Changing host] 06:27:31 -!- ahpla has joined ##crawl-dev 06:27:55 -!- TGWi has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:49:17 hmm.. anybody with lots of C++ experience around? 06:49:23 not me 06:52:43 greensnark, ping? 06:54:28 -!- Vandal has joined ##crawl-dev 06:55:03 Boo 06:55:25 greensnark, I was pondering the idea of turning dgn_level_vetoed into an exception 06:55:42 how awful does that sound? 06:56:41 -!- syllogism has joined ##crawl-dev 06:56:44 Sounds fine 06:57:03 Speaking of exceptions, we should make sure we're compiling Lua with g++ and not gcc at some point 06:57:21 because, right now it's checked at arbitrary points, whereas with an exception, it could be caught near the call to _build_dungeon_level or so, once 06:57:32 Because lua_error does not unwind C++ stacks correctly unless Lua was compiled with a C++ compiler for exception support 06:58:29 greensnark, if it sounds fine to you, I guess I'll go for it, then. 06:58:38 greensnark, only I wonder how to do it best. 06:59:22 Sounds fairly straightforward to me; what's the issue? 06:59:57 well.. should I just replace all dgn_level_vetoed = true; with throw level_vetoed("some message") or similar? 07:00:00 Zaba: we can not assume Lua is compiled with particular settings 07:00:34 kilobyte, most vetos originate from C++ code 07:00:42 Zaba: in particular, private copies of libraries, especially those as big as Lua, are strictly forbidden by Linux/BSD distributions for security reasons 07:02:09 kilobyte, does that affect dgn_level_vetoed being turned into an exception, though? 07:03:15 Vetos are usually pure C++ stack frames since it's all in dungeon builder code 07:03:19 only if there's any Lua involved 07:03:29 but sadly, our dungeon builder code is peppered with it 07:03:31 But we already have code that'll leak with the wrong Lua 07:05:09 if there are leaks, they need to be fixed... the only builds that do use contrib Lua are Windows ones 07:05:33 While in general I agree with not bundling dependencies, Lua is kind of an exception 07:05:47 I don't think there's any direct lua interface to dgn_level_vetoed 07:05:48 Because most distros will provide Lua compiled with a C compiler 07:06:30 it's probably done through dgn_ensure_vault_placed 07:06:32 It's not like we can fix these leaks easily either; if I declare a std::string, then do a parameter check and need to use luaL_error, bam that string leaks if Lua uses longjmp instead of throw to handle the error 07:06:45 03kilobyte * r73fab0d36053 10/crawl-ref/source/ (abl-show.cc describe.cc): Mark functions named _foo static. 07:06:47 03kilobyte * r0be8ee0dcdb9 10/crawl-ref/source/macro.cc: Make an inlined function static. 07:06:49 03kilobyte * r996f026a1be5 10/crawl-ref/source/ (main.cc zotdef.cc zotdef.h): Evict a function to zotdef.cc 07:06:50 03kilobyte * r400095ad5f81 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-behv.cc: ZotdeF: rot according to the time elapsed, not number of monster turns. 07:07:40 03zaba * r8ba709c19871 10/crawl-ref/source/ (command.cc mon-pick.cc mon-pick.h): Remove use of mons_global_level to filter results from ?/M. 07:07:52 greensnark: a more important problem: due to the terrible design of C++ exceptions, there can be only one exception at once. Second one = instant crash without a chance to dump or clean the screen. 07:08:17 Yeah, C++ exceptions are a bit bolted on 07:08:36 But if you need to unwind the stack and run destructors, I'm not aware of a substitute 07:08:44 ZotdeF? How... interesting. 07:08:53 a typO 07:08:55 -!- OG17 has quit [Quit: OG17] 07:09:00 well, it just seemed to me that dgn_level_vetoed is something for which exceptions are the right tool 07:09:09 due: Aweesome ZotdeF 07:09:25 but I'm not sure, and that's why I ask people with more experience :P 07:10:24 greensnark: Did I misspell awesome somewhere? 07:10:58 due: You did! 07:11:23 11:56 <+due> Would appreciate comments, even just "aweesome idea +1". :) 07:11:43 Naturally I have been milking that typo for all it's worth 07:12:31 :| 07:12:41 * due drowns greensnark in milk. 07:14:44 -!- OG17 has joined ##crawl-dev 07:20:16 03kilobyte * r45151b0a0304 10/crawl-ref/source/files.cc: On the next compat break, drop -1000 from save/etc names. 07:20:59 luabind is pretty cool 07:21:24 Too bad it wants boost and stuff :P 07:22:33 I'm not sure if it makes sense to keep restrain with respect to dependencies 07:23:12 Well, if I were doing a one-man hobby project I certainly wouldn't worry about it 07:23:39 like, I'd could use pango for finding glyphs -- it does depend on fontconfig and glib, though 07:23:40 boost has a lot of handy stuff, but it's big and hits compile times 07:24:11 is it mostly template based, or properly encapsulated? 07:24:16 Well, tiles deps are ok, I think 07:24:27 boost has a lot of template-only stuff and also some libs 07:25:02 It's actually not too much of a problem on Linux - distro boosts are fine - and Windows where you can get binaries 07:25:14 Last time I used it on Mac I had to compile it myself, and the boost compile took nearly an hour :P 07:25:23 yay! 07:26:05 Stuff like pango sounds reasonable as a dependency 07:26:21 we currently recompile all contribs every time Crawl's build options change 07:26:55 Shouldn't the contrib build options be separate from Crawl build options 07:28:16 yeah, it shouldn't care whether we're building debug or optimized, tiles or console 07:29:14 fortunately except for people developing on Windows (galehar), it hurts only package builds 07:30:04 greensnark: do you remember if DGL builds rely on any chmods from Crawl's build process? 07:30:33 if it merely copies stuff to the chroot, it should work fine 07:30:39 cao's build does not, and I think Napkin explictly sets up permissions 07:31:16 I think it's just a copy + getting rid of the old setgid 07:31:34 Now that the setgid is gone I don't think any chmoding is involved, but Napkin would know 07:33:48 i use MCHMOD=0755 and MCHMOD_SAVEDIR=755 as compile parameters, patch SHARED_FILES_CHMOD_{PRIVATE,PUBLIC} in AppHdr.h to 0644 and have a separate install target in the makefile added 07:35:30 755 and 644 is no-op 07:40:33 hmm, it doesn't run Crawl's install target at all, it instead calls /var/lib/dgamelaunch/sbin/install-trunk.sh 07:40:46 I can't read that file so I don't know what's inside 07:41:35 VETO: D:3: Isolated areas with no stairs. 07:41:37 oh it works 07:46:07 before messing with the build system, I'll better update 07:47:02 hmm, something is broken. 07:47:09 with item generation 07:47:21 I wonder whether it's related to my local changes in dungeon.cc 07:47:28 or the recent zotdef merge 07:47:56 oh, what? 07:48:03 can somebody check? Just doing &d repeatedly through D brings up an unusual number of levels with an unusual number of unlinked items for me. 07:49:24 no unlinked items for me 07:50:36 hmm. 07:50:56 Zaba: Sounds like you're skipping the link items step 07:51:43 Unstable branch on CDO updated to: 0.8.0-a0-3468-g45151b0 (31.13) 07:51:52 hm.. let's see why that might be broken 07:53:00 ah 07:53:47 I am, indeed. 07:55:32 -!- eith has joined ##crawl-dev 07:57:05 is there a system that should not lock data files? 07:57:26 right now on Windows you can corrupt them if you run several Crawls at once 07:57:46 I don't think we support any non-multiuser system,so no 07:58:17 lomarcan77 (L1 DEWz) ASSERT(_read_offset+size <= _pbuf->size()) in 'tags.cc' at line 160 failed. (D:1) 07:58:19 lomarcan77 (L1 DEWz) ASSERT(_read_offset+size <= _pbuf->size()) in 'tags.cc' at line 160 failed. (D:1) 07:58:20 lomarcan77 (L1 DEWz) ASSERT(_read_offset+size <= _pbuf->size()) in 'tags.cc' at line 160 failed. (D:1) 07:58:29 lomarcan77 (L1 DEWz) ASSERT(_read_offset+size <= _pbuf->size()) in 'tags.cc' at line 160 failed. (D:1) 07:58:30 You know what 07:58:34 lomarcan77 (L1 DEWz) ASSERT(_read_offset+size <= _pbuf->size()) in 'tags.cc' at line 160 failed. (D:1) 07:58:35 I think something broke saves :) 07:59:31 Baraton (L23 DEFE) ASSERT(!invalid_monster(mon)) in 'state.cc' at line 405 failed. (Vault:3) 07:59:41 Baraton (L23 DEFE) ASSERT(!invalid_monster(mon)) in 'state.cc' at line 405 failed. (Vault:3) 07:59:45 Baraton (L23 DEFE) ASSERT(!invalid_monster(mon)) in 'state.cc' at line 405 failed. (Vault:3) 07:59:53 I just hope it wasn't me 07:59:58 Baraton (L23 DEFE) ASSERT(!invalid_monster(mon)) in 'state.cc' at line 405 failed. (Vault:3) 08:01:42 Baraton (L23 DEFE) ASSERT(!invalid_monster(mon)) in 'state.cc' at line 405 failed. (Vault:3) 08:02:44 yaay 08:03:35 hmm, I tested loading old saves, so it doesn't sound like a zotdef issue 08:03:45 no idea what, though 08:04:42 invalid_monster(mon) is either a null pointer or an invalid monster type, right? 08:14:07 omil (L11 HEAE) ASSERT(_read_offset+size <= _pbuf->size()) in 'tags.cc' at line 160 failed. (Lair:1) 08:14:09 omil (L11 HEAE) ASSERT(_read_offset+size <= _pbuf->size()) in 'tags.cc' at line 160 failed. (Lair:1) 08:14:18 omil (L11 HEAE) ASSERT(_read_offset+size <= _pbuf->size()) in 'tags.cc' at line 160 failed. (Lair:1) 08:16:52 omil (L11 HEAE) ASSERT(_read_offset+size <= _pbuf->size()) in 'tags.cc' at line 160 failed. (Lair:1) 08:17:37 yaay... got it 08:17:42 what is it? 08:21:32 03kilobyte * r66ff2975d2e7 10/crawl-ref/source/enum.h: Fix save compat, recovering pre-zotdef-merge games. 08:26:14 Unstable branch on CDO updated to: 0.8.0-a0-3469-g66ff297 (31.13) 08:30:25 Napkin: could you show me the top secret files in /var/lib/dgamelaunch/sbin/ ? They're root:root 0750. 08:30:45 mostly install-trunk.sh 08:41:33 -!- eith has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 08:41:56 greensnark, looks like using an exception for dgn_level_vetoed works 08:51:34 yes, gimme a minute, kilobyte 08:57:29 kilobyte: chmod o+r * - but please let me know when you are finished or have hacked my server ;) 09:02:07 Napkin: got it, will try haxoring :p 09:02:18 please don't 09:02:25 too much mess to clean-up ;) 09:05:13 so it does nothing but call "make cdo-install" as root... which does its own chmodding 09:05:40 exactly 09:05:59 which is required to separate the dgl user and the crawl user 09:09:10 unless you have some other idea how to do it? 09:15:01 no, that's fine... I'm just purging any chmodding from normal installs, I wondered what I need to preserve to avoid breaking CDO 09:15:21 roger 09:15:40 ok, with my track record, "avoiding breaking" is a pipe dream, let's settle on "trying to minimize damage" :p 09:16:20 hehe 09:16:26 !coffee kilobyte 09:16:26 * Henzell hands kilobyte a pot of cappuccino, brewed by Crazy Yiuf. 09:16:57 hmm. 09:17:35 Okay, it looks like in all cases where the normal_random_map_for_place build method might be invoked, it's really used for a random_map_in_depth vault 09:17:59 because _dgn_random_map_for_place is also used in _builder_by_branch, and I don't see it giving different results in subsequent calls. 09:22:04 -!- eith has joined ##crawl-dev 09:54:31 -!- humeral has joined ##crawl-dev 09:59:11 I'm working with a version I pulled from git a few days ago, and the Temple has 8 altars for Lugonu. Is this an intentional corruption by the god or a bug? 10:00:10 since she's the god of corruption, ... 10:00:40 Ok, thanks. 10:01:09 03zaba * r29d935899cb2 10/crawl-ref/source/dungeon.cc: dungeon.cc: Simplify _builder_normal, as PLACE: vaults are handled by _builder_by_branch. 10:01:19 03zaba * r04da6c68429d 10/crawl-ref/source/dungeon.cc: Convert dgn_level_vetoed into an exception. 10:01:42 I hope I didn't break anything... 10:01:57 or at least, I hope I will be able to fix anything I've broken 10:04:40 Morning! 10:09:44 moin Cryp71c 10:10:47 03dolorous * r2ece6d89e4b0 10/crawl-ref/source/zotdef.cc: Add spacing fixes. 10:10:48 03dolorous * r303a3cc33d04 10/crawl-ref/source/zotdef.cc: Add formatting fixes. 10:10:53 03dolorous * r8419c662afac 10/crawl-ref/source/zotdef.cc: Comment fixes. 10:10:55 03dolorous * r8fba4ecb349d 10/crawl-ref/source/zotdef.cc: Add minor cosmetic fix. 10:10:56 03dolorous * r09e7261ce6f6 10/crawl-ref/source/zotdef.cc: Simplify. 10:10:57 03dolorous * r40f395547b6c 10/crawl-ref/source/zotdef.cc: Make some functions static, and factor out unneeded parameters. 10:27:43 03kilobyte * re10a8ac6472a 10/crawl-ref/source/ng-input.cc: Remove an outdated check -- we can allow a player "bones" safely now. 10:37:53 -!- galehar has quit [Quit: Page closed] 10:44:40 03dolorous * r85cec736870a 10/crawl-ref/source/zotdef.cc: Move Zotdef danger messaging to its own function. 10:44:40 03dolorous * r4714bc64d088 10/crawl-ref/source/zotdef.cc: Add spacing fixes. 10:44:40 03dolorous * rec2dcc5b33d1 10/crawl-ref/source/zotdef.cc: Add formatting fix. 10:44:40 03dolorous * r03baf38873ae 10/crawl-ref/source/zotdef.cc: Simplify. 10:51:26 !tell dpeg poke poke, I poke you. 10:51:26 Cryp71c: OK, I'll let dpeg know. 10:58:03 03dolorous * rcdd09749c13f 10/crawl-ref/source/zotdef.cc: Add spacing fix. 10:58:13 03dolorous * rb842b0eedd03 10/crawl-ref/source/zotdef.cc: Typo fix. 10:58:14 03dolorous * ra18f6fc752dd 10/crawl-ref/source/zotdef.cc: Replace a magic number with a #define. 11:02:51 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 11:04:12 03dolorous * rf4b2deb83351 10/crawl-ref/source/zotdef.cc: Rename a variable, for consistency. 11:08:07 03dolorous * recfed463fc63 10/crawl-ref/source/zotdef.cc: Replace another magic number with a #define. 11:25:35 03dolorous * r1dcaf67bee59 10/crawl-ref/source/zotdef.cc: Simplify. 11:27:59 03dolorous * r8a69a6e5e0ed 10/crawl-ref/source/zotdef.cc: Add formatting fixes. 11:44:55 -!- hashc has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 11:50:35 03galehar * r05dc8604b38f 10/crawl-ref/source/skills2.cc: Fix simulating reskilling from a crosstrained skill. 12:27:18 -!- enne has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:27:44 -!- enne has joined ##crawl-dev 12:33:48 03j-p-e-g * r8ca0b340e865 10/crawl-ref/source/rltiles/ (dc-dngn/statues/dngn_statue_skull.png dc-feat.txt): Add another of LoginError's statue tiles. 12:33:51 03j-p-e-g * rc8286cb1b5f8 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/portals/wizlab.des: Use more specific statue tiles in some wizlab maps. 12:34:02 03j-p-e-g * rb3dc828d4904 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/branches/temple.des: Fix #2879: De-randomize corrupted_temple. Now 6 Lugonu, 6 random gods. 12:45:39 hmm 12:46:22 Felids don't actually die before they "rejoin the land of the living" (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=2902) by jpeg 12:50:34 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 12:55:30 03zaba * r79fa5f4202e2 10/crawl-ref/source/dungeon.cc: Remove unused level_type argument from _builder_items. 12:55:31 03zaba * r0e71f3deebc7 10/crawl-ref/source/dungeon.cc: Split generation of pan levels from _builder_by_type into a separate function. 12:55:32 03zaba * re543584e624e 10/crawl-ref/source/ (aptitudes.h makefile skills2.cc): Split skill aptitudes from skills2.cc into aptitudes.h. 12:58:20 -!- Noom has joined ##crawl-dev 13:37:10 -!- eith has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:46:18 -!- monky has joined ##crawl-dev 14:04:12 -!- TGWi has joined ##crawl-dev 14:18:26 -!- OG17 has quit [Quit: OG17] 14:24:11 -!- OG17 has joined ##crawl-dev 14:49:02 -!- syllogism has quit [] 14:50:10 -!- galehar has joined ##crawl-dev 14:50:14 -!- Pseudonut has joined ##crawl-dev 15:09:21 03gafrie * r6dac77244f8a 10/crawl-ref/source/ (8 files): Show feature mimics in dungeon overview 15:09:23 03gafrie * r61c8f95f778d 10/crawl-ref/source/ (mon-stuff.cc mon-util.cc stash.cc stash.h terrain.cc): Feature mimics appearing in search results 15:13:02 -!- Noom has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 15:32:46 -!- elliptic_ has joined ##crawl-dev 15:32:54 -!- Zaba has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 15:34:09 -!- upsy has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:34:47 -!- Pseudonut has quit [*.net *.split] 15:34:47 -!- enne has quit [*.net *.split] 15:34:47 -!- elliptic has quit [*.net *.split] 15:34:47 -!- ahpla has quit [*.net *.split] 15:34:48 -!- RjY has quit [*.net *.split] 15:35:12 -!- elliptic_ is now known as elliptic 15:37:30 -!- enne has joined ##crawl-dev 15:37:30 -!- ahpla has joined ##crawl-dev 15:37:30 -!- RjY has joined ##crawl-dev 15:39:04 elliptic, here, by chance? (and are you familiar with map_knowledge and any of its functionality? 15:39:20 here but not familiar, sorry 15:40:06 butchering and staff of power got fixed? 15:40:16 that's awesome 15:40:58 tgwi: old news 15:41:02 no u 15:41:22 -!- Zaba has joined ##crawl-dev 15:43:34 Zaba, I don't suppose you're familiar with map_knowledge and its functionality? 15:46:41 03gafrie * r275271efb72f 10/crawl-ref/source/tileview.cc: Fix door mimic displayed tile 15:46:52 03gafrie * rd67b2a10d552 10/crawl-ref/source/viewmap.cc: Cycling through features mimics 15:47:39 -!- Pseudonut has joined ##crawl-dev 15:47:49 -!- Textmode has joined ##crawl-dev 16:03:29 -!- Cryp71c has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:09:00 -!- Pseudonut has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:34:34 -!- Noom has joined ##crawl-dev 16:35:17 -!- galehar has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.12/20101026210630]] 16:47:31 03gafrie * r01172fd65793 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-place.cc: Fix stair mimics colouring 17:02:50 Xom killing characters by switching to a Vampiric weapon (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=2903) by Ashenai 17:39:15 -!- eith has joined ##crawl-dev 17:48:32 -!- Zaba has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 17:56:56 -!- Zaba has joined ##crawl-dev 17:57:13 argh wtf? 17:57:24 Someobody wants to move official development conversation for the... unofficialforum? 17:58:04 hey due did you see this 17:58:06 !lg * ckiller=~eld 17:58:06 1. 78291 the Intangible Farmer (L27 HECK), worshipper of Xom, slain by an eldritch tentacle (called by Ykumeo) in Pandemonium (rand demon 7) on 2010-11-30, with 638160 points after 213206 turns and 11:34:22. 17:58:31 YAY :D 17:58:35 :D 17:58:39 :D :D :D: D :D 17:59:10 <3 17:59:18 Argh this infuriates me to not extent. 17:59:28 due: what is this? 17:59:54 http://dungeoncrawlstonesoup.freeforums.org/game-development-forum-t52.html 18:00:13 Some snippets: Also, I think for the most part devs and expert players are the ones primarily contributing to the development discussion, which might not be a great thing. It's kinda like senators on capital hill deciding all the minutiae of our day-to-day laws that the commoner cant make heads or tails of. 18:01:11 nice 18:01:17 due: i don't see anything wrong with that POV 18:01:29 i guess you have to win an election to join this channel 18:01:40 Eronarn: that is totally wrong on so many levels? 18:01:44 good thing no one voted against me 18:02:02 due: it's not totally wrong 18:02:09 ... 18:02:23 let's have miss May from sales have a say in kernel development! 18:02:31 kilobyte: That too. 18:02:52 there's nothing wrong with feedback -- in fact we want more from newbie players 18:02:56 this channel is largely people who have been involved in crawl for a while, either as developers or players or both; that might nto be a great thing; a lot of people not initiated into the culture of crawl's development, game development, opensource development, etc. would find it pretty confusing if they tried to immerse themselves 18:03:11 i'm confused by how "for the most part devs are the ones primarily contributing to the development discussion" isn't just being silly, tongue-in-cheek, or trolling 18:03:12 there are definitely elements of truth in what you pasted 18:03:24 Okay, I'll rephrase 18:03:37 The comment seems to think that there is something *wrong* with this. 18:03:46 but I'm not going to look for random forums to learn that "it would be nice to be able to backup saves" 18:03:51 I'm not arguing that it isn't the case, but the comment seems to suggest that devs and expert players isBAD. 18:03:51 it's not like, morally wrong 18:04:04 it might not be best practices 18:04:08 It's like "omg no they don't LISTEN to us". 18:05:06 In that case, I agree with their argument. More non-devs should do development. And stop complaining. ;) 18:05:10 due: i think the lesson to take from this is that some crawl players feel out of touch with crawl developers 18:05:38 this doesn't mean crawl's development needs to be overhauled but it could mean more PR by devs could result in happier players 18:05:55 https://crawl.develz.org/wiki/doku.php?id=user:dpeg 18:06:11 They only feel otu of touch because they haven't taken the effort to look. 18:07:37 sure, but can't change the players you have (easily); all you can do is cater to their proclivities 18:07:57 maybe this means making it blindingly obvious how to be involved with crawl development, instead of just obvious 18:08:53 Why? 18:08:57 What benefit do we get out of it? 18:17:30 Hm, no david. 18:18:16 The spell Invisibility is really loud. (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=2904) by elliptic 18:22:23 Okay, I've gottne three "excellent" replies to my email abotu group registrattion 18:22:37 And a lot of "go ahead" feedback on IRC. 18:22:42 Should I jsut go ahead and start the ball rolling now? 18:33:12 due: sure, why not? 18:33:28 "If a process terminates with a portion of a file locked or closes a file that has outstanding locks, the locks are unlocked by the operating system. However, the time it takes for the operating system to unlock these locks depends upon available system resources. Therefore, it is recommended that your process explicitly unlock all files it has locked when it terminates. If this is not done, access to these files may be denied if the operating system 18:33:38 yay Windows... now this is totally broken 18:34:06 ... 18:34:12 It cut off at "operating system"? 18:35:48 And done! 18:35:49 hrm, irssi didn't show this as cut for me, but looking at doy's log, it was 18:38:10 the benefit you get out of happier players is happier players :P 18:38:33 kilobyte: I've had this issue before, it's odd. 18:49:01 irc has a max message length 18:52:59 Zannick: yes, but irssi is supposed to block overlong ones and tell you 18:53:15 instead of silently dropping a part 18:53:18 i've not seen that 18:53:29 however, irssi does block multi-line pastes 18:54:05 for me, it doesn't block but asks for confirmation 18:54:07 yeah, it seems to prompt on multi-line pastes, but not overly long single lines 18:54:27 yeah, that's what i meant 18:54:31 :| 18:54:33 irssifail :( 18:54:36 Maybe there is a script. 18:54:58 i don't think any client i've used for irc does that 18:55:03 at least by default 18:55:12 That's strange. It's not exactly a difficult thing to Judge. 18:55:42 indeed, the server tells you what it is when you connect 18:58:20 any idea when Crawl started requiring three instead of one rune? 18:58:43 I get a feeling that this part of the code might be a bit obsolete :p 18:59:23 At least 0.4.5? 18:59:49 before 0.4, i'm sure 19:01:05 I'd look at 2.0 or so 19:02:10 if you paste overly long junk on mirc, you'll just flood yourself out 19:02:13 irssi at least has a check! 19:10:03 -!- valrus has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:13:15 03kilobyte * r4f5ad0ec0879 10/crawl-ref/source/ouch.cc: Felids: fix missing "You die...". 19:13:17 03kilobyte * r7483cde5dc48 10/crawl-ref/source/AppHdr.h: Remove an unimplemented "new" option from 9 years ago. 19:13:18 03kilobyte * r5c297c58a73e 10/crawl-ref/source/ (AppHdr.h fight.cc): Remove an unmaintained option to remove the "new" str-dex weighting. 19:13:20 03kilobyte * rcc0a54443d7f 10/crawl-ref/source/ (AppHdr.h spl-transloc.cc): Remove an option to disable "new" semi-controlled blink. 19:13:42 03kilobyte * r07d06e55d44b 10/crawl-ref/source/ (AppHdr.h defines.h): Move the num of runes needed define, it's not really user-configurable. 19:13:50 "new" <3. 19:14:09 it's what the comments said 19:14:31 I know. <3. 19:35:56 -!- Pseudonut has joined ##crawl-dev 20:11:18 -!- Zaba has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:13:19 -!- Mu_ has quit [Quit: Defecator, may everything turn out okay so that you can leave this place.] 20:22:29 -!- Zaba has joined ##crawl-dev 20:26:21 When are the good gods being put on the explore system? :o 20:26:28 I wanted to try a Paladin with that in place 20:42:42 technically there's no pressing need since they hate undead and excommunicate lichen 20:43:31 I just thought that was one of the main points of even implementing it 20:43:41 there was an option to disable str weighting? 20:43:48 lol, did you use lichen to mean the lich family 20:43:49 Vandal: well, it's being used for ashenzari 20:43:55 casmith789: lichen is definitely the plural of lich 20:43:59 what else would that word mean?! 20:44:05 I know that part TGW 20:44:06 a lichen 20:44:19 I just figured they would enable it on the good gods like they were intending to 20:44:20 lichen <3. 20:44:29 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lichen 20:44:36 I thought they didn't like the whole gaining piety over time thing 20:44:59 casmith789: psh, like we can trust wikipedia 20:45:05 nethack has lichen doesn't it 20:45:10 they leave corpses 20:45:18 yes 20:45:27 liches is the plural of lich. sorry 20:45:42 should be lichen 20:48:45 ox -> oxen, lich -> lichen 20:49:07 and everyone knows that english words can be determined by extrapolation 20:49:45 Vandal: while sitting in the Temple shouldn't give free piety, I don't think the good gods would care for exploration 20:49:46 bench->benches, lich->liches 20:50:13 benchen 20:50:16 ok 20:50:16 ok 20:50:38 are there any words that end with -ch that pluralize this way? 20:50:53 ox -> oxen or vax -> vaxen end with -x 20:50:55 it''s liches 20:51:03 x -> en is the standard 20:51:09 ch -> es 20:51:17 boxes is the worst ever 20:51:30 should be boxen 20:51:49 wait so 20:51:52 raxen? 20:52:00 yes. 20:52:03 kilo are you saying the team is backing away from giving them the explore system? 20:52:09 :[ 20:52:37 http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/boxen has an explanation why it's wrong 20:52:38 Raxen? 20:52:52 Oh well, I remember that being one of dpeg's things he used to talk about 20:53:10 rax: not yet, there's only one of you. so far. 20:53:44 (but a raxen boxen may contain multitudes. of raxen.) 20:54:00 english is a horrible language and I hate it 20:54:24 monky: though, plough, drought, draught, ought 20:54:41 , augh 20:54:45 rax! <3. 21:09:26 wiktionary has a huge category "plurals ending in -en", but all but 4 are redundant 21:09:50 5 21:10:01 kilobyte: FYI it was a joke 21:10:03 [wo]men, children, oxen, boxen, brethren 21:10:41 is "brethren" the plural of "brethr"? 21:11:11 TGWi: It's a group term. 21:11:21 TGWi: Which, I believe, doesn't hav ea singular form. 21:11:22 most of those words aren't derived in the same way anymore even if they are etymologically related 21:11:24 Oh. 21:11:27 also "boxen" is redundant and also wrong 21:11:33 It's an archaic plural form of brother. 21:12:02 there was "sistren" too but this is no longer correct 21:12:23 * due goes out. 21:14:02 xboxen :D 21:30:11 03kilobyte * r466ea97c5374 10/crawl-ref/source/ (AppHdr.h database.cc files.cc files.h): Drop any chmod() calls from inside Crawl. 21:30:22 03kilobyte * ra82b27b5ab38 10/crawl-ref/source/files.cc: Use one-argument version of mkdir() on Windows. 21:30:23 03kilobyte * r4180ca9b4b34 10/crawl-ref/source/ (6 files): Implement file locking on Windows. 21:30:24 03kilobyte * r01cf0f439879 10/crawl-ref/source/files.cc: Don't ever use uids in filenames on Windows. 21:30:25 03kilobyte * r1e100b044bf2 10/crawl-ref/source/ (AppHdr.h files.cc hiscores.cc initfile.cc initfile.h): Get rid of MULTIUSER logic. 21:30:28 03kilobyte * re7411984a26f 10/crawl-ref/source/ (hiscores.cc hiscores.h): Don't write uids to score files anymore. 21:30:30 03kilobyte * r35f7dc9cf9b5 10/crawl-ref/ (docs/crawl.6 source/main.cc): Mention -zotdef in the command line help. 21:31:07 -!- Vandal has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 21:42:08 -!- elliptic has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:53:55 -!- Twilight13 has joined ##crawl-dev 21:56:47 -!- Twilight-1 has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 22:01:20 -!- Vandal has joined ##crawl-dev 22:06:45 -!- ZChris13 has joined ##crawl-dev 22:17:03 -!- dnr has joined ##crawl-dev 22:17:33 Hello? 22:17:50 hi there 22:17:55 Hi 22:18:00 quiet in here 22:18:43 Neunon told me that I should come here to ask which devs if any want to be mods on the forum 22:19:23 He's asked if he could be a mod, I already have galehar as a mod, and two other mods who are not devs. 22:38:24 -!- Twilight-1 has joined ##crawl-dev 22:41:55 -!- Twilight13 has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:44:23 -!- eith has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 23:03:51 -!- casmith789 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:03:58 -!- casmith789 has joined ##crawl-dev 23:37:00 Windows development builds on CDO updated to: 0.8.0-a0-3513-g35f7dc9