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02:45:12 <Fangorn_> Anyone know what the irc username is that corresponds to rob in Mantis?
02:46:27 <casmith789> by
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02:53:31 <Fangorn_> !tell by I've attached a patch to Mantis issue 354 that should fix the problem.
02:53:32 <Henzell> Fangorn_: OK, I'll let by know.
02:55:15 <sorear> I don't know about by, but Mantis automatically sends me e-mail every time someone attaches a file to a ticket
02:57:12 <Fangorn_> Is that something you setup in Mantis preferences?
02:57:40 <sorear> don't remember
02:58:21 <Fangorn_> I see a preference for emails when notes are added, but not when files are attached...in any case, I did both.
02:58:42 <Fangorn_> I just wanted !tell him, since he has the bug assigned to him
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03:20:39 <CIA-39> 03matt.tadd * r86efab317e96 10/crawl-ref/source/item_use.cc: Fix cycling quiver backwards from first item (part of #354).
03:21:21 <by> Fangorn_: thanks
03:21:44 <Fangorn_> you're welcome
03:22:03 <by> I'd missed the bug being reopened
03:23:00 <Fangorn_> its small bugs like that that are good for me to familiarize myself with the codebase
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03:33:08 <sorear> Fangorn_: would you prefer to be listed in the CREDITS as Matthew Tadd, Fangorn, both, neither, or something else?
03:33:32 <Fangorn_> my name, Matthew Tadd, please
03:35:33 <CIA-39> 03stefan * r7fac83e35222 10/crawl-ref/CREDITS.txt: Add Matthew Tadd (Fangorn) to CREDITS.txt
03:36:06 <Fangorn_> :)
03:36:24 <sorear> HEY
03:36:40 <sorear> git forgot my e-mail
03:37:52 <Fangorn_> you're note at stefan@localhost.localdomain?
03:37:56 <Fangorn_> not?
03:38:46 <sorear> :p
03:39:20 <greensnark> Better than root@localhost.localdomain
03:39:22 <greensnark> Barely
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03:42:40 <sorear> ah, apparently git was using the darcs EMAIL variable
03:42:53 <sorear> which I got rid of in a rc purge last week
03:44:26 <Fangorn_> you didn't specify it in git config <--global>?
03:45:07 <sorear> no, it automatically scraped it from my darcs config, so I never set it
03:46:36 <Ashenzari> Crash on level exit (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=1992) by serg271
04:01:49 <KiloByte> a crapload of other things use EMAIL from the env
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04:15:18 <ortoslon> Enne: skills in skill training menu are one of few remaning things that look clickable but aren't
04:20:40 <greensnark> due: Can you use a different font on the body of the banner?
04:20:53 <greensnark> The new font looks quite different from the old banner font
04:21:07 <due> greensnark: Really?
04:21:15 <greensnark> Yes, I just compared the hare and free will
04:21:20 <due> greensnark: Sure, I'll double check.
04:21:24 <greensnark> New font looks pretty bad :(
04:21:26 <due> I might've fucked up and not installed the font.
04:21:43 <due> Sorry, I got distracted with my new HTC Desire :)
04:22:02 <due> You're right, different font. Weird.
04:22:27 <greensnark> The fine print at the bottom of the banner looks about the same
04:22:36 <greensnark> Have fun with Android :)
04:23:24 <greensnark> Also, if you can crop it to the same size as the others, it'd be awesome :)
04:29:03 <due> :)
04:29:07 <due> I was in too much of a hurry to add them.
04:32:38 <greensnark> Take your time, but having the new images soon would be nice so the rules page doesn't look broken :)
04:33:22 <greensnark> Meh, the old Nemelex Choice code expects Henzell's db of all games to be up-to-date
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04:42:52 <due> hey mu
04:42:55 <Mu_> yo
04:53:45 <Keskitalo> Afternoons!
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05:09:10 <Mu_> i get an error trying to pull from sprintgit
05:11:42 <due> poke bilokyte?
05:12:23 <Mu_> KiloByte
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05:17:12 <Napkin> Moin!
05:17:21 <due> moin napking
05:17:32 <Napkin> hey due :) how's it going?
05:18:17 <Napkin> I've did a lot of whining last night, trying to install tiles on my debian without using a system-wide installation :D
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05:18:42 <Napkin> but it was worth it - new tiles look smoooooth :)
05:19:20 <Napkin> *i've done
05:22:20 <due> they are nice
05:33:34 <KiloByte> Mu_: yay, a yet another power failure that lasted longer than the UPS can hold
05:33:49 <Mu_> D:
05:34:08 <syllogism> was meph really nerfed, not noticing much difference
05:34:33 <KiloByte> Mu_: and the vserver I isolated the git-daemon into is not set to start on boot
05:35:56 <KiloByte> allowing anonymous pushes is not a good idea, even if the box is heavily sandboxed and has no direct connectivity
05:36:57 <KiloByte> dpeg wanted it to work without having to set up accounts and keys, but it's definitely not something I want to keep
05:46:43 * due pushes your anonymously.
05:46:44 <Napkin> maybe i should finally set up gitosis on CDO?
05:47:46 <Napkin> what about github and gitorious - are they more reliable than sourceforge?
05:48:26 <greensnark> Pretty hard to be less reliable than Sourceforge :)
05:48:39 <Napkin> hehe
05:50:56 <greensnark> syllogism: You have ideas to fix Makhleb/Trog issues in Sprint?
05:50:56 <due> gitorious! gitosis! glithub?
05:51:23 <Napkin> anyone ever setup gitosis yet?
05:56:29 <syllogism> I don't see any other option than to either increase the piety cost or slow their piety gain rates. Well, you could just disallow them for the tournament but that's just bandaid
05:56:30 <Napkin> oh, hey due?
05:56:34 <syllogism> and fighter types need berserk in sprint
05:56:40 <due> Napkin: hm?
05:56:52 <Napkin> any idea how to best add the new crawl*setup.exe to our trunk page?
05:56:55 <due> syllogism: Oh, increase piety cost of ability
05:57:00 <syllogism> yes
05:57:02 <due> Napkin: Just add a new identifier?
05:57:07 <due> syllogism: And decrease piety gain for non-player kills
05:57:16 <syllogism> oh, that works too
05:57:18 <Napkin> but it's .exe - not zip
05:57:23 <due> Napkin: Hm, gimme a sec
05:57:30 <due> That way you don't get the whole feedback loop
05:57:33 <Napkin> and i guess it should be listed on the main page, not only archives
05:58:11 <Napkin> maybe like this?
05:58:12 <Napkin> ----
05:58:12 <Napkin> windows
05:58:13 <Napkin> - installer
05:58:19 <Napkin> - tiles zip
05:58:24 <Napkin> - console zip
05:58:27 <Napkin> mac osx
05:58:30 <Napkin> - tiles zip
05:59:01 <Napkin> - console zip
05:59:19 <Napkin> ----
05:59:30 <due> Hm, new installer will be more difficult.
05:59:31 <Napkin> yeah, i can imagine
06:00:04 <syllogism> it seems to me increasing the piety cost would work better, but it's not very elegant
06:00:10 <Napkin> globbing to crawl*zip|crawl*exe? and then a new default identifier?
06:00:34 <due> Napkin: basically what I'm doing
06:00:41 <syllogism> better than fiddling with the piety growth rates that is
06:00:41 <ortoslon> i sent an email about approaching 0.7 to the indiegames.com/blog editor (who i'm kinda friends with)
06:00:42 <greensnark> I'm less concerned with elegance than simplicity-of-fix here
06:00:56 <due> :q!
06:00:58 <due> Oops, not vim.
06:01:03 * Napkin bows to the python hacker *
06:01:40 <greensnark> syllogism: 2.5x piety cost for Sprint greater servants and BiA?
06:01:49 <syllogism> that sounds good
06:01:52 <greensnark> Ok
06:01:59 <ortoslon> i've talked to him about dcss earlier, he said he didn't post about it because he didn't have time to play it
06:02:42 <due> Napkin: should b eable to just add the signifiers now
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06:03:27 <syllogism> ??piety
06:03:27 <Henzell> piety[1/6]: With your current god, you have a piety number nominally from 1-200.  If your piety reaches 0, you are excommunicated.  piety[2] describes piety and penance.  piety[3] describes piety growth in general.  piety[4] describes piety growth for each god.  piety[5] describes uses of piety.  piety[6] tells you how you can determine your piety.
06:03:35 <syllogism> ??piety{6]
06:03:35 <Henzell> I don't have a page labeled piety6 in my learndb.
06:03:39 <syllogism> ??piety[6]
06:03:39 <Henzell> piety[6/6]: Piety display: 0-5 Sinner, displeased; 6-20 Believer, noncommittal; 21-29 Believer, pleased; 30-40 *, pleased; 41-49 *, most; 50-70 **, most; 71-74 **, greatly; 75-99 ***, greatly; 100 ****, greatly; 101-119 ****, extremely; 120-130 *****, extremely; 131-160 *****, exalted; 161-200 ******, exalted
06:03:49 <syllogism> do you get the abilities at 120 piety?
06:04:37 <Napkin> due: you mean you are still at it or I should?
06:04:41 <due> Napkin: you can :)
06:04:42 <due> I'm lazing
06:05:05 <Napkin> i'm a bit worried, how to add a new default signifier to show up on the main page
06:05:34 <syllogism> I think you do, so that would still allow quite a few servants at once but you wouldn't be able to use them every encounter
06:05:47 <Napkin> !coffee due
06:05:48 * Henzell hands due a mug of black coffee, brewed by Snorg.
06:05:51 <Napkin> pretty please :)
06:06:21 <due> oh, new signifiers on the main page are a paaain
06:06:31 <due> i'll do them presently :)
06:06:35 * Napkin whistles innocently *
06:06:38 <Napkin> thank you! :)
06:06:57 <CIA-39> 03greensnark * r8d37da42549e 10/crawl-ref/source/ (initfile.cc initfile.h macro.cc main.cc): Fix macro_dir handling (Napkin).
06:07:11 <Napkin> thank you! :)
06:07:27 <greensnark> Still can't set it in .rc though :P
06:07:42 <Napkin> where is it saved now?
06:07:48 <greensnark> Once you set savedir and datadir you can only change macro path in -macro command line
06:08:04 <Napkin> ok, will try :)
06:08:08 <greensnark> We should probably default it to use the homedir
06:08:15 <greensnark> ~/.crawl/macro.txt maybe
06:08:22 <Napkin> i'd love that
06:08:54 <Napkin> well, actually.. if DATADIR is giving, it should default to DATADIR/settings/
06:09:26 <Napkin> how come it does so when compiling for windows?
06:09:38 <Napkin> but not for my favorite OS!? ;)
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06:10:51 <Napkin> but a general .crawl folder would be awesome
06:11:29 <Napkin> giving prefix or DESTDIR without SAVEDIR/DATADIR created ~/saves and ~/morgues - that's terrible
06:11:55 <Napkin> my precious $HOME
06:14:04 <Napkin> I think greensnark hates me now ;>
06:14:33 <greensnark> I can't clean up the entire mess now
06:15:05 <Napkin> well, the macro file was the important one
06:15:15 <greensnark> I need a vacation from Crawl and tournament :P
06:15:30 <due> poor greensnark :(
06:15:59 <Napkin> barbecue on August 6th - join us :)
06:16:14 <greensnark> Germany is a bit far :)
06:16:28 <Napkin> ahh, just a few hours ;)
06:20:36 <bhaak> he's talking like a programmer :)
06:21:34 <Napkin> even if I run danger of being kicked now, selecting a "(M)acro raw" blanks the entire screen after typing the key you want to macro something to (in tiles)
06:21:47 <greensnark> Mantis :)
06:22:52 <Napkin> yes sir! :-P
06:23:09 <syllogism> oh it does :P
06:24:54 <syllogism> on my keyboard macro handling seems better in Tiles than console. E.g. I don't need to press space (or some other key) after ~ to get the macro prompt
06:25:18 <Napkin> ~ is a co-called dead key for you
06:25:22 <Napkin> *so-called
06:25:26 <syllogism> yes
06:25:35 <Napkin> what xkb keymap do you use?
06:25:51 <greensnark> Napkin: He uses Win 7 x64 :)
06:25:58 <Napkin> with putty?
06:26:13 <greensnark> Oh, putty
06:26:22 <Napkin> hmm... putty in linux takes over my keymap - no clue about windows
06:26:40 <syllogism> this was offline, I'll look into putty settings
06:26:47 <Ashenzari> Ranged elemental brands get no bonus damage (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=1993) by ledtim
06:27:12 <Napkin> you'll probably have to change the windows keyboard setting per application
06:29:21 <CIA-39> 03greensnark * rdeeda1288b74 10/crawl-ref/source/ (initfile.cc macro.cc): Dump macro file in ~/.crawl/macro.txt by default on Unix.
06:29:30 <greensnark> That macro change will probably confuse the crap out of Windows users now
06:29:44 <greensnark> Because when I say "on Unix" I meant "everywhere" :P
06:30:02 <Napkin> *giggle*
06:30:06 <greensnark> Napking made me do it
06:30:14 <syllogism> should have added (Napkin) then
06:30:19 <Napkin> yeah, blame it on me :D
06:30:21 <Napkin> too late :-P
06:30:43 <greensnark> Anyway, hopefully all that'll happen is that Windows users will wonder where their old macros went
06:31:03 <greensnark> Someone filed a bug saying that the Windows installer didn't find saves they created with the zipped Crawl
06:31:08 <syllogism> !lg fangorn
06:31:08 <Sequell> 404. Fangorn the Magician (L3 HuWz), slain by a gnoll (a +0,+0 spear of reaching) on D:2 on 2010-07-15, with 147 points after 1636 turns and 0:13:57.
06:31:49 <Ashenzari> Raw macro blanks screen when awaiting "Input macro action" (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=1994) by Napkin
06:32:00 <Napkin> maybe because kilobyte's compile had zipped savegames activated?
06:32:07 <Napkin> i think the CDO doesn't do that
06:32:14 <Napkin> *i think the CDO build doesn't do that
06:32:20 <Napkin> not entirely sure though
06:32:33 <greensnark> No, saves were saved in current directory with the old Windows builds
06:32:47 <greensnark> While the installer uses a subdir of the user's home dir for saves
06:32:57 <greensnark> Naturally the two Crawls won't find each other's stuff
06:33:42 <Napkin> well, difference is only, that on CDO i need to specify DESTDIR
06:33:56 <Napkin> if I understood kilobyte correctly
06:34:01 <KiloByte> generally, if Crawl is installed in a place like C:\Program Files\Crawl, it won't have write permission to its own directory
06:34:05 <greensnark> We need to create a crawl-paths.cc that deals exclusively with initializing the 3000 paths we use for various things
06:34:17 * Napkin hides *
06:34:34 <Napkin> in a separate folder, please, greensnark - thinking gource :>
06:34:36 <KiloByte> unless you run with admin rights on XP, or have both admin rights _and_ UAC disabled on Vista/7
06:34:52 <greensnark> KiloByte: Yes, the new installer's behaviour is correct
06:35:07 <syllogism> on vista that's likely :P
06:35:14 <Napkin> viswhat?!
06:36:01 <Napkin> are you telling me, that if a poweruser installs some software in >=XP, the folder of the software doesn't belong to him anymore?
06:36:12 <Napkin> *>XP
06:36:13 <KiloByte> greensnark: if you do so, please add SCORE_PATH and BONES_PATH, please
06:36:24 <greensnark> Not doing that now
06:36:31 <greensnark> I want to do a minimum of Crawl crap
06:36:43 <greensnark> My tournament backlog is long enough without screwing with Crawl :P
06:37:09 <KiloByte> Napkin: in XP, I think "power users" can write to C:\Program Files\, but since I don't use Windows when I don't have to, I'm not really sure
06:37:25 <Napkin> heh.. so we need a portable version of crawl soon?
06:37:40 <greensnark> Napkin: Also, I'm afraid I won't be picking these changes for 0.7 :)
06:37:53 <greensnark> Maybe 0.7.1
06:37:55 <KiloByte> the zip files kind of do that... they need to be copied somewhere manually
06:38:04 <syllogism> Appdata\Roaming\.crawl\macro.txt :(
06:38:12 <Napkin> not even the one about macros always being saved in $PWD/settings/ ? :-O
06:38:15 <greensnark> syllogism: Roaming? :P
06:38:19 <syllogism> yes
06:38:25 <greensnark> Haha
06:38:41 <Napkin> am I seriously the only one, doing a local install in linux?
06:38:59 <CIA-39> 03greensnark * r33f1f0de87d0 10/crawl-ref/source/initfile.cc: Use ~/.crawl/macro.txt as default macro file only on Unix, fix compile with SAVE_DIR_PATH set and !DGAMELAUNCH (oops).
06:39:01 <greensnark> Probably not
06:39:15 <greensnark> However, I don't want to complicate my 0.7 life at this point
06:39:46 <Napkin> well, ok, i can live with "cd $CRAWL; ../bin/crawl"
06:39:57 <Napkin> just thought it might be confusing for others
06:40:40 <greensnark> True
06:40:52 <KiloByte> greensnark: I feel really bad we don't have secure saves on multiuser systems yet.  Or, we do but only if Crawl is configured to not use shared scores and bones.
06:41:03 <greensnark> The problem with these changes is that every platform out there has to be tested
06:41:17 <Napkin> yeah, I understand
06:41:19 <greensnark> KiloByte: Go ahead and fix the problem? :)
06:41:40 <greensnark> It won't go in for 0.7, but at least 0.8 won't have the issue
06:41:59 <Napkin> i'll test the installer built on CDO in my xp vm
06:42:11 <greensnark> Ok, let me take these fixes for 0.7 tentatively
06:42:15 <greensnark> If they explode I'll revert them
06:42:18 <KiloByte> hmm, right.  I'm not sure what to do with the db, but it's not that important.
06:42:23 <greensnark> Also let me do the rc2 now
06:43:12 <greensnark> KiloByte: Can you check if SAVEDIR=~/foo works with master
06:43:27 <Napkin> don't announce it yet, greensnark - due is still busy with the trunk page
06:43:29 <KiloByte> greensnark: actually, I'll see how intrusive that patch would be.  If not very, I may include it in Debian patches and merge in 0.7.1
06:43:43 <KiloByte> greensnark: I fixed it a week ago, but lemme check again
06:43:58 <greensnark> Yeah, if it doesn't break save-location for existing 0.7 installs we can take it for 0.7.1
06:44:01 <KiloByte> since it's something no one tests until packaging time
06:44:33 <greensnark> Napkin: I think due is busy with his HTC :P
06:46:25 <Napkin> ok, behavior with current installer of 0.7.0-rc1-27-g8c4d6e6
06:47:01 <KiloByte> greensnark: the situation for 0.7 is: SAVEDIR=/var/games/crawl -> unsecure saves, shared unsecure db, shared score, shared bones.  SAVEDIR=~/.crawl -> secure saves, secure wasteful db, unshared saves, unshared bones.
06:47:34 <Napkin> folders morgue and saves created in $HOME\Application Data\crawl - while macro.txt is saved in $PROGAMS\Crawl\settings\macro.txt
06:47:48 <KiloByte> greensnark: we can pick either variant (at build time), moving to the other variant will make saves unaccessible
06:48:56 <Napkin> so - when uninstalling your macros are deleted as well
06:49:10 <Napkin> morgues and saves remain
06:49:20 <KiloByte> Napkin: that's definitely a bug
06:49:22 <Napkin> <- xp sp3, admin
06:49:40 <KiloByte> Napkin: even worse, it will make macros unsaveable at all on multiuser
06:50:25 <Napkin> and it will delete all modification to the files in settings folder
06:50:36 <greensnark> Ok, if someone wants to fix that, feel free
06:51:49 <Napkin> i'm just glad the dgamelaunch installs work as expected ;)
06:53:07 <CIA-39> 03greensnark 07stone_soup-0.7 * r1897b57acfd9 10/crawl-ref/source/ (initfile.cc initfile.h macro.cc main.cc): Fix macro_dir handling (Napkin).
06:53:10 <CIA-39> 03greensnark 07stone_soup-0.7 * r8aeeeae5d408 10/crawl-ref/source/initfile.cc: Use ~/.crawl/macro.txt as default macro file only on Unix, fix compile with SAVE_DIR_PATH set and !DGAMELAUNCH (oops).
06:53:11 <CIA-39> 03greensnark 07stone_soup-0.7 * rda51ccc399e8 10/crawl-ref/source/ (initfile.cc macro.cc): Dump macro file in ~/.crawl/macro.txt by default on Unix.
06:53:55 <Napkin> actually.. I am sorry for causing all the fuss...
06:54:31 <greensnark> Why? They're real bugs :P
06:54:55 <greensnark> I am not going to worry about Windows macro bugs, however
06:55:25 <Napkin> sounds reasonable
06:55:33 <Napkin> tourney is more important :)
06:56:51 <ortoslon> i carry over my settings manually on windows. i keep them in a file called "i" and after every unzip i move it and add "include = i" at the end of new init.txt
06:58:06 <greensnark> syllogism: Would it greatly bother anyone if I used the same piety cost multiple of 2.5x for regular Crawl as well for BiA and Makhleb? :P
06:58:41 <greensnark> Makhleb greater servant cost is quite amusing
06:59:57 <purge> What? Greater servants has a cost associated??
07:00:27 <Napkin> KiloByte: what about using $SAVEDIR/settings - for saving macro.txt and maybe copy the original settings on first launch there?
07:00:27 <syllogism> greensnark: I do think it's a problem for vanilla crawl
07:00:31 <purge> (/sarcasm)
07:00:52 <greensnark> Greater servants cost 3-5 piety
07:01:22 <sorear> BiA costs what, 30-50 now?
07:01:24 <syllogism> the piety cost being low is a problem, that is
07:01:26 <sorear> it's huge already
07:01:32 <syllogism> it's like 5
07:01:56 <Mu_> at least greater servant might kill you early on
07:01:58 <sorear> It spends a fixed portion of your piety
07:01:58 <greensnark> BiA is 5-6
07:02:18 <sorear> greensnark: look closer, the BiA piety cost is overriden somewhere
07:03:16 <syllogism> i just used it with 200 piety and it costs 5-6
07:03:29 <sorear> ok somebody broke it.
07:03:32 <casmith789> problem is you can't spam greater servant in regular crawl cause you will run out of piety, and they are generated hostile
07:03:34 <greensnark> BiA piety cost is not overridden anywhere
07:03:38 <sorear> it used to cost a flat 1/5 of your piety
07:03:41 <casmith789> (sometimes)
07:04:12 <syllogism> casmith789: you can totally spam it :P
07:04:29 <greensnark> Maybe he means post piety-cost-increase
07:04:54 <casmith789> also, trog is rubbish anyway
07:05:09 <syllogism> trog is great
07:05:30 <casmith789> do a 15 runer trog in 0.6
07:05:41 <greensnark> 15 runers are not the criterion for a god being good
07:05:54 <casmith789> what is
07:05:59 <syllogism> winning
07:06:00 <greensnark> Does he help you win
07:06:02 <greensnark> Yes
07:06:13 <casmith789> okay, trog helps early, but not late
07:06:20 <greensnark> He helps just fine later on
07:06:30 <casmith789> I wouldn't call him broken though
07:06:43 <syllogism> he isn't really broken, but BiA is slightly too cheap
07:06:44 <casmith789> also, he is weak
07:06:45 <ortoslon> i often use BiA to protect myself after an unfortunate berserk
07:06:56 <casmith789> compared to okawaru or kiku
07:07:08 <syllogism> though if the cost is increased, the quality of the brothers you get shouldn't be so piety reliant
07:07:12 <Napkin> lol, weak compared to okawaru? :-O
07:07:24 <casmith789> oka is stronger than him
07:07:28 <Napkin> what can okawaru actually do?
07:07:34 <casmith789> you can actually cast spells
07:07:37 <casmith789> that's a big plus
07:07:46 <casmith789> like, an insanely big plus
07:07:57 <greensnark> Ok, screw this
07:07:59 <casmith789> the only thing trog has on oka is BiA
07:08:03 <greensnark> I don't give a shit about Sprint anyway
07:08:23 <Napkin> well, if you look at it like that, every god has a plus compared to trog.. not specificly oka
07:08:29 <Napkin> go, greensnark, go! :D
07:08:30 <casmith789> I do :)
07:08:32 <due> greensnark: Rule number 1, ignore the players. :)
07:08:46 <syllogism> due: that sounds like he isnt going to do anything
07:09:12 <greensnark> I'll let dpeg decide about Sprint piety cost
07:09:22 <casmith789> Seriously though, the only thing trog has over oka is BiA, and nerfing that too much will mean that people will just always choose oka over trog
07:09:28 <due> casmith789: So?
07:09:32 <ortoslon> what
07:09:37 <due> I completely disagree, btw.
07:09:40 <ortoslon> i'll never choose oka
07:09:42 <ortoslon> he's boring
07:09:54 <casmith789> the game sucks if you never choose a god
07:10:32 <st_> you say such ridiculous things sometimes
07:10:46 <due> Also, this is not ##crawl.
07:11:01 <Napkin> due - update-trunk-indices.py won't work like that... can we add the .exe or .zip into the signifiers instead?
07:11:38 <due> Napkin: Bugger.
07:11:48 <due> Napkin: What's it doing?
07:12:13 <Napkin> taking the installer as "regular" and the latest tile zip as "tile"
07:12:21 <due> Ahhhhhh.
07:12:45 <due> Any chance we can change the file name schema for the installer?
07:12:49 <Napkin> because they start in the same way
07:13:06 <due> give me an example?
07:13:09 <Napkin> hmmm... we could have to ask KiloByte about that
07:13:30 <due> What are the differences?
07:13:48 <Napkin> crawl-0.7.0-rc1-27-g8c4d6e6.setup.exe
07:13:57 <Napkin> crawl-0.7.0-rc1-24-g21093ec.zip
07:14:00 <Napkin> crawl_tiles-0.7.0-rc1-24-g21093ec.zip
07:14:03 <due> Hm.
07:14:05 <Napkin> crawl_osx-0.7.0-rc1-24-g21093ec.zip
07:14:08 <Napkin> crawl_tiles_osx-0.7.0-rc1-24-g21093ec.zip
07:14:13 <Napkin> ---
07:14:16 <greensnark> Ok, provisionally I shall increase the piety cost for BiA and greater servants
07:14:19 <Napkin> those are the 5 files we have
07:14:22 <due> We need to move setup to the beginning.
07:14:32 <Napkin> yes, i agree
07:14:33 <greensnark> And if dpeg weighs in before Sunday I'll adopt his suggestions
07:14:34 <due> Where's the makefile hiding for the installer on CDO?
07:14:48 <Napkin> why?
07:15:05 <due> It should just be a matter of changing that.
07:15:23 <Napkin> I can rename it with the update.sh
07:15:34 <Napkin> how about stone_soup-0.7.0-rc1-27-g8c4d6e6.setup.exe
07:15:39 <Napkin> like we choose for releases?
07:16:05 <due> Hm, sure.
07:16:10 <Napkin> or crawl_setup-0.7.0-rc1-27-g8c4d6e6.exe
07:16:29 <Napkin> which would suit your needs too and keep the crawl at the beginning
07:17:17 <Napkin> you choose - i need coffee, brb :)
07:17:44 <ortoslon> electric eels look beautiful in new water
07:17:50 <due> crawl_setup would work :0
07:18:53 <Napkin> ok, give me a minute
07:19:56 <KiloByte> you can edit crawl.nsi the way you want, the line to change is Outfile
07:20:24 <Napkin> or you do it in git?
07:20:45 <Napkin> i'll do it - let's let greensnark rest ;)
07:20:49 <Napkin> we can adjust outfile later
07:21:06 <greensnark> I don't know anything about the windows installer anyway :)
07:23:06 <Napkin> done, due
07:23:15 <KiloByte> it's just bikeshedding -- and while indeed the colour of the bikeshed looks badly out of place compared to sheds next to it, let' s see if it sticks
07:23:34 <Napkin> also did a mv crawl-0.7.0-rc1-27-g8c4d6e6.setup.exe crawl_setup-0.7.0-rc1-27-g8c4d6e6.exe, but kept crawl-0.7.0-rc1.setup.exe since it's linked in the wordpress post, due
07:24:08 <KiloByte> or perhaps, it may be not the best idea since we'll forget to update that
07:25:20 <greensnark> I hope the macro dir changes didn't break anything?
07:25:31 <CIA-39> 03greensnark * r8636e5810e06 10/crawl-ref/source/abl-show.cc: Increase piety cost for brothers-in-arms and greater servants to 2.5x their normal values in Sprint.
07:25:37 <greensnark> If they're problematic I'd like to back them out before rc2
07:27:48 <Napkin> hehe, i think you are right, greensnark - htc desire has won the battle :D
07:27:57 <Napkin> i'll try to modify the trunk page updater
07:28:03 <Napkin> first time python...
07:28:05 <greensnark> I can do that
07:28:16 <Napkin> if you like?
07:28:18 <greensnark> I know a little python :)
07:28:34 <Napkin> great, wait - let me just adjust the top with the names
07:28:51 <CIA-39> 03greensnark 07stone_soup-0.7 * rbc3a27e43275 10/crawl-ref/source/abl-show.cc: Increase piety cost for brothers-in-arms and greater servants to 2.5x their normal values in Sprint.
07:31:14 <Napkin> ok, greensnark - names and default signifier "default_setup_signifier" added
07:31:51 <Napkin> should be top-most in the main page within the windows h3
07:32:07 <Napkin> time for breakfast then finally :)
07:32:15 <greensnark> 2 min, phone calls :)
07:32:19 <greensnark> Bon appetit
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07:34:06 <Brysos> is there a setting in win7 that would make it so console 6.1 and 7rc won't launch? 5.1 still launches fine...
07:34:57 <syllogism> won't launch?
07:35:16 <Brysos> right if I just click the icon, no window appears although there is a crawl process in the task manager
07:35:20 <Brysos> if I try using a cmd window
07:35:31 <Brysos> it just sort of hangs after running the exe
07:35:43 <Brysos> however i have two win 7 comps and one will run it fine
07:37:56 <syllogism> where did you extract it
07:38:05 <Brysos> desktop
07:38:11 <Fangorn_> I don't know if saves and morgues will share well across mutliple versions
07:38:14 <greensnark> due really likes long lines :P
07:38:20 <due> greensnark: In python?
07:38:27 <greensnark> Everywhere :)
07:38:33 <due> I know :)
07:38:35 <greensnark> But yes, I was looking at the script :)
07:39:00 <due> Did you get it working?
07:39:08 <due> You have to copy basically all of the default functionality to extend it.
07:39:18 <due> It's actually very nasty and should be refactored but I haven't had the time/inclination.
07:39:30 <greensnark> Just started looking at it
07:39:34 <greensnark> Is it in a git repo
07:39:42 <due> Not sure, Napkin?
07:39:45 <due> We should probably git it
07:39:47 <greensnark> I've scped it here, but it should be versioned
07:39:57 <Napkin> please do
07:40:08 <greensnark> Napkin types even while eating breakfast :P
07:40:20 <Napkin> 2 hands are a blessing ;D
07:41:15 <greensnark> Maybe this entire bin/ directory could be in git
07:41:22 <greensnark> Oh, monster is here
07:42:24 <Napkin> nah, not worth it
07:42:38 <greensnark> No?
07:42:40 <Napkin> it's just that script that has more than a few lines
07:42:56 <Napkin> gitignore .sh maybe?
07:43:00 <greensnark> Oh right, all the others use scripts placed elsewhere
07:43:02 <greensnark> Yes, good call
07:43:08 <greensnark> Are these whereis scripts still used?
07:43:22 <Napkin> just for user crawl
07:43:28 <Napkin> haven't tried them in a while
07:43:31 <Napkin> add them
07:43:35 <Fangorn_> Napkin: I uploaded a patch to fix Mantis #354 (cycling ammo interface issue), and sorear committed it to the master branch...how does it get added to the stone_soup_0.7 branch?
07:44:16 <Napkin> cool, Fangorn - the release manager will probably add it soon :)
07:44:35 <greensnark> If I meet them, I'll let them know :)
07:44:47 <Fangorn_> alright, cool..who's the release manager?
07:45:15 <casmith789> greensnark :/
07:46:34 <purge> casmith789 sounds like he needs a break from crawl-dev :P
07:46:57 <casmith789> huh?
07:47:08 <Napkin> on the contrary, casmith789... it's "Greensnarking! \o/"
07:47:16 <purge> +1
07:47:28 <Napkin> I beg you to address our release managers in proper manner :-P
07:47:34 <casmith789> No problem
07:47:37 <CIA-39> 03matt.tadd 07stone_soup-0.7 * r46c6c7a95b4a 10/crawl-ref/source/item_use.cc: Fix cycling quiver backwards from first item (part of #354).
07:47:38 <greensnark> Fangorn_: The commit is in 0.7 now
07:47:46 <Napkin> thank you! :)
07:47:55 <casmith789> All praise the Greensnarking! \o/
07:48:05 <purge> ...
07:48:09 <Fangorn_> nifty, all hail the release manager!
07:48:30 <syllogism> casmith789: even with the change they are probably still too powerful :P
07:48:35 <due> Okay
07:48:39 <casmith789> hey, in sprint, sure
07:48:41 <due> greensnark: Put the desire in a draw
07:48:43 <due> *drawer
07:48:46 <casmith789> I was talking about normal crawl
07:48:51 <due> casmith789: It's sprint-only?
07:48:52 <syllogism> it affects only sprint
07:49:01 <casmith789> I know
07:49:03 <due> Pay attention, man.
07:49:11 <due> greensnark: Did you managed to do the script or did you need me to?
07:49:12 <casmith789> but I thought you were talking about nerfing it earlier in both
07:49:16 <due> greensnark: My distractions have been reduced.
07:49:31 <greensnark> due: <3
07:49:35 <greensnark> Could use those banners :)
07:49:49 <due> Oh, fuck
07:49:52 <due> Forgot about the banners
07:49:53 <greensnark> Script is all yours too :)
07:49:57 <greensnark> Get the script first :)
07:49:58 <due> Will do script now
07:50:00 <Napkin> *giggle*
07:50:01 <due> Too late for banners, though
07:50:03 <greensnark> Banners can wait
07:50:08 <due> I need gimp on my desie ;)
07:50:09 <Napkin> due \o/
07:50:47 <greensnark> I'd like rc2 out in an hourish :P
07:51:01 <casmith789> how is rc2 different from rc1? just a couple of bugfixes?
07:51:06 <greensnark> Yes
07:51:31 <greensnark> About 30 commits since rc1
07:51:38 <casmith789> oh, cool
07:51:46 <due> greensnark: Did my trove fix go into 0.7? I am blind.
07:51:50 <greensnark> It did
07:51:54 <due> Excellent
07:51:59 <due> Somenoe hit me with a stick over it earlier :)
07:52:01 <greensnark> Your fetish for American spelling has been noted
07:52:03 <due> Even though it's the ploog's fault.
07:52:04 <due> HEY.
07:52:07 <due> It was David's fault.
07:52:13 <greensnark> Really :P
07:53:20 <due> Yup, all his fault.
07:54:00 <syllogism> ??vorpalize
07:54:00 <Henzell> vorpal[1/2]: Increases damage by 12.5% on average and increases variability (but reduces it for launchers). Can be placed on any weapon but a blowgun with {scroll of vorpalise weapon}.
07:54:04 <syllogism> ??vorpalise
07:54:04 <Henzell> vorpalise[1/1]: Game spells it this way, players don't. See {vorpal}
07:54:37 <due> Should be done.
07:54:38 <greensnark> !tv clouded
07:54:38 <Sequell> 2069. clouded, XL6 MDBe, T:4976 requested for FooTV.
07:54:54 <due> Stupid fucking Americans. :p
07:55:36 <due> Napkin: done
07:55:37 <Napkin> i'd say - everybody is a bit stupid while fucking, due :>
07:55:43 <due> git would be really nice for this actually
07:55:51 <Napkin> darshan made it already
07:55:52 <due> Because that way you can see what I do and don't have to pester me ;)
07:55:52 <Napkin> commit!
07:55:54 <due> Oh, he did?
07:55:58 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
07:55:59 <Napkin> hehehe
07:56:02 <due> Hang on
07:56:08 <greensnark> due: git clone crawl@crawl.develz.org:bin :)
07:56:21 <due> Toooo lazy.
07:56:22 <Napkin> i'm still blaming the script solely on you, due ;>
07:56:27 <due> :(
07:56:35 <due> Well, I did write all of it, though I don't remember writing most of it?
07:56:43 <Napkin> but we're here to help!
07:56:46 <Napkin> !coffee due
07:56:46 * Henzell hands due a cup of café au lait, brewed by Ijyb.
07:56:55 <due> Okay, commit done.
07:56:58 <greensnark> due needs a !tea command
07:57:00 <Napkin> thank you! :)
07:57:07 <Napkin> exactly my thought, greensnark :D
07:57:28 <due> There is a reason not to run that clone in ~
07:57:29 <syllogism> I had some coffee earlier and now it's tea time :P
07:57:30 <due> persson@persson:~$ git clone crawl@crawl.develz.org:bin
07:57:31 <due> fatal: destination path 'bin' already exists and is not an empty directory.
07:57:36 <due> Too late for tea for me, actually
07:59:17 <Napkin> mkdir cdo-bin; cd cdo-bin; git init; git remote add cdo crawl@crawl.develz.org:bin
07:59:19 <greensnark> due: Choose a different name on your end
07:59:40 <greensnark> Or you can do it with Napkin's fancy command sequence too :)
07:59:48 <due> :)
07:59:54 <due> Fancy command sequence too?
07:59:58 <greensnark> `git clone crawl@crawl.develz.org:bin cdo-bin` might be easier
08:00:00 <due> Oh.
08:00:05 <due> I just did it in a subdirectory.
08:00:09 <Napkin> pah! back to the basics! :D
08:00:10 <due> I'm lazy. ;)
08:00:31 <greensnark> due does it in subdirectories :P
08:00:39 <Napkin> eeew! ;)
08:00:45 <greensnark> "Let's go over to my subdirectory!"
08:01:03 <due> Well, it means everything's nicely organised.
08:02:08 <Napkin> trunk page looks great - will build a new installer and test the macro stuff
08:02:19 <Napkin> or anything you would like to add first, KiloByte?
08:02:35 <ortoslon> rmb viewport dragging in minimap seems broken
08:02:50 <due> Viewport/minimap seems broken in many extents, ortoslon.
08:03:10 <Napkin> could be related to this one, ortoslon: https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=1991
08:03:39 <greensnark> Is this tiles viewport glitch something new
08:03:48 <ortoslon> yes
08:03:52 <ortoslon> and yes
08:04:09 <syllogism> how new
08:04:18 <due> how now brown cow?
08:04:24 <ortoslon> i don't remember, i use mouse rarely
08:04:31 <Mu_> oh mennas is only missing his description when i'm working in the sprint branch, like he's not even in /descript/monsters but i can place him ok so he definitely is ingame?? master branch has his description
08:04:49 <due> Mu_: seems something is broken
08:05:01 <due> I'm too tired to think what though :)
08:05:12 <greensnark> My dat/descript/monsters.txt has Mennas' description in 0.7
08:05:20 <Mu_> ye he's in the rc
08:05:29 <greensnark> Oh wait, I'm on master :P
08:05:35 <Mu_> that too
08:05:45 <Mu_> just not sprint git build ??
08:05:48 <greensnark> Oh
08:05:50 <greensnark> That's weird
08:05:56 <greensnark> I thought the sprintgit thing is based on master
08:06:06 <greensnark> Mu_: Are you using a debug build for sprintgit?
08:06:18 <due> Debug fucks with the description screen most of the time.
08:06:28 <greensnark> Debug builds tend to drop long monster descriptions because of all the added debug goop and the description code panicking at the length
08:06:40 <Mu_> i do make wizard
08:06:49 <greensnark> Ok, that's not a debug build
08:07:03 <Mu_> if i do git checkout master mennas is in descript/monsters but after doing git checkout sprint he vanishes from it
08:07:11 <Mu_> but you can place him in game it's just his info that's missing
08:07:26 <greensnark> How does sprintgit take changes from master?
08:07:34 <greensnark> If it's just a regular merge it should have all the changes in master
08:07:37 <Mu_> idk you'd have to ask someone who isn't a moron
08:07:38 <by> someone runs 'git merge master'
08:07:41 <due> I think it's a regular merge.
08:07:47 <due> Has anyone merged recently?
08:08:03 <greensnark> Oh, is that why dpeg is filing bugs with a weeks-old Crawl version? :)
08:08:06 <by> no idea, don't have access on this computer
08:08:09 <due> Probably
08:08:13 <due> Let me check
08:08:27 <Mu_> o i didn't know i had to do something :3
08:08:29 <due> Wouldn't surprise me though
08:08:37 <due> by: will do it
08:08:41 <due> Yeah.
08:08:57 <due> Why do I always type "git submodulate"?
08:09:01 -!- Brysos2 has joined ##crawl-dev
08:09:11 <due> Oh god, another Brysos?
08:09:13 <greensnark> Because you don't have it in a convenient alias
08:09:16 <due> There's millions of them!
08:09:19 <Brysos2> when one is just not enough
08:09:25 <due> greensnark: git-submodules-suck-a-lot isn't that convenient.
08:09:27 <greensnark> An alias that goes up to the parent git dir without giving you lip for not being in the base dir
08:09:50 <greensnark> "You must run this from the top level directory!" <-- How about the bloody command do that for me? :P
08:09:59 <due> Yeah, that's really annoying.
08:10:02 <due> AHHH
08:10:05 <due> MY GIT IS COLOURED?!
08:10:11 <due> Who came in and coloured my git?
08:10:33 <greensnark> Git is meant to be a many splendo^Wcoloured thing
08:10:39 <due> Gross.
08:10:52 <greensnark> Hey, I love the colours :(
08:11:02 <greensnark> And Napkin obviously loves colours judging by his .vimrc :P
08:11:03 <due> I don't mind them, I hate sudden changes.
08:11:03 <Brysos2> sadly, this Brysos also cannot launch 6.1 or above in win7
08:11:22 <due> Real players play on CAO ;)
08:11:30 <due> Mu_: Pull and rebuild :)
08:11:39 <greensnark> Brysos2: You said crawl shows in the task manager; is it using CPU or just idling there
08:11:46 <greensnark> Also what directory are you running it in
08:12:02 <Mu_> that was a big pull huh :p
08:12:04 <Brysos2> idle
08:12:06 <Brysos2> desktop
08:12:29 <greensnark> Brysos2: Have you tried deleting the Crawl dir and extracting afresh from the zip
08:12:36 <Brysos2> well crawl-0.6.1 on the desktop
08:12:50 <greensnark> Yes, your desktop should be safe, no UAC issues there
08:12:53 <syllogism> viewport dragging seems to work here
08:13:16 <ortoslon> i could record a video of how it works here and upload to youtube
08:13:24 <due> ortoslon: or how it doesn't?
08:13:29 <ortoslon> hahaha
08:13:40 <Brysos2> same result
08:13:54 <Brysos2> spins up a conhost too and both sit there
08:14:02 <syllogism> well it behaves somewhat awkwardly when you don't have much mapped
08:14:04 <Napkin> check in your $HOME and move "Application Data\crawl" away for a test, Brysos2?
08:15:01 <greensnark> due: How do I write a line to stderr in Python? :P
08:15:50 <greensnark> Oh, sys.stderr.write
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08:18:36 <due> better
08:18:40 <due> print blah >> sys.stderr
08:18:47 <due> something like that
08:19:32 <greensnark> Oh, neat
08:19:38 * greensnark did not know this
08:19:39 <Napkin> tested rc1-32
08:19:45 <greensnark> I do Python about once a year :)
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08:19:54 <greensnark> rax wrote the initial tourney scripts in Python :)
08:19:57 <due> it's something slightly different to that
08:20:13 <greensnark> Looks like the tiles X-map misbehaviour is my fault :P
08:20:16 <rax> "wrote" is generous. I would use the verb "failed."
08:20:17 <due> :o!
08:20:22 <Napkin> same behaviour about macro.txt being saved in $PROGRAMS\Crawl\settings
08:21:30 <greensnark> Anyway Python is pretty cool in that you can be productive pretty quickly even when not very familiar with it
08:21:38 <greensnark> Napkin: Yes, that's not fixed
08:21:48 <greensnark> As long as it doesn't blow up, that's fine :)
08:22:13 <greensnark> I'm willing to take a fix for that if KiloByte or someone makes a fix that they can verify works on Windows
08:22:24 <greensnark> My vmware install is semi-hosed atm :P
08:22:43 <KiloByte> Napkin: I'm cooking right now, parents will come soon; I won't help you until later
08:23:01 <greensnark> KiloByte: Got an approximate time?
08:23:07 <greensnark> +5 hours?
08:23:40 <KiloByte> no no, they live in the same town so it's just a dinner
08:23:48 <greensnark> Ok, we'll wait for the fix then
08:23:49 <KiloByte> but it needs to be cooked first
08:24:07 -!- Cryp71c has joined ##crawl-dev
08:24:07 <greensnark> Bon appetit
08:24:13 <KiloByte> no, it's ~2 hours, it's not that important I guess
08:24:24 <greensnark> Take your time :)
08:25:01 <syllogism> That's a silly name!
08:25:31 <syllogism> does it only say that if you give it no name at all? :P
08:25:31 <greensnark> What is the name in question
08:25:48 <greensnark> Actually it doesn't say that at all for me, I can create characters with no name easily
08:25:58 <syllogism> this was Tiles
08:26:00 <greensnark> " the Ruffian"
08:26:17 <greensnark> There are several sequences through the startup menus that allow you to sneak in without entering a name
08:26:21 <greensnark> In both tiles and tty
08:27:01 <syllogism> there's no line clear between the different complaints you can get while attempting to enter the name
08:27:46 <Brysos2> is crawl supposed to have a data folder somewhere outside of its installation directory?
08:27:50 * greensnark kicks CIA-39
08:27:51 <CIA-39> ow
08:28:12 -!- BrysosN has quit []
08:28:16 <greensnark> Brysos2: Depends on how you installed Crawl
08:28:19 <syllogism> Brysos: not by default no
08:28:28 <greensnark> The old zip distribution just dumps everything in the directory you extracted it
08:28:30 <Brysos2> ok, literaly just dragged out of the zip
08:29:53 <greensnark> Aren't there sysinternals tools to check what win32 calls a process is making
08:30:12 <Brysos2> does procexp do it?
08:30:12 <greensnark> If you can find out what it does up until it stops we may know where it's stuck
08:30:22 <greensnark> process explorer might, I'm a little rusty
08:30:57 <Mu_> greensnark what do i type to do the submodule thing without it complaining about changes to submodule things
08:31:53 <by> Brysos2: how long have you let it run?
08:32:02 <greensnark> Brysos2: Also, could you check the console build
08:32:14 <by> isn't this console?
08:32:16 <syllogism> it is
08:32:17 <ortoslon> minimap viewport problems: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2781010/viewport.avi (VLC should be able to view that)
08:32:24 <Brysos2> I never let it run more than a a minute before killing it
08:32:24 <greensnark> This is the console build?
08:32:27 <syllogism> you should check the Tiles build :P
08:32:28 <Brysos2> yes console
08:32:30 <Brysos2> tiles works
08:32:32 <syllogism> oh
08:32:42 <Brysos2> I like console :)
08:32:54 <greensnark> Brysos2: So you get a blank console window?
08:32:59 <Brysos2> no, no window
08:33:10 <greensnark> How do you try to start Crawl?
08:33:21 <Brysos2> via icon (crawl.exe)
08:33:28 <Brysos2> although I have tired using a cmd window
08:33:36 <greensnark> What happens when you run it from a cmd.exe window?
08:33:38 <Brysos2> and it just sort of hangs after I enter crawl.exe
08:33:58 <syllogism> what's your terminal size
08:34:07 <greensnark> Could be just trying to compile .des files, but that shouldn't take a minute
08:34:08 -!- purge has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
08:34:09 <Brysos2> default in the init let me see
08:34:24 <by> also it shouldn't be idle, right?
08:34:34 <greensnark> Yes
08:34:49 <syllogism> could he try copying the .des files from his Tiles build
08:34:51 <Brysos2> default console size
08:38:26 <CIA-39> 03greensnark * r97f88be3aa3c 10/crawl-ref/source/view.cc: Fix tiles crash when using 'X' (oops).
08:39:40 <greensnark> No particular ideas come to mind
08:39:46 <greensnark> You can check what file handles the process has open
08:39:53 <greensnark> There was a sysinternals tool for that iirc
08:40:06 <syllogism> there's one called Handle :P
08:40:14 <greensnark> Sounds logical :P
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08:42:00 <Napkin> with the installation from the installer i had no problem running crawl-tiles.exe or crawl-console
08:42:00 <Fangorn_> wasn't that filemon?
08:43:00 <Napkin> created des with console, tiles works without recompiling
08:43:06 <Fangorn_> http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/bb896645.aspx
08:43:32 <greensnark> Brysos2: Do the 0.7 crawl builds work for you?
08:43:40 <greensnark> i.e. is the problem only with 0.6
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08:43:50 <syllogism> he said rc1 as well
08:43:50 <Napkin> other way around works too without recompiling the des/db
08:43:58 <greensnark> Oh, ok
08:44:04 <syllogism> but not 0.5.2
08:44:29 <greensnark> I wonder if it is looking for his Appdata/Remote folder :)
08:45:21 <Napkin> ouch... reinstalling overwrites all files in settings/
08:47:02 <Brysos2> .7 does not work
08:47:06 <Brysos2> 5.1 works
08:47:19 <Brysos2> I dont' think I tried 5.2
08:48:24 <Brysos2> hmm according to process monitor the last thing it did was go through the saves directory
08:48:35 <Fangorn_> yes
08:48:36 <syllogism> there's a saves directory?
08:48:44 <Fangorn_> delete everything in that directory
08:50:03 <Brysos2> did that
08:50:05 <Brysos2> and relaunched
08:50:07 <Brysos2> same issue
08:50:21 <Brysos2> it recreated the db and des subdirs
08:50:35 <Napkin> thanks for the video, ortoslon
08:51:02 <greensnark> Brysos2: Are there files in those subdirs
08:51:06 <Brysos2> yes
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08:51:21 <ortoslon> offtopic: are there decent screen recorders on linux?
08:51:25 <greensnark> I wonder if it's dying trying to set some console mode
08:52:04 <CIA-39> 03greensnark * r3d390b1ab030 10/crawl-ref/source/menu.cc: Refix linewrap column check to avoid CPU-pegging on small terms.
08:53:18 <dpeg> !seen Mu_
08:53:18 <Henzell> dpeg: You have 5 messages. Use !messages to read them.
08:53:18 <Henzell> I last saw Mu_ at Sat Jul 17 13:30:57 2010 UTC (22m 21s ago) saying greensnark what do i type to do the submodule thing without it complaining about changes to submodule things on ##crawl-dev.
08:53:27 <Mu_> :3
08:53:57 <Mu_> git submodule update just makes an error
08:53:59 <dpeg> Mu_: thanks for replying in the Sum thread. I was feeling alone :)
08:54:21 <greensnark> dpeg <3
08:54:24 <greensnark> !coffee dpeg
08:54:25 * Henzell hands dpeg a pot of cappuccino, brewed by Snorg.
08:54:27 <Brysos2> conhost is trying to create a file in my appdata/local/temp/Rar$DR00.403/crawl-0.6.1/crawl.exe
08:54:33 <Brysos2> that seems odd
08:54:35 <Mu_> dpeg: the discussion got pretty long :p
08:54:46 <CIA-39> 03greensnark 07stone_soup-0.7 * rbc73cb084c12 10/crawl-ref/source/menu.cc: Refix linewrap column check to avoid CPU-pegging on small terms.
08:54:47 <CIA-39> 03greensnark 07stone_soup-0.7 * r0b197bf6f438 10/crawl-ref/source/view.cc: Disable view checks that break tiles.
08:54:56 <syllogism> Mu_: I don't know how to deal with the submodules either so I Browse Submodules and pull the updates one by one :P
08:55:00 <syllogism> when it errors
08:55:07 <greensnark> Mu_: What's the error :P
08:55:25 <Mu_> $ git submodule update
08:55:25 <Mu_> error: You have local changes to 'Makefile'; cannot switch branches.
08:55:25 <Mu_> Unable to checkout '8f39855df59d7bb534283c1564e33abed023711d' in submodule path
08:55:25 <Mu_> 'crawl-ref/source/contrib/freetype'
08:55:59 <greensnark> Mu_: What does git config --global core.autocrlf say? :P
08:56:13 <Mu_> false
08:56:20 <greensnark> Ok, that's right then
08:56:38 <greensnark> Can you cd to crawl-ref/source/contrib/freetype and try git config core.autocrlf there?
08:56:41 <greensnark> Without the --global
08:57:13 <Mu_> false
08:57:16 <Mu_> :p
08:57:19 <greensnark> Hmm
08:57:22 <Napkin> for sub in $(git submodule | awk '{ print $2 }'); do (cd $sub && git checkout . && git clean -f >/dev/null ); done
08:57:23 <greensnark> And what does git diff say there? :)
08:57:45 <greensnark> Napkin: Nice shell-fu :P
08:58:06 <Mu_> it says a million billion lines have changed
08:58:07 <greensnark> Wonder why the makefile is getting dirtied though
08:58:18 <greensnark> Interesting
08:58:20 <Napkin> hey, sometimes I listen when you tell me what to do, greensnark ;-P
08:58:41 <greensnark> Mu_: Does git checkout -f in crawl-ref/source/contrib/freetype fix that
08:59:06 <greensnark> Don't run it in th main repo if you have uncommitted changes :P
08:59:12 <Mu_> now git diff produces nothing
08:59:22 <greensnark> How on earth is the makefile getting changed, I wonder
08:59:37 <greensnark> Mu_: Does this happen regularly? :P
08:59:51 <greensnark> You wouldn't happen to be editing random files with Windows editors, would you?
09:00:00 <greensnark> Like that makefile there :P
09:00:02 <Mu_> i only touch des files
09:00:06 <dpeg> :)
09:00:10 <syllogism> what's the makefile dated? :P
09:00:19 <Mu_> i don't think the makefile has ever made an error
09:00:31 <greensnark> Mu_: ANyway, you should be able to update submodules now
09:00:57 <Mu_> do i do --init at the end i never knew what that was for
09:01:00 <greensnark> Mu_: You been doing any tiles builds?
09:01:13 <greensnark> --init is to initialize submodules for the first time. It's harmless to use it thereafter
09:01:27 <Mu_> ok
09:01:35 <greensnark> Have you been building tiles?
09:01:41 <Mu_> nope
09:01:49 <Mu_> just make wizard
09:01:56 <greensnark> Huh, freetype shouldn't be involved in a console build
09:02:12 <greensnark> Perhaps you have other people who use your computer and use Windows editors to mess with makefiles? :P
09:02:16 <Mu_> git submodule update did a bunch of stuff this time but then it gave another error
09:02:22 <Mu_> error: You have local changes to 'pcre_dfa_exec.c'; cannot switch branches.
09:02:22 <Mu_> Unable to checkout '2df28629438f3f0dee83194fa130c04be920596b' in submodule path
09:02:22 <Mu_> 'crawl-ref/source/contrib/pcre'
09:02:30 <syllogism> :P
09:02:33 <Mu_> it's only me and i don't touch this shit :p
09:02:39 <syllogism> I had that too :
09:02:40 <syllogism> :P
09:02:53 <Mu_> D:
09:03:29 <greensnark> Ok, use Napkin's command
09:03:33 <Mu_> i've never been able to do make distclean because of some makefile error, dunno if that's relevant because i don't even know what that command does :p
09:03:53 <greensnark> Go to your repo top dir and for sub in $(git submodule | awk '{ print $2 }'); do (cd $sub && git checkout . && git clean -f  >/dev/null ); done
09:04:12 <greensnark> You're using the git bash prompt, I trust?
09:04:27 <greensnark> Or are you using plain cmd.exe
09:04:43 <greensnark> If you're using raw cmd.exe run the msys batch file first
09:04:47 <Mu_> idk i run msys.bat
09:04:56 <greensnark> Yeah, that should be enough
09:05:10 <syllogism> syntax error near unexpected token `do'
09:05:11 <greensnark> Run Napkin's commands and it should clean up all submodules
09:05:46 <Mu_> ok
09:05:50 <syllogism> oh nevermind there it goes
09:06:05 <Mu_> hooray
09:06:15 <Mu_> thanks greensnark/Napkin
09:06:37 <greensnark> What do you do to dirty the submodules, though? :)
09:06:48 <greensnark> Sounds like a msys git submodule bug
09:07:15 <Mu_> i don't even know where those files are
09:07:34 <greensnark> Napkin: Can you check if current 0.7 fixes your tiles scrolling isue?
09:07:53 <Fangorn_> pcre submodule allows for perl-like regular expressions in c
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09:20:05 <Napkin> will do now, greensnark
09:21:34 -!- Cryp71c has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds]
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09:21:58 <greensnark> Graçias
09:22:29 <greensnark> Actually "Gràcies" since most of the winning team were Catalan :)
09:22:32 <Napkin> damn, tile_options overwritten
09:26:09 <Napkin> works excellent now, greensnark
09:26:34 <Napkin> scrolling map with cursor keys and jumping via X>>> works great
09:26:56 <greensnark> Thanks!
09:27:01 <greensnark> So I did break it :P
09:27:08 <Napkin> one thing ortoslon might mention though - if you scroll around with the mouse and the cursor is about to leave the map, the view is reset
09:27:15 <Napkin> which I guess is fine, ortoslon?
09:27:45 <Napkin> no idea how it behaved before
09:28:02 <Napkin> i would say it's fixed :)
09:28:28 <greensnark> !lm * br.enter=Lair
09:28:28 <Sequell> 29897. [2010-07-17] chalk the Blackguard (L12 SpEn) entered the Lair of Beasts on turn 18797. (Lair:1)
09:28:29 <Napkin> want me to close the issue for you, greensnark?
09:28:32 <greensnark> !lm * br.enter=Lair x=oplace
09:28:32 <Sequell> 29897. [2010-07-17] [oplace=Lair:1] chalk the Blackguard (L12 SpEn) entered the Lair of Beasts on turn 18797. (Lair:1)
09:28:36 <greensnark> Napkin: That'd be great
09:29:48 <ortoslon> Napkin: the view should be reset only when you release the mouse button
09:30:32 <Napkin> now the view is reset when the cursor in view_port leaves the map border
09:31:08 <ortoslon> i don't quite understand you
09:31:34 <ortoslon> i'll download the newest build after i die on rc1-24 and then will tell you
09:31:54 <Napkin> well.. when you use the right mouse button to scroll through the mini map
09:32:06 <Napkin> there is always a cursor being displayed in the middle of the view_port
09:32:29 <ortoslon> ah
09:32:35 <ortoslon> should be fine then
09:32:43 <Napkin> if that cursor is moved outside the map boundaries, the view_port is reset
09:33:01 <greensnark> Reset meaning it bounces back to the top-left or something?
09:33:10 <Napkin> no, back on your char
09:33:16 <greensnark> Ah
09:33:31 <Napkin> like it was before you initiated this right-mouse-button-on-minimap-scrolling
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09:34:15 <Napkin> i guess it would be nicer, if that didn't happen.. and the cursor is prevented to leave boundaries - but it's definitely not a show-stopper anymore
09:35:51 <Napkin> thank you, greensnark :)
09:35:52 <ortoslon> i've just noticed that decks look unsorted in the inventory panel
09:36:14 <ortoslon> can you make them sorted by potency/type by default?
09:36:27 <greensnark> Enne FR :)
09:37:20 <Enne> They're probably sorted by inventory slot.
09:37:43 <ortoslon> which is almost useless
09:37:53 <Enne> "Sort them yourself, ya lazy bum!"
09:37:56 <Enne> ;)
09:38:01 <ortoslon> heh
09:38:24 <Enne> File a FR.  That might be useful for other item types as well.
09:42:37 <Enne> greensnark: Why did you add an assert about viewp being out of bounds in viewwindow?
09:42:44 <Ashenzari> sort decks in inventory panel (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=1995) by ortoslon
09:42:56 <greensnark> Enne: It's gone now :)
09:42:59 <Enne> Oh, ok.
09:43:16 <greensnark> Another console assumption, that
09:43:17 <Napkin> hmm... how much do i need to "clean" when doing a git pull; make install to get the version in ?V have the right value?
09:43:42 <RjY> Napkin: just version.o i think
09:43:51 <RjY> i actually have a patch for this
09:43:53 <Enne> (Clearly I need some coffee before worrying about bugs.)
09:44:01 <greensnark> !coffee Enne
09:44:01 * Henzell hands Enne a pot of café au lait, brewed by Nikola.
09:44:02 <Napkin> !coffee Enne
09:44:02 * Henzell hands Enne a pot of irish coffee, brewed by Crazy Yiuf.
09:44:06 <Napkin> hehe
09:44:10 <Napkin> Moin Enne :)
09:44:12 <greensnark> Irish is good
09:44:21 <Napkin> milk too!
09:44:35 <greensnark> I don't like cafe au lait much :P
09:44:43 <greensnark> Black coffee <-- me
09:44:51 <Napkin> blond and sweet ;)
09:45:08 <greensnark> South indian filter coffee is pretty decent if you're adding milk :)
09:45:17 <RjY> http://rjy.ath.cx/stuff/0001-makefile-fix-incorrect-version-number-built-into-ve.patch
09:45:22 <greensnark> Most foreigners' cafe au lait is pretty disastrous though :P
09:45:34 <Napkin> hehe
09:45:51 <Napkin> when i was in brazil - there was no way to drink coffee without :D
09:50:56 <Napkin> that patch works fine, thank you, RjY :)
09:51:50 * Napkin points out that patch to greensnark *
09:51:58 <CIA-39> 03rjy * r88232bc39f1c 10/crawl-ref/source/makefile: makefile: fix incorrect version number built into version.o
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09:53:11 <greensnark> RjY: You wouldn't happen to be in CREDITS already under a disreputable alias?
09:54:03 <CIA-39> 03rjy 07stone_soup-0.7 * r66795b0f56f2 10/crawl-ref/source/makefile: makefile: fix incorrect version number built into version.o
09:54:51 * Enne is secretly hoping for Icy Lich.
09:55:25 <greensnark> Hehe
09:55:55 <greensnark> RjY: Your preferred name/alias for credits?
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09:56:21 <greensnark> You know, it's amusing, but some folks have trouble telling me their real names :P
09:56:37 <greensnark> I remember when I asked syllogism for his, each time he tried to tell me his internet connection would mysteriously drop
09:56:52 <Napkin> lol
09:57:51 <RjY> greensnark: no i'm not in credits. (is it really needed for a one line patch?)
09:57:56 <greensnark> Yes
09:58:07 <greensnark> If you want to skip it, that's fine too
09:58:23 <greensnark> Your choice :)
10:01:27 <RjY> can you leave it for now? i'm not really all that bothered to be honest; especially since the style is to use your real name and i kind of hate my real name. i'm in git log --grep and that's enough for me
10:02:03 <greensnark> Ok, cool
10:02:51 <Enne> You could always change your real name and then use that.  ;)
10:03:56 <Napkin> the amount of people in the credits at the end of the gource video were quite surprising for my colleagues :D
10:04:07 <Napkin> *was
10:04:12 -!- Mu_ has quit [Quit: Defecator, may everything turn out okay so that you can leave this place.]
10:04:26 <Napkin> did you see the new version, Enne?
10:04:40 <greensnark> Yeah, one of those open source tracker sites claimed DCSS had a huge number of contributors which indicatoed "a very mature project"
10:04:44 <greensnark> How little they knew :P
10:04:49 <greensnark> I think it was ohloh
10:04:58 <Enne> Napkin: How does it differ from the old one?
10:05:07 <greensnark> Enne: lightsaber noises
10:05:15 <Enne> Haha.
10:05:18 <Napkin> btw - grats on your first post in the workpress - and the huge amount of feedback :)
10:05:40 <Enne> Thanks! Everybody loves tiles, apparently.
10:05:41 <Napkin> oh.. and i used openshot video editor to add some more text during the video
10:06:13 <Napkin> and managed to do a better job with audacity this time, i believe ;)
10:15:49 <ortoslon> thanks for making the source look better than the game :P
10:18:38 <greensnark> One of these days I shall blackmail Napkin into adding lightsaber noises
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10:31:34 <Napkin> lol, ortoslon - i don't do coding.. i'm an innocent sysadmin :-P
10:33:58 <ortoslon> Enne: funny glitch: blood splash on an empty stone arch is redrawn every time so it looks like the blood is splashing in the arc
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10:48:28 <Napkin> oh? something wrong with crazy yiuf's vault?
10:48:40 <Napkin> hammers all around :-O
10:49:10 <greensnark> dpeg and due cannot agree on whether that's a bug :)
10:49:30 <greensnark> I think dpeg is responsible for the hammer festival
10:49:40 <Napkin> hihi
10:50:12 <ortoslon> halt hammerzeit
10:50:30 <Napkin> well said ;)
10:51:49 <ortoslon> BR: insubstantial wisps' name leads to underestimation of their power :P
10:52:01 <Enne> (Is there a reason the ../settings/* files aren't getting read anymore for me?)
10:52:19 <Napkin> non of them or just the macro file, enne?
10:52:54 <Enne> Ok, so tiles_options.txt in particular.
10:53:24 <Enne> ...but also init.txt.
10:53:30 <greensnark> Hm, did I break that
10:53:43 <Napkin> asking because of the previously hardcoded "settings/macro.txt"
10:53:48 * Napkin hides quickly *
10:54:12 <Enne> It can read them out of ~/.crawlrc but not ../settings.  In either case, it just says "Read options from unknown."
10:54:24 <greensnark> The "Read options from unknown" is a longstanding bug
10:54:52 <greensnark> I changed some code to find macros, it might have broken other stuff
10:59:15 <RjY> i think if you're not a source diver or you only saw yiuf's original cottage a few times you're not going to realise that the hammer in there isn't random
10:59:48 <RjY> so you're not going to get the joke with the many-hammers version, in which case it does look like a bug
11:00:30 <doy> i disagree, it really is pretty clearly a vault
11:00:38 <RjY> (or equivalently the player is aware the hammer is a fixed item but isn't aware of the meme that sprung up around it)
11:01:09 <doy> and so people will be aware that item placement rules are different (and arbitrary) in vaults
11:01:36 <doy> especially for a vault specifically designed for a unique named "crazy yiuf"
11:02:03 <Napkin> hehe
11:03:23 <greensnark> Can the Enchantress be generated in 0.7
11:03:29 <Enne> Yes.
11:03:41 <Enne> Er, don't listen to me.
11:03:48 <Enne> *blush*
11:03:53 <greensnark> Can't find any des file references :)
11:04:05 <syllogism> i think kilobyte said it cant
11:04:20 <syllogism> but it might be generated in some sprint map :P
11:04:33 <greensnark> That's fine, this is for tourney unique kills
11:04:56 <greensnark> I think the last time we had Polyphemus players were going crazy because the game didn't generate him :P
11:05:23 <syllogism> if Enchantress was restricted to some rare vault I think they would go crazy again :P
11:05:45 <greensnark> The Lernaean hydra is in there :P
11:06:00 <greensnark> Most of the top players will visit Swamp often enough though
11:06:16 <syllogism> !lm * cv=0.6 rune=decaying
11:06:16 <Sequell> 531. [2010-07-17] NyaaKitty the Martial Artist (L15 KeAr) found a decaying rune of Zot on turn 36685. (Swamp:5)
11:06:22 <syllogism> !lm * uniq=~lernaean cv=0.6
11:06:23 <Sequell> 41. [2010-07-10] ronf the Fencer (L16 HERe) killed the 27-headed Lernaean hydra on turn 52259. (Swamp:5)
11:06:44 <syllogism> !lg * killer=~lernaean cv=00.6
11:06:44 <Sequell> No games for * (killer=~lernaean cv=00.6).
11:06:47 <KiloByte> syllogism: normal game: spriggans, sp druids, sp riders.  Sprint: sp defenders, the Enchantress.
11:06:48 <syllogism> !lg * killer=~lernaean cv=0.6
11:06:48 <Sequell> 6. NyaaKitty the Black Belt (L16 MfTm), worshipper of Okawaru, mangled by the 27-headed Lernaean hydra on Swamp:5 on 2010-07-16, with 106586 points after 44665 turns and 2:43:05.
11:07:00 <syllogism> 6 kills is pretty pathetic all things considered :P
11:07:13 <syllogism> the name should be just The Lernaean Hydra
11:07:13 <KiloByte> syllogism: we'll have a branch or at least a portal with them in 0.8
11:07:16 <doy> @??the lernaean hydra
11:07:17 <Gretell> the Lernaean hydra (08D) | Speed: 10 (swim: 60%) | HD: 30 | Health: 150 | AC/EV: 0/5 | Damage: 18 per head | Flags: amphibious, cold-blooded, regen | Res: 06magic(120), 03poison | Chunks: 09poisonous | XP: 7599.
11:07:23 <doy> really needs to be speed 12
11:07:42 <KiloByte> ??oklobra
11:07:42 <Henzell> oklobra[1/1]: A horrible, twisted, monstrous hybrid of a hydra, an oklob plant, and lingerie.  Many heads, with the potential to grow many more, each of which spits acid!
11:07:43 <syllogism> because it says it's 27-headed people take it too seriously :P
11:07:54 <KiloByte> someone changed this learndb entry :(
11:08:26 <greensnark> syllogism: Well, not everyone takes it too seriously, there was that hilarious rgrmisc post
11:08:36 <KiloByte> the old version had AF_DISTORTION attacks and made it guard a "madness" rune
11:08:46 <greensnark> ??blink hydra
11:08:47 <Henzell> blink hydra[1/2]: Speed 20 hydras, that also blink around and have distortion brand on their heads. Blink hydra hides and armour are mutagenic, but give the no-teleport special.
11:08:51 <greensnark> ??blink hydra[2]
11:08:51 <Henzell> blink hydra[2/2]: if its heads disagree where to blink, a blink hydra separates into several severely wounded blink hydrae
11:08:56 <dpeg> the hammer festival is very rare
11:08:56 <Henzell> dpeg: You have 6 messages. Use !messages to read them.
11:08:58 <greensnark> KiloByte: That was a different entry
11:09:14 <dpeg> so chances are that every player seens the ordinary Yiuf first, and the hammered Yiuf later
11:09:18 <greensnark> ??hydrataur
11:09:19 <Henzell> hydrataur[1/1]: One of four possible unique guardians at lvl 3 of the abyssal stair. Each of his nine necks ends in a javelin throwing humanoid torso, and he also buffs, heals and sprays hellfire. Carries the madness rune.
11:09:44 <dpeg> I keep accumulating these messages.
11:09:52 <doy> necks that end in a torso
11:09:54 <doy> that's interesting
11:10:17 <greensnark> Presumably the torso has a neck of its own
11:10:25 <dpeg> And a nick of its own.
11:10:27 <greensnark> In all, it is well supplied with necks
11:10:48 <doy> should implement some of these as specials for later zig levels
11:10:49 <doy> (:
11:11:25 <dpeg> in 0.8, Ziggurats will be super cool because of holy monsters
11:11:41 <dpeg> Everyone will be dying to get a glimpse of them.
11:11:46 <doy> but they'd be even cooler with blink hydra rooms!
11:11:48 <doy> (:
11:11:49 <greensnark> Literally dying
11:12:14 <dpeg> Hydras that are able to rip off a head and throw it at the player.
11:12:26 <KiloByte> rip off THE PLAYER'S head
11:12:27 <greensnark> Halflings that can throw explosive pineapples
11:12:32 <KiloByte> and throw it at them
11:12:52 <KiloByte> doesn't matter for most races, but a felid player will risk losing two lives
11:13:34 <greensnark> Killer Klowns should be able to juggle their heads with other objects
11:14:04 <KiloByte> Monkey Island 1's Murray?
11:14:20 <KiloByte> before he became a disembodied skull
11:17:39 <dpeg> greensnark: would be good speech (VISUAL), yes.
11:17:57 * greensnark is not serious :P
11:19:10 <greensnark> Enne: This rc problem is new?
11:19:17 <greensnark> Where tile_options is not read
11:19:38 <Enne> New-ish? I think I noticed it yesterday.
11:19:46 <greensnark> Oh
11:20:00 <greensnark> That predates my macro_dir changes <3
11:20:04 * greensnark feels better already
11:20:06 <greensnark> :D
11:20:24 <greensnark> About time we fixed the silly "unknown" though
11:21:13 <KiloByte> greensnark: indeed, oklobra's learndb was the same at least back to the day I implemented learndb.html, so you're right, my memory is faulty
11:22:01 <greensnark> doy: You going to play in the tourney? :P
11:22:14 <greensnark> cabal needs players, can't let 78291 battle the forces of darkness solo
11:22:19 <greensnark> I mean the forces of teamkiku
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11:27:43 <CIA-39> 03enne.walker * r5924350ec00d 10/crawl-ref/source/ (tilereg.cc tilereg.h tilesdl.cc): Resize the minimap region to take up more space.
11:27:43 <CIA-39> 03enne.walker * rfe22e64dcfd6 10/crawl-ref/source/rltiles/dc-feat.txt: Fix blood animations on stone arches.
11:27:44 <CIA-39> 03enne.walker * r6bb769da38d4 10/crawl-ref/source/tilereg-map.cc: Let minimap right click view go out of bounds.
11:28:01 <doy> greensnark: hopefully!
11:28:02 <greensnark> Sure would be nice to be able to run the tourney scripts on some other machine
11:28:12 <greensnark> cao feels about 5x slower than my desktop
11:28:13 <doy> who else from the cabal is even still around
11:28:26 <greensnark> Grimm is in cabal, right?
11:28:34 <syllogism> cbus sent me an in-game message today :P
11:28:35 <doy> is he still around?
11:28:40 <greensnark> Grimm is around, yes
11:28:51 <doy> cbus, jarpiain, stabwound, grimm, me, 78291 i think was the lineup
11:28:52 <greensnark> !rc doy
11:28:53 <by> greensnark: could offer a free feature request to the tournament winner; maybe stabwound would play so speed randomization is removed
11:28:55 <Henzell> http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rcfiles/doy.crawlrc
11:29:10 <greensnark> by: Heh
11:29:17 <greensnark> I think he's just not in a Crawl mood
11:30:10 <by> team square_los can fight team no_random_speed
11:30:17 <syllogism> hah
11:30:24 <syllogism> team_no_acid_walls
11:30:36 <greensnark> team_no_heavy_armour in there?
11:30:53 <greensnark> I guess team_no_heavy_armour is a superset
11:31:19 <Enne> team_let_me_pick_my_draconian_colour_whine_whine_whine
11:31:19 <Napkin> omg! i was just about to praise my +4,+3 quarterstaff of chaos.. when I fell through shaft 5 -> 8!
11:31:42 <greensnark> Napkin: Isn't chaos awesome! You get to go to new places, meet new monsters
11:32:04 <Napkin> almost right beside an ogre :D
11:32:18 <syllogism> you can probably abuse the mechanic by summoning and then whacking them until you get a shaft, though it's not clear what these shafts would accomplish :P
11:32:39 <casmith789> d:27 at level 1
11:33:07 <syllogism> good luck getting a weapon of chaos at level 1
11:33:16 <syllogism> i suppose you could get reaally luck with xom
11:33:24 <doy> well, crazy yiuf's vault isn't that uncommon
11:33:26 <doy> and it's pretty early
11:33:31 <syllogism> and then really lucky again repeatedly while you scum for shafts :P
11:33:38 <syllogism> doy: killing him would give you a bunch of xp
11:33:49 <doy> @??crazy yiuf
11:33:50 <Gretell> Crazy Yiuf (15g) | Speed: 10 | HD: 3 | Health: 20 | AC/EV: 2/9 | Damage: 9 | Res: 06magic(12) | Chunks: 07contaminated | XP: 41.
11:33:56 <CIA-39> 03enne.walker 07stone_soup-0.7 * r56918939373c 10/crawl-ref/source/rltiles/dc-feat.txt: Fix blood animations on stone arches.
11:34:00 <doy> hmmm, guess 41 is too much
11:34:03 <CIA-39> 03dpeg * r950e825a04ad 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/database/monspeak.txt: Add Killer Klown speech (greensnark).
11:34:05 <RjY> you all joke, but last tournament i really wanted to make a clan named the society for the restoration of spell range :P
11:34:19 <greensnark> dpeg: Hey, that was a joke :P
11:34:29 <greensnark> dpeg: b0rsuk is going to be really pissed with more Killer Klown speech :P
11:34:40 <dpeg> greensnark: it is only a VISUAL :)
11:34:47 <syllogism> he should form a team and get in the line :P
11:34:53 <syllogism> team no_joke_monsters
11:35:04 <greensnark> Yeah, that team would fill up quick
11:35:12 <greensnark> I keep seeing players in ##crawl complaining about death cobs :P
11:35:49 <Napkin> wtf.. who is Joseph?! and who gave him a that sling?! the bullets hurt as if he had thrown a rock!
11:35:58 <greensnark> Napkin: That would be a dueism
11:36:03 <greensnark> A dueity perhaps?
11:36:05 <dpeg> Where were those players when someone added hellephants?
11:36:08 <syllogism> oh I noticed that too :P
11:36:15 <greensnark> dpeg: They're around :P
11:36:27 <greensnark> There was a lot of wailing and gnashing of teeth over hellephants
11:36:28 <dpeg> greensnark: thankfully I didn't notice them :)
11:36:47 <greensnark> Also some players in SA are affronted that there's a cats branch instead of a jelly-race branch :P
11:37:01 <greensnark> Apparently this is a direct personal insult to them :P
11:37:15 <syllogism> still waiting for GoB race
11:37:23 <greensnark> What's the GoB race
11:37:25 <syllogism> giant orange brain
11:37:28 <Mu_> good design methodology is to pitch ideas @ SA and do the opposite of their consensus
11:37:28 <greensnark> Oh, right
11:37:36 <syllogism> not sure why i said GoB and not GOB :P
11:37:43 <Napkin> dead :(
11:37:50 <greensnark> dpeg: GoEC on SA thinks Crawl design is fundamentally flawed
11:38:02 <greensnark> dpeg: because it doesn't have NH-style endgame after orb :)
11:38:09 <dpeg> greensnark: nice joke
11:38:10 * bhaak snickers
11:38:15 <syllogism> just end-game before orb, but then real end game is too easy :P
11:38:25 <syllogism> (his words)
11:38:25 <Napkin> anyways, monsters are much better to see in tiles now, really great
11:38:54 <Napkin> the monster list tab is somehow missing the names of the monsters and not promiment enough yet
11:39:11 <Napkin> compared to the console monsterlist, at least
11:39:13 <Enne> You can mouse over them for names.
11:39:26 <Enne> Theoretically the tile should indicate which monster they are.
11:39:28 <Napkin> i don't touch the mouse too often
11:39:37 <syllogism> though tele control should be prohibited during orb run
11:39:51 <RjY> out of curiosity, are you opposed to a jelly race branch or is it just that no-one cares enough to write it?
11:39:56 <Napkin> i played with tile_tag_pref = tutorial which is quite cool for starters in tiles
11:39:58 <dpeg> syllogism: yes, carrying the orb should do that
11:40:13 <casmith789> jelly race branch? isn't that slime? or am I missing something
11:40:15 <dpeg> RjY: it's certainly not a task for mainline development
11:40:38 <Enne> Napkin: Oh, good! I just added that on a whim and nobody ever gave much feedback about it.
11:41:03 <Napkin> it's really cool - maybe you can even add the value to always show all names?
11:41:25 <doy> casmith789: git branch, not game branch
11:41:29 <casmith789> ah
11:41:30 <greensnark> dpeg: I think Napkin has joined team_tiles :)
11:41:35 <Enne> Napkin: I could, but then I'd have to fix the bug where names cover up each other and look terrible.  ;)
11:41:41 <Napkin> would haven chosen that, but tutorial was quite nice too - like "ah, first hobgoblin this game!" :D
11:42:07 <Napkin> greensnarking :D
11:42:28 <dpeg> greensnark: one of us will be the last man consoling.
11:42:56 <RjY> i mean, i just figured there's a cats branch since kilobyte cared enough to make it
11:42:58 <Napkin> and i wish the wand tiles with torches had a halo around it ;)
11:42:59 <greensnark> I don't think doy is in any danger of abandoning his 8x12 bitmapped terminal fonts soon either :)
11:43:07 <doy> 6x10
11:43:08 <doy> (:
11:43:54 <greensnark> casmith789: This might interest you: http://crawl.akrasiac.org/tourney10/overview.html
11:44:07 <greensnark> Under "Clans"
11:44:10 <casmith789> hey, cool
11:44:14 <casmith789> let's end it there
11:44:21 <greensnark> Hehe
11:44:59 <greensnark> !rc casmith789
11:44:59 <Henzell> http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rcfiles/casmith789.crawlrc
11:45:11 <greensnark> You seem to be missing two players though
11:45:25 <greensnark> !rc MarvinPA
11:45:25 <Henzell> http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rcfiles/MarvinPA.crawlrc
11:45:34 <greensnark> Ok, they haven't updated their rcs
11:46:04 <st_> haha, the "winning gods" on my page is funny
11:46:11 <st_> No God, No God, No God, No God, Okawaru, Trog
11:47:48 <casmith789> hmm, how come Team Kiku is "TeamKiku" and not with a space?
11:48:47 <Mu_> jiyva banner should be named dissolution imo :p
11:49:10 <greensnark> casmith789: Because you didn't use an underscore in the name
11:49:15 <casmith789> oh, okay
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12:06:36 <ortoslon> syllogism: you could polymorph yiuf to get his staff of chaos without killing him
12:07:51 <syllogism> true
12:08:03 <greensnark> Someone should do a concept game :P
12:08:27 <greensnark> Using stairs only to find Yiuf and thereafter only shafts to get to D:27
12:08:49 <greensnark> Sounds like it'd be as much fun as killing Cerebov using only spammals
12:14:18 <greensnark> dpeg: We increased the piety cost of BiA and greater servants in Sprint
12:14:33 <greensnark> dpeg: Can you check that that's ok
12:15:08 <greensnark> Greater servants are really cheap even in the main game
12:15:27 <greensnark> Especially with Faith :P
12:18:36 <dpeg> greensnark: yes, I saw that. Looks okay :)
12:18:59 <doy> yeah, i wouldn't be opposed to increasing greater servant cost in general
12:19:02 <dpeg> One would wonder whether those abilities aren't too cheap in the main game either.
12:19:03 <doy> but probably not for 0.7
12:19:04 <doy> (:
12:19:08 <dpeg> doy: exactly
12:19:21 <doy> greater servant definitely is, i haven't played enough trog games to really comment on bia
12:19:46 <dpeg> hoover time
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12:30:23 <dpeg> hoover finish
12:33:08 <greensnark> What about taekwondo
12:34:52 <KiloByte> one thing about armour training: how the heck are you supposed to train it if you have 27 EV even in a dragon armour and thus dodge everything?
12:35:21 <casmith789> wear a -6 ring of evasion
12:35:28 <KiloByte> (SpBe with int being the dump stat)
12:36:12 <by> wear gold dragon armour?
12:36:39 <KiloByte> by: when I'll find one, yeah
12:37:25 <by> greensnark: is the bia piety change on cdo?
12:37:46 <by> (unfortunately I don't have my cdo-enabled key handy to update myself)
12:38:09 <casmith789> I think it is, but not certain
12:39:11 <greensnark> Not on cdo
12:39:15 <casmith789> oh
12:39:17 <casmith789> bother
12:39:17 <greensnark> At least I haven't run the build yet
12:39:18 <casmith789> :)
12:39:30 <greensnark> I was going to do it after the rc2 thing
12:39:45 <casmith789> I just won a TrBe and was all pleased with myself :p
12:39:50 <casmith789> guess I just cheated :(
12:40:44 <doy> i'm up to xl11 as a trbe and only used bia once so far (and probably didn't even need to then)
12:40:53 <doy> i imagine it continues to get harder though
12:41:21 <by> trbe should be able to win sprint 1 without brothers if they get past sonja
12:41:30 <doy> i'm doing sprint 2
12:41:33 <by> ok
12:41:42 <doy> it feels easier than sprint 1, if you can get out of the starting room
12:42:19 <by> yes, I find I prefer the less open feel of sprint 1
12:44:42 <dpeg> by: yes, Sprint 1 was so cramped, I loved that.
12:44:59 <dpeg> But we will get many more maps, including some small and really dense ones (I hope).
12:45:02 <by> it's really playable now with the noise changes with a lot of characters
12:45:17 <dpeg> greensnark: no time these weeks. I am completely out of shape, couldn't kick any cop's ass.
12:45:33 <by> just have to patiently retry the first three monsters with many chars
12:45:36 <casmith789> sprint 2 is easier imo because of the choice of routes
12:45:47 <casmith789> but sprint 1 was a lot more accessible after the noise changes
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12:46:28 <greensnark> pointless_ returns
12:46:34 <pointless_> indeed
12:46:38 <greensnark> pointless_: You playing in this year's tourney?
12:46:50 <pointless_> well probably not much
12:46:57 <dpeg> We need some developers playing!
12:47:10 <dpeg> I wouldn't even suggest winning, just playing :)
12:47:12 <greensnark> dpeg: I hope for two wins to maintain my peerless 2009 record
12:47:12 <nrook> "devteam" would be a great name for a clan, just saying
12:47:42 <dpeg> nrook: there has been a devteam clan in the last years.
12:48:07 <greensnark> We don't use the "DevTeam" name because it's lame when we're not even in the top 10 :P
12:48:27 <dpeg> of course, there could be special rules for clan DEVTEAM members
12:49:04 <greensnark> I could do pretty well if we import the felid life rules for name == "greensnark"
12:49:16 <greensnark> I'd be a haaard man to beat with those rules on a normal species
12:49:26 <felirx> devteam is allowed to run in debug builds
12:49:30 <felirx> you know... hunting bugs!
12:49:33 <dpeg> :)
12:51:15 <Mu_> i've been rejected from the SA clan for not wanting to play ogres :p
12:51:42 <dpeg> Mu_: you should play in the devteam clan now!
12:52:02 <dpeg> Like last year, I'll only be around for one week in August. :/
12:52:09 <dpeg> You can have my place, if you like.
12:52:58 <Mu_> nah don't worry about it :p
12:53:02 <dpeg> greensnark: what about making the JIYVA and CHE banners worth 100 points each?
12:53:13 <doy> hmmm
12:53:20 <greensnark> Che already is worth 100
12:53:21 <doy> giant orange brains are particularly unimpressive in sprint
12:53:30 <greensnark> People were complaining that the Jiyva banner is underpointed, yes
12:53:31 <doy> because they summon from the d:1 list
12:54:37 <casmith789> can't you make the jiyva banner to destroy a rune
12:54:59 <dpeg> greensnark: cool!
12:55:09 <dpeg> casmith789: no, not as cool
12:55:17 <doy> too easy
12:55:25 <casmith789> it's effectively cheating someone out of a win
12:55:45 <dpeg> now, if the task was to destroy _all_ runes (over the course of the tournament)...
12:57:30 <pointless_> no lowest D at xl:1 competition :(
12:57:30 <greensnark> If the task were to destroy all runes over the course of the tournament, it'd be a 2011 tournament task :P
12:57:55 <greensnark> I don't mind reinstating the XL 1 dive thing, code's all there and tested from last year :P
12:58:17 <greensnark> Convince dpeg and you have it :)
12:58:42 <pointless_> dpeg: Diving at xl:1 is an important crawl skill, surely the competition should reward it?
12:59:22 <greensnark> Diving at XL 1 while singing the complete score to Meet me in St Louis
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13:01:09 <dpeg> pointless_: we have Sprint now
13:02:03 <pointless_> Not really the same since you gain levels and kill things in sprint
13:02:46 <by> an xl 1 sprint competition
13:04:18 <greensnark> Sprint in twinned game mode where you must control two characters simultaneously with the same keystrokes on two different sprint maps, and either dying ends the game
13:04:38 <by> that sounds like some work to code
13:05:08 <greensnark> Not too hard if you play on both servers, but tracking death, yes
13:05:14 <greensnark> jarpiain used to do it with regular crawl games
13:05:24 <greensnark> Playing on cao and cdo with the same set of keystrokes
13:07:43 <by> just require same milestone timestamps :)
13:07:54 <by> might be enough of a challenge, in a non-sprint game at least
13:09:12 <by> seems like simultaneous play would involve a lot of interface trickery
13:09:46 <jld> Wasn't one of Linley's shoot-em-ups based on a "control two things in separate universes with same commands" scheme?
13:10:37 <doy> hmmm, the timers in sprint 2 are a nice touch
13:11:28 <sorear> greensnark: did he start them in the same second, before the RNG seeding improvements?
13:11:51 <doy> sartak did that with nethack once
13:13:22 <purge> Shouldn't there be a large banner on the CDO front page advertising the tournament?
13:15:33 <dpeg> pointless_: I was one of the (few) players who loved the XL 1 sidegame, and I think that Sprint captures the basic idea much better.
13:16:36 <pointless_> I liked the xl:1 dive, and I'm sad to see it go but obviously it's not up to me.
13:19:07 <dpeg> pointless_: I played it seriously in the last tournament :)
13:19:23 <dpeg> But it is also much more scripted than Sprint.
13:20:31 <pointless_> Yes I understand what you are saying. This doesn't mean I agree, but there's apparently nothing to discuss here.
13:20:34 <syllogism> !lg * xl=1 place>D:10
13:20:35 <Sequell> 10917. polystyrus the Charm-Maker (L1 SpEn), succumbed to a kobold's poison on D:2 on 2010-07-17, with 69 points after 247 turns and 0:01:27.
13:20:41 <syllogism> err
13:20:43 <syllogism> !lg * xl=1 place>D:9
13:20:43 <Sequell> 26. sqwishy the Scout (L1 SpTh), killed by triggering a bolt trap in a Labyrinth on 2010-06-28, with 246 points after 1556 turns and 0:19:23.
13:20:49 <syllogism> well that works at least :P
13:20:55 <doy> hmmm, sprint should also be no_monster_gen
13:21:00 <dpeg> doy: why?
13:21:07 <dpeg> It's fun when they spawn and open doors.
13:21:08 <doy> because it generates monsters from d:1
13:21:10 <syllogism> those monsters are just free piety and food :P
13:21:10 <doy> and that's boring
13:21:31 <doy> and yeah, what syllogism said
13:21:52 <dpeg> doy: yes, but a goblin can still open a door
13:22:15 <dpeg> I had that a few times, and it's great fun. Apart from that, the native depth could be higher, yes.
13:23:24 <dpeg> btw, do the Mu sprint shops now stock more interesting items?
13:23:42 <syllogism> dpeg: have you tried trog/makhleb since the piety nerf?
13:23:49 <Ashenzari> Dungeon overview shows previous characters info (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=1996) by chukamok
13:24:08 <syllogism> seemed pretty good to me; they are still very useful, but you can't go completely crazy with the summons
13:24:18 <dpeg> syllogism: no, no time :(
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13:28:57 <KiloByte> problem: Geryon likes to fly over lava when he gets a chance, and that makes it possible the horn will be lost.
13:29:07 <greensnark> That's fine with me
13:29:12 <KiloByte> perhaps it may be better to take flying away from him?
13:29:15 <greensnark> "Remember not to kill him over lava next time"
13:29:17 <doy> no
13:29:31 <doy> well
13:29:38 <doy> was the problem before that the beasts gave xp?
13:29:54 <dpeg> I don't think it's a big problem. Pointing out the issue in Geryon's description is fine by me. Should I go ahead?
13:29:59 <greensnark> dpeg: No, please
13:30:08 <dpeg> greensnark: no? Okay.
13:30:08 <greensnark> We really don't need this kind of hand-holding
13:30:15 <doy> agree with greensnark
13:30:17 <greensnark> Player will figure it out next game :)
13:30:26 <dpeg> I'd add a strange sentence but I don't mind.
13:30:28 <KiloByte> it's just screwing unspoiled players for no good reason
13:30:41 <greensnark> They can win the game just fine
13:30:41 <Napkin> oh? iron devil in d10 :-O
13:30:48 <dpeg> Napkin: not a problem
13:30:53 <ortoslon> lava destroying items isn't spoiler knowledge
13:31:09 <dpeg> ortoslon: but they might not now about opening the hell gates.
13:31:49 <dpeg> "A huge, three-headed, winged arch-demon, guardian of the gates of Hell.
13:31:58 <dpeg> is the current description
13:32:03 <greensnark> Players should in general be careful about killing flying monsters over lava
13:32:10 <doy> @??hellephant
13:32:10 <Gretell> hellephant (04Y) | Speed: 10 | HD: 20 | Health: 140-200 | AC/EV: 13/10 | Damage: 45, 20, 15 | Flags: 05demonic, !sil | Res: 06magic(133) | XP: 3634 | Sp: fire breath (3d40), blink.
13:32:18 <greensnark> This is not something that needs extra instructions
13:32:36 <greensnark> We're approaching American style inanity such as "contents of coffee cup may be hot" :P
13:32:38 <KiloByte> there are no other vital items which may fly
13:32:49 <dpeg> I think it is okay to state that Geryon carries the horn.
13:32:51 <greensnark> It's not vital
13:33:02 <doy> There is a fountain of blood, spattered with blood here.
13:33:02 <ortoslon> !coffee greensnark
13:33:02 <greensnark> There's no need to state it, he blows the bloody thing and produces messages
13:33:03 * Henzell hands greensnark a mug of cappuccino, brewed by Nikola.
13:33:21 <dpeg> doy: with a helping of blood, perhaps?
13:33:32 <dpeg> greensnark: true that
13:33:48 <greensnark> ortoslon: Thanks!
13:34:13 <by> if anything, add some speech, "over my dead body"?
13:34:31 <dpeg> geryon's descriptions has one of these quotes either Peter or Nat is so fond of. I didn't have the guts to fight them when they spread in the database like a plague.
13:34:59 <greensnark> As long as you remove it without saying "Removing Peter's precious darling quotes" in the first line of the commit they won't notice :P
13:35:07 <doy> very nethack-ish
13:35:08 <doy> (:
13:35:11 <by> "Clean up quotes."
13:35:21 <dpeg> greensnark: I can't!
13:35:27 <greensnark> Why? :P
13:35:39 <pointless_> "Minor cosmetic fixes"
13:35:40 <by> hey, Geryon has three heads
13:35:55 <greensnark> by: Yeah, I hadn't realised that before either :)
13:35:59 <dpeg> I already abused them by sneaking superuser access and then handing it out freely (and inviting tons of people to the team).
13:35:59 <by> "Spacing tweaks."
13:36:14 <dpeg> greensnark: Ethics and stuff :P
13:36:34 <greensnark> Ethics is that place in central Europe, right?
13:36:42 <dpeg> I realise I am in a small minority which is riddled with feelings like this :)
13:36:42 <by> clearly, geryon should grow extra heads if you kill a beast
13:37:09 <greensnark> @?? Geryon
13:37:09 <Gretell> Geryon (03&) | Speed: 10 | HD: 15 | Health: 300 | AC/EV: 15/6 | Damage: 35 | Flags: 05demonic, see invisible, fly | Res: 06magic(120) | XP: 6391 | Sp: beast.
13:37:19 <greensnark> He should also get as many attacks as heads, obviously
13:37:48 <dpeg> Random numbers of heads, I say!
13:38:05 <greensnark> We should do a hydra with an irrational number of heads one of these days
13:38:20 <dpeg> hypercomplex number!
13:38:46 <dpeg> People will pass out simply from seeing "A (3+2i-4j-k) headed hydra."
13:38:54 <Ashenzari> Tiles version response time is very slow... (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=1997) by Twilight
13:39:20 <syllogism> blazing fast over here, very responsive
13:39:26 <ortoslon> ^ "time for a new PC" :P
13:39:39 <greensnark> syllogism: He's using a netbook :P
13:39:51 <greensnark> You're sitting on a machine that can play DF :P
13:39:52 <dpeg> And I always thought Tiles is by design for slow people.
13:39:55 <syllogism> barely :P
13:40:11 <ortoslon> dpeg: i'm an exception to that
13:40:12 <syllogism> tiles is more responsive than console :P
13:40:22 <greensnark> Whoa, 1 second per move
13:40:29 <KiloByte> syllogism: how come?
13:40:51 <syllogism> KiloByte: it probably isn't, it just felt very snappy when I tried it
13:40:53 <KiloByte> it's slowish, but it's mostly about drawing, not calculations
13:41:12 <greensnark> I think syllogism is joining team_tiles any minute now
13:41:14 <KiloByte> heck, it's playable when I ssh -X into my freaking phone
13:41:29 <syllogism> greensnark: I'll just need ascii tiles :P
13:41:32 <ortoslon> i'll test it on 9" acer aspire one right now
13:41:36 <greensnark> KiloByte: You play tiles over X forwarding from your phone... ?
13:41:56 <sorear> so, who'se going to give #1997 the "MANTIS IS NOT A SUPPORT FORUM" lecture?
13:42:00 <KiloByte> greensnark: I'm trying to debug why tiles don't work there
13:42:00 <greensnark> !learn add KiloByte Plays tile Crawl running on his phone using X forwarding.
13:42:03 <Henzell> kilobyte[2/2]: Plays tile Crawl running on his phone using X forwarding.
13:42:06 <greensnark> KiloByte: Too late :P
13:42:44 <dpeg> Is that line a badge of honour or not?
13:43:04 <KiloByte> greensnark: tiles on desktop: work.  tiles running on the phone with the desktop's display: work.  tiles locally on the phone: nyet work.  tiles on the desktop with the phone's display: nyet work
13:43:05 <greensnark> dpeg: I'm not sure, myself
13:43:20 <greensnark> Oh, you were forwarding to the phone
13:43:26 <greensnark> Is the screen big enough? :P
13:43:42 <KiloByte> 800x480, 4 inches
13:44:13 <greensnark> Oh, and you were running on the phone after all
13:44:20 <KiloByte> I know nothing about GL, and it screams something about not being to open GLX display
13:44:53 <KiloByte> a 900Mhz arm CPU, that's a decent machine
13:45:07 <greensnark> We should do a wiki page talking about the slowdown because of the heavier use of OpenGL in recent Crawls
13:45:15 <KiloByte> it's just the X server which lacks something Crawl's implementation wants
13:45:16 <greensnark> Then we can close this kind of thing with a URL to the wiki
13:45:30 <syllogism> severity: major
13:45:47 <greensnark> Enne did a comprehensive reply to someone with this problem, but I don't remember where that was
13:45:54 <greensnark> We should just wikify that and start pointing people at it
13:46:50 <felirx> for the record, at least .6 worked fine on my netbook with roughly te same specs
13:47:02 <greensnark> Wow, Singularity might have a full set of six players this year
13:47:07 <greensnark> dpeg: Go team us <3
13:47:07 <dpeg> !tell enne Do you happen to know where you posted your in-depth reply to OpenGL slowdowns? 20:45 <+greensnark> We should do a wiki page talking about the slowdown because of the heavier use of OpenGL in recent Crawls
13:47:07 <Henzell> dpeg: OK, I'll let enne know.
13:47:27 <dpeg> this reminds me that I collected some messages of my own
13:47:29 <dpeg> !messages
13:47:29 <Henzell> (1/6) Cryp71c said (4d 3h 40m 31s ago): Alright, I'll keep that in mind while cleaning house.
13:47:31 <dpeg> !messages
13:47:31 <Henzell> (1/5) greensnark said (2d 59m 11s ago): Where are the source files for README.pdf
13:47:48 <dpeg> greensnark: where you would expect them, in a sensible organised project!
13:47:50 <dpeg> !messages
13:47:50 <Henzell> (1/4) greensnark said (2d 58m 24s ago): Please ignore the previous message
13:47:52 <dpeg> !messages
13:47:52 <Henzell> (1/3) greensnark said (2d 58m 9s ago): Do not ignore the previous message
13:47:54 <dpeg> !messages
13:47:54 <Henzell> (1/2) syllogism said (18h 22m 1s ago): I worry BiA/greater servants are going to ruin Sprint in tournament; they costs ~4-5 piety to use and killing almost any monster increases piety by at least 3
13:47:58 <dpeg> !messages
13:47:58 <Henzell> (1/1) by said (3h 18m 27s ago): i'd like to switch back to singularity if you take me
13:48:08 <greensnark> dpeg: You were requested to ignore that message :P
13:49:05 <dpeg> !tell by You're in. Of course we take you, someone's gotta get a win. Cannot trust these Finns, or the peg people or compulsive non-streaking Indians!
13:49:05 <Henzell> dpeg: OK, I'll let by know.
13:50:11 <by> thanks
13:50:11 <Henzell> by: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it.
13:50:34 <greensnark> dpeg: Hey, before you go, change the tsnark to greensnark :P
13:50:38 <by> ??team
13:50:38 <Henzell> I don't have a page labeled team in my learndb.
13:51:05 <dpeg> greensnark: ok, will do
13:51:20 <syllogism> !lg tsnark
13:51:20 <Sequell> 13. tsnark the Grappler (L11 TrIE), worshipper of Xom, slain by a killer bee on Lair:4 on 2009-08-30, with 14325 points after 18438 turns and 1:27:12.
13:51:24 <syllogism> !lg tsnark 1
13:51:24 <Sequell> 1. tsnark the Firebug (L1 OgFE), slain by a giant gecko on D:1 on 2009-08-01, with 45 points after 235 turns and 0:11:24.
13:51:45 <syllogism> did you have a game going or something :P
13:52:03 * greensnark takes the Fifth.
13:52:05 <doy> wow, that was dumb
13:52:08 <doy> oh well
13:53:04 <ortoslon> netbook testing cancelled, my thumbdrive went kaput
13:54:17 <greensnark> !lg doy Sprint
13:54:17 <Sequell> 138. doy the Wrestler (L13 TrBe), worshipper of Trog, blasted by an orc sorcerer (bolt of negative energy) on Sprint (Sprint II: "The Violet Keep of Menkaure" : the violet keep of menkaure) on 2010-07-17, with 50943 points after 4642 turns and 2:00:18.
13:55:27 <doy> "whew, i got to the other side of the ice cloud room" "oh wait, i haven't explored the other side of the ice cloud room, and now i can't retreat" "oh yeah, and i left my potions on the other side"
13:56:18 <greensnark> :)
13:56:40 <doy> oh, and i had also berserked to kill the ice statue, so slowed on top of everything else
13:56:55 <doy> (since when do ice clouds block bolts of fire?)
13:57:33 <greensnark> dpeg: Let me know when you've updated your crawlrc :P
13:57:44 <greensnark> I think they reduce the range of the bolt
13:57:46 <ortoslon> doy: do they disappear upon blocking?
13:57:57 <doy> ortoslon: not as far as i could tell
13:57:58 <greensnark> At least there was some code to that effect that I recall
13:58:27 <dpeg> greensnark: at your service!
14:00:59 <greensnark> dpeg: Don't see by in the list
14:01:00 <syllogism> you can use conjure flame to block monster ice attacks
14:01:07 <syllogism> some of them anyway
14:01:08 <greensnark> !rc rob
14:01:08 <Henzell> http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rcfiles/by.crawlrc
14:01:34 <greensnark> by: You need to move your TEAMCAPTAIN line up to first line :)
14:01:51 <dpeg> blammo :)
14:01:59 <by> greensnark: ok, thanks
14:01:59 <greensnark> And dpeg: I believe his preferred tournament name is "rob" :P
14:02:22 <dpeg> by: which one?
14:02:57 <by> rob
14:03:25 <by> cao is incredibly laggy for me; it used to be better than cdo...
14:03:46 <greensnark> Has your ping worsened
14:03:48 <dpeg> # TEAMNAME Singularity
14:03:49 <dpeg> # TEAMCAPTAIN dpeg
14:03:49 <dpeg> # TEAMMEMBERS greensnark haranp keskitalo Tityrus rob
14:03:57 <syllogism> !lg tityrus
14:03:58 <Sequell> 1198. Tityrus the Charm-Maker (L4 HEEn), slain by an orc (a -1,+0 orcish flail) on D:3 on 2010-07-02, with 178 points after 3074 turns and 0:08:14.
14:04:21 <by> greensnark: seems like it: high variance, between 120 and 210 ms
14:04:33 <by> used to be a constant 100 or 120 or so iirc
14:04:39 <greensnark> I generally have much worse ping to cdo if I go direct
14:04:48 <greensnark> My cao ping is about where it usually is, 280ms
14:05:09 <greensnark> Very little variance too
14:05:16 <by> but cao used to play better with that ~100ms ping than cdo with lower ping
14:05:32 <greensnark> The machine is not seriously loaded
14:05:40 <by> probably the connection
14:05:45 <greensnark> Also, CDO hardware has improved considerably from days of yore :)
14:06:06 <greensnark> Napkin is running a nice 12G Core i7 with triple-channel RAM, I believe
14:07:55 <Napkin> you are the one running that one, greensnark ;)
14:08:08 <greensnark> Oh, I thought that was you :P
14:08:15 <Napkin> i have mere 4gb with core2quad
14:08:18 <greensnark> I stayed with the cheap 8G option :)
14:08:44 <Napkin> well, let's see what next year brings ;)
14:09:03 <Napkin> anyways, by, are you using ssh?
14:09:32 <Napkin> i believe my isp's _disabled_ bandwidth management is screwing with telnet
14:10:05 <by> usually, but telnet right now
14:10:44 <by> Napkin: also, I'm not bothered by possible cdo lag -- either it's gone or I'm used to it
14:11:45 <Napkin> at this time of the day the tremulous servers are a bit busy - but still the server has a load of 0.33
14:11:55 <greensnark> Napkin: by has lag to cao, not cdo
14:12:12 <Napkin> oh
14:12:22 * Napkin goes back his cave *
14:12:32 <greensnark> by: Anyway, nothing stopping you playing on cdo :P
14:12:46 <by> yes, I was just surprised when editing my cdo rc before
14:12:55 <greensnark> The more players on cdo the better, actually, because cao tends to be seriously overloaded during the tourney
14:13:04 <greensnark> And running the tourney scripts on cao doesn't help the load :P
14:14:26 <greensnark> !rc dpeg
14:14:26 <Henzell> http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rcfiles/dpeg.crawlrc
14:14:50 <greensnark> Ok, I shall fix his rc for him :P
14:17:53 <dpeg> greensnark: what's still wrong?
14:18:53 <greensnark> Just the .rc trawler being overly picky
14:19:06 <Ashenzari> Identify scrolls target themselves (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=1998) by Tiedyemike
14:21:21 <KiloByte> greensnark: is it intentional that spriggans, and spriggans only are handled in player_size_adjusted_body_armour_evasion_penalty()?
14:21:56 <greensnark> That's essentially the old AC code, nothing new
14:22:07 <greensnark> Or did I screw that up
14:23:13 <greensnark> If I did, let me know. I'm not in the mood to dredge through old Crawl code
14:23:20 <KiloByte> it seems strange to have a long function doing convoluted calculations that boil down to just: if (you.species == SP_SPRIGGAN) ev_penalty = ev_penalty*3/2;
14:24:14 <greensnark> I think that is EV code ripped off from 4.1
14:24:17 <greensnark> Which had giants and stuff
14:24:34 <dpeg> Is there a proponent of "items should be dropped in the order in which they are selected" here?
14:24:37 <greensnark> And probably transforms with different size specs
14:25:23 <dpeg> (I am not, and I just looking for more power to close.)
14:25:27 <greensnark> Ok, rc2 punted to tomorrow
14:25:32 * greensnark off to bed.
14:25:43 <bhaak> gn8 greensnark
14:25:45 <KiloByte> dpeg: yeah, but without showing that order or providing any interface to do that
14:26:00 <KiloByte> greensnark: bye!
14:26:16 <dpeg> KiloByte: ok, so I can't just close free handedly, will leave that FR be.
14:26:35 <KiloByte> the bulk of that FR is way, way overcomplicated
14:27:27 <KiloByte> it may be better to just close and add a tiny mention somewhere in a wiki, the proposed UI is byzantine
14:27:50 <dpeg> okay, perhaps I should do that
14:27:52 <KiloByte> but, the current dropping order is alphabetical, which makes little sense
14:28:14 <dpeg> but is very reliable
14:28:26 <KiloByte> yeah
14:28:32 <dpeg> I believe that in a situation where the order matters, you're always better off doing it turn by turn.
14:28:39 <by> it makes perfect sense to me interface-wise
14:29:08 <dpeg> I could reply to the FR that the feature they want is already implemented: = :)
14:29:42 <by> it would be good to have these kinds of things go straight to the wiki
14:30:08 <dpeg> by: I wouldn't want to do that if everyone agreed that it's a bad idea.
14:30:17 <dpeg> With KiloByte's input, I'll add it to the wiki,.
14:30:41 <dpeg> actually, I like it better to see the FR and discussion first, then add to the wiki. At least with stuff like interface ideas.
14:30:41 <by> I meant if these kind of suggestions were directly added to the wiki, not filed on mantis at all
14:30:54 <dpeg> yes, I understand what you mean
14:34:18 <Napkin> ouch - since when does the ice cave have devils and fiends? :O
14:37:22 <KiloByte> fiends?  hah
14:38:05 <dpeg> Napkin: Eino hat ein bisschen aufgerüstet.
14:38:44 <KiloByte> well, Gehennom has 46972967 fiends and 0 balrugs too, at least according to my underleveled spriggan who wanted a demon whip Trog failed to give but had to run with his tail tucked under
14:40:01 <KiloByte> !learn add spriggan Due to a quirk of 0.7 code, they are the only race that suffers from the size adjustments -- 1.5x the EV penalty.
14:40:01 <Henzell> spriggan[5/5]: Due to a quirk of 0.7 code, they are the only race that suffers from the size adjustments -- 1.5x the EV penalty.
14:41:33 <Napkin> maybe the entrance should no longer be as early as d13 anymore then?
14:43:02 <dpeg> Napkin: did you dieß
14:43:30 <Napkin> yeah.. called 3 more brothers in arms while trying to get away, but.. oh well
14:43:35 <dpeg> The actual map can also refer to the level of the entry vault...
14:43:47 <dpeg> Napkin: :/
14:44:12 <Napkin> demonspawn mutations are really cool now!
14:44:14 <Ashenzari> Crash in describe_xom_favour(), _xom_effect_to_name() with certain (debugging) mallocs (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=1999) by JoachimSchipper
14:44:16 <KiloByte> Napkin: ouch, but there's no point in conserving piety too much
14:44:35 <Napkin> just played one but already wow-effects :D
14:44:56 <Napkin> well, i was out of brothers (piety) after those 3 times, KiloByte ;)
14:45:04 <dpeg> !tell Keskitalo The Ice Cave with the fiends could to be too hard, at least at D:10. (Napkin died, despite liberal use of BiA.) What do you think of leaving the entry vault depths where they are, but picking the actual portal maps depending on dungeon level?
14:45:04 <Henzell> dpeg: OK, I'll let Keskitalo know.
14:46:50 <KiloByte> ah, you were already low
15:00:46 <dpeg> Can one of you look at 1473 (ideally favourably), or should we ask greensnark?
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15:09:00 <CIA-39> 03pointless_ * rb60faeec26c2 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-abil.cc: Better constraint handling when a tentacle end changes position
15:09:03 <CIA-39> 03pointless_ * r96b9b9d7d754 10/crawl-ref/ (220 files in 31 dirs): Merge master into articulated_kraken
15:09:04 <CIA-39> 03pointless_ * re9a00c7fc594 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-abil.cc: Don't bother doing a search when retracting a tentacle
15:09:04 <CIA-39> 03pointless_ * r03c84b26989c 10/crawl-ref/ (16 files in 4 dirs): Merge branch 'master' of ssh://crawl-ref.git.sourceforge.net/gitroot/crawl-ref/crawl-ref into articulated_kraken
15:09:06 <CIA-39> 03pointless_ * ra0b970f4ce59 10/crawl-ref/source/makefile: Revert an accidentally committed makefile change
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15:17:01 <ConCon> hi, err... do i mention tiles errors here too? (newb here)
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15:20:09 <Enne> ConCon: Sure.  :)
15:20:09 <Henzell> Enne: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it.
15:20:13 <Enne> !messages
15:20:13 <Henzell> (1/1) dpeg said (1h 33m 6s ago): Do you happen to know where you posted your in-depth reply to OpenGL slowdowns? 20:45 <+greensnark> We should do a wiki page talking about the slowdown because of the heavier use of OpenGL in recent Crawls
15:23:45 <Enne> !tell dpeg This? http://groups.google.com/group/rec.games.roguelike.misc/msg/641d5b67e8433344
15:23:45 <Henzell> Enne: OK, I'll let dpeg know.
15:24:23 <Enne> We're really at a "somebody with more time than me should do a DirectX port" point.
15:24:31 <Enne> That would fix the Windows issues, at least.
15:34:38 <ConCon> wasn't anything big, just on 0.7 rc1 tiles autopickup had a lua memory issue
15:34:57 <ConCon> save & exit and restart fixed it
15:35:58 <Enne> If you have a save or more information, can you file a bug on Mantis?
15:48:52 <dpeg> Enne: thank you!
15:48:52 <Henzell> dpeg: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it.
15:50:28 <ConCon> wrote something on mantis Enne, didn't have a save unfortunately
15:50:38 <Enne> Thanks, ConCon.  :)(
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15:54:36 <Ashenzari> Lua memory issue with autopickup (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=2000) by ConCon
15:56:22 <Mu_> syllogism do you think those spriggan defenders in the middle of the map are too tough
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16:13:49 <Poor_Yurik> Was about to beat Spelunky and I died to a lowly spider :(
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16:38:09 <pointless_> wow look at me accidentally pushing to the wrong branch
16:39:02 <doy> i hate that
16:39:05 <pointless_> so I seem to have pushed articulated kraken to master, although I didn't mean to
16:39:11 <pointless_> can I reverse this somehow?
16:39:13 <doy> yeah
16:39:23 <doy> you'll have to delete the master branch
16:39:38 <doy> git push origin :master
16:39:53 <doy> then get your local master pointing to the right place
16:39:57 <doy> and git push origin master
16:41:32 <doy> (normally you could just fix it and "git push -f", but sourceforge doesn't allow forced pushes, because sourceforge is dumb)
16:41:54 <pointless_> looks like I pulled remote/master to my local master after making this change (because I am smart and pay attention to things)
16:42:39 <doy> was it a merge or a fast-forward?
16:43:08 <pointless_> I think it was a fast forward (there is no commit for that pull)
16:45:58 <pointless_> dpeg: are you here?
16:48:03 <doy> oh, actually, "git reset --hard 'HEAD@{15 minutes ago}'" should work
16:51:17 <pointless_> that doesn't seem to be working for me (it seems to be giving me the articulated_kraken branch at that timestamp)
16:51:53 <doy> 'master@{15 minutes ago}' then
16:56:23 <pointless_> so far I've managed to get master up to a commit on friday: 	Add Ilkka Koskela (coolio) to the credits.
16:57:05 <doy> here, just reset --hard to 950e825a04adf858ce0e051cdcc0bff51795b544
16:57:45 <pointless_> nice
16:57:57 <pointless_> so I push nothing to master, then push my local copy to master?
16:58:02 <doy> yes
16:59:07 <pointless_> yay
16:59:38 <pointless_> so reset --hard just forcibly undoes whatever changes I make to commit order/merges?
17:00:25 <doy> reset --hard means "update the current branch ref and my working copy to this revision"
17:01:27 <pointless_> I see
17:01:45 <doy> without --hard, it doesn't update the working copy (although it does update the index)
17:01:55 <pointless_> well that was more exciting than the time I pushed a bunch of out of date tags to the repository
17:01:58 <doy> (:
17:05:59 <dpeg> pointless_: yes!
17:06:37 <dpeg> pointless_: :( for the git mess
17:06:48 <pointless_> well I was going to ask you to push your copy of master, but that's fixed now
17:06:53 <pointless_> so don't worry about it
17:07:38 <doy> luckily, git is awesome enough that it's easy to fix without leaving a mess
17:07:40 <doy> (:
17:07:54 <dpeg> !seen enne
17:07:55 <Henzell> I last saw Enne at Sat Jul 17 20:50:39 2010 UTC (1h 17m 16s ago) saying Thanks, ConCon.  :)( on ##crawl-dev.
17:08:02 <dpeg> Enne: still around?
17:08:10 <Enne> A little.  :)
17:08:10 <doy> compare trying to fix a mistake like that in svn
17:08:12 <doy> (:
17:08:31 <dpeg> Do you think it's worthwhile to have a wiki page with the drivers Q&A, and perhaps links to drivers that seem to work for some people?
17:08:47 <Enne> Ooh, that's a good idea.
17:08:51 <dpeg> pointless_: what's up? Also thumbs up for the kraken! Yay for 0.8 :)
17:09:02 <dpeg> Enne: I can do it, but you could do it better. :)
17:09:29 <doy> pointless_: something i find useful is to have the current branch displayed in your prompt
17:09:45 <pointless_> dpeg: nothing, I was going to ask you to push your local master to fix the git issue, but that is not necessary now
17:09:47 <doy> 141 [16:57:45] doy@zaon crawl-ref(g*:stone_soup-0.7) $
17:09:52 <dpeg> pointless_: ah, cool
17:09:57 <pointless_> that's a good idea
17:10:09 <dpeg> doy is a git expert, it seems :)
17:10:37 <dpeg> Enne: drop me a line if I should have a go at the page, okay?
17:10:42 <dpeg> off now
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17:11:31 <doy> pointless_: http://github.com/doy/conf/blob/master/bashrc#L198 is how i do it, but i think there might be easier ways these days
17:11:38 <doy> works well enough for me though
17:13:46 <Enne> I'm using this git-completion.bash script from here: http://www.simplicidade.org/notes/archives/2008/02/git_bash_comple.html
17:13:59 <Enne> It also reminds me that I'm in the middle of a rebase.
17:14:50 <doy> yeah, my prompt does that too
17:15:17 <doy> and yeah, i think that was the "easier ways" i was thinking of
17:17:34 * sorear always wondered what the practical function of doy's weird prompts was
17:22:38 <doy> it's useful!
17:52:50 <CIA-39> 03dolorous * r2fbee3c09eca 10/crawl-ref/source/ (describe.cc xom.cc xom.h): Make describe_xom_favour() and _xom_effect_to_name() return std::string.
18:05:16 <Ashenzari> Monsters Abyssed from arena show up in real game (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=2001) by dbi
18:05:46 <by> heh
18:06:29 <sorear> ...
18:07:02 <doy> this whole "restart on game end" thing is seeming more and more questionable
18:07:18 <doy> crawl has way too much global state scattered all over the place
18:07:45 <sorear> i told you so
18:07:54 <Napkin> congrats on the breaking the 2000th issue!
18:08:21 <sorear> nevermind the fact that it also duplicates dgamelaunch functionality
18:09:04 <Napkin> it's actually very convenient not to have to restart and reposition the window every time I die in Tiles
18:09:26 <Napkin> of course, wm is to blame.. but nevertheless
18:09:48 <Enne> Napkin: I could fix that, probably.
18:10:21 <Napkin> :)
18:13:03 <doy> yeah, it is pretty useful for tiles
18:14:00 <Enne> It'll probably be useful for any port as well, like the iPad or if somebody revives DS Crawl.
18:14:15 <Napkin> true
18:14:27 <Napkin> loading time on those devices can be harsh
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18:25:39 <syllogism> "Monsters Abyssed from arena show up in real game"
18:31:04 <syllogism> they do indeed, another restart_after_game issue
18:32:50 <KiloByte> 99 ijyb hp:1 ; holy scourge ego:pain good_item . buckler ego:reflection good_item . gold dragon armour randart:dragon_king v 99 sigmund spells:banishment,banishment,banishment,banishment delay:0 t:99
18:33:06 <KiloByte> repeat a few times just to be sure, then start that SpCK :p
18:33:16 <syllogism> yes :P
18:33:20 <syllogism> too bad you can't do it online
18:34:12 <casmith789> GDA on a d:1 SpCK with a buckler of reflection?
18:34:26 <syllogism> maybe not the ideal item set for a spck
18:34:31 <casmith789> and a holy scourge of pain!?
18:35:00 <sorear> don't forget . potion of experience
18:35:03 <sorear> q:26
18:35:24 <sorear> remember: monsters aren't scaled to your xl in crawl
18:35:46 <sorear> also, you can just make a bunch of friendly cerebovs to do your bidding
18:37:06 <syllogism> so trying that now
18:37:09 <KiloByte> it may be tricky to get them out of the Abyss, I don't think they follow you on the gate out
18:39:05 <syllogism> the prompt is pretty short, can't fit in everything
18:39:20 <sorear> can't you just run the arena several times?
18:39:32 <syllogism> maybe
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18:44:42 <by> non of my trog gifts in cdo sprint have been particularly highly enchanted for damage
18:45:02 <by> is it likely something changed there recently?
18:45:15 <syllogism> got a crash :P
18:45:39 <syllogism> while waiting for my supposedly friendly hd:99999 frederick to spawn in abyss
18:46:34 <Enne> Haha.
18:48:23 <casmith789> has sprint been updated on cdo yet today?
18:48:33 <syllogism> dont think so
18:48:34 <casmith789> because I got a +4,+5 executioner's axe if that helps
18:48:37 <casmith789> today
18:49:03 <casmith789> not amazingly high, but decent
18:49:33 <syllogism> another crash, probably can't handle friendly monsters
18:50:20 <sorear> probably can't handle hd:99999
18:50:33 <syllogism> was a more vanilla frederick this time :P
18:50:41 <syllogism> hd:99999 works fine
18:50:46 <sorear> @?? frederick
18:50:47 <Gretell> Frederick (03@) | Speed: 10 | HD: 21 | Health: 159 | AC/EV: 0/10 | Damage: 27 | Flags: evil, spellcaster, see invisible | Res: 06magic(140) | Chunks: 07contaminated | XP: 5373 | Sp: mystic blast (3d25), b.cold (3d30), invisibility, animate dead, iron shot (3d36).
18:50:54 <syllogism> @?? frederick hd:99999
18:50:56 <Gretell> Frederick (03@) | Speed: 10 | HD: 99999 | Health: 159 | AC/EV: 0/10 | Damage: 27 | Flags: evil, spellcaster, see invisible | Res: 06magic(140) | Chunks: 07contaminated | XP: 15000 | Sp: mystic blast (3d85720), b.cold (3d109097), invisibility, animate dead, iron shot (3d133340).
18:52:37 <syllogism> oh wait, didn't crash now
18:53:03 <casmith789> that's quite some damage :p
18:53:11 <syllogism> you can take him through an abyss portal too
18:53:28 <Mu_> syllogism do you think those spriggan defenders in the middle of the map are too tough
18:54:04 <syllogism> @?? spriggan defender
18:54:04 <Gretell> spriggan defender (08i) | Speed: 16 | HD: 15 | Health: 35-55 | AC/EV: 3/30 | Damage: 10 | Flags: see invisible | Res: 06magic(140) | Chunks: 07contaminated | XP: 1579.
18:54:20 <Mu_> i got joey off sa to do some testing and it was one of the comments he made
18:54:35 <syllogism> what was he playing
18:54:41 <Mu_> spck
18:54:41 <syllogism> also did he beat it yet
18:54:56 <syllogism> spck of makhleb?
18:54:57 <Mu_> he got to zot and got oneshot by the orb of fire for more than his maxhp
18:55:02 <Mu_> yeah
18:55:11 <syllogism> if he got to zot it's definitely not too tough :P
18:55:27 <Mu_> "oh, and those spriggan defenders are, IMHO, way too strong.  maybe lower their hp?  they can usually plow through a couple of greater servants (even executioners!) a piece.  i don't know how other builds would handle them."
18:55:38 <syllogism> they've like no hp
18:55:50 <Mu_> ya it's prolly their ev he was getting at
18:56:41 <syllogism> you don't even have to fight them if you don't wake them up
18:56:47 <sorear> !fight spriggan defender v executioner
18:57:13 <sorear> !fight spriggan defender v executioner t:9 delay:200
18:57:47 <sorear> Oh, they have silly weapons
18:57:47 <syllogism> !fight fiend v spriggan defender t:5 delay:200
18:57:53 <sorear> No wonder they win
18:57:59 <sorear> Flails on Sp?  Seriously?
18:58:12 <Mu_> i gave mine daggers of draining
18:58:21 <sorear> !fight spriggan defender v balrug t:13 delay:150
18:58:57 <syllogism> you definitely should not touch the defenders
18:59:06 <Mu_> alright
18:59:22 <syllogism> I suppose you could change their equipment to something marginally less annoying :P
18:59:36 <sorear> daggers of distortion, mayhaps?
18:59:39 <Mu_> hehe
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19:00:44 <Mu_> also mennas taught me that silence goes through walls
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19:03:42 <syllogism> !fight spriggan defender v ogre ; potion of berserk rage t:5 delay:150
19:04:07 <syllogism> !fight spriggan defender v stone giant ; potion of berserk rage t:5 delay:150
19:04:11 <due> Evening.
19:11:07 <syllogism> Mu_: with some luck a troll can even take out two defenders with zerk
19:11:15 <syllogism> and if you can isolate them, definitely
19:13:08 <Mu_> ok
19:14:02 <due> Mu_: Yeah. Silenced through walls <3.
19:14:10 <Mu_> lmao
19:14:13 <Mu_> is it a bug or intentional
19:14:35 <by> not a bug
19:14:53 <Mu_> nice
19:30:42 <Keskitalo> !messages
19:30:42 <Henzell> (1/1) dpeg said (4h 45m 38s ago): The Ice Cave with the fiends could to be too hard, at least at D:10. (Napkin died, despite liberal use of BiA.) What do you think of leaving the entry vault depths where they are, but picking the actual portal maps depending on dungeon level?
19:31:23 <Keskitalo> !tell dpeg Could be good, the difficulty is very different when you compare the frost giant maps with the ice fiend maps.
19:31:23 <Henzell> Keskitalo: OK, I'll let dpeg know.
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19:40:46 <syllogism> @?? the lernaean hydra simulacrum
19:40:47 <Gretell> large simulacrum (12Z) | Speed: 8 | HD: 30 | Health: 63-115 | AC/EV: 0/5 | Damage: 1412(cold:30-89) per head | Flags: 07undead, evil | Res: 06magic(6), 12cold+++, 03poison | Vul: 04fire | XP: 1795.
19:40:59 <syllogism> I see cold damage was added at some point
19:41:51 <due> It had to be added?
19:42:06 <by> sprint BiA nerf can't have been too hard: just won a KeBe without
19:42:09 <syllogism> as in gretell shows it
19:42:16 <due> Oh
19:42:26 <syllogism> by: without BiA?
19:42:29 <by> yes
19:42:37 <by> (sprint 1)
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19:47:27 <syllogism> did you kill the fire giants or blink past lom?
19:48:36 <due> hey hey blinky lom!
19:49:21 <by> fire giants
19:49:52 <syllogism> @?? fire giant
19:49:52 <Gretell> fire giant (05C) | Speed: 10 | HD: 16 | Health: 69-123 | AC/EV: 8/4 | Damage: 30 | Flags: sense invisible, !sil | Res: 06magic(85), 05fire++ | Chunks: 07contaminated | XP: 2046 | Sp: b.fire (3d25), fireball (3d26).
19:50:35 <by> they're not the hard part really; sonja is the biggest obstacle
19:50:54 <due> Sonja is the scariest actually
19:51:11 <due> She is scarily difficult
19:52:27 <by> fire giants might be trouble if you don't find fire resistance, I guess, but you can still curare them
19:53:46 <Poor_Yurik> i just beat Spelunky
19:54:00 <syllogism> I wish it was longer
19:54:08 <CIA-39> 03pointless_ 07articulated_kraken * r96b9b9d7d754 10/crawl-ref/ (220 files in 31 dirs): Merge master into articulated_kraken
19:54:09 <CIA-39> 03pointless_ 07articulated_kraken * rb60faeec26c2 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-abil.cc: Better constraint handling when a tentacle end changes position
19:54:10 <CIA-39> 03pointless_ 07articulated_kraken * re9a00c7fc594 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-abil.cc: Don't bother doing a search when retracting a tentacle
19:54:11 <CIA-39> 03pointless_ 07articulated_kraken * r03c84b26989c 10/crawl-ref/ (16 files in 4 dirs): Merge branch 'master' of ssh://crawl-ref.git.sourceforge.net/gitroot/crawl-ref/crawl-ref into articulated_kraken
19:54:15 <CIA-39> 03pointless_ 07articulated_kraken * ra0b970f4ce59 10/crawl-ref/source/makefile: Revert an accidentally committed makefile change
19:54:18 <CIA-39> 03pointless_ 07articulated_kraken * rb40fa65a34a9 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-abil.cc: Don't use a distance estimate in the tentacle connect search
19:54:22 * due in ur tentacles, retracting them.
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19:58:00 <pointless_> hmm seems like that push did not actually work, or at least those commits haven't show up on the sf web interface
19:58:23 <Poor_Yurik> syll, yeah maybe.  although I was over 400 deaths by the time I beat it, so I feel like I got more than enough playtime out of it.
19:58:27 <due> Mu_: <3
19:58:39 <due> pointless_: solution: SF sucks balls.
19:58:57 <pointless_> That doesn't sound like a solution to me
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19:59:24 <CIA-39> 03pointless_ 07articulated_kraken * r96b9b9d7d754 10/crawl-ref/ (220 files in 31 dirs): Merge master into articulated_kraken
19:59:25 <CIA-39> 03pointless_ 07articulated_kraken * rb60faeec26c2 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-abil.cc: Better constraint handling when a tentacle end changes position
19:59:26 <CIA-39> 03pointless_ 07articulated_kraken * re9a00c7fc594 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-abil.cc: Don't bother doing a search when retracting a tentacle
19:59:31 <CIA-39> 03pointless_ 07articulated_kraken * ra0b970f4ce59 10/crawl-ref/source/makefile: Revert an accidentally committed makefile change
19:59:33 <CIA-39> 03pointless_ 07articulated_kraken * rb40fa65a34a9 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-abil.cc: Don't use a distance estimate in the tentacle connect search
19:59:35 <CIA-39> 03pointless_ 07articulated_kraken * r24e7e1e5c78e 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-abil.cc: Kraken pathfinding/connectivity improvements
19:59:54 <doy> heh
20:00:02 <pointless_> ok I just had to do it twice
20:00:04 <pointless_> no big deal
20:00:14 <doy> why are we still using sourceforge
20:00:47 <sorear> doy: you seem to have two active termcasts
20:00:53 <sorear> on the same pty
20:01:04 <doy> sorear: you've brought this up several times
20:01:17 <doy> that's what happens when there's a non-clean disconnect
20:01:19 <sorear> in the past, you've had one dead one
20:01:22 <doy> like a hup or whatever
20:01:26 <sorear> but everything you type is going to both
20:01:38 <sorear> same idle time
20:03:31 <doy> i just had to kill urxvtd, apparently the clients are still connected to ptys somewhere
20:03:34 <doy> weird
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20:05:38 <sorear> heh, someone wants more terrain damage >3
20:05:40 <sorear> <3
20:05:53 <Ashenzari> Symmetry in vegetation damage (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=2002) by angrykoopa
20:43:48 <CIA-39> 03neunon * ref4dd6923a6e 10/crawl-ref/source/makefile: makefile: add configurable system SQLite and Lua paths
20:51:06 <Ashenzari> Game crashes due to too long player names (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=2003) by Eifeltrampel
20:51:50 <due> I had nothing to do with it!
20:51:51 <due> Nothing!
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21:05:57 <due> greensnark: Erm, apparently that font that came with it is not the font that the characters in the rosy side of the rosette use, but is the font that the descriptions use.
21:06:00 <due> Urk.
21:06:05 * due at a loss
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21:13:06 <Enne> Wait, what about the font?
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21:17:51 <due> Enne: The font that rax emailed me doesn't seem to match up with the font that was used.
21:22:03 <due> And I am rubbish at art.
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21:40:15 <Zao> Eifeltrampel ought to learn about Alt-PrintScreen.
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22:26:35 <Ashenzari> Blade card produces bad text (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=2004) by Whales
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23:20:17 <due> !tell greensnark I've done a comparison with all the fonts that ccame from Rax--none of them match. :/
23:20:18 <Henzell> due: OK, I'll let greensnark know.
23:20:32 <due> !tell rax Were there any other font files? I've done a comparison with all th eones in the zip file you sent me: none of them match.
23:20:32 <Henzell> due: OK, I'll let rax know.
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