00:12:00 -!- Poor_Yurik has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:26:00 -!- bhaak has joined ##crawl-dev 01:40:44 -!- Poor_Yurik has joined ##crawl-dev 01:43:19 wb Poor_Yurik 01:43:49 hey, connection died. about to head to bed, le tired. 01:44:10 x-com complete pack on steam right now for less than 4 dollars. bought. 01:44:10 goodnight :) 01:44:14 <3 for grinder 01:44:22 glad you likey 01:44:25 spriggans incoming 01:44:58 hey rob 01:57:15 03sorear * r2d3331056c08 10/crawl-ref/CREDITS.txt: Add Poor Yurik to CREDITS 01:57:21 we need to do a better job of accounting 01:57:44 we have literally no minimum contribution ... but often people get lost in the shuffle 02:02:16 A Storm of Spriggans: art and gameplay ideas (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=1863) by Poor Yurik 02:02:59 hrm two bugs in most recent tiles binary -- bailey was "you see a flagged portal here", and after i exited it recolored the floor tile behind the empty arch red 02:03:22 or maybe flagged is not a bug i dunno :P 02:09:09 Sorear 02:09:24 About the credits thing, sorry I didn't get back to you, got caught up 02:11:26 It looks like everyone on the credits list is using their real name, I'd like to do the same thing. 02:11:38 due, spriggans uploaded. 02:19:13 -!- neunon has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:19:22 -!- neunon has joined ##crawl-dev 02:20:39 03Keskitalo * r778165996b6d 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/portals/ (bailey.des bazaar.des ossuary.des sewer.des): Fix [1858]: some of the portal vault destinations were unloadable in wizard mode. 02:23:04 The bailey map name is wrong, duh. 02:24:42 The new hobgoblins look very menacing. O_o 02:25:48 03Keskitalo * r77ab4614c97a 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/portals/bailey.des: Fix a messed up bailey map NAME in previous commit. 02:40:49 Poor_Yurik: Not /everyone/ 02:42:21 Denzi, GreyKnight, Iainuki, Ilyak, Icy Lich, nyra, Pedro, REMsleep, Solf, Zooko # obvious pseudonyms 02:42:34 Jude Brown # known pseudonym 02:43:53 hm 02:44:05 Anal butt plug spam in the wiki! <3 02:44:31 Alas, ThndrShk2k was vigilant and removed it. :) 02:44:39 (4 I recognize) # Present under their real name, which they almost never use online 02:44:55 (not even going to say the nicks) 02:45:43 Hm, just keep me as Poor Yurik now then. I mean, anyone that knows anything i've done in the past knows me by that name anyway. 02:46:31 you're currently in as John 'Poor Yurik' Attea 02:46:35 i am officially exhausted. 02:46:42 I committed after you disappeared 02:47:01 ah ok, thank you 02:47:10 * sorear doesn't have access rights to expunge information from the repository 02:47:33 so what kind of blood rituals does one have to undertake to go from community contributer to stone soup team member? 02:49:00 basically dpeg decided we were short on manpower and gave passes to everyone on the online high score chart who admitted C++ proficiency 02:49:35 this was probably a mistake; we went from understaffed to a food fight in the soup kitchen in about a month 02:49:49 we've grown to work together peacefully, most of the time 02:50:56 the most recent people - Cryp71c, felirx - got in by the time honored tactic of "submit stuff until the people in charge of integrating contributions get sick of it" 02:53:07 basically, yeah. 02:53:25 ooh, I should become a crawl developer 02:53:31 sometimes this works very well. There's a one line bug (here) PM me your public key and stop bothering us # this happened to me on my first day in #moose 02:54:39 hah 02:56:00 that is how I became an atheme developer too 02:56:08 "you need to stop sending us patches, just send an ssh key instead" 03:17:57 !tell Poor_Yurik Feel free to ignore OG17. I do. 03:17:59 due: OK, I'll let Poor_Yurik know. 03:22:37 -!- eith has joined ##crawl-dev 03:37:59 haha 03:37:59 Poor_Yurik: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 03:38:11 I am like half asleep and just wrote a pretty huge response to him 03:39:05 Enjoy! 03:41:04 :( 03:41:36 I restrained myself from commenting because I'll probably blow my top at him. 03:41:39 * due hugs Poor_Yurik. 03:42:23 I love OG17; he replies to the trolls so I don't have to 03:42:58 Half the time he seems to be making trolling comments himself. 03:46:28 -!- neunon has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 03:47:34 -!- neunon has joined ##crawl-dev 03:48:03 I trimmed my reply down to a sane size. 03:48:14 I type 100+ wpm, so before I know it...wall of text. 03:49:34 really, if you want to become a better typist, just spend a couple years on IRC 03:49:48 Basically, yeah. 03:50:04 Why are people so nice to OG17? 03:51:40 but when programming, you do better if you type slowly 03:53:48 Kilobyte, typing a reply to you 03:54:04 We should just chat it up on here instead of play reply tag 03:55:34 sure; I'm at work though so I'm not very responsive 03:59:13 just posted a reply 04:05:57 k sleepy time. bbl. 04:07:57 bye! 04:08:41 dragon armour is not "human sized", it fits spriggans and is one of very few choices which they can use 04:09:09 ah gotcha. 04:09:45 I mean I kinda saw her on the same level as like a Medusa 04:10:00 where she kinda has a place carved out as her own 04:10:32 Medusa didn't carve, those statues were produced... differently 04:10:34 I could redraw her as a spriggan if you really think it is just a flawed idea 04:10:46 no i mean, a female creature with great power 04:11:07 the idea was, ok, spriggans happy doing there thing, enchantress comes in and they all worship her and she is their queen 04:11:27 her dark magic put them into threall 04:11:29 er thrall 04:12:03 just trying to weave a story into the Enchantress's special role in the forest with all those Spriggans defending her. 04:12:11 right, that's a valid theme, yet the one where she's just one of them is a lot simpler and doesn't need any further explanation 04:12:46 k, i'll try whipping up a spriggan enchantress asap 04:13:25 it depends if it would be very hard to change her; I wonder if just pushing the top of the tile down a bit would be enough 04:13:39 what did you think about my replies about the berserker and druid? 04:14:04 it's ok. i mean, when people didn't like my first iteration of the kobolds, I completely redrew them. 04:14:43 hey, it's not like MY tiles, which make people cower in fear and run to immediately replace them :p 04:15:15 03kilobyte 07holyhaul * r33ef6b3a50cb 10/crawl-ref/source/ (rltiles/dc-mon.txt rltiles/dc-mon/holy/shedu.png tilepick.cc): An ugly tile for shedu. 04:15:19 here's a sample 04:15:53 I will tell you one thing, drawing tits to denote female on a character half the size of a normal human tile is next to impossible because of lack of available pixels :D 04:16:30 hmm right, losing boobage is bad :p 04:17:38 she is going to end up looking like one of the little robed sand scavenger guys from star wars 04:18:17 going to give it a try though. actually already starting to spriggify her now. 04:19:06 Jawas. 04:21:41 -!- syllogism has joined ##crawl-dev 04:25:05 whip, whip! 04:27:06 03sorear 07stone_soup-0.7 * r383ac934a308 10/crawl-ref/CREDITS.txt: Add Poor Yurik to CREDITS 04:27:52 KiloByte: that's not so ugly 04:27:57 there must be better ways to denote female than 'tits' 04:29:16 ♀ 04:30:04 elly, in 32x32 pixel art, not much else besides long hair, pink, heels ala Nellie, etc. 04:30:26 Especially if you are only using maybe 50% of those pixels 04:31:40 you could make them less gendered :P 04:33:38 i'd say in, in general, fantasy artwork exaggerates gender differences, it doesn't minimalize them. 04:35:14 that doesn't really mean crawl has to do it too... 04:36:50 well two of my favorite fantasy artists are bromm and franzetti, so you aren't going to get much agreement from me on this one :) 04:37:02 fair enough 04:37:28 moin guys 04:38:16 so.. anyone got an idea how to work around the streak-calculation or should I remove the Delete-save-game-functionality from CDO? 04:40:36 perhaps it could be there just for unstable branches? 04:40:38 maybe a crawl -quit or -end parameter? 04:40:56 to have it logged in the logfile? 04:41:16 that would assume the save can be loaded in order to get the game's parameters 04:41:42 ja? it has to be fully loaded? can't the char data be loaded only? 04:42:25 what if the char data itself is corrupted? 04:42:49 yeah, well, harddisk could be broken too ;) there always is a worse case 04:43:05 but usually there's some trouble with level or inventory, no? 04:43:10 it includes pieces like gear or race/class which are not unlikely to be bad 04:44:28 what would break if we wrote a mostly blank line to the logfile, with just player name and version? 04:44:51 The bots 04:45:35 I have removed the ability to delete the char from all but master/pre-0.7 and sprint (based on master/pre-0.7) for now. 04:45:51 thanks 04:46:13 bare minimum logfile entry would include start and end dates 04:46:15 but in general it would be great if players could delete their char 04:46:35 due: I researched the pluralization of holies. "shedu" and "lammasu" use null plurals in all pages I found, "cherubs" use either English or Hebrew plurals with English being more common, "ophanim" always use Hebrew. This leaves apis (-es?) where all references point to a singular-only entity (an Egyptian god and a city). 04:46:39 And ktyp=deleted or similar 04:46:44 Shouldn't be hard to do 04:47:04 of these, we can get all but the start time without the save 04:47:22 by: Time doesn't have to be accurate, can just write the current time 04:47:35 name is provided by dgamelaunch 04:47:36 for stable I'm not sure if we want to allow that at all... if there's a save-corrupting bug we want it to be investigated and fixed 04:48:19 KiloByte: Shedu is singular and plural, I'm pretty sure. Cherub and cherubim, ophan and ophanim. 04:48:27 maybe if the dgamelaunch menu fit a "please copy the save and file a report first" into the 80x24? 04:49:14 Likewise Apis, I think. 04:49:51 by, I could also just have the backup make automatically when a char is deleted 04:50:07 well, gretell could even announce when a new file shows up in the dumps 04:51:54 due: we currently pluralize them as cherubs 04:58:24 Yeah, 'cois I haven't changed it yet :0 04:58:30 It's on my to-do list. 05:01:15 ok, I changed ophanim and shedu, but not cherubs, leaving them for you 05:01:31 Sure 05:02:13 hippogrives <3 05:04:03 03kilobyte 07holyhaul * rd29b482732ab 10/crawl-ref/source/ (mon-class-flags.h mon-data.h mon-stuff.cc): A monster class flag M_ALWAYS_CORPSE. 05:04:13 03kilobyte 07holyhaul * rc0afe6a4a334 10/crawl-ref/source/libutil.cc: Pluralization: "shedu", "lammasu" (null plurals), "ophanim". 05:04:15 exceellent, thanks! 05:06:49 Oh, damn, didn't mean to push that. Oh well. 05:06:54 why does my DS resist blessed fire 05:07:04 03due 07holyhaul * r08d645fe7cc5 10/crawl-ref/source/ (directn.cc enum.h mon-data.h mon-spll.h monster.cc): Begin implementing resurrection, spirit calls. 05:07:07 03due 07holyhaul * r786187a823dd 10/crawl-ref/source/libutil.cc: Pluralise cherub as cherubim, too. 05:07:07 the clouds at least 05:07:10 It definitely shouldn't. 05:07:22 It didn't on my recent tests... 05:07:29 You are engulfed in blessed fire! You resist. 05:07:34 :| 05:07:39 Can you pastebin a dump? 05:07:53 maybe there's a firey component that's resisted? 05:08:14 Shouldn't be, I maybe messed up. 05:09:10 Can someone check cloud.cc:938 onwards in holyhaul branch? It's entirely possible that I am completely wrong with stuff. 05:09:27 http://pastebin.com/0V3awAV1 05:10:51 v=0.7.0-a0:lv=0.1:name=rob:uid=0:race=Yak:cls=unknown:char=????:xl=0:sk=Fighting:sklev=0:title=Skirmisher:place=D::$:br=D:lvl=0:absdepth=1:ltyp=D:hp=-1:mhp=-1:mmhp=-1:str=-1:int=-1:dex=-1:start=20100530120948D:dur=-1:turn=-1:kills=0:gold=0:goldfound=0:goldspent=0:sc=-1:ktyp=deletion:dam=-1:end=20100530120948D 05:10:56 would that work? 05:11:30 syllogism: thanks 05:11:40 Just recmpiling, think I missed something. 05:11:58 Like forgetting to initiliase aa variable, "lol". 05:12:10 Napkin: would calling 'crawl -log-deletion player_name' work for you? 05:12:49 sure, but wouldn't a function to also delete the game be more general usable? 05:13:11 I'm wary of doing things with files from within crawl :) 05:13:20 ok :) 05:14:24 but you're right, it should probably also try deleting 05:14:52 blessed toes are pretty nasty :) 05:15:01 syllogism: They heal too :D 05:15:50 by: That would be fine, yes 05:16:07 hrm, there's also the gametype issue 05:16:19 being able to see vault names in debug mode is great 05:16:22 by: -sprint will also be passed by dgl 05:16:47 syllogism: how nasty? also, yes. 05:17:03 syllogism: I had a blessed toe healing all the cherubim it summoned like crazy 05:17:31 I'm getting "index < size in fixedvector.h line 70 " asserts while looking around with X 05:17:50 Run in gdb and get a backtrace? ;) 05:18:42 err, x 05:18:48 ah 05:18:56 hm, I haven't had any crashes with it... strange 05:19:01 what specifically were you looking at? 05:19:16 Map edge possibly 05:19:24 Backtrace would be nice 05:19:50 just start a new game and widly flail the cursor around :P 05:19:54 with shift 05:19:58 wildly 05:20:15 Probably the same code that checks whether it's in a vault :P 05:20:15 -save-version doesn't work with -sprint either at the moment 05:21:22 greensnark: looks like it 05:21:33 Will fix in a moment 05:23:18 -!- ais523 has joined ##crawl-dev 05:33:25 03greensnark * r53d7c547b44e 10/crawl-ref/source/directn.cc: Don't crash when debug-describing squares outside LOS with 'x' (syllogism). 05:37:07 syllogism: Fixed, I think. 05:37:22 03due 07holyhaul * rc8fe033948b9 10/crawl-ref/source/cloud.cc: Fix blessed fire and Demonspawn (syllogism). 05:45:25 -!- Poor_Yurik2 has joined ##crawl-dev 05:45:39 mulitple Poor_Yurik2! 05:49:45 -!- Poor_Yurik2 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:53:18 -!- Rich_Yurik has joined ##crawl-dev 05:53:24 -!- Rich_Yurik has quit [Client Quit] 05:53:31 Rich_Yurik <3 05:57:53 The Lair endings look sooo good.. need to see if I can think of some maps. 05:59:15 eh, dragon hides don't give any resistances 05:59:24 is that done on purpose? 06:01:13 I think so? 06:04:06 Can someone reply to #1419 with detailed instructions? I'm gonna head off. 06:05:27 sounds like a bug to me. Turing these into proper armour rather than a loose hide will improve the combat value, yeah, but it shouldn't affect the magical properties. 06:07:23 due: replied 06:07:52 any reason to not make hides give rF/rC/rPois/rWhatever? 06:09:56 KiloByte: Do it; we may have to review the game impact later, but I see no reason not to 06:32:51 03kilobyte * r577da51bb5ac 10/crawl-ref/source/ (dat/descript/items.txt player.cc): Make dragon hides work even when raw. Mention enchanting in their descs. 06:37:06 The old behaviour could be explained by saying that the innate magical nature of dragons makes the skin active while on the dragon, but when removed it requires external tuning in the form of an enchant scroll to be brought into effect? :D 06:42:40 hmm, you're changing dragonhide to work like NetHack? 06:44:12 how does it work now? 06:44:52 bhaak: gives the same resistances whether worn or not; enchanting it makes it into dragon armour, which is the same as the hide but has a better AC 06:45:12 ais523: wether worn or not??? 06:45:23 err, whether enchanted or not 06:45:29 it doesn't work from inventory, that would be ridiculous 06:45:30 ah, okay 06:45:55 partial resistance when not enchanted :) 06:45:57 * bhaak ducks 06:47:33 bhaak: you'll have to duck a /long/ way, specially given the conversation in #unnethack a few minutes ago 06:48:14 what's wrong with that? dragon armours give rF++ rC-, so dragon hide gives rF+ rC- or something? 06:50:49 casmith789: you missed the context 06:52:22 03kilobyte * re07ac8355f61 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/lua/autofight.lua: Update autofight for sqrt(5) instead of sqrt(8) reaching. 07:16:38 Poor_Yurik: if you have the time, could you think about a tile for the trunk tutorial message spots? 07:17:24 !seen Mu 07:17:25 dpeg: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 07:17:25 I last saw Mu at Wed Nov 18 00:02:18 2009 UTC (32w 12h 15m 7s ago) joining the channel. 07:17:29 !message 07:17:34 !messages 07:17:35 (1/1) Chapayev said (14h 40m 31s ago): greensnark tells me you're going to commit the sprint 2 map i sent you--i just emailed you a slightly revised version of the map, which makes a certain wall undiggable that really needed to be undiggable. hope you like the map! 07:17:45 !seen itsmu 07:17:45 I last saw itsmu at Wed Jun 23 16:53:44 2010 UTC (6d 19h 24m 1s ago) joining the channel. 07:18:26 !seen Mu_ 07:18:26 I last saw Mu_ at Tue Jun 29 00:32:49 2010 UTC (1d 11h 45m 37s ago) quitting with message Quit: Defecator, may everything turn out okay so that you can leave this place.. 07:18:56 How's dpeg? 07:20:44 I shouldn't play Sprint, but I did :) 07:20:48 Finally won that map!!! 07:20:49 :) 07:20:52 You're sick. 07:20:55 The endgame is insane. 07:21:13 10102746 1 the Heavyweight Champion (level 17, 157/157 (161) HPs) 07:21:13 Began as a Troll Berserker on June 30, 2010. 07:21:14 Did you see I started the holies overhaul? 07:21:23 Dpeg's game lasted 01:23:18 (10421 turns). 07:21:28 due: yes, of course! <3 07:21:39 level 17, nice 07:21:42 Heal other's looking spiffing to start. 07:21:52 Working on ophanim at the minute. 07:22:31 syllogism: yes, more room and xp than in the original map 07:22:44 oh you played the new one 07:22:48 is it on the server??? 07:22:52 no! 07:22:59 dpeg's preparing for the tourney :P 07:23:03 it's too easy if he already won :P 07:23:06 due: spiffing = good or bad? 07:23:11 greensnark: hi! 07:23:11 dpeg: good! 07:23:14 :) 07:23:23 is it mu's? 07:23:23 Hello 07:23:29 syllogism: yes 07:23:33 It's amazing 07:23:48 he has to make it harder :P 07:24:21 wy? 07:24:23 *why? 07:24:28 It's insanely difficult. 07:24:31 syllogism: the endgame is insanely hard :) 07:24:38 but you won already 07:24:46 as a TrBe 07:24:50 the early game is a bit too easy imo 07:25:06 dpeg: You can see how highly syllogism esteems your Crawl playing skills :P 07:25:10 yes :) 07:25:57 What colour for ophan: red or lightred or ETC_FIRE? 07:26:42 We have orphans now? :P 07:26:43 Oh 07:26:43 due: what's the glyph? 07:26:48 G 07:26:55 ETC_FIRE seems good 07:27:00 It's afloating wheel covered in eyes. 07:27:03 I think G is suitable :) 07:30:51 greensnark: Can we change Grinder's depth in trunk? He's a pushover. 07:30:58 03due 07holyhaul * r883af1877f80 10/crawl-ref/ (21 files in 7 dirs): Merge branch 'master' into holyhaul 07:31:10 due: Why are you asking me, do it :P 07:31:26 Er. 07:31:27 in 0.7, I meant. 07:31:47 Make your changes to master as usual, I'll pick the ones I like :) 07:31:55 Okay :) 07:32:07 Depth change won't be an issue 07:34:44 D:1? ;) 07:35:00 What, he's a Sprint unique now? :p 07:35:14 Hah. 07:35:19 No, not strong enough. 07:35:29 @??chuck 07:35:29 Chuck (16C) | Speed: 10 | HD: 18 | Health: 120 | AC/EV: 14/2 | Damage: 45 | Res: 06magic(96) | Chunks: 07contaminated | XP: 3023. 07:35:32 That's a Sprint unique. 07:35:40 With large rocks of returning. 07:35:45 Chuck and Norris spawn together perchance? 07:35:47 and he chucks them 07:35:49 why not a custom monster 07:36:06 syllogism: Because it was easier to hack in rocks of returning as an actual unique. 07:36:16 Can we have LeChuck as a unique 07:36:19 He'd be an undead pirate 07:36:20 greensnark: YES. 07:36:22 He could show up in Shoals 07:36:23 urks 07:36:23 No, no no 07:36:25 Don't say pirate 07:36:26 shhhh 07:36:30 arrr 07:36:31 Damn, dpeg saw 07:36:34 pirate buccaneer. Arr 07:36:37 testudine! testudine! 07:36:44 LeChuck is a wimp 07:36:47 Er, undead buccaneer 07:36:48 * dpeg is allergic to pirates. 07:37:13 hmm, crawl needs a feline buccaneer! 07:37:19 We should add a new class called "Flooring Inspector" 07:37:32 Why/ 07:37:33 add ninjas instead, like sasuke or momochi 07:37:34 MONS: ☠ = human name:pirate n_rpl ; sabre unrand:captain's_cutlass 07:37:52 Cute 07:37:55 we really need to allow unicode in .des files :p 07:38:00 Yeah 07:38:15 It would also help crazy Sprint designers who run out of symbols :P 07:38:24 not good 07:38:46 People can start submitting maps composed entirely of kanji 07:38:56 a dotless i could be a beheaded i! 07:39:22 there are two characters in kraken's desc since early 0.6, and no one complained yet 07:39:25 dragons could be represented by real chinese dragons! 07:39:40 KiloByte: I noticed those :P 07:39:46 that means either no one reads descriptions or most people use unicode already 07:40:08 Or that nobody cares about broken characters in descriptions :) 07:40:24 A lot of players use Putty + CP437, no? 07:40:43 you get your descriptions from wikipedia? :) 07:41:19 uhm, why not? 07:43:01 how shall one discover good new quotes if they are all already in wikipedia? 07:44:48 greensnark: about Unicode on Windows, win98 support is a stumbling block. It can be written pretty easily, even though one needs to use LoadLibrary() to conditionally load Unicode stuff where available and emulate when not, but I have trouble running win98 at all. 07:45:12 People still use Win98? 07:45:20 can't run it native, in VirtualBox it took 6 hours to install (on a modern host machine!), and every operation takes literally ages 07:45:22 you dump DOS but not Win98? 07:45:54 I say we support Win2k and above unless it's really inconvenient, in which case we support XP and above 07:46:15 No need to mess with 9x/ME garbage 07:46:52 it's not that hard, it's just I suck at win32 development (because of not using that pile of crap) and having trouble running it 07:47:18 -!- xardas-3 has joined ##crawl-dev 07:47:22 There's no point trying to support it, really 07:47:40 alternatively, we could use opencow (an unicows look-alike with a sane license), which is an emulation layer which does that automatically, but that would be an extra dependence 07:47:46 anyone running win98 is leaving himself serevely open to security risks and such 07:48:00 and ridicule 07:48:06 bhaak: I get my quotes from old books. 07:48:12 felirx: and running Windows at all is different how? 07:48:21 due: great! 07:48:29 winxp and up actually gets security fixes 07:48:31 greensnark: did Rachel get back to you, concerning tournament rules? 07:48:34 bhaak: Project gutenberg <3 07:48:42 dpeg: Not yet 07:48:44 ok 07:50:25 !tell Mu_ "acquire foo" on your sprint map won't work, since it runs before the player gets to have his skills set. Should I try to hack it with lua so the item spawns only once you actually see it? 07:50:26 KiloByte: OK, I'll let Mu_ know. 07:51:38 KiloByte, due: did you play Mu's map a bit? I want to make some suggestions, but that's best when most testers have some feeling for the map already. 07:53:07 dpeg: I died with great regularity. 07:53:14 I can't play Sprint, sorry. I'm just rubbish at it. 07:53:30 dpeg: no, just glanced at the commit 07:53:31 due: how far did you get? 07:53:37 dpeg: Second room? 07:53:41 what? 07:53:44 I wasn't playing very seriously. :) 07:53:47 !lg 07:53:48 1331. bookofjude the Thaumaturge (L11 SpVM), worshipper of Sif Muna, slain by a war dog on Lair:2 on 2010-06-30, with 12727 points after 23813 turns and 1:18:43. 07:53:52 It's trivial to get to Orc :P 07:53:52 greensnark: in the crawl survey, it seems nobody said anything about using a windows <= WinME. 2 using WinME and Win95, 6 using Win98 in the nethack poll 07:53:52 I am basically very reckless recently. 07:54:18 bhaak: Well, Nethack :P 07:54:42 Sepp Blatter possible plays NH 07:54:57 greensnark: that's unfair! 07:55:01 NetHack is _almost_ capable of running in DOS real mode 07:55:14 na, he uses the paper and pen version. otherwise it would take the drama and emotion out of the game! 07:55:24 Sepp Blatter? 07:55:31 KiloByte: and that would be a good thing? 07:55:34 FIFA president, a demented old fart 07:55:45 Crawl in turn, instead of 640KB-system requires 640MB-system 07:55:47 and Swiss! 07:55:57 Ah. 07:55:59 corruption, embezzlement, right wing tendencies 07:56:30 Okay, sleeeep. Goodnight folk. 07:56:36 night! 07:56:37 night! 07:56:42 na, that's not right 07:57:05 it's called "pricy favors" not "corruption" 07:57:16 bhaak: Yeah, you may be right about Blatter being the paper and pencil type :) 07:57:43 bhaak: unless you're in the US, then it's "lobbying" and is somehow perfectly legal 08:02:34 -!- Enne has joined ##crawl-dev 08:07:38 -!- xardas-3 has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.5.9/20100401213457]] 08:08:37 dpeg: anf ideas what the magical blue square tile should be for tut? 08:09:37 felirx: no. Why should they do something? 08:10:04 I mean the blue square that pops up the messages 08:13:45 if the messages refer to literally a "blue square", I kind of think I have an idea for a tile 08:14:17 the lbue square was chosen arbitarily and was supposed to be a kind of a placeholder for tiles 08:14:20 until a tiles was made 08:16:14 I could picture having a signpost tile. It'd make more sense why there was a message there. 08:16:37 original idea was a question mark of sorts but signpost will also work 08:16:45 or something completely else if anyone has ideas 08:25:25 -!- purge has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 08:38:17 -!- Vandal has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:47:50 03kilobyte * rfcbeaddbb4b1 10/crawl-ref/source/tags.cc: Add some assertions for saves. We should make these just fail loading instead of crashing one day. 08:48:03 03kilobyte * r46e7d980a7d5 10/crawl-ref/source/main.cc: Fix confusion near lava being 100% safe. 08:48:43 greensnark: this fixes the mushroom alley in Mu_'s map being harmless 08:57:31 -!- Zaba has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:03:13 -!- Zaba has joined ##crawl-dev 09:29:04 -!- ais523 has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:39:57 -!- Vandal has joined ##crawl-dev 10:05:52 -!- Chapayev has joined ##crawl-dev 10:07:40 -!- Textmode has quit [Quit: Over the ages, man has been certain of a great many things. some of these things were even true.] 10:12:43 -!- Adeon has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 10:12:57 -!- Adeon has joined ##crawl-dev 10:19:28 -!- Chapayev has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:20:11 -!- Chapayev has joined ##crawl-dev 10:27:57 -!- Chapayev has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 10:28:48 -!- Chapayev has joined ##crawl-dev 10:32:44 Chapayev: email sent! 10:34:41 dpeg: oh thanks! i'll check it 10:37:02 Chapayev: my mail is about Mu's map :) I will come to your map next. 10:37:54 dpeg: thanks for forwarding it to me, didn't you mean for mu's map to be for the tournament? if so, you better tell robert vollmert not to put it in the angband.pl git repository 10:39:13 by: you here? 10:39:29 There should be a private repository... 10:44:33 Rolling a new president for this country seems to be a curious affaire. 10:44:57 (1240 fuckwads are voting, and they'll need a third round, too.) 10:45:33 dpeg: are you in germany these days, or canada? 10:51:29 back in Germany 10:51:46 dpeg: where in germany? 10:55:09 between Hannover and Berlin 10:55:12 you're coming here? 10:55:48 Chapayev: no, just curious what part of germany you're in, to complain about the politics--i understand the politics in berlin are much different from politics in bayern :) 10:56:31 oh, this is politics for the whole country :) 10:56:38 i see, well good luck :) 10:56:39 Did I complain? 10:56:46 dpeg: well, you mentioned 1240 fuckwads 10:57:02 Well, that's a fairly neutral assessment. You should see my personal opinion! 10:58:40 dpeg: what is it? 10:58:58 (These 1240 fuckwads are chosen by the parties, or for being prominent etc. and it is their task to elect the new president.) 10:59:19 dpeg: is this like electors in the electoral college in the u.s.? 10:59:22 yes 10:59:38 by: you mentioned putting Mu's map to angband.pl. Thanks for that! Chapayev just pointed out that the map is supposed to be secret until Aug 15 -- but you knew that, right? :) 11:01:17 yes, I thought that was what the angpand.pl repository was meant for 11:01:43 cool! 11:02:29 why's the tournament starting on august 15 this year, instead of august 1? rax is too busy? 11:03:07 btw, does that unseen horror part you mention in the mail have clouds nearby? clouds work well for the invisible creatures in sprint 1 11:03:42 Chapayev: tournament starts august 1, just the sprint map is to be released later 11:03:45 WHo told you the tournament is starting on August 15? 11:03:48 by: ah, is ee 11:03:49 i see 11:04:15 rax: nobody, i just heard that the sprint map wouldn't be released until august 15, so i (mistakenly) thought that was when the tournament began 11:04:19 Ah. :) 11:04:31 rax: how did your thesis go? 11:05:15 Got an A, graduated, left, can't have been that bad. My advisor didn't come to my defense. So that was exciting. 11:05:20 Now I get to do it all over again! 11:05:48 your advisor didn't come to your defense?? that's weird 11:06:05 by "do it all over again" do you mean you enrolled in another grad program, or you have to defend your thesis again? 11:06:45 -!- ogaz has joined ##crawl-dev 11:06:55 That was my MA, I'm starting my PhD this fall. 11:07:02 rax: ah, i see 11:07:05 She also didn't read my thesis. It was, uh, departmental drama. 11:07:06 rax: in creative writing? 11:07:13 by: no clouds, no. It has wandering mushrooms, though :) 11:07:29 PhD is in gender studies, Indiana University, also maybe we should move to ##offtopic or /msg :) 11:07:47 rax: ah, okay, good luck in bloomington! 11:18:41 is it intentional that picking up lugonu in the sprint abyss doesn't give you enough piety to leave? 11:22:37 by: no, I believe this is an oversight 11:31:52 wasn't lugonu piety nerfed on purpose? 11:32:21 maybe not 11:33:26 -!- Mu_ has joined ##crawl-dev 11:33:53 I think originally, when you took lugonu, you had enough piety to corrupt immediately, but not having enough to leave the abyss doesn't seem right 11:36:00 syllogism: switching to Lugonu should enable you to get out of the Abyss right away. 11:36:42 i suppose that's fine if the new maps can better deal with corruption 11:37:25 you mean the Sprint maps? 11:37:28 yeah 11:37:46 I see what you mean 11:39:24 syllogism: the map i finished and sent to dpeg recently uses undiggable walls to protect the orb from corruption--not sure if that's what you mean 11:39:36 yes 11:40:43 I just used corruption in sprint 1 and it didn't seem to do much at all 11:41:22 you could use it to dig straight to the orb fairly early 11:43:52 Neil's map also has undiggable walls in Zot. 11:44:22 by: it works easily enough, I won a l8 TrCK using it 11:44:23 stone walls aren't diggable, but should be corruptable 11:44:31 casmith789: when 11:44:34 today 11:44:59 maybe my corruption got disrupted by myself escaping to the abyss? 11:45:15 or it's just very random 11:45:25 it's random 11:45:30 n78291 said he'd tried it and got to tiamat but not the orb 11:45:40 I use it on the very right shop of the row 11:45:53 and that has worked twice 11:46:02 that's what I did; it didn't seem to affect any of the stone walls 11:46:08 oh right 11:46:11 must have just got unlucky 11:46:17 !lm . sprint type=abyss.enter 11:46:19 6. [2010-06-30] rob the Scorcher (L11 DEFE) is cast into the Abyss! (Sprint) 11:46:23 !lm . sprint type=abyss.enter -2 11:46:24 5. [2010-06-30] rob the Arsonist (L7 DEFE) is cast into the Abyss! (Sonja) (Sprint) 11:46:30 !lm . sprint type=abyss.enter -tv:<2 11:46:31 6. rob, XL11 DEFE, T:3328 (milestone) requested for FooTV. 11:48:36 -!- Zao has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:49:01 oh, you got one of the stone walls, but that was pretty unlucky 11:49:54 !lm . -3 sprint -tv 11:49:54 934. casmith789, XL8 TrCK, T:544 (milestone) requested for FooTV. 11:51:52 maybe it only works well at low invocations skill 11:52:40 why would that matter? 12:12:15 Hehe, Kiku+PbD combo @ SA, nnnice 12:12:25 SA? 12:12:36 something awful 12:12:40 ah 12:13:01 you can't say that they didn't tell you in front :) 12:20:44 dpeg: i just discovered that the lien PLACE: D:1 should be taken out of sprint2.des and shouldn't appear in sprint maps 12:21:02 dpeg: it interferes with the sprint map selector when there are multiple maps tagged sprint 12:22:06 okay 12:22:32 I will send your map to the Sprint tag team right now, minus that line. Yes? 12:22:43 dpeg: sounds great, thanks 12:24:59 Xom: "otentially the best gameplay element in the history of electronic gaming" ^_^ 12:25:08 Hi dpeg! 12:25:33 Hi Eino! Great to see you :) 12:25:50 Keskitalo: still pressed for time? 12:26:02 (I am.): 12:26:37 Yeah, tough I managed a commit earlier. :> 12:27:59 :) 12:28:15 I'll be away for most of August :/ 12:29:08 grrr, I get "unknown monster: iron elemental" 12:29:37 dpeg: in master? 12:29:40 yes 12:29:49 did we rename something? 12:30:11 03enne.walker * rffc3a770aec2 10/crawl-ref/source/ (20 files in 11 dirs): [1863] Add assorted spriggan tiles. (Poor_Yurik) 12:30:16 03enne.walker * ra775ed1bd95b 10/crawl-ref/source/ (6 files in 4 dirs): [1861] Add shadow imp, Grinder tiles. (Poor_Yurik) 12:30:26 @??iron elemental 12:30:27 iron elemental (10E) | Speed: 6 | HD: 12 | Health: 72-144 | AC/EV: 20/2 | Damage: 40 | Flags: 11non-living, !sil | Res: 13magic(immune), 04fire+++, 12cold+++, 11elec+++, 09poison+++ | XP: 1087 | Sp: iron shot (3d24), slow, metal splinters (3d27). 12:30:37 03enne.walker * r17a52b8a53e4 10/crawl-ref/source/rltiles/tool/ (tile.cc tile_colour.h): Fix auto-corpsified tile garbage. 12:31:13 dpeg: You'll need a fresh compile? 12:31:30 * Keskitalo drools a bit at holyhaul 12:31:33 for changing maps? 12:31:53 dpeg: if you compiled before iron elemental was added to mon-data.h then yeah you have to make clean 12:32:11 Sounded like your compile doesn't have the new iron elemental monster that's used in the map. 12:32:45 alright 12:34:02 a fog machine isn't getting placed in a new map i'm working on, any known conditions under which fog machines don't get placed? 12:34:41 Enne: The old shadow imp tile is good in itself, it could be kept in the UNUSED dir? 12:34:50 are you hitting the cloud limit? 12:34:50 Mu_: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 12:34:56 !messages 12:34:59 (1/1) KiloByte said (4h 44m 33s ago): "acquire foo" on your sprint map won't work, since it runs before the player gets to have his skills set. Should I try to hack it with lua so the item spawns only once you actually see it? 12:35:05 Mu_: no, this is the only fog machine in this map 12:35:18 Keskitalo: Oh, good thought. I'll do that. 12:35:47 jpeg influence :) 12:35:48 !tell KiloByte If you could make acquire foo work on-sight that would be really cool :) 12:35:49 Mu_: OK, I'll let KiloByte know. 12:36:40 i remember getting nonexistant clouds when i tried to make them generate smaller than 3x3 12:36:46 no idea otherwise 12:37:15 -!- purge has joined ##crawl-dev 12:37:28 Mu_: hm, it's not that 12:37:30 Mu_: do you think your sprint map is challenging enough? 12:37:31 Enne: Iron imps still have the old manes tiles, right? They're a bit insubstantial! 12:37:38 hi purge! 12:38:01 Keskitalo: Yeah, they do. It's on the 0.7 tiles wiki page. Maybe we could just recolor an imp to be greyish? 12:38:17 syllogism: no it's too easy 12:38:32 Mu_: that's what I thought :P 12:38:51 That could do if nothing else. 12:38:54 it's always easy to make a map harder :) 12:39:46 purge: Would you like to make a new iron imp tile? :) 12:39:55 syllogism: do you want to playtest it? I 12:40:25 Only condition is that you won't give it around and that you won't compete for "first Sprint win" in the tournament. (You can win later on, of course.) 12:42:37 I'm not intending to participate in the tourney so that wouldn't be an issue, but I'm not sure if I can force myself to play offline and provide meaningful feedback 12:42:44 maybe 12:42:55 yes/yes? :) 12:43:25 yes 12:44:10 just a moment 12:44:31 Chapayev: the fuckwads are voting again :) 12:44:41 dpeg: good luck :P 12:45:28 Chapayev: it doesn't really matter: the president they're electing wields no power. He will be the über-fuckwad :) 12:45:57 Enne: Need a place for this cute creature too: https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=958 12:46:31 Mu_: weird, this map has a real big subvault, and when i remove the subvault, the fog machine works :P 12:47:11 !messages 12:47:11 (1/1) due said (9h 29m 12s ago): Feel free to ignore OG17. I do. 12:47:44 !tell felirx ok, I can look into the tutorial thing. 12:47:44 Poor_Yurik: OK, I'll let felirx know. 12:48:09 yay 12:48:10 felirx: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 12:48:20 Ooh, the new griffon tile is nice. 12:48:29 Hi Poor_Yurik! 12:48:32 some of the ideas for that are a question mark of some kind or a signpost but your hands are free 12:50:38 Chapayev: bizarre :p 12:50:38 Hey Keskitalo! 12:51:32 Ok felirx, might not have it done for a few days due to rl stuff, but I'll see what I can do. 12:51:40 no hurry 12:52:06 Mu_: okay, it works now, after moving the fountain into its own 1x1 subvault :P 12:52:26 subvaults are extremely, extremely awesome, but sometimes they behave in ways i don't understand at all 12:53:30 Chapayev: is this a bug, an unexplained feature (i.e. lack of documentation) or something else? 12:54:12 dpeg: is there any documentation for subvaults? maybe i'm just guilty of not doing enough RTFM 12:55:43 Chapayev: yes, there is :) 12:55:51 docs/develop/levels/... 12:56:16 dpeg: ah, okay, i've read most of those files but i guess i missed the subvault section :P i'll look at them again 13:01:09 :) 13:01:17 Your map is awesome, just playing it. 13:02:22 dpeg: thanks! 13:04:30 thin mist can never block LOS, right? it's purely decorative? 13:06:10 maps sent 13:06:12 syllogism: ^ 13:08:48 yes, got them 13:12:25 Dig in 13:13:56 thin mist can never block LOS, right? it's purely decorative? 13:13:58 oops 13:15:06 i was thinking it might be a good idea to add a rune to every sprint map we make from now on 13:15:17 just because the scoring algorithm works much better when there's a rune to be had 13:15:20 a new type of rune? 13:15:23 ah 13:15:33 when someone wins with zero runes, their turns taken aren't taken into account in their score 13:16:14 Enne: is there anything we should do regarding the tiles license question? 13:16:22 so everyone's winning sprint scores hover just above 250,000--they get 250,000 for winning and a few extra points for xp and gold 13:16:33 yeah 13:22:17 dpeg: okay, i gotta go--hope you like sprint2.des, and if everyone is okay with it, it'd be great to have it playable on CDO sometime soon 13:24:55 see you! 13:25:16 -!- Chapayev has quit [Quit: leaving] 13:37:19 can Chapyev's map go into master? 13:39:21 by: I would wait for a bit. 13:39:50 Let players have a glance -- we could switch roles, if we wanted (Neil's map public, Chapayev's map for the tournament). 13:40:59 let me play play-test it. Just take the one where I can't get over turn 15! 13:46:00 Unfortunately, Nethack testers do not meet our quality criteria. 13:46:27 grml, I'm not a nethack tester 13:46:46 how about DF players 13:46:52 bhaak doesn't test nethack 13:46:58 he writes a fork of it 13:47:03 lol 13:47:10 see, I already got fanboys! 13:47:25 ...yes 13:47:41 I'd play it if it was a spoon of nethack. everyone loves these forks for some reason 13:48:19 you could play a spork 13:56:59 Mu's map is a lot of fun as a spellcaster 13:58:32 is resting slow in the sprint maps for anyone else? 13:58:50 seemed sluggish yes 14:04:41 died in abyss :( 14:06:01 -!- ogaz has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 14:11:10 level 12 :) 14:20:34 that "door covered with warnings" behind mushrooms and elephants could just say "instant death" 14:20:34 KiloByte: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 14:20:54 since that's what 5 azure jellies to a level 8 character are 14:22:10 m1nced (L12 HaBe) (Bailey) 14:22:35 yay sprint crashing on startup due to seeing a holyhaul save 14:26:10 scratch my earlier plan to make loading saves more resilient... this crash was something far, far away from the proper save-loading code 14:26:40 an assert in mons_type_name()... and that just to list the save on the chooser screen 14:27:42 via the tile packing code? 14:28:44 KiloByte: no no, you can win that fight. But the actual Slime, that is deadly :) 14:29:43 felirx: it was a console build 14:41:00 Mu_: maybe you should set HD for humans/elves since the xp/hp variance is quite significant 14:41:40 I got 6.5k for this human and it was the fourth monster I killed 14:47:30 -!- ogaz has joined ##crawl-dev 15:42:25 Green-blooded monsters should bleed green blood (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=1864) by minmay 15:45:59 agree, thankfully there are no green-blooded monsters 15:50:00 * Siber goes to file a feature request for vulcans 15:52:32 -!- Zao has joined ##crawl-dev 16:02:32 Crash on targeting Gastropod, possibly caused by nightstalker or antenna (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=1865) by serg271 16:05:12 03enne.walker 07stone_soup-0.7 * r0963a7c689d9 10/crawl-ref/source/ (6 files in 4 dirs): [1861] Add shadow imp, Grinder tiles. (Poor_Yurik) 16:05:13 03enne.walker 07stone_soup-0.7 * r62a30d720b3d 10/crawl-ref/source/ (20 files in 11 dirs): [1863] Add assorted spriggan tiles. (Poor_Yurik) 16:05:18 03enne.walker 07stone_soup-0.7 * rb9721599bac9 10/crawl-ref/source/rltiles/tool/ (tile.cc tile_colour.h): Fix auto-corpsified tile garbage. 16:10:30 oh nellie... 16:12:25 xD 16:12:29 oneshotted :P 16:12:33 nice :p 16:13:21 does Nellie appear in regular crawl? 16:13:30 shouldn't do 16:14:18 due added all of my custom enemies as real monsters to make things easier though so it would be easy to add her 16:14:52 would giving the elves and such lower HD decrease their xp then? 16:15:04 it should 16:15:48 cool, i'll have to try it 16:15:57 playing spellcasters of sif is very fun 16:16:52 there's plenty of xp so you've a lot of flexibility, especially once you get selective amnesia 16:17:03 it's kind of annoying how sometimes you don't get any books by the altars though 16:20:44 early game might be too easy and there's a lot of variance, but overall the difficulty appears good 16:21:09 especially with all the bonus runes/areas 16:22:17 did good god piety gain get nerfed in sprint yet? 16:23:10 i think so 16:23:19 New Spriggan Enchantress is uploaded. https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=1863 16:25:02 syllogism: yes 16:25:08 blood god piety is hard to come by (in sprint 1 at least) 16:25:13 syllogism: cool you like it 16:25:22 by: Trog is easy enough to please 16:25:45 dpeg: even if you pick him up at an altar? 16:26:35 are the runes just for points or is the plan to make zot entry require 3? 16:26:43 I've played some MDFi, and the furthest I got was 16:26:52 Makhleb's power-for-kills 16:29:44 syllogism, due is gonna make the zot door require 3. i think the code might already be in. 16:30:24 by: uhm, you get full piety in just a few kills 16:31:22 is this again a case of if (coinflip()) lots of piety else none ? 16:31:54 possibly 16:33:16 Zin and TSO are out, though... in Sprint 1, you could abuse their piety so the passive gain was removed, there is no way to get it now, though (there's just a few evil/chaotic monsters) 16:35:20 by: ah, don't know 16:42:55 Mu_: a guaranteed id scroll or two would be nice 16:43:14 heh, lots of awesome randarts in shops in my sprint run... but 375 gold total 16:43:36 KiloByte, let me know what you think of the new Enchantress tile. 16:43:46 you found only 375 in mines? 16:43:47 I made her based on your suggestion of her being a Spriggan. 16:44:11 syllogism: yeah 16:44:26 should do something about gold variance too then 16:44:34 I got 1k on one run and over 2k on another 16:44:46 you could prolly dig out a little more gold from the walls :3 16:45:16 if you've the means :P 16:45:20 Poor_Yurik: looks like some strange shaman with that mask, but not bad 16:45:44 I got 3.8k some other time 16:52:42 Mu_: also, the bug with confusion near water first asking a question "do you really want to move while confused near deep water" and then just saying "Why would you do that?" instead of drowning hits pretty bad on the way to your Lair 16:52:56 syllogism: yes, there's a chance for acquire_gold: you could get zero of them. 16:53:05 haha oh dear 16:53:15 Mu_: I mentioned that in my mail =) 16:54:05 Mu_: I fixed that, but greensnark didn't pick it (yet?) for 0.7 16:54:39 so from now on i should just push edits to that other git thing right 16:56:24 Mu_: yes, if you can, that'd be awesome. 16:57:24 berserkers seem a bit too easy 16:58:50 there are a few classes that have an easy time i need to add obstacles for. i guess berserkers need a big room with blinking enemies or something. 16:59:12 The map is also good for stabbers, I think. 16:59:30 some blinking mage with some enchantments or curare 16:59:58 okay 17:00:03 no more sonja :( 17:00:21 yes Sonja! 17:00:26 dispersal projectiles are another possibility :3 17:01:23 the two uniques by the lair/hive entrances are pretty wimpy 17:02:33 the merfolk javelineer is a major killer, lost two berserkers to it already 17:02:55 you can lure it out if you know it's there 17:03:36 you need to wake it up, and pray it won't kill you before you retreat, since you wade through shallow water and he swims 17:03:44 syllogism: not always 17:06:50 -!- Zaba has quit [*.net *.split] 17:06:51 -!- greensnark has quit [*.net *.split] 17:06:52 -!- ivan has quit [*.net *.split] 17:06:52 -!- Napkin has quit [*.net *.split] 17:08:34 -!- Zaba has joined ##crawl-dev 17:08:35 -!- greensnark has joined ##crawl-dev 17:08:35 -!- ivan has joined ##crawl-dev 17:08:35 -!- Napkin has joined ##crawl-dev 17:08:49 -!- Napkin_ has joined ##crawl-dev 17:08:51 -!- Napkin has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:09:20 # ctrlf 17:13:37 how many large rocks does chuck have :P 17:13:48 39 17:14:02 and it's REAL FUN fighting him as a troll :p 17:14:17 it'll be a large rock of returning when i use the proper chuck 17:14:23 @??chuck 17:14:23 Chuck (16C) | Speed: 10 | HD: 18 | Health: 120 | AC/EV: 14/2 | Damage: 45 | Res: 06magic(96) | Chunks: 07contaminated | XP: 3023. 17:14:31 i zapped a wand of random effects at him and got confusion 17:14:32 Large rock of returning? :P 17:14:34 Mu_: yes, that'll be better. Ogres and Trolls can abuse Chuck. 17:14:36 although, due to him being a slow thrower, I chucked quite a few javelins of returning as well 17:15:15 KiloByte: yes, it is well possible to kill him without using his rocks. 17:16:04 Enne, it's a special case ;p 17:16:13 ghrmblah, hate hate hate liches paralyzing you while berserk 17:16:26 (I was just amused.) 17:17:18 I'm a level 13 TrBe and I haven't used BiA yet 17:17:50 03enne.walker * rc302ddc00fe0 10/crawl-ref/source/ (7 files in 5 dirs): [1863] Spriggan tile updates. (Poor_Yurik) 17:17:51 03enne.walker * re34637d7b464 10/crawl-ref/source/rltiles/UNUSED/monsters/shadow_imp.png: Move old shadow imp tile to UNUSED dir. 17:17:52 03enne.walker * r593575201ab3 10/crawl-ref/source/ (3 files in 3 dirs): Add iron imp tile. 17:18:49 BiA is insane in Sprint 17:19:54 KiloByte: yes, but so expensive. 17:20:40 BiA is insane /everywhere/ 17:20:49 sorear: hi! 17:21:09 I wonder how people found Trog to be complete pre-BiA =) 17:21:33 well, pre-BiA trog had haste 17:21:33 My chapayev Sprint game just died to the Lernean hydra. 17:21:40 sorear: yes, but that's not insane at all. 17:22:04 Do you get to pick the map? 17:22:12 sorear: yes 17:22:24 but only between old Chapayev and new Chapayev 17:22:29 Neil's not yet included 17:23:01 All of you who're testing... we should make up our minds which map is better for the tournament. They're both cool and they'll both stay, of course. 17:23:37 maybe points for wins on each map? 17:23:52 weren't we supposed to have several, changed every week? 17:23:59 ogaz: no, I think that's overkill. Also means we have to test two maps extensively. 17:24:02 KiloByte: :) 17:24:24 In 2030, when we have a division of dedicated Sprint map makers. 17:25:08 we have over a month to produce more... and two maps are in testing already 17:26:15 KiloByte: greensnark would be throwing trouts around could he hear you :) 17:26:39 I like the idea of injecting some dope into the tournament by adding a Sprint challenge half way. 17:27:13 wasn't the idea of weekly sprint maps his in the first place? 17:27:34 that's one of the reasons we don't have them public 17:27:37 I cannot believe that. Perhaps he was intoxicated. 17:28:13 can just make new subvaults for the current ones now :p 17:28:15 He's opposing that we have a secret map at all. I was proposing that because I believe the Sprint map will be much less fun if it's been dissected in advance by players. 17:33:12 03kilobyte * rd748cad4beed 10/crawl-ref/source/rltiles/UNUSED/monsters/enchantress_human.png: Store the old human enchantress in UNUSED. 17:33:42 Thanks, KiloByte. 17:34:05 I might end up redoing her armor to look completely different, maybe make her an assassin or something. 17:35:16 assassins require quite a bit of brainstorming :( We don't want people keeping themselves surrounded by pets or clouds all the time. 17:36:07 I didn't really mean that with any gameplay connotations except for a stabby unique with a hood. 17:36:33 maybe make them invisible until they are within a few spaces of the player 17:36:43 and then appear in a puff of blink smoke 17:37:22 no, assassins were planned since day 0 17:38:41 in fact, before other spriggans were even considered, in pre-0.5 times. The idea first appeared in a FR for a spriggan unique Parsley. 17:38:54 a stalker 17:39:12 except that poison spells quite give you away 17:40:38 everyone has a means of seeing invisible by that time, so it would be just a yet another item on the checklist, like rPois is for Hive/Snake 17:41:17 gotcha 17:41:33 real stealth, with awareness rolls, would be better... except there is the issue of pets 17:41:54 which would be there for invisibility too 17:42:27 you'd be able to think "hey, what's in that one square where my pets don't enter?" 17:42:45 Maybe that wouldn't be a bad thing :) 17:44:27 hmm... just got an idea. What about having them move through squares already taken by other monsters, and pushing (recursively) a pet aside when it's time to reveal? 17:45:38 mgrd makes that somewhat challenging 17:46:16 That would be cool, not sure how it would work if there was no open space for the pet to move to 17:48:05 sorear: that's an implementation detail, which can be worked out somehow. Like, not having them on mgrd at all. 17:49:39 sorear: there may be better solutions, too. That's why I'd think about the user-visible behaviour rather than about what's under the hood. 17:51:32 heck, they could even be some kind of fuzzy wave packs :p 17:51:57 mmm quantum monsters 17:52:09 with observation being "is there a quick blade between my ribs?" 17:53:10 Aizul splashes around in water (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=1866) by Tenaya 17:55:02 does sif piety feel like it changes extremely rapidly in sprint to anyone else? 18:11:18 -!- kofrad has joined ##crawl-dev 18:29:07 -!- ogaz has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 18:30:42 -!- xyblor has joined ##crawl-dev 18:37:15 Keskitalo: I need to aquire a copy of photoshop again before I can do tiles 18:37:44 Keskitalo: and Hi :) 18:42:18 I'm glad people commented on religious jobs in the wiki. I added some more ideas about the lugonu class. https://crawl.develz.org/wiki/doku.php?id=dcss:brainstorm:job:religious_jobs 18:59:42 -!- Textmode has joined ##crawl-dev 19:03:08 xyblor: I never said it on the wiki, so I do here: the idea of one class per god is a good one, imo. 19:03:19 oh good 19:03:49 Warpers start at the Abyss, hehe. 19:04:09 just brainstorming 19:04:15 It's a cute idea but I think the Lugonu<-->Abyss link is much stronger than the warper<-->Abyss one. 19:04:19 Oh, that's absolutely okay. 19:04:49 I am clearly in favour of 4/5, 19:05:13 do you have a favorite name? 19:05:44 no, not really 19:06:03 so you think xom will stay 19:06:07 English is not my mother tongue, and whenever I use something, someone will want to change it later. 19:07:02 xyblor: I am not married to Xom, but some players are... in my opinion, starting Xom is less important than E, L, T, Y, that's all. 19:07:27 -!- Chapayev has joined ##crawl-dev 19:07:28 fair enough 19:09:39 I don't really see any reason to get rid of Zin now 19:10:13 the recite buff was huge; maybe even too much 19:10:58 recite finally got buffed?? in 0.7-a? 19:11:47 I'm not sure when 19:12:07 well it is awesome news that it got buffed, that was a long time coming 19:12:31 zin was the cruddiest god for the entire time i have been a crawl player, since sometime in the 0.3's 19:12:58 he's pretty fun in trunk 19:13:46 pretty much every orc band will start chopping each other up as soon as you tell them about the evils of mutation 19:14:01 Chapayev: Recite got improved and Zin got a new power, too. 19:15:35 heh, you know how some people made ubuntu christian edition, and it comes with bible software and that kind of stuff? they should get their own software repository and put their own custom build of crawl it in, where zin is super-powerful 19:16:38 I don't know if a polytheistic game world would be acceptable 19:16:50 you'd have to remove the other gods 19:17:31 xyblor: they could be (false) idols. 19:18:00 so many masters of explaining things away :) 19:19:24 and then we'll have Crawl Islamic Edition with a god who rewards killing anyone who doesn't worship him, especially priests of other religions 19:19:30 oh, wait... 19:19:58 -!- pointless_ has joined ##crawl-dev 19:21:03 I feel the discussion may have wandered into politically incorrect territory :D 19:26:35 Napkin_: you there? 19:27:40 Chapayev: no, 2:30 am over here 19:27:48 dpeg: ah, that's right :P 19:28:43 except that Napkin's time zone is same as mine or dpeg's 19:29:18 KiloByte: huh? 19:29:19 Maybe you should go to sleep? 19:29:27 KiloByte: oh i get it 19:32:10 -!- Vandal has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:32:36 has there been any more decision on whether or not to remove or merge Fi and Gl? 19:34:04 due: awake? I have a question about using markers from multiple subvaults. 19:34:31 -!- Vandal has joined ##crawl-dev 19:35:02 xyblor: they're quite different; AC and EV fighters are not very similar 19:35:17 that's what I think 19:35:37 Gl and Cr are pretty redundant, though. It makes little sense to not use magic if you don't use heavy armour and are not a Troggie. 19:36:15 right, but you don't necessarily have to go to enchantments 19:36:38 there's Reaver for that 19:37:20 you could also say it makes little sense to not worship a god; but we don't need to decide for the player 19:38:17 -!- Mu_ has quit [Quit: Defecator, may everything turn out okay so that you can leave this place.] 19:38:25 yeah, but all you lose is a couple of skill levels you won't use 19:38:51 so you want to get rid of Gl :-( 19:39:01 there's cases where you go heavy armor without magic 19:39:04 trmo, for example 19:39:09 light armor withotu magic, i mean 19:40:08 or many other pure fighters of races that can't use most armors 19:41:02 OgFi and DrFi might be better off putting XP into dodging than holding out for a heavy dragon armor--that's a valid game decision 19:42:07 I agree 19:42:22 well, they can put at least some XP into dodging, scum D:1 for that gda, or die 19:42:32 I think all Fi should start with scale mail. races that can't wear it can't be Fi 19:43:31 I would also remove the claws option for GhFi and TrFi 19:43:47 there's monk for that 19:43:51 exactly 19:44:35 it's silly He is an UC background, too 19:44:49 yeah 19:45:25 I guess it just recognizes the races where it's smarter to drop the staff and fight with claws 19:46:28 for TrHe, it makes sense; for most others, not really 19:47:05 what others are there? 19:48:17 all races which don't prefer to fight unarmed 19:48:34 and are not ghouls, who can't be He in the first place 19:48:35 oh right I forgot it was changed for everyone 19:48:47 He being unarmed that is 19:48:58 yeah that's dumb 19:49:17 unarmed ghfi in heavy armor is great though 19:49:21 i would be sad to see that go 19:49:36 hmm, right 19:49:55 although it will only take a GhMo 2 minutes to find ring mail 19:50:18 having no combat skills at all would be thematic for a healer, but if they're to use something to fight, it will be a weapon rather than fists 19:50:38 and staves have a traditional link to healers 19:50:43 xyblor: but the starting xp would be in dodging rather than armour 19:51:40 Chapayev: I suspect dodging is the way to go for unarmed chars anyway since the armour nerf 19:52:17 xyblor: did the armor nerf get partially reversed? i remember it was too severe 19:52:26 I don't know 19:52:38 i hope it either was partially reversed or will be partially reversed 19:53:07 heavy armor unarmed ghfi of makhleb was really really fun 19:53:18 yeah that's a classic 19:56:47 TrCK and GhCK also get the claws option 19:57:31 but Gl don't 19:57:34 weird 20:00:16 Chapayev: armor nerf got overhauled, yes 20:00:20 ah, good 20:00:57 -!- syllogism has quit [] 20:08:04 -!- dpeg has quit [Quit: zzz] 20:11:37 what's "Eino's usability project"? 20:11:56 they're making a usability report? 20:12:14 made 20:12:35 who's on the "team"? 20:13:00 https://crawl.develz.org/wiki/doku.php?id=dcss:usability_project:report 20:13:21 that's so cool! 20:14:13 Remember, when you think school projects think DCSS 20:14:42 I almost can't believe what I'm reading 20:15:25 crawl is serious business 20:16:51 yo 20:17:27 Um I don't know if you've heard, but crawl is serious business so you might want to use a more formal greeting. Just saying. 20:17:39 lol 20:18:50 No :p 20:19:03 oh well 20:21:31 there's some really good stuff in that report 20:22:26 a lot of it is about the tiles version though 20:22:40 Well, it's the most usable, in theory. 20:22:59 true 20:23:49 although a lot of the problems they describe don't exist in ascii 20:24:00 console rather 20:28:37 was everyone amazed when this report came out? 20:29:07 -!- Chapayev has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:29:57 -!- eith has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:30:15 -!- Chapayev has joined ##crawl-dev 20:46:57 -!- Chapayev has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:47:58 -!- Chapayev has joined ##crawl-dev 20:49:21 -!- ogaz has joined ##crawl-dev 21:04:16 -!- ogaz has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:06:54 -!- ogaz has joined ##crawl-dev 21:24:36 Chapayev: You should file bugs for your subvault issues 21:39:25 Chapayev: which subvault issues? 21:40:21 greensnark: also, aren't you one of the guys that runs CDO? i was wondering if it would be good to put sprint2.des on to the copy of sprint that runs on CDO 21:40:51 I thought dpeg wants to keep it secret 21:41:08 I'm confused about what's supposed to be secret and what's not 21:41:13 greensnark: i thought he wanted to keep mu's map secret, not sprint2.des, which is the one i made 21:41:36 In scrollback he was talking about wanting to discuss and decide which to use for torunament 21:41:52 oh okay, i guess we wait and ask dpeg :P 21:42:27 <-- hates secret Crawl development 21:42:33 But whatever 21:43:30 But you should totally file bugs for issues with subvaults, or they'll never be fixed :P 21:43:31 i think it makes sense in this case but yeah i was not intending to submit that sprint map to be used for the tournament 21:44:09 greensnark: the issues i have had were weird, fixable, and probably more solvable by thorough documentation of how the subvault code works than by any change to the subvault code 21:44:56 So you're too lazy to file the bugs? :P 21:45:29 greensnark: i'm not sure they're bugs yet--dpeg pointed out that there's some documentation of the subvault code that i haven't read yet :P 21:45:46 But seriously, thorough documentation of how subvault code works will be full of unreadable technicalese 21:46:01 If subvaults are behaving unexpectedly, that is likely a bug 21:46:52 Unreadable technicalese? What's that and how do I recognize it? 21:47:04 okay, i'll go back and try to produce some minimal examples of weird subvault behavior 21:47:24 sorear: On account of being a programming nut you wouldn't recognise it 21:47:42 But we don't want to dump a load of that crap on folks who just want to design levels :P 21:48:11 subvault needs a man page :) 21:48:46 The subvault concept is intended to be simple to understand and use. If it's full of caveats like can't-have-marker-on-edge-of-subvault, those should be treated as bugs and fixed 21:49:17 Vault designing should not be like win32 programming 21:57:18 -!- neunon_ has joined ##crawl-dev 22:00:14 -!- neunon has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 22:00:14 -!- neunon_ is now known as neunon 22:03:08 -!- Chapayev has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:03:29 -!- Chapayev has joined ##crawl-dev 22:04:06 03greensnark * rc88befd15f67 10/crawl-ref/source/abyss.cc: Fix corruption not handling translucent walls correctly, make corruption use proto-abyss terrain instead of _generate_area. 22:20:36 03greensnark * r2ceca421fba7 10/crawl-ref/source/abyss.cc: Make _abyss_proto_feature static. 22:20:39 03greensnark * r17bd8f00492f 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/descript/items.txt: Fix wording for dragon hides, could use more work. 22:27:02 Chapayev: What's wrong with subvaults? The subvault "man page" is syntax.txt. 22:28:29 If a marker is not working, are you sure that it's on a subvault glyph that will get copied back to the parent vault? 22:30:04 Enne: it was actually a marker on the main map, not a marker in the subvault 22:30:33 Enne: it works now, after moving the marker into its own 1x1 subvault, so it doesn't matter for my purposes 22:31:18 Enne: but it was a little weird, it was just a fog_machine which wasn't getting placed or wasn't working as long as a certain very large subvault was being placed 22:31:53 Enne: when i get a chance i'll go back and duplicate it and come back with a minimal example 22:34:02 Chapayev: Weird. Ok! I'd love to see a minimal (or even not-so-minimal) example whenever you have a chance to create one. :) 22:34:51 Chapayev: Also, is there anything syntax.txt could clarify or document about subvaults that would be helpful? 22:38:57 Enne: are disconnected subvaults handled okay? i always assumed not 22:39:08 also i have never been brave enough to try non-simply-connected subvaults 22:39:17 They should be. 22:39:54 There's no notion of connectivity, only bounding box size. 22:40:23 the bit about the bounding box was the most helpful thing about subvaults in syntax.txt 22:40:41 actually the write-up about subvaults in syntax.txt was very helpful in general, thanks to you and dpeg for mentioning to me that it exists 22:55:26 03enne.walker * r8dbb39b20291 10/crawl-ref/source/rltiles/dc-mon/spriggan/spriggan_rider.png: Fix rim on spriggan rider. 22:55:27 03enne.walker * rcbec86004fe2 10/crawl-ref/source/tilemcache.cc: Give equipped weapon tiles to spriggans. 23:07:02 03greensnark * reda45b1c453b 10/crawl-ref/source/ (delay.cc delay.h misc.cc monster.cc player.cc): s/is_run_delay/delay_is_run/, use delay_type instead of int. 23:07:05 03greensnark * rc23381e8a54a 10/crawl-ref/source/delay.cc: Interrupt all run delays when confused. 23:10:55 -!- pointless_ has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.6/20100625231939]] 23:12:08 03greensnark 07stone_soup-0.7 * ra4ff05c89a3c 10/crawl-ref/source/directn.cc: Don't crash when debug-describing squares outside LOS with 'x' (syllogism). 23:12:09 03kilobyte 07stone_soup-0.7 * r1f02aa928844 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/lua/autofight.lua: Update autofight for sqrt(5) instead of sqrt(8) reaching. 23:12:11 03kilobyte 07stone_soup-0.7 * r84b8a497fc7e 10/crawl-ref/source/ (dat/descript/items.txt player.cc): Make dragon hides work even when raw. Mention enchanting in their descs. 23:12:12 03kilobyte 07stone_soup-0.7 * rfa49cc205bc6 10/crawl-ref/source/main.cc: Fix confusion near lava being 100% safe. 23:12:14 03kilobyte 07stone_soup-0.7 * r11da211a9519 10/crawl-ref/source/tags.cc: Add some assertions for saves. We should make these just fail loading instead of crashing one day. 23:12:20 03greensnark 07stone_soup-0.7 * rd0eff9eaa709 10/crawl-ref/source/abyss.cc: Fix corruption not handling translucent walls correctly, make corruption use proto-abyss terrain instead of _generate_area. 23:12:21 03greensnark 07stone_soup-0.7 * rda6e7d443655 10/crawl-ref/source/ (delay.cc delay.h misc.cc monster.cc player.cc): s/is_run_delay/delay_is_run/, use delay_type instead of int. 23:12:22 03greensnark 07stone_soup-0.7 * r14550d7139ce 10/crawl-ref/source/delay.cc: Interrupt all run delays when confused. 23:18:54 -!- Enne has quit [Quit: Enne] 23:20:49 -!- Chapayev has quit [Quit: leaving] 23:48:32 yo yo yo 23:49:53 Hello