00:00:48 godabil.cc:899: warning: 'int _prompt_for_fruit(int&, const char*)' defined but not used 00:02:24 -!- raydarken has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:02:36 -!- Iainuki has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 00:05:18 slow compile is slow 00:05:32 Slow link is slow. 00:06:01 slow channel is slow 00:06:21 slow cat is slow 00:06:33 :D 00:11:31 nice, crawl leaked /no/ memory 00:11:43 * elly played for a while under valgrind 00:12:46 it's hard to leak memory if you don't actually use malloc or new anywhere 00:13:03 -!- kats has joined ##crawl-dev 00:13:27 we actually do in a handful of places, but the vast majority of Crawl's memory management is handled by std::map, std::vector, and std::string 00:13:41 and Lua, which has its own garbage collector 00:15:36 apparently the only usages of malloc in crawl at the moment are by me 00:15:37 (: 00:16:06 I always found "malloc" disturbing. 00:16:15 why? 00:16:41 "malloc" looks awfully like "malus" 00:16:49 heh 00:17:04 I thought ghost_demon used it? 00:20:32 ah, and the lexer for the level compiler 00:20:41 doesn't look like ghost_demon does 00:21:17 is cpu usage down too? 00:22:16 old tiles code used to use a lot of malloc, new tiles code only uses a very few calls 00:22:33 doy: what about 'new'? 00:22:42 -!- kats has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:23:40 i'm sure we use 'new' all over the place, but that's a lot more irritating to grep for 00:24:20 hmmm, looking for 'delete' shows a decent number of usages 00:24:26 but not an incredible amount 00:24:34 deleeeete 00:24:38 deleeeeeete 00:25:07 Hm, apparently trying to compile crawl while converting FLACs to MP3s and running a VirtualMachine is a bad idea? 00:26:29 -!- kats has joined ##crawl-dev 00:30:20 O_o My computer would have a stroke. 00:31:39 Madtrixr: It's an EEE Pc as well :) 00:32:33 Mines just old. 00:32:36 old old old... 00:37:08 my computer's pretty ancient but could handle that fine 00:37:33 How old? 00:37:44 7:1 swap ratio and a dedicated swap partition felt like such overkill when I set it up on a lark seven years ago 00:37:48 were you there when I bitched about how old my PC was in c-ot? 00:37:51 but it's working really well for me now 00:37:56 no. 00:38:21 my PC is approximately half my age 00:38:51 So...10 years old? 00:39:11 8-9 or so 00:39:17 Alright. 00:39:26 it's only approximately half my age 00:39:42 Mines about 10-9 I'd say. 00:42:21 and i thought mine was old 00:43:55 I think we got this before 9/11. 00:44:46 mine has some pre-9/11 parts, actually 00:44:58 but most of it is from 2004 00:45:04 or maybe 2003 00:45:18 It's a gateway too. 00:51:17 Morning! 00:51:35 Morning Kes? 00:51:38 doh. 00:51:45 Morning Kes! 00:52:21 Hiya Eino! 01:20:22 -!- ortoslon has joined ##crawl-dev 01:23:04 -!- ortoslon has left ##crawl-dev 01:23:09 hm, am I doing something wrong, or is a '+' prompt now default after the message that says how damaged a monster is? 01:24:05 -!- kast has joined ##crawl-dev 01:25:33 -!- kats has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:30:46 -!- kast has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 01:32:44 -!- by has joined ##crawl-dev 01:35:41 -!- kats has joined ##crawl-dev 01:36:10 hey rob 01:42:40 -!- Ero has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 01:46:53 hi 02:09:03 was 0.6 branched yet? 02:16:42 nope 02:17:48 It probably should be, though. 02:18:36 -!- TGW has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:18:50 would everybody apply things to the branch, or do we need someone in charge? 02:19:11 I don't think we ned someonoe in charge 02:19:15 things can be undone if necessary 02:20:26 but ther'es less than a month until the "release date"... 02:20:33 having an actual release manager is pretty useful for keeping things together 02:22:30 do we need one, though? 02:23:54 Is steam damage broken again? 02:24:05 A steam dragon took me to 7hp from about 40 with rF+. 02:24:37 * by thinks doy would make a fine release manager 02:24:42 by: agree 02:28:03 due: 3d10 + more from the cloud 02:28:06 sounds fine to me 02:28:18 hah 02:28:20 sounds like work 02:28:22 (: 02:28:25 hm 02:28:38 steam resistance (rF) is 100/50/50 02:28:42 like old hellfire 02:29:23 doy: it is, I'm sure; but think of the fame and glory :) 02:29:28 (i'll think about it if people think that it's a good idea though) 02:29:29 (: 02:29:30 Ah, so it's rF++ that makes a difference? 02:30:10 ??steam 02:30:11 steam[1/1]: Does a token amount of damage and (more importantly) obscures LOS. Used by smoke demons, steam dragons and pale draconians, and can be created by evaporating water. 02:30:15 aside from the other qualifications, you probably know how to handle the git branches and tags properly :) 02:30:21 Less than "token". 02:30:59 !tell dpeg due and I are nominating doy as 0.6 release manager; he isn't even strongly objecting so far :) 02:30:59 by: OK, I'll let dpeg know. 02:31:08 back when I wrote that entry, steam dragons were rarer/deeper 02:32:34 -!- stabwound has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 02:37:56 -!- stabwound has joined ##crawl-dev 02:55:40 someone should write up a mail to the list for "okay guys, let's *actually* branch now" 02:59:41 bah 03:00:19 -!- dpeg has joined ##crawl-dev 03:00:25 i'm too fast for you d: 03:00:25 Mornings 03:00:25 dpeg: You have 3 messages. Use !messages to read them. 03:00:36 !messages 03:00:36 (1/3) due said (8h 58m 35s ago): I have half a mind to code the colosseum for 0.7. :) 03:00:47 !seen due 03:00:47 I last saw due at Wed Feb 10 08:32:58 2010 UTC (27m 49s ago) saying Hoorayicide. on ##crawl. 03:01:00 due: Is ##crawl misbehaving again= 03:01:01 ? 03:01:08 The suckers made me /part yesterday. 03:01:18 i /parted ##crawl weeks ago 03:01:25 re: colosseum: yes, that's a good portal vault. 03:01:32 my life has been much less irritated since 03:01:41 doy: I log in there automatically but I don't follow anymore. 03:01:48 !messages 03:01:48 (1/2) due said (8h 59m 37s ago): Otherwise, portals page looks good! 03:01:53 !messages 03:01:53 (1/1) by said (30m 54s ago): due and I are nominating doy as 0.6 release manager; he isn't even strongly objecting so far :) 03:02:03 doy: tag, you're it! 03:02:20 (: 03:02:29 we should get a consensus about branching though 03:02:35 doy: release manager, shouldn't we have branched long ago? 03:02:40 We need results! 03:02:44 d: 03:03:00 Executive Prime Release Managager, of course :P 03:03:16 I'd say "let's branch the moment the list of blockers is empty". 03:03:36 kilobyte: my inbox was full of stuff and the IOOD page is not updated. 03:03:43 could you list quickly what you did for IOOD? 03:03:49 dpeg: I had an argument with OG17. 03:04:06 due: That's not hard to do, I think. 03:04:33 About the tone of the comment onthe "was cursed" bug. 03:04:43 ah, I saw your reaction on Mantis :) 03:04:55 kilobyte: i don't think we need to wait on tiles 03:05:02 "Sort out this shit alone, motherfuckers." :) 03:05:15 Heh, basically that. 03:05:20 1. monsters don't attack it anymore and in some cases will walk around, 2. spells/missiles go through it, 3. its initial aim is way from perfect 03:05:23 doy: are you saying this out of neglicence/spit regarding tiles, or for reals? 03:05:36 kilobyte: 3. is somewhat like I proposed? 03:05:38 doy: Tiles are essential before we can release 06, but I don't think we should wait for them to branch. 03:05:41 dpeg: i mean, i don't think we need to wait for all tiles to be in before branching 03:05:55 doy: sure! Should just tell the tiles crowd. 03:05:57 yes 03:06:05 kind of. 03:06:21 kilobyte: I didn't provide formulas, of course. 03:06:26 The numbers need to be adjusted, though. And we'd probably want power as a factor in the formula. 03:06:30 kilobyte: did autoexplore stopping/avoiding for submergers ever get in? 03:06:33 what happens if the orb goes into a wall? 03:06:48 doy: no 03:06:53 doy: do we want to wait for Ctrl-O and Textmode's spell colouring? 03:07:08 I will add autoexplore stopping for ~ on the 0.6 page. 03:07:18 dpeg: ^O should be a pretty trivial fix 03:07:24 no idea about the spell coloring stuff 03:07:32 dpeg: on diggable walls, it will destroy one square of it 03:07:45 i really think it would be better to hold off on spell coloring and get actual menucolors-style coloring for 0.7 03:07:52 but some people think it's an important feature for 0.6, so 03:09:12 especially if fedhas is only picky about certain necromancy spells, i think it'd be pretty annoying if it wasn't there 03:09:15 dpeg: there was one version with MADLY low accuracy, but after I fixed a bug in homing, the accuracy is probably too high again 03:09:58 kilobyte: I am not sure IOOD as a digging spell is good. 03:10:01 MarvinPA: agree, either all of necromancy with no spell coloring, or cherry picking but then colouring is mandatory 03:10:06 You can use pure Con to dig, effectively. 03:10:17 re: spellcolours -- seconding Adam 03:10:56 agree with dpeg about digging 03:11:20 dpeg: it's not like digging effects are rare, and I didn't even add it, it came packaged with disintegration 03:11:21 kilobyte: but it could still do some damage next to it, perhaps? 03:11:54 kilobyte: digging per spell is not easy to obtain (and manage). IOOD would change that a bit. 03:12:43 yeah, digging is currently finite at least, except to earth elementalists 03:13:03 or anyone who finds a stone of earth elementals? 03:13:18 MarvinPA: well, that's going to go away as soon as possible d: 03:13:18 the stone will be changed, it does not count 03:13:25 ah heh, fair enough 03:13:33 it is ridiculously broken 03:13:47 Good digging: dig, wand of digging. Slow digging: stone of earth, wands of disint, LRD, shatter, wands of random effects, summoning cacos. 03:14:17 (hostile eyes of devastation) 03:14:22 kilobyte: stone is broken; wands are finite; LRD & Shatter are harder to cast than IOOD 03:15:10 lrd is a level 5 spell 03:15:12 iood is 8?> 03:15:51 iood is 8? Wasn't is 7 when I played? :) 03:16:06 But I may be seriously off here. 03:16:08 7, but pure conj and not too hard for a vehumite to get reliably castable 03:16:10 lrd is really really slow though 03:16:23 yeah, 7 pure conj is pretty trivial with veh 03:16:23 In any case, IOOD disintegrating or not is not a 0.6 breaker. 03:16:28 sure 03:16:47 0.6 spell colouring has to go in 03:16:48 kilobyte: what did you think of the idea that IOOD needs a minimal distance to do damage? 03:16:49 trivial patches will be pretty easy to pick out between branches in any case 03:16:54 I really like that idea for some spell. 03:17:09 Did Textmode supply his patch yet? 03:17:14 doy: Will we have to ask you to apply patches, or can we do them ourselves? 03:17:44 hehe 03:17:54 doy: rule with an iron hand! 03:17:56 well, since the tracker would have to warn you about that, it's same as not being able to cast it at all 03:18:00 Heck, with a fist of steel! 03:18:04 which _is_ an option 03:18:27 I like the idea of giving iood a splash radius 03:18:31 kilobyte: this is not true for IOOD, where the spell is not instant. 03:18:37 sorear: i don't 03:18:40 could even do like 1/5 damage in the splash zone 03:19:01 kilobyte: how did you make IOOD not useful in close range? 03:19:01 the people using it will strongly avoid casting it nearby 03:19:21 iood targets tend to have a lot more hp than iood users 03:19:29 oh, close range is already addressed? 03:19:34 maybe 03:19:40 kilobyte had ideas about it, at least 03:20:14 troves should be finished soonish 03:20:23 that'll just be a single patch and easily cherrypicked 03:20:38 the ideas so far are: 1. using explosions (with a drawback of making it more powerful, but this can come with a bigger nerf), 2. special-casing point blank launch to do backlash damage 03:20:53 due: hurry up, before doy closes the gates with his trousers of clay! 03:21:16 dpeg: git checkout -b stone_soup0.6 origin/stone_soup0.6, git cherry-pick , git push? ;) 03:21:19 kilobyte: hey, and 3. IOOD needs minimum distance to work 03:21:24 and now sorear's 3. explosions with only 1/5 damage to the splash zone 03:21:34 so 4 ideas =) 03:21:39 Good noon! 03:21:47 Noon -- where are you? 03:22:03 Isn't noon around midday? 03:22:11 kilobyte: 0. make iood very inaccurate to start, so it'll tend to circle around nearby targets while still tending to home in when it has time 03:22:12 indeed 03:22:41 sorear: i like that idea, actually 03:22:47 I'll go to a talk in a minute, might be useful to add these IOOD ideas to the pagE? 03:23:01 doy: 0. is my reading of a patch that came in last night 03:23:12 I haven't actually tested to see if it works like that in-game 03:23:25 sorear: yeah, but i don't think that patch does it enough to affect close range 03:23:38 Third user test done (out of five). We lost screen capture and first 10 minutes of sound, but I think we'll manage. 03:23:45 changing it so it does could be pretty cool 03:23:57 Keskitalo: cool! 03:24:18 even making it just fire in a random direction, but then homing at the target 03:24:36 doy: but this hurts *all* uses of IOOD, not just vs adjacent targets 03:24:39 could prove to be very annoying 03:25:09 dpeg: wouldn't be all that much worse against far away targets 03:25:16 Have to consider monsters casting it as well.. 03:25:17 -!- Twinge has joined ##crawl-dev 03:25:17 if i understand how it works properly 03:25:29 Keskitalo: hmmm, yeah, i suppose 03:25:36 --> wiki :) 03:25:42 -!- dpeg is now known as dpegtalk 03:26:04 sorear: the problem with being inaccurate is that it is still guaranteed at point blank 03:26:06 i just think the mental picture of orbs just exploding out of the caster's body and then circling around and homing in on a target is pretty awesome 03:27:00 doy: Yes. That DOES sound awesome 03:27:05 do want. 03:27:12 I agree, and more it requires you to be in an open space to use it the better imho :) 03:27:26 that would require either greatly reducing the turn radius or it would end useless except for some exceptionally open places 03:27:46 kilobyte: what would the effects of reducing the turn radius be? 03:28:10 -!- Twinge- has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 03:31:57 being unable to dodge monster-cast ones, abuse monster ones vs their casters, and so on 03:38:24 dpegtalk: you should write to c-r-d about our release manager and allow the non-ircer's a chance to object (they won't) 03:40:43 yikes, ZAP_HASTING etc. has name "0", and mons_cast_noise checks against that to determine visibility 03:40:52 that's a literal string "0" 03:41:21 yeah, a lot of beams do weird things with "0" names 03:43:27 ZAP_IOOD is the only one that has name "0" and enchantment == false 03:44:30 the monster and player versions of IOOD are diverging quite a bit 03:45:06 I think it's inevitable because victim intelligence has such a high influence on its effectiveness 03:45:08 it woudldn't hurt too much to apply another asymmetric nerf 03:45:11 sorear: the only difference is that player-cast orbs dissipate upon going out of range 03:45:49 I thought there was also a damage difference 03:46:11 well, still, asymmetric nerfing is quite fine with me 03:47:12 doy: do you know any place besides mon_cast_noise that checks the name[0] = '0' thing? I can't find anything 03:47:31 it used to be checked in a lot more places 03:47:34 by: might have been in earlier versions of the code 03:47:49 is_enchantment is relatively new 03:47:51 ok, I'll kill it 03:48:04 i've never delved very far into the beam code(: 03:48:13 crawl has used name == "0" to switch from EV to MR since a very long time 03:48:25 ah 03:48:44 also, beam flavors used to be encoded in the color 03:49:06 red beams have one effect, green beams another 03:53:39 kilobyte: what is ZAP_IOOD used for? just tracing? 03:56:01 yeah. There is another beam when the orb hits, though, to do the actual damage. 03:57:27 -!- Iainuki has joined ##crawl-dev 03:59:28 -!- Spads has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 04:03:47 -!- Spads has joined ##crawl-dev 04:04:10 that's demonic 04:06:53 !log * id=539894 04:06:53 No games for * (id=539894). 04:07:20 !lg heteroy place=lair:7 04:07:20 7. heteroy the Cleaver (L14 HuAM), worshipper of Xom, slain by a red devil (summoned by Xom) on Lair:7 on 2010-01-18, with 37179 points after 27725 turns and 1:43:30. 04:07:27 !lg heteroy place=lair:7 x=id 04:07:27 7. [id=588352] heteroy the Cleaver (L14 HuAM), worshipper of Xom, slain by a red devil (summoned by Xom) on Lair:7 on 2010-01-18, with 37179 points after 27725 turns and 1:43:30. 04:07:43 so ids are not permanent? :( 04:07:52 !log heteroy place=lair:7 04:07:53 7. heteroy, XL14 HuAM, T:27725: http://crawl.develz.org/morgues/trunk/heteroy/morgue-heteroy-20100118-062626.txt 04:08:00 Dunno. 04:33:41 too bad you can't remap DCHAR_SPACE with cset_*; it would be possible to affect casting noises otherwise 04:34:17 O_o 04:41:14 -!- stabwound has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 04:45:25 -!- stabwound has joined ##crawl-dev 04:58:54 back 04:59:06 welcome back, how went le talky walky? 05:00:23 was very interesting, I hijacked that talk with my questions :) 05:00:25 -!- dpegtalk is now known as dpeg 05:00:28 :) 05:00:30 naughty peg 05:01:20 lol 05:02:27 release manager would mean what? 05:02:47 People who want to apply commits have to ask him, apart from bug fixes? 05:14:58 dpeg: probably; maybe says gets final say on things like what bugs need to be fixed, etc... Keskitalo did this for 0.5 iirc, maybe ask him? 05:15:06 s/says // 05:15:14 Keskitalo: you here? 05:18:54 -!- Spads has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 05:19:28 mail sent 05:23:53 -!- greensnark has joined ##crawl-dev 05:23:56 I espy a greenish-coloured snark. 05:24:00 Ahah, it exists here, also. 05:24:04 What do you mean, greenish 05:24:04 greensnark: You have 3 messages. Use !messages to read them. 05:24:13 haha, three messages :P 05:24:17 * greensnark has no ish and never did. 05:24:25 !tell greensnark REmember to read your messages. 05:24:25 due: OK, I'll let greensnark know. 05:24:32 I'm here to complain about cbus always playing overly easy characters 05:24:32 greensnark: You have 4 messages. Use !messages to read them. 05:24:40 WTF is with the messages :P 05:24:46 greensnark: his last win had 90 EV! :) 05:25:04 !tell greensnark Ignorance is bliss! 05:25:04 dpeg: OK, I'll let greensnark know. 05:25:34 !tell greensnark Ignore dpeg's messages. 05:25:34 due: OK, I'll let greensnark know. 05:25:40 (Payback is a bitch!) 05:25:50 moin greensnarking! 05:30:34 90EV, ick 05:30:35 greensnark: You have 4 messages. Use !messages to read them. 05:30:37 Heyy Napkin 05:30:50 :) 05:31:20 sorear: I'll update Henzell's source tree once 0.6 is released and rax installs it on cao :) 05:31:47 Say, is 0.6 out yet? 05:31:47 It feels like a century since 0.5 :P 05:32:08 of course it's not out yet :p 05:32:21 At this pace of releases, only testudines will live to see new releases! 05:32:27 greensnark: we've got a release manager, though 05:32:28 Sorry :P 05:32:46 Yay! 05:32:47 0.6 branched yet? 05:32:56 you should ask doy :) 05:33:06 Aha, he's the release manager? 05:33:23 Good to have someone driving the release <3 05:33:53 !tell doy 0.6 branched yet? :P by said to ask you! 05:33:54 greensnark: OK, I'll let doy know. 05:40:47 -!- Spads has joined ##crawl-dev 05:42:40 I guess I managed 0.5.2? 0.5.1 was a disaster with especially some infrastructure changes (or just new features, I forget) that wrecked CAO update. After that Darshan suggested a policy of no new features in minor releases, and we did manage keep them out of 0.5.2 apart from showing silence range in cyan. :) 05:43:08 -!- kats has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:43:20 -!- kats has joined ##crawl-dev 05:43:21 If there's a release manager, they can decide whether to add new features in point releases 05:43:50 The idea is that having one person in charge of such decisions makes it much less likely that things will break than if there's "Oh everybody's changing stuff" lack of accountability 05:43:51 But I think I mostly did a couple of emails, tagged the release when done and updated SF downloads and pages. 05:46:45 that part seems to be in docs/develop/release.txt 05:47:12 Ah yes, exactly. 05:48:08 swamp looks really nice now 05:48:53 03by * r7204e603691b 10/crawl-ref/source/godabil.cc: Remove unused _prompt_for_fruit. 05:48:54 03by * re8685650eacc 10/crawl-ref/source/ (beam.h mon-cast.cc): Remove demon_beam_type. 05:48:56 03by * r7e15d7e3d8ad 10/crawl-ref/docs/options_guide.txt: Fix cset_* documentation (add trees). 05:48:57 03by * r7072607392c7 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-cast.cc: mons_cast_noise: Add FIXME comment. 05:48:58 03by * r620b7dd9e350 10/crawl-ref/source/ (beam.cc beam.h): Add convenience method beam::visible(). 05:49:02 03by * rfeff4d744e5b 10/crawl-ref/source/viewchar.cc: Make dchar_glyph return 0 for invalid arguments. 05:49:04 03by * r8a9c315a2dce 10/crawl-ref/source/ (beam.cc mon-cast.cc): Kill beam names starting with "0". 05:49:05 03by * rb5910d657ef1 10/crawl-ref/source/ (beam.cc item_use.cc mon-cast.cc): Replace uses of DCHAR_SPACE with NUM_DCHAR_TYPES. 05:49:05 03by * r87f30daeefaf 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-cast.cc: Use beam::visible() in mons_cast_noise. 05:49:10 03by * r923974d928f4 10/crawl-ref/source/ (15 files): Rename bolt::type to bolt::glyph. 05:49:24 A primal wave of by commits 05:49:43 * due is shoved back into deep water 05:49:43 Ahaha, you finally got rid of the legendary "0" beam 05:49:44 * due drowns 05:50:03 it was only used for spellcasting noise now, it seems 05:50:21 In the early 0.1 days Haran fixed a bug where players could inscribe random things with {poisoned} and throw it at monsters to poison them 05:50:30 heh 05:50:41 HAHAHAH nice 05:51:16 hope I haven't introduced a whole new pile of bugs just before branching 05:51:29 Mar 1 is a looong way away 05:51:35 The testudines are waiting 05:51:47 We should totally do a codename for each release 05:52:45 "Awesome Alligator" 05:52:49 or "Colossal Crocodile" 05:52:55 "Tantalizing Testudine" 05:53:05 or "Mesmerising Mermaid" 05:53:18 "Vitriolic Volcano"? 05:53:24 "Mellifluous Mara"? 05:53:36 it should be somewhat RL-related: katzenhaarallerigresistenz 05:53:40 Silent Siren 05:53:51 Silent Siren <3 05:54:19 bhaak: What does that verbal procession mean? :P 05:55:23 can I give spells to a ghost in wizard mode? 05:55:39 greensnark: resistence to the allergy of cat hairs. But I mistyped :) 05:55:47 &Mplayer ghost spells:magic_dart? 05:55:48 bhaak: Love it! 05:55:52 Don't know if that would work. 05:56:03 It should work 05:56:21 Or memorise that spell and create a player ghost, it'll draw from your spells 05:56:34 oh, it does work, the spellbook debug messages were misleading 05:57:10 The ghost code will initialise the spells, but they will be replaced once the monster is generated 05:58:06 Thanks for the lovely white robe, wight! 05:58:48 !tell dpeg bhaak proposes the 0.6 release be codenamed "katzenhaarallergiresistenz" 05:58:48 greensnark: OK, I'll let dpeg know. 05:58:52 Spriggans are the perfect counter for randmo speed movement. 05:58:57 -!- Textmode has joined ##crawl-dev 05:59:05 Hiya Textmode! 05:59:14 !tell dpeg This was bhaak's idea entirely, in no way influenced by anyone else on ##crawl-dev, not to mention any names. 05:59:14 greensnark: OK, I'll let dpeg know. 05:59:15 Mornin' 05:59:38 !lm ghost=stathol 05:59:39 1. [2010-02-02] rob the Bludgeoner (L14 OgPr) killed the ghost of Stathol the Backstabber, a powerful SpEn of Okawaru on turn 41295. (D:15) 05:59:52 !tell dpeg but it should be correctly written Katzenhaarallergieresistenz, but you should know that :) 05:59:52 bhaak: OK, I'll let dpeg know. 05:59:52 Let me have breakfast, then Ill give the code a once over and rebase ->submit 06:00:11 !lm ghost=stathol x=gameid 06:00:11 Unknown selector gameid in gameid 06:00:20 !lm ghost=stathol x=game_id 06:00:20 1. [2010-02-02] [game_id=593487] rob the Bludgeoner (L14 OgPr) killed the ghost of Stathol the Backstabber, a powerful SpEn of Okawaru on turn 41295. (D:15) 06:00:29 !log id=593487 06:00:29 1. rob, XL15 OgPr, T:47491: http://crawl.develz.org/morgues/trunk/rob/morgue-rob-20100202-135321.txt 06:00:39 greensnark: you could also have asked him what the english term means in german. He would have gotten to the same conclusion :-D 06:00:55 Hmm? 06:01:22 bhaak: Does he have an allergy to cats? :P 06:01:38 If I'd known this I could have had so much fun at his expense in the past 06:01:42 But! It's not too late! 06:01:43 resistance to cat hair allergy is a bit longer when written in Finnish, as compared to German 06:01:56 Any other embarrassing things I should know about dpeg, this is a good time to tell me! 06:02:05 Kissankarva-allergiavastustuskyky? 06:02:13 Yegods 06:02:23 I'd put 'n' between allergia and vastustus 06:02:34 I suppose saying that word helps when you're gargling 06:02:52 or not, I'm not entirely sure 06:02:57 greensnark: no, I only know embarrassing details about jpeg, as I haven't met dpeg in person :) I only meant that as a German, he knows how to strings his words together 06:03:06 Oh that 06:03:13 Yes, I've already poked fun at him for being German :P 06:03:27 Käytettävyystestauspalautelomakkeensuunnittelupalaverikäytännöt. 06:03:36 Looks like I need to start on the Finns now :P 06:04:11 * greensnark spanks Keskitalo with a Käytettävyystestauspalautelomakkeensuunnittelupalaverikäytännöt 06:04:12 but only using ASCII letters would be best 06:04:21 Kolmivaihekilowattituntimittari 06:04:24 Whatever the heck a Käytettävyystestauspalautelomakkeensuunnittelupalaverikäytännöt is 06:04:33 greensnark: First off, it's plural. :P 06:04:47 It's an alphabetical monument :P 06:04:56 finnish is cool, all its words look like processed by a RNG 06:05:03 <3 06:05:12 Yeah, we could just use Finnish words for random Pan lord names 06:05:24 finnish is occasionally a good encryption algorithm when stronger algorithm is not needed 06:05:25 I'm for it. 06:05:25 Although the messagewindow might have trouble with words longer than 80 characters 06:05:41 Mara is a nickname for a Finnish president 06:05:55 And Duvessa is Finnish for toilet paper 06:06:00 Finns are a very poetic people :P 06:06:07 Really? How cute. 06:06:17 Well, something related to that ;P 06:06:20 I don't recall the details :P 06:06:21 Trutfully that's a very contrived word. "The procedures for meetings concerning the feedback forms of user testing." 06:06:54 I bet Finnish and German are excellent for those essays where you're ordered to keep stuff within 500 words, and you have much to say 06:07:13 Compression ratio in words could be as goo as 10:1 if you worked your nouns right 06:07:26 :) 06:08:00 -!- syllogism has joined ##crawl-dev 06:08:13 meanwhile, I thing I was in an MMO once with an NPC called duvessa...'twas a silly place. 06:13:44 -!- TGW has joined ##crawl-dev 06:15:29 oh god, tgw. :o 06:18:29 Love the ne wballisto stuff. 06:18:39 Maybe lightgreen would be a better colour for mould, thoug? 06:31:02 Vampires now bottle blood with af, but on the A screen it still says "You can bottle blood from corpses with 'c'." 06:33:48 !tell greensnark I am not allergic to cats! 06:33:48 dpeg: You have 3 messages. Use !messages to read them. 06:33:48 dpeg: OK, I'll let greensnark know. 06:33:48 !tell greensnark I am not allergic to cats! 06:33:49 dpeg: OK, I'll let greensnark know. 06:33:49 !tell greensnark I am not allergic to cats! 06:33:49 dpeg: OK, I'll let greensnark know. 06:34:55 are you alergic to snarks? 06:35:28 nah, he's allergic to options 06:35:43 I am allergic to options. A seasonally to players. 06:36:06 *And 06:36:11 heh 06:36:54 doy: are troves 0.6 content or will they be postponed? 06:38:08 !seen doy 06:38:09 I last saw doy at Wed Feb 10 09:48:04 2010 UTC (2h 50m 4s ago) saying ive never delved very far into the beam code(: on ##crawl-dev. 06:40:29 Not postponing them. :/ 06:40:33 Not after the work I've put into them! :( 06:41:16 due: joking :) 06:41:24 * due beats dpeg with a tsick. 06:41:28 dpeg: Oooh, look, trees! 06:41:38 * dpeg hates being beaten with tsick! 06:42:13 FR: tsicky flame 06:42:15 * dpeg beats himself with a proper stick. 06:42:34 * kilobyte smears a tsick with cat fur dust and waves it around. 06:42:57 kilobyte: we need to make progress on IOOD! 06:43:48 right. So, what shall we do with point-blank? Leave it as is? Use one of those ideas? 06:44:13 the rest, damage and accuracy, are just numbers, hard to balance but not requiring any brainstorming 06:44:51 yes on the latter 06:45:03 for point blank, should collect all ideas on the page 06:45:06 wait a day 06:45:11 and make a decision? 06:45:13 maky. 06:45:15 mkay 06:45:45 thanks 06:47:04 on a mildly related topic, I think the orb's movement in the first turn should be randomised 06:47:24 so that you have pretty much the same chance of the target stopping to hit it at any range 06:49:14 !tell pointless_ The Fedhas descriptions seemed good to me! 06:49:14 Keskitalo: OK, I'll let pointless_ know. 06:49:30 -!- stabwound has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:49:35 didn't kilobyte do that already? 06:50:07 I think so, too. 06:50:14 oh ok 06:50:21 pretty sure I saw commits to that effect. 06:51:58 TGW: In case you use cdo/trunk win builds for testing, I'm updating them now. 06:52:25 ok 06:52:56 hrm, how should I mark implemented parts on the wiki? Crossing out makes sense on TODO lists, not here. 06:53:08 Hmm...spl-util.cc is modified...what did I do to spl-util.cc... 06:53:14 kilobyte: what part of the wiki? 06:53:31 -!- stabwound has joined ##crawl-dev 06:53:35 ah, removed two debugs, and added a //FIXME 06:53:37 Hi stabwound! 06:53:42 I mean, lines of the plan that are already there. 06:53:42 'lo stabwound 06:53:54 kilobyte: striking out is completely okay 06:53:55 * kilobyte meows at stabwound. 06:55:00 kilobyte: Italics? Not sure if that's good, but I used that on the silverchaos page, a note on top explaining the use. 06:55:41 !lm ghost=stathol -tv 06:55:43 1. rob, XL14 OgPr, T:41295 (milestone) requested for FooTV. 06:58:28 !tv stathol char=spen place=d:15 06:58:28 1. Stathol, XL15 SpEn, T:47257 requested for FooTV. 07:00:12 !lm ghost=stathol -tv 07:00:12 1. rob, XL14 OgPr, T:41295 (milestone) requested for FooTV. 07:00:53 we definitely should rename you.your_level, since it's the most egregiously misnamed thing in the whole codebase 07:01:01 kilobyte: do it! 07:01:02 Would you.depth be a good name? 07:01:10 absdepth? 07:01:18 or that 07:01:55 there's a lua function by that name, lemme check what it does 07:02:55 returns you.your_level? :) 07:02:55 it returns you.your_level+1 07:03:00 aha! 07:03:12 I think absdepth is fairly descriptive 07:03:19 the shift by 1 is a nuisance, of course 07:03:31 (internally starting at level 0 is bad) 07:05:35 why? 07:05:41 arrays are 0-indexed :0 07:05:54 yay! my first merge conflict! 07:06:44 due: the inconsistency between internal and external representation is not good, I would think 07:06:52 (I am not a coder, do as you please) 07:07:52 :/ I don't think I understand the merge markers 07:09:06 Textmode: it's: common text <<<< text in one side ==== text in the other side >>>> common text 07:09:42 having C++ you.absdepth and lua you.absdepth do different things (shifted by 1) is an absolute no-no 07:09:51 yes 07:10:24 0-based depth is used in 53289734983578 places, though :( 07:11:39 I'll change it to you.depth, ok? 07:11:43 ok 07:12:13 sounds good; how about you.depth0 ? 07:12:24 The conceptual solution would be to start at DL 0 and XL 0 :) 07:14:57 dpeg, can I ask a little go-related question? :) 07:15:25 cbus: yes, do it in /msg 07:17:26 We should fix C++ depth to be 1-based at some point 07:17:31 It always trips new devs up 07:17:57 And naughty dpeg spamming me with messages :P 07:18:05 Henzell needs dupe elimination 07:18:24 dpeg denies cat allergy x3e8 07:18:28 ...this merge tool sucks, it can do everything *but save the merged file* 07:18:30 I'll use you.depth0 so we are reminded of this. 07:18:42 kilobyte: absdepth0 sounds better 07:18:57 It is an absolute depth, not a depth-in-branch 07:19:37 Textmode: Is that some demo version :P 07:19:49 "Haha, you spent 10 minutes merging, just pay $29.99 and you can save!" 07:20:15 Does git not create merge markers for conflicts on Windows? 07:20:16 greensnark: its from the repository, I imagine there is a away, but none of the obvious options seem to do anything useful... 07:20:25 :wq 07:20:34 * greensnark :wqs dpeg. 07:20:47 I'm going to spread a vicious rumour about dpeg being allergic to cats :P 07:20:49 is a way* 07:21:15 Textmode: can you copy everything and paste to another editor? 07:21:32 Textmode: and then drop that tool like a rotten potato 07:21:34 kilobyte: yeah, thats what I think I'll do. still though, wtf? 07:22:07 kilobyte: the stupid part is that its quite nice in general, even has git-intergration (to an extent) 07:22:18 just...can't save... 07:22:43 Textmode: there will be a way. What is the name of the tool? 07:22:52 "nubinia the Eclecticist (L19 SpAE), worshipper of Sif Muna, blown up themselves on Crypt:1" 07:22:55 Is that IOOD? 07:22:56 <3 07:23:01 most probably 07:23:02 Grammar fail in that message 07:23:14 "blew themselves up" would be better 07:23:25 !log nubinia place=crypt:1 07:23:25 1. nubinia, XL19 SpAE, T:75295: http://crawl.develz.org/morgues/trunk/nubinia/morgue-nubinia-20100210-061912.txt 07:23:38 Oh 07:23:41 That's morgue fail too :) 07:23:42 crawl bug 07:23:49 -!- Vandal has joined ##crawl-dev 07:23:49 dpeg: meld 07:23:50 "blown up by themself"? 07:24:07 They had no IOOD 07:24:20 -!- kats has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 07:24:22 Weird death that 07:24:23 Ah. 07:24:31 WhoIOOD'd then? 07:24:35 zapping self with disint would also produce that 07:24:52 wait, "Blown up themselves (81 damage) 07:24:53 perhaps zapping self with random effects? 07:24:56 A spriggan would probably resist, though? 07:24:59 ... with a 07:25:10 Yeah, that death line in the morgue is epic brokage :P 07:25:22 can ccache speed up building a copy in a different directory? 07:25:24 "blew themselves up with a " 07:25:28 I gave up on Random effects a long time ago, somehow it always seems to buff hostiles, and blast allies... 07:25:47 Random effects is awesome 07:25:52 Just keep zapping :P 07:25:57 I am not too convinced on Random Effects either. 07:26:00 If nothing else, you will die hilariously 07:26:14 <3 random effects 07:26:16 greensnark: I'm a Xomite. 07:26:18 But it is fun with artificers, so that's good enough for me 07:26:24 by: yes, if the ccache is in a centralized directory (which it is per default IIRC) 07:26:24 I do give it a pass if I have more reliable options 07:26:25 And there are devs who like it :) 07:26:30 the tool is called meld. 07:26:51 clean checkout is compiling so slowly it appears to not be working here 07:27:05 hooray for compilatin. 07:27:23 Yeah, even my desktop takes close to 50s now :/ 07:27:42 !tv nubinia place=crypt:1 07:27:42 1. nubinia, XL19 SpAE, T:75295 requested for FooTV. 07:28:00 st_ on ##crawl points out that Boris and probably Frederick too also got IOOD when one of the (Ancient?) Lich spellbooks was changed to include it (iron shot was switched out). 07:28:17 Frederick IOOD will be darkly hilarious 07:28:31 Frederick should not get IOOD. 07:28:35 I'm undecided about boris. 07:28:37 I was thinking of giving it to one or the other explicitly 07:28:37 I vote that due whips up unique spellbooks for them with any changes he thinks are good. 07:28:48 Ahhh, why me? :( 07:28:58 You spoke last :P 07:28:59 Cause you do such cool uniques :) 07:29:01 Bah. 07:29:03 I'm sleeping! 07:29:12 I can maybe do it tomorrow. 07:29:14 * greensnark hands Keskitalo the ankus. 07:29:25 I was typing the suggestion before due spoke. :) 07:29:27 he should have sidestepped 07:29:29 I'll do it tomorrow unless it's done. 07:29:36 * Keskitalo ankuses due 07:29:44 s/k// 07:29:44 So what killed nubinia? I got distracted and missed the end :P 07:29:46 due: Great! 07:30:25 greensnark: watch it, fun 07:30:26 bbbut troves! 07:30:36 !tv nubinia place=crypt:1 07:30:36 1. nubinia, XL19 SpAE, T:75295 requested for FooTV. 07:30:40 Stop piling work onto due, he is close to collapsation! 07:30:45 Heh 07:30:50 TRoves are done 07:30:53 I shouldreally just merge. 07:31:03 But I have three things I want to change first. 07:31:32 due: If you are overloaded and don't find the task fun, I can try to think of something. 07:31:45 It's pretty easy :) 07:31:47 Also 07:31:56 Oh, enemy IOOD 07:31:56 I'm planning unique speech for every unique with generic speech. 07:31:56 awesome splat 07:32:00 Nice 07:32:01 wrong step :) 07:32:07 But misattributed 07:32:07 Preferably for 0.6, but perhaps not. 07:32:23 I wonder if stepping diagonally would have helped 07:32:36 Textmode: hm, meld a nice page but no documentation :) 07:32:38 Boris should definitely keep IOOD 07:32:43 I agree <3 07:32:44 by: yes, or blink 07:32:46 That was rockage 07:32:51 dpeg: heh 07:32:53 by <--> due 07:33:13 -!- kats has joined ##crawl-dev 07:33:14 regardless, I got past the merge 07:33:25 dpeg: blink? 07:33:39 due: yes, you can try to blink out of the way 07:33:42 Textmode: Ahaha, you think so, but observe: your feet are still in the Merge's deadly jaws! 07:33:51 he shouldn't definitely cast it point-blank 07:33:59 greensnark: :P 07:34:05 greensnark: Merge or Marge? 07:34:05 but that's already on the agenda 07:34:21 Presumably Textmode would not mind if his feet were in Marge's jaws. 07:34:36 kilobyte: what do you think of IOOD casting always producing the * next to the caster, before it starts moving? 07:34:44 "The [foo] conjures an orb." 07:35:00 "Boris pets his orb" 07:35:07 This would help with several aspects of the spell. 07:35:08 * due pets Boris's orbs. 07:35:11 "Boris says, 'Go get them, dawg!'" 07:35:20 dpeg: it does, and it even charges the orb the energy for moving out of your square 07:35:29 Sleep, night. 07:35:34 night Jude! 07:35:36 bye! 07:35:40 Nighty 07:35:47 * due puts on hisnighty. 07:35:52 bill nighty! 07:35:56 kilobyte: hm, perhaps I misunderstood. I meant that after casting it will look like ..@*.. 07:36:14 only in the next turn, the orb moves 07:36:36 so it's paralyzed for the whole next turn? 07:37:02 wait 07:37:14 alright, what was the command to export a patch? 07:37:19 would look silly, and be abusable (guaranteed blocker) 07:37:20 Turn 1: ...@... action: zap IOOD 07:37:24 Textmode: git format-patch 07:37:26 Turn 2: ...@*.. 07:37:35 Turn 3: ...@###* 07:38:05 kilobyte: you wouldn't know where it's placed .. the fuzziness 07:38:15 anyway, just an idea 07:40:28 the fuzz applies to direction mostly, even with the max error it would still be placed in the exact spot before you 07:41:32 that...seems to have done nothing... 07:41:40 03kilobyte * rbbe824de9cef 10/crawl-ref/source/ (37 files): Rename hilariously misnamed you.your_level to you.absdepth0. 07:42:56 "$git format-patch" seems to have done nothing useful... 07:43:41 you need to tell you where the patch is supposed to be based 07:43:51 in the simplest case, "git format-patch HEAD^" 07:45:01 "$git format-patch spellcolors"? 07:46:51 -!- Madtrixr has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:51:47 javelins are reported as overpowered on r.g.r.misc 07:54:19 The old Mystic Blast / Bolt of Cold / Invisibility / Animate Dead / Iron Shot / Invisibility for Frederick? 07:54:37 For Boris: Iron Shot / Bolt of Cold / Invisibility / Animate Dead / IOOD / Invisibility ? 07:54:54 Is Mystic Blast --> Iron Shot ok? 07:54:59 yes 07:57:41 @?? boris 07:57:42 Boris (05L) | Speed: 10 | HD: 22 | Health: 154 | AC/EV: 12/10 | Damage: 25, 1513(drain) | Flags: 07undead, evil, spellcaster, see invisible | Res: 06magic(322), 02cold, 10elec++, 03poison | XP: 7917 | Sp: mystic blast, b.cold, invisibility, animate dead, iron shot. 07:57:47 @?? lich 07:57:47 lich (15L) | Speed: 10 | HD: 20 | Health: 40-120 | AC/EV: 10/10 | Damage: 1513(drain) | Flags: 07undead, evil, spellcaster, see invisible | Res: 06magic(293), 02cold++, 03poison | XP: 3507 | Sp: b.cold, paralyse, greater demon, animate dead, iron shot, teleport self / b.draining, animate dead, summon undead, throw frost, crystal spear / b.fire, confuse, haste, b.draining, greater demon, banishment / mystic 07:59:08 boris IOOD is a bit too nasty, probably 08:00:27 This one changes enum.h. :/ 08:00:36 that did nothing, either. what am I missing? 08:00:38 8d17 v 3d37 08:00:55 but you can flee 08:00:58 and always hits at melee range 08:00:59 -!- Mu_ has joined ##crawl-dev 08:01:10 not sure if that's still the case 08:01:18 yes, me neither 08:01:42 but you really don't need to enter boris' melee range 08:02:07 true 08:02:27 Textmode: Try git format-patch origin ? 08:04:22 oh at least you can still destroy monster OOD 08:08:46 five patches, probably too many for due's liking :P 08:09:21 syllogism: not anymore! :p 08:11:13 kilobyte: oh forgot I hadn't updated after the change 08:11:47 hellfire ignoring ac nerfs ev :P 08:11:47 I think due had me turn a collection of patches into a single patch last time... 08:11:57 don't do that 08:16:12 03by * r5463a99a4f94 10/crawl-ref/source/files.cc: Give ghosts spellcasting flags. 08:16:21 03by * rdd9e1797b2c2 10/crawl-ref/source/ (beam.cc beam.h): Remove bolt::invisible(). 08:16:47 one line fix doesn't quite capture the time spent on tracking that one down 08:17:24 heh 08:26:54 03by * rcc8448919e73 10/crawl-ref/source/beam.cc: Remove ASSERT against bolt.name. 08:30:35 by: sounds like you're having fun, there? 08:31:09 Does anyone want me to do anything with this patch, or should I just hang on to it? 08:36:16 was that: "my patch is done, would someone like to apply it?" 08:36:30 by: yes, I think so. 08:36:32 in which case I'd suggest uploading it somewhere 08:36:43 or mailing it or whatever 08:36:45 Textmode: did you mention whatever is left open? 08:37:00 does metabolism use absolute time or relative time? 08:37:03 Textmode: plus a how-to on adding/changing spells/gods? 08:37:44 I added comments to the relevant functions (not that it isn't farily obvious) 08:38:40 Due had me reduce it to a single patch file, last time. I can't remember exactly how (did I reset the repo, and apply the patch, then re-export?) 08:38:53 no need to reduce 08:39:23 Comments <3 08:39:30 if you prefer, you can also push to github or so 08:39:49 if you want, I could write a seperate guide, but theres really not much too it... god_(likes|hates)_spell in religion.cc, and spell_is_(useful|useless) in spl-util.cc 08:40:09 Textmode: if it's clear enough, don't worry 08:40:12 Textmode: don't worry 08:40:18 there was one bug left, is taht mentioned somewhere? 08:40:30 a fixeme in the relevant function 08:40:35 fixme* 08:40:52 should be in the commit messages, too. 08:41:01 yes 08:44:11 @new fulsome: dancing is incredibly, incredibly tedious now 08:44:37 yeah, I think I'm behind the idea of reverting fulsome. 08:44:43 http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=296 08:44:49 since there's no cost to fizzling, you can dance it just as well but you have to intentionally miscast it 08:44:50 attached patch files. 08:48:05 Textmode: thanks, will apply 08:48:53 posted to the issue. 08:53:00 tell me if i f-ked up anywhere. 08:53:07 03dolorous * r68cbd3eda7b1 10/crawl-ref/source/food.cc: Add punctuation fix. 08:53:38 ouch IOOD is now pretty worthless in corridors 08:53:45 heh 08:54:19 what happened? 08:54:31 it doesn't always go straight 08:54:42 ...crashes into walls? 08:54:46 yes 08:54:49 heh 08:54:51 wha 08:55:00 syllogism: that was the intention 08:55:06 I know 08:55:08 yeah, I was about to say that. 08:55:32 <3 the list of test cases. Stasis doesn't do the "Prev. teleport" text on the % screen btw (as I think it should?() 08:56:48 -!- stabwound has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 08:56:59 -!- purge has joined ##crawl-dev 08:57:58 stasis sees to be a bit of an oddity. 08:58:07 seems* 08:58:15 zapping dig crashes the game 08:58:22 :/ 08:58:48 Keskitalo: it seemed like the only reasonable way to go about it. 08:59:37 (re: test cases) 09:00:09 syllogism: as of latest commit? 09:00:23 compiled 30 minutes ago 09:00:40 there was an ASSERT problem I fixed recently 09:00:53 34 minutes ago 09:00:56 ok 35 minutes ago :P 09:01:34 -!- stabwound has joined ##crawl-dev 09:01:40 Invisible Boris with IOOD <3 09:01:50 Keskitalo: slouch will work anyway? 09:02:21 Ah, that was local testing the books. 09:02:27 Kesk: have you gotten a chance to look at my dead tree tiles submissions? 09:02:28 Hmh, Boris blew up Frederick. 09:02:49 purge: I did glimpse, I though they looked good in the mock-up/screenshot. 09:02:54 they can still blow up themselves too 09:03:18 Keskitalo: Also, you can move http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=734 to unused and close that FR if you want 09:05:39 purge: the boxes? 09:06:11 Textmode: do you prefer that I note problems here or on the tracker? 09:06:35 03kilobyte * r631ba4818589 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-project.cc: Make the amulet of inaccuracy affect casting IOOD. 09:06:36 no preference. 09:06:59 not that anyone will wear inaccuracy by that point, but still... 09:07:13 mainly, for my taste there is far too much redundancy with the new god_{hates,likes}_spell 09:07:15 if its a lot, it might be better to note that there are issues (on the tracker) and give me the full list, but thats nether here nor there. 09:07:25 redundancy? 09:07:36 god_likes_spell should call vehumet_supports_spell 09:07:57 and if another god likes spells? 09:08:08 then there's god_hates_spell_type and friends in goditem 09:08:20 I didn't know about that function. 09:08:27 they could probably be merged... 09:08:45 still though, wtf is that doing in an item file? 09:08:50 http://sprunge.us/EMMM 09:09:12 that's what god_likes_spell could look like 09:09:37 having the same checks duplicated in different places is kind of bad; I realize that it can be hard to avoid 09:10:02 for example, there'll have to be a lot of redundancy with did_god_conduct unless we break up the huge switch there 09:10:17 and I won't suggest to do that 09:10:28 03Keskitalo * r6d29179dbd0e 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-spll.h: Code cleanup: Keep the spellbooks of uniques and other monsters separate. 09:10:29 yeah, the conducts and the support functions I wrote do over lap a lot. 09:10:36 03Keskitalo * r6cbc9c31d6cc 10/crawl-ref/source/ (enum.h mon-data.h mon-spll.h): Separate spellbooks for Boris and Frederick. 09:10:39 bare in mind this is my first patch. 09:11:10 I agree with switching in the vehumet function for the vehumet case in god_likes 09:11:27 yes, sure, I hope I'm not too critical 09:11:45 maybe a bit harsh, but they are valid points 09:12:27 does rub me the wrong way in thats its not how I'd do it, but then its not my project, so... 09:13:03 in my opinion duplication of logic should be avoided 09:13:12 personally, I was planning on following up with looking at intergrating the support functions I wrote more with the rest of the code, and eliminating some of the redundancy 09:13:31 that's a fine approach, too 09:14:10 a lot of it seems scattered in unusual places, like I never would have looked in an item header for a god/spell function. 09:14:46 other issues: Fedhas doesn't dislike all necromancy, but only those tha satisfy is_corpse_violating_spell 09:14:56 sure, it's a mess 09:14:59 by: but that's a newish change :) 09:15:09 yes 09:15:10 by: yeah, check the channel logs. 09:15:38 dpeg: yeah the chests 09:15:45 03j-p-e-g * r14a8b5a72006 10/crawl-ref/source/mutation.cc: On Vamp's mutation screen, don't say that bottling blood works with 'c'. 09:15:51 but if I apply as is, fedhas highlighting will be broken 09:16:21 originally it was necromancy, thenI was informed of the new rules for fedhas, and implemented that list of spells, then due reverted that because it wasn't in yet, and now its in. :) 09:16:39 so yeah... 09:23:55 well, maybe someone else wants to apply it like that -- I'll unassign the issue 09:24:20 by: please mention the changes that should be done! 09:26:45 aye. 09:33:11 is_chaotic spell? 09:34:05 that should be exactly what Zin dislikes 09:34:36 I never got a decent anwser to zins dislikes 09:34:51 read the code: did_god_conduct 09:34:55 yes, reusing current conducts is better than listing spells by hand (not that I'd have looked at the patch) 09:35:34 I have a stronger opinion there :) 09:35:54 is that the complete list of flaws? 09:36:00 by: than me? 09:36:06 dpeg: yes 09:36:23 by: well, you *are* a coder, so you actually know what you are talking about :) 09:36:25 -!- eith has joined ##crawl-dev 09:38:15 if you don't mind my saying so, these functions are all in semi-random files.. 09:38:53 Textmode: there are other deficiencies, though those may have been there all along: out-of-range colouring should not be redundant with _is_valid_target in directn.cc; more concretely, get_nearest_monster_dist should also check ballistomycetes (another recent change) 09:39:29 in that regard, I'm in line with the original code. 09:39:40 so really I only failed to upgrade it. 09:39:44 yes, I probably wouldn't have applied the range colouring patch either :) 09:40:02 the code is a huge mess, I agree 09:41:01 also, there should be a function that checks whether the player is prevented from teleporting, and that should be used almost everywhere that currently checks ARTP_PREVENT_TELEPORTATION 09:41:19 seconded there, that was a huge pain. 09:41:32 and still isn't working, you'll note. 09:41:47 surely I can't be the first that needed such... 09:42:49 I'll look into implementing player_prev_teleport 09:43:17 range colouring patch? 09:43:23 okay, I changed to using the vehumet function, switched to the corpse-check function for fedhas, is-chaotic for zin 09:44:02 dpeg: yeah, I'm not real clear on that. 09:44:29 What is it? 09:44:33 (also removed a random floating commented-out line) 09:44:49 dpeg: just saying that I'm more critical on patches I apply than on code that is already in 09:44:51 dpeg: no clue. something to do with range, and coloring. 09:45:15 ah, greying out spells you cannot cast for range reasons 09:45:23 by: which is probably a good idea 09:45:23 -!- lorimer has quit [Quit: test] 09:45:35 You are explaining nicely, so everything should be okay. 09:45:38 if this were not in, and someone gave me a patch to the current code, I would likely object to it 09:46:06 I'm not sure what to do about that range thing, though... 09:46:17 Textmode: just leave it as is 09:46:22 okay. 09:48:08 oh, item_blocks_teleport exists already 09:48:13 ... 09:48:52 ...does it work? 09:49:05 I'm sure it does; try it? 09:50:21 sure, why not. 09:50:53 -!- lorimer has joined ##crawl-dev 09:51:43 a lorry 09:53:51 meep? 09:54:29 by seems to be working, so thats one issue of the list. 09:56:27 tell me more about that range coloring patch? 09:56:38 might as well take a look at the damage... 09:58:01 I just mean that greying out a spell in the z screen should use the same checks that direction() uses for choosing the target 09:59:24 four jellies on D:2 seems a bit excessive 09:59:32 (jiyva altar) 09:59:52 what in the name of... 09:59:56 would there be any support behind luaing that to make it more reasonable? 10:00:02 by: what am I looking at? 10:00:50 TGW: that is reasonable 10:00:56 it is? 10:00:59 yes 10:01:05 how do you figure? 10:01:20 What do you want? 10:01:23 ow... 10:01:46 yeah, by. I'm going to take you up on your offer of not intergrating that right now :P 10:01:53 cap on the number of jellies equal to some function of absdepth? 10:02:07 A chance to pick up Jiyva in D:2? And there's four jellies? Phah. 10:02:13 I can't even get to the altar without dying, and I don't see how anyone could 10:02:18 it makes my head hurt, not that its indecypherable, but I'm having trouble wrapping my head around WHY!?! 10:02:30 (I say without looking at the altar of course. :)) 10:03:25 TGW: jellies are slow, sure you can get to the altar 10:03:32 keskitalo: .J. / J_J / .J. 10:04:34 one or two jellies are definitely not enough, and four are okay 10:04:50 ah, I see _get_dist_to_nearest_monster is old; I thought your patch introduced that 10:05:31 nope, I reffed it out of the old spellcasting menu code. 10:05:32 -!- by has quit [Quit: later] 10:05:42 ah, I know what confused you, though 10:05:50 TGW: there are plenty of overflow altars which aren't reasonable to get to if they show up on D:2 10:05:50 doy: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 10:05:54 its one of the two functions I promoted, isn't it? 10:05:59 nothing wrong with coming back later for them 10:06:02 !messages 10:06:03 (1/1) greensnark said (4h 32m 9s ago): 0.6 branched yet? :P by said to ask you! 10:06:04 doy: hallooooo :) 10:06:18 and I think I might of moved at least one of tehm to a different file.. 10:06:28 (: 10:06:47 Textmode: not sure if that is a good idea -- you might confuse everyone 10:07:00 dpeg: was semi-nesscery. 10:07:22 dpeg: good seems to have come of it, though. seems they were redundant in the first place. 10:07:35 aha! 10:09:02 -!- lorimer has quit [Quit: re-rebewt to test] 10:10:13 dpeg, later, off to play go :) 10:10:20 dpeg: besides, I realised one of the problems with my first version was that I was being too "meek" in writting the patch 10:10:46 I was more agressive with version 2, and I think its the better for it 10:11:19 Textmode: yes, can easily be. This is somethign to be experienced, which I never did :) 10:11:33 heh 10:12:13 -!- lorimer has joined ##crawl-dev 10:13:39 We have a lorimered reboot 10:13:47 Or a rebooted lorimer, one of them 10:14:48 how do I export just the last patch? "$git format-patch -1"? 10:14:55 * lorimer pokes greensnark in the eye 10:14:58 \o/ i win! 10:15:06 Textmode: yes 10:15:08 Ow 10:20:26 yay! peppermints! 10:21:15 by: http://loveclub.pastebin.com/d6637680 10:21:16 -!- Zaba has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 10:21:37 wait, nm 10:21:43 by: ignore 10:21:52 i think thats wrong. 10:22:50 -!- Zaba has joined ##crawl-dev 10:22:50 -!- Zaba has quit [Changing host] 10:22:50 -!- Zaba has joined ##crawl-dev 10:25:45 oh my its a snark that is green 10:26:39 http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=296 10:26:47 but is this snark a boojum? 10:29:05 ?? boojum 10:29:05 I don't have a page labeled boojum in my learndb. 10:29:35 -!- pointless_ has joined ##crawl-dev 10:30:33 purge: 'The hunting of the snark: an agony in eight fits" http://www.gutenberg.org/files/13/13.txt 10:30:46 I am not a boojum 10:31:08 that's what they all say 10:31:09 I guessed as much, since we are all still here. 10:31:32 I have caused no disappearances of bakers 10:31:55 One meets so few bakers socially 10:32:04 :) 10:32:31 I have met several people who bake but are not professional bakers, and they appear undisappeared 10:37:23 * Textmode twiddles thumbs 10:41:01 greensnark: did your DEHu get a decent amount of uniques finally? 10:42:02 * Textmode pokes by 10:44:24 03by * reeb389e5fdd9 10/crawl-ref/source/tilepick.cc: Fix crash in _finalise_tile for out-of-bounds cells. 10:45:11 Textmode: you want to use god_hates_spell_type 10:45:11 pointless_: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 10:45:16 !messages 10:45:17 (1/1) Keskitalo said (3h 56m 3s ago): The Fedhas descriptions seemed good to me! 10:47:05 Hmm... 10:47:25 pointless_: Eino is right, they're very nice. 10:47:33 thanks 10:48:00 what is this doing in goditem.cc is my question :/ 10:50:27 does Kiku still prevent Ne miscasts? 10:53:10 no idea 10:53:23 I am completely out of touch with Kikubaaqudgha. 10:55:17 It doesn't say so on ^, and I gave myself red glow in wiz-mode by miscasting animate dead at 200 kiku piety, so I guess not. 10:55:34 So the question is should Ne spells be highlighted as 'good' for kiku worshipers 11:01:54 ...can you animate butterfly corpses? 11:02:16 legion of joyous doom! 11:04:34 Kiku never stopped the standard miscast glow 11:04:42 -!- stabwound has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:07:14 -!- eith_ has joined ##crawl-dev 11:07:36 -!- eith_ has left ##crawl-dev 11:08:59 -!- stabwound has joined ##crawl-dev 11:10:17 -!- eith has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 11:11:17 oh Kiku still does protect you from necromancy miscast effects 11:11:46 -!- yobbo has left ##crawl-dev 11:12:47 -!- eith has joined ##crawl-dev 11:13:39 purge: Not too many uniques, but that DEHu is still gathering dust 11:13:45 I was waiting for the targeting changes to settle 11:14:00 There were some maddening --more-- prompts the last time i played 11:15:07 So the line about kiku protecting you from death magic was removed from ^ at some point, but the protection from necromancy miscast effects is still there 11:16:27 well, necro miscasts != death magic 11:16:50 sorry, i mean ~=. I'm a luaite :) 11:17:11 but the protection also works against mummy curses and zot trap necro effects 11:17:30 Well there should be something there even if the protection from death magic isn't the right line 11:18:09 pointless_: yes 11:18:21 pointless_: a hint at mummy curses? 11:19:18 I don't know, I'm just looking back through some e-mail right now to try and see if the intention was to remove the miscast effect protection 11:19:33 pointless_: might be best to send a mail to the list and ask 11:19:50 That's probably simpler 11:28:28 swiftness increases levitation speed, does it affect Fly speed, too? 11:29:18 Fly increases Swiftness speed, levitation does not :) 11:29:32 green: sorry for the message spam, btw. Some of it was more relevant at the time it was sent :) (And I thought it'd be counter-intuative to send you a message apologizing for the message spam!) 11:30:11 oh, easily corrected 11:30:20 That's fine. In any case, the naughty persons were due and dpeg. 11:30:32 I'm still plotting my revenge on dpeg. 11:30:38 !tell dpeg greensnark is being naughty again. 11:30:38 dpeg: OK, I'll let dpeg know. 11:30:46 So far I've filled up three large A1-sized charts 11:31:13 I am packing a parcel for Bangalore, 150 lbs of good German stones. 11:31:13 dpeg: You have 4 messages. Use !messages to read them. 11:31:15 The initial elements of my plan involve cats to prey upon dpeg's legendary allergy to cat fur. 11:31:36 oh, it itches 11:31:41 -!- Twinge- has joined ##crawl-dev 11:31:50 I haven't sent the cats yet, hang on 11:32:32 * dpeg happily awaits pussycats for tomorrow's breakfast. Yummy! 11:32:44 toasted or boiled? 11:33:15 Oh, so you're the real cateater. 11:33:20 The other person was just a poseur 11:33:43 Using apportation through trees gives "translucent wall" message (http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=755) by minmay 11:34:09 -!- Twinge has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:35:16 Yay edge cases involving trees. 11:35:34 Using apportation through trees should have a chance of fetching a log 11:35:46 "WHAMM! A log hits you in the teeth!" 11:35:48 We should add a transparent tree wall type imo. 11:35:52 yes 11:35:57 Glass trees 11:36:05 They'll become the new favourite for vaults overnight 11:37:22 wirey trees? 11:38:21 okay, thats the overlap of god_hates_spell/god_hates_spell_type 11:38:29 what was the other one? 11:40:45 Was there another one? 11:42:42 the oppisate? wasn't there one that overlapped with likes_spell? 11:43:30 by mentioned using vehment_supports_spell, I don't know that there is a function that checks 'favored' status of spells beyond that 11:43:31 03by * r6a4ec461d699 10/crawl-ref/source/spells4.cc: Fix apportation mentioning translucent walls falsely (#755). 11:43:44 *vehumet 11:44:13 I did that already...but I'm fairly certain I'm missing one that was pointed out eariler... 11:45:57 Since crossbows seem like decent things to hit guys with now (at least early) they should have a "really attack with..." prompt 11:46:21 even time you switch weapons to butcher you have to do it again 11:46:27 s/even/every 11:46:42 s/should/shouldn't 11:49:49 I don't think I can even remember seeing a X-bow... 11:50:31 -!- Twinge has joined ##crawl-dev 11:50:51 Dwarven hunters/marksmen start with them 11:51:29 hmm, I should try that at some point, then 11:53:06 -!- Twinge- has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:58:34 03dolorous * r880c1fba978b 10/crawl-ref/source/godwrath.cc: Properly mark undead animated by Kiku's wrath as gifts of Kiku. 12:00:01 someone needs to update serpent-scourge 12:00:23 its description has "grey snakes" 12:01:16 also, considering it's a venom whip of rP it really should be another snake type anyway 12:01:30 (since grey snakes are nonvenomous and have no rP) 12:02:18 It says anacondas in master, but I agree about the unsuitability of venom brand and anacondas. 12:02:27 oh ok 12:02:40 TGW: file? 12:02:45 I also dislike all randart names that involve god names and branch names, eugh 12:02:52 grumble grumble 12:03:05 greensnark: all of them? 12:03:09 Yes 12:03:17 But this is obviously subjective :P 12:03:18 even Xom's Discontent? 12:03:20 ??apropos randarts 12:03:20 apropos randarts[1/4]: i - the ring of Xom's Flight of Fancy {MUT +Lev SInv} 403 gold 12:03:21 Yes 12:03:35 tangentially related 12:03:41 ??unapropos randarts 12:03:41 Every two-bit randart is of Xom's Regard and Sif Muna's Idiocy and similar 12:03:41 I don't have a page labeled unapropos_randarts in my learndb. 12:03:43 aw 12:03:56 And I saw a hammer of the Shoals :P 12:04:07 The Shoals demand at least a great mace, not a lowly hammer :P 12:04:09 ??apropos randarts[2] 12:04:09 apropos randarts[2/4]: the +1 scale mail of Okawaru's Supremacy {god gift} 12:04:16 greensnark: just reduce the weight :) 12:04:21 doy: judging by [2] those also go in apropos 12:04:26 (: 12:04:44 dpeg: No worries, they don't annoy me that much :P 12:04:45 There could be hueristics to make them match the name more =) 12:04:50 I like to have things I can complain about! 12:04:55 Twinge: patch! 12:04:59 But that don't bother me overly :P 12:05:08 greensnark: so glass and randart names are good sources! 12:05:10 Like orcs' dialogue! 12:05:14 twinge: i am very much opposed to that 12:05:20 Aieeeeeee! He mentioned glass 12:05:31 I was saving glass up for some other day's complaining 12:05:43 dpeg: Sounds too controversial. I better work on aptitudes and monster spawn depths instead. 12:05:52 Well, I will counter with pizzas. Cannot stand pizzas. 12:06:19 * greensnark gives dpeg a pizza with cat fur topping. 12:07:15 pizza is only anachronistic if it's pineapple 12:08:03 Average game turncount for both servers combined is 4429 12:08:25 Napkin: You around? 12:08:37 which server has longer games? 12:08:41 greensnark: can we get an avg collector for !lg, similar to 'x'? 12:08:42 greensnark: this means that the game is too easy. 12:08:43 With ref to the earlier discussion on saving timestamps every X turns 12:08:59 what happens if you remove mummies and quits? 12:09:08 doy: Yes, but avg tends to kill the db :/ 12:09:17 -!- kats has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:09:30 greensnark: lame 12:09:33 I propose saving timestamp every 100 turns so that FooTV can seek to arbitrary turns 12:09:45 greensnark: yes! 12:09:53 I would appreciate that insanely much 12:10:24 Assuming each timestamp is 8 bytes, that's 355 bytes of overhead for the average game 12:10:28 Napkin: What do you think? 12:10:35 We'd stop recording timestamps at say turn 600k 12:11:05 Which means maximum size of the timestamp file would be ~48k 12:13:47 reee 12:13:52 <3 12:13:56 what's up? 12:14:00 Hallo Napking! 12:14:12 Hi :) 12:14:35 03Keskitalo * r9efc26e667ae 10/crawl-ref/source/item_use.cc: Make silver hurt the player according to player_is_shapechanged(). 12:14:38 Napkin: Are those file sizes ^^ okay for the turn timestamp files? 12:15:06 per each tty-recording? 12:15:11 Per game 12:15:16 Not per ttyrec 12:15:20 ok 12:15:42 doesn't sound like too much 12:15:47 Cool! 12:16:00 i should could morgues to know how much it would use up? 12:16:06 anyways, dinner :D 12:16:09 bbl o/ 12:16:12 Ciao :) 12:16:12 *count 12:16:41 Oh, drat. your_level was renamed breaking what I'm working on ;( 12:16:42 -!- kats has joined ##crawl-dev 12:16:57 Napkin: how do you think we should handle cdo for splitting off the 0.6 branch? 12:18:51 -!- kats has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:18:53 -!- kats has joined ##crawl-dev 12:18:53 CDO should probably run the 0.6 branch until release for playtesting 12:19:17 Once 0.6 is branched :) 12:19:23 -!- by has joined ##crawl-dev 12:19:29 "Are we there yet?! How about now?!" 12:19:37 should we add an extra entry in dgl for it? or should it just replace master for now? 12:19:54 has 0.6 been branched yet? :) 12:20:04 I'm trying to remember what Napkin did for previous releases 12:20:37 branching here, branching now 12:21:29 Twinge: it is absdepth0 now 12:22:30 dpeg: Yeah I caught that, probably an easy quick fix 12:23:35 also, who knows what the actual weights for jiyva altar slime entries and shields of reflection are supposed to be? 12:23:45 Keskitalo does 12:23:54 Serpent-scourge should not use anacondas (http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=756) by TGW 12:23:54 k 12:23:55 I do! 12:24:16 What should serpent scourge use, black mambas? 12:24:22 sounds reasonable 12:24:34 serpent-scourge? 12:24:46 should add commit ids for the temporary changes to the wiki 12:24:48 oh an unrandart 12:25:53 serpent-scourge sounds like it should have a unique serpentbane effect 12:26:15 in any case, if someone wants to fix those autoexplore issues sometime today, i'll do the branching tonight 12:26:32 Hooray branching 12:26:47 Are the autoexplore issues tagged with the 0.6 target thing 12:27:05 probably not 12:27:10 nobody seems to use that tag 12:27:18 I'll give the ~ a try 12:27:24 I think only by does :) 12:27:42 couldn't we recycle existing autoexplore behaviour? 12:27:43 I introduced it, it wasn't taken up 12:27:53 I think it's a good idea 12:28:00 by: yes, you have to use LOUD WORDS and beat people into it. 12:28:07 But it does mean someone should triage issues 12:29:17 We should sic due on the flavour text of these unrandarts 12:29:50 We need to inject some artistic verisimilitude to these otherwise bald and unconvincing descriptions 12:30:30 So... 12:30:36 Someone has been editing art-data.h by hand 12:30:45 Someone naughty, in case I need to spell it out 12:31:44 Does corpse violating sound like necrophilia to anyone *else* :P 12:31:57 Why do you think it's forbidden? 12:32:03 how is art-data.h supposed to work? 12:32:08 It's autogenerated 12:32:13 from/by what? 12:32:15 how do I make a change show up in it? 12:32:16 From art-data.txt 12:32:20 ah hah 12:32:25 hmm... 12:32:34 I think zelgadis made it autogenerated 12:32:40 art-data.h should come with a huge disclaimer at the top -- does it? 12:32:44 Apparently the corpse flag is not recognised by his script 12:32:56 -!- by has quit [Disconnected by services] 12:32:56 -!- by_ has joined ##crawl-dev 12:33:04 It does have a disclaimer which I didn't read 12:33:11 pointless_: sigh :) 12:33:15 why is it even in version control 12:33:40 doy: good point, it shouldn't be modifiable in there 12:33:56 -!- raydarken has joined ##crawl-dev 12:34:02 autogenerated stuff shouldn't be in the repository at all, really 12:34:10 Aye 12:34:32 doy: can you remove it? 12:35:09 Also it's unfortunate that adding new flags implies editing art-data.pl in slightly nonobvious places :P 12:35:14 well, someone should fix the script to handle that corpse flag first 12:37:06 It is a good idea to keep the script? 12:37:55 yes, autogenerating data files like this is good 12:38:08 how obnoxious would it be to make the negine handle the file directly? 12:38:15 engine* 12:38:44 Textmode: you mean runniong the perl script automatically? 12:38:49 well I'll edit the script unless it turns out my perl skills are too feeble to handle it 12:38:55 dpeg: no, just parsing the text file 12:39:19 and if we're going to go that route, i'd rather just expose the unrand generation api to lua and define them that way 12:39:23 I assume the makefile runs the script to regen the file when needed 12:39:34 greensnark has been making noises about doing that for monsters for a while now d: 12:39:40 isn't perl a good way to deal with text files? 12:39:42 doy: doesn't sound like such a bad idea 12:40:01 and yeah, the makefile automatically runs the script to generate the header now 12:41:28 can anyone think of anything else I should change/fix in my highlighting patch? Otherwise I think I'm going to try this again... 12:42:13 -!- by_ is now known as by 12:44:19 My grand monster plan is to load monster defs from Lua :P 12:44:33 But it needs a fair stretch of clear thinking time to finish 12:45:10 is there an issue for ~ and autoexplore? 12:45:42 by: the only I can think of is whether we want a message when a ~ comes into view 12:45:44 by: nah, i think i was just whining about it on irc 12:46:02 dpeg: depends on if we want autoexplore to stop, or to just avoid it 12:46:15 That's the question! 12:46:22 does anything non-melee use ~? 12:46:41 some monsters have reaching 12:47:04 but they should be unsubmerged a turn earlier, I think 12:47:15 yeah 12:47:21 I think that's okay as long as you aren't walking past eels or something 12:47:31 TGW: yeah, pretty sure eels never submerge now 12:47:48 ~ is for "melee only, has not seen you, within a few squares?" 12:48:01 TGW: that is the intention 12:48:08 i don't know if all of that has been implemented though 12:48:09 TGW: melee only, is awaiting you 12:48:17 oh 12:48:29 oh, yeah, it can stay submerged after seeing you, until you come into range 12:48:39 other than that though 12:48:42 this is of relevance 12:48:53 because we don't want mean players to snipe the water fauna with spells 12:49:00 (: 12:49:09 I'd make autoexplore ignore it to a range of 3 12:49:12 I have the suspicion some players might do that. 12:49:22 TGW: that would be safe, yes. 12:49:30 Still, stopping/message when seeing a ~ ? 12:49:42 no 12:49:51 03greensnark * rf1904f13ada4 10/crawl-ref/source/ (art-data.h art-data.txt util/art-data.pl): [756] Serpent-scourge is now black mamba hide instead of anaconda hide (TGW). 12:49:56 dpeg: don't think it's necessary 12:49:57 could also be message, not stopping 12:50:00 TGW++ 12:50:15 I normally don't add (xxx) attribution for Mantis issues, but seeing this was TGW, I just had to 12:50:19 :P 12:50:46 I am tempted to make a commit with message. "Do not change early Jiyva altar with four jellies. (TGW)" 12:50:54 Very Zen :P 12:51:07 Does a jelly have Buddha nature 12:51:08 does it let you commit nothing? 12:51:26 TGW: I could pair it with a spacing fix. =) 12:51:33 :P 12:51:47 Minor cosmetic fixes 12:51:50 greensnark: how, do you surmise, did Buddha get his lovely round belly? 12:51:53 git commit --allow-empty 12:52:04 doy's to the rescue! 12:52:34 greensnark: I think you should tell your compatriots that Buddha and Jiyva are one and the same thing. 12:52:37 Not the other. 12:53:30 For some reason I cannot fathom, this script checks whether it has write access to artefact.h 12:54:13 am I going to get in trouble if I make the spacing in field_type in art-data.pl uneven? 12:54:16 Why is it writing to artefact.h?! 12:54:39 pointless_: Feel free :P 12:54:44 I already did :P 12:54:54 pointless_: The spacing policy will undoubtedly get you. 12:55:05 *police 12:55:06 s/policy/police/ 12:55:20 Spacing police, arrest this man 12:55:28 art-data.pl adds trailing whitespace! 12:55:33 Apparently 12:55:36 whose fault is that d: 12:55:43 It's creator's :P 12:55:43 greensnark: radiohead? 12:55:47 *its 12:55:51 purge: Yes! 12:56:41 Serial spacing crimes! 12:57:04 now we know why zelgadis hides all the time 12:57:46 Oh, it also adds enum constants to artefact.h 12:57:47 Who knew 12:58:31 I don't really like scripts that modify parts of files that humans edit 12:58:45 We should make it write to a new file altogether 12:58:50 yes 13:01:26 03by * r1d0976223641 10/crawl-ref/source/misc.cc: Make i_feel_safe take into account exposed monsters (~). 13:02:24 can someone check this is ok for autoexplore + submergers? 13:04:11 re submergers, I think they still flee and submerge, no? 13:04:35 by: don't know about fleeing, but they have to submerge when you leave their range 13:05:13 i wonder if giving that a two or three turn delay would make the situation a bit better 13:05:43 doy: it would make it worse?! 13:05:50 why? 13:05:58 the mean players with their spells 13:06:07 dpeg: they flee, and submerge when not next to you anymore 13:06:18 by: good! 13:06:29 are shark fins in yet 13:06:37 dpeg: well, the current state basically means that pure casters can't kill things like sharks at all 13:06:38 ah, so the proposal wasn't meant to allow you to kill them 13:06:41 doy: and if you give players two turns to shoot, they will do so. Even if it's annoying. 13:06:47 doy: so be it. 13:07:01 doy: it is better than the other way around 13:07:11 melee users can't either, unless they drive them into corners 13:07:13 perhaps they could stay unsubmerged if confused or so. 13:07:14 okay i guess 13:07:16 but I guess that's ok 13:07:30 it would mean that water creatures are a completely new type of threat 13:07:32 I know 13:07:35 We' 13:07:38 ll have to see 13:07:55 Eronarn: no, is not in 13:12:09 by: would it be hard to make unknown granite statues stop autoexplore? 13:12:18 -!- stabwound has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:12:26 I think this would solve the fog vault issues. 13:14:34 dpeg: i wonder if water monsters in shallow water should be attackable even when submerged. It's not very deep water. 13:14:42 -!- lorimer has quit [Quit: once more, with feeling] 13:14:51 think it's described as up to your waist or something 13:14:57 Eronarn: this is a gameplay issue, nothing about realism 13:15:11 If you can attack monsters while they cannot attack you, that's b ad. 13:16:19 dpeg: oh, this would work in both directions - as an alternative to monsters needing to surface to bite you. 13:17:02 Hm, I cannot see that. If you make a detailed proposal, we can discuss it, but I wouldn't change the mechanic for 0.6. 13:17:13 -!- stabwound has joined ##crawl-dev 13:17:39 I kind of like the idea of monster size factoring in; large creatures like sharks could be seen in shallow water even a few steps away :) 13:17:51 (Probably not for 0.6. But would be neat IMO) 13:18:09 -!- lorimer has joined ##crawl-dev 13:19:41 But seriously, spiked giant clubs used to be as good as executioner's axes which was insane for a common weapon, and they made it way better in the trunk. Spiked giant clubs and large rocks are like consolation prizes for trolls and ogres to make up for not being able to wear/dodge poo poo. 13:19:57 Gently caress spiked clubs 13:21:30 yeah, bring back board with nail 13:21:42 And two by fours 13:26:01 -!- kats has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 13:26:16 <3 board with nail 13:27:36 can they be enchanted? 13:28:01 I think the original submergers proposal also mentioned that they should never flee, apart from meaningful ones, like kraken. 13:28:10 dpeg: <3 13:28:31 randart board with nail Xom's Champion {MUT TELE} 13:30:22 due: hey? 13:30:50 due is asleep. 13:31:19 apparently, the human failed to die for st_ 13:31:41 These tough humans 13:31:53 Got to admit their never-say-die spirit 13:32:06 greensnark: well, he was clearly enjoying his glass cage 13:32:08 it's hacked to hp:10 though 13:32:34 hack it to hp:1? 13:32:36 with no equipment, and then it's bathed in miasma for four turns or something 13:32:38 It is a problem with the quality of the miasma cloud. They don't make them anymore like they used to. 13:32:43 :P 13:32:49 doy: then the human would die right away -- no fun. 13:32:50 Yeah, cheap mass-produced modern miasma 13:32:57 doy: way less cool 13:32:57 from China! 13:33:11 same reason I want to be able to make a corpse instead of just placing the zombie when the human dies 13:33:18 the best solution is to keep the miasma going until he drops 13:33:50 or, also good: bail out if the human does not die, just leave him there 13:34:23 I was thinking more along the lines of "kill the human manually" 13:34:26 but I don't know if you can do that 13:34:28 dpeg: The code needed to have the statues in fog vaults is in there. They can be marked in vaults as stoppers, and even described as "covered in warnings" or so. Making unknown granite statues would mean lots of travel stopping in vaults where they really are just decoration. 13:34:55 Keskitalo: so we should be able to solve all fog problems by hand now? 13:35:19 Keskitalo: if so, could you send a mail to c-r-d with directions? I can look into this later. 13:35:56 "covered in warnings" is way too lame -- "sprinkled with unusual amounts of blood" 13:36:05 dpeg: I don't know how it's done, I just know Matthew added the necessary code. :) 13:36:15 dpeg: Hehe, that's true. 13:36:33 "containing very interesting pornographic drawings" 13:36:40 -!- kats has joined ##crawl-dev 13:36:41 dpeg: But I can look it up and even do it, I should have the time tomorrow and Friday. 13:36:46 Keskitalo: anybody knows how to do it? Are there examples? 13:36:47 The tiles pickup menu is rather nicely done 13:37:10 greensnark: I think the tiles people have hired professionals, those cheaters. 13:37:22 Keskitalo: that would be very helpful, I am somewhat burdened. 13:37:43 Serpent scourge is almost impossible to see against the floor background 13:40:51 by: hmmm, now ~ stops autoexplore with the message "Not with this strange disturbance nearby!" 13:40:54 which is kinda odd 13:43:59 Keskitalo: it may help that the fog vaults are grouped together 13:46:24 -!- kats has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 13:49:10 -!- kats has joined ##crawl-dev 13:50:02 dpeg: I can dig up the commit messages etc; due has probably done at least something similar enough in his vaults. :) 13:50:29 Keskitalo: okay, that should enable us to achieve this 13:50:49 Keskitalo: can add you and me to the 0.6 page for the topic, if you want 13:51:27 -!- Twinge- has joined ##crawl-dev 13:52:19 Is this sensible: http://pastebin.ca/1792945 13:53:13 -!- Twinge has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 13:53:42 dpeg: Okay, I added. 13:53:48 thanks 13:55:36 -!- Twinge- has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 13:57:31 -!- Twinge has joined ##crawl-dev 14:04:25 Heh, it feels been so long since I did any levels. And I also think I've never used markers before. 14:06:06 Hmm, a 6.2% reduction on D:1 goblins/kobolds/rats/bats/hobgoblins. Seems good; probably all I can do with D:1 without introducing a new monster or something 14:06:52 I got TGW's kiku altar again, this time the human died but didn't get animated 14:07:03 st_: did it leave a corpse? 14:07:06 it needs to leave a corpse 14:07:21 right, no corpse 14:07:22 doy: st_ what happened when the human did not die? 14:07:40 --doy 14:07:42 it just stood there 14:07:49 seems like the human would always die, at least eventually 14:07:50 I think that's perfectly okay. 14:07:52 did it make any miasma? 14:08:01 TGW: it can be lucky? 14:08:13 how's that? 14:08:24 it did, it was poisoned and slowed but got healthy a few turns later 14:08:30 huh 14:08:39 lucky human! 14:08:54 TGW: he did leave a corpse for me but didn't produce a zombie 14:09:00 kilobyte: buh 14:09:13 this is confusing because it worked for dpeg and I 14:09:15 We can play with the hp setting (currently 10) to make it die more often, but I like that sometimes the human survives and sometimes leaves no corpse. 14:09:16 dpeg and me 14:09:25 and the autoexclusion stays even though the cloud is temporary 14:09:27 TGW: I got a dying human with corpse, so full action. 14:09:35 kilobyte: that's not so good 14:09:50 I can guarantee the human dies at the right time 14:09:55 Zaba: I read your comments on the description.s 14:09:56 I'm more worried about the reanimation failing 14:09:58 Zaba: you here? 14:10:05 kilobyte: did you wait around a few turns? 14:10:14 TGW: do we have reports where there was not reanimation with corpse? 14:10:20 dpeg: kilobyte 14:10:31 kilobyte: corpse, no zombie? 14:10:39 TGW: yes 14:10:45 ok 14:10:47 :/ 14:11:03 TGW: need to make a test run, 20 humans 14:11:07 TGW: can you do it? 14:11:08 does anyone present know lua better? 14:11:11 I could 14:11:15 !seen zaba 14:11:16 I last saw Zaba at Wed Feb 10 16:22:50 2010 UTC (3h 48m 26s ago) joining the channel. 14:13:08 -!- kast has joined ##crawl-dev 14:13:18 -!- kats has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:14:03 test 1: death, corpse, reanimate 14:19:25 of ten trials, numbers 1, 2, 4, 8 and 10 produced a corpse and a zombie 14:19:33 while the other five killed the human but produced no corpse 14:19:47 sounds goo 14:19:48 d 14:22:41 TGW: http://crawl.develz.org/ttyrecs/KiloByte/2010-02-10.10:40:14.ttyrec around turn 1239 14:22:42 one of the non-corpse trials killed the human slowly enough that I don't think it would have zombified though 14:22:56 that might be what happened to kilo 14:23:30 he died almost instantly 14:23:31 TGW: I think it's okay, as long as it'S rare enough 14:23:32 http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=296 14:23:37 what about this version? 14:23:40 dpeg: I can fix it 14:23:45 seems to be just okay, I'll make a comment 14:23:50 maybe 14:23:54 TGW: but why? Some little randomness is good. 14:24:11 TGW: you can say MONS: human hp:1 14:24:11 TGW: we could lower health to 9 and have the zombification trigger later? 14:24:16 kilobyte: no 14:24:30 hmm 14:24:36 is there a way to just kill a monster? 14:24:45 kilobyte: no, then there is no suffering 14:25:03 I think it's okay that the human won't die all the time. 14:25:10 TGW: give the message, remove the monster, place the zombie 14:25:13 It's our version of Schrodinger's cat :) 14:25:25 kilobyte: that's what due wanted to do and it's lame 14:25:31 yeah 14:25:34 time is my bff 14:25:37 the iood nerf is pretty nice 14:25:38 just leave it like now 14:25:45 bff? 14:25:58 dpeg just accepted a NetHackism! 14:26:00 why? The human still dies, but doesn't do this using the hp loss mechanics but an instant effect. 14:26:06 best friend forever 14:26:16 kilobyte: I mean "remove the monster, place the zombie" 14:26:49 it is just a little vault 14:26:52 I plan on removing the hack, figuring out how to kill a monster with lua, and tying the zombification to the human's death (with a delay) 14:26:59 which happens to be working, by the way =) 14:27:17 TGW: it's not worth it, imo 14:27:47 dpeg: I'm glad you value my time <3 14:27:47 Don't you see that the Kiku movie is much more interesting when the end is somewhat random? 14:28:07 TGW: sure I do! 14:28:54 the movie works in less than 50% cases 14:29:21 kilobyte: so we lower HP to 9 and try again, or increase the fog 14:30:14 "Kikubaaqudgha cinestars -- today: PAIN AND SUFFERING!" 14:30:48 I'll do that. 14:33:21 would anyone miss .lst and .map files from the morgue folder? 14:33:28 on CDO, that is 14:33:41 Napkin: what are they? 14:33:43 I would 14:33:46 .map, definitely not 14:33:49 it would be nice to keep them for a week or so? 14:33:49 Textmode: .lst is a list of every item 14:33:54 hmm... 14:33:58 .map is every level generated, I assume? 14:34:04 with hp 9, the human only lives one or two turns 14:34:35 what for, by? 14:34:50 .lst does not serve any productive purpose, except for people curiosity ("were those boots my spriggan got running?") 14:35:19 TGW: what is the 3 in dgn.place_cloud(_x, _y, "foul pestilence", 3) ? 14:35:24 dpeg: duration 14:36:00 Napkin: I could see the .map being useful with bug reports on occasion 14:36:06 TGW: thanks, so we simply increase that! 14:36:12 anyone know how to manually fry a monster? 14:36:20 okay, i went through and tagged appropriate bug reports with the 0.6 target tag 14:36:20 did you yet, by? 14:36:36 TGW: I am repairing the vault right now. 14:36:59 Napkin: maybe, don't know; I won't complain if you remove them 14:38:42 TGW: I have increased health to 12 and miasma duration to 4. Okay? 14:38:48 ok 14:39:07 I agree it would be nice to influence the corpse chance. But it's fully okay like this. 14:39:29 Extraneous . in long description when using lua:props_marker feature_description (http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=757) by evktalo 14:41:26 doy: what would you say about forbidding anyone but you to touch 0.6 between branching and release? One person doing all the commits would ensure there's no confusion about "was this commit applied?" 14:41:38 kilobyte: sounds reasonable to me 14:42:11 03dpeg * r4977ad0e8c77 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/variable/altar.des: Minor change to TGW's caged human kiku vault. 14:42:23 doy: what kind of message would you like for the disturbance? ideally in a format that would also fit monsters 14:43:15 grr, I left the testing PLACE in. 14:43:49 by: well, monsters that stop autoexplore just say "A foo comes into view." 14:44:00 by: you don't get the "Not with a" message unless you press o again 14:44:20 you do if you autoexplore close to a mimic, say 14:44:31 03dpeg * r47e6ee965807 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/variable/altar.des: Remove testing PLACE: D:1. 14:44:36 so "A strange disturbance comes into view." / "Not with a strange disturbance in view" would be reasonable 14:44:44 then it's "foo is too close for bar" 14:44:51 but it doesn't come into view 14:45:06 yes, that's the difference 14:45:21 but "A strange disturbance is too close for your liking" just sounds really weird 14:45:30 hehe 14:46:01 "A bad moon is too close for your liking" 14:46:21 not sure where the "too close for your liking" messages come in 14:46:59 by: that happens when a monster enters los without "coming into view", like if it starts out in los when you go down stairs 14:47:09 i think also if it turns visible 14:47:23 ah 14:47:25 -!- Amonchakad has joined ##crawl-dev 14:47:28 Hello 14:47:57 anyway, i_feel_safe currently only has "Not with ..." messages, but those could easily be changed to something else when interrupting travel 14:48:07 I just wanted to congratulate whoever added the "on death" message for a Fedhas worshipper. 14:48:16 It was some time since I laughed so hard. 14:48:26 That was pointless's genius. 14:48:33 Hats off to him,then 14:49:04 Yes, it is very good. 14:49:26 While I'm here, did anyone else notice some autoexplore glitches in the latest trunk or 2? 14:49:48 Amonchakad: there have been a couple in the past week or so, but i think they should all be fixed now 14:49:56 Ok,great 14:50:01 Amonchakad: there have been fixes, how recent? -- ah ok 14:50:09 Goodbye guys. Keep up the great work! 14:50:09 if you still find anything, feel free to file issues about them 14:50:15 bye! 14:50:22 Yeah,if I find anything big I'll create an issue 14:50:23 cheers 14:50:25 -!- Amonchakad has quit [Client Quit] 14:50:47 dpeg: you should look through the list of 0.6 bugs i made, make sure it looks sane 14:50:57 doy: tomorrow! 14:51:20 okay: 14:51:21 (: 14:51:35 -!- kast has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:55:41 !tell pointless_ People love your Fedhas death message :) Is it the same for all player species/forms? (Fedhas could be more happy about a beefy troll than a tiny spriggan. And mummies or bloodless vampires probably don't help the vegetation.) What about rarely creating toadstools from the player's corpse? 14:55:41 dpeg: OK, I'll let pointless_ know. 14:56:03 -!- kats has joined ##crawl-dev 14:56:22 dpeg: It's the corpse sacrifice message 14:56:22 pointless_: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 14:56:30 pointless_: I know this. 14:56:31 !messages 14:56:32 (1/1) dpeg said (51s ago): People love your Fedhas death message :) Is it the same for all player species/forms? (Fedhas could be more happy about a beefy troll than a tiny spriggan. And mummies or bloodless vampires probably don't help the vegetation.) What about rarely creating toadstools from the player's corpse? 14:56:37 I didn't think Undead could even worship Fedhas in the first place? 14:56:41 pointless_: but mummies leave no corpses. 14:56:53 undead can't worship fedhas 14:56:56 oh, sorry 14:57:01 Because they leave no corpses you see 14:57:04 :) 14:57:14 is there a gameplay reason? 14:57:35 not particularly, but it goes along with the anti corporeal undead conduct. If we add player shadows or something that might be ok 14:57:52 I imagine embalming a corpse would be a fedhas conduct violation, so mummies are clearly out 14:57:57 I am asking because it might be possible on day that undead worship good gods. 14:57:58 would "There are monsters nearby!", "There is a mimic nearby!" work in all cases? 14:58:11 by: I think so. 14:58:19 i.e., for preventing you from travel? 14:59:09 I'd be willing to let ghouls worship fedhas as long as decomposition insta-killed them 14:59:26 heh 14:59:40 pointless_: using the ability would instakill them? 14:59:51 it instant kills monster ghouls after all 14:59:53 is forbidding it as an unthinking act ok? 14:59:53 minced (L1 MuCK) escaped from the Abyss! <-- Gretell probably should not report L1 CK of Lugnou escaping the Abyss 15:00:02 ^ sorear 15:00:17 Twinge: henzell doesn't 15:00:39 POWDER shows turns after the player's death. Would be cool to see the toadstool spring from the player's corpse. 15:00:41 Twinge: gretell doesn't have the same set of ad-hoc filters because, historically, cdo hasn't had enough traffic for it to matter 15:01:08 about unthinking acts, people who don;t know a single spell should be forbidden to worship Sif 15:01:08 Ah. I thought it was being played even more these days =) 15:01:16 it is! :D 15:01:29 since she'll excommunicate you in a moment anyway, with no way to get piety 15:01:47 kilobyte: yes 15:01:54 she shouldn't accept you 15:01:59 kilobyte: abandoning gods after taking them should have near-zero penalty, as a general principle 15:02:04 could be a conduct -- "KNOWS SPELLS" 15:02:18 kilobyte: the wrath reform will make god mistakes easily fixable 15:02:23 sorear: but it's also good flavour 15:02:40 sorear: there will still be cases when you want to abandon early 15:02:43 Asking again - anything embarrassing in this? http://pastebin.ca/1792945 15:02:49 but Sif won't accept non-casters 15:03:11 by: message seems very robust 15:03:30 dpeg: Did the explore stoppers. 15:03:35 yay 15:03:57 03by * r28b47741362f 10/crawl-ref/source/misc.cc: Make i_feel_safe messages more generic. 15:04:02 Keskitalo: the 'static' in the int definition 15:04:35 does IOOD have to be white/gray? It could look a bit more menacing 15:04:42 If I hadn't killed my NaTm off, I probably wouldn't have gotten this done today. :) 15:04:50 Keskitalo: :) 15:05:07 IOOD should be flashing magenta! 15:05:23 doy: Thanks! 15:06:00 @?? orb of destruction 15:06:01 orb of destruction (16*) | Speed: 30 | HD: 5 | Health: 50 | AC/EV: 0/10 | Flags: 11non-living, lev | Res: 13magic(immune), 04hellfire+++, 12cold+++, 10elec++, 09poison+++, 08acid+++ | XP: 0. 15:06:06 Keskitalo: looks fine; I'd check "victim == &you" instead of victim->atype() != ACT_MONSTER 15:06:31 03greensnark * raaeaf071773a 10/crawl-ref/ (7 files in 4 dirs): Remove autogenerated art-data.h, rltiles/dc-unrand.txt and rltiles/tiledef-unrand.cc from repository. 15:06:42 since the code is not totally actor-generic anyway, with how_mutated() and player_is_shapechanged() 15:07:12 doy: ..I confused static and const, actually.. 15:07:22 (: 15:07:31 by: Thank you! 15:07:44 That looks much neater. 15:07:45 declaring random automatic variables like that as const is mostly a waste of time anyway 15:08:11 I like const declarations 15:08:26 They tell you you don't have to worry about the value being changed 15:08:34 Which makes life easier in Crawl's gnarly code 15:08:47 Of course, it does assume nobody plays silly buggers with the const variable 15:10:19 In fact in some absurdly long functions, I used to figure out if something changed a variable midway by making the variable const and looking for compile errors 15:10:27 similaryly, if mons_cast_noise had had const bolt and monsters parameters, it would have been easier to figure out 15:10:28 This is often much faster than other ways of understanding such functions 15:10:51 (just kidding with that last) :P 15:11:08 Ooh, someone rewote monst_cast_noise? <3 15:11:18 unfortunately, the monster can't be const because it calls out to lua 15:11:34 nothing major, just moved code out into sub-functions and fixed bugs 15:11:35 Oh, casting noises use Lua? 15:11:46 very indirectly 15:13:01 how about we just rewrite Crawl in a pure language 15:13:16 or maybe that was something else, and it was just the call to handle_seen_interrupt that caused problems 15:13:31 sorear: get started 15:13:45 sorear: Yeah, you're the Haskell guru, not me :) 15:14:05 The monad hits! 15:14:13 You feel uplifted 15:14:13 syllogism, greensnark: there are other '*'-glyph monsters, and they tend to be among most dangerous ones; I'd prefer to keep IOOD distinct from these 15:14:14 I'd prefer crawl to be written in Haskell 15:14:20 And I thought sorear meant assembler. 15:14:29 agree with kilobyte 15:14:42 how does that leave white as the only option 15:15:20 red, green, and cyan are taken 15:15:21 of course it doesn't, but flashing colours are likely to cause confusion 15:15:31 could still use magenta 15:15:51 Ma-gen-ta Ma-gen-ta! 15:15:57 The people have spoken 15:16:00 :P 15:16:05 i don't really have an opinion d: 15:16:13 I like magenta :) 15:16:19 lightcyan actually 15:16:35 I'll just use mon_glyph = orb of destruction:random anyway 15:16:49 Iskenderun like's magenta too 15:16:54 actually ETC_MAGIC, used for the trail, doesn't conflict with any of those 15:17:01 but would be an utter fruit salad 15:17:08 likes* :P 15:17:21 kilobyte: hmmm, could try that out 15:17:21 I like the white orbs. 15:17:21 hrm, putting iood in the knowledge bot doesn't show its tile 15:17:31 dpeg: You also like the white stairs in the X map :P 15:17:34 the white orbs look fine when you are casting them 15:17:37 So obviously your taste cannot be trusted :P 15:17:40 but not when it's a monster 15:17:43 but: bikeshed. And kilobyte is the IOOD man. 15:17:52 Yeah 15:17:56 Agreed 15:18:12 * greensnark hands dpeg a cat in commemoration of this historic agreement. 15:18:35 * dpeg gives greensnark a white staircase in return. 15:18:48 My plan is to have the whole world believe dpeg is allergic to cats by 2011 15:18:53 By means of simple repetition 15:19:06 I bet dpeg himself will be convinced of this by 2011 15:19:13 My plan is to start with "cats only" diet by 2011, too. 15:19:15 I just tried magenta, and it makes orbs hide in their trail. 15:19:39 make orbs etc_magic '0' :p 15:19:52 sorear: I thought you use '0' for pan lords 15:20:09 I suppose it gives you a pleasant thrill to see a pan lord shooting toward you at speed 30 15:20:14 I thought the white * looked really neat when fired by invisible Boris. Though any colour might have looked great in that situation. 15:20:32 greensnark: I also use it for the orb of zot! 15:20:36 Ahh 15:20:53 might as well use it for everything 15:21:33 -!- stabwound has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 15:21:36 We need a simplerobin that sets all monster glyphs to '.' 15:21:44 Or a zenrobin or whatever 15:21:48 What about reversing the order of the demons, so that 5 are the baddest ones? This way new players aren't spoiled about how many tiers there are. 15:22:03 1 looks way more dangerous than 5 15:22:04 d: 15:22:20 they'd get a heart attack when they see a 9 :p 15:22:20 doy truly lives in the past :P 15:22:23 that would be the one change that might force me to use some old_glyphs setting :P 15:22:34 haha 15:22:40 It would certainly play hob with glyph memory :P 15:22:45 the numbers are randomly assigned each game! 15:22:52 03kilobyte * re27bd1dd68c8 10/crawl-ref/source/religion.cc: No worshipping Sif when not knowing any spells. Also, give a message for necromutation. 15:22:54 Way worse than the old orc/orc warrior confusion 15:23:13 kilobyte: did you introduce a conduct for NO_SPELLS? 15:23:43 no, why? That would be an overkill. 15:23:53 Things can make the PC forget spells. 15:23:55 kilobyte: we can use that conduct in other places, as well. 15:23:57 it's not what you do, it's a state 15:24:22 Scott Bakker's Prince of Nothing series had spellcasters get tainted by a mark 15:24:24 if you lost all spells, you can learn them 15:24:28 yeah, conducts are only necessary for things which you can't calculate from the current gamestate otherwise 15:24:34 Which made them vulnerable to being turned into pillars of salt when hit by artefacts known as chorae :P 15:25:01 is Prince of Nothing worth reading. I read it for a bit and got distracted 15:25:07 It's decent 15:25:11 attach chorum to arrow, fire at ancient lich, giggle manically 15:25:18 -!- stabwound has joined ##crawl-dev 15:25:31 03Keskitalo * r685d84a81f6c 10/crawl-ref/source/item_use.cc: Make silver hurt players according to how mutated they are. 15:25:33 03Keskitalo * ra221e9a1dbbe 10/crawl-ref/docs/develop/levels/advanced.txt: Remove outdated info about loadmaps.lua. 15:25:34 03Keskitalo * r7ddaac0e84d4 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/ (3 files in 2 dirs): Use autoexplore stopper markers for Lemuel's fog generator vaults with statues placed for the purpose. 15:25:36 03Keskitalo * r00e6ae76a66e 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/variable/mini_monsters.des: Add warnings to the doors of a rotten minivault. 15:25:41 Keskitalo: <3 mutation+silver 15:26:10 reading John Wright's Golden Age right now, somewhat asimovian; I like it 15:26:22 Hmm, will try 15:26:35 three books but they are fairly short 15:28:26 Stathol's IOOD's kept missing :P 15:29:09 Silver damage caps at double; no horrific mutilation of heavily mutated vampires in bat form. 15:29:15 This is probably the crash dump involved in Sebi's runaway memory hogging: http://crawl.develz.org/morgues/trunk/Sebi/crash-Sebi-20100206-181107.txt 15:29:50 Napkin wasn't sure that that is the file, but it seems pretty likely 15:30:09 Sebi also has keymappings out the wazoo 15:30:34 -!- syllogism has quit [] 15:30:41 weapons have materials, now? 15:30:44 http://crawl.develz.org/configs/trunk/Sebi.macro 15:30:55 Textmode: Silver and steel are technically brands (and ammo only) 15:31:03 ah 15:31:12 and no comments on my pathc? 15:31:15 patch* 15:32:44 greensnark: I also have plenty of keymappings without ever changing anything there conciously 15:33:25 Yeah, so do I, apparently 15:33:30 Although I do add a few 15:33:49 Do we still have a default macro file lying around somewhere? 15:33:55 I thought we tossed it 15:35:08 Napkin: Where do the default macros come from? :) 15:35:17 there are default macros? 15:35:19 -!- by has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 15:35:22 Apparently! 15:35:27 i was unaware 15:35:46 There was a macro file in the repository in b26, I don't remember at what point it was removed 15:35:57 It was filled with the oddest keymappings :P 15:36:04 (: 15:36:36 rob has a hit_closest macro :P 15:36:49 (: 15:37:39 03dolorous * r4836fe468176 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/variable/ (entry.des mini_monsters.des): Add wording fixes. 15:37:40 03dolorous * r56594db2a18b 10/crawl-ref/source/religion.cc: Add more wording fixes. 15:37:51 Silver hurting players because they worship a chaotic god is probably too harsh. Comparing to holy wrath it's inconsistent. (Although thematically, HW is blessed by TSO, while silver "serves no-one" so to speak) 15:37:56 In any case, I suspect the macro code is what's causing the occasional Crawl process to balloon out of control 15:38:16 -!- Mu_ has quit [Quit: Defecator, may everything turn out okay so that you can leave this place.] 15:38:17 Keskitalo: yes, i don't like that one 15:38:42 I don't think player's is_chaotic check is used anywhere else, so I'll remove it for now. 15:39:10 All the rest are monster checks and there's no actor checks. 15:39:45 With holy monsters it'll get put right in of course. :] 15:41:00 Hmm.. the chaotic god worship check should probably be is_unclean(), which is what Zin cares about. 15:43:34 Arf, better leave this for another time. 15:46:59 -!- kast has joined ##crawl-dev 15:49:22 -!- kats has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 15:53:08 /quit cheers 15:53:09 -!- kats has joined ##crawl-dev 15:53:11 -!- dpeg has quit [Quit: cheers] 15:54:17 * Textmode sighs 15:54:52 How can a god that objects to is_unclean have an altar in the Sewers :P 15:55:02 -!- kast has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:55:28 the real estate really misrepresented the property... 15:55:36 -!- kast has joined ##crawl-dev 15:58:26 -!- kats has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:00:15 -!- kats has joined ##crawl-dev 16:03:11 the ad said "waterfront property" 16:03:54 -!- kast has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:07:52 I think sewers should have an abyss portal in the deep water section so that they make sense as a drainage system 16:08:13 haha 16:11:33 it's Zin who's the shit god, not Lugonu 16:11:47 green: Zin can also have Oklobs spawn nextr to his altars last I saw, I don't know that that was fixed yet 16:12:12 why would it be? 16:12:21 Oklobs are obviously cleansing agents 16:12:22 oklobs aren't unclean! their acid burns away all the filth! 16:12:28 that's difficult and silly 16:12:37 What doy said :) 16:13:02 They're twisted mutations of platlife 16:13:09 prove it 16:13:24 it's "A vicious plant, dripping with vitriol." 16:23:08 why did I just have a vision of Oklob's in DF? 16:24:37 it would actually be kind of interesting if certain animals couldn't go down stairs 16:26:06 what kind of animals couldn't go down stairs, though? 16:26:12 up, sure, but down? 16:26:16 oklobs should be able to cast teleport self 16:26:17 like, wild haggis? 16:26:25 kilobyte: :) 16:26:26 while the player is not on in LOS :) 16:26:33 kilobyte: male, or female? 16:29:46 morning 16:30:10 Morning due 16:30:17 on the surface of your choice 16:30:17 We're arguing about oklobs?cool! 16:30:42 Textmode: cows can't go down stairs irl 16:30:43 -!- kats has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:31:03 TGW: are there any cows in crawl? 16:31:09 that's obviously something that it would be valuable to replicate ingame 16:31:10 d: 16:31:16 doy: crawl has stairs 16:31:20 Did the patch for spell colours get applied? 16:31:31 due: think there was still discussion going on 16:31:31 Textmode: We'll have sacred bulls come 0.7. 16:31:36 due: http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=296 16:31:52 Textmode: did you work out how to get it into one file? :) 16:31:53 I have no idea whats happening with it now 16:32:00 due: i also assigned a bunch of tickets to you that you had mentioned in the comments that you'd look at 16:32:05 feel free to unassign or whatever 16:32:15 doy: sure, there's a dozen or so that I should be looking into. 16:32:33 i also tagged a bunch of stuff as 0.6 target, so that should be reasonably complete 16:32:42 feel free to add or remove stuff from that list though 16:32:48 Textmode: (for the record, git diff origin/master > blah.patch, git reset --hard origin/master, git apply blah.patch, git commit -a) 16:33:13 -!- kats has joined ##crawl-dev 16:33:31 also important: "It is physically impossible for pigs to look up into the sky." 16:33:41 due: if the patch is already committed, that's just "git rebase origin/master" 16:33:42 hogs should start wandering if you have lev 16:33:44 d: 16:33:45 due: I've added that to my notes file 16:33:56 this is why working with committed things is so much nicer 16:33:57 doy: oh, :) 16:34:03 -!- purge has quit [Quit: !] 16:34:08 doy: I honestly have no idea beyond my own nasty hacks. 16:34:12 due: Also, isn't it easier to git reset origin/master; git commit -a 16:34:25 OKAY 16:34:30 I'll stop pretending I know anything about git 16:34:33 --mixed is the default, and it won't erase your working copy 16:34:34 hehe 16:34:47 heh 16:36:25 do centaurs have human digestion or centaur digestion? 16:36:36 erm, horse 16:36:47 because this site says horses can't vomit, which seems very important 16:37:00 they have enough of a human body to have a human digestive tract... 16:37:18 This is obviously the time to propose... llamataurs!!!1 16:37:19 ... we care about centaurs vomiting? 16:37:28 due: it's very important! 16:37:29 obviously! 16:37:33 due: eating contaminated meat is very bad if you can't vomit 16:37:40 we should add a vomit command like in IVAN 16:37:41 centaurs should have negative gourmand 16:37:46 ... 16:37:46 sapro* 16:37:49 ... 16:38:09 Are we playing "fuck the centaurs"? 16:38:25 apprently. 16:38:30 Cool 16:38:38 Aaargh player.h got hit. 16:38:41 perhaps afterwards, we can do an encore with spriggans :) 16:38:58 No, spriggans are fine! : 16:39:00 who hit player.h? 16:39:04 No touch my spriggans 16:39:12 centaurs do have the highest win rate besides dd 16:39:14 unless you want to buff them casting apptitudes! 16:39:20 doy: because nobody plays ce 16:39:27 !apt sp 16:39:27 Sp: Air=120, Armour=170, Axes=150, Bows=70, Conj=160, Xbows=100, Darts=70, Div=70!, Dodge=50!, Earth=120, Ench=50!, Evo=52, Exp=130, Fighting=150*, Fire=140, Ice=140, Inv=97, Long=140, Maces=160, Nec=120, Poison=100, Polearms=180*, Shields=180*, Short=90, Slings=70, Splcast=78, Stab=50!, Staves=150*, Stealth=50, Summ=150, Throw=90, Tloc=50!, Tmut=60!, Traps=60!, Unarmed=130 16:39:31 !lg * race=centaur s=char 16:39:32 5697 games for * (race=centaur): 1337xCeHu, 567xCeCK, 506xCeHe, 433xCeFi, 325xCePa, 276xCeEE, 267xCeMo, 191xCeWz, 190xCeBe, 172xCeDK, 161xCeTm, 159xCeFE, 137xCeCr, 95xCePr, 92xCeGl, 88xCeWn, 84xCeEn, 71xCeIE, 69xCeAE, 58xCeVM, 56xCeCj, 54xCeSu, 54xCeNe, 53xCeRe, 49xCeAr, 44xCeWr, 32xCeAM, 31xCeSt, 27xCeTh, 19xCeAs 16:39:33 Spriggans are actually pretty well balanced. 16:39:35 felirx: only you can touch the spriggans? (lovely little sprigganses...) 16:39:36 !lg * won race=centaur s=char 16:39:36 59 games for * (won race=centaur): 9xCeHe, 9xCeFi, 5xCePa, 4xCeHu, 3xCeMo, 3xCeAs, 2xCeGl, 2xCeCK, 2xCeCr, 2xCeBe, 2xCeWn, 1xCePr, 1xCeEE, 1xCeRe, 1xCeNe, 1xCeAr, 1xCeVM, 1xCeTm, 1xCeAE, 1xCeFE, 1xCeEn, 1xCeIE, 1xCeWz, 1xCeDK, 1xCeSu, 1xCeWr, 1xCeTh 16:39:37 Just bloody difficult to play right. 16:39:59 s 0.6 branched? :o 16:40:05 due: not yet 16:40:09 don't get me wrong, I love sprigs. 16:40:16 okay 16:40:25 I love their vegan-armorless little hearts. 16:40:26 doy: have I got time to squeeze the Troves changes in? 16:40:31 !gamesby race=sp 16:40:31 doy (race=sp) has played 76 games, between 20061214 and 20091123, won 4 (5.3%), high score 1404023, total score 4824781, total turns 950167, total time 204:40:26. 16:40:33 due: yes 16:40:38 ...lightly suated, with just a hint of spice. 16:40:39 * greensnark has a C++ question. 16:40:40 I'm off work for the rest of the week for a variety oof reasons but I might have time to finish it today. 16:40:45 Might not, of course. 16:40:47 macro.cc does ' const keyseq &result = Macros[tmp]; 16:40:56 To determine if a key sequence has an associated macro 16:41:05 Does that not always increase the size of the Macros map? 16:41:15 what is Macros? 16:41:20 A std::map 16:41:23 pure evil 16:41:24 the bracket operator is an insert 16:41:28 for mpas 16:41:29 *maps 16:41:34 shouldn't it be access mmm 16:41:36 Mapping a std::deque into another std::deque 16:41:50 greensnark: what pointless said 16:41:51 Obviously there is a limit to the number of valid keystrokes, so it won't swell forever 16:41:54 std::dpeque? 16:41:58 [] on a map always vivifies the slot 16:42:02 But it still looks like bad form 16:42:19 yes, [] to check for existence is bad form 16:42:30 Also the keyboard buffer can accumulate lots of crap 16:42:41 And each combination of keystrokes will get stuffed into that map 16:42:43 Right? 16:42:49 The same thing is done for keymappings as well 16:42:56 http://www.cplusplus.com/reference/stl/map/operator%5B%5D/ 16:42:59 if tmp is the contents of the buffer then yes 16:43:05 That is deeply icky 16:43:23 Yeah, tmp is the size of the buffer 16:43:32 If it cannot find a macro, it drops one keystroke off the end and tries again :P 16:43:37 I'd prob use find or something to browse the map 16:43:40 sounds cool 16:43:40 instead of [] 16:43:40 That is one sad map :P 16:43:46 Yeah, find is correct there 16:43:52 greensnark: you should rewrite it! 16:44:20 I'll fix these issues at least :P 16:44:36 greensnark doing code in our crawl! 16:44:36 There is some scary code for the command repeat that I shall defer till later :P 16:44:42 `? 16:44:47 Yeah 16:44:51 ` is... evil and disgusting aand always *always* crashes. 16:45:04 Code dealing with ` has its tentacles throughout Crawl :P 16:45:11 ` is a kraken? 16:45:15 if you're using [] and the value is not found, it gets added and ref returned 16:46:05 * due beats greensnark with a stick. 16:46:34 f1904f13ada43c, you added corpse violation flags for the artefact stuff in that commit but didn't say so in the commit message! :o 16:46:38 <-- commit police? 16:47:20 Actually, pointless added the corpse violation flags :) 16:47:43 Yes, I was naughty 16:48:17 i_feel_safe doen't feel safe around exposed monsters. 16:48:19 I support this. 16:48:32 When you say "exposed", you mean? 16:48:37 Oh ~ 16:48:38 "~" :) 16:48:39 I misunderstood 16:48:45 HAHA. Me too, when I first read it. 16:48:49 -!- Twinge- has joined ##crawl-dev 16:49:02 "Sharks apparently are the only animals that never get sick. As far as is known, they are immune to every known disease including cancer." 16:49:05 that's terrifying 16:49:16 but can they vomit? 16:49:17 Don't you wanna be a shark? 16:49:44 * greensnark is already a snark, pretty close. 16:51:06 * due attaches greensnark to gameboy, starts feeding in greenshark codes. 16:51:42 -!- Twinge has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:54:15 -!- Twinge has joined ##crawl-dev 16:54:21 greensnark: Can we generate branch ends that have no_ctele flags being removed on item pickup a few thousand timese to look for errors? 16:54:35 greensnark: The code complains if there are multiple objects in an item_pickup flagg. 16:54:43 TGW, prety sure thats wrong. A while back there was a report on snake-oil salesmen selling shark cartaliage pills as a anti-cancer ward. one of the refutations was that it was a false premise, sharks *do* get cancer. 16:55:20 due: I thought you fixed that? 16:55:35 oh, you're right 16:55:38 Does the error occur on level generation? 16:55:44 Or does it occur when the player picks up the thing 16:55:47 When entering the level. 16:55:57 I thought I had fixed it, but I'd like to do a few thousand generations just to check. 16:56:23 Doing a few thousand generations is easy, but presumably you want the game to stop and die when the error occurs 16:56:39 Is it enough to just check for multiple items in the rune or orb stack? 16:56:40 -!- nrook has joined ##crawl-dev 16:56:56 -!- Twinge- has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:57:03 You can add a test-case based on rune-gen 16:57:17 rune-gen generates a bunch of branch ending levels and checks that they contain the rune 16:58:03 due: perplexingly, kilobyte has reported that the kiku vault failed to reanimate a corpse 16:58:19 TGW: Yeah, I haven't pushed my fix to it yet. 16:58:32 Relying on miasma is a bad idea. :) 16:58:46 I was going to make it automatically kill the human but I couldn't figure out how 16:58:51 dpeg said that the miasma you get these days is low-quality stuff 16:59:25 mon.kill() or something like that 17:02:08 I like the idea that sometimes Kiku will screw up and the human will survive 17:03:13 i don't think kiku needs to be portrayed as any more incompetent than he already is 17:03:14 -!- nrook has quit [Quit: Java user signed off] 17:03:16 (: 17:03:28 * due snorts. 17:03:40 -!- nrook has joined ##crawl-dev 17:05:49 03j-p-e-g * r5b85f8c19598 10/crawl-ref/source/ (abl-show.cc food.cc): For Vampires of sufficient xp, always show the Bottle Blood ability. 17:06:41 Kiku is like a replacement god in Lord of Light trying hard to look like the real thing 17:06:54 So true. 17:07:09 :/ 17:07:42 03greensnark * r01a16eade9b4 10/crawl-ref/source/macro.cc: Fix macro and keymap std::maps expanding until they contain all keysequences and subsequences ever entered by the user in one play session. 17:09:54 -!- mspang has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:10:21 -!- mspang has joined ##crawl-dev 17:14:27 due: also there's like no way the lu vault is broken 17:16:26 Can I set a hard limit on the number of keys Crawl will accept in one shot 17:17:12 I suspect the Crawl processes that die are the result of Crawl getting a massive injection of keystrokes 17:17:32 And then stuffing those combinations into its macro maps 17:17:52 but but but farming! 17:17:53 (: 17:17:53 TGW: don't make pronouncements like that :) 17:17:53 The second aspect should be fixed, but I see no reason to accept gigatons of keystrokes in the first place 17:17:56 also 17:18:04 except the fed gift 17:18:06 Sif Muna no longer lets you worship her if you have no spells? 17:18:12 due: yes 17:18:18 due: because those people will get excommunicated 17:18:21 and that's just ugly 17:18:45 yeah, i can't imagine this would affect gameplay in any way, and it makes thematic sense 17:18:48 So if you're trying to convert to spellcasting you have to wait until you get spells before you worship her? 17:18:55 due: yes 17:19:01 Okay. 17:19:09 is there another way you would do it before? 17:19:10 neccromutation message needs tweaking. :) 17:19:12 Yeah, the Sif thing is a good change 17:19:14 worshipping her before you get spells isn't really going to benefit you at all anyway 17:19:23 there is *no way* to get sif piety without spells 17:19:32 and sif offers no benefit at [......] 17:19:38 It's one of those changes that are so obvious in retrospect you wonder why you never considered it before :) 17:24:12 hmmm, looks like the lichform message will also trigger for dg trying to worship any god, or non-orcs trying to worship beogh 17:24:13 ... the spell colour code patch is in three parts, each bzip'd? 17:24:24 due: i think those are different revisions of it 17:24:32 normal users can't delete attachments 17:24:35 ah 17:24:51 11 patches :/ 17:24:51 yeah, only the last one matters. 17:24:56 can I combine them? 17:25:11 Can I stop you? 17:25:18 can anyone stop you? 17:25:21 I mean, is there an issue with my combining them? 17:25:29 I doubt it... 17:30:20 Eh, too lazy. 17:30:46 will have another look later, gotta get stuff done. 17:33:14 okay. 17:49:14 -!- haranp has joined ##crawl-dev 17:49:26 nice catch on the macro bug greensnark 17:49:46 hey haran 17:49:49 hi all 17:49:54 only here for 5 minutes 17:49:54 haranp: can I look at (glow) for quiver now? 17:50:02 or do you still have other direction stuff to do? 17:50:04 Hi haranp :) 17:50:08 due: what do you mean? 17:50:37 greensnark: if only the STL designers had thought of a reasonable [] implementation which somehow maintained constness 17:50:52 haranp: http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=550 17:51:04 Oh, firing code, not direction stuff. sorry! 17:51:51 I did mean direction stuff there actually...but I only meant until I merged direction-rewrite back into master. Sorry about forgetting that 17:52:00 The bug dates back to at least b26, so I'm fairly certain that this alone is not what's causing the Crawl-goes-crazy-and-eats-RAM issue 17:52:01 Sure, go ahead with any changes 17:52:04 No, it's fine 17:52:42 greensnark: did it happen again? I only saw napkin mention it once 17:52:42 I just couldn't remember why I hadn't looked at it last week and then I realised :) 17:52:51 * due feeds the Crawl machine RAM. 17:52:59 It's happened several times on cao with 0.5.x 17:53:21 I think the last one forced rax to reboot 17:53:29 haranp: napkin has mentioned it several times 17:53:42 awkward! 17:53:44 could we hack the allocator to limit memory and stackdump if it exceeds the limit? 17:53:57 that's called "setting a ulimit" 17:54:07 Napkin plans to do a setrlimit and limit Crawls to 100M 17:54:10 This weekend 17:54:17 napkin has a busy weekend :) 17:54:32 We can probably put in a call to setrlimit ourselves 17:54:46 Conditional on DGL 17:55:05 Napkin is going to set RLIMIT_AS in dgl 17:55:17 i thought someone looked into that and we already did 17:55:19 Any reason why we shouldn't do the same? 17:55:25 We set RLIMIT_CORE to unlimited :P 17:55:28 oh 17:55:29 heh 17:55:34 Not good when Crawl 17:55:38 is gobbling RAM :) 17:56:11 ramilicious 17:56:26 gotta go 17:56:27 -!- haranp has quit [Quit: leaving] 17:57:07 bye 17:57:28 Hey, 3.0.2 also had a macro.cc 17:57:51 Apparently written following the coding convention that each function must make no less than two malloc calls 17:58:07 i like that convention! 17:58:14 I got shoals! 17:58:28 should I do it at xl12? 17:58:40 3.0.2's macro.cc had implementations of strcmp and strcpy for int arrays 17:58:42 yes 17:58:43 ! 17:58:47 I think I'll just close this source file now 18:00:11 greensnark: snippets from one of the particularly fun bits of code from my old job: http://tozt.net/uploads/text/report_command.txt 18:00:28 bah, I missed haran 18:01:10 "ClassNameIdxAroFieldST1AZ2g" <-- looks like data corruption 18:01:28 greensnark: As the main proponent of the DOS port, I need you to check crd 18:01:36 holy FUCK if I may say, class definition in a macro? 18:01:40 I am not a proponent of the DOS port 18:01:44 Let it die 18:01:50 is that a macro? 18:01:58 -!- stabwound has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 18:02:03 I was willing to tolerate it when there were lots of people begging for it and it wasn't too much work 18:02:09 But it is too much work now :P 18:02:13 doy: looks like quality fodder for thedailywtf.com 18:02:48 doy: Exciting, I don't want to look at the code that uses those macros :) 18:03:58 But it doesn't rise to the levels of Crawl 3.0 :) 18:04:42 the macro current mon-stuff.h already freaks me out 18:04:48 -!- bmh has joined ##crawl-dev 18:04:55 with it's cascaded ternary mess 18:05:04 I'm glad Python doesn't have macros and evil stuff like this. 18:05:04 hi dev 18:05:08 hi bmh 18:05:19 macros are fine, as long as they're hygenic 18:05:36 Though I must admit, I've got some evil decorators. 18:06:05 greensnark: 3.0.2 was pre-C++, right? 18:06:34 -!- kast has joined ##crawl-dev 18:07:05 okay 18:07:07 Lair uses city level 18:07:10 It used g++\ 18:07:19 -!- stabwound has joined ##crawl-dev 18:07:28 I don't know what C++ features it used, if any 18:07:28 Am I the only one who thinks city level looks odd ruined? 18:07:32 This weekend I actually met a guy who was playing DOS Crawl. 18:07:42 bmh: Did you put him out of his misery 18:07:50 greensnark: I told him to download 0.6 18:07:56 3.0.2 has a spells0.cc 18:08:01 * greensnark has got to go look at spells0.cc 18:08:02 -!- kats has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:08:39 -!- kats has joined ##crawl-dev 18:08:52 http://sprunge.us/ibXa 18:08:56 It's actually not too horrific 18:09:26 It still surprises me that there were so many people willing to work on Crawl at that time 18:09:36 I doubt if I would have bothered 18:09:52 that cprintf with huge spacing jumps to eye 18:10:11 why not \t 18:10:32 Oh no, if you start commenting on individual things, you'll be here all week :P 18:10:43 ;) 18:10:47 You just sit back and drink in the distilled awesomeness of 3.0 in panorama 18:10:50 When did we rename transmigatrion to transmutation? 18:10:55 0.4.5->0.5? or was it earlier? 18:11:06 0.5 I think 18:11:07 it was tmig in 0.4 18:11:09 Pretty recently, anyway 18:11:15 Yeah 18:11:15 don't remember if it was 0.5 or 0.6 that it changed 18:11:15 I recall seeing mention of a Chei statboost, but nothing indepth and I don't see a note on the tracker. 18:11:18 Can someone fill me in? 18:11:31 "You kill the berserk polar bear" :( 18:11:37 Poor baby :( 18:11:45 -!- kast has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:11:59 -!- kast has joined ##crawl-dev 18:12:25 Should you be able to read while engulfed in smoke? 18:13:24 Yes 18:13:30 You can always hold the scroll/book closer 18:13:36 The game doesn't specify how thick the smoke is :P 18:15:29 -!- greensnark has quit [Quit: Night] 18:15:30 20' visibility smoke, no? 18:15:31 So, are we addressing shaft generation for 0.6? 18:15:36 -!- kats has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:16:24 i think shaft generation is fine for now 18:16:34 And god gifts? I haven't gotten a *single* weapon from troog that's usable in the last three gifts. 18:16:39 I noticed this in my last game as well. 18:16:45 He keeps giving my slings or crossbows. 18:17:13 might be worth testing 18:17:31 I don't have any ranged skill. 18:19:07 -!- kats has joined ##crawl-dev 18:21:03 I really enjoy the new inventory. (This is probably old news, but I haven't been playing on CDO long) 18:21:38 new inventory? 18:22:33 The "] to select all armour" thing 18:22:41 -!- kast has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:22:42 That's... not new? 18:22:46 I'm sure that was in 0.4.5. 18:22:50 Or 0.5 at least 18:23:07 im pretty sure its new, the inventory screen definately looks different anyways 18:23:56 the command always worked, but it wasnt stated on the screen 18:26:01 MDFi of Chei, this should be interesting to see how he plays 18:27:31 ngiht all 18:27:38 -!- Textmode has quit [Quit: Leaving] 18:49:44 Runed lajatang. 18:50:11 hmm? 18:50:42 Trog. 18:52:39 -!- Mu_ has joined ##crawl-dev 18:57:51 -!- bmh has quit [Quit: bmh] 19:03:10 -!- pointless_ has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.5.7/20091221164558]] 19:04:01 -!- pointless_ has joined ##crawl-dev 19:12:53 -!- nrook has quit [Quit: Java user signed off] 19:17:31 Another lagatang. 19:17:42 We need to look at acquirement for 0.6. 19:18:38 just weapon acquirement that's weird, or? 19:18:52 Stathol is complaining abotu getting multiple helmets in ##crawl. 19:19:02 19:14:39 < Stathol> So I've acquired armour 4 times in this game... 19:19:02 19:14:46 < sorear> all animal skins? 19:19:02 19:14:54 < Stathol> And it's given me some flavor of +2 helmet of int twice. :/ 19:19:30 @whereis stathol 19:19:30 No where information for stathol (). 19:19:36 @whereis Stathol 19:19:36 Stathol the Eclecticist (L20 DECj), a worshipper of Vehumet, is currently on Vault:1 after 87650 turns. 19:19:38 DECj 19:19:56 i don't think that's too unreasonable 19:20:21 No, I think that's okay 19:20:53 my experience with book acquirement is that it gives useless stuff 19:22:01 well... wizmode testing with a character with only axe skill produced 8 axes, a sling, and a crossbow 19:22:09 which i don't think is too unreasonable 19:22:34 try long blades 19:22:42 another 5 got 4 axes and a longbow 19:24:34 9 long blades, a trident, a sling, a broad axe, a dagger, a lajatang, and a spear 19:26:01 03pointless_ * rb3ff7df0a983 10/crawl-ref/source/godabil.cc: Make evolution prioritize low count stacks of fruit 19:28:09 didn't it before? 19:28:44 doy: Try trog's weapon gifts? 19:28:51 it was supposed to but I didn't have a sort in the right place 19:29:01 ah 19:29:51 9 maces, two slings, two crossbows, a battleaxe, a short sword for m&f skill 19:31:00 I've had a broad axe, a sling and two lajatangs. 19:31:23 I don't understand the lajatangs. 19:32:06 Okay 19:32:16 Try short blades 2, axes 2, long blades 13. 19:32:37 Across 12 gifts, I got two long swords. 19:32:42 The rest were sabres, daggers and war axes. 19:33:23 12 axes from trog at axes 27 19:36:53 glaive, lajatang, hand axe, short sword, double sword, trident, dagger, spear, katana, sabre, scimitar, sabre, double sword, sling, sabre 19:36:56 hmmm 19:36:59 with your stats 19:38:45 if i remember correctly, it's supposed to be doing (skill level + 1) / (total skill levels + (1 for each skill)) chance for each weapon type 19:38:58 doesn't look like that's what's happening currently though 19:39:44 it looks like mixes are an issue 19:40:10 Two long blades from another set of twelve. 19:40:44 Six from another set of 18. 19:41:28 hmmm 19:41:39 for one thing, it doesn't look like trog acquirements are treated as divine 19:41:47 that's odd 19:41:53 const bool divine = (agent == GOD_OKAWARU || agent == GOD_XOM); 19:42:47 hmmm, although it appears that the only thing divine is used for is to make non-divine acquirement have a better chance at higher-end items 19:44:18 !tell Keskitalo I died to ice devils guarding an ice cave. :D 19:44:18 due: OK, I'll let Keskitalo know. 19:44:35 ...hrm 19:45:17 ah, nm 19:45:27 bug? :) 19:46:05 no, it's just that people seem to insist on using that streaming random choice algorithm in places where it's really not necessary 19:46:10 and just makes the code less clear 19:46:23 streaming random choice? 19:46:25 like x = blah 19:46:33 if one_chance_in(x) x = blah2 19:46:34 and so on? 19:46:41 yeah 19:46:45 I despise that a lot. 19:46:56 it's very useful in certain situations 19:47:08 but... not everywhere 19:50:41 -!- Madtrixr has joined ##crawl-dev 19:51:32 They're very difficult to translate at later dates. 19:58:41 @whereis due 19:58:41 No where information for due (). 19:59:43 I died :) 19:59:44 !log 19:59:48 1274. bookofjude, XL13 SpBe, T:32262: http://crawl.develz.org/morgues/trunk/bookofjude/morgue-bookofjude-20100211-014243.txt 20:06:25 due: looks like part of it is that a lot of long blades are getting vetoed, for some reason 20:09:14 wouldn't it be a lot cleaner to throw a die and switch the value in cases like that 20:09:32 assuming you have a set of choises you have to choose between 20:09:41 acquirement code is pretty convoluted 20:10:33 due: you know what it probably is, in your case 20:10:45 it's trying to give you high quality items 20:10:51 -!- stabwound has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:10:55 but high quality items are mostly two-handed 20:11:02 and spriggans can't wield two-handed weapons 20:11:07 so it ditches it and tries again 20:11:31 so spriggans get a disproportional amount of weapons from classes where high quality items aren't two-handed 20:11:35 like staves 20:11:43 and slings, and crossbows 20:13:53 -!- Mu_ has quit [Quit: Defecator, may everything turn out okay so that you can leave this place.] 20:15:22 -!- stabwound has joined ##crawl-dev 20:20:46 due: and long blades get vetoed a lot because apparently holy wrath is a common brand, and only tso can gift holy wrath weapons 20:22:24 -!- eith has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 20:25:03 -!- bmh has joined ##crawl-dev 20:25:29 Can we remove the costs for Chei's ponderous-making? 20:25:38 no 20:25:39 why? 20:26:05 what's the cost? 2 MP? 20:26:06 I'm playing as a fighter worshipping Chei and can't slow myself because I don't have enough MP 20:26:14 it's a bit silly I think, and hahaha 20:26:18 oh, that cost 20:26:25 thought you meant piety 20:26:52 yeah, ponderousify doesn't seem like an mp cost makes sense 20:27:24 It had a cost initially because dpeg had suggested making ponderousifying possibly adding brands 20:28:50 I feel dirty. I just gave a troll a point of intelligence 20:41:46 Seconding removal of pondersoufy MP cost 20:42:30 03doy * rc9a460cdf97e 10/crawl-ref/source/item_use.cc: hunger is a temporary disability 20:54:09 -!- Ero has joined ##crawl-dev 20:55:48 !log 20:55:52 9572. TGW, XL1 HaEn, T:0: http://crawl.develz.org/morgues/trunk/TGW/morgue-TGW-20100211-012927.txt 20:55:59 not that one 20:56:06 !log . 9573 20:56:07 Index out of range: 9572 20:56:21 that start vault was a bit excessive 20:56:47 I can't point to it, but there's a bunch of crap just outside your LOS in every direction 20:56:59 !log tgw 20:56:59 9572. TGW, XL1 HaEn, T:0: http://crawl.develz.org/morgues/trunk/TGW/morgue-TGW-20100211-012927.txt 20:57:04 it's not that one 20:57:07 gretell didn't get it 21:06:38 Anyone know offhand where the code for crazy-OOD spawns is handled? 21:06:50 nope 21:06:56 -!- eith has joined ##crawl-dev 21:07:11 probably the same place that the code that normal spawns is 21:07:17 not sure where that is either though 21:07:22 it is nuts how many entries there are 21:07:31 yeah 21:07:49 d:1 entry vaults were new to like 0.3 or so too 21:09:07 it might be onia_ninara_010_handbag 21:10:07 yeah, that looks rihgt 21:10:17 i love that vault, actually 21:10:34 it seems a bit much 21:10:46 oh, hmmm 21:10:51 that's not the one i'm thinking of, actually 21:10:56 seriously there is *nowhere you can step* without seeing a monster 21:11:04 Cheibriados Ponderous'ify -- remove MP cost (http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=758) by brendan 21:11:04 one direction, two monsters 21:11:14 another, you're *standing next to* a monster 21:11:20 erik_entry_003 is the one i like 21:11:40 and if it's a goblin that shouts, that's a pretty bad thing 21:13:38 agree at all? 21:13:43 i think the idea is that the stuff inside isn't supposed to come out unless you specifically search out the hidden doors 21:14:41 entry vaults are supposed to be an easy, atmospheric introduction, yeah? 21:15:02 and thus you never have enemies in los 21:15:46 file it as an fr, see what other people have to say 21:15:52 i don't really have an opinion either way 21:16:02 ok 21:20:34 morning 21:21:37 !vault handbag 21:21:38 evening 21:21:40 Lines pasted to http://pastebin.com/m534d8f21 21:21:43 hey 21:21:43 night 21:21:51 i went for a nap 21:22:00 ooohhandbag 21:22:23 What's wrong with it? 21:22:37 it has quite a few monsters for an entry vault 21:22:44 so does david's river 21:22:59 doy: did you manage to fix acquirement? :) 21:23:25 due: monsters can't get to you across the river though 21:23:49 a pack of kobolds that *always* generates with ammunition? 21:24:08 due: acquirement issues are because spriggans can't wield high quality long blades, axes, and maces, and because long blades have a high chance of getting holy wrath, which isn't valid for non-tso gifts 21:24:44 due: it has quite a few 100% unavoidable monsters 21:24:46 fixing those things would require more than just a simple fix, i think 21:24:57 doy: hm 21:25:04 TGW: so what, you die? 21:25:08 due: yep 21:25:10 everyone dies. 21:25:26 everyone goes away in the end? 21:25:47 doy: my wiz-mode tests locally were on a human fighter. 21:25:50 so yeah 21:25:54 i saw a few double-handers there. 21:26:20 i'm sure non-tso can grant holy wrath 21:26:21 due: preferably to a play error or the sort of RNG that is silly to fix 21:26:25 or at least they could in 0.6 21:26:31 due: nope 21:26:38 hm 21:26:48 then holy wrath should be given no chance if divine and not TSO 21:26:50 effects.cc:2123 21:26:52 it shouldn't evne be considered 21:27:02 right, but those are in two completely separate parts of the code 21:27:15 acquirement works by generating a totally random item, and then ditching it if it's invalid 21:27:25 i think the definition of blessed is wrong... 21:27:32 i'm *sure* trog has given me holy weapons before. 21:27:50 this is a dumb way to do things, but i don't think messing with acquirement code this close to the release is a good idea 21:28:01 oh, never mind 21:28:13 blesses is blessed blades, not holy wrath 21:28:23 yeah 21:28:23 *blessed 21:28:31 hmmm, that might be easier to fix 21:28:49 scripts can be made to generate 100s of acquirement items for easy testing info 21:30:32 i'm still not getting many long blades for a human fighter of trog in wizmode. 21:30:38 and it doesn't make sense. 21:30:48 due: because there are a whole lot of blessed blades 21:30:55 of types of blessed blades, rather 21:31:04 and they're generally high quality 21:31:08 so acquirement picks them a lot 21:31:09 Tone down onia_ninara_010_handbag (http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=759) by TGW 21:31:09 ah 21:32:16 03doy * r63489a28b8de 10/crawl-ref/source/effects.cc: trog is divine 21:32:18 03doy * r9557d3d79c15 10/crawl-ref/source/effects.cc: don't even consider blessed blades for acquirement 21:32:22 :) 21:32:28 <3333 21:32:56 acquirement should be looked at for spriggans and such in 0.7, probably 21:35:56 Muuuch better. 21:35:58 hmmm, 8 lbl, 4 sbl, 4 axe, 1 mace, 1 staves, 2 bow 21:35:58 that's a bit more reasonable 21:36:16 Seven long blades, a sling and two axes. 21:36:26 So it was just that odd combination, then? 21:36:45 well, it was long blades in general 21:36:56 getting picked a lot less frequently than they should 21:37:02 Yeah, but having other skills means that it would end up picking for them instead? 21:37:21 well, yeah, that's how weapon acquirement works in general 21:37:39 yeah. 21:37:49 okay, yawn 21:37:53 i'd nbetter get ready to go out 21:38:08 the excess of lajatangs issue was because of being a spriggan 21:41:41 Hmm. I'm thinking super-OOD spawns should be limited for D:2 & D:1 specifically (And only if under 3k turns on level). There are a ton of possibly OOD D:2 spawns that are basically insta-death, and they aren't THAT rare. Later on you'll usually have more options/consumables to potentially deal with them. I'm not even thinking anything very drastic - a 1 in 6 chance that a super OOD spawn is ignored under these circumstances. 21:42:06 Twinge: we already completely forbid OODs on D:1, ever 21:42:19 sorear: Hmm? I thought that was only on initial generation 21:42:26 for pretty much that reason 21:43:50 Either way, D:2 is my main focus here anyway; just seemed logical to include D:1 as well, but may be unnecessary. 21:44:44 by d:2 you should have enough maneuvering room to at least be able to run 21:44:54 and if you don't, well, it's d:2 21:44:57 doy: Not from things faster than you 21:46:13 And again, I do not consider 'it's early' to be an acceptable excuse; it's better to die with no control of your fate early than it is late, sure, but it's still not especially good :) 21:46:32 for things that are as rare as this, i don't really care 21:47:05 I'm starting to come around on seeing OOD spawns the way you guys do, to some extent, but I still see them as a little too common with too high a threat potential for D:2 21:47:18 well, how common are they? 21:47:39 i thought they didn't start until you've been on the level for like 2k turns? 21:47:52 No - they can happen on initial spawn. 21:48:13 run some level generation tests, i'm curious how often it actually happens 21:49:28 About 15% of the time you'll get an OOD mob on D:2 on the initial generation, not counting respawns 21:49:49 how ood though? 21:49:49 (Not counting vanilla orcs, which are technically OOD at that point) 21:50:47 Varies. Some aren't too bad, some are deadly. Wyverns, Steam Dragons, Manticores, Crocidles, Giant Toads, Trolls, Centaurs, Ice Beats are all possible for example 21:51:14 rings autopickup logic (http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=760) by blub 21:51:22 Like I said, I don't think it needs a drastic reduction - just a mild one 21:52:33 -!- kast has joined ##crawl-dev 21:52:58 -!- kats has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:53:07 shrug, talk to greensnark 21:53:12 -!- kats has joined ##crawl-dev 21:54:26 Counting only the ones which should be overly threatening for D:2... I'd consider it dangerously OOD about 10.5% of the time, again only based on initial generation and not counting respawns. I'd aim to reduce this to ~8.8%, so OOD spawns would still happen often enough - they'd just be toned down a bit 21:54:31 And only on D:2 21:56:51 -!- kast has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:59:50 !tell due so, how's that trove stuff coming? 21:59:50 doy: OK, I'll let due know. 22:00:06 absdepth0 (formerly you_level or whatever) -- D:1 starts at 0 or starts at 1? 22:00:42 !tell Keskitalo what are the numbers supposed to be for shield of reflection rarity and jiyva altar slime entry generation? 22:00:42 doy: OK, I'll let Keskitalo know. 22:01:29 due: The rotting human corpse of freed slave. 22:01:31 !tell Napkin i'm going to branch for 0.6 in the next day or two, do you want to convert cdo over this weekend sometime? 22:01:32 doy: OK, I'll let Napkin know. 22:06:34 Twinge: d:1 is 0 22:10:42 Thanks; that's what I thought but wasn't certain 22:14:22 !messages 22:14:22 (1/1) doy said (14m 32s ago): so, how's that trove stuff coming? 22:14:44 doy: I've got test cases to finish running and tweakiing the code to only pick identified books, weapons, armour and rings from shops and floor... 22:14:47 Well, just shops. 22:14:53 And then there's flavour messages. 22:16:07 due: that's just one of the last big-ish things to go in for 0.6 22:16:18 doy: I should be able to finish it tonight and merge my troves branch back in. 22:16:23 so if that could go in before we branch, that would be sweet 22:16:24 (: 22:16:33 (Though I might just rebase it because otherwise it's 200+ commits. :) 22:17:37 yes, do that please 22:17:38 (: 22:17:49 -!- stabwound has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 22:18:57 * due back in a few hours. 22:23:24 Hmm. why doesn't "if (!(you.absdepth0 == 1) && !(one_chance_in(6)))" work? (it seems to always returns true; even just "!(one_chance_in(2))" also doesn't work, or "!one_chance_in(2)") 22:23:26 -!- stabwound has joined ##crawl-dev 22:25:02 what are you trying to do? 22:33:07 Twinge: well anyway my guess is that you are trying to reduce the chance of placing on OODs on D:2 and the if statement you wrote is always false on d:2, so you would actually want you.absdepth()!=1 || one_chance_in(6) 22:33:25 err || !one_chance_in(6) 22:39:05 pan lords don't seem to show up in the monster list 22:40:43 -!- TGW has left ##crawl-dev 22:43:34 03doy * rb32511525b4d 10/crawl-ref/source/ (29 files in 4 dirs): rename overmap -> dgn-overview (it's not a map!) 22:47:04 -!- kast has joined ##crawl-dev 22:48:15 -!- kats has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:48:46 pointless: My check was backwards since that seemed the easiest way to do it, so it should always be true if not D:2 and true 5/6 times if it is D:2. However, it looks like the super_ood function is not actually the super_ood function, or something, because commenting it out entirely doesn't removing the OOD spawns :P 22:49:09 -!- kats has joined ##crawl-dev 22:49:36 thanks anyway though, and I'll try those if needed once I actually find the right place, heh. 22:50:06 it looks like that if statement is always false if d:2? 22:50:23 or maybe it's getting too late for me 22:51:51 -!- kast has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:51:52 Oh, right, it definitely is, so I was certainly wrong there, should be or instead of and. 22:52:56 But I still need to find where to actually put that. the super_ood thing looks like and id described like what I'm looking for but doesn't seem to be it. Unless there's another sub-level of 'pretty far OOD but not quite insanely OOD' I'm missing. 22:53:34 good luck with that 22:53:46 -!- pointless_ has quit [Quit: night] 22:54:59 -!- kats has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 22:56:36 -!- kats has joined ##crawl-dev 23:00:45 -!- kast has joined ##crawl-dev 23:04:37 -!- kats has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 23:05:39 hmm, swamp's range is showing up on my ctrl+o screen 23:05:48 even though my game has snake and shoals 23:05:54 both of which i've found 23:08:18 yeah, i'm just about to fix that 23:08:29 aha ok :) 23:09:52 lol, that number does not mean what I think it means! D:2 spawns -- 0.03% | golden dragon 0.39% | stone giant 23:11:32 Don't auto-prompt to eat poisonous chunks (http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=761) by tinyrodent 23:16:33 Aizul keeps casting sleep at me after I enslave soul'd him. (http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=762) by Pseudonut 23:21:34 Dungeon Overview lists nonexistent branch (http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=763) by tinyrodent 23:23:49 hmm, should orcs in orc (and elves in elf i guess) know about traps created by minefield cards? 23:28:18 i would say "no, though they should have a chance to discover them based on intelligence" 23:29:11 Might require a not insignificant recode to make that the case, though. 23:30:06 yeah, i guess i'll mantis it anyway 23:30:38 Put it as tweak or trivial probably, though I agree with you 23:30:48 yep 23:30:50 -!- Kil2 has joined ##crawl-dev 23:32:03 oh heh, it even created traps with orcish spears/needles etc 23:38:17 ??translucent rock wall 23:38:17 I don't have a page labeled translucent_rock_wall in my learndb. 23:41:16 !learn add translucent_rock_wall Exactly what it says on the tin - a translucent, rock wall. 23:41:17 translucent rock wall[1/1]: Exactly what it says on the tin - a translucent, rock wall. 23:45:26 I return. 23:45:58 There's not really any marker on the traps to indicate how they were created, I think. 23:49:31 -!- kats has joined ##crawl-dev 23:49:58 Okay.. 23:49:59 Troves. 23:50:24 I should probably exclude runes, yeah? ;) 23:50:56 there was some joking about requiring an Abyssal rune or such, but probably best to just exlclude all 23:50:56 Bah. 23:51:40 I'm fine with requiring runes, personally 23:51:44 but kilobyte will kill you 23:51:48 dpeg's not, so. 23:52:02 It's going to be books, rings and amulets, consumables, armour and weapons. 23:52:06 "it's not a win unless you're actually physically carrying all 15 runes when you leave" 23:52:12 sorear: 15+, no? 23:52:29 "any game mechanic which prevents me from satisfying my definition of a win is broken by design" 23:52:51 we really should do the same thing for items are we do for monsters with mon-info. 23:52:52 Well, you oculd re-acquire an Abysal rune would be the idea 23:53:06 -!- kast has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:53:16 !tell by What do you think about unlinking items and item_def for Lua, and using an item_info, similar to mon_info? 23:53:16 due: OK, I'll let by know. 23:56:49 -!- bmh has quit [Quit: bmh]