00:41:20 <Cheibriados> Neutral monsters never speak 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=12483 by damerell
01:05:11 <Gretell> Stable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.26.1-0-gd7a4d63c15 (34)
01:51:38 <Cheibriados> 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.27-a0-263-gc8dee61: Show melee accuracy on v (vt) 10(3 minutes ago, 3 files, 25+ 7-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/c8dee61f84d7
02:05:56 <Kelbell> Unstable branch on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.27-a0-263-gc8dee61f84 (34)
02:16:34 <Cheibriados> 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.27-a0-264-g0178f6a: Remove *Curse 10(12 minutes ago, 7 files, 14+ 30-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/0178f6a2e2a7
02:24:43 <Cbrotell> Unstable branch on cbro.berotato.org updated to: 0.27-a0-263-gc8dee61f84 (34)
02:44:01 -!- amalloy is now known as amalloy_
02:45:58 <Kelbell> Unstable branch on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.27-a0-264-g0178f6a2e2 (34)
03:27:39 <Cbrotell> Stable (0.26) branch on cbro.berotato.org updated to: 0.26.1-0-gd7a4d63c15
03:41:14 <Kelbell> Stable (0.26) branch on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.26.1-0-gd7a4d63c15
03:42:08 <Kelbell> Fork (bcrawl) on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.23-a0-3859-ge9853cb0d6
03:47:50 -!- Tiobot is now known as Guest96288
03:52:20 <Kelbell> Fork (bcadrencrawl) on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.03-117-g23df59a1cf
06:36:07 <Cheibriados> Shopping list/found items get removed without asking 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=12484 by Le_Nerd
07:17:00 <Cheibriados> New branch created: pull/1721 (3 commits) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/1721
07:17:01 <Cheibriados> 03Aliscans02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/1721 * 0.27-a0-255-gdde0899: Rename lua_persist::string as lua_persist::text. 10(19 hours ago, 1 file, 3+ 3-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/dde08997f6e5
07:17:01 <Cheibriados> 03Aliscans02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/1721 * 0.27-a0-256-g685ece6: Make _ability_quiver_range_check() static. 10(19 hours ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/685ece60b42b
07:17:01 <Cheibriados> 03Aliscans02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/1721 * 0.27-a0-257-g9c45596: Add a default constructor for crawl_view_buffer(crawl_view_buffer). 10(19 hours ago, 1 file, 1+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/9c45596aa554
07:46:08 <nagdon> just dropping some random feedback: I played some crawl after skipping a few years, and I reallye enjoyed the fast-paced Dungeon Sprint games
07:53:56 <nagdon> I played mostly on Red Sonja, Ten Rune Challenge & The Pits, and while all are really enjoyable, I think it would be relatively easy to combine their strengths into something even better (Ten Rune Challenge feels like "regular" crawl, but has balance/randomization issues especially in the start [e.g. sometimes you get a book of Minor Magic,
07:53:56 <nagdon> sometimes not]; The Pits has better replayability than the others because it uses random monster sets; and Red Sonja has the best balance, item availability [no large item heaps, but lots of shops provide everything] and general experience, but it uses almost no randomization [which is not a problem for one game, but not too replayable])
07:56:06 <Pinkbeast> Have a go at MEATSPRINT :-)
07:57:41 <nagdon> yes, that's an _interesting_ experience ;)
07:58:47 <nagdon> but I prefer puzzle-solving / trickery etc (that appears e.g. in Red Sonja) over the raw bloodshed of meatsprint / linesprint / ziggurat-sprint etc.
08:02:21 <nagdon> e.g I enjoyed trying out Wu Jian council (on e.g. a DsTm) in Ten Rune Challenge and the new IE spells in The Pits without wading through hordes of popcorn monsters in normal games; those experiences are not available on the more gimmicky sprint maps (and e.g. even in The Pits (with iron walls) it is sad to be a FoEE with no Dig, no Passwall and no
08:02:21 <nagdon> Shaft)
08:03:54 <nagdon> by the way, the new spells are great, I enjoyed frozen ramparts/new ozo's armour gameplay and absolute zero
09:58:47 <advil> gammafunk: it's ~/bin/update-trunk-indices.py; pretty straightforward but there are three places to edit, two are cutting and pasting to add the new version, and the third is a string that identifies the new version
09:59:00 <advil> I did it already for 0.27 while trying to reconstruct it
09:59:20 <advil> this script is called automatically by the build scripts for the windows downloads, but it can be run directly too
10:01:24 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> advil: thanks, I can remember to update the guide with that info when I do the debs
10:47:06 <ebering> I guess no one updated the download links yet
11:01:34 <Cheibriados> Trove manuals aren't on autopickup, don't tell you which skills they belong to 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=12485 by Sar
11:08:20 <Cheibriados> 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.27-a0-265-g4b4afb4: Reduce husk bloat 10(62 seconds ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/4b4afb4849f2
11:12:36 <Cheibriados> 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.27-a0-266-ge61c0db: Remove food and chunks - redux! 10(40 seconds ago, 1 file, 2+ 4-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/e61c0dba20ca
11:17:09 <Kelbell> Unstable branch on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.27-a0-266-ge61c0dba20 (34)
11:29:12 <advil> gammafunk: do you know what the proper way is to update the website from the dcss-websites repo?
11:29:42 <advil> there's some scripts which I've never been sure if they're supposed to be run manually, or even run at all
11:30:59 <advil> and I think I've usually just manually copied download.htm, but that seems wrong
11:32:24 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> advil: Yes, my system is to use the dcss-website checkout in ~crawl, pull changes, and just copy the relevant file(s) to ~/website
11:32:34 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> usually that file is just (I think) site/download.htm
11:32:34 <advil> ok
11:32:45 <advil> well, I just did that for 0.26.1 downloads
11:32:48 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> not very sophisticated, I know, but seems to work fine
11:32:56 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> sounds good
11:33:12 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> wonder if we can get napkin to enable https on cdo
11:33:18 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> would be nice
11:33:57 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> pictured: a chrome update that refuses downloads from http sites without jumping through 3 prompts first
11:35:11 <advil> Pinkbeast not sure I get your mantis report about debug output
11:35:21 <advil> are you saying you think there should be debug output on non-debug builds?
11:36:25 <Pinkbeast> advil: "non-debug builds" is a term I'd like to avoid. monster_speech.txt thinks DEBUG_MONSPEAK alone makes a build with some debugging output.
11:36:40 <advil> why would you want to avoid that term?
11:36:45 <advil> yes, I see the doc issue
11:37:03 <advil> but I'm literally going to fix it by saying "a debug build of Crawl compiled"
11:37:32 <Pinkbeast> Because is a build with DEBUG_MONSPEAK alone a "non-debug build", even though we turned on a debugging option for the build? # hang on, one more sentence coming
11:38:09 <Pinkbeast> I think essentially DEBUG_DIAGNOSTICS has come to subsume two things - "turn on all the debugging" (as it does in AppHdr.h) and "make debugging output work at all".
11:38:29 <advil> I haven't checked that define but basically none of the debug defs work on non-debug builds
11:39:07 <advil> well, there's also debug-lite
11:39:23 <Pinkbeast> By which you mean builds without DEBUG_DIAGNOSTICS; there it is being "make debugging output work at all".
11:41:58 <Pinkbeast> On reflection I think the thing that's wrong here, given your understanding of what DEBUG_DIAGNOSTICS does, is the #ifdef DEBUG_DIAGNOSTICS in AppHdr.h
11:42:20 <Cheibriados> 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.27-a0-267-g0e4e36e: Remove rings of attention 10(4 minutes ago, 18 files, 14+ 39-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/0e4e36e7b595
11:42:58 <Pinkbeast> If anything it should be the other way around - #ifdef DEBUG_THING_THAT_WANTS_DPRF means #define DEBUG_DIAGNOSTICS
11:42:58 <advil> by a debug build I mean a build with FULLDEBUG, which entails a bunch of other stuff by default, including DEBUG_DIAGNOSTICS
11:43:01 <Pinkbeast> (Also this would mean monspeak wouldn't have to be off by default in & Ctrl-Q because you could have a debug build without it)
11:43:42 <advil> there's also DEBUG (debug-lite) builds that don't enable DEBUG_DIAGNOSTICS
11:44:10 <Pinkbeast> Oh! Well, then there are many "non-debug" builds, ones without FULLDEBUG, where there is debug output. (There are none without DEBUG_DIAGNOSTICS, or not via dprf)
11:45:03 <advil> I think I'm confused about what we're talking about
11:45:54 <advil> in any case, debug output requires DEBUG_DIAGNOSTICS, I don't think that should change?
11:45:59 <Pinkbeast> I feel like I'm being Captain Obvious but I don't grasp what's missing
11:47:03 <Discord|> <12e​bering> The vibe I'm reading from you (possibly filtered from just logging off of a seminar with a questioner who was doing the same) is someone who asks a question in a seminar that's rather vague, expects a very specific answer they already had in mind, and will keep vaguely hinting at it until the speaker in the dark stumbles into what they had in mind.
11:47:18 <Pinkbeast> DEBUG_DIAGNOSTICS makes dprf work and turns on some things that use dprf, such as DEBUG_MONSPEAK, whether you wanted all of them or not. I submit, if it is to continue to be the thing that makes dprf work, that it should _not_ turn those things on (FULLDEBUG could) but they should turn DEBUG_DIAGNOSTICS on.
11:47:47 <Discord|> <12e​bering> ok that's much clearer thank you
11:47:49 <advil> ok, that could be reasonable
11:48:45 <Pinkbeast> TBH I think this was vague to start with because I didn't know which of the things DIAGNOSTICS did was the thing it's meant to do
11:48:56 <advil> FULLDEBUG does turn on DEBUG_MONSPEAK too by default
11:49:11 <advil> can you point where does DIAG turn on MONSPEAK?
11:49:46 <Pinkbeast> AppHdr.h #ifdef DEBUG_DIAGNOSTICS \n #define DEBUG_TESTS \n #define DEBUG_MONSPEAK \n etc
11:50:13 <advil> also that line in that developer doc is from 13 years old so I think it's just never been updated as these things have changed
11:50:51 <Pinkbeast> AppHdr.h # oh damn it's moved in vanilla, hang on
11:50:55 <advil> %git 37461d386a4
11:50:55 <Cheibriados> 07Aidan Holm02 * 0.26-a0-705-g37461d3: Split debug defines out of AppHdr.h 10(3 months ago, 3 files, 55+ 51-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/37461d386a40
11:51:14 <Pinkbeast> Now it's at the end of debug-defines.h
11:54:31 <advil> %git 49c5cce947c7e85
11:54:31 <Cheibriados> 07PleasingFungus02 * 0.15-a0-1668-g49c5cce: Re-enable, and fix, DEBUG_MONSPEAK 10(7 years ago, 2 files, 6+ 5-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/49c5cce947c7
11:56:20 <advil> looks like once upon a time this stuff *didn't* use dprf
12:05:15 <advil> probably exactly so that you could have a build with only monspeak
12:06:04 <Kelbell> Unstable branch on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.27-a0-267-g0e4e36e7b5 (34)
12:06:18 <Cheibriados> 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.27-a0-268-gfa1d483: Pay more attention to removing rings 10(8 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/fa1d4835b490
12:06:18 <Cheibriados> 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.27-a0-269-gccae488: Mostly remove rings of stealth (various) 10(5 minutes ago, 9 files, 8+ 22-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/ccae4883681b
12:08:10 <Pinkbeast> Also, I appreciate this stuff probably is pretty trivial to you (collectively) because you're used to the de facto behaviour anyway
12:11:46 <advil> I think we mostly never mess with these defines, I pretty much use only fulldebug builds locally unless I'm profiling something
12:12:41 <advil> hence the existence of DEBUG_BLOOD_POTIONS in that file
12:14:21 <Cheibriados> 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.27-a0-270-ga82526b: Enable stealth hats and gloves 10(43 seconds ago, 1 file, 5+ 3-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/a82526b2dbdd
12:15:16 <advil> I'll add in something that forces DIAG under MONSPEAK, but I think it's pretty pointless to define MONSPEAK on its own unless someone changes back those dprfs to mprfs
12:15:33 <advil> for the other 3 defines there things are a bit more complicated
12:15:45 <advil> well, one of them is obsolete
12:16:12 <Cheibriados> 03wheals02 07* 0.27-a0-271-g03888ab: Rule of three fix 10(2 minutes ago, 2 files, 11+ 4-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/03888ab0b065
12:17:39 <Kelbell> Unstable branch on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.27-a0-270-ga82526b2db (34)
12:18:02 <Discord|> <03w​heals> ^ would appreciate any c++ wizards looking that over
12:18:53 <dcss-ci> 04Build failed for 08master @ ccae4883 06https://github.com/crawl/crawl/actions/runs/537837460
12:20:41 <advil> wheals: oh hm, was that having a practical effect? (I'm not enough of a wizard to evaluate)
12:21:13 <Discord|> <03w​heals> i don't think it was, but only because of copy elision
12:22:35 <Discord|> <03w​heals> if the copy constructor weren't elided in view.cc:1420, the m_buffer field of vbuf would point to deleted memory
12:23:48 <Discord|> <03w​heals> because it was using the default copy ctor, which just copies the pointer without moving over the underlying data
12:24:14 <Discord|> <03w​heals> ...though all of this is just my speculation, i'm not enough of a wizard either
12:25:03 <advil> did you also wonder about move semantics there?
12:27:20 <advil> I *think* some stuff may actually assume it exists, but if I understand the rule of five correctly explicit copy constructor/assignment preclude it unless there's an explicit move constructor/assignment
12:28:23 <Discord|> <03w​heals> i considered adding them, but it's not necessary there because of elision again
12:28:36 <Cheibriados> 03advil02 07* 0.27-a0-272-g40f84a5: Update some 13 year old docs with current build info (12482) 10(16 minutes ago, 2 files, 8+ 14-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/40f84a5caa67
12:29:13 <dcss-ci> 04Build failed for 08master @ a82526b2 06https://github.com/crawl/crawl/actions/runs/537860844
12:29:13 <Discord|> <03w​heals> actually i think i should add it, because of tileweb.cc:2384
12:29:13 <Henzell> Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.27-a0-267-g0e4e36e (34)
12:29:13 <advil> yeah that is exactly what I was thinking of, I was looking  at that code recently
12:29:13 <dcss-ci> 04Build failed for 08master @ 03888ab0 06https://github.com/crawl/crawl/actions/runs/537866328
12:29:23 <advil> !blame PF
12:29:24 <Sequell> I pronounce PF... Guilty!
12:30:29 <Discord|> <03w​heals> one nice thing about the copy and swap paradigm is that i only have to add a move copy ctor to also have a move assignment operator, IIUC
12:32:12 <Cheibriados> 03advil02 07* 0.27-a0-273-gdc19187: One more ring of stealth (fix CI) 10(33 seconds ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/dc19187ef54a
12:33:10 <advil> actually probably not just CI
12:34:13 <Cheibriados> 03advil02 07* 0.27-a0-274-gb5755f8: lint 10(17 seconds ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/b5755f8d7c9d
12:43:18 <dcss-ci> 04Build failed for 08master @ 40f84a5c 06https://github.com/crawl/crawl/actions/runs/537897656
12:44:20 <Kelbell> Unstable branch on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.27-a0-272-g40f84a5caa (34)
12:45:03 <dcss-ci> 04Build failed for 08master @ dc19187e 06https://github.com/crawl/crawl/actions/runs/537908943
12:47:02 <Kelbell> Unstable branch on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.27-a0-274-gb5755f8d7c (34)
13:02:31 <Discord|> <10P​leasingFungus> can’t believe advil is blaming me just because things are my fault
13:05:04 <advil> well, I only blamed you by acronym
13:05:10 <advil> could be another PF!
13:08:46 <Cheibriados> Scarf of invisibility isn't greyed out with sacrificed Evocations. 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=12486 by Yermak
13:09:56 <Discord|> <03w​heals> advil: turns out that m_next_view kept being used after the end of the function, so it made no sense to use move semantics anyway
13:10:46 <advil> interesting
13:10:59 <advil> that code gave me a bad feeling I have to say
13:11:13 <advil> the stuff in tileweb.cc
13:17:45 <Cheibriados> 03Aliscans02 {wheals} 07* 0.27-a0-275-gfa7a5ec: Rename lua_persist::string as lua_persist::text. 10(25 hours ago, 1 file, 3+ 3-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/fa7a5ec6c48c
13:17:45 <Cheibriados> 03Aliscans02 {wheals} 07* 0.27-a0-276-g67906b0: Make _ability_quiver_range_check() static. 10(25 hours ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/67906b04340d
13:32:19 <Kelbell> Unstable branch on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.27-a0-276-g67906b0434 (34)
13:56:55 <Pinkbeast> advil: Thanks again for taking a look at what was at your end a pretty trivial docs bug
13:57:10 * Pinkbeast unearths his list of serious bugs # joke
14:41:05 <gammafunk> which code in tileweb.cc gave you a bad feeling?
14:41:08 <gammafunk> now I'm curious
14:42:01 <gammafunk> perhaps just m_next_view, the one that wheals mentioned
14:42:43 <Gretell> soul (L13 DEFE) Crash caused by signal #6: Aborted (Depths:4)
14:48:09 <Discord|> <12e​bering> !crashlog
14:48:10 <Discord|> <04C​erebot> 23358. soul, XL13 DEFE, T:16838 (milestone): http://crawl.develz.org/morgues/0.26/soul/crash-soul-20210204-194241.txt
14:49:11 <Discord|> <12e​bering> looks like another cdo memory limit?
14:49:56 <Discord|> <12e​bering> yes
14:51:23 <advil> it does seem to get hit on longer pregen runs, so I wonder if some memory is not getting released between levels
14:53:22 <Discord|> <12e​bering> @gammafunk did you/will you run objstats for 0.26? or did you for 0.25
14:54:26 <advil> gammafunk yeah the code that updated and sent the view
14:55:16 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> I have not yet ebering, but I should
14:55:31 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> you can feel free to run yourself, of course, but maybe I can get to that this weekend
14:55:43 <advil> also was not excited about the basic stuff for this in view.cc, ran across all this while trying to improve console flickering
14:56:34 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> it's not a super high priority since in practice people tend to run it themselves for specific purposes
14:56:34 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> but it's nice to have the pre-run data, of course
14:56:34 <Discord|> <12e​bering> I don't have the iron to do a big 1000 iters many different set-up runs
14:56:41 <Discord|> <12e​bering> trying to see what the impact removing gadget shops would have
14:56:56 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> yeah, often just 100 is enough to get a reasonable answer
14:57:25 <Discord|> <12e​bering> ya, have 100 running now
14:57:39 <Discord|> <12e​bering> but that's with the change, I kicked it off then went looking for the pre-run comparison point 🙂
14:57:49 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> rip
14:58:04 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> it takes about 8-10 hours to run those 4 workbook 1k iteration jobs
14:58:22 <Discord|> <09g​ammafunk> need to set it up on cdi so it's easier for me to kick off
15:21:34 -!- aidanh_ is now known as aidanh
15:39:22 <advil> hm I don't seem to be getting any very strange memory behavior locally that I can immediately spot
15:49:51 <advil> does anyone know if there's a way to use wizmode on cdo?
16:09:46 <kate-> i think it's manually enabled for dev accounts? so you'd probably need to poke someone with admin access if you don't have it already, i think my old account has it enabled but my current one doesn't
16:29:38 <alexjurkiewicz> someone has a game in a bad state on trunk:
16:29:41 <alexjurkiewicz> Feb 04 17:21:15 ip-172-26-2-230 python[28519]: INFO: #2068  P2782  Starting trunk.
16:29:43 <alexjurkiewicz> Feb 04 17:21:16 ip-172-26-2-230 python[28519]: INFO: #2068  P2782  ERR: /var/dcss/builds/dcss-trunk/0.27-a0-270-ga82526b/bin/../dat/des/builder/shops.des:566: Bad item name: 'ring of stealth'
16:30:15 <Discord|> <12e​bering> %git
16:30:16 <Discord|> <04C​erebot> Aliscans {wheals} * 0.27-a0-276-g67906b0: Make _ability_quiver_range_check() static. (28 hours ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/67906b04340d
16:30:34 <Discord|> <12e​bering> if you force-transfer them that des error was fixed in the next commit
16:31:43 <alexjurkiewicz> cool. I'll get them to try and confirm, thanks
16:54:53 <advil> yeah, that's bad rebuild timing basically
16:55:07 <advil> it happened on cko too, but was fixed on upgrading the savecs
17:10:00 <Cheibriados> 03ebering02 07* 0.27-a0-277-g024f7ef: Remove gadget shops 10(2 hours ago, 12 files, 28+ 34-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/024f7ef292e8
17:27:01 -!- Tiobot is now known as Guest44321
17:36:02 <Kelbell> Unstable branch on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.27-a0-277-g024f7ef292 (34)
18:23:31 <Lantell> Unstable branch on underhound.eu updated to: 0.27-a0-277-g024f7ef292 (34)
20:06:00 <Discord|> <10P​leasingFungus> big oops
20:09:20 <Cheibriados> 03Aliscans02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/1717 * 0.27-a0-236-g88406c5: Create a dbrand field in struct unrandart_entry. This is treated in the same way as the descrip one, except that a blank line is always left after each line in it. 10(6 minutes ago, 4 files, 66+ 34-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/88406c51775b
21:04:30 -!- amalloy_ is now known as amalloy
21:12:53 <Cheibriados> 03Aliscans02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/1717 * 0.27-a0-237-gf05506c: Replace tabs with spaces. 10(3 minutes ago, 2 files, 17+ 17-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/f05506cb318a
22:19:13 <kate-> oh, extremely belated response but i think PF mentioned boots of running the other day and i'd definitely be in favour of removing them (surprise), rampaging seems like a much more fun design space
22:20:04 <kate-> also helps make another step towards the mythical aut-based scoring being practical......
22:43:34 <nicolae_> nice, y'all got rid of food while i was gone