01:34:23 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.26-a0-489-g112e8ad46e (34) 01:55:05 Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.26-a0-489-g112e8ad46e 03:12:00 Unstable branch on crawl.beRotato.org updated to: 0.26-a0-489-g112e8ad (34) 03:30:52 Fork (bcrawl) on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.23-a0-3526-ge83b935abd 03:35:01 Fork (bcadrencrawl) on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.22.1-2918-g0f80f4ea4d 03:36:51 03wheals02 07* 0.26-a0-490-gf8362a0: Fix draconian acid breath. 10(21 minutes ago, 1 file, 2+ 6-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/f8362a0c9817 04:30:00 -!- amalloy is now known as amalloy_ 06:01:50 Unstable branch on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.26-a0-490-gf8362a0c98 (34) 07:46:08 tape (L6 SpEn) Crash caused by signal #6: Aborted (D (Sprint)) 09:28:40 steves (L15 FoAK) Crash caused by signal #6: Aborted (Lair:6) 12:16:29 Invisible oklob plant reveals information about itself when being hit. 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=12334 by Yermak 13:06:52 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.26-a0-490-gf8362a0 (34) 13:45:59 !lg * ktyp=zot -log 13:45:59 13. negi3, XL27 GrEE, T:126741: http://lazy-life.ddo.jp:8080/morgue/negi3/morgue-negi3-20200803-153021.txt 13:46:42 not sure of the exact cause but this player basically got locked out of finishing hell because they were slow in the vestibule 13:46:56 probably they were doing their resting there rather than in hell branches? 13:48:01 I also suspect that from the log they may have thought that exploring other levels would get them more time in the vestibule 13:48:23 I wonder if all of hell should have a shared bank? 13:57:52 advil: yeah, it's certainly possible to do a bunch of stair dancing in vestibul from the 4 hells if you're scumming hell effect spawns 13:58:15 which is a sort of tedious tactic we'd target with the clock 13:59:16 but it's possible that vestibul is going to see a good deal of resting just from retreating from hell branches and resting up to try again 13:59:29 which is not something we'd want to disincentivize either 14:00:00 I wonder if a Dungeon-style shared bank for vestibule+4 hells would be good, like you say 14:01:20 yeah, there's a fine line between normal resting in hell and scumming 14:01:32 seems like it would still allow a fair amount of stair scumming but at least not infinitely much; I guess you'd want to game it by periodically visiting new hell branches (just level 1) 14:02:05 probably if you're playing hell normally it'd be fine? 14:02:55 where I guess what I mean by "normally" is basically diving, but possibly resting outside branches or exiting to rest of badd effects 14:03:12 I think so; if you have an especially weak character, you might have to retreate several times withing each hell branch 14:03:33 yeah, even if you are diving, having to retreat is common; I guess that's mostly just hell:7 14:04:32 it seems pretty reasonable that forward progress in general in hell should give you more time in the vestibule, it's just that "forward progress" is kind of different than in other parts of the game because of the subbranch structure 14:04:48 yeah 14:05:55 you could certainly argue that it's part of the extended challenge that you can't spend a lot of time in vestibul 14:06:06 but that's verging a bit into using the clock for gameplay challenge 14:06:17 right, I'm not sure if this clock is quite set up to balance this specific issue 14:06:34 well, not the anti-grinding-and-tedious-tactics side of challenge, but another use of the clock 14:06:42 which is what we got away from with removing food in the first place 14:06:49 since it's pretty hard to keep track of how much time you've spent in the vestibule I think 14:07:04 seems ok to me to link them for now 14:07:37 because of the current bank cap it would mean that really slow play in some subbranch could impact others, not sure if that's going to matter 14:07:37 likely the structure of hell will change in the near term anyhow 14:07:37 and wheals has proposed not capping the banks 14:07:39 hell reform?? 14:07:47 extended reform in general 14:08:12 but I'm not sure what the scope of that will be; ebering mentioned he was interested, so we'd have to see what ideas he had 15:49:23 -!- toblu3 is now known as toblu 16:04:20 New branch created: targeted-commands (1 commit) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/tree/targeted-commands 16:04:20 03advil02 07[targeted-commands] * 0.26-a0-490-gf8c989f: Rudimentary API for programmatic targeting 10(6 minutes ago, 10 files, 82+ 23-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/f8c989fb4092 16:08:47 03advil02 07[targeted-commands] * 0.26-a0-490-g3afe30d: Rudimentary API for programmatic targeting 10(11 minutes ago, 10 files, 81+ 23-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/3afe30d01408 16:18:08 04Build failed for 08targeted-commands @ f8c989fb 06https://github.com/crawl/crawl/actions/runs/193800071 16:22:11 The build has errored. (targeted-commands - f8c989f #14128 : advil): https://travis-ci.org/crawl/crawl/builds/714603193 16:55:46 ./deps.py: Command failed (Command '['sudo', 'bash', '/tmp/llvm.sh']' returned non-zero exit status 100.) 17:06:47 fascinating 17:06:50 also cool branch 17:12:30 The build passed. (targeted-commands - 3afe30d #14129 : advil): https://travis-ci.org/crawl/crawl/builds/714604175 17:16:09 thx 17:16:23 still got to make it a cool implementation 18:23:40 Unstable branch on underhound.eu updated to: 0.26-a0-490-gf8362a0c98 (34) 18:30:03 maybe the vestibule should pause the clock. That would be a simpler solution 18:31:47 I have to admit I was hoping to have nowhere where apocalypsing would be possible 18:32:09 it does seem like there's not a lot of scumming potential in the vestibule though 18:33:56 definitely prefer a single shared hell clock to an unclocked vestibule 18:34:17 advil: I sent this in pm and I'm not sure you saw it but now is probably a good time for the removedness blog post :) 18:34:20 (I 18:34:46 ah, I have a bunch of work I'd need to do for that 18:34:49 (I've got a vague personal goal of having weekly-ish blog content this cycle but it doesn't feel like there's enough for a trunk update) 18:34:57 rerun scripts on 0.25 + current trunk 18:35:05 dang anything I can do to help 18:35:12 since i drafted it mid-late 0.25 18:52:40 it's always better to not overcommit to blog posts anyhow 18:53:28 just has a habit of starting as a plan that peters out after a couple times 18:58:06 the removedness post seems vaguely connected to another thing we did way back when, but didn't really properly do anything with it: a crawl survey 18:58:55 with all these fairly radical changes in 0.26, might be something to consider doing properly again, since we have more active people who might not mind doing some of the data processing (that we didn't do last time) 18:59:49 just a thought if anyone is interested in the idea; we did a google survey where the results were exportable to a spreadsheet 19:00:32 we just never cleaned up, analyzed, or reported on the spreadsheets; was done in En, Kr, and Ja 19:39:53 ebering, does autoexploring out of a cloud have the same problem? 20:14:26 blog content or 'blontent' 20:15:40 i have no opinion about the vestibule thing for now. i may have an opinion later, but if anyone wants to take action, they have my blessing 20:19:42 Does anyone know why do we have default --more-- on "You finish merging with the rock."? It's really annoying. 0.21 didn't have that. 20:33:58 %git 3df51eec349 20:33:58 07Medar02 * 0.18-a0-648-g3df51ee: Replace many more() calls with default force_more_message options. 10(4 years, 8 months ago, 13 files, 71+ 31-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/3df51eec349b 20:34:31 Yermak sorry, it's been a force_more since 2015 and was a hard-coded more before that 20:34:54 but it does seem a bit unnecessary 20:50:15 Sublimation of Blood: converts some of the caster's blood into magical energy. Wereblood: transforms some of the caster's blood into that of a were-beast. 20:50:34 But one can be used with statue form, and the other - cannot. 20:52:22 advil, huh, apparently I'm wrong about 0.21. 20:55:37 well, there's always the possibility that some bug interfered before then 21:18:00 UristMcRaven (L21 GnCj) ASSERT(isnormal(n)) in 'ray.cc' at line 189 failed. (Vaults:2) 21:18:45 ASSERT(cooky == QUIVER_COOKIE); (void)cooky; 21:18:45 stupid c (c++?) quesiton, what does `(void)cooky;` even do? 21:30:42 (also if someone gives me credentials for @crawlcode I will post that) 21:46:48 hi hi crawldev 21:47:39 does anyone here happen to know how the experience modifiers in mon-data.h were assigned? this seems kind of arbitrary 21:48:43 your best bet is using git blame to do crawlarchaeology 21:48:49 but i'd bet they're a patchwork mess of nonsense 21:49:42 advil: embarrassingly, despite having created that account, i don't remember the current pw 21:49:51 like, i'm trying to figure out appropriate values for "kobold-ish +~3 unique", but i'm looking at some uniques in what would be similar depths and it's like 21:50:03 terence: xp mod 20 21:50:07 jessica: xp mod 125 21:50:09 like, what 21:52:58 anyway, thanks PF 22:15:53 A lot of them are weird because the logic to generate XP values for monsters is so specific 22:16:20 And uniques often break the logic in differing ways 22:17:44 yeah i'm looking at this and it seems like it's probably intended to be some function of xp return based off of hp or hd with a manual adjustment for whatever the unique has going on difficulty wise, but it's hard to tell 22:34:04 Yermak: the travel_one_unsafe_move option does not work with the "autoexplore" travel mode, regardless of the obstacle, the underlying reason is the same in each case 22:35:22 whose crawl is it anyway where the xp is made up and score doesn't matter 22:41:54 -!- amalloy_ is now known as amalloy 23:05:57 @??terence 23:05:57 Terence (11@) | Spd: 10 | HD: 2 | HP: 17-24 | AC/EV: 6/8 | Dam: 5 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors | Res: 06magic(10) | XP: 35 | Sz: Medium | Int: human. 23:05:59 @??jessica 23:05:59 Jessica (15@) | Spd: 10 | HD: 1 | HP: 8-11 | AC/EV: 2/10 | Dam: 5 | natural, 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, evil, spellcaster | Res: 06magic(10) | XP: 37 | Sp: pain (d14), slow, haste, blink | Sz: Medium | Int: human. 23:06:06 same xp lol 23:06:08 @??big kobold 23:06:08 big kobold (08K) | Spd: 10 | HD: 5 | HP: 24-31 | AC/EV: 3/12 | Dam: 7 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors | Res: 06magic(20) | Chunks: 14noxious | XP: 97 | Sz: Medium | Int: human. 23:06:11 @??kobold 23:06:11 kobold (07K) | Spd: 10 | HD: 1 | HP: 3-4 | AC/EV: 2/12 | Dam: 4 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors | Chunks: 14noxious | XP: 1 | Sz: small | Int: human. 23:06:16 less xp 23:47:10 big kobold so tanky 23:47:19 but now I find out it's because they dodge even with big fat belly 23:50:18 gotta juke