02:48:38 <Gretell> Monster database of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.23-a0-577-g2b1de94
03:53:07 <Kelbell> Webtiles server stopped.
03:53:16 <Kelbell> Webtiles server started.
05:32:55 <Cheibriados> Game doesn't show my quivered items. 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=11787 by Killmatronix
10:01:43 <Cheibriados> Opening a door shafted me 2 floors 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=11788 by RoGGa
10:02:57 -!- THE_GIAGGOSTUONO is now known as eb
12:24:02 <Cheibriados> Ceiling hatch deposited me inside a transporter vault 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=11789 by MainiacJoe
12:24:22 <ebering> !blame gammafunk
12:24:23 <Sequell> I pronounce gammafunk... Guilty!
12:29:19 <Cheibriados> Died in spider nest and game crashed without showing morgue or final character screen 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=11790 by conquersex
12:29:53 <Cheibriados> 03ebering02 07* 0.23-a0-578-gfddc42b: Consider dispersal traps impassible in levelgen 10(75 minutes ago, 1 file, 2+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/fddc42b1e8eb
12:29:53 <Cheibriados> 03ebering02 07* 0.23-a0-579-g6f77609: Adjust dispersal sequencing 10(66 minutes ago, 1 file, 2+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/6f776099ac90
12:29:53 <Cheibriados> 03ebering02 07* 0.23-a0-580-gf63cd86: Don't place monsters on traps 10(24 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 7-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/f63cd86e0c8c
12:29:53 <Cheibriados> 03ebering02 07* 0.23-a0-581-g66906bf: Only trigger traps in player sight 10(17 minutes ago, 1 file, 59+ 94-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/66906bf02876
12:32:54 <Kelbell> Unstable branch on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.23-a0-581-g66906bf028 (34)
12:56:33 <ebering> the last one of those might be controversial
13:08:35 <switch__> could it affect edge cases like a player trying to utilize a trap that is just out of los?
13:09:33 <switch__> sorry, that question was worded kind of poorly. the actual question is, do (we) care about <x> ^
13:11:19 <switch__> just off the top of my head, it probably won't happen super often, but if you're trying to shaft a monster that's following you and you move out of los of the shaft trap, and the monster walks over it, that'd feel pretty weird
13:12:49 <ebering> well, monsters already have a chance to avoid traps that are known to them
13:12:59 <ebering> which is all traps, since traps are now known
13:13:07 <switch__> in a corridor, i mean
13:13:16 <ebering> yes. I know.
13:13:22 <switch__> oh, i understand
13:13:23 <ebering> monsters can walk over traps without triggering them sometimes
13:13:33 <ebering> well, they can for shafts and mechanicals
13:13:49 <switch__> i think it would lead the player to assume the latter happened, rather than the former
13:13:58 <switch__> which could make them make that mistake again
13:14:04 <switch__> (assuming they're aware)
13:15:21 <switch__> but i agree with the general idea, i don't think traps across the screen should trigger out of los
13:15:26 <switch__> for the reasons you provided
13:15:49 <|amethyst> ebering:  hm, the commit message for 723c74fb6 gives one rationale, but the added comment gives a different one
13:16:05 <|amethyst> ebering:  Wouldn't be terrible to include both rationales in the in-code comment
13:16:21 <|amethyst> (Don't make alarm traps permanent)
13:17:41 <switch__> maybe some kind of intelligent turn-based activation/de-activation of traps based on player los
13:22:16 <ebering> |amethyst: looks like an artefact of a careless rebase. that comment should go above the check and the other one (about not abusing permanent) should be on that line
13:22:20 <ebering> |amethyst: thanks!
13:22:46 <Cheibriados> 03ebering02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/916 * 0.23-a0-586-gafa89c0: fixup! Adjust Triple Draw and Deal Four 10(3 minutes ago, 1 file, 2+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/afa89c08cd28
13:24:30 <gammafunk> fixup!
13:25:09 <gammafunk> I had meant to remove the zot trap message for out of LOS triggering
13:25:12 <gammafunk> so this does that already
13:25:43 <gammafunk> out of los alarm trap triggering doesn't seem a very good thing
13:25:59 <gammafunk> out of los teleport trap tiggering is a less bad thing that's been lost by that change
13:26:22 <gammafunk> old alarm traps sort of worked better out of los but now they definitely don't
13:26:34 <ebering> well new alarm traps already didn't fire out of los
13:27:13 <Cheibriados> 03ebering02 07* 0.23-a0-582-g1b4a0ca: Elaborate in a comment (|amethyst) 10(2 minutes ago, 1 file, 2+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/1b4a0ca2fb01
13:27:25 <gammafunk> well, ok that's true, but then they were another exception
13:27:33 <gammafunk> exception or no, definitely better that they require LOS
13:28:13 <gammafunk> I don't think that los of out of los teleport traps is that big a deal...however it does more relegate teleport traps to very specific vault shenanigens
13:28:19 <gammafunk> in terms of them doing very much
13:29:00 <gammafunk> by "very specific" I basically just mean the case of using it to disperse monsters that have woken up out of a vault into the level
13:29:06 <gammafunk> that case is now gone
13:29:26 <ebering> it was my intent to remove that case
13:29:45 <ebering> since it's a spoiler: if you know a vault has tele traps in it you can wake it up with much less risk and fight monsters one on one
13:29:56 <gammafunk> right, I'm not commenting on intent
13:30:01 <gammafunk> I'm asking whether it was a good case
13:30:24 <gammafunk> and more to the point I think it's getting close to the case that teleports have less reason to be a thing
13:30:35 <gammafunk> I think it may just be the case that they should all be replaced with dispersal traps
13:30:47 <gammafunk> s/teleports/teleport traps/
13:32:09 <Kelbell> Unstable branch on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.23-a0-582-g1b4a0ca2fb (34)
13:32:12 <gammafunk> the most notable use case of them is in hall_of_zot, where I don't think they achieve too much
13:33:26 <ebering> That's definitely a possiblity: I'd hinted as much in my trap commits
13:48:51 <ebering> That's definitely a possiblity: I'd hinted as much in my trap commits
13:48:58 <ebering> oops
13:51:48 <gammafunk> !fixup
13:51:56 <gammafunk> I mean
13:51:58 <gammafunk> fixup!
13:59:04 <Pinkbeast> Is https://github.com/elliptic/dcss_henzell the right repository
13:59:04 <Pinkbeast> please ?
14:01:09 <gammafunk> you want
14:01:10 <gammafunk> ??sizell[2
14:01:10 <switch__> the main repository is https://github.com/crawl/crawl , if that's what you mean
14:01:11 <Sequell> sizell ~ sizzell[2/2]: Source at https://github.com/crawl/sizzell
14:01:25 <gammafunk> no, that's not what Pinkbeast was asking about
14:01:34 <gammafunk> I think that's elliptic's old clone of henzell
14:01:36 <Pinkbeast> gammafunk: Thanks (and switch__ thanks, but indeed wrong question)
14:02:50 <Pinkbeast> Oh, thank Eris, it's Perl for a change
14:03:53 <switch__> speaking of languages that are fun to read, why is the cloud generator code lua? has anyone made a serious attempt to rewrite it in C, or is that todo?
14:05:12 <Pinkbeast> Is that why Desolation of Salt runs like a drain? ;-)
14:05:16 <switch__> yep
14:06:04 <switch__> i saw a post on the wiki talking about it being a todo, so i'm actually just asking if anyone's already put effort into it since then
14:07:03 <geekosaur> switch__, pleasingfungus was working on it at one point. it ran into a number of problems inclding increasing load because C++ loops etc. run much tighter than lua loops
14:07:23 <switch__> as in, the game actually ran slower?
14:08:59 <switch__> no way he wrote these findings in a public place, right?
14:09:37 <Pinkbeast> ICBW but I guess rather that one game was more prone to sucking an entire CPU core rather than, say, blocking on disc
14:11:48 <geekosaur> might find them in channel; logs from back then
14:18:41 <switch__> i definitely wouldn't have been in the channel at the time
14:18:45 <switch__> are those hosted somewhere?
14:20:22 <ebering> from the channel title Logs: http://s-z.org/crawl-dev/
14:46:32 <switch__> oic, thanks!
14:52:56 <geekosaur> I thought I'd pointed you at that before, sorry
14:54:27 <geekosaur> andit's not so much that the game ran slower. on an unloaded system the animations were smoother. but do that on a server with a bunch of games and animations bring it to its knees
14:54:58 <geekosaur> (not directly tested as such, remembered from when they hit something similar with autotravel animation, leading to
14:55:01 <geekosaur> ??footprints
14:55:02 <Sequell> footprints[1/1]: The new show_travel_trail option is now the default, showing your footsteps as you go. Set show_travel_trail = false in your rcfile to turn it off.
14:55:56 <geekosaur> without the move animtion you cant tell how you got there, hence "footprints" to compensate for turning that animation off to save the servers
14:59:49 <switch__> lol, these logs are like reading the diary of a man slowly losing his mind
15:00:01 <switch__> it looks like PF encountered way too much crawlcode when he tried to fuck with clouds
15:04:09 <geekosaur> yep
15:15:00 <minmay> don't the clouds make desolation too easy anyway?
15:20:54 * Pinkbeast shudders, it's quite bad enough already
15:25:50 <switch__> well, that was quick. can someone that's a good programmer explain what passing something like "int /* garbage */" to a function does?
15:26:33 <Pinkbeast> switch__: Nothing, comment-wise... got an example?
15:27:00 <gammafunk> it's a common thing in methods of subclasses
15:27:13 <gammafunk> it's just because a subclass method doesn't need that argument
15:27:19 <gammafunk> but it much have the correct signature
15:27:23 <gammafunk> s/much/must/
15:27:48 <switch__> https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/l-dgn.cc#L1204 pinkbeast, old code that brings up the topic in the logs https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/e094bde24f5f05ea142fc9493e072a19003f285d/crawl-ref/source/l_dgn.cc#L1181
15:28:01 <gammafunk> so player/monster class methods that are defined in the actor class
15:28:43 <switch__> gotcha, i think i understand
15:29:03 <Kelbell> Experimental (new-nemelex) branch on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.23-a0-586-gafa89c08cd
15:29:14 <switch__> (the extremely general idea, anyway)
15:47:37 <switch__> i'm having trouble finding the part where he gives up
15:48:10 <switch__> or is that exactly how it went
15:49:24 <geekosaur> pretty much. slow fade into oblivion rather than splat or even fizzle
16:21:13 <Cheibriados> Sif Muna gives gift message, but no book, when player already has all spells in library 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=11791 by jrmartel
16:23:14 <switch__> i gotta say, these logs would be extremely bland, if not for gamma's jokes
16:28:54 <jrmartel> I'm taking discussion of a little bug to here from ##crawl
16:29:04 <jrmartel> How do y'all think I should resolve https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=11791
16:29:37 <jrmartel> I was thinking no more gifts, and the ^ screen will change to reflect that once you add the last spell to your library
16:37:19 <gammafunk> jrmartel: Yeah, that sounds like a pretty good approach
16:37:27 <gammafunk> I can't really comment on what the best menu location would be to display this information
16:37:57 <gammafunk> ah, just in the listing of the passive
16:38:22 <gammafunk> the text could change accordingly
16:49:00 -!- Rast-- is now known as rast
17:08:55 <Cheibriados> 03ebering02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/916 * 0.23-a0-587-gce1bd7d: fixup! Iconography and gui elements for decks 10(3 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/ce1bd7d098ab
17:20:42 <Kelbell> Experimental (new-nemelex) branch on crawl.kelbi.org updated to: 0.23-a0-587-gce1bd7d098
17:21:33 -!- werekitten is now known as isha
18:20:58 <Lantell> Unstable branch on underhound.eu updated to: 0.23-a0-582-g1b4a0ca2fb (34)
19:22:00 -!- MarvinPA_ is now known as MarvinPA
19:28:54 <ebering> !tell MarvinPA I'd like to merge new-nem in the next week or so, but not before I hear from you again
19:28:55 <Sequell> ebering: OK, I'll let marvinpa know.
19:29:07 <ebering> gammafunk: also interested in your further thoughts if you've got them
19:29:33 <gammafunk> I'll have to final take a look, maybe can do tonight after these vids upload
19:29:43 <gammafunk> ...take a final look, I mean
19:30:50 <gammafunk> would you believe that wheals says bring back Merc card or the branch gets deleted? would you believe he said that?
19:34:37 <ebering> no I wouldn't
19:34:41 <ebering> wheals wouldn't do me like that
19:37:55 <gammafunk> rats
19:44:03 <ProzacElf> i'd believe it!
20:50:01 -!- Tiobot is now known as Guest3190
21:07:24 <conquersex> i just picked up the swamp rune from a very weird place, it had lava surrounding it, if i hadn't found a ring of flight my mibe wouldn't have been able to pick it up. Is this a bug?
21:09:04 <conquersex> it also had exclusions marked on it but i didn't do them. single tile exclusions, lots of them
21:10:30 <conquersex> I just checked and there is a way in but i don't know why it is travel excluded. i can reach there by walking though so not a faulty vault.
22:05:09 <conquersex> bug report - i'm in the spider nest completely surrounded by spiders of various kinds. There is space at the edge of my los for a summon to appear but trog's brother in arms is not working. it doesn't give me a message that 'you fail to use your ability' it just isn't working. i do become more hungry. playing as mibe on spider nest 3
22:12:38 <conquersex> it's working at other places
22:26:10 <minmay> you can't summon monsters further than 2 squares away from you
22:26:21 <minmay> so if there are no free spaces within 2 squares nothing will be summoned
22:28:32 <conquersex> minmay: didn't know that, thanks!