00:28:57 Unstable branch on CRAWL.XTAHUA.COM updated to: 0.22-a0-355-g201945f (34) 02:34:05 03Aidan Holm02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/728 * 0.22-a0-355-ge285447: Add CK_RESIZE to console input handling 10(6 months ago, 4 files, 57+ 15-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/e2854476136e 02:34:05 03Aidan Holm02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/728 * 0.22-a0-356-gb67bfc1: Add tile_def_info() helper 10(5 months ago, 1 file, 8+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/b67bfc122b2c 02:34:05 03Aidan Holm02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/728 * 0.22-a0-357-g6693722: Add hierarchical UI system 10(5 months ago, 4 files, 801+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/669372297a76 02:34:05 03Aidan Holm02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/728 * 0.22-a0-358-g6764949: Add widget preferred size caching 10(5 months ago, 2 files, 16+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/6764949cf002 02:34:05 03Aidan Holm02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/728 * 0.22-a0-359-g0d7ff35: Add crt/sdl-specific widget margin helpers 10(5 months ago, 1 file, 13+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/0d7ff3511e5b 02:34:05 03Aidan Holm02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/728 * 0.22-a0-360-g8a8655a: Add rowspan, colspan, and flex_grow to grid 10(5 months ago, 2 files, 84+ 56-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/8a8655a72075 02:34:05 03Aidan Holm02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/728 * 0.22-a0-361-gf05e9dd: Add UI scissor stack 10(5 months ago, 2 files, 50+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/f05e9dd0e119 02:34:05 03Aidan Holm02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/728 * 0.22-a0-362-g41cf65f: Add text widget 10(4 months ago, 2 files, 188+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/41cf65fd5226 02:34:05 03Aidan Holm02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/728 * 0.22-a0-363-g74dfc4c: Only render visible grid rows 10(5 months ago, 2 files, 41+ 10-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/74dfc4cb1eea 02:34:05 03Aidan Holm02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/728 * 0.22-a0-364-gc9f5491: Add UI widget event observer API 10(4 months ago, 4 files, 307+ 50-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/c9f5491cbfd3 02:34:05 ... and 83 more commits 02:34:12 03Aidan Holm02 07[ui-overhaul] * 0.22-a0-355-ge285447: Add CK_RESIZE to console input handling 10(6 months ago, 4 files, 57+ 15-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/e2854476136e 02:34:12 03Aidan Holm02 07[ui-overhaul] * 0.22-a0-356-gb67bfc1: Add tile_def_info() helper 10(5 months ago, 1 file, 8+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/b67bfc122b2c 02:34:12 03Aidan Holm02 07[ui-overhaul] * 0.22-a0-357-g6693722: Add hierarchical UI system 10(5 months ago, 4 files, 801+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/669372297a76 02:34:12 03Aidan Holm02 07[ui-overhaul] * 0.22-a0-358-g6764949: Add widget preferred size caching 10(5 months ago, 2 files, 16+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/6764949cf002 02:34:12 03Aidan Holm02 07[ui-overhaul] * 0.22-a0-359-g0d7ff35: Add crt/sdl-specific widget margin helpers 10(5 months ago, 1 file, 13+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/0d7ff3511e5b 02:34:12 03Aidan Holm02 07[ui-overhaul] * 0.22-a0-360-g8a8655a: Add rowspan, colspan, and flex_grow to grid 10(5 months ago, 2 files, 84+ 56-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/8a8655a72075 02:34:12 03Aidan Holm02 07[ui-overhaul] * 0.22-a0-361-gf05e9dd: Add UI scissor stack 10(5 months ago, 2 files, 50+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/f05e9dd0e119 02:34:12 03Aidan Holm02 07[ui-overhaul] * 0.22-a0-362-g41cf65f: Add text widget 10(4 months ago, 2 files, 188+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/41cf65fd5226 02:34:12 03Aidan Holm02 07[ui-overhaul] * 0.22-a0-363-g74dfc4c: Only render visible grid rows 10(5 months ago, 2 files, 41+ 10-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/74dfc4cb1eea 02:34:12 03Aidan Holm02 07[ui-overhaul] * 0.22-a0-364-gc9f5491: Add UI widget event observer API 10(4 months ago, 4 files, 307+ 50-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/c9f5491cbfd3 02:34:12 ... and 83 more commits 02:36:14 !tell johnstein ok, all (known) bugs fixed; ui-overhaul is ready for an experimental whenever you have time 02:36:14 aidanh: OK, I'll let johnstein know. 03:25:57 Unstable branch on crawl.beRotato.org updated to: 0.22-a0-355-g201945f (34) 04:25:59 New branch created: pull/739 (1 commit) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/739 04:25:59 03Nikolai Lavsky02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/739 * 0.22-a0-355-g69f6f62: Remove books from shopping list on pickup (Kipster) 10(29 minutes ago, 1 file, 3+ 5-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/69f6f6212b12 04:51:23 -!- amalloy is now known as amalloy_ 07:38:24 -!- wHATEver is now known as Guest38106 13:07:13 -!- amalloy_ is now known as amalloy 13:25:14 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.22-a0-355-g201945f (34) 14:30:19 -!- Bammboobies is now known as Bammboo 16:32:34 I'm trying to cast mephitic cloud at Urug right now and getting the message "No susceptible monsters in range." Urug is wearing a shiny chain mail which I assume has rPois. Is this behavior intentional or is information about egos leaking out? I'm playing git on CBRO, username RepHenryClay, game is saved. 16:45:41 is there a balance reason to have a stepdown applied to spell skills for spell failure? 16:46:21 the stepdown only seems to be applied when skills are very highly trained, e.g. 20 spellcasting and 20 in the relevant spell schools 16:47:00 one benefit to removing this stepdown is that we should be able to accurately describe spellcasting penalties from armour and shields in-game in understandable terms 16:47:45 e.g. "Wearing this chain mail will reduce spellcasting success by an effect equivalent to -7.5 skill points" or something similar 16:48:45 the urug thing is an info leak, though a known one 16:52:32 gotcha, just checking 17:00:33 !tell elliptic do you know if there's any specific reason to step down the contribution from spell skills at high skill levels? 17:00:34 CanOfWorms: OK, I'll let elliptic know. 17:01:07 !tell elliptic removing the stepdown would allow the game to inform players about armour/shield spellcasting penalties in a reasonably straightforward way 17:01:08 CanOfWorms: OK, I'll let elliptic know. 17:01:24 where is the stepdown? I have no memory of this 17:01:25 elliptic: You have 2 messages. Use !messages to read them. 17:02:19 let me get it 17:04:05 !source spl-cast.cc:477 17:04:06 https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/spl-cast.cc#L477 17:04:25 the calculations for spell success use the same function as spellpower, which passes everything through a stepdown 17:06:06 !source spl-cast.cc:324 17:06:07 https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/spl-cast.cc#L324 17:06:15 oh, that stepdown 17:06:22 that affects things long long before skill 20 17:06:29 it's incredibly significant 17:06:47 ??spell power 17:06:48 spell power[1/5]: (Spellcasting/2 + 2*avg school skill) * INT/10 * (1.5 ^ enhancer count). Spellpower has diminishing returns over 50: http://tinyurl.com/oeme7aj - Stepdown formula is min(pow, 200, 50*log_2(1 + pow/50)). Capped at 200. Negative spell enhancers use 0.5, not 0.66. 17:07:02 that's for spellpower, though 17:07:04 at least I think it's the same as that stepdown 17:07:08 yeah, it is 17:07:39 but I think pow is spellcasting/2 + schoolaverage*2 when plugged into that function 17:07:46 you mean specifically when that function is used for spell success? 17:07:51 yeah 17:10:40 yeah, I see 17:13:20 I wonder if this was ever intended 17:13:37 it is at least somewhat significant though 17:15:27 e.g. at skills 24, that stepdown makes them effectively 22.75 for failure rate computation 17:15:49 yeah 17:16:42 this kind of situation mostly comes up either for casters wanting to cast level 8/9 spells, maybe level 7 spells too 17:16:52 or heavy armour casters that want level 6+ spells 17:19:28 my guess is that the balance effects are acceptably small that this is worth cleaning up 17:19:48 could also maybe compensate by making level 9 spells harder to cast in general 17:19:52 yeah 17:21:27 I guess things are being scaled by 6 before being compared with the difficulty_by_level table 17:23:03 I think in the current situation, at 27 spellcasting/schools, a level 9 spell has roughly the same failure as a level 1 spell with 0 spellcasting/schools 17:23:57 I'm looking at 24 spellcasting/schools as a more reasonable point, and it looks like increasing the difficulty_by_level by 20 should roughly compensate for removing the stepdown 17:24:17 and if we're tweaking spell success rates there's a weird bump in the progression curve 17:24:39 the difference between level 3/4 is higher than the difference between level 4/5 17:24:52 of course often people have lower skills so probably increasing by less than 20 is good 17:25:46 I think I'd suggest 330 -> 340 and remove stepdown for spell fail calculations 17:25:57 alright 17:26:29 you could make level 5 spells a bit harder if you wanted but I don't really see that much point, the curve is going to be weird anyway 17:26:41 we probably want to adjust the curve leading up to level 9 to since that creates as significant gap between level 8 and 9 17:26:58 I summarized the analysis in a tavern post for reference: https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=25311 17:28:27 well for level 4 the main change would be swapping the delta values which would leave level 5 unchanged, but level 4 spells a bit easier to cast 17:28:35 a 0.5 level savings 17:30:29 honestly I don't see the point in changing this just for the sake of making the curve a little nicer-looking 17:30:47 level 4 spells are already very strong, don't think giving them to people a bit early is a good idea 17:30:53 alright 17:31:29 gap between power level for level 8 and level 9 spells is also rather high currently 17:32:16 yeah, removing the stepdown should make level 8s noticeably easier to cast 17:33:04 well maybe not for V worshippers or robe casters 17:33:27 I mean, I think because of wizardry and intelligence I'm usually not at the stepdown skill level when I start to cast L8 spells 17:33:35 yeah 17:34:41 but if you wanted to increase L8 to 265 that sounds fine too, or L9 to 345... honestly I think L8/9 spells might be a little easy to get to at the moment anyway 17:35:09 I'd bump up 8 and 9 by 10 each 17:35:41 that should increase the requirements for level 8 by about 1 skill level 17:35:56 I would bump up 9 by more than 8 whatever you do 17:36:02 alright 17:36:53 anyway I don't think this is a huge balance point, just a question of how easy we want it to be for players to get to L8/9 spells 17:37:24 do think some compensation for removing the stepdown is a good idea but exactly how much probably isn't that significant 17:37:42 yeah, I'm doing some wizmode testing and with 11 int 16 spellcasting/20 schools I can cast level 8 at 14% without wizardry 17:37:43 I'd be more concerned about adjusting L4/5 balance since that's more meaningful 17:38:03 I don't think the stepdown has a meaningful effect on level 4/5 17:38:08 right 17:38:15 I mean about what you were saying before about fixing up the curve 17:38:27 ah, yeah 17:38:47 stepdown mainly relevant for L9 spells, to a lesser extent L8 spells, and occasionally lower spells on heavy armor chars 17:39:03 I wasn't too concerned about level 4/5, it just looked weird 17:39:36 it is a bit weird, but I'd only want to touch those numbers alongside some more general spell rebalancing project 17:41:34 okay, I'll tweak the level 8 and 9 requirements and clean up the spellpower code since it has a lot of if !fail_rate_checks that can be merged into a single block 17:45:46 sounds good, that code is mostly remnants of extremely ancient code... 18:19:29 Unstable branch on underhound.eu updated to: 0.22-a0-355-g201945fe43 (34) 19:37:03 hi team 20:25:27 hola bh 20:43:20 I have come to ask for reviews / merge of the datafiles PR :) 20:46:41 might be a while depending on whether maybe aidanh or someone else has some time 20:47:09 advil's ghost branch is a bigger priority for me (probably for him as well), and after that I want to do the portal rework 20:56:19 -!- amalloy is now known as amalloy_ 20:57:35 fair enough 22:21:04 chequers: I'll take a look at it eventually, I just have kind of a deep stack right now and not much time lately, sorry 22:27:42 wonder how many stack frames advil has right now 22:27:52 to have such a deep stack 22:39:07 -!- amalloy_ is now known as amalloy 22:50:13 03CanOfWorms02 {GitHub} 07* 0.22-a0-356-g802c45d: Remove a stepdown in spell success calculations 10(11 seconds ago, 1 file, 23+ 27-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/802c45d0897b 22:54:56 neat 23:09:51 Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.22-a0-356-g802c45d089 (34) 23:21:56 03CanOfWorms02 {GitHub} 07* 0.22-a0-357-ga98e25f: Fix ordering in spellpower calculations 10(11 seconds ago, 1 file, 3+ 3-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/a98e25f71347 23:54:15 -!- Tux[Qyou] is now known as breaky 23:59:43 Unstable branch on CRAWL.XTAHUA.COM updated to: 0.22-a0-357-ga98e25f (34)