00:18:24 <Rast-> FR combine leech and bloodbane into one item
00:18:36 <Rast-> makes both of them more interesting imo
02:05:26 <amalloy> ??leech
02:05:27 <Sequell> leech[1/1]: The +8 demon blade "Leech" {vamp, rN+ AC-3 EV-3}. Has a guaranteed on-hit vampiric effect!
02:05:29 <amalloy> ??bloodbane
02:05:29 <Sequell> bloodbane[1/1]: Unrandart +8 vorpal demon blade that lets you berserk, makes you angry, and makes you less stealthy. The berserkitis triggers on 9% of attacks.
02:06:20 <amalloy> the +16 vampal demon blade "Leechbane"
02:23:40 <gammafunk> the thing is that leech is really really good
02:23:44 <gammafunk> because it's better vamp
02:28:47 <nikheizen> ??vampiric
02:28:47 <Sequell> vampiric[1/1]: On 60% of non-zero damage hits to natural holiness, not-summoned (includes trj spawns/god wrath/etc) targets without rN, heal 1d(damage) HP. Good gods hate it. You must be full to wield a vampiric weapon unless you are undead, and doing so will reduce your satiation.
02:30:11 <nikheizen> The sentence "Good gods hate it." always makes me think of those clickbait ads.
02:30:54 <nikheizen> I'm surprised that the % for regular vamp is as high as 60%.
03:11:43 <Rotatell> Unstable branch on crawl.beRotato.org updated to: 0.21-a0-338-g36cf2fc (34)
03:31:27 -!- amalloy is now known as amalloy_
03:33:31 -!- amalloy_ is now known as amalloy
05:30:14 -!- amalloy is now known as amalloy_
12:18:00 -!- amalloy_ is now known as amalloy
13:04:03 <Henzell> Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.21-a0-338-g36cf2fc (34)
15:14:10 <Rotatell> Parsimony (L17 GnWn) ASSERT((int)Buffer.size() == expanded_keys_left) in 'macro.cc' at line 544 failed. (Snake:3)
15:24:52 <amalloy> !crashlog
15:25:03 <Sequell> 17876. Parsimony, XL17 GnWn, T:35444 (milestone): http://crawl.berotato.org/crawl/morgue/Parsimony/crash-Parsimony-20171003-191402.txt
15:30:19 <geekosaur> seems less likely to be gn related than the old macro bug
15:32:34 <amalloy> !source _register_expanded_keys
15:32:35 <Sequell> 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/macro.cc#L404
15:35:12 <amalloy> !source prompt_for_quantity
15:35:12 <Sequell> 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/prompt.cc#L280
15:48:33 <amalloy> well, beats me
16:20:34 <advil> it could be related somehow to changes that I made to text input
16:20:52 <advil> I can't replicate it yet though, so it's not something simple like that prompt is broken
16:21:32 <advil> although ugh testing reveals that I broke ctrl-u
16:21:36 <advil> on console
16:24:05 <|amethyst> And webtiles text entry always sends ctrl-u to erase what might have been there before
16:24:05 <Sequell> |amethyst: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it.
16:24:40 <advil> yeah, but I'm pretty sure that works?
16:24:45 <|amethyst> !learn edit regretindex[1] s|.*|https://crawl.develz.org/wiki/doku.php?id=user:regret-index|
16:24:45 <Sequell> regretindex[1/1]: https://crawl.develz.org/wiki/doku.php?id=user:regret-index
16:24:56 <|amethyst> !lm Parsimony crash x=tiles
16:24:57 <Sequell> 1. [2017-10-03 19:14:02] [tiles=true] Parsimony the Frost Mage (L17 GnWn of Cheibriados) ASSERT((int)Buffer.size() == expanded keys left) in 'macro.cc' at line 544 failed on turn 35444. (Snake:3)
16:25:07 <advil> (ctrl-u works correctly on the buffer, it just doesn't print right)
16:25:17 <|amethyst> ah
16:26:50 <advil> so it'll be weird when there's a prefill in a message window, but that almost never happens
16:29:37 <advil> I did console first, so I must have broken this with some cleanup later and never went back and tested
17:27:51 <advil> "buffer[length = rest] = 0;;" is some borderline @crawlcode there
17:30:50 <amalloy> i'm not thrilled about the assignment-as-subexpression, but there are times when it is idiomatic C. the ;; is what really gets me
17:33:53 <advil> it tells a story
17:35:02 <gammafunk> haha
17:35:09 <gammafunk> why is it double semicolon?
17:35:29 <advil> I think it's just sloppiness, afaik that has no impact
17:35:43 <|amethyst> Let's see what git blame says
17:35:49 <advil> it's just a line that made me have to check the C standard twice in one line
17:35:51 <advil> guess
17:36:12 <geekosaur> hopefully whoever wrote that didn't think bourne shell got its ;; from C...
17:36:21 <|amethyst> kilobyte, hm
17:36:30 <|amethyst> looks like bad copy-paste maybe?
17:36:41 <|amethyst> since that same line occurs elsewhere with just one simicolon
17:36:59 <advil> yeah, I'm guessing it was just fast typing
17:41:27 <amalloy> i think you can construct a series of weird if/else clauses with dangling elses, such that if you wrapped those around the line in question the ;; would have an impact
17:42:00 <|amethyst> wouldn't have to be weird at all
17:42:18 <|amethyst> an if-else with this line (without {}) as the if body would do it
17:42:25 <|amethyst> if (foo)
17:42:28 <|amethyst> bar;;
17:42:29 <|amethyst> else
17:42:31 <|amethyst> baz;
17:42:41 <amalloy> |amethyst: i was having trouble constructing one where the ;; doesn't turn the `else` into a syntax error
17:42:52 <|amethyst> amalloy:  oh, I see
17:43:09 <|amethyst> amalloy:  you meant "impact" in the "underhanded C contest" sense :)
17:43:37 <amalloy> yes, kb would never sabotage the codebase by making it fail to compile! he would just heroically insert an extra ;; to keep someone from using if/else wrong
17:44:22 <advil> heh
17:44:34 <advil> man, as usual double wide characters mess things up for everyone
17:44:58 <amalloy> wide as in two bytes, or display size?
17:45:01 <advil> maybe I'll ignore them, the verison that I broke ignored them
17:45:04 <advil> display size
17:45:18 <advil> really kill to begin needs to calculate the strwidth of the thing it's killing
17:45:35 <advil> it's just not very elegant to do
17:45:47 <|amethyst> did it?  I remember working on a lot of code to make double-width characters work better, but I might not have handled ctrl-u
17:45:56 <|amethyst> ah, I think it was backspace that I was handling, not ctrl-u
17:46:37 <advil> btw I sort of broke those again in the name of making the code cleaner, some of the linewrapping interaction with double-wide chars doesn't work any more
17:47:06 <advil> you have to work at it to get it those issues to happen though
17:47:25 <advil> I'll fix it eventually, I left a note in the code for that one
17:48:03 <|amethyst> confusingly, Unicode calls those "fullwidth"
17:49:18 <|amethyst> and normal single-width characters are "halfwidth"
17:49:25 <|amethyst> though it tends to use those terms only when there are two different versions, and then only for the "non-default" width
17:49:40 <|amethyst> so you might have halfwidth kana, or fullwidth latin characters
17:51:27 <|amethyst> what's really annoying is that there's not really a good way, particularly in terminal mode, to tell which width a character has
17:51:53 <|amethyst> since wcwidth() is a property of the locale
17:52:02 <|amethyst> but your font might not agree with the locale
17:52:27 <|amethyst> this is sometimes an issue for people using clubs/spades as their trees, and intersect for their arches
17:52:50 <|amethyst> those are single-width according to the GNU foo.UTF-8 locales
17:53:03 <|amethyst> (or you wouldn't be able to use them at all as glyphs)
17:53:23 <advil> I'm definitely glad someone worked out the basics of this before I was working with the line_reader code :)
17:53:24 <|amethyst> but in some fonts they are double-width
17:54:15 <|amethyst> advil:  btw, next you're going to implement position-anywhere multi-line text boxes, right?
17:54:31 <|amethyst> that sounds "fun"
17:54:40 <wheals_> in console?
17:54:51 <|amethyst> yeah, obviously in webtiles it's trivial
17:55:06 <|amethyst> "obviously"..."trivial"
17:55:40 <advil> heh I think it's pretty doable, do we need them for something?
17:56:15 <advil> it would be fun in a painful sort of way
17:56:31 <|amethyst> advil:  in-game option editing maybe
17:56:41 <advil> yeah, reasonable
17:56:55 <|amethyst> of course all this should be usable in a scrollable menu
17:57:15 <advil> of course
17:57:24 <advil> can our menus currently scroll?
17:57:35 <advil> there's so many different kinds, I sort of lose track
17:58:08 <geekosaur> fsvo
17:58:08 <advil> actually re webtiles, I haven't yet done position-anywhere textboxes
17:58:09 <|amethyst> advil:  in formatted_scroller, which is a kind of menu
17:58:11 <|amethyst> "menu"
17:58:34 <|amethyst> this is used for the scrollable help pages for example
17:58:42 <advil> I was losing steam and wanted to get something "done"...but I'd still like to do webtiles position-anywhere menus also
17:58:43 <advil> ah ok
17:59:11 <advil> er, webtiles position-anywhere textboxes
17:59:11 <|amethyst> rewriting Menu from scratch sounds like a worthy challenge too
17:59:27 <advil> heh
17:59:28 <|amethyst> maybe I should add that as an Implementable, and tag it "simple" in the hopes of tricking somebody into working on it
18:00:07 <|amethyst> rewriting it might not actually be so bad: re*designing* it is the real problem
18:00:22 <gammafunk> oh
18:00:40 <advil> yeah, the design is a little hard to figure out sometimes
18:00:48 <gammafunk> MarvinPA_: |amethyst: advil: amalloy: https://github.com/crawl/crawl/wiki/0.21-Development-and-Release-Plan#player-ghosts
18:01:04 <gammafunk> lasty isn't here, but a bunch of ideas there are his
18:01:23 <gammafunk> I cobbled together a description of the major ideas I've heard for ghost reform
18:01:44 <gammafunk> since it may not be too much of a project and there may be multiple people willing to work on it
18:02:02 <advil> thanks for the writeup
18:02:10 <gammafunk> np, feel free to edit if you see mistakes
18:02:26 <|amethyst> gammafunk:  I think option 1, normalizing ghosts, would also need something done with spells
18:02:48 <gammafunk> |amethyst: I could certainly see this, but depending on how it's done, it could be tricky
18:02:53 <gammafunk> how do you decide what are appropriate spells
18:03:06 <gammafunk> spells are one of the main think that make hostile player ghosts interesting
18:03:15 <gammafunk> for those that believe hostile player ghosts are interesting at all, that is
18:03:17 <advil> |amethyst: thinking about it, I don't think I yet know what a gui library for dcss ought to be like. the console/local tiles/webtiles split is a big problem for sanity
18:03:17 <Lantell> Unstable branch on underhound.eu updated to: 0.21-a0-338-g36cf2fc (34)
18:04:00 <gammafunk> if hostile player ghosts that you fight are to remain a thing, to some extent they have to remain suitably distinct from other monsters you encounter on the level
18:04:27 <gammafunk> so you don't want to be too agressive with culling spells, although certainly you can still do some things for sanity
18:04:34 <|amethyst> gammafunk:  right, but I mean removing weapon brands and debuffing defenses/speed seems like it would "trivialize" melee ghosts
18:05:11 <gammafunk> potentially if done too much, but the proposals there give a few options
18:05:21 <gammafunk> I actually am not sure what Lasty recommended about speed
18:05:34 <gammafunk> he said "normalize speed values, possibly to 12"
18:05:42 <gammafunk> maybe he meant all ghosts should be speed 12 :o
18:06:09 <gammafunk> as far as defenses go, you can have high AC/EV without it being like "eresh levels of evasion and antaeus levels of AC"
18:06:38 <gammafunk> since monster don't have AC/EV values that are all that high, but yeah the whole thing is a kind of balancing act
18:06:46 <|amethyst> hm, looking further down the list, I think "Make Ghosts Harmless" should instead be "Remove Ghosts"
18:07:09 <|amethyst> If they do nothing but provide flavour, they don't have much reason to exist, potentially when that does nothing about the worst downsides
18:07:11 <gammafunk> as for weapon egos, I think disto and chaos are just a bad things to encounter frequenly
18:07:21 <gammafunk> you mean for offensive player names and such?
18:07:24 <|amethyst> yeah
18:07:36 <gammafunk> yeah, one thing I didn't put in this list is the possibility of name filters for registration
18:07:52 <gammafunk> perhaps it wouldn't be all that difficult to implement in webtiles, but I guess there are existing account names
18:07:56 <gammafunk> and maybe it's not a battle worth fighting
18:08:17 <gammafunk> but it's notable that things like the lobby listing and irc bots have the exact same problem
18:08:30 <gammafunk> those are optional features, of course
18:08:40 <|amethyst> yeah, but I feel like it's worse if they appear "in-game"
18:08:41 <gammafunk> |amethyst: oh, one thought I had if we either go with the harmless approach or the vault approach
18:08:53 <gammafunk> |amethyst: we could maybe then justify an RC option to disable ghosts?
18:09:21 <gammafunk> if we make it so that generation rates don't depend on player deaths
18:09:37 <gammafunk> then having players disable ghost creation in their games seems like it's less of a problem
18:09:46 <gammafunk> maybe that doesn't even require the harmless/vault approach
18:10:12 <|amethyst> my concern about RC options is whether there are situations where you'd want to change the option in the middle of the game
18:10:22 <|amethyst> if there are, the interface for doing that is really bad
18:10:29 <gammafunk> hrm, we could make it an option that only had effect at game start?
18:10:36 <|amethyst> yeah, that would work
18:11:13 <|amethyst> My suggestion:
18:11:15 <|amethyst> remove normal ghosts
18:11:37 <|amethyst> instead, after you get the orb, you have the option to avoid the orb run and instead take stairs to a new realm
18:11:45 <|amethyst> where you fight "ghosts" of winning players
18:12:00 <Cheibriados> 03advil02 07* 0.21-a0-339-ge64e265: Return kill-to-begin to its previous state 10(7 minutes ago, 1 file, 10+ 6-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/e64e265beb41
18:12:10 <|amethyst> in exchange for a bonus to score maybe, or a 16th rune or something
18:12:12 <|amethyst> or maybe just in exchange for not having to orb run
18:12:56 <|amethyst> and we could have some fall-back ghosts if there aren't enough winning players yet, or even to be mixed in with those if there are
18:13:02 <gammafunk> that's a pretty radical change to introduce in terms of gameplay impact
18:13:32 <|amethyst> I think the radical part is removing normal ghosts
18:13:36 <advil> ghostsprint
18:13:41 <gammafunk> it sounds like it's trying to solve a problem with the orb run and ghosts
18:13:42 <|amethyst> the other part only affects "extended"
18:13:57 <gammafunk> but forcing people who don't like the orb run to fight ghosts doesn't seem like a good approach
18:14:42 <gammafunk> it's an interesting take, but part of the fun of seeing ghosts (for those who find that fun)
18:15:06 <gammafunk> is "oh look here's an amalloy ghost. Yeah, chei worshiper, that figures!"
18:15:27 <gammafunk> that and getting the "fighting somethign different from the normal branch monster" thing
18:15:34 <gammafunk> *something
18:15:41 <|amethyst> I think the former is only fun for people who are heavily involved in the metagame
18:15:54 <|amethyst> 90% of players don't know who amalloy is I bet
18:16:01 <gammafunk> well it's not about metagame really; my example has nothing to do with that
18:16:15 <advil> maybe we should make them choose between food and ghosts at game start
18:16:16 <gammafunk> it's just "hey here's a player I recognize, now I fight them!"
18:16:20 <gammafunk> haha
18:17:23 <gammafunk> |amethyst: it sounds like you're mostly in the 'remove ghosts' camp, which is fine, but I don't think your proposal will really make anyone on the various sides very happy
18:17:24 <|amethyst> I'm not exactly in the remove ghosts camp, but
18:17:38 <gammafunk> I might be wrong I guess, it's almost the sort of thing we'd have to survey to know for sure
18:17:46 <|amethyst> the more I think about, the more I find it hard to justify their existence from a balance and game-design perspective
18:18:19 <|amethyst> since we have for some time been moving away from "flavour" being a reason to keep something in the game
18:18:50 <gammafunk> no it's not a balance thing at all I feel; I think it's mostly a 'social' feature, although some ghosts fights are alright when the ghosts aren't too extreme
18:18:51 <|amethyst> gammafunk:  my suggestion was based on an old suggestion of mine for post-orb, but there you fought devs instead of ghosts
18:19:20 <gammafunk> at least I've heard a bunch of people express sentiments like what I've expressed: "ghosts are not too bad to fight when they don't have insane properties"
18:19:25 <gammafunk> yeah, but that was a sprint idea!
18:19:29 <|amethyst> if it's not a balance thing, why would the first option be to change balance features of the ghost to make them less like the player
18:19:38 <gammafunk> at least the version that grunt and I talked about was, your idea wasn't for sprint I guess
18:19:42 <|amethyst> e.g. making spriggan ghosts not faster than naga ghosts
18:19:52 <|amethyst> that seems like a purely balance concern
18:21:15 <|amethyst> harmless ghosts keep the social part, but they're not really interesting in-game after you've heard all the possible messages a few time
18:21:28 <gammafunk> ghosts having a cap on speed I don't think is any major balance concern
18:21:42 <|amethyst> Why do it, then?
18:21:44 <gammafunk> it's more of a "how annoying is this monster to fight given that it has a lot of HP, good EV" etc
18:21:45 <advil> most of the time I think it's more that fast ghosts are super annoying
18:21:49 <gammafunk> ye
18:21:50 <gammafunk> s
18:21:55 <|amethyst> ah, annoyance rather than difficulty
18:21:58 <advil> though annoying can be dangerous (if they have bad spells or disto)
18:22:16 <gammafunk> yeah, annoying vs difficult can be a bit of a grey area, but for a monster you can ultimately kill with stairs
18:22:36 <gammafunk> esp if we did things like move the min. ghost depth to e.g. 10
18:22:50 <advil> I like the xp banding ideas for depth, I'm not sure why we don't do that really
18:22:54 <advil> btw I think I mentioned this to gf already but I found this description of the Demon ghost system very interesting: https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?p=320976#p320977
18:23:50 <advil> assuming that link worked
18:24:11 <gammafunk> yeah it worked
18:24:28 <gammafunk> some of it is like your vault/grave proposal (which I guess was inspired by this)
18:24:32 <advil> yeah
18:24:38 <gammafunk> normalizing for player level is maybe interesting, but possibly hard to do
18:24:56 <|amethyst> Hm
18:24:59 <gammafunk> I feel like that's maybe not too much of a concern though
18:25:02 <advil> well, if we only spawn ghosts +-3xl or something
18:25:05 <gammafunk> if you release ghost from a grave
18:25:14 <|amethyst> if you're going to normalise for something I'd normalise for dungeon level rather than player level
18:25:15 <gammafunk> you can just leave the ghost if it's e.g. xl20 firestormer
18:25:21 <advil> yeah, the grave idea means we could actually make dangerous stuff
18:25:24 <gammafunk> and come back to fight it if you care to
18:25:28 <advil> |amethyst: one of the balance complaints is orbrun ghosts
18:25:40 <advil> I don't know how frequent or real that is, but that's a thing people say at least
18:25:47 <advil> also portal ghosts
18:25:50 <gammafunk> losing the orbrun to a bad ghost?
18:26:02 <|amethyst> advil:  right, and an orbrun D:3 ghost would be balanced down to be comparable to normal D:3 ghosts
18:26:02 <advil> ghosts from an orbsplat I think
18:26:04 <gammafunk> I've not heard that one, seems like it would be ...not common
18:26:07 <gammafunk> oh
18:26:08 <gammafunk> haha
18:26:12 <gammafunk> yeah, ok, that makes sense
18:26:41 <|amethyst> balancing on player level means you're encouraged to dive so that the level gets generated while you're still at low XL
18:26:56 <|amethyst> (of course, we have things to discourage that)
18:26:59 <gammafunk> hrm, yeah maybe so
18:27:06 <gammafunk> well, right
18:27:13 <gammafunk> I guess it depends a bit on what the final ghost system looks like
18:27:24 <gammafunk> if it's a little vault with an item in it, you get a ghost guarding that with a lower XL
18:27:32 <advil> I'm not opposed to people diving more actually!
18:27:32 <gammafunk> but that also seems like not actually a real strat
18:27:35 <gammafunk> sure
18:27:50 <gammafunk> like how do you know you'll get the ghost vault thing
18:27:56 <advil> for the ghost vault, I agree that we wouldn't need to do any banding like thi
18:27:56 <gammafunk> and yeah the level is very dangerous for you now and you don't know what the reward will be etc
18:27:57 <advil> s
18:28:02 <|amethyst> I mean, currently we frown upon making level or item gen depend on the player
18:28:13 <gammafunk> |amethyst: well the item would not depend on the player
18:28:23 <gammafunk> the item I was thinking of was just like "one star_item" or w/e
18:28:26 <|amethyst> e.g. "hard" vs "easy" versions of vaults depend on the depth, not on the player's XL
18:28:32 <gammafunk> the loot pile could depend on the vault depth
18:28:41 <gammafunk> but yeah if you use XL of player, potentially the generated ghost is easier
18:28:47 <advil> also with ghost vaults, we might remove the stair movement restriction
18:28:55 <gammafunk> yeah advil
18:29:00 <gammafunk> how do you define "depend on the dungeon level" btw?
18:29:09 <gammafunk> in terms of a player ghost
18:29:18 <gammafunk> the ghost had to have entered the level for the first time?
18:29:24 <gammafunk> even that wouldn't quite do it
18:29:31 <gammafunk> they might have been shafted and never revisited
18:29:37 <|amethyst> gammafunk:  e.g. you could set the HD to (absdepth) rather than setting it to (player's XL)
18:29:47 <gammafunk> true
18:29:51 <gammafunk> I guess that might be enough
18:29:57 <gammafunk> lower melee accuracy and spell damage
18:30:08 <|amethyst> you'd need other tweaks probably to the spell list
18:30:08 <gammafunk> maybe the ghost monster could depend a bit better on HD for damage or something, not sure
18:30:14 <gammafunk> yeah
18:30:44 <gammafunk> well it's clear that if we do want to keep fighting hostile ghosts a thing it's not completely trivial even if we agree what we want to some degree
18:31:21 <|amethyst> to clarify: I don't mind tuning or not tuning ghost power in some way
18:31:41 <|amethyst> what I care about is that, if we do tune it, it should be based on depth rather than on the current (living) player's XL
18:31:51 <|amethyst> since we try hard to avoid caring about the latter everywhere else
18:31:57 <gammafunk> sure, that seems fine to me
18:32:34 <gammafunk> mikee's ghost ally idea is kind of cute but I'm not sure it's workable
18:33:03 <gammafunk> however like |amethyst's crazy orb idea it was creative
18:33:11 <gammafunk> obv all these ideas that don't make it should all go into next april 1st
18:33:44 <gammafunk> advil was like "hey why don't we put them in a vault" and I was like "omg! a vault! best idea ever!"
18:34:04 <advil> :)
18:34:31 <advil> |amethyst: is that r-i writeup something that just happened?
18:36:48 <gammafunk> I recall there being a different r-i "rant" page in the past, so it seems like it got edited
18:38:17 <gammafunk> ah
18:38:19 <gammafunk> my doku dev team profile
18:38:21 <gammafunk> Did not implement jump-attack, did implement Asterion, Lehudib wizlab, other vaults.
18:39:03 <gammafunk> I'm not sure if we want to try to move most of that content to the github wiki
18:39:14 <gammafunk> it's nice to be able to make pages in markdown and I think the UI is probably better overall
18:39:30 <gammafunk> no timeouts when editing a page is nice, for one
18:39:43 <advil> yeah, I think it's better to just port things as needed for the main things you'd use a wiki for
18:40:31 <gammafunk> I also sort of wondered if the github project thing was worth using? I should look more into what it can do
18:42:09 <advil> I guess it's another way to do release plans / checklists?
18:42:13 <advil> I haven't looked at it before
18:42:17 <advil> seems to be trello-ish
18:42:50 <gammafunk> for actual editing/commenting it might be a bit better than using a wiki page, I'll have to see
19:07:28 <johnstein> github projects is similar to trello and similar to gitlab issue board
19:07:39 <johnstein> I've used the two latter ones a fair amount
19:08:07 <johnstein> GH projects are new to me though but it looks a bit more flexible than GL issue boards
19:08:20 <johnstein> less tightly integrated with issues and milestone
19:08:21 <johnstein> s
19:08:43 <johnstein> and the ability to have several separate project views
19:08:49 <johnstein> which does seem useful
19:09:20 <Jorgrell> Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.21-a0-339-ge64e265 (34)
19:11:58 -!- amalloy is now known as amalloy_
20:14:08 <advil> !crashlog
20:14:11 <Sequell> 17881. gjx2, XL25 MiFi, T:45493 (milestone): https://webzook.net/soup/morgue/trunk/gjx2/crash-gjx2-20171003-200001.txt
20:14:42 <advil> !crashlog Parsimony
20:14:43 <Sequell> 1. Parsimony, XL17 GnWn, T:35444 (milestone): http://crawl.berotato.org/crawl/morgue/Parsimony/crash-Parsimony-20171003-191402.txt
20:17:31 <advil> macro_buf_add is a really bad way to do what that function is doing
20:17:57 <advil> it's fairly broken in webtiles actually
20:21:24 <advil> I guess that crash might happen if you have a macro that does ;
20:21:31 <advil> + some other stuff
21:03:27 <Cheibriados> 03advil02 07* 0.21-a0-340-g325bad4: Fix prompt_for_quantity on webtiles 10(4 minutes ago, 4 files, 15+ 9-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/325bad4d08f3
21:06:53 <advil> that commit will eliminate that crash since the code path isn't there, but I'm still not entirely sure what caused the crash
21:35:23 <advil> I think traps/stabbing are still being set to TRAINING_ENABLED
21:35:41 <gammafunk> ah
21:35:45 <gammafunk> that would be a problem
21:35:56 <gammafunk> I didn't look carefully at the other fixes done wrt training
21:36:15 <gammafunk> also in the save transfer code it does it unconditionally
21:36:34 <gammafunk> but I figured maybe the morgue skill dump code did some other kind of listing
21:37:02 <gammafunk> it's something I can look into tomorrow maybe but of course if you see a fix advil, please feel free to do so
21:37:03 <advil> it just checks you.train
21:37:10 <advil> I think it's a quick fix
21:37:21 <advil> do you know if sacrificed skills need to be set to TRAINING_ENABLED for gnolls?
21:38:03 <gammafunk> I don't see how; you.train is translated into values for you.training for the actual xp distribution
21:38:19 <advil> actually, is can_train accurate for gnolls?
21:38:44 <gammafunk> I think can_train is uncoditionally 1 or unconditionally 0?
21:39:01 <advil> !source init_train
21:39:02 <Sequell> 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/skills.cc#L599
21:39:03 <gammafunk> so I guess it wouldn't be; I'd really have to go back and look at the code
21:39:10 <advil> the issue is that the else clause there triggers
21:39:31 <advil> and then everything is set to TRAINING_ENABLED unconditionally
21:39:45 <gammafunk> yeah, I think can_train is always 0 for gnolls
21:39:50 <gammafunk> for all skills
21:40:09 <advil> ah ok
21:40:25 <gammafunk> yeah, there should probably be a check for the skill being "usable" or however that is called
21:40:52 <gammafunk> I guess for autotraining there's an additional check done somewhere in the calculation for you.training?
21:41:04 <advil> yeah, must be
21:41:04 <gammafunk> since it seems that this would be a problem for non-gnolls with autotraining on
21:41:40 <gammafunk> hrm, that is a bit odd, since I believe you.train is directly used for skilling menus
21:41:47 <gammafunk> for the enable/focus hotkeys
21:42:06 <gammafunk> I must have hated this code a lot, I've already forgotten how most of it works :(
21:42:15 <gammafunk> maybe I just only barely understood it enough in the first place
21:43:02 <advil> the skill menu also checks is_useless_skill I think
21:43:23 <advil> yeah, this stuff is all a mess
21:51:24 <advil> !lg * won ru -log
21:51:25 <Sequell> 1593. GordonOverkill, XL27 MiAM, T:70919: https://underhound.eu:81/crawl/morgue/GordonOverkill/morgue-GordonOverkill-20171003-105759.txt
21:58:13 <advil> %git fc3775ba1767baeebefa2986fbf026009fc02cde
21:58:13 <Cheibriados> 07elliptic02 * 0.21-a0-324-gfc3775b: Don't train Stabbing and Traps on gnolls. 10(3 days ago, 1 file, 5+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/fc3775ba1767
22:00:31 <gammafunk> right, that's all that fix was; that was actually causing XP to go into stabbing/traps
22:00:41 <gammafunk> and it would still show as 0.0 because of the -99 apt
22:00:53 <Cheibriados> 03advil02 07* 0.21-a0-341-g5efb6f4: Actually disable traps+stabbing for gnolls 10(6 minutes ago, 1 file, 10+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/5efb6f4854c2
22:01:16 <advil> yeah, I don't think the actual training is going wrong, elliptic's commit fixed that
22:01:51 <advil> hm I hope that doesn't mess up the percentage calculation
22:06:02 <advil> ugh I think it did
22:06:29 <gammafunk> we were so busy complaining about monster AI code and beam.cc
22:06:38 <gammafunk> ...we never noticed skills.cc until it was too late...
22:09:22 <Jorgrell> Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.21-a0-340-g325bad4 (34)
22:11:35 <advil> thpugh I had to hit every possible sac to move it to 4%
23:03:18 <advil> %git 246b9df9e082f87749dadd949d56ae20c9522895
23:03:18 <Cheibriados> 07elliptic02 * 0.21-a0-325-g246b9df: More gnoll skill code tweaks. 10(3 days ago, 1 file, 60+ 10-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/246b9df9e082
23:04:03 <advil> oh heh he didn't update the display of percentages I guess
23:04:09 <advil> no wonder I'm so confused
23:07:10 -!- n| is now known as crawl-oldfogy
23:07:30 -!- crawl-oldfogy is now known as n1
23:09:29 <Jorgrell> Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.21-a0-341-g5efb6f4 (34)
23:15:20 -!- ProzacElf is now known as fool
23:15:21 <elliptic> advil: oh, display of percentages meaning 4% for each skill or whatever? yeah, I didn't think about that at all (probably because it isn't very useful)
23:15:37 -!- fool is now known as heirophant
23:15:50 <advil> yeah, I was just using it to see if I got things right
23:16:08 -!- heirophant is now known as n|
23:16:19 -!- n| is now known as Guest22912
23:16:22 <advil> you have to sac I think that 6 skills before it actually changes
23:16:25 <elliptic> thanks for looking into the issues with those skills still showing up in morgues
23:16:41 <advil> changes on the m screen that is
23:16:42 <advil> np
23:16:46 -!- Guest22912 is now known as Prozacelf
23:17:23 <elliptic> I understand how the actual training code works now but the rest of skills.cc is still opaque to me
23:17:34 -!- Prozacelf is now known as ProzacElf
23:25:45 <advil> it's impressively convoluted
23:43:42 <Cheibriados> 03advil02 07* 0.21-a0-342-g97c3cd8: checkwhite 10(5 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/97c3cd8f437b
23:43:42 <Cheibriados> 03advil02 07* 0.21-a0-343-gb326f1e: Disable traps & stabbing in a slightly different way 10(4 minutes ago, 2 files, 43+ 19-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/b326f1e70d45
23:52:33 <Cheibriados> 03advil02 07* 0.21-a0-344-g2144152: Actually save a header file 10(54 seconds ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/214415253db3