00:18:21 -!- mngr_ is now known as daiy
00:24:38 -!- mngr_ is now known as daiy
00:35:54 -!- mngr__ is now known as daiy
02:52:51 <Gretell> Monster database of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.21-a0-125-gb006224
09:10:48 -!- tsujin_ is now known as tsujin
09:37:32 -!- mngr_ is now known as daiy
09:52:39 -!- mngr_ is now known as daiy
10:58:27 -!- mngr_ is now known as daiy
12:47:59 <Cheibriados> 03Lasty02 07* 0.21-a0-126-g1d32bfb: Allow poisonous vapours to target spaces that might have monsters (Siegurt) 10(34 seconds ago, 1 file, 6+ 5-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/1d32bfb9b6cb
13:09:27 <Jorgrell> Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.21-a0-126-g1d32bfb (34)
15:03:27 <Cheibriados> New branch created: rc-control (1 commit) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/tree/rc-control
15:03:27 <Cheibriados> 03advil02 07[rc-control] * 0.21-a0-126-g4b269b0: Add a command line option and build option to disallow ready() 10(46 seconds ago, 5 files, 27+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/4b269b0ae671
15:03:53 <advil> that's as much for discussion as anything, once I worked through how much it would break I'm not sure it's the right solution
15:05:31 <advil> but it would be nice to somehow have a system where server operators can either opt in or opt out of bots, on a per user or per server basis, as they prefer
15:08:41 <Cheibriados> Can't choose a class for the ancestor 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=11150 by Ge0ff
15:29:58 <gammafunk> advil: are you saying we may not be ready() for this?
15:30:07 <gammafunk> it's a nice idea, in all seriousness
15:30:14 <advil> nice
15:32:07 <advil> I think I'm most worried about breaking hugedmg.rc, I get the sense that a lot of people use it and it can be very helpful to weaker players
15:33:06 <gammafunk> well, if that's truly the case, it could be something added as an option, I guess
15:33:15 <gammafunk> but hugedmg.rc is a bit hacky
15:33:29 <gammafunk> I think it prints those messages even if you change forms?
15:33:46 <advil> I've never used it myself (and I could be wrong about how popular it is)
15:33:58 <gammafunk> I don't think it's incredibly popular
15:34:04 <gammafunk> I'd imagine more people are using target_skill
15:34:11 <gammafunk> which would also be broken by this
15:34:15 <advil> ah I don't know that one
15:34:21 <gammafunk> ??target_skill
15:34:21 <Sequell> target skill[1/1]: Opens the skill screen automatically when a skill reaches a target level set by the player. Use {gammafunkrc} or instructions here: https://github.com/gammafunk/dcss-rc#target_skill
15:34:39 <gammafunk> something else that should ideally already be in our UI
15:34:39 <advil> ah I do know that one, just didn't know it had an independent life
15:34:39 <advil> yes, I have plans to do that actually
15:34:46 <advil> one of my 0.21 goals
15:34:51 <gammafunk> yeah not everyone is using that through my rc, some have elliptic's original code
15:34:54 <gammafunk> oh, that's great
15:36:40 <advil> it'd be nice to find a way to at least allow the messaging stuff that people do in ready()
15:37:10 <gammafunk> hopefully implementing a proper bread swinging UI is also part of your 0.21 plans
15:37:16 <gammafunk> then I wouldn't need speedrun_rest.lua
15:37:24 <advil> heh
15:37:33 <gammafunk> I had some of the most fun writing that one, honestly
15:37:53 <gammafunk> filtering messages so that slow-walking wouldn't get interrupted
15:38:04 <gammafunk> all sorts of other little issues
15:38:27 <gammafunk> hrm, and rip my dynamic force-mores
15:38:30 <gammafunk> end of an era
15:38:44 <advil> yeah I saw the force more stuff too, it would be a shame to break that
15:39:13 <gammafunk> it's probably the sort of thing that would also be possible directly in RC
15:39:23 <gammafunk> but it'd be tricky to implement well
15:39:34 <gammafunk> by directly in RC, I mean without lua
15:40:02 <advil> HDA has an announce_damage thing that's better than huge_dmg
15:40:26 <gammafunk> yeah, he has a bunch of different things, not all of which I'm familiar with it
15:40:43 <gammafunk> araganzar has an RC taking certain things from his RCs and the rest from mine that I made for him
15:40:49 <gammafunk> &rc araganzar
15:40:56 <Sequell> http://crawl.berotato.org/crawl/rcfiles/crawl-0.18/araganzar.rc
15:41:15 <advil> was there a plan to or discussion of moving away from turncount scoring at some point?
15:41:49 <gammafunk> sure, that's come up a lot, there are just some major issues, all of which are solveable
15:41:57 <gammafunk> but which would involve significant work
15:42:09 <gammafunk> what to do with old scores
15:42:23 <gammafunk> precisely how to adjust for species move speed
15:42:35 <advil> that's what looking at speedrun_rest kind of makes me think about :D
15:42:42 <advil> but yeah, I can see that those are non-trivial
15:43:05 <gammafunk> if we did it relatively soon
15:43:11 <gammafunk> we'd have the added benefit of people claiming we only did it to nerf chei
15:43:17 <advil> heh
15:43:19 <gammafunk> since the current WR is a chei win
15:44:10 <elliptic> advil: I started to work on aut_scoring several months ago and had a plan and some commits in a local branch, but then got distracted by non-crawl things
15:44:25 <advil> oh nice
15:44:42 <advil> right, I forgot that that charly wr was chei
15:45:02 <elliptic> the main issue I had was figuring out what parts of current code care about turncount and deciding what to do about them
15:45:08 <elliptic> gammafunk: wasn't it also 0.17 or something disgusting like that?
15:45:16 <advil> yes
15:45:25 <|amethyst> elliptic:  outside Crawl proper, footv cares
15:45:25 <advil> !hs *
15:45:27 <gammafunk> yep
15:45:30 <Sequell> 7541547. Charly the Wrestler (L27 VSMo of Cheibriados), escaped with the Orb and 15 runes on 2017-07-10 02:14:41, with 80214242 points after 17823 turns and 7:17:12.
15:45:34 <gammafunk> although he commented in the tavern thread about it
15:45:43 <advil> !hs * -log
15:45:47 <Sequell> 7541547. Charly, XL27 VSMo, T:17823: http://crawl.xtahua.com/crawl/morgue/Charly/morgue-Charly-20170710-021441.txt
15:45:54 <gammafunk> that trunk is also viable for these scores
15:45:56 <elliptic> |amethyst: yeah, that was one thing I discovered (though I think that seemed straightforward enough to change)
15:46:02 <gammafunk> it's just that 0.17 probably would require fewer attempts
15:46:12 <gammafunk> and might actually be a bit faster on top of things
15:46:12 <elliptic> the main weirdness iirc was that our OOD timer depends on turncount
15:46:41 <elliptic> which it almost certainly shouldn't but it was a bit complicated to figure out what should be done to change it
15:46:50 <travis-ci> The build passed. (rc-control - 4b269b0 #8526 : advil): https://travis-ci.org/crawl/crawl/builds/253982400
15:46:52 <elliptic> without making naga/chei run into OODs all the time
15:47:20 <elliptic> gammafunk: uh, I don't believe that... 0.17 had evocable ring of teleport
15:47:28 <advil> hmm, have that based on turncount still seems not entirely unreasonable?
15:47:30 <advil> *having
15:48:03 <elliptic> advil: it's sort of bad if nagas should rest by moving back and forth to get fewer OODs
15:48:22 <elliptic> or other people should rest by swinging bread or whatever
15:48:35 <advil> hmm
15:48:49 <elliptic> I think we should probably just rethink how monster spawning works in general
15:48:58 <elliptic> at least in regards to OODs
15:49:01 <gammafunk> "Both versions have its cons and pros. 0.17 has unlimited tele spam, no -cTele status, stronger VS start... while trunk gives you interesting mutation gamble possibilites and faster abys.
15:49:05 <gammafunk> Probably 0.17 gives you a better chance of doing a sub 20k run, which doesnt mean it is impossible on latest version. PurpleRed proved that post 0.17 speedrunning is still possible, if a Deep Elf, which is amongst the weakest species in game, can take it sub 20k then VS could make it much faster, even despite the lack of Zot 5 PoG trick and infinite PoG spam on certain levels."
15:50:14 <elliptic> I mean, obviously enough luck with finding branches and abyss/pan can make up for a lot of things
15:50:38 <gammafunk> but yeah maybe 0.17 is just a bit faster overall; we're probably all that close to the true max possible score you could get either
15:51:04 <elliptic> but given that he played 0.17 specifically for those rather important differences it seems a bit disingenuous to say that it didn't help
15:51:09 <|amethyst> IMO include on D:1 a timed portal to Zot:5
15:51:10 <gammafunk> er *probably not all that close...
15:51:28 <|amethyst> for the speedrunners
15:51:37 <advil> !hs purplered
15:51:38 <Sequell> 2729. PurpleRed the Archmage (L27 DECj of Vehumet), escaped with the Orb and 15 runes on 2016-09-27 08:26:02, with 75249848 points after 19065 turns and 12:26:59.
15:51:46 <advil> !hs purplered -log
15:51:47 <Sequell> 2729. PurpleRed, XL27 DECj, T:19065: https://crawl.project357.org/morgue/PurpleRed/morgue-PurpleRed-20160927-082602.txt
15:52:21 <gammafunk> elliptic: yeah, I don't think Charly (and certainly not myself either) was saying that 0.17 didn't help, just that trunk can probably get a similar score to what he got
15:52:38 <elliptic> I mean, the theoretical possible is far faster
15:53:16 <gammafunk> it would be nice if we did finally get updated scoreboards that allowed us to just have scores per version
15:53:19 <elliptic> like an order of magnitude at least presumably
15:55:37 <gammafunk> sub 10k 15 runes?
15:56:01 <advil> qw's next challenge
15:56:02 <gammafunk> I'm glad your musu is no where close to that
15:56:22 <gammafunk> I need a goal that feels achievable
15:57:20 <gammafunk> it's ok if we through endless OOD at Nagas btw
15:57:23 <gammafunk> !streak dynast
15:57:28 <Sequell> dynast has 19 consecutive wins (NaWn, NaWn, NaWn, NaWn, NaWn, NaWn, NaWn, NaWn, NaWn, NaWn, NaWn, NaWn, NaWn, NaWn, NaWn, NaWn, NaWn, NaWn, NaWn) and has won their last 11 games (NaWn, NaWn, NaWn, NaWn, NaWn, NaWn, NaWn, NaWn, NaWn, NaWn, NaWn).
15:57:38 <gammafunk> it will hopefully put dynast out of his misery
15:57:49 <gammafunk> s/through/throw/
15:59:11 <elliptic> the OOD timer is pretty weird and spoily regardless
16:00:07 <gammafunk> the whole OOD system isn't that great in that OOD lists are not very reasonable for most branches (in many places they're simply a bit more of things the player is already fighting)
16:00:13 <elliptic> I'm not really sure what the point is of occasionally dropping centaur warriors on D:1 against chars who spend a couple thousand turns there
16:00:52 <|amethyst> though nowadays when someone complains about highly OOD monsters it seems more often a minmay vault than the OOD timer
16:01:42 <gammafunk> yeah, I guess that system was designed with the idea of pushing the player onwards, but it's a pretty clumsy way to do that
16:02:26 <elliptic> I think it was designed to keep people from scumming easy spawns forever, yeah
16:03:16 <|amethyst> no spawns would do that too
16:03:22 <elliptic> yes
16:04:47 <gammafunk> |amethyst: tbh minmay is far from being the only vault author to use OOD monsters
16:06:17 <gammafunk> and while not OOD, I've heard stories of some vaults that surround the player with speed 25 death cobs with slowing attacks and horrifying elec golems, all apparently as a reference to some seasonal festivities!
16:06:25 <|amethyst> I know, but I suspect that if you count vaults that can occur in early-ish D and have the possibility of multiple 9s, his name would come out on top
16:06:53 <|amethyst> mostly because he has made so many vaults
16:06:53 <elliptic> vault OODs are much tamer than what the OOD timer can produce though
16:06:53 <gammafunk> hrm, part of the problem is that he is more prolific than any other vault author by far, I think
16:06:55 <|amethyst> and likes 9s
16:07:18 <gammafunk> can't 8 match the super OOD timer pretty well?
16:07:23 <gammafunk> I guess not on D:1
16:07:37 <gammafunk> ??8[2
16:07:37 <Sequell> 8[2/2]: Is also a marker for extremely out of depth (depth*2+4 depth!) monsters in vaults; both traditional and valued by most devs. Good results: d:4 wolf spiders, d:5 centaur warriors, d:6 fire crabs, d:9 sphinxes, d:10 fire giants, d:11 liches.
16:07:58 <gammafunk> oh yeah, that won't be worse than 6
16:08:04 <gammafunk> ??9
16:08:04 <Sequell> 9[1/1]: Gargoyles! Very high AC, but low HP, low EV, creature. Decent conjurations, great melee early. LRD blows them up easily. See: {gargoyle} {war gargoyle} {molten gargoyle}.
16:08:07 <gammafunk> ??9[2
16:08:08 <Sequell> I don't have a page labeled 9[2] in my learndb.
16:08:10 <gammafunk> rip
16:09:30 <elliptic> I do think that removing respawns altogether is worth considering - I don't have a good sense of how much xp they account for in an average game, so maybe we could get stats on that
16:09:34 <gammafunk> no spawns and OOD timer reform could be good things, certainl. I guess we could compensate by simply generating a small number of additional level monsters
16:10:02 <gammafunk> right, would have to look in terms of average turns a player spends on a level, I guess; that will vary by level though
16:10:18 <|amethyst> it does mean safer luring though
16:10:21 <elliptic> I was thinking of just having the game track which monsters are respawns
16:10:38 <elliptic> and then track how much of the player's xp gain comes from them
16:11:11 <gammafunk> a morgue field?
16:11:19 <elliptic> |amethyst: yeah, that's the main drawback... one thing that we could do is have some small proportion of monsters generate awake
16:12:31 <elliptic> gammafunk: that, or just put it somewhere in the morgue file
16:13:18 <elliptic> one complication is that I expect that the number of respawns the player fights varies a lot by location
16:13:35 <gammafunk> yeah, zot:5 and vaults:5 would potentially have a lot
16:14:14 <elliptic> I'm pretty sure that people tend to spend less time on levels later in the game
16:14:24 <|amethyst> I suspect D:1 has a lot for some players
16:14:24 <elliptic> with a couple exceptions like V:5
16:14:45 <|amethyst> I know I spend 1000-2000 turns on D:1 regularly
16:14:58 <|amethyst> more if I accidentally press 5 one time too many
16:15:00 <elliptic> anyway it would just be nice to get a general sense for how many respawns there are
16:15:26 <elliptic> I really have no idea whether they account for 5% additional xp gain or 25%
16:19:36 <gammafunk> elliptic: would you make this a per-level tablesomehow?
16:19:41 <gammafunk> *table somehow
16:20:11 <gammafunk> I guess it could be  a list like how we show vault placements
16:21:04 <elliptic> don't we already have some optional dump thing breaking down by level (or branch?) various things like xp gain and turns spent
16:21:05 <elliptic> ?
16:21:23 <elliptic> maybe could add this to that
16:21:41 <gammafunk> !log . won
16:21:43 <Sequell> 74. gammafunk, XL27 MfAM, T:84750: http://crawl.berotato.org/crawl/morgue/gammafunk/morgue-gammafunk-20170611-121836.txt
16:22:09 <|amethyst> that doesn't help us very much unless we turn it on by default
16:22:27 <gammafunk> not sure we have anything that's per-level aside from the vault dump, let me see
16:22:27 <Lasty> Clearly this is a good reason to switch over to the doooooom cloooooock . . .
16:22:30 <gammafunk> ??options
16:22:30 <Sequell> rcfile[1/4]: https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/docs/options_guide.txt
16:22:45 <|amethyst> yeah, those two are per-branch, not per-level
16:22:51 <|amethyst> turns_by_place and kills_by_place
16:23:02 <gammafunk> No one likes your luring gimicks, Lasty! Give it up and quit the dev team!!!!!
16:23:08 <elliptic> |amethyst: that's true unless we just want to look at a few games, yeah
16:23:11 <Lasty> but yeah, checking xp-from-ood per game and per level seems like a good first step towards considering whether to make xpless OODs
16:23:16 <Lasty> gammafunk: !!!
16:23:30 <Lasty> gammafunk: this is just because you keep killing nagas of usk, isn't it??
16:23:54 <gammafunk> of only usk had a 5* ability as good as zin's sanctuary, I'd have won
16:24:20 <Lasty> If only
16:25:24 <gammafunk> I see turns_by_place
16:25:35 <gammafunk> and kills_by_place
16:32:38 <gammafunk> looks like kills_by_place is only by branch, not by level
16:32:53 <gammafunk> likewise for turns_by_place
16:33:16 <gammafunk> those options probably should be called kills_by_branch and turns_by_branch
16:36:58 <gammafunk> http://imgur.com/a/Ev4tV
16:37:01 <gammafunk> tedronai made a nice album of his raiding my dig for victory vault
16:38:59 <Lasty> gammafunk: haha, nice
16:39:14 <gammafunk> I don't appreciate people stealing my rings of Tuna like that
16:42:45 <Lasty> I can see why
17:08:50 <Lasty> Dev advice needed: when removing an invis cloak, it takes a turn for the invis to end. It looks like it's because the "unequip" action is interruptable, so time passes before the unequip event actually happens and not after it.
17:09:16 <Lasty> Anyone know if thre's a good solution?
17:09:43 <Lasty> If we move the unequip event earlier in the process, we'd need to reequip if the player aborts midway through the process, so that's no good
17:09:56 <Lasty> Just taking an extra AUT after the unequip effect is a possibility...
17:10:03 <Lasty> but it feels hacky
17:13:28 <Cheibriados> 03Lasty02 07* 0.21-a0-127-g329daca: Increase contam from unequipping an item that's granting you invis (Siegurt) 10(43 seconds ago, 2 files, 11+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/329daca0a120
17:16:18 <minmay> If you take off armour with the +Fly randart property the flight effect is immediately removed, would it be possible to copy that?
17:16:37 <Lasty> ah, interesting
17:16:39 <Lasty> let me check
17:17:36 <Lasty> ah, it looks like it calls land_player() directly when setting the duration
17:18:27 <Lasty> !source land_player
17:18:27 <Sequell> 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/player.cc#L4843
17:19:09 <Lasty> well, something similar should be possible
17:22:32 -!- Amnes1ac is now known as Amnesiac
18:03:12 <Lantell> Unstable branch on underhound.eu updated to: 0.21-a0-127-g329daca (34)
18:09:16 <Jorgrell> Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.21-a0-127-g329daca (34)
18:09:49 <Lasty> minmay: actually, I didn't need to get fancy at all. player-reacts stuff is still happening, so I just need to change the duration from 1 to 0. Turns out it handles negatives just fine.
18:11:27 <Cheibriados> 03Lasty02 07* 0.21-a0-128-gf2b353c: Make removing a cloak of invis instantly de-invis you (minmay) 10(42 seconds ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/f2b353c23db6
18:12:45 <|amethyst> oh by the way
18:13:31 <|amethyst> I propose we schedule the 0.21 release for 2 October
18:14:27 <|amethyst> because that is Crawl's 20th birthday
18:14:33 <Lasty> I have the impression that so far not much has changed in trunk. Are we sure there's going to be enough content for a release?
18:14:34 <Lasty> Oh, nice
18:14:55 <|amethyst> not much changed in 0.20 either
18:14:59 <gammafunk> Lasty: more shrikes is about all we needed for the next release imo
18:15:15 <Lasty> |amethyst: there's a new species!
18:15:19 <|amethyst> removing monster spawns and food ought to do it
18:15:25 <gammafunk> uh oh
18:15:28 <gammafunk> we're removing food?!
18:15:31 <Lasty> |amethyst: sounds solid
18:15:45 <Lasty> finally players will like new releases again! and by players I of course mean regulars
18:15:50 <gammafunk> A U T B A S E D S C O R I N G
18:15:51 <|amethyst> gammafunk:  if we're having a hard time coming up with stuff for 0.21, why not? :)
18:16:00 <|amethyst> player-visible stuff
18:16:01 <Lasty> srsly tho, removing food is fine w/ me
18:16:19 <|amethyst> oh, and remove tiles too
18:16:23 <Lasty> sold
18:16:28 <gammafunk> can we also just remove online play?
18:16:33 <gammafunk> degenerate imo
18:16:35 <Lasty> I'd love to get a trial version of either ranged reform or doom clock going, but I don't know if I'll have the time anytime soon :-\
18:16:44 <Cheibriados> New branch created: pull/572 (1 commit) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/572
18:16:44 <Cheibriados> 03Chloe Kudryavtsev02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/572 * 0.21-a0-129-g8d0584b: Fix various typos in jewellery hints (fixes #571) 10(13 minutes ago, 1 file, 2+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/8d0584b32574
18:16:47 <|amethyst> gammafunk:  kind of hard for the dev team to do that, though
18:17:07 <gammafunk> |amethyst: we could sabotage webtiles
18:17:31 <gammafunk> remove all the json output
18:23:51 <|amethyst> gammafunk:  right, that part's easy, but getting rid of online terminal play while still allowing local terminal play is a bit difficult
18:24:06 <|amethyst> gammafunk:  I guess we could put massive security holes in the game so no one would want to run a server
18:24:59 <|amethyst> say, press & to get a root shell
18:25:30 <johnstein> even an admin of my caliber would get the hint with that
18:25:55 <|amethyst> press + to kill -9 -1 :P
18:26:26 <johnstein> even better
18:32:58 <gammafunk> makes me think that maybe we need a special hacking branch
18:33:02 <gammafunk> or at least a hacking wizlab
18:33:35 <|amethyst> Linley's Dungeon Controlroom
18:34:15 <geekosaur> you're reminding me of this vague idea I had of retheming crawl with dev oriented monsters (infinite loops, core dumps, beam.cc, ...)
18:34:47 <gammafunk> cerebot, lomlobot
18:35:21 <geekosaur> possibly  past devs (due's silent tower :p )
18:35:53 <Xenobreeder> I think I've found a bug. I've got Eos and umbra (from the ring), they cancel each other out, but I still can't cast darkness or go invisible.
18:38:45 <Lasty> Cerekov: why not give gammafunk a greeting?
18:39:06 <Cerekov> right thats what you meant the other Lasty on CBRO
18:39:18 <gammafunk> !
18:39:28 <Lasty> Cerekov: not me, gammafunk!
18:39:30 <Cerekov> as did confuse / dchan / etc fireball probably won't do list ah hahaha thanks for looking that up on wizardry for spells i can max my sacrifices with Ru, then ditch him" a good weapon :)
18:39:44 <gammafunk> Cerekov: do you do birthday parties?
18:39:45 <Cerekov> ran into a harpy
18:39:56 <gammafunk> that sounds like a yes...
18:40:08 <Lasty> i dunno, there's bound to be some clawing
18:40:22 <gammafunk> Cerekov: what are the devs up to these days?
18:40:23 <Cerekov> <3
18:40:30 <Lasty> that's right: devs are love.
18:40:43 <gammafunk> Cerekov: should we remove food?
18:40:43 <Cerekov> ok but not /that/ good
18:41:04 <gammafunk> Lasty: what "corpus" does it use for learning?
18:41:29 <|amethyst> geekosaur:  I would like to see that :)
18:41:34 <Lasty> Well, learning is vastly overstating what it does, but it's using a lengthy awbw chat log along with selected forum scrapings
18:41:59 <gammafunk> ah, I see
18:42:06 <gammafunk> Cerekov: do you have any dirt on gammafunk?
18:42:09 <Cerekov> oh, i can vitalize for them
18:42:11 <|amethyst> re Linley's Control Room, things like a lever that lets you move any one branch entrance to any other place in the dungeon
18:42:45 <gammafunk> why not just implement Xom Maker?
18:42:49 <Lasty> What's Xom Maker?
18:42:51 <gammafunk> it would be really cool to have a mario maker style level builder
18:43:05 <|amethyst> isn't that wizmode?
18:43:07 <Lasty> isn't that what vaults are for?
18:43:09 <gammafunk> something I just made up, but I basically mean mario maker for dcss
18:43:19 <gammafunk> Lasty: interactive, like mario maker
18:43:22 <Lasty> ah
18:43:22 <|amethyst> I mean, the interface for doing it in wizmode sucks, but it is possible
18:43:47 <|amethyst> I would be all in favour of improving that part of the wizmode interface
18:43:50 <gammafunk> yeah, having a real interface + online database of levels, maybe a way to assemble entire dungeons from said levels
18:44:25 <gammafunk> in some ways it's an even greater challenge than mario maker
18:44:26 <|amethyst> gammafunk:  generate .des files from existing levels
18:44:36 <|amethyst> (without randomisation of course)
18:44:40 <gammafunk> since you'd want to have a way to specify things like SHUFFLE and SUBST
18:45:00 <gammafunk> but I suppose that wouldn't be impossible to implement or anything
18:45:39 <|amethyst> I think it would be difficult to implement in a way that was actually usable for the complex cases
18:46:16 <|amethyst> but simple cases probably wouldn't be that bad
18:46:42 <|amethyst> of course, this is a major task to design, let alone implement
18:46:48 <gammafunk> yeah
18:46:58 <gammafunk> if I get a huge twitch donation, I'll do it
18:46:58 <Cerekov> sacrifice love[3/3]: The butterfly can only win dd
18:47:19 <gammafunk> nice, it has learndb
18:47:20 <Cerekov> it is hilarious :(
18:47:44 <|amethyst> gammafunk:  I could probably fund some of it, not at market programmer rates of course
18:47:56 <|amethyst> nothing one could live on
18:48:09 <gammafunk> It's not like I really eat all that much ramen
18:48:11 <johnstein> I'll chip in a dollar at least
18:48:44 <|amethyst> need new dev blood
18:48:59 <gammafunk> dev blood for the blood god
18:49:18 <|amethyst> skills for the skill throne
18:50:16 <Lasty> we need a new dev that's good at coding c++ but is easy to manipulate
18:50:22 <Lasty> so that I can make them do ranged reform for me
18:51:10 <|amethyst> Lasty:  turn it into a crash bugfix and advil will do it :)
18:51:24 <|amethyst> might even be able to trick me into working on it that way
18:51:32 <Lasty> oh man, I hadn't thought of that
18:51:44 <Lasty> first I have to introduce a crash that's related to ranged combat existing at all
18:52:12 <gammafunk> does anyone have experience with launching a process for purposes of debugging it with gdb in another window?
18:52:18 <|amethyst> but subtly enough that we don't just find and revert that commit
18:52:29 <gammafunk> I can start it up manually and check the process number, but it's a pain to do that each time
18:52:29 <|amethyst> hiding it from git bisect is the really tricky part
18:52:37 <Lasty> |amethyst: aw man, I have to do this the hard way, huh?
18:53:08 <|amethyst> gammafunk:  I just do  gdb -p $(pidof crawl)  :P
18:53:11 <gammafunk> right, that's probably what I want!
18:53:22 <|amethyst> assuming you have only one crawl process anyway
18:53:25 <gammafunk> hrm, except I need $(pidof crawl) to happen in another terminal window
18:53:27 <Lasty> the important thing is to subtly introduce a series of weirdly-named variables that hold references to other functions and methods and also mutate.
18:53:39 <|amethyst> gammafunk:  no, that checks the whole system
18:53:49 <Lasty> After a few dozen commits doing that, eventually I'll link them up in a truly awful wa
18:53:50 <Lasty> y
18:53:50 <|amethyst> gammafunk:  it in effect does ps ax and greps it
18:53:50 <gammafunk> oh I see
18:53:57 <gammafunk> it's not doing the launching
18:54:00 <|amethyst> gammafunk:  so no good on a multiuser system
18:54:01 <gammafunk> yeah that works as well
18:54:38 <gammafunk> a follow-up question is whether I can made gdb not need to be run as root when using -p, but that's probably an ubuntu thing
18:54:49 <|amethyst> gammafunk:  yes, let me find the setting
18:56:16 <|amethyst> gammafunk:  https://askubuntu.com/a/41656
18:57:02 <gammafunk> |amethyst: thanks a lot
19:09:17 <Jorgrell> Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.21-a0-128-gf2b353c (34)
19:29:59 <TZer0_> !messages
19:30:00 <Sequell> No messages for TZer0_.
19:30:04 -!- TZer0_ is now known as TZer0
19:30:05 <TZer0> !messages
19:30:06 <Sequell> No messages for TZer0.
19:35:53 <gammafunk> Cerekov: Could you give TZer0 a message?
19:35:54 <Cerekov> cute vault that had a really good bruschetta
21:03:32 <advil> re "turn it into a crash bugfix and advil will do it", lol
21:03:34 <advil> but also
21:03:36 <advil> %git 7bf63f6c59ec0b09b03f62e0b917198a2f13f101
21:03:36 <Cheibriados> 07advil02 * 0.21-a0-92-g7bf63f6: Convert a segfault into an ASSERT failure 10(2 weeks ago, 1 file, 1+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/7bf63f6c59ec
21:03:50 <advil> I was tempted
21:11:23 <amalloy> to get a c++ dev to do something for you, just make a few smug remarks about how easy it would be in java
21:20:29 <Lasty> gammafunk: nice Cerekov message up there
21:20:30 <Cerekov> that crosstrains with maces! this is good but it didn't before
21:23:13 <advil> what is Cerekov?
21:23:14 <Cerekov> =p
21:23:45 <bh> hey Lasty, did you go to porchfest?
21:23:57 <Lasty> advil: a markov bot
21:24:12 <advil> ah trained on crawl-dev logs or something?
21:24:14 <Lasty> bh:I walked by some porchfest, but didn't attend in any meaningful way
21:24:22 <Lasty> advil: trained on forum and awbw logs
21:24:41 <Lasty> bh: did you?
21:25:15 <bh> sat on my porch and listened. no one knew what crawl was, though
21:25:19 <Lasty> lol
21:25:23 <Lasty> makes sense
21:25:32 <Lasty> I still have yet to get anyone from work interested in crawl
21:26:04 <bh> some guy who sits near me plays while he waits on builds
21:26:09 <gammafunk> Lasty: also good response there to 'what is Cerekov?'
21:26:09 <Cerekov> AK
21:26:09 <Lasty> haha
21:26:17 <Lasty> it is really good for waiting on builds
21:26:23 <Lasty> Cerekov: I see you as more of a CK
21:26:23 <Cerekov> haha
21:26:39 <gammafunk> glad it has a sense of humor
21:26:45 <Lasty> I programmed that in first, obv
21:30:36 <johnstein> !hs cerekov
21:30:37 <Sequell> No games for cerekov (sc<1000000000).
21:30:40 <johnstein> lame
21:31:23 <Lasty> johnstein: this is your chance!
21:38:05 <gammafunk> Lasty: this is the only novel thing I've programmed Cerebot to do https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/325651923514556417/335957554729451520/Peek_2017-07-15_20-35.gif
21:38:33 <Lasty> gammafunk: lol, nice
21:38:42 <gammafunk> I have yet to implement !tornado and !shatter, but I'll get to those
21:39:00 <gammafunk> maybe even exapnd it to other spells
21:39:19 <gammafunk> have it make a little Lich (L) that hits you with iron shot, lcs, or w/e
22:27:33 <n1> give it the banishment animation!
22:32:25 <gammafunk> oh, good idea
22:32:30 <gammafunk> a !banish command as well
23:47:07 <gammafunk> ??wizard's_castle
23:47:07 <Sequell> THE WIZARD'S CASTLE[1/5]: MANY CYCLES AGO, IN THE KINGDOM OF N'DIC, THE GNOMIC WIZARD ZOT FORGED HIS GREAT *ORB OF POWER*. HE SOON VANISHED, LEAVING BEHIND HIS VAST SUBTERRANEAN CASTLE FILLED WITH ESURIENT MONSTERS, FABULOUS TREASURES, AND THE INCREDIBLE *ORB OF ZOT*.
23:49:33 <Lasty> Cerekov: one for the road?
23:49:35 <Cerekov> heh
23:49:41 <Lasty> Cerekov: you can do better
23:49:41 <Cerekov> FeAE
23:49:48 <Lasty> Cerekov: fine, let's go
23:49:50 <Cerekov> just need to figure out how to get into trouble if only I wasn't being sarcastic i think it's no fun either
23:52:03 <gammafunk> Lasty: Cerekov saved the best for last
23:52:29 <Lasty> It always does.
23:59:40 <Eksell> Unstable branch on CRAWL.XTAHUA.COM updated to: 0.21-a0-128-gf2b353c (34)