00:00:10 <Eksell> Unstable branch on CRAWL.XTAHUA.COM updated to: 0.20-a0-1126-g0f15420 (34)
00:12:46 <nikheizen> for once i agree with you on something
01:19:11 <Gretell> Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.20-a0-1126-g0f15420 (34)
01:21:10 <gammafunk> who are you again?
01:59:34 <Gretell> Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.20-a0-1126-g0f15420
02:52:47 <Gretell> Monster database of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.20-a0-1126-g0f15420
03:13:46 -!- amalloy is now known as amalloy_
03:14:02 <Rotatell> Unstable branch on crawl.beRotato.org updated to: 0.20-a0-1126-g0f15420 (34)
03:14:38 -!- amalloy_ is now known as amalloy
04:12:47 -!- amalloy is now known as amalloy_
06:25:07 -!- Stendarr|2 is now known as stendarr
08:40:43 -!- jeefus is now known as jefus
10:19:14 <advil> johnstein: I think this request is referring to CBRO: https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=11064
10:21:14 <advil> I have no idea how to see what their mantis email is though (either it's not possible or I don't have the permissions or the link is somewhere really strange)
10:21:21 <advil> hm maybe !tell is better
10:21:37 <advil> !tell johnstein I think this request is referring to CBRO: https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=11064
10:21:38 <Sequell> advil: OK, I'll let johnstein know.
10:22:56 <advil> %git 00179d9
10:22:56 <Cheibriados> 07PleasingFungus02 * 0.20-a0-810-g00179d9: Fix /Random Effects (10960) 10(3 months ago, 2 files, 2+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/00179d9f2c0d
10:24:27 <johnstein> advil: I get access denied when I try that link. I don't get that for a different item (11063)
10:24:27 <Sequell> johnstein: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it.
10:24:59 <advil> oh weird they set it as private
10:25:48 <advil> they had some issue with mistyping the email when they registered an account
10:26:38 <johnstein> ah ok.
10:26:39 <advil> I'm not immediately sure how to give you access...do you have an email address you use for requests like this? or should I point them to IRC?
10:28:37 <advil> ah it's on the wordpress howto
10:28:44 <advil> johnstein@beRotato.org ?
10:54:13 <Cheibriados> 03advil02 07* 0.20-a0-1127-g1289703: Fix Makhleb's major destruction (11063) 10(4 minutes ago, 1 file, 2+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/128970383703
11:09:27 <Jorgrell> Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.20-a0-1127-g1289703 (34)
11:16:20 <PalythWork> hey quick question, is the rPois displaying issue (which i assume is bumping the Spirit over too much) a display issue or an actual issue in the dump file. Dont want to create an issue if this is just a display issue. https://crawl.jorgrun.rocks/morgue/palyth/palyth.txt
11:18:36 <advil> hmm that looks like a character set problem
11:18:52 <advil> it's an infinity symbol, I assume
11:18:57 <advil> probably worth creating an issue for
11:19:34 <advil> though there may already be one, let me check
11:20:55 <advil> (it's definitely not the only character code issue in text files outputted by crawl, but it's usually mainly an issue in crashlogs)
11:21:59 * geekosaur is not sure what the problem is here; dump looks fine?
11:22:12 <geekosaur> maybe the problem is some people have locale issues trying to view the dump file
11:23:50 <advil> you might have manually set it at some point, |amethyst suggested I do that for the crashlogs but I never got around to it
11:24:08 <advil> shows as (no idea if this will work) rPois    ∞
11:24:24 <PalythWork> http://dobrazupa.org/morgue/palyth/morgue-palyth-20150321-011713.txt
11:24:26 <PalythWork> that is fine
11:24:38 <PalythWork> both Ghouls
11:24:42 <advil> hm
11:25:06 <advil> must be some interaction with server
11:25:07 <PalythWork> i need to step away and pretend to do work at work...but if it is an issue, i can create something when i get back
11:26:01 <geekosaur> ok, it's possible the problem is cjr is sending it with a bad charset/locale header; I set my browser to force utf8
11:26:08 <geekosaur> so it looks fine to me
11:26:27 <advil> yeah, I think that's what's happening
11:26:28 * geekosaur got tired of misconfigured web servers _years_ ago
11:26:58 <advil> I did too but I'm lazier I guess :D
11:28:45 <advil> PalythWork: yes, it is a bug, and I think the specific issue is that CJR is sending text files with windows-1252 encoding, rather than UTF-8
11:28:46 <geekosaur> (also that "shows as" is kinda classic utf8 being displayed as iso8859)
11:29:33 <advil> or windows-1252 in this case, it seems (I have no idea what that is)
11:30:08 <advil> some ms custom superset of 8859
11:30:24 <geekosaur> yes
11:31:19 <geekosaur> well, not that custom it's the designated iso8859-x code page (with most of the variations presumably being trying to deal with the fact that iso8859 is not a single character set but a family)
12:22:25 <Cheibriados> CJR is displaying dumps with wrong encoding. 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=11065 by Palyth
12:56:29 -!- amalloy_ is now known as amalloy
13:06:03 <Henzell> Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.20-a0-1127-g1289703 (34)
14:02:35 <Doesnty> ok i'm trying to work through the pacify formula and i have a better idea than making the odds visible
14:02:40 <Doesnty> make the formula simpler
14:05:34 <geekosaur> in the land of crawlcode, those are famous last words >.>
14:08:48 <Doesnty> https://pastebin.com/KPjXyNAk i think i'm reading the code right?
14:10:45 <Doesnty> i don't think the practice of rolling dice to determine the size of the next dice to roll is kosher either
14:11:50 <amalloy> it's bizarre in terms of actual sensible statistical practices, but not that uncommon in crawlcode i think
14:14:31 <geekosaur> ^
14:14:40 <geekosaur> again, "in the land of crawlcode..."
14:14:48 <geekosaur> here be dragons, leave your sanity at the door
14:20:09 <minmay> weapon damage and to-hit both do that
14:20:28 <minmay> multiple times even
14:33:07 <Doesnty> shout-outs to healing taking power as a parameter, which is determined purely from invo, and then directly accessing invo anyway though
14:59:39 <geekosaur> Doesnty, I think that's left over from ely healing being based on piety in very old versions
14:59:54 <Doesnty> prob.
15:35:11 -!- jeefus is now known as jefus
18:04:23 <Lantell> Unstable branch on underhound.eu updated to: 0.20-a0-1127-g1289703 (34)
18:40:35 <minmay> ok, items that you see held by monsters really need to be marked as seen
18:41:05 <minmay> i killed an orc warrior and maurice picked up its hand axe of electrocution 200 turns later because i hadn't walked over the pile
18:46:10 <ProzacElf> awesome
18:46:24 <ProzacElf> although i thought maurice could pick up shit you'd seen anyway
18:47:19 <amalloy> only if you're holding it
18:51:20 <ProzacElf> oh
18:51:39 <ProzacElf> i swear someone told me he could swipe wands you dropped on the floor too though
18:52:05 <geekosaur> maurice used to be able to grab more stuff, years ago
18:54:31 <amalloy> monsters in general used to be able to pick up things you put on the floor, not just maurice
18:55:12 <amalloy> (this led players to throw powerful but unwanted stuff into lava just in case)
18:55:30 <Doesnty> oh, did maurice specifically stop cheating
18:56:08 <geekosaur> ??monsters[3
18:56:08 <Sequell> monsters[3/4]: dirty cheaters
18:56:16 <sedition> lol
18:56:19 <Doesnty> it's maurice
18:56:28 <Doesnty> he can do something perfectly normal and it's cheating
19:02:41 <amalloy> do we still want new results for the 2016 player survey, or should i un-sticky it from /r/dcss?
19:05:25 <gammafunk> we were planning to close the survey with the new release
19:05:35 <gammafunk> I guess leave it up until next Wed?
19:05:58 <gammafunk> but that commit will probably be made before then and could be made any time
19:06:18 <gammafunk> the commit to disable the survey message, that is
19:06:49 <gammafunk> 4,174 responses in total so far
19:07:22 <gammafunk> percent that have won the game finally went under 50% to 48.9%
19:07:27 <gammafunk> perfect game balance achieved????
19:17:30 <KurzedMetal> Hey guys, what do you think about showing the AEVP for body armours while inspecting them? I think it would help new players understand the importance of armour skill and str in removing that penalty. I even gave it a try to implement it, but I have barely no experience with C/C++ and still didn't get my dev env up to test it myself: https://github.com/KurzedMetal/crawl/commit/5b6479ec14eae6571fc7706d374631113a5a67c1
19:40:42 <Floodkiller> is there any interest in merging/rejecting PR #534? it's pretty low impact (just vault modifications), so I was hoping it could get looked at before feature freeze
19:42:01 <gammafunk> !pr 534
19:42:01 <Sequell> https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/534
19:42:09 <advil> Floodkiller: it seems like a very good idea to me but I'm not a vaults person at all
19:42:59 <gammafunk> I'm doing freeze/branching today
19:43:08 <gammafunk> after I finish up my vault content and push
19:43:21 <gammafunk> this could get merged after freeze
19:43:38 <gammafunk> did you make people without flight at least get penalized reasonably consistently?
19:43:43 <gammafunk> in terms of having to travel further
19:44:03 <advil> that's what it looks like
19:44:08 <Floodkiller> yes, almost every instance of the shallow water paths is either visiting more land mass or exposing more open area
19:44:11 <gammafunk> well I saw that he mentioned it
19:44:20 <gammafunk> but what I'm asking is, how consistent is this penalty
19:44:38 <amalloy> it doesn't look like that was done for the geh map
19:44:45 <gammafunk> e.g. "you walk two tiles further" is not a real penalty
19:45:02 <Floodkiller> the geh map didn't really have space to do that, for the most part
19:45:19 <gammafunk> yeah, so this might want to wait until 0.21, but I think it's an ok change
19:45:25 <Floodkiller> neither did coc_grunt
19:45:49 <gammafunk> since the number of games where people are affected by this as a problem are just so very few it's not a huge priority
19:45:59 <gammafunk> but I'll take a look and possibly merge
19:46:33 <Floodkiller> I can grab some minimap screenshots if you would prefer that over looking at vault code
19:48:18 <gammafunk> well it would be more helpful if you could modify your commit to fix those maps where you weren't able to penalize lack of flight much
19:48:38 <gammafunk> it is possible for those maps to simply not penalize it, I think that theme is most strongly represented in cocytus as opposed to geh but
19:48:40 -!- amalloy is now known as amalloy_
19:49:03 <gammafunk> it would be nice if those maps designed to strongly favor use of flight continued to do so
19:51:49 <Floodkiller> I can look into coc_grunt and see if I can make the shallow water stretch longer between islands (although there isn't much space to overly extend it)
19:53:35 <gammafunk> if you can't finish changes soon, this is also something we can merge in trunk at pretty much any time
19:54:05 <gammafunk> since it's not any kind of hugely hyped change like tomb hatches that will make literally everyone play only trunk!!!
19:54:20 <gammafunk> !lg * tomb newtomb s=src
19:54:21 <Sequell> 75 games for * (tomb newtomb): 19x cwz, 17x cbro, 14x cao, 11x cxc, 4x cpo, 4x cue, 3x lld, 2x cjr, cdo
19:54:26 <gammafunk> finally, cwz back on top
19:54:44 <gammafunk> another thing we didn't really get to was alex's Zin PR
19:54:55 <gammafunk> I never really got to look at it and I didn't hear much other feedback
19:55:25 <gammafunk> oh I guess brannock commented that it might wait till 0.21
19:55:42 <gammafunk> I suppose it is a fairly drastic change that would have needed merging earlier
19:56:11 <Floodkiller> looking at geh_mu, I think extending the main bridge over lava might ruin the vault's appearance (it's easier to blend shallow water and deep water for paths than solid ground and lava)
19:56:37 <gammafunk> !vault geh_mu
19:56:37 <Sequell> 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/branches/geh.des#L485
19:58:18 <gammafunk> isn't the only required flight when going over the inner moat?
19:58:26 <Floodkiller> going over the inner moat and a single tile right in front of the rune (which I replaced with a door)
19:58:47 <gammafunk> yeah, so I think the door is fine for the rune
19:59:14 <gammafunk> and simply put a path to that one door exposed to the inner moat
19:59:33 <gammafunk> it's such a small distance over the lava
19:59:37 <gammafunk> literally two tiles
19:59:50 <gammafunk> so it doesn't really impact the appearance of the vault much at all
19:59:53 <Floodkiller> yeah, I currently just have those two tiles in front of the door as solid ground, since the player is already exploring around the moat to reach it
20:00:21 <gammafunk> right, that's all the change needed I think for that vault
20:00:32 <gammafunk> since the player already is forced to walk a huge distance to even get there
20:00:57 <Floodkiller> then that would just leave coc_grunt, which is the one with the bunch of skinny islands doing a snake to the two potential ends
20:01:05 <gammafunk> !vault coc_grunt
20:01:05 <Sequell> 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/branches/coc.des#L449
20:01:29 <Floodkiller> the current change I have for that is just connecting the skinny isles with mostly direct shallow water, but I could try to make them bend out a bit if desired
20:05:23 <gammafunk> yeah, this vault is a bit trickier to adapt
20:05:31 <gammafunk> probably the cleanest way is just to do it like that
20:06:17 <gammafunk> you could make the shallow water path take move tiles and in some instances run by islands with other things on it, but this is a vault that would need more serious rework
20:07:19 <gammafunk> s/take move tiles/take more tiles to move through/
20:08:40 <Floodkiller> the way I would probably change it through major rework would be to shrink the islands and make it more shallow water overall, then crack the walls for flight shortcuts
20:10:43 <gammafunk> yeah, you have to use those shortcuts pretty sparingly though
20:10:51 <gammafunk> since 99% of players will use them if they exist
20:11:53 <gammafunk> so you want to design the map primarily with the idea that players will have access to flight
20:12:32 <gammafunk> and consider the penalty for those vanishingly few players that manage to not have access to any source of flight
20:13:53 <Floodkiller> looking at it, I would probably do it by shortening how far down the wall goes on each side on the bottom to allow flight to skip the bottom islands if they wanted
20:14:18 <Floodkiller> but mostly design it around the map being mostly shallow water, so the main benefit would be avoiding shallow water fighting/movement
20:15:19 <gammafunk> yeah
20:40:07 <minmay> !tell marvinpa wand range is pretty bad on monsters, if you remember that wands of acid exist you'll never die to ijyb wand of acid because you can easily stay out of range. any wand monsters can use should have los range
20:40:08 <Sequell> minmay: OK, I'll let marvinpa know.
21:24:18 -!- thurin is now known as Guest3361
22:00:11 -!- aakz is now known as krystinec
22:16:31 <minmay> is it intended that orc knights can now might each other
22:37:18 <Doesnty> i think it is
22:37:30 <Doesnty> there was a lot of talking about it a while back
22:37:41 <Doesnty> when the battlecries were merged together
22:38:15 <Doesnty> https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/4634998fe68343748f85fe9ea3bfe43761273b36
22:49:59 <minmay> I see
22:50:00 <minmay> "The main impact on gameplay will be that knights can now rouse
22:50:01 <minmay> warlords."
22:50:14 <minmay> this seems like a big overestimation of how common orc warlords are :P
22:50:38 <Lasty> heh true
22:51:06 <minmay> !lg * orc s=cv / ckiller=orc_knight o=%
22:51:08 <Sequell> 5822/73714 games for * (orc): 295/2943x 0.14-a [10.02%], 156/1575x 0.12-a [9.90%], 426/4448x 0.19 [9.58%], 42/443x 0.3 [9.48%], 598/6531x 0.20-a [9.16%], 149/1651x 0.13 [9.02%], 86/988x 0.12 [8.70%], 210/2494x 0.13-a [8.42%], 186/2226x 0.15-a [8.36%], 288/3462x 0.16-a [8.32%], 71/856x 0.11-a [8.29%], 516/6222x 0.19-a [8.29%], 161/1972x 0.11 [8.16%], 103/1263x 0.14 [8.16%], 95/1179x 0.4 [8.06%], 25...
22:56:56 <alexjurkiewicz> is it a problem that knights can might knights tho
22:57:36 <minmay> no, I never said it was; just noticed it was new (old battle cry could only affect monsters with lower HD)
23:05:39 <Henzell> AlexThePrettyGood (L14 HEFE) ASSERT(range >= 0) in 'beam.cc' at line 601 failed. (beam 'puff of flame', source 'tengu conjurer', item 'none'; has range -1) (Zot (ZotDef))
23:13:47 <gammafunk> nice crash message
23:18:54 <gammafunk> woah
23:19:00 <gammafunk> toadstools wither and die?
23:31:09 <minmay> always have
23:32:35 <alexjurkiewicz> @??tengu conjurer
23:32:35 <Gretell> tengu conjurer (02Q) | Spd: 10 (move: 90%) | HD: 7 | HP: 28-36 | AC/EV: 2/17 | Dam: 10, 5, 5 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, spellcaster, see invisible, fly | Res: 06magic(20) | XP: 322 | Sp: mephitic cloud, b.venom (3d12), battlesphere, blink [04emergency] / mystic blast (3d13), force lance (3d11), battlesphere, blink [04emergency] / shock (d12), b.lightning (3d14), battlesphere, blink [04emergency] /..
23:52:48 <Yermak> Proposal: winning the very first tournament game counts as a streak continuation. I.e. +1 to streak length.