00:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:00:33 i prefer to think as rarely as possibl 00:05:14 -!- laj1 has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:08:09 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 00:18:34 -!- eb has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:22:11 -!- stabmebro has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:28:24 hm, who's the cyno guy? 00:29:22 <|amethyst> %git pull/426 00:29:22 07Floodkiller02 * 0.20-a0-445-g9e7cdba: Fix Ash skill boost exceeding Cyno skill cap. 10(3 days ago, 1 file, 2+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/9e7cdbadc5ed 00:30:01 -!- nd has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 00:31:18 -!- timvisher has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:31:48 Unstable branch on CRAWL.XTAHUA.COM updated to: 0.20-a0-492-g6327889 (34) 00:33:03 -!- debo has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 00:42:15 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 00:44:36 -!- Kramin42 is now known as Kramin 00:45:27 -!- laj1 has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 00:46:57 ty 00:47:36 !tell floodkiller a little funny that you can train base skills to 14 even if cross-training makes it irrelevant... pro anti-draining tech? 00:47:37 Pleasingfungus: OK, I'll let floodkiller know. 00:47:55 (not sure what the ordering is there) 00:48:03 !tell floodkiller though of course the same is true for normal races! 00:48:04 Pleasingfungus: OK, I'll let floodkiller know. 00:48:38 -!- maha_ has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.93 [Firefox 50.1.0/20161208153507]] 00:49:32 yeah, it is an interesting quirk of how cross-training seems to apply first 00:49:32 Floodkiller: You have 2 messages. Use !messages to read them. 00:50:09 but also doesn't stop you from training the base skill 00:51:34 was watching arag play his doggo 00:51:53 tabstorm complained that the race is bad because it encourages 'warrior mages', 'which are bad' 00:51:58 'but all spells higher than level 4 are bad' 00:52:50 -!- maha_ has quit [Client Quit] 00:52:56 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 00:54:42 in conclusion memes 00:55:33 -!- Blazinghand has joined ##crawl-dev 00:55:37 what on earth 00:56:18 tabstorm....woat.... 00:56:37 yeah it's kind of a warriormage synergy race 00:56:38 so making them dogs was, in fact, the perfect fit then 00:57:32 can't teach an old dog new tricks 00:57:32 Floodkiller: I haven't read the original commit if you gave a summary there, but where you basically going for a species with a kind of "inverted difficulty"? 00:58:55 that's what design goal I'm attempting to design the species around, yes 00:59:18 yeah I think this was talked about, even with myself being present and participating in the conversation, but I forgot 01:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:01:42 -!- JimmahDean has quit [] 01:02:20 crazy ideas: a game which is easier at the start, but harder at the end 01:02:27 i won't have it. 01:02:52 -!- Harudoku has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:03:39 that game exists, and it is called Sailor Moon Tentacle Hentai Highschool Touhou Magic Dream 01:04:57 hm 01:07:05 -!- krull has quit [Quit: Page closed] 01:07:50 I'd get more involved with discussing it, but I'm currently busy shitposting about AGDQ 01:08:01 the guy who yelled at the audience 01:08:05 stop complaining about him, Floodkiller 01:08:25 I'm complaining about the lack of Bepis 01:09:23 SA people are so bizarre 01:09:45 pff 01:10:29 i got over the removal of HE by playing dwarf fortress 01:10:33 and killing elves 01:11:57 i was gonna say i got over it by dreaming of elves but i havent had any dreams of elves since HE removal 01:12:01 ! 01:12:05 Pleasingfungus, I noticed the same thing about crosstraining 01:12:05 rast: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 01:12:08 haha 01:12:11 its not even a change from the base game btw 01:12:19 when i was writing the blog changelog post 01:12:23 just in the base game people arent usually getting to 27 skill 01:12:27 i was really really tempted to make the changes an acrostic for HIGH ELVES SUCK 01:12:30 or something like that 01:12:38 heh 01:12:41 !messages 01:12:41 (1/1) dpeg said (1d 14h 58m 30s ago): Yeah, a Gozag unique would be cool! :) $$$ 01:13:09 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:13:46 the crawl 0.20 downloads page is a redirect to "Never Gonna Give You Up" 01:13:53 epic. 01:14:09 -!- timvisher has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:16:44 acrostic or uh 01:16:47 dammit 01:17:05 that word where you rearrange letters 01:17:27 anagram! 01:18:08 you'd probably only use part of the post in that case 01:18:11 the opening or closing message, i suppose 01:20:02 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.20-a0-492-g6327889 (34) 01:22:03 if you enter the konami code ont he web page the letters rearrange htemselves into an ascii elf 01:22:24 -!- acalycine has quit [Quit: bye] 01:23:31 -!- eb_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:46:28 liar! 01:50:52 -!- simmarine has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:50:58 -!- acalycine has quit [Quit: bye] 01:56:51 Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.20-a0-492-g6327889 01:57:15 -!- mong has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:07:23 -!- Pleasingfungus has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.93 [Firefox 50.1.0/20161208153507]] 02:10:31 -!- HellTiger_NB has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:17:03 -!- tukey has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 02:17:40 heh 02:17:48 |amethyst: ever heard of anything like this? https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=22812 02:22:34 -!- AltReality has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:26:19 heh 02:26:39 i assume you personally put that in when you removed HE 02:26:43 =p 02:37:48 -!- Lasty has joined ##crawl-dev 02:53:02 -!- timvisher has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:54:38 Monster database of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.20-a0-492-g6327889 02:58:44 -!- coledot has quit [Quit: coledot] 03:00:04 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:00:57 -!- Pacra has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 03:04:51 -!- ig0rbit has quit [Client Quit] 03:12:33 -!- aditya has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 03:19:14 cigotuvi (L18 MiBe) ASSERT(verb_index < (int)ARRAYSZ(attack_types)) in 'mon-util.cc' at line 2075 failed. (WizLab) 03:20:00 cigotuvi (L18 MiBe) ASSERT(verb_index < (int)ARRAYSZ(attack_types)) in 'mon-util.cc' at line 2075 failed. (WizLab) 03:20:22 -!- Insomniak` has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 03:22:35 -!- CanOfWorms has joined ##crawl-dev 03:23:25 Experimental (councilgod-PR) branch on crawl.beRotato.org updated to: 0.20-a0-694-ga0108bb 03:26:13 looks like someone's latched on to the poison dart barachians... 03:27:53 the fault of our tiles devs 03:28:01 -!- sooheon has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:32:35 !learn add hellcrawl https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=21527 03:32:36 hellcrawl[2/2]: https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=21527 03:36:59 Unstable branch on crawl.beRotato.org updated to: 0.20-a0-492-g6327889 (34) 03:45:36 -!- debo has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:47:55 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: I'M OUT SON. PEACE, LOVE, EXPLOSIONS.] 03:48:52 -!- timvisher has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:00:04 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:03:54 -!- Zeor1 has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 04:05:34 -!- CanOfWorms has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.92 [Firefox 3.6.28/20120306064154]] 04:08:15 Experience potion failed to advance my level 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=10904 by nubinia 04:09:54 -!- Ququman has joined ##crawl-dev 04:12:13 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:17:51 -!- APV_ has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 04:27:36 -!- filthy has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:36:15 -!- scummos| has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 04:41:29 lol 04:41:31 quick question 04:41:41 ??starting stats [2] 04:41:41 starting stats[2/3]: Ba: 6,6,6 | Ce 10,7,4 | DD 11,8,8 | DE 5,12,10 | Dg 11,12,11 | Dr 10,8,6 | Ds 8,9,8 | Fe 4,9,11 | Fo 12,7,6 | Gh 11,3,4 | Gr 11,8,5 | Ha 8,7,9 | HE 7,11,10 | HO 10,8,6 | Hu 8,8,8 | Ko 6,6,11 | Mf 8,7,9 | Mi 12,5,5 | Mu 11,7,7 | Na 10,8,6 | og 11,9,4 | Op 7,10,7 | Sp 4,9,11 | Te 8,8,9 | Tr 15,4,5 | Vp 7,10,9 | VS 10,8,9 04:41:42 -!- timvisher has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:41:45 ??stat gain [2] 04:41:45 stat gain[2/2]: Ba sid/5 | Ce sd/4 | DD si/4 | DE i/4 | Dg choose2/3 | Dr sid/4 | Ds sid/4 | Fe id/5 | Fo si/4 | Gh s/5 | Gr si/4 | Ha d/5 | HE id/3 | HO s/5 | Hu sid/4 | Ko sd/5 | Mf sid/5 | Mi sd/4 | Mu sid/5 | Na sid/4 | Og s/3 | Op sid/5 | Sp id/5 | Te sid/4 | Tr s/3 | Vp id/5 | VS sd/4 04:41:58 how come Ko still are sd/5 stat gain 04:42:13 because the devs hate ko 04:42:17 bu have 5/9/10 starting stats 04:42:17 duh 04:42:59 "ko should be geared toward magic. but not actually have stats that imply that" 04:44:02 !tell MarvinPA How come Ko still have SD/5 statgain when their starting statline is 5/9/10? 04:44:03 Lightli: OK, I'll let marvinpa know. 04:44:20 lol 04:44:20 good luck 04:44:38 -!- SteelNeuron has joined ##crawl-dev 04:44:44 !messages 04:44:44 No messages for SteelNeuron. 04:45:32 hey SteelNeuron, i have like 8 cylob videos i could send to you =p 04:45:45 cylob? 04:45:49 lol 04:46:12 you're australian, yes? 04:46:37 or a kiwi maybe 04:47:27 oooh no, my timezone isn't THAT off 04:47:32 I'm from Spain :) 04:47:38 But I go to bed early so I might as well be 04:47:44 lol 04:48:32 i guess it's a lot less funny then 04:49:46 I thought you were talking about a crawl species so go figure 04:49:53 haha 04:50:39 FR: autechre 04:50:44 species 04:52:22 -!- Insomniak` has quit [Quit: I like to rock] 04:56:55 -!- ig0rbit has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:01:01 -!- rossi has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:02:30 -!- GauHelldragon has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 05:06:48 -!- dondy1 is now known as dondy 05:09:56 -!- vale_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:12:37 -!- timvisher has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:15:42 -!- wheals has joined ##crawl-dev 05:22:42 -!- vale_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:23:08 -!- purge has quit [Quit: Page closed] 05:37:04 -!- Tux[Qyou] has joined ##crawl-dev 05:38:54 -!- amalloy_ is now known as amalloy 05:40:15 -!- ProzacElf has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 05:54:07 -!- timvisher has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:00:01 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:05:34 -!- laj1 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:20:10 -!- scummos__ has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 06:32:09 -!- snux has quit [Quit: leaving] 06:35:20 -!- timvisher has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:49:30 -!- Kellhus has quit [Quit: Page closed] 07:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:06:13 -!- bgiannan has joined ##crawl-dev 07:12:42 -!- timvisher has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:19:46 -!- bencryption has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.0.1] 07:25:14 -!- Ge0ff has quit [Quit: Leaving] 07:26:32 -!- amalloy is now known as amalloy_ 07:34:26 -!- Lightli has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:42:57 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 07:50:00 -!- timvisher has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:51:58 -!- epsilonhalbe has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 08:00:01 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:15:12 -!- epsilonhalbe has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:19:25 -!- Taraiph has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:21:48 -!- timvisher has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:29:14 -!- Syader has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:35:16 -!- sooheon has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 08:35:40 -!- laj1 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:36:18 -!- SteelNeuron has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:45:10 -!- debo has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:00:15 -!- timvisher has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:06:32 -!- Lightli has joined ##crawl-dev 09:11:40 -!- scummos| has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:22:00 -!- Dark-Jedi has quit [Quit: If it breaks, you get to keep both backports.] 09:23:32 -!- bgiannan has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 09:36:56 -!- Sentinel_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 09:41:19 -!- removeelyvilon has quit [Quit: Page closed] 09:41:41 -!- removeelyvilon has joined ##crawl-dev 09:42:55 time for my daily dose of good info 09:44:52 -!- timvisher has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:52:38 -!- laj1 has joined ##crawl-dev 10:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:00:24 -!- Jarlyk2 has quit [Quit: Page closed] 10:09:05 -!- sooheon has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:15:24 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:15:57 -!- removeelyvilon has quit [Quit: Page closed] 10:16:50 -!- simmarine has joined ##crawl-dev 10:26:50 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 10:38:01 -!- bgiannan has joined ##crawl-dev 10:39:22 -!- Harudoku_ is now known as Harudoku 10:42:58 -!- bgiannan has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:45:09 -!- wheals_ has joined ##crawl-dev 10:47:18 -!- wheals has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 10:51:28 -!- Fixer has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:05:37 -!- wheals_ is now known as wheals 11:13:44 -!- KamiKatze has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:17:34 -!- MarvinPA_ has joined ##crawl-dev 11:20:30 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:22:07 -!- scummos| has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 11:29:00 -!- Smello has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 11:32:35 -!- laj1 has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:44:51 -!- SteelNeuron has joined ##crawl-dev 12:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:02:32 -!- ig0rbit has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:11:32 -!- MadCoyote is now known as FunkyBomb 12:12:49 -!- timvisher has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:19:28 -!- concrocotta has quit [Quit: Ciao] 12:21:22 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 12:22:29 -!- aditya has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.6] 12:22:55 -!- ProzacElf has joined ##crawl-dev 12:25:25 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.20-a0-492-g6327889 (34) 12:27:47 -!- sooheon has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 12:39:59 -!- timvisher has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:47:37 -!- matp has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 12:49:35 -!- scummos| has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:50:23 -!- removeelyvilon has quit [Quit: Page closed] 12:51:08 -!- Tuxedo[Qyou] has joined ##crawl-dev 12:53:00 -!- simmarine has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:53:14 -!- simmarine has joined ##crawl-dev 12:54:01 -!- Tux[Qyou] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:56:44 -!- sooheon has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:59:44 -!- LexAckson_ has joined ##crawl-dev 13:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:11:22 -!- Jarlyk2 has quit [Quit: Page closed] 13:18:53 -!- matp_ is now known as matp 13:20:01 -!- scummos| has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 13:21:31 -!- xnavy has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:22:34 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 13:29:44 -!- rossi has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:31:28 -!- MarvinPA_ has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 13:40:10 -!- Soul_ has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 13:40:57 -!- LexAckson__ has joined ##crawl-dev 13:40:57 -!- LexAckson_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:41:16 -!- FunkyBomb has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 13:41:20 -!- bgiannan has joined ##crawl-dev 13:43:02 -!- BadBadger is now known as FunkyBomb 13:45:55 -!- bgiannan has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:50:43 -!- sooheon has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:52:15 -!- zxc has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:56:40 -!- LexAckson__ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:04:27 -!- coledot has joined ##crawl-dev 14:05:43 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 14:06:23 -!- timvisher has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:21:56 -!- victorclf has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:23:55 -!- pib has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:28:58 -!- scummos__ has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 14:29:01 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 14:30:44 -!- epsilonhalbe has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:39:28 -!- amalloy_ is now known as amalloy 14:41:12 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 14:42:42 -!- Tuxedo[Qyou] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:42:56 -!- quinn has joined ##crawl-dev 14:43:01 -!- Tuxedo[Qyou] has joined ##crawl-dev 14:43:23 -!- quinn has quit [Client Quit] 14:43:31 -!- Shard1697 has joined ##crawl-dev 14:44:29 -!- sooheon has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:48:55 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 14:55:33 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 15:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:15:20 -!- Dixie has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:15:48 MarvinPA: Are you happy with where scattershot is balance-wise? I noticed that it one-shot many hydra with not all that much evo 15:16:00 dynast was saying he five-shot trj with it with 6 evo 15:16:46 which it can be fine to have a top-tier damage wand like that, but I wonder if it should perhaps be more rare 15:19:29 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: I'M OUT SON. PEACE, LOVE, EXPLOSIONS.] 15:19:35 -!- lunkers has joined ##crawl-dev 15:28:30 well, i figured the point was that evo was going to be useless to train =p 15:31:06 -!- Tuxedo[Qyou] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:31:23 not sure why you would figure that, but ok 15:33:15 heh, you always take my sarcasm at face value 15:34:00 i'm sure that you guys wanted to make it so "train evo" wasn't a no brainer 15:35:00 -!- timvisher has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:35:13 but i think it's kind of gone to where it's not worth training at all most of the time 15:38:36 -!- lobf has joined ##crawl-dev 15:38:36 well that's what I mean ProzacElf 15:39:07 -!- sooheon has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:39:08 -!- dtsund has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:39:19 "evo is useless to train =" "oh why are you listening to my sarcastic statement about evo being useless =p" "actually evo is useless =p" 15:39:32 so it's not clear what your actual position is 15:39:43 if it's seriously that evo is useless to train, you're just wrong 15:39:46 the opposite of that is true 15:40:24 -!- Lasty has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:41:30 it's schroedinger's design complaint 15:42:38 -!- Lasty has joined ##crawl-dev 15:48:35 -!- valrus has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:48:57 gammafunk: sorry about being unclear. i think evo has gone too far in the direction of being useless 15:49:17 but my original comment was just me being snarky 15:49:19 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 15:49:45 i will endeavor to not do that in the future 15:49:59 yeah, I figured as much, but I just can't agree with that 15:50:54 -!- bgiannan has joined ##crawl-dev 15:51:00 I think a solid majority of characters want to train at least some evocations, and training more (more being like "somewhere well above 10") gives you a good return 15:51:20 now you can choose not to train evocations and win, but that's true of every school 15:51:26 s/school/skill/ 15:52:17 i may be off base about wand of clouds too 15:52:20 more more would better be described as "somewhere well above 8", but you have a bunch of items that become rather strong with high evo 15:52:26 but scattershot is great at 0 evo 15:52:32 it gives you OP summons and a bunch of conjurations/aoe effects 15:52:37 so it's kind of a universal problem solver 15:53:08 i'll admit that evo was overpowered as soon as you found your first rod 15:53:16 in 0.17-0.19 15:54:49 i just think that it's in kind of a weird spot right now 15:55:08 right but you haven't substantiated any of these claims well 15:55:38 probably you're way overstating how good rods were (they were relatively bad in most cases without a lot of evo) 15:56:11 well, i maybe didn't make it clear but /scattershot and lightning rod seem like they're a lot better at 0 evo than the equivalent rods were 15:56:16 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 15:57:01 lightning rod in particular seems way better than disc of storms was at 0 evo 15:57:40 if that's intended, then ok 15:58:30 well disc of storms was infinitely evocable 15:58:35 and scattershot seems like it lost the cone aoe in return for more damage 15:58:57 well, disc was also functionally useless if you didn't have reled. 15:59:02 relec 15:59:41 that's not the case, but it did limit people's use of it; my point is that they're not good comparisons 15:59:55 -!- wheals_ has joined ##crawl-dev 16:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:00:12 well, the rod did directly replace the disc 16:00:26 did it? 16:00:58 well, it seemed like it from the end-user view 16:00:59 I'd say that the disc just got removed for the most part 16:01:10 -!- timvisher has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:01:20 no it doesn't really seem that way; if it replaced anything, it replace the lightning rod 16:01:24 (the actual rod) 16:01:28 heh 16:01:31 ok, fair 16:02:05 i'm not trying to pick a fight with you here, btw. 16:02:23 -!- wheals has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:02:38 i just happen to naturally be a dick sometimes =p 16:03:42 …you should work on that ;) 16:03:43 lobf: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 16:03:52 !messages 16:03:53 (1/1) PleasingFungus said (4w 5d 3h 34m 20s ago): https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/docs/crawl_manual.rst#n-philosophy-pas-de-faq 16:04:02 pff 16:04:30 well this is not 4chan or w/e; no one is assuming (or even cares) that so-and-so is in a 'beef' with so-and-so 16:10:51 -!- valrus has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:12:25 -!- ontoclasm1 has joined ##crawl-dev 16:18:51 mmm 16:18:53 beef 16:25:52 -!- Dixie has quit [Quit: brb] 16:28:46 I'm out of fish 16:28:51 going to buy more tomorrow 16:30:11 -!- timvisher has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:32:53 -!- sooheon has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:36:55 -!- scummos| has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:37:49 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 16:38:40 nooooo 16:39:05 my brother got me a bunch of stuff from a german place in wisconsin for xmas 16:39:14 i never heard of "rollmops" before 16:39:19 but they're pretty damned good 16:39:34 herring fillets wrapped around a cornichon 16:42:31 -!- Menche has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:42:49 rollmop sounds like a swiffer sweeper 16:44:32 or one of those mops from commercials on the low rent cable channels 16:49:38 yeah, my brother asked me if i ever heard of them before i opened them 16:49:51 i was like "what, a cleaning product?" 16:53:39 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:02:22 -!- Pleasingfungus has joined ##crawl-dev 17:02:53 %git 716b500fed3976d1ddd75953281b7fe19d162c47 17:02:53 07MarvinPA02 * 0.20-a0-415-g716b500: Replace discs of storms with lightning rods 10(4 weeks ago, 38 files, 101+ 152-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/716b500fed39 17:02:56 gammafunk: ^ 17:02:59 ProzacElf: ^ 17:05:11 -!- bgiannan has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 17:08:57 -!- timvisher has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:10:21 -!- Dark-Jedi has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 17:11:59 that doesn't change my statement 17:12:27 most especially doesn't change what I said about evocations in general 17:12:40 i'm not disagreeing about evo in general 17:12:45 but to that end, it's possible that some of those new wands will get adjustments 17:12:57 just saying that 17:13:00 16:01:20 no it doesn't really seem that way; if it replaced anything, it replace the lightning rod 17:13:13 feels a bit silly when the actual commit describes it as replacing stormdisc 17:13:42 I mean it doesn't feel silly to me; it is correct, what I said 17:14:16 -!- Harudoku has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:14:47 -!- GraemeLion has joined ##crawl-dev 17:16:28 MPA can just send me a tell with a chaos dunk, if he wants 17:16:30 I'm impervious 17:20:50 -!- LexAckson__ has joined ##crawl-dev 17:26:03 -!- Jarlyk2 has quit [Quit: Page closed] 17:26:55 lol 17:27:25 -!- sooheon has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 17:29:14 undunkable 17:29:36 I've heard it said that you are rubber 17:29:41 and that I am glue 17:30:31 A Golem Uranium Elementalist? excellent combo choice, Lasty 17:31:19 gammafunk: sshh, not until 0.21 and the removal of minotaurs 17:31:32 ! 17:32:01 oh can we replace them with my multiple neck race? 17:32:55 ProzacElf: that's on the won't-do list, but uranium elementals aren't. 17:32:58 Makes ya think. 17:33:24 to be fair, only multple *head* races are on the won't do list 17:33:35 no one said anything about 8 necks attached to one head 17:34:04 ProzacElf: this race should start with all the amulets 17:34:09 i also didn't see anything prohibiting a detachable head 17:34:12 and no ability to remove any of them 17:34:14 that you can throw at dudes 17:34:16 heh 17:34:17 -!- hellmonk has joined ##crawl-dev 17:34:21 someone has been playing too much Decap Attack 17:34:22 i can live with that 17:34:29 Two different people proposed that on tavern recently. 17:35:04 hey, i came up with this idea like 2 or 3 years ago! 17:35:07 =p 17:35:30 did they pay any royalties? 17:36:29 they will after i sue the bejeezus out of them! 17:37:53 also, explain the difference between uranium elementals and plutonians 17:38:27 *elementalists 17:38:38 one's a background, the other is a species 17:39:36 ah 17:39:41 how obvious 17:40:57 -!- MarvinPA_ has joined ##crawl-dev 17:46:05 -!- LexAckson__ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:49:08 -!- scummos__ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:50:47 -!- removeelyvilon has quit [Quit: Page closed] 17:52:48 hellmonk: dcss-ca also removed monsters spawning after level generation, and it made levels feel quite empty. you might want to generate more monsters in the first place 17:53:03 yeah, that will probably happen 17:53:20 I really need to do something about stairdancing before messing w/ anything else though 17:54:16 god, that GDD thread about "phasing out races" 17:54:29 gammafunk: yep, it's amazing 17:54:36 dcss-ca idea again! it made using stairs interruptible 17:54:43 but hatches uninterruptible 17:54:52 I farmed some thanks in that thread so I don't mind it 17:55:16 hellmonk: smart 17:55:54 alexjurkiewicz, I'd probably just forbid any stair use with adjacent monsters 17:56:08 yet another stealth EV nerf 17:56:11 and tweak monster gen to not place monsters within a few tiles 17:56:28 everything's an elephant now? 17:56:30 oh, a tavern thread i need to check out? 17:56:59 dungeon crawl: elephant soup 17:57:59 MarvinPA_: good catch on the panlord ac/ev correlation -.- 17:58:35 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:00:20 -!- lunkers has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:00:25 having not read the thread, i like the idea of phasing out races. dcss, season 5, trading lizardmen and ettins for starkin and Deep Gnomes... 18:00:48 r e m o v e c e n t a u r s 18:00:56 x 18:01:30 is this about me? is it about me?! ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT ME IS IT ALL ACTUALLY ABOUT ME 18:01:43 ^ highlight from season 3 18:03:18 -!- Syader_ has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:04:11 I'm truly sorry for my part in that silliness, but it's just.. so obnoxious 18:04:50 should i actually read this thread 18:04:56 it's very cyc at the end 18:05:11 but no, you shouldn't 18:05:18 you don't deserve gdd, since you didn't read the frog thread 18:05:26 Pleasingfungus: only read it if you like tavern nonsense 18:05:35 damn it, Lasty! 18:05:42 haha 18:05:46 i'll pass for now. 18:08:46 Unstable branch on underhound.eu updated to: 0.20-a0-492-g6327889 (34) 18:09:29 incidentally, has there ever been a slime ending to Lair? 18:09:35 I'm thinking it could be good 18:09:39 don't believe so 18:10:07 r-i would argue that branch endings should focus on the content of the branch itself, rather than being yet another "here's another branch in this branch" thing 18:10:09 i had a slime lair:7 back in the day 18:10:13 probably her version would be more eloquent 18:10:14 lair 6 acid blobs pogchamp 18:10:17 and possibly mystify 18:10:31 thanks to acid blobs and azure jellies just wandering up the stairs 18:10:55 I did once have a Lair:6 with ~8 death oozes, but I never found a vault for it 18:11:02 that wasn't annoying at all btw 18:11:38 -!- Kranix has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 18:11:48 Pleasingfungus: I take it r-i is against most of the swamp endings 18:11:53 ya 18:11:57 Pleasingfungus: do dire elephants and dragons count in Lair/ 18:12:23 where do dire elephants fit if not in lair? 18:12:34 vaults, formerly 18:12:36 speaking purely for myself, i'd say dire elephants at least are fine 18:12:37 er -- depths 18:12:59 dragons are evergreen. they're good everywhere 18:13:11 D:1 storm dragon confirmed balanced 18:13:20 also lair is sort of the best place to get early dragon armor 18:13:38 actually a storm dragon lair ending would be "fun" 18:13:42 hellmonk: i ran into a d:7 storm dragon once =p 18:14:00 hellmonk: I was thinking that too. . . 18:14:32 i mean, d:2 shapeshifter that turned into a black mamba was probably the king of weird OOD spawns i've see 18:14:34 n 18:15:05 dunno what else you'd put with it though, there aren't a lot of air or lightning themed lair mobs 18:15:08 d:1 hill giant was also classy 18:15:13 eels 18:15:17 lots and lots of eels 18:15:21 eels are bad tho 18:15:42 ok, a shitload of raiju? 18:16:43 hellmonk: bai suzhen 18:16:48 lol 18:16:58 bai suzhen and 20 hydras 18:17:03 bai suzhen hd:8 name:Weakened Bai Suzhen 18:17:28 shock serpents 18:17:29 bai suzhen perm ench: charmed name:Bae Suzhen 18:17:39 and nikola 18:17:55 also, nikola should have s2s 18:17:58 And why not have a pack of dream sheep nearby. It'd be fun. 18:17:59 that summons more shock serpents 18:18:46 and also a spell that destroys resistance potions 18:19:19 re that "branch in a branch" thing, I think it's fine to do the crossovers that fold in a few select cross-branch monsters and mostly use Lair branch monsters 18:19:45 storm dragons don't sound very lair-appropriate 18:20:04 you're just trying to defend your sunken temple ending with the merfolk avatar, aren't you? =p 18:20:09 -!- Ququman has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:20:26 none of the current crossover vaults feel like they're vaults you'd normally find in their respective places; slime is a bit tough since slime has pretty nasty monsters 18:20:31 gammafunk: agreed 18:20:37 re folding in select mons 18:21:03 -!- sooheon has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:21:05 sorry ProzacElf, you're going to need to employ that "snark/irony statement -> factual statement" translator we talked about earlier 18:21:25 incidentally the tomb ending in spider has always felt a bit off to me 18:22:16 i actually don't mind that lair ending, but merfolk avatar is probably a nasty surprise if you're not aware of the vault to begin with 18:23:07 I'm all for jokes/memes in channel, but it really doesn't work great when you just speak this way during conversations where people are just trying to actually discuss things 18:23:33 i think jokes should be allowed. 18:23:35 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 18:23:38 agreed 18:24:14 i mean, i suppose i could tag it with "/s" instead of "=p" 18:24:43 you could tag it with s/.*// as well 18:24:48 i sort of felt the "sticking tongue out emoji" implied jokiness 18:24:51 -!- scummos__ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:24:54 har 18:25:41 gammafunk: nice meme 18:25:53 seriously, if you have an actual complaint, just make it in plain terms, it's not an insult to make one 18:26:14 i think it was just a joke..... 18:26:32 well, i clarified that i'm ok with that lair ending, even if it's a bit nasty 18:26:50 but that i think the tomb ending to spider feels a bit off 18:26:56 both in terms of theme and difficulty 18:27:20 i mean, i guess death scarabs are "spiders" sort of 18:27:45 non-spider monsters aren't good in spider? 18:28:11 are there any others that usually show up? 18:28:22 i mean, "moths" are not technically spiders 18:28:27 demonic crawlers 18:28:28 spider has scorpions, moths, wasps 18:28:32 and i guess demonic crawlers and scorpions 18:28:33 sometimes even ants 18:28:36 -!- timvisher has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:28:39 entropy weavers too 18:28:41 and yes entropy weavers 18:28:53 it has a bit list of non-spider monsters, yeah 18:29:05 *big 18:29:06 lol 18:29:11 notionally it's an ecosystem 18:29:19 all animals that prey on each other 18:29:25 spiders at the top, notionally? iirc 18:29:27 eels too 18:29:36 Pleasingfungus: it's an ecosystem based on adventurer prey 18:29:44 and nikola 18:29:46 One adventurer sustains the ecosystem for up to 12 seconds 18:29:55 this is why the game needs to be harder 18:29:57 so to summarize, "I think it feels off" isn't much help if you don't really explain why; even it feels too difficult is vague 18:29:59 mara is a very scary spider 18:30:20 if you mean the scarabs specifically are too difficult, they aren't really, and the vault isn't getting especially many kills 18:30:33 it isn't? :( 18:30:38 I think the death scarab one is ok, though it runs into the same problem as the other box of enemies one where it's kind of a spoiler since the best option is often to read teleport and then open the door 18:30:58 !spiderendkills current 18:30:59 Spider End kills (current): 82x spider_rune_water (26.20%), 61x grunt_spider_rune_circles (19.49%), 48x floodkiller_spider_rune_tomb (15.34%), 46x grunt_spider_rune_parallel (14.70%), 34x johnstein_spider_rune_arachne_lair (10.86%), 21x grunt_spider_rune_island (6.71%), 21x guppyfry_spider_rune (6.71%) 18:31:21 among the more dangerous, but not the most, and definitely nothing too bad 18:32:04 are there available stats about how frequently it shows up? 18:32:10 the tomb one isn't that bad about spoilerishness at all imo 18:32:23 it's pretty easy to figure that there's something bad behind the door 18:32:33 -!- bannakaffalatta has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 18:33:06 "well how is it too dangerous?", is my point; what hellmonk said is something valid, but it's not really about difficulty, and yeah that applies to other vaults 18:33:35 the "well I opened up this bad place and now I shall teleport" thing 18:33:35 yeah, I don't think it's particularly too difficult or worse than certain other vaults that do the same thing 18:33:38 tengu get so much more fun to play at xl14 18:33:44 or arguably before xl 5 18:35:20 -!- SteelNeuron has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:35:31 it actually isn't doing too bad, Floodkiller 18:35:43 oh hey, confused monsters with polearms can accidentally reach to hit you 18:35:49 i don't think that ending has ever actually killed me, so maybe i'm barking up the wrong tree. it just felt to me like 6-8 death scarabs was kind of a big spike in difficulty compared to what you'd normally see 18:36:07 although i guess 2 scorpions + 2 ghost moths + a spark wasp or 2 is just as bad 18:36:15 if not worse 18:36:33 they are faster, squishier emperor scorpions 18:36:56 the first vault there places more frequently than the others 18:37:02 this may also be a bit true for spider_rune_circles 18:37:18 everything in Spider dies to Confuse and Invis. 18:37:22 i feel like the tomb ending is the one of those i've seen the least 18:37:28 which makes it a pretty easy branch in a lot of games 18:37:31 Lasty: that is totally not true for demonic crawlers 18:37:34 true 18:37:42 tho they don't have the damage output to be scary on their own 18:37:44 counting how many times you have seen it is a bad indicator though, due to variance 18:37:56 source: every vpen i played before i learned to diversify 18:38:19 Based on my games, roulette of golubria has a rather high weight 18:42:47 -!- MarvinPA_ has quit [Quit: Leaving] 18:42:57 yes, it is true that that isn't a real great metric 18:43:27 although my games would indicate that hellbinder is the only wizlab 18:44:12 !wizlabs 18:44:14 WizLab seen by gammafunk (): 7x The Roulette of Golubria (25.93%), 5x Eringya's Formal Garden (18.52%), 4x The Chambers of the Cloud Mage (14.81%), 4x Zonguldrok's Shrine (14.81%), 2x Lehudib's Moon Base (7.41%), 2x Doroklohe's Tomb (7.41%), Cigotuvi's Fleshworks (3.70%), Wucad Mu's Monastery (3.70%), The Hall of the Hellbinder (3.70%) 18:44:32 nice 18:44:33 thats a cool command 18:44:37 !wizlabs 18:44:39 WizLab seen by hellmonk (): 4x Zonguldrok's Shrine (20.00%), 4x Iskenderun's Mystic Tower (20.00%), 3x The Roulette of Golubria (15.00%), 2x Lehudib's Moon Base (10.00%), 2x Cigotuvi's Fleshworks (10.00%), 2x The Chambers of the Cloud Mage (10.00%), 2x Wucad Mu's Monastery (10.00%), Doroklohe's Tomb (5.00%) 18:44:47 !wizlabs 18:44:48 WizLab seen by ProzacElf (): 7x The Hall of the Hellbinder (50.00%), 2x Doroklohe's Tomb (14.29%), Iskenderun's Mystic Tower (7.14%), Wucad Mu's Monastery (7.14%), Cigotuvi's Fleshworks (7.14%), The Roulette of Golubria (7.14%), The Chambers of the Cloud Mage (7.14%) 18:44:57 hahaha 18:45:00 oh wow, you really do get a lot of hellbinder 18:45:01 fully half! 18:45:15 !wizlabs 18:45:16 WizLab seen by Floodkiller (): 6x Iskenderun's Mystic Tower (15.38%), 6x The Hall of the Hellbinder (15.38%), 5x Eringya's Formal Garden (12.82%), 4x Wucad Mu's Monastery (10.26%), 4x The Roulette of Golubria (10.26%), 4x The Chambers of the Cloud Mage (10.26%), 3x Doroklohe's Tomb (7.69%), 3x Cigotuvi's Fleshworks (7.69%), 2x Lehudib's Moon Base (5.13%), Zonguldrok's Shrine (2.56%), Tukima's Stud... 18:45:51 now we know 18:45:56 who's taking all our portals 18:45:58 it's Floodkiller 18:46:10 where else do you think I grind my splatratio? 18:46:19 !wizrank Floodkiller 18:46:20 No keyword 'Floodkiller' 18:46:27 !wizrank name=Floodkiller 18:46:29 WizLab ranking (name=Floodkiller): 1/3x Cigotuvi's Fleshworks [33.33%], 1/6x The Hall of the Hellbinder [16.67%], 0/4x The Roulette of Golubria [0.00%], 0/1x Tukima's Studio [0.00%], 0/3x Doroklohe's Tomb [0.00%], 0/2x Lehudib's Moon Base [0.00%], 0/4x The Chambers of the Cloud Mage [0.00%], 0/4x Wucad Mu's Monastery [0.00%], 0/1x Zonguldrok's Shrine [0.00%], 0/6x Iskenderun's Mystic Tower [0.00%] 18:46:32 I need to fix that 18:46:58 I think the hellbinder death was to a Beogh wrath smite right after I got tormented 18:47:21 do things there actually have torment? 18:47:28 oh tormentors might place there 18:47:31 tormentors 18:47:39 -!- Kalir has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:48:00