00:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:02:00 hmm 00:02:09 just noticed skullcrusher has spikes on it... despite being a giant club 00:02:54 -!- MaxFrost has quit [Quit: Going offline, see ya! (www.adiirc.com)] 00:05:36 i thought it was a GSC 00:06:06 clearly it's a giant club with spikes on it 00:06:21 OBVIOUSLY distinct from a giant spiked club 00:06:24 GAWD 00:06:46 -!- ChaseSP has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 00:07:03 original weapon do not steal 00:07:20 it menaces with spikes of alder 00:13:11 there's a simple solution here 00:13:23 change the artefact :V 00:15:39 -!- FinalBossDad_ has joined ##crawl-dev 00:15:55 -!- luna1 has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:15:55 -!- Weretaco has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:15:55 -!- FinalBossDad has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:16:22 -!- illusion-znc has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:16:22 -!- yaknyasn has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:17:14 we can't do that though 00:17:16 that would be 00:17:21 an ogre buff 00:17:25 and we can't have that 00:17:34 no need to ogrereact 00:18:17 someone explain fire crabs to me 00:18:32 the reasoning behind them, that is 00:18:33 well, where do you think dragons evolved from 00:18:36 they're crabs 00:18:40 but with fire 00:18:42 difficulty: dont use cursed toes or death cobs in your argument 00:18:53 fr: add apocalypse crabs to spider 00:18:57 they're the appropriate genus!!! 00:19:15 or like, whatever the term is 00:19:52 we already added death scarabs 00:19:52 -!- GhostOfToal has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 00:20:01 phylum 00:20:03 death cobs are irradiated popcorn the wizard of zot left 00:20:04 that's what it is 00:20:10 CanOfWorms: just make a apoc crab spider end 00:20:16 !!! 00:20:25 lugonu corruption theme.. 00:20:34 ugh i need to stop posting in this channel 00:20:35 would be tricky to make it actually dangerous perhaps 00:20:56 apoc crabs are my only monster contribution really 00:21:01 * 00:21:06 they're memorable! 00:21:25 somebody else implemented em of course 00:21:40 yeah we wouldn't let artists touch code, let's be real here 00:21:47 don't make me haul out dungeoness crabs again >.> 00:21:50 * ontoclasm wiggles his fingers 00:21:54 ??crab rule 00:21:54 crab rule[1/1]: no more crabs. 00:22:05 fr a crab unique 00:22:14 ...because gammafunk is the crabbiest dev 00:22:22 and wants to stay that way 00:22:26 it should breathe miasma clouds 00:22:36 the death crab 00:24:38 ontoclasm: true, we need more miasma breathing things in tomb... 00:25:01 honestly just put miasma generators all over tomb 00:25:05 desolation of tomb 00:25:14 just fill the whole tomb with miasma all the time 00:25:15 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 00:25:25 if you're trying to make sure nobody ever does tomb again you can just remove it 00:25:28 did you see that pretty crazy layout that infiniplex made? 00:25:35 it was for tartarus 00:25:42 nope 00:25:45 had the walls decay into miasma cloud generators over time 00:25:51 weird 00:28:51 -!- luna1 has joined ##crawl-dev 00:31:53 -!- Lasty has joined ##crawl-dev 00:33:38 -!- Lasty has quit [Client Quit] 00:36:27 why does spider get all the cool endings 00:40:48 -!- adelrune has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:41:49 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 00:44:03 because of vaults designers 00:44:09 you should design some cool vaults for the other 3 branches 00:44:34 my favorite spider ending is the tri-pronged one 00:44:38 that bends back onto itself 00:45:17 do you mean the one that looks like a pee-pee or a different one 00:45:35 it's like <->-> 00:46:18 that one's fun to tackle because once you break into the final section there's half a dozen emperors bearing down on you and no real way to corral them 00:46:22 so you gotta pull out the big stops 00:46:57 !vault grunt_spider_rune_parallel 00:46:59 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/branches/spider.des#L1561 00:47:16 make more shoals endings 00:47:29 !lg * status~~sleep 00:47:30 it has what, 2 and a half 00:47:32 31. lovekoma the Blocker (L12 FoFi of Okawaru), slain by a yak on Lair:4 on 2016-12-06 13:15:59, with 18025 points after 15390 turns and 0:31:35. 00:47:45 whats the half 00:47:57 big huts 00:48:01 oh 00:48:03 huts have some variations 00:48:04 then shrines 00:48:06 then uhh 00:48:10 the ice one 00:48:21 !orcendkills 00:48:23 Orc End kills (): 2133x grunt_orc_garden (14.12%), 1306x grunt_orc_community_town_hall (8.65%), 1296x st_orc_congregation (8.58%), 1260x grunt_orc_cross (8.34%), 1253x st_orc_open (8.29%), 1229x st_orc_pillars (8.14%), 1039x st_orc_rangers (6.88%), 1023x pubby_orc_utopia (6.77%), 984x pf_orc_diabolical (6.51%), 827x st_orc_ogre_mass (5.47%), 722x grunt_orc_tribal_feast (4.78%), 709x st_orc_elflike... 00:49:28 I have a shoal end I need to clean up 00:49:28 CanOfWorms: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 00:49:35 do you want to tackle it, brannock 00:49:37 !messages 00:49:38 (1/1) regret-index said (28m 5s ago): crab spider ends are pre-emptively veto'd 00:49:43 !!! 00:49:51 what about spider crab ends 00:49:52 -!- mong has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:50:01 make a corrupted shoals ending with guaranteed distortion merfolk impaler and a apocalypse crab 00:50:12 and a lugonu altar 00:50:21 corrupted everything ending 00:50:26 corrupted vaults:5 quarter 00:50:27 I'm terrible at vault design 00:50:29 corrupted zot entrance 00:50:30 lucy's beach barn 00:50:48 full of death oconuts 00:50:56 so even if I made something it'd likley be wildly Degenerate 00:52:22 make more tiles, imo 00:52:34 oh, we apparently still rim tiles, because some of our older tiles don't have black borders 00:52:38 I'd been meaning to do something about that 00:53:08 i fix rims whenever i edit a tile without them 00:53:19 never seemed worth doing a big batch thing 00:53:40 what do you guys think of the rakshasa tile 00:53:51 I have a note on here to review it, but that note is a couple months old 00:53:59 so I've entirely forgotten my mindset when I wrote it 00:54:19 i'm not a huge fan 00:54:25 better remove rakshasas just to be safe 00:54:26 it's somewhere on my big list 00:54:28 base score 5/10. not a crab: -1, not a dragon: -1, no "giant": -1. Final score: 2/10 00:54:37 we're not removing rakshasa 00:55:42 probably you were thinking that it looks like it has lightning powers or something 00:56:07 also its facing right and the robe shading is a bit pillowy in places maybe?? 00:56:11 partly that and partly it's a very, very old tile with a stiff and highly humanoid pose 00:56:12 it's also not great technically 00:56:17 also the right-facing yeah 00:56:39 it's facing a direction? 00:56:52 iiiiish 00:57:05 ??rakasha 00:57:06 I don't have a page labeled rakasha in my learndb. 00:57:15 also on my list of tiles to look at: wizlab and trove entrances 00:57:18 !learn add rakasha see {rakshasa} 00:57:18 rakasha[1/1]: see {rakshasa} 00:57:21 draw a sweet tiger man 00:57:27 either it's facing right or its face happens to be extremely asymmetrical 00:57:33 i assume it's the former 00:58:53 Mara has some pretty killer parachute pants 00:59:07 can't touch this 01:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:02:41 -!- bgiannan has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:03:24 -!- tsujin_ has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:03:29 -!- Harudoku has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 01:04:56 -!- bgiannan has joined ##crawl-dev 01:12:53 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: I'M OUT SON. PEACE, LOVE, EXPLOSIONS.] 01:16:36 -!- nefhilion_ has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:19:03 -!- hellmonk has quit [Quit: Page closed] 01:19:23 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.20-a0-268-gb6bde61 (34) 01:19:42 !lm berder crash 01:19:43 27. [2016-12-07 01:29:20] Berder the Ruinous (L27 NaFE of Sif Muna) ASSERT((int)levels seen <= brdepth[branch]) in 'place-info.cc' at line 33 failed on turn 108623. (Depths:2) 01:19:53 !lm berder crash -log 01:19:54 27. Berder, XL27 NaFE, T:108623 (milestone): http://crawl.berotato.org/crawl/morgue/Berder/crash-Berder-20161207-012920.txt 01:21:57 -!- haltingproblem has quit [Quit: haltingproblem] 01:22:18 !tell |amethyst I copied over Berder's save. 01:22:19 johnstein: OK, I'll let |amethyst know. 01:22:36 !tell Berder I copied over your fixed save on CBRO. let me know if you have any issues. 01:22:39 johnstein: OK, I'll let berder know. 01:25:33 -!- Guest36244 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:26:09 !seen berder 01:26:09 I last saw Berder at Sun Jul 27 13:53:00 2014 UTC (about 2y 19w 2d 16h 33m 9s ago) quitting, saying 'Ping timeout: 250 seconds'. 01:26:17 !seen causative 01:26:25 I last saw causative at Wed Dec 7 02:30:10 2016 UTC (3h 56m 14s ago) quitting, saying 'Ping timeout: 250 seconds'. 01:26:25 johnstein: berder was online as causative iirc 01:26:31 yep, that's it 01:35:36 -!- syranez has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:37:12 -!- GhostOfToal has quit [Quit: leaving] 01:40:06 -!- ontoclasm1 has joined ##crawl-dev 01:40:28 !tell causative I copied over your fixed save on CBRO. let me know if you have any issues. 01:40:29 johnstein: OK, I'll let causative know. 01:40:37 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 01:42:15 -!- GhostOfToal has quit [Client Quit] 01:42:49 -!- ProzacElf has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 01:43:34 -!- GhostOfToal has quit [Client Quit] 01:44:21 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 01:44:42 -!- GhostOfToal has quit [Client Quit] 01:46:29 -!- ontoclasm1 has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 01:48:45 -!- Kramell has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:49:32 -!- asdu has quit [Quit: Page closed] 01:50:59 -!- LexAckson has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 01:53:35 -!- dtsundere has joined ##crawl-dev 01:54:39 -!- dtsundere is now known as dtsund 01:55:55 -!- GhostOfToal has quit [Quit: leaving] 01:57:33 Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.20-a0-268-gb6bde61 01:58:47 -!- GhostOfToal has quit [Client Quit] 02:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:00:07 -!- jehoesefat has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:01:11 -!- GhostOfToal has quit [Client Quit] 02:02:06 -!- derfel has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:03:07 -!- fiyawerx has quit [Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.] 02:05:54 -!- crate has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:06:48 -!- rast has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:08:24 -!- us17 has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:09:25 -!- Zekka has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 02:18:45 -!- DDFi has quit [Client Quit] 02:19:31 -!- GhostOfToal has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 02:19:50 -!- simmarine_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:20:29 -!- Brannock has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 02:21:09 !stats ogcj 02:21:11 !stats hucj 02:21:14 Starting stats for OgCj: Str 12 Int 14 Dex 10. Stat gain: s/3 02:21:21 Starting stats for HuCj: Str 8 Int 15 Dex 13. Stat gain: sid/4 02:22:16 are you planning your next stream??? 02:22:31 oh, no 02:22:38 deng 02:23:24 !apt og 02:23:26 Og: Fighting: 3!, Short: -4*, Long: -3*, Axes: -3*, Maces: 3!, Polearms: 0, Staves: -1, Slings: -3, Bows: -3, Xbows: -3, Throw: 0, Armour: -2, Dodge: -1, Stealth: -2, Shields: -1, UC: -1, Splcast: 1, Conj: -3*, Hexes: -3, Charms: -3, Summ: -3*, Nec: -3*, Tloc: -3*, Tmut: -3, Fire: -3*, Ice: -3*, Air: -3, Earth: -3*, Poison: -3*, Inv: 1, Evo: -2, Exp: 0, HP: 3!, MP: 0 02:24:06 !tell MarvingPA what do you think of what's in PR 421 (and possibly flattening the Og m&f apt, at least a bit if not all the way to 0) 02:24:06 Sorry gammafunk, I don't know who marvingpa is. 02:24:10 !tell MarvinPA what do you think of what's in PR 421 (and possibly flattening the Og m&f apt, at least a bit if not all the way to 0) 02:24:11 gammafunk: OK, I'll let marvinpa know. 02:24:55 !winssinceracewon 02:25:00 !winssinceclasswon 02:25:37 Skald: 31, Assassin: 28, Abyssal_Knight: 25, Arcane_Marksman: 24, Warper: 21, Air_Elementalist: 20, Earth_Elementalist: 18, Venom_Mage: 17, Ice_Elementalist: 16, Fire_Elementalist: 15, Transmuter: 14, Monk: 13, Hunter: 12, Artificer: 11, Conjurer: 10, Enchanter: 9, Fighter: 7, Necromancer: 2, Wizard: 5, Summoner: 4, Wanderer: 3, Gladiator: 1, Chaos_Knight: 0 02:25:38 Ghoul: 32, Gargoyle: 30, Deep_Dwarf: 29, Felid: 27, Vampire: 26, Ogre: 25, Halfling: 24, Merfolk: 19, Demigod: 18, Formicid: 17, Mummy: 16, Tengu: 15, Kobold: 13, Spriggan: 12, Centaur: 11, Vine_Stalker: 10, Deep_Elf: 9, High_Elf: 8, Demonspawn: 7, Human: 6, Hill_Orc: 5, Octopode: 4, Naga: 3, Troll: 1, Draconian: 0 02:26:11 CanOfWorms: given those lists and HuTm | KoEE | NaAK already on the char poll list, what's two more chars I could put in poll for next char 02:26:23 and given I'm going to finish OgAs next stream 02:26:34 so no og or as 02:26:50 also I hate AM and don't much like fe or vp 02:27:02 hmm 02:27:05 !apt mf 02:27:06 Mf: Fighting: 1, Short: 2, Long: 1, Axes: -2, Maces: -2, Polearms: 4!, Staves: -2, Slings: -2, Bows: -2, Xbows: -2, Throw: 0, Armour: -3*, Dodge: 3, Stealth: 2, Shields: 0, UC: 1!, Splcast: -1, Conj: -2, Hexes: 0, Charms: 1, Summ: 0, Nec: -2, Tloc: -2, Tmut: 3!, Fire: -3*, Ice: 1, Air: -2, Earth: -2, Poison: 1, Inv: 1, Evo: 0, Exp: 0, HP: 0, MP: 0 02:27:26 GrAE MfAM 02:27:36 -!- Patashu_ has joined ##crawl-dev 02:27:37 I said I hate AME! 02:27:42 oh right 02:27:42 *AM 02:27:46 !apt gr 02:27:47 Gr: Fighting: 1, Short: -1, Long: -1, Axes: -1, Maces: 0, Polearms: -1, Staves: 0, Slings: -1, Bows: 0, Xbows: 0, Throw: -1, Armour: 1, Dodge: -2, Stealth: 2, Shields: 1, UC: 0, Splcast: -1, Conj: 1, Hexes: -1, Charms: -1, Summ: -1, Nec: -2, Tloc: -1, Tmut: -2, Fire: 0, Ice: 0, Air: -2, Earth: 2, Poison: 0, Inv: 1, Evo: -1, Exp: 0, HP: -2, MP: 0 02:27:48 I forgot that once you spat out the species 02:27:56 and no thanks for grae 02:27:59 deng 02:28:20 -!- zxc has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:28:21 it's not unbearable anti-synergy but there are surely better choices 02:28:32 well they have the conj for it 02:28:44 yeah it's just a nem choice 02:28:51 !lg * grae won 02:28:52 31. Cruella the Cloud Mage (L27 GrAE of Vehumet), escaped with the Orb and 3 runes on 2016-11-20 19:20:05, with 1798732 points after 66553 turns and 13:09:56. 02:29:01 not quite, but closeish 02:29:05 HaWr 02:29:09 !lg . hawr 02:29:10 No games for gammafunk (hawr). 02:29:16 ...wait 02:29:18 !apt ha 02:29:18 Ha: Fighting: -1, Short: 2, Long: 0, Axes: 0, Maces: -1, Polearms: -1, Staves: -2, Slings: 4!, Bows: 1, Xbows: 1, Throw: 0, Armour: 1, Dodge: 1, Stealth: 2, Shields: 1, UC: -2*, Splcast: -3, Conj: -2, Hexes: -2, Charms: 1, Summ: -2, Nec: -2, Tloc: 1, Tmut: -4*, Fire: 0, Ice: 0, Air: 0, Earth: 0, Poison: 0, Inv: 1, Evo: 0, Exp: 1!, HP: -1, MP: 0 02:29:21 oh ok 02:29:23 tloc 1 02:29:28 yeah that can work fine 02:30:07 is MfTm too obvious? 02:30:14 I have hutm 02:30:15 on the list 02:30:18 something for gh would be good 02:30:24 hmm 02:30:25 GhIE, I guess 02:30:39 that seems like one of the least painful starts 02:30:50 hrm 02:30:53 !apt gh 02:30:53 Gh: Fighting: 1, Short: -1, Long: -1, Axes: -1, Maces: -1, Polearms: -1, Staves: -1, Slings: -1, Bows: -1, Xbows: -1, Throw: -1, Armour: -1, Dodge: -1, Stealth: 2, Shields: -1, UC: 1!, Splcast: -2, Conj: -2, Hexes: -2, Charms: -1, Summ: -1, Nec: 0, Tloc: -1, Tmut: -1, Fire: -2, Ice: 1, Air: -2, Earth: 1, Poison: 0, Inv: 1, Evo: -1, Exp: 0, HP: 1, MP: -1* 02:30:56 given that you probably don't want another As 02:30:56 !stats ghie 02:31:01 Starting stats for GhIE: Str 11 Int 10 Dex 9. Stat gain: s/5 02:31:03 yeah, deffo not 02:31:18 helps me even out the wins by species/class 02:31:28 I'm probably 2.5 on average for all 02:31:31 -!- ololoev has quit [Client Quit] 02:31:39 !lg gammafunk won s=species 02:31:40 69 games for gammafunk (won): 4x High Elf, 4x Troll, 4x Octopode, 4x Spriggan, 4x Kobold, 3x Human, 3x Hill Orc, 3x Vine Stalker, 3x Halfling, 3x Naga, 3x Demonspawn, 2x Merfolk, 2x Ogre, 2x Tengu, 2x Vampire, 2x Deep Dwarf, 2x Demigod, 2x Felid, 2x Ghoul, 2x Gargoyle, 2x Formicid, 2x Deep Elf, 2x Mummy, 2x Centaur, White Draconian, Pale Draconian, Grey Draconian, Black Draconian, Basajaun 02:31:52 want crace 02:31:53 lg . won s=crace playable !vp !fe 02:31:55 and playable 02:31:57 ah 02:32:02 !lg . won s=crace playable !vp !fe 02:32:02 fe is ambiguous: may be species or class. Use fe-- (Felid) or --fe (Fire Elementalist) to disambiguate 02:32:06 !lg . won s=crace playable !vp !fe-- 02:32:07 60 games for gammafunk (won playable !vp !fe--): 4x Draconian, 4x Troll, 4x Kobold, 4x High Elf, 4x Spriggan, 3x Vine Stalker, 3x Octopode, 3x Naga, 3x Human, 3x Hill Orc, 3x Halfling, 2x Centaur, 2x Mummy, 2x Demonspawn, 2x Demigod, 2x Tengu, 2x Ghoul, 2x Formicid, 2x Merfolk, 2x Deep Elf, 2x Ogre, Deep Dwarf, Gargoyle 02:32:26 that seems off 02:32:35 the other query gave 2 Gr 02:32:35 off how? 02:32:36 playable 02:32:38 dk etc 02:32:39 I guess it was an experimental background? 02:32:44 or removed background 02:32:53 -!- SteelNeuron has joined ##crawl-dev 02:32:59 !lg . gr won s=cls 02:33:00 2 games for gammafunk (gr won): Death Knight, Wanderer 02:33:00 so GrDK doesn't count??? 02:33:08 sure, why would it? 02:33:14 it's not like I'm going to win more DK 02:33:26 it is a gr win though... 02:33:45 I don't think it's a problem really 02:33:57 well in that case, how about GrIE 02:33:58 not like classes are removed frequently and it's just one win 02:34:03 !messages 02:34:03 No messages for SteelNeuron. 02:34:20 yeah 02:34:22 grie is good 02:34:23 !lg gammafunk won s=background playable !am 02:34:24 !lg . grie 02:34:24 Unknown field: background 02:34:25 No games for gammafunk (grie). 02:34:29 -!- PElf has quit [Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- Chicks dig it] 02:34:31 !lg gammafunk won s=class playable !am 02:34:32 62 games for gammafunk (won playable !am): 4x Artificer, 4x Chaos Knight, 4x Enchanter, 3x Necromancer, 3x Warper, 3x Wanderer, 3x Transmuter, 3x Summoner, 3x Wizard, 3x Conjurer, 3x Fighter, 3x Monk, 3x Hunter, 3x Ice Elementalist, 3x Gladiator, 2x Skald, 2x Earth Elementalist, 2x Air Elementalist, 2x Venom Mage, 2x Assassin, 2x Fire Elementalist, 2x Abyssal Knight 02:34:55 i should mention I also don't like Hu, but that one is fine anyhow 02:35:06 Hu as in the class 02:35:12 well I'll put those on there 02:35:15 !lg . ghmo 02:35:16 1. gammafunk the Wrestler (L27 GhMo of Pakellas), escaped with the Orb and 3 runes on 2015-12-18 03:11:22, with 1578146 points after 82608 turns and 9:44:12. 02:35:26 god, maybe ghvm or something 02:35:31 !stats ghvm 02:35:33 Starting stats for GhVM: Str 11 Int 10 Dex 9. Stat gain: s/5 02:35:45 honestly it should be ghsu with that deng int 02:36:00 -!- Lasty has joined ##crawl-dev 02:36:02 in fact that sounds kind of nice 02:36:06 !!! 02:36:11 maybe lasty can suggest a combo... 02:36:15 no! 02:36:36 we can't trust lasty, he'll try to have me go dith and do things like that 02:36:52 put on the amulet... of dithmissal... 02:37:44 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 02:37:55 so I guess that's two of MfTm, GhSu and GrIE 02:38:04 maybe even just ghne 02:38:06 !lg . ghne 02:38:07 1. gammafunk the Reanimator (L9 GhNe of Sif Muna), slain by a cyclops on D:9 on 2016-07-05 01:02:41, with 1874 points after 8056 turns and 0:45:27. 02:38:10 aha 02:38:14 rip 02:38:43 -!- Lasty has quit [Client Quit] 02:38:52 CanOfWorms: not MfTm, but HaWr 02:38:58 ah right 02:39:02 I have HuTm, but yeah I'll put those up there, thanks 02:39:35 people need to see more mages with "melee races" 02:39:41 personally I'm going to vote KoEE if I make it to the stream 02:39:50 -!- Lasty has joined ##crawl-dev 02:39:59 I've screwed up Ko mages pretty good so far 02:40:14 !apt ko 02:40:15 near-splat death in swamp that was completely avoidable 02:40:15 Ko: Fighting: 1, Short: 3!, Long: -2, Axes: -2, Maces: -1, Polearms: -2, Staves: -1, Slings: 0, Bows: 0, Xbows: 2!, Throw: 1!, Armour: -2, Dodge: 2, Stealth: 4, Shields: -2, UC: 0, Splcast: 0, Conj: 0, Hexes: 0, Charms: -2, Summ: 0, Nec: 0, Tloc: 0, Tmut: 0, Fire: 0, Ice: 0, Air: 0, Earth: 0, Poison: 0, Inv: 1, Evo: 2, Exp: 1!, HP: -2, MP: 0 02:40:25 actual splat on zot:3 that were ridiculously avoidable 02:40:33 well, koee is a perfect match 02:40:42 a power combo... 02:40:47 also ko has 1 throwing?! 02:40:58 has to compete with those xbows 02:41:28 fr: unique kobold that can throw large rocks 02:41:51 ah, they had +3 before 02:41:53 maybe just a kobold riding on the back of a stone giant 02:41:54 that would explain t 02:41:55 *it 02:42:59 -!- WalrusKing has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:44:04 -!- Zxpr1jk has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:52:03 -!- MarvinPA_ has joined ##crawl-dev 02:53:13 Monster database of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.20-a0-268-gb6bde61 02:53:37 -!- Henzell has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:54:49 -!- Henzell has joined ##crawl-dev 02:54:56 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:56:21 -!- tabstorm has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 03:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:04:24 -!- flappity has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 03:05:45 -!- Twinge has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 03:06:01 -!- ProzacElf has joined ##crawl-dev 03:08:04 -!- Menche has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:13:50 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:15:19 -!- MarvinPA__ has joined ##crawl-dev 03:17:48 -!- MarvinPA_ has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 03:20:39 -!- Twinge has joined ##crawl-dev 03:24:38 Experimental (councilgod-PR) branch on crawl.beRotato.org updated to: 0.20-a0-420-geb9b46b 03:25:08 -!- Twinge has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 03:25:50 -!- Twinge has joined ##crawl-dev 03:26:13 -!- Zannick has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 03:26:17 -!- ProzacElf has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 03:36:57 -!- Krakhan has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 03:44:00 -!- causative has joined ##crawl-dev 03:44:46 thanks |amethyst johnstein U:2 seems to be working now 03:44:46 causative: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 03:45:31 -!- CanOfWorms has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.92 [Firefox 3.6.28/20120306064154]] 03:51:38 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 03:53:59 -!- jaccarmac has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:58:18 -!- jaccarma` has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 04:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:08:11 -!- Elsi has joined ##crawl-dev 04:10:41 -!- smltlk has quit [Quit: leaving] 04:19:23 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 04:19:25 ??splat 04:19:26 splat[1/4]: A death at a high-ish experience level. 04:20:17 -!- odiv has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 04:28:06 -!- smltlk has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 04:32:32 -!- Napkin_ is now known as Napkin 04:36:26 -!- jerkstore has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 04:51:11 -!- Zekka has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 04:56:32 -!- jefus- has joined ##crawl-dev 04:58:59 -!- Zannick has joined ##crawl-dev 05:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:00:12 -!- jeefus has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 05:02:07 -!- zxc has joined ##crawl-dev 05:03:38 -!- bgiannan has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.5] 05:06:50 -!- bgiannan has joined ##crawl-dev 05:20:04 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 05:23:34 -!- twelwe has joined ##crawl-dev 05:40:02 -!- TuxQmoob has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 05:49:51 -!- TuxQmob has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 05:59:30 -!- odiv has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 06:00:01 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:01:57 but... 06:02:01 ??splat[2 06:02:01 splat[2/4]: The sound of broken dreams and failure. Also, the sound you make when you try to fight a pack of orcs with a warrior, two wizards, and a priest while you're only XL3. 06:10:43 -!- Weretaco has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 06:14:42 !kw splat 06:14:43 Keyword: splat => xl>=17 !won 06:22:06 -!- f0rbidden has quit [Quit: Page closed] 06:22:54 -!- Zekka_ has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 06:38:30 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 06:44:03 -!- Tux[Qyou] has joined ##crawl-dev 07:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:01:42 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:02:01 -!- wheals has joined ##crawl-dev 07:03:53 -!- therealodie has quit [] 07:11:04 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:12:08 -!- tsujin has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:16:48 -!- Patashu_ has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 07:29:02 -!- Krakhan has quit [Changing host] 07:29:36 Hmm, there is an inconsistency between webtiles and local I think 07:29:59 Marking EV as enhanced and calling update_window makes it appear blue offline, but not online 07:29:59 -!- ddubois_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 07:30:00 same branch 07:31:53 !source player.js 07:31:54 https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/webserver/game_data/static/player.js 07:32:09 looks like it shows ev as blue if phasing or agile 07:32:42 oh so it doesn't use the same code, I see 07:32:45 yeah 07:32:46 cool 07:34:26 not cool tbh :P 07:34:31 !source _print_stats_ev 07:34:31 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/output.cc#L822 07:36:09 -!- _Jordan_ has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 07:36:43 03PabloMansanet02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/413 * 0.20-a0-421-g9dbcded: Remove lie 10(17 hours ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/9dbcded4bb86 07:36:43 03PabloMansanet02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/413 * 0.20-a0-422-gb4bb872: Add Afterimage to EV boosters in web interface 10(89 seconds ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/b4bb872e172a 07:40:41 -!- CrawlWall has quit [Quit: Page closed] 07:59:27 -!- dpeg has joined ##crawl-dev 08:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:05:43 -!- Furril has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 08:06:18 -!- dpeg has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 08:10:29 -!- WangHW has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 08:15:14 -!- iFurril has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 08:27:49 -!- gammafunk has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:29:25 -!- Zyrdl has quit [Quit: Page closed] 08:38:01 -!- MaxFrost has quit [Quit: Going offline, see ya! (www.adiirc.com)] 08:57:30 -!- MarvinPA__ is now known as MarvinPA 09:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:15:41 -!- tabstorm has joined ##crawl-dev 09:22:24 -!- gammafunk has joined ##crawl-dev 09:26:13 -!- tabstorm has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 09:29:31 -!- haltingproblem has quit [Quit: haltingproblem] 09:37:17 -!- Bammboo has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:39:37 -!- Patashu_ has joined ##crawl-dev 09:40:31 -!- simmarine has joined ##crawl-dev 09:40:44 -!- raganim86 has quit [Quit: leaving] 09:42:16 -!- dpeg has joined ##crawl-dev 09:43:18 !tell Lasty I triggered someone to give somewhat specific Hep feedback: www.reddit.com/r/dcss/comments/5gsewq/best_ancestor_hepliaklqana 09:43:18 dpeg: OK, I'll let lasty know. 09:45:09 Also, I can report that "Temple of the Roguelike" forum is very low-key (no replies since I posted the survey there, and just two dozen views). But the r/roguelikes/ thread exploded, including former players complaining about the removal of [everything]. The beauty :) 09:46:40 There's something interesting I've realised lately about public perception of DCSS 09:46:47 All in my limited perspective of course 09:47:05 But... People don't mind huge reworks 09:47:07 Or don't seem to 09:47:14 it's the removal that everyone takes exception to 09:47:25 roguetemple is a generic roguelike forum, it might be not many there are playing DCSS as they rather like playing the new hip roguelikes 09:47:38 So maybe it would pay off to always exhaust the path of rework for any mechanic... For example, instead of removing High Elves, finding them a role 09:48:18 bhaak: sure thing. I posted the survey there because I assume that people are familiar with DCSS, and might have played in the past ... so may feel motivated to spend five minutes on the poll. 09:51:11 SteelNeuron: I see where you're coming from, and I think you're wrong :) 09:51:57 As a father of two, I consider the removals and the resulting backlash as part of education (educating the players, that is). A lot of players have fully understood what we're going for, so it's definitely not in vain. 09:52:21 @dpeg: Interesting perspective 09:52:30 Still, I think there could be a middle ground 09:52:38 Elves in particular are a fantasy staple, there is always room for elves 09:53:29 hm, I come from a corner where underdog always beats mainstream... in this genre, elves and Tolkien are mainstream, so I'm against it :) 09:53:31 Maybe it would be satisfying for some people to have a new kind of high elf rather than completely axing them. But in cases where the theme was experimental to begin with (say, Stalker) I understand 09:54:04 it is so funny that some people are still bitter about Mountain Dwarves... this is now, what, six years? 09:54:59 Hahaha 09:55:16 I think what's annoying people about HE is the fact that it's being taken out just as riposte made it in 09:55:39 SteelNeuron: I think the most moderate statement I can make is this: I realise that removals hurt, and it's a good idea to ship each new version with fun new content, to make it easier for them 09:55:41 But I agree, I personally think elves are boring in general, and HE in particular 09:57:43 bhaak: I always thought DCSS is a hip new roguelike :P 09:59:14 -!- Cryp71c has joined ##crawl-dev 10:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:00:42 dpeg: interesting that battlemage seems to be the fave there 10:00:42 Lasty: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 10:00:53 used to be that people would always say hexer 10:01:21 Lasty: yes, I could imagine that different players/groups come up with strict opinions on how to order the ancestors 10:01:41 ...all six combinations of them :) 10:01:41 I'm totally a knight person. 10:02:24 I'm quite confident that "best ancestor" depends on character build by now. 10:03:07 dpeg: I think that's mostly true. I think the three distinct roles each offer something -- meat shield, damage source, control. 10:03:20 But I think it's probably fair to say that some of the roles do their role better than others. 10:03:29 I'm not sure which those might be, having only played a few times. 10:03:48 The god is overall strong enough that I'm not sure it matters that much which one you choose 10:03:57 I'd say this is something to look at with some distance... in a year or so. 10:04:16 dpeg: maybe 10 years ago, DCSS was hip 10:04:29 How is Uskayaw perceived now in terms of power? I haven't been able to make it work too much yet 10:04:36 uh oh, are we not hip anymore??? 10:04:37 dpeg: nowadays it's up there in the attic with nethack and angband! 10:04:49 bhaak: we're not dead yet! 10:04:59 bhaak: what's hip? 10:05:39 Lasty: I think there are two desiderata for Hep: (1) choice of ancestor depends on build, (2) choice of ancestor affects subsequent gameplay. 10:05:51 dpeg: I think that's true-ish 10:07:47 2) is a little iffy because to some extent all ally play is kinda the same, but you do sometimes want to maneuver differently around a knight than a battlemage 10:08:45 Lasty: for example Brogue 10:08:52 -!- haltingproblem has quit [Client Quit] 10:09:22 bhaak: brogue is hip now? I thought it was a granddaddy by this point 10:10:28 Lasty: brogue is an example of minimalism that ages well 10:11:02 bhaak: I haven't played it, but I had the impression that most people around here who have played it find it really irritating to replay 10:11:07 if you don't start with lots of backage, you don't have to remove much 10:11:23 03PabloMansanet02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/413 * 0.20-a0-423-g551ff68: Swap LB and MF brand choices 10(2 minutes ago, 1 file, 2+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/551ff6854cad 10:11:26 irritating? 10:11:43 bhaak: constantly searching, for example 10:12:27 Lasty: Brogues has excellent replay value for its size. 10:12:38 ah 10:12:54 Lasty: the constant searching is a meme on the level of "in Crawl, you should mark which spaces you've stepped on". 10:13:26 kids should play Brogue at school 10:13:41 dpeg: really? The way it was described to me, it sounded like you could literally die on any step if you don't search first 10:13:49 maybe that was an exaggeration? 10:14:33 the potential deaths are somewhat level dependant, so you learn what is dangerous and what's not 10:14:37 later on, you have to do more searching, and it is one of (very few) irritating things in the game... OTOH, maps are small, and every step counts already 10:15:34 hm 10:15:47 I've heard that one of the usual deaths on the first levels is death by being burned because you triggered a fire the engulfed the whole level 10:15:50 I should try it and judge for myself. I had been discouraged from trying it by the reviews I heard from crawl community members. 10:15:55 I should think about how to address this. After all, I could fix the ring id problem too. 10:16:43 Lasty: you should really give it a try. Don't listen to duvessa and their ilk. Brogue is mandatory for any self-respecting designer -- both where it excels and also where it fails. 10:16:57 Well, I wasn't thinking of duvessa 10:17:02 good! 10:17:24 he was one of those who were continually dismissing Brogue as "move-search-move-search". 10:18:46 I've been wondering about something. It's a bit of a thought process 10:18:59 How would you feel if the game had a strategic resource with limited uses per game 10:19:06 I'm keeping it vague on purpose 10:19:53 The idea being that you can use it to smooth out whichever part of the difficulty curve you find harder for your species/combo 10:20:10 of course, the game would have to be balanced around the existence of this resource 10:20:20 SteelNeuron: that was a bit of my theory around desperate haste 10:20:35 I didn't feel that it worked out well 10:20:40 Hm 10:20:48 IMO it's still a good idea, but crawl isn't designed around that sort of thing 10:20:50 What problems did you find with it? 10:20:58 Balance problems, basically. 10:21:14 having ANY more power at the beginning of the game really changes the game 10:22:08 I see 10:22:27 It's the kind of thing that should be species dependent 10:22:32 But of course loses all elegance if you approach it that way 10:23:16 what about desperate swiftness? 10:23:28 haste is offensive, but something that is strict getaway could work 10:24:01 SteelNeuron: it still is one get-out-of-trouble power 10:24:20 * dpeg is still bitter about the HP+2 buff some versions ago :) 10:24:31 :P 10:24:32 dpeg: haha 10:24:35 How about... 10:24:38 reverse ghosts 10:24:44 felids are grateful for it, but screw felids 10:24:56 if you get to low HP at exactly the same level and species as one of your ghosts, you get posessed 10:25:03 So you can win a combo by sheer perseverance haha 10:25:06 (don't take me seriously) 10:26:25 getting possessed makes you win? 10:26:42 Well, you get help from your past life in some form 10:26:57 you already do in the form of free XP 10:27:02 and even that is arguably bad 10:27:14 Yeah, I'm not being even remotely serious with this don't worry 10:27:31 I'm just frustrated I can't win a mummy 10:27:46 amalloy: you should have planned that jiyva diving more carefully! 10:28:01 I should go back and watch the leadup to that fight, maybe you had a plan 10:28:10 s/fight/attempt/ 10:28:23 but I can think of how I'd do it as Fo^Fedhas, there are a few good ways 10:29:47 Now that it's online, devs should have to take turns in playing hellcrawl, and see if there's good stuff in there. 10:30:11 dpeg: I intend to play it at some point 10:30:24 IMO the changes so far are 50% the future of crawl, 50% tavern meme silliness 10:30:29 dpeg: there's nothing good in it, only good things taken away 10:30:59 gammafunk: convinced 10:31:13 like it removed snozzcucubmers effectively 10:31:18 can anything good come of that? 10:31:32 -!- xnavy_ is now known as xnavy 10:31:34 *cucumbers 10:31:35 I am particularly interested in the level cuts. While mainline Crawl should be going slow as ever, hellcrawl might help in gauging how far we can go. 10:31:44 gammafunk: NO! 10:32:04 I think level cuts and smaller levels are both good things that we should continue to incrementally advance 10:32:04 He who removes the snozz will die by the snozz. 10:32:13 Lasty: fully agreed 10:33:25 -!- Brannock has joined ##crawl-dev 10:33:27 Different topic: we had this wands/rods discussion the other day, and I wrote the digest for c-r-d... people seem to agree or not to care. Can I look for coding support? I'd really like to remove the big three wands, for example. 10:33:27 yeah, I feel lair branches could probably be 3 levels 10:33:35 I've been meaning to post up a list of what I see as being the priorities for modern cral 10:33:36 crawl 10:33:43 Lasty: oh, please do 10:33:43 gammafunk: yeah, I'd like that 10:33:57 and we add a full on moon branch 10:34:03 you can put that on the list 10:34:08 dpeg, I'm about to go on my morning walk, let me read that digest then mull it over 10:34:11 during the walk 10:34:24 Brannock: yes, please :) 10:34:29 Lasty: but if you post on tavern, I can only reply in private messages 10:34:45 dpeg: oh yeah? 10:34:49 dpeg: self-exile 10:34:50 ? 10:34:54 fwiw I'm working on a project right now to truncate postgame 10:35:00 I was thinking of posting in the 0.20 plan and the CRD list 10:35:04 I think 3-level lair branches are too short, though 10:35:12 dpeg: my audience is devs, not players 10:35:32 why are 3-level lair branches too short 10:35:37 Lasty: my personal stupidity threshold was hit, and I managed to pull out without any drama. Now people like duvessa and tabstorm have the tavern entirely for themselves. (I do post on SA, which still feels a bit strange.) 10:35:40 -!- nefhilion has quit [Quit: Page closed] 10:35:53 dpeg: haha, you're a goon! 10:35:54 shrug. personal intuition? 1-2-go feels abrupt 10:36:10 Lasty: only because someone (LordSloth) paid me =) 10:36:12 Brannock: it's so the mechanics don't overstay their welcome 10:36:12 dpeg: yeah, there are some very vocal posters who mostly dominate the conversation in tavern 10:36:17 and that's mostly unfortunate 10:36:17 it will be pleasantly abrupt 10:36:24 not to say we can't add levels to other areas or something 10:36:32 but there's still so much xp in the game 10:36:44 and by the game I mean the 3-rune game 10:36:58 as long as the rune levels are suitably challenging, I think it'd be ok 10:37:00 gammafunk: my edgy combinations (in tournament I only played Nemelex choices) feel the lack of xp... of course that's exactly as it should be, but I'm saying we have to be somewhat careful. Of course, you're a much better player, you could probably skip Lair entirely and win :) 10:37:16 dpeg: that's what everone does in hellcrawl! 10:37:19 since it doesn't have lair 10:37:23 *everyone 10:37:27 hence I should play it some time 10:37:30 yeah 10:37:32 it's on cbro now 10:37:37 not sure how much lag that is for you 10:37:45 but it has console on cbro 10:37:52 I haven't played myself either 10:38:06 I like scroll of excavation (for /digging/disint) 10:38:12 rod changes are biiiig 10:38:16 Brannock: me to 10:38:17 scroll? 10:38:21 is it to be targetted? 10:38:33 removing /haste/hw/tele has a lot of knock-on effects 10:38:40 I guess it needs to be limited, but targetted scroll that's not a smite targetter feels a bit weird 10:38:40 Brannock: how do you feel about wand of destruction replacing /dig and /disint? 10:38:43 ?recharge going away is probably workable 10:38:50 Lasty, elegant-ish 10:38:51 okay 10:38:53 that's my initial thoughts 10:38:55 will think more on my walk 10:38:56 removing a lot of teleport would be a big change 10:38:57 brb 1hour 10:39:05 but that also makes my teleport plans more exciting 10:39:14 someone set a timer 10:39:29 if he's not back in 1hr we send out the hellhounds to look for him 10:39:45 maybe raiju would search more efficiently 10:39:47 I've informed Pikel 10:39:53 Brannock: haha 10:40:06 gammafunk: doomhounds surely 10:40:13 wow, that's just harsh 10:40:20 they can summon him! 10:40:21 -!- haltingproblem has quit [Quit: haltingproblem] 10:40:29 but then we'll have too many Brannocks 10:40:34 those aren't summons! 10:40:37 they're actual monsters, remember 10:40:55 -!- Jafet has joined ##crawl-dev 10:41:28 gammafunk: cannot have too many Brannocks 10:41:38 disagree 10:41:46 gammafunk: sorry, they can _recall_ him 10:42:28 probably the only way we could ever have a dev team get together 10:42:39 gammafunk: you're not willing to fly to Berlin? 10:42:40 Lazy. 10:42:42 have a doom hound that howls in the devs 10:42:49 I've been to Berlin, was fun 10:42:58 wouldn't mind visiting germany again 10:43:26 gammafunk: why didn't you tell me? 10:43:34 this was before I was on the dev team 10:43:41 I even talk to players!!1! 10:43:51 and in fact, I've met some of them, both in Toronto and in Berlin 10:44:31 ...with gloves and surgical mask, to be sure, but still 10:45:13 -!- Ratatosk has quit [Quit: Ratatosk] 10:45:44 Where is the dev team from mostly? I always assumed USA 10:45:52 probably true these days 10:46:06 we used to have a strong European leg (at one point, three devs from Berlin even) 10:49:31 dracoomega was in the UK, no? 10:50:05 and I think 1kb is/was based in poland? 10:51:29 yes, and galehar in France (hence the translation project, bien sur) 10:51:49 I want to say that neil was the first dev who joined at the start of the shift towards US 10:52:11 the snark was from India, and haran from Israel, I think both are in the US now 10:52:41 Erik is a US American who lives/lived in Czech Republic (or maybe Slovakia)! 10:53:17 not sure when onto joined, but then grunt after neil, myself/basil/reaverb/PF and...is canofworms the only recent non-US member to join? 10:53:32 basil might not be from the US, actually I think he isn't, but not sure 10:53:52 I only really know about my elders =) 10:54:18 mumra is based in the UK, I want to say, so that wasn't quite right 10:54:20 at least I think 10:54:44 -!- _Jordan_ has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 10:54:48 true 10:55:02 do you remember dolorous... also from the US IIRC 10:55:08 yeah, I joined around 0.11 or 0.12, so all those previous versions' dev teams are unknown to me 10:55:19 I never chatted with, no 10:55:38 snark and dpeg are the only two all-the-way-backs I've talked a lot with 10:55:42 he had a reputation for endless "whitespace fixes", but he actually a lot of stuff, too 10:55:54 dolorous wasn't the same as rob? 10:56:16 funny, the first five devs (in order: erik/snark, haran, dpeg, kilobyte, jpeg) were all outside of the US -- what has happened O: 10:56:30 no, rob=by is a mathematician from Berlinb 10:56:32 dpeg: Brogue has 26 floors!! you realize this is a provocation to war. 10:56:46 -!- valrus_ has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 10:56:53 it also has an amulet of Yendor, which allows us to use ballistic weapons 11:00:01 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:00:03 There's a captive monkey. I can't figure out if there's a way to interact with it other than killing it. It looks like it's just hostile but imprisoned. 11:00:17 figure it out :) 11:00:29 -!- tabstorm has joined ##crawl-dev 11:00:44 Brogue has a penchant for puzzles, if you can't figure them out, you have to play Nethack instead 11:00:52 ah 11:01:47 When you say puzzle, do you mean actual puzzle? 11:01:55 or more like "mystery"? 11:02:14 hm, I guess both 11:02:26 -!- haltingproblem has quit [Quit: haltingproblem] 11:03:14 wow, another mathematician 11:03:26 just the sort of people we shouldn't let on the dev team 11:03:43 We will prove you wrong. 11:04:09 Isn't it worth that half the current devteam is paid by Google? :) 11:04:12 *worse 11:04:20 actually I think only...one? 11:04:30 oh maybe bh still is there 11:04:38 hm, and we are more than two.. I need to update my arithmetics 11:04:45 bh is still there 11:04:52 is PF at Google? 11:04:53 -!- tabstorm has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 11:04:56 no 11:05:22 I'm on the moon, Lasty is in LIBERAL-LAND 11:05:24 I think Haran is, and Adam (kilobyte) wanted to... 11:05:41 gammafunk: moon is fine and dandy but... which side? 11:06:06 the orange side 11:06:15 gammafunk: just don't let those mathematicians program. they are fine for inferior jobs like designer but for heaven's sake, no programming! 11:06:25 well said bhaak 11:06:28 bhaak is right, listen to him 11:06:56 oops, it's easily to accidentally fall through a hole in the ground if you think you're examining a feature 11:07:24 Lasty: getting used to the interface? Do you play with the mouse :P 11:07:50 dpeg: yeah, trying to 11:07:58 I don't want to play with a mouse, but it seems easier at first 11:08:09 I'll have to get used to the commands 11:08:47 dang, son, this pink goo seems like it's gonna kill me if I get anywhere near it. Hope it can't catch me. 11:08:58 dpeg: if you could play cogmind (runs very well in wine on linux, but is graphical, although does have VI keys and good UI), you would like a lot of it 11:09:20 it costs money though 11:09:30 actual real money, not zorkmids or gozag gold 11:09:56 it shows how to make a fun game featuring extensive item destruction! 11:10:34 and it does "food clock" pretty well, as well as making much of your char strength based on what equip you have 11:10:40 oh, you can attempt to "remove" something you aren't wearing 11:10:41 weird 11:10:53 instead of using XP 11:11:25 -!- haltingproblem has quit [Quit: haltingproblem] 11:13:46 I have developed a telepathic bond with my monkey 11:17:15 being surrounded by explosive gas is surprisingly harmless (absent fire) 11:21:00 Lasty: fun to watch you get into it :) 11:21:21 gammafunk: thanks for this. I'll try to get my contacts to get Cogmind. 11:21:47 yeah, let me know if you have questions; I've been doing "combat" builds, but "flight" is the fastest way to win 11:22:12 should run fine with any reasonably recent Wine 11:22:26 I am sitting on a windows machine 11:22:35 oh, yeah, you can run it natively then! 11:23:21 its approach to UI is pretty interesting; you can see all equipped things and most inventory onscreen at any time 11:23:37 only menus are for things like reading help and setting options 11:24:02 well, only modal menus that obscure the game area, I should say 11:24:31 I heard good things about it, will try to get my hands on it 11:37:27 -!- dpeg has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 11:37:42 -!- dpeg has joined ##crawl-dev 11:38:19 dpeg, my major thought about the abolishment of /haste and /tele is I'm probably in favor of it (with a concurrent increase in !haste and ?tele) 11:38:23 but /HW has me concerned 11:38:34 yes? 11:38:35 I think we could replace /HW not with more !hw but possibly with a rare scroll 11:38:41 scroll of renewal/rejuvenation/whatever 11:38:55 this solves the Mummy issue and gives us another rare scroll to play with (along with ?brand, ?acq) 11:39:10 would the scroll do anything but HW? 11:39:37 heal percentage of health instead of fixed health, and ??possibly?? clear bad statuses 11:39:39 unsure 11:39:59 crazy idea: resets the player to their status from 10 turns ago 11:40:42 this "good idea about DD" I think might be "halve their damage reduction, but allow them to regenerate half of whatever damage they took" 11:40:45 are you concerned about Mu, or do you think /HW removal is too bad for everyone? 11:40:49 Mu mostly 11:40:55 They're already a challenge race with very little upside 11:41:16 well, they can always take on Elyvilon for the healing needs! 11:41:43 I'm tentatively in favor of squashing rods into wands but I think we'll run into another issue: too many wands 11:42:01 and very few wands scale with Evocations as noticeably as rods currently do 11:42:14 if it's just for Mu, then I'd prefer a Mu-only solution (an ability like they have already)... although I wouldn't mind a rare, strong scroll for the id-game 11:42:20 rod of lightning is easily moved into an evokable 11:42:29 -!- Concrocotta has quit [Quit: Ciao] 11:42:46 I think 0.19 removed four or so wands already... not saying status quo is perfect, but at least it used to be worse :) 11:43:00 as for digging/disint, and Lasty's idea of a wand of destruction... I'm guessing this is a wand that doesn't give the player fine control over digging, but just blasts out a chunk of terrain 11:43:23 I agree with PF about merging wands/misc for acquirement 11:43:27 Brannock: I understood Lasty to make that a damage-only wand 11:44:39 re: DD: what do you mean by "half the damage they took"? They could always rest up to 50%? 11:45:14 example: currently DD shaves off (20) damage, but can't regenerate. New DD would shave 10 damage but be able to regenerate 10 11:45:31 I think damage shaving is much smaller than that. 11:45:36 example numbers 11:46:07 sounds like a productive walk :) 11:46:22 Do you feel like replying to c-r-d, or do we wanna settle on something right here? 11:46:24 it's meditative, almost 11:46:29 I'll do a writeup 11:46:33 thx 11:47:24 re: /HW replacement: like I said, I don't mind another rare scroll, but the theme should be different from potions (so straight HP gain would be iffy, imo) 11:47:44 dpeg, Brannock: I wanted it to be a sharply-limited-use wand that does take out a big chunk of terrain, but with little control 11:47:50 making it useless for killholing 11:48:00 and limited enough that you wouldn't want to use it for pathbuilding 11:48:04 yeah 11:48:06 probably noisy too? 11:48:22 yeah 11:48:27 so zap it at a wall and blow it to pieces then walk through it. ideal for escaping 11:49:23 Lasty: ah, good to know :) 11:52:11 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 11:56:20 -!- PleasingFungus has joined ##crawl-dev 11:56:28 !tell brannock you used to be able to have a knight ancestor with a polearm! stupid remove... 11:56:28 PleasingFungus: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 11:56:28 PleasingFungus: OK, I'll let brannock know. 11:56:48 !tell |amethyst wrt ancestor thread: :) 11:56:48 PleasingFungus: OK, I'll let |amethyst know. 11:57:02 greetings, 11:57:02 Brannock: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 11:57:19 Brannock: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 11:58:06 -!- WangHW has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 11:59:13 i got woken up at 2:30 am this morning by a horrible gnawing pain in my stomach, followed by nausea. probably i am going to die 11:59:29 it's okay, though, since i'm retired anyway. i'm sure you guys will steer crawl to a bright future without me. 12:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:01:34 !tell lasty you should REALLY try brogue. it's really good! search is a problem but it's one of the very few problems with a very well-designed, fun game 12:01:34 PleasingFungus: OK, I'll let lasty know. 12:02:05 You should take a potion of healing 12:02:24 man, remember !healing and !healwounds 12:02:24 I hope you feel better soon! After the inevitable 24-48 hours of misery 12:02:27 those were the good old days 12:02:49 guys are unnaturally hard rock walls supposed to be destroyable with shatter? 12:02:54 yes 12:02:57 wait 12:03:05 map-edges? no 12:03:11 well it says "A wall imbued with magic that makes it indestructible." 12:03:16 but i just destructed it 12:03:26 but it's in the zot chamber 12:03:44 -!- smltlk has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 12:03:51 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 12:03:56 PleasingFungus: go to bed, chop chop! 12:04:31 PleasingFungus: I already started trying it 12:04:31 Lasty: You have 2 messages. Use !messages to read them. 12:04:36 dpeg: it's 9 am.... 12:04:41 dpeg, in general I'd like to see more rare consumables be added, instead of removing them. it's always exciting to find !experience or ?acquirement, since they don't show up in every game... but these aren't tactical 12:04:42 sick is sick 12:04:51 Brannock: agree 12:05:05 Brannock: imo rare tactical consumables work less well 12:05:09 silence, holy word, torment 12:05:18 I use ?silence a lot 12:05:19 tend to end up clogging your inventory for long periods of time 12:05:30 elves, mummies, liches 12:05:38 in fact I frequently learn Silence spell 12:05:41 well, silence is okay. holy word is more of an issue since undead/demons are so backloaded 12:05:47 hrm 12:05:49 holy word I think needs to go away, it's just not a good design 12:06:00 i was going to remove torment scroll, and then i didn't 12:06:01 I'd be fine w/ removing it 12:06:06 but i don't think there would be an issue with removing both of those 12:06:09 unless someone has some cool idea to rescue it 12:06:12 well 12:06:14 ID game 12:06:21 Brannock: make it non-holy 12:06:22 it's good to remove torment for the id game 12:06:33 since out of combat damage is extremely lame 12:06:34 ontoclasm, Scroll of Word? 12:06:38 see also: why ?immo was reworked 12:06:40 I have a really cool idea to rescue it that you should impliment immediately: build a menu for goldified ammo. 12:06:43 lmao 12:07:01 I think torment is a better design than holy word 12:07:07 does a little damage but more importantly stuns most monsters for a small perido of time 12:07:15 ontoclasm: didn't we remove that? 12:07:25 huh 12:07:27 we could just buff fear 12:07:40 and there's a lot more uses for torment than ?holy 12:07:42 remove fear at the same time 12:07:54 what's wrong w/ fear? 12:08:05 ontoclasm: ?Fear is useful, do you worry about overlap with spell? 12:08:05 fear is good 12:08:17 ontoclasm has no ?fear 12:08:33 honestly i'd be fine with removing the spell version 12:08:42 fear and holy word do the same thing 12:08:45 basically 12:08:46 PleasingFungus: me too 12:08:48 uh 12:08:50 they don't, though 12:08:52 except each one has weird immunities 12:09:18 unrealiable mass cc so you can hopefully get a few turns to escape 12:09:25 I agee that holy word is strange: a scroll dealing with one type of enemies... by contrast, ?torment is much more broadly useful 12:09:25 -!- cait has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 12:09:40 -!- THERetroGamerNY has quit [Quit: Be Blessed!] 12:09:41 or wait the stun on holy word got removed so nevermind 12:09:49 it got turned into daze 12:10:01 i don't think i've ever found a good situation for ?torment as a non-undead char. 12:10:10 ozocubu's holygeration 12:10:21 -!- haltingproblem has quit [Quit: haltingproblem] 12:11:02 the cc element on ?HW is either light or nonexistant 12:11:09 the damage is the more salient part by far 12:11:12 PleasingFungus, re: rare tactical consumables, I was spitballing a new rare scroll that would reset the player's health/mp/statuses/position to what they were 10 turns ago. might be too wild of an effect 12:11:24 beware the code cost 12:11:33 Brannock: that sounds craz powerful 12:11:35 crazy 12:11:41 it'd be acq-tier rare 12:12:15 It's like a no-investment Borg's w/ no downside -- sounds really scary to me 12:12:28 -!- LexAckson has joined ##crawl-dev 12:12:32 actually yeah that's a good point 12:12:37 oh well 12:12:47 but I think theres' a lot of design space right now for cool effects that hasn't been explored yet 12:12:52 Lasty: true, but consumables get away with much less (spells need to be tightly clamped) 12:13:12 dpeg: yeah, definitely, but an effect like that would definitely be power creep 12:13:35 well 12:13:40 dpeg: scroll of amulet of life saving 12:13:44 is it still power creep if it's a reaction to the removal of the power wands 12:13:57 sure 12:14:02 PleasingFungus: net power creep? yes, i think so. 12:14:11 i'm not convinced 12:14:15 Brannock is concerned about Mu... 12:14:21 My actual concern with this is that it encourages players to carefully track what exactly they were 10 turns ago which is a lot of mental taxation 12:14:28 easiest way out is probably a Mu-only ability 12:14:37 we could also: buff mu attributes or apts 12:14:39 The wands give a semi-rare power boost by increasing access to effects that already exist 12:14:42 Brannock: yes, or we do the tracking and then... code cost 12:14:43 it sounds a bit like veering into extra lives 12:14:47 which would be a lot simpler 12:14:54 the new scroll would add 1-4 free casts of borg every game 12:15:10 which, felids, my favorite race of all time 12:15:12 or just leave Mu as a challenge race even 12:15:17 true 12:15:19 Mu is getting increasingly awful 12:15:25 impossible 12:15:26 not like Mu is unplayable without those wands 12:15:31 increasingly? 12:15:34 I'm fine w Mu being hard 12:15:38 how has Mu increased in awfulness recently 12:15:43 And it's not like every Mu got those wands 12:15:52 well, caves of qud has that cool spell which allows you to "precognize" aka have 8-10 turns during which if you die you reset to your original position before the 10 turns 12:16:02 yeah, extra lives, probably not gonna happen 12:16:11 and we do have Death's Door 12:16:16 Tux[Qyou]: i love qud but it's not even remotely balanced 12:16:21 like, even by crawl standards 12:16:24 PleasingFungus: agreed 12:16:40 disagree because ontoclasm wouldn't allow that 12:16:49 he only does the art! 12:16:51 would he make art for an imabalanced game? 12:16:52 hah 12:17:02 *spelling 12:17:04 my standards are EXACTING 12:17:17 after all, he made lacertilians 12:17:37 my fav was jelly people 12:18:11 off to work 12:18:16 -!- Lasty has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 12:18:30 would there be any real issues with merging wand and misc acquirement? 12:18:33 I can do that today 12:18:39 , he said, boldly 12:18:59 please call it "devices" or something 12:19:01 Brannock: getting that clutch gold wand of haste maybe? 12:19:04 misc is the silliest name 12:19:07 -!- Lasty has joined ##crawl-dev 12:19:15 acquire stuff 12:19:27 ??misc_acquirement 12:19:27 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/acquire.cc#L665 12:19:33 well ok thanks 12:19:41 ??staff_acquirement 12:19:41 staff acquirement[1/1]: Gives a magical staff. You have a 50% chance to get the enhancer for your best skill if you haven't seen it (if you have, or if there's no enhancer for that skill, you have a flat 1/3 chance for any staff). Otherwise, you get wizardry, energy, or power, with the first two being twice as likely. Can also grant unrandart staves (Olgreb, Wucad Mu, Torment, Elemental Staff). 12:20:30 Brannock: let's think of it in terms of an acq flowchart. When does someone choose "acquire evocables?" 12:20:50 when the twitch chat poll says they must 12:20:51 when minmay's flowchart says to, of course 12:20:53 otherwise not often 12:21:03 when they have high Evocations, weapon and armor is set, and they're not hungry for spells 12:21:09 is misc how you get a rod these days? 12:21:13 Yeah. 12:21:23 Right now, you choose wand because you're hoping for a power wand, and you've identified a few wands already. Acquire misc is in the 'not sure when you choose this' category. 12:21:43 I guess I might if I built a rod char 12:21:46 and wanted more rods 12:21:52 or just more evocables failing that 12:21:54 My feeling is that acquire evocables would end up in the same slot. not sure that's worse than status quo, since acq wand is pretty 'dominant' right now. 12:22:00 so basically the theoritical Artificer 12:22:03 but it would empower the terrible Always Bacquire Barmour people. 12:22:10 so beware that cost! 12:22:21 uh 12:22:28 it's Balways Bacquire Barmour 12:22:32 for crying out loud.... 12:22:33 i know. 12:22:38 i just... you know? 12:22:42 sometimes you just. 12:22:47 yeah for real 12:22:50 i'm not that terrible 12:23:07 barmour is just the best 12:23:15 just because everything else is worse 12:23:25 we could go the despoilerification route 12:23:36 you get a set of classes chosen, and you see the results for each class 12:23:39 looks like getting rid of "misc" is a large-scale surgery of the codebase 12:23:43 jewels aren't too bad these days 12:23:46 then there's no acquirement choice bias 12:23:47 and a whole lot of renames of variables 12:23:49 Brannock: ? 12:23:51 and enums 12:23:53 well there'd be less anyhow 12:24:00 oh 12:24:01 gammafunk: despoilerise acq by automatically choosing wand 12:24:02 MISC_DISC_OF_STORMS 12:24:11 i assumed you were just poking at acq code 12:24:17 ontoclasm complained about "misc" 12:24:21 trying to remove the item class seems like a ton of work for not much reason 12:24:21 and yeah I'm looking at acquire.cc now 12:24:24 amalloy: well you could despoilerizing it by removing the scroll 12:24:29 *despoilerize 12:24:44 Brannock: i assume he was complaining about the name in the acq dialogue.... 12:24:49 but that's one way to solve problems of "this class is always chosen" 12:24:58 it just cuts out some strategic planning 12:25:01 yes i am just bikeshedding 12:25:02 He is, but then I noticed "Misc" is an actual item class 12:25:14 sure. it doesn't really mean misc 12:25:29 it's a bad name for something more specific 12:25:51 gammafunk: it's nice to have a way to patch up holes in your character's build. sort of like brogue treasure rooms. 12:26:02 which i think is an analogy that people have used before. 12:26:14 this is a defense of the existence of some form of 'acq', not necessarily the current form. 12:26:21 we can just add like 12:26:24 i do like the current form, but that's my Spoilered Player Privilege talking. 12:26:27 armour stashes 12:26:42 mini halls of blades 12:26:43 vault_first_armour 12:26:45 just make selectable troves 12:26:57 that would be kind of cooler tbh 12:27:00 without thinking hard about it 12:27:07 because man who has time for thinking hard about things 12:27:27 about troves: please make the weapon trove more useful 12:27:33 what's wrong with weapon troves? 12:27:44 alright discussion successfully derailed, my job is complete 12:27:46 every time I've ecountered it there were 8 ego weapons 12:27:59 and about 8 normal weapons 12:28:09 since i'm fond of the gambling aspect of acq scrolls, you could have maybe ~4 choices, each of which has maybe two different things it could give you 12:28:44 and 0, maybe one artifact 12:28:45 maybe, if you can put a nice UI on that 12:28:57 8 items isn't too much to display, I guess 12:29:35 A) +5 flaming broad axe / the +12 great mace of the Fish {rFire, *Contam}. B) +27 crystal plate armour / + 0 hat... 12:29:48 yeah, that's kind of the weird thing about that 12:29:57 the ridiculous false choices within class 12:30:04 i'm saying that wouldn't be a choice 12:30:07 I think it's not actually a choice 12:30:08 yeah 12:30:14 A might give you the axe OR the mace 12:30:16 you would choose a class, and then you'd get one of the two things listed at random 12:30:21 an unspoiled gamble 12:30:28 oh 12:30:43 I mean, there's already a gamble for the classes, no? 12:30:47 will you hope for the crystal plate, and get the hat? the thrill of success! 12:30:48 ? 12:30:51 or are you saying there'd only ever be the same 4 classes? 12:30:54 yeah, probably 12:30:58 oh ok 12:31:07 4 as an arbitrary number 12:31:09 isn't this (((power creep)))? 12:31:20 it gives the player much more control about what they get 12:31:25 ....why are you doing the antisemitism echoes on 'power creep' 12:31:37 scary echoing 12:31:40 ........ 12:31:40 misstep 12:31:41 my bad 12:31:43 w/e 12:31:45 anyway 12:31:46 he's a member of the alt-brogue movement 12:31:48 lol 12:31:49 lol 12:32:03 you can certainly adjust what sort of things acq generates 12:32:06 sadly that would also affect vaults 12:32:18 since we have made bad design choices 12:32:31 we = the dev team, mostly including people who haven't been involved for years 12:32:51 the big deal there is mostly troves 12:32:53 that use that type 12:33:00 the rest of that usage is not very significant 12:33:08 also if we're reworking the way acq works, ideally we could have a cancellable u 12:33:11 *ui 12:33:15 I think wand/misc acq merge could be done as-is. 12:33:21 so you don't have to carefully peer through your inventory before reading acq 12:33:50 dpeg: yeah, i don't think it ruins acq balance or anything (mainly since acq isn't balanced :P) 12:34:27 Brannock: do you want any help with the merge, or do you think you have it under control? 12:34:43 I wanna take a shot at it first but if I run into trouble I'll ask for help 12:34:56 thanks for the offer 12:35:03 big advantage of the merge: 'acq misc' with sacced love doesn't produce really horrible outcomes 12:35:08 gammafunk: I'm worried full-set acq might actually reduce choices. 12:35:11 we disable that already 12:35:16 we do not 12:35:27 !source acquire.cc:1531 12:35:28 https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/acquire.cc#L1531 12:35:35 that is not sac love 12:35:37 oh 12:35:47 oh 12:35:47 yeah 12:36:08 currently with NO_LOVE, you can end up with a misc acq that only and always returns crystal ball of energy 12:36:28 dpeg: what is full-set acq? 12:36:29 which is because other options are useless if you've already gotten one, except that so is crystal ball, except that we need something to return 12:36:39 since otherwise acq misc vaults will crash..... 12:36:47 wands don't have that problem :) 12:38:46 gammafunk: you read ?acq, and get a set of an armour, a weapon, etc. -- what you proposed :) 12:39:17 what I proposed could not be described as "full set" 12:39:18 agreeing with dpeg: there's a very strong tendency for there to be a very clear 'best choice' there with that system 12:39:30 since I proposed randomly choosing a subset of classes 12:39:35 gammafunk: sorry, did I get your idea wrong? 12:39:35 that doesn't matter 12:39:40 yes, but still... 12:40:04 that does matter, actually 12:40:11 anyhow I didn't propose "full set" acquirement 12:40:13 if you have a specific list of guaranteed items, it will usually be clear which is the most useful 12:40:18 gammafunk: I've used that mechanic twice, for Nemelex' Triple Draw, and for Gozag's potions... there is often a clear winner. 12:40:21 this is something that minmay brought up in previous discussions 12:40:57 right, and that remains the case in your proposal as well 12:41:07 gammafunk: you mean for current ?acq? 12:41:16 of course, with triple draw and gozag potion i think that's kind of fine 12:41:27 no, I mean for the proposal PF gave above 12:42:30 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 12:42:39 you at least potentially get an average versus guaranteed quality tradeoff there 12:42:43 the only thing proposals like this are solving is really the spoiler problem 12:42:55 what is a HUP signal? 12:42:55 the "one clear choice" problem is still going to be there 12:43:17 Brannock: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SIGHUP 12:43:21 a POSIX signal 12:43:25 oh I see 12:43:38 the book acquirement with this system would be actually better than current book acquirement tbh 12:44:05 since if you're a demigod wizard trained in fire magic you can always get a book of frost 12:44:09 or a book of dragon 12:44:17 ??? 12:44:21 specifically, server console games are sent SIGHUP when the remote disconnects (or at least when the network stack discovers the remote went away) 12:44:32 PleasingFungus: you could control which crap you'd acquire 12:44:37 how 12:44:46 oh, i think i see what you mean 12:44:51 a) the book of power/the book of frost 12:44:55 you'd be more likely to choose book acquirement than now 12:45:00 exactly 12:45:03 also manuals 12:45:14 er, except i think you might've misunderstood my proposal 12:46:06 PleasingFungus: how? 12:46:11 you might still get a book of frost 12:46:15 in my proposal, you only get to choose a lettered category 12:46:25 mpr("The demon of the infinite void smiles upon you."); 12:46:26 since it will offer you frost / annihilations 12:46:40 and roll for which one it gives you, which may roll frost 12:46:46 gammafunk: but you won't bash yourself for getting a book of frost so much now 12:47:02 I'm not sure how you can claim that 12:47:09 I'd bash myself the same 12:47:13 I am absolutely fine with changing ?acq as long as we think we make choices harder 12:47:13 hell 12:47:17 I'm bashing myself right now 12:47:39 // no, you can't acquire the orb 12:47:41 dpeg: yeah I'm just trying to solve the spoiler thing, to be honest 12:47:44 this file is great 12:47:52 demon of the infinite void is a classic 12:47:58 secret knowledge of how each class works is pretty annoying to look up and memorize 12:48:01 gammafunk: yes, I know. Guess I'd take choices over non-spoilerness, in a pinch. 12:48:14 dpeg: you're probably too lazy to read the spoilers 12:48:23 wow, deep dwarves are much more likely to get /HW 12:48:31 gammafunk: of course, you know me well :) 12:48:55 often, I am too lazy to read the scroll, and shelve it for later 12:49:15 -!- aditya has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 12:49:58 wow, that's pretty lazy 12:50:06 tbf even in these new systems, you can manipulate it 12:50:27 you can hold onto it so that the results will be better for the class you care about it 12:50:32 s/it// 12:50:35 -!- Ququman has joined ##crawl-dev 12:50:42 welll 12:50:49 that sounds a lot like holding onto !xp or w/e 12:50:57 e.g. questionable 12:51:24 *i.e. 12:51:32 it's not going to be very optimal, but better than holding onto !xp 12:52:08 but yeah showing the results through some kind of choice mechanic will solve enough of the problem 12:52:37 PleasingFungus: I am not too lazy to drink !xp! 12:52:46 lol 12:52:56 doesn't that present....well I guess it doesn't present as many choices if you just always hit enter 12:53:02 and train what you're currently training 12:53:11 but technically it offers even more choices! 12:53:24 imo, remove choices 12:53:27 agree 12:53:47 hey, dpeg 12:53:53 yall just need more exotic words for choices, choices for choices 12:53:54 do you have a reddit account? 12:54:14 twelwe: choices are like pizza toppings 12:54:21 i'm looking for support in https://www.reddit.com/r/dcss/comments/5f973j/can_you_get_trapped_in_the_labyrinth/davkoua/?context=4 12:54:27 which is an endless argument from which i cannot escape 12:55:18 PleasingFungus: yes, I post on reddit 12:56:00 !lg . ce won min=cv x=cv 12:56:01 2. [cv=0.16-a] gammafunk the Hawkeye (L24 CeAM of Okawaru), escaped with the Orb and 3 runes on 2015-01-30 05:42:04, with 1429559 points after 88692 turns and 7:37:32. 12:56:04 damn 12:58:30 !kw starved 12:58:30 Keyword: starved => ktyp=starvation 12:58:39 !lg * cv<=0.15 urune<=5 !boring !won xl>=10 s=crace / starved o=% 12:58:44 926/355031 games for * (cv<=0.15 urune<=5 !boring !won xl>=10): 4/351x Grey Elf [1.14%], 66/8770x Mountain Dwarf [0.75%], 1/142x Ogre-Mage [0.70%], 1/180x Gnome [0.56%], 56/11663x Deep Dwarf [0.48%], 48/11596x Merfolk [0.41%], 61/16193x Hill Orc [0.38%], 22/6697x Centaur [0.33%], 70/21502x Troll [0.33%], 29/9212x Naga [0.31%], 27/8675x Tengu [0.31%], 24/7787x Human [0.31%], 72/24698x Demonspawn [0... 12:58:51 man that grey elf hunger was real 12:58:59 PleasingFungus: will post there later, food now 12:59:25 :) 13:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:00:27 %git e45c69eaa1 13:00:27 07reaverb02 * 0.15-a0-953-ge45c69e: Remove Ce and Ha special diets 10(2 years, 7 months ago, 3 files, 21+ 3-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/e45c69eaa197 13:00:33 !lg * cv<=0.14 urune<=5 !boring !won xl>=10 s=crace / starved o=% 13:00:37 861/292338 games for * (cv<=0.14 urune<=5 !boring !won xl>=10): 4/351x Grey Elf [1.14%], 66/8770x Mountain Dwarf [0.75%], 1/142x Ogre-Mage [0.70%], 1/180x Gnome [0.56%], 48/9922x Deep Dwarf [0.48%], 47/9985x Merfolk [0.47%], 57/13646x Hill Orc [0.42%], 22/5626x Centaur [0.39%], 29/8389x Naga [0.35%], 23/6657x Human [0.35%], 60/17795x Troll [0.34%], 67/19976x Demonspawn [0.34%], 44/13165x Draconian... 13:02:50 !lg * crace="grey elf" starved s=name 13:02:50 11 games for * (crace='grey elf' starved): Brannock, chilliwack, daf, DashNine, Errol1, Isou, Lemuel, magree, suga3, Weasel, Zaba 13:02:56 whoa 13:02:59 hm 13:03:09 !lg brannock crace="grey elf" starved 13:03:10 1. Brannock the Smasher (L14 GECr of Okawaru), starved to death on Hive:1 on 2007-08-19 03:51:19, with 56731 points after 34623 turns and 3:19:15. 13:03:12 lmao 13:03:20 time to pray 13:03:25 !tv brannock crace="grey elf" starved 13:03:26 1. Brannock, XL14 GECr, T:34623 requested for FooTV: telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org. 13:03:32 I remember that game, that was actually a really dumb death because iirc I was ferrying food to my stash 13:03:37 hahhaa 13:03:38 and dumped everything, went back to hive to get more, starved 13:03:52 gecr... classic combo 13:04:13 Pray Glow? what century is this? 13:04:30 heh, cast berserk and starved 13:04:33 a different time, the 60s 13:04:56 was the red Glow from berserk? 13:05:30 i think it might be from oka haste 13:05:35 wow, -6 cloak 13:05:41 -!- tabstorm has joined ##crawl-dev 13:05:44 corrosion was real af 13:06:04 okawaru haste! amazing 13:06:08 i think it was an artefact 13:06:13 I played a grey elf on nostalgia 13:06:15 I think 13:06:18 !lg . nostalgia 13:06:19 !log brannock crace="grey elf" starved 13:06:19 4. gammafunk the Caller (L7 GESu of Sif Muna), mangled by Duvessa (a +1,+2 short sword of draining) on D:6 on 2014-04-01 12:48:20, with 701 points after 2656 turns and 0:26:12. 13:06:20 can you believe back in the day haste used to be a player spell 13:06:23 1. Brannock, XL14 GECr, T:34623: http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/Brannock/morgue-Brannock-20070818-235302.txt 13:06:23 !lg . nostalgia s=crace 13:06:23 4 games for gammafunk (nostalgia): 2x Grey Elf, High Elf, Elf 13:06:30 wow, I really liked elves 13:06:31 G - the -6 cloak "Thryitere" {insul, poison, magic, blink, berserk} 13:06:33 (Okawaru gifted it to you on level 8 of the Lair of Beasts) 13:06:44 ahh, the days of manual inscribing 13:06:52 oh, insulation ego? 13:06:56 wow, yeah 13:07:05 grunt wanted to bring that back 13:07:13 more egos are good, imo 13:07:29 how can I best express my disagreement 13:07:30 I forgot about Selective Amnesia... 13:07:54 more egos that are not just resists might be good 13:08:08 sure 13:08:15 harder to come up with good ideas, ofc 13:08:33 i mean, bad ideas are easy. trample ego 13:08:34 boom 13:08:49 I could trample all day 13:08:53 Brannock: lol 13:09:47 !lg Eidom snake 13:09:48 No games for Eidom (snake). 13:09:50 pity 13:10:09 did those grey elves have glamour 13:10:10 ??glamour 13:10:11 glamour[1/1]: An ability grey elves received in old versions of crawl at xl 5. It tried to confuse, paralyze, charm, or scare nearby humanoids. It sucked. 13:12:48 glamour is a weird word to use for all those things 13:12:50 -!- zxc has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:13:21 gammafunk: i think it's less weird if you speak british 13:13:44 probably, yeah 13:13:57 -!- Zekka has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 13:13:57 i say, based on my experience reading terry pratchett novels featuring elves 13:14:59 -!- causative has left ##crawl-dev 13:15:50 you guys ever do something wild like speak french in here? 13:16:22 twelwe: absolutely not. 13:16:27 gammafunk: i wonder if it had a hunger cost 13:16:48 but honestly sample size is low enough that e.g. that brannock death could've skewed it dramatically 13:16:51 4 starvation deaths 13:17:03 "It tried to confuse, paralyze, charm, or scare nearby humanoids" 13:17:03 so like zin? 13:17:21 -!- JimmahDean has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 13:21:25 -!- tabstorm has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 13:24:28 -!- PleasingFungus has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.93 [Firefox 50.0.2/20161129173726]] 13:25:58 not sure how to handle distribution of rods, evocs, AND wands. current behavior is if you choose misc, you'll get 1/8 chance to get a rod, 7/8 chance to get a misc evocable 13:26:09 so new behavior should be... 1/8 chance rod, 4/8 chance wand, 3/8 misc? or what? 13:28:56 yes 13:32:56 oh I know a better way to handle this 13:35:05 -!- adelrune has joined ##crawl-dev 13:40:18 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 13:44:45 ugh, is there a way to easily get Ru sacrifices in wizmode so I can test the itneraction with Sacrifice Love? 13:45:03 &]Sacrifice Love doesn't give me the mut 13:47:02 they have weird names 13:47:02 MarvinPA: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 13:47:09 !source mutation-data.h 13:47:09 https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/mutation-data.h 13:47:32 oh, thanks 13:47:36 I'll remember to check that file in the future 13:48:32 Lots of CBOE but jsut as many wands 13:48:36 and the occasional rod 13:48:38 Seems fine to me, then 13:59:59 bikeshed time! 14:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:00:03 "Evocables" 14:00:10 -!- JimmahDean_ is now known as JimmahDean 14:00:14 Does this adequately communicate "Wands, Rods, and Misc Evocables"? 14:00:25 dpeg? 14:00:29 "V-ables" :p 14:00:46 well, except rods are only v not V 14:05:15 -!- THERetroGamerNY has quit [Quit: Be Blessed!] 14:10:49 03Brannock02 07* 0.20-a0-269-g17f5411: Merge wand and misc acquirement 10(40 seconds ago, 1 file, 11+ 10-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/17f5411d996b 14:14:47 best thing about this commit? 14:14:50 acquirement menu is now symmetrical 14:16:40 Brannock: no justification for the change in the commit; not really a that big a deal or anything, but always nice if you can put something even if it's simple 14:16:40 gammafunk: You have 3 messages. Use !messages to read them. 14:16:43 wth 14:16:57 oops, good catch 14:16:59 will keep in mind for future 14:17:14 gammafunk: hi i got carried away 14:18:21 MarvinPA: yeah, re: what you said about the minmay proposal 14:18:29 I think I suggested something to make it closer to that 14:18:41 !apt mu 14:18:41 Mu: Fighting: 0, Short: -2, Long: -2, Axes: -2, Maces: -2, Polearms: -2, Staves: -2, Slings: -2, Bows: -2, Xbows: -2, Throw: -2*, Armour: -2, Dodge: -2, Stealth: -1, Shields: -2, UC: -2*, Splcast: -1, Conj: -2, Hexes: -1, Charms: -2, Summ: -2, Nec: 0, Tloc: -2, Tmut: -2, Fire: -2, Ice: -2, Air: -2, Earth: -2, Poison: -2, Inv: -1*, Evo: -2, Exp: -1, HP: 0, MP: 0 14:19:02 -!- CanOfWorms has joined ##crawl-dev 14:19:22 MarvinPA: regarding Mu, you mean to say just make them have +1 SC and no other change? 14:19:31 maybe, yeah 14:19:59 seems ok, although I guess /hw removal hasn't actually happened 14:21:14 perhaps it's imminent and I'm simply in denial 14:21:29 i was thinking of starting on a few of the discussed wand/rod changes maybe, at least 14:22:10 i`m here to help today 14:22:11 your work will hopefully lead to the revival of Pakellas, something I'm sure you're excited about 14:22:43 i think removal of the big 3 wands would be pretty okay regardless and mu shouldn't really be a blocker for it anyway, but keeping the +spellcasting/-schools thing somewhere seems nice 14:22:54 poor pakellas_experiments.des, all you are now is a "lua gimmicks" tutorial 14:22:56 and it feels like it fits there 14:24:16 sure, with Mu there's maybe a lot more pushing them towards being a mage in the first place so that more will try the higher SC, poor school apts thing 14:24:32 well, we recommend mages for Mu, at least 14:24:37 and the recommendations are infallible 14:24:47 definitely! 14:25:56 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: I'M OUT SON. PEACE, LOVE, EXPLOSIONS.] 14:26:26 -!- SteelNeuron has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:28:12 -!- Blazinghand has joined ##crawl-dev 14:30:03 !apt og 14:30:03 Og: Fighting: 3!, Short: -4*, Long: -3*, Axes: -3*, Maces: 3!, Polearms: 0, Staves: -1, Slings: -3, Bows: -3, Xbows: -3, Throw: 0, Armour: -2, Dodge: -1, Stealth: -2, Shields: -1, UC: -1, Splcast: 1, Conj: -3*, Hexes: -3, Charms: -3, Summ: -3*, Nec: -3*, Tloc: -3*, Tmut: -3, Fire: -3*, Ice: -3*, Air: -3, Earth: -3*, Poison: -3*, Inv: 1, Evo: -2, Exp: 0, HP: 3!, MP: 0 14:35:14 -!- Cryp71c has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:38:27 -!- adelrune has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 14:38:39 -!- Ratatosk has quit [Quit: Ratatosk] 14:44:23 -!- _Jordan_ has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 14:45:24 !stats mucj 14:45:27 Starting stats for MuCj: Str 11 Int 14 Dex 12. Stat gain: sid/5 14:45:30 !status ogcj 14:45:42 !stats ogcj 14:45:44 Starting stats for OgCj: Str 12 Int 14 Dex 10. Stat gain: s/3 14:46:27 !stats hecj 14:46:34 Starting stats for HECj: Str 7 Int 18 Dex 15. Stat gain: id/3 14:47:01 -!- adelrune has joined ##crawl-dev 14:53:41 -!- travis-ci has joined ##crawl-dev 14:53:42 The build has errored. (master - 17f5411 #7352 : Isaac Sloat): https://travis-ci.org/crawl/crawl/builds/182058414 14:53:42 -!- travis-ci has left ##crawl-dev 14:53:48 uh oh 14:53:55 !blame2 brannock 14:53:56 bbbrrraaannnnnnoooccckkk 14:54:06 ah, false alarm 14:54:31 sorry CanOfWorms, put away the pitchfork and the hot tar 14:54:35 aw 14:54:39 it's like we can't have fun anymore 14:59:08 back 15:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:06:12 -!- bannakaffalatta has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:09:33 Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.20-a0-269-g17f5411 (34) 15:10:16 MarvinPA: I'd be excited about wand removal <3 15:14:17 -!- adelrune has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 15:21:21 Brannock: wonderful, many thanks 15:28:16 -!- adelrune has joined ##crawl-dev 15:44:52 -!- diazepan has quit [Quit: diazepan] 15:50:47 -!- Patashu_ has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 15:51:50 if they players have to fill out a survey, the devs should have to fill one out of their own 15:52:39 twelwe: sure, we report to Linlry 15:52:43 *Linley 15:55:18 I think I've found footage of a real, live, orb guardian 15:55:20 http://i.imgur.com/ATWMNi8.gifv 15:57:40 FR: multicolored orb guardians 15:57:43 -!- Tuxedo[Qyou] has joined ##crawl-dev 15:58:59 -!- Tux[Qyou] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:03:07 rip wand acquirement 16:03:20 feels good, doesn't it? 16:03:22 no more relatively reliable shots at haste/tele/hw wands 16:04:32 if we're lucky, these wands disappear Real Soon too 16:04:58 Removing tele and haste I see no issues with 16:05:07 (wands) 16:05:30 -!- Lightli has quit [Quit: Page closed] 16:05:49 -!- Lightli has joined ##crawl-dev 16:05:54 sorry about that 16:06:00 anyways did you say anything while I dc'd 16:06:13 Lightli: perhaps there'll be slightly more potions as compensation, who knows 16:06:21 the issue is /hw 16:06:24 since DD exists 16:07:09 yes, DD needs a different mechanic 16:08:23 what would replace the starting /hw then 16:08:40 and in a way that doesn't make DD complete garbage 16:09:10 if only there was a consumable... that restored as much hp per use as a wand of heal wounds... 16:09:40 -!- adelrune has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:10:34 CanOfWorms: Yes, the issue is those run out pretty quickly on a species without native regen 16:10:52 *HP regen 16:10:55 if only said species had some ability to make more of the consumable... 16:11:14 might as well just cut out the middleman then 16:11:24 you mean the DD? 16:14:12 -!- miek_ has joined ##crawl-dev 16:17:00 -!- JimmahDean has quit [] 16:18:24 -!- adelrune has joined ##crawl-dev 16:26:20 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 16:26:31 -!- Kadarus has quit [] 16:26:58 -!- dpeg_ has joined ##crawl-dev 16:27:14 -!- Blazinghand has joined ##crawl-dev 16:27:28 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Client Quit] 16:30:18 -!- _Jordan_ has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 16:33:05 -!- tabstorm has joined ##crawl-dev 16:35:07 -!- dpeg has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 16:35:46 -!- MarvinPA_ has joined ##crawl-dev 16:48:01 -!- Blazinghand has joined ##crawl-dev 16:48:53 -!- GhostOfToal has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 16:53:02 ha, there's this "stupid devs remove all cool races" troll on reddit, he keeps making new accounts even 16:54:26 -!- qoala has joined ##crawl-dev 16:56:30 -!- jeefus has joined ##crawl-dev 16:57:39 -!- adelrune has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:58:10 -!- dpeg_ has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 16:58:12 Anyone have any idea what the story is behind the weird way skill costs increase by level in calc_skill_cost()? 16:58:55 !source calc_skill_cost 16:58:55 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/skills.cc#L154 16:59:30 -!- Tuxedo[Qyou] has quit [Quit: Excess flood] 17:00:01 For example, in the first three rows, the cost for each level goes up by 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1, 1, 4, 9, 15, 11, 25, 25, 27 17:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:00:22 Lasty_1: it's so you don't train M&F from level 0 to level 8 for killing a single ogre mage at XL27 or whatever. do you mean how were the specific numbers chosen, or...? 17:00:28 Unless I'm missing something it means that some skill levels are disproportionately more expensive than the progression would suggest 17:00:29 -!- jefus- has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 17:00:39 er, than progression should suggest 17:00:55 yeah, the specific values in that table 17:01:27 -!- qoala has quit [Quit: Abscond!] 17:01:29 the pre-skill_cost_level piece 17:01:45 -!- qoala has joined ##crawl-dev 17:02:39 -!- qoala has quit [Client Quit] 17:03:02 -!- Lasty_1 is now known as Lasty_ 17:03:42 amalloy: I'm really tempted to redo the progression to something that seems more sane, but I'm also scared to touch something that's such a fundamental part of crawl 17:04:44 looks like the numbers were initially implemented in 17:04:46 %git 9b381b9 17:04:46 07galehar02 * 0.9-a1-683-g9b381b9: New skill costs. 10(5 years ago, 4 files, 47+ 118-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/9b381b9ce1f5 17:05:24 oo, a discussion link! 17:05:35 I hope someone says why they picked these values 17:05:47 -!- cosmonaut has quit [Quit: Page closed] 17:06:22 the values in that commit are slightly different from the current values so I'm looking for the commit that updates them 17:06:50 the discussion here implies that the progression they implemented was based on a prior progression 17:07:14 -!- Kranix has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 17:07:26 that was probably a dracoomega commit 17:07:26 -!- Xenobreeder has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:07:36 the one that reworked XP level requirements 17:08:42 yep, found it 17:08:44 %git f54e3c 17:08:44 07DracoOmega02 * 0.13-a0-2256-gf54e3ca: Increase xp required for higher levels, smooth out mid levels 10(3 years, 5 months ago, 2 files, 8+ 8-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/f54e3ca8c7a7 17:08:51 -!- aditya has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 17:09:25 huh 17:09:30 and that matches the most recent values 17:09:43 it looks like they had a pretty weird curve even back then 17:10:26 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 3, 3, 3, 10, 12, 16, 20, 24, 30, 35, 30, 20, 15 17:10:57 There was a huge cost increase in the middle levels 17:11:15 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1, 1, 4, 9, 15, 11, 25, 25, 27 (for comparison) 17:11:35 Looks like this moves the cost increase a bit earlier 17:15:49 Lasty_: you probably have to look at average xp for various dungeon levels as well 17:16:52 -!- ProzacElf has joined ##crawl-dev 17:17:24 gammafunk: yeah 17:17:30 blerg 17:17:31 <|amethyst> nb those aren't the costs for particular skill levels 17:17:31 |amethyst: You have 2 messages. Use !messages to read them. 17:17:49 |amethyst: right, it's cumulative 17:18:04 <|amethyst> no, those aren't related to skill level at all 17:18:08 no? 17:18:17 <|amethyst> those are global cost multipliers based on the character's total XP 17:18:49 ah 17:18:53 where are base costs stored? 17:19:34 <|amethyst> the function just above that computes them 17:19:46 <|amethyst> it uses the same exp_needed as XL, but scaled 17:19:49 <|amethyst> !source exp_needed 17:19:49 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/player.cc#L3552 17:19:55 ah 17:20:10 -!- cmcbot has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:20:23 <|amethyst> err 17:20:24 <|amethyst> no wait 17:20:38 <|amethyst> I am wrong 17:21:17 <|amethyst> that function skill_cost_needed is what tells you which entry in calc_skill_cost to use 17:21:21 <|amethyst> !source skill_exp_needed 17:21:22 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/skills.cc#L1497 17:21:54 <|amethyst> that's the one that gives skill points needed for particular skill levels 17:22:12 ah 17:22:27 that looks much more sane 17:22:42 <|amethyst> the numbers in calc_skill_cost are, essentially, how many XP you need for a skill point 17:22:49 ah 17:24:54 So you need to have a total of 7050 skill points to get a skill to 15 17:25:40 <|amethyst> yes, assuming 0 aptitude 17:26:28 so it's just the xp-to-skillpoints ratio that got a really odd progression based on character level 17:27:31 <|amethyst> also the XL progression (exp_needed) is a little weird 17:27:55 <|amethyst> which affects which entry from calc_skill_cost you use as the ratio 17:28:09 heh, fair. I've never checked through those 17:28:50 heading off to the train -- I'll look through this more later. It's scary to think about what linearizing this would do... 17:29:20 <|amethyst> I think linearizing would be bad 17:29:39 <|amethyst> unless you rescale a lot of other things, anyway 17:30:07 <|amethyst> but I think getting to XL14 should not require half the XP it takes to get to XL27 17:30:20 <|amethyst> or people won't reach XL14 until Depths or so 17:31:21 <|amethyst> !lm * xl=22 recent s=place 17:31:24 56272 milestones for * (xl=22 recent): 5299x Depths:1, 5253x Vaults:5, 2804x D:15, 2715x Elf:3, 2136x Depths:5, 2127x Vaults:4, 2080x Vaults:3, 1963x Elf:1, 1916x Crypt:1, 1767x Depths:3, 1729x Depths:2, 1711x Crypt:3, 1660x Orc:2, 1466x Vaults:2, 1435x D:14, 1301x D:13, 1270x Abyss:3, 1264x Depths:4, 1264x Shoals:4, 1062x Slime:5, 1026x Vaults:1, 929x Abyss:2, 813x Bazaar, 737x WizLab, 720x Slime... 17:33:08 <|amethyst> skill_exp_needed being linear might not be so bad though 17:33:28 <|amethyst> currently it's approximately quadratic 17:35:29 @??orb of fire 17:35:29 orb of fire (05*) | Spd: 15 | HD: 30 | HP: 120-172 | AC/EV: 20/20 | 11non-living, see invisible, fly, unbreathing | Res: 13magic(immune), 04fire+++, 02cold, 11elec+++, 09poison+++, 04rot+++, 13neg+++, 13torm, 04napalm | Vul: 11silver | XP: 8544 | Sp: b.fire (3d40) [06!sil], fireball (3d43) [06!sil], malmutate [06!sil] | Sz: little | Int: human. 17:35:35 heh 17:35:52 kill one more orb of fire than you had to kill for the last xl 17:35:57 to get to the next xl 17:36:06 where do we generate names for scrolls/panlords? 17:36:47 <|amethyst> skill_exp_needed derivative: 50, 100, 150, 200, 250, 300, 350, 400, 450, 550, 650, 750, 850, 950, 1050, 1150, 1250, 1350, 1500, 1650, 1800, 1950, 2100, 2250, 2400, 2550, 2750 17:37:02 <|amethyst> I guess it's really cubic 17:37:39 <|amethyst> second derivative: 50, 50, 50, 50, 50, 50, 50, 50, 100, 100, 100, 100, 100, 100, 100, 100, 100, 150, 150, 150, 150, 150, 150, 150, 150, 200 17:38:08 <|amethyst> !source make_name 17:38:08 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/itemname.cc#L2850 17:38:36 thank you 17:39:44 <|amethyst> oh huh 17:40:21 <|amethyst> I didn't realise that "last two letters were consonants" thing existed 17:41:07 -!- keksz has joined ##crawl-dev 17:41:26 <|amethyst> IMO that should have an exception for "end" clusters 17:41:34 end clusters? 17:41:56 <|amethyst> currently crawl can end a random name with digraphs/clusters like "sh" "ch" "th" 17:42:02 <|amethyst> but 17:42:27 <|amethyst> if I'm reading this correctly, those can't appear at the end of a word that isn't the last word in the random name 17:43:24 this is quite the function 17:43:54 <|amethyst> Brannock: note the comment 17:43:59 <|amethyst> Brannock: * This function is insane, but that might be useful. 17:44:06 haha 17:50:48 hi guys and girls, i'm working on a pretty small patch for dcss and could use some help. any of you know if there is a function to wrap a string around "" tags and such? 17:51:19 looks weird doing it manually, especially when the color is not static.. 17:51:24 <|amethyst> Just found it: colour_string("hello", RED) 17:51:34 new patch! what does it do? 17:51:41 -!- CanOfWorms has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.92 [Firefox 3.6.28/20120306064154]] 17:51:47 nvmind, amethyst found it! he is the best (colour_string) 17:52:23 it's a pretty small patch, i just want to color the names in CTRL+x according to threat level 17:52:44 since console and webtiles have that information but it's not very easy to determine that in tiles 17:53:05 and you have to check each monster individually.. thought i might as well add that to CTRL+x 17:53:32 nice 17:54:09 dpeg said some ppl don't like the colours, but since they're in console and webitles already might as well add it to ctrl+x to make it easier for tiles 17:54:15 -!- zxc has joined ##crawl-dev 17:56:07 wow,s omeone in tavern wrote 13 paragraphs arguing against the removal of the hat of the high council 17:56:18 <|amethyst> BTW, we're on hacker news today: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13126045 17:56:52 <|amethyst> TBF, "on hacker news" is essentially like "someone made a reddit post" 17:57:54 i KNEW it was worth updating the readme!! 17:57:54 "If you like rougelikes" loool rougelike is my favorite color 17:58:34 itym "If U like rougelikes" 17:59:47 -!- tabstorm has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 18:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:00:03 -!- wheals_ has joined ##crawl-dev 18:00:25 well, the comments on hn are usually of better quality 18:00:41 -!- haltingproblem has quit [Quit: haltingproblem] 18:00:51 -!- tabstorm has joined ##crawl-dev 18:01:42 Unstable branch on underhound.eu updated to: 0.20-a0-269-g17f5411 (34) 18:01:57 <|amethyst> "somebody made a reddit post on slashdot" 18:02:02 <|amethyst> anyway, I must be off, later 18:02:37 cya 18:02:40 thx for the help 18:03:08 keksz: don't forget to submit your patch as a github pull request 18:03:21 -!- wheals has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 18:03:33 its not my first patch but thx 18:08:41 -!- adelrune has joined ##crawl-dev 18:08:47 |amethyst: i meant linear growth, rather than a growth pattern that goes up and down by seemingly arbitrary amounts 18:09:35 |amethyst: definitely against purely linear increasing costs 18:10:00 see my comments above about the growth patterns 18:11:19 -!- adelrune has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:11:55 sounds like you're saying you want quadratic xp costs 18:12:09 so that growth is linear? 18:13:24 i seem to have the color working now (using menuentry->colour instead) but I'm wondering if there is an easier way to get the correct color for the monster 18:13:28 gammafunk: more or less 18:13:46 if you look here that seems to be the best way to do it, but it's a lot of boilerplate code for just getting the color back :P https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/output.cc#L1665 18:13:48 it doesn't have to be perfect, but a pattern like 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1, 12 seems weird to me 18:14:41 is there some way to just the the &desc_colour back instead? i'm not a big c++ coder.... 18:16:13 -!- HarryHood has joined ##crawl-dev 18:17:02 -!- scummos__ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:23:25 unless monster_info::to_string were to be split up, no 18:23:29 -!- wheals_ is now known as wheals 18:24:12 thx wheals , in the end it's just a 2 line boilerplate code, not too bad :) 18:24:15 kinda funny convention for a function named to_string to not return a string 18:24:15 wheals: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 18:24:17 !messages 18:24:18 (1/1) chequers said (5d 17h 51m 23s ago): thanks 18:24:21 but that's crawlcode for ya 18:25:21 I don't remember what I thanked you for, but yw 18:25:25 well it works, I guess. i would prefer have several "getsting", "getcolor", "getdescription" instead of a function that does it all at once 18:25:46 im not a great c++ coder so im doing a small patch, otherwise i'd try splitting it up 18:30:03 -!- MarvinPA_ has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 18:43:00 -!- LexAckson has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:43:03 -!- ProzacElf has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 18:43:06 -!- keksz has quit [Quit: Page closed] 18:46:08 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 18:51:18 -!- HarryHood has quit [Quit: Leaving] 18:51:18 -!- Blazinghand has joined ##crawl-dev 18:52:26 -!- GhostOfToal has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:55:11 -!- MIC132 has joined ##crawl-dev 18:55:52 -!- dpeg has joined ##crawl-dev 18:56:10 Hi, there's a short patch at pastebin.com/Y0eVAFay 18:56:52 Would someone review? It's an interface thing, colouring the Ctrl-X monster in the monster list (threat) colours. The guy did it because that would be the quickest way to see those colours in tiles! 18:58:13 -!- Ququman has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:00:49 unique idea: electric adder called Jacob's adder 19:02:24 dpeg: you just missed them in here 19:02:35 blammo 19:03:34 I hope ^ is uncontroversial and can just go in? 19:04:08 testing 19:04:35 dpeg: there are a couple obviously-needed style improvements. (1) don't remove an unrelated blank line in this commit, and (2) put spaces around the = 19:04:59 amalloy: a pity he's gone, he could do more with that information than me 19:05:15 as for content, i'm not sure. it seems to me like this is an improvement, but (a) is it the *right* improvement, and (b) doesn't this conflict with other stuff that affects menu colouring? 19:05:25 btw, there's another little interface idea I saw in a different reddit thread: we could have a list of active keys for the ?: output (notes). What I could think of: (u)niques, (l)evels, (m)utations, (m)essages (stuff you entered there by the : command). What do you think? yes/no/implementable? 19:06:00 amalloy: hm, who to ask? 19:06:03 dpeg: sounds good to me. also add ?:/ for general search 19:06:44 -!- Ladykiller69 has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 19:06:56 ?:/ sounds easy to implement; i'm not sure if the "type" based stuff like uniques is easy or hard 19:08:09 okay, better command set for ?: would be: "u"niques, "l"evels (XL), ":" messages (related to : and ?: commands), "/" search, "m"utations, "p"ortal vaults? 19:09:21 i don't have strong feelings about what is the right set of commands to add, aside from thinking / should be one of them and that it sounds cool to add some in general 19:10:09 oh, "?" for help and "r"unes 19:10:29 who searches ?: for runes? i guess to find out what turn you got them? why? 19:10:46 -!- jeefus is now known as jefus 19:10:50 look up order and time for rune pickups 19:10:59 fair enough i suppose 19:11:16 hm, "c"lose calls, the possibilities are endless :) 19:11:41 -!- kdrnic has joined ##crawl-dev 19:11:57 you could probably implement it by having each key perform a preset search pattern 19:12:08 for a lot of things, yes 19:12:13 actally, some of those like unique would need searching other fields than the message 19:12:16 but for, eg, uniques, not necessarily 19:12:50 my connection will probably break soon enough... would you ask other devs about that patch ^ 19:12:58 wow, this patch just taught me about ctrl-X 19:13:05 *ctrl-x 19:13:12 the guy had bad experience with his pathces rotting (and they all went in eventually, he said) 19:13:13 i thought it was a typo for shift-x 19:15:19 !source direction 19:15:19 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/directn.cc#L494 19:15:31 directn is a contraction of direction... 19:15:52 just like directx is a contraction of directiox 19:16:30 is this like the contraction of a tensor =) 19:16:55 !source monster::to_string 19:16:56 Can't find monster::to_string. 19:17:02 !source actor::to_string 19:17:02 Can't find actor::to_string. 19:17:08 oh 19:17:15 !source monster_info::to_string 19:17:15 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/mon-info.cc#L1308 19:17:52 i think the patch can be improved by colouring monster names in x -> hover display as well 19:17:57 somewhere in this function 19:18:34 ah, clever 19:19:34 i think this function determines the correct colour.. and then does nothing with it? 19:21:32 oh, the colour is returned to the caller 19:21:34 silly c & 19:24:22 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 19:26:28 -!- amalloy is now known as amalloy_ 19:28:48 -!- Pacra_ has joined ##crawl-dev 19:28:56 -!- Pacra has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:29:13 !source colour_string 19:29:14 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/libutil.cc#L354 19:31:39 hm, how do I convert a monster to a monster_info? 19:32:25 ((monster_info)monster_at(gc)) -- beautiful 19:44:37 -!- simmarine has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:45:05 -!- simmarine has joined ##crawl-dev 19:51:53 -!- MIC132 has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:00:23 -!- Kellhus has quit [Quit: Page closed] 20:00:26 -!- Ultraviolent4 has joined ##crawl-dev 20:00:37 is trunk broken for everyone atm or just CPO? 20:00:53 nm someone answered in ##crawl 20:00:57 just CPO apparently 20:04:20 trunk works in cjr 20:04:22 wink nudge 20:06:07 -!- Ultraviolent4 has quit [Quit: Page closed] 20:11:33 -!- cait has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 20:14:33 Its fiksed 20:14:45 By Alex Jurkiewicz 20:15:55 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 20:19:10 -!- haltingproblem has quit [Quit: haltingproblem] 20:20:36 -!- _Jordan_ has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 20:31:39 -!- haltingproblem has quit [Quit: haltingproblem] 20:38:36 -!- Stonar has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 20:39:37 -!- duvessa has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 20:45:14 -!- Guest89784 is now known as ChaseSP 20:52:59 -!- tabstorm has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:57:30 -!- nefhilion has quit [Quit: Page closed] 21:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:02:23 -!- tabstorm has joined ##crawl-dev 21:02:51 -!- amalloy_ is now known as amalloy 21:06:22 -!- amalloy is now known as amalloy_ 21:06:52 -!- amalloy_ is now known as amalloy 21:09:17 -!- haltingproblem has quit [Quit: haltingproblem] 21:11:59 -!- GhostOfToal has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 21:18:48 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 21:32:59 -!- CanOfWorms has joined ##crawl-dev 21:35:18 -!- Lasty has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:37:44 -!- Lasty has joined ##crawl-dev 21:48:41 http://i.imgur.com/aAUzfmp.jpg 21:48:49 xl1 hune 21:49:03 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 21:57:17 -!- haltingproblem has quit [Quit: haltingproblem] 22:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:05:18 -!- Cheibriados has joined ##crawl-dev 22:05:18 -!- The topic of ##crawl-dev is: Crawl Development | Logs: http://s-z.org/crawl-dev/ | People with +v have commit access. | Please keep general Crawl-related chat to ##crawl. | Dev wiki: http://crawl.develz.org/wiki | Long stuff to a pastebin service, please. 22:05:19 -!- The topic of ##crawl is: Play Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup online now! Type ??servers for instructions. | http://crawl.develz.org | FooTV: http://termcast.develz.org - ??footv for instructions | See also ##crawl-offtopic 22:09:51 -!- Blazinghand has joined ##crawl-dev 22:10:09 -!- panicbit2 has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 22:10:28 -!- Weretaco has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:11:37 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Client Quit] 22:12:13 -!- Menche has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:12:20 -!- eki has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:12:24 -!- myp has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 22:24:22 -!- ChaseSP has quit [] 22:38:33 -!- fazisi has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 22:40:10 CanOfWorms: that deep elf in my one dream had that sort of thing 22:40:17 ! 22:41:04 i can't remember exactly what but she had purple or black marks on her arms or hands or shoulders or something 22:41:22 and in the dream it was just something that happened if you used a lot of magic 22:41:31 she didn't have, like, demonic pacts or anything 22:43:37 i thought they were pretty 22:45:29 -!- adelrune has joined ##crawl-dev 22:51:18 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 22:52:07 -!- kdrnic_ has joined ##crawl-dev 22:55:04 -!- kdrnic has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 23:00:01 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:02:16 -!- amalloy is now known as amalloy_ 23:02:33 -!- amalloy_ is now known as amalloy 23:05:29 look who's back: https://www.reddit.com/r/roguelikes/comments/5h43u1/dcss_new_player_how_i_fell_in_love_with_game_but/ 23:06:04 CanOfWorms: that's the notorious poster I mentioned some hours ago. You know this clown? Who is it? 23:07:07 no, I don't 23:07:09 but they posted the exact same topic in the dcss subreddit 23:07:11 ah, asked b/c of the "back" 23:07:15 yes, true 23:07:22 and in my survey thread 23:07:36 <|amethyst> why did the post in /r/dcss get removed anyway? 23:07:58 did it get removed? 23:08:23 it just got pushed back to page 3iish because it was old 23:08:27 <|amethyst> "I created this thread on DCSS but I was insulted and thread deleted so have to post it here." 23:08:28 https://www.reddit.com/r/dcss/comments/5fn0yr/new_player_how_i_got_addicted_to_the_game_but_now/ 23:08:48 I always hope it's a pimply teenager, sitting in his closet with nothing to do. 23:09:09 <|amethyst> CanOfWorms: I guess "delisted" then 23:09:21 <|amethyst> CanOfWorms: it does not appear in /r/dcss/new 23:09:34 that's normal though isn't it? 23:09:48 topics older than a certain time period stop getting pushed to the first page 23:10:01 it's over a week old at this point 23:10:02 did someone already make the joke how DCSS is well prepared for the_donald? 23:10:19 donald draws a card... it is the Tomb. 23:10:43 not "you're fired"? :) 23:12:20 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 23:12:30 that's old hat 23:12:34 now it's all about building... THE WALL 23:12:47 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Client Quit] 23:13:01 <|amethyst> CanOfWorms: /r/foo/new is sorted by date, and I see things from 9 days ago but not this post 23:13:12 Clinton wanted to build a wall, too, and the EU is building one... all so similar 23:13:23 <|amethyst> CanOfWorms: an, no, wait, I do see it after all 23:15:52 <|amethyst> s/an/ah/ 23:16:08 there is a moderation log if you want to check stuff like that too 23:16:09 I just read the DCSS thread, this is bordering on sad. Heck, I can still chuckle. 23:18:03 -!- PleasingFungus has joined ##crawl-dev 23:19:05 -!- dpeg has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 23:25:05 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 23:25:29 "I think I will make it my mission to warn everyone to stay away from this game, show them the way devs treat their players." 23:26:01 -!- dtsund has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:26:04 -!- Pacra_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:26:22 omg that user made a different account 23:26:24 wtf 23:26:24 someone lost their first multi-rune character 23:26:36 how can you tell? 23:26:51 just compare the username of both threads 23:26:54 the numbers are different 23:27:26 wow, I didn't notice the URLs were different 23:27:35 I doubt two different people would decide to name themselves "DepressedCrawlerXXXX" 23:27:44 i just skim read both as the old /r/dcs one 23:27:57 yeah... they made a new one in r/roguelike 23:30:00 <|amethyst> I think it's part of the "they deleted my post" lie 23:30:17 <|amethyst> so you click on the user's history and see there is no post listed 23:30:31 |amethyst: note that the link you post is relative, so will be inaccurate in a few days 23:30:45 actually, looking at the after= argument.. I'm not sure that's true 23:31:45 pretty messed up that we, the devs, would delete someone's post like that. 23:31:48 <|amethyst> they apologised, all good 23:31:50 -!- wheals has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 23:33:15 ah, that's nice. 23:35:28 -!- DevlanMud has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:38:01 and quite unexpected, really, which makes it nicer :) 23:38:21 i think that person is also this person https://www.reddit.com/r/roguelikes/comments/5guo77/dungeon_crawl_dcss_survey_2016/davl6gz/ 23:39:37 looks like it 23:40:07 -!- Pacra_ has joined ##crawl-dev 23:41:04 -!- Pacra has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:42:35 if that person is actually roguecrawler that would be depressing 23:42:43 because he's replying a few comments down 23:43:22 although that user does seem to really like death knights... 23:43:39 has he gotten to actually play a death knight yet? 0.15 is still available 23:43:41 hi PleasingFungus 23:43:45 I wonder how much of this is the "cool name" factor 23:43:54 rename necromancers to death knight 23:44:41 !remove Lightli 23:44:42 03PleasingFungus ⛐ 0.20-a0-2014-gea94782: Remove Lightli 10(in the future, 20 files, 744+ 809-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/commit.png?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=ea94782 23:44:50 fire elementalist > immolation page, ice elementalist > glacier squire, earth elementalist > tectonic lord 23:44:55 so how long do hw/haste/tele wands have 23:45:04 before they go the way of me 23:45:12 Lightli, what kind of answer do you expect? 23:45:21 Brannock: there are a whooooole mess of crawl players who don't seem to really get the fact that you can play characters in ways other than the precise way implied by their names 23:45:22 Soon (tm) 23:45:48 PALADIN 23:45:56 (ASSASSIN) 23:46:01 ((HEALER)) 23:46:02 a DK and a Gl who takes yred are like 95% the same deal 23:46:29 but Gl is about weapons and light armor and dodging and goes Oka, obviously 23:46:33 haha 23:46:37 it would be cool to have a new background sometime 23:46:45 PleasingFungus: deprived 23:46:55 isn't that just wanderer? 23:47:10 wanderers start with skills and items 23:47:16 they're just randomized 23:47:27 Deprived I think is "start with nothing at all" 23:47:30 deprived starts stark naked with 0 in all skills 23:47:33 <|amethyst> ontoclasm: that was addressed: "Yred's nicest abilities are passive and raise dead for me. So if you say that you couldnt do it before. Then there really is no hope now. If you get the temple at D6 you barely have enough time to raise Yred's piety much to get anything, and then most noobs die in lair or orcish mines." 23:48:19 ontoclasm: How would that work with DD 23:48:25 <|amethyst> !lg * recent lair yred x=avg(piety) 23:48:27 425 games for * (recent lair yred): avg(piety)=109.89 23:48:30 Lightli: i guess they'd start with /HW and nothing else 23:48:32 works better if dd /hw is removed 23:48:38 also presumably you should start with like 23:48:38 along with other /hw 23:48:40 a ration 23:48:42 (and dd have an inherent healing ability) 23:48:42 but then how do they heal themselves 23:48:43 -!- haltingproblem has quit [Quit: haltingproblem] 23:48:49 wow, luxury 23:48:56 a whole ration? 23:49:02 in my day, we had a choko and we liked it 23:49:05 bring back potion of porridge for deprived 23:49:33 i vaguely regret porridge removal 23:49:45 (i legit think it's a cool idea, actually) 23:49:49 <|amethyst> naked with 0 skills and * with your choice of god 23:49:54 nooo 23:50:15 Troll Deprived would be easy then 23:50:16 |amethyst: also an idea i guess 23:50:17 deprived must be naked and 1 ration 23:50:19 just start with Trog 23:50:24 bring back Pr 23:50:25 -!- MaxFrost has quit [Quit: Going offline, see ya! (www.adiirc.com)] 23:50:27 and have it be just 23:50:31 bring back old Cr 23:50:32 "you start with a god of your choice" 23:50:40 with starting book haste spell and BERSERK RAGE spell 23:50:50 %git 25d4a4e9b 23:50:50 07PleasingFungus02 * 0.16-a0-340-g25d4a4e: Make !porr give exactly 6000 nutrition 10(2 years, 3 months ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/25d4a4e9bffb 23:51:02 ^ this was good stuff 23:51:10 careful porridge balancing 23:51:21 i mean, the reason to add backgrounds is that they make the early game play differently 23:51:21 rip drinking potions of poison to not die 23:51:44 and (arguably) both of these concepts might do that i guess 23:52:07 i think that is a necessary but not sufficient constraint 23:54:18 hey PF does my merge code check out as a good way to do it? 23:54:23 wasn't sure what you had in mind for it 23:54:28 %git 23:54:28 07Brannock02 * 0.20-a0-269-g17f5411: Merge wand and misc acquirement 10(10 hours ago, 1 file, 11+ 10-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/17f5411d996b 23:55:21 ahh. still has weird cboe code, but that's not the end of the world 23:55:39 works for now, and maybe someone can do a big nice refactor later 23:56:48 I wonder if this will end up getting some players to try out rods 23:58:15 make them not have to be wielded! or change ' to cycle between all consecutively lettered wieldables in my inventory, so I can have more than two 23:58:37 and 0 wield time, I guess, with a pony 23:59:16 we were discussing turning (most) rods into wands this morning 23:59:17 -!- adelrune has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:59:29 (and removing the rest) 23:59:38 (STUPID REMOVE) 23:59:51 Unstable branch on CRAWL.XTAHUA.COM updated to: 0.20-a0-269-g17f5411 (34)