00:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:00:04 where does this come up? 00:00:20 the teleporters between sections? 00:00:26 Hardcore Lua is my new book 00:00:28 ah, that uses this function 00:00:37 PleasingFungus: I've already had one reserved clan name today, now I get a book? 00:00:41 I am too softcore lua 00:01:38 I can help with wall lowering, but I'd need specifics 00:01:43 everything's looking up for chequers! 00:01:44 I have lowered walls recently 00:01:54 gammafunk: walls, not bars? 00:02:06 you know when you're on my level? 00:02:07 grates are a different kind of wall :P 00:02:09 it's all the same. 00:02:33 You all see grates and walls, I just see the lua matrix 00:02:36 (I wonder whatever happened to that idea of making grates block nothing besides movement) 00:03:02 You just have to be careful when raising walls on things standing on them 00:03:11 but this probably is lowering-only 00:03:31 gammafunk: http://i.imgur.com/0FJ6eJO.png 00:03:54 yeah I've play-tested it myself 00:04:03 but why are you showing me this? 00:04:13 -!- Harudoku has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:04:23 I wasn't sure if you had. Instead of that transportation mechanism, just have a pressure plate which removes (all/some?) of the wall separating the cells 00:04:29 is my read of regret-index's idea 00:04:48 completely off >_> 00:05:12 I'd imagine it's more like, you're in a room, you kill stuff, walls lower in the room, more stuff comes in? 00:05:15 or no 00:05:23 fine, pastebin 00:05:27 I guess that's really the same thing 00:05:44 http://sprunge.us/XObZ 00:05:47 -!- AreBrandon has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:05:48 make it like Doom where you have to shoot the one tiny computer screen you see through the window, behind the imp 00:06:21 oh ok 00:06:25 this I can probably work with 00:08:01 so if I load that map, the 'm' and 'n' pressure plates are visible 00:08:21 i think even i might be able to do this 00:08:24 if I step on either, both, vanish, and the corresponding uppercase letter walls for the letter i stood on vanish, and the pressure plates 'r' and 's' appear 00:08:27 and i've never seen a vault before in my life 00:08:44 correct 00:08:53 pleasingfungus: so where did that volcano layout come from 00:08:58 enlightenment 00:09:04 forest elves. 00:09:06 pixies. 00:09:08 magic dust. 00:09:11 do the math... 00:09:23 where did the math come from 00:09:27 burn the forest 00:09:28 GOT YOU! 00:09:32 damn! 00:09:35 spriggans stole the idea from your head and did it for you, huh 00:09:47 I hear that volcano vault 'doesn't even feel like a real volcano' 00:09:51 what is a real volcano 00:10:27 idk 00:10:27 one that has volcano explosions 00:10:34 do you need a way to prevent monsters stepping on the pressure plates 00:10:36 it has volcano explosions! just little ones 00:10:37 BECAUSE VOLCANOES EXPLODE 00:10:39 lil splosions 00:10:46 or would it be a) already handled or b) a good problem for the player to solve 00:10:46 that's easy to do with a tag I think 00:11:02 technically i think it has more volcano explosions than any other vault? not sure 00:11:03 hrm, although it's kind of problem since monsters then have weird AI over those tiles 00:11:14 yeah that sounds dubious 00:11:26 more I think about it, the more I just like making the player have to deal with it 00:11:31 could make it some special player-only marker (visible) rather than a pressure trap 00:11:32 oh 00:11:41 actually you step on this first 00:11:43 then you get monsters 00:11:45 so it's nbd 00:11:54 right, but then the next pressure plates appear 00:11:56 I assume you can only do one of these? 00:12:11 nah, you do three, and at each level there's a choice of two plates 00:12:17 # Pressing either of a pair of MN -> RS -> YZ removes the other plate 00:12:38 so plates 'm' and 'n' are visible when you arrive. You step on 'm' and 'M' 'n' vanish 00:12:46 and 'r' 's' appear 00:12:50 -!- Harudoku has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:13:09 maybe 'r' 's' appear only when all the caged monsters are dead 00:13:20 vanishing pressure plates... 00:13:27 obviously they retract. into the ceiling 00:13:43 no reliance on killing things here, that'll put even more glyph pressure on these poor vaults 00:13:49 yeah, I mean what you could do is put then in a runed door tomb 00:13:55 but that seems a bit silly 00:14:00 *them 00:14:12 you could just let the player deal with it as chequers said 00:14:24 ok well I think I can hack this 00:14:41 lemme go tri unless the wungus already is 00:14:46 haha called you a wungus 00:15:15 regret-index: i learn so many words reading your stuff. "venatio". 00:16:07 smaze 00:16:33 obviously need to make sure gauntlet gets merged so I can add it to crawl_vocabulary 00:16:56 -!- punpun has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 00:17:58 ??crawl vocabulary 00:17:59 I don't have a page labeled crawl_vocabulary in my learndb. 00:18:06 tisk tisk 00:19:12 it's more of a spiritual thing. 00:20:46 oh, I mean we can actually just make the trap a no-on when a monsters steps on it 00:20:54 looking at this callback 00:20:57 noop 00:21:04 er yeah 00:21:12 weightless demons 00:21:38 interesting, iter.slave_iterator 00:21:42 probably should have used that one 00:22:01 convert_slaves_to_lava() 00:22:17 classic crawlcode entry 00:22:36 convert_to_lava_orc() 00:22:51 you just want more people to see my funny ghost tile 00:23:03 !source iter.slave_iter 00:23:04 Can't find iter.slave_iter. 00:23:07 f u sequell 00:23:23 aha! 00:23:28 it has a value and a key, good 00:23:38 so we can use the same key string but different vals for different walls 00:23:43 much better than string hijinks 00:24:23 actually now I see how these key-value things work, I probably should just be using one key and different values in my pak vaults in some cases 00:24:26 but I digress 00:25:01 "new things before fixing old things", a time honoured crawl tradition- 00:26:20 -!- WalkerBoh has joined ##crawl-dev 00:27:49 -!- tabstorm has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 00:28:02 regret-index: http://dpaste.com/0GHTFP0 00:28:07 regret-index: i mean, they're pretty bad 00:28:20 but i'm proud of figuring out i could put audience into the D 00:28:26 maybe audience should be neutral to the player? 00:28:48 ew, permaglass :P 00:29:00 well, copying what is used inside the gauntlet 00:29:22 hey, it has a tile these days! 00:29:31 things can look different inside and outside! like wizlabs! 00:30:03 Unstable branch on CRAWL.XTAHUA.COM updated to: 0.19-a0-526-gbe2e51c (34) 00:30:09 :) 00:30:23 -- An easier and more posh way of interfacing with find_marker_positions_by_prop. 00:30:28 do you suggest just 'n' glyphs instead? 00:31:59 * regret-index shrugs. 00:32:25 regret-index: do you mind if I move the lua into gauntlet.lua in the appropriate dir, since it's hard to manage so much lua in a des 00:32:26 the entrance vaults are pretty changed from what's open on the branch already... >_> 00:32:40 well that and it's hard for my editor to syntax hilight des+lua 00:33:14 you love tricking me with unpushed work!! 00:33:20 so uncollaborative~ 00:33:58 well I'll just push whatever to the branch and you can force-push over it with subsequent edits 00:34:04 er 00:34:15 are you sure force push is the concept you're looking for 00:34:38 well, if he incorporates my changes into his local branch, then yeah? 00:34:42 maybe I don't follow you 00:34:51 -!- lordfrikk has joined ##crawl-dev 00:35:09 it's not ideal but it's either than or we just keep dpasting patches etc 00:36:36 regret-index: so do you prefer monsters stepping on grates to be a no-op or for them to work but require LOS of the player? 00:36:45 or for them to just always work for monsters 00:36:50 all three of these are possible 00:37:10 I suppose players will assume that monsters can trigger them 00:37:40 third option 00:37:56 http://puu.sh/pjEwG/6594210d2e.png 00:37:56 alright 00:38:01 new slime creatures...???? 00:38:49 i like it 00:38:49 heh, regarding those grate traps: 00:38:51 -- TODO: deal damage to the player / monsters that are caught under a grate! 00:38:54 TODO indeed 00:39:39 it all comes down to what the titanic ones look like 00:39:42 I like the current titanic slime creature tile but the rest are pretty... unpleasant 00:39:51 so go ahead and work on more if you want 00:40:13 -!- tksquared has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 00:40:21 yeah I'm planning to do the whole set 00:40:40 what message do we want for a lowered wall? 00:40:49 for crawl.mpr() 00:41:07 are there any current comparison messages, like... in menkauresprint? 00:41:22 I'll put a placeholder and can check later 00:41:23 "The pressure plate clicks, and a section of wall slides away!" 00:43:52 -!- Amphouse has quit [Quit: Page closed] 00:46:54 -!- Rust3dCor3 has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:49:26 single quotes and double quotes are always interchangeable, right 00:49:35 -!- Smello has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:49:46 -!- tksquared has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 00:50:23 you're supposed to alternate them for nested quotes 00:52:13 -!- Dingbatt_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 00:55:11 -!- eb has quit [] 00:56:06 -!- valrus has quit [Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…] 00:56:12 what does the mini_float tag do 00:56:35 -!- lordfrikk has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:57:02 nothing, technically 00:58:04 -!- Grivan has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 00:58:45 !source is_launched 00:58:45 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/itemprop.cc#l2134 00:58:51 -!- tksquared has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 00:59:51 -!- WalkerBoh has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:00:23 well here are some entry vaults: http://dpaste.com/0MS6MEE 01:00:47 2016-06-07 02:59:49,185 INFO: #859 P345 ERR: ASSERT(force_type == OBJ_RANDOM) in 'makeitem.cc' at l 01:00:50 ine 1948 failed. 01:00:56 !crash allbefore 01:00:58 1. allbefore, XL20 DrAE, T:68868 (milestone): http://dobrazupa.org/morgue/allbefore/crash-allbefore-20141020-224122.txt 01:01:01 hm nope 01:01:15 https://crawl.project357.org/morgue/allbefore/crash-allbefore-20160607-031202.txt 01:01:20 regret-index: you have pq/PQ as grate trap related glyphs in your des, but mention mn in comments and actually put down mn glyphs 01:01:23 is that a typo? 01:01:30 fedhas_altar_fruit_tree 01:02:22 typo, meant mn 01:02:27 return weapon && launch_type == LRET_LAUNCHED; does this line mean return launch_type LRET_LAUNCHED if weapon is not nullptr? 01:02:47 oops regret-index that dpaste was for you 01:02:58 I can use _festive 01:03:00 ifyou feel like acepting / improving them :P 01:03:01 Naruni: can you rephrase? 01:03:52 after adapting it into the style that I haven't pushed solely because I'm going to let gammafunk do whatever 01:05:42 PleasingFungus, umm i am wondering if that line also serves the same as this: if (weapon) { launch_type == LRET_LAUNCHED; return true; } 01:06:53 the function returns bool 01:07:10 !source !ranged_attack:using_weapon 01:07:10 Can't find !ranged_attack:using_weapon. 01:07:15 !source ranged_attack:using_weapon 01:07:15 Can't find ranged_attack:using_weapon. 01:07:20 !source ranged_attack::using_weapon 01:07:20 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/ranged_attack.cc#l325 01:13:06 ok, so let's see how many ways this is broken 01:14:06 how bad could it be 01:15:01 syntax needs improvement, at least: 01:15:02 : gauntlet_place_grate_trap_pair(_G, {"m", "n"}, {"M", "N"}, {1, 2}) 01:15:02 : gauntlet_place_grate_trap_pair(_G, {"r", "s"}, {"R", "S"}, {3, 4}) 01:15:02 : gauntlet_place_grate_trap_pair(_G, {"y", "z"}, {"Y", "Z"}, {5, 6}) 01:15:19 but that can come after it works 01:16:18 regret-index: : gauntlet_tiers(_G) 01:16:22 this doesn't seem to exist 01:16:24 ? 01:16:55 w e l p 01:17:04 I guess I can comment that out? 01:18:04 -!- PleasingFungus has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:19:20 03regret-index02 07[gauntlet] * 0.18-a0-1458-ge618060: Gauntlet drafts half done 10(2 minutes ago, 3 files, 365+ 217-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/e618060e18ec 01:19:27 overlay >_> 01:19:38 why did I even type "half done" 01:19:49 brain spinning in circles argh 01:20:26 -!- PleasingFungus has joined ##crawl-dev 01:20:55 cool 01:21:09 i'll write up a little patch now to enable a status light 01:22:35 -!- rossi_ has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 01:22:41 Naruni: == is a comparison operator. "a == b" evaluates to true if a and b are equal, and false otherwise. "launch_type == LRET_LAUNCHED;" does nothing; all it does is evaluate whether launch_type is set to LRET_LAUNCH, but it doesn't do anything with that information. 01:23:42 Naruni: "if (weapon && launch_type == LRET_LAUNCHED) { ... }" is equivalent to "if (weapon) { if (launch_type == LRET_LAUNCHED) { ... } }". You may be getting confused between == and =? 01:25:14 -!- FireSight has quit [] 01:26:02 gotcha 01:26:03 thanks 01:26:21 made a fix for sniper missing... but there's still some things broken under the hood 01:26:32 patch going up to 10448 01:26:38 ok. i'm very curious 01:26:53 oh and that guy who said commit a6dc205 IMO is wrong, that didn't break anything 01:28:00 ah, good 01:28:07 i was pretty confused by that. 01:29:13 i tested that a bit and i got AUTOMATIC_HIT on every launch with sniper from that patch 01:29:24 hrm, now why aren't you placing, mr. vault 01:30:38 spite? 01:31:07 something like that! 01:31:11 it refused to place that level 01:31:41 regret-index: does this vault ever place for you? 01:31:50 default depth is fine, don't think there's a tag problem... 01:32:13 &P for platehex? then it works, yeah 01:32:37 hrm, ok 01:32:40 how do STATUS_ enum variables work 01:32:49 I left a CHANCE: 0% on it because of needing that lua, though, which you might be running into if you're just constantly regnerating the floor 01:32:55 yeah I changed that 01:33:01 let me try &P 01:33:05 like, when you look at STATUS_BEOGH, there are only two references, the definition and the condition 01:33:12 well ok now it places... 01:33:30 map loaded with the lua the first time, I'm so scared... 01:33:35 now to step on the plate... 01:33:45 ah... have to update STATUS_LAST_STATUS 01:34:24 yeah 01:34:32 wow 01:34:37 it seems to have completely worked the first time 01:34:53 the mythical code.... 01:35:01 wall lowers, pair trap disappears 01:35:05 original trap also disappears 01:35:20 this is madness! 01:35:34 well I guess I can push this, it will need some lua cleanups probably 01:35:45 does the next set of traps appear 01:35:54 oh they all appear at start 01:36:02 isn't that the idea? 01:36:04 who runs the c-r-d mailing list? i sent a mail a couple of days ago and it's been awaiting approval to post or not 01:36:10 aw man, you were close 01:36:17 Naruni: ask dpeg, I think he mods it 01:36:17 1/2 should appear at the start 01:36:23 once you hit one of them, 3/4 appear 01:36:33 er 01:36:40 aren't there only 3 pairs 01:37:09 the first two plates appear at the start, after you step on one the next two appear, once you step on one of those the last two appear 01:37:16 or are there 4 pairs 01:37:20 3 pairs 01:37:25 gammafunk: chequers' "1/2" refer to individual plates; one pair 01:37:27 !tell dpeg when you have a moment, would you review and accept or reject a mail i sent to c-r-d 4 Jun 01:37:28 I meant 3/4 as in plates 3 & 4 01:37:28 Naruni: OK, I'll let dpeg know. 01:37:49 yes, they're not supposed to all be present at once 01:37:55 regret-index: http://dpaste.com/25TMBS3 You're not warned when you enter a level with -Tele -- do you think that's important? 01:37:55 well that's easy enough 01:38:01 thanks gammafunk 01:39:06 chequers: imo yes, there should be a warning for that, if we have a warning for -Shaft 01:39:19 curses, foiled by my own past contribution 01:39:32 oh, better bugfix 01:39:44 !source set_level_flags 01:39:45 Can't find set_level_flags. 01:41:56 ...also, that level is going to be a little weird with the glyphs but whatever I'll fix it after 01:42:20 !source branch_type 01:42:21 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/enum.h#l772 01:42:45 what's the view for easily fixed list 01:44:41 -!- Twiggytwiggytwig has quit [Quit: See ya guys later ;)] 01:46:15 https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/search.php?project_id=1&sticky_issues=on&sortby=last_updated&dir=DESC&hide_status_id=80&tag_string=simple maybe 01:47:22 hm, do you think it's a problem for the -tele warning message to occur in stairs 01:47:31 since it doesn't fire if you wizmode yourself into the branch :p 01:47:58 as long as it triggers when you return to the branch from the abyss 01:48:57 how do I generate a banishing creature 01:49:06 just banish yourself 01:49:24 ^B 01:49:37 -!- lordfrikk has joined ##crawl-dev 01:49:58 hm, that weird comment may have been right 01:51:17 hrm 01:51:21 this is very strange 01:51:28 good thing to test, and it works 01:52:02 i guess i shouldn't show -tele for Fo 01:52:56 regret-index: http://dpaste.com/2ME96FJ seems to work for fo/non-fo in and out of gauntlet 01:53:01 no backwards conditionals this time >_> 01:53:39 q: can monsters blink/tele while in gauntlet 01:54:22 gammafunk: there's no hep altar in my temple. you were gonna fix that, right? 01:54:33 hrm, the thing with placing 01:54:36 er 01:54:47 they forgot about hep when building the temple 01:54:53 should have worshipped him 01:54:55 amalloy: you can fix it by worshiping a better god 01:54:58 memories were hazy 01:57:33 chequers: thanks 01:59:01 oh also i forgot, i was looking for an uskayaw altar anyway, not hep 01:59:06 neither of those is in temple 02:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:00:14 PleasingFungus: yes 02:00:21 PleasingFungus: the restriction is only for teleportation 02:01:22 hm, disto weapons won't blink you though 02:01:34 regret-index: hrm, are you sure these traps appearing after the previous is triggered? 02:01:42 will players notice their placement? 02:02:05 well, the arena is pretty small 02:02:18 it's actually more complexity to place them in sequence like that, and is there a downside to all being avail at once? 02:02:35 it is small, but they appear out of los in a number of positions 02:02:38 if they're all placed at once, can the player tell which pair are 'active' 02:02:48 well they'd all be active 02:02:51 -!- Zeor has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 02:02:53 all pairs rather 02:03:08 so you step on one of a pair, the other in the pair disappears 02:03:10 but that's it 02:03:17 that and the wall going down, that is 02:03:28 if there's no progression then the map has to be reconfigured a bunch, since the vast majority of the loot is based on the "last" pair with the highest enemies and the immeadiately visible randart jewellery loot 02:03:29 well, the original design had different tiers of monster difficulty behind different walls 02:03:35 also that yes 02:03:49 'It is not affected by Zin's recite' sounds horrible, suggestions? 'It does not respond to the preachings of Zin'? 02:04:02 maybe you could fix the 'player wont notice' by printing a message and spawning some fog? 02:04:02 it also makes it harder to tell what the pairings are 02:04:19 Naruni: It is unable to understand the word of Zin' 02:04:24 alright, I'm just not sure about placing feature traps dynamically 02:04:30 since I'm not seing a feature type for them 02:04:40 chequers: you misunderstood my question 02:04:52 are monsters affected by the tele restriction? 02:05:08 hm 02:05:12 they have a moniker of "preasure plate trap" through kfeat 02:05:22 but this is not a feature type in feature-data.h 02:05:37 so I don't think I can pass it to dgn.terrain_changed() 02:06:00 I believe it's just "mechanical trap" 02:06:03 ...huh. 02:06:16 but I'm not sure if there's a way to make this recognize that it's plate specifically 02:06:51 PleasingFungus: haha, they can 02:06:59 How about removing corpses from the list of items? 02:07:02 A spear. There is something else lying underneath. 02:07:37 I expect getting a list of items to choose upon hitting ',', not wasting a turn on picking up a useless thing 02:07:38 oh 02:08:13 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 02:08:49 Yermak: that's useful for knowing when you can cast animate dead 02:08:57 can't wait to see somebody accidentally distort away a spriggan defender with a quickblade they wanted 02:09:12 and the defender lands in the many, many glass chambers outside 02:09:16 Yes, I agree, but we for sure could remove this "There is something else lying underneath." 02:09:30 yeah, i'm fixing it 02:09:45 Thank you 02:09:58 sorry, not your issue Yermak 02:10:15 haha, ok 02:10:20 your issue is reasonable but we all hate you here 02:10:29 you report too many bugs. it ruins our 'smooth vibe' 02:10:43 at a distance, I don't think you could unless you want to let players see everything in a stack 02:10:43 -!- Wah has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:11:09 which might remove the last bits of monsters picking things up when you can see them 02:11:40 win-win! 02:12:31 scrying? 02:13:21 hm 02:13:51 |amethyst: to your knowledge, would it be possible to change dungeon terrain to a plate trap specifically at play time? 02:14:25 from the code I'm seeing, we can place a mechanical trap, but god knows what that would actually be 02:14:33 !source blink_fineff 02:14:34 1/2. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/fineff.h#l106 02:14:36 hrm, I bet that nem card would show how 02:14:58 regret-index: anyhow, I can take a stab at this again tomorrow, that's one important detail that needs ironing out 02:15:41 -!- Krakhan has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:15:48 there might be a cute hack we could do where we place the trap but don't reveal it and have the trigger make no effect until the trap is active 02:16:05 but I'd bet that the trap id code would thwart this 02:16:06 so that's probably unwise 02:16:16 eurgh. 02:16:25 i have absolutely no idea how attack's "weapon" property is set 02:16:28 !seen |amethyst 02:16:28 I last saw |amethyst at Tue Jun 7 03:40:25 2016 UTC (2h 36m 2s ago) saying 'oh, I guess you.hp_max is 0 somehow' on ##crawl-dev. 02:16:33 oh good he's not dead. 02:16:40 uncontrolled blinking cant send you through glass can it 02:16:44 that nem cards should mean it's possible 02:17:03 hrm, I guess I can push what I have so far, but it will need some rewriting (assuming the trap thing can work) 02:17:12 -!- zero_one has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 02:17:13 gammafunk: can't you just say 'pressure plate'? 02:17:26 hm 02:17:34 chequers: no 02:17:35 PleasingFungus: I don't know that it will work, since it called the dgn.terrain_change() function 02:17:39 which expects a feature name 02:17:51 ah, yeah. hm 02:18:03 yeah i don't think we have anything that dynamically places traps right now 02:18:12 regret-index: i'll send you a PR for these things, so I can write proper commits. Or do you want to do that yourself 02:18:13 PleasingFungus: doesn't nem's trap card to this? 02:18:18 bad ideas: override random mechanical trap to always be pressure plates in this branch 02:18:19 it used to place traps around the player, for sure 02:18:19 uh 02:18:22 it's not lua 02:18:38 well that may be, but the same functions are often avail in dgn lib 02:18:45 also warpwright card is a better example 02:18:47 that's what the lib is, lua interface to crawl functions 02:18:48 since it places a specific trap 02:18:54 well no not really 02:19:00 since teleport trap is a 'base' trap type 02:19:02 alternately shaft 02:19:04 like 'mechanical' 02:19:04 yeah 02:19:15 trap card probably doesn't exist 02:19:20 nem card specifically placed mechanical traps of different kinds 02:19:26 but not sure if that was some hack or what 02:19:43 minefield card, rip 02:19:47 yeah that one 02:20:09 %git 82f6ad17de140911205a720b336cfa36603c8532 02:20:09 07MarvinPA02 * 0.15-a0-696-g82f6ad1: Remove decks of dungeons and a number of now-unused cards 10(2 years, 1 month ago, 24 files, 129+ 387-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/82f6ad17de14 02:20:29 place_specific_trap(*ri, TRAP_RANDOM); 02:20:37 -!- Sprort has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 02:20:49 solution: remove all mechanical traps other than pressure plates 02:21:32 oh, well plate traps have a TRAP_ type 02:21:41 wonder if that's in dgn 02:21:59 problem is there's got to be a terrain change as well 02:22:18 I'll poke more tomorrow 02:22:50 mm 02:23:05 thanks for what is evidently quite the hassle >_> 02:23:53 -!- zero_one has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 02:25:16 03gammafunk02 07[gauntlet] * 0.18-a0-1459-gb9be99b: Make gauntlet walls lower through pressure plates 10(61 minutes ago, 2 files, 222+ 171-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/b9be99b51e3a 02:25:23 -!- Poncheis has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:25:31 oh crap that has a flubbed weight/chance, but w/e 02:25:43 it still doesn't seem to place as a normal choice, no idea why 02:28:29 regret-index: https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/292 02:28:45 -!- Sprort has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 02:28:47 contains the dpaste links I gave you and a little more, cleaned up 02:29:01 such dlua sectioning maybe might deserve its own folder with files for ice cave, volcano, wizlab, ... 02:29:22 what does the d in dlua stand for 02:29:29 dungeon 02:29:44 stands for DOPE 02:29:45 as in dungeon crawl lua? 02:30:04 clua is crawl lua, dlua is dungeon lua iirc 02:30:13 (though I guess that might not be a great idea for wizlabs since they contain plenty of lua in and out of the vaults) 02:30:14 crawl meaning "userland" 02:30:18 ah, they have different access 02:30:29 New branch created: pull/292 (7 commits) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/292 02:30:29 03regret-index02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/292 * 0.18-a0-1455-g67c73e9: New portal vault: the Gauntlet (set-up, concept map) 10(3 months ago, 14 files, 401+ 5-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/67c73e925d03 02:30:29 03regret-index02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/292 * 0.18-a0-1456-g07e359d: More interim Gauntlet progress 10(34 hours ago, 6 files, 362+ 163-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/07e359dd8745 02:30:29 03regret-index02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/292 * 0.18-a0-1457-g4d3c75d: Make Gauntlet's no-tloc actually work, also only block teleportation 10(33 hours ago, 5 files, 9+ 9-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/4d3c75d9515a 02:30:29 03regret-index02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/292 * 0.18-a0-1458-ge618060: Gauntlet drafts half done 10(73 minutes ago, 3 files, 365+ 217-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/e618060e18ec 02:30:29 03chequers02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/292 * 0.18-a0-1459-ge2aa5ed: Improve -Tele status. 10(9 minutes ago, 7 files, 25+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/e2aa5ede13d8 02:30:29 03chequers02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/292 * 0.18-a0-1460-g326130d: Allow distortion attacks to blink under -Tele. 10(9 minutes ago, 2 files, 2+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/326130d348a4 02:30:29 03chequers02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/292 * 0.18-a0-1461-g0a224ef: Prevent monsters teleporting in NO_TELE levels. 10(3 minutes ago, 1 file, 3+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/0a224ef4dc73 02:30:33 -!- Zekka has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 02:31:13 ...thanks, chei >_> 02:31:30 indeed 02:31:31 ...and 2772 more commits. 02:36:18 -!- amalloy is now known as amalloy_ 02:36:51 -!- CanOfWorms has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.92 [Firefox 3.6.28/20120306064154]] 02:37:34 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.19-a0-527-g599b5d7: Count projectiles as launched correctly (Jafet) 10(7 minutes ago, 3 files, 9+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/599b5d79c636 02:37:34 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.19-a0-528-gd42735b: Fix nevermiss/deflect missile interaction (10448) 10(39 seconds ago, 1 file, 4+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/d42735bc8c38 02:37:40 -!- sage1234 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:38:37 wow what the fuck 02:38:39 one sec 02:39:13 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.19-a0-529-g411dd88: Oops 10(15 seconds ago, 1 file, 2+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/411dd8896613 02:43:29 need to sort everything out tomorrow 02:43:31 -!- regret-index has quit [Quit: leaving] 02:49:16 -!- Idolo has quit [] 02:49:37 -!- Blazinghand has joined ##crawl-dev 02:55:15 -!- AreBrandon has joined ##crawl-dev 02:55:45 -!- scummos__ has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 02:55:57 -!- JStrange has joined ##crawl-dev 02:57:29 -!- PleasingFungus has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.92 [Firefox 46.0.1/20160502172042]] 02:58:53 -!- lordfrikk has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 03:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:03:28 -!- Laptop_ has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 03:04:19 -!- rchandra has left ##crawl-dev 03:09:35 -!- GauHelldragon has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 03:10:14 Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.19-a0-529-g411dd88 (34) 03:10:32 -!- hellmonk has quit [Quit: Page closed] 03:12:49 -!- amalloy_ is now known as amalloy 03:17:33 -!- flappity has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:20:33 -!- Nattefrost has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 03:20:53 DCSS would be amazing in vr! I just bought Vanishing Realms last night and tried it. Fighting skeletons larger than myself sure was thrilling :D Dodging wasn't as easy as I thought it would be... 03:20:54 Mattias: You have 2 messages. Use !messages to read them. 03:22:09 -!- rossi_ has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 03:23:34 Unstable branch on crawl.beRotato.org updated to: 0.19-a0-529-g411dd88 (34) 03:26:12 -!- AreBrandon has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 03:26:45 -!- vale_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:28:40 -!- Lasty_ has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 03:29:47 -!- removeelyvilon has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 03:30:39 -!- DaneiTHREE has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:34:06 -!- Zxpr1jk has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:35:35 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: I'M OUT SON. PEACE, LOVE, EXPLOSIONS.] 03:35:44 -!- nikheizen has quit [Quit: leaving] 03:45:49 -!- removeelyvilon_ has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 04:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:13:47 -!- JStrange_ has joined ##crawl-dev 04:16:41 -!- Bcadren has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:16:53 -!- JStrange has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 04:20:22 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 04:21:32 -!- removeelyvilon_ has joined ##crawl-dev 04:22:21 Gentlemen. If you are concerned with people getting too much mp, you could reduce the maximum +mp propr... proper... attribute to +x from +9 04:24:05 and perhaps introduce a hard cap for max mp? 04:27:38 so this decj I'm playing is only at spider and already has as much mp as hp 04:29:47 -!- Patashu_ has joined ##crawl-dev 04:31:15 heck, you could even cut down on the staves of energy/magical power/magical power rings. there cboe for channeling (which has some risk involved) 04:31:31 and pure stat sticks are kinda boring compared to enhancer 04:31:43 is* 04:33:49 and makes Sif a little more attractive, perhaps 04:34:23 and less mp will increase player deaths 04:34:25 everybody wins 04:35:34 -!- Torro has quit [Quit: Page closed] 04:37:55 -!- yesno has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 04:41:38 -!- NeremWorld has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 04:42:53 -!- travis-ci has joined ##crawl-dev 04:42:53 The build was broken. (master - d42735b #5801 : Nicholas Feinberg): https://travis-ci.org/crawl/crawl/builds/135786822 04:42:53 -!- travis-ci has left ##crawl-dev 04:59:02 -!- JStrange has joined ##crawl-dev 05:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:00:04 -!- Jafet has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.5] 05:02:37 -!- JStrange_ has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 05:07:25 -!- ProzacElf has joined ##crawl-dev 05:17:27 -!- olscumpy has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 05:19:51 -!- tv1990 has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 05:22:46 -!- rossi_ has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 05:29:02 -!- amalloy is now known as amalloy_ 05:31:03 -!- removeelyvilon_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 05:32:55 -!- removeelyvilon has quit [Quit: Page closed] 05:52:40 -!- NeremWorld has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 06:00:07 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:06:04 -!- edsrzf has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 06:06:30 -!- Sorbius has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 06:07:42 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:11:51 -!- JStrange_ has joined ##crawl-dev 06:14:40 -!- JStrange has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:24:42 -!- finrod has quit [Quit: leaving] 06:31:00 -!- rockit has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 06:31:42 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 06:42:41 -!- ProzacElf has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 06:56:32 -!- removeelyvilon_ has joined ##crawl-dev 06:57:08 Is spider form bloodless (?) blood armour doesn't works on it 07:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:02:12 -!- removeelyvilon_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 07:02:32 -!- removeelyvilon has quit [Quit: Page closed] 07:09:28 -!- JStrange has joined ##crawl-dev 07:13:14 -!- JStrange_ has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 07:18:41 -!- wheals has joined ##crawl-dev 07:20:54 -!- Insomniak` has quit [Quit: I like to rock] 07:22:20 -!- rossi_ has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 07:22:45 -!- Wahaha has quit [Quit: Leaving] 07:31:58 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 07:37:03 -!- jafet has joined ##crawl-dev 07:43:36 -!- elliptic has quit [Quit: Leaving] 07:45:35 -!- JStrange_ has joined ##crawl-dev 07:46:22 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 07:48:20 -!- JStrange has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 07:55:29 -!- Shard1697 has joined ##crawl-dev 08:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:02:31 -!- Lasty has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 08:07:10 -!- Doll has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 08:07:21 -!- FatShack has joined ##crawl-dev 08:13:45 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 08:19:41 -!- Harudoku_ is now known as Harudoku 08:34:39 -!- ldf_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 08:38:53 -!- wheals has quit [Quit: Leaving] 08:39:24 -!- rockit_ has quit [Quit: Leaving] 08:39:45 -!- rossi_ has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.5] 08:44:15 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 08:44:20 -!- Patashu_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:48:29 -!- yesno has quit [Client Quit] 08:52:34 -!- Harudoku has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 08:55:09 -!- Dracunos7 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:58:43 -!- Harudoku_ is now known as Harudoku 08:58:58 -!- Dracunos has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 09:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:00:27 -!- removeelyvilon has quit [Quit: Page closed] 09:01:17 -!- Grivan has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 09:05:13 -!- Dracunos7 is now known as Dracunos-m 09:08:33 -!- Harudoku has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:30:40 -!- Nattefrost1 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:31:49 -!- Demise_ has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 09:37:08 -!- Shard1697 has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 09:39:52 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 09:40:05 -!- tealeaves has quit [Quit: Bye] 09:44:30 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:47:08 -!- Tux[Qyou] has joined ##crawl-dev 09:47:19 -!- Daekdroom has quit [Quit: Leaving] 09:48:10 -!- Lasty_ has joined ##crawl-dev 09:50:37 -!- wheals has joined ##crawl-dev 10:00:01 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:02:05 Misleading fulminant prism message when invisible 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=10482 by Jafet 10:04:23 -!- Telnaior has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 10:04:25 -!- Telnaior_ is now known as Telnaior 10:07:26 -!- tealeaves has quit [Quit: Bye] 10:07:26 -!- debo has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 10:08:50 <|amethyst> hm 10:13:46 <|amethyst> !tell PleasingFungus In "Count projectiles as launched correctly"... what was the code path that calls using_weapon() before launch_type is initialized? Something in init_attack I guess? 10:13:47 |amethyst: OK, I'll let pleasingfungus know. 10:26:47 <|amethyst> !tell ontoclasm not sure if this is new, but apparently allies don't show the confusion marker in webtiles: https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=20144 10:26:47 |amethyst: OK, I'll let ontoclasm know. 10:29:01 -!- SurpriseTRex has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:29:40 -!- removeelyvilon has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 10:32:32 -!- elliptic has quit [Quit: Leaving] 10:33:33 -!- zero_one has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:33:51 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 10:34:06 -!- Dracunos-m has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 10:38:31 -!- nezrel has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:39:54 -!- jeefus has joined ##crawl-dev 10:39:56 -!- destrovel has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 10:43:20 -!- jefus- has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:46:59 <|amethyst> Perhaps Arachne shouldn't spawn on Spider:3 10:47:02 <|amethyst> https://www.reddit.com/r/dcss/comments/4mxj9y/yavp_first_victory_5_rune_with_dd_of_pakellas/ 10:47:51 <|amethyst> Led to this person thinking their game didn't spawn a gossamer rune, because they killed "the boss" (and never actually entered Spider:4) 10:48:25 <|amethyst> !log doublebanjo won 10:48:25 1. doublebanjo, XL27 DDFi, T:67574: http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/doublebanjo/morgue-doublebanjo-20160607-051956.txt 10:51:04 <|amethyst> presumably the same would go for Ilsuiw and Vashnia? Lerny appears to already be restricted to rune vaults 10:51:06 |amethyst: I mean, Ilsuiw has generated on shoals:3 for ages 10:51:12 without any problems as far as I know 10:51:16 <|amethyst> !lg banjo 1 10:51:17 1/15. banjo the Skirmisher (L2 DsCK of Xom), blasted by a rat (exploding inner flame) (hexed by Xom) on D:2 on 2013-05-01 13:45:44, with 61 points after 584 turns and 0:03:05. 10:51:24 <|amethyst> hm, perr 10:51:24 I'm hesitant to change things on the basis of one person 10:51:29 <|amethyst> !lg doublebanjo 1 10:51:30 1/247. doublebanjo the Insei (L1 DgTm), slain by a jackal on D:1 on 2015-08-10 00:37:22, with 2 points after 109 turns and 0:01:46. 10:52:31 <|amethyst> hm 10:52:35 should be ok now that all branches announce which rune is inside 10:52:46 <|amethyst> !lg doublebanjo x=vlong 10:52:46 247. [vlong=0.19-a0-518-g626ee58] doublebanjo the Grand Gadgeteer (L27 DDFi of Pakellas), escaped with the Orb and 4 runes on 2016-06-07 05:19:56, with 2554375 points after 67574 turns and 8:53:16. 10:53:34 <|amethyst> maybe instead of "Done exploring", something like "Nowhere to go but down" if there are untaken downstairs (or maybe if all three are untaken?) 10:53:53 if this were a common occurence then sure, but it really seems sort of hard for people to (a) mistake a unique band for a rune vault (and keep on doing so after finding actual rune vaults in other branches/games) and then (b) not notice three downstairs 10:54:40 |amethyst: that sounds more awkward to me (and also has the unwanted implication that players can't go upstairs and head somewhere else in the dungeon first) 10:54:46 <|amethyst> hm 10:55:38 if "Done exploring." was a problem, we would have players be confused by it much earlier than Spider:3 10:55:39 -!- scummos__ has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 10:55:53 (maybe we do - I don't know - but this one report doesn't give much evidence for that) 11:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:08:43 <|amethyst> Mutation FR: beefy arm, "Your arms fuse together into one big beefy arm": like sac hand, but you do double (or 1.5 or whatever works for balance) melee damage 11:09:59 -!- tealeaves has quit [Quit: Bye] 11:10:24 -!- tealeaves has quit [Client Quit] 11:13:29 originally } did show the level the rune was on, that could be brought back 11:13:52 <|amethyst> probably someone who doesn't know about ctrl-o doesn't know about } either 11:14:18 <|amethyst> I think elliptic's right, that there's not much we can do to help a player who doesn't notice three downstairs 11:16:10 <|amethyst> !tv doublebanjo uniq=vashnia 11:16:11 Unknown field: uniq 11:16:29 <|amethyst> !lm doublebanjo uniq=vashnia -tv:<0:>2:x4 11:16:31 1. doublebanjo, XL18 HOFi, T:39066 (milestone) requested for FooTV: telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org. 11:17:31 clearly the solution is to allow lerny to generate outside the rune vault :P 11:17:58 not sure whether that'd cause more or fewer deaths 11:19:47 %git 65b0b99d 11:19:47 07|amethyst02 * 0.16-a0-1288-g65b0b99: Darken squares in targetter even without use_animations (minmay) 10(1 year, 8 months ago, 2 files, 3+ 5-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/65b0b99dfc72 11:20:11 |amethyst: is there no way to disable the darken_beyond_range behavior after that commit ^ ? 11:20:34 -!- nikheizen has joined ##crawl-dev 11:20:36 <|amethyst> elliptic: there is not, but it would be nice 11:21:04 <|amethyst> elliptic: could revert and split UA_RANGE in two 11:21:15 <|amethyst> though since there's no delay it's not really an animation 11:21:21 <|amethyst> so maybe should be a separate option 11:21:25 it looks like the darken_beyond_range option was combined with some sort of animation, and then people wanted to turn off the animation but leave the darken behavior (which is reasonable) 11:21:39 |amethyst: yeah, could bring back the old darken_beyond_range option 11:22:31 I don't actually know whether anyone other than qw would turn it off though? 11:22:43 <|amethyst> people on slow ssh connections 11:22:52 <|amethyst> since changing the colour is a repaint 11:23:24 -!- PoisonMushroom has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 11:24:27 -!- PleasingFungus has joined ##crawl-dev 11:24:43 |amethyst: don't know, honestly. i just saw it being triggered through dprfs i'd put in the using_weapon() function 11:24:44 PleasingFungus: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 11:24:56 <|amethyst> elliptic: looks like darken_beyond_range had the same problem 11:25:24 |amethyst: which problem? 11:26:22 <|amethyst> elliptic: in that it caused 1. the targetter to darken out-of-range squares, and 2. casting a spell or evoking a rod with nothing in range to flash the screen dark for 50 ms 11:26:47 |amethyst: pretty sure the flash didn't exist when darken_beyond_range was first added? 11:27:02 I meant bringing it back without the flash 11:27:32 <|amethyst> elliptic: it did exist 11:27:39 <|amethyst> but yeah 11:27:41 <|amethyst> %git 2c9b3ce286 11:27:41 07by02 * 0.6.0-a1-773-g2c9b3ce: Simplify out-of-range darkening. 10(7 years ago, 8 files, 26+ 28-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/2c9b3ce286f5 11:27:47 <|amethyst> search for delay(500) 11:28:05 <|amethyst> the rod version didn't exist though 11:28:39 -!- Rust3dCor3 has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:29:49 well, regardless I'll try to bring it back without doing anything other than controlling the darkening 11:30:02 <|amethyst> just in range_view_annotator? 11:30:09 yeah 11:30:28 <|amethyst> sounds good 11:33:03 or could have the option control it in view.cc I guess 11:34:26 <|amethyst> elliptic: that would also disable the other one that is controlled by use_animations 11:34:32 <|amethyst> which might not be unreasonable 11:34:53 <|amethyst> oh huh 11:35:37 |amethyst: it would? they don't look logically connected to me 11:35:49 <|amethyst> it would happen either way actually 11:35:59 <|amethyst> they work by creating a range_view_annotator then calling delay 11:36:49 <|amethyst> !source spl-cast.cc:785-790 11:36:49 https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/spl-cast.cc#l785 11:37:13 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.19-a0-530-g13207c4: Remove the shadow form / good god worship ban 10(5 minutes ago, 1 file, 0+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/13207c47f74d 11:37:13 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.19-a0-531-g78927d6: Tweak a fulminant prism message (10482) 10(64 seconds ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/78927d68673d 11:37:42 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: caster->observable() maybe? 11:38:03 ah, nice 11:38:47 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.19-a0-532-g15b4f41: Simplify (|amethyst) 10(13 seconds ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/15b4f4167f9b 11:39:07 <|amethyst> re shadow form, maybe it would help if there weren't an evil monster named "shadow"? 11:39:22 |amethyst: I see 11:39:25 <|amethyst> which I'm guessing at least factored into the thinking there 11:39:53 the funny thing is that ban came from grunt, who i believe was also the one who clarified that shadow form & the shadow monster have nothing to do with each-other 11:41:23 <|amethyst> elliptic: I guess I see two possibilities: 1. require both use_animations += range and darken_beyond_range for those two things 11:41:41 -!- JStrange_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:42:16 <|amethyst> elliptic: or 2. make those two things ignore darken_beyond_range (which means not implementing it in view.cc or in range_view_annotator, at least not entirely) 11:43:22 <|amethyst> elliptic: 1. is a little weird because then += range is useless with the other option set to false; but then again they're both true by default 11:43:43 probably 1 is fine if the intended usage for turning darken_beyond_range off is to have fewer repaints? 11:44:01 it wouldn't be useless, right? there would still be a delay? 11:44:06 <|amethyst> hm 11:44:21 <|amethyst> there would be 11:44:32 <|amethyst> which might be an argument against 1 11:44:52 <|amethyst> since the delay without changing anything about the display is worse than pointless 11:44:54 -!- jafet has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.5] 11:45:19 <|amethyst> does qw turn off animations? 11:45:34 did you know that qaz's upheaval can blow upo walls? 11:45:47 |amethyst: use_animations = 11:47:22 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: you can also kill things on the other sides of walls 11:47:26 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: e.g. in linesprint 11:47:33 huh 11:47:35 crazy 11:48:01 |amethyst: that sounds like a bug 11:48:46 it should at least use the same logic as LRD to see whether it affects things you can't see 11:48:50 <|amethyst> yeah, particularly since you have to target the wall with ! 11:49:00 but probably it just sholudn't be possible to target walls, I had no idea you could 11:49:16 (or destroy walls) 11:50:44 hey, i made it impossible to target walls yesterday :P 11:50:50 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:51:31 <|amethyst> wheals: you could still use ! with that bug 11:51:54 oh yeah 11:51:55 <|amethyst> wheals: you just made it hard to target walls :) 11:51:57 my mortal enemy 11:52:46 |amethyst: I guess removing the delay if darken_beyond_range is false is easy enough 11:52:50 just a few extra checks 11:53:18 <|amethyst> elliptic: hm, yeah 11:53:32 (like, add a darken_beyond_range check to the UA_RANGE check) 11:53:34 <|amethyst> re upheaval, I think if you make it unable to target walls that fixes the hitting things on the other side problem 11:54:09 <|amethyst> the explosions don't cross walls, it's just that when the centre is on a wall they don't have to 11:57:38 -!- jafet has joined ##crawl-dev 11:57:51 <|amethyst> not sure what it should be using instead of beam.target() though 11:58:10 <|amethyst> I guess it should actually fire the beam then use its pos() 11:58:12 <|amethyst> ? 11:58:30 -!- LexAckson has joined ##crawl-dev 12:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:02:14 -!- oxeimon has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 12:08:47 -!- Ququman has joined ##crawl-dev 12:09:17 isn't it smite-targetted? 12:09:27 -!- scummos__ has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 12:09:46 it is 12:10:12 Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.19-a0-532-g15b4f41 (34) 12:14:58 -!- namelastname112 has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 12:15:57 -!- Cerpin_ has joined ##crawl-dev 12:16:10 hrm, that fulminant prism bug would've been a good easy implementable 12:16:12 ah well 12:16:44 -!- Telnaior has quit [Quit: Quit: Quit: Quit:] 12:17:37 -!- Kellhus has quit [Quit: Page closed] 12:20:31 <|amethyst> wheals: oh, hm 12:21:42 03elliptic02 07* 0.19-a0-533-g957b73b: Bring back the darken_beyond_range option. 10(3 minutes ago, 6 files, 12+ 4-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/957b73b33746 12:26:56 -!- travis-ci has joined ##crawl-dev 12:26:56 The build has errored. (master - 15b4f41 #5803 : Nicholas Feinberg): https://travis-ci.org/crawl/crawl/builds/135905624 12:26:56 -!- travis-ci has left ##crawl-dev 12:27:37 -!- Crauler has quit [Quit: Page closed] 12:27:54 -!- eliot is now known as eliotn 12:31:06 -!- Zekka has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 12:31:21 -!- Cerpin_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:37:04 -!- Xenobreeder has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 12:39:49 seems like wall_ok defaults to false 12:40:06 hm 12:40:10 i can't target walls with upheaval 12:40:24 are you sure about the linesprint thing? maybe this was true in older versions? 12:41:04 hrm, but it looks like it would've been false in the first version of the code, too 12:41:20 PleasingFungus: supposedly you have to target with ! 12:41:27 (I haven't tried it myself) 12:41:38 ...ah, yeah, that works 12:41:42 i always forget about special target commands 12:41:43 hrm 12:45:31 easy to fix, just thinking about messaging 12:46:03 -!- Twiggytwiggytwig has quit [Quit: See ya guys later ;)] 12:48:20 -!- halv has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 12:48:27 -!- jafet has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 12:49:33 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.19-a0-533-g957b73b (34) 12:50:03 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:51:24 -!- Cerpin_ has joined ##crawl-dev 12:52:04 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 12:52:49 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.19-a0-534-g5adfe90: Ban Upheaval on solid objects (|amethyst) 10(79 seconds ago, 1 file, 8+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/5adfe90e791d 12:53:09 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 13:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:02:57 -!- halv|2 has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:03:17 -!- regret-index has joined ##crawl-dev 13:03:57 -!- oxeimon has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 13:04:15 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.19-a0-534-g5adfe90 (34) 13:05:52 -!- Zekka has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 13:06:00 -!- halv has quit [Client Quit] 13:06:42 -!- zxc has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:08:48 -!- HellTiger has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:09:14 what's the stance on color support for console players? can we expect all players to be able to render colored text? 13:09:48 i believe 16 colour support is an expected minimum 13:10:05 Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.19-a0-534-g5adfe90 (34) 13:10:34 03chequers02 07[gauntlet] * 0.18-a0-1459-ge2aa5ed: Improve -Tele status. 10(11 hours ago, 7 files, 25+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/e2aa5ede13d8 13:10:34 03chequers02 07[gauntlet] * 0.18-a0-1460-g326130d: Allow distortion attacks to blink under -Tele. 10(11 hours ago, 2 files, 2+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/326130d348a4 13:10:34 03chequers02 07[gauntlet] * 0.18-a0-1461-g0a224ef: Prevent monsters teleporting in NO_TELE levels. 10(11 hours ago, 1 file, 3+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/0a224ef4dc73 13:10:34 03regret-index02 07[gauntlet] * 0.18-a0-1463-g92c2340: Merge pull request #292 from alexjurkiewicz/gauntlet 10(4 seconds ago, 0 files, 0+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/92c2340ca01a 13:17:29 -!- amalloy_ is now known as amalloy 13:18:28 -!- jeefus is now known as jefus 13:28:01 -!- GauHelldragon has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:33:34 -!- fazisi has quit [Quit: Your lil lungs is too small to hotbox with god.] 13:34:54 -!- Zxpr1jk has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 13:35:09 -!- Cerpin_ has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 13:35:15 -!- scummos__ has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 13:36:57 -!- Cerpin_ has joined ##crawl-dev 13:37:24 opinions on drawing menus in the viewport instead of blanking out the screen? 13:39:29 sounds not good to me, would force most menus to have to scroll a ton more than currently? 13:39:38 yeah i thought the same 13:39:56 it would probably make sense on local tiles though 13:41:38 -!- eliotn has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 13:45:11 -!- Cerpin_ has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 13:47:14 @??gelid blood saint 13:47:14 gelid blood saint (126) | Spd: 10 | HD: 15 | HP: 68-95 | AC/EV: 18/12 | Dam: 15 | natural, 05demonic, 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, priest, evil, unholy | Res: 06magic(60), 02cold++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++, 11silver | XP: 1385 | Sp: legendary destruction (3d34 / 3d25 / 3d20 / 3d22 / 3d27 / 9d15) [11!AM] | Sz: Medium | Int: human. 13:47:37 -!- eliot is now known as eliotn 13:48:25 @??gelid blood saint spells:fireball.16.wizard;iceblast.12.wizard;ghostly_fireball.10.wizard;orb_of_electrocution.10.wizard 13:48:25 Unknown spell name: 'orb of electrocution' in 'fireball.16.wizard;iceblast.12.wizard;ghostly_fireball.10.wizard;orb_of_electrocution.10.wizard' 13:48:32 @??gelid blood saint spells:fireball.16.wizard;iceblast.12.wizard;ghostly_fireball.10.wizard;orb_of_electricity.10.wizard 13:48:32 gelid blood saint (126) | Spd: 10 | HD: 15 | HP: 72-101 | AC/EV: 18/12 | Dam: 15 | natural, 05demonic, 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, unholy, spellcaster | Res: 06magic(60), 02cold++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++, 11silver | XP: 1318 | Sp: fireball (3d25), iceblast (3d21), ghostly fireball (3d20) (3d25), o.electricity (3d27) | Sz: Medium | Int: human. 13:48:48 -!- Nattefrost1 has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 13:52:25 !source mons_spell_beam 13:52:25 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/mon-cast.cc#l435 13:53:15 major destruction, random bolt, and legendary destruction here should have their own static spell_type lists instead of being defined in the function, right 13:54:38 some kind of map might be nice 13:54:50 also serpent of hell breath is a mess 13:55:02 i suspect it should be four spells 13:59:42 -!- tealeaves has quit [Quit: Bye] 13:59:49 ...huh, random bolt doesn't have bolt of cold 14:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:00:08 -!- Dracunos has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 14:00:52 -!- edsrzf has joined ##crawl-dev 14:01:00 -!- travis-ci has joined ##crawl-dev 14:01:01 The build was broken. (master - 957b73b #5805 : elliptic): https://travis-ci.org/crawl/crawl/builds/135916913 14:01:02 -!- travis-ci has left ##crawl-dev 14:01:43 (possibly has to do with it temporarily having crystal bolt) 14:02:24 -!- destrovel has quit [Client Quit] 14:07:38 -!- mopl has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 14:07:55 -!- destrovel has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:11:15 maybe 14:11:57 ...pff, http://dpaste.com/3TXM19C gets dual cast messages >_> 14:12:55 oh, and it crashes when the first explosion kills it 14:21:08 -!- Alazlam has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 14:23:55 -!- tcsc has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:24:03 -!- ProzacElf has joined ##crawl-dev 14:25:17 i feel like the the fact that it kills itself with the first explosion and so doesn't get a chance to kill itself (and presumably also its allies?) with the second explosion is an indicator that this still isn't a great spell concept for a monster that comes in packs 14:26:26 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 14:26:33 it doesn't actually kill itself with the first explosion very often (three out of five demonspawn races will resist one of the spells pretty well, rolls) 14:26:35 orb of elec particularly being a problem there, although i'm not a huge fan of the multicasting serpent of hell thing generally i guess 14:26:52 I was just testing to see how it'd be handled >_> 14:31:31 "conjurer even stronger than the annihilators, for extended" through "take out the potentially easily dodging crystal spears, and instead blowing everything up" isn't the best arrangements, I will have to admit 14:33:06 crystal spear accuracy is not particularly bad 14:33:15 or do you mean dodging by staying out of range, because yes that is easy 14:34:37 though deep elf sorcerers / high priests / elementalists / margery hypothetically come in decent numbers with explosions they don't resist (well, for margery it's a 4/10 chance to spawn not resisting) and they seem fine? 14:35:33 i was thinking of orb of elec as the main problem since that seems so much more likely to catch allies 14:36:01 fair 14:36:19 the others hopefully wouldn't be so bad, yeah 14:36:42 blood saints, really into fireball variations 14:37:21 -!- Nattefrost has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:37:36 mmm reminds me that ghostly fireball still needs a rename! 14:37:49 spooky blast 14:38:47 Ectoplasmic ephemeral emanation 14:39:34 ghostlight burst 14:39:50 orb of ectoplasm, commonly orb of ick 14:40:29 my suggestion https://youtu.be/ess9bRJ0bPw?t=10s 14:41:10 throw hitodama 14:41:52 -!- travis-ci has joined ##crawl-dev 14:41:53 The build passed. (master - 5adfe90 #5806 : Nicholas Feinberg): https://travis-ci.org/crawl/crawl/builds/135924973 14:41:54 -!- travis-ci has left ##crawl-dev 14:42:31 minmay's suggestion: flawless 14:43:20 regret-index: hurl hitodama, surely 14:43:24 hm. i'm gonna get a reputation as The Hurler at this rate. 14:44:06 !source _god_wrath_name 14:44:06 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/godwrath.cc#l101 14:44:09 good comment here 14:45:53 function of make it a pain in the ass to check for wrath ikills 14:48:40 haha 14:48:47 i think i wrote that 14:48:51 legacy behaviour 14:49:24 hmm vehumet and makhleb wrath seem to crash when drawing the wrath card maybe 14:49:43 someone should fix that 14:49:43 not sure what the actual issue here but i can definitely believe that they would cause crashes somehow 14:49:49 gotta be the avatar 14:49:54 that's the thing those two have in common 14:49:59 ERROR in 'dbg-scan.cc' at line 554: mid cache bogosity: mid 93 points to DEAD MONSTER mindex=0 mid=0 14:50:10 seems feasible! 14:51:45 oh or they just crash always, not a wrath card thing 14:52:10 &W under makhleb crashes also 14:52:24 |amethyst: do you have a suggestion as to how best to do something like dungeon_terrain_changed() but setting a specific trap type? This is to a be a known plate trap, so the display needs updating, unlike with the old minefield card 14:55:04 |amethyst: I guess the real issue is that plate trap is a type of mechanical trap, unlike other trap types which have their own feature type, I think 14:57:12 -!- Zxpr2jk has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:57:28 !lm * crash noun~~mid_cache 14:57:29 250. [2016-05-30 19:18:56] runewalsh the Octopoid Barricade (L27 OpIE of Ashenzari) ERROR in 'dbg-scan.cc' at line 554: mid cache bogosity: mid 14462 points to worldbinder mindex=17 mid=14511 (Abyss:1) 14:57:40 !lm * crash noun~~mid_cache -lg 14:57:41 Unknown option: lg 14:57:44 !lm * crash noun~~mid_cache -game 14:57:45 runewalsh:cue:20160429120144S. runewalsh the Champion of Chaos (L27 OpIE of Makhleb), escaped with the Orb and 15 runes on 2016-05-31 04:06:15, with 12159805 points after 140683 turns and 17:53:33. 14:57:49 !lm * crash noun~~mid_cache -game -log 14:57:50 250. runewalsh, XL27 OpIE, T:102935 (milestone): http://underhound.eu:81/crawl/morgue/runewalsh/crash-runewalsh-20160530-191856.txt 14:58:09 !lm * crash noun~~mid_cache -2 -game 14:58:10 runewalsh:cue:20160429120144S. runewalsh the Champion of Chaos (L27 OpIE of Makhleb), escaped with the Orb and 15 runes on 2016-05-31 04:06:15, with 12159805 points after 140683 turns and 17:53:33. 14:59:18 -!- halv has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 14:59:40 -!- simmarine has joined ##crawl-dev 15:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:00:37 -!- green_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 15:03:56 Crash when triggering Vehumet or Makhleb conjuration wrath 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=10483 by MarvinPA 15:03:56 hmm i guess if you convert from nemelex->tso (or any good god) you can get angels from the wrath card 15:04:08 and then get penance for killing them 15:04:22 or probably excommunicated 15:05:13 -!- rchandra has joined ##crawl-dev 15:05:42 inconsistency: iron dragons are edible, iron trolls are not 15:05:45 I wonder what's worse, wrath card caling upon every single last god or changing it to only look for specific gods 15:05:53 the latter 15:05:55 oh or nevermind, that's actually handled 15:06:10 under the regular good god wrath checks 15:06:39 important to have multiple sources of curses from cards 15:06:59 not for long! 15:07:18 were shadow fiends renamed simply to make them harder to search for, or was there a compelling need to shoehorn in some random aztec flavor too? 15:07:49 if you want to search for shadow fiends, just use 1 15:08:02 =p 15:08:10 ProzacElf: your question seems a little bit leading 15:08:25 (also remembring just "tz" is enough to only find them) 15:08:26 we're not in court are we? 15:08:39 aren't we? 15:08:56 and yes, i know that the person who made those changes is in here =p 15:09:04 is crawl court in session? 15:09:04 the sign wasn't up 15:09:09 you are being Judged 15:09:16 shit! 15:09:46 MarvinPA: afaik you only get penance for killing friendly holies? 15:10:03 did people previously struggle to look up neqs, ynoxinul, loros, kiku, yred, or hep 15:10:08 nope, you definitely get it for hostile ones 15:10:11 regret-index: yes 15:10:15 for just attacking them, even 15:10:20 actually I am understanding that the aztec flavor was the main point; more generally, expanding the mythic sources a bit from the usual greek foo. there's some other things planned along those lines as well 15:10:21 hrm 15:10:24 that doesn't seem right 15:10:45 i can't reproduce that 15:10:47 I am working on pushing non-standard greek foo right now, actually >_> 15:10:52 which is good 15:10:54 or hmm, maybe something is weird since yeah 15:10:54 ProzacElf: shadow fiends are even easier to search for now than they used to be. ?/m tz 15:11:00 because it would be insane if you got penance for attacking hostile angels 15:11:04 holy pan for good god worshippers is real now isn't it, i think i did that even 15:11:06 yes 15:11:11 years ago 15:11:12 taking the name from aztec mythology seems to me more disrespectful than anything else, tbh 15:11:13 this must be somehow wrath-specific 15:11:40 is it more disrespectful than taking things from other mythologies? 15:11:42 i guess if there were more examples it'd seem less shoehorned 15:11:52 sure, you have to start somewhere 15:11:54 -!- yogidabear has quit [Quit: Page closed] 15:12:01 shoehorned hamhanded tedious 15:12:37 stupid remove? 15:12:55 speaking of, that guy apparently hangs out in #dwarffortress too 15:12:59 ? 15:13:07 who? 15:13:19 oh I think I see a way to do this 15:13:24 onget 15:13:31 -!- Cerpin_ has joined ##crawl-dev 15:13:33 PleasingFungus: using a religious figure as an evil demon is something that crawl has not done for any other mythology 15:13:36 that was the guy who always complained about stupid remove, wasn't it? 15:13:43 -!- ada482 has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 15:13:53 mara? 15:14:39 ProzacElf: no idea who you're talking about, sorry 15:14:52 I always assumed mara was a naming coincidence 15:14:56 since, y'know, mara in crawl is male 15:15:09 mara's dialogue takes directly from the religious figure 15:15:14 ProzacElf: onget was the one, yeah 15:15:16 draws directly* 15:15:34 ProzacElf: South Korean player 15:15:36 oh, the other religious figure 15:15:41 i like the descs for buggy/very buggy cards 15:15:46 looking around, there seem to be 15:15:51 at least three different religions featuring a 'mara' 15:15:57 heh, yeah 15:15:59 which i didn't realize 15:16:04 yes, I suppose I should be complaining about mara too in that case 15:16:06 also a supermarket chain 15:16:16 honestly, there are certain ingrained greater issues with bogstandard fantasy trappings as a whole (magic as systemized exoticized pagan / foreign religions, how nobody blinks at the european stuff) 15:16:24 we would never disparage quality produce 15:16:29 but at least mara in buddhism is ACTUALLY AN EVIL DEMON 15:16:33 i mean, assuming someone using the nick onget on irc is the same one from tavern 15:16:40 not the case for tzitzimitl 15:16:41 pleasingfungus: "tara" is worse :P 15:16:44 I like apples a lot, for instance 15:17:12 minmay: but in crawl, the player is evil so eir perspective is warped 15:17:16 apples are just ok. mid-tier 15:17:23 that's wrong 15:17:27 you're wroung about apples 15:17:29 *wrong 15:17:33 sorry. these are the facts 15:18:00 I have no problem with using zin/tso as mouthpieces to make fun of abrahamic religions in crawl, but doing it to a religion that western civilization essentially genocided out of existence seems awfully crass 15:18:07 tzitzimitl were multifasceted, because it was readily a title and also no mythology is clean-cut 15:18:38 it seems nobody on the devteam considers this a problem so I'll drop it 15:19:26 should we cut tiamat for being a demonizing of nammu by the babylonians 15:19:27 i don't think tzi are trying to make fun of anything 15:19:36 and while you're at it, better go after Christianity for equating *all* of them 15:19:39 It seems a non-issue to me 15:20:02 idk, i get where m is coming from 15:20:20 also have to cut dispater and ereshkigal for being non-malevolent underworld gods we just threw in with hades 15:20:22 better to be careful with religion than not 15:20:36 Well we kind of sailed that ship 15:20:39 haha 15:20:42 oh, I see it, but there was a barb in that last tail-slap: it's ultimately cultural 15:20:44 since crawl has a lot of heretical religious junk in it 15:20:45 no, religion is the same as weearing a green hat 15:21:05 pretty sure tiamat was just taken from D&D 15:21:17 and whoever added her had no idea who nammu is 15:21:29 Well that would make no difference 15:21:38 if it's 'problematic' it's 'problematic' 15:21:54 well, is this basketball or a court of law? 15:21:59 the law rarely cares about intent 15:22:06 * gammafunk shoots. He scores! 15:22:08 but if we're deciding what kind of foul to issue then it matters 15:22:51 minmay: if you're arguing that the intent of the person who added a monster matters, then surely tzi are home free 15:23:43 Let's all just play Megaman 2 and forget about crawl anyways 15:23:53 wood man is racist! 15:24:06 the leaf is a cultural icon! 15:24:06 you mean oilman, right 15:24:10 and he uses it as a shield! 15:24:14 zippo man? 15:24:19 no that's heat man 15:24:31 was it supposed to be crash man or clash man 15:24:31 so many men... 15:24:42 oil man had to be recoloured in translation 15:24:44 guts man? 15:24:56 I think 9 had a woman for once? 15:24:57 maybe? 15:25:13 =O 15:25:16 splash woman? 15:25:26 there's also the whole mega man 6 world tournament stereotypes thing 15:25:49 splash woman made things worse, since before that obviously robots have no gender 15:26:00 Fine! Let's just play Pong then! 15:26:14 white phalluses lobbing shots at each other, preposterous 15:26:16 pretty sure the "Man" in "Wood Man" etc. was a translation thing 15:26:24 or they just thought it sounded cool 15:26:31 they're robots, i doubt they have gender identities 15:26:43 explain splash woman then 15:26:52 Oil Man has... dialogue.... 15:26:57 Lightli: look back a minute 15:27:02 there's also, you know, roll, and 15:27:32 let's be glad that crawl gods have no gender 15:27:51 -!- dpeg_ has joined ##crawl-dev 15:28:00 and blame pleasingfungus for adding more gender in hep ancestors, right 15:28:05 I mean, I'm just assuming dr. wily didn't go "I'd better make sure these killer robots identify as a specific gender" when he was building them 15:28:17 of course not, he built them to take over the world 15:28:20 he's a mad scientist 15:28:21 rename tzi to prolematizers 15:28:28 *problematizers 15:28:29 also half the time he didn't even build them himself 15:28:34 problem solved 15:28:35 then again, I suppose if you're building a robot there's not much point in making it a robot you *can't* fuck 15:29:03 -!- Lasty_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:29:06 -!- eliotn has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 15:29:21 look, the easy thing is to cut all religions and mythologies and replace them with new contents. 15:29:24 let's start with 15:29:24 elves 15:29:40 look, they're already robot masters 15:29:40 anyway, my actual biggest complaint about tzitzimitl is that it has too many attack flavours 15:29:40 @??tzitzimitl 15:29:40 Tzitzimitl (061) | Spd: 10 | HD: 22 | HP: 84-124 | AC/EV: 12/16 | Dam: 2709(claw)04(miasmata), 1805(pain), 1413(drain) | 05demonic, 10doors, evil, unholy, see invisible, fly | Res: 13magic(immune), 02cold++, 10elec, 03poison, 04rot, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 3662 | Sp: b.cold (3d32) [06!sil], b.draining (3d29) [06!sil], s.torment [06!sil], dispel undead (3d32) [06!sil.. 15:29:53 @??bennu 15:29:53 bennu (08b) | Spd: 16 | HD: 14 | HP: 61-91 | AC/EV: 6/16 | Dam: 2708(holy), 1813(drain), 18 | evil, see invisible, fly, regen | Res: 06magic(140), 04fire+++, 03poison, 04rot, 13neg+++ | Vul: 12drown, 08holy | XP: 1285 | Sz: Medium | Int: human. 15:30:05 those are bad too 15:30:06 cutting their pain brand is on my todo list 15:30:15 miasmata on its own counts as at least 2 i think so imo i would make the other two plain 15:30:17 somehow, I keep being distracted from my todo list 15:30:24 the drain is pretty pointless as well 15:30:34 miasmata? I know it's supposed to be miasma 15:30:39 -!- halv has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.2.0 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/] 15:30:39 but the name is kind of ridiculous 15:30:42 also, does the miasmata create the clouds too, or do they generate clouds on death? 15:30:56 they generate clouds on-hit 15:31:32 ??tzitzimitl[2] 15:31:32 tzitzimitl[2/3]: tsee-tsee-mee-tlhl 15:31:53 I'm pretty sure whoever wrote that just gave up on the fourth syllable 15:33:11 miasmata is like the ophan thing 15:33:30 except it only happens if you let a tzitzimitl melee you 15:33:41 !vault amalloy_card_club 15:33:42 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/variable/mini_monsters.des#l1985 15:33:49 "Tl is pronounced like t with the tongue held in a postion for l" 15:33:55 and they're speed 10 so I think you theoretically could polearm your way into not dealing with their miasmata? 15:33:57 soon to be a tragic victim of non-nemelex deck removal??? 15:34:10 !learn e tzitzimitl[2 s/$/ (Tl is pronounced like t with the tongue held in a postion for l)/ 15:34:10 tzitzimitl[2/3]: tsee-tsee-mee-tlhl (Tl is pronounced like t with the tongue held in a postion for l) 15:34:14 are there any other games for elves and orcs to play 15:34:26 clearly they could be playing D&D 15:34:29 with a box of beasts 15:34:34 beer pong 15:34:49 since we don't have enough potion of degen vaults already 15:34:52 ??booze 15:34:52 booze ~ ooze[1/1]: It can do FIVE damage with a single blow. Beware the HP cost. 15:34:56 nice 15:34:57 we should just give them a copy of crawl 15:35:03 how is "hl" pronounced 15:35:09 ambrosia could fill in for some of those degen vaults 15:35:12 scheherazade... 15:35:15 the deck is supposed to be a reward, so the vault could just use ambrosia 15:35:16 -!- scummos__ has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 15:35:32 an evokable crawl figurine 15:35:33 although i know the player can't have too many potions that are useful but not *too* useful =p 15:35:33 !learn s tzitzimitl[2 tsee-tsee-mee-tl (pronounced like t with the tongue held in a postion for l) 15:35:34 tzitzimitl[2/3]: tsee-tsee-mee-tl (pronounced like t with the tongue held in a postion for l) 15:35:40 "The orc's DEFE was slain by an adder! The orc drinks a potion of ambrosia." 15:35:57 strip crawl 15:36:04 bits of armour scattered around the vault 15:36:36 stop tempting me to make a vault completely unrelated to these ideas 15:36:37 though i guess you'd really want to include aux armour for that, and that'd probably be too good as loot... 15:36:54 adjust the depth, then 15:38:12 -!- removeelyvilon has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 15:38:53 -!- tealeaves has quit [Quit: Bye] 15:38:53 what is ambrosia made out of anyways 15:39:16 ??ambrosia 15:39:16 potion of ambrosia[1/1]: Gives 3-10 turns of confusion and an HP/MP recovery effect (3-5 of each per turn). The recovery depends on the confusion; clarity no longer blocks either in 0.18. Works for deep dwarves! New in 0.16, replacing !confusion. 15:39:24 it's produced by ghost moths 15:39:47 oh 15:39:58 no it's made from them 15:39:58 not produced by them 15:40:03 it's like an extract or a syrup 15:40:07 you gotta use the eye goo 15:40:13 and not just eat the whole body 15:40:18 http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/dat/descript/items.txt;#l737 15:40:29 well obviously you have to process it afterwards 15:40:44 hm I thought I wrote from and not by way back when I wrote that patch 15:40:45 rip me 15:41:26 hmm i guess ?id to see the top card of a deck could go with them being nemelex only 15:42:33 would fix the iding off the floor thing 15:42:39 since apparently there was some bug involving that? 15:44:00 yeah 15:44:02 oh man no more non-nem decks ruins my vault idea for a Xom/Nem altar pair where the deck is all Xom cards and Xom warns the player that randomness can't really be controlled 15:44:15 (would be too spoilery too) 15:47:18 watching .. for dialogue ideas 15:49:27 ...huh, is irssi eating up .. 15:50:01 apparently? 15:50:17 it showed up as watching .. for dialogue ideas for me 15:53:23 there we go, 青蛇 15:56:33 -!- Cerpin_ has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:56:59 what's the canonical "get the name of this feature" function? 15:57:15 depends what you want to do with it 15:57:24 %git 15:57:24 07PleasingFungus02 * 0.19-a0-534-g5adfe90: Ban Upheaval on solid objects (|amethyst) 10(3 hours ago, 1 file, 8+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/5adfe90e791d 15:57:33 feat_type_name might be what you want 15:58:01 yeah that works 15:58:57 !source die 15:58:58 1/3. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/dbg-asrt.cc#l840 15:59:21 -!- MgDark has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:00:35 ebering: could just remove all cards except xom card 16:00:57 speaking of features, nobody has seen why "staircase leadng out of the dungeon" stopped working in 0.18+, have they? 16:01:16 it did? 16:01:29 as the name of the item to reglyph, yeah 16:01:30 that seems like a pretty big bug 16:01:33 oh 16:01:38 item? 16:01:39 _There is a staircase leading out of the dungeon here. 16:01:40 oh i see 16:02:11 that's part of our gradual deprecation of console and console-only features, probably 16:02:22 reglyphing? what's that? 16:02:40 exit_dungeon maybe? i don't know how feature reglyphing works 16:03:07 maybe that's just for vaults 16:04:06 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:04:07 feature = staircase leading out of the dungeon { α } was what worked in 0.17 and before 16:04:31 -!- VoxSomniator has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:05:21 hmm should dowsing card stick around, it seems like not something that really fits in decks of war 16:05:29 hmm that is a list option actually, could be simplly needing += 16:05:43 it should not 16:05:43 i know r-i likes the effect but it might be one that needs a new home if it's to keep existing 16:06:00 -!- Cerpin_ has joined ##crawl-dev 16:06:21 I can't think of a great reason to keep dowsing other than "high-powered mmap is kind of cool" 16:06:29 -!- olscumpy has joined ##crawl-dev 16:06:39 well it's not even mmap I guess, but didn't it used to map and do the item/monster detect thing? 16:06:43 what is high-powered mmap 16:06:50 telepathy, item/trap detection 16:07:02 oddities instead of war 16:07:02 is high-powered mmap mmap without holes in 16:07:10 MarvinPA, what make line did you use when you found 10483? i can't reproduce it 16:07:10 regret-index: what's oddities 16:07:29 aha, that is it! now I do wonder why that one worked without being fixed but it is good now 16:07:29 !mantis 10483 16:07:29 https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=10483 16:07:29 ...fair enough 16:07:32 "high-powered" refers to the item/monster detection 16:07:46 "high falutin" 16:07:46 -!- KrisztiCat has quit [Quit: Page closed] 16:07:58 I was going to like feast paired with swine and famine paired with necromut >_> 16:08:28 so you transform into an engorged pig? 16:08:30 Naruni: all sources of makhleb/veh wrath were doing it, &W and the wrath card and just triggering it normally from abandonment 16:08:39 yes 16:08:59 that's almost as dumb as tranforming into a gluttonous hydra 16:09:09 *transforming 16:09:17 is oddities going to be removed? 16:09:23 Naruni: might be a debug-mode specific thing? i just mantised it so it's less likely to be forgotten, since i didn't feel like looking into it at the moment 16:09:26 apparently 16:09:26 MarvinPA, i am able to get it to crash, &W hits 16:09:31 rip xom card 16:09:47 rip all cards 16:09:49 MarvinPA, yes that's what i thought, thats why i asked what was the make line you used to build that crawl 16:09:53 wasn't xom card just "a xom effect" 16:09:54 at some time Xom gave dur_telepathy, right? 16:10:01 oh i see, make debug 16:10:14 in which case if you like the xom card, the solution is to worship xom 16:10:14 (-jwhatever) 16:10:16 gotcha i was using make DEBUG=y 16:10:22 thanks 16:10:35 all this design space getting freed up... 16:10:42 i'm gonna add, like, five new gods 16:10:57 xom telepathy looks like it's gone but yeah, that existed i think 16:11:06 sure, add five new bad features 16:11:12 we'll remove them like we removed nem 16:11:24 -!- Lasty_ has joined ##crawl-dev 16:11:34 xom telepathy no longer exists? 16:11:41 or just from the card? 16:11:59 dowsing card removal means these leftover divinations spells can finally go, exciting stuff 16:12:18 wow, could we sometime arrive at the removal of divinations miscasts entirely? 16:12:28 got to remove sif first 16:12:30 sif still- 16:12:33 and ocs 16:12:45 ocs has nothing to do with div miscasts 16:12:49 for years 16:13:06 ??divinations_miscast 16:13:06 divinations miscast ~ divination miscast[1/1]: 1: confuse/nothing 2: (1d3 int loss / 3-12 mp loss) and confuse 3: (5-24 mp loss / 3-5 int loss) and confuse 16:13:19 all features i add, are Good 16:13:21 I like the theme of confuse 16:13:44 1: confuse/nothing/confuse/confuse 2: int loss/confuse/confuse/nothing 3: confuse 16:14:07 if they're only left on sif wrath they could be incorporated into sif wrath instead of miscasts, of course 16:16:27 but that would make it harder to justify removing sif 16:16:30 :) 16:16:53 "if we got rid of sif, we could get rid of divinations! think of the millimarvins!" 16:17:16 Well if we remove all gods, I'm down for removing sif 16:17:23 dg crawl 16:17:24 cboe 16:17:30 -!- Nattefrost has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:17:34 shhh 16:18:07 just have sif wrath do random miscasts instead of div ones 16:18:15 div miscasts staying around is awful 16:18:18 optimal millimarvins would be cutting everything but newts, yaks, orc knights, and orb guardians 16:18:52 xom, jiyva and ash all use detect_items so they're on the list in order to remove divinations too 16:18:59 yeah random school miscasts would be neat 16:19:00 hrm 16:19:03 ??vehumet_wrath 16:19:03 vehumet wrath[1/3]: ABANDONMENT: 25 penance. RETRIBUTION: HD = your XL. Spell level = 1 + random_range(XL/5,XL/3) capped at 9. Spells include fire storm/hellfire at 9, LCS at 8, poison arrow/iron shot at 6. XL27? Expect 3d20 hellfire, 8d20 fire storm and 3d48 LCS. All of which ignore your EV/SH. 16:19:13 ok so he just directly calls spells 16:19:26 fr giant newt chunks restore 10-30 MP 16:19:47 well we'd also need tins of nurse meat 16:19:49 I thought giant newt chunks gave you max MP 16:19:51 and nurse dancing 16:20:01 yeah they raise max Pow iirc? 16:20:06 newt corpses give you 1-3 pow 16:20:06 maybe they also restore Pow 16:20:09 which can raise max pow by 1 16:20:10 for all that crawl is, at least we lack nurses, plain nymphs, and foocubi. 16:20:12 but giant newts are giant 16:20:16 so they should give 10-30 instead of 1-3 16:20:21 (...though we still have sirens) 16:20:41 more focused on the "lure you to your death" part at least 16:20:55 fr: if harpies are nearby, sirens give an air raid warning 16:22:25 what happens to staff of wucad mu 16:22:54 with div miscasts gone 16:22:55 wucad mu having random miscasts sounds more interesting than wucad mu having div miscasts 16:23:21 i guess i wouldn't really evoke something that could just paralyse or mutate me though 16:23:29 so nevermind that thought 16:23:31 could limit severity 16:23:37 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 16:23:54 hi, ontoclasm 16:24:06 hi 16:24:06 ontoclasm: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 16:24:10 !messages 16:24:10 (1/1) |amethyst said (5h 57m 22s ago): not sure if this is new, but apparently allies don't show the confusion marker in webtiles: https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=20144 16:24:24 ...huh 16:25:48 that's sort of not a bug 16:25:51 sort of 16:25:52 if there are no objections left, I'm pushing bee priestesses 16:25:55 i'll leave a comment in the thread 16:27:49 done 16:29:44 PleasingFungus: well, it's a bug insofar as it's highly non-intuitive 16:29:50 which decks still exist now? war, escape, wonders only? 16:30:07 war, escape, destruction 16:30:28 oh I keep thinking destruction was in war. thanks 16:30:40 bee priestesses? 16:30:55 Malicious Mellies 16:31:14 imo they should be harpy priestesses 16:31:33 -!- debo has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:31:40 -!- oxeimon has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:31:54 ha, just realized r-i is pushing these ladies immediately after complaining about me 'adding more gender to crawl' 16:31:56 -!- Dalwyn has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 16:32:14 they're not gendered in the same way that you ungendered queen ants 16:32:34 that i... what 16:32:46 Aren't they gendered in exactly the same way? 16:32:52 .... 16:33:25 for that matter, there are no drone bees or ants 16:33:34 or whatever you call the formic equivalent 16:33:45 i think they're drones? 16:33:54 %git fbd35b67d51823a 16:33:54 07PleasingFungus02 * 0.16-a0-2443-gfbd35b6: De-gender insects 10(1 year, 7 months ago, 1 file, 2+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/fbd35b67d518 16:33:58 "males" I think 16:34:07 oh yeah 16:34:09 i remember that 16:34:18 hah 16:34:23 clearly, will have to be reverted after we add the new fixedart, Ladykiller 16:34:30 apparently drone is also acceptable 16:34:56 if wikipedia is accurate 16:36:07 (randomly gendering essentially all monsters would have been better than referring to everything as "it" but at some point I give up about the game where one may eat lots of raw flesh of sentients) 16:36:24 -!- tealeaves has quit [Quit: Bye] 16:36:41 I agree, randomly gendering everything would be good 16:36:52 you hit the spatial vortex! she is destroyed! 16:36:52 anh 16:37:01 good for romance-language speakers 16:37:02 heh 16:37:15 mamma mia! 16:37:35 as long as we call orcs "it" it makes zin look silly for not letting us eat them 16:37:43 regret-index: when we remove chunks some day, it'll be a lot less uncomfortable to consider :p 16:37:44 er 16:37:46 'You eat the corpse of Jessica. This raw flesh smells bad, but tastes good.' 16:38:11 * ontoclasm creates gender variant tiles for every monster 16:38:25 I'm looking forward to seeing the male/female forms of orbs of fire 16:38:33 pink bowtie 16:38:38 er, hair tie? 16:38:39 ez 16:38:39 thing 16:38:46 bonnet, maybe 16:38:48 barette 16:38:50 essentialism! 16:38:56 pink hair tie for female, pink bowtie for men 16:39:00 er male 16:39:01 ah, that's it, thanks 16:39:22 just put it in the top-right where the little ally hearts used to live. 16:39:35 -!- Cerpin_ has quit [Quit: leaving] 16:39:55 -!- Cerpin_ has joined ##crawl-dev 16:40:13 looking forward to seeing genderbent dowan 16:41:06 https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1000017/crawl/orbs.png 16:41:17 lol 16:41:27 I think that would actually be a cool project, making genderbent tiles for all the gendered uniques 16:41:47 i inhaled 16:41:49 was it a known thing that pakellas's implementation also randomly nerfed nemelex deck power by a ton 16:41:52 duvesso and dowannie 16:42:00 gendorb 16:42:19 marvinpa what 16:42:19 "I do not think this will be particularly noticeable outside of Pakellas usage, however." good commit message 16:42:37 legendary card power is decreased from ~900 to ~600 16:42:59 I do not think this will be particularly noticeable outside of Pakellas usage, however, since we are removing Nemelex Xobeh from the game immediately." 16:43:02 welp 16:43:59 making me increasingly keen on all this evocations/invocations enhancer code going away! 16:44:09 rip nemelex 16:44:54 what's the sum total of nemelex stuff you're doing anyway, marvinpa 16:45:01 also what do people think about making nemelex use invocations instead of evocations, with decks being nem-specific (that was how i ran into this) 16:45:31 I'm fine with it, I guess 16:45:34 a866074 Remove the Dowsing card 16:45:35 e57bfe6 Don't identify the top card of a deck with ?ID 16:45:35 4225554 Don't place decks as vault loot 16:45:35 a999d4c Remove decks of oddities 16:45:35 f520205 Remove some cards from the deck of punishment 16:45:35 517904f Simplify Exile card power calculations 16:45:37 how does deck power work? 16:45:44 confusingly 16:45:49 no I mean, with that change 16:45:57 what cards are left in the deck of punishment? 16:45:58 does it still use evocations skill? 16:46:00 confusingly 16:46:02 oh, the same but with invo instead of evo 16:46:11 then it'd be pretty reasonable 16:46:14 and maybe just based on xl if you abandon, like punishment cards are 16:46:14 -!- crovaxon has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 16:46:25 Naruni: sorry for taking so long to relay your c-r-d posting. It was the only content in a pile of 50 spam mails from South America. 16:46:38 since you lose your bonus then so it's a small number even at xl27 anyway 16:47:04 clearly with decks as only a nemelex gifted thing it's finally time for a god to take away all gifts upon abandonment? 16:47:21 MarvinPA: +1 for Nemelex Evo --> Inv 16:48:08 dpeg_, it's fine, thanks. I talked with someone (don't know if it was you) but it looks like what I proposed is not a logical pursuit 16:49:05 MarvinPA: re nerfing deck power - the evo stepdowns? 16:49:11 yeah 16:49:13 knew it 16:49:23 that commit made me really leery at the time but i didn't say anything 16:49:25 should've! 16:49:32 See Something, Say Something - crawl dev's mantra 16:50:43 -!- Kenran has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:51:39 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 16:52:07 nemelex using inv is a great idea, kiku next 16:52:13 i'm sure that there's not much that can be done about it, but it's kind of annoying to have my ancestor just totally happy to hang out next to slime walls 16:52:41 "see a silent spectre, say something" 16:53:28 i always liked that a perk of nem is not having to spend xp on evo and your god 16:54:16 +1 for invo decks 16:54:23 at least, i thought it was a cool concept; i don't know if it's a good execution 16:54:25 Gives Pakellas a real niche as the evo god 16:54:44 so no evo gods after pakellas gets cut in a month, got it 16:55:31 -!- PleasingFungus has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.92 [Firefox 46.0.1/20160502172042]] 16:55:33 -!- removeelyvilon has quit [Quit: Page closed] 16:56:11 -!- debo has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 16:56:26 !kw ancestor.class verb=ancestor.class 16:56:27 Defined keyword: ancestor.class => verb=ancestor.class 16:56:42 rip pakellas 16:56:57 rchandra: perhaps, but I think that Kikubaaqudgha fares better with Nec than Nemelex Xobeh does with Evo. 16:58:02 at a minimum Kiku shuoldn't ruin the necro title for eir Invocations title :) 16:58:12 rchandra: I was a victim of this. 16:58:26 what is the argument for making nemelex use invo skill instead of evo? 16:58:59 gods should use the god skill when feasible 16:59:08 My tournament OgNe^K painstakingly arrived at Nec 27 first, only to stay at Lord of Darkness. I contemplated changing that to "Ogre Lord of Darkness" (special case for 27). 16:59:34 that decks are a god ability in the current state 16:59:40 and decks now being nem-only, they aren't ... yeah, that 16:59:47 rchandra: had to defect Kiku to become Ogre of Death, as it should be. 17:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:00:13 wheals: sure, but there are plenty of god abilities that don't depend on invocations 17:00:18 is 27 nec for dg "Demigod of Death" 17:00:19 a fince choice. I defect from kiku a lot now actually 17:00:29 no 17:00:31 could make nem abilities just depend on piety if we wanted 17:00:31 *fine 17:00:37 or do we go full-hog with "God of Death" 17:00:37 !lg * dg sk=necro sklev=27 17:00:38 23. minmay the God of Death (L27 DgNe), escaped with the Orb and 3 runes on 2016-05-19 07:11:29, with 1503655 points after 110987 turns and 4:48:58. 17:00:40 good 17:01:13 elliptic: that'd seem like a very big change in the god's design 17:01:44 as opposed to the other big changes in nemelex's design? :P 17:02:24 ouch 17:02:24 anyway I guess I understand (and agree with) the argument that decks don't anything to do with evocations now 17:02:27 so they shouldn't depend on some unrelated skill 17:02:45 (though I think effect disparities are volatile enough without relying on the vaguaries of piety compared to skills) 17:02:54 (well, solely relying on) 17:03:25 this is a fairly large nerf to nem though, right? or are we compensating in some way 17:04:21 will also need a plan for nem worshippers who leave with their shoes of decks 17:04:22 ...eventual card constriction? >_> 17:04:55 -!- Krakhan has quit [Changing host] 17:07:20 could pakellas passively recharge wand charges rather than have it be an active thing? 17:07:33 elliptic: invo apts didn't get decreased like evo ones did, so that helps a bit 17:07:56 03regret-index02 07* 0.19-a0-535-gb916c57: New monster: Meliai, bee priestesses 10(2 hours ago, 13 files, 58+ 8-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/b916c57f77ab 17:07:56 03regret-index02 07* 0.19-a0-536-g4d3b45e: Meliai dispersal + new (Hive) vaults + bee / wasp hive vault edits 10(4 minutes ago, 7 files, 478+ 66-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/4d3b45e20226 17:08:03 although i guess arguably that is also a nerf that unnecessarily targeted nemelex in the first place 17:08:42 I guess nemelex changes enough every couple of versions that worrying about it being nerfed is a bit silly, I have no idea what its balance is like currently 17:09:07 nor do I 17:09:18 anyone familiar with "down and out" from finances? 17:09:24 I haven't touched him outside of my one polytheist win because of deck inventory tedium 17:09:27 speaking of pakellas, i had my first pakellas game the other day, adn the piety/MP costs felt completely inconsequential. i was at ****** all game, with 50 !magic for zot:5, and i was able to use device surge in every situation that felt dangerous 17:09:28 !lg * won t nem / fifteenskills=evocations 17:09:30 13/17 games for * (won t nem): N=13/17 (76.47%) 17:09:32 and it'll probably change again with further card changes and inventory changes and 17:09:52 !lg * won t nem / sk=evocations 17:09:53 6/17 games for * (won t nem): N=6/17 (35.29%) 17:10:03 !seen Lasty_ 17:10:03 I last saw Lasty_ at Tue Jun 7 20:39:00 2016 UTC (31m 3s ago) saying 'er male' on ##crawl-dev. 17:10:29 yeah Pakellas could be toned down a bit in power 17:10:33 Some of us hope that sanka's random spell god could be Nemelex Done Right (tm). (I do, too.) 17:10:51 imagine my tongue sticking out at you, dpeg_ 17:11:19 anyway, changing nemelex to invo sounds fine to me but I do think that we should remember that we might want to look at the card power formula again at some point with this in mind 17:11:33 -!- Patashu_ has joined ##crawl-dev 17:11:34 regret-index: you made me wonder how Melissae was the plural of meliai 17:11:50 did I still type melissae somewhere in those commits 17:11:51 bah. 17:11:59 elliptic: i'm sort of hoping to remove separate deck rarities, and that'd definitely require a bunch of reworking of the formulae 17:12:11 so could hopefully factor that in! maybe, somehow 17:13:17 !learn add meliai Bee priestesses that come in trios in late D, with one-handed axes, Smiting, and Heal Other. Kind of scary, especially when a queen bee berserks them. 17:13:17 meliai[1/1]: Bee priestesses that come in trios in late D, with one-handed axes, Smiting, and Heal Other. Kind of scary, especially when a queen bee berserks them. 17:14:00 MarvinPA: yeah, removing deck rarities definitely makes sense with decks not generating outside nem (well, it already made sense, but more so now) 17:14:27 i don't know how to draw a bee priestess 17:14:48 (I introduced deck rarities. It certainly looked like a cool idea back then!) 17:14:50 -!- bonghitz has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 17:15:10 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bee_(mythology)#/media/File:Plaque_bee-goddess_BM_GR1860.4-123.4.jpg 17:15:40 dpeg_: I think it worked better when nemelex was really overpowered and decks did lots of crazy things 17:16:13 it was just hard to balance the different rarities and for both nem and non-nem when people actually started to try to fix nemelex 17:16:34 is nemelex still overpowered 17:16:41 elliptic: cool, so it does not feel as stupid :) I really wish I'd have seen the bigger picture back then, though. 17:16:58 Lightli: nobody knows! 17:18:28 ??regret-index[2] 17:18:29 regret-index ~ regretindex[2/2]: cut down decks: escape as elixir / velocity / shaft+tomb / solitude+exile / cloud, destruction as vitriol+venom / storm / pain / orb / degen / wild magic, no war, summoning as pentagram / elements + uglies / rangers / illusion / dance / foxfire. need some god/etc home for blade/fortitude. 17:18:55 -!- wheals has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:19:14 ...five escape cards? 17:20:23 probably just not combining shaft and tomb I guess 17:21:14 -!- tealeaves has quit [Quit: Bye] 17:23:52 ??velocity 17:23:53 velocity[1/2]: Vorpal ranged weapons are suffixed with 'velocity'. It gives 20% bonus damage and does not overwrite the ammunition brand. 17:23:56 ??velocity [2] 17:23:56 velocity card[1/1]: power 0: slows, hastes, or swifts either all allies or all enemies. power 1: hastes allies or slows enemies. power 2: hastes allies and slows enemies. 17:24:23 i think removing one of solitude/exile would be better than merging them (probably solitude since that's all regular spell effects)? seems nice to aim for relatively simple individual effects 17:24:49 fair 17:26:09 what happened to the hand concept for nem 17:26:24 still possible! 17:26:26 it's sort of a separate thing that could still happen independently 17:26:40 -!- breadbocks has quit [] 17:26:44 "nemelex has too many effects" is seperate from "nemelex has annoying inventory juggling" 17:29:16 i'd maybe remove uglies as well rather than merging them into something, but overall seems possibly better than my earlier suggestion of keeping war as a mix of buffs+summons 17:29:32 -!- Rust3dCor3 has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:30:41 one of the parts of nemelex having too many effects is that there's five roles they can slot into- attempts at escape, conjurations, summoning, buffs, and whimsy (oddities) 17:30:57 -!- Demise_ has joined ##crawl-dev 17:31:14 leaves velocity as the only card with the new ally-affecting stuff, maybe that could go too in the process (especially with summoning as a dedicated deck) 17:31:22 (well, no more whimsy whenever you push) 17:31:36 -!- Dracunos7 has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 17:32:40 without that gradation point the card should probably just be "slow all enemies" and make duration greatly depend on power, perhaps? 17:33:08 !tell Lasty Interesting Usky feedback by Wahaha in "2 cents" thread. 17:33:09 dpeg_: OK, I'll let lasty know. 17:33:29 huskayaw, god of dancing dogs 17:43:06 -!- staplegun has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 17:43:18 -!- Harudoku has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:43:53 -!- Patashu_ has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 17:45:36 -!- sanka has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 17:45:47 -!- Doll has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 17:46:04 -!- Cerpin_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:46:49 -!- Demise_ has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 17:51:19 a lot of "libpng warning: iCCP: known incorrect sRGB profile"s from making tiles 17:51:38 err, compiling tiles 17:55:41 yeah i wanted to ask about that 17:55:51 i have no idea what it means 17:55:58 and it doesn't say which tiles it's talking about 17:57:51 -!- ystael has quit [Quit: leaving] 18:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:00:06 -!- staplegun has quit [Client Quit] 18:03:30 -!- tabstorm has joined ##crawl-dev 18:07:34 -!- Dracunos has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 18:10:22 Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.19-a0-536-g4d3b45e (34) 18:12:51 rip oddities 18:14:04 rip 18:14:16 maybe soon rip nem decks using evo 18:14:35 rip excellent gameplay and rip thrilling design 18:14:57 -!- Dracunos has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 18:14:59 Unstable branch on underhound.eu updated to: 0.19-a0-536-g4d3b45e (34) 18:15:21 hey, pakellas still exists! 18:15:40 03regret-index02 07* 0.19-a0-537-g8b19063: Miasma cloud tiles (CanOfWorms) 10(2 minutes ago, 6 files, 4+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/8b19063074bf 18:15:46 sorry I can't play another other god but nem, I love it too much 18:16:00 -!- tealeaves has quit [Quit: Bye] 18:17:29 gammafunk: religious inconsistency alert! 18:17:57 Not that I'm opposed to nem decks using invo, but why not just remove sack of spiders/ box of beasts? 18:18:06 seems like lots of gameplay changes have to be made to balance them 18:18:10 -!- dpeg_ has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 18:18:25 I think the push for nem decks using invo is unrelated to sack/box 18:18:50 @??meliai 18:18:50 unknown monster: "meliai" 18:18:53 correct 18:19:53 obviously, it's better-designed to use only invo, I had figured there was an element of "well, evocations is already too powerful, so training evo for nemelex also makes your evocables more powerful etc." 18:20:55 when there's only eighteen nemelex effects to worry about instead of... thirty-five, nemelex might be more comprehensible 18:21:20 Why not just remove Cheibriados? lots of gameplay changes have to be made to accomodate it. The answer is that some people like using that thing 18:21:36 regret-index: well, still 54 really! 18:21:41 I won a Nem game in 0.17t that was really heavily on the deck+evo synergy 18:22:16 but yes still progress, hopefully 18:22:34 wrath complexity doesn't count towards worship complexity! 18:22:36 ...maybe. 18:23:01 i meant 18*3 for power levels 18:23:09 har 18:23:22 hmm, how many of those scale 18:23:27 ??regretindex[2] 18:23:27 regretindex[2/2]: cut down decks: escape as elixir / velocity / shaft+tomb / solitude+exile / cloud, destruction as vitriol+venom / storm / pain / orb / degen / wild magic, no war, summoning as pentagram / elements + uglies / rangers / illusion / dance / foxfire. need some god/etc home for blade/fortitude. 18:23:29 since even with rarities gone i was assuming they'd stick around, seems hard to scale a single destruction effect that far 18:23:30 -!- zero_one has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 18:24:10 looking at the action table that char evoked a rod 452 times and a deck 149 18:24:18 whoops 299 18:24:20 149 was wands 18:25:42 maybe... 32 effects, splitting on level and then combining cards without discrete stages + possible changes? 18:26:07 bring back Draw One, make it the only way to draw cards at all. 18:26:13 fuzzy stuff 18:26:40 remove decks, add rod of cards 18:26:40 causes random card effect when evoked 18:26:55 minmay: Do you want nem removed 18:27:00 Lightli: yes 18:27:14 how many gods do you want removed, nem, I assume pakellas, what else 18:28:01 -!- regret-index has quit [Quit: leaving] 18:28:13 about 18 i guess 18:28:54 which ones would you want to stay 18:29:16 what im saying is that nem evo -> invo is a nem nerf because it doubles the xp a nem worshiper needs to take advantage of evo 18:29:29 (take equal advantage of, that is) 18:29:40 ebering: that's the point isn't it? 18:31:00 maybe i missed it in scrollback but the reason i saw offered was "since decks are now only used by nem worshippers as part of being a nem worshipper they should use invo" 18:31:12 -!- nezrel has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:31:32 -!- Amphouse has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 18:32:18 ebering: IMO it is more like "there is no reason for nemelex to use evo now" 18:33:28 -!- rchandra has left ##crawl-dev 18:33:30 <|amethyst> n.b. decks currently don't only exist for nemelex worshippers 18:33:36 if evo is used for both evocables and nemelex abilities, then clearly either evo skill is too valuable to nem worshippers or not valuable enough for not-nem worshippers (pakellas has the same problem) 18:34:02 <|amethyst> besides abandonment, there are also various vaults 18:34:08 -!- wheals has joined ##crawl-dev 18:34:27 -!- minqmay has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 18:35:34 Pakellas is more directly involved with regular evokables though 18:35:55 -!- removeelyvilon has quit [Quit: Page closed] 18:35:56 you could make his abilities run off of invo if you wanted to take him down several notches 18:36:27 <|amethyst> hrm 18:36:33 <|amethyst> do pakellas abilities currenty use evo? 18:37:15 <|amethyst> hm 18:37:41 I think they do 18:37:41 (I'm not suggesting the nerf isn't warranted, just pointing out what it is) 18:37:44 <|amethyst> empirically, they appear to use evo for fail rate, but the code says FAIL_INVO 18:37:49 -!- mong has quit [Quit: Leaving] 18:37:59 FAIL_INVO gets adjusted to use evo for pakellas somewhere 18:38:06 <|amethyst> ah 18:38:12 _invo_skill() 18:38:14 <|amethyst> what is FAIL_EVO for then? 18:38:23 <|amethyst> ah 18:38:29 <|amethyst> actual evoked abilities 18:38:35 -!- dpeg_ has joined ##crawl-dev 18:38:49 actual evokables i think, i guess the differences are for different fail rate formulae (based on the old system) 18:38:54 <|amethyst> yeah 18:40:18 -!- oxeimon has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:46:10 -!- miek_ has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 18:52:21 -!- serq has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:52:45 03regret-index02 07* 0.19-a0-538-g122b14b: Some large god-themed vaults for Depths / etc 10(2 minutes ago, 2 files, 198+ 79-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/122b14b03be5 18:55:45 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.19-a0-539-g35d398d: Make iron giants a Dis-only monster 10(4 days ago, 4 files, 4+ 14-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/35d398dc39af 18:55:45 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.19-a0-540-gbd6fe5b: Simplify Exile card power calculations 10(5 hours ago, 1 file, 1+ 8-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/bd6fe5b1c81d 18:55:45 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.19-a0-541-g7b4a13f: Remove some cards from the deck of punishment 10(5 hours ago, 1 file, 0+ 3-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/7b4a13f6e435 18:55:45 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.19-a0-542-g8eb93c7: Remove decks of oddities 10(4 hours ago, 6 files, 22+ 150-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/8eb93c798019 18:55:45 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.19-a0-543-ge25d64f: Don't place decks as vault loot 10(3 hours ago, 4 files, 12+ 63-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/e25d64f11971 18:55:45 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.19-a0-544-g65534a8: Don't identify the top card of a deck with ?ID 10(3 hours ago, 4 files, 1+ 24-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/65534a889959 18:55:45 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.19-a0-545-g8323b11: Remove the Dowsing card 10(3 hours ago, 9 files, 7+ 64-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/8323b11ed209 18:55:45 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.19-a0-546-g7be440f: Make Nemelex use invocations instead of evocations 10(71 minutes ago, 9 files, 13+ 37-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/7be440f59e77 18:55:45 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.19-a0-547-g2f637b1: Don't not slow Pakellas piety at high levels 10(66 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 5-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/2f637b197988 18:55:45 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.19-a0-548-gda230b6: Personalise the Torment card 10(30 minutes ago, 6 files, 38+ 39-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/da230b6bd9f8 18:55:45 ... and 2 more commits 18:56:45 -!- hyperbolic has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 18:57:16 boring ones at the end there 18:57:18 %git HEAD^ 18:57:18 07MarvinPA02 * 0.19-a0-549-gfe150d3: Make the Wraith card ignore rN 10(16 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/fe150d370f66 18:57:24 %git 18:57:24 07MarvinPA02 * 0.19-a0-550-g174f244: Use a canned message 10(8 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/174f2441f40c 18:59:02 oh i guess iron giants already snuck back out of dis 18:59:47 time to post that in SA 19:00:00 -!- hyperbolic has joined ##crawl-dev 19:00:04 03gammafunk02 07[gauntlet] * 0.18-a0-1464-gd553ba0: Add dgn.place_specific_trap() for dlua 10(30 minutes ago, 1 file, 53+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/d553ba0dafad 19:00:04 03gammafunk02 07[gauntlet] * 0.18-a0-1465-gfa5ba26: Finish implementation of wall-lowering grate traps for gauntlet 10(9 minutes ago, 2 files, 87+ 48-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/fa5ba265f3cb 19:00:10 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:00:10 -!- WereVolvo has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:00:10 -!- tealeaves has quit [Quit: Bye] 19:00:35 !tell regret-index There's a working implementation of wall traps in the gauntlet branch, let me know if you have problems 19:00:36 gammafunk: OK, I'll let regret-index know. 19:01:04 er s/grate/pressure plate/ 19:01:35 -!- miek_ has joined ##crawl-dev 19:01:40 -!- ProzacElf has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 19:03:32 -!- regret-index has joined ##crawl-dev 19:03:42 hell enemies in zot aren't too bad, right >_> 19:03:43 regret-index: You have 2 messages. Use !messages to read them. 19:04:18 marvinpa: should have just replaced that giant_chief_lemuel iron giant with a juggernaut instead of cutting the depths set 19:04:29 <|amethyst> when was the last time Zot's monster list changed? 19:04:34 i mean it's probably okay there but i'd prefer to kick that one out just to be relatively strict on it, as with shard shrikes/doom hounds 19:05:04 Naruni: that made ?id no longer identify the top card of decks, so if you could rebase your patch will it be good to go? 19:05:19 there are technically snuck-out shrikes and doom hounds too >_> 19:05:33 i think there's just one shrike (and still one iron giant too)? hadn't spotted the doom hound 19:05:48 !vault ice2_lemuel 19:05:48 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/variable/mini_monsters.des#l2536 19:06:06 yeah i'd caught that one, and tower_of_babel for the remaining iron giant 19:06:40 seems safe to remove the shrike there actually 19:06:43 tower of babel could _maybe_ make sense as an ambush vault with an actual wall border 19:06:50 or make it coc-specific 19:07:03 |amethyst: ghost moths maybe? 19:07:13 <|amethyst> iron giant isn't really a good Cyberdemon anyway 19:07:18 of course dracs have changed a decent amount in what they do, at least the classed ones 19:07:19 if you want I could clean out the non-Zot/Hells vaults with said hell monsters myself 19:07:22 -!- Kellhus has quit [Quit: Page closed] 19:07:36 death cobs, also 19:07:41 and curse toes! 19:08:03 ghost moths are the last actual addition I remember though 19:08:12 as opposed to large changes of existing monsters 19:08:18 |amethyst: actually I think iron giant is a pretty good cyber demon, and in Doom 2016 it can even throw you! 19:08:19 (not counting vaults of course) 19:08:20 <|amethyst> ah, forgot about ghost moths 19:08:29 <|amethyst> gammafunk: but it has no machine gun! 19:08:30 the player is wy faster than a cyber even in classic doom 19:08:48 machine gun on a cyber? 19:08:55 it has a rocket launcher that fires iron shots 19:08:56 regret-index: sure, if you're offering :P 19:08:58 <|amethyst> oh right 19:09:01 -!- Sorbius has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:09:03 <|amethyst> it's a rocket launcher 19:09:04 clearly need to change the flying skulls in that vault to lost souls 19:09:08 <|amethyst> was confusing it with arachnotron 19:09:23 yeah, crawl doesn't really have a good hitscanner boss like that 19:09:26 twelve lost souls and an iron giant, I'm sure people would love it 19:09:35 -!- scummos__ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:10:13 Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.19-a0-550-g174f244 (34) 19:10:56 <|amethyst> gammafunk: isn't everything but IOOD hitscanning, really? 19:11:35 I would consider smite targetting as 'hitscanning' since you can block line of fire 19:11:41 but you're probably right 19:11:54 since in doom line of fire can get hitscanning block 19:12:03 well blocked from hitting you instead of some monster 19:12:12 <|amethyst> yeah 19:12:34 We have to stretch our analogies to enable the Dooming 19:13:02 -!- tealeaves has quit [Quit: Bye] 19:14:58 -!- namelastname112 has joined ##crawl-dev 19:15:38 oh i guess decks still "practice" evocations for auto skill training purposes, yay for victory dancing 19:16:00 <|amethyst> FR: replace autotraining with qw 19:16:47 !vault lightli_tower_of_babel 19:16:47 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/variable/float.des#l2704 19:17:07 -!- eb has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:17:15 missing several outside blocks, tisk tisk 19:17:23 -!- Ququman has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:17:37 <|amethyst> you know, zangband has cyberdemons by name 19:18:10 oh gosh uskayaw is tied into this code, that is scary 19:18:11 should make a vault out of one of my old descent levels 19:18:28 <|amethyst> granted, it also has Santa Claus, Martti Ihrasaari, and Fat Man + Little Boy 19:19:02 at least it's not slash'em extended which has "sl*t with syphilis" 19:19:50 hey, we had satan claus for a bit 19:20:01 he's even immortalised in Sequell 19:20:06 slash'em has juggernauts 19:20:08 i think that's almost the theoretical upper limit for bad taste in roguelikes 19:20:28 plain slash'em has lightsabers 19:20:45 amethyst: Don't forget Oremroj, the unique cyberdemon 19:20:55 or how they're dangerous enough that lategame uniques frequently summon specifically cyberdemons 19:21:04 <|amethyst> Lightli: hah, never encountered that one 19:21:20 I think I spelt it wrong anyways 19:21:25 Oremorj* 19:21:53 <|amethyst> yeah, I knew it was misspelled and never encountered the monster 19:22:07 fr: add Elvenkings, which are like slightly buffed deep elf knights, and have the same glyph+color as boris 19:22:52 <|amethyst> minmay: I think a liberal crime squad roguelike could probably push those theoretical limits 19:23:08 <|amethyst> minmay: but I guess the difference there is self-awareness 19:23:16 at least liberal crime squad is ironic 19:23:16 yes 19:23:33 like how Hatred is a lot more worrying than Postal was 19:24:08 for starters, it wasn't a good video game 19:24:56 crawl, like doom, also has a 2016 remake 19:25:24 thank god there isn't anything like chaingunners in crawl 19:25:42 Master archers don't fire fast enough 19:25:45 actually crawl might be more like wolfenstein 3d, since it has swastika-shaped level layouts and hitler 19:25:54 well, it had hitler until relatively recently 19:26:50 -!- JimmahDean has quit [Killed (wilhelm.freenode.net (Nickname regained by services))] 19:26:50 -!- JimmahDean_ is now known as jimmahdean 19:26:51 <|amethyst> nearly half its life ago 19:26:57 <|amethyst> %git 8d485d7ee 19:26:57 07haranp02 * 0.2-a0-541-g8d485d7: s/Adolf/Frederick 10(9 years ago, 7 files, 13+ 13-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/8d485d7ee5fc 19:27:01 ??hitler 19:27:01 circlelos[1/1]: The type of {los} used before 0.17, so-named because it approximates a circle. With the player at position c, it's the set of points p with (p.x - c.x)^2 + (p.y - c.y)^2 <= R^2 + 1 where R is 8 under normal circumstances. 19:27:07 ahahhahaaha 19:28:00 anyways, I made a post on the SA forums introducing the wonders of Invo!Nem and smitebees to the world 19:28:03 -!- Tux[Qyou] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:28:05 I await the horrified replies 19:28:09 -!- jimmahdean is now known as JimmahDean_ 19:28:15 -!- regret-index has quit [Quit: leaving] 19:28:36 -!- Dracunos has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 19:28:42 -!- Dracunos_ is now known as Dracunos 19:28:59 on the other hand, crawl is also a lot like lasertank 19:29:03 -!- GoblinBomb has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:29:10 er, hovertank 3d 19:29:17 though it's like lasertank too in some ways i guess 19:29:47 subscribe for more video games that are like other video games 19:29:51 -!- CanOfWorms has joined ##crawl-dev 19:30:26 what were the SA forums like when mountain dwarves were removed 19:30:28 <|amethyst> speaking of first-person "3d" games 19:30:37 <|amethyst> someone should make a reboot of Moraff's World 19:31:07 minmay: They still rage about it sometimes to this day 19:31:20 seems like they're fine with invo Nemelex 19:31:30 but are freaking out about smitebees 19:31:46 -!- Gobbo is now known as GoblinBomb 19:34:11 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.19-a0-551-g1edb3d8: Make using decks practice Invocations when autoskilling 10(10 minutes ago, 3 files, 8+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/1edb3d8ce98a 19:34:25 I wanted a modern version of dungeon master 19:34:35 then one came out and I realized I didn't actually want a modern version of dungeon master 19:36:55 if i want to rebase acid crabs what is the magic I need to do to fix my PR 19:36:57 it's been a while 19:38:23 re*base* acide crabs ebering? Seems like a mistake. 19:38:32 *acid 19:39:27 new monster: neutral crab 19:39:36 fr: base crabs 19:39:37 just scuttles around being a crab, doesn't have attacks 19:40:16 0.19 crab list: fire crab, ghost crab, apocalypse crab, acid crab, base crab, neutral crab, stab crab 19:40:52 Crawl 0.19 Dances with Crabs 19:40:57 what about lobster crabs, they breath clouds of lobsters 19:41:25 nice try gammafunk but you'll never come up with a monster as good as stab crabs 19:43:49 stab crab (t) | Spd: 10 | HD: 8 | HP: 41-61 | AC/EV: 10/5 | Dam: 40(stab) | Res: magic(60), stab | Vul: poison | Chunks: noxious | XP: 689 | Sp: stab [!AM, !sil] | Sz: small | Int: stab. 19:44:24 grandjackal (L25 DrGl) (Lair:1) 19:44:45 grandjackal (L25 DrGl) (Lair:1) 19:44:47 you're just trying to get the knife crab meme into crawl 19:44:52 <|amethyst> !crashlog 19:44:53 13731. grandjackal, XL25 DrGl, T:82045 (milestone): http://crawl.berotato.org/crawl/morgue/grandjackal/crash-grandjackal-20160607-234436.txt 19:45:04 what would a stab crab do 19:45:06 grandjackal (L25 DrGl) (Lair:1) 19:45:10 <|amethyst> minmay: I see one problem with that monster 19:45:38 <|amethyst> minmay: it has stab resistance 19:45:50 <|amethyst> minmay: which means you cannot attack its weak point for massive damage 19:45:58 there's a knife crab meme? 19:46:08 don't play dumb, you're not fooling anyone 19:46:10 |amethyst: you can. just not by stabbing it 19:46:15 <|amethyst> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0QaAKi0NFkA 19:46:22 three hundred and ninety nine you ess dollars 19:46:44 that's not a stab crab, it's got the wrong colours 19:46:53 this is the stab crab tile http://i.imgur.com/YT9iRj9.jpg 19:47:27 grandjackal (L25 DrGl) (D:10) 19:48:31 fr: when you polymorph maurice, he can become a grab crab 19:48:57 only one knife? 19:49:02 crab crab 19:49:05 breathes crabs 19:49:29 carb crab 19:49:31 breathes bread rations 19:50:25 scab crab: doesn't do anything, occasionally messages you for money 19:50:58 cab crab: the official service of autotravel in the dungeon 19:51:31 -!- GauHelldragon has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 19:51:49 anyway i was serious about my git question please send a git crab to help 19:53:05 -!- JimmahDean_ is now known as JimmahDean 19:54:04 -!- HellTiger has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:54:33 <|amethyst> ebering: are you asking for help rebasing, or you did that and you want to update the PR now? 19:54:53 the latter 19:56:19 I think I just force push but that might do terrible things? 19:56:58 <|amethyst> force push to your branch will do it 19:57:16 <|amethyst> the "terrible things" are a decision you made when you rebased rather than merging 19:58:06 <|amethyst> in that people who already checked out your branch (or the PR) and worked on it would have problems 19:58:42 <|amethyst> but there shouldn't be any technical problems with that 19:59:11 <|amethyst> and, particularly when there are conflicts, I'd personally rather see the rebasing done in the PR rather than as it is imported into trunk 20:00:01 -!- Zekka has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 20:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:01:33 -!- cait is now known as yesno 20:03:11 "Spellbinder" is too suicidal. Its effects often harm the owner. Moreso, it's possible to harm summons (that could have been produced by miscats too), angering some gods. 20:03:50 -!- Chozo has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 20:04:32 what sort of effects harm the owner? 20:06:04 -!- sage1234 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:06:51 -!- jafet has joined ##crawl-dev 20:08:03 -!- regret-index has joined ##crawl-dev 20:08:29 presumably the explosions and the clouds 20:09:13 chequers: http://dpaste.com/3TXM19C seems to crash if the caster's first spell kills it 20:09:16 there's a tv of someone getting killed by a hell sentinel, somewhere 20:09:24 ??spellbinder[$ 20:09:24 spellbinder[4/4]: !lg * cikiller~~Spellbinder 2 -tv 20:09:42 Very dangerous miscats! 20:10:10 Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.19-a0-551-g1edb3d8 (34) 20:10:20 ??spellbinder[3 20:10:20 spellbinder[3/4]: !lm SGrunt spsk uniq=the_Enchantress -tv:<0.2:>0.2 20:10:20 ??spellbinder[2 20:10:20 spellbinder[2/4]: !lg minmay 2940 -tv:T116100 20:10:20 [2] is a good example of spellbinder 20:10:38 i'm too lazy to watch TVs, can you just tell me what happens 20:10:41 regret-index: on it 20:11:10 Probably it summoned friendly sentinel, then harmed it with an explosion. 20:11:42 4 is the good one 20:11:44 That is indeed what happened. 20:11:51 it's better than that 20:11:56 the player got a friendly hell sentinel 20:12:01 then proceeded to WORSHIP OKAWARU 20:12:12 -!- Erik_the_Red has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:12:16 then got penance and instakilled from an electric orb miscast 20:12:29 @??hell sentinel 20:12:29 Hell Sentinel (071) | Spd: 10 | HD: 19 | HP: 114-168 | AC/EV: 25/3 08(spiny 5d4) | Dam: 40, 25 | 05demonic, 10doors, unholy, see invisible | Res: 13magic(immune), 04fire+++, 05damnation, 12cold+++, 11elec+++, 09poison+++, 04rot, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 2905 | Sp: hurl damnation (3d20) [06!sil], iron shot (3d33) [06!sil] | Sz: Large | Int: human. 20:12:31 the Okawaru penance is just icing on the cake. He didn't get instakilled though 20:12:38 the hell sentinel punched him 20:12:43 well instakilled in the sense that 20:12:49 the moment the explosion went off he died 20:12:54 yes 20:13:03 I don't get it. So, spellbinder hit a monster and caused a miscast on the monster which summoned hostile demon, which was therefore friendly to the player 20:13:08 03regret-index02 07* 0.19-a0-552-g1526261: Control some more vault placements of hells enemies 10(3 minutes ago, 4 files, 57+ 47-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/15262616c8d7 20:13:14 yes 20:13:26 Then spellbinder hit the monster again and caused a miscast on the monster which summoned an orb of electricity 20:13:40 Which exploded, harming the hell sentinel, which made the hell sentinel hostile 20:13:43 ? 20:13:45 yes 20:14:03 and then okawaru got mad and the hell sentinel punched the 46 hp gargoyle for the instakill 20:14:13 regret-index: did you want that fixed against master, or is it part of gauntlet 20:14:17 regret-index: thanks! 20:14:27 master 20:14:29 'welcome 20:14:52 was leaving the iron giant in zot intentional? 20:14:58 ... 20:14:59 yes 20:15:07 hm. Maybe spellbinder miscasts could just never summon orbs of electricity. Or never summon anything. But are there other possible issues? 20:15:21 ok, i'd still prefer it gone i guess, just wasn't sure since the commit message only mentioned shrikes in zot specifically 20:15:32 * regret-index shrugs. 20:15:35 chequers: minmay's tv has a twister getting spawned from the miscast 20:15:58 MarvinPA: nice nem changes 20:16:17 grandjackal (L25 DrGl) (Lair:1) 20:16:18 there's pretty much no way spellbinder can actually use miscasts as much as it does and not be horribly damaging to the user 20:16:31 grunt's is the only one that's actually positive 20:16:40 he gets a paralyze miscast off the enchantress and gibs her 20:17:04 -!- n1 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:17:20 wheals, im not sure. i do remember that decks were acting funky in the testing 20:17:20 I mean, if you really feel strongly about it, I'll leave a note for my next sweep for it to be... 20:17:33 what do I even have left for that vault. 20:17:42 spellbinder might be slightly better if it was a ranged weapon since at least you wouldn't be able to harm yourself, usually 20:18:04 ...crystal guardian, I guess 20:18:22 not super bothered i guess, just something to keep an eye on that more don't sneak out 20:18:30 CanOfWorms: it doesn't have a twister getting spawned from a spellbinder miscast 20:18:37 CanOfWorms: it has *two* twisters getting spawned from two spellbinder miscasts 20:18:41 nice! 20:21:03 -!- olscumpy has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 20:21:41 -!- destroythecore has quit [Client Quit] 20:23:48 -!- JStrange_ has joined ##crawl-dev 20:24:01 -!- Demise_ has joined ##crawl-dev 20:24:22 @??meliai 20:24:22 unknown monster: "meliai" 20:24:24 good tower_of_babel changes 20:24:31 |amethyst, could you update monster? 20:25:33 -!- aredel has quit [Quit: Page closed] 20:27:08 -!- mamgar has quit [Quit: Exit Stage Left] 20:28:36 03ebering02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/205 * 0.19-a0-551-ga36888c: Acid Crabs 10(5 months ago, 10 files, 62+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/a36888cc3924 20:28:36 03ebering02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/205 * 0.19-a0-552-gf12db2b: Acid Crab tile (nikheizen) 10(5 months ago, 1 file, 0+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/f12db2bd83f1 20:28:36 03ebering02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/205 * 0.19-a0-553-g79d1c0e: Add the occasional acid crab to U 10(5 months ago, 1 file, 1+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/79d1c0e1f3eb 20:29:12 how do i create a friendly blood saint in wizmode 20:29:47 x over it, cycle F 20:30:20 hah cool 20:31:33 I don't mind the concept of an acid clouds monster but putting it in U where there are already entropy weavers and caustic shrikes feels a bit much 20:32:18 regret-index: it's simplest to just not fire the second legendary destruction if the first kills the monster -- is that acceptable? 20:32:24 (this is how SoH works) 20:32:27 yeah 20:32:43 no arms left to direct the blast! 20:33:16 also feedback on the spell list? I'll submit this as a PR 20:33:27 and the cast rate 20:33:56 clearly acid crabs are more at home in Z 20:34:09 to make the spell list as simple as possible and explosive as possible I was looking at... (25, fireball), (20, iceblast), (15, ghostly fireball) 20:34:29 "die, spriggans, die" 20:34:41 done 20:34:53 red draconian buff 20:35:08 if you're doing this as a pr you should also change the spell description 20:36:22 do you think it makes more sense for legendary destruction to cast twice by anyone, or limit that to a blood saint thing 20:36:38 blood saints are the only users of it atm, just thinking about least suprise 20:37:13 don't make spells work differently depending on who casts them! 20:37:40 what marvinpa said 20:37:41 roger 20:38:39 <|amethyst> if you really wanted something like that 20:38:46 <|amethyst> and I'm not suggesting this is a good idea 20:38:58 <|amethyst> but you could make the second cast depend on spellpower 20:39:24 <|amethyst> regret-index: rebuilding now 20:39:33 Legendary Destruction spell 20:39:33 Conjures two destructive magical effects. The effects may be Fireball, 20:39:33 Iceblast, or Ghostly Fireball. 20:40:10 -!- Lasty has joined ##crawl-dev 20:41:08 hmm 20:41:21 PR up, you can fix that description in another commit :) 20:41:27 make it less robot 20:43:17 -!- ZiBuDo has joined ##crawl-dev 20:44:04 New branch created: pull/293 (1 commit) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/293 20:44:04 03chequers02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/293 * 0.19-a0-518-g8d3156c: Buff Blood Saints (regret-index). 10(4 minutes ago, 3 files, 25+ 11-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/8d3156c9716e 20:44:58 Monster database of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.19-a0-552-g1526261 20:45:25 (I would have personally gone on for two hundred words about those explosions being regularly resisted by demons and how legendary destruction is currently bad due to variable ranges and effects and what not) 20:45:30 unknown monster: "version" 20:45:30 <|amethyst> %??version 20:45:30 (but that's me) 20:45:34 Monster stats Crawl version: 0.19-a0-552-g1526261 20:45:34 <|amethyst> %??-version 20:45:37 <|amethyst> @??-version 20:45:37 Monster stats Crawl version: 0.19-a0-552-g1526261 20:45:40 @??meliai 20:45:40 meliai (03y) | Spd: 20 | HD: 7 | HP: 20-28 | AC/EV: 6/14 | Dam: 14, 1208(poison:14-28) | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, priest, evil, fly | Res: 06magic(20) | Vul: 09poison, 08holy | Chunks: 14noxious | XP: 299 | Sp: smiting (7-17) [11!AM], heal other (2d3) [11!AM] | Sz: small | Int: human. 20:45:56 <|amethyst> @??killer bee 20:45:56 killer bee (07y) | Spd: 20 | HD: 3 | HP: 13-19 | AC/EV: 2/18 | Dam: 1008(poison:6-12) | fly | Res: 06magic(10) | Vul: 09poison | Chunks: 14noxious | XP: 62 | Sz: tiny | Int: animal. 20:45:59 <|amethyst> @??queen bee 20:45:59 queen bee (13y) | Spd: 10 | HD: 7 | HP: 33-44 | AC/EV: 10/10 | Dam: 2008(poison:14-28) | fly | Res: 06magic(20) | Vul: 09poison | Chunks: 14noxious | XP: 304 | Sp: berserk other [11!AM, 06!sil], berserk other [11!AM, 06!sil, 04emergency] | Sz: little | Int: animal. 20:46:08 regret-index: there's actually code which I think makes the range of any legendary destruction spell long enough to hit a targetted enemy 20:46:25 so you could use it to hit something at edge of LoS with lcs 20:46:31 due to cheated non-variable ranges, then :P 20:47:05 <|amethyst> hm 20:47:15 I wonder if meliai are frail enough 20:47:19 @??black mamba 20:47:19 black mamba (02S) | Spd: 18 | HD: 7 | HP: 33-44 | AC/EV: 4/15 | Dam: 2008(poison:14-28) | cold-blooded | Res: 06magic(20), 03poison | Chunks: 14noxious | XP: 456 | Sz: Medium | Int: animal. 20:47:22 <|amethyst> yeah, making all the options resistible might not be a buff 20:47:58 I like how meliai are classified as evil 20:47:59 but no more rmsl! 20:48:01 vulnerable to holy? 20:48:12 smiting defaults to assuming evil gods 20:48:18 <|amethyst> because of having 'smite', yeah 20:48:40 <|amethyst> oh hm 20:48:55 <|amethyst> actually, smiting doesn't have SPTYP_NECROMANCY 20:48:58 <|amethyst> so why 20:49:00 they could worship uskayaw or fedhas but there's some ambiguity I'm relying on 20:49:06 ??meliai 20:49:07 meliai[1/3]: Bee priestesses that come in trios in late D, with one-handed axes, Smiting, and Heal Other. Kind of scary, especially when a queen bee berserks them. 20:49:15 <|amethyst> @??goblin ; spells:smiting.200.wizard 20:49:15 goblin (15g) | Spd: 10 | HD: 1 | HP: 3-5 | AC/EV: 0/12 | Dam: 4 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, spellcaster | XP: 2 | Sp: smiting (7-17) | Sz: small | Int: human. 20:49:15 ??meliai[2] 20:49:15 meliai[2/3]: Because killer bees needed smiting! 20:49:15 <|amethyst> that goblin isn't evil 20:49:15 ??meliai[3] 20:49:15 meliai[3/3]: it's a new monster and it's an orc prist fused with a bee 20:49:53 <|amethyst> ah 20:49:55 @??meliai 20:49:55 meliai (03y) | Spd: 20 | HD: 7 | HP: 20-28 | AC/EV: 6/14 | Dam: 14, 1208(poison:14-28) | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, priest, evil, fly | Res: 06magic(20) | Vul: 09poison, 08holy | Chunks: 14noxious | XP: 299 | Sp: smiting (7-17) [11!AM], heal other (2d3) [11!AM] | Sz: small | Int: human. 20:49:58 @??goblin ; spells:smiting.200.priest 20:49:58 goblin (15g) | Spd: 10 | HD: 1 | HP: 3-5 | AC/EV: 0/12 | Dam: 4 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, priest, evil | Vul: 08holy | XP: 2 | Sp: smiting (7-17) [11!AM] | Sz: small | Int: human. 20:49:59 <|amethyst> @??goblin ; spells:priest.200.wizard 20:49:59 Unknown spell name: 'priest' in 'priest.200.wizard' 20:50:02 i feel like bees with smiting was an old learndb joke 20:50:02 oh god they made them fast 20:50:05 <|amethyst> err, yeah 20:50:12 <|amethyst> @??meliai god:fedhas 20:50:12 meliai (03y) | Spd: 20 | HD: 7 | HP: 20-28 | AC/EV: 6/14 | Dam: 14, 1208(poison:14-28) | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, priest, fly | Res: 06magic(20) | Vul: 09poison | Chunks: 14noxious | XP: 299 | Sp: smiting (7-17) [11!AM], heal other (2d3) [11!AM] | Sz: small | Int: human. 20:50:14 <|amethyst> aha 20:50:20 smitebees 20:50:24 <|amethyst> it's just because of 'unnamed god' 20:50:39 <|amethyst> not smiting specifically 20:50:50 <|amethyst> (unnamed god plus divine spells) 20:51:51 <|amethyst> regret-index: maybe we should add GOD_UNNAMED_BUT_NOT_THAT_BAD_REALLY 20:51:52 standard medieval rendering of unfriendly nature as outside of the holy natural order, I guess 20:52:32 !tell pleasingfungus why do ancestors get sinv? 20:52:32 amalloy: OK, I'll let pleasingfungus know. 20:53:09 um, you two are missing a HUGE opportunity 20:53:10 <|amethyst> regret-index: I'm imagining the two monks inventing things: "So what do bees do?" "The usual: buzz, make honey, smite things with unholy wrath." 20:53:23 would it be that bad to assume the nameless god isn't evil? almost every other priest that comes to mind already has other evil spells 20:53:25 GOD_BEE_GOD !!!!!! 20:53:40 BEE GOD 20:53:49 Beeogh 20:54:13 look, potnia theron was just general beasts and artemis is well known as the hunt, it's more than just bees 20:54:24 <|amethyst> @??norris god:fedhas 20:54:24 Norris (07@) | Spd: 10 | HD: 20 | HP: 176-248 | AC/EV: 1/9 | Dam: 36 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, fighter, priest, see invisible | Res: 06magic(140) | XP: 5028 | Sp: brain feed [11!AM], smiting (7-17) [11!AM], invisibility [11!AM], confuse [11!AM], paralyse [11!AM] | Sz: Medium | Int: human. 20:54:24 ****** Permanently transform into a queen bee. You periodically drop royal jelly and have poison branded unarmed attack. 20:54:48 @??killer bee 20:54:48 killer bee (07y) | Spd: 20 | HD: 3 | HP: 13-19 | AC/EV: 2/18 | Dam: 1008(poison:6-12) | fly | Res: 06magic(10) | Vul: 09poison | Chunks: 14noxious | XP: 62 | Sz: tiny | Int: animal. 20:54:50 <|amethyst> @??gnoll shaman god:fedhas 20:54:50 gnoll shaman (00g) | Spd: 10 | HD: 3 | HP: 16-23 | AC/EV: 4/9 | Dam: 10 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, priest | Res: 06magic(20) | XP: 40 | Sp: corona [11!AM], heal other (2d1) [11!AM], haste other [11!AM], minor healing (2d1) [11!AM, 04emergency] | Sz: Medium | Int: human. 20:55:01 <|amethyst> @??deep troll shaman god:fedhas 20:55:01 deep troll shaman (00T) | Spd: 10 | HD: 12 | HP: 39-58 | AC/EV: 6/10 | Dam: 27, 2009(claw), 2009(claw) | 10doors, priest, see invisible | Res: 06magic(40), 08blind | XP: 877 | Sp: haste other [11!AM], might other [11!AM], minor healing (2d6) [11!AM, 04emergency] | Sz: Large | Int: human. 20:55:01 *** Shaft a monster so that they fall three levels and land in the middle of your hive 20:55:08 @??meliai ; nothing 20:55:08 meliai (03y) | Spd: 20 | HD: 7 | HP: 20-28 | AC/EV: 4/14 | Dam: 14, 1208(poison:14-28) | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, priest, evil, fly | Res: 06magic(20) | Vul: 09poison, 08holy | Chunks: 14noxious | XP: 299 | Sp: smiting (7-17) [11!AM], heal other (2d3) [11!AM] | Sz: small | Int: human. 20:55:10 fedhas isn't the smiting sort 20:55:23 <|amethyst> @??chaos champion god:fedhas 20:55:23 monstrous chaos champion (006) | Spd: 10 | HD: 15 | HP: 112-155 | AC/EV: 8/8 | Dam: 25, 15, 15 | natural, 05demonic, 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, fighter, priest, evil, unholy | Res: 06magic(60), 13torm | Vul: 08holy++, 11silver | XP: 1620 | Sp: b.random (3d22 / 3d19 / 3d20 / 3d24) [11!AM], c.chaos [11!AM] | Sz: Medium | Int: human. 20:55:27 <|amethyst> oh right 20:55:29 <|amethyst> still demonspawn 20:55:52 <|amethyst> I think those are the only ones that would change their evil bit 20:55:58 what, norris doesn't count as evil due to brain feed? 20:56:06 <|amethyst> brain feed stopped being evil 20:56:11 right 20:56:16 because of... brain worms? 20:56:18 does it still make a difference for zin? where evilness isn't just a bool 20:56:23 -!- PleasingFungus has joined ##crawl-dev 20:56:24 <|amethyst> %git 9420a2fa 20:56:24 07dolorous02 * 0.6.0-a1-238-g9420a2f: Tweak spell flags a bit. 10(7 years ago, 1 file, 2+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/9420a2faa5ee 20:56:26 that's the only thing that was evil about him? 20:56:40 <|amethyst> oh wait 20:56:42 @??norris 20:56:43 Norris (07@) | Spd: 10 | HD: 20 | HP: 176-248 | AC/EV: 1/9 | Dam: 36 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, fighter, priest, evil, see invisible | Res: 06magic(140) | Vul: 08holy | XP: 5028 | Sp: brain feed [11!AM], smiting (7-17) [11!AM], invisibility [11!AM], confuse [11!AM], paralyse [11!AM] | Sz: Medium | Int: human. 20:56:46 <|amethyst> it was still evil then, just not unholy 20:56:48 @??norris god:fedhas 20:56:48 Norris (07@) | Spd: 10 | HD: 20 | HP: 176-248 | AC/EV: 1/9 | Dam: 36 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, fighter, priest, see invisible | Res: 06magic(140) | XP: 5028 | Sp: brain feed [11!AM], smiting (7-17) [11!AM], invisibility [11!AM], confuse [11!AM], paralyse [11!AM] | Sz: Medium | Int: human. 20:57:01 <|amethyst> huh 20:57:08 -!- Harudoku has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 20:57:13 <|amethyst> it's necromancy 20:57:17 amalloy: so that they can be useful against invisible enemies 20:57:25 !source MiscastEffect 20:57:26 1/3. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/spl-miscast.cc#l74 20:57:31 <|amethyst> oh right 20:57:40 <|amethyst> @??orc priest ; fedhas 20:57:40 Bad item name: 'fedhas' 20:57:43 <|amethyst> @??orc priest god:fedhas 20:57:44 orc priest (03o) | Spd: 10 | HD: 3 | HP: 13-18 | AC/EV: 3/9 | Dam: 6 | natural, 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, priest, evil | Res: 06magic(20) | Vul: 08holy | XP: 41 | Sp: pain (d14) [11!AM], cantrip [11!AM], smiting (7-17) [11!AM], heal other (2d1) [11!AM] | Sz: Medium | Int: human. 20:57:46 <|amethyst> hm 20:58:10 <|amethyst> @??orc priest god:fedhas spells:pain.200.priest 20:58:10 orc priest (03o) | Spd: 10 | HD: 3 | HP: 13-18 | AC/EV: 3/9 | Dam: 6 | natural, 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, priest, evil | Res: 06magic(20) | Vul: 08holy | XP: 35 | Sp: pain (d14) [11!AM] | Sz: Medium | Int: human. 20:58:14 <|amethyst> @??orc priest god:fedhas spells:brain_feed.200.priest 20:58:14 orc priest (03o) | Spd: 10 | HD: 3 | HP: 13-18 | AC/EV: 3/9 | Dam: 6 | natural, 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, priest, evil | Res: 06magic(20) | Vul: 08holy | XP: 35 | Sp: brain feed [11!AM] | Sz: Medium | Int: human. 20:58:24 PleasingFungus: they seem like they are already really useful in general. notably like, very strong in the early game, before you get to even * of piety. most gods are useless at that point, whereas hep has given me an ally that can solo monsters that i would otherwise have to run away from 20:58:25 <|amethyst> @??norris god:fedhas 20:58:25 Norris (07@) | Spd: 10 | HD: 20 | HP: 176-248 | AC/EV: 1/9 | Dam: 36 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, fighter, priest, see invisible | Res: 06magic(140) | XP: 5028 | Sp: brain feed [11!AM], smiting (7-17) [11!AM], invisibility [11!AM], confuse [11!AM], paralyse [11!AM] | Sz: Medium | Int: human. 20:58:39 amalloy: wow, before you even get to * of piety? 20:58:43 !learn edit meliai s|ate D|ate D (and beehive vaults, including some very large ones in Lair:5- and D:13-)| 20:58:43 Use: !learn edit meliai[NUM] s/// 20:58:47 -!- Harudoku_ is now known as Harudoku 20:58:48 <|amethyst> why is the orc priest getting the evil flag but not norris? 20:58:51 !learn edit meliai[1] s|ate D|ate D (and beehive vaults, including some very large ones in Lair:5- and D:13-)| 20:58:51 meliai[1/3]: Bee priestesses that come in trios in late D (and beehive vaults, including some very large ones in Lair:5- and D:13-), with one-handed axes, Smiting, and Heal Other. Kind of scary, especially when a queen bee berserks them. 20:58:54 <|amethyst> @??norris god:fedhas spells:brain_feed.200.priest 20:58:54 Norris (07@) | Spd: 10 | HD: 20 | HP: 176-248 | AC/EV: 1/9 | Dam: 36 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, fighter, priest, see invisible | Res: 06magic(140) | XP: 3887 | Sp: brain feed [11!AM] | Sz: Medium | Int: human. 20:58:59 my impression of the unclassed ancestor is that it was kind of useless, and that was before i cut its damage by 1/3rd 20:59:08 <|amethyst> OHH 20:59:12 i'd be very surprised to see it soloing anything remotely threatening 20:59:20 I think the one case where the new-early-sinv ancestor is overly useful is killing solo invis orc wizards 20:59:33 <|amethyst> orc priest has MH_EVIL specifically 20:59:33 which is mostly just removing tedium imo 20:59:37 <|amethyst> so I'm very confused now 20:59:39 lol 20:59:40 PleasingFungus: i mean, i took a god later than usual this game, since iw as waiting for hep and i don't normally do that 20:59:42 what 21:00:02 (re: "tedium") 21:00:02 so on D:7 i was already somewhat higher-level, and i thought ancestor scales with xl rather than piety 21:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:00:04 how late, and what sort of enemies was it helpful against? 21:00:16 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: it's helpful for soloing adders 21:00:19 it does scale with xl, but the class selection is a huge power boost 21:00:23 MarvinPA: 100% serious 21:00:24 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: since rP∞ 21:00:30 110% 21:00:37 i also noticed it being pretty tough in my current game when i picked it up on d:9 21:00:39 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: on the occasions I got it that early 21:00:50 invisible orc wizards, of course. anything with poison damage. just now it solo'd a hungry ghost and a hippogriff for me 21:00:52 i can certainly make it weaker/more fragile early on 21:00:54 1learn add hep_challenge don't choose a class and get all runes 21:00:55 could have afforded to be a bit squishier maybe 21:00:55 at XL10 21:00:58 and a hippogriff, huh 21:01:01 the hungry ghost i'm fine with 21:01:14 @??hungry ghost 21:01:14 hungry ghost (03W) | Spd: 10 | HD: 7 | HP: 33-44 | AC/EV: 0/17 | Dam: 502(hunger) | 07undead, 10doors, evil, see invisible, fly, unbreathing | Res: 06magic(40), 02cold++, 09poison+++, 12drown, 04rot+++, 13neg+++, 13torm, 04napalm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 184 | Sz: Medium | Int: human. 21:01:25 yeah 21:01:28 yeah, i think hungry ghost is fine 21:01:31 ...huh, pretas have quite the ev. 21:01:35 @??hippogriff 21:01:35 hippogriff (07H) | Spd: 10 | HD: 7 | HP: 33-44 | AC/EV: 2/7 | Dam: 10, 8, 8 | fly | Res: 06magic(20) | XP: 184 | Sz: Large | Int: animal. 21:01:40 more surprising 21:01:42 what xl are you? 21:01:48 oh, 10 21:01:51 gimme a sec 21:02:20 -!- namelastname112 has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 21:02:53 hp 35, 7/10 defenses, 10 damage 21:03:05 could tone down early-game ac 21:03:24 PleasingFungus: https://gist.github.com/amalloy/f107e4750781d7077bc45cbbaa05573d fwiw, in case it is useful to analyse whether it is dodging too much, hitting too much or whatever 21:03:40 looks like ac, yeah 21:03:41 hm 21:03:51 thinking 21:04:02 @??ancestor hd:7 21:04:02 ancestor (11R) | Spd: 10 | HD: 7 | HP: 1 | AC/EV: 7/10 | Dam: 10 | 11non-living, 10items, 10doors, see invisible, fly, regen, unbreathing | Res: 06magic(46), 05fire, 02cold, 09poison+++, 12drown, 04rot+++, 13neg+++, 13torm, 04napalm | XP: 12 | Sz: Medium | Int: human. 21:04:04 -!- xxxx has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 21:04:06 good, it's right 21:04:11 @??ancestor hd:18 21:04:11 ancestor (11R) | Spd: 10 | HD: 18 | HP: 1-2 | AC/EV: 18/10 | Dam: 21 | 11non-living, 10items, 10doors, spellcaster, see invisible, fly, regen, unbreathing | Res: 06magic(120), 05fire, 02cold, 09poison+++, 12drown, 04rot+++, 13neg+++, 13torm, 04napalm | XP: 94 | Sp: haste | Sz: Medium | Int: human. 21:04:16 lol @ hp 21:04:50 elon musk hah 21:05:00 !lm * ancestor.identity 21:05:01 No keyword 'ancestor.identity' 21:05:05 !lm * noun=ancestor.identity 21:05:05 No milestones for * (noun=ancestor.identity). 21:05:08 !lm * verb=ancestor.identity 21:05:08 elon musk is also pretty good against orc priests 21:05:09 No milestones for * (verb=ancestor.identity). 21:05:38 remembered their ancestor Richard Dawkins 21:05:49 !source _hepliaklqana_ally_hp 21:05:50 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/religion.cc#l1321 21:05:57 https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=20222 21:06:05 wow, now that's fast 21:06:12 'I didn't bother to view it though' 21:06:30 non global functions indicated by _name(int num) are not listed in header files, how would _name(int num) be assigned a default value for num if not called with an int? _name(int num = 0)? 21:06:43 <|amethyst> Naruni: exactly 21:06:51 maybe ac's just high in general 21:06:52 hrm 21:06:52 |amethyst, thanks 21:07:01 @??executioner 21:07:01 Executioner (151) | Spd: 20 | HD: 12 | HP: 54-78 | AC/EV: 10/15 | Dam: 30, 10, 10 | 05demonic, 10doors, fighter, unholy, see invisible | Res: 06magic(140), 05fire, 02cold, 10elec, 03poison, 04rot, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 2309 | Sp: pain (d14) [06!sil], haste [06!sil] | Sz: Large | Int: human. 21:07:31 could just halve ac across the board 21:07:50 |amethyst, so if i call via _name() then num will be initialized and assigned 0 when called, or _name(3) num will have the value 3? 21:07:59 03MarvinPA02 07[sifcast] * 0.19-a0-521-g109cbea: Give Sif's channel energy a fail rate based on Invo 10(21 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/109cbea65cc5 21:07:59 03MarvinPA02 07[sifcast] * 0.19-a0-522-gb780e24: Update Sif descriptions 10(20 minutes ago, 3 files, 15+ 5-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/b780e24f8f80 21:07:59 03MarvinPA02 07[sifcast] * 0.19-a0-523-g63d696b: Use a passive_t for Sif no-mp casting 10(19 minutes ago, 3 files, 24+ 6-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/63d696b94c3f 21:08:05 <|amethyst> Naruni: right 21:08:06 @??knight hd:18 21:08:06 knight (11R) | Spd: 10 | HD: 18 | HP: 1-2 | AC/EV: 32/8 | Dam: 21 | 11non-living, 10items, 10doors, spellcaster, see invisible, fly, regen, unbreathing | Res: 06magic(120), 05fire, 02cold, 09poison+++, 12drown, 04rot+++, 13neg+++, 13torm, 04napalm | XP: 94 | Sp: haste | Sz: Medium | Int: human. 21:09:19 ac = hd/2, maybe, and 5 + hd for knights? 21:09:21 -!- eb has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:09:26 _name(int& num = 0) will that still work in the function declaration? 21:10:08 i think then if i am needing a reference then the function will have to be called with the parameter. 21:10:16 Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.19-a0-552-g1526261 (34) 21:10:26 pleasingfungus: battlemage nerfs... 21:10:32 yeah 21:10:34 hrm 21:10:37 -!- olscumpy has joined ##crawl-dev 21:10:47 my hexer has seemed sort of tanky in lair, it's only really died to hydras i think 21:11:06 is 0 a valid int& anyway? 21:11:12 i very much doubt it 21:11:24 what would it be a reference to? 21:11:26 and the knight didn't die all game except when i abandoned it in v:$ but i guess being tanky is sort of the point there, but definitely feels like ac could be bumped down a bit 21:12:26 <|amethyst> Naruni: yeah, 0 won't work there 21:12:27 PleasingFungus: i can imagine it meaning "before you call this function, allocate an int on the stack, set it to 0, and then pass a reference to that as the param". but it seems that it doesn't mean that; it's just not allowed 21:12:43 that would be... odd 21:12:46 that is allowed if it were a const int& 21:12:50 unlike most of c++ 21:12:51 huh 21:13:10 this is why i'm scared to claim i know anything about c++ 21:13:10 -!- oxeimon has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 21:13:10 -!- Grivan has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:13:10 i think 21:13:11 wheals: that is what SO claims 21:13:37 regarding spellbinder -- is it a solution to make your summons not hate you if one attacks another 21:13:40 <|amethyst> amalloy: that's what happens if it's a const reference :) 21:13:43 PleasingFungus: do you care what class i remember? 21:13:52 <|amethyst> amalloy: conceptually anyway 21:14:02 amalloy: might be more useful to take a non-knight class 21:14:04 wait why did i take a hep altar. i just remembered i was supposed to be testing usk this game 21:14:07 lmao 21:14:09 owned 21:14:26 <|amethyst> amalloy: hey, that means you get to test hep wrath at the same time! 21:14:28 test hepl wrath as well 21:14:34 lol 21:14:37 heh 21:14:39 koboldina was testing that, apparently 21:14:40 pls. my streak 21:14:50 sent me some tells suggesting ways i could spice it up 21:15:05 PleasingFungus: IMO hep should change your character's name and gender 21:15:13 the inevitable fight with the ancestor 21:15:16 it actually does change your gender. 21:15:20 from unmentioned to unmentioned, right 21:15:23 :) 21:15:27 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: BTW, I have found my Hep mnemonic actually useful 21:15:28 unmentionable, imo 21:15:29 Hep says, "Hmm, I think YOU were actually Octavia!" 21:15:30 <_< 21:15:37 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: previously I could never remember whether the k or q comes first 21:15:58 secretly, i cannot type my own god's name 21:16:00 i blame grunt 21:16:01 |amethyst, can this be pushed please? it will help the rest of using items on the floor http://dpaste.com/12KTHM3 21:16:13 i remember the weird bit as being in alphabetical order 21:16:25 <|amethyst> Naruni: do you have specific errors in mind? 21:16:30 (i hope that is correct) 21:16:37 ??hepl 21:16:37 hepliaklqana[1/3]: God of ancestral memory. Grants a powerful, customizable permanent ancestor at ** piety, which will be automatically revived if slain (after a few dozen turns). Likes exploration. 0*: ally & recall, 2*: Remember Life, 3*: {Transference}, 4*: {Idealise}, 5*: Transference-slow 21:16:45 <|amethyst> Naruni: if so I think it would be better to use an enum rather than a raw int 21:16:52 bah, I forget the second l 21:16:56 i think it'd be nice to return a pair<> too 21:17:19 |amethyst, yes: PROMPT_ABORT, PROMPT_NOTHING, NO_SELECTABLE_ITEMS and possibly some others as situations arise 21:17:23 regret-index: the second l is my bane 21:17:29 <|amethyst> oh 21:17:40 at this point i remember that it exists, but placement is shakey 21:17:48 oh, what 21:17:55 does no one actually read that entry 21:18:18 !learn e hepliaklqana[1 s/ at ** piety// 21:18:18 ERROR: bad repetition operator: ** 21:18:18 !learn e hepliaklqana[1 s/ at [*][*] piety// 21:18:19 hepliaklqana[1/3]: God of ancestral memory. Grants a powerful, customizable permanent ancestor, which will be automatically revived if slain (after a few dozen turns). Likes exploration. 0*: ally & recall, 2*: Remember Life, 3*: {Transference}, 4*: {Idealise}, 5*: Transference-slow 21:18:32 <|amethyst> those are already plain ints because they are used alongside item indices 21:18:33 i mean, i guess i certainly didn't 21:18:43 haha https://www.reddit.com/r/roguelikes/comments/4mzwvg/after_days_of_hard_work_i_finished_my_last_year/ 21:18:44 the only important bit to read is the first word 21:18:54 :) 21:19:08 |amethyst, i dont follow 21:19:45 <|amethyst> Naruni: If you're using the existing PROMPT_* macros, then it does have to be an int after all 21:19:58 i agree 21:20:07 -!- miserium has quit [Quit: Page closed] 21:21:46 <|amethyst> Naruni: anyway, this should be included along with the changes that are going to use it 21:22:01 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.19-a0-553-g63c04df: Cut Hep ancestor AC 10(66 seconds ago, 1 file, 2+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/63c04df377ac 21:22:07 <|amethyst> I'm hesitant to commit something that just adds an unused parameter 21:22:25 Cut Hep...heh` 21:22:35 |amethyst, oh that makes sense, ok 21:22:37 no! bad gammafunk! 21:23:38 <|amethyst> Naruni: btw, could use PROMPT_INAPPROPRIATE for your 'no selectable items' code 21:23:42 <|amethyst> Naruni: possibly renaming it 21:23:46 <|amethyst> Naruni: it's currently unused 21:24:02 ??ancestor 21:24:02 ancestor[1/6]: A permanent companion granted by {Hepliaklqana}. Scales with the player's XL. Can be specialized into one of three types: Knight ([3]), Battlemage ([4]), or Hexer ([5]). 21:24:04 ??ancestor[2 21:24:04 ancestor[2/6]: HD = (player XL - 1)*2/3 + 1. HP = hd * 5 + max(0, (hd - 12) * 5). MR = hd*hd/2. Base AC = HD. Base damage = HD*3/2 + 3. 21:24:31 !learn e ancestor[2 s|AC [=] HD|AC = HD/2 21:24:32 ancestor[2/6]: HD = (player XL - 1)*2/3 + 1. HP = hd * 5 + max(0, (hd - 12) * 5). MR = hd*hd/2. Base AC = HD/2. Base damage = HD*3/2 + 3. 21:24:56 !learn e ancestor[3 s/5/7/ 21:24:56 ancestor[3/6]: Knight: melee companion. Starts with a longsword, a shield, and bonus AC; 7 + HD/2. XL 15: Choose a broad axe or demon trident, both flaming. XL 21: Haste and shield becomes a large shield of reflect. XL 27: Weapon ego changes to speed. 21:25:49 |amethyst, looking at it again, wouldn't PROMPT_NOTHING actually fill that? 21:27:37 -!- destrovel has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 21:28:16 <|amethyst> Naruni: aha 21:28:21 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:28:28 <|amethyst> Naruni: yeah, that's how prompt_invent_item uses it 21:29:50 PleasingFungus: how strong is the idealise might effect? 21:30:17 elon musk just got !!! damage against an elephant at only XL11, which seemed excessive for a battlemage 21:31:07 battlemage specifically is the 'high damage' variant 21:31:11 ?/elon 21:31:11 Matching terms (2): eithelonnen, elona; entries (6): eith[1] | elona[1] | hilarious_deaths[1] | lemuel[4] | merfolk[2] | sausage[1] 21:31:19 (custom ancestor name) 21:31:36 amalloy: lang=grunt? 21:31:49 chequers: with a quarterstaff! 21:32:40 ??! 21:32:40 ![1/3]: ! adds an annotation to your current floor. ! (glyph) represents a potion. See ![2] for !'s on hit. 21:32:43 ??![2 21:32:43 ![2/3]: If you hit something and the message ends with !, that means you did 7-17 damage. !!: 18-35. !!!: 36-71. !!!!: 72-143. !!!!!: 144-287. !!!!!!: 288+; and so on. Yikes! 21:32:48 yikes! 21:33:00 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:33:14 amalloy: battlemages have ~50% higher melee damage than other classes, and idealise doubles melee damage 21:33:29 battlemages are, notionally, the damage output class 21:33:44 the legendary 'cannon of glass' (except your glass is steel-reinforced?) 21:34:04 -!- nicolae- has joined ##crawl-dev 21:34:50 does it do anything to spell damage? 21:34:56 doubles spellpower 21:34:57 seems kinda knight-centric if not 21:34:59 aha 21:35:21 the ability desc claims "strength and armour" 21:35:32 which sounds physical 21:36:07 hm 21:36:24 could be rephrased 21:36:30 i thought 'attack strenght' very loudly when i wrote it 21:36:33 -!- PleasingFungus has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.92 [Firefox 46.0.1/20160502172042]] 21:36:48 he felt so bad about having to rephrase the description that he quit 21:36:58 -!- dpeg_ has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 21:38:29 -!- tealeaves has quit [Quit: Bye] 21:38:51 -!- Zekka has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 21:39:21 -!- jafet has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.5] 21:40:15 -!- kebab has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:43:43 !tell PleasingFungus can the Hep ancestor be shoot-through like shrooms and demonic guardians for quality of life? 21:43:43 ebering: OK, I'll let pleasingfungus know. 21:50:18 -!- Shard1697 has joined ##crawl-dev 21:53:31 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:58:59 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 22:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:00:16 -!- destrovel has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 22:03:24 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 22:03:39 -!- debo has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 22:03:54 -!- Kandayo has quit [Client Quit] 22:04:31 -!- jeefus has joined ##crawl-dev 22:06:53 -!- Leszczynek has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.2.0 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/] 22:06:54 -!- Amphouse has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 22:09:30 -!- maxonian has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 22:10:11 -!- zxc has joined ##crawl-dev 22:10:13 Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.19-a0-553-g63c04df (34) 22:13:59 ebering: doesn't that make it way too appealing to use your ancestor to plug up a corridor? 22:16:18 -!- Shard1697 has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 22:18:15 amalloy: polearms and pproj already exist 22:18:44 polearms don't let you shoot-through 100% of the time though, on purpose 22:19:34 crawl allies are in a weird place in this regard though 22:20:13 I dunno 22:23:33 -!- Crauler has quit [Quit: Page closed] 22:24:07 I like how the SA thread is basically completely terrified over the idea of smite bees 22:24:19 -!- oxeimon1 has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:24:35 The god that a year ago was THE evocations god becoming invocations based: Whatever 22:24:54 Killer bees with smiting: WHY 22:24:55 nemlex changes every other version 22:25:08 I thought it was every version 22:25:31 :) 22:25:41 bees are legit terrifying 22:25:48 one of only a few monsters that make me play slowly 22:26:29 -!- oxeimon has quit [Client Quit] 22:26:47 you draw a card... it is metamorphosis. this doesn't seem to belong here. nemelex becomes a god of invocations! 22:26:57 chequers, I still have regular nightmares featuring packs of caustic shrikes 22:27:26 -!- Lasty has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:27:40 * geekosaur considered making a joke about nem replacing jiyva as the god of change 22:27:43 I kinda wish they were either buffed a bit and spawned in smaller bands (or even singularly) or nerfed a bit if they stayed a pack monster. but I may just be a coward 22:27:49 It's just ramping up to the hot new evocable, Bag of Bees. <- I like it 22:29:04 arena comparisons with meliai bands: 65-35 rupert, 4-6 agnes 22:29:05 -!- tealeaves has quit [Quit: Bye] 22:30:20 yup that's pretty terrifying 22:30:32 especially given rupert hits like a truck 22:31:44 rupert reminds me of something 22:31:50 wiglaf? 22:32:06 have patience 22:32:24 03chequers02 07* 0.19-a0-518-g8d3156c: Buff Blood Saints (regret-index). 10(2 hours ago, 3 files, 25+ 11-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/8d3156c9716e 22:32:24 03regret-index02 07* 0.19-a0-555-g4192497: Merge pull request #293 from alexjurkiewicz/blood-saint-buff 10(8 seconds ago, 0 files, 0+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/41924973104f 22:33:35 @??demonspawn blood saint spells:fireball;iceblast;ghostly_fireball 22:33:35 Invalid spell slot format: 'fireball' in 'fireball;iceblast;ghostly_fireball' 22:33:46 * chequers waits for the description update with 200-word essay about "those explosions being regularly resisted by demons and how legendary destruction is currently bad due to variable ranges and effects and what not" 22:34:36 har. 22:34:37 btw, blood saints are suuuuper happy to damage allies with their attacking spells. It might be because of how legendary destruction is a pseudo-spell, so they don't realise they're doing it. But it seemed like an alright proposition 22:35:15 if you think it's a problem I'd look into it, but mostly I find enemies being unwilling to damage me when other enemies are near is a player buff 22:35:27 yeah, I'm not too worried 22:35:52 though that concern (alongside the whole demon elements/resists) is why orb of elec didn't make t to the list 22:36:06 it's more of a problem than you might think 22:36:23 monsters in a corridor blasting bolts through each other 22:36:28 helping the player out 22:36:55 no bolts any more 22:37:07 I'm talking in general 22:37:11 yeah 22:37:13 there are bolts a lot in the game 22:37:42 the big time i think AI should ignore allies is damnation 22:38:52 "Conjures two explosive magical effects in instant succession. The effects may be any mix of Fireball, Iceblast, or Ghostly Fireball." 22:38:54 perhaps damnation could just be 1x1 rather than 3x3 22:39:11 perhaps "The effects could be Fireball, ..." 22:39:15 I don't really see damnation as any particularly special case, unless you mean 'in extended' 22:39:27 But crawls hit AI could probably use some rethink in general 22:39:34 yeah, basically I mean "to make extended more dangerous" 22:39:42 @??hellion 22:39:42 hellion (042) | Spd: 12 | HD: 7 | HP: 33-44 | AC/EV: 5/10 | Dam: 10 | 05demonic, 10doors, unholy | Res: 06magic(60), 05damnation, 03poison, 04rot, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 384 | Sp: call down damnation (3d15) [06!sil] | Sz: Medium | Int: human. 22:39:57 -!- jefus- has joined ##crawl-dev 22:40:46 -!- wheals_ has joined ##crawl-dev 22:40:48 chequers: clearly, you should help with the next holies revamp :P 22:41:47 I'd rather someone reads my idle thoughts and implements it for me, it seems much simpler that way 22:42:19 holies revamp. step 1) remove holies. hail satan! 22:42:36 rip TSO summons 22:43:14 Since when did elephant become humanoid? You can say it by looking at their skeletons 22:43:21 -!- jefus has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:43:36 -!- wheals has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 22:43:38 -!- wheals_ is now known as wheals 22:43:41 -!- jeefus has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:43:45 -!- jefus has joined ##crawl-dev 22:43:49 * regret-index burns in agony. 22:44:16 <|amethyst> hmm 22:44:43 ...oh, right, monster is screwed up by that legendary destruction change? >_> 22:45:34 <|amethyst> hm 22:45:35 <|amethyst> I got an infinite recursion it looks like 22:45:41 <|amethyst> from legendary destruction 22:46:01 <|amethyst> hm 22:46:04 <|amethyst> not infinite recursion 22:46:31 should have waited for travis :) 22:47:12 <|amethyst> hm, can't reproduce that 22:47:13 pleh. 22:47:15 hm, travis failed due to network conections 22:47:27 <|amethyst> oh here we go 22:47:35 but I mean, it works at least some times locally 22:48:26 !lg * recent ckiller=killer_bee s=place 22:48:27 9430 games for * (recent ckiller=killer_bee): 2462x D:7, 1943x D:8, 1065x D:9, 810x D:6, 783x D:4, 736x D:3, 672x D:5, 366x D:10, 149x D:11, 127x D:2, 91x Lair:1, 42x Lair:2, 42x D:12, 34x Lair:3, 27x Temple, 16x D:1, 13x D:13, 11x Lair:4, 7x Lair:5, 6x D:14, 5x Orc:1, 5x Lair:7, 5x Lair:6, 3x Abyss:3, 2x Abyss:4, 2x D:15, 2x Orc:3, 2x Lab, Sewer, Abyss:1 22:48:56 !lg * recent killer=meliai 22:48:56 No games for * (recent killer=meliai). 22:49:07 <|amethyst> oh 22:49:09 <|amethyst> it's this loop 22:49:12 !lg * recent killer~~meliai|ikiller~~meliai 22:49:13 No games for * (recent killer~~meliai|ikiller~~meliai). 22:49:23 I don't think any servers have updated with them yet 22:49:27 <|amethyst> while (grid_distance(mons->pos(), mons->target) > range) 22:49:30 cpo has 22:49:34 ah 22:49:42 and cjr updates hourly 22:49:48 |amethyst: is that... the range adjustment code 22:50:04 <|amethyst> well 22:50:11 -!- simmarine has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:50:18 <|amethyst> it's picking a different spell until it finds one with a good range 22:50:19 which shouldn't be called on anyway considering the fireballs all have the same range? >_> 22:50:28 ...uh oh 22:51:10 <|amethyst> simplest fix would be to make the range of legendary destruction 5 (then remove this code) 22:51:42 would you like a PR? 22:52:02 <|amethyst> hm 22:52:20 <|amethyst> I can do that 22:52:23 does major destruction call on the same range adjustment? 22:52:24 <|amethyst> but would it be better to do that or to make it full-range? 22:52:37 probably shouldn't cheat 22:52:43 there's also vestigial code I didn't remove at mon-cast.cc line 6096 22:52:47 about IOOD 22:53:05 <|amethyst> yeah, I have that already 22:53:15 well, all the fireballs are range 5 22:53:33 <|amethyst> I meant, make it give range-8 fireballs 22:53:53 i prefer max-los since I don't think crawl communicates less-than-los-range monster spells well/at all 22:54:40 <|amethyst> it does communicate them at all now, but it's buried a bit 22:54:49 there is parity with player stuff, for whatever value symmetry keeps 22:55:15 <|amethyst> it even shows the monster glyph 22:55:20 <|amethyst> Range : 6------> 22:55:30 range-one monster spells are pretty well communicated but that's only for vampiric draining and ghosts with freeze 22:55:36 console reasons :) 22:55:49 and throw 22:56:02 yeah throw makes intuitive sense 22:56:47 maybe i should submit a pr to make range a number 22:57:16 at any rate, while future changes might be reasonable, for now it seems most reasonable to make legendary destruction mirror its components 22:57:24 which are all derivative of one spell 22:58:14 (future sweeping changes, I mean) 22:58:38 i think pf had opinions on said sweeping changes 23:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:02:30 -!- DevlanMud|Lappy has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:03:56 03|amethyst02 07* 0.19-a0-556-g111ede8: Checkwhite. 10(7 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/111ede86d090 23:03:56 03|amethyst02 07* 0.19-a0-557-ga0db8be: Remove some leftover Legendary Destruction IOOD code. 10(7 minutes ago, 1 file, 0+ 11-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/a0db8be4d7a5 23:03:56 03|amethyst02 07* 0.19-a0-558-gb769e50: Fix a Legendary Destruction freeze. 10(46 seconds ago, 2 files, 1+ 10-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/b769e5006604 23:04:32 thanks, |amethyst 23:05:04 might be worth adding a comment to _legendary_destruction_spell about this 23:05:33 // If you add a spell with a smaller range, you'll need to re-add code like what was removed in b769e50 23:05:43 <|amethyst> well 23:05:51 <|amethyst> I haven't tested, but I *think* 23:06:04 <|amethyst> that the spell would get its range extended 23:06:21 -!- ZiBuDo has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:06:54 <|amethyst> that loop wouldn't work anyway 23:07:02 <|amethyst> with the restructured code 23:07:35 <|amethyst> because it now picks the spell after doing setup_mons_cast 23:08:04 <|amethyst> oh, both before and after 23:08:39 <|amethyst> err, inside and after 23:09:12 yeah. I'm not sure if you need the call to _legendary_destruction_spell elsewhere in the file, but I didn't want to touch it :P 23:10:04 <|amethyst> oh, hm 23:10:09 <|amethyst> I wonder now 23:10:21 Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.19-a0-555-g4192497 (34) 23:10:54 <|amethyst> I think it might be taking some properties from the spell picked there, and other properties from the one picked in the call to mons_cast 23:11:21 How about allies using fire_stop when player is on line of fire (behind the target)? 23:13:07 if I banish an enemy wearing an artifact, is it lost forever or can I find him in Abyss:1? 23:13:32 <|amethyst> depends on the enemy 23:13:42 vault warden, not unique 23:14:04 <|amethyst> @??vault warden 23:14:04 vault warden (04p) | Spd: 10 | HD: 16 | HP: 73-104 | AC/EV: 10/10 | Dam: 36 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, fighter, see invisible | Res: 06magic(60) | XP: 1705 | Sp: seal doors | Sz: Medium | Int: human. 23:14:45 is it based on HD? 23:15:18 <|amethyst> yes, but I'm not 100% sure exactly when that triggers 23:15:43 looking at monster::banish it seems like every monster gets killed if they're banished 23:15:43 <|amethyst> ah 23:15:45 <|amethyst> I see now 23:16:04 if it was an unrandart and gets destroyed you can find it in abyss 23:16:15 it was unrandart 23:16:28 so if you have +18 wyrmbane and decide you would rather reset its enchantment to the original +9 or whatever, you can throw it in lava then scum abyss until you find it again 23:16:38 <|amethyst> minmay: ? 23:16:40 -!- PleasingFungus has joined ##crawl-dev 23:16:57 <|amethyst> minmay: do you know when that bug was introduced? 23:16:57 secret tech 23:17:21 -!- Sorbius has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:17:45 oh, my mistake 23:17:46 i think i only really had opinions on soh breath 23:17:46 PleasingFungus: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 23:17:47 you can't use lava 23:18:00 i don't have opinions on legendary destruction etc 23:18:04 but you can destroy it by putting too many items on one level 23:18:07 however, wrt willingness to hurt allies 23:18:09 PleasingFungus: it was more about the range of monster spells 23:18:11 but is banishment considered destroying the artifact? 23:18:11 then it can generate again in abyss 23:18:13 oh 23:18:14 legmajorendary destruction 23:18:48 it can generate again in abyss if you banished a monster with it, yeah 23:18:49 I think I remember you talking about how you wish most monster spells were either 1 or max-los range 23:19:02 my feeling is that it's something that crawl communicates poorly, that's sort of a pain to eyeball for most ranges, and that generally isn't a great fit in crawl 23:19:11 +1 23:19:16 minmay, thanks! 23:19:28 i'd be very happy if there was better ui for it 23:19:28 since i think it's a cool design space 23:19:30 i just don't know how that'd work 23:19:38 <|amethyst> aha 23:19:49 <|amethyst> yeah, now I see the code that does what minmay is talking about 23:19:59 clearly give up and just average every spell to max, half, or 1 range 23:20:38 ranges which are fine: 1, 2, max, maybe 3? 23:21:43 <|amethyst> JStrange_: so either 1. the vault warden passed the chance (about 1/3) to survive abyssing, in which case it will be carrying around the weapon in the abyss 23:22:07 <|amethyst> JStrange_: or 2. the weapon was marked "lost in the abyss" in which case it is allowed to generate in the abyss 23:22:38 |amethyst, thanks! at least now I know how it works 23:22:49 are there any 3-range spells? 23:22:51 possibly not 23:22:56 oh, also 23:23:00 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: monster spells? 23:23:08 cause fear! 23:23:12 <|amethyst> LCS 23:23:17 ?? 23:23:31 crazy 23:23:32 <|amethyst> wait 23:23:39 ...oh, right, the legendary destruction message is still doubled-up 23:23:41 wait, not cause fear 23:23:51 haha 23:23:58 conjure flame? 23:24:00 but yeah i guess lcs is? that seems a lot shorter than i remembered 23:24:09 cloud cone 23:24:12 also, force lance 23:24:13 <|amethyst> range-3 spells: conjure flame, LCS, force lance, berserk other 23:24:17 wtf is cloud cone 23:24:23 rod of clouds 23:24:37 I think this is bad ui-wise because then some people might think blood saints double-acted instead of getting to use a specific double-cast 23:24:47 regret-index: ah. I figured it was more explicit this way 23:25:05 the first message could... mention "twin wraths" or something. 23:25:45 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:25:48 i wonder what prints the message 23:25:52 !source setup_mons_cast 23:25:53 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/mon-cast.cc#l1051 23:26:02 berserk other having a limited range is probably the worst of the lot 23:26:26 <|amethyst> don't print in setup_mons_cast 23:26:26 -!- jafet has joined ##crawl-dev 23:26:28 though of course I hesitate to say moths of wrath should be buffed or nerfed 23:26:51 yeah nah i'm just trying to find the code 23:27:40 <|amethyst> chequers: mons_cast_noise 23:27:59 <|amethyst> could pass do_noise = false to the recursive calls 23:28:10 <|amethyst> hm 23:29:08 !source mons_cast_noise 23:29:08 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/mon-cast.cc#l6765 23:29:15 03regret-index02 07* 0.19-a0-559-ga3d69d0: Some more Legendary Destruction edge clean-up 10(2 minutes ago, 4 files, 29+ 20-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/a3d69d02d147 23:29:28 moths of wrath should be buffed and nerfed 23:29:42 <|amethyst> chequers: I guess you'd need to leave the noise on the first spell but not the second 23:29:46 I think displaying range of spells when you xv a monster would be good 23:29:52 <|amethyst> chequers: or make the noise first 23:30:00 and also maybe making more monster spells have LOS range would be good 23:30:02 <|amethyst> elliptic: outside the spell description you mean? 23:30:07 |amethyst: that seems reasonable 23:30:27 <|amethyst> chequers: ah, you'd definitely want to make the noise first and pass false to both calls 23:30:37 oh? 23:30:41 I do think there are some effects that would be problematic at LOS range though 23:30:45 <|amethyst> chequers: otherwise you're getting the casting messages and casting noise of those spells 23:30:46 moths being a good example 23:30:52 <|amethyst> chequers: rather than of legendary destruction 23:30:52 -!- nicolae- has left ##crawl-dev 23:31:03 maybe indicate in some way if you're in range 23:31:10 like changing the text color 23:31:20 but seriously: ghost moths should be nerfed by removing the invis (they don't even have blink or batty) and pointless stat drain, but should be buffed by making them do more damage 23:31:21 <|amethyst> what text color? 23:31:21 |amethyst: oh, it is already in the spell description? yeah, I was thinking of a number next to the name of the spell or something 23:31:31 -!- wheals has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:31:43 maybe wheals' suggestion is better though 23:31:47 <|amethyst> elliptic: you even get the monster's glyph in place of the @ in the y--> diagram :) 23:32:00 |amethyst: which monster glyph? 23:32:03 which just really confuses tiles players :) 23:32:16 <|amethyst> elliptic: of the monster whose spell you're viewing 23:32:17 hm, I will look at legendary destruction messaging later 23:32:24 <|amethyst> elliptic: if you view it from the monster description, that is 23:32:45 |amethyst: oh, I thought you meant that for monster spells targetting a monster it showed y-->X or something :P 23:32:56 <|amethyst> ah, no 23:32:59 !learn add chequers_todo legendary destruction gives two messages. make the noise first and pass false to both mons_cast calls, otherwise you're getting the messages and noise of the fireball rather than legendary destruction 23:32:59 chequers todo[1/1]: legendary destruction gives two messages. make the noise first and pass false to both mons_cast calls, otherwise you're getting the messages and noise of the fireball rather than legendary destruction 23:33:02 <|amethyst> y---> instead of @---> 23:33:17 <|amethyst> probably we have PF to thank for that little touch? 23:35:32 that's silly, since when do killer bees cast spells??? 23:36:03 -!- destrovel has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:36:16 @??moth of wrath 23:36:16 moth of wrath (04y) | Spd: 12 | HD: 9 | HP: 40-59 | AC/EV: 0/10 | Dam: 2505(rage) | fly | Res: 06magic(40) | XP: 502 | Sp: berserk other [11!AM, 06!sil] | Sz: small | Int: animal. 23:36:23 <|amethyst> @??queen bee 23:36:23 queen bee (13y) | Spd: 10 | HD: 7 | HP: 33-44 | AC/EV: 10/10 | Dam: 2008(poison:14-28) | fly | Res: 06magic(20) | Vul: 09poison | Chunks: 14noxious | XP: 304 | Sp: berserk other [11!AM, 06!sil], berserk other [11!AM, 06!sil, 04emergency] | Sz: little | Int: animal. 23:36:34 dammit, don't prove me wrong 23:36:35 berserk other is the y--->, duh 23:36:51 besides that's a "spell" 23:37:05 <|amethyst> @??meliai 23:37:05 meliai (03y) | Spd: 20 | HD: 7 | HP: 20-28 | AC/EV: 6/14 | Dam: 14, 1208(poison:14-28) | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, priest, evil, fly | Res: 06magic(20) | Vul: 09poison, 08holy | Chunks: 14noxious | XP: 299 | Sp: smiting (7-17) [11!AM], heal other (2d3) [11!AM] | Sz: small | Int: human. 23:37:15 meliai have invocations, completely different. 23:37:15 ok well now clearly that's just fake 23:37:30 so are meliai going to remain evil 23:37:31 it's like when |amethyst used to log in as Cheibriados and send messages 23:37:34 <|amethyst> next thing you'll be telling us that decks are invoked, not evoked 23:37:36 or are they going to be classified as not-evil 23:37:59 I think the nameless god should count as not-evil and- 23:38:07 -!- VoxSomniator has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:38:16 monsters should get innate MH_EVIL tags or something 23:38:42 |amethyst: btw, I find the ----> thing not very useful - I just have to count how long it is, and there is still confusion about whether the end square is the > or the blank square after the > 23:39:39 <|amethyst> elliptic: there's probably room to draw a box :) 23:39:41 I know that there would still be confusion if we just gave a number (does range 2 mean two empty squares between the monster and me?) but maybe we should at least do both 23:39:54 <|amethyst> (for monster spells, not player) 23:40:46 <|amethyst> elliptic: could be less cute and replace the @ or monster glyph with the range 23:41:04 i remember that was suggested before 23:41:12 <|amethyst> elliptic: especially now that LOS_RADIUS is not 8 :/ 23:41:20 not that i'm voting against 23:41:23 <|amethyst> statues are rude! 23:41:30 by box you mean show a 7x7 square with the @/monster in the center for range 3, etc? 23:41:47 maybe with the arrow too I guess 23:42:01 <|amethyst> elliptic: yeah... probably won't actually fit for spells with LOS radius and long descriptions though 23:42:07 <|amethyst> and takes up a lot of space for those 23:42:11 yeah, 15 rows is a lot 23:42:12 tinyterm unreasons 23:42:15 would be cool if you could draw the actual los 23:42:18 -!- Zekka has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:42:21 with in-range things colored 23:42:25 but yeah maybe won't all fit 23:42:31 <|amethyst> hm 23:42:35 hm, that would help a lot 23:42:37 if you could do that 23:42:39 <|amethyst> if monsters had just one spell it would be much easier 23:42:43 <|amethyst> you could make a | mode 23:42:45 in pfcrawl... 23:42:51 <|amethyst> that displays a halo around each monster 23:43:13 <|amethyst> also if there were just one monster 23:43:15 <|amethyst> with one spell 23:43:25 <|amethyst> obviously that's where development is headed 23:43:30 obviously. 23:43:34 <|amethyst> at least that's what Tavern tells me 23:43:35 what's the spell? 23:43:42 Cast Fist 23:43:59 <|amethyst> probably that Stab spell minmay was proposing for stab crab 23:44:11 i missed stab crab :( 23:44:21 he was trying to recycle and old meme 23:44:27 and claim he discovered it 23:44:33 <|amethyst> #<@t.0# 23:44:36 <|amethyst> ultimate sprint 23:44:47 http://66.media.tumblr.com/3cac3e03252d946a908c78df595d26b9/tumblr_minkl7prWG1r5x7c3o1_1280.png meme's 23:45:09 |amethyst: hm, even for monsters with spells with multiple ranges you could at least use the longest range the monster has 23:45:21 could even just color things differently while xing over the monster 23:45:23 man, m e m e s. 23:45:34 I hate weaponizing them here, but 23:45:36 <|amethyst> elliptic: ooh, I like highlighting in x 23:45:37 pretty dank, right? 23:45:51 |amethyst: how do you deal with monsters with multiple spells each with a different range 23:46:01 - |amethyst 23:46:03 as in, if you are in x mode and are over a monster, then all squares that can be affected by an action by the monster are highlighted 23:46:07 didn't elliptic just answer that 23:46:15 <|amethyst> chequers: either what elliptic said 23:46:16 <|amethyst> or 23:46:16 it was a good answer! i liked the answer! 23:46:27 not sure if it should include stuff like centaurs 23:46:29 <|amethyst> since you have only a limited number of slots 23:46:45 <|amethyst> you could highlight each different range in a different colour 23:46:49 though even for centaurs it would help with figuring out which squares are in LoS of the centaur 23:47:14 |amethyst: that might get too busy, not sure 23:47:18 <|amethyst> and then once we've got the basic functionality for visualising a monster's LOS 23:47:24 obviously the pro strat is to x-e the centaur every turn 23:47:30 <|amethyst> we can implement a spell that lets you take over and control a monster 23:47:36 CanOfWorms: people actually do that sometimes 23:47:42 heh 23:47:45 <|amethyst> paradroid crawl 23:47:47 I have created an exclusion to make sure I know the monster's LoS 23:47:48 i'd want to start with just spells 23:47:49 yeah I've done x-e before 23:47:51 colour mixing crawl 23:47:51 yeah 23:48:00 -!- WalkerBoh has joined ##crawl-dev 23:48:11 -!- Taraiph has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 23:48:15 red green yellow for the first three spells 23:48:17 would you colour orc knights' los, because they might have stones? 23:48:21 <|amethyst> one issue is that this makes targetting slower 23:48:30 then cyan yellow magenta for the second monster's first three spells 23:48:31 <|amethyst> for the same reason as darken_beyond_range 23:48:35 PleasingFungus: we already keep track for the player of whether a monster has shown a ranged attack 23:48:40 one of my favorite uses of x-e that I saw someone do is go to elf and make an E every time they killed a blademaster or master archer 23:48:46 I wonder if people will think we have a new god that offers players rainbow halos 23:48:49 since they know like 2 of each would be in the vault 23:48:53 PleasingFungus: so you'd only do it for orc knights if you have seen them use a ranged attack 23:49:00 idk 23:49:04 i don't feel super strongly about this, i guess 23:49:06 exclusions for note taking 23:49:07 PleasingFungus: but I agree we could start with spells 23:49:40 are there any non-spell ranged attacks which aren't full-los 23:49:41 I just think it might make sense to extend it to other ranged attacks too 23:49:56 -!- n1k has joined ##crawl-dev 23:49:56 chequers: polearms, sort of 23:50:09 rip limited ranged throwing nets 23:50:11 and rocks 23:50:33 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 23:51:15 gammafunk: I use exclusions sometimes to record where I was standing when I heard timed portal messages 23:51:22 fr all species can throw large rocks at 0 range but you get +1 range per 5 strength 23:51:36 <|amethyst> elliptic: waypoints are less intrusive :) 23:51:51 hrm, I guess I can see that 23:52:25 |amethyst: but you can't see them on the map! 23:52:30 you can only travel to them 23:52:35 or can you see them on X now? 23:52:39 I think they show up on X 23:52:47 but I haven't used or thought about waypoints in years 23:52:58 in that case yeah I guess you could use them 23:53:00 ugh so many files to change here 23:53:03 I don't remember how to make them though! 23:53:30 PleasingFungus: after playing more hep disregard my message it seems fine 23:53:53 :) 23:53:59 you will be shocked to hear you weren't the first person to suggest that 23:54:05 <|amethyst> X 23:54:11 i'm resisting it on principle of 'too many special cases!' 23:54:12 ??antique lich 23:54:12 antique lich[1/1]: Just a recoloured and renamed {ancient lich}. You'll get a lot for one, if it's in mint condition! 23:54:16 and also that yeah there are plenty of ways to deal with it 23:54:21 <|amethyst> XWWWWW to cycle 23:54:29 also, fedhas needs some turf to call its own! 23:54:33 so to speak 23:54:36 <|amethyst> and you can G, unlike exclusions 23:55:15 |amethyst: you need to introduce something to give people more reason to stash, then waypoints will come back in style 23:55:26 the antique lich is so weird considering that the zonguldrok wizlab is otherwise pretty straightforward with the undead rising from their graves and what not 23:55:36 those zombies really do need a buff 23:55:38 last I checked 23:55:42 <|amethyst> gammafunk: I usually do use a waypoint for my spellbook stash 23:55:45 they used to be human zombies! 23:55:48 ug 23:56:02 lol 23:56:04 |amethyst: I do kind of make some small stashes still 23:56:06 theme uber alles 23:56:07 making less zombies and letting them be more than ogre zombies seems reasonable though. 23:56:07 <|amethyst> gammafunk: I still keep a spellbook stash because it's nice to see all my available spells on one screen 23:56:10 I just never waypoint them 23:56:21 PleasingFungus: i was mostly annoyed becasue I took D:2 hep on a HuWz and then couldn't dart through my ancestor without thinking about it 23:56:42 seems like meph + ancestor would be quite strong 23:57:11 yes it is :) 23:57:13 -!- AreBrandon has joined ##crawl-dev 23:57:43 <|amethyst> I don't think not being able to shoot through your ancestor is any worse than not being able to shoot through your called imps 23:57:53 <|amethyst> it's better in fact 23:58:13 <|amethyst> since you won't anger your ancestor if you do manage to hit it 23:58:20 hrm, norris is technically out of his placement in the vaults entrance anyway 23:58:38 <|amethyst> and you can recall it out of the way 23:58:52 <|amethyst> (without needing another spell)