00:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:04:55 -!- RedFeather has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.92 [Firefox 46.0.1/20160502172042]] 00:05:11 fuck me 00:06:47 corrupted memory 00:07:49 hrm 00:07:58 hrm. 00:07:58 is uka on cxc yet 00:09:07 Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.19-a0-214-g62d10c9 (34) 00:13:55 -!- HellTiger has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:15:49 -!- Insomniak has quit [Quit: I like to rock] 00:16:50 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:17:46 !versions 00:17:52 %git 00:17:52 07|amethyst02 * 0.19-a0-214-g62d10c9: Don't put shrikes in the bennu genus (elliptic) 10(70 minutes ago, 5 files, 13+ 7-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/62d10c936acd 00:18:03 !version 00:18:07 trunk: 0.19-a0-199-g2bafcdf; 0.18: 0.18.1-8-gdd0e5ea; 0.17: 0.17.2; 0.16: 0.16.2-12-gd0ad4c3; 0.15: 0.15.2; 0.14: 0.14.2; 0.13: 0.13.2; 0.12: 0.12.3; 0.11: 0.11.3; 0.10: 0.10.3-19-g6f05415 00:18:15 oh 00:18:17 ??bots 00:18:17 bots[1/3]: Bots that can be pm'd: announcement bots: Henzell (CAO, !), Gretell (CDO, @), Lantell (CUE, $), Rotatell (CBRO, ^), Eksell (CXC, |), Jorgrell (CJR, =); others: Varmin, Cheibriados (%), and Sequell (! ?? & and others) 00:18:21 |version 00:18:22 trunk: 0.19-a0-188-ga21aea4; 0.18: 0.18.1-8-gdd0e5ea; 0.17: 0.17.2; 0.16: 0.16.2-12-gd0ad4c3; 0.15: 0.15.2; 0.14: 0.14.2 00:18:41 seems not yet 00:18:50 ??rebuild 00:18:50 rebuild[1/2]: http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rebuild/ http://underhound.eu:81/rebuild/ http://crawl.berotato.org/crawl/rebuild/ http://crawl.xtahua.com/rebuild/ Bug Grunt, |amethyst, or Nap Kin for CDO. Use your powers wisely. 00:18:52 ??rebuild[2 00:18:52 rebuild[2/2]: Trunk update start times in UTC (second number during summer time): CAO: 1700; CDO: 0600/0500; CLAN: 2300/2200; CBRO: 0800/0700; CXC: 0500/0400; CPO: every 15 minutes 00:19:25 in about 40 mins 00:19:28 -!- Dracunos has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 00:19:37 it's so exciting! 00:20:25 assuming you're registered on zotpass and have paid for the gozag-tier membership, of course 00:24:09 !tell lasty the ukayaw wrath for berserking monsters may want to copy how gozag does it now. The best way to avoid ukayaw wrath is to let monsters get berserked and walk backwards 00:24:10 chequers: OK, I'll let lasty know. 00:24:39 pf: are you fine with the very light sprinkling of rime drakes on ice caves for now, incidentally? 00:28:16 -!- flappity has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:28:42 -!- flappity has joined ##crawl-dev 00:29:35 Unstable branch on CRAWL.XTAHUA.COM updated to: 0.19-a0-214-g62d10c9 (34) 00:30:57 -!- jehoesefat has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:33:23 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:33:49 !lg * cv=0.18|0.19-a place=Spider:4|Swamp:4|Snake:4|Shoals:4 kmap!~uniq s=kmap 00:33:50 703 games for * (cv=0.18|0.19-a place=Spider:4|Swamp:4|Snake:4|Shoals:4 kmap!~uniq): 278x, 29x swamp_old_school, 29x shoals_iceberg_rune, 22x grunt_spider_rune_parallel, 21x spider_rune_water, 21x snake_pit, 20x grunt_snake_rune_serpentine_throne, 19x swamp_alternative, 17x shoals_iceberg, 15x johnstein_snake_rune_scales, 14x swamp, 14x swamp_basic_johnstein, 14x grunt_spider_rune_circles, 12x swa... 00:33:59 shoals_iceberg_rune 00:34:48 !lg * cv>=0.18 kmap~~shoals_iceberg s=ckiller 00:34:49 51 games for * (cv>=0.18 kmap~~shoals_iceberg): 13x a frost giant, 8x a water nymph, 7x a merfolk impaler, 6x a merfolk aquamancer, 6x an alligator snapping turtle, 5x a merfolk javelineer, 2x a manticore, 2x a snapping turtle, a sea snake, a wind drake 00:35:34 frost giants having double the kills of javelineers, what 00:38:14 frost giant (12C) | Spd: 10 | HD: 16 | HP: 84-120 | AC/EV: 9/3 | Dam: 35 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, fighter, spellcaster, see invisible | Res: 06magic(80), 02cold++, 12drown | XP: 1747 | Sp: b.cold (3d25) | Sz: Giant | Int: human. 00:38:14 %??frost giant 00:38:19 merfolk javelineer (00m) | Spd: 10 (swim: 60%) | HD: 13 | HP: 66-90 | AC/EV: 3/14 | Dam: 17 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, master archer, amphibious | Res: 06magic(60), 12drown | XP: 1129 | Sz: Medium | Int: human. 00:38:19 %??merfolk javelineer 00:38:57 well, they are certainly nastier enemies individually 00:39:31 (maybe shoals shouldn't have frost giants be one of the most dangerous monsters in it?) 00:40:13 -!- zxc has joined ##crawl-dev 00:40:47 Yeah, I appreciate the attempt at ice theme, but... 00:41:17 !kw recent 00:41:17 Keyword: recent => cv>=0.17 00:41:21 !kw current 00:41:22 Keyword: current => cv>=0.18 00:41:33 regret-index: current will gives you stable+trunk 00:41:43 it is hard to remember all those kw though 00:41:53 and they shift meaning! 00:42:10 yeah we try to only change them after release though 00:42:29 we being the mysterious Sequell cabal 00:43:02 -!- Shard1697 has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:43:19 I think the ice end I got in shoals actually has two frost giants 00:43:22 which seems a bit much 00:43:27 -!- amalloy is now known as amalloy_ 00:43:38 we have a single kraken in the other rune vaults, which ends up being a way easier monster 00:44:03 and by end I mean the rune vault itself, which is the only one I think that places those 00:44:22 almost surprised grunt didn't throw in shard shrikes... 00:45:10 a single kraken in the cave rune vault, which places two less 0s 00:45:27 actually, the ice end has a 1/3 chance for a kraken simulacrum ontop of the frost giants... 00:46:26 regret-index: i don't feel strongly about it 00:46:48 I realize that the ice kraken is probably just never going to be a dangerous monster baring some real "don't have rc" stupidity, but two frost giants is a bit much as supplement 00:47:26 !lg * shoals ikiller~~kraken_simu 00:47:29 8. WalkerBoh the Warrior (L19 KoCj of Okawaru), slain by a tentacle (attached to a kraken simulacrum) on Shoals:4 (shoals_iceberg_rune) on 2016-05-15 06:15:33, with 207306 points after 39622 turns and 1:37:55. 00:47:33 !lg * shoals ikiller~~kraken_simu s=kmap 00:47:34 should I bring combo_gods back soon? 00:47:34 8 games for * (shoals ikiller~~kraken_simu): 7x, shoals_iceberg_rune 00:47:43 hrm 00:47:58 oh...the tentacles maybe? 00:48:03 !lg * shoals ikiller~~kraken_simu s=kmap -2 00:48:04 8 games for * (shoals ikiller~~kraken_simu): 7x, shoals_iceberg_rune 00:48:08 !lg * shoals ikiller~~kraken_simu s=kmap -2 00:48:09 8 games for * (shoals ikiller~~kraken_simu): 7x, shoals_iceberg_rune 00:48:11 sounds like uka will be bonafide soon 00:48:12 doh 00:48:18 !lg * shoals ikiller~~kraken_simu -2 00:48:19 7/8. namelastname112 the Impassioned (L17 DrAs of Ukayaw), slain by a tentacle (attached to a kraken simulacrum) on Shoals:4 (shoals_iceberg_rune) on 2016-04-21 09:43:37, with 163673 points after 38239 turns and 1:41:59. 00:48:28 (if I'm reading the backlog accurately) 00:48:28 now that's interesting 00:48:30 hep will be also, barring whatever problems pf is facing at the moment 00:48:34 ah ok 00:48:38 uka is merged in trunk, johnstein 00:48:42 so uka is now 00:48:45 so sounds like no combo_gods needed soon? 00:49:06 oh, yeah I guess until PF decides that hep is ready to merge, you want to keep that 00:49:09 !lg * shoals ikiller~~kraken_simu -3 00:49:10 6/8. cybersaint2k the Fighter (L16 DsGl of Cheibriados), demolished by a tentacle segment (created by a kraken simulacrum) on Shoals:4 (shoals_iceberg_rune) on 2016-04-01 18:40:43, with 132118 points after 26194 turns and 14:32:01. 00:49:19 well, I haven't brought back experimentals yet 00:49:24 ok, so tentacle segments don't give the kmap 00:49:42 usually I wait till there's a decent update on one of the experimental branches, or a direct request 00:49:44 man, if only player resists at time of kill were logfile fields 00:50:04 ...oh, there's no 0 subst in that ice end rune either 00:50:23 johnstein: oh, well PleasingFungus is the best to ask, but I would say that hep development is very much active 00:50:49 so frost giants + higher average than the other rune huts in exchange for... diagonal entryway? yeeesh. 00:50:54 -!- Rust3dCor3 has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 00:51:15 sometimes...grunt....does things... 00:51:19 * gammafunk trails off 00:51:33 !blame grunt doing things 00:51:33 I pronounce grunt doing things... Guilty! 00:51:37 I'll probably bring it back within a week or so then 00:51:53 johnstein: I'll try to make a tourney post tomorrow, so thanks for the graphs 00:51:59 wheals will be around any day now to remind me to switch trunk back to default 00:52:26 -!- CanOfWorms has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.92 [Firefox 3.6.28/20120306064154]] 00:52:31 gammafunk, np. like I said, I kinda wanted to do more, but ran out of juice 00:52:39 I would do a quickfix but I think pf would screech at me 00:52:41 johnstein: i'm currently working on merging hep into master 00:52:54 PleasingFungus, good luck! 00:52:55 what, about nerfing that vault a bit? surely not! 00:52:58 yeah....... 00:53:28 regret-index: ? 00:54:14 because it'd slightly interrupt said merging? 00:55:11 a commit storm approaches 00:55:17 i don't think it would 00:55:25 -!- Shard1697 has joined ##crawl-dev 00:55:26 if i'm understanding you correctly 00:55:31 anyway don't hold off on me, this is gonna take... a bit... 00:55:49 git rebase --abort count: 3 00:56:08 fun fun 00:56:29 git reset --hard 00:56:43 PleasingFungus, are you rebasing combo_gods then? or merging? 00:56:56 sounds like a merge, johnstein 00:57:15 since he's rebasing it onto master 00:57:26 like dragons onto firewood 00:57:52 well, he just said rebase, so I got confused for a moment thinking that he was rebasing combo_gods to master 00:58:02 well that's what you'd do for a merge, yeah 00:58:11 I mean, it's not a git merge 00:58:20 but it's an easy way to merge a branch 00:58:26 yup 00:58:58 I was interpretting 'merge' as 'git merge'. so seeing 'rebase' for a sec made me think that I misread above and combo_gods was coming back as a rebased branch 00:59:33 rather than an intermediate step in easily merging hep into trunk 00:59:49 (i.e. if it's a rebased combo_gods, I have to do more work to get it to play nice) 01:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:00:40 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 01:00:58 I'm just going to stop rambling and chalk it up to me being exhausted tonight and misreading pretty much everything. 01:01:35 this field needs better jargon 01:03:11 i mean 01:03:15 i would not have described it as a merge 01:03:21 since at no point am i performing a 'git merge command' 01:03:23 so 01:03:26 v0v 01:03:30 -!- LexAckson__ has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:03:40 VoV 01:04:06 v_V 01:07:15 -!- jeefus has joined ##crawl-dev 01:08:15 -!- JStrange has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:08:49 ^_^ 01:10:43 -!- hellmonk has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 01:10:52 -!- jefus has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 01:13:05 -!- waat has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:13:23 -!- johlstei has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:13:43 -!- johlstei has joined ##crawl-dev 01:13:45 -!- mango_lives has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:14:01 -!- GauHelldragon has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:15:28 -!- VoxSomniator has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:17:16 okay, now just gotta squish 83 commits 01:17:55 -!- amalloy_ is now known as amalloy 01:17:58 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 01:18:54 I fucked it up!!! 01:19:59 PleasingFungus: you can always put it back together 01:20:04 impossible 01:25:40 -!- crate has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:29:22 it's git 01:29:39 to suggest undo is possible is to misunderstand git at a fundamental level 01:29:52 there is roll forward, and there is rm -rf + re-clone 01:29:57 haha 01:30:01 I <3 The Reflog 01:30:50 lmao 01:30:53 I <3 git branch AwesomeBranch-bak 01:31:00 !tell lasty you re-added _Sacrifice_Messages... 01:31:01 PleasingFungus: OK, I'll let lasty know. 01:31:10 reflog is cool 01:31:14 We fear the reflog 01:31:17 i guess 01:31:59 i was wondering why that was showing up in the rebase 01:32:28 https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/23faf3b4bf32dd5bf43ef3ac02330daf07f2d1f0 czech out religion.cc 01:32:41 johnstein: Did you get vagrant/virtualbox to work? 01:32:41 Mattias: You have 2 messages. Use !messages to read them. 01:32:45 !messages 01:32:46 (1/2) johnstein said (14h 36m 5s ago): I'm running it on ubuntu 15.10. 01:32:47 !messages 01:32:47 (1/1) johnstein said (4h 16m ago): I might need a bit more real-time coaching. I'm not really sure how to practically apply your advice 01:32:53 I see :) 01:33:15 johnstein: Have you ever ran virtualization on your desktop before? 01:33:36 I mean, Intel virtualization needs to be enabled in the bios for it to even work 01:34:19 -!- waat has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 01:35:24 Mattias, not really. haven't spent much time on it. your responses didn't really make 100% sense to me indicating that I probably need to understand the basics of vagrant, ansible, virtualmachines, etc 01:35:41 I've run docker on my KVM 01:35:44 ansible didn't even get to run there :) you just need the "virtual server" 01:35:54 or you could use a real server if you want 01:36:01 I'm doing all of this on the KVM. not my desktop 01:36:08 ah 01:36:32 trying to spin up a real version and see what I need to do to get it working for real 01:36:58 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 01:37:02 i dont think you need the paravirt extensions to use virtualbox do you 01:37:11 Well, I've only tried in ubuntu 15.04 so far, should work in 16.04 and 14.04 I hope. will try in vagrant today 01:37:47 johnstein: all you need is a base system to get started if you can spin that up. Then the ip and ssh with sudo access or root directly 01:39:00 johnstein: here is how the inventory file should look like: http://docs.ansible.com/ansible/intro_inventory.html use the group [webtiles] as described in the readme 01:39:14 -!- knu has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:39:38 ??dgl[4 01:39:38 dgl[4/4]: ansible version in development by Mattias at https://github.com/mattias/ansible_playbook_webtiles 01:44:40 Mattias: like this? https://github.com/jmbjr/ansible_playbook_webtiles/commit/28ce66cf933d55566f9444023f5be50a58d33229 01:44:55 johnstein: yeah 01:45:01 the readme also says I should set up group_vars/webtiles. what ssh user do I need to use? 01:45:03 ??cbro 01:45:03 cbro[1/4]: Server in Georgia, US: crawl.beRotato.org -- ssh port 22, username crawler, keys at http://crawl.beRotato.org/crawl/keys (no password access). In case of DNS problems, use crawl.boylecraft.net. Webtiles at: http://crawl.beRotato.org. Use glyph/sigil ^ for bots 01:45:18 for cbro, for example, the ssh user players use to play is 'crawler' 01:45:40 is that the user? does it need to exist in the host system? or is that part of the ansible magic? 01:45:47 -!- LexAckson__ has joined ##crawl-dev 01:45:51 johnstein: It needs to exist, you can use root to start with 01:45:53 i.e. you just say what it needs to be and ansible sets it up inside the container? 01:45:58 it just tells ansible which user to login to ssh with 01:46:07 and you can also use a password 01:46:14 or the key I've made an example with 01:46:18 -!- Zeor has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 01:46:22 I don't allow root ssh access. I should probably make it 01:46:25 make a user 01:46:46 johnstein: http://docs.ansible.com/ansible/intro_inventory.html#list-of-behavioral-inventory-parameters 01:46:50 -!- Grivan has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:46:50 full list of variables to use there 01:47:04 or could I just test webtiles for now and just do ssh later? 01:47:05 ansible_ssh_pass might be of interest if not using keys 01:47:16 ansible logs in and installs everything through ssh 01:48:09 -!- FalseLobster has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 01:48:10 -!- FireSight has quit [] 01:48:23 vagrant would have made it easier since you could just destroy it and restart from scratch fast 01:48:37 ??ssh 01:48:37 ssh[1/4]: chmod 400 01:48:43 ??ssh[2 01:48:43 ssh[2/4]: faze's bash function for crawl: https://gist.github.com/4022518. put this in your .bashrc and drop cao_key in ~/.ssh. Nice, easy syntax: crawl (cao|cdo|cszo). 01:50:48 ??ssh[3 01:50:48 ssh[3/4]: Use elliott's ~/.ssh/config file: https://gist.github.com/4058528; wget -O ~/.ssh/cao_key http://crawl.develz.org/cao_key && chmod 400 ~/.ssh/cao_key 01:50:49 ??ssh[4 01:50:49 terminal size[1/3]: The standard terminal size is 80 columns and 24 rows. Using a different terminal size will make it difficult for others to watch your game online and will incur the wrath of greensnark. For puTTY, just set the terminal size option. For xterm, use 'xterm -geometry 80x24'. To reset the size of an existing terminal, use 'stty cols 80 rows 24'. 01:50:52 johnstein: how do you login to the server manually? You have to use a user right? 01:51:07 Or do you have physical access? :P 01:52:00 -!- tw__ is now known as tw_ 01:53:09 I have my personal account. but I'm trying to set this up like I would if I were doing it for real 01:53:25 so I'm setting up a crawler account, just like cbro 01:53:51 I'm still confused. if vagrant makes this easier, I should do that 01:54:19 I suppose I really don't understand what vagrant or ansible are and how they differ from docker 01:54:56 johnstein: vagrant just gets a premade box and starts it in virtualbox basically with one command, vagrant up 01:55:08 johnstein: ansible is a provisioner which installs everything through ssh 01:55:09 which didn't work for me 01:55:32 probably means I didn't configure it properly. all I did was apt-get install vagrant 01:55:38 and virtualbox 01:55:43 and ansible 2.0.2.0 01:55:46 then did vagrant up 01:55:47 vagrant should just work. but sometimes on some computers it can be a hassle 01:55:58 it was a freshly updated 15.10 01:56:04 I know my colleague used to have issues, but we fixed them (he uses os x though) 01:56:05 I was on 14.04, but upgraded 01:56:19 it's a bummer that it's a hassle 01:56:28 was really hoping it would Just Work 01:56:34 like Magic or something 01:56:41 Yeah, well, I plan to add virtualization through digital ocean later, that'll be "Just Work" :) 01:56:50 No need to setup a server then 01:56:56 and DO will work (but costs) 01:57:20 I used vagrant because it should just work :P 01:57:33 as a demo thingy at least 01:57:37 thought DO was just another VPS company. is there something special that they offer? 01:57:41 ah 01:57:45 They're cheap 01:57:51 (I was looking at DO but went with Ramnode instead) 01:57:51 and they have an awesome api 01:58:21 so, if you do that, we don't need to run any of the existing servers anymore? 01:59:20 Well, no... if you would like to move over to this. Right now it's just for the trunk version 01:59:37 Also need to test migration 01:59:44 Is that just copying the database? 01:59:46 and files? 02:00:02 I could make that automatic as well ;) 02:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:00:16 I'm still stuck on step 1, so dunno 02:00:31 Did you get a user up with sudo access? 02:00:50 which user needs sudo access? 02:00:55 Any user you choose 02:01:05 Someone which can manage the system 02:01:10 my personal account has it. but crawler, the crawl ssh user, definitely won't 02:01:31 johnstein: then go to group_vars/webtiles and set the ssh user 02:01:35 maybe I should have run $ sudo vagrant up 02:01:38 johnstein: do you use a private key or password? 02:01:49 vagrant up should have worked without sudo 02:02:16 -!- knu has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:02:29 ansible_ssh_pass: thepassword 02:02:30 I have to create the ssh user on the host. I never remember if I should use useradd or adduser. then I had to find the public key. then I Have to freaking build the .ssh folder since adduser didn't do it. and chown/chmod it 02:02:35 ansible_become_pass: thesudopassword 02:02:55 heh 02:03:37 you can encrypt files btw if you put sensitive stuff into them and want to git them 02:04:01 ansible-vault encrypt path/to/file.yml 02:04:08 use the same password for all encrypted files 02:04:23 add --ask-vault-pass to the end of the ansible-playbook command 02:04:24 so for cbro/dbro, you have to set dgamelaunch as the shell. ansible is handling that? 02:04:39 or do I still need to set that up in the host system for crawler? 02:04:57 johnstein: the ansible playbook will create a new ssh user with the dgamelaunch shell 02:05:23 johnstein: https://github.com/jmbjr/ansible_playbook_webtiles/blob/master/playbooks/finalize.yml#L39 02:05:33 -!- insecticide has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:05:37 johnstein: and the user: https://github.com/jmbjr/ansible_playbook_webtiles/blob/master/vars/webtiles.yml#L10 02:05:51 vars/webtiles.yml has all the configuration 02:05:54 -!- crate__ is now known as crate 02:05:56 so players will still connect using the 'crawler' username/key, like they do now, but ansible will redirect that to the newly created ssh user inside the ansible setup? 02:05:57 Need to clean it up though 02:06:18 johnstein: then change ssh_username to crawler and it'll just make sure everything is correct 02:06:24 johnstein: it will add the cao keys though 02:06:59 johnstein: but depending on how much custom you have on the existing server, I wouldn't just run this yet until properly tested :) 02:07:13 I'm not running it on the same VPS as cbro 02:07:20 it's a totally different server 02:07:45 I'm just trying to wrap my head around what I need to do, step by step, to get it set up 02:07:54 johnstein: btw, under [webtiles] you can add several ips. new line each. it'll install/ensure stuff is correct on all those servers simultaneously. 02:08:35 johnstein: group_vars is for the whole [webtiles] group. That is, all configs there goes for all those servers. 02:08:53 johnstein: under host_vars folder, you can add a file named the same as the ip, then use the variables you want specific to those servers. 02:09:26 -!- Shard1697 has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 02:10:18 johnstein: I think, this would be easier with a GUI. Maybe make a website which then when done "downloads" the configuration 02:10:25 ? 02:10:39 what would the GUI help with? 02:11:03 was hoping that after running this, I could log in via console, or see it in webtiles 02:11:13 or do you mean, editing the files is easier with a GUI? 02:11:33 sorry if I seem really dumb and slow with this. 02:11:39 yeah, step by step form to edit the configuration variables 02:11:50 like, which ssh username to use etc 02:12:03 a wizard guide :P 02:12:17 my text file that I'm working on should be enough I would hope 02:12:22 -!- knu has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:12:31 I'm still really confused on why 'vagrant up' didn't seem to work 02:12:37 Yeah, but I still had to point you in the correct direction 02:12:57 I've barely installed much on this server. just some minecraft stuff and docker 02:13:00 I need to add the ssh username part to the readme 02:13:09 I still don't understand what's going on there 02:13:11 For me it is only natural :P 02:13:14 sure 02:13:40 Btw, picked up HTC Vive yesterday :D It finally arrived! 02:14:40 -!- Lohengramm has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:14:56 -!- Shard1697 has joined ##crawl-dev 02:16:20 and after all that, I can't log in via ssh key. ugh. I really hate getting bogged down in stupid steps like this 02:16:54 johnstein: correct user:group? permissions? authorized_keys has the pubkey? 02:17:00 -!- Sprort has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 02:17:09 is authorized_keys spelled correctly? :P 02:17:37 authorized_keys can have 664 permissions 02:17:41 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:17:45 -!- Lohengramm has joined ##crawl-dev 02:18:02 1) I think so. 2) yes. crawler:crawler 700 3) should be. direct copy of the pubkey and using the same private key as my usual cbro login 4) should be spelled correctly 02:18:05 hm 02:18:10 -!- yaknyasn has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:18:19 lmao 02:18:23 just found a good bug 02:18:25 thanks, past me 02:18:44 -!- filthy has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:18:52 Mattias, I even restarted ssh 02:18:57 -!- inire has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 02:19:15 johnstein: shouldn't have to restart ssh, .ssh/ with 775 permissions? 02:19:45 Wait, I'll check which permissions I used in ansible 02:19:55 well, it's 700, just like on cbro 02:20:04 johnstein: https://github.com/jmbjr/ansible_playbook_webtiles/blob/master/playbooks/finalize.yml#L44 02:20:08 johnstein: That made it work for me :P 02:20:24 775 for .ssh, 600 for the authorized_keys 02:20:59 -!- PsyMar has quit [Disconnected by services] 02:21:13 -!- PsyMar2 is now known as PsyMar 02:21:20 johnstein: did you ssh with the ident key? 02:21:27 ssh -i key user@hostname 02:21:49 -!- Laptop_ has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 02:22:42 good lord I copied the wrong public key 02:22:56 works now. 700 02:23:15 700 for both, actually. .ssh and authorized_keys 02:23:41 -!- buki has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:23:59 Yeah, my issue when I made the ansible playbook was I misspelled authorized_keys :P 02:24:05 took a while to figure out 02:24:34 -!- glaas has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 02:24:55 johnstein: make sure to change the configuration ;) 02:25:01 under group_vars/webtiles 02:25:25 johnstein: don't change the usernames etc though, need to remove that part.. I think it should always be crawl and crawl-dev 02:25:33 The files in crawl seems to be setup for this 02:25:48 you can edit that in some of the config files 02:25:57 johnstein: ops, I meant vars/webtiles.yml 02:26:14 yeah, could make it configurable, but might as well go "standard" 02:26:47 First to test this so it works and fix what needs to be fixed :) 02:26:47 Mattias, remind me again what group_vars/webtiles is for? 02:26:49 -!- Harudoku has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 02:27:13 if I change it to: ansible_ssh_user: crawler 02:27:35 why do I need to bother with the private key? I don't have that on the host. that's on my desktop 02:27:35 johnstein: group_vars/webtiles is configuration for all servers, right now it only sets the ssh user etc. host_vars is for specific servers, vars/webtiles.yml is the config for the main webtile server 02:28:12 johnstein: set the path to it on your desktop. ansible needs to use it to login just like when you do it manually (if non-standard ssh key). if it is your global key, remove the configuration line completely 02:28:18 i.e. crawler doesn't have a private key even on cbro 02:28:28 if it is password, use ansible_ssh_pass instead 02:28:32 hm 02:28:38 let me rephrase 02:28:51 -!- amalloy is now known as amalloy_ 02:28:51 you mean in finalize.yml? 02:28:56 I'm testing the console login by using putty from my PC desktop 02:29:00 ah 02:29:06 -!- ProzacElf has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 02:29:19 I ssh to: crawler@ip-to-kvm-server-that-is-testing-new-webtiles-setup 02:29:32 I have the crawler private key on PC 02:29:35 just like I do for cbro 02:29:41 -!- ProzacElf has joined ##crawl-dev 02:29:47 great, then you can remove it from the configuration 02:29:50 so it won't use the vagrant key 02:30:02 -!- WalkerBoh has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:30:07 if it complains, just explicitly tell ansible where the key is 02:30:21 I keep getting this feeling that I'm coming at this from a totally backwards perspective 02:30:26 but ok. I will delete 02:31:00 -!- tollymain has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:32:09 Mattias, ok. commit #2 https://github.com/jmbjr/ansible_playbook_webtiles/commit/24814ef6261d831448bcec00052f60b73c13a5aa 02:32:30 -!- tollymain has joined ##crawl-dev 02:32:31 johnstein: ansible_ssh_user has to be there, that's not a global setting 02:32:45 ansible_ssh_user: crawler 02:33:15 private keys the system usually takes the "default" first. if it is a non-default one you have to specify it 02:34:20 yea, that's what I have. ansible_ssh_user: crawler 02:34:43 but I'm still wondering if that's the right user. you said that needs to be the user that players will log in as, right? 02:35:14 -!- insecticide has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:35:48 so all players will have the crawler private key on their own systems. the private key won't exist at all on my server 02:36:29 (I'm still assuming the players will be doing the same things they do now. that could be part of my learnings here if that's not the intention) 02:36:31 No, this is the user that ansible needs to setup the system with, the one with sudo access 02:36:46 ansible will later setup the ssh user using the configuration ssh_username 02:37:04 ok. then I did the crawler user thing wrong 02:37:43 Ansible needs a ssh user with sudo access to install everything related to webtiles. 02:37:52 crawler is the name of the player ssh user. I think the dgamelaunch wiki uses the 'crawl' user. but I set up cbro slightly differently. I'll change the ansible_ssh_user to my personal ssh login. 02:38:04 the wiki uses terminal ;) 02:38:24 crawl is for webtiles 02:38:32 crawl-dev is the admin of it all 02:39:08 ??dgl[3 02:39:09 dgl[3/4]: https://crawl.develz.org/wiki/doku.php?id=dcss:server:setting_up_dgamelaunch_and_webtiles 02:39:43 So basically, all you need is a root or admin user so ansible can do its thing 02:39:57 -!- ProzacElf has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 02:40:07 if the admin user uses sudo, make sure you also set the sudo password 02:40:30 Simplest way is to add -K to the end of the ansible-playbook command 02:41:01 this is where I need to go learn how to encrypt my git commits? 02:41:29 ansible-vault encrypt thepath/tothefile 02:41:43 but yeah, only if you commit sensitive information 02:41:44 I have no clue where I run that. is that a shell command? 02:41:48 yeah 02:41:54 -!- ProzacElf has joined ##crawl-dev 02:41:59 -!- Idolo has quit [] 02:42:27 http://docs.ansible.com/ansible/playbooks_vault.html#running-a-playbook-with-vault 02:42:39 This is quite a lot at once :) 02:43:04 I'm getting the feeling that this is out of my current league. if this were 4 years ago before kids I could spend the rest of the week getting up to speed on this better 02:43:45 I need to commit everything I'm doing so I can remember what I was doing and have some solid versions to go back to when I inevitably screw something up 02:44:00 I'm still not following the overall process flow either 02:44:13 I need to make a better README I think 02:44:21 and it's still bugging me that I can't get the vagrant stuff running when it sounds like it should Just Work 02:44:33 -!- Laptop_ has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 02:44:36 Yeah, that's what vagrant sells itself with. "It just works" 02:44:50 Are you running it on windows? 02:44:56 -!- giantbat has quit [Client Quit] 02:45:11 -!- Quazifuji has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 02:45:36 that's basically what I'm trying to do here. figure out how to update the README so someone can go from 0 to up and running with it 02:45:40 no 02:45:50 I'm running it on ubuntu 15.10 02:45:59 Should be no problems then -.- 02:46:01 am I doing that part wrong? should I not be running this on my server? 02:46:03 unless virtualization is off 02:46:12 what problems are you having with vagrant? 02:46:16 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:46:22 -!- Rast- has joined ##crawl-dev 02:46:32 vagrant is only for testing 02:46:40 I can't remember the output. it was in a pastebin I sent to mattias 02:46:54 zxc: basically it keeps waiting for ssh to be available but it never is 02:46:55 -!- Lightli has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 02:47:03 Mattias, can you walk me through the typical workflow? 02:47:09 johnstein: vagrant up :P 02:47:12 you can't vagrant ssh in? 02:47:12 that is the only thing 02:47:13 i.e. let's assume this has been working for a while 02:47:27 and I need to add a new version 02:47:29 vagrant is that easy, or should be 02:47:32 step 1 is? 02:47:52 vagrant is also only for testing, not for a live webtiles server 02:47:57 right now, step 1 is for me to log-in to cbro, su to crawl-dev, then edit a ton of files. publish. and I'm done 02:48:14 well. that's steps 1-10 02:48:21 step 11 is, log out of cbro 02:48:56 johnstein: step 0 : ansible-galaxy install -r requirements.yml (only run this once) step1: ansible-playbook -i inventories/ crawl.yml 02:49:11 johnstein: or well, before step 1. add the version to the list in vars/webtiles.yml 02:49:20 then done 02:50:19 what happens when ansible-playbook runs? it makes in-situ changes to the server? or it destroys/reforms the server? 02:50:21 -!- Rast-- has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:50:21 johnstein: this all assumes step -1 was completed (configuring the config files), that is group_vars/webtiles (ssh user stuff) and vars/webtiles.yml (the server config 02:50:44 sounds like ansible-playbook is really just running a fancy macro to do the updates 02:50:53 johnstein: it is idempotent. It will first check if the "change" is already applied. if so, skips the step. it runs all tasks in the playbooks folder. 02:51:18 where one of the tasks is 'publish' 02:51:43 I can see now why vagrant and the virtualbox don't make any sense at all for my situation 02:51:55 since I've already got the server to run it on 02:52:02 right? 02:52:14 yeah 02:52:31 This is a clean server right? not a production server? 02:52:33 vagrant is good for running something in a standard environment that you are free to screw up 02:52:39 We still need to test this :P 02:52:47 yeah, that's why I picked vagrant 02:53:03 so first time I run ansible-playbook, it will set up the chroot in the host system (or inside the virtual env if I use that) 02:53:09 I've been using it for running the new scoreboard during development 02:53:48 johnstein: yeah, if it doesn't already exist 02:53:52 new scoreboard...more like backdoor script to overinflate streak scores... 02:54:25 -!- Lightli has joined ##crawl-dev 02:54:41 Mattias, it's not fully clean. I have some docker, crawl dev, and minecraft stuff on it 02:54:55 but it's not the production cbro server 02:55:23 Hm, I'd really try to get vagrant to work for this.. so much smoother 02:55:35 you can just destroy the whole vm then rebuild it to try the new versions later 02:55:41 yes removing all the griefing games will show that many streaks are longer than otherwise thought 02:56:10 Mattias, do I need to do anything fancy to allow my pc browser to access the webtiles portion? 02:56:37 Mattias: are the ports set up in the vagrantfile? 02:56:46 johnstein: in the configuration you could set a domain. edit the pc's hosts file by adding ip then domain 02:56:55 i.e. I'm going to run the server on my KVM. but log in from my windows PC, either in console or webtiles. I remember having to set up a few things for docker to work well 02:56:59 zxc: ports are setup automagically for ssh in vagrant 02:57:14 pc's hosts file? 02:57:16 Mattias: that's not what I meant - I mean for accessing webtiles 02:57:30 you ought to be able to just go localhost:8080 in your browser or whichever port it is 02:57:56 zxc: if I were running this ansible-playbook and vagrant on my local pc, then yea 02:58:07 oh i thought you were 02:58:10 zxc: the vm has its own ip, I use /etc/hosts to setup the domain and ip 02:58:19 nope. running it on my other ramnode server 02:58:21 No port forward 02:58:34 trying to see what it will take to replace the current manual way I have to do things on cbro 02:58:41 trying to make it as similar as possible 02:59:04 that seems to be one reason this is confusing 02:59:15 I wonder if the dgl menu stuff will be very brittle 02:59:19 that's more of a minor gripe 02:59:22 but those menu keys 02:59:52 Mattias, do I need to edit the Vagrantfile? 02:59:55 http://crawl.crawl-webtiles.com/ <-- add 92.43.32.77 crawl.crawl-webtiles.com to your hosts file: http://www.howtogeek.com/howto/27350/beginner-geek-how-to-edit-your-hosts-file/ 03:00:01 since you can't just necessarilly choose a menu key automatically based on some version substring or anything 03:00:02 johnstein: No, shouldn't have to 03:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:00:31 gammafunk: menu keys in ssh? 03:00:40 no? in dgl 03:00:49 I mean it's over ssh, yes, but this is a dgl thing 03:00:52 gammafunk: yeah, dgl = ssh for me :P https://github.com/mattias/ansible_playbook_webtiles/blob/master/templates/main_user.txt.j2 03:00:55 gammafunk: one of the templates 03:00:55 Mattias, it has the old ip in inventories/hosts, and has the vagrant ssh user and private key 03:01:15 well what does one of the templates mean 03:01:16 johnstein: oh, I didn't mean to add it there, I meant to your systems hosts file. 03:01:33 I'm saying a menu key is kind of a weird thing where you might not know which key it should be 03:01:37 Mattias, sorry, I went back to seeing if I could get vagrant working on my KVM 03:01:41 gammafunk: template uses the python jinja2 templates and you can add variables and loops etc. I use the loop.index to set keys for each version 03:01:57 -!- scummos__ has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 03:01:59 right but how is the key determined is my point 03:01:59 gammafunk: the index will be the index of the list you have for your versions 03:02:09 gammafunk: first version = 1 03:02:18 It is predictable 03:02:21 gammafunk, yea I've had a similar question for experimentals, where I have to set the dgl key to something creative when we have multiple experimentals that start with the same letter 03:02:33 yeah, what admins probably prefer is the key used but like the major version number 03:02:38 hrm 03:02:47 !lg * recent s=explbr 03:02:47 what does cbro use 03:02:47 828910 games for * (recent): 824078x, 3329x combo god, 726x faithful, 419x abyssrun, 247x evoker-god-rebase, 111x orcs and elves 03:02:50 !lg * s=explbr 03:02:55 gammafunk: I thought about that. but then I was thinking, what about when 0.28 comes? 03:02:56 5664238 games for *: 5647803x, 3329x combo god, 1862x smithgod rebased, 1645x iashol, 1343x faithful, 1238x chunkless, 922x bearkin, 870x evoker-god, 763x no backtracking god, 671x plutonians, 634x salamander, 597x gods, 542x imp, 466x mulch ado about nothing, 419x abyssrun, 416x weightless, 247x evoker-god-rebase, 174x new nemelex, 156x squarelos-0.17, 111x orcs and elves, 18x cards, 12x shoals-l... 03:03:13 Mattias: at that time those older versions will almost certainly be offline 03:03:32 but yeah you could hypothesize about that I guess 03:03:38 gammafunk: But yes, this is one of the "TODO" stuff, making versions more configurable. instead of using a simple list it can be an array of hashes 03:03:41 Mattias, I will have that issue when 0.23 comes since 0.13 was my first version. I suppose I'll ahve to retire 0.13 03:04:00 like { version: 0.18, command: 8, state: present 03:04:03 } 03:04:06 but I'm more worried about the somewhat random names of the branches 03:04:10 experimental branches 03:04:13 yeah most servers have 7 for 0.7, 8 for 0.18 etc 03:04:19 it's a minor issue, like I said 03:04:27 although if you do use some index scheme like you describe 03:04:32 'cards' and 'combo-gods' 03:04:34 as long as there's a way they can override the menu 03:04:35 Right now I just want this tested and try to fine tune it :) 03:04:36 I guess manual edit 03:04:37 both would be [c] 03:04:42 yea 03:04:47 Mattias: another big issue is this 03:04:49 ??dplusplus 03:04:50 I don't have a page labeled dplusplus in my learndb. 03:04:50 gammafunk: templates can be manually edited there yes. 03:04:52 doh 03:04:55 ??lld 03:04:55 lld[1/2]: Located in Japan. http://lazy-life.ddo.jp:8080/#lobby - Admin is https://twitter.com/dplusplus/ 03:04:57 ??lld[2 03:04:57 lld[2/2]: repository with webtiles patches from dplusplus: https://github.com/dplusplus/patched-dcss-webtile/commits/master 03:05:16 Mattias: that's the repo lld uses, webtiles trunk with special commits for his own custom html etc 03:05:24 and I believe the cjr admin does something similar 03:05:34 and so does ckr 03:05:41 cbro is boring 03:05:44 intentionally 03:05:50 so they merge master into their own branch or something 03:06:09 not sure if hong on cwz uses an actual repo or what, but dplusplus definitely does 03:06:22 and has a japanese-localized version of 0.16, but that's another thing 03:06:46 would be just like an experimental branch I suppose, not sure about the setup of that 03:07:29 I don't see any recent commits in dplusplus' repo, so he's probably not doing too much with that these days, but he has custom scoring pages etc 03:08:13 "You smell burning hair." の訳に対応 03:08:20 good commits on that jp repo 03:09:18 Yeah, I need to learn how webtiles gets "created" and how to specify a branch for it 03:09:24 I think update-trunk does it 03:09:38 but I don't want the git version of crawl to be special, I just want webtiles to be another branch 03:10:18 Mattias, inventory.vm.network :private_network, ip: "192.168.28.71" 03:10:36 in the vagrantfile. what's this for? just setting the local ip? 03:10:43 johnstein: yeah, the ip for the vm 03:10:58 it is update-trunk that does it, yeah 03:11:03 ok. so 28.71 is just a randomly picked one? 03:11:07 johnstein: yup 03:11:42 webtiles is just a subdir in the crawl repo, and update-trunk is what installs master 03:11:44 johnstein: you could do "inventory.vm.network :public_network" 03:11:54 johnstein: that'll make it so it gets a DHCP ip from your router 03:11:57 public to the internet 03:12:14 Mattias, how would that work on my KVM? 03:12:23 oh right, you do vm in your vm :P 03:12:24 same way I suppose? 03:12:31 no idea really 03:12:36 hey dawg, heard you liked VMs 03:13:09 ==> crawl1: Waiting for machine to boot. This may take a few minutes... 03:13:10 crawl1: SSH address: 127.0.0.1:2222 03:13:10 crawl1: SSH username: vagrant 03:13:10 crawl1: SSH auth method: private key 03:13:10 crawl1: Warning: Connection timeout. Retrying... 03:13:10 crawl1: Warning: Connection timeout. Retrying.. 03:13:21 johnstein: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/24620599/error-vt-x-not-available-for-vagrant-machine-inside-virtualbox 03:13:25 good ssh port 03:13:32 What you are trying to do is nested virtualization, which is up till now still WIP for bare metal hyperviosrs like Xen, KVM and VMware. Technically the passthrough of VT-x, VT-d and VT-c is still not mature so you simply can't do it, let alone VirtualBox (type 2 hypervisor). 03:13:33 Mattias, so, after running vagrant up, eventually get to this part 03:13:52 That might be why 03:13:57 Docker is special 03:13:59 -!- eb_ has quit [] 03:14:09 what's going on? sounds like it's using the fake vagrant user, that does not exist on my host, to try to log into the newly created virtual machine 03:14:11 -!- knu has quit [Quit: Reboot...] 03:14:20 ah hm 03:14:29 I suppose I could wrap this up in a docker container 03:14:36 HEY DAWG 03:15:01 johnstein: vagrant creates a premade virtualbox box, which has a user vagrant (or vagrant expects it to exist) 03:15:09 got it 03:15:23 can docker run virtualbox ? :P 03:15:30 You are doing some insane stuff there :D 03:15:44 well what I mean is, I can just spin up a docker container that runs the ansible-playbook 03:15:56 sure, that might work 03:16:06 johnstein is going to switch his desktop to bootable iso in virtualbox on his dbro VM with dbro running under dosbox on his android phone using linux2dos 03:16:28 that sounds more fun anyway, since I at least barely understand docker, whereas I haven't done any homework on vagrant or virtualbox 03:16:58 gammafunk, and I'll run it all from my little raspberry pi 03:17:02 I'd just run ansible & vagrant & virtualbox on the host (Windows) 03:17:11 Then be done with it :P 03:17:27 well, you've already demonstrated it works like that 03:18:03 I'm trying to get it weaponized for use as a real server so we can flush out more bugs in a more representative environment 03:18:26 well. not bugs. but workflow speedbumps 03:19:02 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 03:19:25 -!- removeelyvilon has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 03:21:14 Mattias, ty for the help. I think I definitely understand more on what's going on and how it's supposed to work 03:21:50 To try my vagrant fully initialized, use this ip: 92.43.32.77 03:21:57 then add the domain crawl.crawl-webtiles.com 03:22:00 Sec, guide inc 03:22:12 johnstein: win 10 or 7? 03:22:26 I'm on 7 for now 03:22:36 johnstein: http://helpdeskgeek.com/windows-7/windows-7-hosts-file/ 03:22:59 once in the file, add this exact line: 03:23:08 92.43.32.77 crawl.crawl-webtiles.com 03:23:27 Unstable branch on crawl.beRotato.org updated to: 0.19-a0-214-g62d10c9 (34) 03:23:27 That's the old school way of DNS :P 03:23:45 ssh works too :) just use the cao key 03:24:21 !seen simn 03:24:21 Sorry chequers, I haven't seen simn. 03:24:23 !seen simnarine 03:24:23 Sorry chequers, I haven't seen simnarine. 03:24:26 !seen simmarine 03:24:26 I last saw simmarine at Tue May 24 02:58:42 2016 UTC (4h 25m 43s ago) quitting, saying 'Read error: Connection reset by peer'. 03:24:34 looks like I updated my hosts file to get my octoprint working. forgot about that 03:24:41 !tell simmarine are you going to fight for the speedrun record? :) 03:24:42 chequers: OK, I'll let simmarine know. 03:25:37 hey, /etc/hosts is also oldschool DNS 03:26:01 neither are actually DNS, tbf 03:26:26 yeah 03:26:28 it's not DNS :P 03:27:03 I've set this vagrant to use 1gb ram (everything installed fine on 512mb) 03:27:28 last time I changed a local bind configuration I think I screwed it up pretty good several times before it did what I want 03:28:29 connecting.......................... 03:28:56 johnstein: not working? 03:29:02 oh, spec! 03:29:05 hm. This site can’t be reached 03:29:05 crawl.crawl-webtiles.com took too long to respond. 03:29:14 oh, that spec was me :P 03:29:16 -!- Zekka has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 03:29:33 hm, should work... 03:29:45 did you save the hosts file? :) 03:30:04 http://crawl.crawl-webtiles.com:8080/#watch-mattias 03:30:39 Mattias, http://i.imgur.com/xvf4MO3.png 03:30:53 Should work :/ 03:31:37 I'm connecting through the internet ip as well 03:31:38 hmmm 03:31:43 although I do it locally on this network -.- 03:31:51 I did port forward everything 03:31:59 I believe you 03:32:21 -!- iFurril has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 03:32:22 I'll use a real domain next time, and do it on DO 03:33:14 I gotta go to bed. ty for the help. good night 03:33:20 -!- DaneiTHREE has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:33:20 good night :) 03:33:33 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.19-a0-215-gcce208a: Re-remove _Sacrifice_Messages 10(88 minutes ago, 1 file, 0+ 160-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/cce208aba78c 03:33:33 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.19-a0-216-g212af83: Update a shaft-immunity comment 10(45 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/212af83b39a2 03:33:33 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.19-a0-217-g6c022ac: Fix ABIL_BLINK failure chance 10(74 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/6c022ac0f45a 03:33:33 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.19-a0-218-gc856d53: Make allies target enemies hit by beams 10(49 minutes ago, 1 file, 3+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/c856d5307b08 03:33:33 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.19-a0-219-g285762d: Let monsters cast Iceblast 10(2 hours ago, 2 files, 3+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/285762d43a0f 03:33:33 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.19-a0-220-g140ffe5: New god: Hepliaklqana the Forgottten 10(2 hours ago, 13 files, 83+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/140ffe51053d 03:33:33 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.19-a0-221-g2efe68d: Implement Hepliaklqana ancestors 10(2 hours ago, 31 files, 1240+ 50-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/2efe68df89ef 03:33:33 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.19-a0-222-g75ffc05: Add Hepliaklqana to sprints 10(2 hours ago, 5 files, 15+ 10-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/75ffc054b89a 03:33:33 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.19-a0-223-g079c302: Hepliaklqana wrath 10(2 hours ago, 5 files, 32+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/079c30293712 03:33:33 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.19-a0-224-g4a5363d: Automatically respawn the ancestor 10(87 minutes ago, 6 files, 45+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/4a5363d526a0 03:33:33 ... and 7 more commits 03:33:39 I'll see if I can figure out an easier way to test this 03:33:39 AWS has a free tier, maybe that 03:34:02 gammafunk: 6c022ac was the goodbug, if you're curious 03:34:35 lol 03:34:47 oh, it's just the fail chance? 03:34:51 ya 03:35:00 too bad 03:35:08 you know about that nostalgia case/break bug? 03:35:19 ??terpsichore 03:35:19 terpsichore[1/1]: A Tukima-using unique that existed in 0.8-a for about 1.5 months. 03:35:24 %git 69458e0dca7068575033625ae091bf97c3111507 03:35:24 07PleasingFungus02 * 0.18-a0-1507-g69458e0: Dataify ability failure chances 10(3 months ago, 1 file, 299+ 442-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/69458e0dca70 03:35:33 "There is at least one bug in this commit. Can you spot it?" 03:35:36 i found the bug 03:35:44 I brought her back for that branch but somehow messed up a merge 03:35:46 damn i'm good. 03:35:57 and her spell got added above m. menagerie 03:35:59 with no break 03:36:01 haha 03:36:03 so she got a free spell 03:36:06 double feature! 03:36:28 barong and nian dance, huh 03:36:55 my real favorite was watching crate and we noticed that his summons would not work on lair:8 03:37:03 plants? 03:37:06 they just disappeared when he summoned, and I was..yes 03:37:08 i remember that 03:37:10 sorry 03:37:10 too many monsters on the level 03:37:12 i stepped on your story 03:37:17 no that's fine 03:37:36 I had some changes to do to that altar vault's list, not that I can recall them now 03:37:49 i could look at my logs to see if i can find them, if you want 03:38:00 PleasingFungus: I assum you'll rebuild cbro at some point? 03:38:05 or I guess a few 03:38:16 go ahead 03:38:25 can sit on it rebuild in some hours 03:38:45 but otherwise cbro and a few others won't see it for 22 hours 03:39:02 I hope people at the very least get the "xom is calling vampires giant leeches" joke 03:39:05 im hype for crash bugs 03:39:14 er, probably not caused by the vault 03:39:15 lasty has a head start 03:39:18 to be clear 03:39:19 haha 03:39:23 yeah the rebasing process was... 03:39:25 exciting 03:39:28 i'm sure i lost a few more things 03:39:38 wait shit i forgot to credit wormcan for the altar tile 03:39:43 fuck! 03:39:50 also forgot to credit for the abil tiles i didn't make... 03:39:53 tisk, tisk. 03:40:08 i made a mental note and then i didn't write down my mental note 03:40:10 so i forgot :( 03:40:19 oh 03:40:21 hey 03:40:59 it's technically not a mental note if you write it down 03:41:29 a moot point! 03:45:26 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.19-a0-232-g2f94a7d: Recolour Hep altar in console 10(24 seconds ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/2f94a7d4f686 03:45:34 ??transference 03:45:35 Transference[1/1]: Hepliaklqana 3* ability. Switch any creature's location (including yourself!) with your ancestor's, as long as your ancestor is in LOS. At 5*, also slows creatures adjacent to the target for a duration dependent on invo; from 3-6 to 6-20 turns, at 0/27 invo respectively. 03:45:40 -!- NeremWorld has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 03:46:52 so how close is Hep to trunk status 03:47:02 HD = (player XL - 1)*2/3 + 1. HP = hd * 5 + max(0, (hd - 12) * 5). MR = hd*hd/2. Base AC = HD. Base damage = HD*3/2 + 3. Gains rF at HD 11, rC at HD 12, Haste at HD 14, and sInv at HD 16. 03:47:05 fuck 03:47:08 !learn s ancestor[2 HD = (player XL - 1)*2/3 + 1. HP = hd * 5 + max(0, (hd - 12) * 5). MR = hd*hd/2. Base AC = HD. Base damage = HD*3/2 + 3. Gains rF at HD 11, rC at HD 12, Haste at HD 14, and sInv at HD 16. 03:47:08 ancestor[2/6]: HD = (player XL - 1)*2/3 + 1. HP = hd * 5 + max(0, (hd - 12) * 5). MR = hd*hd/2. Base AC = HD. Base damage = HD*3/2 + 3. Gains rF at HD 11, rC at HD 12, Haste at HD 14, and sInv at HD 16. 03:47:14 Lightli: we're scrapping it, sadly. 03:47:17 it just didn't make the grade. 03:47:22 rip 03:48:30 !learn s ancestor[3 Knight: melee companion. Starts with a longsword, a shield, and bonus AC; 5 + HD/2. HD 10: Choose a broad axe or demon trident, both flaming. HD 14: shield becomes a large shield of reflect. HD 18: Weapon ego changes to speed. 03:48:30 ancestor[3/6]: Knight: melee companion. Starts with a longsword, a shield, and bonus AC; 5 + HD/2. HD 10: Choose a broad axe or demon trident, both flaming. HD 14: shield becomes a large shield of reflect. HD 18: Weapon ego changes to speed. 03:49:30 !learn s ancestor[4 Battlemage: conjurer companion. Starts with a quarterstaff, throw frost, and stone arrow. HD 10: Choose to replace throw frost with either Iceblast or Bolt of Magma. HD 14: lajatang of freezing. HD 18: stone arrow -> crystal spear. 03:49:30 ancestor[4/6]: Battlemage: conjurer companion. Starts with a quarterstaff, throw frost, and stone arrow. HD 10: Choose to replace throw frost with either Iceblast or Bolt of Magma. HD 14: lajatang of freezing. HD 18: stone arrow -> crystal spear. 03:49:47 kniiiiiiiiiiightssssss 03:49:53 lmao 03:49:57 into dreams 03:50:01 also i've ruined the battlemage entry 03:50:05 my greatest regret about this god, probably 03:50:43 !learn s ancestor[5 Hexer: support companion. Starts with a dagger, Slow, and Confuse. HD 10: Choose to replace Slow with either Metabolic Englaciation or Paralyse. HD 14: Confuse -> Mass Confusion. HD 18: antimagic quickblade. 03:50:44 ancestor[5/6]: Hexer: support companion. Starts with a dagger, Slow, and Confuse. HD 10: Choose to replace Slow with either Metabolic Englaciation or Paralyse. HD 14: Confuse -> Mass Confusion. HD 18: antimagic quickblade. 03:50:57 i refuse to touch ancestor[6 03:51:05 still need to figure out another militarized church title besides "templar" to rename de knights with 03:51:08 ??ancestor[6] 03:51:09 ancestor[6/6]: |amethyst: If she were an ash worshipper her name would be ldgy 03:51:24 paladin? 03:51:27 welcome... in-jokes! 03:51:30 Unstable branch on crawl.beRotato.org updated to: 0.19-a0-231-gae044c8 (34) 03:51:32 ontoclasm: crusader!!! 03:51:33 welp 03:51:45 ? 03:51:46 someone just got stuck in pan because he was a Fo 03:52:02 (Akett on CBRO) 03:52:15 hm, big mistake 03:52:19 never be a fo 03:52:20 teleport closets and islands sure are fun to constantly search for 03:52:34 this is a cute vault 03:52:45 regret-index: give all players an innate tele ability 03:52:49 alternately, let shaft work in pan 03:53:06 okay I at least instantly know the vault 03:53:25 nicolae_pan_performance_anxiety 03:53:51 Unstable branch on underhound.eu updated to: 0.19-a0-231-gae044c8 (34) 03:54:01 it actually specifically tries to avoid said closeting except that kprop was changed to not override and linger 03:54:07 w e l p 03:55:53 ... 03:56:00 I also like that it has dwarves. 03:56:20 incredibly, trunk still builds 03:56:40 wonder why l_moninfo.o builds last... 03:56:44 gammafunk: crawl.txt 03:57:11 needs one of those travis-ci images 03:57:22 [incredibly-it-builds] 03:58:14 are there any vaults with intentional teleport closets or islands? 03:58:38 as in, designed to be teleport sinks that trap the player? 03:58:42 yes 03:58:48 elf:3 =p 03:58:49 no, I think that would be regarded as a bug 03:58:52 and hall of blades =p 03:59:01 but no, not in the way you mean 03:59:09 you could end up on hellion_isle without flight or something like that 03:59:18 it always has an exit iirc 03:59:20 I'm just wondering, perhaps the code that picks a teleport destination should perform some path finding checks for the target square 03:59:20 oh 03:59:21 or maybe not 03:59:23 unless it already does 03:59:28 but in the sense that teleporting randomly on a level is a pretty terrible idea, elf:2 and elf:3 and zot:5 are all pretty terrible places to just be doing it 03:59:30 !vault hellion_island 03:59:31 Can't find hellion_island. 03:59:36 !vault pan_lemuel_hellion_island 03:59:37 Can't find pan_lemuel_hellion_island. 03:59:39 and the issues only concern squares that are technically reachable but shouldn't be teleported to for some other reason 03:59:40 yeah a guess 03:59:43 cocytus:7 and gehenna:7 both do not try to prevent people from being stranded 04:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:00:09 yeah you could end up there without teleport 04:00:26 but pan assumes you have access to teleport 04:00:57 -!- waat has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 04:01:02 that and there are all those hellions that would kill you and who are likewise stranded 04:01:54 hellion isle technically currently has an exit on it 04:02:14 err, stairs down, same difference 04:02:27 oh, that always places? 04:02:40 I didn't read the lua function for that I guess 04:02:45 ??tso wrath 04:02:45 the shining one wrath[1/1]: ABANDONMENT: 50 penance. RETRIBUTION: None, unless you are worshipping an {evil god}. Otherwise, 3/7 d(XL/5) + d3 - 1 permanent daevas and angels, 2/7 a blast of cleansing flame, 1/7 noise, 1/7 silence. 04:02:50 huh, a hide-covered altar to Ukayaw 04:02:50 -!- FunkyGnoll is now known as FunkyBomb 04:02:53 hide-covered 04:03:24 a hazy altar of hepliaklqana 04:03:31 hazy is the best we can do?? 04:03:37 -!- JStrange has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 04:03:57 like, what about "mist covered" 04:04:03 mist is cool 04:04:16 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.19-a0-231-gae044c8 (34) 04:04:21 a thin mist of swamp altar of hep 04:04:27 gammafunk: Patches Welcome 04:04:30 PleasingFungus: who ever came up to you and said "wow do you see that cool haze?" 04:04:36 420 04:04:50 a forgotten altar of hep? 04:04:59 we already have forgotten altars 04:05:00 I actually hesitated for a brief bit about having bennu "blaze out" 04:05:02 we have faded...yeah 04:05:24 shame, wasted opportunity to appeal to the vape nation demographic 04:05:46 oh duh 04:05:51 I still think alluding to any number of ritual beast mask dances would be best for the altar, but whatever 04:06:06 one of those almost killed me again in tomb 3 due to terrible strategies I employed 04:06:06 I though ukayaw altars were just a drum 04:06:08 regret-index: did you ever talk to lasty about that? 04:06:10 but thankfully I almost died to other things instead 04:06:20 no, because I got the idea all of when I saw it merged today :P 04:06:21 !tell johnstein would you be up for helping me cheat & rescue Akett from a Pan teleport closet? I'd need you to give me his save, and then to reupload a modified version 04:06:22 PleasingFungus: OK, I'll let johnstein know. 04:06:42 oh hah 04:06:47 I was watching that game earlier 04:06:52 are there even any masks in crawl besides the one unrand 04:07:05 was carrying around dragon king bot not using it, deserves to die imo 04:07:13 s/bot/but/ 04:07:33 he switched after I pointed out how electric golems weren't common enough for relec to be a serious issue 04:07:42 there are crowns 04:07:53 well, a crown 04:08:07 but also an unrand 04:08:28 wow, he didn't want to wear gda because of egolems 04:08:34 glad I wasn't in chat when he said that 04:09:12 Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.19-a0-232-g2f94a7d (34) 04:09:16 he had sda anyhow, which is pretty good at least 04:09:33 +8 randart SDA 04:09:42 regret-index: no need to "but whatever", then! :P 04:10:03 I like the beast mask idea 04:10:17 Hides is thematic but kind of...I guess hides are cool too 04:10:24 crawl does have a thing about hides 04:11:37 You can slow nearby creatures when transferring your ancestor 04:11:49 transfer meaning "swap places with"? 04:12:07 who in god's name is Yamquzzuhalamma 04:12:14 my ancestor wouldn't have a name like that 04:12:20 R glyph! 04:12:24 @??dryad 04:12:24 dryad (09R) | Spd: 10 | HD: 8 | HP: 45-59 | AC/EV: 6/12 | Dam: 10 | spellcaster | Res: 06magic(80) | Vul: 04fire | XP: 350 | Sp: awaken vines, awaken forest, minor healing (2d4) [04emergency] | Sz: Medium | Int: human. 04:12:27 you have forgotten your anscestors, clearly! 04:12:35 @??rakshasa 04:12:35 rakshasa (08R) | Spd: 10 | HD: 11 | HP: 54-77 | AC/EV: 8/14 | Dam: 20 | 05demonic, 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, unholy, see invisible | Res: 06magic(140), 03poison, 04rot, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 993 | Sp: mystic blast (3d16) [06!sil], phantom mirror [06!sil], blink [06!sil] | Sz: Medium | Int: human. 04:12:46 see that's the worst, one of the most annoying crawl enemies 04:13:23 gammafunk: mesopotamian 04:13:30 oh that's cool then 04:13:34 :) 04:13:35 mesopotamians were cool 04:13:49 _Sif Muna was always female, you're pretty sure. 04:13:53 hahaha 04:13:56 see, that shit is gold 04:13:57 sure, if you like cuneiform 04:13:59 amalloy was right 04:14:00 !tell lasty how about instead of a drum altar for uka, a ceremonial beast mask shelf? see nian, rangda/barong, supay of the diabladas, etc 04:14:00 regret-index: OK, I'll let lasty know. 04:14:01 well done, PleasingFungus 04:14:11 also, yes wrt slow nearby creatures, except that transfer can also be used on other creatures 04:14:23 gammafunk is hella blasphemous, I see 04:14:24 "you're pretty sure" is great because it sounds so millenial 04:14:24 so you can swap your ancestor with yourself, with that yaktaur captain, w/e 04:14:34 rakshasa always just refuse to die ever 04:14:37 it's been months but i think it might've been a homestuckism 04:14:43 possibly unconscious 04:15:17 lol 04:15:20 -!- GauHelldragon has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 04:15:22 She looks easy. 04:15:22 Unstable branch on CRAWL.XTAHUA.COM updated to: 0.19-a0-231-gae044c8 (34) 04:15:27 boo 04:15:40 I guess that's a bug for all allies maybe? 04:15:46 never even noticed if they print that 04:16:01 all allies, and also hex chances 04:16:11 which would also appear on e.g. friendly orc wizards 04:16:23 latter is on my list, former (looks easy) wasn't 04:16:32 tho idk how much of a bug it is 04:16:38 besides the obvious childish joke 04:17:09 it's sort of an hd indicator that we allow players to know about, so I guess you could argue that it's fine 04:17:17 er 04:17:38 uh, what the fuck 04:17:40 i think it might be xp 04:17:41 ugh, I was just about to push some vault fixes but I got a merged into master commit 04:17:42 ? 04:17:47 what do I do to avoid this 04:17:50 rebase 04:17:54 PleasingFungus: when I xv sif 04:18:02 there's a git setting that makes git pull do a rebase instead of a merge 04:18:04 and then hit esc 04:18:09 and then hit o 04:18:15 Give which item to monster? 04:18:16 is the obvious childish joke that allies are easy to order around 04:18:18 from a menu 04:18:21 03regret-index02 07* 0.19-a0-233-gabd010d: Minor vault work and newer Shoals ending toning down 10(15 minutes ago, 4 files, 29+ 32-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/abd010d11427 04:18:26 huh 04:18:26 that pops up 04:18:27 wow, lightli, so innocent 04:18:28 or am I missing the joke here 04:18:30 that is exceptionally bizarre 04:18:36 can anyone verify? 04:18:42 let me try without any rc 04:18:58 yep, with default rc happens 04:18:59 yeah 04:19:01 what the fuck 04:19:05 replicated 04:19:22 you're supposed to be able to give them things? 04:19:23 i best i know 04:19:25 it's 04:19:27 i bet it's 04:19:29 a missing break 04:19:31 somewhere 04:19:43 rip being able to give non-Beogh allies weapons and armor 04:19:44 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 04:19:48 ??cbro 04:19:48 cbro[1/4]: Server in Georgia, US: crawl.beRotato.org -- ssh port 22, username crawler, keys at http://crawl.beRotato.org/crawl/keys (no password access). In case of DNS problems, use crawl.boylecraft.net. Webtiles at: http://crawl.beRotato.org. Use glyph/sigil ^ for bots 04:19:54 and no you absolutely aren't supposed to be able to give them shit 04:19:58 oh ok 04:20:09 hm hm hm hm 04:20:11 I gave sif a kickass war axe, just like I do in my dreams 04:20:44 hm 04:20:46 wizard_give_monster_item 04:20:49 heh 04:20:54 wizard mode only thing? 04:20:56 yeah 04:20:59 obscure wizmode command 04:21:01 ok 04:21:03 it also has 04:21:05 the exact same prompt as beogh gifting 04:21:07 ty for heart attack 04:21:09 yeah it's a useful one 04:21:36 I was going to say I'm in wiz mode 04:21:41 was wondering if it would happen outside of wiz mode 04:22:04 holy shit that piety gain 04:22:43 high? 04:22:52 well I didn't finish exploring the floor out of temple 04:22:55 and I got to 1* 04:23:11 but I did just ~ to temple and join, not sure if that mattered 04:23:36 also fuck this default rc with autoexplore view delay, I'm going back 04:23:51 piety gain is identical to ely's at present 04:23:54 i can't remember how decay compares 04:23:59 haha 04:24:00 The Almanac of Twisted Dislocation -- Animate Skeleton, Pain, Vampiric Draining, PoG, Cigotuvi's, DChannel 04:24:04 well named 04:24:09 sounds painful 04:24:22 token tloc 04:24:30 i feel like i see a lot of that these days 04:24:36 token w/es 04:24:57 necromancy / tloc spell, rip and animate target's skeleton 04:25:08 woah, why did this phantom get confused...I guess it just acquired the R as a target and blinked 04:25:09 ahh, yeah, piety is currently identical to ely's, but of course ely is gonna eat way more with the abilities 04:25:14 -!- Kintak has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 04:25:16 yeah ok 04:25:21 regret-index: good idea! 04:25:25 might be a little high right now, i've gone back and forth 04:25:41 it hasn't gained another * since that level + some of next 04:25:48 ait 04:25:55 I did get some message about sif learning something 04:25:57 i will hold off on further panic for now 04:26:01 ahh, did you level up? 04:26:20 yes 04:27:03 ancestor hd = 2/3rds of yrs, and all their stats scale off hd 04:27:03 it's kind of weird that you can "remember" your ancestor's identity I guess infinite times 04:27:15 part of hep's theme is the malleability of memory 04:27:21 but also that ability might become one-time 04:27:29 because it's sort of clutter 04:27:33 for the abil menu 04:28:01 i made it a one-time on-join prompt but mpa was mean and made me change it back 04:28:01 ancestor reboots 04:28:04 haha 04:28:05 what wizmode command lets you give monsters items 04:28:11 x over them and then hit o 04:28:12 new costumes and names for every few branches 04:28:14 it's in x ? 04:28:26 wow, costumes? you're gonna drive the tiles folks mad! 04:28:43 not like there are any standards for those anyway 04:28:45 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: I'M OUT SON. PEACE, LOVE, EXPLOSIONS.] 04:29:18 awww 04:29:19 I guess I should ungive her 04:29:20 the axe 04:29:25 uka still has the ? altar 04:29:28 lol 04:29:30 hm 04:29:46 I thought uka had a drum for an altar 04:29:56 well, on cbro it's the ? 04:29:56 nobody made a tile for said drum 04:29:57 I just killed her and she came back 04:30:07 also drum is bland!! 04:30:12 the fuck 04:30:15 i made a drum 04:30:17 I - Ancestor Life: Battlemage None 0% 04:30:26 "Hexer"? 04:30:30 gammafunk: pls don't kill 04:30:32 it's wrong, to kill 04:30:40 i wonder what happened to the drum i made 04:30:42 such a beautiful name trio: knight, battlemage, hexer 04:30:50 it's the classics. 04:31:20 http://i.imgur.com/9cSedZS.png here was a drum. not really an altar though 04:31:20 let formicid dig through stone at the cost of mhp 04:31:31 http://i.imgur.com/Xbg9vKI.png grunt's take 04:32:01 -!- ontoclasm1 has joined ##crawl-dev 04:32:04 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:32:34 PleasingFungus: the hexer ally taught me that ME is actually a great spell 04:33:04 it's good 04:33:06 -!- ololoev has quit [Quit: Page closed] 04:33:10 i'm worried about the current choice there but who knows 04:33:18 i guess now that these two are in the game i'll need to get them to complete my polytheist quest? 04:33:31 i think the knight and the hexer are far superior to the battlemage 04:33:35 you'd be fine if you'd already gotten polytheist 04:33:37 or at least they were last time i played around 04:33:51 yes, but i obviously hadn't =p 04:33:51 rip 04:34:00 battlemage has a reasonably different spellset now. not sure it's better 04:34:17 which of the polytheist gods screws up everything like mitra boddhivista 04:34:19 i found it a very helpful ally when i was playing, since ranged allies are really strong 04:34:45 regret-index: maitreya? 04:34:49 -!- Jessica has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 04:34:56 i found that it wanted to charge in and hit things with its stick entirely too often 04:34:59 heh 04:35:02 yes, they'll do that 04:36:01 pleasingfungus: last I checked there's no buddhist anything in crawl :P 04:36:13 heh....at least when you enslave an efreet or get a pan lord from a pentagram card, you know they'll use their ranged attacks 04:36:22 clearly... need to rename hell rats to raigo???... 04:36:23 even if they aren't all that worried about catching you as collateral damage 04:37:15 shrikes don't look like robot birds anymore!? 04:37:20 the robot bird tile was awesome! 04:37:49 wait, did someone actually change the shrike tile 04:38:11 according to someone in ##crawl 04:38:16 now they look like actual birds 04:38:17 oh yeah 04:38:19 hrm 04:38:22 i'm not really a fan of that 04:38:24 looking atit 04:38:36 maybe i'll argue with ontoclasm about it 04:38:38 idk 04:38:42 i feel a little bad but: the old tile was better 04:39:15 heh 04:39:27 he gets most stuff right but i do like the old tile better 04:39:30 &watch mibe 04:39:31 http://crawl.akrasiac.org:8080/#watch-Mibe 04:39:37 he's in a zig that has a bunch right now 04:40:07 -!- PleasingFungus has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.92 [Firefox 46.0.1/20160502172042]] 04:40:15 i think maybe you didn't look closely enough at the old tile 04:40:26 i mean i understand if you don't like the new one but 04:40:45 heh 04:40:56 it's not *bad* 04:41:00 i just liked the old one 04:41:09 it was like "oh no, metal death bird!" 04:41:33 https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/bdaf798f747eb18aee31dec724aa2d5ecc8c1603/crawl-ref/source/rltiles/mon/animals/caustic_shrike.png 04:41:42 * ontoclasm1 shurgs 04:41:58 it has tiny little wings 04:42:25 the new one does look better from a technical standpoint 04:42:38 -!- ololoev has quit [Client Quit] 04:42:38 I appreciate the tile change, but I think caustic shrikes don't look very... caustic 04:42:39 oh well 04:43:06 bear in mind i still miss the old roly-poly ugly things too =p 04:43:09 i've pretty much gotten used to the fact that 95% of the things i make people end up hating 04:43:27 oh, i like the vast majority of the new tiles 04:43:27 like, the shard shrike at least has a clearly unnatural palette, but the caustic shrike looks both more vicious and also just, a bird >_> 04:43:48 not sure if you can fit much on though 04:43:53 bringing back the metallic coloration might help 04:43:56 and the red eyes 04:44:12 although i didn't get a great look at the eyes spectating that game 04:44:26 since they were constantly covered in freezing clouds and/or tornadoes 04:44:41 they have red eyes still 04:45:00 or rather, they have red eyes now 04:45:05 the old tile had yellow eyes 04:45:27 oh 04:45:28 heh 04:46:01 -!- Arglure has quit [Quit: Page closed] 04:46:09 frankly i have to use my imagination a fair amount on a 12" screen. even if it is a nice one 04:48:31 -!- ololoev has quit [Quit: Page closed] 04:52:02 -!- ontoclasm1 has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 04:52:56 going to be busy for the next indefinite while, hopefully somebody might pick up the level gen problems I couldn't untangle on the laplace branch since people seem to agree with trying out the pan improvement segments of my proposal >>_>> 04:53:01 -!- regret-index has quit [Quit: leaving] 04:57:21 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 05:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:00:58 -!- knu has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 05:08:38 -!- grisha5 has quit [Quit: Page closed] 05:09:14 Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.19-a0-233-gabd010d (34) 05:10:14 -!- knu has quit [Quit: Reboot...] 05:20:14 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 05:21:33 -!- vale_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:27:23 -!- vale_ has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 05:30:32 -!- lordfrikk has quit [Quit: Leaving] 05:31:35 -!- namelastname112 has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 05:32:14 -!- mbj has quit [Quit: Page closed] 05:40:46 -!- dpeg_ has joined ##crawl-dev 05:45:39 -!- dtsund has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 05:50:01 -!- Porost has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:00:03 -!- edsrzf has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 06:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:02:00 -!- ProzacElf has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 06:02:20 -!- removeelyvilon has quit [Quit: Page closed] 06:03:28 -!- jjukjjuk has quit [Client Quit] 06:05:11 -!- Mandevil_ is now known as Mandevil 06:06:49 -!- LexAckson__ has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:10:03 -!- Laptop_ has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 06:21:03 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:24:34 -!- Yermak has quit [Quit: Page closed] 06:25:41 minmay: what is even happening in that OpTm thread 06:28:03 -!- vale_ has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 06:32:16 -!- DIonized has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 06:32:19 -!- DIonized_ is now known as DIonized 06:36:47 https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=20020&view=unread&sid=d3cc36bb5284c472bffcfb80f1d32947#unread <-- can you remove dorokhle's tomb 06:36:54 it's a dumb spoilery wizlab that kills the most people 06:37:16 and i'm all for killing people in wizlabs, but it's killing people who aren't spoiled 06:39:27 chequers: it is my wizlab and I am very happy with it killing people. Also, could you please avoid "dumb". Thank you. 06:45:13 gammafunk: it is duvessa being his usual self. As so often, the reasonable version of that train of thought is expressed by crate. 06:46:42 dpeg_: yeah, my question to him was basically rhetorical 06:47:33 ah, I miss stuff like this so often in online conservation (I hope I do better in RL talk; not convinced :) 06:50:02 -!- Kat_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 06:52:03 -!- fixit_friend has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 06:52:03 -!- tollymain has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity] 07:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:00:42 -!- DIonized has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:00:46 -!- DIonized_ is now known as DIonized 07:09:49 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:18:09 -!- fixit_friend has joined ##crawl-dev 07:18:39 -!- Lasty has joined ##crawl-dev 07:20:08 Lasty: what god do we get today? 07:20:57 -!- Furril has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 07:21:12 -!- Akett has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 07:25:12 -!- debo has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 07:25:26 -!- Denapoli has quit [Quit: Page closed] 07:25:55 -!- aredel has quit [Quit: Page closed] 07:28:41 -!- vale_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:34:50 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:34:58 dpeg_: spoilery then 07:35:29 dpeg_: it kills people by letting people who aren't familiar with its lua walk into it and then get surrounded and die 07:36:03 -!- lordfrikk has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 07:36:20 -!- lordfrikk_ is now known as lordfrikk 07:36:30 -!- wheals has joined ##crawl-dev 07:37:33 -!- iFurril has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:41:00 chequers: What I really dislike is the immediate jump from "this is spoilery" to "this has to be removed". 07:41:42 There are a number of ways how it can be improved. Also, this is spoilery exactly once, so I am not sure if it is worse to dying once in every branch end (which an unspoiled player will expect), but that's a digression. 07:46:29 I've started a character before the combo_god merge into trunk, saved on d:1. After the merge I continued it, got to d9, checked all stairs and the temple, no Uka&Hepl. 07:46:51 Xenobreeder: a valid reason for ^Qyes 07:47:19 Well, I probably would, but this character has innate rF, rC and regen. 07:47:31 ah, pity :) 07:47:54 yeah the temple altar distribution is decided on game start 07:48:02 including overflows 07:48:23 if you wander the abyss long enough you should find an altar ;) 07:48:36 I'll probably just go Chei and try to do duhz. If I die — no harm done. 07:59:18 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 08:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:00:47 -!- zxc_ has joined ##crawl-dev 08:01:35 dpeg_: what god DON'T we get today? 08:01:35 Lasty: You have 9 messages. Use !messages to read them. 08:01:38 whoa 08:02:10 dpeg_: I know MorganLeah has a god in progress that just needs code cleanup 08:02:16 and testing of course 08:02:22 -!- mopl has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 08:02:54 -!- namelastname112_ has joined ##crawl-dev 08:03:16 i'm doing a spen of hepl and my ancestor is slower then me 08:03:23 is it supposed to be like it 08:03:27 -!- zxc has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 08:04:09 good question 08:04:58 namelastname112_: I don't think that was considered. It would make sense, but it'd make the god much better for fast chars and worse for slow ones. And also Tengu would . . . something 08:05:19 perhaps the ancestor should move at the same speed you do, ignoring haste/slow 08:05:28 or perhaps, for convenience, just at the same speed you do 08:05:43 it's just feels weird 08:05:45 i mean 08:05:54 it looks like the ancestor is currently always 10 speed 08:05:54 my ancestor is a spriggan too, right? 08:06:08 !tell pleasingfungus sp ancestors are speed 10 - bug? 08:06:09 chequers: OK, I'll let pleasingfungus know. 08:06:37 dorokoleh's tomb doesn't kill people by anything related to lua and/or walking into things 08:06:47 or gettings surrounded 08:07:00 the spoilery thing that kills people are the very very dangerous monsters it places 08:07:06 just like the other spoilery wizlabs 08:09:56 I should say *very very dangerous since they're not dangerous if you react appropriately (which may involve leaving) 08:10:22 ?dorok 08:10:26 ?/dorok 08:10:27 Matching terms (3): doroklohe, doroklohe's_tomb, tomb_of_doroklohe; entries (9): doroklohe[1] | doroklohe[2] | khufu[1] | named_wizards[1] | spells_that_do_not_exist[1] | tod[1] | tomb[6] | tomb_card[1] | wizlab[2] 08:10:32 well, I think for new players the walls will crumble when they are not in sight of the vestibule 08:11:07 well they should move towards the vestibule 08:11:28 and then to the exit, again if they can't kill/deal with those things 08:11:50 wizlabs basically = spoilers in crawl, there's no way to avoid this 08:12:02 gammafunk: also most portal vaults 08:12:05 yes 08:12:10 volcanoes, ice caves 08:12:46 -!- removeelyvilon has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 08:13:03 and it could be avoided if we didn't have vaults, but just made things through layouts without fixed structure, but people like their vaults 08:13:38 i don't think volcanos are toooo spoilery 08:13:42 -!- Lasty has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 08:13:54 except the flame cloud appearing logic, which is one-off 08:14:19 icecv is sort of bad since the randomly appearing clouds are pretty solid and take up a lot of space 08:14:21 they're all really spoilery imo, I don't mind it 08:14:41 but I can understand why some people don't like maps with spoilers; it's just not the current state of crawl 08:15:26 i'm definitely in favour of some things that semi-require spoilers 08:15:30 eg pan lord design 08:16:21 I just feel dorok tomb gives, relative to other spoilery maps, much less room for unspoiled players to play imperfectly 08:16:45 the room it gives has nothing related to the spoilers you mention, that's my point 08:16:55 the spoilers that make it hard: it places hard monsters 08:17:49 some maps place harder monsters, and are more difficult; you can argue that the gimmick is maybe not sufficiently interesting/fun, but I don't think it has anything to do with difficulty 08:18:31 and we have a fairly low bar for what constitutes 'interesting' wrt things like that 08:20:31 I think the spoiler is that monsters suddenly appear at the same time distributed through the level space 08:23:49 maps can distribute monsters in all sorts of ways, and other vaults place monsters in similar patterns/space to that one 08:25:17 -!- nugua has joined ##crawl-dev 08:25:22 and as I said, the map isn't dangerous if you just react to "I'm seeing a number of dangerous monsters" appropriately 08:25:23 -!- nugua is now known as regret-index 08:25:30 he's back 08:25:56 * regret-index sighs to herself 08:26:06 *she's back? 08:26:33 here's what I'd do with wizlab_doroklohe if I had any time 08:26:41 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 08:27:03 stagger-step the tombs opening up 08:27:35 instead of drip then all at once? 08:27:50 with longer steps 08:27:51 for lack of better terms 08:28:22 yeah, I mean people are dying there because they're not playing crawl well, because they're not understanding what monsters they're fighting 08:28:31 but I'm all for taking its gimmick and refining it 08:28:33 -!- eb has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 08:28:46 allow people to recognize some danger with a few middle-tier monsters, and also allow clearing out some of them with some terrain 08:29:25 yeah, something like that could be nice 08:29:47 -!- Lasty has joined ##crawl-dev 08:29:59 also I went and marked ice clouds in ice caves with shallow water origin points, as imperfect as this is 08:30:25 -!- vale_ has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 08:30:33 -!- ebarrett has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 08:31:03 again, if I had more time: I'd mark "the vague guess of where the clouds would stretch" with changed floor tiles / colour (sigh, dith/tso), but this requires some specific random placements instead of nearly completely random placements in some ice caves 08:31:37 only person with any ideas to repair level shit I swear 08:31:39 -!- regret-index has quit [Quit: leaving] 08:33:24 it's a lonely road... 08:33:54 I'm making a bot to help people wear ascii glasses, at least 08:33:58 !glasses 08:33:58 ( •_•)    ( •_•)>⌐■-■    (⌐■_■) 08:35:14 Lasty: I did OpTm of Sif, and I loved every minute of it 08:35:17 re: Dorokhloe: I should add a transparant ToD with monster inside at the entrance 08:35:33 ToD? 08:35:39 Tomb of Dorokhloe 08:35:43 gammafunk: you're young :) 08:35:49 oh dang 08:36:26 that's a cute idea, sure 08:40:03 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:43:03 -!- zxc_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:43:23 -!- zxc_ has joined ##crawl-dev 08:44:30 -!- Shard1697 has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 08:44:52 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 08:46:34 -!- wheals has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 08:48:00 -!- wheals has joined ##crawl-dev 08:50:24 -!- Lasty_ has joined ##crawl-dev 08:52:57 -!- waat has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 08:58:34 -!- Patashu has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 09:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:01:55 -!- Grivan has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 09:02:53 !tell MarvinPA What's the motivation behind disabling VS mp gain under Pak? Seems like it's just a way of making that species unable to worship Pak, given how central that MP drain is to staying alive as a VS. 09:02:54 Lasty_: OK, I'll let marvinpa know. 09:04:44 -!- iFurril has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 09:04:44 -!- zxc_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:05:23 -!- zxc_ has joined ##crawl-dev 09:06:00 Lasty: you think MP drain is central to their staying alive? I wouldn't say it is 09:06:07 i don't see that VS should get to ignore the conduct, it seems fine for them to happen to be less good with the god as a result 09:06:07 MarvinPA: You have 2 messages. Use !messages to read them. 09:06:26 how come pak uses both mp and piety instead of just the one? 09:06:26 where the conduct is defined as "no non-consumable mp restoration" 09:06:28 -!- Twiggytwiggytwig has quit [Quit: See ya guys later ;)] 09:06:36 -!- Nattefrost has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 09:06:41 -!- eb has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:07:05 zxc_: well, Fedhas uses fruit and piety 09:07:56 I think it should just use piety if you ask me 09:08:28 pretty random how much fruit you find over the course of the game 09:08:30 <|amethyst> just use piety as in remove all the MP-related conducts and abilities 09:08:32 <|amethyst> ? 09:08:48 I think he means just use MP 09:08:51 fedhas oklobs 09:09:04 yeah and that was regarding fedhas 09:09:06 I think fedhas oklobs should use piety instead of fruit 09:09:13 I wished for that myself 09:09:31 but don't you dare go countering my argument that way again zxc! 09:09:42 and for pak, I am not entirely sure but it seems odd to use both mp and piety. With other gods this would be normal but pak doesn't allow mp regain like normal 09:10:20 brb router 09:10:33 I think the idea is to put additional limits usage of his abilities 09:10:44 -!- zxc_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:10:55 *on usage 09:11:22 practically speaking, I only felt limited that way in the early game 09:11:34 in terms of not having enough piety 09:11:44 -!- dpeg_ has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 09:11:59 -!- zxc_ has joined ##crawl-dev 09:12:03 fedhas' limit works very differently, since fruit is pretty scarce, of course 09:12:19 <|amethyst> the problem with fruit is that it's so bursty 09:12:27 -!- dpeg has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 09:12:28 <|amethyst> either you find a vault with 15 fruit in it, or you don't 09:12:53 yeah, the limit ends up feeling pretty frustrating 09:13:04 mp under pak is sort of a strategic resource instead of a tactical one because you don't regen mp normally, so you're using two strategic resources (piety and mp) which seems redundant 09:13:19 as opposed to most gods where an ability costs mp (tactical) and piety (strategic) 09:13:58 well mp isn't just purely strategic under pak, it's still tactical as well 09:14:42 it seems like you can gozag-ify pak by removing pak piety and having mp be the piety 09:14:52 not sure if that would be good, haven't thought about it much 09:15:10 I think it mostly functions as an additional constraint 09:15:17 but I found this was only relevant in the early game 09:15:23 seems like unnecessary complexity 09:15:27 <|amethyst> MP serves as rate-limiting 09:15:50 well is it complex? Piety is pretty well-implemented and understood 09:16:05 not liek Pak piety is some weird other thing 09:16:07 it's more that mp functions differently to normal 09:16:08 *like 09:16:11 not the piety 09:16:43 why not just disallow spells and make pak abilities cost (more) piety? 09:16:52 and not have anything to do with mp 09:16:57 no, the soft-limit on spells is kool 09:17:12 KooL? 09:17:15 yes 09:17:15 <|amethyst> Pak originally did disallow spells, didn't e? 09:17:21 yeah 09:17:28 oh he doesn't still? 09:17:50 no, pak allows spells now 09:17:57 grunt changed it after declaring it bad 09:19:19 the power level of the god feels pretty high still, so I guess I'd be interested in adjustments for that sake, but the mp+piety thing doesn't strike me as too bad anyhow 09:19:54 I guess the biggest thing that might need rethinking is the gifting mp pots, but I'm not sure how others feel about that 09:20:16 <|amethyst> gifting MP potions is there to solve a specific problem 09:20:23 yes and it does do that 09:20:52 well specifically solves one problem, but might create others wrt balance 09:21:36 -!- debo_ has joined ##crawl-dev 09:26:22 -!- wheals has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:26:37 -!- debo_ has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 09:27:26 -!- NotKat has quit [Quit: Page closed] 09:38:50 -!- tealeaves has quit [Quit: Bye] 09:39:24 -!- LexAckson__ has joined ##crawl-dev 09:40:06 -!- tealeaves has quit [Client Quit] 09:40:33 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:46:59 Ukayaw likes it when . Ukayaw especially likes it when hurt your foes. 09:46:59 there are multiple issues with this line :P 09:50:16 Lasty: ^ 09:50:36 Maybe Uka just likes new experiences in general 09:53:22 -!- LexAckson_ has joined ##crawl-dev 09:55:21 -!- Nattefrost has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 09:56:34 -!- LexAckson__ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:58:14 03|amethyst02 07* 0.19-a0-234-g798d037: Correct messages for gods with only really_likes (elliptic) 10(66 seconds ago, 1 file, 11+ 6-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/798d037a5ef1 09:58:14 03|amethyst02 07* 0.19-a0-235-g1519406: Add a missing to Ukayaw likes (elliptic) 10(16 seconds ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/1519406909a7 09:58:40 -!- Dracunos has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 09:58:47 <|amethyst> should Hep be added to zigsprint? 09:59:50 %git 75ffc054b89a873d8ec09fff91341a5ff0027caf 09:59:50 07PleasingFungus02 * 0.19-a0-222-g75ffc05: Add Hepliaklqana to sprints 10(8 hours ago, 5 files, 15+ 10-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/75ffc054b89a 10:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:00:06 if you can find a way to squeeze it in, presumably! 10:00:19 (pitsprint too according to the commit comment) 10:00:33 -!- vale_ has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 10:03:27 <|amethyst> ukayaw is just sitting in a corner outside the pattern 10:03:33 <|amethyst> could do the same for hep 10:04:48 <|amethyst> could make two of rooms 22, 23, 24 one tile shorter vertically 10:05:48 <|amethyst> which will allow the start room to be expanded by two tiles, making room for the two altars (one on each side, plus spacing) 10:09:07 Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.19-a0-235-g1519406 (34) 10:10:49 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.19-a0-236-g0f70547: Add new gods to levdes.vim for vault syntax highlighting 10(2 minutes ago, 1 file, 4+ 4-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/0f705476faf8 10:11:27 <|amethyst> MarvinPA: doh, you beat me to it 10:11:44 heh, spotted when looking at the sprint .des files i guess? 10:11:53 <|amethyst> yeah :) 10:14:42 Ukayaw likes it when [REDACTED] 10:15:14 -!- debo_ has joined ##crawl-dev 10:17:21 -!- Daekdroom has quit [Quit: Leaving] 10:17:52 -!- debo has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:18:51 03|amethyst02 07* 0.19-a0-237-g32c3287: Add Hep to, and better place Uk in, zigsprint. 10(2 minutes ago, 1 file, 19+ 18-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/32c3287dfddc 10:22:07 -!- Dracunos7 has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 10:22:10 -!- ebarrett has quit [Disconnected by services] 10:22:35 hmm, should "putrid demonspawn zombie" be a thing that exists (as opposed to just "demonspawn zombie") 10:23:34 apparently if you reanimate a classed draconian/demonspawn it comes back as just a draconian/demonspawn zombie 10:23:50 but if you animate a nonclassed one it keeps its colour/flavour as a zombie 10:24:30 -!- stickyfingers has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 10:24:54 i assume changing base draconian's species to be MONS_DRACONIAN (instead of whatever their colour is) will break something else somewhere though, that seems likely 10:26:22 <|amethyst> I don't think that's unreasonable 10:26:30 -!- tealeaves has quit [Quit: Bye] 10:27:15 <|amethyst> putrid vs (say) monstrous demonspawn presumably look different, so it's not unreasonable for their corpses to look different 10:27:45 <|amethyst> maybe it's a bit weird for draconian skeletons (but even then, grey and black would have differently-shaped skeletons) 10:28:23 hmm maybe, although in that case it's still weird for classed ones not to keep their flavour 10:29:14 Why monster can evoke wand while berserk but player cannot? 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=10439 by CALLOUS 10:29:14 <|amethyst> yeah, that requires some special case in the corpse-generation code to compensate for special cases in the draconian type code 10:30:46 <|amethyst> I think that bug applies only to digging 10:31:33 <|amethyst> the normal wand stuff is handled with scrolls, rods, throwing, etc, and looks like it's protected by a !mons->berserk_or_insane() except for slime creatures 10:42:06 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.19-a0-238-g7ec5e23: Don't generate dryad zombies 10(17 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/7ec5e2342591 10:42:06 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.19-a0-239-g2507afc: Don't allow passwalling while in tree form 10(10 minutes ago, 1 file, 6+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/2507afca6a00 10:42:37 -!- ystael has quit [*.net *.split] 10:42:37 -!- waat has quit [*.net *.split] 10:42:37 -!- Athaboros has quit [*.net *.split] 10:42:38 -!- buki has quit [*.net *.split] 10:42:39 -!- HellTiger_NB has quit [*.net *.split] 10:42:39 -!- ByronJohnson has quit [*.net *.split] 10:42:39 -!- G-Flex has quit [*.net *.split] 10:42:40 -!- bencryption has quit [*.net *.split] 10:42:40 -!- Twinge has quit [*.net *.split] 10:42:40 -!- FiftyNine has quit [*.net *.split] 10:42:41 -!- zxc_ has quit [*.net *.split] 10:42:42 -!- jeefus has quit [*.net *.split] 10:42:42 -!- staplegun has quit [*.net *.split] 10:42:43 -!- tw_ has quit [*.net *.split] 10:42:43 -!- elliptic has quit [*.net *.split] 10:42:43 -!- destrovel has quit [*.net *.split] 10:42:43 -!- cmcbot has quit [*.net *.split] 10:42:43 -!- mzmz has quit [*.net *.split] 10:43:00 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 10:43:32 <|amethyst> oh, re that Harm thing 10:43:51 <|amethyst> not relevant to Harm anymore, but: gaining a religion doesn't tell you about bad jewellery 10:43:59 <|amethyst> there is explicit code to check for bad armour 10:44:04 <|amethyst> but it only iterates over armour 10:44:15 <|amethyst> !source religion.cc:3141 10:44:16 https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/religion.cc#l3141 10:44:33 -!- nezrel has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:45:49 03|amethyst02 07* 0.19-a0-240-g2c39c2a: Don't let monsters cast or zap Dig while berserk/insane (#10439) 10(9 minutes ago, 1 file, 5+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/2c39c2ad0148 10:45:55 <|amethyst> That bug also applied to spells 10:46:03 <|amethyst> berserk monsters could cast dig too 10:46:31 -!- Nattefrost has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 10:47:06 -!- cosmonaut has joined ##crawl-dev 10:47:12 nice 10:56:45 -!- fearless has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:58:58 -!- fearless has quit [Client Quit] 10:59:16 -!- destrovel_ has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:00:59 Kellhus (L20 VpEE) ASSERT(mthing.holding_monster() == mon) in 'mon-gear.cc' at line 84 failed. (D (Sprint)) 11:01:35 Kellhus (L21 VpEE) ASSERT(mthing.holding_monster() == mon) in 'mon-gear.cc' at line 84 failed. (D (Sprint)) 11:01:56 -!- knu has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:05:56 -!- parabolic has joined ##crawl-dev 11:06:17 -!- parabolic is now known as elliptic 11:06:44 oh hm. I suppose I should update my levdes.vim file 11:06:44 johnstein: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 11:08:27 -!- DDFi has quit [Quit: Page closed] 11:09:05 Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.19-a0-240-g2c39c2a (34) 11:10:36 -!- eb has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 11:10:53 -!- wheals has joined ##crawl-dev 11:12:49 -!- koboldina has quit [Quit: Page closed] 11:14:27 -!- LexAckson_ has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:17:18 <|amethyst> !crashlog kellhus sprint 11:17:19 2. Kellhus, XL21 VpEE, T:526 (milestone): http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/Kellhus/crash-Kellhus-20160524-150134.txt 11:18:11 fun with sprint-modified uka piety gain there 11:18:26 <|amethyst> !crashlog kellhus sprint -2 11:18:27 1/2. Kellhus, XL20 VpEE, T:347 (milestone): http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/Kellhus/crash-Kellhus-20160524-150057.txt 11:20:01 <|amethyst> ? 11:20:04 the unspeakable: slime creature hp:10000 hd:100 name:The_Unspeakable n_rpl col:jewel tile:mons_unspeakable generate_awake perm_ench:haste spells:shadow_creatures.25.natural;airstrike.25.natural;smiting.25.natural;death's_door.25.natural.emergency 11:20:04 %??spec:the unspeakable 11:21:34 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 11:21:59 <|amethyst> let me see if I can get a better backtrace 11:23:46 <|amethyst> monster is a molten gargoyle, so I guess a vile 11:23:49 -!- herself has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 11:25:28 -!- lordfrikk has joined ##crawl-dev 11:26:06 <|amethyst> weapon is a morningstar 11:26:16 -!- knu has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:26:42 -!- debo has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:27:20 -!- removeelyvilon has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 11:29:25 <|amethyst> the item's position is correctly (-2,-2) 11:30:33 <|amethyst> but link is 27701 which corresponds to mindex 700 == MAX_MONSTERS 11:32:35 <|amethyst> hm 11:32:41 <|amethyst> this monster's index really is 700 11:32:48 <|amethyst> I guess the level got full 11:33:14 <|amethyst> and whatever was supposed to prevent creating the monster in the first place isn't working 11:34:59 <|amethyst> oh 11:35:07 <|amethyst> I bet I broke this 11:36:13 <|amethyst> yes 11:36:22 <|amethyst> %git e68714429 11:36:22 07|amethyst02 * 0.17-a0-1874-ge687144: C++11: More range-based for loops and algorithms. 10(8 months ago, 39 files, 237+ 354-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/e6871442934c 11:36:50 <|amethyst> I changed a bunch of for (int i = 0; i < MAX_MONSTERS; ++i) to for (auto &mons : menv) 11:36:53 -!- vev has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:37:00 <|amethyst> but menv actually has two extra elements 11:38:05 <|amethyst> didn't we see another weird crash at some point involving anonymous friendly monster? 11:40:18 -!- zxc_ has joined ##crawl-dev 11:40:18 -!- jeefus has joined ##crawl-dev 11:44:03 -!- stickyfingers has quit [Quit: Page closed] 11:44:16 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:45:54 -!- ByronJohnson has joined ##crawl-dev 11:45:54 -!- G-Flex has joined ##crawl-dev 11:45:54 -!- Twinge has joined ##crawl-dev 11:46:54 -!- ByronJohnson has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 11:50:10 -!- Dracunos has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:54:23 -!- ByronJohnson has joined ##crawl-dev 11:57:33 -!- knu_ has quit [*.net *.split] 11:57:34 -!- ystael has quit [*.net *.split] 11:57:34 -!- waat has quit [*.net *.split] 11:57:34 -!- Athaboros has quit [*.net *.split] 11:57:35 -!- buki has quit [*.net *.split] 11:57:35 -!- HellTiger_NB has quit [*.net *.split] 11:57:36 -!- G-Flex has quit [*.net *.split] 11:57:36 -!- bencryption has quit [*.net *.split] 11:57:37 -!- Twinge has quit [*.net *.split] 11:57:37 -!- FiftyNine has quit [*.net *.split] 12:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:00:28 -!- Denapoli has quit [Quit: Page closed] 12:00:37 -!- vale_ has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:01:00 -!- Zekka has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 12:06:17 -!- G-Flex has joined ##crawl-dev 12:06:17 -!- Twinge has joined ##crawl-dev 12:06:38 !tell pleasingfungus got your message about the tp closet. I won't be in a spot to help till later tonight. the player could probably do the save backup though if they can log into console. 12:06:39 johnstein: OK, I'll let pleasingfungus know. 12:07:30 -!- PleasingFungus has joined ##crawl-dev 12:13:39 -!- debo_ is now known as debo 12:16:42 -!- siepu has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:21:48 johnstein: the backup was performed 12:22:51 -!- Denapoli has quit [Client Quit] 12:30:49 -!- Ququman has joined ##crawl-dev 12:33:12 -!- Jessika has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 12:38:57 -!- removeelyvilon has joined ##crawl-dev 12:39:18 hello 12:39:37 greetings. 12:39:37 PleasingFungus: You have 2 messages. Use !messages to read them. 12:39:39 ! 12:39:58 !tell chequers all ancestors are the same speed and size. hail hep 12:39:58 PleasingFungus: OK, I'll let chequers know. 12:40:20 good that you mention hep, can I bother you for some feedback 12:40:45 you can do whatever you dream you can. believe in yourself! 12:41:03 bob ross, game developer 12:41:47 well first of all it's AWESOME. the flavour is awesome, the tiles are awesome, you can name your ancestor just for fun (uh the optimalgoodplayers aren't going to like that one) 12:42:08 renaming your ancestor is BASICALLY the new winscumming 12:42:27 I only used the hexer so far but metabolic is really good, it's almost like a torpor snail that doesn't slow you 12:42:59 -!- Gravitas is now known as Gravitas81 12:43:34 there being only 1 ally and the fact that it revives avoids a lot of trouble I have with other permanent ally gods (no emotional stress when you lose him and easier to manage) 12:44:00 the ancestor can be affected by inner flame, is that intended? 12:44:23 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 12:45:38 not something i'd considered, but sounds funny 12:47:43 you can name your pet? ugh 12:48:01 i named mine 'the pony from nethack' 12:48:09 then i fell off it 12:48:21 -!- dpeg has joined ##crawl-dev 12:48:44 -!- scummos__ has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 12:48:54 greetings, mr. ploog! 12:49:25 I kina figured that corpse-violating spells would upset him but that would neither be fun nor original and besides, I think necro got enough kicks to the shins for a while 12:50:09 also it's not actually in theme 12:50:20 -!- Kellhus has quit [Quit: Page closed] 12:50:49 idk if I cared about ancestors I would give ppl a proper burial 12:52:31 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.19-a0-241-g54f067d: Improve ancestor descriptions 10(23 seconds ago, 1 file, 7+ 7-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/54f067d60a22 12:53:31 but it's like a memory, right 12:53:37 but the ancestor is a reconstruction from memory. in some sense Hep is not an ancestor god but a memory god 12:53:47 -!- cang has quit [Quit: Page closed] 12:54:07 PleasingFungus: we're on last name terms now? 12:54:14 sorry 12:54:16 professor ploog 12:54:27 i have some questions about my grades, 12:54:40 * dpeg sends pleasingfungus a full collection of capital letters. 12:54:46 PleasingFungus: dismissed! 12:54:48 ! 12:55:00 now i'm all prepared to become a console player! 12:55:23 -!- Twiggytwiggytwig has quit [Quit: See ya guys later ;)] 12:56:11 active abilties feel kinda meh (does transference at high piety apply the actual slow status? If yes, I can't seem to get it to work) but may be because my invo is kinda whack atm 12:56:43 worth noting that idealise doubles attack & spellpower 12:57:25 k that sounds pretty good 12:58:52 also all my ancestors were pirates, poachers, thieves, lawyers, smugglers, people who keep others waiting, madmen, and other vermin 12:58:54 just like irl 12:59:36 -!- sanka has quit [Quit: Page closed] 12:59:43 grim 13:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:00:20 and that's my experience with hepl so far 13:00:33 Btw is there a way to donate for this game 13:01:54 -!- vale_ has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:02:54 yes I can send dets 13:02:57 ;) 13:03:00 -!- Nattefr0st has quit [Client Quit] 13:04:27 -!- blabber has joined ##crawl-dev 13:04:28 removeelyvilon: we accept donations in form of kindnesscoin and politewordmarks 13:04:46 I only have bison dollars do 13:05:25 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.19-a0-241-g54f067d (34) 13:05:55 No seriously there are so many mediocre games that cost a fortune but for this I would gladly give something 13:06:13 -!- OCTOTROG has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:06:25 I believe all devs accept cookies 13:06:49 we prefer not to let money into things, even donations 13:06:56 and cookies? 13:07:03 we do accept cookies. 13:07:07 thought so 13:07:15 -!- jefus- has joined ##crawl-dev 13:07:17 everyone can be bribed with cookies 13:07:28 how many cookies to remove adders from D:1? 13:08:02 how about this. for every cookie you give me, i'll add an adder instead 13:08:08 Oh and I forgot one thing: the hexer is not good at actually stabbing things 13:08:25 it has like, no stealth training or sb training or something 13:08:37 PleasingFungus: I don't think you get how this works 13:08:57 removeelyvilon: it's a sham! 13:09:04 I give cookie, you remove adder 13:09:04 a sham indeed 13:09:08 Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.19-a0-241-g54f067d (34) 13:09:22 zxc_: yeah, i get it. you give me cookies, i kill more of your characters 13:09:29 that's what a crawl dev is supposed to do, right? 13:09:40 well thanks for the hard work guyse 13:09:57 -!- mibert has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 13:10:35 -!- jeefus has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 13:15:38 you're welcome, i really put in a lot of hard work on hep 13:15:41 working all day 13:16:42 slaving in the bug mines 13:17:59 -!- travis-ci has joined ##crawl-dev 13:18:00 The build has errored. (master - 2507afc #5562 : Chris Campbell): https://travis-ci.org/crawl/crawl/builds/132584987 13:18:00 -!- travis-ci has left ##crawl-dev 13:18:52 -!- aredel has joined ##crawl-dev 13:20:34 hello, need help in strange situation with training skills: i play MuFi of gozaq, so for my own preparations for zig i need time to farm gold, while train skills. problem is that if i unchoose all skills then i cant exit from that screen. 13:21:47 so, choose a skill? 13:22:07 exactly, problem can occur lately, when i will train all skills up to 27, and then...what shall i do in that situation?) 13:22:24 once everything's at 27, you can exit the screen without choosing a skill. 13:22:25 <|amethyst> it should let you exit if you have no trainable skills left 13:22:52 <+PleasingFungus> ok, if it will be realy so , glas to see that. then thx for help. 13:22:56 np :) 13:22:59 ) 13:23:14 question for devs: currently transference lets you swap your ancestor with stationary enemies, e.g. statues. bug or feature? 13:23:15 i'm undecided 13:24:01 -!- HellTiger_NB has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:24:45 ah btw, last question from me) should i try to train last skills (for example poison magic)? i mean specially memorize spell for that* 13:25:35 or system can ignore that and let me not to train it? 13:25:42 <|amethyst> you don't need to (you can exit the screen if all trainable skills are level 27) 13:25:54 <|amethyst> but if you're getting the XP anyway, why waste it? :) 13:26:23 ah ok, now i feel relieved, thx a lot) 13:26:56 <+|amethyst> thats not a problem) but i cant train transmutation 13:27:04 -!- GauHelldragon has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:27:44 crap, sry my bad 13:28:11 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.19-a0-242-g22108c2: Improve Idealise scaling with Invocations 10(2 minutes ago, 1 file, 3+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/22108c2ed435 13:28:17 i thought that Mu cant transform and thus - cant train that magic( there are some spells that i can memorize! 13:28:52 ok, now i realy feel relieved, thx for all who helped me ^_^ 13:30:04 -!- aredel has left ##crawl-dev 13:32:25 PleasingFungus: sounds like a bug to me 13:32:34 yeah i guess 13:32:36 PleasingFungus: I think being able to move statues seems like a really dangeruos thing 13:32:36 sad 13:32:45 ? 13:32:48 <|amethyst> BTW, it would be nice to have something like this in learndb or even in-game: http://crawl.chaosforge.org/List_of_spells_by_school 13:33:06 ??hexes 13:33:07 hexes[1/4]: Contains all the good hexes, after Enchantments was split into Charms and Hexes. Enchanters start with a {Book of Maledictions}. To see Hexes spells, see hexes[2]. To see books which contain Hexes spells, see hexes[3]. 13:33:10 ??hexes[2 13:33:10 list of spells by school[7/14]: Hexes: {corona}, {confusing touch}, {ensorcelled hibernation}, {slow}, {confuse}, {tukima's dance}, {dazzling spray}, {inner flame}, {spectral weapon}, {cause fear}, {leda's}, {fulminant prism}, {metabolic englaciation}, {silence}, {invisibility}, {mass confusion}, {darkness}, {discord} 13:33:15 <|amethyst> aha 13:33:25 <|amethyst> thanks 13:33:25 mass confusion 13:34:01 <|amethyst> maybe I should take the script that generates that wiki page and make it generate !learn set commands as well 13:34:02 |amethyst: could do this is in a ?/ submenu 13:34:49 or allow searching by school in ?/s 13:35:22 ?/s seems like the right place, yeah 13:35:23 No matches. 13:35:26 thanks sequell 13:36:52 wheals: oh yes 13:37:43 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.19-a0-243-g6ce9f98: Ban transferring immovable enemies (ololoev) 10(53 seconds ago, 1 file, 5+ 3-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/6ce9f98cab13 13:39:32 -!- vev has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:40:35 -!- amalloy_ is now known as amalloy 13:41:03 is ukayaw piety intended to work with faith? seems like it probably shouldn't 13:41:06 since there's no cost for removal 13:41:37 MarvinPA: it is currently intended to work w/ Faith 13:41:43 <|amethyst> could add timed antifaith 13:41:52 There's no cost for removal, but there's also no way to abuse stockpiling faith 13:41:54 <|amethyst> XP-gated, rather, not timed 13:41:55 there's no - yeah 13:42:00 which is why the removal cost exists 13:42:23 on the other hand, is this really any different from swapping, say, reflection on or off? think about it... 13:42:33 i thought swapping amulets for tactical bonuses was illegal now 13:43:11 Well, you do lose some piety swapping out "faith even w/ Uka, it just isn't as painful 13:43:12 <|amethyst> dismissal 13:43:21 So it's not consequence-free 13:43:35 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.19-a0-244-gdf7ae78: Don't multiply Ukayaw piety in Sprint 10(2 hours ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/df7ae78f96eb 13:43:35 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.19-a0-245-gacb3693: Remove some references to rods acting as weapons 10(71 minutes ago, 2 files, 1+ 16-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/acb36933c863 13:43:40 <|amethyst> dismissal even has an on-wear effect that makes it more likely to trigger 13:43:40 it's just long-term-consequence-free, which is fine because it's also long-term-benefit-free 13:43:53 |amethyst: heh, true. I hadn't considered that. 13:44:02 MarvinPA: nice catches! 13:44:18 fr: nice catechism 13:44:31 kellhus caught the sprint one, was pretty fun to watch 13:44:33 !lg kellhus won sprint 13:44:34 20. Kellhus the Rhythm of Life and Death (L24 HOFi of Ukayaw), escaped with the Orb and 17 runes on 2016-05-24 15:58:22, with 150476871 points after 12100 turns and 0:51:28. 13:44:43 good rune count 13:44:46 MarvinPA I noticed that monsters (i. e. minotaur in labyrinth) can still use rods to smack you 13:45:30 <|amethyst> well, for a monster even a bread ration would be better than fighting unarmed :) 13:45:35 hmm, could make monsters treat them like ranged weapons and swap to unarmed i guess? 13:46:04 <|amethyst> MarvinPA: could make monsters put rods in their ranged slot 13:46:09 <|amethyst> MarvinPA: too 13:46:31 |amethyst: clearly monsters need to pick up any item they can get their hands on to wield. Especially pizza. 13:46:34 <|amethyst> MarvinPA: so they'll swap back to a weapon the way kobolds do 13:46:40 -!- vale_ has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 13:46:54 <|amethyst> (kobolds with crossbows/blowguns that is) 13:46:56 yeah 13:47:20 |amethyst: so then if you find a minotaur w/ rod of shadows, you stand next to it to stop it from summoning? 13:47:31 brutal nerf to my upcoming rod+xbow dual-wielding unique 13:48:14 well on the plus side you're at least having to stand next to a monster that does decent melee damage in that case 13:50:00 i don't think i'd describe that tactic as a problem - it seems like a reasonable mechanic to have 13:51:32 <|amethyst> Lasty_: it doesn't have to use the same criteria to swap 13:51:36 <|amethyst> but it could 13:52:56 -!- aredel has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 13:54:20 -!- dalwyn has quit [Quit: Page closed] 13:55:10 |amethyst: fair 13:55:20 -!- scummos__ has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 13:55:32 -!- cosmonaut has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 13:55:55 -!- LexAckson has joined ##crawl-dev 13:56:15 <|amethyst> hm 13:56:30 <|amethyst> in the save compat code for uncursing rods 13:57:00 <|amethyst> I think it might be safer to pass , false to do_uncurse_item so it doesn't recheck bondage 13:57:32 <|amethyst> either way bondage would probably be wrong, but checking bondage while you're still in the middle of unmarshalling items doesn't sound like a good idea 13:57:56 <|amethyst> there's an XXX elsewhere about bondage 13:58:19 kinky 13:58:31 <|amethyst> could call ash_check_bondage(false); at the end of unmarshalling the player, or at least after all items 13:58:54 <|amethyst> or maybe we'd want (true) so the player gets messages about the change? 14:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:02:27 -!- LexAckson_ has joined ##crawl-dev 14:05:13 -!- travis-ci has joined ##crawl-dev 14:05:14 The build passed. (master - 2c39c2a #5563 : Neil Moore): https://travis-ci.org/crawl/crawl/builds/132585988 14:05:14 -!- travis-ci has left ##crawl-dev 14:05:34 -!- LexAckson has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:05:54 when you adjusted hunger costs of divine abilties, there was no mention of Ely. Coincidence? 14:07:01 removeelyvilon: I think the consensus at the time was that Ely food costs were working infe 14:07:02 fine too 14:07:17 k 14:09:09 Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.19-a0-245-gacb3693 (34) 14:11:17 New branch created: nfm-bondage-compat (1 commit) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/tree/nfm-bondage-compat 14:11:17 03|amethyst02 07[nfm-bondage-compat] * 0.19-a0-246-g5bb4cf0: Update Ash bondage on load. 10(4 minutes ago, 1 file, 6+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/5bb4cf025403 14:11:34 <|amethyst> untested 14:12:19 <|amethyst> I guess that could have gone inside an #if TAG_MAJOR_VERSION but it seems like the kind of thing that's likely to be necessary in the future and isn't bad to do unconditionally 14:13:55 -!- G-Flex| has joined ##crawl-dev 14:15:24 -!- FiftyNine has quit [Ping timeout: 282 seconds] 14:15:24 -!- buki has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:15:25 -!- ystael has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:15:38 curses, foiled again 14:15:46 good joke for when we add tin-foil rods 14:15:55 and then let them be cursed? idk 14:16:12 anyway commit looks plausible 14:16:30 -!- tealeaves has quit [Quit: Bye] 14:16:42 -!- waat has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 14:16:42 -!- Athaboros has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 14:16:42 -!- G-Flex has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 14:16:42 -!- Twinge has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 14:17:00 -!- Twinge has joined ##crawl-dev 14:17:43 Wait, wouldn't shared damage + insta-kill mean that you instantly kill every enemy 14:17:55 ? 14:18:00 -!- blabber has quit [Quit: leaving] 14:18:11 I just read about Ukayaw 14:18:13 -!- Nattefrost has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:19:32 ??ukayaw 14:19:32 ukayaw[1/3]: Experimental branch god of ecstatic dance. Piety raises very quickly as you deal damage and drops very quickly over time. *: Stomp for AOE damage. **: Teleport through a line of creatures, confusing them. ***: on reaching this piety level, briefly paralyze all enemies in LOS. ****: On reaching this piety level, monsters share damage. *****: Telefrag any monster in LOS. 14:19:46 telefrag doesn't deal damage 14:19:54 ??ukayaw[2 14:19:55 ukayaw powers[1/1]: *: Stomp. **: Line Pass. *****: Grand Finale. Upon reaching ***, briefly and irresistably paralyze all monsters in LOS. Upon reaching ****, pain bond all monsters in LOS. The *** and **** powers can be triggered once per 30 turns. All powers scale heavily w/ Invo. 14:20:00 ??pain bond 14:20:00 pain bond[1/1]: Monsters affected with pain bond broadcast their damage to nearby pain-bonded monsters. Amount of damage shared is damage*(4-distance)/5. Maximum range is 3 tiles. Damage from pain bond is also shared, allowing for massive feedback loops against large groups. Mindless creatures are immune. 14:21:58 ??grand finale 14:21:58 grand finale[1/1]: Ukayaw ***** power. Blink to a non-mindless monster and explode it. Nearby monsters can be hit by flying bits for light damage. Base failure rate is 120 - (5*Invo) - (piety points over 5*) percent. Using Grand Finale sets your piety to *. Grand Finale has a high hunger cost. 14:22:28 ...why non-mindless? 14:22:36 no emotions 14:22:55 exploding is a very emotional experience 14:23:44 PleasingFungus: exactly :p 14:23:53 well the description is something like merge your emotions with the emotions of the victim and then violently break the bond apart 14:24:13 nice 14:24:35 it's either a euphemism for intercourse or some Vulcan "my mind to your mind" gone horribly wrong 14:25:06 new race request 14:26:00 well I get it now, in some othe RPG I played inta KO effects are technically max HP damge so I was worried there for a second 14:26:23 yeah, in crawl instant-death isn't the same as "take damage equal to current hp" 14:26:47 See also drowning, lava 14:26:53 stairs 14:27:01 lol 14:27:41 crawl characters have a very special take on object permanence. 14:27:57 Side note, I love object permanence jokes. 14:28:16 -!- stanzill has quit [Changing host] 14:28:40 were you around when there was a channel meme wrt me & lack of object permanency 14:28:54 elliptic (L22 GhAr) ASSERT(m) in 'mon-util.cc' at line 2201 failed. (Shoals:4) 14:29:00 hrm 14:29:01 uh 14:29:02 !crashlog elliptic 14:29:04 25. elliptic, XL22 GhAr, T:42854 (milestone): http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/elliptic/crash-elliptic-20160524-182853.txt 14:29:15 PleasingFungus: I missed it, sadly 14:29:51 well, that's an odd crash 14:29:58 !source mon-util.cc#2201 14:29:59 Can't find mon-util.cc#2201. 14:30:04 !source mon-util.cc 14:30:05 https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/mon-util.cc 14:30:06 there were a lot of merfolk in sight, including invisible ilsuiw 14:30:14 my last action was just tab 14:30:53 . . . the javelineer you killed didn't exist enough to give you XP? 14:30:59 er to have an XP value 14:31:03 not xp 14:31:06 look at the stack crace 14:31:10 *trace 14:31:25 oh, threat level 14:31:34 a monster threw something and died before impact 14:31:37 looks like 14:31:55 !source ranged_attack.cc 14:31:55 https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/ranged_attack.cc 14:32:41 I went back and killed the same group of monsters without repeating the crash, fwiw 14:32:43 ranged_attack::using_weapon() assumes that the attacker will continue to exist for the duration of the attack 14:33:00 which is the sort of assumption that makes me nervous 14:33:17 hm, I might have had ukayaw pain sharing on at the time 14:33:21 ah ha 14:33:23 yeah i bet that's it 14:33:25 so maybe the monster hit another monster with the throw 14:33:33 (invisible ilsuiw, say) 14:33:46 ah, haha, yeah 14:33:47 The merfolk javelineer throws a javelin. You kill the merfolk javelineer! 14:34:40 I'm surprised we haven't seen something like this with spines, but maybe spines is checked further along in the process 14:34:51 spines don't trigger on ranged attacks 14:34:55 this is a ranged-attack specific bug 14:35:10 ...also, we've had a bunch of similar bugs involving cleaving and spectral weapons and so on in melee 14:35:12 historically 14:35:30 this bug usually only happens with ball lightning 14:35:32 it is sort of hard to notice when pain sharing is on, since I guess it only affects monsters in sight at the moment in triggers and then it disappears fairly quickly? 14:36:02 I sort of feel like it should be a status effect that affects all monsters in sight, even if they weren't in sight when it started 14:36:22 obviously would be a buff, but balance could be tweaked and I think it might play better 14:38:55 -!- WalrusKing has quit [Read error: No route to host] 14:40:26 <|amethyst> Lasty_: btw, the way to do what you tried is 14:40:31 <|amethyst> !source mon-util.cc:2201 14:40:31 https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/mon-util.cc#l2201 14:41:22 -!- CanOfWorms has joined ##crawl-dev 14:41:53 <|amethyst> as far as fixing the bug, one possibility would be to store all that stuff (is launched, attacker skill, ...) in the attack ahead of time 14:41:59 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 14:42:16 <|amethyst> we already do that for many things 14:42:19 yeah 14:42:24 i think we might already be storing at least one relevant thing 14:42:26 testing 14:42:32 by making attackers commit suicide at the start of an attack 14:42:32 <|amethyst> a more general but more intrusive fix 14:43:24 <|amethyst> is to not actually mark monsters as dead (particularly, removal from mid cache and possible reset()ing) until fineffs fire 14:43:40 <|amethyst> who knows what that would break though 14:43:46 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 14:43:56 -!- zxc_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:44:31 everything 14:44:39 <|amethyst> not sure if you'd also want to postpone removing them from the grid 14:44:49 <|amethyst> that probably causes interesting bugs whichever way you go 14:47:41 -!- tealeaves has quit [Quit: Bye] 14:49:39 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.19-a0-246-ga6dc205: Don't crash when a ranged attacker dies (elliptic) 10(2 minutes ago, 2 files, 9+ 8-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/a6dc20555d9a 14:50:31 bonus: reduces code duplication :) 14:53:07 i'm trying to make it so that any supercharged device always has a chance of miscasting if you abandon pakellas, is there a better way of doing that than just adding another param to your_spells? (it's easy for wands but not for rods) 14:53:28 i guess i could do it in _rod_spell but then it'd happen after the spell effect instead of before like all other god-forced miscasts do 14:53:43 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: #9717 ? 14:53:54 !bug 9717 14:53:55 https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=9717 14:54:02 oooh 14:54:15 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: ah, no, that crash was about skill, which it looks like you haven't pulled out yet 14:54:20 yeah sorry 14:54:33 http://sprunge.us/IjKU is my current pakellas wrath thing, works fine i think but would be nice not to have to add yet another param 14:55:16 <|amethyst> ah, wait 14:55:23 <|amethyst> that one was weapon = attacker->weapon(attack_number); 14:55:51 -!- vale__ is now known as vale_ 14:55:55 <|amethyst> oh, because of how beams and ranged attacks work 14:55:59 it looks like an earlier crash 14:56:08 during ranged attack init, rather than during the attack itself 14:56:13 <|amethyst> yeah 14:56:23 <|amethyst> the problem is that a ranged_attack gets created for each monster that is hit 14:56:37 <|amethyst> so saving stuff in the attack doesn't help with that 14:56:52 <|amethyst> you'd have to store it in the beam, or make a prototype attack and copy it 14:57:11 <|amethyst> well, the prototype attack would have to be stored in the beam too 15:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:00:46 hm 15:00:51 so we'd still have this crash for pen javs 15:00:52 probably 15:01:18 <|amethyst> yeah 15:02:46 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 15:03:21 -!- Denapoli has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 15:03:31 MarvinPA: it seems a little silly to go to so much trouble to penalize the use of supercharged rods specifically 15:05:15 i think it's neat flavour, and also good generally to have some kind of lasting penalty for gifting gods 15:06:08 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: yeah, I can get a reliable crash 15:06:11 maybe not worth it i guess, i think it's maybe reasonable to have forced miscasts happen after the spell effect generally though in which case it's a bunch neater to implement too 15:06:41 are people really gonna use their supercharged rods if they occasionally blow up 15:07:10 <|amethyst> true, could just destroy the items 15:07:22 -!- ProzacElf has joined ##crawl-dev 15:07:37 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: &mmerfolk javelineer hp:1 ; javelin ego:penetration q:100 then a bunch of &mball lightning att:friendly perm_ench:paralysis 15:07:43 heh 15:08:36 MarvinPA what if the player hasn't used supercharge yet or didn't have the piety to 15:08:39 1/5 is probably too much, but if it's a powerful spell effect and an occasional miscast it seems reasonable that you'd still want to use it sometimes (especially since you're not guaranteed to have a ton of other rods) 15:08:53 then they don't get that penalty 15:09:05 Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.19-a0-246-ga6dc205 (34) 15:09:26 is 'rods with miscasts' a compelling enough mechanic to justify the complexity? 15:09:47 also, out of curiosity, are supercharged rods inscribed or otherwise indicated in some way other than the enchantment? 15:09:57 they're not currently but the patch changes that 15:10:10 nice, you're way ahead of me 15:10:19 d) +10 supercharged iron rod (10/18) 15:10:19 <|amethyst> hm.. the problem with making a prototype attack is that there's no real way to change the defender of an existing attack 15:11:05 -!- vale_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:11:51 hey pssstt... rod of clouds is very very very powerful 15:12:06 anyway i guess i like the mechanic of permanently weakening the gifted item, and miscasts-on-cast are used in multiple other places as wrath effects 15:12:30 <|amethyst> would have to split out the defender part of attack's and ranged_attack's constructors into a separate method at the very least 15:12:35 but i can push the no-evocable wrath without that for now and see if anyone else has opinions on the miscast bit 15:13:21 code simplification: permanent miscast chance applies to all rods 15:13:44 bonus question: is there a miscast chance for evoking supercharged /hw? 15:14:12 yeah (necro miscasts, it looks like!) 15:14:25 heh 15:14:25 <|amethyst> that's why SPFLAG_NOT_EVIL exists :) 15:15:18 i sort of preferred making it specific to the supercharged device because having it be rod-only is kinda arbitrary, and having it apply to all things considered devices (as the current wrath does) is more complicated i think 15:16:07 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:16:08 (more complicated code-wise, since it touches a lot of places and does weird things like pretend that phial of floods is casting summon water elementals and so on) 15:17:57 -!- Gamefreak has quit [Quit: Page closed] 15:18:27 -!- tealeaves has quit [Quit: Bye] 15:19:07 -!- nikheizen has joined ##crawl-dev 15:20:08 -!- simmarine has joined ##crawl-dev 15:27:22 -!- syllogism has joined ##crawl-dev 15:30:05 Are the "ultimate" books (GG, Akashic, Annihilations, Necronomicon) rarer than others? 15:30:48 !source book_rarity 15:30:48 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/spl-book.cc#l115 15:30:57 yes 15:31:06 -!- Denapoli has quit [] 15:31:11 thanks! 15:32:42 -!- PsyMar has quit [Disconnected by services] 15:32:57 -!- PsyMar2 is now known as PsyMar 15:33:41 pleasingfungus 15:33:54 -!- Shinino has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 15:34:00 are you here 15:34:03 ? 15:34:36 do you know that ancestor can't catch up with you when you are a spriggan 15:34:41 is that intented 15:34:53 saw this on the forum, it's a good question 15:34:55 yes 15:35:03 ancestors do not vary by player race 15:35:21 that's kinda lame 15:35:28 PleasingFungus: do we still have this toggle so that you can travel as slow as your slowest ally? 15:35:34 think so 15:35:36 i mean 15:35:38 or you can just recall 15:35:39 he is a spriggan too 15:35:42 namelastname112_: lame = not fast? 15:35:48 <|amethyst> dpeg: yes, ctrl-e 15:35:50 should he also be restricted from using 2h weapons? 15:35:54 thx! 15:36:06 dpeg no, i mean my ancestor is a spriggan too right 15:36:13 PleasingFungus: yes, you are right: that way lies madness 15:36:17 namelastname112_: gameplay > flavour 15:36:23 :( 15:36:26 <|amethyst> your ancestor is a memory construct 15:36:35 a speed 10 memory construct 15:36:36 are felids still blocked from worship? 15:36:39 your ancestor is elderly and has bad hips 15:36:39 <|amethyst> your brain's just not fast enough to make it move at spriggan speed 15:36:46 MarvinPA: yes 15:36:48 if ancestors don't vary by race it seems like they should be allowed to worship too 15:36:49 please respect your ancestors 15:36:52 CanOfWorms: they should be happy ancy can walk at all 15:36:58 or at least, i thought that was the reason felids were blocked initially 15:37:08 it seemed Too Weird even for me to have felid ancestors wielding swords etc 15:37:12 ymmv 15:37:29 mmdv 15:37:40 (mmdf?) 15:37:46 <|amethyst> but now they're not actual ancestors 15:37:55 I think Felids are a problem, but best to treat everyone equal here. 15:37:58 <|amethyst> I bet felids have legends about how they used to run around using swords and armour 15:38:00 troll ancestors sure were more advanced in the study of magic than today 15:38:01 maybe old felids were real big and clever 15:38:14 <|amethyst> then they gave up their uncivilised ways 15:38:36 Did you get my c-r-d mail? Nobody seems to give a shit about the halfling. 15:38:42 i didn't get the c-r-d mail 15:38:42 (two-tailed swords?) 15:38:43 i haven't seen it yet 15:38:50 ah, ok 15:38:53 i will not stand in the way of any felid-sympathisers. 15:38:58 however, i will look down on you. 15:39:07 'helping felid players... depraved!' 15:39:21 remove felids then 15:39:41 players with 'cat' in their name would complain 15:39:47 namelastname112_: I have just proposed Ha removal (more precisely: Ha-Ko merge). One genocide after the other, please. 15:40:01 sludge dwarves 15:40:13 Grey Orcs 15:40:14 r i p the halfing 15:40:20 ! 15:40:20 nobody cared 15:40:22 dpeg: i think there was already discussion in favour of doing that in here, so it seems feasible! 15:40:27 elliptic was opposed 15:40:29 last i heard 15:40:35 MarvinPA: yes, I was surprised about that, so I put it on the list 15:40:37 Ha never scored 15:40:46 at least when we were discussing ha removal; idk about merger 15:40:50 -!- namelastname112_ is now known as namelastname112 15:41:14 I am okay with it as long as the new "kobold" is more like a halfling in certain ways :P 15:41:15 i chatted to elliptic about it a bit and do agree with him that Ha are distinct in terms of being "the small race with great defenses" 15:41:22 elliptic: yes, just like it was with MD (I am not sure many players ever realised :) 15:41:26 I still don't understand the motivation for removing either though 15:41:31 so yeah, my proposed merger would sort of be "more like a halfling, but call it a kobold anyway" 15:41:35 ha is kinda boring 15:41:37 MarvinPA: exactly 15:41:57 halfbold? 15:42:01 am i the only kobold defender? 15:42:04 koffing 15:42:04 this is messed up 15:42:06 elliptic: There'll be a separate email on that one, but given the speed of SF emails, I am not sure this will be a 0.19 topic. 15:43:06 like, I see size (large/normal/small/tiny) as one of the more salient distinguishing features between our species 15:43:32 so I'm not sure why we are removing one of the two small species 15:43:57 is it just that people think kobold and halfling are too similar? is it that people dislike halfling flavor? 15:44:00 honestly asking 15:44:03 elliptic: do you think the two species are reasonably differentiated? 15:44:05 speaking about removals 15:44:07 dpeg: yes 15:44:10 ok! 15:44:12 can we get rid of mottled dr 15:44:14 they could be made more so, too 15:44:27 elliptic: sure, that'd be a nice outcome of discussion 15:44:28 it'd be nice to adjust their stats more 15:44:33 it's weird how they converge right now 15:44:37 wrt str/dex 15:44:43 !stats kofi 15:44:45 Starting stats for KoFi: Str 14 Int 6 Dex 15. Stat gain: sd/5 15:44:49 !stats hafi 15:44:51 Starting stats for HaFi: Str 16 Int 7 Dex 13. Stat gain: d/5 15:44:55 i'm not a fan of the flavour but yeah, i maybe wouldn't be opposed to just differentiating the two further either 15:45:07 rename halfling to sludge dwarf 15:45:08 everyone's happy 15:45:11 yes 15:45:35 -!- Gravitas81 has quit [Quit: Page closed] 15:45:35 rename halfling... to mountain dwarf... 15:45:50 then you can remove them 15:45:57 finally the small dwarves everyone has been waiting for... 15:46:00 !apt ha 15:46:00 Ha: Fighting: -1, Short: 3!, Long: 0, Axes: -1, Maces: -2, Polearms: -3*, Staves: -2, Slings: 4!, Bows: 2, Xbows: -1, Throw: 1!, Armour: 1, Dodge: 1, Stealth: 2, Shields: 1, UC: -2*, Splcast: -3, Conj: -2, Hexes: -1, Charms: 1, Summ: -1, Nec: -2, Tloc: 1, Tmut: -4*, Fire: 0, Ice: 0, Air: 1, Earth: 0, Poison: -1, Inv: 1, Evo: 0, Exp: 1!, HP: -1, MP: 0 15:46:01 !apt ko 15:46:02 Ko: Fighting: 1, Short: 3!, Long: -2, Axes: -1, Maces: 0, Polearms: -2, Staves: -1, Slings: 2, Bows: -1, Xbows: 2!, Throw: 1!, Armour: -2, Dodge: 2, Stealth: 4, Shields: -2, UC: 0, Splcast: -1, Conj: -1, Hexes: 0, Charms: -2, Summ: 0, Nec: 0, Tloc: 0, Tmut: -1, Fire: 0, Ice: 0, Air: 0, Earth: 0, Poison: 0, Inv: 1, Evo: 2, Exp: 1!, HP: -2, MP: 0 15:46:23 deep dwarves grew big and strong underground. 15:46:25 see, halflings use long blades but kobolds use maces 15:46:26 totally different 15:46:44 kobolds are actually half-way competent at doing things 15:46:47 like sneaking 15:46:50 -!- murtidash has quit [Quit: Page closed] 15:47:21 Short: 3! 15:47:24 Ko aren't half as good as Ha at having 25/35 defenses by XL17 15:47:35 i think people see a lot of overlap with Sp too 15:47:41 03|amethyst02 07* 0.19-a0-247-g2f0009a: Annotate armour stashes for American spelling (xbon) 10(3 minutes ago, 1 file, 4+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/2f0009ae008b 15:48:01 all three of them are sort of similar but at least Sp have fast movement to distinguish them 15:48:04 in that both Sp and Ha/Ko have bizarre weapon handedness and high EV 15:48:30 the main difference being that Ha/Ko doesn't have the extra perk of being top 3 in the game, yes 15:48:39 Ha is the weak link in that chain, the other two are distinct enough imo 15:49:01 removeelyvilon: how can only one not be distinct enough, that doesn't make any sense 15:49:12 like what is it not distinct from 15:49:14 -!- travis-ci has joined ##crawl-dev 15:49:15 The build passed. (master - 22108c2 #5565 : Nicholas Feinberg): https://travis-ci.org/crawl/crawl/builds/132626774 15:49:15 -!- travis-ci has left ##crawl-dev 15:49:24 Ha seems a lot more distinct from Sp than Ko does to me, and not because of the "bad at transmutations!!!!" 15:49:31 How is Ko any more "distinct" than Ha, anyway? 15:49:35 like look at the armour Ha typically wears 15:50:44 !lg * recentish !boring !@bot ha|ko s=species / won o=% 15:50:48 741/40918 games for * (recentish !boring !@bot ((ha || ko))): 346/14871x Halfling [2.33%], 395/26047x Kobold [1.52%] 15:50:55 <|amethyst> !lg * sp recent won x=avg(ac) 15:50:56 213 games for * (sp recent won): avg(ac)=17.65 15:50:58 <|amethyst> !lg * ko recent won x=avg(ac) 15:50:59 204 games for * (ko recent won): avg(ac)=31.2 15:51:01 <|amethyst> !lg * ha recent won x=avg(ac) 15:51:02 159 games for * (ha recent won): avg(ac)=36.45 15:51:07 but people want to call the merged species Ko because Ko is a D&Dism supported by monsters whereas Ha is a D&Dism unsupported by monsters, I guess? 15:51:09 why is one of the three not "castery" 15:51:12 !lg * recentish !boring !@bot ha|ko s=species x=avg(ac),avg(ev),avg(sh) 15:51:15 40918 games for * (recentish !boring !@bot ((ha || ko))): 26047x Kobold [6.38, 16.1, 1.06], 14871x Halfling [7.36, 14.99, 2.04] 15:51:17 Sp is pretty "castery" 15:51:21 er 15:51:23 sort of 15:51:25 !lg * recentish !boring !@bot ha|ko won s=species x=avg(ac),avg(ev),avg(sh) 15:51:26 741 games for * (recentish !boring !@bot ((ha || ko)) won): 395x Kobold [31.32, 36.41, 10.54], 346x Halfling [36.19, 34.49, 14.32] 15:51:34 i mean there's only so much you can do with apts, of course 15:51:39 it's because kobolds have a hint of personality unlike ha 15:51:42 nearly 5 more AC on average 15:51:48 !apt sp 15:51:49 Sp: Fighting: -2*, Short: 1, Long: -2, Axes: -2, Maces: -3*, Polearms: -3*, Staves: -3*, Slings: 2, Bows: 2, Xbows: 0, Throw: 0, Armour: -3*, Dodge: 4!, Stealth: 5!, Shields: -3*, UC: -2*, Splcast: 2, Conj: -3*, Hexes: 2, Charms: 4!, Summ: -2, Nec: -1, Tloc: 4!, Tmut: 3!, Fire: -2, Ice: -2, Air: -1, Earth: -1, Poison: 0, Inv: 0, Evo: 3!, Exp: -1, HP: -3, MP: 1 15:51:58 and are actually present in the game (as monsters) 15:52:10 but like... a small race with good conj & elements are such 15:52:14 and* 15:52:16 who doesn't love these rat like verming throwing stones at you? 15:52:20 elliptic: re: share-pain as a player buff, I don't like that for thematic reasons. I like the idea that the monsters who were present for the even are the ones that are affected, and that monsters that missed it aren't. 15:52:33 Lasty_: gameplay > "thematic", IMO 15:52:41 Sp's air and earth apts are probably closer to average than Hu's are 15:52:54 and fast is kind of even more ridiculous when you're making ranged attacks 15:53:05 CA gave Ha wild magic, and Ko got perma-Evolve 15:53:11 like, SpEE that kills things with spells is already amazing 15:53:35 I feel like you're defining "castery" as "has a positive conjurations aptitude" 15:53:44 of course not 15:53:45 fixit_friend: i feel like those are kind of non-sequiturs 15:53:50 they have nothing to do with the races currently do 15:53:54 *with what 15:53:59 obv you can make a good sp caster but that's true of basically every race 15:54:29 yeah, giving Ha wild magic would mainly just make it a bit worse at getting haste castable 15:54:33 elliptic the has I have witnessed were little more than miniature minotaurs. kobolds and spriggans were different 15:54:44 Miniature Minotaur 15:54:57 MiMi 15:55:02 CanOfWorms: reserved clan name? 15:55:03 <|amethyst> !learn add reserved_clan_names Miniature Minotaurs 15:55:04 reserved clan names[17/17]: Miniature Minotaurs 15:55:06 shit!! 15:55:09 removeelyvilon: they are more of a melee race if that is what you mean, yes 15:55:15 yeah, wild magic tends to make them slingers *or* conjurers 15:55:17 that isn't what I'm saying at all, compare spvm/spee/spae/whatever to other vm/ee/ae/whatever. unless you ignore movement speed, which is the defining feature of spriggans, they excel at damage spells 15:55:25 but if you simplify things like that then HO and Mi are far more similar than anything else 15:55:34 they just happen to also be good at En 15:55:39 evolve goes a bit more naturally with quickblading / demon whipping 15:55:45 uh 15:55:47 it does? 15:55:55 yes 15:55:59 |amethyst: could also work as 'the minature minotaurs' 15:56:06 fixit_friend: because... you get aux attacks? 15:56:27 <|amethyst> but there is just one mutation for which that is relevant... 15:56:40 <|amethyst> oh 15:56:43 <|amethyst> speed of auxes 15:56:45 yup 15:56:46 what mut were you thinking of? 15:56:49 <|amethyst> I was thinking offhand 15:56:52 <|amethyst> so claws 15:56:54 anyway, wow, that is pretty roundabout 15:57:11 like, fine for CA, since a big part of that fork is to do random shit and mix things up 15:57:27 <|amethyst> I do think a perma-evolve race sounds interesting 15:57:28 anyway if we want to make Ko and Ha more distinct, I'd suggest continuing along the same path as the last ko/ha changes: making ko more dodgy/stealthy/magicky and ha more strengthy/armoury/shieldy 15:57:41 |amethyst: foo^jiyva? 15:57:48 elliptic: what do you think of innate rMut? 15:58:03 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: only decent players invited :/ 15:58:04 elliptic: reasonable to me 15:58:06 dpeg: pretty much completely unnoticeable 15:58:08 elliptic: I think you're giving more fuel to "remove Ko" with that since it's making Ko closer to a slow spriggan 15:58:08 elliptic: I can be made to bow to the gameplay pressure. I didn't think it was that bad, but I may be too close to it. 15:58:12 |amethyst: just get slime temple! 15:58:17 -!- VoxSomniator has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:58:26 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: and not have worshipped another god first 15:58:41 all the pros go fedhas -> jiyva anyway 15:58:52 minmay: well, maybe focus more on the casty aspect... yes, I know spriggans can cast spells too, but people do seem to go wild over kobold eating + casting 15:58:55 ??fedhas wrath 15:58:55 fedhas wrath[1/3]: ABANDONMENT: 30 penance. RETRIBUTION: Summons oklobs and wandering mushrooms in a circle around you. If there are corpses nearby, can turn them into spores. Also, fire/ice/air/earth miscasts. 15:59:02 "If spriggans were balanced, they would be kobolds" 16:00:02 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:00:22 yeah pretty much, fr remove sp 16:00:27 love 2 eat 16:00:32 Lasty_: it might not be that bad, but it is my least favorite part of ukayaw right now (though I've been enjoying ukayaw in general - it is an interesting design!) 16:01:50 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.19-a0-248-ge1419cd: Don't try to identify wands when zapped by the player 10(60 minutes ago, 1 file, 0+ 7-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/e1419cd40ed2 16:01:50 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.19-a0-249-ge4ddcd5: Mark supercharged rods as such in their name 10(33 minutes ago, 2 files, 4+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/e4ddcd548abe 16:01:56 elliptic: I'm glad to hear that overall it's be fun! 16:02:13 minmay: not until after we at least remove Fe 16:02:32 elliptic I think the "magicky" is a good point, what if ko wre better at "destructive" magic like conj which sp is supposedly not so good in 16:02:43 !apt ko 16:02:44 Ko: Fighting: 1, Short: 3!, Long: -2, Axes: -1, Maces: 0, Polearms: -2, Staves: -1, Slings: 2, Bows: -1, Xbows: 2!, Throw: 1!, Armour: -2, Dodge: 2, Stealth: 4, Shields: -2, UC: 0, Splcast: -1, Conj: -1, Hexes: 0, Charms: -2, Summ: 0, Nec: 0, Tloc: 0, Tmut: -1, Fire: 0, Ice: 0, Air: 0, Earth: 0, Poison: 0, Inv: 1, Evo: 2, Exp: 1!, HP: -2, MP: 0 16:03:00 that is already pretty decent conjury apts 16:03:22 Lasty_: reading this discussion, I wonder if I should've offered Fe rather than Ha on the sacrificial altar! 16:03:24 but could increase conj to 0 certainly 16:03:24 !gamesby . kocj 16:03:25 PleasingFungus (kocj) has played 4 games, between 2014-09-29 15:42:18 and 2014-10-19 19:11:10, won 1 (25.0%), high score 15225289, total score 15236031, total turns 95713, play-time/day 0:36:08, total time 12:38:55. 16:03:40 kocj is already fun, fwiw 16:03:55 dpeg: perhaps so! 16:04:06 IIRC kobolds have pretty low Int 16:04:10 Lasty_: I see no problem with this plan 16:04:24 I didn't know kobolds were "magicky", I usually use evo as their ranged option 16:04:26 giving kobolds more int also possible, yes 16:04:43 <|amethyst> dpeg: Fe would have more passionate defenders and detractors 16:05:05 |amethyst: that, and I still have some feelings of obligations towards Adam 16:05:06 <|amethyst> dpeg: the defense of halflings seems to mostly be "eh, seems fine to me" :) 16:05:19 haha 16:05:22 <|amethyst> s/seems/they seem/ 16:06:07 of course, underlying all this is the question "what is well-differentiated to us"? I think the margin has been increased throughout DCSS. 16:06:11 -!- Dracunos has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 16:06:43 dpeg: The problem w/ felids isn't a lack of differentiation, it's that they skip all the fun bits of the game and won't even let you kill them off :D 16:07:25 Lasty_: yes, this is true. Was talking about the Ha-Ko discussion here. 16:07:55 ah, right 16:08:16 hahaha 16:09:05 Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.19-a0-247-g2f0009a (34) 16:09:31 -!- insecticide has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 16:09:53 dpeg: are you saying the 5 elves weren't well-differentiated?! 16:10:10 rip sludge elves 16:10:25 wheals: yes. I think I suggested El and GE removals after winning one of each :) Discussions back then were shorter! 16:10:46 !won . GE 16:10:47 dpeg (GE) has won once in 12 games (8.33%): 1xGEAE 16:10:58 !wtf GE 16:10:59 Grey Elf* 16:11:20 Linley must've been an elf fan. 16:11:39 what if we just replaced all species with elf variants 16:11:41 s/l/m/ 16:11:43 dwarven elf 16:11:55 cat-elf 16:12:01 elftaur 16:12:14 elf = 11 in German :) 16:12:24 are ancestors undead? 16:12:39 MarvinPA: seems like the alreadyknown variable can be removed entirely from that function 16:12:40 removeelyvilon: until recently they were 16:12:48 more like non-living 16:12:52 they're nonliving now i believe 16:12:56 k 16:13:00 huh, pakellas can device surge evokable blink/berserk/invis etc 16:13:06 are those really "devices" as such 16:13:28 what happens if you do? 16:13:29 MarvinPA: as much as a deck of cards is 16:13:31 MarvinPA: well, sac artifice turns them off, so i'd say they are devices 16:13:38 but having them supercharge seems un-useful 16:13:42 Oh, right, device surge, not supercharge 16:13:49 minmay: decks aren't affected by pakellas 16:13:55 MarvinPA: really? 16:13:56 oh 16:14:06 er, i did say supercharge even though i meant surge 16:14:15 MarvinPA: that seems odd 16:14:26 I mean, I know it steps on Nem's toes 16:14:28 but still 16:14:43 I think "evocations god" stepped on Nem's entire body in the first place 16:14:54 sure 16:14:55 brutally crushing him 16:14:56 decks of cards aren't really...charged 16:15:01 i dunno 16:15:02 amalloy: but a sack of spiders is? 16:15:07 wow, true fact 16:15:21 surging sack of spiders is bizarre 16:16:02 fix the oddness by removing nemelex and decks 16:16:10 IMO, replace Nemelex w/ something like sanka's random spell god, then leave Pak as the only evo god 16:16:18 +1 16:16:20 Then fix potion of magic stockpiling 16:16:22 also you seriously need to nerf sack of spiders, it's embarrassing 16:16:31 minmay: yeah, true 16:16:50 * dpeg never plays with modern evokables, for fear of being laughed at 16:17:00 i think defining devices as "misc evokables and wands and rods" is reasonable enough, anyway, since nobody is ever going to intentionally surge a +blink 16:17:00 if {spiders is being nerfed, imo {beasts should be too 16:17:00 It got nerfed once, but it's still amazing 16:17:08 lasty was gonna nerf beast 16:17:11 amalloy: yeah, it should too 16:17:22 also i'm not sure spidersack got nerfed? 16:17:26 PleasingFungus: it did; the evo required to get good spiders got increased 16:17:31 ahh 16:17:35 didn't recall 16:17:38 It was a while back 16:17:40 i keep getting ants out of my {spiders 16:17:46 imo sue for truth in advertising 16:17:48 amalloy: sounds like a 16:17:49 !glasses 16:17:50 ( •_•)    ( •_•)>⌐■-■    (⌐■_■) 16:17:50 bug 16:18:15 I did that for you, Grunt. 16:18:42 !remove Lasty 16:18:43 03amalloy ⛐ 0.19-a0-166-g9adcfa2: Remove Lasty 10(in the future, 37 files, 828+ 907-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/commit.png?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=9adcfa2 16:19:03 I can't actually think of good nerfs for sack of spiders/box of beasts, because they are based on allies which are my #2 most despised mechanic in crawl, my contribution is limited to complaining that they're overpowered 16:19:13 amalloy: haha, that's in the future! You're stuck with me for now. 16:19:21 i love allies 16:19:23 Lasty_: maybe it was 2 seconds in the future 16:19:29 Allies uber alles? 16:19:36 minmay: we all have to go some day 16:20:03 Lasty_: just like a non-mummy non-elf to say that 16:20:41 minmay: you and your desperate need for a transcendant, eternal truth! Go duel in a forest arena inside your school, why don't you? 16:21:01 #cannottellifIwantpeopletogetthatreferenceornot 16:21:20 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:22:09 -!- aredel has quit [Client Quit] 16:22:55 !lg * ckiller=sigmund 16:22:57 140038. Beholder179 the Vexing (L5 TrAM), slain by Sigmund (a +0 scythe) on D:3 on 2016-05-24 20:17:49, with 239 points after 1977 turns and 0:14:01. 16:22:59 !lg * kmap~~minmay 16:23:01 47723. irqconflict the Fighter (L9 GrFi of Okawaru), slain by a manticore on D:8 (minmay_curly_fans) on 2016-05-24 20:02:57, with 2641 points after 7367 turns and 0:20:05. 16:23:07 oh and i guess device surge on +rage and +blink actually just spent some mp to do nothing 16:23:17 guys hurry up on those vaults this is getting to the point where i won't be able to bring it back 16:23:52 MarvinPA: it doesn't increase the success chance I assume? 16:24:18 don't think so, it's implemented basically as a spell enhancer so should just be power 16:24:19 re: sack of spiders, I think it might be worth removing the concept of charges, and making it have a Evo/30 chance of unraveling instead of working on each use before use. Or maybe that plus charges. Re: box of beasts, toning down the calculated power and/or the beast stats would probably be sufficient. 16:25:01 -!- PleasingFungus has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.92 [Firefox 46.0.1/20160502172042]] 16:25:07 or they could be rarer and more expensive in shops 16:25:12 minmay: device surge never affects the success chance displayed in (a) 16:25:16 they're currently all over the place and dirt cheap 16:25:21 true 16:25:37 and they're both awfully powerful to be so plentiful 16:26:00 yup 16:26:25 jeez, my to-do list for 0.19 is so long 16:26:55 -!- insecticide has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 16:26:59 -!- mibert has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 16:27:11 MarvinPA: seems like if it is going to affect those at all, it should affect the success rate, since almost all evocables with a success rate get the success rate improved by device surge, don't they? 16:27:29 I'm assuming surged disc of storms is more likely to succeed 16:28:27 it looks like it just wastes mp on disc of storms too actually? 16:30:52 -!- DaneiNEGATIVEONE is now known as DaneiTWO 16:31:01 what 16:31:29 !lg * trunk (hep|ukayaw) s=god / won 16:31:29 in fact the only calculation in the disc of storms code that makes use of your evocations enhancer is the fail rate, but that is specifically calculated before the surge is applied 16:31:35 does it only work on stuff that has an actual spellpower then? does it waste mp on sack of spiders, box of beasts, phantom mirror... 16:31:38 2/85 games for * (trunk ((hep || ukayaw))): 2/26x Ukayaw [7.69%], 0/59x Hepliaklqana [0.00%] 16:31:54 Hep's getting a lot more plays 16:32:09 -!- Kenran has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:32:38 minmay: those all use your adjusted evo power somewhere it looks like 16:34:08 -!- travis-ci has joined ##crawl-dev 16:34:09 The build passed. (master - 6ce9f98 #5566 : Nicholas Feinberg): https://travis-ci.org/crawl/crawl/builds/132628908 16:34:09 -!- travis-ci has left ##crawl-dev 16:35:06 all of these are individually and lovingly hand-special-cased so i guess disc of storms just got missed or something, i guess disc of storms just needs to apply player_adjust_evoc_power to its range and/or power calculations 16:35:31 those gods are both in trunk now? i have a lot of polytheist catchup work to do 16:35:40 although i guess i oneandwon hep, so never mind 16:36:44 amalloy: yeah 16:36:56 Lasty wasn't Ukayaw available earlier than hep? so mb ppl are more hype for the newer one atm 16:37:22 nice, you can device surge your cboe 16:37:27 v. useful 16:37:34 removeelyvilon: yes 16:37:58 removeelyvilon: possibly, but both have been on branch for a while now 16:38:04 fr: Ukayaw altar tile 16:38:06 I think Hep has probably changed more recently tho 16:38:15 removeelyvilon: yeah, still working on the altar tile 16:38:27 I think ontoclasm has it somewhere in his queue 16:39:14 in my first game I was split between the two, but I was like "that ancestor thing sounds too intriguing not to try" I wondered what he'd look like etc. 16:39:35 what his abilites were 16:39:59 -!- stanzill has quit [Quit: au rev] 16:40:17 -!- PsyMar has quit [Disconnected by services] 16:40:31 -!- PsyMar2 is now known as PsyMar 16:41:38 -!- newtant has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:41:54 !lg . Uka 16:41:55 17. dpeg the Cleaver (L13 DsGl of Ukayaw), slain by an orc warlord (a +0 long sword of draining) on D:12 (erik_orc_1) on 2016-03-01 00:02:31, with 29975 points after 19499 turns and 0:53:06. 16:42:10 -!- JimmahDean has quit [] 16:42:18 lasty: uka should have a discoball altar 16:43:23 !lg dpeg zig:16 16:43:24 1. dpeg the Rhythm of Life and Death (L27 MiGl of Ukayaw), slain by a stone giant (shapeshifter) on Zig:16 on 2016-02-09 12:45:12, with 658546 points after 87436 turns and 4:44:35. 16:43:26 somehow gives me a Brazilian Capoeira vibe 16:43:29 !lg * trunk (hep|ukayaw) s=god x=sum(dur) 16:43:34 86 games for * (trunk ((hep || ukayaw))): 60x Hepliaklqana [1d+14:16:38], 26x Ukayaw [19:13:24] 16:44:20 of those 26 Ukayaw games, I seem to have played 17 16:44:40 -!- siepu has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:44:55 -!- Athaboros_ has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:45:52 hepl feels more shadowy than dith 16:45:58 dpeg: no, your games are older 16:46:11 !lg * 0.19-a (hep|ukayaw) s=god x=sum(dur) 16:46:12 63 games for * (0.19-a ((hep || ukayaw))): 42x Hepliaklqana [1d+4:15:32], 21x Ukayaw [16:30:06] 16:46:28 !kw trunk 16:46:29 Keyword: trunk => alpha !experimental 16:46:48 !lg * trunk uka s=cv 16:46:53 26 games for * (trunk uka): 21x 0.19-a, 5x 0.18-a 16:47:00 hm 16:47:18 !lg * trunk uka 0.18-a s=src,explbr 16:47:23 5 games for * (trunk uka 0.18-a): 5x cpo (5x) 16:47:29 um 16:47:35 !lg * trunk uka 0.18-a s=file 16:47:40 5 games for * (trunk uka 0.18-a): 5x cpo/dcss-logfiles-combo god 16:47:46 <|amethyst> cpo doesn't mark explbr 16:47:55 <|amethyst> !lg * cpo s=explbr 16:47:56 38311 games for * (cpo): 38311x 16:47:57 why not? 16:48:00 -!- ystael_ has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:48:02 <|amethyst> I dunno 16:48:13 Weird autopickup behaviour 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=10440 by Sar 16:48:17 <|amethyst> trying to remember 16:48:24 !lg * cpo s=file 16:48:25 38311 games for * (cpo): 27146x cpo/dcss-logfiles-trunk, 4726x cpo/dcss-logfiles-0.17, 3418x cpo/dcss-logfiles-0.16, 2677x cpo/dcss-logfiles-0.18, 259x cpo/dcss-logfiles-0.15, 85x cpo/dcss-logfiles-combo god 16:48:34 <|amethyst> hm 16:48:44 !kw experimental 16:48:45 Keyword: experimental => explbr!=||file~~'/(smithgod|jump)/' 16:48:49 <|amethyst> our makefile uses the source branch to determine how to set -DEXPERIMENTAL_BRANCH 16:49:01 <|amethyst> assuming USE_DGAMELAUNCH but I'm sure chequers sets that 16:49:24 !kw experimental explbr!=||file~~'/(smithgod|jump|combo_god)/' 16:49:25 !kw experimental explbr!=||file~~'/(smithgod|jump|combo god)/' 16:49:25 Defined keyword: experimental => explbr!=||file~~'/(smithgod|jump|combo_god)/' 16:49:26 Defined keyword: experimental => explbr!=||file~~'/(smithgod|jump|combo god)/' 16:49:37 !lg * trunk uka 0.18-a s=file 16:49:42 5 games for * (trunk uka 0.18-a): 5x cpo/dcss-logfiles-combo god 16:49:46 !kw experimental explbr!=||file~~'/(smithgod|jump|combo_god)/' 16:49:47 Defined keyword: experimental => explbr!=||file~~'/(smithgod|jump|combo_god)/' 16:49:49 !lg * trunk uka 0.18-a s=file 16:49:54 5 games for * (trunk uka 0.18-a): 5x cpo/dcss-logfiles-combo god 16:50:10 <|amethyst> !lg * cpo trunk s=file 16:50:14 27961 games for * (cpo trunk): 27146x cpo/dcss-logfiles-trunk, 606x cpo/dcss-logfiles-0.17, 124x cpo/dcss-logfiles-0.18, 85x cpo/dcss-logfiles-combo god 16:50:27 <|amethyst> !lg * cpo s=file 16:50:28 38311 games for * (cpo): 27146x cpo/dcss-logfiles-trunk, 4726x cpo/dcss-logfiles-0.17, 3418x cpo/dcss-logfiles-0.16, 2677x cpo/dcss-logfiles-0.18, 259x cpo/dcss-logfiles-0.15, 85x cpo/dcss-logfiles-combo god 16:50:32 !lg * cpo trunk s=file / experimental 16:50:35 !kw experimental explbr!=||file~~'/(smithgod|jump|combo god)/' 16:50:37 Defined keyword: experimental => explbr!=||file~~'/(smithgod|jump|combo god)/' 16:50:39 !lg * trunk uka 0.18-a s=file 16:50:40 0/27961 games for * (cpo trunk): 0/85x cpo/dcss-logfiles-combo god [0.00%], 0/124x cpo/dcss-logfiles-0.18 [0.00%], 0/606x cpo/dcss-logfiles-0.17 [0.00%], 0/27146x cpo/dcss-logfiles-trunk [0.00%] 16:50:41 elliptic: ah, good. I was worried about the small numbers. 16:50:45 5 games for * (trunk uka 0.18-a): 5x cpo/dcss-logfiles-combo god 16:51:19 !lg * trunk uka 0.18-a s=file / file~~'combo god' 16:51:24 5/5 games for * (trunk uka 0.18-a): 5/5x cpo/dcss-logfiles-combo god [100.00%] 16:51:25 -!- eb has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:51:32 dpeg: yeah, the query was only considering games with the gods in trunk (or at least it was trying to) 16:51:46 Lasty: i think canofworms wanted to make a U altar 16:51:47 !lg * trunk uka 0.18-a s=file / file~~'/(smithgod|jump|combo god)/' 16:51:47 !kw experimental explbr!=||file~~'/(smithgod|jump|combo)/' 16:51:49 Defined keyword: experimental => explbr!=||file~~'/(smithgod|jump|combo)/' 16:51:52 0/5 games for * (trunk uka 0.18-a): 0/5x cpo/dcss-logfiles-combo god [0.00%] 16:51:59 yes 16:52:00 that's a good idea 16:52:01 at some point... 16:52:05 !lg * trunk uka 0.18-a s=file 16:52:07 !lg * cpa trunk s=file / experimental 16:52:11 5 games for * (trunk uka 0.18-a): 5x cpo/dcss-logfiles-combo god 16:52:11 No keyword 'cpa' 16:52:16 <|amethyst> !lg * trunk uka 0.18-a file~~'/(smithgod|jump|combo god)/' 16:52:17 No games for * (trunk uka 0.18-a file~~'/(smithgod|jump|combo god)/'). 16:52:17 !kw trunk 16:52:18 Keyword: trunk => alpha !experimental 16:52:29 <|amethyst> !lg * uka 0.18-a cpo file~~'/(smithgod|jump|combo god)/' 16:52:29 No games for * (uka 0.18-a cpo file~~'/(smithgod|jump|combo god)/'). 16:52:34 <|amethyst> !lg * 0.18-a cpo file~~'/(smithgod|jump|combo god)/' 16:52:35 No games for * (0.18-a cpo file~~'/(smithgod|jump|combo god)/'). 16:52:38 <|amethyst> !lg * 0.18-a cpo file~~/(smithgod|jump|combo god)/ 16:52:39 Broken query near ' god)/' 16:52:42 <|amethyst> !lg * 0.18-a cpo file~~/(smithgod|jump|combo_god)/ 16:52:42 Broken query near '/' 16:52:55 <|amethyst> !lg * 0.18-a cpo file~~(smithgod|jump|combo_god) 16:52:56 81. ASUHDUDE the Chopper (L3 MiCK of Xom), slain by Ijyb (a +8 club) on D:3 on 2016-05-15 19:29:38, with 63 points after 1392 turns and 0:05:34. 16:52:58 !lg * experimental file~~'/(smithgod|jump|combo)/' 16:52:59 <|amethyst> !lg * 0.18-a cpo file~~(smithgod|jump|combo_god) s=file 16:53:00 2941. zkyp the Skirmisher (L1 OgWn), slain by a jackal on D:1 (dpeg_cavernosity) on 2014-06-01 16:39:24, with 0 points after 54 turns and 0:00:26. 16:53:01 81 games for * (0.18-a cpo file~~(smithgod|jump|combo_god)): 81x cpo/dcss-logfiles-combo god 16:53:04 !kw experimental 16:53:04 Keyword: experimental => explbr!=||file~~'/(smithgod|jump|combo)/' 16:53:11 <|amethyst> !lg * file~~(smithgod|jump|combo_god) s=file 16:53:12 8217 games for * (file~~(smithgod|jump|combo_god)): 3329x cbro/crawl/meta/combo god/logfile, 2694x cszo/meta/smithgod/logfile, 1862x cszo/meta/smithgod rebased/logfile, 247x cszo/meta/jump/logfile, 85x cpo/dcss-logfiles-combo god 16:53:34 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.19-a0-250-g7140f5a: Rework Pakellas wrath to passively block all device use 10(2 hours ago, 7 files, 53+ 166-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/7140f5a2ec98 16:53:34 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.19-a0-251-g4ed0e95: Don't allow Pakellas device surge to work on +Blink, +Rage etc 10(30 minutes ago, 1 file, 0+ 8-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/4ed0e95abdc5 16:53:34 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.19-a0-252-g247cc30: Fix disc of storms device surge having no effect 10(12 minutes ago, 1 file, 9+ 6-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/247cc300569d 16:53:42 <|amethyst> !kw experimental explbr!=||file~~(smithgod|jump|combo_god) 16:53:43 Defined keyword: experimental => explbr!=||file~~(smithgod|jump|combo_god) 16:53:49 device surged disc of storms seems now possibly ridiculous, although i was testing with maxed out skills 16:53:52 <|amethyst> !lg * cpo uka trunk s=cv 16:53:55 No games for * (cpo uka trunk). 16:53:57 !kw experimental 16:53:57 Keyword: experimental => explbr!=||file~~(smithgod|jump|combo_god) 16:54:01 ontoclasm, CanOfWorms: cool, thanks folks 16:54:04 I wonder how the / got there 16:54:09 but that seems like an improvement over taking mp to do nothing i guess 16:54:12 <|amethyst> !lg * cpo trunk s=cv 16:54:17 27876 games for * (cpo trunk): 12788x 0.18-a, 11400x 0.17-a, 2483x 0.16-a, 1205x 0.19-a 16:54:20 <|amethyst> !lg * cpo trunk s=file 16:54:25 27876 games for * (cpo trunk): 27146x cpo/dcss-logfiles-trunk, 606x cpo/dcss-logfiles-0.17, 124x cpo/dcss-logfiles-0.18 16:54:28 -!- Marvin is now known as Guest51578 16:54:42 <|amethyst> !lg * cpo uka s=cv 16:54:43 6 games for * (cpo uka): 5x 0.18-a, 0.19-a 16:54:44 still sort of like the idea of messing with supercharged devices permanently, more opinions on that welcome! 16:54:48 <|amethyst> !lg * cpo uka trunk s=cv 16:54:51 No games for * (cpo uka trunk). 16:55:03 <|amethyst> !lg * cpo hep trunk s=cv 16:55:08 2 games for * (cpo hep trunk): 2x 0.19-a 16:55:22 <|amethyst> oh, I guess no one's tried uka on CPO since the merge 16:55:29 yeah, I assume that is it 16:55:30 <|amethyst> I thought maybe I broke something 16:55:38 super random comment: why is veh altar burning "in the flames of Iskenderun" 16:55:46 MarvinPA: is it significantly more nuts than maxed skills w/o device surge? 16:56:08 removeelyvilon: i always figured it was like hawking radiation etc. 16:56:17 iskenderun discovered it so it's named after her 16:56:25 fanfiction.txt 16:56:55 SHE?! 16:57:06 mind=blown 16:57:10 yes iskenderun is canonically female 16:57:20 Lasty_: hard to tell! i did >250 damage to myself with it but maybe that is possible without surging 16:57:22 a felid i think 16:57:46 is anything known about the other mages? 16:57:56 -!- Weretaco_ has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 16:58:34 probably, but it's just stuffed in random item descriptions etc 16:59:29 <|amethyst> that was removed recently 16:59:37 <|amethyst> well 16:59:40 <|amethyst> two years ago 16:59:46 <|amethyst> %git 5ee52639 16:59:46 07MarvinPA02 * 0.14-a0-3421-g5ee5263: More monster description improvements 10(2 years, 2 months ago, 1 file, 19+ 49-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/5ee52639f2ab 16:59:49 is iskenderun a first name? i always figured it was a last name but now i'm questioning everything 17:00:03 ??iskenderun 17:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:00:03 iskenderun[1/1]: The first swimming cat in Britain (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turkish_Van). Claimed to be the inventor of {Mystic Blast}, {Battlesphere}, and {Orb of Destruction}. 17:00:18 <|amethyst> amalloy: İskenderun is a Turkish city named after Alexander 17:01:23 <|amethyst> the cat (named after the city) for which Crawl's Iskenderun is supposedly named is "Van Iskenderun Guzelli" 17:01:27 <|amethyst> so middle name I guess 17:01:30 |amethyst: shouldn't it be Greek, historically speaking? 17:01:36 (recent Turkey, of course) 17:02:02 <|amethyst> dpeg: the greek name is Alexandretta 17:02:08 ah, interesting 17:03:23 -!- Rust3dCor3 has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 17:04:03 <|amethyst> though a comment in the source code provides the real history 17:04:11 <|amethyst> !source spl-data.h:550 17:04:11 https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/spl-data.h#l550 17:04:37 nice, phantom mirror lets you identify the real mara 17:04:38 -!- PsyMar has quit [Disconnected by services] 17:04:54 -!- PsyMar2 is now known as PsyMar 17:05:01 for "free" (assuming you want to reflect mara anyway which i did) 17:05:20 Free in what sense? 17:05:28 it aborts and does nothing if you target a fake mara 17:05:31 lol 17:05:33 dang 17:05:34 and if you target a real one it works 17:06:03 -!- LexAckson_ has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 17:06:04 I've been wondering for a while now if it is possible to determine the real mara/rakshasa by using some of the autotargeting logic built into tab... 17:06:12 but I haven't rigorously tested 17:06:31 so does hepl essentially have no wrath if you are max level 17:06:45 Lasty_: tab just uses threat_level and injury_level (or whatever it is called) 17:07:08 and the player can already see those things 17:07:16 ??recent 17:07:17 Keyword: recent => cv>=0.17 17:07:22 so I'm not sure what you mean by "autotargeting logic" here 17:07:45 1learn add recent <+|amethyst> that was removed recently <+|amethyst well> <+|amethyst> two years ago 17:08:02 -!- Shard1697 has joined ##crawl-dev 17:08:35 -!- fixit_friend has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 17:09:10 Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.19-a0-252-g247cc30 (34) 17:09:14 also the duplication specifically randomises your last_target or whatever it's called (which autotargets the last monster you used z/f on) 17:10:15 <|amethyst> and also resets the webtiled client id="..." 17:10:19 <|amethyst> s/tiled/tiles/ 17:10:37 elliptic: good 17:10:56 removeelyvilon: you fail to gain exp just like always 17:10:57 elliptic: I thought there was something in tab and/or targeting logic that kept track of last target 17:11:12 being xl27 does not mean you're done gaining exp 17:11:17 <|amethyst> not in tab, but it is in the z autotargetting 17:11:18 Lasty_: probably you were thinking of what wheals mentioned 17:11:31 yeah, probably 17:11:45 /facepalm... yeah XL and skills are different things... 17:15:33 crawl 0.19: dance of the forefathers 17:15:52 I noticed that tab moves you closer to monsters that are not pathable 17:16:10 like in nicolae's monster-in-specimen-tubes vault 17:16:46 tab tried to move me close to those monsters, which were unreachable in a transparent ToD thing 17:17:15 gammafunk: yeah, I really should import some version of qw's logic to avoid doing that into vanilla tab 17:17:30 yes, was just about to say, does your cell_see_cell thing allow that 17:18:07 no, the cell_see_cell doesn't know about glass or deep water that you can't cross, etc 17:18:28 ah, as the name suggests, it's probably just about visibility 17:18:42 also sometimes even if there is glass in the way, tab will take you to the monster (around a glass pillar, say) 17:18:59 yeah, the thing I added uses the same logic as exclusions 17:19:37 <|amethyst> amalloy: btw, did you see my suggestion re the XE thing? 17:19:44 -!- jehoesefat has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:20:03 anyway the way qw handles this is by pretending that it tabbed towards the monster a bunch of times and seeing whether it gets stuck before reaching the monster 17:20:57 maybe I'll go see how hard it would be to merge that into regular autofight 17:21:39 -!- travis-ci has joined ##crawl-dev 17:21:40 The build passed. (master - acb3693 #5567 : Chris Campbell): https://travis-ci.org/crawl/crawl/builds/132630248 17:21:40 -!- travis-ci has left ##crawl-dev 17:23:04 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:23:46 -!- WereVolvo has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:28:21 truly the god of ancestral memory, he let's ancestors even remember spells that don't exist anymore 17:29:39 there's gotta be a Pepperidge Farm Remembers joke here somewhere 17:33:29 -!- CanOfWorms has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.92 [Firefox 3.6.28/20120306064154]] 17:34:36 -!- mzmz has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 17:35:13 removeelyvilon: You mean Mass Confusion? 17:35:18 yes 17:35:24 -!- PleasingFungus has joined ##crawl-dev 17:35:38 also hi hep altar 17:35:46 didn't know he got put into trunk now 17:36:03 he went in shortly before you started asking about him, last night 17:36:04 it looks great 17:36:09 praise canofworms 17:36:11 k 17:36:38 fr: Ancestor Identity icon 17:36:48 how does exploration piety work in regards to Temple 17:36:53 is it optimal to explore it 17:37:21 think so 17:37:45 ugh, i never thought about that. all those games where i skipped temple! ruined! 17:37:54 Beware The Hunger Cost 17:38:20 MarvinPA: i remember grunt talking about stormdisc back when surging was first being implemented; iirc he tried to support stormdisc but couldn't figure out any reasonable approach 17:38:45 I remember him mentioning that surging doesn't work with Dispater's staff because of how ridiculous it would be 17:39:56 hmm, well taking your mp and piety and doing nothing sounds like the very least reasonable approach of all! 17:39:56 -!- Patashu has joined ##crawl-dev 17:40:06 -!- syllogism has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:40:25 maybe it could arbitrarily just enhance some subset of range/damage/number of thingies, instead of all of them 17:40:50 MarvinPA: a couple unrands also don't work with surge 17:40:52 like dispater 17:41:11 I think the surged sack of spiders making billions of spiders is pretty OP 17:41:11 ??hexer 17:41:12 hexer ~ hexes[1/4]: Contains all the good hexes, after Enchantments was split into Charms and Hexes. Enchanters start with a {Book of Maledictions}. To see Hexes spells, see hexes[2]. To see books which contain Hexes spells, see hexes[3]. 17:41:23 ??hexes [4] 17:41:23 hexes[4/4]: The durations in AUTs of these hexes/enchantments are reduced by monster HD: Slow, fear, paralysis, petrify, confuse, enslave. The duration is divided by (HD+mod), where mod depends on the enchantment. 17:41:54 there was a good instance I had in Zot where I used surge sack of spiders vs. an ancient lich and got 5 ghost moths 17:42:08 it looks like no unrands work with surge 17:42:17 and I spent a minute laughing at the poor lich on stream, but 17:42:25 it then went invis next turn 17:42:25 the very next turn it went invisible ;_; 17:42:34 that sounds pretty good but not too OP 17:42:41 how much evocations did you have? 17:43:06 n1: no, I got 5 ghost moths *and* a ton of other s 17:43:32 hm, I guess I can't really chime in on this because I have no idea how frequently you can use device surge anyway 17:43:39 you can use it quite a lot 17:43:57 i'm finding myself not using it at all this game 17:44:04 -!- Guest51578 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:44:06 and just spamming lots of attack wands and using mp to recharge them 17:44:21 what is a "hexer" anyway 17:44:22 I killed cerebov during the tournament without him casting a spell with like 3 casts of mana viper and melee 17:44:26 sure, you don't have to use it, but it makes the evokers pretty strong 17:44:27 ?/hexer 17:44:28 Matching entries (3): ancestor[1] | ancestor[5] | Remember_Life[1] 17:44:34 -!- Patashu has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:44:36 i guess i should use it on xp evokers maybe, yeah 17:44:48 but for sack of spiders you get super a lot of spiders 17:45:04 and for BoB it makes some pretty swol beasts 17:45:10 is that the official name for somebody versed in hexes magic 17:45:33 Hexer and Battlemage...honestly remove his commit access... 17:46:34 !remove gammafunk 17:46:35 03PleasingFungus ⛐ 0.19-a0-167-gc13de19: Remove gammafunk 10(in the future, 2 files, 397+ 996-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/commit.png?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=c13de19 17:46:41 I'm taking nem with me 17:46:45 what determines HD for ancestor again? I know it's XP level 17:46:55 woah, that emoji 17:46:56 ??ancestor 17:46:56 ancestor[1/6]: A permanent companion granted by {Hepliaklqana}. Scales with the player's XL. Can be specialized into one of three types: Knight ([3]), Battlemage ([4]), or Hexer ([5]). 17:47:00 but is it a 2/3 ratio? 17:47:01 ??ancestor[2 17:47:01 ancestor[2/6]: HD = (player XL - 1)*2/3 + 1. HP = hd * 5 + max(0, (hd - 12) * 5). MR = hd*hd/2. Base AC = HD. Base damage = HD*3/2 + 3. Gains rF at HD 11, rC at HD 12, Haste at HD 14, and sInv at HD 16. 17:47:03 yes 17:47:08 oh shit i thought i edited that 17:47:10 i forgot 17:47:19 !learn e ancestor[2 s/ Gains.*// 17:47:19 ancestor[2/6]: HD = (player XL - 1)*2/3 + 1. HP = hd * 5 + max(0, (hd - 12) * 5). MR = hd*hd/2. Base AC = HD. Base damage = HD*3/2 + 3. 17:47:31 do ancestors still get self-haste 17:47:34 yes 17:47:38 that's listed elsewhere 17:47:41 somewhere 17:48:26 Lightli at level 21 17:48:28 -!- wheals has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:48:58 really hits a powers spike there 17:49:05 15-21 is kind of a drought 17:50:14 hrm, not sure what kinds of self-buffs would scale well for an ally like that 17:50:14 (it actually isn't because metabolic reks everything) 17:50:16 they're all pretty strong 17:50:33 but on 21 you not only get an ability upgrade, you get haste on top of that 17:50:46 so that's what makes that level extra good 17:50:51 -!- Dingbatt has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 17:50:53 -!- Cerpin has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:53:23 -!- insecticide2 has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 17:53:37 -!- travis-ci has joined ##crawl-dev 17:53:38 The build failed. (nfm-bondage-compat - 5bb4cf0 #5568 : Neil Moore): https://travis-ci.org/crawl/crawl/builds/132636757 17:53:38 -!- travis-ci has left ##crawl-dev 17:53:42 oh yeah, does the ancestor still siphon off xp 17:53:49 and thus make it so you want to leave it behind for easy fights 17:54:03 <|amethyst> haha 17:54:09 <|amethyst> I should have at least check that it compiled 17:54:59 if you are an insane person, yes 17:55:11 HAM 17:55:26 not convinced it's meaningfully HAM 17:56:10 well less xp means you gain levels lower 17:56:28 if they're easy enemies, then you're almost certainly getting only a negligible amount of xp from them 17:56:59 so it's a fraction of a negligible amount of xp, vs potential risk if a fight suddenly becomes hard (from other enemies showing up etc) plus the time taken to shuffle your ancestor off whever 17:57:22 the risk is 1 turn taken to call your ancestor in 17:57:42 Never underestimate the pendantry of optimalgoodplayers 17:57:52 i just simply don't care at all 17:58:12 see: people hoping for the dark maul to show up so they can get ridiculous regen per turn out of swinging it 17:58:23 that's for speedrunning 17:58:27 which is completely unrelated to this 17:58:32 since this would be a huge net time loss 17:58:59 but PF, isn't this exactly the same as with the summons xp penalty 17:59:09 it's the same code, yes 18:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:00:44 does summoning the ancestor cost anything 18:01:42 n 18:01:46 ontoclasm: recall ancestor 2mp, hunger 18:01:50 source: in-game 18:01:52 hm 18:01:56 -!- rarewave has quit [Quit: Page closed] 18:01:57 should it have a hunger cost 18:01:57 i don't remember what i put the hunger cost as 18:02:00 or why 18:02:01 but you dont have to summon it 18:02:04 can we remove harm ammy 18:02:06 -!- eb_mobile has quit [Quit: I quit] 18:02:11 lol 18:02:13 why 18:02:14 We have the ability, yes 18:02:24 oh right, it comes back on its own doesn't it 18:02:30 why is there harm ammy 18:02:37 it's fun 18:02:44 it's useless 18:02:58 lol 18:03:03 think harder, friend 18:03:09 i'm trying 18:03:14 harm amulet owns 18:03:14 hugedmg 18:03:16 but i can't find any use for it 18:03:23 do you want a hint 18:03:33 03|amethyst02 07* 0.19-a0-253-g646af27: Make X<>_ (etc) use pathfinding again. 10(37 minutes ago, 1 file, 62+ 10-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/646af277f3b0 18:03:33 03|amethyst02 07* 0.19-a0-254-g899822b: Allow XE to cycle through more out-of-sight exclusions. 10(18 minutes ago, 1 file, 2+ 5-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/899822bb9ed1 18:03:39 i don't see why i want to get 25% more damage 18:03:44 Unstable branch on underhound.eu updated to: 0.19-a0-252-g247cc30 (34) 18:03:48 |amethyst: niiiiice 18:04:00 -!- Cerpin has joined ##crawl-dev 18:04:00 and you *removed* an argument 18:04:22 enh, i guess not really. sort of 18:04:46 does the hint include a ranged weapon 18:05:12 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.19-a0-255-ge2f8e15: Remove vestigial Hep hunger costs 10(2 minutes ago, 1 file, 3+ 3-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/e2f8e154c2f6 18:05:13 03|amethyst02 07[nfm-bondage-compat] * 0.19-a0-247-gc6eb840: Fix compilation (doh) 10(10 seconds ago, 1 file, 1+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/c6eb840648f5 18:05:18 that's one option! 18:05:31 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: mostly I reverted 18:05:31 monsters have ranged options too 18:05:38 well, literally? No, since the hint itself is merely a sequence of words 18:05:52 Like what, you want me to mail you a hint letter *and* a crossbow? 18:06:12 I already have one at home 18:06:52 Mostly I Reverted sounds like a potential clan name 18:07:03 close... 18:08:06 -!- Dracunos has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:08:10 i shouldn't have wasted my awesome clan name on a team that wouldn't place well 18:08:10 minmay: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 18:08:12 !messages 18:08:13 (1/1) crate said (1h 24m 15s ago): yes, my problem isnt his arguing, it's that he has repeatedly tried to claim i have said things i have not said 18:08:25 -!- Marvin is now known as Guest42332 18:08:34 wow 18:08:52 any clan with twelwe in it is a good clan 18:09:54 I don't even 18:09:56 wow 18:10:15 why would you argue with crate 18:10:49 who does 18:10:55 i just made a post arguing with crate. 18:11:47 thanks |amethyst 18:11:55 you can measure how good crawl is by how long it takes until you run into crate 18:12:11 funny but unkind 18:12:18 -!- Dracunos7 is now known as Dracunos 18:12:30 minqmay top 10 is great! congrats 18:12:41 minmay* 18:13:35 PleasingFungus: he didn't acknowledge you, quit faking it 18:13:50 :( 18:13:52 senpai... 18:16:24 duvessa does have a point that we have a lot of ally stuff in the game, though 18:16:42 not sure what can really be done about that 18:16:50 i don't see it as a problem 18:17:13 Lasty_: Have you considered putting a cooldown of some sort on Solo Time 18:17:30 (if there isn't already) 18:17:40 I've had it trigger multiple times in close succession 18:17:45 it's a problem (to me) since allies are really really strong, and they become something you want to use a lot 18:18:22 i mean it's really only a problem if you think allies are terrible, like me 18:18:45 gammafunk: is your argument here "we have too many strong evocables?" because people were literally just talking about nerfing spiderbag and beastbox 18:18:49 if you like allies then its no more a problem than spells being a huge part of the game 18:19:33 minmay: I think what I mean is creating a game where players have no good reason to not make extensive use of allies 18:19:38 er, too much negation 18:20:03 yes, where allies are basically obligatory, like spells (wands count as spells here) 18:20:30 you can still win without spells 18:20:56 not counting evoc 18:20:56 see: trog 18:20:56 and even without evoc 18:21:05 that's not the point at all, though 18:21:12 PleasingFungus: evokables are a good place to look since you don't lose much by training your 10 evo to use a lot of allies 18:21:16 and you can win without allies, doesn't change the fact that it is enormously weaker than winning with allies 18:21:17 minmay's point is that the vast majority of playstyles now include allies 18:21:24 as a significant part of play 18:21:30 gammafunk: more than when evo was cheaper! 18:21:43 when evo was cheaper all these evocables didnt exist 18:21:47 um 18:21:55 are you quite sure about that 18:22:14 do you count temporary allies as allies 18:22:17 I suppose that depends on what you mean by "cheaper" 18:22:22 removeelyvilon: of course 18:22:32 %git a594528b74066783cf4dfbb8c6302d3c13ef14cd 18:22:32 07Lasty02 * 0.17-a0-284-ga594528: Lower all species Evo apts by 1 10(1 year, 2 months ago, 1 file, 38+ 38-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/a594528b7406 18:22:56 I don't count archaeo as an ally since I'm really tired of hearing about the "metal gear roguelike" 18:23:15 <|amethyst> I think minmay is talking about 18:23:20 <|amethyst> %git cb5881f4 18:23:20 07galehar02 * 0.12-a0-220-gcb5881f: Remove the hidden special cost of some skills, adjust aptitudes. 10(3 years, 9 months ago, 2 files, 131+ 147-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/cb5881f43b3e 18:23:31 -!- scummos__ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:24:00 yes, that 18:24:07 (I agree that the game seems to be more spell-centered in general but that has been this way as far as I can remember) 18:24:17 why are you talking about spells 18:24:23 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:24:31 minmay: looks like a pretty small change? 18:24:33 could always make the god powers involving summons more piety hungry 18:24:48 +1 apt is about 15%, iirc, so from 20% to 15%...? 18:25:02 Lightli: that doesn't seem relevant 18:25:13 <|amethyst> became 25% more expensive and 19% cheaper 18:25:24 <|amethyst> err 18:25:38 PleasingFungus: all that happened was I thought "when evo was cheaper" was referring to something that it wasn't 18:25:39 <|amethyst> I should say, multiplied the cost by 1.25 and divided by 1.19 18:25:47 minmay: ok. sorry for the confusion 18:25:48 PleasingFungus: I don't know where you got the idea that I was claiming the 0.12 commit had a greater impact than the 0.17 one 18:26:05 i was just confused about why you were talking about that one at all 18:26:07 forget it 18:26:12 doesn't matter 18:26:25 because "when evo was cheaper" could mean either one :P 18:26:34 :P 18:26:34 I don't think it is helpful to lump all sorts of allies together. 18:26:50 like a big meatball 18:27:11 Evocables are certainly an issue, but I don't see how this is related to summon spells or gods. 18:27:45 dpeg: the relation is the uses of these things are quite similar in practice 18:28:10 gammafunk: yes, but we have structural differences to exploit. 18:28:11 there are strategically limiting differences certainly 18:28:25 -!- Ququman has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:29:00 i'm personally concerned about the burden on design of specifically avoiding having 'too many allies' 18:29:07 -!- adalaide482 has quit [Quit: Leaving] 18:29:18 dpeg: well gameplay isn't defined by just strategic differences, it's also defined to a large degree by what you do in combat 18:29:40 from my own experience in t, my use of allies was pretty limited (except in my su run ofc) 18:29:46 I guess I am pretty biased because I intentionally skip several sources of allies. 18:30:06 the ally consumables are for emergencies or near-emergencies, rather than something you'd pop off in most fights 18:30:06 <|amethyst> are evokers and summons and beogh allies and hep allies really used in the same ways in combat? 18:30:22 |amethyst: I don't think so, that is my point! 18:30:28 sure, they're used in pretty similar ways 18:30:46 rod of shadows is different, ofc, but rods are very rare and i'm not sure i actually saw any 18:30:46 PleasingFungus: oh, the tavern post is me complaining as a player. my design opinion is that crawl should have no allies at all, I am aware this is not one that developers share, which is why I have not aired it in here 18:31:02 minmay: yeah i gotcha 18:31:13 i'm no longer sure what we're really arguing about here 18:31:16 but we're definitely arguing about something 18:31:21 I only said anything in here because someone was interpreting that post as a design complaint, which it wasn't really 18:32:03 what determines the severity of banish 18:32:38 a formula I dreamed up one day when i wrote the patch 18:32:38 uh 18:32:39 dpeg: I'd be curious to hear how you think they're used differently; it's my experience that they're all used in a fairly similar way 18:32:46 I think banisher HD? 18:33:04 I think there's a lot of wishfull thinking that differences in allies are more meaningful than they are 18:33:18 !source banish 18:33:18 1/3. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/monster.cc#l2914 18:33:30 !source banish 2 18:33:30 2/3. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/player.cc#l5630 18:33:33 !source banish 3 18:33:34 3/3. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/view.cc#l1293 18:33:38 no none of those 18:33:53 gammafunk: my uses of allies are Trog, Gozag bribe, zombies (spell, Yredelemnul), and all of these are really different. It is a very limited set. 18:33:57 -!- debo has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 18:34:03 I cant use my hexer as a meatwall 18:34:04 -!- scummos__ has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 18:35:25 -!- tealeaves has quit [Quit: Bye] 18:35:37 -!- tealeaves has quit [Client Quit] 18:35:40 !source banished 18:35:41 1/2. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/abyss.cc#l391 18:35:52 -!- travis-ci has joined ##crawl-dev 18:35:53 The build has errored. (master - a6dc205 #5569 : Nicholas Feinberg): https://travis-ci.org/crawl/crawl/builds/132646391 18:35:53 -!- travis-ci has left ##crawl-dev 18:35:58 ah 18:36:09 removeelyvilon: _banished_depth is the function with the formula 18:36:27 first time I got to "new abyss endings" 18:36:36 I think you succeeded in making it harder 18:36:56 I would maybe put the differences between those as "fast, normal speed, and slow" 18:37:24 -!- tealeaves has quit [Client Quit] 18:37:30 gammafunk: off the top of my head, permanent allies you fight with differently since you want to keep them alive; ranged allies have different positioning constraints and goals 18:37:30 different power levels but not fundamentally different 18:37:36 malign gateway and mesmerize plus starcursed masses are no joke 18:37:49 03elliptic02 07* 0.19-a0-256-gdde7822: Autofight: don't move towards unreachable monsters (gammafunk, qw). 10(8 minutes ago, 1 file, 47+ 9-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/dde782283fc4 18:38:02 hahaha, did r-i put a mermaid next to a malign gateway 18:38:02 nice 18:38:04 that's great 18:38:15 fwiw i dislike all the ally evokers too 18:38:22 gammafunk: I think that's too coarse. 18:38:24 they're very... samey 18:38:32 im still meditating on what would be an interesting tloc evoker 18:38:32 ontoclasm: are we talking elemental evokers? 18:38:33 there is the keeping alive thing, yeah, but as far as ranged allies go, those allies are just fine to use in melee for the most part 18:38:39 since the previous try didn't work 18:38:40 and box and sack 18:38:41 yes 18:38:49 ...and all the ally rods 18:38:55 you'd say that lamp of fire feels the same as box of beasts? 18:39:00 it's not really a constraint terribly much, aside from allies like an orc sorceror maybe 18:39:06 kind of yes 18:39:09 or rather 18:39:15 gammafunk: not saying you have to keep them out of melee, just that you don't need to get them into melee 18:39:24 they are sort of different, but they're different because of the fire clouds 18:39:42 if lamp of fire just made a ton of fire clouds that'd be neat 18:39:51 man, if I could just aim the damn thing... 18:39:55 haha 18:40:00 gammafunk: for example, there is a big difference how the ally is paid for: needs a corpse, or MP, etc. For my set, this matters in how I fight. 18:40:05 similarly if the fan just blew everything away really far 18:40:13 etc. 18:40:56 dpeg: the corpse thing can matter early on in particular, yeah, but we're really talking strategic resources here; in combot, once you have the ally, there's generally more similarity than difference; but we're really talking in generalities now 18:41:08 in combot... 18:41:34 elliptic: will that slow down tab much? 18:41:38 gammafunk: yes, I see what you mean. At least as far as gods go, I was aware of ally overuse. Not sure if I did enough for you people :) 18:42:34 gammafunk: I don't think it should slow it down at all unless it hits the lua throttle, and I tested briefly and it didn't seem to be doing that 18:43:12 related but distinct is the fact that holy heck are there are a lot of evocations things now 18:43:17 like, it is slower to do these checks but it should still basically be instant 18:43:32 -!- ldf has quit [Quit: ldf] 18:44:04 we've been removing evocations things 18:44:04 it used to be kind of niche but now raising evo is good for... i want to say literally every character 18:44:12 this is such a weird discussion 18:44:14 i feel like i'm having deja vu 18:44:16 like what 18:44:23 lantern 18:44:23 like several summoning rods 18:44:25 for example 18:44:27 lantern, yes 18:44:38 are rods in general rarer 18:44:40 evocations really needs to be scrutinised; I didn't put in on my list (the c-r-d mail you didn't get yet) because I have no plan for them 18:44:44 ah, just swarm, i guess 18:44:51 -!- tealeaves has quit [Quit: Bye] 18:45:10 tomes of destruction, of course 18:45:21 -!- tealeaves has quit [Client Quit] 18:45:34 rings of invisibility 18:45:36 ontoclasm: well rods aren't generally a thing you want to go for on every character 18:45:43 why not 18:45:49 because they're bad 18:45:51 without a lot of evo 18:45:54 lots of vanishing evocables 18:46:14 still 18:46:15 rod of shadows is pretty good with lower evo maybe, but that's pretty rare 18:46:16 from my personal experience, i feel like the big problem with Evocations Is OP was solved when the apt was lowered a year ago 18:46:26 on my own characters, i don't feel obliged to dump much xp into evo 18:46:36 nothing like i used to 18:46:56 -!- Ladykiller69 has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 18:47:14 for one skill it provides an enormous amount of utility 18:47:21 enh 18:47:23 -!- Datul has quit [Quit: Page closed] 18:47:27 not really 18:47:32 not without putting a pretty serious investment into it 18:47:41 or without some very nice item finds 18:47:48 ontoclasm: yes. I don't have any numbers to back it up, but if feels overconcentrated. 18:47:58 if --> it 18:48:39 invis evocations being less common is pretty good 18:48:44 i think that box of beasts and possibly spidersack should be nerfed, but the idea that evocations in general are overpowered simply does not agree with my experience. 18:48:59 -!- Guest42332 has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:49:03 i definitely like the suggestion of having some of the elemental evokers not create allies and just focus more on the other effect 18:49:11 yeah I think most evocations usage is: sack, BoB, mirror, evokers, wands 18:49:11 that could be fine 18:49:22 though flood phial would be a little boring without the summons 18:49:45 they're all fun to use items for the most part, but most players want to use those 18:49:56 mirror and wands don't scale that much with evo 18:50:01 <|amethyst> !crashlog * sprint 18:50:03 614. Kellhus, XL21 VpEE, T:526 (milestone): http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/Kellhus/crash-Kellhus-20160524-150134.txt 18:50:16 evokers are pretty uncommon, esp in a 3-rune game - i generally find one or two toward the tail end 18:50:18 flood phial is the one i'd say could keep them since they're a bigger part of it 18:50:24 the power increas from training evo on wands is pretty significant though! 18:50:26 MarvinPA: sounds reasonable to me 18:50:47 people overlook it, but wands still remain useful even at 0 evo of course 18:51:03 conventional wisdom and my own experience have pointed toward not training evo for wands 18:51:23 no, that statement isn't implying that you would do so "only for wands" 18:51:28 -!- ProzacElf has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:51:43 but that the benefit on wands from training evo is significant (and you want evo for other things) 18:51:49 conventional wisdom for that probably also dates back to when it really didn't do much 18:52:02 but also to when evo was cheaper....... 18:52:08 no! not that again!!! 18:52:09 just saying. just sayin 18:52:28 * gammafunk screams into his phantom mirror! 18:52:50 gammafunk: i mean, the problem here would be if the game was becoming too 'samey' by virtue of nearly every character being obliged to train significant amounts of evo 18:53:21 personally I don't use evo much other than wands (because I dislike allies) and don't usually bother training it just for wand power, but I have done so sometimes and it was okay 18:53:28 i feel like that was generally the case a year or two ago, but again, i don't think that's the case now; i think whether or not you should put a significant investment into evo varies heavily by what you find 18:53:52 yep, I guess all I'm saying is that "better wands" is yet another reason for that sameyness of training evo; not at all suggesting we need to change wands, of course 18:54:00 I think the evokers and other things are good places to look 18:54:04 i hear wands are worse now 18:54:06 PleasingFungus: yeah, if most people were training 15+ evo then that would be one thing, but I think that much is still not too common? 18:54:11 I guess we can check 18:54:24 I feel 8-10 is pretty common 18:54:25 !lg * t won / fifteenskills~~evocations 18:54:27 461/1361 games for * (t won): N=461/1361 (33.87%) 18:54:27 6-10 18:54:31 i remember doing that in the old days, but i haven't in a while 18:54:32 nice 18:54:39 that's a lot higher than I thought 18:54:40 also, do there need to be evokers for all four elements 18:54:48 we were talking about removing tremorstone 18:54:53 !lg * t won urune<=5 / fifteenskills~~evocations 18:54:55 250/981 games for * (t won urune<=5): N=250/981 (25.48%) 18:54:58 PleasingFungus: I'll have a long talk with you sometime about how you're bad at crawl 18:54:58 !lg * t won / fifteenskills~~fighting 18:55:00 1294/1361 games for * (t won): N=1294/1361 (95.08%) 18:55:03 !lg * recent won urune<=5 / fifteenskills~~evocations 18:55:05 1546/5660 games for * (recent won urune<=5): N=1546/5660 (27.31%) 18:55:09 !lg * t won urune<=5 / fifteenskills~~fighting 18:55:11 919/981 games for * (t won urune<=5): N=919/981 (93.68%) 18:55:11 -!- Dracunos is now known as Dracunos-m 18:55:16 i'll have to pencil a date in after this ANOTHER LASTY GOD date on my calendar 18:55:28 elliptic: time to nerf hp...? 18:55:43 was just pointing out that we have other extremely popular skills :P 18:55:43 -!- mzmz has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 18:55:59 i think fighting is the default "i don't actually benefit from any skills at this point" skill to train 18:56:03 oh yeah, no issue there, but 33% with 15+ evo surprises me 18:56:06 I think that if we were at 50% of wins having evo >= 15 then that would be worrying 18:56:12 also how much of this came from auto skill training 18:56:13 -!- Dracunos_ is now known as Dracunos 18:56:15 for 3-rune it's only 25% 18:56:24 but only 33%, and more like 25% for 3-runers, seems fine for me 18:56:50 !lg * t won urune<=5 / fifteenskills~~invocations 18:56:51 207/981 games for * (t won urune<=5): N=207/981 (21.10%) 18:56:54 haha 18:56:57 !lg * t won urune<=5 / fifteenskills~~poison 18:56:58 !lg * cv<=0.16 cv>=0.14 won / fifteenskills~~evocations 18:56:59 2/981 games for * (t won urune<=5): N=2/981 (0.20%) 18:57:01 4384/12169 games for * (cv<=0.16 cv>=0.14 won): N=4384/12169 (36.03%) 18:57:09 evocations more popular than invocations... 18:57:11 !lg * cv<=0.16 cv>=0.14 won urune<=5 / fifteenskills~~evocations 18:57:14 2442/8689 games for * (cv<=0.16 cv>=0.14 won urune<=5): N=2442/8689 (28.10%) 18:57:23 some impact, but not as much as i'd have guessed 18:57:25 interesting 18:57:31 well, when the majority of invocations in the game don't use invocations skill, it's hard to blame evo 18:57:32 -!- Kellhus has quit [Quit: Page closed] 18:57:56 !lg * t won urune<=5 / fifteenskills~~spellcasting 18:57:58 150/981 games for * (t won urune<=5): N=150/981 (15.29%) 18:58:29 !lg * t0.12 won urune<=5 / fifteenskills~~spellcasting 18:58:30 !lg * t won urune<=5 / fifteenskills~~axes 18:58:35 164/480 games for * (t0.12 won urune<=5): N=164/480 (34.17%) 18:58:35 good night 18:58:36 261/981 games for * (t won urune<=5): N=261/981 (26.61%) 18:58:43 -!- removeelyvilon_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 18:58:46 !lg * t won urune<=5 fifteenskills~~throwing|crossbows|longbows|slings 18:58:47 rofl 18:58:47 120. glosham the Executioner (L24 MiBe of Trog), escaped with the Orb and 3 runes on 2016-05-22 19:49:48, with 1936264 points after 48733 turns and 9:23:34. 18:58:52 !lg * t won urune<=5 / fifteenskills~~throwing|crossbows|longbows|slings 18:58:53 -!- removeelyvilon has quit [Quit: Page closed] 18:58:54 120/981 games for * (t won urune<=5): N=120/981 (12.23%) 18:59:12 !lg * t won urune<=5 / fifteenskills~~unarmed 18:59:13 148/981 games for * (t won urune<=5): N=148/981 (15.09%) 18:59:37 this isn't going to stop until we've done every skill, is it 18:59:49 it's over. 18:59:51 i declare it done. 18:59:57 !lg * t won urune<=5 / fifteenskills~~summonings 18:59:58 32/981 games for * (t won urune<=5): N=32/981 (3.26%) 18:59:59 fite me 19:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:00:32 owned 19:01:41 <|amethyst> elliptic: does that handle monsters on the other side of water when you have a polearm? 19:02:06 <|amethyst> e.g. K~....@ 19:02:07 -!- Dracunos-m has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 19:03:11 |amethyst: it doesn't fight there, no. I considered handling that case but wasn't actually sure what the best behavior was 19:03:38 <|amethyst> elliptic: oh 19:03:39 <|amethyst> elliptic: actually, even this doesn't work 19:03:44 <|amethyst> elliptic: K~@ 19:03:44 hm, actually I think it might not work if K~@ 19:03:46 yes 19:03:49 that should be fixed at least 19:04:00 -!- wheals has joined ##crawl-dev 19:04:28 I guess it is probably easiest to make it fight in both those situations, so I'll do that 19:04:53 <|amethyst> elliptic: and I think more player-friendly generally 19:05:48 player-friendly?!? what would dpeg think... 19:06:16 03|amethyst02 07* 0.19-a0-257-gf6a2070: Don't put monsters in invalid menv slots. 10(11 minutes ago, 8 files, 19+ 7-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/f6a20703e660 19:06:21 big brother has found you guilty of playerthink 19:06:21 <|amethyst> http://s-z.org/neil/images/logicbug.jpg 19:06:48 !vault bailey_polearm_1 19:06:49 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/portals/bailey.des#l712 19:06:58 overeager C++11ification 19:07:06 is this problem related to how autoexplore instakills you in this bailey 19:07:22 oh, yeah, we should fix that 19:07:52 does it actually instakill you 19:08:17 autoexplore into orc knight bardiche 19:09:07 it actually moves you in range of a knight in the center chamber? 19:09:16 Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.19-a0-256-gdde7822 (34) 19:09:23 that does seem bad 19:09:35 yes, it does that 19:10:06 moves you in range of the orc warriors along the perimeter too 19:10:09 <|amethyst> fortunately it does stop you when you are hit, so it's only instakill if you get one-shotted or if you press o a bunch of times 19:10:27 <|amethyst> but you can o all the way around the perimeter, getting hit the whole time 19:10:46 PleasingFungus: ^ THIS is player-friendly! :) 19:10:51 right, it's a bit of an exaggeration, but a d:7 character getting one-shotted by an orc knight is hardly out of the question 19:11:03 i'm very friendly 19:11:10 <|amethyst> hmm, actually, I think I see an info leak here 19:11:29 <|amethyst> once you get close enough to the place where the perimeter moat ends, o stops working 19:11:37 <|amethyst> this happens before you can actually see a way to get across 19:11:46 <|amethyst> but your character somehow knows that the orcs can now path to you 19:11:50 -!- nezrel has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:12:19 it probably shouldn't ignore monsters across water at all, orcs could always have missiles and even if it's yaks across water you should be killing them for xp anyway 19:12:33 water|lava 19:13:24 lavawater 19:13:34 -!- FireSight has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:13:36 minmay: in that case we should have many fewer vaults placing water 19:13:39 <|amethyst> I don't think "you should be killing them for xp anyway" is a good reason to block autoexplore 19:14:03 wait, shit, i forgot i wanted to argue with ontoclasm 19:14:08 <|amethyst> we do try to track whether the monster has a (known) ranged attack but I don't recall the details 19:14:09 hey ontoclasm! shrikes! 19:14:19 <|amethyst> which are not bennu 19:14:28 <|amethyst> :P 19:14:32 03elliptic02 07* 0.19-a0-258-g6208554: Handle reaching correctly in will_tab (|amethyst). 10(30 seconds ago, 1 file, 2+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/6208554616d4 19:14:38 feh 19:14:40 bugs are other people's problems 19:14:56 <|amethyst> gammafunk: re the overenthusiastic C++11ification, I can justify myself somewhat 19:15:13 |amethyst: yeah, if a monster demonstrates a ranged attack once then it is treated as ranged (and blocks autoexplore across water) 19:15:35 <|amethyst> gammafunk: I saw for (int i = 0; i < MAX_MONSTERS; ++i) { monster* mons = &menv[i];... } and assumed "of course that loops over the the whole of menv 19:15:43 <|amethyst> gammafunk: silly me! 19:16:18 oh, haha, I see 19:16:42 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 19:17:32 minmay: in that case we should have many fewer vaults placing water 19:17:39 you say this as if I would consider it a downside 19:20:42 -!- Shard1697 has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 19:23:10 -!- Insomniak` has quit [Quit: I like to rock] 19:25:09 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 19:26:54 -!- eb_ has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 19:35:12 -!- GauHelldragon has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:36:16 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 19:37:01 -!- Dingbaat has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 19:42:05 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:43:19 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 19:44:27 -!- WorkSight has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 19:45:10 03|amethyst02 07* 0.19-a0-259-gbc3808f: Don't reenable autopickup when an invisible ally dies (#10440) 10(32 seconds ago, 1 file, 4+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/bc3808f23bc4 19:45:40 <|amethyst> wheals: thanks for pointing that out 19:46:11 i suspected it was something like that when i saw it was psyche :) 19:46:42 <|amethyst> you know 19:46:47 <|amethyst> I always thought that counted 19:46:55 <|amethyst> rather than being boolean 19:47:15 <|amethyst> and wondered why it didn't seem to work correctly sometimes 19:47:41 <|amethyst> but I guess counting would cause problems 19:48:10 <|amethyst> e.g. you see a monster go invisible, it leaves LOS, becomes visible, re-enters LOS, becomes visible again... count would be 2 19:48:23 <|amethyst> s/becomes visible again/goes invisible again/ 19:48:25 -!- serq has quit [Quit: und weg...] 19:50:41 <|amethyst> Completely unrelated, came up in tavern a month ago, ... 19:50:49 -!- Shard1697 has joined ##crawl-dev 19:50:55 <|amethyst> did you know that Monks start out with twice as many skill points as Artificers? 19:51:57 wow, monk op 19:52:03 j/k 19:52:18 |amethyst: er, I didn't mean to imply that was a problem 19:52:19 <|amethyst> those are the two extremes 19:52:29 <|amethyst> I don't think it's a problem necessarily 19:52:49 <|amethyst> artificers start out with plenty of good equipment 19:53:03 <|amethyst> fighter is second-highest, then warper 19:53:11 yes, I always thought number of skill points was supposed to inversely correspond to starting item quality 19:53:15 <|amethyst> AM is second-lowest 19:53:30 then you have cased like A----yeah 19:53:54 <|amethyst> Hu is 846, AM 714; Fi 1054, Gl 904 19:54:11 <|amethyst> oh, right, Gl get nets 19:54:29 Fi equipment was also worse until relatively recently 19:54:37 <|amethyst> yeah 19:54:46 it was certainly worse the last time that number of skill points changed :P 19:55:11 -!- joy1999 has quit [Quit: Http://www.ZeroIRC.NET Zero IRC Ver 2.9G] 19:56:16 <|amethyst> I don't think it's necessarily that it was supposed to correlate with item quality 19:56:19 I still don't know why monk has stealth, though 19:56:39 <|amethyst> rather, I think generally people think of it in terms of counting up skill levels, rather than skill points 19:56:51 <|amethyst> which, to be fair, is how the effects of most of those skills work 19:58:16 <|amethyst> if you just count skill levels, the Mo/Ar ratio is 1.5 rather than 2 20:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:01:09 <|amethyst> so FE gets 3/1 fire/conj, while VM gets 4/0 ... same effect on spellpower etc on their L1 spells, but that's more skill points for the VM 20:01:58 <|amethyst> not sure which we *should* be counting if we ever decide to rebalance backgrounds 20:02:38 03Shmuale Mark02 07* 0.19-a0-260-gf2f6d40: Remove more code for zapping unidentified wands. 10(2 minutes ago, 1 file, 19+ 42-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/f2f6d4064bdf 20:02:52 wtf 20:02:54 -!- Cerpin has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:03:09 it's that period again isn't it 20:03:48 -!- jefus- is now known as jefus 20:04:47 03wheals02 07* 0.19-a0-260-g70816b2: Remove more code for zapping unidentified wands. 10(25 seconds ago, 1 file, 19+ 42-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/70816b2004c9 20:04:53 -!- Cerpin has joined ##crawl-dev 20:04:55 there we go 20:05:15 hopefully nobody pulled in those 128 seconds 20:07:30 sorry about the force push... i accidentally deleted my ~/.gitconfig a couple weeks back 20:07:41 and i can never remember whether i use the period in my email 20:08:05 tomorrow's headline: Developer accidentally destroys entire repo with a force push 20:08:18 in the future 20:09:12 Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.19-a0-259-gbc3808f (34) 20:15:11 wheals: it's more if servers pull in those 128 seconds 20:15:28 servers are not people and we should not treat them with respect 20:15:41 it looks like the targeter for hexes leaks info on armour brands 20:16:08 MR+ items that you don't know are factored in 20:16:25 -!- Kellhus has quit [Quit: Page closed] 20:16:32 wheals: cpo builds every 15 mins and cjr every hour, looks like you just missed cjr though 20:17:04 I'm not sure what they would do if they saw a force push 20:18:32 MarvinPA: and jewellery? 20:18:34 hrm 20:18:44 not sure, i just noticed it on an orc wizard with an MR robe just now 20:19:10 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:19:28 i know there are some targetter leaks, but... hm 20:20:47 -!- namelastname112 has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 20:25:20 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.19-a0-261-g60b6c46: Remove an MR leak (MarvinPA) 10(16 seconds ago, 1 file, 2+ 2-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/60b6c468851b 20:25:26 quotes.txt addition 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=10441 by Can-ned Food 20:26:18 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 20:35:21 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 20:35:59 -!- IceBlind has quit [] 20:36:49 -!- Jessika has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 20:41:34 -!- Zekka has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:46:36 -!- Dracunos7 has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 20:46:59 -!- Ladykiller70 has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 20:51:14 <+|amethyst> assuming USE_DGAMELAUNCH but I'm sure chequers sets that <-- yes 20:51:14 chequers: You have 2 messages. Use !messages to read them. 20:51:19 -!- insecticide has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 20:51:30 what's the problem? are cpo experimental logs showing up as trunk games? 20:52:06 minmay: i'm against "against" 20:53:44 |amethyst: i think the problem is that i'm not switching branch when I build combo_god, I just git fetch ; git reset --hard origin/combo_god 20:53:59 |amethyst: i'll update future explbr's to switch branch 20:54:15 -!- Franz__ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:54:28 <|amethyst> chequers: aha, that would do it 20:55:50 PleasingFungus: i don't get idealise scaling, from 5-8 turns at invo 0 to 5-62 at 27? Why still a min of 5? 20:56:07 smaller code change 20:56:41 |amethyst: oh nice does 899822b fix that weird issue I was replicating with you a few weeks back? 20:56:43 -!- Dracunos72 has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 20:57:20 <|amethyst> chequers: I wasn't able to get that one to replicate but it seems likely 20:57:30 was hep ancestor speed updated? I don't see the commit 20:57:40 oh, it's a deliberate decision not to 20:57:57 what's the justification? "simpler implementation"? 20:58:43 <|amethyst> I suspect more along the lines of "allowing ancestors to vary by player race opens a huge can of worms regarding the god's balance" 20:58:49 nikheizen: there's already a cooldown on Solo Time. 20:59:11 How long? 20:59:54 |amethyst: yep 21:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:03:48 should we give a warning when quaffing !berserk under chei? 21:04:06 i expected the "could place you under penance" prompt 21:05:23 -!- Zekka has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:06:16 nikheizen: it's a bit random. The time-outs are 300 AUT + 0-200 AUT, but after each AUT increment there's a auts_taken/aut_taken*10 + remaining_timer chance of triggering again 21:06:34 nikheizen: if your piety is still high enough 21:07:03 Oh, the chance of triggering again was what I saw then. 21:07:13 Since it happened more than every 30 turns for sure 21:07:31 yeah, that can happen 21:08:27 The idea is that we don't want to force people to lower their piety to re-trigger the events, and we don't want a fixed limit that players can count towards 21:08:34 -!- DevlanMud|Lappy has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:08:53 I see. 21:09:08 Unstable branch on crawl.jorgrun.rocks updated to: 0.19-a0-261-g60b6c46 (34) 21:09:20 I also noticed that occasionally I would stumble upon paralyzed monsters outside of my LOS 21:09:27 often long after I stopped fighting 21:10:04 -!- CanOfWorms has joined ##crawl-dev 21:10:13 Were they waiting for an encore? 21:11:13 nikheizen: did you get a "solo" message in this case? 21:11:42 well, previously 21:11:46 then I would round a corner and see a para'd monster 21:11:51 hrm 21:11:55 that sounds not good 21:12:39 I didn't see that behavior at all fwiw 21:12:49 Hrm. 21:13:07 I wonder if I made sure to check that the monsters can see the player before paralyzing 21:13:53 -!- Dracunos7 has quit [Quit: Bye] 21:14:01 Speaking of which, I thought it was kind of odd that the audience would be prepared for a show they can't see (invisible player). 21:14:16 they can only hear it! 21:14:20 embrace the experience... 21:14:41 "apply_area_visible" -- yeah, this is already handled 21:15:53 Perhaps I just moved around the corner and didn't notice paralyzing them then. 21:16:15 -!- mibe has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 21:19:04 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:20:34 -!- Franz__ has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 21:23:41 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 21:28:50 -!- jehoesefat has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 21:31:50 -!- dpeg has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 21:34:50 -!- AreBrandon has joined ##crawl-dev 21:49:23 -!- PsiRedEye22 has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 21:50:22 -!- destrovel has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:53:28 -!- HellTiger has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 21:54:00 -!- lordfrikk has quit [Quit: Quitting] 21:56:41 -!- PsiRedEye23 has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:58:58 -!- debo_ has joined ##crawl-dev 22:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:03:51 -!- debo_ has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 22:05:50 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 22:05:51 there's a weird text bug with "foo is ." 22:06:06 -!- MarvinPA has left ##crawl-dev 22:06:17 probably the weapon warning 22:06:19 you can see it if you do !lm akett uniq=dispater -tv, it happens when dispater appears for the first time in that -tv 22:06:32 hm 22:06:37 !lm akett uniq=dispater -tv 22:06:43 -!- Cerpin has quit [Quit: leaving] 22:06:43 !lm akett uniq=dispater -tv 22:06:44 5. Akett, XL27 FoFi, T:94296 (milestone) requested for FooTV: telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org. 22:07:18 -!- Cerpin has joined ##crawl-dev 22:07:19 -!- Esox has quit [Quit: Page closed] 22:07:30 hrm 22:07:34 -!- scummos__ has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 22:07:53 can't trivially reproduce 22:08:16 ?/Ashenzari warns you:.*is . 22:08:16 Matching entries (2): ashenzari_reasons[2] | cheibriados_wrath[3] 22:08:24 ??it[ash 22:08:25 I don't have a page labeled it[ash in my learndb. 22:08:27 should be a good new it entry, once we fix it 22:08:31 ??it[Ashenzari 22:08:31 I don't have a page labeled it[Ashenzari in my learndb. 22:08:33 ??it 22:08:33 it[1/43]: It fall off the wall. 22:08:37 r??it 22:08:37 it[32/43]: It draws it back to her home. 22:08:40 ?/It is 22:08:41 Matching entries (98): !help:!abyssturns[1] | alexor[2] | apropos_panlords[3] | aum[1] | battlesphere[2] | brogue[2] | caster[2] | catoblepas[1] | causative[14] | centaur[2] | chaos_spawn[2] | cheibriados[11] | cheibriados_wrath[2] | cheibriados_wrath[3] | crawl_alternative[2] | dchimera[1] | dead_monster[8] | degeneration_card[2] | dpeg[10] | drpraetor[1] | eldritch_tentacle[1] | enchant_weapon_i... 22:08:48 i thought there was one already 22:08:50 guess not 22:08:54 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:09:04 surprising 22:09:21 the only :"it is" that I know of is captured in an image 22:09:22 ??mumo 22:09:23 mumo[1/2]: http://i.imgur.com/5vjyfVe.jpg 22:10:47 i appreciate that the '0.15 only' thing has just been totally dropped 22:12:11 that orb of fire with the hat... 22:12:39 it's inspiring 22:13:00 -!- Lasty has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:13:27 -!- Lasty has joined ##crawl-dev 22:14:06 -!- PleasingFungus has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:18:37 -!- WalkerBoh has joined ##crawl-dev 22:19:12 <|amethyst> !tell PleasingFungus re the "Dispater is ." message... I get it reliably but only if Dispater and another monster come into LOS in the same turn 22:19:13 |amethyst: OK, I'll let pleasingfungus know. 22:21:20 <|amethyst> aha, I see why 22:24:18 <|amethyst> the weapon isn't considered worth describing by get_monster_equipment_desc, because it doesn't have a brand (and is of unknown type) 22:25:41 !cmd .awoken !lg * trunk killer=earth_elemental ikiller~~elementalist elf $* 22:25:42 Redefined command: .awoken => !lg * trunk killer=earth_elemental ikiller~~elementalist elf $* 22:27:17 actually, why is this still trunk? 22:27:25 could just be recent now 22:27:35 you know that feeling when you write dumb code, and you hate yourself? today, I had that feeling 22:27:43 !cmd .awoken !lg * recent killer=earth_elemental ikiller~~elementalist elf $* 22:27:44 Redefined command: .awoken => !lg * recent killer=earth_elemental ikiller~~elementalist elf $* 22:28:12 gammafunk: today i only wrote great code, on a product co-workers are clamouring for. it was a good day 22:28:19 nice 22:28:50 tomorrow will be different for me, I'm hopeful 22:29:21 .awoken 22:29:22 23. mbj the Convoker (L18 TeSu of Zin), slain by an earth elemental (summoned by a deep elf elementalist) on Elf:1 (eino_elf_arrival_shootout) on 2016-05-20 22:51:55, with 190034 points after 66194 turns and 4:55:38. 22:29:31 .awoken -2 22:29:32 22/23. AFZvezda the Carver (L14 HuFi of Makhleb), mangled by an earth elemental (summoned by a deep elf elementalist) on Elf:1 on 2016-05-20 02:00:13, with 45715 points after 21805 turns and 1:05:36. 22:29:52 -!- zxc has joined ##crawl-dev 22:30:56 would give points to someone who renamed the command to .wokeaf 22:36:34 -!- destrovel has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:36:58 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Client Quit] 22:47:28 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:49:57 -!- Mandevil has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 22:54:22 -!- CanOfWorms has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.92 [Firefox 3.6.28/20120306064154]] 22:55:30 -!- RedFeather has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.92 [Firefox 46.0.1/20160502172042]] 22:58:04 -!- travis-ci has joined ##crawl-dev 22:58:05 The build was fixed. (nfm-bondage-compat - c6eb840 #5575 : Neil Moore): https://travis-ci.org/crawl/crawl/builds/132692684 22:58:05 -!- travis-ci has left ##crawl-dev 22:59:50 hrm, are there any other big 0.18 monster changes 22:59:54 tzitz, mutant beasts 23:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:00:05 dart slugs, howlers 23:06:28 iron giants 23:06:45 spark wasps 23:10:25 yeah I should have mentioned I was wondering about tiles specifically 23:10:30 but I think I have them all 23:11:19 !tell CanOfWorms I was able to use the set of base tiles and fire base tiles for mutant beasts in RandomTiles just fine; sadly I can't make a proper one showing combinations of facets, but it's better than nothing 23:11:19 gammafunk: OK, I'll let canofworms know. 23:11:46 the tiny little dinky one looks pretty hilarious carrying around a war axe 23:14:57 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 23:17:05 -!- fixit_friend has joined ##crawl-dev 23:21:05 -!- AreBrandon has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:22:32 gammafunk: in terms of tiles, nagas, merfolk 23:23:00 sun demons 23:23:39 water elementals 23:23:49 maybe other elementals 23:26:00 zxc: ah, yeah good point that those changes, but those don't happen to require any modifications on my part 23:26:06 -!- Pekkekke has quit [] 23:26:06 mutant beasts and new monster do though 23:26:11 or renamed monsters 23:26:18 s/changes/changed/ 23:26:41 I posed my question rather poorly, same as always 23:27:52 do you ever have dreams involving crawl monsters 23:27:55 what's up 23:28:19 no, but I had a dream about a tiles chat conversation once 23:28:23 gammafunk: ok I obviously have no idea what you are looking for 23:29:05 zxc: yeah, I think all the changes I need to look out for are covered, so thanks regardless 23:29:24 ontoclasm: making sure randomtiles has all 0.18 tile stuff, crucial 23:29:26 i wish my games had tiles chat conversations 23:29:31 aha 23:29:32 well.... 23:29:54 somebody should implement chat in console 23:30:06 obv it can't be an overlay but it could be a screen you can switch to 23:30:23 We were spitballing about that once some time back 23:30:31 doubt it would work well 23:30:50 there's already that 'Press _' thing in the corner 23:30:55 or whatever it is 23:31:03 -!- wheals has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:31:05 ontoclasm: the current solution is to spectate yourself in webtiles with your console window over the browser window 23:31:23 does assume you don't use fullscreen console, or are at least able to alt-tab over from time to time 23:31:33 the solution is to use note_chat_messages 23:31:57 there's that too, but that's sort of a different solution 23:33:08 the critical problem is I have no way to make tiles chat or twitch chat messages affect my game in a convenient way 23:33:28 like I can't make my twitch bot have a !tile meatlord command 23:33:34 to set my tile to the meatlord 23:34:02 would have to hack some thing that connected over ssh and sent dgl messages 23:34:38 s/sent/send/ 23:36:54 sun demon is my favorite tile 23:37:06 i think CoW made it 23:37:20 I really like the new neqoxecs 23:37:23 the most adorable incandescent horror 23:37:26 like some kind of relaly weird eldritch pig 23:37:33 *really 23:37:38 i haven't seen one in the wild but it looked cool 23:37:45 neq, i mean 23:38:24 i saw a sun demon in the wild because i got a hostile one from Summon Demon and it almost one-shot my musu 23:38:28 :< 23:38:55 -!- VoxSomniator has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:38:59 -!- murtidash has quit [Quit: Page closed] 23:39:26 -!- travis-ci has joined ##crawl-dev 23:39:28 The build passed. (master - dde7822 #5576 : elliptic): https://travis-ci.org/crawl/crawl/builds/132698647 23:39:28 -!- travis-ci has left ##crawl-dev 23:40:02 mummies: made of flamable bandages 23:40:13 *flammable 23:42:07 03|amethyst02 07* 0.19-a0-262-g5df7875: Don't omit mention of Dispater's staff, +0 rods (CanOfWorms) 10(70 minutes ago, 2 files, 13+ 6-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/5df78756b03d 23:42:24 <|amethyst> !tell PleasingFungus I think I fixed it, but you might want to look over 5df78756 23:42:25 |amethyst: OK, I'll let pleasingfungus know. 23:42:57 -!- Wraiths has quit [Quit: Page closed] 23:43:09 -!- Dracunos has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 23:48:24 -!- demise_ has joined ##crawl-dev 23:48:45 -!- Daekdroom has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:51:02 -!- Athaboros has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:51:55 -!- ebarrett_ has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:53:16 -!- Demise has joined ##crawl-dev 23:53:38 -!- demise_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 23:53:55 -!- Demise has quit [Client Quit] 23:55:41 -!- Demise_ has joined ##crawl-dev 23:57:59 -!- Demise_ has quit [Client Quit]