00:00:00 this isn't an abyss vault 00:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:00:05 !tell wheals you need a github profile pic: https://www.google.com.au/search?q=wagon+wheels+chocolate 00:00:05 chequers: OK, I'll let wheals know. 00:00:56 New branch created: pull/144 (4 commits) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/144 00:00:56 03chequers02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/144 * 0.17-a0-2059-g6eec189: Allow manually specifying randart quality 10(15 hours ago, 2 files, 11+ 9-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/6eec1891d23b 00:00:56 03chequers02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/144 * 0.17-a0-2060-g2448efe: Increase wizmode &$ to help Gozag testers 10(15 hours ago, 2 files, 3+ 3-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/2448efe9c9f2 00:00:56 03chequers02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/144 * 0.17-a0-2061-g2758420: Move logic for randart weapon plus to a public function 10(15 hours ago, 2 files, 9+ 5-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/2758420f7b75 00:00:56 03chequers02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/144 * 0.17-a0-2062-g3f011b4: Add Gozag artefactisation. 10(15 hours ago, 5 files, 98+ 3-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/3f011b4e086f 00:01:50 is he going to gold-plate your weapon? 00:01:57 better 00:02:15 cast a new one out of solid gold? 00:02:25 although the way artifact generation code works, the higher the "quality", the great the chance it has negative properties 00:02:28 he takes your gold and casts the art out of it 00:02:43 -!- rast has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:02:45 so you tend to get things like MR++ rC- 00:02:51 well, obviously your gold 00:03:10 i don't care about the artifact-whateverness 00:03:28 what makes this the pinnacle of gold god blessings 00:03:35 the lore needs writing, no way 'artefactise' is the final name 00:03:58 well, this is making gozag the ultimate rent seeker 00:04:06 he already is 00:04:08 first, he gives you gold! just for killing monsters! you were going to do that anyway! 00:04:24 but, you really need some shops, you'd better pay him a cut to get some shops 00:04:50 now you have your items, but you only found a mundane broad axe. now he can upgrade it for you! for a free 00:05:08 doubtful, what with all the shops and all 00:06:01 03gerbias02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/132 * 0.17-a0-2066-g49b7fdc: Merge branch 'master' of https://github.com/crawl/crawl into rot-fixes 10(40 minutes ago, 0 files, 0+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/49b7fdc61b72 00:06:01 03gerbias02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/132 * 0.17-a0-2067-g0a3f452: Make !HW not cure rot with No Device Heal 3 10(8 minutes ago, 2 files, 5+ 4-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/0a3f452158fa 00:06:52 -!- Sequell has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:07:01 -!- Sequell has joined ##crawl-dev 00:08:26 Grunt: I saw you sneakin' in and out of twitch 00:08:33 <.< 00:08:34 >.> 00:08:52 !send Pan gammafunk 00:08:52 Sending gammafunk to Pan. 00:08:53 oh ho, we have a sneaker 00:09:00 -!- lobf has joined ##crawl-dev 00:09:21 i tried to watch one of your videos but it was completely impossible to tell what was going on 00:09:56 my eyes exploded after ten minutes 00:10:02 couldn't handle it anymore 00:11:06 03gerbias02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/132 * 0.17-a0-2067-gdcd6e23: Make !HW not cure rot with No Device Heal 3 10(13 minutes ago, 2 files, 7+ 13-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/dcd6e23e6342 00:12:16 -!- Kramell has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:13:07 -!- Guest47598 is now known as n1k 00:13:11 -!- n1k has quit [Changing host] 00:13:11 -!- n1k has joined ##crawl-dev 00:14:02 -!- Kramell has quit [Excess Flood] 00:16:11 03gerbias02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/132 * 0.17-a0-2067-g5cdb83f: Make !HW not cure rot with No Device Heal 3 10(18 minutes ago, 2 files, 7+ 12-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/5cdb83f00433 00:19:49 -!- apexlion has quit [Client Quit] 00:21:09 wee, squish 00:22:03 Unstable branch on CRAWL.XTAHUA.COM updated to: 0.17-a0-2064-g265a032 (34) 00:22:13 -!- Daekdroom has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:30:57 * hypractvChipmunk experiences a momentary feeling of inescapable doom. 00:53:27 -!- pintc has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 00:55:00 -!- pintc has quit [Changing host] 00:55:10 -!- Saka2 has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:58:11 -!- Smello has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:00:03 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:04:52 -!- SomeStupidGuy has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 01:06:58 -!- simmarine has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:07:50 -!- tealeaves has quit [Quit: Bye] 01:09:29 Unstable branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.17-a0-2064-g265a032 (34) 01:12:14 -!- CanOfWorms has joined ##crawl-dev 01:13:16 -!- SirLicksAlot has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 01:18:43 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 01:19:13 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.17-a0-2064-g265a032 (34) 01:21:27 !source acquire.cc:89 01:21:28 https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/acquire.cc#l89 01:21:41 why do divine gifts bias towards body armour? 01:23:30 looks like just a random choice by PF when he rewrote acq 01:23:32 -!- st_ has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 01:28:51 <|amethyst> no 01:28:56 <|amethyst> the old code was 01:29:03 <|amethyst> if (coinflip()) 01:29:03 <|amethyst> result = _random_nonbody_armour_type(); 01:29:18 <|amethyst> and there are five nonbody armour types 01:30:00 is that the only thing making oka armour acq worse than scroll acq 01:30:44 <|amethyst> not the only thing 01:30:51 <|amethyst> !source _body_acquirement_weight 01:30:51 1/1. https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/master/crawl-ref/source/acquire.cc#l201 01:31:54 so oka is more random 01:32:24 <|amethyst> ah, found why they're different 01:32:32 <|amethyst> %git 6f12496d 01:32:32 07jpeg02 * 0.6.0-a0-402-g6f12496: sExperimentally tweak armour acquirement to give out more equipment for secondary slots. (Okawaru still uses the old 50% armour, rest secondary chances.) 10(6 years ago, 2 files, 145+ 24-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/6f12496dcf3c 01:36:12 -!- tensorpudding has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:37:05 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: CADENZA-CLASS CLOCKWORK KNIGHT--OPERATION TERMINATED] 01:37:42 -!- raskol has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:37:43 i might comment that magic number at least 01:37:51 i didn't pick up that 5 = number of aux 01:40:03 oh, it is called out in the comment 01:40:48 in that function I linked, the code refers to weight.first and weight.second. where do 'first' and 'second' come from? 01:41:05 as far as I can see the data is an array of arrays, but the fields are anonymous 01:41:26 chequers: pair 01:41:36 pair has a first and a second 01:41:42 ah 01:41:48 just stdlib magic? 01:42:03 well, "magic", sure 01:42:10 it's not an array of arrays, it's a vector of pairs 01:42:25 -!- omnirizon has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:46:49 -!- GauHelldragon has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 01:46:49 <|amethyst> C++11 uniform initialization 01:47:03 <|amethyst> you can use curly braces to init more than just plain arrays and structs 01:47:25 <|amethyst> the type has to be known 01:48:25 <|amethyst> but then curly braces can turn into constructor calls or elementwise struct initialization, depending 01:48:44 <|amethyst> s/known/supplied by context/ 01:50:25 <|amethyst> so e.g. in struct coord_def Compass[9] = { {0, -1}, {1, -1}, ... }; the outer braces must be initializing an array, and the inner ones must be initializing a coord_def; and since coord_def has a non-explicit constructor that takes two parameters, it calls that one 01:51:30 <|amethyst> (hm, which reminds me, I should try making coord_def's constructor and methods constexpr) 01:51:59 <|amethyst> (then that could be done completely at compile time instead of at static initialization time) 01:52:53 -!- knu has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:54:07 Windows 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08:13:18 -!- waat has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:16:33 -!- dtsund has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 08:16:55 -!- xtwv has quit [Quit: Leaving] 08:19:53 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 08:20:52 -!- Patashu has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 08:23:43 -!- rchandra has joined ##crawl-dev 08:26:22 -!- Twiggytwiggytwig has quit [Quit: See ya guys later ;)] 08:31:18 -!- wheals has joined ##crawl-dev 08:34:04 -!- honeybadger has quit [Quit: Page closed] 08:34:05 hypractvChipmunk: so, re: skinflayer, I don't think it's a bad idea to have an unrand that stacks damage on consecutive hits. -6 makes it pretty crummy for sure, and limiting it to monsters that have skin makes it something you need to swap a lot. What about letting it affect any monster (with text changes to match) and giving it a more moderate enchantment -- +0 or something 08:34:12 how was it in your testing? 08:36:21 -!- Palyth_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:37:26 -!- Furril has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 08:38:01 hey, good morning 08:40:04 -!- tealeaves has quit [Quit: Bye] 08:40:20 Also: Good morning. :) 08:40:56 my testing was pretty minimal, since I have no feel for much beyond the first few floors, but based on feedback from |amethyst and DrKe, it's now a -2 demon whip and applies its effect only when at least one point of damage is scored 08:41:46 -!- iFurril has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 08:43:08 you're the first to mention the swapping thing, but the change to requiring damage might also allow us to drop the flesh requirement 08:44:04 so it isn't the ultimate plant slayer that it was originally >8) 08:45:17 haha 08:45:29 Ah, the bonus damage ignores AC. I missed that at first. 08:47:43 It's hard for me to determine how it'll play -- -11 enchantment (against a +9 demon whip) hurts a lot, but ignoring AC is kinda nice. -2 might still just be too low. I suppose the risk in making it apply to monsters w/o skin is that it might just feel like another plain damage brand... 08:47:45 hrm 08:48:17 yeah, but I went into it expecting to be told to change that...it's as much for flavor reasons as gameplay, since you're removing the stuff that mitigates damage 08:49:53 i considered having it remove natural resistancesbased on the same logic, but that seemed excessive 08:53:22 I was hoping to get playtest feedback from people who actually know what the game looks like beyond floor six to see how it fares...I don't really trust myself to construct reasonable test scenarios at that level 08:56:53 -!- tealeaves has quit [Quit: Bye] 08:57:33 -!- Wheatmill has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:00:01 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:02:58 -!- Albatross_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 09:05:13 -!- pblur has joined ##crawl-dev 09:06:22 -!- tealeaves has quit [Quit: Bye] 09:06:40 I was just eyeing up the TM follows size proposal on the tavern (basically that spider form etc. apply as a size modifier instead of setting the size. This would be parallel with the current behavior of tree form, for instance.) 09:06:42 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 09:06:50 Would there be any interest in a patch? 09:07:21 Not asking for a commitment, just not sure if this is something that seems like it could be a good idea. 09:07:50 I have no objection (or strong feelings on the subject) 09:08:06 Dunno if anyone else will feel differently 09:08:08 -!- tealeaves has quit [Client Quit] 09:08:16 kk 09:17:47 -!- tealeaves has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 09:18:05 -!- Palyth_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:21:11 -!- Krakhan has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 09:30:11 -!- infrasho1tfoo has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 09:38:55 i think it really can't work on monsters without flesh with that flavor 09:39:02 like imagine it being effective on a skeleton 09:39:36 -!- Krakhan has quit [Changing host] 09:42:42 -!- Krakhan|2 has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 09:44:04 yeah, it'd probably need new flavor if so 09:44:15 but I'm not sure whether it's interesting enough w/o the flavor 09:44:36 It might help if it was clear how much bonus damage it was doing 09:44:56 well i mean, there are plenty of monsters with flesh in the game 09:45:03 is it that much more narrow than pain brand 09:45:11 <|amethyst> Lasty_1: 1 then 2 then 4 then 8 then 16 etc 09:45:28 there's a cap i think 09:45:32 -!- vale_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:45:35 <|amethyst> 32768 09:45:41 You hit the skeleton. The skeleton is leaking marrow! 09:45:46 |amethyst: perfect 09:45:52 <|amethyst> the cap is there for technical reasons, not practical ones 09:45:57 -!- Lasty_1 is now known as Lasty_ 09:46:01 nah i mean, by hc 09:46:13 Cap Skinflayer bonus stacks at 15. 09:46:21 <|amethyst> DrKe: damage is 1 << bonus 09:46:32 -!- ldf_ has joined ##crawl-dev 09:46:32 -!- ldf has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:47:02 <|amethyst> so I guess 65536 is the cap 09:47:21 <|amethyst> oh, no 09:47:26 <|amethyst> 32768 is right 09:47:28 no, you had it the first time 09:48:36 oh 09:48:42 i perceived that as just being 15 damage 09:48:49 that kinda changes things 09:49:15 little bit >8x 09:51:59 -!- Jiang_Qing has quit [Quit: Saliendo] 09:52:05 -!- mtyson has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.92 [Firefox 41.0.1/20150929144111]] 09:52:14 -!- infrasho1tfoo has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 09:52:39 <|amethyst> it sounds like a weapon that should be supplied in the zigsprint starting room 09:52:47 <|amethyst> (also makes "testing" easier :) 09:52:54 i would try maybe fsim this vs e.g. dwhip of elec +9 against stone giant, etc 09:53:13 <|amethyst> I don't know how well fsim works 09:53:18 <|amethyst> because it does many iterations 09:53:22 you think it wouldn't parse the bonus damage 09:53:26 <|amethyst> and time doesn't elapse 09:53:30 yeah 09:53:38 <|amethyst> no, I think it would shoot up to 32768 very quickly 09:54:38 considering it needs to hit for damage to apply the bonus stacks it would vary fight to fight quite a bit 09:54:46 against things with meaningful AC 09:55:05 so harder to test without something like fsim 09:57:17 Oh, ah, I skimmed that as +15 also 09:57:18 heh 09:57:43 minus something makes more sense in that context 09:58:12 and it keeps the damage bonus when you switch targets within 100 AUT 09:58:20 so yeah, definitely not too week 09:58:24 *weak 09:58:26 >8P 09:58:28 i felt dwhip was better because you could give it a minus to hurt the accuracy 09:58:28 <|amethyst> well, the bonus is per-enemy 09:58:32 without making the damage too low 09:58:51 * Lasty_ brings the patch back up 09:59:17 -!- ololoev has quit [Client Quit] 09:59:53 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 10:00:01 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:00:12 @?? stone giant 10:00:12 stone giant (15C) | Spd: 10 | HD: 16 | HP: 71-104 | AC/EV: 12/2 | Dam: 45 | 10items, 10doors | Res: 06magic(80), 12drown | XP: 1422 | Sz: Giant | Int: human. 10:00:50 I had considered a bloodfrenzy one that tracked on the player instead with a much shorter fall-off, but that seemed too RNG-dependent 10:00:53 im sure +9 elec would kill a stone giant faster but that's a top tier weapon in any case 10:01:02 im not sure what kind of dwhip to compare it to 10:01:37 it would depend on the character also, how much str and skill is helping the base damage to be >0 10:01:45 after ac 10:01:46 so, say you're fighting a stone giant. The base -2 demon whip is doing an average of (back-of-the-envelope) ~2 damage/hit. 10:02:10 like, keep the bonus as long as you didn't miss 10:03:51 so skinflayer does something like 3 / 4 / 6 / 10 / 18 / 34 damage, and the stone giant dies on (probably) the 6th hit 10:03:57 -!- ystael has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:04:11 <|amethyst> @??cerebov 10:04:11 Cerebov (05&) | Spd: 10 | HD: 21 | HP: 650 | AC/EV: 30/8 | Dam: 60 | 05demonic, 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, fighter, see invisible | Res: 13magic(immune), 05hellfire, 04fire+++, 03poison, 12drown, 04rot, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 22535 | Sp: fire storm (8d16 / 8d17) [06!sil], iron shot (3d36) [06!sil], haste [06!sil], sum.greater demon [06!sil] | Sz: Giant | Int: huma.. 10:04:27 DrKe: yeah, that was an important consideration when i was originally getting feedback from |amethyst ...I wanted to make it definitely require str/skill to get over the barrier 10:04:33 +9 demon whip would be doing approx 18 damage / turn, and kill on the 4th hit 10:04:47 er +9 of elec 10:04:56 -!- radinms has quit [] 10:05:47 +9 vorpal demon whip would do something like 10 damage/hit and kill after about 8 turns 10:06:38 if elec procced every hit or did you average that out 10:06:39 So brandwise this would fall somewhere between vorpal and elec, but with the damage heavily back-loaded, meaning that you can't take advantage of effects that weaken the foes before you start hitting with the whip. 10:06:49 hypractvChipmunk: averaged it out 10:07:06 all very back-of-envelope, but good enough 10:07:20 -!- tealeaves has quit [Quit: Bye] 10:07:21 yeah, just checking 10:07:26 back-of-envelope-wise, elec is roughly worth +9 slaying 10:07:46 on dark maul? 10:07:50 gotcha 10:08:11 <|amethyst> kvaak: but you can't fit dark maul on the back of an envelope! 10:08:25 hehe 10:10:53 Is this a new unrand? 10:11:05 Skinflayer, I mean? 10:12:30 not officially. i wrote it yesterday and it's in a Pull Request 10:13:04 i wanted to be Lasty for a day 10:13:20 because lasty is so cool 10:13:33 Lol 10:13:39 Interesting idea at least 10:13:52 ty >8) 10:14:46 To be Lasty though, you need to invent a unique that's guaranteed to spawn with it. And maybe supply a nice starting vault full of giant eyeballs or something. ;) 10:15:08 did lasty do that? 10:15:23 No, just a relatively evil usage for the idea 10:15:27 the discussion it's provoking is well worth the effort already 10:16:24 well, one cannot become Lasty in merely a day 10:16:25 -!- Evablue has quit [Quit: Evablue] 10:16:35 I'll work up to that point though 10:17:55 -!- Rjs has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:19:17 -!- tealeaves has quit [Quit: Bye] 10:20:02 -!- ldf_ has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:22:11 Finally, the recognition I so richly deserve 10:22:33 >8D 10:23:56 Also, I had bad math -- elec brand is more like +18 slaying than +9. Forgot to factor in that slaying is also averaged. 10:24:30 so the elec dwhip damage per turn should be closer to 22 per hit 10:24:43 (averaged, back of envelope) 10:25:04 you need to get a new envelope 10:25:08 ?? elec 10:25:09 electrocution[1/1]: Weapon brand that causes your weapon to blast your target with an explosion of sparks on 1 out of every 3 hits, doing 7+d13 additional damage (which ignores AC). Does not work on targets with rElec. 10:25:22 how is it anything like +18 10:25:42 did I do my math wrong again? 10:25:46 Okay, let me do this properly 10:25:50 7+d13 averages 4.31 10:26:00 with the proc rate being 1/32 10:26:04 1/3 evn 10:26:08 today is typo day 10:26:27 +18 slaying averages more than two times that 10:26:47 dang it, I was right the first time -- approx +9 slaying 10:27:17 go get your envelope back! 10:27:27 tho of course 1) it's ignoring the +hit effect of slaying and 2) it's ignoring the AC discount that elec gets 10:27:56 -!- filthy has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 10:29:10 i say elec is +10 10:29:14 -!- LexAckson has joined ##crawl-dev 10:29:19 but i guess +9 is closer 10:29:24 yes well I'd appreciate it if you could ignore the fact elec ignores ac 10:29:32 since what the fuck +9 slaying is insane 10:30:55 <|amethyst> it's not exactly an AC discount, though.... slaying doesn't have AC subtracted separately from the main attack 10:31:32 true 10:31:40 <|amethyst> if the base attack roll was bigger than the AC roll, slaying is pure extra damage 10:31:52 And if it was less, then it might be no damage at all 10:31:53 <|amethyst> and if it was smaller, then elec wouldn't have procced 10:32:11 is that true? I thought elec and poison brands proc even w/o damage 10:32:17 <|amethyst> oh, maybe 10:32:23 Yes, they do 10:32:31 AF_ stuff is handled differently 10:32:56 which is one reason that monsters w/ venom weapons are much more dangerous than ones with AF_POISON 10:33:07 Otherwise you could never kill anything with a +9 elec quickblade... 10:33:12 that too 10:33:16 Well, anything high AC 10:33:33 <|amethyst> ah, yeah, I was confusing it with AF_ELEC 10:34:04 pblur: when a spriggan casts spiderform, what size would you make it? 10:34:12 <|amethyst> huh, we list the brands that require base damage to trigger, rather than listing the ones that do not 10:34:32 I assume the ones that require base damage are the multiplicative ones? 10:34:39 Microscopic! 10:34:52 <|amethyst> Lasty_: and antimagic and vampirism 10:35:18 well, otherwise they multiply zero, so I think that's a given 10:35:21 Probably +8 10:35:21 -!- kvaak has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 10:35:32 Which will make your evasion payoff absurd 10:35:40 Maybe cap at +6 if it's a problem 10:35:53 ?size 10:36:02 ??size 10:36:02 size factor[1/2]: For evasion purposes: spider form and bat form are tiny (factor 6), spriggans and felids are little (factor 4), halflings and kobolds are small (factor 2), trolls ogres centaurs and nagas are large (factor -2), hydraform is big (-4), and dragonform is huge (factor -8). 10:36:11 -!- kvaak has joined ##crawl-dev 10:36:15 Oh. This is different from wiki 10:36:22 Assuming this is correct 10:36:26 ??size[2 10:36:26 size factor[2/2]: Monster sizes from %?? (for constriction and trampling) in order and with examples: tiny (rats); little (felids); small (kobolds); medium (humans), large (trolls); big (death yaks); giant (dragons) 10:36:47 -!- Twiggytwiggytwig has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 10:37:03 |amethyst: so really the rule could be expressed as "weapon brands apply on 0 damage hits if their effect does something on 0 damage hits" 10:37:08 Assuming this is correct, +10 10:37:19 Or "weapons brands apply on 0 damage hits if it would make sense" 10:37:22 Maybe capping at 8 if it's op 10:38:02 It looks like that won't break the math 10:38:47 like I can see the vampirism exception there to avoid confusion and meaningless spam 10:39:12 I don't know how antimagic works 10:39:51 ??antimagic 10:39:51 antimagic[1/2]: A weapon brand which makes monsters sometimes lose a turn when they try to cast spells. Wielding it reduces max mp by 2/3, getting hit by it depletes mp. Works on everything that has non-divine spells, including demons, orbs of fire, electric golems, etc. 10:39:55 Antimagic and vampirism each apply an effect based on amount of damage done 10:40:08 if the damage is 0, there effect would do nothing 10:40:09 yeah they are both big weapon brands 10:40:10 generally 10:40:19 Though your evasion at 27 dodging, 24 dex is something like 85.5 raw EV, but stepped dwon to 50-something 10:40:23 Which is huge 10:40:29 ??antimagic[2 10:40:29 antimagic[2/2]: Miscast chance for monsters increases based on damage dealt (with the weapon), decreasing every turn. 10:40:34 But Spriggans generally rock 40+ lategame anyhow 10:41:24 that's a pretty cool brand 10:41:26 55 assuming I did my math right 10:41:27 I could be wrong, but I think the effectiveness of EV per point tends to go down somewhat after ~30ish EV... 10:41:41 03oblivionis02 07https://github.com/crawl/crawl/pull/138 * 0.17-a0-2032-g4163e3a: Update branches.txt 10(8 seconds ago, 1 file, 22+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/4163e3a2c6fe 10:42:00 pretty sure you can argue ev having diminishing returns 10:42:12 like i think it does anyway 10:42:19 i don't know at how much ev 10:42:27 there are a lot of factors 10:43:36 -!- tensorpudding has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 10:44:59 -!- siepu has quit [Quit: Leaving] 10:45:14 https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=14989 10:45:23 From berder's simulations 10:45:46 Looks like the max returns on EV depend on the monster, but even orb guardians peak at 40ish 10:45:58 Juggernauts probably peak even higher 10:46:04 thanks for that 10:46:17 But for most things 30 is about peak return value 10:48:14 So balance-wise, the super-tiny size isn't actually that big a deal 10:49:12 not ultra-lategame, anyways 10:49:48 but you become untouchable much earlier, no? 10:49:58 hypractvChipmunk: a spriggan w/ spiderform and some Dodging could easily get 30+EV on D2 or so 10:50:06 And for trolls/ogres, this is a relatively small nerf, dropping them only to spriggan size instead of slightly smaller. Which IMHO is compensated for by that fact they get 50% more HP on their already absurd HP pools 10:50:12 ah 10:50:12 !lm . max=ev x=ev xl=9 10:50:13 631. [2014-08-08 18:54:02] [ev=42] perunasaurus the Martial Artist (L9 TeTm of Okawaru) killed Joseph on turn 10630. (D:8) 10:50:14 of course spriggans are already basically invincible to not-orc-priests 10:50:19 hahaha spriggans 10:50:20 -!- Tux[Qyou] has joined ##crawl-dev 10:50:20 good joke 10:50:45 -!- vale_ has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 10:51:08 !lm . recent max=ev place=d:2 10:51:08 205. [2015-02-24 03:20:05] Lasty the Insei (L3 OpTm) killed Terence on turn 1401. (D:2) 10:51:09 >8) 10:51:16 !lm . recent max=ev place=d:2 x=ev 10:51:17 205. [2015-02-24 03:20:05] [ev=20] Lasty the Insei (L3 OpTm) killed Terence on turn 1401. (D:2) 10:51:37 huh. I never knew I held the distinction of highest D:2 EV :p 10:51:47 uh 10:51:53 oh, heh 10:51:53 I used . not * 10:51:55 !lm * recent max=ev place=d:2 10:51:56 in your own games 10:51:59 380977. [2014-09-05 03:05:26] Monsoon the Ticktocktomancer (L27 OpMo of Cheibriados) killed Crazy Yiuf on turn 106550. (D:2) 10:52:05 you are the most evasive lasty of all time 10:52:09 !lm * recent max=ev place=d:2 x=ev 10:52:10 lol 10:52:10 Yeah, if we say dex = 20, dodging = 5, that's about 30 with spider form, 20.6 without 10:52:14 380977. [2014-09-05 03:05:26] [ev=62] Monsoon the Ticktocktomancer (L27 OpMo of Cheibriados) killed Crazy Yiuf on turn 106550. (D:2) 10:52:22 lol 10:52:30 Which is a big difference... except that nothing can hit you anyhow 10:52:32 !lm * recent max=ev place=d:2 x=ev xl<10 10:52:36 379771. [2015-07-27 12:16:05] [ev=32] misbiopy the Ducker (L6 SpMo) killed Jessica on turn 2876. (D:2) 10:53:14 I suppose really this doesn't exacerbate the silliness of spriggans 10:53:34 -!- simmarine has joined ##crawl-dev 10:53:38 -!- infrasho1tfoo has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:53:45 !lg * recent D:2 sp s=killer 10:53:47 7722 games for * (recent D:2 sp): 1859x an adder, 1359x a worm, 706x a gnoll, 472x Sigmund, 468x, 361x a goblin, 342x a hobgoblin, 240x a kobold, 198x Jessica, 196x Terence, 186x Crazy Yiuf, 162x Ijyb, 141x a jackal, 131x Natasha, 114x Robin, 95x a giant gecko, 94x a quokka, 83x a bat, 61x a rat, 60x an orc wizard, 39x an orc, 38x an orc priest, 32x a giant mite, 32x an ooze, 26x a hound, 25x a gi... 10:54:14 friggin worms, seriously 10:54:17 I love how many of those are worms 10:54:44 I hate those things with a passion 10:54:47 i dont think spider form needs that 10:54:55 it would have much more interesting implications for dragon form 10:55:28 and i guess hydra form also 10:55:33 if anyone uses that 10:56:12 I use it as I-want-dragon-form-but-I-don't-have-it form 10:57:14 !lg . d:2 s=killer 10:57:14 71 games for hypractvChipmunk (d:2): 19x an adder, 11x a gnoll, 4x a worm, 4x a hobgoblin, 4x Terence, 3x a kobold, 3x Crazy Yiuf, 3x Natasha, 3x an orc priest, 3x Sigmund, 2x a goblin, a giant frog, a white imp, an orc, miscasting Spider Form, an iguana, , Aethrus's ghost, an iron imp, Robin, a centaur, a rat, a giant gecko 10:57:38 miscasting spider form, nice 10:58:08 !lg * ktyp=burning vmsg~~sticky 10:58:09 2181. goldelona the Invulnerable (L21 MiBe of Trog), incinerated by a hell hog (sticky flame) on Abyss:1 on 2015-10-12 11:39:55, with 356366 points after 60931 turns and 2:52:14. 10:58:13 !lg * ktyp=burning vmsg~~miscast 10:58:14 11. Charan the Firebug (L7 GrFE), incinerated by miscasting Fireball on D:5 on 2015-07-20 01:27:48, with 487 points after 6590 turns and 0:25:25. 10:58:20 !lg * ktyp=burning vmsg~~miscast.*ticky 10:58:22 !lg * recent ikiller~~miscasting s=ikiller 10:58:23 2. Sneal the Firebug (L5 DEFE), incinerated by miscasting Sticky Flame on D:3 on 2013-12-13 14:42:24, with 224 points after 2869 turns and 0:26:14. 10:58:23 283 games for * (recent ikiller~~miscasting): 105x miscasting Summon Ice Beast, 19x miscasting Sticky Flame, 18x miscasting Animate Dead, 17x miscasting Spider Form, 16x miscasting Call Imp, 15x miscasting Summon Lightning Spire, 15x miscasting Call Canine Familiar, 12x miscasting Conjure Flame, 9x miscasting Mephitic Cloud, 5x miscasting Regeneration, 5x miscasting Shadow Creatures, 5x miscasting... 10:58:38 nice 10:58:44 I'm surprised there aren't more for Regen 10:58:51 !lg * ikiller~~miscasting_Summon_Ice_Beast s=char 10:58:52 268 games for * (ikiller~~miscasting_Summon_Ice_Beast): 33x DEIE, 22x MuSu, 20x MfIE, 20x DESu, 15x MuIE, 15x DrIE, 14x OpIE, 14x VpIE, 12x HEIE, 11x VpSu, 9x TeSu, 7x DgIE, 6x KoSu, 6x HuIE, 5x DrSu, 4x KoIE, 4x FeSu, 3x DgSu, 3x MuWz, 3x HuSu, 3x HESu, 2x SESu, 2x HOSu, 2x GrSu, 2x VSSu, 2x VSIE, 2x TrSu, 2x GhIE, 2x DsSu, 2x GrIE, VpWz, OpCj, OpWn, HOFi, FoFi, OpSu, NaIE, MfCK, FoWn, SEIE, MiSu... 10:58:52 -!- LexAckson_ has joined ##crawl-dev 10:58:57 !lg * ikiller~~miscasting_Summon_Ice_Beast s=role 10:58:58 268 games for * (ikiller~~miscasting_Summon_Ice_Beast): 151x Ice Elementalist, 101x Summoner, 4x Wizard, 3x Wanderer, 2x Fighter, 2x Necromancer, Monk, Conjurer, Assassin, Transmuter, Chaos Knight 10:59:25 ambitious fighters 11:00:01 -!- omarax has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:00:13 Yeah. Currently, small races end up pretty gipped in forms, because only tree and shadow form respect their advantage (size) and they all respect their low HP. 11:00:42 Spriggans are a bad example, as Sp are silly, and SpTm is really about as challengy as you get 11:00:59 <|amethyst> appendage, blade, statue, lich, tree, shadow 11:01:07 !lg * current trunk won sp s=-role 11:01:11 135 games for * (current trunk won sp): Transmuter, Necromancer, Abyssal Knight, Fire Elementalist, Air Elementalist, 2x Ice Elementalist, 2x Skald, 2x Chaos Knight, 2x Warper, 2x Hunter, 2x Conjurer, 3x Wanderer, 3x Arcane Marksman, 3x Monk, 3x Fighter, 4x Earth Elementalist, 5x Berserker, 6x Gladiator, 6x Artificer, 7x Wizard, 10x Venom Mage, 16x Assassin, 52x Enchanter 11:01:14 huh 11:01:18 interesting 11:01:22 heh 11:01:34 Thx amythest. 11:01:39 right on the money, don't you love that 11:01:45 !lg * won sp s=-role 11:01:45 1423 games for * (won sp): 2x Reaver, 2x Paladin, 2x Jester, 3x Crusader, 4x Thief, 7x Priest, 10x Death Knight, 10x Summoner, 11x Healer, 13x Skald, 13x Air Elementalist, 14x Necromancer, 15x Arcane Marksman, 16x Hunter, 16x Fire Elementalist, 17x Transmuter, 19x Abyssal Knight, 19x Ice Elementalist, 20x Monk, 20x Gladiator, 21x Wanderer, 22x Fighter, 31x Chaos Knight, 31x Earth Elementalist, 33x... 11:02:03 -!- LexAckson has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:02:03 ah there are some 0s there! 11:02:12 <|amethyst> sptm was easier when they kept their speed 11:02:16 !lg * won sp / current trunk o=-N 11:02:19 135/1423 games for * (won sp): N=135/1423 (9.49%) 11:02:20 oops 11:02:21 !lg * sp s=role /won o=-% 11:02:23 1423/229585 games for * (sp): 19/9326x Abyssal Knight [0.20%], 104/32526x Assassin [0.32%], 17/4645x Transmuter [0.37%], 34/8193x Wizard [0.41%], 2/480x Jester [0.42%], 43/9565x Stalker [0.45%], 3/667x Crusader [0.45%], 35/6854x Warper [0.51%], 4/782x Thief [0.51%], 13/2474x Air Elementalist [0.53%], 37/6647x Artificer [0.56%], 31/5520x Chaos Knight [0.56%], 21/3458x Wanderer [0.61%], 626/97494x E... 11:02:24 !lg * won sp s=role / current trunk o=-N 11:02:28 135/1423 games for * (won sp): 0/2x Reaver [0.00%], 0/2x Paladin [0.00%], 0/2x Jester [0.00%], 0/3x Crusader [0.00%], 0/4x Thief [0.00%], 0/7x Priest [0.00%], 0/10x Death Knight [0.00%], 0/43x Stalker [0.00%], 0/11x Healer [0.00%], 0/10x Summoner [0.00%], 1/17x Transmuter [5.88%], 1/14x Necromancer [7.14%], 1/19x Abyssal Knight [5.26%], 1/16x Fire Elementalist [6.25%], 1/13x Air Elementalist [7.69... 11:02:31 <|amethyst> !lg * won sptm s=+cv 11:02:32 17 games for * (won sptm): 2x 0.8-a, 2x 0.16-a, 2x 0.6, 2x 0.15-a, 0.10, 0.6-a, 0.4, 0.16, 0.17-a, 0.3, 0.13-a, 0.12-a, 0.9-a 11:02:39 no recent SpSu wins 11:03:00 I suppose I should fix that some time 11:03:23 My two favorite miscast deaths: 11:03:23 !lg * recent ikiller~~"miscasting summon small mammal" 11:03:23 !lg * recent ikiller~~"miscasting Sublimation of Blood" 11:03:25 1. GauBotGW the Caller (L6 HuSu), mangled by a spatial vortex (summoned by miscasting Summon Small Mammal) on D:3 on 2015-06-24 23:24:55, with 240 points after 4385 turns and 0:07:40. 11:03:27 -!- LexAckson_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:03:30 1. Herrn the Skirmisher (L6 VSFi), blasted by a soul eater (drain life) (summoned by miscasting Sublimation of Blood) on D:3 on 2014-09-23 05:49:21, with 228 points after 2286 turns and 0:07:46. 11:03:39 no love for miscasting borg's? 11:03:43 "I wouldn't mind giving some hp for mana..." 11:03:44 Abyssal knight looks like the only more challengy combo for spriggan 11:03:46 DrKe: even better 11:03:47 -!- LexAckson has joined ##crawl-dev 11:03:51 DrKe: I didn't find any in the logs 11:03:53 !lg * recent ikiller~~"miscasting Death's Door" 11:03:54 No games for * (recent ikiller~~'miscasting Death\1s Door'). 11:03:58 !lg * recent ikiller~~"miscasting Death" 11:03:59 No games for * (recent ikiller~~'miscasting Death'). 11:04:00 aw 11:04:01 i think there is at least one 11:04:02 I feel guilty playing spriggan...I get so much farther on average than anything else it's ridiculous 11:04:04 i remember looking it up before 11:04:06 its old though 11:04:09 maybe if you drop recent 11:04:12 oh yeah 11:04:15 !lg * ikiller~~"miscasting Death" 11:04:16 No games for * (ikiller~~'miscasting Death'). 11:04:18 My first win was a sp 11:04:20 ... 11:04:28 !lg 78291 zig 11:04:30 24. 78291 the Archmage (L27 NaAE of Ashenzari), killed by miscasting Death's Door on Zig:19 on 2014-02-17 04:08:41, with 1104500 points after 145760 turns and 8:24:43. 11:04:41 !lg * ikiller~~"borgnjor" 11:04:41 No games for * (ikiller~~borgnjor). 11:04:46 !lg 78291 zig x=killer,ikiller 11:04:47 24. [killer=;ikiller=] 78291 the Archmage (L27 NaAE of Ashenzari), killed by miscasting Death's Door on Zig:19 on 2014-02-17 04:08:41, with 1104500 points after 145760 turns and 8:24:43. 11:04:47 am I spelling that right? 11:04:49 <|amethyst> !lg * kaux~~borgnjor 11:04:49 ... 11:04:57 pblur: the AK is scum factor, add I understand it 11:04:58 1. sorbius the Severer (L16 DDNe of Lugonu), killed by miscasting Borgnjor's Revivification on Vaults:1 (evilmike_marble_ring) on 2012-09-28 22:04:39, with 102742 points after 37192 turns and 2:54:36. 11:05:01 ! 11:05:03 These days they seem a bit harder than they did back then, because of the low HP making them occaisionlly randomly die. 11:05:04 as* 11:05:13 Sure, that's fair 11:05:14 <|amethyst> ikiller~~miscasting only counts miscast summons 11:05:15 Of course 11:05:26 Because people will do obviously bad things 11:05:28 ahh 11:05:29 <|amethyst> !lg * recent kaux~~miscasting 11:05:31 512. thirtiethelement the Grave Robber (L6 DDNe of Makhleb), killed by miscasting Vampiric Draining on D:4 on 2015-10-12 05:26:09, with 320 points after 3615 turns and 0:48:21. 11:05:34 <|amethyst> !lg * recent kaux~~miscasting s=kaux 11:05:34 512 games for * (recent kaux~~miscasting): 85x miscasting Sticky Flame, 60x miscasting Iskenderun's Battlesphere, 44x miscasting Regeneration, 39x miscasting Fireball, 29x miscasting Mephitic Cloud, 23x miscasting Iskenderun's Mystic Blast, 21x miscasting Throw Icicle, 20x miscasting Spider Form, 15x miscasting Animate Dead, 15x miscasting Summon Ice Beast, 14x miscasting Fulminant Prism, 14x misc... 11:05:49 <|amethyst> !lg * recent kaux~~miscasting s=-kaux 11:05:49 512 games for * (recent kaux~~miscasting): miscasting Searing Ray, miscasting Magic Dart, miscasting Iron Shot, miscasting Recall, miscasting Conjure Ball Lightning, miscasting Control Teleport, miscasting Dispersal, miscasting Ignite Poison, miscasting Bolt of Fire, miscasting Animate Skeleton, miscasting Teleport Other, miscasting Dragon Form, miscasting Pain, miscasting Bolt of Magma, miscastin... 11:06:01 miscasting recall lol 11:06:04 <|amethyst> !lg * recent kaux~~miscasting_magic_dart 11:06:05 Miscasting magic dart -- now that's a feel-bad 11:06:06 1. BigStickPopham the Conjurer (L1 DECj), killed by miscasting Magic Dart on D:1 on 2015-05-02 15:40:57, with 0 points after 81 turns and 0:00:36. 11:06:12 <|amethyst> on a decj 11:06:16 <|amethyst> !lg * recent kaux~~miscasting_magic_dart -log 11:06:18 1. BigStickPopham, XL1 DECj, T:81: http://dobrazupa.org/morgue/BigStickPopham/morgue-BigStickPopham-20150502-154057.txt 11:06:26 <|amethyst> oh, found a chain mail 11:06:28 Also animate skeleton -- "fight's over, now I'll just . . ." 11:06:37 lol 11:06:55 <|amethyst> !lg * recent kaux~~miscasting_pain -log 11:06:59 1. Newgrounder, XL2 DsNe, T:1410: http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/Newgrounder/morgue-Newgrounder-20141001-213251.txt 11:07:08 more chain mail 11:07:09 lol 11:07:11 killed by wearing chain mail 11:07:21 miscasting recall? 11:07:21 You miscast Pain. Pain shoots through your body! 11:07:24 Jessica casts pain on you so in revenge you . . .cast pain on you. 11:07:27 <|amethyst> !learn add chain_mail http://dobrazupa.org/morgue/BigStickPopham/morgue-BigStickPopham-20150502-154057.txt http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/Newgrounder/morgue-Newgrounder-20141001-213251.txt 11:07:27 chain mail[2/2]: http://dobrazupa.org/morgue/BigStickPopham/morgue-BigStickPopham-20150502-154057.txt http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/Newgrounder/morgue-Newgrounder-20141001-213251.txt 11:07:35 nice 11:08:03 ??spellcasting penalty 11:08:03 I don't have a page labeled spellcasting_penalty in my learndb. 11:08:20 ?? aevp 11:08:21 aevp[1/1]: Adjusted body armour evasion penalty. Affects spell success, melee accuracy. Its value is [(2/5) * er^2 / (str+3)] * [45 - armour_skill]/45. 11:08:22 when he miscast recall, did they all come back hostile? =x 11:08:28 i liked whatever change it was that made 100% fail spells give a prompt when casted 11:08:29 ??spell successs 11:08:29 spell successs ~ spell success ~ success rate[1/3]: Spell success rates are coloured according to miscast severity.Grey means less than 0.1% chance of a severity 2+ miscast, yellow means < 0.5%, light red < 2.5%, dark red >= 2.5%. 11:08:56 !learn add spell_success See 11:08:56 spell success[2/2]: See 11:09:02 ??spell_success[2 11:09:02 spell success[2/2]: See 11:09:06 {} 11:09:08 ergh, brain not work 11:09:10 -!- Lawman0 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:09:23 <|amethyst> !learn set spell_success[2] see {chain mail[2]} 11:09:24 spell success[2/2]: see {chain mail[2]} 11:09:35 <|amethyst> ??spell success[chain 11:09:35 chain_mail[2/2]: http://dobrazupa.org/morgue/BigStickPopham/morgue-BigStickPopham-20150502-154057.txt http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/Newgrounder/morgue-Newgrounder-20141001-213251.txt 11:09:38 <|amethyst> ??spell success[2 11:09:39 chain mail[2/2]: http://dobrazupa.org/morgue/BigStickPopham/morgue-BigStickPopham-20150502-154057.txt http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/Newgrounder/morgue-Newgrounder-20141001-213251.txt 11:11:17 lol 11:13:35 -!- zero_one has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:13:51 -!- tealeaves has quit [Quit: Bye] 11:14:56 !lg * ikiller~~miscasting_Summon_Ice_Beast s=name 11:14:56 wheals: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 11:14:57 268 games for * (ikiller~~miscasting_Summon_Ice_Beast): 3x Akhier, 3x Johnny, 3x gammafunk, 2x Tutankham, 2x Noah, 2x stoc, 2x xeno23, 2x Morik, 2x defeeca, 2x Frobop, 2x ronnoc500, 2x takos, 2x Sn0bb, 2x axecop, 2x mess, 2x Noiyera, 2x Burrobuns, 2x Blackmore, 2x aTarkinC, 2x BatMan, 2x Rule42, 2x Kitty, nickwilmes, Melum, AKnight, Skincrawler, LaVieElectronique, hurafacha, starseed13, Tuskar, ma... 11:15:05 as i thought 11:15:07