00:00:19 there are about a dozen monster with res asphyx, btw 00:00:25 separate from unbreathing 00:00:28 there's 00:00:31 <|amethyst> jellies and eyes 00:00:31 all slimes 00:00:33 yes 00:00:34 so anyhow they're already vulnerable to high power hexes, much more so at lower hd 00:00:36 @??ophan 00:00:36 ophan (05G) | Spd: 10 | HD: 15 | HP: 82-114 | AC/EV: 10/10 | 08holy, see invisible, lev | Res: 06magic(140), asphyx, 12drown, 04rot, 13neg+++, 08holy | XP: 1403 | Sp: b.fire (3d24) [06!sil], holy flames [06!sil] | Sz: Medium | Int: high. 00:00:49 the final one is a mystery 00:00:50 can you guess without cheating!? 00:01:02 orb guardians 00:01:03 <|amethyst> not me, since I'm already cheating :) 00:01:15 chequers: nope, everyone knows those are perfectly vulnerable to curare 00:01:18 perfectly ordinary Xs 00:01:45 ok i give up bit if you say death yaks i'm uninstalling the game 00:01:46 Stable (0.16) branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.16.1-16-gc44b35d 00:01:51 sky beasts 00:02:10 what even are those things 00:02:13 like, lore-wise 00:02:29 they're sky beasts. 00:02:33 <|amethyst> a strange aerial creature formed of clouds and tortured flesh 00:02:39 <|amethyst> sounds demonic to me 00:02:39 ??sky 00:02:40 sky[1/16]: I last saw Sky__ at Sun Mar 23 22:26:25 2014 UTC (7w 5d 21h 16m 51s ago) saying 'my deflect missle spell doesn't go away. does it make me hunger lots or something' on ##crawl. 00:02:48 this guy made those 00:03:20 better than zermako beasts, at least 00:03:25 <|amethyst> IMO they should be X and not Y though 00:03:41 -!- Maud has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 00:03:45 but we use Y for elemental beast thingies 00:03:47 ??Y 00:03:47 I don't have a page labeled Y in my learndb. Did you mean: ', 6, ?, d, p, q, t, u, v, Â©, â˜¡, ðŸŒ½, ðŸ•, ðŸŒ. 00:03:51 <|amethyst> all two of them 00:04:08 <|amethyst> the other of which is just a dumb melee creature with an attack flavour 00:04:13 uhhhhhh 00:04:21 did you call ice beasts dumb 00:04:22 I wonder 00:04:23 ok. 00:04:26 ??[3m_Lï¿½ 00:04:26 I don't have a page labeled [3m_Lï¿½ in my learndb. 00:04:27 this decision is too much for me. 00:04:31 I'm gonna have to meditate for like 00:04:33 a week 00:04:34 <|amethyst> (sky beast is a dumb melee creature with an attack flavour that also goes invisible and makes rain) 00:04:37 to decide whether i should make this merge 00:04:39 well, commit my patches first 00:04:43 and even then, god. it'll probably take me weeks....! 00:04:44 those are non-controversial 00:05:00 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.17-a0-589-gf3c920e: Merge res_asphyx() into is_unbreathing() 10(2 minutes ago, 10 files, 26+ 37-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/f3c920e20ba7 00:05:02 the first one is 00:05:02 non-contraversial 00:05:08 the second doesn't make sense to me 00:05:14 -!- rchandra has joined ##crawl-dev 00:06:38 moon troll should clearly have res asphyx 00:06:38 just think of all the SpEns, craying out for an easier time in Pan 00:06:44 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: did you intend to add M_UNBREATHING to jellies and eyes? 00:06:47 and me and my always unused !invis 00:06:47 it lives on the moon after all 00:06:53 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: the commit message implies so 00:06:55 yes 00:07:01 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: because you didn't 00:07:06 spens have it so easy as it is 00:07:08 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: unless I'm missing something 00:07:10 you are 00:07:13 check monster::is_unbreathing 00:07:25 <|amethyst> oh 00:07:37 feel free to remove that with the explicit flag, if you think it's preferable 00:07:44 I just didn't want to do all the copy-pasting 00:08:00 now MiBes, those chars are just impossible to win 00:08:15 !won gammafunk mibe 00:08:16 gammafunk (mibe) has not won in 8 games. 00:08:19 fucked up... 00:08:28 !lg . 00:08:29 2852. gammafunk the Caller (L6 HESu), blasted by Aurophilus' ghost (flame tongue) on D:5 on 2015-04-14 23:08:18, with 363 points after 2223 turns and 0:13:56. 00:08:33 !lg . mibe 00:08:34 8. gammafunk the Executioner (L18 MiBe of Trog), quit the game on Vaults:5 (vaults_vault) on 2015-04-14 21:42:37, with 258387 points after 19668 turns and 3:24:32. 00:08:56 "i'm going to slowly for this speedrun" quit? 00:08:57 !lg Aurophilus d:5 00:08:58 4. Aurophilus the Magician (L6 DEFE of Vehumet), shot by a centaur (arrow) on D:5 on 2015-04-14 22:51:10, with 305 points after 3486 turns and 0:34:05. 00:08:59 <|amethyst> (FR: MH_SLIME ) 00:09:05 d:5 centaur, ouch 00:09:08 -!- tensorpudding has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:09:14 I panicked when I saw a defe ghost 00:09:19 !lg Aurophilus d:5 x=dam,mhp 00:09:19 4. [dam=4;mhp=35] Aurophilus the Magician (L6 DEFE of Vehumet), shot by a centaur (arrow) on D:5 on 2015-04-14 22:51:10, with 305 points after 3486 turns and 0:34:05. 00:09:23 rip 00:09:28 !lm . 00:09:29 13827. [2015-04-15 03:02:42] gammafunk the Summoner (L11 HESu of Sif Muna) entered the Shoals on turn 7031. (Lair:6) 00:09:40 !lg * thisweek max=tdam x=tdam 00:09:41 9943. [tdam=132] tigertrap the Nimble (L13 DgTm), engulfed by a cloud of flame on Orc:4 (st_orc_rangers) on 2015-04-13 20:28:28, with 48194 points after 22190 turns and 1:15:54. 00:09:51 oh that's a good kw 00:09:53 !kw thisweek 00:09:54 Keyword: thisweek => end>${day(now()) - ndayofweek(now()) * seconds_interval(86400)} 00:10:08 !hs * thisweek !won 00:10:08 9851. Airwolf the Farming Conqueror (L27 GhGl of Makhleb), blasted by a hellion (burst of hellfire) (summoned by a shadow demon) on Zig:17 on 2015-04-12 00:59:16, with 1807399 points after 240511 turns and 20:12:27. 00:10:12 good 00:10:16 death to farmers 00:10:27 rip agriculture 00:10:30 be careful, thismonth and thisweek use calendar months rather than time periods 00:10:40 so !hs * thismonth on may 1 is useless 00:10:59 ah 00:11:07 need a lastsevendays kw I guess 00:11:21 !kw lastweek 00:11:22 No keyword 'lastweek' 00:11:25 !kw week 00:11:26 Keyword: week => end>${now()-interval('7d')} 00:11:30 !kw month 00:11:30 Keyword: month => end>${now()-interval('31d')} 00:11:33 ^ 00:11:39 <_miek> oh someone fixed those to be done better 00:11:46 <_miek> that makes working out lastweek and lastmonth a lot easier 00:11:47 !lg . week s=char 00:11:47 20 games for gammafunk (week): 15x HESu, 3x MiBe, HuCj, DEFE 00:11:59 !lg * week s=char won 00:12:00 211 games for * (week won): 9x MiFi, 8x FoFi, 8x GrFi, 6x MiBe, 4x VSBe, 4x OpTm, 4x HOFi, 4x GrEE, 3x KoHu, 3x VSFi, 3x FoHu, 3x DsWn, 3x MfSk, 3x DrTm, 2x OpWn, 2x OpWz, 2x MiCK, 2x TrMo, 2x HEIE, 2x DsMo, 2x DsAr, 2x FeBe, 2x MiMo, 2x DsNe, 2x DrFE, 2x DgTm, 2x GrIE, 2x OgBe, 2x HOGl, 2x DEFE, 2x FeTm, 2x DsFi, 2x NaWr, 2x DECj, SpAs, NaEE, MfWn, DDGl, OpIE, DsGl, GhGl, DrFi, TeAE, FoCK, NaTm, ... 00:12:08 <|amethyst> ¡kw month end>${now()-interval('30.4d')} 00:12:14 !lg * week s=god won 00:12:15 211 games for * (week won): 21x Trog, 21x Cheibriados, 19x The Shining One, 16x Okawaru, 16x Vehumet, 14x Ru, 14x Makhleb, 12x Dithmenos, 11x Ashenzari, 9x Xom, 9x Qazlal, 8x Kikubaaqudgha, 7x Zin, 6x Lugonu, 5x Yredelemnul, 5x, 3x Jiyva, 3x Nemelex Xobeh, 3x Sif Muna, 3x Beogh, 2x Fedhas, 2x Elyvilon, 2x Gozag 00:12:22 Unstable branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.17-a0-588-g17c131f (34) 00:12:42 |amethyst: you didn't account for leap years 00:13:19 actually, rounding to two sig figs you did 00:14:36 Stable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.16.1-16-gc44b35d (34) 00:14:58 !lg . month s=char 00:14:59 143 games for gammafunk (month): 128x HESu, 8x HuFi, 3x MiBe, DEFE, HuCj, HuBe, SpEn 00:15:18 !hs gammafunk month hesu 00:15:19 128. gammafunk the Convoker (L14 HESu of Sif Muna), quit the game on Vaults:5 (vaults_vault) on 2015-04-02 09:20:40, with 74891 points after 12155 turns and 2:22:50. 00:15:26 !hs gammafunk month hesu -64 00:15:27 65/128. gammafunk the Caller (L4 HESu), blasted by TheHza's ghost (spray of energy) on D:3 on 2015-03-28 19:39:22, with 134 points after 1311 turns and 0:08:41. 00:15:52 -!- shummie has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:17:20 <_miek> !lg . month / won 00:17:21 1/17 games for _miek (month): N=1/17 (5.88%) 00:19:14 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.17-a0-589-gf3c920e (34) 00:20:28 -!- Whistling_Beard has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:27:25 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 00:27:59 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 00:31:20 -!- Finerminer has quit [Quit: Page closed] 00:37:42 -!- PleasingFungus has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.91.1 [Firefox 37.0.1/20150402191859]] 00:40:57 -!- tgcid has joined ##crawl-dev 00:44:58 -!- Zargon has quit [Client Quit] 00:46:00 -!- bitcoinbastard has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 00:52:45 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 00:53:44 Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.17-a0-589-gf3c920e 00:54:58 -!- tksquared has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:57:42 -!- pikaro has joined ##crawl-dev 00:59:11 -!- jaxry has quit [Quit: Page closed] 01:03:48 -!- amalloy is now known as amalloy_ 01:04:41 -!- FoxySlunt has quit [Quit: Page closed] 01:06:26 -!- Imosa has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.91.1 [Firefox 34.0/20141127111547]] 01:08:38 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: CADENZA-CLASS CLOCKWORK KNIGHT--OPERATION TERMINATED] 01:09:16 -!- mumbologist has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:18:42 -!- Akitten_Homura has quit [Quit: Connection reset by pier.] 01:18:49 -!- CacoS has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 01:21:59 -!- Whistling_Beard has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:22:06 !lg . month s=ktype 01:22:07 142 games for gammafunk (month): 72x quitting, 32x mon, 25x beam, 8x wizmode, 3x pois, winning, spore 01:22:32 !lg . ktyp=spore 01:22:33 3. perunasaurus the Cudgeler (L5 GrHe of Elyvilon), killed by an exploding giant spore set off by themself on D:3 on 2014-09-02 13:19:26, with 193 points after 2519 turns and 0:07:29. 01:22:44 huh, i didn't know it had its own ktyp 01:22:49 yeah me neither 01:23:07 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 01:23:09 !lm . turns=0 month ktype!=wizmode / lg:urune>0 01:23:09 5/134 milestones for gammafunk (turns=0 month ktype!=wizmode): N=5/134 (3.73%) 01:23:16 -!- Maud has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:26:45 -!- lobf has joined ##crawl-dev 01:33:30 -!- tabstorm has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 01:38:36 -!- simmarine has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:39:19 -!- amalloy_ is now known as amalloy 01:41:54 !kw month 01:41:55 Keyword: month => end>${now()-interval('31d')} 01:51:43 are you sure entropy weavers aren't extra common for some reason 01:54:01 should i really be able to butcher when polymorphed to a wisp 01:54:55 <|amethyst> I think we don't want to go back to the era of butchering restrictions, no 01:55:30 if you are capable of hitting things, you're probably capable of butchering things 01:57:28 <|amethyst> I imagine butchery will be gone sometime in the next few years anyway 01:57:37 <|amethyst> possibly along with eating enemies in general 01:58:52 -!- anubiann00b has quit [Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client] 02:00:06 on that subject I was thinking of submitting a patch to remove the ability to pick up chunks 02:00:56 -!- vale_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:00:58 <|amethyst> IMO there is no reason for chunks to exist then 02:01:02 yeah 02:01:06 <|amethyst> except for disint/IOOD graphics 02:01:17 nethack-style corpse eating would be preferable to chunks that you can't pick up 02:01:55 that's true 02:02:04 <|amethyst> and it would require major changes to ghoul 02:02:07 yeah, that 02:02:29 while we're killing sacred cows, what about making scrolls of acquirement more specific in what you can get? 02:02:32 like weapon -> mace 02:02:42 <|amethyst> how would you specify it? 02:02:46 not really relevant for all categories though 02:02:56 <|amethyst> I don't think typing would be that great 02:02:57 just hardcoded lists for weapon & armour to pick a type/slot 02:03:07 <|amethyst> oh, you mean "M+F" when you say "mace" 02:03:13 ah, yeah 02:03:26 <|amethyst> I thought you were offering an example of something you would never ever acquire, but could 02:03:29 <|amethyst> :P 02:03:55 something else I want to do is make all the crappy weapons less crappy :P 02:04:09 so that one day, people will find artifact clubs in the early game and want to use them 02:04:09 what would be the goal here 02:04:28 more of the weapons that exist would be usable 02:04:34 <|amethyst> I think that's another case where you might as well just remove them 02:04:40 well, that works too 02:04:51 <|amethyst> if everything is going to be the same quality, there's no need for false variety 02:05:16 -!- lobf has quit [Quit: lobf] 02:05:24 <|amethyst> though I guess you could make skill more relevant to the choice somehow 02:06:00 <|amethyst> so that with 0 skill you really would prefer a falchion to a scimitar 02:06:49 that's something i proposed on gdd but nobody liked the idea 02:07:41 <|amethyst> I'm not sure it would be a good idea, but if you want to make crappy weapons less crappy that's how I'd do it 02:07:59 <|amethyst> s/less crappy/less crappy while still existing/ 02:08:07 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 02:08:08 i mean 02:08:13 what weapons exactly are we talking about? 02:08:27 clubs specifically are more a d:1 flavor thing than anything 02:08:44 pretty much everything below the Fi starting level 02:08:52 so what specifically? 02:08:59 spears, clubs, hammers, whips 02:09:07 <|amethyst> ? 02:09:12 <|amethyst> spears are decent weapons 02:09:32 <|amethyst> it's a short sword without stabbing but with reach 02:09:43 don't Fi start with tridents? 02:09:51 <|amethyst> yes 02:09:56 <|amethyst> they also start out with weapon skill 02:10:11 <|amethyst> unlike your average, say, summoner 02:10:27 that's true 02:10:34 ??maces & flails 02:10:35 maces & flails[1/2]: club (+3/5/1.3/0.6), whip (+2/6/1.1/0.5), hammer (+3/7/1.3/0.6), mace (+3/8/1.4/0.7), flail (+0/10/1.4/0.7), demon whip (+1/11/1.1/0.5), sacred scourge (+0/12/1.1/0.5), morningstar (-2/13/1.5/0.7), eveningstar (-1/15/1.5/0.7), dire flail (-3/13/1.3/0.6) [2], great mace (-4/17/1.7/0.7) [2], giant club (-6/20/1.7/0.7) [2], giant spiked club (-7/22/1.8/0.7) [2] 02:10:44 <|amethyst> whip is likewise a short sword 02:10:58 <|amethyst> mace is the bad one really 02:11:02 <|amethyst> compare mace and flail 02:11:17 do hammers actually exist at all outside of crazy yuif? 02:11:23 <|amethyst> (well, club is also bad) 02:11:50 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 02:11:56 <|amethyst> doy: not in random floor loot anyway 02:12:00 ??long blades 02:12:01 long blades[1/1]: (acc,dam,delay,mindelay) [hands]: falchion (+2/8/1.3/0.6), long sword (+1/10/1.4/0.7), scimitar (-2/12/1.4/0.7), demon blade (-1/13/1.3/0.6), eudemon blade (-2/14/1.2/0.6), double sword (-1/15/1.5/0.7), great sword (-3/16/1.6/0.7) [2], triple sword (-4/19/1.9/0.7) [2] All long blades chop hydra heads. 02:12:14 <|amethyst> I'm trying to remember when the last time I saw a non-yiuf artefact hammer 02:12:14 yeah 02:12:18 so i don't think hammers are an issue 02:12:23 yeah I guess m&f is the one with the two oddly terrible choices 02:12:34 hammers and clubs are ~entirely flavor, really 02:12:37 although axe has a lot of 1h junk 02:12:49 <|amethyst> I wouldn't say entirely flavor 02:12:52 well 02:12:58 <|amethyst> club is there to have a weapon to give early goblins 02:13:00 just there to make the early game a bit less monotonous 02:13:03 yeah 02:13:03 <|amethyst> without making them too good 02:13:06 right 02:13:22 <|amethyst> but, yeah, I guess those could all become whips with only a loss to flavour 02:13:31 how can I create a branded weapon in wizmode? 02:13:34 i don't really see why though 02:13:45 <|amethyst> &%whip ego:flaming 02:13:49 it's not like them existing is actively causing a problem 02:13:52 ah, was trying brand: 02:13:58 doy: I think clarity is good 02:14:01 <|amethyst> doy: acquirement was one thing brought up 02:14:12 does acquirement give you clubs? 02:14:22 that's something that could specifically be changed 02:14:24 if it does 02:15:11 no, this is a digression from 'pick the weapon type you want to acquire' 02:15:27 well, i think that's a bad idea to begin with 02:15:41 what's the elec ego name? 02:15:50 <|amethyst> I don't think that's fundamentally flawed or anything, but I don't think it's what we want out of acquirement 02:15:57 ah, electrocution 02:17:18 fun fact: +9 flail of speed == +0 dwhip of electocution, against D targets 02:17:49 <|amethyst> one problem is that the uses of naming a weapon class are pretty limited 02:18:37 <|amethyst> you could in 95% of cases just pick whatever would currently have the highest weight, and that's what the player wants 02:19:05 <|amethyst> exceptions being ranged weapons and characters with no weapon skill 02:19:16 that's true. My thinking about this started with "I hate acquiring the wrong weapon type because I changed skill direction on D:3" 02:19:17 <|amethyst> and maybe sbl -> lbl switches 02:19:47 maybe take the current skills, and double any that are being trained 02:19:58 and then just pick the highest, rather than the current probability system 02:20:02 that sounds worse 02:20:08 <|amethyst> no, that's bad because it encourages you to toggle things on the m screen 02:20:12 people going and fiddling with their skill training menu before reading scrolls 02:20:13 <|amethyst> before acquiring 02:20:23 <|amethyst> or reading unided 02:20:24 <|amethyst> yeah 02:20:42 <|amethyst> just because I turned off training doesn't mean I want items of that type any less 02:20:46 <|amethyst> maybe I hit mindelay 02:20:51 yeah 02:21:13 <|amethyst> I could see maybe increasing the strength of the weight 02:21:24 <|amethyst> e.g. weighting by skill^2 or higher 02:21:35 <|amethyst> (if it doesn't already do that, not looking at the code at this instant) 02:21:51 might write up a patch about this 02:22:07 <|amethyst> still not sure if it's what we want 02:22:23 <|amethyst> but I don't know that it's not :) 02:22:28 Stable (0.16) branch on crawl.beRotato.org updated to: 0.16.1-16-gc44b35d 02:22:32 <|amethyst> the question being "should acquirement be more reliable" 02:23:05 -!- driftwood has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 02:23:35 <|amethyst> FR: when you acquire gold, there's a little non-interactive minigame that determines the amount 02:23:50 non-interactive?! 02:23:59 goblin heist minimovie 02:24:02 <|amethyst> The slot machine spins... 02:24:33 -!- alefury has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:24:34 i think unreliability of acq is important, but unreliability in ways that doesn't annoy the player 02:24:36 <|amethyst> Choko Choko Adder: you receive 3200 gold! 02:24:56 wanting an artifact axe and getting a -9 artifact axe is good, getting a +7 bardiche is bad 02:24:58 -!- Siegurt has joined ##crawl-dev 02:25:12 (or some weapon that's good but not realistically usable) 02:25:27 why? 02:25:28 <|amethyst> ? 02:25:38 <|amethyst> yeah, I'd rather get the +7 bardiche than a -9 hand axe 02:25:41 <|amethyst> I can use the former 02:25:52 <|amethyst> particularly with crosstraining 02:26:09 -!- soundlust_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:26:28 <|amethyst> s/crosstraining/new crosstraining/ 02:26:55 <|amethyst> maybe it won't be my primary weapon, but the axe definitely won't be :) 02:27:27 <|amethyst> that said, getting a -9 spear would suck :) 02:28:24 i mean 02:28:45 why is this the case compared to just finding a random item on the ground? 02:29:33 -!- Whistling_Beard has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:32:03 <|amethyst> because you could have chose to acquire something other than weapons where the expected benefit is higher anyway 02:32:08 <|amethyst> s/chose/chosen/ 02:33:34 <|amethyst> it is a lot easier to feel bad about choosing weapons and getting one you don't want, than just finding one you don't want on the ground 02:33:52 -!- heteroy has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:34:59 Unstable branch on crawl.beRotato.org updated to: 0.17-a0-589-gf3c920e (34) 02:35:21 -!- anubiann00b has quit [Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client] 02:38:33 -!- zxc232 has joined ##crawl-dev 02:43:19 Oddbjorg (L22 FeEn) ASSERT(slot) in 'acquire.cc' at line 102 failed. (Trove) 02:43:22 -!- tksquared has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:49:10 -!- Lightli has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 02:51:08 <|amethyst> hm 02:51:26 <|amethyst> !crashlog oddbjorg 02:51:27 2. Oddbjorg, XL22 FeEn, T:77910 (milestone): http://dobrazupa.org/morgue/Oddbjorg/crash-Oddbjorg-20150415-074312.txt 02:52:39 <|amethyst> hmm 02:52:57 <|amethyst> that means the weights in _acquirement_armour_slot were all zero 02:53:19 <|amethyst> oh 02:53:22 <|amethyst> felid 02:53:29 right. the question is why a felid got an armour trove anyway 02:53:59 <|amethyst> it was trove_simple 02:54:06 <|amethyst> ITEM: acquire weapon / acquire armour / any useful good_item 02:54:19 <|amethyst> one of them chose 'acquire armour' 02:54:30 <|amethyst> I guess felids aren't the only problem though 02:54:43 <|amethyst> hm 02:54:48 aren't they? 02:55:01 <|amethyst> octopode with horns 3 and sac hand 02:59:21 -!- tabstorm has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 02:59:25 <|amethyst> there are several other troves that aren't armour troves (and thus disallowed for fe and op) yet can place an 'acquire armour' 03:00:07 <|amethyst> and two non-trove vaults (pandoras_box_mu and evilmike_iron_armoury) 03:00:22 <|amethyst> !lg * map=pandoras_box_mu 03:00:22 18. haldagan the Grappler (L17 DrFi of Cheibriados), mangled by a reaper (a +0 scythe of venom) on Depths:1 (pandoras_box_mu) on 2014-12-22 11:09:49, with 174912 points after 32417 turns and 1:56:41. 03:00:27 <|amethyst> !lg * map=pandoras_box_mu fe 03:00:27 fe is ambiguous: may be species or class. Use fe-- (Felid) or --fe (Fire Elementalist) to disambiguate 03:00:30 <|amethyst> !lg * map=pandoras_box_mu fe-- 03:00:32 2. xw the Ripper (L14 FeBe of Trog), slain by a vampire mosquito on D:16 (pandoras_box_mu) on 2011-03-26 14:55:08, with 56349 points after 29470 turns and 0:07:50. 03:00:54 <|amethyst> !lg * map=evilmike_iron_armoury fe-- 03:00:56 1. Nexos the Covert (L9 FeWr of Nemelex Xobeh), slain by a slime creature on D:12 (evilmike_iron_armoury) on 2013-06-22 14:37:40, with 4930 points after 27050 turns and 1:14:32. 03:03:51 -!- tensorpudding has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:06:06 -!- vale_ has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 03:06:34 i am of the opinion that no vaults other than troves should be using acquire for floor items at all 03:06:50 it's pretty odd 03:14:17 <|amethyst> arguably troves shouldn't either 03:14:32 <|amethyst> why should the trove, which existed before you came to the dungeon, know what you want? 03:14:38 <|amethyst> s/want/can use/ 03:15:33 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:16:50 well, there's nothing saying that the trove did exist before you came to the dungeon 03:17:05 it's a portal vault, it could just spring into existence at the moment you open it 03:17:34 <|amethyst> oh, that text was removed 03:18:45 <|amethyst> hm 03:19:21 <|amethyst> at least I seem to remember there having been some text somewhere in-game about the origin of the troves, but I'm not seeing it in the old descriptions 03:26:16 -!- Whistling_Beard has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:30:56 -!- Lightli has joined ##crawl-dev 03:31:39 -!- Patashu has joined ##crawl-dev 03:32:37 -!- Vizer has quit [Quit: bye] 03:37:06 -!- Siegurt has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 03:38:15 -!- Patashu has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:38:34 -!- Patashu has joined ##crawl-dev 03:41:16 -!- mumra has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:45:24 -!- rchandra has left ##crawl-dev 03:46:34 -!- BotCarls has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 03:47:46 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 03:48:47 -!- lessens has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:48:48 -!- lessens_ is now known as lessens 03:50:32 -!- Zargon has quit [Quit: Page closed] 03:50:55 -!- wmbt has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 03:51:15 -!- stubblyhead has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 03:51:15 -!- speranza has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 03:51:19 -!- speranza_ is now known as speranza 03:52:07 -!- Patashu has quit [Disconnected by services] 03:52:07 -!- Patashu_ has joined ##crawl-dev 03:53:14 -!- CcS has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:53:15 -!- honeybadger has quit [Quit: Page closed] 03:54:48 -!- mopl has quit [Quit: Page closed] 03:55:25 -!- Patashu has joined ##crawl-dev 03:56:48 -!- pikaro has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 03:57:18 -!- tgcid has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 03:57:24 -!- kober has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.91.1 [Iceweasel 24.7.0/20140723063708]] 03:58:19 -!- Patashu_ has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 04:00:47 -!- raskol has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 04:06:38 -!- vale_ has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 04:09:45 -!- nikheizen has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.91.1 [Firefox 37.0.1/20150402191859]] 04:10:59 -!- tgcid has joined ##crawl-dev 04:11:12 -!- mumra has joined ##crawl-dev 04:11:16 -!- st_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:11:50 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 04:17:13 -!- scummos__ has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 04:34:49 -!- scummos__ has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 04:36:50 -!- tgcid has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:37:41 -!- n1k has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:38:53 -!- edlothiol has joined ##crawl-dev 04:39:54 -!- Earlo has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:41:11 -!- copt has quit [] 04:43:03 -!- Basil has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 04:49:08 -!- Basil has joined ##crawl-dev 04:49:34 -!- Whistling_Bread has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:49:51 -!- filthy has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 04:53:51 -!- ___miek has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 05:01:06 -!- amalloy is now known as amalloy_ 05:02:10 -!- CacoS has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 05:04:02 -!- RFJesus1egend4r1 has joined ##crawl-dev 05:04:03 -!- Whistling_Bread has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:04:09 hello? 05:07:15 idk how this irc stuff works but id like to mention that "artificial beings" doesn't seem clearly defined, yredelemnul wont accept gargoyles for that reason presumably, but shining eye's malmutate says it doesn't work on 'artificial beings', but it does affect gargoyles. 05:07:47 soo what exactly is artificial when it comes to species, or maybe malmutate just needs a description change 05:08:46 it's pretty arbitrary 05:08:57 it shouldn't be :u 05:09:03 i'd report a bug about that case you found, at least one text should be updated 05:09:20 Where do i do that? 05:11:22 -!- Sorbius has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 05:12:21 -!- sylnt has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:14:02 ??mantis 05:14:03 mantis[1/2]: To report bugs or submit new content like vaults, patches or tiles, go to: http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/main_page.php 05:14:29 -!- Patashu_ has joined ##crawl-dev 05:14:29 -!- Patashu has quit [Disconnected by services] 05:17:49 -!- Patashu has joined ##crawl-dev 05:21:26 -!- Patashu_ has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 05:26:31 -!- halberd has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 05:28:19 -!- Basil has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 05:33:30 -!- CacoS has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 05:36:02 -!- PsyMar has quit [Quit: witty quit message goes here] 05:40:57 @??frost giant 05:40:57 frost giant (12C) | Spd: 10 | HD: 16 | HP: 87-122 | AC/EV: 9/3 | Dam: 35 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, fighter, spellcaster, see invisible | Res: 06magic(80), 02cold++, 12drown | XP: 1750 | Sp: b.cold (3d25) | Sz: Giant | Int: normal. 05:40:57 -!- RFJesus1egend4r1 has quit [Quit: Page closed] 05:47:19 -!- Bcadren has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 05:50:19 -!- mopl has quit [Client Quit] 05:58:00 -!- ololoev has quit [Quit: Page closed] 05:58:48 -!- sylnt has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:00:48 -!- myp has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 06:02:03 -!- rophy has quit [Quit: Miranda NG! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-ng.org/] 06:15:14 -!- jefkin has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 06:17:30 -!- fazisi has quit [Quit: Leaving] 06:19:22 -!- Crehl has quit [Quit: Killed by a kitten] 06:19:25 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 06:20:58 FR: megalabyrinths via http://gigapan.com/gigapans/171239 06:21:36 -!- ololoev has quit [Quit: Page closed] 06:22:19 -!- heteroy_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:24:54 no good, the 100 million turn limit would actually matter there 06:27:00 hahaha, good point 06:27:32 -!- AltReality has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 06:37:45 -!- Lasty has left ##crawl-dev 06:38:49 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:38:50 -!- someone__ has quit [Client Quit] 06:41:36 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 06:44:36 -!- iafm has quit [Quit: leaving] 06:47:20 -!- tabstorm has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 06:48:58 -!- Lightli has quit [Quit: Page closed] 06:49:11 -!- Lightli has joined ##crawl-dev 06:55:57 -!- Jonatan has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 07:00:02 -!- ByronJohnson has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 07:03:42 -!- pikaro has joined ##crawl-dev 07:04:07 -!- shoeman has quit [Quit: Page closed] 07:04:29 -!- Z_LAMP has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:15:48 -!- tabstorm has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 07:20:34 -!- doubtofbuddha has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 07:22:36 -!- siepu has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:31:31 -!- iafm has quit [Quit: leaving] 07:32:20 -!- tabstorm has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 07:33:10 -!- Kolbur has joined ##crawl-dev 07:35:14 -!- Patashu has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 07:35:52 -!- rast has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:44:37 -!- panicbit has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 07:53:03 -!- Zargon has quit [Quit: Page closed] 07:56:33 -!- Lasty_ has joined ##crawl-dev 07:57:41 -!- Brannock_ has joined ##crawl-dev 08:14:48 -!- debo has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:17:13 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 08:22:38 -!- vale_ has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 08:27:33 -!- wheals has joined ##crawl-dev 08:35:26 deleting #9587, it seems to be by spambots 08:35:26 wheals: You have 2 messages. Use !messages to read them. 08:36:21 !messages 08:36:21 (1/2) MarvinPA said (3h 59s ago): oops, i explicitly remembered to check for that (since i broke it in the past in that way too!) and everything looked fine 08:36:23 !messages 08:36:23 (1/1) MarvinPA said (3h 7s ago): except then later i realised i had to go back and multiply it by BASELINE_DELAY so i broke it again after all, will look into fixing it this evening if nobody else gets there first 08:37:22 -!- onget has quit [Quit: Page closed] 08:37:39 seems like just making it a DUR_ as was mentioned in the commit would be simplest 08:37:47 but i'm not quite sure how to do everything 08:38:26 !tell marvinpa i think making them a DUR_ as your commit mentioned looks like the best fix overall, but i'll leave it to you 08:38:26 wheals: OK, I'll let marvinpa know. 08:40:10 http://i.imgur.com/boEDsJ0.png alright, basing new Tiamat tile on the draconians, does this look like ok outfit? 08:40:24 I felt also like giving her different expression to differentiate her more. 08:40:58 ( obviously not final ) 08:44:48 -!- debo has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 08:46:39 -!- Brannock_ has quit [Quit: Leaving] 08:50:22 -!- filthy has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 08:51:25 -!- pikaro has left ##crawl-dev 08:53:33 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 08:55:27 -!- magicpoints has quit [] 08:58:35 the flat colours look... off 08:58:42 but don't listen to me, listen to ontoclasm 09:00:58 As said, it was just sketching some armour over her. 09:01:40 The progress atm: http://i.imgur.com/AXxVbne.png 09:01:49 aha, cool 09:02:28 totally misunderstood 09:02:55 needs more draconian boobies 09:02:57 !tell |amethyst does anyone on cszo use skill_focus = toggle? 09:02:57 wheals: OK, I'll let |amethyst know. 09:06:29 -!- Evablue has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 09:06:40 -!- Brannock_ has joined ##crawl-dev 09:07:06 -!- LexAckson has joined ##crawl-dev 09:07:31 floatRand: remember that bright things are going to look like they're farther forward than dark things 09:07:49 so her right arm, which should be behind her, looks like it's swung out in front of her body somehow 09:08:03 or sticking out of the middle of her chest i guess? 09:08:12 Yeah, still gotta fix that then. In mean time, rainbow cloak or the less rainbowy cloak? http://i.imgur.com/W7Cu76A.png 09:08:22 -!- SomeStupidGuy has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 09:09:15 i'd have to see it against a dark background but i'm guessing the top will look better 09:13:06 -!- SurpriseTRex has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:13:24 -!- Menche has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:13:56 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:17:24 -!- mumbologist has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 09:18:02 http://i.imgur.com/v8yBhie.png 09:18:38 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 09:18:43 http://i.imgur.com/Nk9NLKy.png 09:19:31 -!- koolguydude has quit [Quit: Page closed] 09:20:34 -!- radinms has quit [] 09:20:49 03ChrisOelmueller02 {|amethyst} 07* 0.16-a0-4079-gb44d370: Remove dead commented code 10(9 weeks ago, 1 file, 0+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/b44d37026556 09:20:49 03ChrisOelmueller02 {|amethyst} 07* 0.16-a0-4080-gfd5ab8d: Tweak skill menu help section text slightly 10(8 weeks ago, 1 file, 22+ 26-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/fd5ab8dc51b3 09:20:49 03ChrisOelmueller02 {|amethyst} 07* 0.16-a0-4081-g01c0d03: Redesign skill menu text (mostly legend, plus minor tweaks) 10(8 weeks ago, 3 files, 87+ 62-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/01c0d03ed83e 09:20:49 03|amethyst02 07* 0.16-a0-4082-g4c7a7ce: Better detect crosstraining in skill help. 10(8 weeks ago, 1 file, 19+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/4c7a7ceed17f 09:20:49 03|amethyst02 07* 0.16-a0-4083-g8c86c84: Show m help for both enhancement and dehancement. 10(8 weeks ago, 1 file, 17+ 7-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/8c86c8474ff2 09:20:49 03|amethyst02 07* 0.16-a0-4084-g8aca3ed: Document a code dependency. 10(8 weeks ago, 1 file, 3+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/8aca3edbfb24 09:20:49 03|amethyst02 07* 0.16-a0-4085-g50cc3cd: Make sure the new skill menu help fits in tiles. 10(8 weeks ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/50cc3cd3efc4 09:20:49 03wheals02 07* 0.17-a0-597-g7863fb5: Merge branch 'skillmenu' 10(2 minutes ago, 0 files, 0+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/7863fb55327f 09:20:49 03wheals02 07* 0.17-a0-598-g707f55f: Be more paranoid about attributing boosts to Ash. 10(7 days ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/707f55f98691 09:20:49 03wheals02 07* 0.17-a0-599-g5197bcd: Remove an unused enum value. 10(7 days ago, 2 files, 0+ 3-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/5197bcdea56b 09:22:12 -!- Tux[Qyou] has joined ##crawl-dev 09:22:44 -!- test2 has quit [Quit: Page closed] 09:32:56 -!- iafm has quit [Quit: leaving] 09:34:26 Alright, set done. 09:35:34 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 09:37:14 -!- Rewans has quit [Quit: Page closed] 09:41:17 -!- NotKintak has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 09:42:38 http://imgur.com/a/cbmk8#8 09:44:09 ??tiamat 09:44:09 tiamat[1/1]: A unique draconian, found in Zot. Tread carefully. Always has the {dragonskin cloak}, which you should note will grant her various resistances. Enjoys randomly changing her colour (and her breath weapon to match). Comes with a band of draconian pals, and can be tricky to spot among them. 09:46:22 -!- rast has joined ##crawl-dev 09:47:40 !learn set zap_id see {wand[3]} 09:47:41 zap id[1/1]: see {wand[3]} 09:47:55 http://i.imgur.com/XiiGR0b.png 09:48:06 !learn set wand[3] Wands always id on pickup, or when monsters zap them. Charges identify on zap with a Evocations skill/27 chance. 09:48:06 wand[2/2]: Wands always id on pickup, or when monsters zap them. Charges identify on zap with a Evocations skill/27 chance. 09:48:18 !learn set zap_id[3] see {wands[3]} 09:48:19 zap id[2/2]: see {wands[3]} 09:48:25 !learn del wands[3] 09:48:25 Deleted wands[3/3]: see {zap id} 09:48:34 !learn del mv wand[2] wands[3] 09:48:34 That's easy, mv_wand doesn't even exist! 09:48:37 !learn mv wand[2] wands[3] 09:48:38 wand[2] -> wands[3/3]: Wands always id on pickup, or when monsters zap them. Charges identify on zap with a Evocations skill/27 chance. 09:52:04 -!- ssteam has quit [Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- s0 d4Mn l33t |t'z 5c4rY!] 09:54:16 -!- Kintak has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:57:42 -!- NotKintak has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 09:58:18 03wheals02 07* 0.17-a0-600-g8185899: Prevent wasting enslave soul in some circumstances (#2479). 10(28 minutes ago, 2 files, 7+ 6-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/818589925885 09:58:18 03wheals02 07* 0.17-a0-601-g949c2d4: Fix enslavement wand not showing success chance (#9624). 10(18 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 0-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/949c2d44487f 09:58:18 03wheals02 07* 0.17-a0-602-gb88e696: Fix /HW targetting for Ely worshippers. 10(15 minutes ago, 1 file, 0+ 6-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/b88e6965fb65 09:58:18 03wheals02 07* 0.17-a0-603-g95395bb: Remove a memory leak. 10(13 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/95395bbb31df 09:58:18 03wheals02 07* 0.17-a0-604-g28ea44c: Deduplicate wand-spell mapping. 10(65 seconds ago, 1 file, 8+ 30-) 13https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/28ea44c234ff 10:00:26 -!- muravey has joined ##crawl-dev 10:01:10 that enslave soul commit has a pretty nice hash 10:01:26 no alphas for 15 spaces or something 10:01:28 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:01:36 -!- wheals has quit [Quit: Page closed] 10:01:41 -!- Kintak has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 10:05:14 -!- CacoS has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 10:08:13 -!- SurpriseTRex has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:14:40 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 10:15:35 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 10:15:51 -!- CcS has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 10:18:43 -!- SomeStupidGuy has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 10:18:45 -!- mauris has joined ##crawl-dev 10:19:43 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 10:24:23 -!- Reawakening has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:29:33 -!- Evablue has quit [Quit: Evablue] 10:30:16 -!- appleKen has quit [] 10:34:08 -!- Menche has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 10:37:10 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:38:34 -!- vale_ has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 10:43:57 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 10:49:32 -!- siepu has quit [Quit: Leaving] 10:52:10 -!- Sharkman1231 has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 10:59:39 -!- ly^ has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:01:28 -!- ZChris13 has joined ##crawl-dev 11:03:45 -!- wheals has joined ##crawl-dev 11:03:58 -!- ZChris13 has quit [Client Quit] 11:04:07 -!- Monkaria has quit [Quit: Page closed] 11:04:15 -!- Basil has joined ##crawl-dev 11:04:48 -!- ZChris13 has joined ##crawl-dev 11:08:48 -!- Hanyuu has quit [Quit: Page closed] 11:12:14 -!- pikaro has joined ##crawl-dev 11:13:46 is there a way to get items in view range in clua? I can only find items_at in a dlua lib... would like to iterate through them and check if there are corpses for auto-animate dead 11:14:56 get_items_at maybe? 11:15:26 Regarding buffing Yred's usage in extended, maybe give high-piety followers chance to block Hell's effect ( or is that too Zin-nish? ), rRot or some powerful capstone ( more powerful servants gifted while in Hell/Pandemonium/Tomb ) 11:17:19 wheals, sorry, I missed that one thrice apparently... thanks! 11:17:40 no problem; we should really document all these functions some time :) 11:18:12 -!- Evablue has quit [Quit: Evablue] 11:18:57 -!- Alarkh has joined ##crawl-dev 11:19:16 -!- elliptic has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:28:53 -!- SurpriseTRex_ has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:30:38 -!- ZChris13 has quit [Disconnected by services] 11:31:04 -!- ZChris13 has joined ##crawl-dev 11:34:04 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:34:12 floatRand: imo there are problems with extended that are causing those problems 11:34:16 as opposed to problems with yred 11:34:39 different gods/races/skills/whatever are good in different situations, so if a part of the game mostly puts you in the same situation over and over again, it's going to cause an issue 11:34:51 Well, yeah. 11:35:18 so I think it should be approached from that angle 11:35:26 <|amethyst> Is Yred being not very useful in extended worse than TSO being not very useful in Lair? 11:35:26 |amethyst: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 11:35:31 <|amethyst> I guess extended is bigger than lair 11:35:32 although certainly there shouldn't be gods that are /useless/ in certain branches, at least in my view 11:35:36 -!- amalloy_ has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 11:35:44 extended is like half the runes in the game, and also the most difficult part of the game 11:35:52 more than half actually 11:35:59 -!- Foamed has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:36:01 Pan/Hell are so demon-orientated. 11:36:19 <|amethyst> is it the most difficult? 11:36:19 less than they used to be, at least, with monster demonspawn being added 11:36:34 <|amethyst> I'd think D:2 or so would be the most difficult 11:36:37 okay, maybe d:1 is more difficult depending on how you want to analyze that 11:36:45 why not increase the needed runes to enter zot? 11:36:52 it's the part of the game with the strongest monsters with the strongest abilities 11:36:56 why increase the needed runes to enter zot? 11:37:09 I am still 110% in favor of diversifying the hell out of extended; it would resolve a lot of issues 11:37:13 ... that was not meant to be a pun 11:37:32 it's almost entirely composed of demons and undead, which share a lot of strengths and weaknesses 11:37:44 dunno, to make winning less easy? 11:37:56 That's not problem. 11:37:58 yet hell and pan alone account for 9 runes, and tomb is another, out of 15 total 11:38:02 -!- amalloy_ has joined ##crawl-dev 11:38:04 -!- amalloy_ is now known as amalloy 11:38:29 i think they are overrepresented in runes compared to even the turns you spend there 11:38:36 that is also true 11:38:37 <|amethyst> !lg * s=name / won 11:38:39 Well, yeah. IMO, demonic rune could be tossed and thrown into some living branch. But then there would be less reason to do the !fun! vaults. 11:38:46 <|amethyst> err, that's not what I wanted 11:38:46 28902/4214007 games for *: 464/6247x 78291 [7.43%], 364/1518x bmfx [23.98%], 271/538x elliptic [50.37%], 230/3996x jeanjacques [5.76%], 219/2996x johnnyzero [7.31%], 205/1213x hyperbolic [16.90%], 203/2592x HilariousDeathArtist [7.83%], 196/453x Basil [43.27%], 185/1503x MrPlanck [12.31%], 184/4266x nago [4.31%], 179/3245x clouded [5.52%], 176/435x mikee [40.46%], 173/1426x Tolias [12.13%], 161/23... 11:38:48 imo pan and hell are pretty redundant in terms of the kinds of things you encounter 11:38:55 <|amethyst> !lg * cdist=name 11:38:56 Unknown field: cdist 11:38:57 it's good that they're different in terms of branch structure, plus there are hell effects, but still 11:39:02 <|amethyst> !lg * x=cdist(name) 11:39:07 <|amethyst> !lg * won x=cdist(name) 11:39:10 do we really need cerebov *and* gehenna 11:39:12 -!- vale_ has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:39:33 4214007 games for *: cdist(name)=48201 11:39:34 28902 games for * (won): cdist(name)=3997 11:39:36 -!- Athaboros has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:39:40 I personally wouldn't point to cerebov and gehenna as the problematic overlap 11:40:17 eh, they're both demonic fire rune places with demonic firey monsters 11:40:21 <|amethyst> if only 8% of players can win, I don't think "mak[ing] winning less easy" is really necessary 11:40:28 merge pan and hells, now asmodeus and cerebov guard the rune together 11:40:30 Well, axe specific pandemonium floors, make named pandemonium runes alternate hell lords instead? 11:40:56 And Pandemonium could be rethinked in structure. 11:40:58 demonic fire rune place doesn't mean anything in of itself. firey monsters does in that you expect hellfire and fire attacks 11:41:11 but asmo and cere don't feel like the same fight 11:41:18 Maybe instead of placing the hell entrance in dungeon, place them in Pandemonium, guarded by Pandemonium Lord? 11:41:28 gammafunk: they're both fire-themed and demonic places where you fight fire-themed demons; this is more redundant than most things in crawl 11:41:31 Get some sort of more sensible cosmological structure. 11:41:38 That was a silly sentence 11:41:50 But it feels bit weird how there is portals to hell and pandemonium in depths 11:42:00 G-Flex: so? is fighting asmo the same as fighting cerebov? that's the only question that matters 11:42:08 gammafunk: no, it's not the only question that matters 11:42:26 the monster set matters 11:42:27 yes, it is when we're complaining about whether things feel "sameish" 11:42:29 in general 11:42:44 the two places are more similar than they need to be 11:42:49 -!- Pluie has joined ##crawl-dev 11:43:02 the game would be better without two 4-5 rune demonic branches in it 11:43:09 -!- bones__ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:43:17 it helps if you discuss one thing at a time 11:43:35 -!- bones__ has joined ##crawl-dev 11:43:42 <|amethyst> I'm all for removing extended... I'll never see it anyway 11:43:46 haha 11:43:53 demonic orb spider 11:44:00 for neil's motivation 11:44:05 crawl development seems very invested in removing redundancy, so I don't get why extended is all about the same general class of... things 11:44:05 -!- mumra_ has joined ##crawl-dev 11:44:19 <|amethyst> we tried diversifying pan 11:44:28 <|amethyst> I've heard nothing but complaints about demonspawn monsters 11:44:30 hell and pan could be consolidated in some way, or one removed, or one drastically reflavored to be not demon themed 11:44:44 heh, drastically reflavored 11:44:50 like the new coke! 11:45:04 sounds pretty easy and likely! 11:45:04 gammafunk: I mean, some of the basic mechanics could be maintained even if other stuff is changed 11:45:21 other stuff...? 11:45:28 like the branch structure in general 11:45:43 neither hell nor pan is structured like a normal branch 11:45:48 <|amethyst> so what do you replace it with? a branch full of natural monsters? 11:45:49 -!- Pluie has quit [Client Quit] 11:45:53 <|amethyst> we already have plenty of those 11:45:57 I think "good new monster ideas" is the hard part to get right 11:45:57 I'd make Pandemonium more evil sorcerer/demonologist/demon/cursed things containing entrances to Hell, while hell contains four runes ( with guardians decided with coinflip between the similar themes, Ereshkigal or Gloorx, Cerebov or Asmodeus ) 11:46:05 |amethyst: not sure 11:46:17 gammafunk: oh yeah I'm not saying any of this would actually be easy 11:46:25 <|amethyst> we also already have an "evil sorcerer/demonologist" branch in Elf 11:46:32 we use different branch structure and and different mixes of the same monsters to the best degree we can 11:46:43 and it makes sense to do that if we want to have hell and pan 11:47:24 Hi there, is this the right place if I have some questions about macro-ing ? 11:47:31 I always imagined Pandemonium being sort of thing surrounding hell/pit, with the hell lords being nobles compared to powerful figures like pandemonium lords etc. http://i.imgur.com/r0MGUP2.png 11:47:36 -!- mumra has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:47:56 gammafunk: yeah, I think hell and pan are pretty decent given the content currently available, without making extremely drastic changes 11:48:21 I didn't mind demonspawn monsters when I fought them, but I don't know what complaints people have about them so I'm cautious in saying that 11:48:41 <|amethyst> I think "too easy" was the biggest one 11:48:43 holy pan was an interesting addition 11:48:43 Pan and Hell work, but they could be reworked to be bit more different. Demonspawn were great addition since they feel like sort of rabble and bastards that just have no other place to go to. 11:48:45 <|amethyst> which could be fixed 11:49:05 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 11:49:12 |amethyst: there also might be the same sort of annoyance factor that draconians might have, where you have lots of sub-types and classes for them 11:49:13 <|amethyst> also "too many different kinds" 11:49:16 <|amethyst> yeah 11:49:45 where is abyss in that pick? 11:49:56 abyss is weird, but I liked when new abyss monsters were added 11:50:02 so it wasn't just "random stuff and also demons" anymore 11:50:25 made it a bit more interesting in its own right 11:50:26 <|amethyst> but mechanically they're not all that different from demons 11:50:33 *pic 11:50:35 Abyss is basically Cthulhuland. 11:50:54 |amethyst: well, in the same way that holy monsters aren't 11:51:04 non-natural monsters tend to share a bunch of characteristics 11:51:17 no corpses, rPois, rN, whatever it is that I'm completely forgetting 11:51:39 <|amethyst> but 11:51:56 Alarkh: maybe 11:52:04 <|amethyst> would renaming the demons in, say, Pan to another holiness with the same properties actually make a difference? 11:52:05 -!- UncertainKitten has joined ##crawl-dev 11:52:31 <|amethyst> I guess "not susceptible to Holy" is a reasonable difference 11:52:44 i think the more important change was that they don't exist elsewhere 11:52:47 im trying to make autoexplore do what i always do : going down when im done exploring for instance 11:53:09 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 11:53:11 but i have a hard time finding documentation about macros 11:53:17 the problem of "and also demons" has more to do with the demons themselves being in pan/hell than the holiness being there 11:54:21 |amethyst: what do you think of the concept of adding more natural monsters to extended, but also making them stronger than existing ones? although I guess demonspawn are intended to kind of do that 11:55:08 theoretically, I think a pan-like branch where the different levels have vastly different flavors/monster sets (kind of like ziggurats) might be okay, especially since it would force the player to prepare for a wide variety of possible circumstances 11:57:14 zigly rune of zot 11:58:36 <|amethyst> G-Flex: I'm not the person to evaluate extended, seeing as how I've never played it 11:58:58 ??neilrobin 11:58:58 neilrobin[1/1]: Play for as long as you want, then kite as many enemies at once and die surrounded by them. Password 'robin'. See {neil} for an example game 11:59:12 ??neil 11:59:13 neil[1/3]: !lg neil 3512 -tv 11:59:17 <|amethyst> tv doesn't work 11:59:24 was on cdo? 11:59:25 <|amethyst> because it's an old CDO ttyrec 11:59:26 <|amethyst> yeah 12:01:11 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 12:02:40 Stable (0.16) branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.16.1-16-gc44b35d 12:02:59 fr: koolaid main, with MONEAT_WALLS 12:03:09 _The Koolaid Man bursts through the wall, destroying it! 12:03:34 -!- Lightli has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 12:05:28 Also, on unrelated note, maybe allow Ashenzari-followers to use enchant item-scrolls to uncurse items like non-followers. Have prompt like "Wish to preserve the curse Y/N?" 12:06:01 floatrand: I'm digging the idea of the vestibule being adjacent to the infinite shifting planes of pandemonium 12:06:12 -!- doubtofbuddha has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 12:10:37 -!- quik has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 12:15:33 -!- sanka has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 12:15:34 -!- simmarine has joined ##crawl-dev 12:18:18 wheals: so like a boring beetle, except better 12:18:36 yeah 12:18:37 wheals: and gets the bleed effect from blunt damage 12:18:45 highly susceptible to LRD 12:20:25 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 12:23:08 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 12:24:55 -!- tokeen has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 12:25:05 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 12:25:35 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.17-a0-604-g28ea44c (34) 12:27:19 -!- Kramell has quit [Excess Flood] 12:28:22 -!- Twiggytwiggytwig has quit [Quit: See ya guys later ;)] 12:30:23 -!- n1k has joined ##crawl-dev 12:32:13 -!- Blazinghand|Work has joined ##crawl-dev 12:36:51 http://i.imgur.com/WTfxH0F.png 12:42:38 -!- nikheizen has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.91.1 [Firefox 37.0.1/20150402191859]] 12:43:53 -!- aarujn has joined ##crawl-dev 12:45:27 @??spatial vortex 12:45:27 spatial vortex (13v) | Spd: 15 | HD: 6 | HP: 40-67 | AC/EV: 0/5 | Dam: 3012(distort) | 11non-living, lev | Res: 13magic(immune), 05fire, 02cold, 10elec, 03poison, 12drown, 04rot+++, 13neg+++, 13torm, 04napalm | XP: 165 | Sz: Large | Int: plant. 12:48:22 -!- Finerminer has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 12:48:41 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 12:50:13 -!- doubtofbuddha has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 12:52:20 -!- Alarkh has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:54:26 -!- alefury has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:57:53 -!- mumra_ has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:58:00 Yredelemnul's / Death's Hand, herder/protector of undead? Casts Might Other, Abjuration, Dispel Undead, Blink Others Encircling projects aura that slowly heals undead creatures and has melee attack that reduces rN? Could be gifted by Yred on very high piety ( and only on certain branches ) http://i.imgur.com/fgsQ5u4.png 12:58:13 Otherwise they could appear in Crypt 3 or sometimes in Abyss. 12:58:18