00:02:43 ??randgod 00:02:43 I don't have a page labeled randgod in my learndb. 00:04:30 -!- clouded_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:05:10 -!- clouded_ has joined ##crawl-dev 00:08:29 03|amethyst02 07* 0.16-a0-3619-g3006438: Hush a signedness warning. 10(39 seconds ago, 1 file, 2+ 2-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=3006438c3b1a 00:10:12 Unstable branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.16-a0-3618-g5850f5e (34) 00:16:54 <|amethyst> thoughts on passing -Werror in .travis/build.pl ? 00:18:00 * PleasingFungus shrugs. 00:19:04 oh 00:19:10 this is what grunt changed 00:19:19 well, everyone loves conflicts 00:20:27 -!- WalkerBoh has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:23:34 -!- markgo has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:23:45 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.16-a0-3620-g0e2f81e: Rewrite disc_of_storms() 10(3 minutes ago, 3 files, 77+ 45-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=0e2f81e93c6b 00:25:54 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 00:30:03 hm 00:30:20 |amethyst: do you think pushing a nontrivial merge commit to evoker-god will make rebasing tougher later 00:30:52 <|amethyst> unless the person who rebases is the same person and uses rerere when they merge 00:31:07 <|amethyst> the conflicts will have to be re-resolved 00:31:10 hm 00:31:15 then I will abstain 00:31:34 pity I just finished merging it :( 00:31:39 pain in the rear, too 00:32:03 Snorg (09T) | Spd: 15 | HD: 8 | HP: 144 | AC/EV: 0/10 | Dam: 30, 2209(claw), 2209(claw) | 10doors, regen | Res: 06magic(60) | XP: 1134 | Sp: berserker rage [11!AM, 06!sil] | Sz: Large | Int: normal. 00:32:03 %??snorg perm_ench:berserk 00:34:26 PleasingFungus: I didn't know what I was talking about earlier. console has wizmode too. 00:34:56 also, shoals-lite is interesting 00:35:36 &~A, &G, &{, ................................................. 00:35:55 it's pretty 00:36:16 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.16-a0-3621-g410066b: Don't generate rPois++/rElec++ 10(2 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=410066b465a0 00:36:22 my hypothesis is that there will be fewer deaths 00:36:56 since if you get stuck in the water fighting, you have at least a chance for the water to dry out under you during the battle 00:37:08 water can also creep under you......... 00:37:11 or maybe more deaths, since you will have more of a chance to 00:37:13 yea that 00:37:24 imo we'll see how it goes 00:38:16 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.16-a0-3622-g5b6d153: Oops (again) 10(19 seconds ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=5b6d153ccf6c 00:38:50 weird. on numpad isn't working on console 00:39:00 but it works on webtiles. known? 00:39:10 I don't know it 00:39:21 but I don't know anything about console 00:39:36 <|amethyst> hm, I changed that recently 00:39:51 this is on shoals-lite 00:39:57 not sure how recently it got merged 00:39:59 <|amethyst> oh, that was only local tiles 00:40:18 <|amethyst> %git 0332368 00:40:19 07|amethyst02 * 0.16-a0-3300-g0332368: Treat keypad . as delete in SDL. 10(3 weeks ago, 1 file, 1+ 0-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=0332368382d8 00:40:19 like, today 00:42:00 Webtiles server restarted. 00:42:30 !tell lasty I am quickly getting the impression that NewRandarts are bonkers 00:42:30 PleasingFungus: OK, I'll let lasty know. 00:42:38 -!- Zanziabar has quit [Quit: Page closed] 00:43:24 and nice, I got admin-wizmode working on all experimentals. productive evening 00:46:10 -!- KurzedMetal has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:51:05 PleasingFungus: they do seem a bit strong, don't they? 00:51:21 ya 00:51:30 my inclination is to increase the number of negative properties 00:51:47 but I don't want to do anything hasty 00:53:27 also I keep getting artefacts with names like "LASTY BASED GOD", "Lasty but not leasty", "Alasty, Poor Monsters!", "Bad props finish Lasty" 00:53:34 which is very suspicious in my view 00:53:39 :P 00:55:08 oh "do anything hasty" reminds me how I could have used hasty <-> lasty, dangit 00:55:35 <|amethyst> !send gammafunk staircase ghosts 00:55:35 Sending staircase ghosts to gammafunk. 00:55:51 ??staircase_ghost 00:55:51 I don't have a page labeled staircase_ghost in my learndb. 00:56:02 <|amethyst> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L%27esprit_de_l%27escalier 00:56:19 oh, haha 00:57:44 !learn add shoals-lite http://crawl.berotato.org/crawl/dev/shoals-lite.gif 00:57:45 shoals-lite[2/2]: http://crawl.berotato.org/crawl/dev/shoals-lite.gif 00:58:05 welp; I decided to try and simulate pretty POOR luck by going into Shoals as a NaVm using only loot from a labyrinth 00:58:13 Needless to say, my NaVM now has PDA 00:59:32 i was considering trying to do something shoals-lite-ish for pan, except with walls instead of shallow water 00:59:35 it's hypnotizing 00:59:44 it's cool but kinda lurchy for me :( 00:59:49 watching it there 00:59:54 I suck at making gifs :C 00:59:55 hrm, that looks like there's a lot more dry land to my eye 00:59:59 but the height map code is kinda terrifying to me 01:00:05 maybe I'm just underestimating how much there usually is 01:00:14 but I'm going by the minimap 01:00:19 -!- AnnoyedKitten has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:00:20 minimap doesn't update out of LOS 01:00:22 breathing walls would (maybe) be cool though 01:00:35 I remember there was some chat about breathing walls 01:00:39 well I know, but I'm saying in this branch, is there just more of that at any time 01:00:41 -!- AnnoyedKitten has joined ##crawl-dev 01:00:43 I think I understand the heightmap code a little better than I used to 01:00:51 gammafun1: shouldn't be more than there used to be 01:00:55 would it just push you if the walls closed in on you? 01:00:58 just less deep water 01:01:01 johnstein: yeah 01:01:06 !send doy enclosed pockets 01:01:06 Sending enclosed pockets to doy. 01:01:11 that minimap must represent low tide, I guess 01:01:14 (clearly it just can't grow shut completely on you) 01:01:20 gammafun1: that's my guess 01:01:26 PleasingFungus: well, that's why it would need to be reasonably fast-moving 01:01:28 gammafun1: imo go look for yourself 01:01:29 like shoals-lite 01:01:30 <_< 01:01:36 oh I can't 01:01:39 that's not a coolserver 01:01:41 sorry 01:01:45 actually 01:01:47 it's the coolest server 01:01:49 factually speaking 01:01:49 coolplayers play on coolservers 01:02:06 doy: old shoals couldn't spawn deep water beneath you (unless you were flying or a mf or op, you know) 01:02:13 gammafun1: are you saying grunt isn't cool???? 01:02:21 ...that's pretty obviously true 01:02:23 doy: same reasoning for walls and the player in shoalspan 01:02:48 !lg coolplayers s=name 01:02:48 44917 games for coolplayers: 8803x Elynae, 8316x BirdoPrey, 5942x NyaaKitty, 3846x Poncheis, 3284x minmay, 2680x casmith789, 2535x gammafunk, 1773x valrus, 1606x xomscumming, 1385x SGrunt, 1213x hyperbolic, 1096x demonblade, 590x n1000, 526x theglow, 491x elliptic, 435x mikee, 191x tartakower, 151x hyperelliptic, 54x Chris 01:03:27 that really should have a filter for "coolgames" I guess 01:03:38 oh but we can't really do that 01:04:32 !kw hugeterm 01:04:33 No keyword 'hugeterm' 01:04:39 !nick hugeterm 01:04:40 Mapping hugeterm => lexackson instar sebi jerek kyrris pfcuttle akhripin grinner tossi heteroy prospero14 izverg merle shyguy miron deathrats sanka hxy kraphead liuckan sugah midpoint palyth demongrey johan farkougg duncan russell klarki neil kaput q335r49 shaijin pigah grrr azru saegor quux dylex shiren filthyape chukamok q leibowitz slitherfritz igxfl serfuzz frobop ghallberg playings sh sgiratc... 01:04:43 right... 01:05:14 ??coolserver 01:05:14 I don't have a page labeled coolserver in my learndb. 01:09:15 -!- travis-ci has joined ##crawl-dev 01:09:15 The build has errored. (master - 3006438 #1522 : Neil Moore): http://travis-ci.org/crawl-ref/crawl-ref/builds/46819184 01:09:15 -!- travis-ci has left ##crawl-dev 01:10:01 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: CADENZA-CLASS CLOCKWORK KNIGHT--OPERATION TERMINATED] 01:10:12 |amethyst! You wouldn't have to give up constness!!! 01:11:24 just init a const armour list with a vector generated by a static method at startup time 01:20:17 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 01:20:17 -!- omnirizon has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:22:27 -!- AnnoyedKitten has quit [Quit: Connection reset by pier.] 01:23:35 just to check 01:23:48 are there still supposed to be multiple islands separated by deep water 01:27:09 -!- bonghitz has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 01:28:39 yes, as long as you can get to all of them using stairs 01:28:51 spectating 01:28:59 show me the islands plz 01:29:05 o I see 01:29:15 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.16-a0-3623-gda98d6b: Track banishers in milestones 10(3 minutes ago, 7 files, 27+ 3-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=da98d6b559ad 01:29:18 ya this is fine. silly but fine 01:29:35 someone who knows about milestones should probably double-check to see if that's reasonable 01:32:44 -!- Krakhan has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:32:58 -!- PleasingFungus has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.91.1 [Firefox 34.0.5/20141126041045]] 01:33:07 uh, didn't we already have that information 01:33:28 !lm * abyss.enter recent s=noun 01:33:29 37005 milestones for * (abyss.enter recent): 8889x entered the Abyss!, 3931x escaped (hah) into the Abyss!, 3528x deep elf sorcerer, 1765x deep elf demonologist, 1560x a distortion unwield, 1518x ogre mage, 1391x Louise, 950x Sonja, 908x a deep elf sorcerer, 757x is cast into the Abyss!, 612x Erolcha, 604x wizard, 585x Psyche, 571x orc, 545x a deep elf demonologist, 490x a Zot trap, 414x hell knig... 01:34:02 not in every single milestone of the game, sure, but why do we need it? 01:35:21 I'm about to sleep so I'm not doing anything about this right now, but I think that commit should be reverted unless there is some actual information that is added 01:35:31 that I'm not thinking of right now 01:35:42 -!- Kintak has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:36:20 -!- WereVolvo has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:41:20 -!- Aryth has quit [Client Quit] 01:49:23 this one looks smoother http://crawl.berotato.org/crawl/dev/shoals-lite.gif 01:49:40 * johnstein can't believe he spent an hour trying to make a shoals-lite gif 01:49:42 -!- travis-ci has joined ##crawl-dev 01:49:43 The build has errored. (master - 0e2f81e #1523 : Nicholas Feinberg): http://travis-ci.org/crawl-ref/crawl-ref/builds/46819679 01:49:43 -!- travis-ci has left ##crawl-dev 01:54:57 -!- __miek has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:57:21 -!- Sonata has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:59:08 -!- Amy is now known as Guest80958 02:00:59 -!- rophy has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:02:31 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 02:10:34 -!- schistosoma has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:16:56 !tell PleasingFungus What happens to the milestone if someone gets banished deeper while already in the abyss? Does the new banisher overwrite the first? 02:16:56 magicpoints: OK, I'll let pleasingfungus know. 02:20:10 -!- theTower has left ##crawl-dev 02:21:10 Unstable branch on crawl.beRotato.org updated to: 0.16-a0-3623-gda98d6b (34) 02:25:33 -!- simmarine has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:28:13 -!- raskol` has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 02:29:07 -!- travis-ci has joined ##crawl-dev 02:29:07 The build was fixed. (master - 410066b #1524 : Nicholas Feinberg): http://travis-ci.org/crawl-ref/crawl-ref/builds/46820324 02:29:07 -!- travis-ci has left ##crawl-dev 02:34:01 -!- Poroso has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 02:40:01 -!- Misder has quit [Quit: Page closed] 02:50:30 -!- schistosoma has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:04:54 -!- travis-ci has joined ##crawl-dev 03:04:54 The build was fixed. (master - 5b6d153 #1525 : Nicholas Feinberg): http://travis-ci.org/crawl-ref/crawl-ref/builds/46820390 03:04:54 -!- travis-ci has left ##crawl-dev 03:12:03 -!- imantor has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 03:17:31 -!- gammafun1 has quit [Quit: leaving] 03:18:18 -!- ElasticHeart has quit [Client Quit] 03:19:46 -!- t4nk362 has quit [Client Quit] 03:24:19 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 03:26:47 -!- clouded_ has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 03:26:47 -!- Atomikkrab has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 03:26:47 -!- [1]AtomikKrab is now known as AtomikKrab 03:30:03 -!- __miek has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 03:31:28 -!- falu has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.1] 03:38:19 -!- ruwin has quit [] 03:40:02 (So when does Pakellas go into trunk) 03:41:04 -!- scummos| has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 03:41:04 -!- imantor has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 03:42:39 -!- Wolfechu has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 03:43:48 -!- travis-ci has joined ##crawl-dev 03:43:48 The build passed. (master - da98d6b #1526 : Nicholas Feinberg): http://travis-ci.org/crawl-ref/crawl-ref/builds/46822753 03:43:48 -!- travis-ci has left ##crawl-dev 03:50:22 -!- st_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:01:10 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:02:40 -!- Sorbius has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 04:06:02 -!- stanzill has quit [Quit: au rev] 04:06:25 -!- CacoS has quit [] 04:08:13 -!- stanzill has quit [Changing host] 04:18:28 -!- pwnmonkey_ has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 04:18:59 -!- pwnmonkey has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 04:20:32 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:22:15 -!- Lightli has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 04:42:42 -!- Hailley has quit [Quit: Petra is closed!] 04:54:28 -!- SurpriseTRex has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:02:04 -!- SomeStupidGuy has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 05:15:22 -!- siepu has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:15:53 -!- rophy has quit [Quit: Miranda NG! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-ng.org/] 05:21:41 -!- Kramell has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:25:39 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 05:49:12 -!- stanzill is now known as stanzwecha 05:51:49 -!- manman has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 05:58:21 -!- Aryth has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:08:35 -!- Blazinghand_ has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 06:15:41 -!- klopfdreh has quit [Client Quit] 06:17:00 -!- Lasty has joined ##crawl-dev 06:18:44 !tell pleasingfungus I'm worried that that is the case as well. I haven't yet found anything that's actually that good -- the best thing I found had -10 hp and killed me -- but I think at the very least there are too many properties overall. 06:18:45 Lasty: OK, I'll let pleasingfungus know. 06:19:15 !tell pleasingfungus Also, I think we really need weighting. +Slaying and +Twstr at least need to be weighted lower than average. 06:19:16 Lasty: OK, I'll let pleasingfungus know. 06:19:34 %git 06:19:35 07PleasingFungus02 * 0.16-a0-3623-gda98d6b: Track banishers in milestones 10(5 hours ago, 7 files, 27+ 3-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=da98d6b559ad 06:22:14 !tell pleasingfungus I haven't been seeing too many "look at this amazing artefact" posts, oddly. 06:22:15 Lasty: OK, I'll let pleasingfungus know. 06:27:10 -!- Monkaria has quit [Changing host] 06:27:11 -!- eeeeeta has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 06:35:15 -!- dis- has joined ##crawl-dev 06:36:29 -!- dis-_ has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 06:41:04 -!- rossi has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 06:45:19 -!- Vizer has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 06:56:30 -!- Lasty has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 06:56:59 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 07:09:31 -!- dpeg has joined ##crawl-dev 07:15:31 Weight by fsim 07:16:18 “@brief Fight simualtion wizard functions.” 07:19:37 -!- siepu has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 07:25:45 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 07:27:22 -!- rossi has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:27:51 -!- Twiggytwiggytwig has quit [Quit: See ya guys later ;)] 07:28:26 -!- edlothiol has joined ##crawl-dev 07:30:54 -!- Lightli has joined ##crawl-dev 07:35:55 -!- Kintak has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:36:15 -!- wheals has joined ##crawl-dev 07:36:32 -!- SkaryMonk has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 07:37:35 -!- FiftyNine has quit [] 07:37:47 -!- pantaril has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 07:38:01 -!- SkaryMonk has joined ##crawl-dev 07:38:53 -!- blithen has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:39:01 -!- hugh_jass has quit [Client Quit] 07:39:07 mottled dragon (13D) | Spd: 10 | HD: 5 | HP: 18-37 | AC/EV: 5/10 | Dam: 15, 6 | fly | Res: 06magic(20), 05fire, 03poison, 04napalm | Chunks: 09poison | XP: 154 | Sp: sticky flame splash (3d4) [11!AM, 06!sil, 08breath] | Sz: Big | Int: animal. 07:39:07 %??mottled dragon 07:39:27 did these always have sticky flame splash? 07:39:48 no 07:39:52 mottled dragon (13D) | Spd: 10 | HD: 5 | HP: 17-38 | AC/EV: 5/10 | Dam: 15, 6 | fly, !sil | Res: 06magic(20), 05fire, 03poison, 04napalm | Chunks: 09poison+07contam | XP: 155 | Sp: sticky flame splash (3d4) | Sz: Big | Int: animal. 07:39:52 %0.14?mottled dragon 07:40:01 mottled dragon (13D) | Spd: 10 | HD: 5 | HP: 17-38 | AC/EV: 5/10 | Dam: 15, 6 | fly, !sil | Res: 06magic(20), 05fire, 03poison, 04napalm | Chunks: 09poison+07contam | XP: 155 | Sp: sticky flame splash (3d4) | Sz: Big | Int: animal. 07:40:01 %0.12?mottled dragon 07:40:15 hm 07:40:20 mottled dragon (13D) | Speed: 10 | HD: 5 | Health: 16-39 | AC/EV: 5/10 | Damage: 15, 6 | Flags: fly, !sil | Res: 06magic(20), 05fire, 03poison | Chunks: clean/none/unknown | XP: 155 | Sp: sticky flame splash (3d4). 07:40:20 %0.9?mottled dragon 07:40:22 possibly what monster means by it isn't what we think it means though 07:40:30 i wonder whether it didn't actually splash before because of my beam.cc refactoring 07:40:47 since it used to compare the beam name rather than the spell for that 07:41:23 -!- debo has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:41:45 -!- dpeg has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 07:41:45 -!- chequers has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 07:42:05 -!- dpeg has joined ##crawl-dev 07:42:06 -!- chequers has joined ##crawl-dev 07:42:09 Lasty_: Here: a hand axe of Beogh's Generosity {chop, +Twstr MR+} (friendly, summoned) 07:42:31 when will dancing weapons get to use their evokables!! 07:42:44 hahaha 07:43:23 a demon trident "Plog" {elec, +Rage} (friendly, summoned, berserk) 07:44:22 this reminds me that we should steal the "duplication" ego from brogue for radarts 07:44:32 How's it work? 07:45:01 sometimes, when you hit something, friendly temporary copies of your weapon appear and start hitting it 07:45:25 i guess they could be auto-spectral weapons, here 07:46:08 -!- demiskeleton has quit [Quit: Leaving] 07:47:14 heh 07:47:19 that's pretty sweet 07:47:35 wheals: does mottled drac player breath still work properly? 07:47:49 i believe it does, fairly sure i tested it 07:47:58 but mottled dragon breath now works like it too 07:49:10 wheals: pretty sure that was never intended, or at least not when mottled drac player breath was changed to splash 07:49:37 that's what i thought too 07:49:57 I don't understand why SPELL_STICKY_FLAME_SPLASH exists at all, really 07:50:10 monster mottled dracs 07:50:13 it looks like it currently works as a ranged version of mottled drac player breath 07:50:19 which is weird IMO 07:51:10 if it is going to copy player breath then it shouldn't magically be range 5 instead of range 1 07:52:29 !tell pleasingfungus you mentioned increasing negative properties, and that could work, but it also might make sense to increase the odds of a property not generating at all. Even the unusable artifacts seem to be getting a ton of properties on average. Or maybe that's just a skewed sample. The apparent average number of properties should be ~2! 07:52:30 Maximum message length is 300 characters. Eschew verbosity, Gladys! 07:52:44 !tell pleasingfungus you mentioned increasing negative properties, and that could work, but it also might make sense to increase the odds of a property not generating at all. Even the unusable artifacts seem to be getting a ton of properties on average. Or maybe that's just a skewed sample. The average number of properties should be ~2! 07:52:44 Maximum message length is 300 characters. Eschew verbosity, Gladys! 07:53:07 <|amethyst> Lasty_: pretty sure the average number is not 2 :) 07:53:25 |amethyst: yeah, apparently not 07:53:33 oh . . . 07:53:36 <|amethyst> Lasty_: just by doing a bunch of %any randart armour looks like it's closer to 4 or 5 07:53:51 I was doing 5x, not 6x, when I did the math 07:54:49 <|amethyst> elliptic: the funny thing is, it's the player version that special-cases the range to 1 07:55:21 !tell pleasingfungus I'm generally not that happy about adding fields that don't actually give any extra information, but I guess that computing last_banished in aggregate in current sequell is hard and this field won't show up in many lines so it is probably fine 07:55:21 elliptic: OK, I'll let pleasingfungus know. 07:56:49 -!- tensorpudding has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 07:56:50 |amethyst: well, before recent changes there was only one way of getting splashy sticky flame and it was range 1 07:58:00 |amethyst: non-splashy sticky flame differs in more ways between players and monsters (it is auto-hit for players) 07:58:27 <|amethyst> elliptic: monster sticky flame (not range) isn't auto-hit? 07:58:59 <|amethyst> oh, it's just that no monsters get plain sticky flame 07:59:00 |amethyst: monsters don't get non-ranged sticky flame unless something changed? or maybe ghosts do, that might have happened at some point 07:59:04 yeah 07:59:11 really sticky flame is a mess 07:59:27 but previously there were only 3 distinct effects and now there are 4, I believe 07:59:47 by far the ultimate incarnation of sticky flame is player MD breath 07:59:50 <|amethyst> you said that previous monster sticky flame splash didn't actually splash? 07:59:51 it's melee AND it can miss! 08:00:28 -!- stanzwecha is now known as stanzill 08:00:33 -!- Wah has quit [Read error: Network is unreachable] 08:00:42 |amethyst: afaik mottled dragon/drac sticky flame breath worked like STICKY_FLAME_RANGE previously 08:01:03 |amethyst: I think it was just called splash in the code 08:02:43 I think that splashy doesn't work well for monsters, btw 08:03:07 because it is usually a drawback 08:04:19 like I imagine mottled dracs in drac packs are a bit sad now (haven't fought them yet in a fair battle though) 08:04:37 <|amethyst> so probably we just give monsters "sticky flame range" instead of "sticky flame splash" since they used to be the same thing? 08:05:19 <|amethyst> and yeah, I see why it didn't splash now, and there was a comment about it 08:05:27 <|amethyst> beam.name = "sticky flame"; 08:05:27 <|amethyst> // FIXME: splash needs to be "splash of liquid fire" 08:05:35 <|amethyst> in 0.15 mon-cast.cc 08:05:48 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 08:05:54 |amethyst: yeah, it does seem like 4-5 is common, but the mechanics of it are that there are 6 42% chances to add a property, and then the property is broken down into either good or bad. That means the average should be about 2.5 properties 08:06:07 03Keskitalo02 07* 0.16-a0-3624-gc698f4c: Fix typo. 10(2 weeks ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=c698f4c16d08 08:06:53 <|amethyst> Lasty_: where is this? 08:06:54 -!- Philonous_ is now known as Philonous 08:06:58 |amethyst: yeah... the only issue I see with that is that I guess we might want dragon/drac breath to be noisier (which I assume is why SPELL_STICKY_FLAME_SPLASH has SPFLAG_NOISY?) 08:06:59 !tell pleasingfungus you mentioned increasing negative properties, but maybe instead increase the odds of a property not generating at all? The unusable artifacts seem to be getting a ton of properties on average. Or maybe that's just a skewed sample. The average number of properties should be ~2.5! 08:06:59 Lasty_: OK, I'll let pleasingfungus know. 08:07:35 Lasty_: are randarts with too few properties still vetoed? that would affect things 08:07:59 like I assume that 0-property randarts are vetoed, maybe 1-property ones in some situations? 08:08:20 !source artefacts.cc:856 08:08:20 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/artefacts.cc;hb=HEAD#l856 08:08:27 oops, that's a couple lines too low 08:08:34 841 is more like it 08:08:57 <|amethyst> elliptic: SPFLAG_NOISY makes it make sound even though it's innate 08:09:08 <|amethyst> elliptic: so I guess that could be put on the slot 08:09:12 elliptic: there is a veto process, and I haven't changed it, so it could be interfering. As it stands, if an artifact is generated w/ 0 good properties, it gets one good property added pre-veto 08:11:36 Lasty_: // Add some extra good props if the artifact has a bad base enchantment 08:11:42 yes, that too 08:11:55 but even the positively enchanted ones are just nuts 08:12:03 (in terms of number of enchantments) 08:12:32 Maybe the possibility of 6x is just too much anyway. Weapons and rings already come in with one property, and so do some armours 08:13:08 ??longest randart 08:13:08 longest randart[1/1]: F - the ring of Serendipity (on tentacle) {Hunger +Blink +Rage +Lev rElec rF+ rC+ Str+2 Dex-2 Stlth++} 08:13:19 Is that new or old? 08:13:25 Hunger, so old 08:13:27 old 08:14:04 -!- Ququman has joined ##crawl-dev 08:14:09 I think 9 props like that one is the most I've seen, maybe 10 08:14:31 dang 08:14:32 so 6 doesn't seem unreasonable to me as a rare thing, even if the props are better on average now 08:14:51 the positive props are better on average, but a larger proportion of the props are negative 08:15:35 so are you actually comparing new randarts to old randarts and finding that the new ones seem better on average? 08:15:55 or are you only looking at new randarts? since if so, you might just be misremembering how good old randarts were :P 08:16:23 -!- Daekdroom has quit [Quit: Leaving] 08:16:28 elliptic: I'm not 100% sure. I'm -concerned- that the new ones are better, and what's definitely true is that they seem to have significantly more properties on average. 08:16:54 I generated a big lump of old artefacts for comparison 08:16:59 Most of them had 1-2 properties 08:17:24 (on top of their base properties) 08:17:28 for old randarts, I'm pretty sure that # of properties depended a lot on type 08:18:13 armours didn't have as many (but aux armour randarts were still very good because you sort of wear them for free) 08:18:45 hmm 08:18:50 if that is no longer the case, then that could also be skewing the comparison 08:19:16 I've mainly been seeing weapon randarts so far, both in my games and in what people have been posting 08:19:44 but yeah, there's no provision currently that changes the number of properties based on item type, save that weapons get 1 brand 08:20:09 note also that artifacts that players post are likely far stronger than average :P 08:20:16 yes, for sure 08:21:28 Overall I'm not sure if the artifacts are stronger now or not, and if so by how much, but I do they they feel a bit property-spammy, and I think that's probably worth addressing to some degree. 08:22:27 well, at the very least it would be good if someone understood why positively enchanted randarts are getting more than 2.4 props on average, if they are 08:22:50 <|amethyst> hm 08:22:55 <|amethyst> for one, I was counting weapon brand 08:23:06 yeah, that shouldn't count 08:23:12 I mean, my HuVM last night found two randart weapons, both w/ ~6 properties, one not very amazing (but w/ +Twstr), the other quite strong but with -10 hp. I got killed later by some foolishness and a player ghost, with -4 hp, in a situation where living one more turn would have gotten me out of danger scott-free, so arguably the penalty on that one did kill me off. 08:23:35 that -10 HP one looked pretty bad IMO :P 08:23:49 Well, in hindsight, it was. 08:23:51 <|amethyst> just made 11 randarts... one is spear of torment 08:23:57 unless you were early enough that +7 qstaff melee is really great 08:24:03 Spear of torment? 08:24:10 sceptre? 08:24:16 <|amethyst> err, sceptre 08:24:16 elliptic: I found it on D:7 or so 08:24:38 Upgrade from +4 flail of venom artifact 08:24:46 !lg Lasty -log 08:24:47 254. Lasty, XL12 HuVM, T:18909: http://dobrazupa.org/morgue/Lasty/morgue-Lasty-20150113-025700.txt 08:24:58 *downgrade :P 08:25:15 <|amethyst> and of the other 10: 2 prop:1 3 prop:4 4 prop:3 5 prop:2 08:25:17 well, I thought the +4 dex might offset the -10 hp 08:25:32 <|amethyst> so I guess that's not as far off as I was thinking, but that's more than 2.4 08:26:19 yeah, seems to be balanced towards 3-4 properties. I wonder if the enchantment-checking bit is being used wrong and is always adding +1 good enchantment? 08:26:30 Lasty_: maybe to some extent, but +4 venom flail melee might be better anyway 08:26:47 elliptic: It didn't feel as strong, but if used to kite things, probably . . . 08:26:49 |amethyst: are those all with positive enchantment? 08:27:18 -!- rossi has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 08:27:44 (+Blink +Rage rPois also seems better than the other stuff the qstaff gave you) 08:27:47 <|amethyst> one of the fives has 0 ench 08:28:09 elliptic: yeah, that may have been a bad judgment call. Blinding by the fanciness! 08:28:11 <|amethyst> so that one would 'count' as a 4 08:28:12 *blinded 08:28:13 (sorry, don't mean to criticize your decision to use the shiny qstaff :)) 08:28:28 elliptic: not at all -- totally fair 08:28:53 elliptic: but my point was that I got seduced by the shininess, and then died to the -10 hp property (plus some stupidity, of course) 08:29:01 which is good! 08:29:36 Artefacts that are exciting without being all that good is a good thing, IMO 08:29:40 fwiw I don't think that 3-4 properties on average is bad, at least for weapons 08:30:30 <|amethyst> oh 08:30:33 weapon randarts need a fair amount of help to compete with good branded items 08:30:38 <|amethyst> looks like things are always getting that +1 08:30:41 Hmm, okay. I'll keep that in mind. I've been operating under the rubric that probably every other dev would prefer to keep the number of properties down ... 08:30:49 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 08:31:00 <|amethyst> I tested a few times in a debugger, and item.plus seems to be 0 whenever we enter make_item_randart 08:31:10 |amethyst: item.plus hasn't been set yet? yeah, was wondering 08:31:12 <|amethyst> at least for &%any weapon randart 08:31:25 <|amethyst> maybe it's different for different generation methods 08:31:26 that explains it then 08:31:35 |amethyst: dang, really? I thought the old version of this was setting the "quality" variable based on item.plus 08:31:35 :digs out old version: 08:32:05 it is quite believable that the old version was broken too :P 08:32:17 heh, fair point! 08:32:29 I shouldn't make unfounded assumptions like that 08:33:47 yup, sure enough. It's using item.plus also. 08:33:59 if (aclass == OBJ_ARMOUR) power_level = item.plus * 2 / (armour_max_enchant(item) + 2) + 2; 08:34:09 Heh, well, oops. 08:34:37 <|amethyst> looking at _try_make_weapon_artefact 08:34:55 elliptic: so do you think that giving mottled dragons plain sticky flame range would be good? 08:35:36 So, we could just invert 222 and 224 08:36:23 Wow, the item.plus chunk does not seem to account for what type of item it is! 08:36:31 wheals: and mottled drac monsters too, since splashy sticky flame really doesn't seem great for a pack monster 08:36:40 oh, it's a _weapon 08:36:40 <|amethyst> Lasty_: there's the same thing for armour and jewellery 08:36:40 heh 08:36:57 fair enough 08:37:10 <|amethyst> hm 08:37:15 <|amethyst> or is there for jewellery? 08:37:16 though maybe they should just get normal sticky flame (ie not range)? 08:37:25 but yeah, there's no reason to make it a randart before assigning item.plus 08:37:28 !learn add rare_messages You feel something staring at you. 08:37:29 rare messages[20/20]: You feel something staring at you. 08:37:45 <|amethyst> ah, jewellery does get the plus first 08:37:52 weird 08:38:04 <|amethyst> in _generate_jewellery_item 08:38:16 !learn add lasty_to_do invert item.plus assignment and make_item_randart (makeitem.cc) 08:38:16 lasty to do[8/8]: invert item.plus assignment and make_item_randart (makeitem.cc) 08:38:29 <|amethyst> (but jewellery of course is explicitly excluded from that bonus good prop) 08:38:44 <|amethyst> (maybe negative-plus jewellery shouldn't be) 08:38:51 <|amethyst> zero should of course 08:40:31 fair point -- -slaying rings should be eligible 08:40:36 and -attribute 08:41:04 and arguably jewellery with just bad base types: inacc, loudness, etc. 08:41:15 makeitemrandart.cc 08:41:49 -!- halberd has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 08:43:34 <|amethyst> I like how we use make_ with two meanings 08:43:46 heh, yeah 08:43:49 <|amethyst> that's English for you 08:44:06 $ make ITEM_RANDART=y 08:44:40 That's the build flag for the version where all items are randarts 08:44:53 Randart potions, randart piles of gold, randart runes of zot 08:45:06 <|amethyst> Orb of Zot {-Cast} 08:45:12 You see here the Orb of Zot {Slay+50}. 08:49:44 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 08:51:06 -!- bencryption has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.8] 08:56:04 <|amethyst> oh, hm 08:56:23 <|amethyst> I bet we're always discarding the travel cache now 09:00:04 New branch created: city-connection (1 commit) 09:00:04 03|amethyst02 07[city-connection] * 0.16-a0-3624-gd71b18a: Paint stepped-on squares. 10(51 seconds ago, 5 files, 13+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=d71b18abbf94 09:00:20 "It is crucial to remind oneself from 09:00:20 occasionally that there are other acceptable situations apart from the own." 09:01:10 |amethyst: Will you also be making autotravel prefer previously-walked tiles? 09:02:01 <|amethyst> Lasty_: makes sense, but I don't know if I will actually do anything with this 09:02:09 <|amethyst> Lasty_: (there's no tiles support right now) 09:02:57 -!- siepu has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 09:05:55 03|amethyst02 07* 0.16-a0-3625-g2624681: Don't discard unexpired travel cache. 10(2 minutes ago, 1 file, 4+ 4-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=26246814e6f5 09:06:31 -!- rockygargoyle has joined ##crawl-dev 09:06:39 <|amethyst> oh 09:06:41 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 09:06:43 <|amethyst> that title is wrong 09:07:07 Grunt: Fannar is struck by lightning. 09:07:07 _You kill Fannar! 09:07:12 <|amethyst> the result would actually be that it fails to discard too-new travel caches 09:11:03 -!- foophykins has quit [Client Quit] 09:13:53 -!- rossi has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.0.1] 09:14:10 catoblepas (06Y) | Spd: 8 | HD: 14 | HP: 62-92 | AC/EV: 10/2 | Dam: 36 | Res: 06magic(100) | XP: 799 | Sp: petrifying cloud (2d6) [11!AM, 06!sil] | Sz: Big | Int: animal. 09:14:10 %??catoblepas 09:14:13 caustic shrike (09b) | Spd: 20 | HD: 17 | HP: 90-128 | AC/EV: 10/18 | Dam: 4008(acid:7d3) | see invisible, fly | Res: 06magic(80), 05fire, 02cold, 08blind | XP: 4359 | Sz: tiny | Int: normal. 09:14:13 %??caustic shrike 09:14:23 good degen card :P 09:15:42 death yak (08Y) | Spd: 10 | HD: 14 | HP: 62-92 | AC/EV: 9/5 | Dam: 30 | Res: 06magic(100) | Chunks: 09poison | XP: 872 | Sz: Big | Int: animal. 09:15:42 %??death yak 09:15:54 i guess catlobe's HD isn't all that high for where they are 09:18:26 |amethyst: looks like you duplicated the if (is_bloodcovered(gp)) check in city-connection in show.cc 09:18:58 Ot 09:19:07 It's high enough for them to turn into caustic shrikes 09:19:22 <|amethyst> wheals: oh, whoops :) 09:19:47 i have no idea how poly really works, and especially not the PPT_s 09:20:30 Speaking of which, I'm thinking of boosting caustic shrike HD and lowering their HP per HD. The goal is to make them less likely to absolutely murder people who polymorph death yaks and orc warlords and the like, and give them a bit of an accuracy bonus now that they're not very dangerous for Depths. 09:21:06 who the hell polymorphs death yaks 09:21:29 -!- kober has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.91.1 [Iceweasel 24.7.0/20140723063708]] 09:21:54 People worshipping Nemelex 09:22:04 With that Degen card 09:22:50 -!- FiftyNine has quit [] 09:25:53 golden dragon (08D) | Spd: 10 | HD: 18 | HP: 90-123 | AC/EV: 15/7 | Dam: 40, 2009(claw), 2007(trample) | see invisible, fly | Res: 06magic(180), 05fire, 02cold, 10elec, 03poison, 12drown | Chunks: 09poison | XP: 4178 | Sp: b.fire (3d27) [11!AM, 06!sil, 08breath], b.cold (3d27) [11!AM, 06!sil, 08breath], poisonous cloud (3d11) [11!AM, 06!sil, 08breath] | Sz: Giant | Int: animal. 09:25:53 %??golden dragon 09:26:00 huh 09:26:05 expected more HD 09:27:02 crate has an interesting proposal in the tavern right now: remove the "ignore 0.8 AEVP for purposes of spellcasting success", as it effectively makes most lightish armours (SwampDA) have no penalty, making them a much bigger contrast w/ heavier armours, like even FDA. If we were to adopt this idea, we'd probably want to slightly decrease the amount that AEVP penalizes spellcasting per unit to compensate, so that the overall effect is to make spellcast 09:27:17 wheals: huh, ditto 09:27:36 i don't think there's really much beyond HD:20 09:28:00 titan (06C) | Spd: 10 | HD: 20 | HP: 91-130 | AC/EV: 10/3 | Dam: 55 | 10doors, fighter, spellcaster, see invisible | Res: 06magic(180), 10elec++, 12drown | XP: 2592 | Sp: b.lightning (3d24), minor healing (2d10), airstrike (0-50) | Sz: Giant | Int: high. 09:28:00 %?? titan 09:28:08 dang, I thought those were higher too 09:28:12 Ereshkigal (16&) | Spd: 14 | HD: 18 | HP: 350 | AC/EV: 10/30 | Dam: 4013(drain) | 05demonic, 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, evil, see invisible | Res: 13magic(immune), 02cold, 10elec++, 03poison, 04rot, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 12959 | Sp: b.cold (3d27) [06!sil], silence [06!sil], sum.greater demon [06!sil], s.torment [06!sil], paralyse [06!sil], major healing [06!sil, 04emergency] | Sz: Large | Int: high. 09:28:12 %?? ereshkigal 09:28:21 HD tops out remarkably low 09:28:30 Tiamat (03d) | Spd: 10 | HD: 22 | HP: 380 | AC/EV: 39/20 | Dam: 60, 45, 1508(poison:44-88) | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, cold-blooded, see invisible, fly | Res: 06magic(140), 03poison | Vul: 11silver | XP: 9299 | Sp: b.lightning (3d25) [11!AM, 06!sil, 08breath] / b.quicksilver (3d20) [11!AM, 06!sil, 08breath] / chilling breath (3d28) [11!AM, 06!sil, 08breath] / poisonous cloud (3d13) [11!AM, 06!sil, 08breath] / searing breath (3d28) [11!AM, 06!sil, 08breath] / spit acid (3d7) [11!AM, 06!sil, 08breath] / steam ball (3d24) [11!AM, 06!sil, 08breath] / sticky flame splash (3d8) [11!AM, 06!sil, 08breath] | Sz: Medium | Int: high. 09:28:30 %??tiamat 09:28:36 Nikola (11@) | Spd: 10 | HD: 18 | HP: 190 | AC/EV: 1/9 | Dam: 20 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, spellcaster, see invisible | Res: 06magic(120) | XP: 3261 | Sp: shock (d18), b.lightning (3d22), chain lightning, blink | Sz: Medium | Int: high. 09:28:36 %??nikola 09:28:42 yeah 09:31:39 Lasty_: the 0.8 thing is definitely hacky and has some weird effects... I think removing it would require fiddling with shield penalties as well though 09:34:50 elliptic: perhaps, though you can eliminate those penalties completely anyway 09:38:42 yeah, but currently using robe + buckler at 1 skill is a pretty common thing for players to do 09:38:56 Sure, but I don't know that we should feel obligated to support that 09:39:14 well, bucklers seem primarily designed for that purpose :P 09:39:16 5 skill is still quite cheap . . . 09:39:32 I thought bucklers were primarily stat-vehicles. :D 09:39:50 I'm not saying we need to replicate the current situation, just that shields need to be taken into consideration as well, not just body armour 09:40:01 fair :) 09:40:31 -!- stanzill is now known as stanzwecha 09:42:00 !learn lasty_to_do look into removing 0.8 AEVP amnesty for spellcasting 09:42:00 I don't know about !learn lasty_to_do. 09:42:02 like I was already thinking that making the 0.8 thing only apply to body armour and decreasing shield penalties slightly might be a good idea 09:42:10 !learn add lasty_to_do look into removing 0.8 AEVP amnesty for spellcasting 09:42:11 lasty to do[9/9]: look into removing 0.8 AEVP amnesty for spellcasting 09:42:26 elliptic: it'd be a boost to shields, which maybe is fine 09:42:44 Lasty_: only a boost to shields if you are using encumbering armour 09:43:22 which admittedly is pretty common given how good dragon armours are 09:43:43 but it would be a nerf to robe+shield chars 09:43:46 -!- syllogism has joined ##crawl-dev 09:44:12 PF has a vague plan to rework shield penalties at some point 09:44:14 %git shp 09:44:14 07PleasingFungus02 * 0.16-a0-2479-g9c8aac6: In-progress shield work 10(2 months ago, 9 files, 138+ 92-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=9c8aac645018 09:44:27 -!- wheals has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:45:03 Yeah. There was a GDD thread about those changes. I should review it, but I think I recall having some concerns. 09:45:11 -!- wheals has joined ##crawl-dev 09:45:21 Lasty_: j - the +2 scimitar "Mufi" (weapon) {slice, -Cast Dex+6, @q1} 09:45:22 yeah, that seemed reasonable too (and would probably also include removing the 0.8 AEVP thing from affecting shields) 09:45:36 -!- Bloax has joined ##crawl-dev 09:45:40 unfortunately, i'm a MuMo 09:45:50 it got my char totally wrong 09:45:54 no it isn't 09:45:57 that is a fine weapon for mumo 09:46:00 wheals: bug report 09:46:01 !lg . mu 09:46:01 IIRC, it made shields always have casting penalties, which is definitely a nerf to casting in shields; it also made shields always have attack delay penalties, which made them bad pairs for light weapons. 09:46:01 23. REMOVEMUMMYFROMCRAWL the Anointer (L23 MuMo of Okawaru), escaped with the Orb and 3 runes on 2015-01-11 23:11:42, with 1442434 points after 79140 turns and 3:56:41. 09:46:09 kvaak: look at the weapon's name 09:46:10 kvaak: note the name 09:46:15 yes 09:46:21 I did note it 09:46:24 hahaha 09:46:38 wheals: I should say that it didn't get your char _totally_ wrong 09:46:38 !lg kvaak mu -log 09:46:38 23. REMOVEMUMMYFROMCRAWL, XL23 MuMo, T:79140: http://crawl.develz.org/morgues/trunk/REMOVEMUMMYFROMCRAWL/morgue-REMOVEMUMMYFROMCRAWL-20150111-231142.txt 09:46:44 -!- PleasingFungus has joined ##crawl-dev 09:46:48 fair 'nuff 09:46:53 getting it half-right is pretty good! 09:46:55 that was actually supposed to be a mufi 09:46:58 ??unapropos randarts 09:46:58 unapropos randarts[1/27]: the amulet of Pantheism (around neck) {Faith rPois rF+ SInv} 09:47:08 ??unapropos randarts[$ 09:47:08 unapropos randarts[27/27]: You finish putting on the -13 plate armour of Joy {+Rage} 09:47:20 but i started a mumo instead just to smite the silly mumo thing 09:47:29 !smite the silly mumo thing 09:47:29 wheals gestures. Something smites the silly mumo thing! 09:47:59 well that + mumo is quite possibly the single worst mu, after ck anyway 09:48:08 actually, this weapon is quite good for me because of crosstraining 09:48:27 at least until i can brand my +9 qblade 09:48:48 (did anyone ever actually fix the permabranding with tempbrands thing) 09:49:06 wasn't that a feature that was removed? 09:49:10 I find it hard to believe that a +2 scimitar will do more damage than a +9 qblade 09:49:12 or did it become a bug after the feature was removed 09:49:18 -!- domiryuu has quit [Quit: leaving] 09:49:32 elliptic: it might let me press tab fewer times though 09:49:34 or do you also have to find the +9 qblade 09:49:40 yes that is true 09:49:59 <|amethyst> kvaak: this one was never a feature 09:50:03 oh 09:50:07 <|amethyst> kvaak: it didn not involve ?brand weapon 09:50:12 <|amethyst> just the two temp brand spells 09:50:27 oh 09:50:30 <|amethyst> and it was fixed 09:50:34 <|amethyst> %git f6bfca6 09:50:34 07PleasingFungus02 * 0.16-a0-3544-gf6bfca6: Stop permabranding weapons with L5 charms 10(5 days ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=f6bfca6cf2a2 09:50:37 whew 09:52:37 elliptic: i think you're right about the quick blade, it does seem to still be better 09:56:19 well, yeah -- +9! 09:57:14 Lasty_: will respond to your floor of !tells once I wake up 09:57:14 PleasingFungus: You have 7 messages. Use !messages to read them. 09:57:18 ^ flood 09:57:45 Flooded floor? #newshoals 09:58:08 !send Lasty_ phial of !tells 09:58:08 Sending phial of !tells to Lasty_. 09:58:19 elliptic: hadn't thought of how you could calculated "banished" with aggregate queries; was just going off a random suggestion (by |amethyst a few weeks ago, iirc?). idk 09:59:13 PleasingFungus: when you feel like handling the flood of tells, check also the discussion in the channel around there as well 09:59:23 I've been reading through it 09:59:27 slowly 10:01:03 fwiw I agree with elliptic that having more props on randarts is more fun than the old system, just need to poke at weighting and/or tilt more toward bad props 10:02:00 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 10:02:46 Lasty_: n - the +5 robe of Watchfulness {Contam *Rage +Rage Slay+4} 10:02:54 that's a pretty cool robe 10:03:19 very strong, but with tradeoffs (though less for a mummy like me) 10:03:25 Contam quite relevant on that robe, for the record 10:03:30 what a rad robe 10:03:42 fr: merge +* props in artefact descriptions where possible 10:03:54 (*+Rage; or +*Rage?) 10:03:56 -!- travis-ci has joined ##crawl-dev 10:03:56 The build passed. (city-connection - d71b18a #1528 : Neil Moore): http://travis-ci.org/crawl-ref/crawl-ref/builds/46861311 10:03:56 -!- travis-ci has left ##crawl-dev 10:04:07 PleasingFungus: not sure that is a good idea 10:04:14 On my ill-fated TrMo, I had a robe HP+5 MP+5 Slay+5... quite stylish, I thought :) 10:04:14 being shorter isn't worth being less clear to players 10:04:19 mm 10:04:24 could swear that =tele displayed like that 10:04:26 somewhere 10:04:33 possibly I'm crazy 10:04:37 yes, but those are always connected 10:05:17 wheals: yes... the *Foo always implies +Foo? 10:05:25 dpeg: not for *Rage 10:06:03 unfr I guess 10:06:29 wrt shield reform, that one's stalled by my complete lack of knowledge of spreadsheets 10:06:46 elliptic: ah, ok. So only for Tele. 10:06:48 I don't have any good tools to analyze how penalties work under the new system vs the old 10:08:36 -!- moocowpong1 has joined ##crawl-dev 10:10:57 PleasingFungus: FWIW, I think the weighting for bad props isn't terrible, though we could do something like increase the odds of having 1 bad prop if there's a certain number of good props, or increase the weighting for 1 bad prop period and decrease slightly the weighting for additional bad props or something like that. 10:11:18 hmm... one interface thing i kind of like in ADOM is the ability to look at just a certain section of your inventory using the symbol keys 10:11:21 I really like the results that are mostly good but with one or two bad elements to offset 10:11:33 quite missing it back in DCSS 10:11:44 wheals: jpeg always wanted that, in the Nethack style, i.e. I? for scrolls etc. 10:12:03 Lasty_: I like those too, which is why I think we should have more bad props :) 10:12:03 FWIW, it's */+Tele, right? 10:12:17 PleasingFungus: heh, fair enough! 10:12:30 ring of teleportation is +/*Tele, yes 10:12:33 good human that jpeg. has great opinions 10:12:54 bhaak: now we never know if "jpeg" or "Nethack" pings you :) 10:13:13 Lasty_: I really wonder how much sense it makes to have bad props be opposed to good props in gen. vaguely seems like we'd want to have more good props make it *more* likely to add bad props 10:13:15 if that makes any sense 10:14:09 Lasty_: in Crawl, you could probably get away with i? etc. It'd look a bit odd, because it shows the full inventory first and then restricts to a subset, but I don't think there's any command key overlap. 10:14:37 there are not that many options for bad props 10:14:44 unless you want to add "ponderousness" to the list 10:14:45 dpeg: maybe I have a ping on your whole family? :) 10:15:00 well, currently d? selects all scrolls. maybe we should change this to 'd?,' so that d and i act the same way here 10:15:04 PleasingFungus: I think I agree w/ your intention there -- tying the number of badprops to the number of good props seems good, though it should be a loose tie IMO. Wanna allow for truly terrible/great items still. 10:15:09 Bloax: there are now more than before, and we could still add some? 10:15:18 well what do you propose 10:15:23 mp/hp degeneration? 10:15:26 (bad) 10:15:48 Lasty_: yeah, ofc 10:15:56 attribute adjustments are all taken 10:16:11 wheals: but that'd be an actual regression (makes d? etc. less convenient) 10:16:14 the only things remaining would be esoteric *Effects 10:16:47 Bloax: I don't agree with that implication 10:16:57 i think it might be worth it for the consistency 10:17:08 PleasingFungus: maybe something like 6 attempts to generate a good prop, then two attempts to generate a bad prop, with the odds weighted by the number of good props? 10:17:19 Or even 3 attempts 10:17:49 ((don't forget that bad properties tend to be worse than good properties are good)) 10:18:03 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: ["Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com"]] 10:18:06 Lasty_: I'm gonna abstain on grounds of being asleep still 10:18:32 PleasingFungus: heh, fair nuff. Lemme know what you think when you feel like it. :) 10:18:37 ya 10:18:39 will do 10:18:50 3:1 attempts doesn't sound too shabby to me 10:18:54 -!- beep is now known as Guest42404 10:18:56 (it's time to see what the results of that are!!!) 10:20:28 -!- eeeeeta has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:24:14 -!- eeeeeta has quit [Client Quit] 10:25:28 heh, an artefact long enough that it scrolls off the shop screen 10:27:36 wheals: That's the goal, for sure 10:28:28 PleasingFungus: xv on monsters with SPELL_HASTE or SPELL_MIGHT shows the range as if they could cast it on other monsters 10:28:32 which is a bit misleading 10:29:08 someone should fix that 10:29:13 W - the +6 ring mail "Fruzanui" {+Twstr HP+9 MP+9} 10:29:13 ! 10:29:20 SPELL_MIGHT_SELF 10:29:44 +twstr. +Twstr! 10:29:49 Always +twstr! 10:29:54 !twist Lasty_ 10:30:04 haunted by a spooky spectre of your own devising....... 10:30:14 i think i will keep my slayrobe for now 10:30:22 That was meant to be an urge to continuously use +Twstr. 10:30:23 heh. 10:33:13 Why not write "Twist" instead of "Twstr"? Chubby would agree! 10:34:51 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…] 10:35:28 FR: need to put hands and feet on the floor to evoke it 10:37:32 seriously, I find "Twstr" to be as unwieldy as "Stlth" 10:38:18 +Twst +Shout 10:38:42 !vault twist_and_shout 10:38:42 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/dat/des/variable/float.des;hb=HEAD#l2646 10:38:50 +twist sounds like a tloc prop... 10:39:12 not really 10:39:19 PleasingFungus: offensive 10:41:19 !? 10:44:15 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 10:44:20 twist?? 10:44:20 This offensive Translocation spell is no longer part of Crawl. 10:44:28 heh 10:44:30 what 10:44:33 uh 10:44:34 derp 10:45:19 -!- PleasingFungus has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.91.1 [Firefox 34.0.5/20141126041045]] 10:47:29 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 10:47:51 -!- siepu has quit [Quit: Leaving] 10:48:37 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 10:51:21 -!- ibar has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 10:53:29 -!- Monkaria has quit [Quit: Page closed] 10:53:43 -!- mopl has quit [Quit: Page closed] 10:55:46 -!- SomeStupidGuy has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 11:01:36 -!- jeanjacques has joined ##crawl-dev 11:01:52 -!- Morg0th has quit [Quit: leaving] 11:07:06 -!- PleasingFungus has joined ##crawl-dev 11:07:27 -!- JaGGedTK has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.2.0 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/] 11:08:16 is there any particular reason ##crawl has no ops 11:10:06 iirc r*x and grunt are ops? 11:10:10 <|amethyst> it does, they just don't sit around with ops enabled 11:10:39 <|amethyst> /msg chanserv flags ##crawl and look for +o 11:11:06 you have to have flags to be actually able to do that 11:11:13 ya,I get 'not authorized' 11:11:15 <|amethyst> oh 11:11:29 <|amethyst> anyway, there are a bunch of people 11:11:57 kvaak: the freenode website has a good article on why it's a good idea to have it that way 11:12:42 <|amethyst> anyway, does someone need kicked or something? 11:13:57 I guess that'd depend on whether you support developing finger and throat cancer 11:15:11 <|amethyst> I smoke, so throat cancer's fine 11:16:22 <|amethyst> Ignore him and he 11:16:28 <|amethyst> 'll go away quicker 11:16:33 <|amethyst> come back if that doesn't work 11:22:00 -!- JaGGedTK has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.2.0 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/] 11:22:12 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:24:07 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.16-a0-3625-g2624681 (34) 11:28:59 -!- ystael has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 11:30:15 -!- pwnmonkey_ has joined ##crawl-dev 11:30:16 -!- pwnmonkey has joined ##crawl-dev 11:32:28 -!- SurpriseTRex has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:37:47 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:44:00 -!- rockygargoyle has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:51:13 -!- rossi has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.0.1] 11:54:20 -!- domiryuu has quit [Quit: leaving] 11:54:23 -!- moocowpong1 has quit [Quit: moocowpong1] 11:57:13 -!- why has quit [Client Quit] 11:57:26 -!- tcsc has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 11:57:33 -!- scummos| has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 11:58:25 -!- simmarine has joined ##crawl-dev 12:10:52 -!- Guest42404 has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 12:12:41 -!- rophy has quit [Client Quit] 12:17:13 kvaak: TheMattyBee? 12:17:35 |amethyst is a ##crawl op too, but I don't think he remembers :) 12:17:41 He's an SA regular. Threw a huge fit over caustic shrikes, said he'd never play Depths again as long as they existed. 12:17:53 so 12:17:56 there was some 12:18:00 !glasses 12:18:00 Grunt collapsed into a black hole today. Authorities cite the accretion disk of billions and billions of pairs of sunglasses as a contributing factor. 12:18:00 ( •_•)    ( •_•)>⌐■-■    (⌐■_■) 12:18:05 caustic commentary 12:18:09 haha 12:18:33 whoever doctored that command is amazing. 12:18:33 * Grunt violently warps Lasty! 12:18:57 Ow! My cohesion! 12:19:57 * Grunt twists Lasty apart! 12:20:05 :( 12:20:16 * Grunt implodes! 12:20:28 -!- TheMattybee has quit [] 12:21:48 iirc wheals changed it to happen every tenth call, something like that 12:21:50 a few months ago 12:21:57 -!- mamgar has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:22:51 -!- mamgar has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:22:55 !seen magicpoints 12:22:55 I last saw magicpoints at Tue Jan 13 10:48:47 2015 UTC (7h 34m 8s ago) saying '??protip[jiyva]' on ##crawl. 12:23:13 !tell magicpoints Yeah, it'll overwrite. possibly that's incorrect, idk 12:23:13 PleasingFungus: OK, I'll let magicpoints know. 12:24:29 !tell Grunt imo !blame Grunt for that evo bug :) 12:24:29 PleasingFungus: OK, I'll let grunt know. 12:25:12 -!- Baconkid has quit [Quit: Page closed] 12:25:28 !tell Grunt also if you can double-check that the current evo stepdown behaviour actually works as expected, I'd appreciate it; I just did some very basic testing 12:25:30 PleasingFungus: OK, I'll let grunt know. 12:32:34 Lasty_: fwiw I'm seeing people post crazy artefacts basically 24/7 in tileschatr 12:32:46 re your earlier "haven't been seeing people post many artefacts" 12:32:49 interesting 12:33:10 among other things 12:33:16 Not surprising given that there is a legit bug with the process that's forcing an extra good property onto every non-jewellery artefact 12:33:18 I think that the <= 0 check for good props should probably be < 0 12:33:25 oh, is that bugged 12:33:29 Did you see the discussion before? 12:33:31 Guess not 12:33:40 yeah, item.plus isn't set yet for non-jewellery 12:33:50 heh 12:33:50 that's a bug that affected the old artefact code too 12:33:59 I skimmed that part iirc 12:34:07 It's on my to-do list 12:34:17 got a bunch of things to do to artefacts when I get home 12:35:12 oh yeah 12:36:47 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:37:29 I should rename artefact_wpn_properties to a name that is not a lie 12:37:44 -!- Porost is now known as Poroso 12:38:18 FWIW, I'm thinking 6x properties at something like a 35% assign rate, then 3x bad properties at 10% * number of good properties assign rate. 12:38:19 -!- omnirizon has quit [Quit: Page closed] 12:39:41 Or maybe 40% if lots of properties are desired. 12:45:14 what is an assign rate 12:45:40 is this (for i = 0; i < 6; i++) if (x_in_y(35, 100)) good++; 12:45:52 dang, those parens are all over the place 12:46:07 yeah, that's the sort of idea I had in mind 12:46:09 also I'm pretty sure there's a way to express that without a loop 12:47:37 binomial distribution, I think 12:47:59 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:48:02 -!- PsyMar has quit [Quit: witty quit message goes here] 12:49:10 PleasingFungus: Do we have a function/library for that already? 12:49:44 probably 12:49:57 int binomial(unsigned n_trials, unsigned trial_prob, unsigned scale = 100); 12:50:02 !source binomial 12:50:03 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/random.cc;hb=HEAD#l283 12:50:33 so "const int good = binomial(6, 35);" 12:50:42 or int good, w/e 12:52:27 nice 12:52:44 !tell lasty const int good = binomial(6, 35); 12:52:45 Lasty_: OK, I'll let lasty know. 12:53:30 -!- bonghitz_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:55:27 const won't currently work, sadly 12:55:30 need to rewrite some stuff 13:00:17 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 13:01:07 -!- __miek has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 13:01:34 -!- UncertainKitten has joined ##crawl-dev 13:01:42 -!- link_108 has joined ##crawl-dev 13:04:30 right, since it's not a const :p 13:04:59 It wouldn't be too hard to get it to a const tho 13:05:20 Do you see that as important? 13:05:35 it's a little thing 13:05:40 I'll probably do it at some point 13:05:46 :shrug: 13:05:53 :) 13:05:57 imo don't worry about it 13:06:18 I enjoy refactoring 13:06:19 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: ["Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com"]] 13:06:30 I know. :) 13:07:14 weirdo 13:07:41 Yeah, not like wheals. wheals hates refactoring. He's a rebel. 13:08:19 I rebel against | mutable state | 13:08:46 smash the mutable state 13:09:00 nsf001 13:09:01 Towards a glorious, immutable future, comrade! 13:09:01 -!- Bloax has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:09:13 but the code refused to change...... 13:10:38 So what's the nuttiest thing someone's found in tileschat? 13:12:30 idk. scrolling up right now, there's SirSamVimes: f - +0 pair of gloves of Jyestra {+Rage rF++ HP+9 Slay+4, acquired: daaaang} 13:12:36 -!- rockygargoyle has joined ##crawl-dev 13:12:37 which seems pretty strong 13:14:42 Yeah, I'd wear that. Heh. 13:15:24 probably removing the accidental bonus properties will help 13:15:37 definitely 13:15:43 though if you want to fix rather than remove that entirely, I still think it should be < 0 rather than <= 0 13:15:46 not sure which you're palnning 13:15:50 I do think we need weighting tho. There's just a lot of +slaying around right now 13:16:17 -!- crawlmonstah has quit [Client Quit] 13:16:57 I was planning to leave the code as-is, but make it read in item.plus correctly. Any particular reason +0 shouldn't get a bonus prop? +0 is a pretty bad enchantment level on an artefact -- it generally means at least -2 AC or -9 slaying (armour, weapon respectively) 13:17:34 Of course, that's over the long term, since you don't necessarily have the enchant scrolls immediately 13:20:55 imo a good artp is generally better than +2 ac 13:21:13 yeah, I'll agree w/ that 13:21:15 depends on the artp obv but I think it'll be better the great majority of the time 13:21:25 it's different on weapons obviously 13:21:35 Worse than +9 slaying or +10 AC, tho. Maybe it should be more context sensitive 13:21:41 probably 13:21:59 tbh it might be simplest to just remove it entirely for now & re-add it if we have a more solid plan 13:22:01 ??shoals-lite 13:22:01 shoals-lite[1/2]: Tides only go between shallow water & land (never deep water); fifteen times faster than classic crawl. Modeled off what word of mouth claims Crawl Lite does with Shoals. Playable on cbro! 13:22:10 perhaps so 13:22:20 and yes I agree about weighting 13:22:22 I'll try to come up with a solid plan in time, and if I don't, I'll just remove it 13:22:33 -!- Ironfoot has quit [Quit: Page closed] 13:22:50 "in time"? 13:22:51 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 13:23:09 it took about 100 turns to cycle from land to water back to land. that really took 1500 turns in shoals-classic? 13:23:22 PleasingFungus: This evening, basically. 13:23:37 read as: I'll do something this evening. I'll try to come up with a solid plan in time, and if I don't, I'll just remove it. 13:23:48 aight 13:23:53 sounds good 13:24:06 johnstein: test it yourself :) 13:24:35 -!- Poroso has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 13:24:43 I know. but I'm at work on my phone and I MUST KNOW NOW 13:24:56 or maybe I'll test it. in time 13:25:13 -!- t4nk520 has quit [Client Quit] 13:28:22 -!- Ironfoot has quit [Client Quit] 13:28:39 -!- moocowpong1 has joined ##crawl-dev 13:29:57 johnstein: looks like it took about 1000 turns 13:30:14 I never noticed it took that long before 13:30:55 I'd say 10x faster and no deep water would be a good improvement 13:32:38 and on shoals:$ need random big waves that come up even faster and are bigger than normal tides (yea I know. probably too complex for a is what minor effect) 13:33:00 ilsuiw basically does that 13:33:18 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 13:34:03 oh. I never noticed 13:34:15 yes, well, that's ilsuiw for you, isn't it 13:34:15 !lm . uniq=ilsuiw 13:34:16 5. [2014-11-28 06:11:00] johnstein the Spry (L19 HaBe of Trog) killed Ilsuiw on turn 48063. (Shoals:5) 13:34:19 !killratio ilsuiw * recent 13:34:21 ilsuiw wins 0.724% of battles against * (recent). 13:34:42 maybe I do remember that 13:35:08 obviously it's a solid feature. bravo 13:35:39 shoals are weird 13:36:22 That seems low for Ilsiuw kills. Does it count her band? 13:36:57 !lm * uniq noun=ilsiuw 13:36:57 No milestones for * (uniq noun=ilsiuw). 13:37:08 !vault uniq_ilsuiw 13:37:08 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/dat/des/builder/uniques.des;hb=HEAD#l381 13:37:20 !source dat/des/branches/shoals.des 13:37:20 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/dat/des/branches/shoals.des;hb=HEAD 13:37:40 most of the monsters in the standard ilsuiw hut are not actually in her band 13:37:42 She's got a pretty nasty band, tho invis does make it pretty trivial 13:37:47 Oh, heh 13:37:53 awright then 13:37:56 Lasty_: I assumed SA being paid would drive away the more... unstable individuals 13:37:59 I guess not 13:38:01 kvaak: ? 13:38:07 let me see. there's something about ilsuiw that I think I remember... 13:38:09 Ilsuiw (09m) | Spd: 10 (swim: 60%) | HD: 16 | HP: 150 | AC/EV: 5/18 | Dam: 10 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, amphibious, spellcaster | Res: 06magic(140), 12drown | XP: 1889 | Sp: throw icicle (3d25), call tide, invisibility, blink, sum.water elementals | Sz: Medium | Int: high. 13:38:09 %??ilsuiw 13:38:19 merfolk aquamancer (03m) | Spd: 10 (swim: 60%) | HD: 14 | HP: 52-73 | AC/EV: 0/12 | Dam: 15 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, amphibious, spellcaster, see invisible | Res: 06magic(80), 12drown | XP: 913 | Sp: primal wave (3d20), steam ball (3d18), throw icicle (3d23), blink [04emergency] | Sz: Medium | Int: normal. 13:38:19 %??merfolk aquamancer 13:38:21 kvaak: it's only $10, so it's not beyond the reach of even the poorest awful people. 13:38:23 yep 13:38:25 no sinv 13:38:33 yeah 13:38:41 makes her pretty easy if you can kill off the aquamancers 13:38:43 PleasingFungus: oh, I'm just referring to someone wishing cancer upon his fellow crawlers upon splatting in zot 13:38:49 er 13:38:54 is this ##crawl 13:38:57 $10 one time fee? 13:39:03 -!- melllvar has quit [Quit: Page closed] 13:39:04 johnstein: I don't recall 13:39:07 johnstein: technically, it's recurring every time you get banned :) 13:39:10 I last looked over 10 years ago 13:39:17 it hasn't changed since 13:39:24 weird site 13:39:25 -!- Kintak has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 13:39:34 The site has changed a lot. 13:39:50 Since it was just Lowtax. 13:40:27 the quote box no longer claims that posters "came out of the closet to say..." 13:40:36 which was some real early-oughts comedy 13:40:39 also this isn't -dev so I'm gonna stop 13:40:44 heh 13:42:53 on-topic rules are harshly enforced in ##crawl and ##crawl-dev, you're on thin ice!!! 13:43:54 :( 13:45:27 -!- Twiggytwiggytwig has quit [Quit: See ya guys later ;)] 13:53:46 -!- rockygargoyle has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 13:56:39 -!- debo has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 13:59:45 -!- rockygargoyle has joined ##crawl-dev 14:02:15 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…] 14:02:33 -!- G-Flex has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 14:03:02 -!- G-Flex has joined ##crawl-dev 14:04:27 -!- absolon has quit [Quit: Page closed] 14:12:09 -!- PleasingFungus has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.91 [Firefox 34.0.5/20141126041045]] 14:33:17 -!- theTower has joined ##crawl-dev 14:36:51 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 14:38:10 -!- PleasingFungus has joined ##crawl-dev 14:45:32 -!- splat has quit [Client Quit] 14:52:27 -!- syllogism has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:52:33 -!- rockygargoyle_ has joined ##crawl-dev 14:55:22 -!- rockygargoyle has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:01:42 -!- Menche has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 15:03:48 -!- fireprfHydra has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:04:28 |amethyst: is it possible for the player to override 4b216655? 15:05:31 I'm a bit confused by how multiple add_autopickup_funcs interact with each other and with autopickup_exceptions 15:08:28 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 15:08:53 (I discovered this when looking at qw, but personally I'd rather not have autopickup pick up books on my own trog chars either... for most of the game you just want to burn them on sight, not pick them up) 15:18:28 -!- fearitself has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:19:06 -!- raskol` has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 15:21:16 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 15:21:40 -!- Wah has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 15:25:22 -!- moocowpong1 has quit [Quit: moocowpong1] 15:26:46 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: ["Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com"]] 15:30:04 -!- Porost is now known as Poroso 15:30:35 !learn add lasty_to_do Block Ely/Beogh conversion under sac love 15:30:35 lasty to do[10/10]: Block Ely/Beogh conversion under sac love 15:31:09 heh 15:31:35 The Sac Love Beogh Run 15:32:06 -!- Moonsilence has quit [*.net *.split] 15:32:07 -!- Fhqwhgads_ has quit [*.net *.split] 15:32:07 -!- Kalir has quit [*.net *.split] 15:32:07 -!- SomeStupidGuy has quit [*.net *.split] 15:32:07 -!- ibar has quit [*.net *.split] 15:32:07 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##crawl-dev 15:50:33 -!- geekosaur has joined ##crawl-dev 15:50:33 -!- Lasty_ has joined ##crawl-dev 15:50:33 -!- oberstein has joined ##crawl-dev 15:50:33 -!- UbAh has joined ##crawl-dev 15:50:33 -!- Kramin has joined ##crawl-dev 15:50:33 -!- bh has joined ##crawl-dev 15:50:33 -!- magicpoints has joined ##crawl-dev 15:50:33 -!- |amethyst has joined ##crawl-dev 15:50:33 -!- Zannick has joined ##crawl-dev 15:50:33 -!- djinni has joined ##crawl-dev 15:50:35 -!- fearitself has quit [Changing host] 15:52:21 !learn add lasty_to_do also under sac love disable god abilities that create allies, prevent Ely/jiyva/beogh for letting you worship, fix Discord 15:52:22 lasty to do[11/11]: also under sac love disable god abilities that create allies, prevent Ely/jiyva/beogh for letting you worship, fix Discord 15:52:52 -!- Sorbius has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 15:53:12 -!- Brannock has joined ##crawl-dev 15:53:14 -!- PsyMar has quit [*.net *.split] 15:53:14 -!- Menche has quit [*.net *.split] 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has quit [*.net *.split] 15:54:54 -!- ByronJohnson has quit [*.net *.split] 15:54:54 -!- ebering has quit [*.net *.split] 15:54:54 -!- yxhuvud has quit [*.net *.split] 15:54:54 -!- Adeon has quit [*.net *.split] 15:54:54 -!- rax has quit [*.net *.split] 15:54:54 -!- Unmovable has quit [*.net *.split] 15:54:54 -!- Jafet has quit [*.net *.split] 15:54:54 -!- djanatyn has quit [*.net *.split] 15:54:54 -!- Wensley has quit [*.net *.split] 15:54:54 -!- bd- has quit [*.net *.split] 15:55:15 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 15:55:37 -!- neunon has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 15:55:38 -!- bhaak has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 15:55:38 -!- yokelz has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 15:56:14 -!- inspector071 has joined ##crawl-dev 15:56:42 -!- neunon has joined ##crawl-dev 15:57:02 apparently someone got an rPois++ art 15:57:10 -!- moocowpong1 has joined ##crawl-dev 15:57:22 this is a bug, right? 15:57:25 -!- fearitself has quit [*.net *.split] 15:57:25 -!- jeremie has quit [*.net *.split] 15:57:25 -!- notid1 has quit [*.net *.split] 15:57:25 -!- rockygargoyle_ has quit [*.net *.split] 15:57:25 -!- Zeia has quit [*.net *.split] 15:57:25 -!- KamiKatze has quit [*.net *.split] 15:57:25 -!- Mdsm has quit [*.net *.split] 15:57:25 -!- Kellhus has quit [*.net *.split] 15:57:25 -!- Zooty has quit [*.net *.split] 15:57:25 -!- bullock has quit [*.net *.split] 15:57:25 -!- Lightli has quit [*.net *.split] 15:57:25 -!- Xenobreeder has quit [*.net *.split] 15:57:25 -!- Limulus_ has quit [*.net *.split] 15:57:25 -!- UraMaru has quit [*.net *.split] 15:57:32 -!- rockygargoyle_ has joined ##crawl-dev 15:57:32 -!- Lightli has joined ##crawl-dev 15:57:59 The cursed whip of Classification {venom, *Rage +Blink rPois++ rF- rC- rN-}. 15:58:11 there's a "double plus ungood" joke in there somewhere... 15:58:33 lol 15:58:36 should i look at its enchantment just to see how bad it is? 15:59:23 -!- Brannock has joined ##crawl-dev 15:59:23 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 15:59:23 -!- 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16:02:20 -!- therealfakemoot has quit [*.net *.split] 16:02:20 -!- djinni has quit [*.net *.split] 16:02:20 -!- axujen has quit [*.net *.split] 16:02:51 -!- gammafunk has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:04:38 -!- gammafunk has joined ##crawl-dev 16:05:10 -!- rockygargoyle has joined ##crawl-dev 16:05:57 -!- DrKe has joined ##crawl-dev 16:06:03 ugh, netsplits 16:06:12 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 16:06:12 -!- theTower has joined ##crawl-dev 16:06:12 -!- FatShack has joined ##crawl-dev 16:06:12 -!- geekosaur has joined ##crawl-dev 16:06:12 -!- UbAh has joined ##crawl-dev 16:06:12 -!- bh has joined ##crawl-dev 16:06:12 -!- magicpoints has joined ##crawl-dev 16:06:12 -!- |amethyst has joined ##crawl-dev 16:06:12 -!- Zannick has joined ##crawl-dev 16:06:12 -!- djinni has joined ##crawl-dev 16:06:18 -!- oberstein has joined ##crawl-dev 16:06:56 !tell Kramin Fixed that last night; should be good by the next server rebuild (ref 410066b465a012 & the next commit) 16:06:57 PleasingFungus: OK, I'll let kramin know. 16:07:28 -!- rockygargoyle_ has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:08:11 -!- Kramin has joined ##crawl-dev 16:08:15 hi kramin 16:08:24 Hi 16:08:24 Kramin: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 16:08:32 !messages 16:08:32 (1/1) PleasingFungus said (1m 35s ago): Fixed that last night; should be good by the next server rebuild (ref 410066b465a012 & the next commit) 16:08:37 ok 16:08:50 I wanted rElec++ too though 16:08:53 sry 16:09:10 fwiw I'm pretty sure rPois-- and rElec-- could also generate 16:09:35 I guess rpois++ could overcome rpois-? 16:09:41 or did it not work like that 16:09:48 you'd think but people said it didn't work 16:09:53 !source player_res_poison 16:09:54 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/player.cc;hb=HEAD#l1787 16:10:03 -!- Tux[Qyou] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:10:07 yep nope 16:10:11 rip 16:10:36 -!- CacoS has quit [] 16:13:13 is it intended for casting statue form to not remove petrifying? 16:13:56 I remember we talked about it at some point 16:14:02 I don't remember the conclusion 16:14:04 (players in statue form are immune to petrification) 16:14:28 but you can still turn into stone while in statue form 16:14:38 it seems logical that it would remove the effect 16:14:50 but i know logic doesnt always apply 16:15:55 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…] 16:16:42 -!- jeanjacques has quit [Quit: quit] 16:18:00 -!- moocowpong1 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:18:36 well there are a lot of cases where gaining resistance/immunity to an effect doesn't cure that effect 16:19:03 i think curing whichever effect is probably the exception rather than the rule in those cases? 16:19:57 http://pastebin.com/AMkBDLsA here was the conversation, if anyone wants to read it 16:20:23 even when rpois actually blocked most? all? poison it did not cure existing poison 16:20:42 conversation was vaguely in favor of making rPetrify cancel out Petrifying, but no action was taken 16:20:47 %git c417ed5 16:20:47 07N7829102 * 0.16-a0-2683-gc417ed5: Improve Wild Magic card (theTower). 10(7 weeks ago, 5 files, 66+ 32-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=c417ed5f1328 16:21:44 geekosaur: "magical dust isn't necessarily the same thing... petrifying, though, is specifically about changing material, so it makes sense that another Trm can override it" 16:22:14 makes sense to me 16:22:25 imo its bad scary magic so it makes sense that another trm can't override it 16:22:32 haha 16:22:37 all magic is scary 16:23:28 !send theTower summon butterflies 16:23:28 Sending summon butterflies to theTower. 16:24:43 how does gaining hunger from hydra form work? i just went from hungry to very full from killing two deep trolls, but killing another two didnt change 16:25:04 MarvinPA: ya flavor can be argued either way; I don't feel strongly about it at all 16:25:40 inspector071: it's capped based on your carnivore level, iirc 16:25:54 !source melee-attack.cc:607 16:25:54 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/melee-attack.cc;hb=HEAD#l607 16:26:05 sort of capped 16:28:08 -!- Krakhan has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:28:26 it just seems weird and unpredictable to me 16:29:13 The angel misses you. Your tendrils lash around the angel's !bad item (cl:100,ty:0,pl:0,pl2:0,sp:0,qu:0) and pull it to the ground! 16:29:16 what is this? 16:29:24 inspector071: I have a vague TODO to improve it. may fix that when I get back 16:29:29 rockygargoyle: blame wheals 16:29:36 !blame wheals 16:29:36 I pronounce wheals... Guilty! 16:29:49 pleasingfungus: ok cool, awesome 16:32:29 pleasingfungus: this happened with an angel created by tso 16:32:51 with a "real" angel this didn't happen 16:33:20 rockygargoyle: toss it up on mantis - bugginess with disarming & summoned creatures 16:33:32 http://imgur.com/f130ZTg 16:33:32 -!- Earlo has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:34:29 feel free to toss that in the ticket 16:34:41 I can't wait for somebody to forget about disarming when ghosts get real equipment 16:35:27 -!- NotKintak has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:36:10 I'll. 16:39:00 done 16:39:09 -!- Krakhan has quit [Changing host] 16:40:18 -!- vonhedlund has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 16:41:32 -!- Lasty has joined ##crawl-dev 16:43:05 rockygargoyle: ty! 16:43:43 Bugginess with disarming & summoned creatures 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=9402 by rockygargoyle 16:49:39 -!- halberd has quit [Changing host] 16:56:46 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:56:48 -!- Chris7 has quit [Quit: Light travels faster then sound, which is why some people appear bright, until you hear them speak] 16:58:44 -!- Kellhus has quit [Quit: Page closed] 17:01:56 -!- bhaak_ is now known as bhaak 17:02:41 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 17:02:45 !source binomial 17:02:46 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/random.cc;hb=HEAD#l283 17:03:09 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:04:26 binomial(6, 40) is giving me way less than I expected. maybe I need to up the probability 17:04:38 what do you expect 17:05:05 average of 2-3 17:05:10 sure 17:05:15 in practice, getting lots of 1s, very few > 3 17:05:21 mostly 1-2 17:05:34 sounds like sample size issue or something broken downstream 17:05:56 in fact, nothing > 1, as far as I can tell. The rest are all bad. . . 17:06:02 yeah, maybe I broke something else 17:06:23 oh, heh. Used min() when I meant max(). :p 17:06:27 rip 17:06:29 classic error 17:07:08 yeah. "I want to set a minimum." "Oh, use max()". :P 17:08:22 -!- alefury has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:08:22 -!- alefury|2 has joined ##crawl-dev 17:08:22 -!- xug has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:11:34 -!- KamiKatze has quit [Quit: Page closed] 17:12:57 -!- Moonsilence has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 17:17:19 -!- debo has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:24:35 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 17:25:23 -!- wat has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:26:10 -!- DayBay has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:28:48 minmax errors! 17:28:56 !tell gammafunk Lasty made a minmax error 17:28:57 Grunt: OK, I'll let gammafunk know. 17:29:01 -!- rockygargoyle has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:29:09 %git HEAD^{/[Mm]inmax} 17:29:10 07Grunt02 * 0.14-a0-2974-g15aa933: Let fighting skill influence Dith's shadow mimic attacks. 10(10 months ago, 1 file, 5+ 4-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=15aa9332fb21 17:29:16 %git HEAD^{/[Mm]inmax}^^{/[Mm]inmax} 17:29:16 07Grunt02 * 0.14-a0-2360-g192af81: Fix a minmax error with Blink Allies Encircling. 10(12 months ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=192af8142f6b 17:29:35 %git HEAD^{/[Mm]inmax}^^{/[Mm]inmax}^^{/[Mm]inmax} 17:29:35 Could not find commit HEAD^{/[Mm]inmax}^^{/[Mm]inmax}^^{/[Mm]inmax} (git returned 128) 17:30:13 Grunt's minmax search had a minmax error... 17:30:14 gammafunk: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 17:30:20 !send Grunt gitgrep 17:30:20 Sending gitgrep to Grunt. 17:30:27 dang...... 17:30:29 that's what he's using, I think 17:30:33 or some weird macro thing 17:30:37 he has weird macro things 17:30:48 probably a macro version of it, ya 17:30:58 Unstable branch on crawl.lantea.net updated to: 0.16-a0-3625-g2624681 (34) 17:31:30 Grunt: did you see 5921b7dc369f 17:32:03 %git 5921b7d 17:32:04 07PleasingFungus02 * 0.16-a0-3637-g5921b7d: Don't zero out evoker power 10(18 hours ago, 1 file, 2+ 2-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=5921b7dc369f 17:32:16 rip... 17:32:23 PleasingFungus: how dare you introduce merge conflicts btw 17:32:23 :b 17:32:39 !blame PleasingFungus 17:32:39 I pronounce PleasingFungus... Guilty! 17:32:59 I live to spite 17:33:09 !learn add PleasingFungus I live to spite 17:33:10 pleasingfungus[19/19]: I live to spite 17:33:13 -!- Mdsm has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:33:16 hm 17:33:53 -!- Lprsti99_______ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:33:55 -!- Zooty has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:34:51 -!- markgo has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:36:41 -!- rockygargoyle has joined ##crawl-dev 17:37:23 -!- Alarkh has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:40:20 -!- endou______ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:42:19 -!- fearitself has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:42:39 -!- halberd has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:50:29 -!- moocowpong1 has joined ##crawl-dev 17:51:22 -!- Daekdroom has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:55:27 -!- HellTiger has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:56:27 -!- Ladykiller69 has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 18:02:31 -!- clouded_ has joined ##crawl-dev 18:05:45 !tell |amethyst It looks to me like it isn't currently possible for the player to override 4b216655 via rcfile due to how ch_force_autopickup and _is_option_autopickup work; as long as one function added with add_autopickup_func returns true, the item will be autopickuped regardless of anything else 18:05:45 elliptic: OK, I'll let |amethyst know. 18:05:53 -!- alefury|2 has quit [] 18:06:50 -!- Napkin_ has joined ##crawl-dev 18:09:19 -!- ldierk has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:09:19 -!- Zaba has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:09:19 -!- Gretell has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:09:20 -!- st_ has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:09:20 -!- imantor has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:09:20 -!- cribozai has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:09:20 -!- minmay has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:09:20 -!- MartinW has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:09:20 -!- odiv has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:09:21 -!- Adder has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:09:21 -!- Finwe has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:09:21 -!- Napkin has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:09:42 -!- Napkin_ has quit [Changing host] 18:09:42 -!- Napkin_ has joined ##crawl-dev 18:10:49 -!- Zaba has joined ##crawl-dev 18:11:18 -!- LexAckson has joined ##crawl-dev 18:12:23 -!- ldierk has joined ##crawl-dev 18:14:08 -!- tcsc has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 18:15:09 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 18:15:42 -!- ystael_ has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:20:27 03Lasty02 07* 0.16-a0-3626-g660aead: Tie randart bad properties to number of good properties more 10(2 minutes ago, 1 file, 8+ 19-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=660aead3edcd 18:21:59 -!- mamgar has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 18:22:27 cool, finally figured out how to asychnronously run a process in tornado and return the output 18:24:38 A great vortex of raging output appears around gammafunk! 18:25:20 gammafunk: I knew you'd like +Twstr! 18:30:40 -!- Crehl has quit [Read error: Network is unreachable] 18:32:46 -!- edlothiol has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:35:02 -!- Amnekian has quit [Quit: Saindo] 18:40:32 -!- mamgar has quit [Quit: Exit Stage Left] 18:40:37 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 18:46:45 Lasty: haha 18:46:51 -!- MgDark has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:51:29 -!- raskol` has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:53:22 -!- stanzwecha has quit [Quit: au rev] 18:53:43 -!- Zeia has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 19:00:06 -!- siepu has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:00:55 -!- PleasingFungus has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.91 [Firefox 34.0.5/20141126041045]] 19:01:19 Lasty: what is the practical implication of that commit? 19:01:44 I haven't been following all of the convo about it and for some reason the commit message isn't making me fully grasp it 19:02:14 Artifacts will 1) be less bonkers than they are now, and 2) the more good properties they have, the more likely it is that they'll have a bad property or two. 19:03:57 so trying to dilute them a bit an make it more of a trade off on whether you want to use it since there will more likely be more bad ones 19:05:55 er, not exactly. More like, make the ratio of good to bad more consistent, and make the number of total properties less absurd. After this, the average should be about 2-4 properties, and the more properties there are, the more likely some will be bad. 19:06:34 Instead of having a ton of properties which are overall at a fixed 1:3-ish bad:good ratio 19:06:45 -!- scummos| has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 19:07:08 -!- Wolfechu has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 19:07:21 so maybe the low end will be better and the high number will be a bit worse 19:07:29 Something like that 19:07:32 -!- Menche has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:08:20 sounds neat 19:08:46 does objstat make randarts? 19:09:24 gammafunk was asking if I wanted to regularly update mapstats and/or objstats. I haven't made time to do that yet 19:10:08 it does make randart summaries, but not exactly the kind Lasty would want to lookat 19:10:17 and it only summarizes brands, actually 19:10:30 well brands and enchants and curses 19:11:10 summarizing artp individually doesn't seem too useful 19:11:11 bummer 19:11:18 03Lasty02 07* 0.16-a0-3627-g7858ef9: Calculate item plus before turning it into a randart. 10(19 minutes ago, 1 file, 12+ 7-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=7858ef97da49 19:11:18 03Lasty02 07* 0.16-a0-3628-g69e0ba6: Adjust +Twstr spawning 10(8 minutes ago, 1 file, 4+ 2-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=69e0ba6aaa38 19:11:24 well I love spreadsheets 19:11:28 well it's not so much a bummer, it's "how do you summarize this" 19:12:12 seems like a spreadsheet where each row is a randart and each column is an attribute/thing and each cell is the quantity for that attribute (most cells would be blank) 19:12:41 I'm drooling over that. but I like data. often to the point of overstating the value-added benefit 19:12:54 well you need more organization than that 19:12:59 base weapon type, subtype 19:13:04 and depth where generated 19:13:18 even more fun! 19:13:22 but sure 19:13:36 it's not easilly seen an a single sheet tbh 19:14:07 perhaps just columns for br, lvl, type, subtype, artp1, artp2, ... 19:14:59 of course there's a problem even then, which is handling the iterations 19:16:43 hrm, i think I can see a why you could do it that could get you good information 19:16:56 basically just add an iteration column as well 19:17:04 *a way 19:17:13 -!- Gibbs has quit [] 19:19:15 I'll maybe try that approach, since it should be easy to implement, and just dump the results to a seperate file 19:19:46 and in the final spreadsheet it could be just another sheet, I guess 19:20:25 but as for running objstat, the impression I get is it might be best if I just run it myself on e.g. an aws instance 19:20:42 keep crawl servers for running crawl (or at least games) 19:20:54 -!- PleasingFungus has joined ##crawl-dev 19:22:12 gammafunk: what's the update greatplayers command? 19:22:23 it's extremely unintuitive 19:22:27 !update-greatplayers 19:22:28 Mapping greatplayers => 78291 hyperbolic stabwound xyblor elliptic pseudonut mikee itsmu nht casmith789 jaeger clouded marvinpa reid nyaakitty evilmike toastyp theglow ionfrigate valrus jeanjacques ebarrett surr elynae magistern pivotal crate bart ophanim pac jeremie eeviac absolutego ktgrey bmfx vizer yogaflame wahaha simm danharaj johnnyzero swiss hilariousdeathartist kryft basil n1000 sgrunt ac... 19:22:41 :) 19:22:43 don't even *try* to guess the command to update greaterplayers 19:22:59 I can't!!! 19:23:10 -!- jeremie has quit [Quit: Page closed] 19:23:28 need a "verify-fooplayer" command tbh 19:24:06 since nothing stops anyone from just adding themself to the nick 19:24:29 learning sequell commands makes you a greatplayer 19:24:40 sequellplayer 19:24:48 or lispplayer perhaps 19:24:49 there's already a command that updates greatplayers 19:25:01 er 19:25:03 yeah 19:25:12 that's what this discussion has been about? 19:26:06 oh. right. well you could just check the entire list whenever you update them. 19:26:57 well that would mean someone wrote (correctly) "verify-fooplayer", like I said 19:27:16 it's not terribly hard to write it, I'll grant that 19:27:47 -!- Crehl has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 19:27:48 wouldn't purging the entire list essentially work 19:27:55 no 19:28:01 you have to iterate over the crawl versions and check by version, since the list of species is different each version 19:28:27 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:28:30 oh right, update-greatplayers doesn't do that 19:29:00 yeah checks current version, adds those who've won all species to the nick 19:29:16 non-redundantly adds, of course, but that's how !nick works 19:29:40 !cmd !update-greatplayers 19:29:40 Command: !update-greatplayers => !nick greatplayers $(!lg * playable:sp won s=name x=count(crace) title:"" fmt:"${.}" join:" " ?: count(crace)=$(!lg * playable:sp won x=count(crace) fmt:"${x}")) 19:30:00 -!- Crehl_ has quit [Client Quit] 19:30:27 that second lg command is counting how many playable species exist 19:30:47 for goodplayer and century player you could purge the entire list though 19:33:08 !purge gammafunk 19:33:51 %git 19:33:51 07Lasty02 * 0.16-a0-3628-g69e0ba6: Adjust +Twstr spawning 10(30 minutes ago, 1 file, 4+ 2-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=69e0ba6aaa38 19:35:11 -!- ibar has quit [Quit: leaving] 19:35:19 -!- NotKintak has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:36:12 gammafunk: can't !verify-fooplayer just call !update-fooplayer and then check whether the player is in the fooplayer nick? 19:36:25 oh 19:36:36 you mean stopping people from adding themselves to the nick 19:36:45 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.16-a0-3629-g1214780: Reduce Gozag food shop prices to 2/3rds base 10(9 days ago, 1 file, 6+ 3-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=12147800e74f 19:36:45 03Lasty02 07* 0.16-a0-3630-g4eef910: Prevent players with certain sacrifices from joining certain gods 10(19 minutes ago, 1 file, 25+ 0-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=4eef91086993 19:36:47 yeah essentially 19:36:47 did it ever happen? 19:36:47 don't we have permissions magic for that now? 19:36:59 !seen dpeg 19:37:00 I last saw dpeg at Wed Jan 14 01:36:45 2015 UTC (14s ago) saying 'did it ever happen?' on ##crawl-dev. 19:37:06 elliptic: would be nice if we could mark entries as somehow only updatable by certain users or I guess commands? 19:37:50 I haven't really looked carefully at the authorization stuff but it seems like something that should be added there if it isn't already 19:38:01 dpeg: we know you added yourself, trying to pass off as centuryplayer! 19:38:38 !learn del lasty_to_do[9 19:38:38 !learn del lasty_to_do[7 19:38:38 !learn del lasty_to_do[5 19:38:38 !learn del lasty_to_do[4 19:38:38 Deleted lasty to do[9/11]: look into removing 0.8 AEVP amnesty for spellcasting 19:38:38 Deleted lasty to do[5/10]: |amethyst: Lasty: I did, but I added a FIXME or two 19:38:39 Deleted lasty to do[7/9]: invert item.plus assignment and make_item_randart (makeitem.cc) 19:38:39 Deleted lasty to do[4/8]: Lasty: oh, the lugonu bribe vault probably needs an entry for Ru (even if it is just Ru = "no" ) 19:38:40 I'll ask the snark at some point when I finish up this other stuff 19:38:43 ...wow 19:39:41 fr: !deleteall entry [start] [stop] 19:39:50 !deleteall gammafunk 19:39:58 sorry I'm read-only 19:40:05 sudo deleteall gammafunk 19:40:19 gammafunk: pretty sure https://github.com/greensnark/dcss_sequell/blob/master/docs/learndb.md#acls should do what you want 19:41:01 or at least can restrict things so that only certain users can update a nick 19:41:33 -!- y2s82_ has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 19:41:38 making it so that only certain commands can update it probably isn't possible at the moment 19:41:42 hrm, is there something for users that have voice? 19:41:46 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 19:41:53 instead of just +authenticated 19:41:55 Oops, hit the wrong entry . . . 19:42:02 !learn add lasty_to_do look into removing 0.8 AEVP amnesty for spellcasting 19:42:02 lasty to do[8/8]: look into removing 0.8 AEVP amnesty for spellcasting 19:42:09 * Grunt removes Lasty. 19:42:11 oh I guess just @devteam would be fine 19:42:18 er 19:42:26 yeah that should work 19:43:04 -!- bullock has quit [Quit: Page closed] 19:43:36 FR: learn del entry[4, 5, 6 19:44:55 hrm, I guess it'd work if we made a "devnicks" entry, since e.g. sgrunt is Grunt's entry in @devteam 19:45:49 yeah, do !learn set :group:devteam or some such I think 19:46:48 oh, that ...is @foo different from the nick entry foo? 19:47:18 yeah, I think @foo refers to groups in ACLs 19:47:24 see https://loom.shalott.org/userdef.html#acls 19:48:11 -!- LexAckson has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:49:37 -!- link_108 has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 19:51:37 -!- Yllodra has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 19:53:09 -!- nicolae- has joined ##crawl-dev 19:57:53 -!- NotMyLeg has quit [Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client] 20:00:42 -!- minmay has joined ##crawl-dev 20:02:26 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 20:04:57 -!- read has quit [Quit: class] 20:05:41 elliptic: wanna talk about removing the 0.8 AEVP spellcasting penalty? Right now it's max(25 * you.adjusted_body_armour_penalty(scale), 0) + 25 * you.adjusted_shield_penalty(scale) - 20 * scale. 20:06:43 Changing it to 22 * would leave plate armour w/ 15 Armour and 20 Str about the same. It'd make everything lighter a little bit heavier . . . 20:10:31 -!- doy has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in] 20:12:03 -!- PleasingFungus has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:12:56 -!- doy has joined ##crawl-dev 20:13:16 -!- PleasingFungus has joined ##crawl-dev 20:13:45 Lasty: remind me about the motivation for this 20:14:53 are you supposed to be able to get rN++ on randarts now 20:15:27 i think technically it can happen if you get a randart amulet of warding but maybe it was changed in the big randart upheaval of '15 20:15:44 it was generated on a weapon 20:15:57 ah. 20:16:30 -!- JaGGedTK has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.2.0 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/] 20:19:08 I knew it could happen and I don't feel strongly about it 20:19:49 i also have difficulties being passionate about rN+ 20:19:59 you are all so negative 20:20:09 rCare 20:20:32 |amethyst: in https://github.com/neilmoore/dgamelaunch-config/blob/szorg/utils/trigger-rebuild.pl, is line 28 necessary? 20:21:13 PleasingFungus: thanks to removing a flat 0.8 penalty, it's really easy to completely remove all spellcasting penalty from armours with ER 7 or lower, but not from heavier ones; as a result, the increased casting difficulty of higher armours is dramatically larger than in lower ER armours, where it basically does not exist. 20:22:22 This has two effects: 1) a sharp increase in casting difficulty at an arbitrary ER point, below which ER means nothing for casting difficulty, and 2) armours below this divide end up being disproportionately good for spellcasting characters 20:23:02 I'm in favor of rN++, and I intentionally added that to the initial version of the new randarts 20:23:04 is that the desired state? 20:23:25 <|amethyst> gammafunk: oh, no it's not.. I made the same error in auth_save_downloader.pl too 20:23:25 |amethyst: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 20:24:03 |amethyst: and can you point me to what lock-or-die is in the rebuild script? 20:24:28 I couldn't find a reference to that things definition 20:24:30 maybe I'm blind 20:24:37 <|amethyst> gammafunk: https://github.com/neilmoore/dgamelaunch-config/blob/master/sh-utils 20:24:40 ah 20:24:42 ty 20:26:29 <|amethyst> !tell elliptic re 4b216655 (the trog thing) yeah, that's a problem... the ideal solution would be for autopickup_exceptions to respect order rather than doing deny-overrides 20:26:30 |amethyst: OK, I'll let elliptic know. 20:27:07 <|amethyst> !tell elliptic or failing that, to allow chk_force_autopickup functions to distinguish "not permitted" from "denied" 20:27:07 |amethyst: OK, I'll let elliptic know. 20:27:40 Lasty: I'm not incredibly fond of the arbitrary ER point, but I really don't feel strongly about light armour being good for spellcasters. it seems like that might be a good thing. 20:27:43 for early-game hybrids especially. 20:28:49 ??hybrid[2 20:28:49 hybrid[2/6]: hold on, how am i supposed to cast AND level up melee skills 20:29:12 <|amethyst> it's a little weird that you can generally wear leather with no spellcasting penalty, but I'm not sure it's a *problem* 20:29:33 PleasingFungus: well, yeah, light armour should be good for spellcasters, but I think it makes sense to have a small, non-zero spellcasting penalty for switching from robes to SDA 20:29:50 <|amethyst> err, SDA? 20:29:57 swampDA 20:30:00 <|amethyst> oh 20:30:07 <|amethyst> there usually is a penalty isn't there? 20:30:20 It goes away with remarkably little str/armour skill 20:30:23 goes away 100% 20:30:51 around 12 str + 10 armour skill is zero penalty for swampDA 20:31:00 but pretty much anything heavier always imposes a meaningful penalty 20:31:02 also ring which has the same ER 20:31:03 <|amethyst> 10 armour skill is a big investment 20:31:32 it's big initially but not later really, you want to get some for almost everyone 20:31:58 mostly it manifests as preferring leather over ring early 20:34:20 I don't think it's so clear cut: robes tend to have better egos and the AC gain from leather (over robe) is initially really small, too. 20:34:43 a lot of caster builds arent actually going to hit zero penalty for a long time 20:34:49 just the penalty probably won't be relevant 20:34:58 because you want more spell levels for spellpower in any case 20:35:02 and its small 20:35:10 ^ regarding ring 20:36:57 Generally the people wearing light armours have no trouble getting spells castable, since they're probably investing in them to a reasonable degree 20:37:36 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 20:37:37 Even if they're weak enough and low enough Armour skill that there's still some penalty 20:38:16 yeah, but in the case of a spell school/character where all i want to do is get the spell castable regardless of power, that penalty will be relevant 20:38:23 are too many people using leather, ring, swampda, etc? 20:38:25 just most spellcasting BGs are concerned with power 20:38:35 I don't really think they are... 20:38:57 so i think its more a consequence of how spellcasters work than the ER->spell fail formula, but i don't really have a deep understanding of it either 20:40:03 PleasingFungus: I aim for something in the ring/MDA/swampDA/QDA range on the majority of my characters 20:40:03 I'd use swampda on almost every char if I could 20:40:23 good ac, good ev, good spell success, what's not to like 20:40:33 huh 20:40:36 this has not been my experience 20:40:39 enchanted/ego ring mails also seem rather common 20:40:47 realistically you do lose a significant amount of ev 20:40:54 especially in the short run 20:40:54 I use those armours often but not by any means overwhelmingly 20:41:21 sure, but you don't need to get 15 dodging just to get non-zero returns 20:41:35 you don't need to do that for anything anymore 20:41:45 unless you have like 3 dex, I guess 20:41:47 actually i don't know how much the dodging change impacted ring specifically, yeah 20:41:58 well my mu had to get quite a bit for dodging in plate 20:41:59 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…] 20:42:02 even though it had a ton of str 20:42:03 yeah, that was a great change IMO 20:42:05 !lg . mu x=str 20:42:05 23. [str=31] REMOVEMUMMYFROMCRAWL the Anointer (L23 MuMo of Okawaru), escaped with the Orb and 3 runes on 2015-01-11 23:11:42, with 1442434 points after 79140 turns and 3:56:41. 20:42:06 it may have made what lasty is talking about worse or better 20:42:09 i'm not sure 20:42:55 -!- eb has quit [] 20:43:05 !lg kvaak x=dex 20:43:05 778. [dex=15] perunasaurus the Insei (L3 OpMo), slain by a hobgoblin (a cursed -1 club) on D:2 on 2015-01-12 15:39:19, with 37 points after 959 turns and 0:02:21. 20:43:09 !lg kvaak x=dex mu 20:43:09 23. [dex=15] REMOVEMUMMYFROMCRAWL the Anointer (L23 MuMo of Okawaru), escaped with the Orb and 3 runes on 2015-01-11 23:11:42, with 1442434 points after 79140 turns and 3:56:41. 20:43:44 !log kvaak mu 20:43:44 23. REMOVEMUMMYFROMCRAWL, XL23 MuMo, T:79140: http://crawl.develz.org/morgues/trunk/REMOVEMUMMYFROMCRAWL/morgue-REMOVEMUMMYFROMCRAWL-20150111-231142.txt 20:44:04 kvaak: can you elaborate a little more wrt dodging, plate armour,e tc? 20:44:16 <|amethyst> looks like your 15.8 skill doubled your EV 20:44:44 if I change the multiplier to 19 and remove the 0.8 bonus, I get the transitions: a Str 7 caster in leather armour w/ 0 Armour skill go from ~30% casting chance to 43%; a swamp dragon user w/ 9 str and 12 Armour skill goes from 50% failure to 77%; a plate armour wearer with 20 str and 15 Armour goes from 45% to 41%. 20:44:48 was your ev negative when you started, or...? 20:45:09 it was 4 when I put that plate on iirc 20:45:15 !ev 20:45:15 Race: str: dex: ER: dodging: armour: :: EV: 8 20:45:17 if I put it at 20 or higher, then plate gets worse 20:45:26 is !ev up to date? 20:45:31 i think you need to consider the EV loss given typical dodging levels, though 20:45:40 Lasty: I would describe those changes as being "bad', rather than "good. 20:45:41 dunno, let's check 20:45:42 " 20:45:44 the ring may not actually be better defensively 20:45:51 !ev mu 31 15 18 16 16 20:45:52 Race: mu str: 31 dex: 15 ER: 18 dodging:16 armour: 16 :: EV: 15 20:45:54 PleasingFungus: What would "good" changes look like to you? 20:46:07 well it gives the correct result at least 20:46:16 !ev mu 31 15 18 10 16 20:46:17 Race: mu str: 31 dex: 15 ER: 18 dodging:10 armour: 16 :: EV: 10 20:46:21 !ev mu 31 15 18 5 16 20:46:21 hm. in general, I quite like the current situation with armour 20:46:21 Race: mu str: 31 dex: 15 ER: 18 dodging:5 armour: 16 :: EV: 7 20:46:28 it's one of my favorite crawl subsystems 20:46:32 PleasingFungus: So you would describe those changes as changes? :D 20:46:36 huh 20:46:41 I think I'd vaguely like it if steam dragon armour was better in some way 20:46:54 initially I calculated I'd need double digit dodging to get any returns 20:46:56 which this would, arguably, do 20:46:56 tbh i feel worse for poor old MDA 20:47:00 <|amethyst> I wouldn't mind seeing the spellcasting penalty for completely untrained leather go up a little 20:47:05 completely obsoleted by QDA 20:47:10 but I guess the massive amount of str I picked up over time lowered the requirements quite a bit 20:47:11 can't have ozo's 20:47:19 |amethyst: ditto. 20:47:26 QDA doesn't obsolete anything as long as it refuses to exist outside zot and v5 20:47:32 -!- Daekdroom has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:47:35 ^ 20:47:40 well 20:47:42 it's not in zot either 20:47:46 -!- socks_ has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 20:47:46 -!- ballingt has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 20:47:55 Also, to be fair, that's the casting chance for a character w/ 20 int and no training in any magic of any kind for an L2 spell. Training even a few levels of magic drops the fail chance to 1% really fast. 20:48:00 well swamp does exist in 50% of games 20:48:02 <|amethyst> also, QDA just got nerfed 20:48:15 -!- tensorpudding has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 20:48:43 <|amethyst> now it obsoletes swamp DA instead 20:48:44 -!- Guest80958 has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 20:48:50 yeah but it has always done that, there's never been a MDA lair branch however 20:48:56 Gotta head out. I'll check in on where the discussion goes later. 20:49:02 -!- Lasty has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:50:17 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:50:54 i think steam is in a better place but i don't love either of them 20:51:44 <|amethyst> turn rSteam into rWater 20:51:51 yes please 20:52:01 <|amethyst> (not swimming) 20:52:06 -!- Sonata has quit [Read error: Network is unreachable] 20:52:24 <|amethyst> but then at least SDA would be a little useful in shoals 20:52:28 * PleasingFungus hisses. 20:52:29 -!- Lprsti99_______ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:52:49 * Grunt roars! 20:53:03 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.16-a0-3631-ga6ec205: Properly cap hydra hunger 10(57 minutes ago, 3 files, 26+ 14-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=a6ec205d9710 20:53:06 * |amethyst splashes sizzlingly! 20:53:06 !send |amethyst Steam Ball 20:53:06 Sending Steam Ball to |amethyst. 20:53:17 make steam dragon armour it into djda, djinn dragon armour, makes you levitate and have "essense points", which are "hp + mp" in a combined meter, and where casting spells... 20:53:23 s/it // 20:53:34 !banish gammafunk 20:53:34 PleasingFungus casts a spell. gammafunk is cast into Hell! 20:54:15 and no it can't be called simply 'dda' since that conflicts with the dragon armour from deep dragons 20:54:33 if you find ozo's steam becomes quite good 20:54:39 but now you have to cast ozo's all the time 20:55:17 i do find robe interactions with shield etc to be convenient 20:55:45 DrKe: do you ever use FDA or StoDA much? 20:56:00 the problem with both of those is late availability 20:56:18 well sure, but you can find a decentish ring/scale to carry you 20:56:22 i sometimes use them 20:56:41 they're in a weird place, on heavy chars i usually want plate, on light chars they're too heavy 20:56:50 but if i happen to have that amount of str that is in the middle and have a hide i will use it 20:56:53 fr dragon scale mail 20:56:54 yes, and while I carry them I'd rather blow those half dozen EA scrolls on my aux armour than walk around with -6 AC 20:57:39 yeah I'm more willing to do that if I have aux armour with an ego 20:57:52 -!- jbenedetto has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:58:10 frankly if I have lots of EA I'll gladly just dump it on plain aux armour 20:58:14 egos are nice but don't grow in trees 20:58:38 "of the Forest" ego 20:58:39 fr 20:59:02 only if you dump the damn forest inhabitants back where they came from 20:59:12 Do you guys still think we could need more negative egos? Someone said this a while back... 20:59:37 dpeg feels negative. 20:59:41 I added more yesterday 21:00:12 PleasingFungus: which? 21:00:20 rN- and rPois- 21:00:36 PleasingFungus: I think dpeg means item egos, not randart properties. 21:00:40 oh 21:00:43 um 21:00:44 i don't really like negatives on weapons, because it's another thing that you have to pay attention to because you can actually address it 21:00:47 there aren't negative item egos 21:00:49 tho 21:00:53 !send PleasingFungus ponderousness 21:00:53 Sending ponderousness to PleasingFungus. 21:00:55 well, there's ponderous 21:00:56 on armor they are ok 21:01:01 I meant what PleasingFungus means. 21:01:02 that is regarding randarts though, so nvm 21:01:07 or not nvm 21:01:09 someone else was calling artps egos 21:01:20 oh 21:01:21 make noise an ego 21:01:23 v0v 21:01:26 blankety blank of noise 21:01:28 agreed 21:01:38 it seems a pretty simple thing to make an ego, at least 21:01:57 at least for weapons 21:01:58 but loudness is already taken 21:02:03 there are only 90 other nouns to choose from 21:02:10 like... noise? 21:02:22 I do not actually think that we have a particular need for negative egos. 21:02:23 that seems too passe 21:02:30 how about 21:02:32 +Twstr 21:02:36 gammafunk: no 21:02:38 gammafunk: how about 21:02:40 gammafunk: *Twstr 21:02:41 *Twstr 21:02:45 *Twstr 21:02:47 DrKe: hi... 21:02:58 what about weapon type specific egos 21:03:30 neither do i, really, but it's fun to throw out ideas, and then throw them out 21:03:30 anyway, new randarts are cool and exciting! 21:03:31 like reach for polearms that only lets you use it if something is in the way, so you always have to experience that 21:03:37 * bh pokes dpeg 21:03:43 * dpeg drops dead 21:03:54 good job, bh, look what you did 21:03:59 rip 21:04:10 * nicolae- sacrifices the dpeg corpse to Makhleb. 21:04:13 well I guess with weapons there's the problem only randarts can get wacky stuff anyway 21:04:15 dpeg rejoins the land of the living... 21:04:36 fr chaos as a randomly generated brand 21:04:40 no 21:04:42 I think there's also more stuff to steal from other games :) 21:04:52 !steal dpeg 21:04:57 agreed. there should be a tetris minigame. 21:05:06 nicolae-: we have chokoban 21:05:15 i just think something like rF- on an otherwise good weapon is really annoying because it's trivial to switch to +8 broadsword of mundanity to kill ice dragons 21:05:26 -!- Lprsti99_______ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:05:29 so it really just gives you another thing to think about 21:05:32 hrm, yeah that's a good point 21:05:34 and puts you closer to 52/52 21:06:06 oh no, more things to think about.............. 21:06:06 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 21:06:15 it's not a fun thing to think about though 21:06:29 can be, contextually 21:06:31 it's i'm in a situation which is only threatening if i forget to switch my sword, otherwise it is trivial 21:06:41 I don't like "ohahah you forgot about negative resist damage!" too much in general 21:06:53 it could be if your other weapon is only a +0 broadsword of mundanity and the ice dragon could wreck you anyways, yeah 21:06:55 depends on which enemies you're facing - esp if the sword has other, positive resists 21:06:59 also 21:07:13 but its usually a case of mwahaha yes 21:07:18 maybe have a guarantee that the negative resists have a positive resist? 21:07:19 rF- vs ice dragons is generally not a problem (excepting a certain period several months ago) 21:07:53 lets say just for the sake of argument that ice dragons check rF+ 21:07:54 An ogre mage comes into view. You die... 21:07:56 PleasingFungus: who would make such a dumb mistake 21:08:03 probably someone really cool 21:08:10 since i can't possibly come up with another hypothetical 21:08:21 ya 21:08:21 it's impossible 21:08:27 there's no other hypothetical that could be offered 21:08:37 if ice dragons didn't check rF, your entire argument would be demolished 21:09:00 <|amethyst> !send DrKe rSticky- 21:09:00 Sending rSticky- to DrKe. 21:09:07 DrKe: I think negative resistances are not the most exciting bad traits... but it is a start 21:09:18 (and sometimes it really matters, more in armour pieces, of course) 21:09:30 i mean i'm not averse to it on a hat or something 21:09:36 that's cool with me because you cant easily swap the hat 21:09:44 when you are facing down the mighty frostflame dragon 21:09:55 <|amethyst> solution: make swapping weapons take as long as armour 21:09:57 so its not just a tedious step you need to remember to take 21:09:58 fr frostflame, checks both rC and rF 21:10:14 crystal bolt 21:10:20 Kramin: simultaneously though 21:10:44 I kind of want an Ice/Fire spell, now that it's feasible. don't know what it would do, though 21:10:45 yes, simultaneously, like some weird violation of thermodynamics 21:10:48 ditteaux 21:11:06 it should be called Freezer Burn 21:11:11 lol 21:11:16 dang. 21:11:16 DrKe: what about rings of fire/ice 21:11:33 aren't they bad for the same reason 21:11:53 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: http://chrono.wikia.com/wiki/Antipode_Bomb 21:11:56 i like thinking about combining elemental schools in new ways, fire/ice, fire/air, earth/ice, earth/air, etc. 21:11:57 i suppose, but they're going to be just swaps for a vast majority of characters, so it doesn't come up as much 21:12:10 i have made the same blunder with them, but not as frequently 21:12:59 my best idea was "fill an area with blocks of ice & fire vortices to block passage". it was not a good idea 21:13:16 -!- Ququman has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:13:51 yeah, my only zot:5 death wasn't related to negative resists, but I put on the wrong rings, getting rc++ instead of rf++ vs. orb of fire; that's maybe one instance where a crazy HDA macro would have saved my lack of attention 21:14:42 hm 21:14:47 how many Zot:5 deaths do I have now 21:14:51 !lg . zot:5 s=ckiller 21:14:51 6 games for Grunt (zot:5): 2x an Orb Guardian, 2x an orb of fire, a golden dragon, a storm dragon 21:14:53 yeah ive definitely had the rF0 orb of fire death 21:14:55 probaly more than one 21:15:17 I remember most of those, but not one of the Orb Guardian ones 21:15:24 !lg . zot:5 ckiller=orb_guardian 1 21:15:24 1/2. SGrunt the Immaculate (L27 HuAr of Zin), mangled by an Orb Guardian on Zot:5 (hall_of_Zot) on 2013-07-01 00:35:31, with 537406 points after 118361 turns and 6:57:44. 21:15:28 -!- dpeg has quit [Quit: sleep] 21:15:29 that's the one I remember 21:15:31 !lg . zot:5 ckiller=orb_guardian 2 21:15:31 2. SGrunt the Sorcerer (L26 SpSk of Gozag), slain by an Orb Guardian (kmap: hall_of_Zot) on Zot:5 on 2014-05-23 02:41:35, with 619082 points after 162226 turns and 7:09:17. 21:15:34 ah 21:15:39 I wondered if that was the other one 21:15:46 so let's see: 21:16:14 zinja gone bad, stair death, overconfidence, typo, wearing the wrong ring, teleport gone bad 21:16:32 in other words: rip... 21:16:39 haha, that's the slug of grunt games 21:17:03 * Grunt slugs gammafunk. 21:18:09 Grunt and gammafunk merge to form a giant gruntfunk 21:19:40 -!- notid1 has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 21:22:24 hm 21:22:43 is there something else that the "wpn" in "artefact_wpn_prop" could refer to? 21:23:35 Redundant -cTele announcement 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=9403 by Aule 21:25:15 -!- debo has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:26:54 oh, that one's mine 21:27:07 rip 21:27:12 !blame PleasingFungus 21:27:13 I pronounce PleasingFungus... Guilty! 21:27:15 also don't ask me how that stuff works 21:28:03 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 21:28:41 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.16-a0-3632-g2f3dc07: artefact_*_wpn_* -> artefact_*_* 10(7 minutes ago, 20 files, 116+ 118-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=2f3dc07e1a7b 21:28:57 rip artefact weapons 21:29:01 <_< >_> <_< >_> 21:29:01 -!- socks_ has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 21:34:49 -!- NotKintak has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:37:17 -!- endou______ has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 21:44:02 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.16-a0-3633-g6873515: Improve prop banning code 10(3 minutes ago, 1 file, 12+ 21-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=687351533216 21:44:59 !ban PleasingFungus 21:45:00 Grunt: check out the old version of "case ARTP_CAUSE_TELEPORTATION" from that commit 21:57:26 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 21:59:39 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 22:04:45 -!- Fhqwhgads_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:05:52 -!- gressup has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 22:07:15 <|amethyst> slide from this week's lecture: http://www.cs.uky.edu/~neil/network.pdf 22:07:50 <|amethyst> also "Muhammad Al-Khwarizmi, Persian computer scientist" and "Euclid, Greek computer scientist" 22:08:19 Xen (L17 MuBe) ASSERT(in_diamond_int(r->start)) in 'ray.cc' at line 166 failed. (Spider:5) 22:09:22 -!- Zanziabar has quit [Quit: Page closed] 22:09:45 -!- Lawman0_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:10:15 Xen (L17 MuBe) ASSERT(in_diamond_int(r->start)) in 'ray.cc' at line 166 failed. (Spider:5) 22:11:02 uh-oh 22:11:17 <|amethyst> !crashlog Xen 22:11:18 3. Xen, XL17 MuBe, T:53019 (milestone): http://dobrazupa.org/morgue/Xen/crash-Xen-20150114-040957.txt 22:11:20 <|amethyst> !crashlog Xen -2 22:11:21 2. Xen, XL17 MuBe, T:53485 (milestone): http://dobrazupa.org/morgue/Xen/crash-Xen-20150114-040801.txt 22:11:23 -!- y2s82_ has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 22:11:45 <|amethyst> same position on both crashes 22:14:47 Crash using iron rod 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=9404 by Xentronium 22:15:04 -!- Blomdor has quit [Quit: Page closed] 22:21:52 rrraaayyy...cccccc 22:26:03 -!- DayBay has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:26:07 -!- DayBay_ is now known as DayBay 22:29:15 rayving mad.... 22:30:51 -!- nicolae- has left ##crawl-dev 22:34:48 the code's in disarray 22:37:00 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 22:39:20 * |amethyst stumbles about in disarray. 22:39:24 * |amethyst smashes the stack! 22:39:28 -!- Baconkid has quit [Quit: Page closed] 22:39:44 You crash... Do you want your variables identified? 22:41:21 -!- demiskeleton has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:41:52 -!- P_R_Deltoid has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 22:46:35 -!- moocowpong1 has quit [Quit: moocowpong1] 22:47:02 -!- P_R_Deltoid has quit [Ping timeout: 243 seconds] 23:00:20 !learn set gammafunk[4] speedruns: MiBe^Mak DEFE^Veh HESu^Sif DESu^Sif 23:00:21 gammafunk[4/12]: speedruns: MiBe^Mak DEFE^Veh HESu^Sif DESu^Sif 23:00:28 -!- socks_ has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 23:01:04 !learn edit set gammafunk[3] CeAM^Oka NaVM^Chei MfSk^Xom VSWz^Ru HOAs^Zin HuSu^Jiyva SpEn^Ash KoWr^Dith TrHu^Qaz 23:01:04 Syntax is: !learn edit TERM[NUM] s/// 23:01:15 !learn set gammafunk[3] CeAM^Oka NaVM^Chei MfSk^Xom VSWz^Ru HOAs^Zin HuSu^Jiyva SpEn^Ash KoWr^Dith TrHu^Qaz 23:01:15 gammafunk[3/12]: CeAM^Oka NaVM^Chei MfSk^Xom VSWz^Ru HOAs^Zin HuSu^Jiyva SpEn^Ash KoWr^Dith TrHu^Qaz 23:01:18 .gfnext 23:01:18 SpEn^Ash 23:01:26 careful there 23:01:28 less you be 23:01:29 SpEnt 23:01:42 oh right 23:03:26 !learn set gammafunk[8] non-experimental: SpEn^Ash KoWr^Dith TrHu^Qaz 23:03:26 -!- Menche has quit [Quit: zZz] 23:03:26 gammafunk[8/12]: non-experimental: SpEn^Ash KoWr^Dith TrHu^Qaz 23:03:46 !learn swap gammafunk[5] gammafunk[8] 23:03:47 Swapped gammafunk[5] with gammafunk[8]. 23:04:13 !learn set gammafunk[3] CeAM^Oka NaVM^Chei MfSk^Xom VSWz^Ru HOAs^Zin HuSu^Jiyva 23:04:13 gammafunk[3/12]: CeAM^Oka NaVM^Chei MfSk^Xom VSWz^Ru HOAs^Zin HuSu^Jiyva 23:04:17 .gfnext 23:04:17 CeAM^Oka 23:04:21 .gfnext 23:04:21 NaVM^Chei 23:08:00 greaterplayer still asks for death knight. not a bug if it's attuned to 0.15, a bug if it's attuned to trunk 23:08:38 !cmd greaterplayer 23:08:38 Command: !greaterplayer => .echo $(do ${1:-.} "")$(greathelper2 cls ${1:-.} backgrounds greaterplayer playable:job $*) 23:08:45 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 23:08:55 !cmd greathelper2 23:08:55 No command !greathelper2 23:09:07 !fn greathelper 23:09:07 !fn greathelper (a b c d e) $(!lg * $e s=$a o=-$a / won @$b format:"${.}" title:"Unwon $c for $name" stub:"$name is a ${d}!" ?:N=0) 23:09:09 !fn greathelper2 23:09:09 !fn greathelper2 (a b c d e f) $(!lg * $e $f s=$a o=-$a / won @$b format:"${.}" title:"Unwon $c for $name$(if $f " ("$f")")" stub:"$name$(if $f " ("$f")") is a ${d}!" ?:N=0) 23:09:53 !kw backgrounds 23:09:54 No keyword 'backgrounds' 23:10:44 oh I see 23:11:12 -!- mong has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.0.1] 23:11:50 -!- P_R_Deltoid has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 23:14:10 -!- debo has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 23:21:35 -!- tcsc has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 23:22:08 -!- Kintak has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:25:00 Unstable branch on CRAWL.XTAHUA.COM updated to: 0.16-a0-3633-g6873515 (34) 23:25:16 -!- bencryption has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.8] 23:27:47 -!- Brannock has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:29:00 -!- DrKe has quit [] 23:40:56 -!- P_R_Deltoid has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:42:58 -!- inspector071 has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 23:43:26 -!- P_R_Deltoid has quit [Read error: Network is unreachable] 23:47:52 -!- simmarine has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:56:33 -!- gammafunk has quit [Quit: leaving] 23:58:29 !tell lasty http://pastebin.com/xcgW1dVc 23:58:29 PleasingFungus: OK, I'll let lasty know. 23:59:39 -!- gammafunk has joined ##crawl-dev