00:00:58 -!- rossi has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:03:37 03|amethyst02 07* 0.15-a0-2005-g9555e25: Improve spell name lookup. 10(52 minutes ago, 1 file, 10+ 4-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=9555e25a93d5 00:03:37 03|amethyst02 07* 0.15-a0-2006-g1cf06be: Refactor god and spell search using templates. 10(22 minutes ago, 3 files, 62+ 47-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=1cf06be6ea14 00:03:53 -!- tswett has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 00:04:02 !send |amethyst factors 00:04:02 Sending factors to |amethyst. 00:04:07 -!- conted has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:05:25 -!- CSDCS has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:06:04 -!- Eldarby has quit [Client Quit] 00:06:29 <|amethyst> !send Grunt binder1st 00:06:29 Sending binder1st to Grunt. 00:06:43 I wonder if there's a good way to display stone/bullet damage in the sling description. It seems like something I'd want to display, since the 'base damage' is pretty misleading... 00:06:52 I guess it's more of a question of code than layout. 00:06:55 oh, ooops re the ball lightning thing 00:07:02 wind drake (16k) | Spd: 12 | HD: 8 | HP: 46-73 | AC/EV: 3/12 | Dam: 12 | fly, DMsl, !sil | Res: 06magic(32), 12wind | Chunks: 07contam | XP: 287 | Sp: trample breath; airstrike (0-26), melee | Sz: Large | Int: animal. 00:07:02 %??wind_drake 00:07:10 * PleasingFungus blames gammafunk!!!! 00:07:10 spriggan air mage (11i) | Spd: 10 (move: 60%) | HD: 14 | HP: 37-62 | AC/EV: 1/22 | Dam: 16 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, spellcaster, see invisible, lev, DMsl | Res: 06magic(130), 10elec++ | Chunks: 07contam | XP: 987 | Sp: airstrike (0-38), b.lightning (3d19), control winds, haste | Sz: little | Int: high. 00:07:10 %??spriggan_air_mage 00:07:32 well the old vault was probably terrible in my defense! 00:07:36 haha, "trample breath" 00:07:44 and I can't remove a terrible thing 00:08:14 Unstable branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.15-a0-2004-g21f9508 (34) 00:08:15 trample breath....huh yeah that's in interesting description 00:08:25 doesn't seem to appear anywhere in the actual codebase 00:08:42 Trample breath was a joke suggestion for the name which stuck. 00:08:52 I'm sure the conversation is logged somewhere :) 00:09:36 probably ##grunt 00:09:42 damg 00:09:43 I wanted to tweet it :( 00:09:43 dang 00:09:43 although I think DO made those monsters 00:09:55 Actually, wind drakes were originally my creation. 00:10:01 aha 00:10:19 They date back to the old old forest work when they were forest drakes <_< 00:10:19 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: you can tweet code from monster, it's okay :) 00:10:21 <|amethyst> ??monster 00:10:22 monsters[1/4]: The most up-to-date code for %?? and %? can be found at http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=monster-trunk.git , or clone from http://s-z.org/neil/git/monster-trunk.git , branch 'bleeding-edge-crawl'. 00:11:04 -!- Kintak has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:11:04 Cloning into 'monster-trunk'... 00:11:07 MONSTER TRUNK 00:11:44 <|amethyst> http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=monster-trunk.git;a=blob;f=monster-main.cc;hb=bleeding-edge-crawl#l417 00:11:55 tweeted it right before you linked :) 00:12:00 <|amethyst> hah 00:12:20 the power of grep....... 00:12:38 <|amethyst> it linked beam.name :) 00:14:01 yeah I noticed that 00:14:05 so many tlds... 00:16:58 <|amethyst> ah, here was the origin of the name: 00:17:06 <|amethyst> %bug 7199 00:17:06 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=7199 00:18:33 " Just wear boots of ultimate suckage, once their sucky name gets changed. " 00:18:54 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.15-a0-2006-g1cf06be (34) 00:19:11 -!- Guest31402 has quit [Changing host] 00:19:11 -!- Guest31402 has joined ##crawl-dev 00:19:15 -!- Guest31402 is now known as BlastHardcheese 00:19:22 were there "boots of stability" or something? 00:21:03 -!- Shome has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90.1 [Firefox 30.0/20140605174243]] 00:21:52 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 00:23:58 -!- MrPeeps has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 00:25:46 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 00:25:46 -!- DrinkMachine has quit [Changing host] 00:25:46 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 00:27:49 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: "boots of the spider" were originally "boots of ultimate suction" 00:27:54 o 00:27:56 dang 00:28:25 hot stuff 00:29:06 |amethyst: http://sprunge.us/EPLh opine 00:30:35 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: so this will display three different numbers? 00:30:39 yes 00:30:46 of which only 2 are meaningful 00:30:50 <|amethyst> what do crossbows display? 00:31:24 <|amethyst> just the weapon damage I guess 00:32:02 <|amethyst> maybe make it something like 00:32:22 -!- tinybat has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:32:27 <|amethyst> Base damage: 10-13 00:32:35 <|amethyst> except I guess that might not fit? 00:33:09 <|amethyst> I guess that's unclear too 00:33:53 <|amethyst> what about including the damage of the fires_ammo_type() in "Base damage:" 00:34:01 <|amethyst> then adding one extra line for slings? 00:34:13 <|amethyst> using MI_SLING_BULLET instead 00:34:19 well, that's currently 0 for bows 00:34:23 and will shortly be 0 for xbows 00:34:32 but oh, I see what you mean 00:34:34 yes 00:34:48 <|amethyst> oh, and I guess it can't be zero for stones 00:34:50 <|amethyst> because throwing 00:34:52 yep 00:34:59 well. actually. 00:35:02 with the way throwing works now 00:35:06 it actually could be 0 00:35:09 I think 00:35:46 <|amethyst> that would be confusing to players anyway 00:35:50 yeah 00:35:58 now that the damage is actually displayed 00:38:04 -!- Lightli has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:40:00 How to phrase it. "When firing bullets: base damage 10"? 00:41:07 "Base damage with bullets: 10". 00:41:26 <|amethyst> hm, perhaps 00:42:23 <|amethyst> could line up the : with the current base damage message, but that's annoying to maintain I guess 00:42:26 it's all so verbose 00:42:27 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 00:44:00 <|amethyst> like 00:44:01 <|amethyst> Base accuracy: -1 Base damage: 10 Base attack delay: 1.4 Minimum delay: 0.7 00:44:04 <|amethyst> Firing bullets: Base damage: 13 00:44:22 -!- Lightli has joined ##crawl-dev 00:44:24 -!- WalkerBoh has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:44:32 <|amethyst> oh, but 00:44:39 <|amethyst> _append_value doesn't fix the width 00:44:41 <|amethyst> so never mind 00:44:52 also 00:44:59 this isn't showing up in the greatsling description 00:45:07 and I'm not sure why 00:45:18 -!- magicpoints has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:45:57 oh god right weapon_skill is misnamed 00:45:58 ffs 00:46:53 ...and if I check range_skill instead of weapon_skill, the description shows up on the hunting sling instead of the greatsling. 00:46:55 help 00:47:10 <|amethyst> not on both? 00:47:12 Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.15-a0-2006-g1cf06be 00:47:14 not on both 00:47:27 with weapon_skill, it shows up on the hunting sling but not the greatsling 00:47:37 weapon_skill(item) == SK_SLINGS 00:47:52 <|amethyst> wait 00:48:09 <|amethyst> weapon_skill shouldn't return a ranged weapon skill at all 00:48:13 yes 00:48:26 I'm wondering if I broke is_range_weapon 00:48:26 -!- Keanan has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 00:48:39 %git 724f6538fe8f6054561caa03f5b7f1973263d297 00:48:39 Could not find commit 724f6538fe8f6054561caa03f5b7f1973263d297 (git returned 128) 00:48:45 oh 00:48:47 I didn't push it 00:48:53 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: CADENZA-CLASS CLOCKWORK KNIGHT--OPERATION TERMINATED] 00:50:10 <|amethyst> yeah, it works fine in trunk 00:50:52 <|amethyst> range_skill returns SK_SLINGS for both, and weapon_skill does not 00:52:35 ah ha 00:52:38 I lost a layer of indirection 00:53:18 was using Weapon_prop[wpn_type] instead of Weapon_prop[Weapon_index[wpn_type] 00:53:20 ] 00:54:40 <|amethyst> ah 00:54:56 -!- Pepe has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:58:22 -!- Keanan has joined ##crawl-dev 00:59:04 huh. now I suspect that function may never have worked at all 00:59:06 'oops' 01:02:33 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.15-a0-2007-g7eaa6eb: Refactor 10(2 hours ago, 2 files, 11+ 7-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=7eaa6eb283b0 01:02:33 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.15-a0-2008-gaf8ee80: Remove an unused variable 10(2 hours ago, 1 file, 0+ 2-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=af8ee80d6102 01:02:33 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.15-a0-2009-g94659ac: Partially refactor mulching 10(80 minutes ago, 3 files, 85+ 50-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=94659acff8f4 01:02:33 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.15-a0-2010-g669a935: Display weapon damage on ammo 10(76 minutes ago, 3 files, 13+ 14-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=669a9351b1e2 01:02:33 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.15-a0-2011-gf59e580: De-obfuscate chaos ammo description code 10(68 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 7-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=f59e580eefff 01:02:33 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.15-a0-2012-g603073e: Display less misleading sling base damage 10(7 minutes ago, 3 files, 24+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=603073ef4d6b 01:02:38 <|amethyst> is #6293 fixed? 01:02:38 <|amethyst> "Slime creature ends up in teleport trap while stairdancing but does not teleport" 01:02:46 <|amethyst> I guess that part is fixed, but rchandra also comments that it happens when swapping with allies too 01:04:53 !bug 6293 01:04:54 https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=6293 01:05:01 yes 01:05:04 hence 01:05:24 !bug 8768 01:05:24 https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=8768 01:05:33 which I've been totally unable to reproduce 01:06:06 huh, that's a cool old tele tile. 01:06:10 what's that one, |amethyst ? 01:06:49 <|amethyst> rchandra: swapping with allies from a trap not triggering the trap 01:07:41 blast from the past. probably worth seeing if it still happens, though tele traps seem less common and permanent now. 01:08:04 I've done it as part of testing 01:08:15 it was functionality that I explicitly added 01:08:29 not tele traps specifically; swapping with allies, or stairdancing, previously wouldn't trigger any traps 01:09:29 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: aha, I hadn't been sure whether you handled swapping too 01:09:36 separately, yes 01:10:07 can't recall if I did it before or after fixing those horrible crashes from monsters climbing stairs into shafts 01:10:48 -!- minmay has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 01:10:58 solution: monsters can't take stairs with you on the other end, but can fight through stairs and follow you when you move. 01:11:11 what problem are you solving 01:11:29 monsters stairdancing into traps 01:11:38 also using stairs for safety 01:12:04 monsters won't stairdance into any traps that they know about and wouldn't walk into normally 01:12:16 -!- bhaak has joined ##crawl-dev 01:12:33 -!- minqmay has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:12:50 I'm not convinced that 'using stairs for safety' is a thing that needs to be 'fixed' 01:14:40 I just want the whole dungeon to be alive but that's huge effort and probably memory/cpu for minimal effect 01:14:53 !send rchandra hyperactive ballistomycetes 01:14:54 Sending hyperactive ballistomycetes to rchandra. 01:18:18 03|amethyst02 07* 0.15-a0-2013-g119cbf9: Stop exploring/running when cancelling ally swap (#8768) 10(11 minutes ago, 1 file, 3+ 0-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=119cbf9ebd36 01:18:18 03|amethyst02 07* 0.15-a0-2014-g043111f: Revert "Don't autotravel through monsters caught in nets" 10(8 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 8-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=043111f78d95 01:18:18 03|amethyst02 07* 0.15-a0-2015-g9a0c33d: Remove an extra break. 10(79 seconds ago, 1 file, 0+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=9a0c33d08245 01:18:55 huh 01:19:06 oh, yeah, I remember that break 01:21:04 stuff.cc can very nearly be renamed to "prompt.cc". 01:21:10 Very close. 01:23:51 -!- Patashu has quit [Quit: Page closed] 01:25:37 -!- UncertainKitten has quit [Quit: Connection reset by pier.] 01:26:39 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: I just added something to libutil.h so... 01:26:59 ? 01:27:18 <|amethyst> %git 1cf06be6 01:27:18 07|amethyst02 * 0.15-a0-2006-g1cf06be: Refactor god and spell search using templates. 10(2 hours ago, 3 files, 62+ 47-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=1cf06be6ea14 01:27:53 ah, the ru redirect thing is still there 01:27:54 <|amethyst> if you have a suggestion for a better location for find_earliest_match I'd be happy to move it 01:28:11 ah. no strong feeling at the moment 01:28:58 I wonder if it would fit well with stuff.cc's letter_to_index and index_to_letter 01:29:26 -!- DrinkMachine has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:29:54 maybe not 01:31:20 !bug 8318 01:31:20 https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=8318 01:31:52 do you think anything should actually be done about this? I guess "ghosts" could have a description. if they don't 01:32:17 ah, they do 01:33:41 !tell lasty maybe the ru redirect in handle_mons_spell could move to around where the antimagic check is (line 3291, mon-cast.cc). This is a very "toilet paper tube" view. 01:33:41 rchandra: OK, I'll let lasty know. 01:34:38 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: well, they could have a tile anyway 01:34:51 what would be more appropriate than a ?, though? 01:34:59 <|amethyst> a ghost? 01:35:16 http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_macgdfyqFW1rwmb58.gif 01:35:25 <|amethyst> I mean, if we're going to tile them as ? we might as well go back to naming them 'removed MONS_GIANT_SLUG' 01:35:58 -!- Nomi has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:36:01 ghost (16W) | Spd: 10 | HD: 1 | HP: 1 | AC/EV: 0/0 | 07undead, 10doors, evil, lev | Res: 09poison+++, 12drown, 04rot+++, 13neg+++, 13torm, 04napalm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 1 | Sz: Medium | Int: normal. 01:36:01 %??ghost 01:41:17 hm. I wonder if the iiam ghost is copyrighted 01:42:19 -!- gastrox has quit [Quit: Page closed] 01:44:00 -!- rchandra has left ##crawl-dev 01:47:04 -!- rophy has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:49:12 |amethyst: http://i.imgur.com/rISmguT.png y/n 01:50:57 <|amethyst> better than a question mark 01:51:15 <|amethyst> someone can improve it if they want :) 01:51:22 what if the original creator of iiam ghost comes after dcss with a copyright violation claim??? 01:51:26 <|amethyst> oh 01:51:35 literally my only concern here 01:51:37 <|amethyst> I didn't realise that was a copy of something 01:51:54 <|amethyst> yeah, I wouldn't use something without a clear license allowing us to use it 01:52:00 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fq3abPnEEGE 01:53:20 anyway 01:53:25 -!- PleasingFungus has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90.1 [Firefox 33.0a1/20140702030201]] 01:54:20 03|amethyst02 07* 0.15-a0-2016-g65a70f9: Replace some function objects with functions. 10(21 minutes ago, 1 file, 9+ 21-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=65a70f904cc3 01:54:40 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:55:00 Monster stats Crawl version: 0.15-a0-2016-g65a70f9 01:55:00 <|amethyst> %??-version 01:55:03 orc (04o) | Spd: 10 | HD: 1 | HP: 4-10 | AC/EV: 0/10 | Dam: 5 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors | Res: 06magic(4) | XP: 3 | Sz: Medium | Int: normal. 01:55:03 <|amethyst> %??orc 01:55:11 kobold (07K) | Spd: 10 | HD: 1 | HP: 2-5 | AC/EV: 2/12 | Dam: 4 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors | Res: 06magic(1) | Chunks: 09poison | XP: 1 | Sz: small | Int: normal. 01:55:11 <|amethyst> %??kobold 01:59:56 -!- Evablue has quit [Quit: Evablue] 02:01:18 -!- tswett has joined ##crawl-dev 02:01:33 -!- Staplegun has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:02:05 -!- ais523_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 02:02:27 -!- HellTiger has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 02:02:36 -!- ruwin has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:07:06 -!- Dixlet_ has joined ##crawl-dev 02:07:18 -!- Evablue has quit [Client Quit] 02:09:47 -!- Dixlet has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:12:04 -!- purge_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:13:01 -!- bmfx has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:14:32 -!- TR_Muscateer has joined ##crawl-dev 02:18:07 -!- Whistling_Bread has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:18:43 Unstable branch on crawl.beRotato.org updated to: 0.15-a0-2016-g65a70f9 (34) 02:21:32 -!- NeremWorld has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:23:59 -!- orionstein is now known as orionstein_away 02:25:20 -!- gammafunk has quit [Quit: leaving] 02:25:43 -!- gammafunk has joined ##crawl-dev 02:26:25 -!- gammafunk has quit [Client Quit] 02:26:38 wow bows are inaccurate beyond belief 02:26:45 -!- gammafunk has joined ##crawl-dev 02:49:20 -!- Dixlet has joined ##crawl-dev 02:50:10 -!- ZRN has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:50:40 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:51:27 -!- NeremWorld has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:51:49 -!- Dixlet_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:58:33 -!- lobf has quit [Quit: lobf] 03:02:38 -!- tsohg has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:08:51 -!- minmay has joined ##crawl-dev 03:24:28 -!- Patashu has joined ##crawl-dev 03:30:22 -!- simmarine has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:30:43 -!- eki has quit [Quit: leaving] 03:34:43 -!- Patashu_ has joined ##crawl-dev 03:34:43 -!- Patashu has quit [Disconnected by services] 03:34:48 -!- ProzacElf has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:37:18 -!- Wolfechu has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:39:18 -!- FlowRiser has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:44:08 -!- edlothiol has joined ##crawl-dev 03:44:22 -!- tksquared_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:48:52 -!- Keanan has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 03:52:14 hey devs 03:52:16 plant (03P) | Spd: 070 | HD: 10 | HP: 38-70 | AC/EV: 10/0 | 03plant, !sil | Res: 13magic(immune), 03poison, 12drown, 13neg+++, 13torm | XP: 0 | Sp: iron shot (3d21) | Sz: small | Int: plant. 03:52:16 %??plant spells:iron_shot 03:52:17 FR 03:54:52 -!- zxc232 has joined ##crawl-dev 04:04:42 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 04:10:35 -!- broquaint has joined ##crawl-dev 04:16:26 -!- dgu has quit [Quit: Leaving] 04:24:01 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:25:37 -!- Wahaha has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 04:26:19 -!- FlowRiser has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:27:49 -!- Guest3423 has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.2] 04:43:58 -!- Basil has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:44:00 -!- scummos| has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:44:38 -!- tksquared has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:53:54 -!- alefury has quit [] 05:04:02 ??nemelex 05:04:02 nemelex xobeh[1/4]: The gambling god. In return for sacrificing anything and everything, you get decks of cards, as well as abilities that let you manipulate the decks in your favor. Nemelex abilities use evocations instead of invocations, and can be used while silenced. 05:04:06 ??nemelex[2 05:04:07 nemelex xobeh[2/4]: Nemelex's gifts are 40% destruction, 30% summoning, 20% escape, and 10% wonders. 05:04:09 ??nemelex[3 05:04:09 nemelex xobeh[3/4]: Abilities: Draw One lets you draw a card without wielding the deck. Peek at Two shows you two cards and identifies the deck. Triple Draw draws three cards and gives you the choice of which to take. Deal Four draws four cards at once and uses up the deck. Stack Five chooses 5 cards for you to reorder, discarding the rest. 05:04:11 ??nemelex[4 05:04:11 nemelex xobeh[4/4]: Information for most cards can be found in the learndb, under ?? card. Card descriptions can be looked up in-game with ?/C. 05:04:14 hmm 05:04:18 isn't this outdated? 05:04:21 for trunk that is 05:04:27 yes 05:06:49 which decks does he give now? 05:07:04 -!- zxc232 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:07:04 defence, war and escape? 05:08:32 -!- Ququman has joined ##crawl-dev 05:13:16 -!- Lumpydoo has quit [Quit: Page closed] 05:14:48 -!- gammafunk has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:22:52 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:27:18 -!- Adder_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:34:33 -!- Kramin has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:45:20 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:46:12 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Client Quit] 05:54:45 -!- tksquared_ has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 06:04:41 -!- dpeg has joined ##crawl-dev 06:05:03 !tell PleasingFungus Very good move on door closing! 06:05:04 dpeg: OK, I'll let pleasingfungus know. 06:12:08 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.15-a0-2017-gf806da2: Fix rounding when closing doors 10(26 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=f806da227c38 06:12:10 not sure about that, it makes a pretty normal action take a weird unexpected amount of time for not very significant gain i think 06:12:10 hm, I have been using doordancing and I'm just happy that I cannot do that anymore 06:12:10 There would sure be other solutions (the door could count how often it is being opened/closed and with increasing chances jam or something, but I considered the aut solution to be very simple) 06:12:10 -!- Cheibriados has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:13:28 -!- Cheibriados has joined ##crawl-dev 06:13:28 -!- The topic of ##crawl-dev is: Crawl Development | Logs: http://s-z.org/crawl-dev/ | People with +v have commit access. | Please keep general Crawl-related chit-chat to ##crawl. | Dev wiki: http://crawl.develz.org/wiki | Long stuff to pastebin.ca please | Immortal Warwalrus and Crazy Yiuf forever. 06:13:28 -!- The topic of ##crawl is: Check out new European server at ??clan! | Play Crawl online now: type ??cao, ??cdo, ??cszo, ??clan, or ??webtiles for instructions | http://crawl.develz.org | FooTV: termcast.develz.org | ##crawl-offtopic: You got your gender in my peanut butter! Xom thinks this is hilarious. 06:15:02 -!- Lasty1 has joined ##crawl-dev 06:52:32 -!- Lasty1 has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 06:53:26 -!- Textmode has quit [Quit: "It was one dev, naked in a room with a carton of cigarettes, a thermos full of coffee and bourbon, and all his summoned angels."] 06:56:13 -!- rossi has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:59:30 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 07:02:58 -!- Chezzo has joined ##crawl-dev 07:03:23 -!- Sgeo has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:05:35 Hi again. I'm trying to redo the tiles without spoiling the game. You guys said you liked my GUI icons. I looked on the wiki, and only learned that the glowing blue skills are selected ones. The top row then is skills unused, what are the other two rows. 07:06:11 What do the other two rows of skills represent? 07:07:05 There's shading that says which ones you can and can't do, right? So it can't be that. 07:08:23 -!- rockygargoyle has joined ##crawl-dev 07:15:18 -!- dpeg has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 07:19:38 -!- Chezzo has quit [Quit: Page closed] 07:21:12 -!- CSDCS has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:28:00 -!- _D_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:34:13 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 07:36:18 -!- Chezzo has joined ##crawl-dev 07:36:29 Hey anybody here? 07:36:37 -!- syllogism has joined ##crawl-dev 07:37:29 So I'm doing the tiles on the gui and I have a question about skills. http://chezzo.com/dcss/current/screenshot.png 07:39:05 oh god it's so bright 07:39:06 aaaaa 07:39:30 The tiles on gui.png, the white with grey skills are unselected? The glowing blue ones are selected? What do the dark grey and gold tiles represent? 07:39:37 !messages 07:39:37 (1/3) reaverb said (15h 24m 6s ago): There's a crash if you convert to Ru, convert to a differant god, and then convert back to Ru. ASSERT(flags & SFLAG_UNSET) in 'store.cc' at line 729 failed. Lines 3543-3547 of religion.cc [in god_pitch(), declaring CrawlStoreValue::new_vector()] seem to e causing it. 07:39:38 -!- Bloax has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:39:40 <|amethyst> Chezzo: the skill images are: on, focus, off, and maxed out 07:39:41 !messages 07:39:42 (1/2) |amethyst said (14h 49m 57s ago): fixed 07:39:44 !messages 07:39:44 (1/1) rchandra said (6h 6m 3s ago): maybe the ru redirect in handle_mons_spell could move to around where the antimagic check is (line 3291, mon-cast.cc). This is a very "toilet paper tube" view. 07:40:07 Awesome. Thanks. 07:40:34 !learn add ru_to_do Sac Love causes prisms to become hostile, hippogriffs still fail to cast 07:40:34 ru to do[2/2]: Sac Love causes prisms to become hostile, hippogriffs still fail to cast 07:41:25 -!- CSDCS has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:41:35 -!- Chezzo_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 07:43:07 -!- demiskeleton has quit [Quit: Leaving] 07:43:07 -!- puissantveil has quit [Quit: Page closed] 07:43:25 -!- rossi has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:56:27 -!- debo has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 07:56:40 -!- LexAckson has joined ##crawl-dev 07:56:58 -!- stickyfingers has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 08:02:05 -!- CSDCS has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:02:19 -!- tsohg has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:08:19 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 08:09:36 -!- magicpoints has joined ##crawl-dev 08:16:18 -!- magicpoints has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:17:35 -!- stanzill has quit [Quit: on y va] 08:20:33 -!- Alarkh has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:22:02 -!- st_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:22:34 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 08:23:46 -!- rchandra has joined ##crawl-dev 08:24:19 -!- TS__ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:36:44 -!- Tenda has quit [Client Quit] 08:43:01 -!- rossi has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:44:39 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 08:47:46 -!- karlo0 has quit [Client Quit] 08:48:58 -!- scummos| has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:49:47 -!- tksquared has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 08:50:53 -!- rohan__ has joined ##crawl-dev 08:52:01 Hi. I just compiled f806da227c3869a1f6811bf190d140da1374f8aa, loaded an old game (I had to update because there was a bug that caused a crash upon entering swamp.) and now many sprites are sliced and mixed in tiles mode. 09:00:44 -!- MaxFrost has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 09:01:51 -!- tsohg has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:06:16 -!- Utis has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 09:13:10 -!- Euph0ria has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:15:35 -!- rockygargoyle has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:18:11 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 09:30:07 rohan__: sometimes the tile sheets aren't updated properly; running make again should fix it. 09:33:21 Grunt: Thank you. I came to the same conclusion. Am rebuilding at the moment. 09:33:38 -!- tksquared has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:36:03 -!- TR_Muscateer is now known as Whistling_Bread 09:36:04 I accidentally rebuit it without tiles-support first. How come almost everything has to be recompiled with tiles enabled? 09:39:49 -!- negatendo has quit [Quit: poop] 09:44:34 What's the skill that matches the icon of the guy holding a dagger? I looked on the wiki, and all skills are present and accounted for. 09:45:02 Er, the hands holding a dagger, downwards. 09:48:37 -!- Farcaster has quit [Client Quit] 09:49:40 -!- scummos| has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 09:49:49 -!- MgDark has quit [Client Quit] 09:49:57 -!- lessens has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 09:50:11 Also, what's the keyhole tile's skill? 09:52:07 -!- Lightli has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 09:53:57 -!- orionstein_away is now known as orionstein 09:54:27 -!- as56t has quit [Quit: Page closed] 09:55:37 -!- scummos^ has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 09:55:58 -!- Alarkh_ has quit [Quit: Leaving] 09:57:22 -!- puissantveil has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 10:06:24 -!- Guest19308 is now known as Wensley 10:06:40 -!- jaumoose has quit [Quit: Leaving] 10:09:25 -!- Patashu_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:10:00 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 10:11:32 -!- st_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:12:04 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 10:13:28 -!- Chezzo has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 10:15:02 -!- ystael has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 10:15:52 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:18:59 -!- ystael has quit [Client Quit] 10:22:25 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 10:23:57 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: ["Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com"]] 10:24:32 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 10:28:52 -!- Sage1234 has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 10:29:57 -!- Alarkh has quit [Quit: Leaving] 10:31:16 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 10:31:56 -!- radinms has quit [] 10:32:36 -!- mopl has quit [Quit: Page closed] 10:35:19 -!- shackes has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:39:19 -!- shackes has quit [Client Quit] 10:41:35 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 10:41:39 I think an accurate description of _item_okay_to_clean would be "return true if it's okay to destroy this item because there are too many items", right? 10:42:13 -!- rossi has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:44:14 BRB. 10:44:17 -!- tswett has quit [Quit: tswett] 10:53:15 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:55:43 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:00:04 -!- _D_ has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 11:04:05 -!- elliptic has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:05:40 -!- TS__ has joined ##crawl-dev 11:05:59 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 11:07:57 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:10:34 -!- Nomi has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:12:12 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 11:12:18 -!- PleasingFungus has joined ##crawl-dev 11:14:22 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 11:14:49 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 11:17:04 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:22:35 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:24:05 -!- absolutego has quit [Quit: leaving] 11:25:50 is there a way to remove one of the game' builtin force_more_messages? I find it pretty annoying that pressing e now gives me a --more-- 11:26:23 -!- Chezzo has quit [Client Quit] 11:27:08 -!- Chezzo has joined ##crawl-dev 11:28:29 -!- tsohg has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:31:10 -!- Demagog has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90.1 [Firefox 33.0a1/20140710030200]] 11:35:01 -!- UncertainKitten has joined ##crawl-dev 11:36:51 -!- CKyle_ has joined ##crawl-dev 11:39:35 -!- CKyle has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:42:01 -!- rockygargoyle has joined ##crawl-dev 11:45:23 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 11:52:29 -!- twelwe has quit [Quit: Page closed] 11:52:57 -!- tswett has joined ##crawl-dev 11:56:35 marvinpa may be correct about the door-closing fix being an error. 11:56:35 PleasingFungus: You have 2 messages. Use !messages to read them. 11:56:47 how does it go. "for every problem in life, there is an answer which is simple, elegant, and wrong?" 11:57:22 -!- lobf has joined ##crawl-dev 11:57:29 closing doors while hasted ends up really awkward as a result, also 11:57:48 it can take anywhere between 7 and 10 aut 11:58:16 Would changing the number from 1.3 to 1.2 fix that? 11:58:59 would change it to 7-9 aut i guess 11:59:12 Where's the randomization come from? 11:59:51 fixing the equally bad error of it always rounding down previously 11:59:52 %git 11:59:52 07MarvinPA02 * 0.15-a0-2017-gf806da2: Fix rounding when closing doors 10(6 hours ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=f806da227c38 12:00:37 !source div_rand_round 12:00:37 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/random-var.cc;hb=HEAD#l203 12:00:47 before that it would always take either 7 or 9 aut 12:00:54 I... honestly did not realize that div_rand_round was a random function 12:01:07 I guess that explains the "rand" in the middle 12:01:32 yes! it is an important function 12:01:53 -!- stickyfingers has quit [Quit: Page closed] 12:02:14 lots of things used to not round randomly, although i think skills were the worst offenders and they have their own thing now 12:02:26 So you get weird hidden breakpoints, etc. 12:03:40 I guess hasted door closing is the least of the problems with that fix, though. 12:04:16 -!- Basil has joined ##crawl-dev 12:07:21 right, mainly it seems pretty weird/unexpected and addresses a problem that i'm not convinced needs solving 12:08:18 mm. it isn't the most urgent problem, but I would like to fix it - it is a dumb behavior to encourage, and randomized energy doesn't really work to prevent it, for the usual reasons that randomized energy fails to work. 12:08:42 this isn't a good fix, though. feel free to roll it back. 12:09:03 i don't think it needs solving in such a specific way, rather 12:09:19 if there were to be some fix i would imagine it'd be a general change to how energy randomisation works 12:09:22 -!- Nomi_ has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:09:39 since it's basically the same thing as pillar dancing, you just don't move 12:10:09 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 12:10:24 Sure. The difference being that it's easier to play weird positioning tricks to stay out of enemy LOS and make them forget about you... 12:11:21 -!- Kellhus has quit [Quit: Page closed] 12:12:12 And the other difference being that door-closing is a much less common action than "moving", so it's easier to make changes to that directly, if we wanted to. (E.g., dpeg's "make doors sometimes break instead of closing if they've been closed too many times" thing, though that specific idea is a little That-Other-Game-y.) 12:12:35 -!- CKyle_ has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 12:12:51 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.15-a0-2017-gf806da2 (34) 12:14:48 ??igni 12:14:48 igni[1/2]: An experimental god branch on CSZO. The new god is described in this commit: http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commit;h=c07910ae6d3bea3a66328782ca471c5a7da96add 12:14:57 ??igni[2 12:14:57 hammer[1/4]: Hammer, Damage Rating: 7, Accuracy Rating: +3, Base Attack Delay: 13 12:15:05 uhh.. 12:15:07 there's also the already-existing "doors can creak when you close them" attracting new monsters 12:15:07 ??igni[2 12:15:07 hammer[1/4]: Hammer, Damage Rating: 7, Accuracy Rating: +3, Base Attack Delay: 13 12:15:13 ??igni[2] 12:15:13 hammer[1/4]: Hammer, Damage Rating: 7, Accuracy Rating: +3, Base Attack Delay: 13 12:15:29 what the hell... 12:15:41 !learn del igni[2] 12:15:41 Deleted igni[2/2]: see {hammer} 12:15:53 O_o 12:16:00 wait, why was that there? 12:16:55 smith god, hammers...? 12:17:06 also I think he turned enemy weapons into hammers? at some point, maybe? 12:17:30 MarvinPA: yeah, true. I've never had a good intuition for how loud door-creaking actually is 12:17:38 ...in the game 12:17:44 10 louds 12:17:59 PleasingFungus: was this that people go "Stop, hammertime" when using a given ability? 12:18:00 10 louds is quieter than fireball,right? 12:18:20 I remember 30 is shatter and 35 is gong . . . 12:19:47 -!- tsohg has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:19:56 Lasty: 15 I think for fireball 12:20:12 shouting is 12, fireball is 15, gong is 40 12:21:02 oh, for some reason I thought fireball was 20 12:21:10 qaz maxes out at 20, right? 12:21:15 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 12:21:15 shouting in spider form with level 2 shoutitis is 10, "hth" 12:21:27 MarvinPA: even with new!shoutitis??? 12:21:33 -!- rohan__ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:21:34 yes 12:21:37 dang 12:21:56 ??fireball 12:21:57 fireball[1/1]: Level 5 Fire/Conjuration spell. Cannot be evaded. Makes noise. Hits a 3x3 area. 12:22:09 haha, "Makes noise." 12:22:17 'a little quieter than a shout' seems like it could be significant 12:22:23 re door 12:22:32 fr: scroll of enchant ring 12:22:55 -!- KurzedMetal has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:23:08 Using "a shout" as a standard metric of noise would be nice 12:23:17 combine player requests and add a scroll of brand ring 12:23:20 !source shout_volume 12:23:21 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/player.cc;hb=HEAD#l6098 12:23:24 Lasty: it is a little quieter than a choko. 12:23:26 "my greatest creation" 12:23:35 Nah, we should be using Qazlal and MicroQazlals. 12:23:39 Has as much nutrition as a shout. 12:23:42 and MiliQazlals 12:24:09 huh, spiders are twice as loud as porcupines 12:24:25 I guess porcupines aren't real anyway 12:24:47 you see how it worked before that, it would have been @crawlcode-worthy if it wasn't so long 12:24:57 They may not be real, but they make amazing noises while eating an ear of corn. 12:25:03 Thanks, YouTube. 12:25:03 your volume depended on the verb you used to shout with 12:25:14 yesss 12:25:33 The quietest word is "syzygy". 12:25:47 Or maybe "sprinkle". 12:25:58 oh that reminds me, i found something in poschengband that puts all of @crawlcode to shame 12:26:10 I'm excited 12:26:30 hm 12:26:31 there's a high level chaos spell called "call the void", and the function that casts it does something like: 12:26:41 And the loudest is "barbarous". 12:26:41 if (cast) { call_the_(); } 12:26:44 ...Anyway. 12:26:49 boooooooooo 12:26:49 hahaha 12:27:15 speaking of strange things 12:27:19 !source cannot_speak 12:27:20 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/player.cc;hb=HEAD#l6050 12:27:31 I'm a little confused about line 6048 12:28:19 indeed 12:28:22 ...oh, I see, that's distinct from treeform-style "can't move" 12:28:31 why are we doing negatives? 12:28:39 cannot_move is just paralysis and petrification iirc 12:28:45 why is it not can_speak? 12:28:58 is_stationary() and cannot_move() are completely orthogonal 12:29:00 obviously 12:29:00 I mean, we don't does_not_have_spell over that function. 12:29:00 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: for one think, I think it might keep you from yelling while paralysed 12:29:02 I notice that items.cc has a bunch of static functions in them. Now you guys have me wondering if turning them into methods would hurt compile time. 12:29:11 |amethyst: yeah, or petrified. I understand now 12:29:16 I was just confusing functions 12:29:35 TZer0: code is hard 12:30:06 PleasingFungus: haha 12:30:32 tswett: tbh, i think one of the better things that could be done is turning a bunch of weird if/else or switch/case code into actual tables & maps 12:31:00 uhh 12:31:06 PleasingFungus: I need to learn map syntax -- there's some Ru code that could really use it 12:31:08 I can also see remnants after lava orcs. 12:31:23 lines 8464-8462 12:31:30 and more. 12:31:32 Yeah, maybe I'll hold off on the making functions into methods thing. 12:32:00 <|amethyst> TZer0: all in an #if TAG_MAJOR_VERSION == 34 12:32:28 <|amethyst> !lm * lo alive 12:32:29 1170. [2014-07-05 08:09:06] PDXTophat the Protected (L14 LOFi of Beogh) reached level 15 of the Dungeon on turn 26944. (D:15) 12:32:43 !lm . lo alive 12:32:44 <|amethyst> !lm * lo alive x=cdist(gid) 12:32:44 19. [2014-04-01 02:15:01] hyperrchandra the Prestidigitator (L15 LOAM of Nemelex Xobeh) killed Rupert on turn 35669. (D:13) 12:32:46 1170 milestones for * (lo alive): cdist(game_key)=182 12:32:59 !source str_to_weapon 12:33:00 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/initfile.cc;hb=HEAD#l200 12:33:06 tswett: look at this fucking thing ^ 12:33:20 Yeah, what's the purpose of this TAG_MAJOR_VERSION stuff? 12:33:26 save compat 12:33:37 when we switch TAG_MAJOR_VERSION, we break save compat 12:33:44 * tswett nods. 12:33:46 <|amethyst> tswett: see docs/develop/save_compatibility.txt 12:33:51 PleasingFungus: needs str == "bow" 12:34:03 and "xbow" :) 12:34:12 rchandra: literally the least of that function's problems 12:34:14 (but true) 12:34:41 ...why does it accept "rocks" but not "stones" 12:34:58 nobody really wants to risk starting with stones 12:35:18 I guess that's supposed to be large rocks 12:35:31 -!- Keskital1 has joined ##crawl-dev 12:36:49 -!- tsohg has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:37:09 What's that function used for, anyway? 12:37:09 I swear, 50% of crawl's code is actually data 12:37:17 sounds about right 12:37:43 -!- Kvaak_ has joined ##crawl-dev 12:37:48 tswett: looks like it's for mapping rcfile settings to starting weapons 12:37:55 * tswett nods. 12:37:57 <|amethyst> tswett: the weapon = option, as well as remembering weapon selection from one game to the next 12:38:21 oh my god 12:38:31 Can the str_to_weapon data be moved out of the code entirely? 12:38:34 !source initfile.cc:2777 12:38:35 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/initfile.cc;hb=HEAD#l2777 12:39:52 -!- jarpiain_ has joined ##crawl-dev 12:39:58 tswett: in principle, yes, though I don't know that there's anywhere that we read non-description data from non-code files. I guess art-data.txt, but that code scares me 12:40:02 -!- bhaak_ has joined ##crawl-dev 12:40:08 tswett: you might also want to look at 12:40:10 !source itemprop.cc 12:40:10 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/itemprop.cc;hb=HEAD 12:40:57 Weapon_prop[] is pretty closely related, though not completely redundant (doesn't include e.g. "viable" or "random", includes weapons that aren't viable starting weapons, etc) 12:41:18 -!- lobf has quit [*.net *.split] 12:41:18 -!- rockygargoyle has quit [*.net *.split] 12:41:19 -!- ystael has quit [*.net *.split] 12:41:19 -!- Crehl has quit [*.net *.split] 12:41:19 -!- bhaak has quit [*.net *.split] 12:41:19 -!- Morg0th has quit [*.net *.split] 12:41:19 -!- mspang has quit [*.net *.split] 12:41:19 -!- Philonous___ has quit [*.net *.split] 12:41:19 -!- phyphor has quit [*.net *.split] 12:41:20 -!- sstrickl has quit [*.net *.split] 12:41:20 -!- OCTOTROG has quit [*.net *.split] 12:41:20 -!- raskol has quit [*.net *.split] 12:41:20 -!- jarpiain has quit [*.net *.split] 12:41:20 -!- syndicus__ has quit [*.net *.split] 12:41:21 -!- Keskitalo has quit [*.net *.split] 12:41:21 -!- unpaidbill has quit [*.net *.split] 12:41:21 -!- Kvaak has quit [*.net *.split] 12:41:21 -!- bencryption has quit [*.net *.split] 12:41:21 -!- pantaril has quit [*.net *.split] 12:41:21 -!- yxhuvvd has quit [*.net *.split] 12:41:21 -!- moose has quit [*.net *.split] 12:42:30 Yeah, could I create a map that does what str_to_weapon does? 12:43:02 -!- rossi_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:43:39 that seems straightforward 12:44:45 I was thinking that you could even do something where you strip spaces out of the provided strings so that you'd accept e.g. "short bow" and "shortbow" without having to enumerate both. that's extra credit, though 12:45:06 !source initfile.cc:2305 12:45:06 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/initfile.cc;hb=HEAD#l2305 12:45:16 (more @crawlcode) 12:45:23 Right now it'll accept "waraxe" but not "huntingsling". 12:45:52 Yeah, lemme just learn how C++ works real quick. 12:47:18 ha ha ha 12:48:25 We're not doing C++11, right? 12:48:30 -!- lobf has joined ##crawl-dev 12:49:13 sadly not 12:49:34 -!- yxhuvvd is now known as yxhuvud 12:49:36 to keep back-compat for pre-intel osx compilation, iirc? 12:49:54 I guess such computers still exist. 12:50:02 msvc still has only partial C++11 support, hasn't it? 12:50:25 <|amethyst> Zaba: 2012 has most of the stuff we'd want to use, and 2013 has more 12:50:38 -!- alefury has quit [*.net *.split] 12:50:52 man. and here I worried I'd run out of godawful crawl code to tweet 12:51:11 -!- nooodl has joined ##crawl-dev 12:51:14 I really wonder if anybody still plays crawl on powerpc macs 12:52:31 -!- ProzacElf_ has joined ##crawl-dev 12:52:43 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 12:53:33 I would if my ibook's hard drive hadn't died :( 12:53:53 (the one component that was effectively impossible to replace) 12:53:57 my powermac g4 is probably fully functional 12:54:34 but even my old netbook is much faster 12:55:57 oh, this is interesting 12:56:08 !source initifile.cc:1063 12:56:08 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/initifile.cc;hb=HEAD#l1063 12:56:17 !source initfile.cc:1063 12:56:18 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/initfile.cc;hb=HEAD#l1063 12:56:31 I wonder how long that test code has been there? 12:57:16 -!- puissantveil has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 12:59:26 %git 673bdae75485d14f759af597c3c62b99601f9a43 12:59:29 07peterb1202 * 673bdae75485: Initial revision 10(9 years ago, 183 files, 153322+ 0-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=673bdae75485 12:59:53 ...h 12:59:55 a 13:01:51 good decade-long "for now" 13:01:59 yes :D 13:05:49 -!- nooodl has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:09:43 -!- LexAckson_ has joined ##crawl-dev 13:09:43 -!- LexAckson has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:10:11 -!- rohan_ has joined ##crawl-dev 13:14:48 PleasingFungus: how many of those "for now"s remain in the code? 13:15:02 -!- simmarine has joined ##crawl-dev 13:16:12 -!- PleasingFungus has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 13:16:17 pyanfar:10077 Z$ grep 'for now' *.{cc,h} | wc -l 13:16:17 41 13:16:53 You puncture the yaktaur! The yaktaur is moderately wounded. The yaktaur disappears!_Your shadow hits something from afar with a dagger. 13:17:10 nice 13:17:14 secret tech 13:17:30 changing rings triggers level entry message for volcano portal 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=8779 by rchandra 13:18:38 -!- LexAckson_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:23:13 -!- Kvaak_ is now known as Kvaak 13:24:34 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 13:24:34 -!- HDA has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 13:27:27 geekosaur: haha 13:27:36 long range melee attacks with dithmenos' shadow mimic 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=8780 by rchandra 13:28:07 we ended up discussing the lantern of darkess in another channel, wouldn't lantern of the damned or something make more sense? 13:28:13 (kinda?) 13:28:27 Lanterns of shadows. 13:28:30 It summons shadows. 13:28:34 *shadows 13:28:36 damn 13:28:38 hurr 13:29:15 -!- gammafunk has joined ##crawl-dev 13:29:23 -!- Wolfechu has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 13:30:57 -!- rohan_ has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 13:31:42 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 13:32:51 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.15-a0-2018-gc3be324: Revert "Make closing doors take 13 aut instead of 10" 10(14 minutes ago, 1 file, 0+ 2-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=c3be324a4c90 13:38:29 here's a great suggestion from XuaXua: make wand of random effects have infinite charges 13:38:50 in order to remove the abuse case of people zapping it at a wand until they give digging, give it a chance to create hostile earth elementals from the wall instead 13:39:54 That was his second choice after "have the wand randomly cast firestorm on your location" 13:40:08 is there really a point to making it any more elaborate? 13:40:52 could just skip all that right to its removal, no? :P 13:41:03 Or leave it as-is, because it's fine. 13:41:27 has the axing quota for 0.15 been filled yet? 13:41:33 I've been out of the loop 13:44:14 -!- moxian has joined ##crawl-dev 13:48:33 -!- tswett has quit [Changing host] 13:48:33 -!- tswett has joined ##crawl-dev 13:51:07 -!- bhaak_ is now known as bhaak 13:51:45 -!- wheals has joined ##crawl-dev 13:53:59 is there a way to remove one of the game' builtin force_more_messages? I find it pretty annoying that pressing e now gives me a --more-- 13:54:10 -!- djetty has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:54:14 this was actually already true if a spriggan pressed e over chunks, for example 13:55:00 why would a spriggan press e over chunks 13:55:20 you don't learn ood on your spens??? 13:56:18 dunno, do old nemelex decks count? 13:57:04 ?qazlal 13:57:07 ??qazlal 13:57:08 qazlal[1/4]: The violent god of natural disasters. Gives SH, temporary resists, RMsl, and clouds surrounding you in a small radius (and immunity to all friendly clouds). See also {upheaval}, {disaster area}, and {elemental force}. At max piety, gives either rF+, rC+, rElec, or 3 AC. 13:57:17 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 13:58:01 anyway, the situations under which e gives a more have not changed from 0.14 13:58:14 -!- wheals has quit [Quit: Page closed] 13:58:35 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 14:05:22 -!- LexAckson has joined ##crawl-dev 14:05:24 -!- LexAckson has quit [Client Quit] 14:07:54 -!- rockygargoyle has joined ##crawl-dev 14:08:23 -!- rohan_ has joined ##crawl-dev 14:17:49 -!- DrinkMachine has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:21:37 -!- Basil has quit [Read error: No route to host] 14:21:45 -!- ystael_ is now known as ystael 14:23:52 -!- Philonous___ is now known as Philonous 14:24:39 -!- PleasingFungus has joined ##crawl-dev 14:25:33 minmay: summoning hostile earth elementals sounds terrible & completely unthreatening 14:25:37 -!- Lightli has joined ##crawl-dev 14:25:38 -!- debo has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:25:49 wand of random effects is pretty low on my list of wands that I'd want to change 14:26:17 significantly lower than flame/frost/mdarts 14:27:08 PleasingFungus: but.. but.. will I keep my tactical weapon in my combat against the evil spores? 14:27:22 -!- Allgodsarefemale has quit [Quit: Page closed] 14:27:47 TZer0: just chuck improvised ranged weapons at the spores. like spare bread rations, for example 14:27:47 Wensley: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 14:28:12 "Eat this!" 14:28:16 Evil Spores is the name of my 0.15 tournament team btw 14:30:20 -!- rockygargoyle has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:32:59 -!- Bloax has joined ##crawl-dev 14:35:06 -!- lobf has quit [Quit: lobf] 14:38:04 -!- behavioral has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 14:42:45 -!- Keanan has joined ##crawl-dev 14:43:13 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 14:43:25 -!- rossi_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:43:34 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: CADENZA-CLASS CLOCKWORK KNIGHT--OPERATION TERMINATED] 14:45:09 Has Crawl always been in C++, or was it originally C? 14:46:19 -!- Staplegun has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:47:38 -!- ProzacElf_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:55:12 -!- ProzacElf has joined ##crawl-dev 14:57:33 -!- debo has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:57:35 -!- ishanyx has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 14:58:37 C++, Linley actually wrote it in order to teach himself C++ 14:58:53 which is why there's so much terrible code in original crawl 14:59:25 BlastHardcheese: ? 14:59:26 was c++ even a widespread thing back in the mid-90's 14:59:30 oh 14:59:34 didn't see tswett . 15:00:05 -!- Keanan has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:00:15 I was wondering since there are a lot of includes ending with .h 15:00:35 tswett: having includes end with h isn't uncommon in C++. 15:00:36 the vast majority of 3-D PC games have been written in C++ since they first started getting made 15:02:18 -!- TS__ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:02:50 and Qt has always been in C++ 15:04:05 If I change just one source file, can I recompile just that one file and then relink, instead of redoing the entire build? 15:05:50 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 15:11:49 -!- rohan_ has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 15:12:31 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 15:13:07 -!- Keanan has joined ##crawl-dev 15:15:29 yes 15:15:35 well. depends on the file 15:15:36 -!- CryptoCactus has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:15:47 Well, it's initfile.cc. 15:15:56 I assume header files would require more stuff to be recompiled. 15:17:04 %git 15:17:04 07MarvinPA02 * 0.15-a0-2018-gc3be324: Revert "Make closing doors take 13 aut instead of 10" 10(2 hours ago, 1 file, 0+ 2-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=c3be324a4c90 15:18:33 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 15:19:08 -!- Galewind has quit [Quit: Page closed] 15:21:41 -!- CSDCS has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:26:35 All right, I have a patch making str_to_weapon use a map. 15:26:47 Should I submit it to the tracker? 15:27:12 It ignores spaces completely, so you can ask for a "longs word" and you'll get a longsword. 15:28:08 yeah, toss it up on the tracker & I'll have a look at it when I get home 15:28:12 can you ask for a DWORD 15:28:23 I was thinking it 15:28:30 What's a DWORD? 15:28:35 -!- Kenran has quit [Quit: Quitting] 15:29:15 You're making a data type joke, aren't you. 15:29:51 admittedly 15:30:25 It would be cool to make it work based on smallest edit distance. 15:30:31 Ask for a "long word", get a longsword. 15:31:04 might be excessive 15:31:20 Ask for a "shossbow", it randomly picks between a short bow and a crossbow. 15:31:24 ha 15:31:28 would be better functionality for the in-game ?/ function 15:31:37 coincidentally, the game really needs to expose ?/ better 15:31:46 please don't ask me how 15:31:54 As for a "", you get a mace. 15:32:38 or, possibly, a dart 15:32:56 though I guess that's not valid starting kit 15:33:20 whats a dart 15:33:49 A very small spear. 15:34:15 I thought it was a kind of large pin. 15:34:38 -!- category has quit [Quit: Page closed] 15:35:53 -!- Kramin has quit [Quit: Bye] 15:36:20 Which "product branch" should I select for master... 15:36:44 (Those dots are chunks produced by butchering a question mark.) 15:37:03 -!- minmay has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:37:38 0.15, probably? 15:38:10 -!- rohan_ has joined ##crawl-dev 15:38:57 -!- minqmay has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:41:02 https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=8781 – here's the issue. 15:41:34 yep, chei will announce it in a sec 15:41:53 -!- twelwe has quit [Quit: Page closed] 15:42:00 -!- eki has quit [Quit: leaving] 15:42:49 dword is obviously a demon sword 15:43:19 Make str_to_weapon use a map instead of a big long if/else chain 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=8781 by tswett 15:43:42 -!- CSDCS has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:49:03 So now what. 15:55:04 -!- HaltingProblem has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:56:07 -!- Chezzo has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:56:24 -!- Trevise_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 15:57:02 [13:28] PleasingFungus yeah, toss it up on the tracker & I'll have a look at it when I get home 15:57:07 we're on step (2) now 15:57:15 or rather, we will be 15:58:58 -!- Keanan has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:01:56 PleasingFungus: I'll be monitering your progress carefully 16:02:25 *monitoring 16:02:34 -!- tcjsavannah has quit [Quit: tcjsavannah] 16:02:42 -!- tswett has quit [Quit: tswett] 16:04:19 dang........ 16:05:10 -!- CSDCS has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:05:26 GLANCING at it right now, it feels like it would be better if we initialized the map once, rather than every time the function was called. that might be a premature optimization, of course 16:05:35 <|amethyst> huh? 16:05:40 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: it's only initialised once 16:05:53 o 16:05:54 <|amethyst> static map _str_to_weapon_map = _create_str_weapon_map(); 16:06:02 I missed that line because I am blind 16:06:14 also, illiterate (gammafunk can back me up on this one) 16:06:31 ok that's fine. does lead in to my second thought 16:06:39 <|amethyst> btw, could avoid the const problem mentioned there by using find instead of operator[] in str_to_weapon 16:07:06 striking thing is that despite his illiteracy, PleasingFungus makes some of the best monster descriptions 16:07:29 basically the beethoven of crawl 16:07:33 but strange indeed are the creatures of the Dungeon 16:08:17 generally c convention is not to hurl around large objects as return values; the more "c-like" way to implement this would probably be declare _str_to_weapon_map & pass a reference to it into _create_weapon_str_map() 16:08:22 probably rename it to _init_weapon_str_map() 16:08:42 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: I don't think that's a problem since this is only called once 16:08:46 true 16:08:47 <|amethyst> and in assignment context 16:09:04 <|amethyst> so most compilers can do RVO 16:09:07 <|amethyst> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Return_value_optimization 16:09:11 dang! 16:09:14 what a world 16:09:30 -!- wheals has joined ##crawl-dev 16:09:35 that tricky |amethyst is hard to defeate because he knows computer science and stuff 16:09:50 mm. what else. would be nice to add a comment to the space-erasing code, since it's not totally obvious what's going on there/what you're trying to do (at a glance) 16:10:03 also would be good to add some docstrings to both functions 16:10:17 check godblessing.cc for a file that's mostly docstring'd 16:10:23 wait, is docstring a pythonism 16:10:25 <|amethyst> static_cast(isspace)) 16:10:29 shit 16:10:31 <|amethyst> why? 16:10:35 haha, the "as-if urle" 16:10:37 a doxygen comment, then 16:10:37 *rule 16:10:58 <|amethyst> no, I mean, why is that cast there? 16:11:40 -!- WereVolvo has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:11:40 <|amethyst> int(*)(int) is the declared type of isspace 16:12:01 <|amethyst> and if it weren't, then casting function pointers is not what you want to do 16:12:51 -!- Blazinghand|Work has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:13:56 I just realized tswett left two minutes before I started critiquing his code 16:13:58 "oops" 16:14:11 well, mantis notes for that at least 16:14:15 or 16:14:23 -!- rohan_ has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:14:37 ...nah, mantis would probably be simplest 16:14:48 -!- Tenda has quit [Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de] 16:15:08 yeah, he'll get an email, and you can also !tell him the bug is updated 16:15:16 not that I need to tell you this; I'm trying to feel useful 16:15:39 I was considering just !telling him, but eh 16:15:40 -!- tsohg has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:15:47 -!- rohan_ has joined ##crawl-dev 16:15:58 how do i get rid of these nasty ^Ms 16:16:09 dos2unix maybe 16:16:17 <|amethyst> wheals: on files you checked out from git? 16:16:26 one i made myself on this branch 16:16:40 <|amethyst> then dos2unix or fromdos if you have it 16:16:40 oh, you're on a windows machine? 16:16:44 yeah 16:17:06 i had the problem when i first started on this new setup but it went away, think it was a setting 16:17:15 <|amethyst> or sed -i.bak -e 's/\r$//' file 16:17:21 hrm, I don't even know how msys handles newlines; is it windows format by default? 16:17:29 oh derp, i think util/checkwhite had handled it 16:17:34 <|amethyst> oh, yeah 16:17:39 but i thought it hadn't since i just did "git show" again 16:17:48 without committing its changes :P 16:17:54 git show, haven't seen that one 16:18:03 * wheals shows gammafunk the door. 16:18:25 You wouldn't be the first 16:19:15 oh, I actually did somethign remotely useful, I swear: I updated the 0.15 plan a bit since we're getting close to release 16:19:21 ??0.15_plan 16:19:21 0.15 plan[1/1]: https://crawl.develz.org/wiki/doku.php?id=dcss:planning:0.15_plan 16:19:37 I'd probably be able to make some patches if people would flesh out any remaining todos 16:19:54 I made some furtive entries myself regarding things like ranged and item balance 16:20:07 as in, what's remaining for that work to be release-complete 16:20:59 in this particular case, the door was a DNGN_BADLY_SEALED_DOOR 16:21:28 If only opening doors took more aut, you wouldn't have to door dance me 16:21:38 but that got reverted, rip 16:21:43 closing doors! 16:21:53 fine, closing doors 16:22:24 maybe I'll just shout out some things now, and people can speak up 16:22:47 Does enchant scroll generation need to be adjusted due to the accuracy/dmg merger? 16:23:08 it was at the time by MarvinPA i think 16:23:18 it feels fine to me, too 16:23:50 iirc it wasn't adjusted for that but i adjusted it for the success rate change 16:23:59 vaguely bearing the merger in mind 16:24:11 yeah looking at objstat, it also seems fine 16:24:35 it was adjusted due to acc/dam merger 16:24:50 which I remember since I did it by hand and put a comment in about it 16:24:56 https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1jUi7mNUQasl4XBgG0aojW-v9AZxhCGraC94a5oNPtgQ/edit the sheet AllLevelsNewWeights 16:24:56 don't recall if it was in the source or in the commits 16:25:05 about 15 in a 3-rune game 16:25:07 seems about right 16:25:32 enough for a good weapon, both melee and a launcher 16:25:56 er s/ a good weapon,// 16:26:17 I'm still not happy with the "one scroll = one plus" change. random failures were frustrating but this system isn't ideal either. 16:26:28 I have some half-formed plans for improvement which I will talk about once they are 16:26:29 more than half-formed 16:26:37 Sounds.... 16:26:40 *enchanting* 16:26:44 the main thing i can think of that needs work to be ready for 0.15 is gozag 16:26:48 !banish gammafunk 16:26:48 PleasingFungus casts a spell. gammafunk is devoured by a tear in reality! 16:26:50 especially his wrath 16:26:58 yeah was just about to ask about the new gods 16:27:15 before Gozag, are there any major Q issues? 16:27:19 qaz seems relatively solid and well-loved. I personally am not that fond of the balance of the 6* gifts 16:27:19 I guess grunt needs to be here 16:27:31 would be interesting to have stats for what people choose 16:27:36 yes his AC gift feels kind of silly 16:27:43 +3 AC vs rF or rC? 16:27:46 i am not that fond of the existence of the 6* gifts, they're super boring 16:27:52 also not that impressed with rElec 16:27:55 you just choose AC always 16:28:02 yeah, that is an overal issue as well 16:28:09 huh. I usually end up choosing rF 16:28:16 I've multiple times suggested increasing the AC bonus and adding either DMsl or some EV to rElec. 16:28:23 well ac is resist everything 16:28:27 and he gives you rF anyway 16:28:40 yeah I guess given that Q gives you those resists, it's actually pretty silly to choose rf or rc, since you surely can get one level from equip and Q takes care of the next level 16:28:58 if you somehow have zero rF items then i would consider rF maybe 16:29:06 the issue is that he only gives you it after you get hit once or twice 16:29:19 and if you're getting hit with multiple elements, he'll flip-flop 16:29:31 this is not an issue with his design, it's an issue for the player relying on them 16:30:02 well I think the idea is that they shouldn't be airtight 16:30:08 otherwise it's the same as just giving the player the resist 16:30:22 oh wow it looks like building on a branch automatically forces a full remake? 16:30:34 wheals: no, it shouldn't 16:30:35 anyway my main problem is the boringness of it rather than the balance, but i am pretty confident that "pick ac close to always" is a thing too 16:30:43 wheals: only if you've changed compilation flags 16:30:59 -DEXPERIMENTAL_BRANCH="\"feature-data\"" 16:31:08 I have been wrong about the strength of game mechanics many times, so I won't argue the ac thing 16:31:14 wheals: are you adding that? 16:31:22 no, i did not 16:31:33 well you could pick rF+ and go IDA 16:31:36 idk. I think it does feel good - getting a Permanent Buff like that, in the same way that getting a good mut does 16:31:42 <|amethyst> no, that was added by gr**nsn*rk (I think) for sequell reporting 16:31:55 wheals: actually, maybe I am getting recompiles but I use ccache, are you using ccache? 16:32:00 it helps immensely 16:32:03 my concern is with the balance rather than the basic concept 16:32:15 i tried to get ccache working here but it didn't really seem to work 16:32:21 <|amethyst> could make that part of the makefile depend on USE_DGAMELAUNCH 16:33:02 MarvinPA: you think maybe just remove the 6* ability? 16:33:07 yes 16:33:15 -!- negatendo has quit [Quit: poop] 16:33:19 the temporary unreliable resists are much more interesting anyway 16:33:30 yeah, that seems reasonable to me; I'll update the plan and ask grunt what he thinks 16:34:46 does he really need a nerf that badly 16:34:58 if this change would be made, it wouldn't be about nerfing him 16:34:58 -!- eb_ has joined ##crawl-dev 16:35:10 you could always make storm shield stronger if you thought he was now too weak (though I'm not sure he would be) 16:35:36 -!- bonghitz has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 16:35:37 The main issues with Gozag are: his god wrath (turning items into gold not being a great wrath, possibly his other effects not severe enough), and are there any remaining problems with shops, bribing, or gold distraction? 16:36:48 I've heard people complaining that bribing is too weak 16:37:58 03|amethyst02 07* 0.15-a0-2019-g30d9616: Only define EXPERIMENTAL_BRANCH for USE_DGAMELAUNCH builds. 10(2 minutes ago, 1 file, 2+ 2-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=30d9616ef6d9 16:38:00 I know there had been some tweaks with that, but I'm not quite sure about the current state of things 16:38:01 duplication i think is ultimately not a very interesting ability in that it primarily acts as a multiplier for early lucky finds, which is obviously the place that luck matters most 16:38:05 <|amethyst> wheals: there you go 16:38:39 nice, though now it doesn't really matter 16:39:02 also currently it's substantially more problematic due to the wrath not working 16:39:41 I always forget that duplication exists 16:39:46 which I think is a common response 16:39:48 i think shops probably work mostly okay as a gold sink 16:40:09 not sure about the most recent iteration of bribing 16:41:02 -!- lobf has joined ##crawl-dev 16:41:34 MarvinPA: by wrath not working, do you mean there's an actual bug where wrath doesn't trigger? 16:41:51 or not work as in poorly designed 16:41:54 the latter 16:41:57 ok 16:42:09 well i mean it also just doesn't trigger if you stay in certain branches 16:42:10 it's probably still buggy too 16:42:23 I'm pretty sure it has bugs when interacting with blood potions 16:42:29 please rate your level of surprise at this statement 16:42:37 -!- rossi_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:42:48 actually I forget if it triggers on blood potions. 16:42:52 sultana 16:42:53 v important for those vp of gozag 16:43:09 *vp formerly of gozag 16:43:30 probably not, they're low value 16:44:10 i forget what the cutoff is but if it triggers on potions of blood then it'd also trigger on potions of confusion 16:44:19 how appropriate 16:44:25 also potions of slowing 16:44:31 good thing those have a value in shops 16:45:12 very powerful for ^chei!!!! 16:45:21 gozag -> chei high-level play 16:45:31 i was thinking more about how they don't exist :P 16:46:47 gozag>chei? 16:46:59 try trog>chei 16:47:04 -!- minmay has joined ##crawl-dev 16:47:10 gotta get those sweet, sweet weapons 16:47:30 anyway i have a local branch that vaguely started changing the goldification wrath to mark things for goldification when they come into view, rather than randomly rolling every time you pick them up 16:47:54 but its bad and adds even more stuff to a bit of code that's already marked as a "repulsive major hack" or something 16:48:26 !source seen_item 16:48:27 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/itemprop.cc;hb=HEAD#l2751 16:48:51 good job Sequell 16:49:08 uh. what 16:49:11 well i mean it also just doesn't trigger if you stay in certain branches 16:49:19 Was this regarding wrath or bribing? 16:49:26 wrath 16:49:30 ok, thanks 16:49:37 Bloax: gozag will sell you weapons!!! 16:49:47 oh right 16:50:02 do tomb so he can't buff the mummies 16:50:08 PleasingFungus: originally it was just the ash ISFLAG_KNOW_CURSE thing there 16:50:09 s/so/since 16:50:15 but it seems to have grown over time 16:50:26 MarvinPA: no I was saying 'what' at the sequell seen_item link 16:50:31 oh i see 16:50:38 your answer is useful too, though! 16:50:38 scroll down a bit! 16:50:58 oh yeah, I remember that code 16:51:05 I think I called it from somewhere else 16:51:57 hm. speaking of itemprop.cc. does the HORN OF GERYON still need special exemption to jelly-eating? 16:52:03 -!- lobf has quit [Quit: lobf] 16:52:07 NOPE 16:52:11 but, hrm 16:52:17 I guess it's kind-of-an-artefact? 16:52:36 we removed the code to prevent geryon from flying over deep water/lava & dropping it there 16:52:38 -!- Morg0th_ has quit [Quit: leaving] 16:52:41 -!- TAS_2012v has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:52:54 idk. obviously this is a niche irrelevant case, I was just wondering 16:52:59 but jellies? are we going to let those terrible jellies have it? 16:53:04 -!- Lasty1 has joined ##crawl-dev 16:53:05 -!- Lasty1 has quit [Client Quit] 16:53:16 (yeah that could be removed though) 16:53:23 feeding the horn of geryon to jellies sounds pretty funny tbh 16:53:31 just let trj place in depths 16:53:41 or worship jiyva.... 16:53:57 -!- Lasty1 has joined ##crawl-dev 16:54:07 ??slimify 16:54:08 slimify[1/1]: Jiyva ability that coats your wielded weapon or fists with slime. Hitting a corporeal undead or natural monster will turn it into a neutral slime of similar HD with no resistance checks. 16:54:08 why would you want to feed jellies that sweet evocable 16:54:12 :( 16:54:24 ??horn_of_geryon 16:54:24 horn of geryon[1/2]: Evoke it if you want to enter Hells in 0.13-. In 0.14 it's an xp-charged evoker (like an {elemental evoker}) that summons 1-4 hell beasts that are usually friendly. The number of beasts and the chance of each being hostile depends on evocations skill. 16:54:31 fr: helljellies 16:54:35 gammafunk: imho feed everything to jellies 16:54:44 tunnel jellies rule..... 16:54:46 ...even the orb 16:55:35 orb of jelly 16:56:01 fr: alternate dcss universe where everything is jelly themed 16:56:25 except slime pits 16:56:49 you finally get to meet disso as a young man 16:57:20 -!- lobf has joined ##crawl-dev 16:57:34 -!- CryptoCactus has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:58:11 he still has summon eyeballs for some reason though, but theuy aren't gelatinous eyeballs 16:58:48 they just sort of rain down and roll all over the place 16:58:53 kind of embarassing, really 16:58:56 FR: kobold oculomancers w/ summon eyeballs 16:59:28 -!- HaltingProblem has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:00:12 oculomantic eyes 17:00:45 delicious 17:00:49 -!- wheals has quit [Quit: Page closed] 17:01:15 -!- Nunurbiz has quit [] 17:01:18 ok, I've updated gozag and Q some, what about new nemelex? 17:02:15 as in, does anyone have any major problems with the rework? 17:02:24 <|amethyst> bah, should be ophthalmomancer 17:02:30 I'm not very happy with how the forms cards work, although not everyone has a problem with that 17:02:59 it seemed pretty good to me generally 17:03:29 i made some small tweaks after my game, nothing major came to mind 17:03:42 I've heard some vague plans to try to break out the decks more, but even if that's more than a vague plan, it'd probably wait for next release 17:04:32 ok, any further issues for ranged combat? I realize some of PleasingFungus' changes might just need more play testing 17:04:42 well i think the low number of deck types is the main thing that makes it an improvement 17:05:40 one thing I can think about that is how problematic hostile summons could be early on if you can't get to a crusade card, but if that didn't seem a problem to you perhaps it isn't 17:06:37 -!- Blazinghand|Work has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:06:48 for ranged combat, I currently just have 'large rocks and mulch rates in general' 17:06:58 that wasn't something that ever came up, and if it did i think that's fine anyway 17:07:40 yeah, sounds good; I'll do another god-forsaken nem run at some point to see how he plays 17:07:46 since bad things happening sometimes when you draw cards is part of what makes them interesting 17:08:22 -!- eki has quit [Quit: leaving] 17:08:38 there was some talk of maybe making I guess arrows/bolts ammo always mulch or perhaps very frequently so that ordinary ammo might actually matter, but I'm not sure about the current thinking there 17:09:18 i think the idea there is that having them always mulch improves the interface (no more running around picking up all your ammo) and could be done without necessarily changing balance particularly 17:09:41 but could then lead to other changes perhaps, that sounds like a longer-term thing though 17:09:51 ah, right. that's what people meant by interface improvement 17:10:55 probably large rock mulching could be increased a bunch in the meantime/for 0.15 though, yeah 17:11:24 (as a balance thing rather than an interface thing that is) 17:11:43 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 17:12:00 ok, I can update that accordinly, and probably will just make a commit to increase the mulch rate a bit later 17:12:17 hrm, there's rock generation as well, but that's not so easy to control 17:12:39 <|amethyst> MarvinPA: someone at some point suggested a version of autoexplore that only does the greedy stuff and doesn't actually explore 17:12:45 -!- tsohg has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:12:45 well we can control the level items being large rocks at least 17:13:06 maybe I should add that 'NumHeldByMonster' field to objstat that PleasingFungus mentioned 17:14:22 I'd be curious to see if my 50% guess was reasonable 17:14:36 |amethyst: ah yeah, that could be good 17:14:36 for what item? 17:14:53 large rocks 17:15:04 yeah, all those C 17:16:04 was talking to a friend (nrook) yesterday, who was amused & horrified at how much of crawl's item distributions come from mon-gear.cc & related functions 17:16:18 (rather than floorgod) 17:16:58 -!- ishanyx has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:17:25 I think that's a Crawl Thing and not something could "fix". it is kind of funny how all-over-the-place crawl item generation ends up being in practice, though. (see also: vaults) 17:17:29 oh shit 17:17:37 I just remembered about blue_anna_alchemist 17:18:24 Unstable branch on crawl.lantea.net updated to: 0.15-a0-2019-g30d9616 (34) 17:18:54 <|amethyst> dpeg likes that luck can give you a huge incentive to go fedhas 17:19:02 does that still give a billion fruit, i thought it was fixed 17:19:04 -!- myp has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:19:13 -!- wHATEver is now known as Guest77648 17:19:29 -!- Kramin42 is now known as Kramin 17:20:41 PleasingFungus: I need that food. I *need* it 17:20:51 i think fruit vaults existing generally is fine for that, this one takes (took?) it to a pretty ridiculous extreme though 17:21:02 MarvinPA: it was "fixed" and now can only give you at most about 500 fruit 17:21:03 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:21:06 iirc 17:21:08 need to do more testing 17:21:10 oh ok 17:21:14 that's close to a billion imo 17:21:20 p much 17:21:21 after getting that valut, I had like 130 fruit 17:21:26 which I *needed* 17:21:36 powerful durians 17:21:49 reaverb pushed a commit to wrap and if () followed by one line in braces. Is the convention to put braces around all if blocks now? 17:21:57 Of course I died, but it wasn't due to lack of fruit at least! 17:22:01 "add more fruit types" is still my proudest commit 17:22:17 Lasty1: run util/unbrace and see what it does 17:22:34 probably it should just not be an actual food vault so that it doesn't have nutrition requirements, i guess 17:22:36 Lasty1: no, but if the if has a multi-line conditional, it always gets a brace by our conventions 17:22:38 My version of mingw doesn't support that command properly IIRC 17:22:47 MarvinPA: I think it'd be possible to actually fix it 17:22:48 gammafunk: ah, that'd be it. Thanks! 17:22:53 you'd need to understand the old hangedman version, though 17:22:57 <|amethyst> yeah, unbrace won't run with the mingw version of perl 17:23:25 alternately: the convention is to put braces either (a) around multi-line ifs, or (b) after multi-line conditionals 17:23:27 if that makes any sense 17:23:41 oh fuck beaten by gammafunk 17:23:44 <|amethyst> docs/develop/coding_conventions.txt 17:23:47 I'm too slow............. 17:23:54 you thought you could defeat me?! 17:24:18 * PleasingFungus is vanquished. 17:24:22 why would you need to understand the old version? surely if the current version produces ~10k nutrition but that means an absurd amount of fruit, then the problem is just that you can't provide that much nutrition in purely fruit form 17:24:29 -!- Isha is now known as ishanyx 17:24:34 ??fruit 17:24:34 food[2/4]: Sultana is 70. Grape is 100. Strawberry is 200. Lychee/choko/rambutan is 600. Apricot/pear/apple is 700. Banana/lemon/orange is 1000. Cheese/sausage is 1200. Beef jerky/pizza/snozzcumber is 1500. Porridge is 6040. In 0.15+, fruit is now condensed into one generic "fruit" item (worth 850 nutrition). 17:24:41 hm 17:24:58 ah 17:26:01 hrm, if it's 10k nutrition, is 12 fruit an absurd amount? 17:26:16 <|amethyst> blue_anna_alchemist has 4 copies of that vault 17:26:20 <|amethyst> so 40k nutrition 17:26:41 so just about a spriggan bakery 17:27:01 no, that'd be 10 bread rations 17:27:08 which I don't think spriggan bakery gives? 17:27:22 maybe it does and I'm misremembering 17:28:04 yeah it's two bread rations 17:28:13 <|amethyst> four 17:28:21 ah 17:28:22 <|amethyst> two ds, q:2 on each 17:28:23 dang 17:28:39 "glowing hunting sling" doesn't glow, doesn't show up on "ego" search 13https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=8782 by MackTheFife 17:28:39 ok but, but not 10 17:29:42 so probably each fruiting_field should be halved or something i guess, at least 17:30:04 fruiting_plant 17:31:00 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 17:31:06 -!- CKyle has quit [Client Quit] 17:31:13 n.b. that there are two (?) other vaults that use fruiting_plant 17:31:31 or more, or _alchemist could just not be a vault since hangedman_ranch looks like it uses the subvault and does it better since it also has a mix of other food types 17:31:43 I'd be fine with that 17:31:46 it is not a very exciting vault 17:31:47 -!- ishanyx has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:32:06 I guess I'll just starve on swamp:5 then, it's fine 17:32:28 also, here are some items in the 'possibly 0.15' category that are probably 'not 0.15', but I'm going to check 17:33:00 -!- Tux[Qyou] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:33:02 8782 sounds like the bug minmay was reporting earlier, but that I was unable to reproduce 17:33:09 something about slings dropped by enemies 17:33:14 *cursed slings 17:33:36 <|amethyst> hm, probably it's more likely about being created in enemy hands than dropped by enemies 17:33:46 <|amethyst> since that's a different codepath 17:33:55 Stat rework (make int/str/dex choices more meaningful), unique purging and xp/incentive rework, monster spell slot rework, and reaverb's weapon brand distribution cleanup 17:34:22 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: did minmay provide a save? 17:34:32 reaver may have already done what he wants for that last one, so I'll check with him, but are any of those others going anywhere soon? 17:35:16 maybe moving some unique spawn ranges around is on my vague todo but isn't important either way on whether it goes into 0.15 17:35:47 |amethyst: no, he just asked if it'd been fixed 17:35:51 the increased xp stuff would be good to go along with that i guess, but i haven't put any thought into it 17:36:26 gammafunk: last I heard about the weapon brand thing was that reaverb hadn't done it but was still planning to do it before 0.15 17:36:29 's release 17:36:32 ok, I'll just note that and mark the others as not in 0.15 17:36:41 PleasingFungus: ok, I'll just remind/ask him about it 17:36:55 -!- TS__ has joined ##crawl-dev 17:37:55 -!- orionstein is now known as orionstein_away 17:38:06 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 17:39:06 |amethyst: I tried to test it the other day but was unable to reproduce; this was what led me to run into the "goblin ; sling cursed" bug that you fixed for me 17:39:28 my best guess was that it was maybe if they picked up a cursed sling off the floor and *then* dropped it? maybe? 17:39:30 -!- orionstein_away is now known as orionstein 17:39:51 but idk maybe the ; syntax generation is still the wrong codepath 17:39:56 there are some chrisO branches (MR specifications for monsters like the player resist instead of magic numbers, character hints at startup, show success chance in hex targeters based on power/monster mr 17:40:04 -!- debo has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:40:29 -!- Porost has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:40:45 I don't think he's still working on these, but the links should stay; I'll just mark them as not 0.15 17:41:13 yeah, the mr changes in particular still sound promising to me 17:41:20 though someone would have to rebase them 17:41:41 we can move over some or all when we make the 0.16 doc 17:41:46 sure 17:41:52 -!- Keanan has joined ##crawl-dev 17:42:01 the hints are addressed at a real problem (we don't communicate what backgrounds actually *do* very well), but the ones he had looked like a hot mess 17:42:11 half of them were jokes 17:42:18 -!- CKyle has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:42:24 -!- syllogism has quit [] 17:42:50 fact: Ar is for blowing up gnolls with rods 17:43:36 I wonder 17:43:43 something awful people suggested adding a "needler" upgrade for the blowgun, featuring explosive needles 17:43:53 I am not sure the suggestion was entirely serious 17:44:09 !lg cv=0.15-a !boring --Ar / won 17:44:10 No games for gammafunk (cv=0.15-a !boring --Ar). 17:44:14 oh 17:44:17 !lg * cv=0.15-a !boring --Ar / won 17:44:18 24/1633 games for * (cv=0.15-a !boring --Ar): N=24/1633 (1.47%) 17:44:21 !lg * cv=0.15-a !boring --As / won 17:44:23 47/6607 games for * (cv=0.15-a !boring --As): N=47/6607 (0.71%) 17:44:31 I knew As was significantly harder! 17:44:32 <|amethyst> we should show the starting skills/equipment for classes alongside the aptitude list 17:44:55 the aptitude list in the manual? 17:44:59 <|amethyst> yeah 17:45:04 <|amethyst> that wouldn't help with Ar 17:45:13 I almost think it's as much of a name problem as anything else. 17:45:31 Ar -> Ev, Evoker? 17:45:38 <|amethyst> how does that help? 17:45:41 that is exactly wrong, though 17:45:42 yeah 17:45:52 <|amethyst> I don't really see this as a problem though 17:45:59 it's not wrong! you do evoke things 17:46:01 artificer isn't "guy who focuses on evocations", it's "guy who starts with powerful wands" 17:46:01 <|amethyst> Players can't figure out strategy given full info 17:46:18 <|amethyst> s/P/If p/ 17:46:33 <|amethyst> then I don't think the problem is that we don't give enough hints 17:46:35 Wand-haver 17:46:46 |amethyst: I feel like misleading players leads to unnecessary frustration - e.g. from people who play an assassin wanting to stab the dungeon 17:46:49 since it's an assassin, right? 17:46:50 well that's really true of most backgrounds, players not figuring out reasonable strategy 17:47:05 Lasty1: "Improviser" 17:47:16 "MacGuyver" 17:47:18 -!- Keanan has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:47:27 Artificer is already a suitably generic name 17:47:27 I think there should explicit text somewhere saying "your background is a starting package, but you can do whatever -- starting with high Evo doesn't mean only train evo" 17:47:27 <|amethyst> So do we tell people under Necromancer "you should definitely train melee skills" ? 17:47:45 |amethyst: we tell them that by giving them a powerful melee-enhancing charm 17:47:46 PleasingFungus: I like the MacGuyver option 17:47:51 :) 17:47:58 but yes, necromancer is one of the other problem backgrounds 17:47:59 Well we could suggest a couple reasonable things I suppose 17:48:20 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: And we tell Ar not to expect to win by evoking by only giving them a few low-level wands 17:48:20 Lasty1: i am pretty sure that's in the manual somewhere already 17:48:24 or words to that effect 17:48:26 ok I get artificer and assassin but what's unintuitive about necromancer? 17:48:44 <|amethyst> it's difficult to win by only casting necromancy 17:48:51 <|amethyst> and not hitting things 17:48:59 MarvinPA: cool. I should look it up so I can paste it into 1/5th of forum threads 17:49:08 I doubt that's true 17:49:08 |amethyst: I don't agree with that in the slightest 17:49:19 <|amethyst> Well 17:49:31 <|amethyst> I shouldn't be the one writing these strategy hints 17:49:32 the spells that make zombies etc are some of the most brokenly powerful spells in the game 17:49:38 -!- tsohg has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:49:43 and pain and vamp draining are incredibly good damage spells for their level 17:50:03 |amethyst: if you're a fighter, you start with a shitty sword and armour. if you're a conjurer, your spells don't go past, what, level 4? 17:50:04 (and agony and new bolt of draining should you find them) 17:50:26 -!- ToBeFree is now known as Raymondo 17:50:35 but people playing fighters have a reasonable expectation of being able to continue "just fighting" by finding better gear to replace their starting stuff as they play 17:50:45 <|amethyst> if you're a hunter, you start off with javelins or large rocks 17:50:47 and new players assume the same thing is true of artificers 17:50:50 Lasty1: in the "starting screen" section: "The choice of character background is definitely less decisive than that of species in Crawl. Basically, the background determines what the character has learned prior to entering the dungeon (i.e. the starting skills), and also helps determine equipment at start." 17:50:53 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 17:50:54 -!- DrinkMachine has quit [Changing host] 17:50:54 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 17:51:08 -!- Raymondo is now known as ToBeFree 17:51:12 <|amethyst> hm 17:51:19 I am speaking from personal experience! 17:51:20 and in the "list of backgrounds" section: "Each background starts out with a different set of skills and items, but from there you can shape them as you will." 17:51:26 I played a lot of really bad artificers when I was starting out 17:51:33 dunno if words to that effect are mentioned in the tutorial or hints mode too, they might be 17:51:37 and I know I am not the only one 17:51:40 PleasingFungus: I'm not sure what you mean by the statement that for conjurers, your spells don'tgo past level 4. Are you saying that's a problem? 17:51:50 gammafunk: no, not at all 17:52:04 MarvinPA: Thanks 17:52:15 I am saying that "starting with equipment of limited power" does not communicate to the player that you can't succeed by focusing on the skills associated with your starting equipment 17:53:02 well I suppose that's only really true for Ar 17:53:07 also as!!!! 17:53:14 I'd say not 17:53:17 throwing isvery powerful 17:53:28 mm 17:53:33 It probably won't stay this powerful forever 17:53:39 -!- Allgodsarefemale has quit [Quit: Page closed] 17:53:53 I guess blowgunthrowing isn't really a separate thing from throwing generally. sort of 17:53:55 tbh it was powerful enough before the ranged reform 17:54:04 Just removing the form damage bonus was a fair nerf 17:54:17 you just need to find any of the nice throwing items, of which there are enough 17:54:39 needles + random throwing items is certainly enough to supplement an As 17:54:50 before the ranged reform throwing *skill* did damn near nothing except for special needles 17:54:52 the assassin is unlikely to do very well trying to blowgun & stab everything, which is the playstyle implied by their starting kit 17:55:07 Before ranged reform it was decent -- I won three characters using it as a primary non-needle offense -- but experts like minmay and crate assured me it was not as good as other options and I couldn't refute it 17:55:18 yeah, training throwing itself was not terribly useful, but man throwing was sill good 17:55:26 because it's actually a "gift kit" ("murder everything up to d:7 with these needles") combined with a "shit weapon/armour kit" 17:56:05 basically it and artificer are the same class 17:56:33 well, I think the thing with As the mitigates that is, if you do train throwing, you have the options you need; Players not knowing that throwing affects tomahawks/javs as well as the blowgun is a problem I guess 17:57:59 as is kind of a harder problem in a way, because of how perfectly & thematically the starting kit & skills come together to describe a playstyle that does not exist 17:58:03 For Ar I guess the communication problem is more acute, but wands are plentiful and the player certainly does quickly learn that wands have finite chargers 17:59:02 well when you say they're 'the same class' you mean on some conceptual level 17:59:08 certainly in practice they aren't! 17:59:14 sure 17:59:19 where was that latest objstat dump 17:59:32 Could it be worth adding a section to the manual about common ways to leverage the starting kits? 17:59:40 nvm got it 17:59:48 Lasty1: does anyone read the manual 18:00:10 -!- tswett has joined ##crawl-dev 18:00:17 force players to read the manual and give a quizz afterwards for each new game until they have a win imo 18:00:34 lol 18:00:49 looks like there are, on average, 1-2 wands for D:1-4 18:01:08 well, why are we looking at d:1-4really 18:01:12 you start with 3 wands, no? 18:01:38 -!- scummos^ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:01:45 and 1-1.5 wands per floor thereafter 18:02:14 ??artificer 18:02:15 artificer[1/1]: A class that starts with three wands (enslave, flame, random effects (all with 15 charges)), a +0 short sword, light armour, some evocations/fighting/dodging skill, and knowledge of recharge scrolls. 18:02:24 Is the premise that some people think they should train Evo exclusively, or that and also they think they should use wands to attack exclusively? 18:02:32 huh. do they still start with knowledge of ?recharge 18:02:48 Lasty1: some less extreme version of the former premise 18:02:52 !source monster_at 18:02:53 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/describe.cc;hb=HEAD#l3139 18:03:08 -!- lobf has quit [Quit: lobf] 18:03:25 the game will very rapidly disprove the latter; the former, less so 18:03:48 ps: thanks, sequell 18:04:00 If they know they can attack with not-wands, it seems like sooner or later they'll notice how much time they spend hitting things with a weapon and train that up . . . 18:04:30 That is -not- the source for monster_at :p 18:04:36 close enough! 18:04:42 haha 18:04:47 yeah, Ar does I guess end up being more a class players choose when they have a better understanding of crawl 18:04:51 http://nethackwiki.com/wiki/Source:Teleport.c#line71 and you guys complain about !coinflip() 18:05:08 minmay: that is a legitimate piece of code, though 18:05:19 assuming that HLevitation is an int 18:05:33 uh 18:05:43 line 63 is pretty silly, though 18:06:47 if monster_at is passed a tile containing the player, does it return some sort of representation of the player? 18:07:08 Or null? 18:07:08 I believe it returns null 18:07:22 ok 18:07:39 My Ru * code isn't working, and I thought that might be why 18:08:15 Lasty1: there's actor::as_monster(), which returns NULL for the player 18:08:22 PleasingFungus: oops, meant to link 63, yes 18:09:31 I bet that was originally !!HLevitation, and someone added the ||s without taking out the !!, since they didn't understand why it was there in the first place 18:09:46 code... is good 18:11:06 https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=8&p=182220#p182220 18:11:54 -Yes, I am drunk (no actually I'm not) 18:11:58 good drunkpost 18:13:06 shrouded in mystey 18:13:07 wow, that's a sweet post 18:13:15 really turned me around 18:13:34 I get "You are not authorised to read this forum." 18:13:41 finally my bad behaviour catches up with me 18:13:56 rip 18:14:59 was it some crazy rant that just got deleted 18:15:32 wasn't that crazy, just a maudlin drunk bitching about everything and nothing 18:15:40 ic 18:16:02 PleasingFungus: You just think that because you don't get out and do enough manual labor 18:16:06 o 18:16:12 possibly 18:16:18 -!- TS__ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:16:28 If you did, you'd understand how much this reminds you of Elitist Jerks 18:16:48 -!- tsohg has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:21:01 -!- __miek has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:21:25 -!- tsohg has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:23:26 -!- ishanyx has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:25:01 -!- Keanan has joined ##crawl-dev 18:26:50 -!- predator217 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:28:32 -!- TS__ has joined ##crawl-dev 18:30:33 |amethyst: tswett added a note to 8781 w.r.t. the static_cast 18:30:47 tl;dr: "It wasn't working, and someone in ##c++ told me to add it, and then it worked." 18:31:28 ship it 18:32:01 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 18:32:06 -!- Porost has quit [Client Quit] 18:34:19 What can I say. 18:34:24 I have 18:34:30 TODO: Possibly don't make these reductions pre-lair to avoid not finding any remove curse/curing and possibly identify (since id game is most relevant pre-lair). Could condition the changes on depth >= 7 (i.e. D:8 and below). 18:35:05 tbh after a bunch of lair-at-4k games I don't feel like there are too few of anything 18:35:18 i don't think the existing breakpoints like that are all that great 18:35:23 yes 18:35:33 I'd love to not have to add them 18:35:42 tabstorm complains to me about too few heal wounds whenever he gets the chance, but hw seems mostly ok 18:35:44 so if it feels reasonable that's good to hear, yeah :P 18:36:33 -!- Pepe has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:37:50 I kind of want to do an ash game 18:37:58 to see how badly the ?rc reduction has hurt him 18:38:13 !lg . won s=god 18:38:14 7 games for Kvaak (won): 2x Ashenzari, Okawaru, Beogh, Vehumet, Lugonu, Trog 18:38:21 those are all post-reduction, not that badly :u 18:38:26 nice 18:38:50 i think the increase in curse scrolls per remove curse was after the ?rc reduction, wasn't it? 18:38:50 someone did suggest that if we needed to buff ash, we could merge the types of curse scroll (weapon/jewellery/armour) 18:38:53 but no need to jump the gun on it 18:38:56 MarvinPA: no 18:38:59 oh ok 18:39:05 it was after "an" ?rc reduction i'm fairly sure 18:39:08 yes 18:39:10 that sounds right 18:39:21 nine times out of ten I have too much of two types of curse scrolls and none of the remaining one 18:39:34 Kvaak: is it consistently the same type? 18:39:50 MarvinPA: rc was reduced again as part of gammafunk's consumables purge, iirc 18:39:54 usually it's armour 18:39:58 ah that one, right 18:40:18 assuming I have full slots I usually try to curse all of my armour, one ring, amulet and shield 18:41:01 so many purges, so little time.... 18:41:09 and end up with tons of curse weapon/jewellery and no armour 18:41:24 which is kind of annoying, even converting them to curse armour at a bad ratio would be nice 18:41:29 -!- mamgar has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 18:41:54 by the end of the game I usually have enough (remove) curse scrolls, there just tend to be lengthy periods where I can't seem to find any 18:42:01 but I guess that's sort of how ash works 18:42:18 -!- tcjsavannah has quit [Quit: tcjsavannah] 18:42:29 -!- rohan_ has quit [Quit: leaving] 18:42:58 -!- Vizer has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:43:01 -!- rossi_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:44:29 -!- sstrickl has quit [Quit: sstrickl] 18:46:17 -!- rockygargoyle has quit [Quit: Page closed] 18:47:07 seems like it'd be simple to tweak the generation ratios a little bit, if we really wanted 18:47:16 for the different types of curse scroll 18:47:33 -!- ishanyx has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:47:43 could be weird, though. consider draconians, ogres, octopodes 18:48:06 what do fe^ash get when they pray over remove curse? only jewellery, or the full mix? 18:48:37 it's weighted based on how many slots you have available 18:48:41 just jewellery 18:48:57 fe only get jewellery, other races have armour weighted based on the number of armour slots they can equip things in 18:49:53 ah 18:50:02 so it's already weighted. interesting 18:51:54 maybe it's just me but the amount of curse weaponry seems a little excessive in general 18:52:32 !log * won cv=0.15-a ash 18:52:33 104. perunasaurus, XL27 DECj, T:85077: http://crawl.develz.org/morgues/trunk/perunasaurus/morgue-perunasaurus-20140710-223020.txt 18:53:16 assuming you need those remove curse scrolls for cursing armour/jewellery odds are you don't have enough remove curse to uncurse your weapon anyway 18:53:29 very often that is 18:55:02 %git 18:55:19 07|amethyst02 * 0.15-a0-2019-g30d9616: Only define EXPERIMENTAL_BRANCH for USE_DGAMELAUNCH builds. 10(2 hours ago, 1 file, 2+ 2-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=30d9616ef6d9 18:55:27 2000, gettting close 18:56:14 well I've updated the planning doc, basically most of the active TODOs are for gozag, and there's nothing terribly major (although maybe there is and it's not on there) 18:57:02 -!- CampinSam has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.3] 18:57:32 ??0.15 18:57:32 0.15[1/1]: August 2014 18:57:35 ??0.15 plan 18:57:36 0.15 plan[1/1]: https://crawl.develz.org/wiki/doku.php?id=dcss:planning:0.15_plan 18:57:45 ??0.14 18:57:46 0.14 ~ 0.15[1/1]: August 2014 18:57:47 I guess I have to make a couple commits this evening, gasp 18:57:51 ...thanks, sequell 18:57:55 gammafunk: don't do it!!! 18:58:13 ??0.16 18:58:14 0.16 ~ 0.15[1/1]: August 2014 18:58:15 gammafunk: adding and removing whitespace really kills the time 18:58:26 all versions point to 0.15 18:58:47 ??0.27 18:58:48 I don't have a page labeled 0.27 in my learndb. 18:58:55 Version 0.16: Rururururu 18:59:07 ru-ination? 18:59:08 hm. one thing you didn't touch on that 0.15 plan 18:59:38 -!- moxian has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:59:47 |amethyst: the 0.15 plan suggests that you (or someone) was going to "find a way to auto-generate doxygen docs upon e.g. cszo rebuilds and host the html docs " 18:59:55 |amethyst: did you ever end up looking into that? 18:59:56 -!- HellTiger has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:00:11 PleasingFungus: that's my thing really :) 19:00:33 and that's why I didn't update it, since I need to figure out what all I need to do there 19:01:16 of course I'd need |amethyst help if we did auto-generate the docs, but we also kind of need maybe an updated doxygen bit in the development doc 19:01:31 o 19:01:43 that bullet point had amethyst's name in it, so I was thrown off 19:02:01 yeah maybe I shouldn't have put his name in that 19:02:03 all is now clear. 19:02:27 -!- Patashu has joined ##crawl-dev 19:02:54 Will implement for 0.15 (|amethyst) Total redesign and rewrite of monster AI 19:02:58 then see if it happens 19:03:53 Is there a "can_wear_armour" function? 19:05:26 for players? 19:05:31 !source player.cc 19:05:32 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/player.cc;hb=HEAD 19:05:37 yeah 19:05:49 -!- Lightli has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 19:05:54 you_can_wear() seems relevant 19:06:16 well, I'd have to pass in a piece of armour 19:06:39 er wait 19:06:48 no, that's an int matching an enum 19:07:47 yep 19:07:53 i think there are like three different ones 19:08:05 " // kittehs were handled earlier " 19:08:06 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 19:08:08 -!- Piginabag has quit [Quit: Page closed] 19:08:09 that are all slightly confusingly different 19:08:21 I think you_can_wear will be sufficient 19:08:39 -!- Hieropants_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 19:10:00 huh. you get half your fire resistance added to your steam resistance, unless you have negative fire resistance 19:10:04 If losing a hand (ring, shield, two-handed weapon) is worth 80 piety, how much should not being able to dodge or wear armour be worth? 19:10:10 in which case you get full penalties 19:10:20 Lasty1: both, or individually? 19:10:25 Both 19:10:30 dang 19:10:44 are we talking dodging=0, or ev=0? 19:10:54 no, just no training either one 19:10:57 also, is armour just the body slot, or the aux slots too? 19:11:26 The sacrifice merely prevents training the Dodging and Armour skills and sets both skills to 0 19:11:40 ok, that's sort of not what "not being able to wear armour" sounds like 19:11:43 er -- two sacrifices 19:11:55 yeah, sorry, that was confusingly stated 19:12:10 wait, so is there one sacrifice per skill (one for dodging & one for armour) or is it one sacrifice that disables both? 19:12:48 One sacrifice per skill, but in the condition that you make one of the sacrifices while already not able to do the other (because either you already made the other sacrifice or because you naturally can't train that skill) you get bonus piety 19:13:00 since not being able to train any defensive skills is bad 19:13:10 ah 19:15:51 So: not being able to train Dodging -and- Armour is better or worse than losing a ring slot and the ability to either use shields or two handed weapons? 19:16:19 I'd say better, but lots of people disagree with me on balance 19:16:26 I am basically a noob 19:17:17 I would put it at probably 20/40 piety respectively (so 60 total) (given that you're going to sacrificing the one you don't care about first, and there's probably one you don't care about) 19:18:56 idk. that might be high 19:19:04 Honestly, I think that's low 19:19:21 Not training any defenses makes it really easy to just die 19:20:31 I think I care about both more often than not 19:20:47 though not early game I suppose 19:20:48 agreed 19:20:50 compared to losing a hand, though? 19:20:56 -!- edlothiol has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:21:11 minmay: how would you rate the hand sacrifice and the armour / dodging sacrifices? 19:21:16 minmay: yeah, i guess I was thinking more early-game. sooner or later you're going to want both in some proportion, of course 19:21:21 I would rather be able to use a real weapon than be able to train both, yes 19:22:27 well losing the ability to use good weapons is really awful if you are not a conjurer or whatever and not really bad at all if you are so it's hard for me to "rate" it aside from pointing out that problem 19:22:30 -!- Patashu_ has joined ##crawl-dev 19:22:30 -!- Patashu has quit [Disconnected by services] 19:23:06 Right, a lot of these sacrifices will be worse for one type of character than another, and we'll assume that people will generally take them on characters that don't care as much 19:23:30 So the piety should generally reflect the best case scenario for the player, give or take 19:24:19 fair point. I guess I'd rate the defensive sacrifices a lot higher in that case 19:24:25 -!- MgDark has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90.1 [Firefox 31.0/20140707160635]] 19:24:29 okay, in the case of playing a "pure caster" then my understanding is that sacrifice hand means you get 0 SH instead of like 5 19:24:38 You lose a ring too 19:24:43 oh, right 19:24:57 and the shield probably has +3 AC or rF+ or something 19:25:02 no 19:25:05 it probably doesn't 19:25:20 I suppose not in the chunk of the game most players die in 19:25:36 so fair point 19:25:38 sure you find bucklers of protection but that's a lucky thing to find 19:25:56 Usually by depths (admittedly, late game) I find at least one 19:26:12 that differs from my experience, yeah 19:26:15 !tell Grunt Does anything actually need to be fixed for player.cc:4085, or is that safe to just remove? 19:26:15 PleasingFungus: OK, I'll let grunt know. 19:26:17 I don't usually find rF+/AC+ bucklers at all 19:26:22 Maybe I'm just lucky 19:26:25 though I suppose there are more bucklers around now that tengu reavers are everywhere 19:26:34 yeah, and spriggans 19:26:56 I'm talking about recently, with all the buckler-having monsters in depths 19:26:59 <|amethyst> hm 19:27:09 but mostly I would only care about if I happen to find two of the good rings 19:27:21 * Grunt grunts. 19:27:26 !source player.cc:4085 19:27:26 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/player.cc;hb=HEAD#l4085 19:27:28 which on average seems to take a long time to happen 19:27:56 -!- plantmann has quit [Quit: Page closed] 19:28:18 -!- Daekdroom has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:28:19 I'm surprised to hear that . . . I perceived that to be a pretty nasty sacrifice for most characters 19:28:24 on the other hand i am guaranteed to not train the second one of armour/dodging for a while which isn't necessarily the case with finding a useful ring or buckler 19:28:26 PleasingFungus: I think the commented-out bit can go away, yes. 19:28:27 Well, you did say "pure" caster 19:28:30 excellent 19:28:40 it is a really nasty sacrifice for most characters because you lose the ability to use all the best weapons in the game 19:28:50 gammafunk: MarvinPA: I'm indifferent to doing away with the 6*; do what you will 19:29:02 but if for some reason you are playing a conjurer in a version where ranged combat is 5000x better, then you dont really care about weapons anyway 19:29:13 Grunt rouses from his slumber! ##crawl-dev trembles... 19:29:14 uh oh, grunt saying "do what you will" scares me a lot 19:29:19 ^^^ 19:29:19 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 19:29:23 trembling!!! 19:29:25 (or if ranged combat actually gets nerfed) 19:29:28 1learn add 19:29:37 ...shall be the whole of the Grunt... 19:29:53 It's probably worth assuming that ranged combat will be brought into line with other attacks 19:30:05 %git :/[Bb]ow 19:30:06 07PleasingFungus02 * 0.15-a0-1987-g8234afa: Rebalance bows 10(2 days ago, 1 file, 3+ 3-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=8234afa0721c 19:30:07 yes, which is why I assumed it 19:30:09 -!- Zermako has quit [] 19:30:20 dang, 3+ 3- 19:30:34 I hadn't realized 19:30:41 Truly a 19:30:43 *glasses* 19:30:45 balancing act 19:30:48 ??grunt[$ 19:30:49 grunt[17/17]: ( •_•) ( •_•)>⌐■-■ (⌐■_■) 19:31:17 man those are some big shades 19:31:27 A big man needs big shades. 19:31:30 >_> 19:31:36 you've got big bones! 19:31:41 <|amethyst> A big enough man is his own shade 19:31:51 sounds pretty shady to me. 19:32:08 anyway most rings are useless in most fights 19:32:16 |amethyst, did you see tswett's response to the mystery of the static cast 19:32:37 so having 1 ring doesn't really become a disadvantage until you find your second ring of protection/evasion/maybe +stat/whatever 19:32:44 true 19:33:03 A lot of the sacrifices aren't too bad at the point when you make them, but sooner or later you'll come to regret them 19:33:09 or until you find 2 rings of protection from magic/regeneration which are useless in most fights (or all for regeneration) but you would want to wear both at once 19:33:44 feel free to look through my games for how many ended up with multiple good protection/evasion rings 19:33:46 (it's not many) 19:34:11 I usually end up with one ac/ev ring and one resistance ring . . . 19:34:59 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: ohh 19:35:18 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: didn't realise there was an overloaded version in 19:36:35 so...it's good? 19:36:56 the amount that I know about static_cast could be expressed in two words: "fuck" and "all" 19:38:51 minmay: if you ever felt like taking the time to look over the Ru sacrifices an express an opinion about the proper piety gain for them, I'd be very interested to hear it. 19:41:32 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: I'd maybe add a comment along the lines of // The cast is necessary to resolve the isspace overload in favour of the version rather than 19:41:48 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: but that shouldn't hold it up I think 19:43:27 -!- ishanyx has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:45:08 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: (btw, _create_weapon_str_map can go away when we dump old compilers and move to C++11) 19:45:22 <|amethyst> PleasingFungus: (because C++11 has an initializer-list constructor for map) 19:45:40 -!- gammafunk has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 19:47:40 -!- tsohg has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:49:31 -!- Isha is now known as ishanyx 19:53:58 blerg -- if I want to combine "string1" and "string 2", what operator do I use? 19:54:18 string3 = string1 + string2; 19:54:23 sweet, thanks 19:54:29 I'm assuming you mean "concatenate" by combine here :) 19:54:33 yes, I do 19:55:10 -!- puissantveil has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 19:55:50 oh . . . this might cause a translation problem if anyone ever tries to translate crawl again 19:56:35 blade_parts(): should I concatenate an "s" to designate plural (slightly more code-efficient) or try to use full words, even if it's slightly worse structure 19:57:04 -!- Euph0ria has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:59:15 -!- magicpoints has joined ##crawl-dev 19:59:36 isn't there a pluralize function somewhere? 20:00:28 -!- Amnesiac has joined ##crawl-dev 20:00:32 -!- Amnesiac has left ##crawl-dev 20:00:58 -!- Crehl_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:02:03 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 20:03:04 <|amethyst> what are you pluralising? 20:04:00 hands/tentacles/paws 20:04:33 <|amethyst> oh, and I guess you want the true name of the part, not whatever it is called in your current form 20:04:42 yeah 20:04:47 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 20:04:48 because it's for blade hands 20:05:24 !pluralise Lasty 20:05:44 <|amethyst> ah, because with sac hand you don't want to say "Your hands are blades." 20:06:06 <|amethyst> I would probably make it work like player::hand_name does 20:06:19 ok 20:07:40 I see hand_name in player.h, but not player.cc. Am I crazy? 20:07:54 <|amethyst> it's in player-act.cc 20:07:57 oh 20:08:26 <|amethyst> hm 20:08:44 <|amethyst> also, I wonder if hand_name itself should be changed for Sacrifice Hand 20:08:53 Yeah 20:09:03 It looks like blade_parts should probably use hand_name 20:09:13 <|amethyst> Lasty1: no, because hand_name looks at your form 20:09:18 ah 20:09:21 <|amethyst> if anything it should be the other way around 20:09:30 <|amethyst> s/if anything/probably/ 20:09:58 <|amethyst> maybe player::real_hand_name ? 20:10:02 blerg 20:10:03 <|amethyst> instead of blade_parts 20:10:14 that would work for me 20:10:44 ugh, I'm tired. 20:10:46 <|amethyst> (I would suggest adding an extra optional parameter to hand_name, but it is an override of actor::hand_name so you can't change the signature) 20:10:57 I don't want to work on this tonight. I'll take a pass tomorrow morning. 20:11:27 fwiw, I pushed some other patches to lastys_crawl/iashol 20:12:36 -!- category has quit [Quit: Page closed] 20:13:12 -!- tksquared has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 20:14:25 lastys_crawl 20:14:28 I'll bet that leaves a 20:14:30 ??grunt[$ 20:14:30 grunt[17/17]: ( •_•) ( •_•)>⌐■-■ (⌐■_■) 20:14:33 lasting impression 20:14:57 !send Grunt A Child's Treasury of Puns 20:14:57 Sending A Child's Treasury of Puns to Grunt. 20:19:56 -!- tcjsavannah has quit [Quit: tcjsavannah] 20:21:39 <|amethyst> !send Grunt Callahan's Crosstime Saloon 20:21:40 Sending Callahan's Crosstime Saloon to Grunt. 20:22:43 -!- eb_ has quit [] 20:24:18 -!- Crehl has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:25:10 Which of you monsters made this rod-mimic-filled level? 20:27:02 -!- PleasingFungus has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90.1 [Firefox 32.0a1/20140529030207]] 20:33:33 -!- Keanan has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:34:39 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 20:35:39 <|amethyst> > Across all C++ projects on Ohloh, 22% of all source code lines are comments. For Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup, this figure is only 9%. 20:36:27 <|amethyst> getting there! 20:37:05 -!- bh has joined ##crawl-dev 20:37:34 so are we going to remove pillar dancing? 20:37:35 bh: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 20:38:21 <|amethyst> Not sure how you can remove it entirely short of all monsters being faster (or otherwise more maneuverable) than players 20:38:49 <|amethyst> you could more severely penalise it 20:39:28 |amethyst: uncommented code is the best code 20:39:58 <|amethyst> I know *you* like things obscure and unreadable :P 20:40:29 -!- Kalir has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 20:41:05 |amethyst: we could remove it, but we'd need to completely upend out action scheduling mechanics 20:41:29 -!- ackack has joined ##crawl-dev 20:41:51 -!- raskol` has quit [Quit: quit] 20:41:57 At the start of a turn, everyone decides what actions they're going to take. Attack actions happen first and then movement actions 20:42:01 imo remove bh instead 20:42:02 <_< 20:42:09 -!- gammafunk has joined ##crawl-dev 20:42:15 GOOD TIMING GAMMA 20:42:18 !nerf gammafunk 20:42:19 * Sequell nerfs gammafunk!!! 20:42:25 nooooo 20:43:18 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:45:56 bh: that wouldn't end pillar dancing 20:45:56 |amethyst: My favored pillar-dancing replacement is to let all monsters gain a short-term Swiftness, with the chance increasing each turn they spend following you. Like Swiftness, they'd slow down afterward. One way or another, it would resolve the chase. 20:47:54 gammafunk: I just had a mindblowing RL idea! 20:48:02 ??bh 20:48:03 bh[1/4]: When it comes to stupid ideas, I'm your man. 20:48:07 You're an @ symbol trapped in a game and you need to kill the evil RL dev who put you there 20:48:32 isn't that essentially in your programming RL 20:49:40 point. 20:50:01 maybe you could make it more explicit 20:50:07 e 20:51:58 ??quazlal 20:51:59 quazlal ~ qazlal[1/4]: The violent god of natural disasters. Gives SH, temporary resists, RMsl, and clouds surrounding you in a small radius (and immunity to all friendly clouds). See also {upheaval}, {disaster area}, and {elemental force}. At max piety, gives either rF+, rC+, rElec, or 3 AC. 20:52:16 ??quazlol 20:52:17 I don't have a page labeled quazlol in my learndb. 20:55:32 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 20:56:10 !whichgod hune 20:56:11 6 recent wins: 3x Kikubaaqudgha, Jiyva, Cheibriados, Ashenzari 20:57:24 -!- Piginabag_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 20:57:26 ??whichgod 20:57:27 whichgod ~ which god[1/1]: kiku 20:57:30 ??whichcombo 20:57:31 I don't have a page labeled whichcombo in my learndb. 20:58:33 -!- ackack has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:59:01 -!- Euph0ria has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:04:09 -!- Keanan has joined ##crawl-dev 21:05:47 -!- ackack has joined ##crawl-dev 21:05:53 !rng sif kiku gozag chei ash 21:05:53 The RNG chooses: gozag. 21:06:00 heh....i'll try it 21:06:28 -!- Tenda has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:06:44 oops, wrong channel 21:07:03 -!- tksquared_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:14:25 -!- Ankalagon has quit [Quit: Page closed] 21:16:20 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 21:17:20 -!- Euph0ria has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:17:58 -!- tksquared has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:20:07 -!- reaverb has joined ##crawl-dev 21:21:01 -!- Crehl has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:21:19 -!- Aryth has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:22:17 -!- WalkerBoh has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:22:30 -!- Textmode has joined ##crawl-dev 21:27:25 -!- puppyknuckled has quit [Quit: Page closed] 21:31:50 !tell PleasingFungus I hope you weren't serious about buffing Ne!!!!! 21:31:51 gammafunk: You have 2 messages. Use !messages to read them. 21:31:51 gammafunk: OK, I'll let pleasingfungus know. 21:32:35 reaverb: I'm tweaking objstat now, so I'll take a look, but how did you run it out of curiousity? 21:32:51 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:32:53 Just the command you gave the on the Tavern. 21:33:05 ./crawl -objstat Branch,Foo,Bar,Etc 21:33:21 -!- st_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:33:58 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 21:39:00 -!- orionstein is now known as orionstein_away 21:39:51 ok, well I should run into that myself if there's a problem 21:42:43 -!- Ququman has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:43:09 -!- Lasty1 has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:43:28 -!- Keanan has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:44:22 -!- Lasty1 has joined ##crawl-dev 21:45:14 -!- orionstein_away is now known as orionstein 21:47:59 -!- PleasingFungus has joined ##crawl-dev 21:48:34 -!- Beast has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:49:07 -!- Makrond has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:49:15 gammafunk: you already knew that I wanted to bring lethal infusion back 21:49:16 PleasingFungus: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 21:49:44 PleasingFungus: Does this mean you have the design ready? 21:49:51 The only lethality the game needs should be directed at our players. 21:49:52 PleasingFungus: well, if it's really going to be a Thing, you could always make a new class! 21:49:53 <_< >_> <_< >_> 21:49:59 -!- Ladykiller69 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:50:05 I think Ne is very strong as a book start as-is 21:50:12 reaverb: I implemented it a month ago 21:50:15 it just needs more playtesting 21:50:16 and I haven't had time 21:50:26 Oh, hmm, what's the implementation? 21:50:33 lemme pull it up 21:50:52 gammafunk: this is part of my agenda of making it more obvious that ne is a good hybrid class 21:50:56 *more obvious to new players 21:51:13 so giving it to a new class would miss the whole point!!! 21:51:23 really don't think that's a good way to make it more obvious, or that it even needs to be made more obvious 21:52:54 Yes, if absolutely necessary something with less effect on gameplay could happen. 21:53:17 I strongly disagree but it is hard to argue when no reasoning is provided, only flat assertions 21:53:20 also http://sprunge.us/NTFQ this is for reaverb 21:53:39 most of the relevant stuff is toward the bottom of the diff, I guess 21:54:05 playtesting established that the numbers are wrong but I haven't had time to figure out what the right ones are 21:54:22 PleasingFungus: Thanks for the implementation. 21:54:25 ha 21:54:34 I am always happy to implement my own ideas 21:55:04 Although would a prop be better than an ATTR? 21:55:56 Sorry, I was confusing lethal infusion with something else, so I retract any complaint about that in particular 21:56:05 -!- Daekdroom has quit [Quit: Saindo] 21:56:06 excruciating wounds? 21:56:17 I think Ne is not a confusing start though 21:56:18 lethal infusion is the world's worst spell name and I really want to change it 21:56:33 PleasingFungus: then... change it 21:56:41 I have yet to think of a better one 21:56:56 the best candidate I had was "murderous pact" and that is also pretty not good 21:56:57 See, my strategy is to make a really bad name and then someone else fixes it 21:57:00 ha 21:57:02 ??lethal infusion 21:57:02 If giving it to Ne won't work, maybe new Lethal Infusion could replace Sure Blade? 21:57:02 lethal infusion[1/1]: Places the {draining} brand on a weapon temporarily. (Necromancy/Charms 2) 21:57:11 ??fire brand 21:57:12 fire brand[1/1]: This spell sets a weapon held by the caster ablaze. It will not affect weapons otherwise subject to special enchantments. Using this on a slicing weapon lets it chop off hydra heads instead of making more grow. If you are fighting something cold-blooded, you want {freezing aura} instead. 21:57:20 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 21:57:24 how about -- 'draining brand' 21:57:24 so this would reduce HD of monsters only? 21:57:42 oh I see 21:58:01 oh yeah I remember the reason I stopped working on this - I was hoping that the drain revamp that people were talking about would be done first 21:58:06 and then I could implement this on top of that 21:58:27 *drain brand revamp 21:59:25 -!- mamgar_ has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:59:45 imo somone should revamp drain brand. I will let the rng decide who 21:59:47 !rng reaverb 21:59:47 The RNG chooses: reaverb. 22:00:15 what's the problem with drain? I've actually not used it terribly much 22:00:26 my sense is it's a strong brand at least 22:00:45 it's strong yes 22:01:03 Quite Powerful 22:01:07 perhaps!!! 22:01:14 ??draining 22:01:15 draining[1/1]: see {draining_brand} or {drain_status} 22:01:19 ??draining brand 22:01:19 draining brand[1/2]: 2/3 chance of doing on average 25% extra damage to susceptible monsters, doing 1+1d3 extra damage and removing that much from max HP. If the 2/3 chance is hit, it has a further 20% chance to drop HD by 1. Only affects monsters of normal {holiness} with no rN. Players with rN+/rN++ are still affected (but get drained less and take less damage). 22:01:23 but the permanently reducing monster hit dice mechanic is bad for a couple of reasons 22:01:30 ??pain 22:01:30 pain[1/3]: L1 necro spell, exclusive to the Book of Necromancy. Inflicts 1hp non-fatal damage on the caster. Does 1d(4 + pow/5) damage, with a limit of 25 power, and bypasses AC - but checks MR and only affects monsters without life protection, or players without torment immunity. 22:01:34 ??pain brand 22:01:34 pain brand[1/2]: Brand which inflicts 1d(necromancy skill) extra damage on necro out of necro+1 successful hits. Does not affect those with rN (demons, undead, unliving, shadow dragons, death drakes, holies). (For the record, a monster's necromancy skill is HD/2, HD if undead or demonic, 0 if mindless/animal). 22:01:41 (1) reduces monster mhp (looks like their health is going up, since the fraction increases) 22:01:44 pain is an odd brand 22:02:04 (2) occasionally encourages scummy tactics (hit-and-run) - minmay swears by this, I haven't done it myself 22:02:27 (3) lowers monster xp, which doesn't matter in practice but misleads new players who hear about it 22:03:00 (4) matters startlingly little in combat, since 1HD rarely makes much of a difference one way or another 22:03:04 yeah, if it were a temporary HD loss, we could drop the xp thing as well I guess 22:03:10 that's the idea 22:03:42 I am not actually sure about point (4) and am going to retract it 22:03:48 since the other three points are enough 22:04:07 I strongly disagree with your retraction of your point (4)!!! 22:04:16 dang................ 22:04:45 * Grunt retracts 1 HD from gammafunk!!! 22:04:51 * gammafunk dies 22:05:02 unknown monster: "rat n_repl" 22:05:02 %??rat name:gammafunk n_repl 22:05:06 shit 22:05:09 already gone 22:05:20 rip 22:06:05 dang 22:08:00 -!- MgDark has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90.1 [Firefox 31.0/20140707160635]] 22:08:33 yeah, I wonder how that brand compares in practice to e.g. flame vs the appropriate non-resistant enemies ( +25% dmg on average vs 2/3 * 25% dmg + 1+1d3 + 2/3 * 1/5 HD loss on average) 22:09:00 er, distribution of terms slightly off 22:09:14 but I was pure math major in college, so I can't calculate 22:09:39 gammafunk: it's not 1/5 HD loss on average, it's 1/7.5 HD loss on average 22:09:55 oh I guess that's what you meant 22:09:58 yeah 22:10:15 2/3 * (25% dmg +1+1d3+2/3*1/5 HD loss) 22:10:24 minmay: but is the effect of that HD loss fairly appreciable in combat? 22:10:34 no 22:10:45 draining is good because of the 1+1d3 22:11:03 HD loss on 13% hits isn't noticeably different from HD loss on 0% of hits 22:11:05 yeah kind of figured; early game that would be very nice 22:11:12 because it only happens on 13% of hits 22:11:15 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 22:11:40 well I'm not really sure what I'd say a loss of 1 HD does 22:12:21 but I guess the fraction is so low you're pretty likely to not even get that 22:14:06 it's noticeable early game (see: natasha) but draining kills things before it happens early game 22:14:40 -!- CryptoCactus has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:14:58 -!- tksquared_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:18:06 totally unrelated: does anyone have an opinion on raising sleep immunity from 1 turn after waking to 1d3 turns after waking 22:18:10 to match paralysis immunity 22:18:34 seems reasonable 22:18:37 tengu reaver (13Q) | Spd: 10 (move: 90%) | HD: 17 | HP: 66-106 | AC/EV: 2/17 | Dam: 27, 11, 11 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, fighter, spellcaster, see invisible, lev | Res: 06magic(68) | XP: 2058 | Sp: b.lightning (3d22), battlesphere, freezing cloud (2d27) / b.magma (3d26), battlesphere, fireball (3d27) / b.venom (3d21), battlesphere, poisonous cloud (3d11) | Sz: Medium | Int: high. 22:18:37 %??tengu_reaver 22:18:42 (On that note natasha should probably gain instead of lose HD, it doesn't match player felids but her getting weaker plays pretty badly in my experince) 22:18:49 tengu reaver (13Q) | Spd: 10 (move: 90%) | HD: 15 | HP: 60-92 | AC/EV: 2/17 | Dam: 27, 11, 11 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, fighter, spellcaster, see invisible, lev | Res: 06magic(60) | XP: 1600 | Sp: b.lightning (3d20), battlesphere, freezing cloud (2d25) / b.magma (3d24), battlesphere, fireball (3d25) / b.venom (3d19), battlesphere, poisonous cloud (3d10) | Sz: Medium | Int: high. 22:18:49 %??tengu_reaver hd:15 22:18:55 reaverb: I have suggested this in the past 22:18:56 heh 22:19:04 tengu reaver (13Q) | Spd: 10 (move: 90%) | HD: 12 | HP: 45-77 | AC/EV: 2/17 | Dam: 27, 11, 11 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, fighter, spellcaster, see invisible, lev | Res: 06magic(48) | XP: 1090 | Sp: b.lightning (3d18), battlesphere, freezing cloud (2d22) / b.magma (3d21), battlesphere, fireball (3d21) / b.venom (3d17), battlesphere, poisonous cloud (3d8) | Sz: Medium | Int: high. 22:19:04 %??tengu_reaver hd:12 22:19:08 or at least, I've suggested that she not lose hd 22:19:19 arguably her gaining hd is "incentive not to kill her"...? 22:19:34 minmay this seems like the sort of thing you would say. is it something you actually would agree with 22:19:58 -!- ackack has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:20:12 PleasingFungus: sleep resistance 1d3 is reasonable, it should probably be looked at in the context for the like 2 monsters which have that spell. 22:20:18 perhaps she multiplies on kill 22:20:28 (player ghosts, the one unique, and maybe pan lords?) 22:20:49 aaaa 22:20:51 natashaswarm 22:21:03 natashic horde 22:21:03 27 Natasha come into view. 22:21:08 Boris should have the spell natashaswarm 22:21:15 summon Natasha 22:21:48 Summon Greater Natasha 22:22:04 -!- Shome has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90.1 [Firefox 30.0/20140605174243]] 22:22:09 Natasha Horde imo 22:22:17 Natasha (06h) | Spd: 10 (move: 80%) | HD: 3 | HP: 15 | AC/EV: 2/12 | Dam: 10 | 10items, 10doors, spellcaster, see invisible | Res: 06magic(24) | XP: 35 | Sp: magic dart (3d4), slow, call imp, 04esc:mephitic cloud | Sz: little | Int: high. 22:22:17 %??Natasha 22:22:22 Natasha (06h) | Spd: 10 (move: 80%) | HD: 6 | HP: 30 | AC/EV: 2/12 | Dam: 10 | 10items, 10doors, spellcaster, see invisible | Res: 06magic(48) | XP: 185 | Sp: magic dart (3d4), slow, call imp, 04esc:mephitic cloud | Sz: little | Int: high. 22:22:22 %??Natasha hd:6 22:26:57 -!- TR_Muscateer has joined ##crawl-dev 22:28:03 -!- KurzedMetal has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:28:51 Natasha (06h) | Spd: 10 (move: 80%) | HD: 50 | HP: 250 | AC/EV: 2/12 | Dam: 10 | 10items, 10doors, spellcaster, see invisible | Res: 06magic(400) | XP: 15000 | Sp: magic dart (3d10), slow, call imp, 04esc:mephitic cloud | Sz: little | Int: high. 22:28:51 %??natasha hd:50 22:28:58 -!- tksquared has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:28:58 huh. just a slow scaling on that dart, then 22:29:17 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 22:29:33 -!- MaxFrost has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:29:50 -!- Whistling_Bread has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:30:40 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 22:31:03 test spawner (16X) | Spd: 14 (swim: 60%; 07stationary) | HD: 1000 | HP: 10000 | AC/EV: 127/127 | 11non-living, amphibious, regen, !sil | Res: 13magic(immune), 05hellfire, 04fire+++, 02cold, 10elec, 03poison, 07acid, 12drown, 04rot+++, 13neg+++, 13torm, 04napalm++ | XP: 1 | Sp: magic dart (3d124) | Sz: Large | Int: plant. 22:31:03 %??test spawner spells:magic_dart 22:32:02 PleasingFungus: yes, punishing the player for killing a monster encourages them not to kill the monster 22:32:28 well, the question was whether a higher hd natasha showing up somewhere on the level was a punishment 22:32:38 you could argue it's more xp....... 22:32:52 yes, probably, since you don't know where natasha teleports to. 22:33:05 -!- rchandra has left ##crawl-dev 22:33:05 So it's easier to be caught by surprise. 22:42:37 -!- rossi_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:45:57 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 22:46:25 -!- Euph0riaX has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:50:18 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:53:20 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 23:03:35 -!- st_ has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 23:04:55 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.15-a0-2020-gdaae54a: Improve sleep code 10(25 minutes ago, 6 files, 27+ 44-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=daae54a4133a 23:04:55 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.15-a0-2021-g0f13574: Add exactly one (1) comma to a vampire level-up message 10(19 minutes ago, 1 file, 8+ 6-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=0f135746da2f 23:05:13 @Kilobyte: If EH is made to not instadrown fliers over water, it should at least confuse them for a turn or two, as they hit the water, wake up, and desperately try to start flying. 23:06:02 !seen kilobyte 23:06:02 I last saw kilobyte at Fri Jul 11 02:06:32 2014 UTC (1d 1h 59m 30s ago) joining the channel. 23:06:13 oops 23:06:16 didn't mean to ping him 23:06:26 was just quoting an old mantis comment directed at him 23:06:28 that I found funny 23:07:06 -!- lobf has joined ##crawl-dev 23:09:47 1learn add PleasingFungus oops 23:10:03 ...I wouldn't be surprised if that was already in there 23:10:03 at this point 23:10:10 It isn't! 23:10:12 !learn add PleasingFungus oops 23:10:13 pleasingfungus[8/8]: oops 23:10:14 Now it is. 23:10:21 oops 23:10:26 !learn mv pleasingfungus[8] pleasingfungus[1] 23:10:27 pleasingfungus[8] -> pleasingfungus[1/8]: oops 23:10:28 Much better. 23:10:37 ??pleasingfungus[$ 23:10:37 pleasingfungus[8/8]: ugh 23:10:42 um 23:10:49 1learn add 23:10:50 <3 23:10:51 something very odd has happened to my learndb entry 23:11:00 Hmm, I was thinking how bad my old shark removal edits probably were, but really they aren't that bad except for nicolae_underground_beach and probably sprint_mu. 23:11:07 http://bpaste.net/show/O6EolCO5SkfeLydLty1l/ 23:12:44 I am trying to decide if lost soul-revived monsters should wake up 23:12:57 it seems like they probably should 23:13:53 That seems fine, although it might make stabbing less practical next to lost souls. 23:15:55 well, so's all forms of killing 23:15:56 -!- rast has joined ##crawl-dev 23:19:29 -!- bh has quit [Quit: Page closed] 23:19:53 -!- CSDCMS has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:21:16 Hm. I'm trying and failing to figure out how to wake a monster up properly. 23:23:25 -!- CSDCS has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:30:01 -!- orionstein is now known as orionstein_away 23:32:37 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 23:35:47 !tell wheals 7*850 * (11 * 1/6 + 8*1/4) isn't 10.1k, it's 22k. imho get good noob 23:35:47 PleasingFungus: OK, I'll let wheals know. 23:36:58 -!- Hailley has quit [Quit: Petra is closed!] 23:37:25 -!- HaltingProblem has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 23:37:36 ' Hm. I'm trying and failing to figure out how to wake a monster up properly.' ME_ALERT? 23:37:41 or one of those 23:37:59 Patashu_: You really like code diving don't you :D 23:38:15 I do it a lot. 23:38:16 ME_ALERT looks about right, yep 23:38:20 thanks! 23:38:57 ME_ALERT is the one if you want the lost soul revived monster to be automatically seeking 23:39:02 I think if yo uwant it to just wake up you want ME_ANNOY? 23:39:20 ME_ALERT seems better, to prevent weird shit where you kill a dude and he forgets about you after revival 23:39:52 ME_ALERT it is then 23:39:56 although tbh 23:40:01 after you just got snatched away from the realm of death 23:40:04 you'd be a little winded too 23:40:05 know what I'm saying 23:40:25 -!- CSDCMS has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:40:53 or the realm of undeath :D 23:41:13 fun fact: when you die in the land of the dead you go to the land of the double dead 23:41:17 when you die in the land of the double dead, that's it 23:41:26 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 23:44:04 -!- Sovek has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 23:44:26 -!- CSDCS has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:45:00 -!- Lightli has joined ##crawl-dev 23:47:38 03PleasingFungus02 07* 0.15-a0-2022-g2a19b96: Don't spawn over 500 fruit in a vault 10(5 minutes ago, 1 file, 2+ 10-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=2a19b96610ed 23:47:40 hm. behaviour event needs a source, and i don't have one in this function 23:47:40 or in the caller 23:47:40 tricky 23:47:40 I don't think it's hard to say the player is responsible for waking a monster up if they kill it. 23:47:40 err, by which I mean, if the issue is decising the source the player seems fine. 23:47:40 this is just "if the monster dies and a lost soul is nearby" 23:47:40 Actually I haven't even looked at the code and you should probably ignore me. 23:47:40 the player can be on the other side of the level 23:47:40 what if it was an allied lost soul 23:47:40 the player isn't even relevant then 23:47:40 and an allied undead, yes. could easily happen with a yreddite who enslaved a deep elf death mage 23:48:26 PleasingFungus: Doesn't that throw off the nutrition numbers in the comments? 23:48:46 the nutrition numbers were wrong before 23:49:00 someone fucked up the math (wheals) (it was wheals) 23:49:00 Hmm, what make you say that? 23:49:06 because I ran the nutrition numbers 23:49:10 (Also the comments should be remove then) 23:49:17 the new comments are right 23:49:17 s/remove/removed/ 23:49:26 or rather, the old comments are now right 23:49:36 Oh, yes that's weird. 23:49:36 except possibly for the vault I didn't touch directly 23:49:59 !vault hangedman_ranch 23:50:00 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/dat/des/builder/food.des;hb=HEAD#l221 23:50:08 I have no idea how much food is in this one 23:50:10 now or before 23:50:32 ??ration 23:50:33 I don't have a page labeled ration in my learndb. 23:50:36 ??meat ration 23:50:37 food[1/4]: Goes in mouth/beak. Without carnivore or herbivore: Royal jelly weighs 5.5, is 5000 nutrition. Meat weighs 8, is 5000 nutrition. Bread weighs 8, is 4400 nutrition. Honeycomb weighs 4, is 2000 nutrition. A chunk weighs 10, is 1000 nutrition. Takes 4 turns to eat rations, 3 for chunks, 1 for ambrosia, and 2 turns for all other food. 23:50:46 !learn add ration See {food} 23:50:46 ration[1/1]: See {food} 23:51:08 ??pizza 23:51:08 I don't have a page labeled pizza in my learndb. 23:51:10 ??food[2 23:51:11 food[2/4]: Sultana is 70. Grape is 100. Strawberry is 200. Lychee/choko/rambutan is 600. Apricot/pear/apple is 700. Banana/lemon/orange is 1000. Cheese/sausage is 1200. Beef jerky/pizza/snozzcumber is 1500. Porridge is 6040. In 0.15+, fruit is now condensed into one generic "fruit" item (worth 850 nutrition). 23:51:17 !learn add pizza See {food[2]} 23:51:18 pizza[1/1]: See {food[2]} 23:51:31 huh. that's now 23k exact 23:51:45 comment says 22.3k which is Close Enough 23:52:28 Commits are cheap. 23:52:53 well, I don't want to do the herbivore/carnivore math 23:52:55 that is my actual reason 23:54:47 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle]