00:00:44 Stable (0.14) branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.14-b1-46-ge1f0920 00:02:07 elliptic: 0.14 is that awesome??? 00:02:09 <_< 00:02:15 I guess ckr+cbro accounts for close to half of that growth maybe 00:02:33 Unstable branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.15-a0-90-g85a0ca6 (34) 00:02:34 since they don't seem to have that much overlap in playerbase with the other servers 00:03:59 ckr is pretty popular, it seems 00:04:27 oddly, the japanese players who are on cszo regularly didn't seemed to know about it when I mentioned it 00:04:39 yeah, ckr had 299 distinct players last month 00:04:41 although I guess it's not actually announced yet 00:06:38 the last tiles chat I joined with one of the newer japanese players on cszo, I made some silly comment and according to google translate his response was "Good morning, producers!" 00:06:53 -!- Foamed has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 00:07:00 because they saw me messing around with wiz mode at one point 00:07:05 that's nice :) 00:08:39 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 00:09:29 should I make a patch to issue a warning when reading ?vuln with tempflight over lava/deep water 00:09:34 ...that was a terrible sentence 00:10:51 -!- mong has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:11:19 -!- Cheibrodos has quit [Quit: Page closed] 00:13:12 -!- xnavy has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 00:13:48 -!- tgcid has joined ##crawl-dev 00:14:02 -!- jeffro has joined ##crawl-dev 00:15:08 -!- jeffro_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:15:26 that is probably a good thing to warn about 00:18:57 -!- mong has quit [Client Quit] 00:21:30 -!- caleba has quit [Quit: caleba] 00:22:12 hm. or if you're in a position that'd be dangerous for you, without transformations... 00:22:34 there are a lot of cases to consider, yeah 00:22:46 yeah I'm thinking about this and it's a mess 00:22:48 I'm gonna make a chart. 00:25:40 uh oh 00:25:46 -!- st_ has quit [] 00:26:35 a decade from now, someone will type !seen PleasingFungus and Sequell will say "I last saw PleasingFungus saying "I'm going to make a chart."" 00:26:42 nooo 00:27:06 -!- wat1 has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:28:38 hmmmm. this might be simpler than I thought... yes. all I have to check is feat_is_dangerous() with permanently=true, I think 00:30:18 -!- xnavy_ has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 00:30:57 -!- SkiChan has quit [Quit: Page closed] 00:36:15 hm. how do I find the name of a grid feature? e.g. 'lava', 'deep water' 00:38:23 -!- Quashie has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 00:40:03 -!- BirdoPrey has quit [Quit: BirdoPrey] 00:43:21 -!- mong has quit [Quit: mong] 00:47:02 -!- Thalfon has quit [Quit: sleep] 00:47:04 my life would be a lot easier if the boots of the spider did not exist 00:47:34 gammafunk was right. I give up. rip 00:47:38 -!- wat2 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:48:21 is it clinging that is the problem 00:50:07 boots of the spider, and boots of flying 00:50:16 and probably other things I'm not thinking of 00:50:47 -!- thedefinite has quit [Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- Go on, try it!] 00:51:47 also, there's two different cases - if you have tempflight, you should be warned, but if you only have a form (e.g. ice form in deep water), reading ?vuln will instakill you, and so should be straight-out disallowed 00:52:15 wont it just kill you with temp flight too 00:52:16 no 00:52:21 oh right 00:52:23 the duration is set to 2 turns 00:52:25 flight is ~special~ 00:52:29 a comment notes for specifically this case 00:52:35 -!- KurzedMetal has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:52:44 PleasingFungus: 20 aut? 00:52:49 imo just remove water/lava 00:52:52 let me look again 00:52:53 problem solved 00:52:59 haha 00:53:09 crate: except for fedhas 00:53:19 Or give fedhas lightning clouds, that would work too 00:53:20 Basil: 11 aut 00:53:21 apparently 00:53:45 actually. hm 00:53:50 lemme test something 00:54:22 vuln code is pretty hacky, yeah 00:55:13 -!- tabstorm has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:55:17 nice 00:55:22 if you read vuln while flying + slowed you die 00:55:25 yes 00:55:51 I'm not sure it's a very good special case 00:55:52 -!- raskol_ has quit [Client Quit] 00:55:59 clearly well-intended 00:56:05 really I think vuln should just not remove player durations 00:56:26 that would certainly make it a lot more useful. 00:56:31 it's not like it's common enough to be really abusable 00:56:38 even with the recent boost to frequency 00:56:45 -!- Pepe has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 00:56:50 hmm 00:56:52 yeah, it might need some balance tweaking but I think it wouldn't be a big deal to balance 00:57:01 let stasis cancel mark then 00:57:03 :p 00:57:05 Wasn't there some thought given to making it remove all statuses without MR-? 00:57:20 it's sort of odd that both effects are on one scroll 00:57:39 the "give everything mr- (including you)" and "remove all statuses (and on you)" effects 00:57:47 also removing contam 00:58:12 it is a very busy scroll! 00:58:33 -!- Nethris has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:58:34 what if it just removed hex-y statuses like slow, mark, etc? 00:58:51 would make sense 00:58:53 and not stuff like flight, contam, etc 00:58:55 Sure 00:59:00 also hex-y forms? 00:59:02 e.g. pig 00:59:06 Can pigs read? 00:59:10 no idea 00:59:14 it does require special-casing a small list (which could be in the item description) 00:59:17 nah, I wouldn't do forms 00:59:21 they can 00:59:31 -!- Quashie has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:59:33 (just tested) 00:59:40 a scroll called "vulnerability" removing specifically hexes is really weird 00:59:50 clearly the name would be changed! 00:59:51 Scrolls of remove hexes and suchlike 00:59:53 the name is weird regardless :P 00:59:56 well yes 01:00:04 "Scroll of things" 01:00:40 well there's a patch changing it to "purge magic" sitting on mantis...! 01:00:53 mm 01:00:58 Invis is a hex 01:01:03 -!- DrinkMachine has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:01:10 Should go to Charms to prevent confusion 01:01:30 no, I think that's problematic 01:02:07 charms has way too much good shit as is 01:02:34 it's a hex that messes up monster's vision 01:02:39 *monsters' 01:02:48 hex eyeballs 01:02:53 uh, I guess vuln actually doesn't remove DUR_SLOW at the moment even? 01:03:00 oh that was the increased frequency I was thinking of. whoops. sometimes it's hard to remember what was actually applied & what wasn't 01:03:02 oh, no, it does 01:03:05 it does that later on 01:03:08 heh, "don't want to overlap with stais!" 01:03:19 *stasis, geeze 01:03:29 oh no the weight increase was pushed. okay. I'm not crazy. 01:03:51 "scroll of antimagic" would be a good name for the current effect 01:03:56 anyway I think cherry-picking a few things from antimagic() would work better than just copying the entire effect, for ?vuln 01:04:14 good name for the current effect except for the half that is "vulnerability" 01:04:17 so if someone can figure out some consistent flavor, that would be good 01:05:03 a scroll that decreases magic resist is interesting for hexers. a scroll that removes glow & modifiers is interesting for many characters, and there are a lot of good variations on the latter idea... 01:05:19 I do think there is some value in ?vuln curing mark/petrification/slow, but the rest just causes issues and makes the scroll less usable 01:06:36 but it would still give the player -mr? 01:07:55 that would sort of defeat the point 01:08:07 At least, if it gives you MR- 01:08:09 giving -MR seems fine to me 01:08:11 Basil: hm? 01:08:58 elliptic: could it remove those debuffs from monsters as well? 01:09:06 the ones it removes for the player, I mean 01:09:21 certainly the scroll is useful right now for removing mark/petrification even though it gives -MR (and does other bad things) 01:09:47 I guess for theme, it has to penetrate through one's MR in order to remove those negative effects 01:10:10 -!- TAS_2012v has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:10:10 gammafunk: it could, but then maybe a few others like confusion and paralysis should be added (which aren't relevant for players because you can't read scrolls during them) 01:10:26 yeah 01:11:34 there's no need to have monster symmetry I guess, but it makes the flavor easier 01:12:36 scroll of magical deep cleansing 01:13:02 spa scroll. 01:13:37 idk, I think "mr-, remove bad effects, remove contam" is enough stuff for one scroll without also affecting monsters 01:13:45 *reduce contam 01:13:58 the -mr to monsters is pretty fun though 01:14:01 it's a good effect 01:14:29 sure. if we're keeping that you'd want to keep symmetry on the other effects 01:15:03 well I was arguing for just that, but we don't *have* to have this symmetry 01:15:34 the deep hex cleansing only affects the source! 01:15:46 warning, consult a doctor before reading a scroll of magical cleansing 01:16:41 symptoms include visions of zot, spontaneous draconian breath, and you may begin spawning high level jellies when damaged 01:16:59 I choose to believe that 'draconian breath' involves coughing out very small draconians. 01:17:07 ogre mage (06O) | Spd: 10 | HD: 10 | HP: 38-71 | AC/EV: 1/7 | Dam: 12 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, spellcaster, see invisible | Res: 06magic(80) | Chunks: 07contam | XP: 924 | Sp: haste other, crystal spear (3d28), blink, b.fire (3d18), b.cold (3d18), 04esc:minor healing (2d5) / haste other, mystic blast (3d15), invisibility, confuse, slow, 04esc:teleport self / haste other, paralyse, haste, b.lightning (3d17), confuse, 04esc:teleport self / haste other, sting (d10), blink, b.lightning (3d17), banishment, 04esc:minor healing (2d5) / haste other, throw flame (3d8), invisibility, teleport other, fireball (3d19) | Sz: Large | Int: high. 01:17:07 %??ogre mage 01:17:16 vampire knight (10V) | Spd: 10 | HD: 11 | HP: 51-95 | AC/EV: 10/10 | Dam: 33, 1505(vampiric) | 07undead, 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, fighter, evil, spellcaster, see invisible | Res: 06magic(88), 02cold, 09poison+++, 12drown, 04rot+++, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 1306 | Sp: blink close, paralyse, haste, invisibility, 04esc:vampiric draining | Sz: Medium | Int: high. 01:17:16 %??vampire knight 01:18:01 huh. xp value is closer than I'd expect 01:20:36 I'm sorry, slow mark petrify are the statuses that it can purge, right? 01:22:08 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:22:15 in the suggestion? 01:22:21 yes 01:23:17 Those are all the ones elliptic named, yeah. (Also paralysis/confuse for monsters) 01:23:35 basically the "magical" debuffs 01:23:43 hmm 01:23:49 elyv's weak is a god thing 01:23:56 and retch is a physical thing 01:24:00 that list isn't set in stone, of course... just a suggestion based on glancing on the current list 01:24:03 unknown monster: "orange devil" 01:24:03 %??orange devil 01:24:06 orange demon (044) | Spd: 10 | HD: 8 | HP: 36-67 | AC/EV: 3/7 | Dam: 1005(reach)04(poison, weakness), 8 | 05demonic, 10doors | Res: 06magic(64), 04rot, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 417 | Sz: Medium | Int: normal. 01:24:06 %??orange demon 01:24:16 What creatures slow you with that being a noticeable threat? 01:24:17 are they a god thing 01:24:21 Basil: liches 01:24:24 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 01:24:29 Basil: also sphinxes 01:24:31 hmm 01:24:32 I got killed by ancient lich slow on z:5, once 01:24:36 no that's some king of poison effect I think 01:24:44 lich (15L) | Spd: 10 | HD: 20 | HP: 62-100 | AC/EV: 10/10 | Dam: 1513(drain) | 07undead, 10doors, evil, spellcaster, see invisible | Res: 13magic(immune), 02cold++, 09poison+++, 12drown, 04rot+++, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 2752 | Sp: b.cold (3d29), paralyse, sum.greater demon, animate dead, iron shot (3d34), 04esc:teleport self / b.draining (3d27), slow, invisibility, throw icicle (3d29), crystal spear (3d40) / b.fire (3d29), confuse, haste, b.draining (3d27), sum.greater demon, 04esc:banishment / mystic blast (3d24), b.cold (3d29), invisibility, animate dead, o.destruction (9d17) | Sz: Medium | Int: high. 01:24:44 %??lich 01:24:55 probably still shouldn't be cured by newvuln either way 01:24:55 i'm pretty sure orange demon gives "weak" status 01:25:14 I'm usually rather more concerned about the para from both of those 01:25:17 than the slow bit 01:25:28 I think it is best to keep the list of effects relatively small, anyway 01:25:36 well weak is a physical kind of effect, not one arising from a magic hex 01:25:46 and -MR means that the para will hit you if they do cast it 01:26:01 then again, slow and para do not coexist with liches 01:26:19 sort of getting back to what I was saying about the mr- and status-removal effects being an uncomfortable fit on the same scroll 01:26:29 Basil: liches with slow don't have para, yeah... and often the use for curing slow or mark is after you kill the monster that caused it anyway 01:26:44 I guess it'd work after a zerk as well 01:26:54 I don't think an mr- scroll would be a strong enough concept on its own, though 01:27:06 gammafunk: right now slow from zerk is special-cased not to be removed, as a physical thing 01:27:22 Is curare the same? 01:27:23 using our 'physical logic' I guess we'd still do that? idk 01:27:27 hm. no 01:27:27 i think that that is really dumb 01:27:31 "removes slow except when it doesnt" 01:27:33 Remove the special case I think 01:27:39 ok 01:27:46 "stasis removes berserk slow I think 01:27:50 yes 01:27:57 yeah, currently it removes slow unless you are exhausted, in which case it reduces slow duration to exh duration :P 01:28:06 meh 01:28:06 heh 01:28:11 so if you were magically slowed and then did something to get exhausted, well... 01:28:22 ddoor 01:28:54 death's door isn't even removed now, I think 01:28:56 anyway I'd be in favor of making it remove post-berserk slow regardless 01:29:27 PleasingFungus: a lot of stuff isn't, and it isn't really clear what the reasoning is 01:29:28 scroll of magical refreshment 01:29:30 it's not as though troggites will be reading ?vuln after every zerk 01:29:43 elliptic: "crawl has too many status effects" 01:29:54 "and no one can keep track of them all" 01:29:55 this is why I'd rather just special-case 3-5 things than special-case 30 things 01:30:23 oh, is DUR_ANTIMAGIC the weird antiwizardry hex that demonspawn can place on you? 01:30:40 I think that is DUR_SAP_MAGIC and DUR_MAGIC_SAPPED? 01:30:44 huh 01:30:45 hmm 01:30:49 grep for "tainted" 01:30:51 not sure what DUR_ANTIMAGIC is though :P 01:30:57 eyes against Dj 01:30:58 leftover from djinn? 01:31:28 RED, "-Mag", "antimagic", "You have trouble accessing your magic." }, 01:31:34 yes 01:31:37 I am not actually sure anything adds it 01:31:43 it's from djinn 01:31:49 so we have to add djinn back 01:31:50 snip snip 01:31:51 yeah, antimagic is Dj-only, and should be removed 01:32:06 huh 01:32:07 (at some point) 01:32:09 I never saw it even when playing dj 01:32:12 neat 01:32:28 wheals didn't even remove all of djinn 01:32:34 it's like Pan all over again 01:32:37 clearly we need more "remove djinn" commits 01:32:42 Shaaame 01:32:46 -!- tgcid has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:33:23 -!- gammafunk has quit [Quit: leaving] 01:33:46 I guess someone should TAG_MAJOR_VERSION==34 DUR_ANTIMAGIC, then 01:40:53 -!- Krakhan has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:42:29 -!- ontoclasm1 has joined ##crawl-dev 01:42:32 -!- ontoclasm1 has left ##crawl-dev 01:45:21 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 01:47:09 -!- 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714-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=5185eb4ffd94 06:57:15 Cherry-picked 2 commits into stone_soup-0.14 06:57:15 03Translators02 {galehar} 07[stone_soup-0.14] * 0.14-b1-49-gc72db44: [Transifex] Sync. 10(9 minutes ago, 51 files, 391+ 714-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=c72db445d51f 07:09:17 -!- zxc232 has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 07:11:39 -!- Nethris has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 07:14:34 -!- Sonata has quit [Read error: Network is unreachable] 07:14:35 -!- dfasdf has quit [Client Quit] 07:15:26 -!- nimitz has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:15:39 -!- duralumin has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:15:56 -!- Sgeo has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:16:20 -!- Amy|Sonata has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 07:16:36 -!- SamB_ has joined ##crawl-dev 07:16:39 -!- dpeg has joined ##crawl-dev 07:17:04 -!- oberstein has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 07:18:14 -!- SkaryMonk2 has joined ##crawl-dev 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seconds] 07:45:54 -!- MiraclePrism has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:07:35 -!- Chris7 has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 08:08:55 -!- SurpriseTRex has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:09:47 -!- Moredread has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:11:19 -!- MaxFrost has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:16:59 -!- ainsophyao has joined ##crawl-dev 08:17:05 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 08:17:14 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 08:19:25 dpeg: mind if I respond to your devwiki comments in the tavern in an attempt to provoke some additional discussion? 08:19:34 -!- tgcid has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:25:17 -!- Chris77 is now known as Chriswork 08:26:47 -!- wheals has joined ##crawl-dev 08:26:54 Lasty: of course not, go ahead! 08:28:07 Tahnks. 08:29:34 -!- DrKe has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:29:40 -!- Lawman0_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:29:48 -!- notcluie has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:34:47 -!- Ragdoll has joined ##crawl-dev 08:34:48 -!- conted has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:35:34 -!- jeanjacques has joined ##crawl-dev 08:37:29 -!- tkappleton has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 08:42:36 iafm (L23 DECj) ERROR in 'tileweb.cc' at line 212: Socket write error: Resource temporarily unavailable (Blade) 08:43:55 WeiSong (L10 HEFE) ERROR in 'tileweb.cc' at line 212: Socket write error: Resource temporarily unavailable (D:9) 08:44:54 NotMyLeg (L11 FoFi) ERROR in 'tileweb.cc' at line 212: Socket write error: Resource temporarily unavailable (D:10) 08:44:55 Werewhale (L13 VpAs) ERROR in 'tileweb.cc' at line 212: Socket write error: Resource temporarily unavailable (Lab) 08:46:03 WeiSong (L10 HEFE) ERROR in 'tileweb.cc' at line 212: Socket write error: Resource temporarily unavailable (D:9) 08:46:03 iafm (L23 DECj) ERROR in 'tileweb.cc' at line 212: Socket write error: Resource temporarily unavailable (Blade) 08:49:46 dpeg I just noticed something. I put up a god of luck proposal that's primary focus was rerolling things and you didn't like it; said rerolling was a bad mechanic. But...you do appear to like the Iashol proposal and one of it's main powers (aura of power) is rerolling things. 08:49:59 -!- Cabadath is now known as Bcadren 08:51:33 Bcadren: No. This is what I said about the power on the wiki page: "Power: not good. First, it is opaque. Second, it is not a uniform boost (attacks with low variance don't benefit at all). I think the desired effect could be achieved in other ways, too. For example: with a chance depending on piety, apply another attack of the same type." 08:52:57 I had a dream that there was a god of painting and all his effects had to do with the color that creatures appear in console...and you couldn't worship him in tiles. 08:53:28 -!- rchandra has joined ##crawl-dev 08:54:25 Bcadren: time to go out and take a walk! :) 08:56:32 I wrote a move like that for a fan-made pokemon RPG a long time ago; heh. What it did depended the comparison of the user's pokedex color and the targets...hah I don't think such could work here though, because -you- don't realy have a color at very least it doesn't change. 08:58:10 -!- Naruni has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:59:43 -!- tensorpudding has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:01:07 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 09:02:12 -!- Foamed has quit [Quit: Heading to bed.] 09:02:54 dpeg: reply posted 09:03:08 Doing one of the dungeon sprints made me realize something; Sif's * ability...is about the same as evoking a staff of energy. It's not even that much stronger. 09:03:18 -!- notcluie_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:03:22 At high invo it's much stronger 09:03:52 ?? channeling 09:03:53 channeling[1/1]: Converts food into mana. The staff succeeds (evo+11)/40, 50 hunger, 1d3 MP; Wucad Mu (evo+1)/25, 50 hunger, 1/5 div miscast, otherwise 2+d5+evo/3 MP; Sif power 60+INT+inv %, 100-300 hunger, d(2+inv/4) mp. For reference, merely resting will recover 14+maxMP per 600 nutrition, at standard metabolic rates. 09:04:52 In an extreme example, at 24 Invo, 1d8 mana/use is way better than 1d3. 09:05:09 It's still weaker than Wucad Mu... 09:05:19 yes, but Sif appears in every game, and Wucad Mu doesn't 09:05:30 -!- _D_ has quit [Quit: leaving] 09:05:31 Trog's gifts are invariably weaker than the Plutonium Sword. 09:05:52 It seems like Wucad Mu and Olgreb's are more common than other fixed arts. 09:05:57 And Dith's fog blood is weaker than the Cloak of the Thief 09:06:36 Though if my own runs are evidence... Boots of the Assassin and Boots of the Spider are more common than boots of running. 09:06:55 To be fair, Sif's channeling also doesn't have any chance of afflicting you with miscasts and doesn't require you to switch weapons/jewelry 09:07:13 bcarden: your experience is a very small sample size 09:07:28 I've found way more boots of running than either of those randarts 09:08:29 Bcadren: it makes no sense to play the early game in hope of a particular item 09:08:41 it makes no sense either to buff a god because some particular item is really strong 09:09:45 Yes, *if* you find Wucad Mu very early, that may influence your opinion about Sif. Good! 09:11:47 I think there are some vaults which are supposed to be guaranteed an artifact staff and each has a really high chance of Olgrebs or Wucad Mu...one of said vaults is a Shoals : 5 end. I've never read the code, so I'm not sure; but from experience it seems like you get an Artifact staff in Shoals 5, period. 09:14:55 I've won with Sif; the gifts and Amnesia were a lot more important to that run than channeling. Though, it was a transmuter that I wanted to be certain would get Haste and several other boost spells; not a pure caster that would really use channeling much. 09:15:05 Your experience is not representative in this case. 09:15:13 -!- bencryption has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.3] 09:15:15 early, guaranteed channeling is very, very strong 09:15:16 There is no guaranteed artifact staff on Shoals:5 09:17:20 -!- tensorpudding has quit [Client Quit] 09:17:45 -!- LexAckson has joined ##crawl-dev 09:17:45 -!- SkaryMonk1 has joined ##crawl-dev 09:19:56 -!- SkaryMonk2 has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 09:21:29 -!- Sequell has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:21:46 -!- Sequell has joined ##crawl-dev 09:22:29 -!- geekosaur has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net] 09:23:23 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 09:23:51 Lasty there's one specific location in the shoals:5 endvault with all the little circular lighthouse-like rooms...that I always get an artifact staff in..it's that specific ending though...not all the endings...I just happen to get that ending a lot (similarly I've yet to get a swamp ending that didn't have the Lernaean Hydra). 09:23:52 -!- geekosaur has joined ##crawl-dev 09:24:46 -!- Mateji has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 09:25:58 Even if one possible vault that can be placed on Shoals:5 is guaranteed to have Wucad Mu (which you've asserted, but you've also said that you haven't checked), Wucad Mu still isn't guaranteed. Heck, there's a 100% guaranteed staff of Wucad Mu in the Wucad Mu wizlab, but wizlabs aren't guaranteed either, and when they spawn, they don't necessary load the Wucad Mu version. 09:26:18 The vast majority of characters do not get the Staff of Wucad Mu. 09:26:40 If you do get it frequently, you should consider yourself lucky. 09:27:16 for a short time it was spawning a lot :) 09:27:48 %git :/[Ss]ta[fv] 09:27:52 07elliptic02 * 0.14-b1-12-g1e0207d: Fix unrand staves being far more common than other unrand weapons. 10(9 days ago, 1 file, 3+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=1e0207d72fd6 09:28:04 true 09:28:18 -!- wat is now known as Furril 09:28:22 And even with that bug in place, it was still rare to get one. 09:28:44 I got it 3 games in a row, and was wondering why until that commit went past 09:29:07 Sif is...one of the gods that I think it's better to have for awhile then leave for a better god later, especially since Amnesia is a permanent and you keep all the book gifts; keep Sif until you have the spells you want; then leave. Late game usefulness is lower, regardless. 09:29:32 -!- Sequell has quit [Quit: Sequell] 09:29:55 -!- tensorpudding has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:30:23 -!- wheals has quit [Quit: Leaving] 09:30:34 -!- Zilis has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 09:32:13 -!- duralumin has quit [Quit: Leaving] 09:32:28 Bcadren: channelling is useful, casting support is useful. People changing gods is also okay! 09:33:19 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:34:14 Sacrifice Memory: lose 50% of your memorizable spell levels. Interesting or boring? 09:34:28 Lasty brutal. 09:34:49 I think it's probably too hard for some characters and completely ignorable for others. 09:35:05 -!- PleasingFungus has joined ##crawl-dev 09:36:42 That's the problem with the sacrifices. Sacrificing my ability to use Fire magic means whole HELL of a lot if I have some fire spells memorized and already invested a lot of XP into it...it means nothing if I'm a melee/ranged character or an ice elementalist. 09:37:27 -!- Sequell has joined ##crawl-dev 09:40:17 Lasty: good! 09:40:38 If you made it work correctly...this god could be really meaningful/brutal;but none of the choices should be trivial. Someone said giving up things in late game should be worth LESS, but I disagree and posit the opposite; giving up the ability to do something that you've invested in means a lot more than having to adapt earlier. 09:40:56 -!- Yermak has quit [Quit: Page closed] 09:40:59 bcarden: right now you'll never be asked to make a sacrifice that is just "fire magic" 09:41:27 there will always be some easier sacrifices, that's no big deal 09:41:51 The smallest arcane sacrifices will be three schools chosen from a mixture of subschools. The combination of the three should restrict access to at least a few valuable spells in every game, since (by definition) the worshipper is not also worshipping Trog. 09:42:37 Lasty: what is your opinion on randomness in sacrifices? E.g. there could be a "handicapped at magic" sacrifice, and it would be one of several things. 09:42:47 Lasty I know the choice; I saw it, it was randomly half of your magic schools...but again; the RNG could be horrible (block something you've invested a lot into) or meh (block something you would have needed to countertrain anyways. 09:43:44 dpeg: I think randomness is fine as long as the possible entries are thematically linked. 09:44:03 Grouping multiple effects into a single sacrifice name allows us to get away w/ fewer sacrifice ability entries 09:44:08 in the ability tables 09:45:04 -!- Eonwe6 has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:04 -!- Isvaffel has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:04 -!- Xiberia has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:04 -!- User__ has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:04 -!- Kintak has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:05 -!- BlastHardcheese has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:05 -!- Lantell has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:05 -!- RiotInferno has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:05 -!- Lasty has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:05 -!- odiv has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:05 -!- tupper has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:05 -!- rast has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:05 -!- Fuzzwah has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:05 -!- johnstein has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:05 -!- johlstei has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:06 -!- neunon has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:06 -!- |amethyst has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:06 -!- tksquared has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:06 -!- iasov has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:06 -!- luukano has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:06 -!- Vizer has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:06 -!- NeremWorld has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:06 -!- Ragnor has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:06 -!- jbenedetto has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:06 -!- Psyknux has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:06 -!- crate has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:06 -!- flowsnake has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:07 -!- myp has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:07 -!- Goncyn has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:07 -!- neuwiz has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:07 -!- lavos3 has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:07 -!- tw_ has quit [*.net *.split] 09:45:14 -!- johnstein has joined ##crawl-dev 09:45:18 Lasty: yes, that's the advantage. The drawback is that it will be really hard to make sacrifices in the same group equivalent. 09:45:24 -!- crate has joined ##crawl-dev 09:45:33 -!- neunon has joined ##crawl-dev 09:46:01 -!- Xiberia has joined ##crawl-dev 09:46:02 -!- Zilis has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 09:46:32 -!- wheals has joined ##crawl-dev 09:46:43 Tragically, Lasty was lost in the netsplit. 09:46:52 -!- Slowpoke_Man has joined ##crawl-dev 09:46:52 -!- rast has joined ##crawl-dev 09:47:30 What's all this about sacrifices? 09:49:06 -!- Sequell has quit [Quit: Sequell] 09:49:20 -!- Sequell has joined ##crawl-dev 09:50:29 -!- Lantell has joined ##crawl-dev 09:50:34 PleasingFungus Lasty is creating a god of sacrifice; you lose things like an arm (ability to use shields and 2H weapons) for powers that would be brokenly powerful compared to other gods if it wasn't for the fact you had to give up so much to get your piety up. 09:50:43 -!- Lasty has joined ##crawl-dev 09:50:49 -!- johlstei has joined ##crawl-dev 09:51:07 Bcadren: I think you misunderstood. One proposal is: Randomly lock one of {Charms or Translocations or Necromancy or Conjurations} and one of {Summoning, Transmutation, Hexes} and two of {Fire, Ice, Earth, Air, Poison}. The player may not cast any spell of the locked schools. The other proposal is: cut the number of spell levels you can memorize in half. 09:52:11 And yeah, there will also be some sacrifices that hurt less, and that's good. If every sacrifice hurt badly, the amount of power granted by the god would have to be amped up like crazy. Think of how much power other gods offer without demanding meaningful penalties. 09:52:23 I think the spell levels version is better. It's less fidgety. 09:52:44 dpeg what you think of the new version here? https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=11528 (currently two from the bottom). 09:52:58 They aren't versions, they're two separate proposals which should each be considered on their own merits. Both or neither could be used. 09:53:31 -!- Slowpoke_Man is now known as BlastHardcheese 09:54:12 -!- Sequell has quit [Client Quit] 09:55:09 -!- BirdoPrey has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:55:20 -!- Sequell has joined ##crawl-dev 09:55:43 -!- |amethyst has joined ##crawl-dev 09:56:55 -!- johlstei has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:57:34 -!- ldf has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:01:37 Bcadren: this is way too complicated -- like Xom, but now with god-player interaction! So many ways for players to plan and grind (make lists of effects, don't use items with bad effects etc.) 10:02:14 -!- MaxFrost has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:02:33 the abilities are actually interesting, but the conduct doesn't work 10:02:40 -!- flowsnake has joined ##crawl-dev 10:08:42 -!- Morg0th has quit [Quit: leaving] 10:11:09 SO you like the abilities, but not the first conduct? 10:11:54 -!- nixor has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 10:12:10 the stuff about "kill with FOO with BAR", "haste POXY" will not work, for several reasons 10:13:30 What about the vulnerability conduct? 10:15:02 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 10:15:44 -!- User_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:15:53 Bcadren: that may work! 10:16:28 -!- Mad_Wack has quit [Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…] 10:23:40 -!- BigBluFrog has quit [Quit: Page closed] 10:23:57 -!- MuadDib_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 10:27:38 -!- Mandevil has quit [Quit: leaving] 10:30:10 -!- orcus is now known as Guest5419 10:45:02 -!- DrKe has quit [] 10:48:07 -!- omnirizon has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:49:18 -!- Piginabag has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:50:36 -!- Zicher has quit [Quit: Page closed] 10:51:14 -!- gnum has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:51:34 -!- Henzell has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:51:35 -!- PleasingFungus has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:53:22 !send dpeg gold 10:53:22 Sending gold to dpeg. 10:56:01 -!- Curzy has quit [Quit: Page closed] 11:00:01 -!- Henzell has joined ##crawl-dev 11:00:40 * dpeg is counting coins. 11:02:21 -!- radinms has quit [] 11:02:48 * Bcadren turns dpeg into a spider. 11:03:49 -!- gammafunk has joined ##crawl-dev 11:04:01 Stable (0.14) branch on crawl.lantea.net updated to: 0.14-b1-49-gc72db44 11:05:06 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: ["Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com"]] 11:05:21 -!- PleasingFungus has joined ##crawl-dev 11:06:31 ...is that it then? is 0.14 (stable) live? 11:07:08 -!- SamB_ is now known as SamB 11:07:19 how do I get the manual to sync into 0.14/trunk? 11:09:14 !tell tenofswords If I wanted to hack on vaultedit, is it best if I just directly edit vaultedit.html, and do you have a repo for it? 11:09:15 gammafunk: OK, I'll let tenofswords know. 11:09:24 -!- elliptic has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:09:38 -!- jameyd is now known as jamey 11:09:43 -!- jamey is now known as jameyd 11:09:53 wheals: make rest 11:09:54 isn't vaultedit nooodl's thing 11:10:12 could be, but I saw this 11:10:14 ??vaultedit[2 11:10:15 vaultedit[2/2]: hangedman's todos: update shown features, tiles; allow putting in text and seeing the vaultedit load that vault; direct links to vault philosophy guides shown for newcomers; dragging around tiles display, expanding it; hovertooltips??; 11:10:29 !seen nooodl 11:10:29 I last saw nooodl at Tue Apr 8 10:40:03 2014 UTC (5h 30m 25s ago) joining the channel. 11:11:04 nooodl: Are you the author of vaulted? I'd like to hack on it some, maybe put it in a repo if you don't have one? 11:11:20 wheals: i'm updating some manual stuff, before you sync it 11:11:21 s/vaulted/vaultedit/ 11:11:35 ok, nice 11:18:08 -!- ldf has joined ##crawl-dev 11:18:29 -!- rossi has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:18:42 -!- SkaryMonk2 has joined ##crawl-dev 11:19:44 -!- SkaryMonk1 has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 11:24:14 -!- wheals has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:25:23 -!- gnum_ has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 11:28:58 -!- Blazinghand|Work has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:30:17 ...btw, any further suggestions for a release name? 11:30:33 I'm going to use "The Shadowy Depths of Madness" if we don't come up with anything else reasonable >_> 11:31:31 -!- zxc232 has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 11:32:17 -!- tensorpudding has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net] 11:34:26 -!- Netmonmatt has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 11:34:45 $ gold (picking it up takes no turns) 11:35:03 good manual 11:35:37 -!- OCTOTROG has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:36:18 -!- Garhauk has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:37:04 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 11:37:30 -!- gammafunk has quit [Quit: leaving] 11:40:42 -!- minmay has joined ##crawl-dev 11:40:48 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:40:51 MarvinPA: I don't think this has ever been true!! 11:47:30 %git 3a6ffef1 11:47:30 07dpeg02 * 0.4-a0-1651-g3a6ffef: Updated manual for the new hud. Moved Gold to Items section. Didn't bother to explain the health/magic bars as they are very intuitive. 10(6 years ago, 1 file, 54+ 30-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=3a6ffef13efb 11:47:43 -!- ystael_ is now known as ystael 11:55:02 six years ago :O 11:56:06 * Bcadren thinks INT should be used for Invo and Evo...just so it's not the only stat a character could foreseeably have no use for. 11:57:53 I just got a nicolae_shop_statue_plus which completely disconnected the shop from the level. 11:57:58 Known bug? 11:58:26 -!- bitsailor has joined ##crawl-dev 11:58:38 -!- bitsailor has quit [Changing host] 11:58:38 -!- bitsailor has joined ##crawl-dev 11:59:57 It's happened with other minivaults; usually it means they don't place exits correctly. 12:00:03 there are a couple of disconnected vault bugs but i don't think i've seen any shop ones 12:00:27 !vault nicolae_shop_statue_plus 12:00:27 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/dat/des/builder/shops.des;hb=HEAD#l138 12:00:59 hmm i have no clue on how minivault placement works so querying that doesn't actually help at all :P 12:01:51 -!- NeremWorld has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 12:01:57 -!- bitsailor has quit [Client Quit] 12:02:05 I guess that means bug report :) Thanks folks. 12:02:15 ...most of these probably need to place exits or get tagged with mini_float. 12:02:21 Stable (0.14) branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.14-b1-49-gc72db44 12:02:25 I'm about to leave, but if that doesn't get done by the time I get back I'll do it. 12:03:15 Grunt: bug report still needed? 12:06:35 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.15-a0-93-g5185eb4 (34) 12:08:45 -!- wheals has joined ##crawl-dev 12:15:43 -!- SkaryMonk2 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:19:19 Did we ever talk about auto-annotating levels with runed doors? 12:22:30 I think, we should. Is there an option that can do that? (Including removal of the annotation once the door has been entered?) 12:23:57 If not, this would make a good implementable. 12:24:32 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 12:25:48 -!- notcluie has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:29:03 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 12:31:18 -!- notcluie has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:33:07 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 12:33:07 -!- DrinkMachine has quit [Changing host] 12:33:07 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 12:36:07 -!- Guest5419 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:37:15 -!- lobf has joined ##crawl-dev 12:43:35 Why did the autoinscribe the unique you took it off of get removed? 12:43:44 -!- bitsailor has joined ##crawl-dev 12:44:48 -!- Cryp71c has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:47:49 Bcadren: somebody didn't like it, I forgot who 12:48:02 I always liked that bit of flavour./ 12:50:27 aww, I like that idea too. I only remember seeing it for "special" items like psyche, sonja, donald, though 12:50:38 -!- wheals has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:50:54 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:53:23 -!- tensorpudding has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:54:19 -!- DrinkMachine has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:54:56 -!- orcus is now known as Guest5363 12:55:47 -!- SkaryMonk1 has joined ##crawl-dev 12:59:51 -!- Foamed has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 13:00:07 Grunt/wheals: i'm done with the manual for now if you want to sync it, i would really like to totally rethink a bunch of documentation stuff for 0.15 because wow there's so much duplicated stuff 13:00:53 * Bcadren wore Purgy once. 13:01:20 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 13:01:22 I haven't seen purgy in awhile; was she made rarer? or removed? 13:04:05 -!- thromnambular has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 13:04:09 -!- ainsophyao has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:04:16 -!- Ququman has joined ##crawl-dev 13:06:48 Purgy still exists. 13:09:00 she rarer? or was her sewer removed maybe? 13:13:13 -!- clouded_ has joined ##crawl-dev 13:14:21 -!- yxhuvud has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:15:43 -!- st_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:15:49 there's more sewer layouts now, so any individual layout is rarer 13:16:00 -!- clouded_ is now known as st_ 13:18:56 -!- rossi has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:21:16 -!- Garhauk has quit [Quit: Page closed] 13:22:45 03MarvinPA02 07* 0.15-a0-94-g674142f: Update some FAQ entries 10(8 minutes ago, 1 file, 3+ 3-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=674142f8aaa0 13:22:46 Cherry-picked 1 commit into stone_soup-0.14 13:23:41 -!- dtsund has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 13:26:37 -!- Foamed has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:26:48 -!- Azrael_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:27:11 MarvinPA: good call! 13:28:55 -!- ldf has quit [Quit: ldf] 13:29:03 -!- simmarine has joined ##crawl-dev 13:29:34 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 13:31:09 -!- Medar has quit [Quit: ] 13:31:22 -!- Lightli has joined ##crawl-dev 13:33:42 -!- Lumpydoo has quit [Quit: Page closed] 13:34:18 -!- Guest5363 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:41:08 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 13:50:18 -!- notcluie_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:54:30 -!- bitsailor has quit [Quit: bitsailor] 13:54:51 -!- Lawman has quit [Quit: Page closed] 13:55:05 -!- Basil has joined ##crawl-dev 13:55:38 -!- SkaryMonk2 has joined ##crawl-dev 13:56:38 -!- Adder_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:58:47 -!- SkaryMonk1 has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 14:02:07 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:02:58 -!- DrinkMachine has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:03:53 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 14:04:04 -!- orcus is now known as Guest84022 14:04:58 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 14:11:04 -!- tensorpudding has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:11:57 -!- omnirizon has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 14:21:06 -!- Akien has joined ##crawl-dev 14:21:07 -!- us17 has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in] 14:21:37 -!- SkaryMonk1 has joined ##crawl-dev 14:23:18 -!- SkaryMonk2 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:24:15 -!- us17 has quit [Client Quit] 14:29:38 -!- ldf has joined ##crawl-dev 14:32:04 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:32:23 -!- duralumin has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:32:36 -!- Bcadren has quit [Quit: REALITY.SYS Corrupted: Re-boot universe? (Y/N/Q)] 14:34:09 -!- syllogism has joined ##crawl-dev 14:34:27 !tell gammafunk yep, i am; there's no repo right now but maybe i'll throw it on one 14:34:28 nooodl: OK, I'll let gammafunk know. 14:35:06 !seen hangedman 14:35:06 Sorry nooodl, I haven't seen hangedman. 14:35:34 !seen tenofswords 14:35:34 I last saw tenofswords at Sun Mar 30 04:58:11 2014 UTC (1w 2d 14h 37m 23s ago) parting ##crawl-dev, saying 'chanpart'. 14:35:34 you want tenofswords 14:36:20 good !seen 14:36:33 hmm vaultedit (but on the other hand: javascript) 14:36:58 i'm afraid that like the vaultedit code is a sin and a crime ;_; 14:37:18 -!- bonghitz_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:39:14 -!- UncertainKitten has joined ##crawl-dev 14:40:38 -!- athros has quit [Quit: leaving] 14:41:18 -!- SkiChan has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:41:40 -!- TRPGer is now known as ciph 14:43:20 !tell dpeg I forgot to ask: what did you have in mind for better Iashol summon support? 14:43:20 Lasty: OK, I'll let dpeg know. 14:46:22 here I am! 14:46:22 dpeg: You have 3 messages. Use !messages to read them. 14:48:33 -!- ackack has joined ##crawl-dev 14:48:45 -!- Acidburn6 has quit [] 14:49:25 Awrighty, then. :) 14:49:47 Did you have anything in particular in mind, or just a general sense that Iashol should be better w/ ally play? 14:49:59 Lasty: There are so many ways to support allies, check https://crawl.develz.org/wiki/doku.php?id=dcss:brainstorm:god:propose:summons 14:50:34 Hmm 14:50:42 -!- wheals has joined ##crawl-dev 14:50:46 Lasty: I think the crippling yourself and using allies go very naturally together 14:50:51 If summon support is a big part of the Iashol package, I should remove the "Sacrifice Love" theme 14:50:59 all is in flux :) 14:51:01 s/theme/ability/ 14:51:06 -!- BigBluFrog has quit [Quit: Page closed] 14:51:28 in other words, players may gravitate towards allies anyway: if so, offer more choices in that direction 14:51:29 I already have some concerns about Sacrifice Love interacting with friendlies summoned by Aura Cataclysm 14:51:48 -!- Kellhus has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:52:01 you can also declare that that's not the intented direction, and decree that Sacrifice God followers have to go alone (a no allies conduct) -- fine too :) 14:52:02 what's the devwiki link, btw? 14:52:16 https://crawl.develz.org/wiki/doku.php?id=dcss:brainstorm:god:propose:sacrifice_god&#powers 14:52:25 thanks 14:52:39 I'm glad you're interested in looking it over 14:53:31 i saw the idea, and i think it's great that you're really working on refining it 14:54:03 er, not that the idea was bad, but that so many people make general ideas but no specificity :) 14:54:36 wheals: I know what you mean. I definitely set out with the idea of creating this myself, so I figured I'd need to get all the details down. :) 14:55:11 -!- DrKe has quit [] 14:55:14 dpeg: I've got faster/stronger slaves. A lot of the other ideas on that page revolve around undead specifically. Some of the conversion abilities could work, tho I don't want to step on Beogh/Yred too much. 14:55:29 Lasty: Feel free to ignore or include whatever you like from the Summon God proposal (or discuss)... this is what some people came up with last time constant piety was discussed, so I thought it might be interesting to you. 14:55:37 Lasty: you should look up the pact god idea 14:55:45 from several years back 14:55:46 Eronarn: I have shown him. 14:55:56 You sent me the link when we discussed earlier, and I've been thinking it over. 14:57:09 -!- elliptic has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:57:24 -!- Pepe has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:58:07 it might be better to hand-pick effects rather than relying on miscasts generally in a bunch of places 14:58:25 I think my favorite follower abilities from that page are non-undead followers resurrecting as undead when killed and contagion, but I'm not sure either could work well thematically. I think there could be an argument for something more along the lines of powered by death combined with death channel: when you kill things, they come back as a short-lived summon that provides extra buffs (some sort of harvested spirit?) 14:58:33 MarvinPA: rip automatise 14:59:01 even if they're just mostly/entirely picked from existing miscasts, since that way they would be easier to make adjustments to as well 14:59:05 in general thanks for revising the manual further, you made some thing clear that i didn't think of 14:59:10 MarvinPA: probably true. I'm thinking for the ** power I should replace the miscasts with {minor irresistable damage | blindness | immobility} or something like that 14:59:18 -!- notcluie has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:59:43 I'll try to cull a good list of effects for the high level one to replace the miscasts 15:00:31 zot traps do something similar now in that they have their own list of effects that were originally just all miscasts, possibly the same sort of thing would work 15:02:12 wheals: no problem, it drove me slightly crazy and i want to think about reorganising the manual entirely for 0.15 though :P 15:02:38 dpeg: overall I think what's most needed is a good replacement for Aura of Power 15:03:33 or documentation generally even, there are so many different files and lots of duplication and potentially out-of-date information 15:03:46 just move everything to obsolete/ and start over :P 15:03:56 heh 15:04:08 I want that ability to be something that enhances overall combat ability w/o stepping too much on existing abilities -- a unique positive generally-useful combat effect. 15:04:15 it says a lot that we have a quickstart guide written by linley, i suppose 15:04:20 Though arguably that's what Aura of Awe already does 15:04:38 and it also says something that it's not _all_ that out of date 15:05:34 yeah i was really impressed last time i read through quickstart that it wasn't actually completely obsolete 15:05:57 (it's a sign crawl hasn't been thoroughly ruined yet) 15:06:21 MarvinPA: manual reorganisation is good! Will you keep the philosophy section? (We could also source it out to some extra file.) 15:07:09 MarvinPA: I have updated quickstart five years ago or so. Even made a pdf version, I think. 15:07:33 Lasty: this will be hard! Many cool things are already in use :) 15:07:38 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:08:35 i don't really have any ideas other than a vague "needs a lot of reorganisation" yet, i like that the philosophy section is in the manual though personally 15:08:53 ok 15:09:17 that section could see some touces too, I think 15:10:03 the website could also do with quite some cleanup 15:11:12 so much to do :) 15:12:41 Agreed. Here are a few initial thoughts. 1) Increase health regen by (piety / 2000) every AUT and mana regen by (piety / 4000) every AUT, 2) Every time an enemy takes damage, 50% chance to regen 2 hp and 1 mp. 3) Your melee (and ranged?) attacks gain fireball AOE centered on target and ignoring friendlies. 4) Your melee (and ranged?) attacks gain AOE along the line of your attack. 5) Each time you deal damage to a monster, have a chance of applying ce 15:14:09 -!- Guest84022 has quit [Quit: leaving] 15:14:42 cut at "cer" 15:14:55 5) Each time you deal damage to a monster, have a chance of applying certain status effects. 6) Damage you would receive greater than 10% of your maxhealth is reduced to 10% of your maxhealth. 15:18:50 -!- rossi has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:20:00 7) cloak of tiamat-type resistance 15:22:45 8) Whenever you walk into a new tile, you melee adjacent monsters. 15:22:59 -!- Netmonmatt has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:26:08 Lasty: ok. Slightly inelegant to have special rules for special modes (ranged, melee, allies). Not sure this can be improved upon, though. 15:26:32 Just spitballing at this phase. I'm not in love with any of these. 15:28:14 When you say inelegant to have multiple modes, which abilities are you thinking of specifically? 15:29:37 3, 4 and 8 only 15:30:10 -!- Vizer has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 15:30:19 8 could be fixed by making the damage tied to piety instead of melee weapon 15:31:20 -!- SkaryMonk1 has left ##crawl-dev 15:31:28 3/4 probably can't be made to support characters who aren't using melee or ranged weapons, but it could be made to support both melee and ranged weapons. Most characters will use at least one of the two . . . 15:39:26 -!- wheals has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:41:25 -!- Ragdoll has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:54:19 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 15:54:59 -!- ToastyP has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90.1 [Firefox 28.0/20140314220517]] 15:55:55 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 15:57:28 -!- codehero is now known as scientificat 15:58:23 -!- wheals has joined ##crawl-dev 15:58:33 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 15:58:34 -!- DrinkMachine has quit [Changing host] 15:58:34 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 16:02:19 -!- jday_ has joined ##crawl-dev 16:04:12 -!- Patashu has joined ##crawl-dev 16:07:44 -!- Patashu[Zzz] has joined ##crawl-dev 16:07:44 -!- Patashu has quit [Disconnected by services] 16:08:08 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:09:30 -!- LexAckson has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:10:57 -!- lobf has quit [Quit: lobf] 16:12:11 -!- Mattias has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:13:44 -!- Mattias has joined ##crawl-dev 16:14:11 -!- eb has joined ##crawl-dev 16:21:23 -!- Krakhan has quit [Changing host] 16:25:21 -!- Vidiny has quit [] 16:25:41 -!- Patashu[Zzz] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 16:28:23 -!- bitsailor has joined ##crawl-dev 16:28:28 -!- Aryth has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:28:48 -!- king139 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:30:31 Igxfl (L9 DgWz) ASSERT(!in_bounds(you.pos()) || !cell_is_solid(you.pos()) || you.wizmode_teleported_into_rock) in 'main.cc' at line 4427 failed. (D:8) 16:33:57 -!- TAS_2012v has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:35:19 -!- tensorpudding has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:35:20 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 16:35:39 -!- Lasty1 has joined ##crawl-dev 16:35:44 Who wrote such a boneheaded assert? 16:35:48 That should be three asserts. 16:37:49 dtsund: note ||, not && 16:38:03 Oh. Whoops. 16:38:14 makes the assert not less boneheaded 16:38:43 bhaak: are you ready for the crawl tournament?! 16:39:10 -!- Blazinghand|Work is now known as Blazinghand 16:39:16 simmarine: yes, as far as I'll probably ignore it mostly :) 16:40:17 simmarine: there is some RL stuff to do, junethack needs some love and IRDC is coming up and I really want to do my little talk that I weren't able to do last year because earlier RL stuff 16:40:56 -!- Mattias has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:41:04 i might play a game or two but as I'm still a complete noob at dcss, that won't get me far :-) 16:41:13 RL stuff or RL stuff, those are your choices ;p 16:41:25 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 16:41:48 -!- Reign_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:41:49 -!- Mattias has joined ##crawl-dev 16:44:11 mmm, junethack 16:49:04 oh wow right that's a thing 16:49:57 -!- Foamed has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 16:51:46 -!- Mattias has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:55:24 -!- Chriswork has quit [Quit: It's a dud! It's a dud! It's a du...] 16:57:51 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:59:29 -!- scientificat is now known as codehero 16:59:33 -!- Akien has quit [Quit: Quitte] 17:02:17 -!- LukanosTestBot has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:04:19 Unstable branch on crawl.lantea.net updated to: 0.15-a0-94-g674142f (34) 17:05:48 -!- Mattias has joined ##crawl-dev 17:08:56 -!- lobf has joined ##crawl-dev 17:12:10 -!- syllogism has quit [] 17:13:57 03Grunt02 07* 0.15-a0-95-g8c39954: Add exits to a couple of shop vaults. 10(3 minutes ago, 1 file, 4+ 4-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=8c399542cd1d 17:13:57 Cherry-picked 1 commit into stone_soup-0.14 17:14:51 -!- king139 has quit [Quit: Page closed] 17:14:58 -!- Cabadath is now known as Bcadren 17:16:48 -!- Bcadren has joined ##crawl-dev 17:16:55 03Grunt02 07* 0.15-a0-96-g6dece55: Sync manual from wiki. 10(40 seconds ago, 1 file, 164+ 217-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=6dece555467d 17:16:55 Cherry-picked 1 commit into stone_soup-0.14 17:17:41 %git stone_soup-0.14 17:17:41 07Grunt02 * 0.14-b1-52-g9c260ac: Sync manual from wiki. 10(87 seconds ago, 1 file, 164+ 217-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=9c260aca432e 17:17:44 Why can't vampires drink from corpses of demonic holiness creatures? [like hell hogs, hell hounds, hellephants, raiju]? 17:17:46 %git 0.13.0^ 17:17:46 07kilobyte02 * 0.13-b1-59-gcd28bc4: Don't process enchantments that have just been deleted. 10(6 months ago, 1 file, 10+ 7-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=cd28bc492a7f 17:18:01 (clearly we need to make a few more cherry-picks so I can get the release out) 17:18:04 %git 0.12.0^ 17:18:04 07Grunt02 * 0.12-b1-166-ga9ee58f: Fix typos in changelog. 10(11 months ago, 1 file, 3+ 3-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=a9ee58fbd0a2 17:18:06 Grunt: many thanks! 17:18:09 %git 0.11.0^ 17:18:09 07kilobyte02 * 0.11-b1-178-g4818192: Butcher and chop up the config file message. 10(1 year, 6 months ago, 1 file, 5+ 4-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=4818192ceb76 17:18:28 -!- DrinkMachine has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:18:30 Grunt: nah, this is clearly the least buggy release yet 17:18:34 that's why so few cherry-picks 17:18:43 s/least/most 17:18:46 ??fo 17:18:46 formicid[1/2]: Ant-people species with permanent stasis, digging and self-shaft abilities, antennae, and human HP/XP and a +1 MP apt. Medium sized, but all weapons are one-handed for them and they have shield penalties of large races. 17:18:48 (aren't we supposed to say that about every release?) 17:18:50 -!- omnirizon has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:19:23 We do! 17:19:26 Any thoughts about #8358? That might be nice to have. 17:19:31 !bug 8358 17:19:31 https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=8358 17:19:52 Grunt: sure, but will be still nice for 0.15 :) 17:20:01 * Grunt shrugs. 17:20:07 "Just one more for feature for this release!!!" :) 17:20:15 It's an interface tweak, not a feature. >_> 17:20:19 Grunt: it does look nice, I don't know enough about that code to know how safe it would be for 0.14 17:20:40 I think MarvinPA was taking a look at it, though I could be thinking of someone/something else. 17:20:55 -!- Xiberia has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:21:42 The proposal itself is really good, of course. I hope it lands in some version, I don't care which one. 17:25:58 this is a very strange interface oddity, considering it doesn't happen every time 17:27:19 I just went through a v:$ replica vaults entrance replay to confirm that I did get "14 humans, a skeletal warrior and Rupert" announced a couple days ago 17:27:23 -!- gammafunk has joined ##crawl-dev 17:31:46 Clearly Rupert is inhuman. 17:31:51 ?/and Rupert 17:31:52 Matching entries (2): chaos_brand[12]: You hit the goblin. You fall down a shaft! Your mindless thralls stay behind. 12 skeletal warriors and Rupert come into view. Your giant spiked club of chaos shouts loudly! | kyrris[10]: Has killed Louise thrice and Frances, Francis, and Rupert twice in the same game. Later abyssed by a deck of escape. Escaped... into Pan. Escaped Pan. Killed by a rat. 17:35:14 -!- debo has quit [Quit: debo] 17:36:23 eb: it depends on how many monsters come into view at once 17:36:36 !send elliptic monsters 17:36:37 Sending monsters to elliptic. 17:37:16 it looks like it only happens when at least 5 distinct monsters come into view at once 17:37:16 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 17:37:29 !send elliptic a goblin, 11 orcs, an ogre, and Nergalle 17:37:29 Sending a goblin, 11 orcs, an ogre, and Nergalle to elliptic. 17:37:30 i.e. it uses genus to try to get the announcement to contain less than 5 things 17:38:17 ah. 17:38:29 -!- Tux[Qyou] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:39:35 -!- Lasty has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:40:06 Vaults is particularly strange for this since "10 humans" can mean a great variety of things 17:40:33 even excluding uniques 17:40:57 !seen nooodl 17:40:57 gammafunk: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 17:40:57 I last saw nooodl at Tue Apr 8 21:49:04 2014 UTC (51m 53s ago) saying 'oh wow right that's a thing' on ##crawl-dev. 17:41:00 -!- Lasty has joined ##crawl-dev 17:42:04 nooodl: Can I just start editing vaultedit.html and hope for the best? This will be a good segue for some of the things I want to do with WebTiles 17:42:19 !send nonethousand 27 humans and Rupert 17:42:19 Sending 27 humans and Rupert to nonethousand. 17:42:20 sure! 17:42:27 it's a mess though 17:42:38 I've never edited a standalone js thing before; just added weird code bits here an there to existing things 17:42:42 i don't know a single thing about writing proper javascript 17:42:54 ah, well what tools do you use when developing? 17:43:02 dev tools in e.g. chrome? 17:44:25 javascript is very good, for a language designed in two weeks 17:44:52 notepad++ and the chrome console 17:45:18 ok, well I'll probably just put it in my personal gitorious repo or something, but let me know if you make your own 17:45:27 /vaultedit/ contains vaultedit.htm, tiles.png, and twitter bootstrap 17:45:46 hrm, can I get access to those vaults from your dropbox? 17:45:55 ah, bootstrap.js is from twitter, ok 17:46:04 yeah I think I'd have everything then 17:46:43 I see tenofswords has a todo list for it, so maybe if we get it into a reasonable state it could be in the crawl tree 17:47:03 You are being crushed by all of your TODO list entries. 17:47:13 nonsense 17:47:16 ??gammafunk 17:47:16 gammafunk[1/2]: TODO: cut monster-in-wall code, vault guards wielding while zerked, ally piety, arte granting sinv + evocable break unseen invis, new sack of spiders, stair placement after vaults in level gen, save the liches 17:47:25 most of those are straight junk 17:47:54 ??0.15_plan 17:47:55 nostalgia[1/2]: This is the basis for 0.15, a new direction for DCSS that will bring back Fun. See http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/docs/changelog.txt;hb=nostalgia 17:48:01 now that is truly a crushing todo list 17:48:04 -!- thromnambular has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 17:48:06 er 17:48:07 hey 17:48:16 gammafunk, escaped with the Orb and 267 TODO list entries 17:48:22 !learn del 0.15_plan[1] 17:48:22 Deleted 0.15 plan[1/2]: see {nostalgia} 17:48:40 ??0.15_plan 17:48:40 0.15 plan[1/1]: https://crawl.develz.org/wiki/doku.php?id=dcss:planning:0.15_plan 17:49:44 dangit reaver, if you're going to add to that, use proper formatting! 17:49:59 !send gammafunk formatting 17:50:00 Sending formatting to gammafunk. 17:50:09 ??grunt 17:50:09 grunt[1/8]: I'm really looking forward to the point in 0.12 where someone first comes across a tornado ghost. 17:50:13 ??grunt[8 17:50:13 grunt[8/8]: Grunt, no fun since... forever :) 17:50:28 ??grunt[format] 17:50:29 I don't have a page labeled grunt[format] in my learndb. 17:50:33 o_O? 17:50:40 !learn add grunt TODO: Find a use for the qbert snake tile 17:50:40 grunt[9/9]: TODO: Find a use for the qbert snake tile 17:50:59 -!- bonghitz has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 17:51:03 !learn edit grunt[9] s/^/ !learn add grunt / 17:51:04 grunt[9/9]: !learn add grunt TODO: Find a use for the qbert snake tile 17:51:55 1learn add grunt[1] rip 17:51:55 A sprint boss or *something* 17:51:56 <_< 17:52:10 ??rip 17:52:10 I don't have a page labeled rip in my learndb. 17:52:21 I'm only using that tile if I get something workable for Jörmungandr <_< 17:53:16 Don't forget we have UNUSED! 17:53:39 -!- bitsailor has quit [Quit: bitsailor] 17:58:30 basically the #1 thing crawl needs is more multi-tile enemies, in my opinion 17:58:44 more? 17:58:54 PleasingFungus: #1? :) 17:59:10 I might not be completely serious 17:59:18 mumra had a project for that: swarm enemies, but to be honest I couldn't see how they would be anything other than annoying 17:59:23 Haran dropped the ball after coding kraken. 17:59:34 !send dpeg hellspiders 17:59:35 Sending hellspiders to dpeg. 17:59:56 his idea was you'd attack them and have a chance of successfully hitting them or moving *into* the swarm 17:59:58 oh, a cute little hellspider would tickle my fancy 18:00:10 ...what exactly would be cute or little about a hellspider?? 18:00:11 <_< 18:00:16 and you'd take additional damage of some kind when in the swarm 18:00:39 but I can't imagine the gameplay resulting from that being very good 18:00:40 I'd call my pet hellspiderlet Fluffy. 18:00:50 dpeg: only if it breathes fire!!! 18:01:05 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: CADENZA-CLASS CLOCKWORK KNIGHT--OPERATION TERMINATED] 18:01:25 miniature hellspider 18:01:27 ?/white fluffiness 18:01:28 No matches. 18:01:29 dwarf hellspider 18:01:31 Yes. Once or twice a day I'd walk Fluffy and she'd eat a bunch of neighbours. 18:01:34 heckspider 18:01:50 -!- Lumpydoo has quit [Quit: Page closed] 18:01:54 miniature giant space hellspider 18:01:58 I doubt there's a good design for a multiple tile enemy in crawl beyond what we have with tentacles 18:01:59 gammafunk: yeah that just reminds me of the reasons that dragonform trample was taken out 18:02:02 (swarms) 18:02:10 * Grunt tramples PleasingFungus!!!!!! 18:02:18 -!- notcluie_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:02:27 Ouch! That really hurt!!! 18:02:27 PleasingFungus: why does that count? Monster trampling is alright! 18:02:47 dpeg: this would be like player trampling, though 18:02:56 dpeg: in both old-dragonform & swarm, it's "your attacks have a chance of causing you to move" 18:02:56 elliptic: which is bad, agreed 18:03:03 as opposed to 'enemies attacks make you move' 18:03:05 yes yes, I see 18:03:13 yeah anyway kind of a moot point 18:03:15 I guessa large, stationary monster that's a kind of boss could be ok if done correctly 18:03:20 harder these days to come up with innovative monsters :) 18:03:31 I wonder if a multi-tile snake that tries to encircle you and prevent escape that way would be fun 18:03:45 !send gammafunk roxxane 18:03:45 Sending roxxane to gammafunk. 18:03:50 oh, shmup spider in a roguelike <3 18:04:01 erm, shmup snake, what am I drinking? 18:04:30 xX_SHMUP_SPIDER_Xx is actually my alternate username 18:04:35 I can see why you would have been confused 18:04:46 PleasingFungus: blink would pretty much make that innefective 18:05:09 what if it was big enough to block los? 18:05:17 like door mimics 18:05:20 but a snake instead 18:05:21 fr: coloured lights garden branch 18:05:47 !seen bh 18:05:47 I last saw bh at Mon Apr 7 01:41:53 2014 UTC (1d 21h 23m 53s ago) quitting, saying 'Ping timeout: 245 seconds'. 18:05:48 seems like it'd just be like mesmerize 18:06:03 if it were successful in trapping the player, that is 18:06:30 alright, multitile monsters are cool, but not worth the trouble -- I mean with kraken we at least had a gameplay reason why we want them to be multi-tiled 18:07:03 starcursed masses are the new multi-tile monsters 18:07:04 dpeg: maybe some kind of special boss in a room the size of LOS or less, but that seems pretty contrived 18:07:10 a stationary boss I mean 18:07:21 it's more for flavor than anything I guess 18:07:29 gammafunk: I am sure it could be done, but there's so many other things on our bursting TODOs :) 18:07:45 Josephine (16@) | Spd: 10 | HD: 10 | HP: 69 | AC/EV: 0/10 | Dam: 11 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, evil, spellcaster | Res: 06magic(66), 13neg+++ | Vul: 08holy | Chunks: 07contam | XP: 1060 | Sp: ghostly fireball (3d16), vampiric draining, animate dead, dispel undead (3d18) | Sz: Medium | Int: high. 18:07:45 %??josephine 18:08:03 can I remove this rN+++? it feels like an outright bug to me 18:08:11 yes 18:08:13 it was for ghostly fireball 18:08:20 or is it necessary to make ghostly fireball "work", yes 18:08:23 yes 18:08:30 -!- HellTiger has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.2.0 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/] 18:08:32 I remember... dracoomega? was talking about it here at the time 18:08:44 it was so she'd cast it when in melee with the player 18:08:45 maybe she should just become a ghoul? 18:08:53 could guarantee her a rN robe 18:09:01 and nerf her damage or something 18:09:06 ghoul is cool 18:09:07 but we generally try to avoid randomly giving resists to uniques just to make stuff work better... see for instance margery not necessarily having any rF, nikola not having rElec, etc 18:09:07 if just one pip is enough to let her cast it 18:09:20 wheals: that would also be better, yes 18:09:37 Nikola (11@) | Spd: 10 | HD: 18 | HP: 190 | AC/EV: 1/9 | Dam: 20 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, spellcaster, see invisible | Res: 06magic(120) | Chunks: 07contam | XP: 3678 | Sp: shock (d18), chain lightning, blink, b.lightning (3d22) | Sz: Medium | Int: high. 18:09:37 %??nikola 18:09:43 you'd have to experiment. I remember it also varied with the level of the player 18:09:43 no relec, haha 18:09:46 never realize that 18:10:08 she'd cast it on level 20 players in melee, since they had enough HD to make it worthwhile 18:10:19 but mostly level 20 players will not be fighting josephine 18:10:39 -!- emagenta has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:10:52 oh, I was killed by a friendly hell sentinel that hellfired an alligator 18:11:05 helping! 18:11:06 I was wondering what people thought about having friendly monsters not make attacks like this if it would kill the player 18:11:19 gammafunk: how do they know whether it would kill the player? 18:11:21 There's a Mantis entry on it somewhere. 18:11:24 or do you mean damage 18:11:28 yeah, damage 18:11:47 -!- TESTTROG has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:11:50 (There's some weird special case code I remember seeing for demons being more likely to harm friendlies.) 18:11:59 (i.e. those on the same side as the demon) 18:12:23 Grunt: and it's not yet been abused by players? :) 18:12:44 ah, maybe I should find that bug if I fix this, but existing bugs asside, and excusing my ignorance of the relevant beam code, would disallowing an attack by a friendly if we can see it would kill the player be ok? 18:12:47 Players would be more likely to be abused by this!! 18:12:51 then there's the bit whether monsters will never cast torment unless the player is in sight 18:13:01 which has been abused to do tomb with beogh 18:13:22 oh is that how that tv was working 18:14:38 -!- MaxFrost has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:14:44 I can understand get simply damage by a friendly monster based on its assessment (forget the name of that aspect of struct bolt) but outright killing the player seems like something we'd want to avoid 18:14:57 within reason; perhaps there are some difficult special cases 18:15:26 s/get simply damage/getting damaged/ 18:16:02 -!- bitsailor has joined ##crawl-dev 18:16:53 apparently I'm the only one killing himself with demons, so this is not a hot topic; I'll take a look and see if I can fix it in a clean way, at least 18:17:15 !lg * place=swamp 18:17:16 5576. kazak the Fighter (L17 NaIE of Cheibriados), slain by the 27-headed Lernaean hydra (kmap: swamp_old_school) on Swamp:5 on 2014-04-08 22:46:37, with 157192 points after 40323 turns and 3:32:13. 18:17:21 !lg . * place=swamp 18:17:22 6. gammafunk the Summoner (L12 HEIE of Sif Muna), blasted by a vapour (bolt of lightning) on Swamp:5 on 2014-04-06 16:35:56, with 16571 points after 9504 turns and 1:53:20. 18:17:25 !lg . * place=swamp -2 18:17:26 5/6. gammafunk the Summoner (L12 HEIE of Sif Muna), blasted by a Hell Sentinel (blast of hellfire) (summoned by the player character) on Swamp:3 on 2014-04-05 12:47:53, with 20466 points after 11604 turns and 1:42:17. 18:17:34 !lg . * place=swamp -2 x=kaux 18:17:35 5/6. [kaux=blast of hellfire] gammafunk the Summoner (L12 HEIE of Sif Muna), blasted by a Hell Sentinel (blast of hellfire) (summoned by the player character) on Swamp:3 on 2014-04-05 12:47:53, with 20466 points after 11604 turns and 1:42:17. 18:17:35 gammafunk: rip 18:17:35 !lg volteccerjack ktyp=rolling 18:17:36 -!- OCTOTROG has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:17:36 2. VolteccerJack the Fighter (L20 TeSu of Okawaru), rolled over by a boulder beetle (summoned by the player character) on Vaults:4 on 2013-12-06 05:38:02, with 268456 points after 63858 turns and 3:55:29. 18:17:50 -!- OCTOTROG has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:17:54 btw, a deep elf mage with no rF just killed itself with fireball while adjacent to me 18:17:57 hrm, how would I query for kills like my death to a friendly hell sentinel 18:18:10 so I'm not sure why josephine would care unless ghostly fireball is really weird 18:18:10 !lg * ckiller=Hell_Sentinel ikiller=the_player_character 18:18:10 7. gammafunk the Summoner (L12 HEIE of Sif Muna), blasted by a Hell Sentinel (blast of hellfire) (summoned by the player character) on Swamp:3 on 2014-04-05 12:47:53, with 20466 points after 11604 turns and 1:42:17. 18:18:13 gammafunk: like so 18:18:20 ah, ty 18:18:49 that's the difference betweeen elliptic and gammafunk; gammafunk gets killed by friendly monsters, elliptic just has monsters kill themselves 18:18:54 -!- debo has joined ##crawl-dev 18:19:35 elliptic: I remember someone was claiming the code works such that monsters won't e.g. fireball themselves unless it would actually kill them. because then they'd be taking less hp damage, so it'd be more worth it...???? 18:19:38 -!- OCTOTROG has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:19:38 hrm, ckiller is problematic, there's no "greater demon" query is there 18:19:47 PleasingFungus: haha 18:20:04 PleasingFungus: not at all true; the relevant code checks XLs IIRC. 18:20:17 I really need to look at the code myself 18:20:20 I'm at work right now, though 18:20:34 empirically, it does seem that monsters hellfire/fireball themselves much more when they near death 18:20:48 I remember the first time I "killed" cerebov he firestormed himself to death, depriving me of the XP, and I just thought "killstealer" 18:20:51 !source mon-util.cc:3266 18:20:51 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/mon-util.cc;hb=HEAD#l3266 18:21:31 which reminds me, would that generate a milestone? 18:21:37 gammafunk: yes 18:21:47 !lm . HEFi uniq=cerebov 18:21:48 1. [2012-11-11 08:11:26] gammafunk the Impregnable Farmer (L27 HEFi of The Shining One) killed Cerebov on turn 238824. (Pan) 18:21:59 "Impregnable Farmer" 18:22:08 I much prefer 18:22:09 that's just..... 18:22:11 !lg * title=ignorant 18:22:12 2. KiloByte the Ignorant Farmer (L27 HEAs of Sif Muna), escaped with the Orb and 15 runes on 2012-11-12 20:58:58, with 8849427 points after 203528 turns and 1d+2:08:06. 18:22:20 where is foe.ratio calculated? 18:22:53 Let me show you the most usual usage of mons_should_fire. 18:22:59 gammafunk: unique milestones are just calculated when the unique dies, regardless of how it happened 18:23:02 !source mon-cast.cc:3110 18:23:02 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/mon-cast.cc;hb=HEAD#l3110 18:23:03 cool, thanks 18:23:11 Specifically, you'll want to step down into fire_tracer 18:23:12 this includes e.g. wandering into miasma 18:23:12 -!- Watball has quit [Quit: Leaving] 18:23:18 which is 18:23:24 !source beam.cc:2182 18:23:24 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/beam.cc;hb=HEAD#l2182 18:23:55 oh, and players were clamouring to tell me that SkiChan picked up two abyssal runes 18:24:06 !lm * recent rune=abyssal s=gid 18:24:07 3431 milestones for * (recent rune=abyssal): John:cdo:20140109145020S, Roshnak:cszo:20130622234517S, puimuR:cdo:20130718093040S, MoogleDan:cszo:20130813212855S, Sky:cszo:20130505001901S, Sphara:clan:20130931060052S, 78291:cszo:20130412200004S, johnnyzero:cszo:20130916014137S, MoogleDan:cszo:20130412134115S, Alectron:cao:20130929100749S, zammy:cszo:20130623161536S, Ahrin:cdo:20130521065014S, Morik:... 18:24:12 ...? 18:24:18 -!- notcluie has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:24:18 probably like the silver rune bug 18:24:23 -!- rast has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:24:25 oh man, there's the demon code you were talking about 18:24:26 wheals: yeah, that was mentioned 18:24:40 -!- rast has joined ##crawl-dev 18:24:59 !lm SkiChan rune=abyssal 18:24:59 2. [2014-04-08 03:50:28] SkiChan the Slayer (L22 GrFi of Okawaru) found an abyssal rune of Zot on turn 67211. (Abyss:4) 18:25:03 !lm SkiChan rune=abyssal-2 18:25:04 No milestones for SkiChan (rune=abyssal-2). 18:25:06 !lm SkiChan rune=abyssal -2 18:25:07 1/2. [2014-04-06 22:17:11] SkiChan the Conqueror (L27 MiFi of Nemelex Xobeh) found an abyssal rune of Zot on turn 102923. (Abyss:4) 18:25:18 PleasingFungus: yup 18:25:48 -!- Asema has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:26:03 wheals: was said silver run bug fixed? 18:26:06 *rune 18:26:23 i believe 18:27:19 gammafunk, wheals: yes 18:27:32 -!- Lysalla has quit [Quit: Page closed] 18:27:49 Grunt: this code does seem to care about damage dealt 18:27:56 PleasingFungus: hm? 18:28:03 ok, so maybe the abyssal rune thing is no more then 18:28:41 wait no I'm bad at reading 18:28:49 gammafunk: well, I'm not aware of there being a bug with multiple abyssal runes ever 18:28:56 hm 18:28:57 wait no I'm not!! 18:29:01 gammafunk: but it doesn't appear that skichan did pick up two abyssal runes in the same game 18:29:08 at least not online 18:29:13 elliptic: are you basic that on the morgue? 18:29:17 return beam.foe_info.power >= div_round_up(beam.foe_ratio * (beam.foe_info.power + beam.friend_info.power), 100) 18:29:22 I'm basing that on the lack of a second milestone? 18:29:26 where those 'power' values are 18:29:32 you called up the two milestones yourself 18:29:36 yeah, players were telling me that they saw it and it was in his ctrl-p 18:29:37 foe_info.power += 2 * final * mons_power(mon->type) / preac; 18:29:40 PleasingFungus: aha, I'm looking at the player case 18:29:40 and they were two different characters :P 18:29:42 which is 18:29:42 namely the message you get when you pick it up 18:29:47 the silver rune bug didn't make two milestones though 18:29:48 foe_info.power += you.experience_level; 18:29:54 !lm * rune=silver s=gid 18:29:55 I think the monster case used to be similar! 18:29:56 nice 18:29:56 wheals: yes it did 18:29:57 29279 milestones for * (rune=silver): 4x Bloodbeard:cdo:20121024184854S, 4x Nomi:cszo:20120917221706S, 4x Sabaki:cszo:20121004205303S, 4x daetrin:cszo:20121025011010S, 4x zigponcheis:cao:20121026025644S, 4x hyperbolic:cszo:20121028183908S, 4x brinewave:cszo:20120918022707S, 4x nht:cdo:20121017164524S, 4x Roarke:cszo:20120919145940S, 4x Vizer:cao:20121025022920S, 4x pivotal:cszo:20120902164322S, 4x... 18:29:59 oj 18:30:05 oops! 18:30:09 yeah this scales both off damage & off "power" (hd?) 18:30:30 PleasingFungus: it is exactly HD 18:30:33 gammafunk: I vaguely remember someone reporting some display bug with ctrl-p in webtiles 18:30:34 it didn't generate an additional milestone, which I saw when I looked at the char dump, but several people were quite adamant about it as they had observed the game 18:30:34 haha 18:30:36 !source mon-util.cc:2976 18:30:37 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/mon-util.cc;hb=HEAD#l2976 18:30:39 though I'm not sure "preac" (damage pre-ac) is actually capped by target hp...??? 18:30:40 gammafunk: could be that 18:31:01 if not then the 'monsters fireballing & killing themself increased frequency' would still be selection bias 18:31:02 which 18:31:04 seems plausible 18:31:08 no, this wasn't "they only saw it under ctrl-p", it was "they saw it, and it was also in ctrl-p" 18:31:16 but I should just watch the ttyrec 18:31:19 oh man, 'for now'. I wonder how long that comment is there 18:31:25 *has been there 18:32:00 %git b1c2d6e09 18:32:02 07haranp02 * 0.5-a0-1362-gb1c2d6e: Complete rewrite of the beam code, making it considerably saner. However, there might be quite a few bugs lurking in this rewrite. Sorry. 10(5 years ago, 19 files, 2064+ 2408-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=b1c2d6e096ee 18:32:18 only five years. nothing, really 18:32:24 rip 18:32:30 it's an ok metric! 18:32:46 -!- lobf has quit [Quit: lobf] 18:33:02 hm, actually, it looks like this changed at some point and now the milestone wouldn't be duplicated 18:33:15 !lm SkiChan rune=abyssal -log 18:33:16 SkiChan, XL22 GrFi, T:67211 (milestone) has no matching game. 18:33:21 %dump SkiChan 18:33:21 http://dobrazupa.org/morgue/SkiChan/SkiChan.txt 18:33:24 !lm . rune=silver s=gid 18:33:24 &dump SkiChan 18:33:25 18 milestones for wheals (rune=silver): wheals:cszo:20140220124936S, wheals:cszo:20140104170640S, wheals:cszo:20131008161617S, wheals:cszo:20130105224942S, wheals:cszo:20140003011542S, wheals:cszo:20121127013633S, wheals:cbro:20140210031343S, wheals:cszo:20140202050227S, wheals:cszo:20130929031701S, wheals:cszo:20140217024148S, wheals:cszo:20140009012738S, wheals:cszo:20131104004548S, wheals:cszo:... 18:33:25 http://dobrazupa.org/morgue/SkiChan/SkiChan.txt 18:33:42 I only see one rune 18:33:48 it wouldn't appear in the notes either 18:33:51 -!- SkiChan has quit [Quit: Page closed] 18:33:52 hm 18:33:54 but now I know the turncount 18:33:56 i definitely ran into the silver rune bug, and it's not duplicated for me 18:34:22 !lm skichan rune=abyssal -tv:<2:>2 18:34:22 2. SkiChan, XL22 GrFi, T:67211 (milestone) requested for FooTV (telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org). 18:34:23 he found it the second time in that one bee vault 18:34:27 I guess could just have done that the first time 18:35:06 -!- rast has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:35:27 wheals: yeah, that code changed at some point and now it checks whether you had the rune before noting/milestoning it 18:35:31 which is actually bad IMO 18:35:37 since it makes it harder for us to detect bugs 18:35:43 it should probably ASSERT even 18:35:56 this is a slow tv 18:36:06 yeah this would be the second time 18:36:18 grunt_abyss_rune_wretched_hive 18:36:19 it's when they called me over to spectate 18:36:20 I wonder 18:36:28 this is when the milestone was created though 18:36:32 so it must be the first time 18:36:43 maybe the first one was a mimic 18:37:05 right, I kept saying "maybe it wasn't picked up or was a mimic" 18:37:07 -!- dpeg has quit [Quit: slee[] 18:37:09 TAGS: abyss_rune unrand patrolling 18:37:12 but several people swore he had picked it up 18:37:19 hm 18:37:23 Here's another idea: 18:37:27 yeah he's checkign the log now 18:37:31 !lm skichan rune=abyssal -ttyrec 18:37:33 2. SkiChan, XL22 GrFi, T:67211 (milestone): http://dobrazupa.org/ttyrec/SkiChan/2014-04-08.00:35:52.ttyrec.bz2 18:37:47 I didn't see a second message 18:38:02 but yeah, searching ttyrec further back is worth doing 18:38:19 The abyssal rune of Zot is a mimic! 18:38:36 player error, nothing to see here :P (except can we remove mimics??) 18:38:36 The ravenous rune mimic is pushed out of the abyssal rune of Zot. 18:38:45 nooo 18:38:47 buff mimics 18:38:50 don't remove them!!! 18:38:54 pushed out of the abyssal rune of Zot? 18:39:00 Grunt: nice message 18:39:14 as in, was there an actual rune? 18:39:20 -!- rast has joined ##crawl-dev 18:39:37 Let me see if I can bring it up on tv. 18:39:41 -!- rast has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:40:11 gammafunk: they can't have picked up an actual rune, since the milestone happened in the bee vault 18:40:12 -!- rast has joined ##crawl-dev 18:40:32 right, but that message seems to imply the actual rune was there (and hence skichan didn't pick it up) 18:40:32 !lm skichan rune=abyssal -tv: 2. SkiChan, XL22 GrFi, T:67211 (milestone) requested for FooTV (telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org). 18:40:36 this may need some adjusting 18:40:46 !lm skichan rune=abyssal -tv:cancel 18:40:46 2. SkiChan, XL22 GrFi, T:67211 (milestone) cancel requested for FooTV (telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org). 18:40:48 !lm skichan rune=abyssal -tv: 2. SkiChan, XL22 GrFi, T:67211 (milestone) requested for FooTV (telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org). 18:41:04 !lm skichan rune=abyssal -tv:cancel 18:41:04 2. SkiChan, XL22 GrFi, T:67211 (milestone) cancel requested for FooTV (telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org). 18:41:06 !lm skichan rune=abyssal -tv: 2. SkiChan, XL22 GrFi, T:67211 (milestone) requested for FooTV (telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org). 18:41:19 obviously not relevant but does anyone know what would have happened if the d:27 staircase to depths in an old, early 0.14 trunk game that I updated to 0.15 wasn't a mimic 18:41:20 ...okay, this is probably early enough 18:41:37 -!- ayutzia has quit [Quit: Page closed] 18:41:38 eb: you would have entered it and gotten a Zot mimic on U:6 18:42:03 I like that answer, won't pursue further 18:42:37 ...okay, maybe this was too early 18:42:41 !lm skichan rune=abyssal -tv:cancell 18:42:42 Unrecognised TV option: cancell 18:42:42 !lm skichan rune=abyssal -tv:cancel 18:42:43 2. SkiChan, XL22 GrFi, T:67211 (milestone) cancel requested for FooTV (telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org). 18:42:47 !lm skichan rune=abyssal -tv: 2. SkiChan, XL22 GrFi, T:67211 (milestone) requested for FooTV (telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org). 18:42:56 !lm skichan rune=abyssal -tv:cancel 18:42:57 2. SkiChan, XL22 GrFi, T:67211 (milestone) cancel requested for FooTV (telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org). 18:42:59 !lm skichan rune=abyssal -tv: 2. SkiChan, XL22 GrFi, T:67211 (milestone) requested for FooTV (telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org). 18:43:08 ...good 18:43:12 Grunt: footv uses player turns, if that is causing confusion (FR: remove player turns) 18:43:37 elliptic: it isn't; I'm just used to basing these on time since a turn is still usually around 10 aut :b 18:44:00 did i miss the pushing out 18:44:03 no 18:44:05 wheals: not quite yet 18:44:12 64177 or so aut 18:45:19 -!- HellTiger_NB has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:45:26 (spoiler the rune on screen right now is a mimic) 18:45:37 which one!! 18:45:47 (both of them!!!) 18:46:00 you mean all three? 18:46:10 THERE 18:46:12 did you see it 18:46:12 there it was 18:46:14 hahaha 18:46:18 that is amazing 18:46:19 the third one got pushedout 18:46:22 good rcfile too 18:46:25 I don't even know what that means!!! 18:46:36 so there was a real rune right there 18:46:46 but the player didn't pick it up :P 18:46:48 but he didn't pick it up, right? 18:46:51 yep 18:46:55 just stood on top of it until teleport 18:46:58 well, case closed 18:47:01 mmm 18:47:04 !learn add rare_messages The ravenous rune mimic is pushed out of the abyssal rune of Zot. 18:47:04 rare messages[8/8]: The ravenous rune mimic is pushed out of the abyssal rune of Zot. 18:47:25 that is a very good vault 18:47:29 I'll be happy to tell him what happened 18:47:33 hangedman_abyss_rune_treasure_dump 18:47:35 if grunt doesn't see him first 18:47:40 !vault hangedman_abyss_rune_treasure_dump 18:47:40 http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/dat/des/branches/abyss.des;hb=HEAD#l1369 18:47:52 "press g" 18:48:15 !lm skichan rune=abyssal -tv:cancel 18:48:16 2. SkiChan, XL22 GrFi, T:67211 (milestone) cancel requested for FooTV (telnet://termcast.develz.org or http://termcast.develz.org). 18:48:41 !lg SkiChan GrFi 18:48:41 35. SkiChan the Carver (L12 GrFi of Nemelex Xobeh), mangled by a boulder beetle on Lair:5 on 2014-04-07 16:37:48, with 22501 points after 14782 turns and 1:20:48. 18:48:55 hrm, he ended a previous run in a very silly way 18:49:02 boulder beetles <3 18:49:08 !lg Skichan place=pan 18:49:08 1. SkiChan the Conqueror (L27 MiFi of Zin), impaled on a Hell Sentinel's spines in Pandemonium on 2014-04-07 01:56:35, with 949169 points after 124003 turns and 18:47:09. 18:49:11 right 18:50:01 !lg dpeg abyss 18:50:01 13. dpeg the Phalangite (L21 MfFi of Okawaru), impaled on a Hell Sentinel's spines (summoned by an ancient lich) on Abyss:1 on 2014-03-05 22:01:27, with 312608 points after 57473 turns and 5:00:47. 18:50:16 one last question, how do people feel about removing or somehow revamping vapours? 18:50:33 Only if the commit message is "Vapourise vapours." 18:50:56 !send gammafunk full stops 18:50:57 Sending full stops to gammafunk. 18:51:14 -!- Ququman has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:51:22 an enemy that's mobile but not hostile that's perma-invis and can only harm you if you don't resist elec 18:51:41 well, not hostile should be "doesn't move towards you" 18:51:43 -!- facemasterDog has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 18:51:45 vapour is the most dangerous monster in swamp for qw 18:51:51 heh 18:52:27 vapours are rare enough that I don't think anyone would notice them being removed 18:52:41 it's a pretty dangerous monster for gammafunk since even his sense invis summons can't really attack it given how it just moves around randomly 18:52:43 except reckless perennial nemelex worshippers I think 18:52:45 also dangerous for nemelex worshippers who don't know how foxfire works 18:53:17 I just know that finding an actual spawned vapour feels like trivia 18:53:18 I'm getting the sense that it's good for removing people like me from the gene pool, but that shouldn't be the only reason 18:53:28 "what is going on, oh I know this one! it's a vapour" 18:53:39 yeah, crawl trivia 18:54:33 once I joined a tiles chat where this was this heated discussion going back and forth over just how in the world this fire giant lost its weapon 18:54:45 crazy detailed theories being hatched, accusations, recriminations 18:54:52 I just say "shapeshifter, poly it" 18:55:01 sure enough it was; gammafunk wins again 18:55:07 :) 18:55:13 could have been that weird jiyva mut 18:55:41 was spectating someone with the slime-tentacle disarm jiyva mut the other day. ettins look really weird without weapons. 18:56:09 yeah, although then the player would have known, presumably 18:56:18 -!- Reign_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:56:18 -!- UncertainKitten has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:56:23 I never presume 18:57:09 gammafunk: I started reading your piece after stepping away from a moment and immediately thought "shapeshifter". 18:57:15 who keeps track of what jiyva is doing to your body, really 18:57:35 except when you notice you have 40 str and 3 dex 18:57:47 Grunt: so glad you weren't in said chat since you would have said it first hence ruining my one shining moment 18:57:47 i keep track of what god i'm worshipping 18:57:50 ...which should happen less!!! 18:57:56 !send wheals godsgodsgods 18:57:56 Sending godsgodsgods to wheals. 18:58:05 !send Grunt randgods 18:58:05 Sending randgods to Grunt. 18:58:10 !send wheals godsgodsgodsgodsgodsgodsgodsgods 18:58:10 Sending godsgodsgodsgodsgodsgodsgodsgods to wheals. 18:58:18 -!- mk83 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:58:27 !send Grunt sgod 18:58:28 Sending sgod to Grunt. 18:58:34 s/grunt/sgrunt/ 18:58:37 What about Sif? 18:58:38 <_< 18:59:10 ...anyway, once the tourney ends we'll probably have a lot of god-related things to contend with 18:59:15 (eight slots to fill!!!) 18:59:20 (and almost as many ideas) 18:59:31 (at least if dpeg has anything to say about it!) 18:59:38 -!- OutworldCrawlRel has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:59:46 -!- gammafunk has quit [Quit: leaving] 18:59:50 rip gammafunk 18:59:52 -!- SteampunkDuck has quit [Client Quit] 19:02:23 https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=11708 19:02:34 I'm not sure whether to be flattered or scared that this keeps coming up. 19:04:02 that was the secret incentive behind adding lamia 19:04:07 -!- ldf has quit [Quit: ldf] 19:04:07 dont try to deny it 19:04:36 "She also supposedly gave the devs some difficult with the eating-nagas mechanic since they were adding so many new nagas to the game at the time they removed her." ??? 19:04:39 {DEVNAME} and the Removals 19:04:54 wtf 19:04:56 eb: only one possible candidate for DEVNAME there <3 19:05:02 where do people get these things 19:05:03 does this guy not realize that dck is a former dev!!!! 19:05:17 elliptic, probably tileschat or something 19:05:18 ...the d in dck stands for dev 19:05:19 -!- OCTOTROG has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:05:24 dev chaos knight 19:05:25 damn someonepa getting all the credit 19:05:35 since apparently people think tileschat never gives bad advice or something 19:05:43 do i not remove enough things :( :( 19:05:44 1learn add tileschat worse than badwiki 19:05:54 wheals, a rising star in the eyes of Removal God. 19:06:03 (we don't have an R god yet, right) 19:06:03 -!- UncertainKitten has joined ##crawl-dev 19:06:11 Grunt: Rithmenos 19:06:16 elliptic: <_< 19:06:18 that sounds like medicine 19:06:29 (we did rename Dith to reserve D for door god, right?) 19:07:15 it is I, Door God 19:07:25 roodoklohe 19:07:54 Room of Dooroklohe 19:07:55 wheals: that sounds like a rood god, always slamming doors on people 19:07:55 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 19:07:56 that tiktacy post is really something 19:08:15 all of them are 19:09:01 -!- lobf has joined ##crawl-dev 19:09:27 "I don't want to be in a clan, but I do have some clan names: Team tiktacy (...)" 19:09:31 good reading suggestion, thank you 19:09:35 tiktacymancer 19:10:39 Any valiant effort to create peace in the tavern will end in you being shit on by a bunch of nerds who have no problems spending an hour looking through your posts to find dirt on you. That is all. 19:11:25 they will never, ever find any dirt on me 19:11:33 wow, bcadren suggested 26 gods under B at some point 19:11:37 but then I'm not trying to make peace on the tavern 19:11:39 !send SamB dirt 19:11:39 Sending dirt to SamB. 19:11:52 * SamB hasn't posted anything to tavern 19:12:10 I don't do much on tavern beyond the occasional obvious bit of help and trace amounts of snark and cynicism. 19:12:14 hard to tell what would result from trying to create peace in the tavern since nobody has ever tried that 19:12:24 Then again, you get the latter basically anytime I communicate with anyone. >_> 19:12:33 minmay: pay attention: people will be mean to you!!!!!! 19:12:39 grunt did you get my EXCITING MESSAGE the other day 19:14:07 you mean, growing up to be a crawl dev doesn't equal automatic fame, money, and glory?? instead, people are mean to you? 19:14:31 it's terrible! 19:14:32 johnstein: nah, devs know better than to try to create peace in the tavern 19:14:48 -!- OutworldCrawlRel has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:15:27 I was actually surprised to learn a while back that the devs didn't use the tavern directly for ideas 19:15:35 I kinda get it better now 19:15:38 -!- Jdc1197 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:16:00 well, some devs do 19:16:11 (and there have been some good ideas out of tavern) 19:16:13 the devs that frequent tavern? 19:16:15 s??bh[tavern] 19:16:22 no s 19:16:22 ??bh[tavern] 19:16:22 I don't have a page labeled bh[tavern] in my learndb. 19:16:24 oh 19:16:37 (the entry doesn't exist though) 19:16:46 ?/what tavern tells me 19:16:47 No matches. 19:16:50 yea. I've seen dev names in there. I just didn't realize it wasn't the primary means of ideation 19:16:52 oh i see someone removed it 19:16:52 ?/avern tells me 19:16:53 Matching entries (1): chris[5]: I just do what the tavern tells me 19:16:56 ah 19:16:59 heh 19:16:59 ...nah, it's just not where you expect. 19:16:59 it was there 19:19:03 ?/tavern 19:19:04 Matching terms (1): tavern; entries (23): abbreviations[3] | chris[5] | crate_crawl[1] | csdc[1] | dieselteamideas[20] | dithmenos[2] | eocrawl[2] | eronarn[14] | famous_last_words[16] | fanfiction[5] | fanfiction[7] | fanfiction[9] | forum[1] | koboldlord[1] | koboldlord[2] | literally[5] | minmay[2] | n1000[6] | ogtm_guide[1] | poetry[14] | quite_powerful[8] | rng[11] | torment[2] 19:19:33 so what is an unwind 19:19:41 oh hey, that tiktacy guy has what I once claimed to be the worst post in tavern history 19:19:47 apparently fanfiction is the entry with the most mentions of tavern? 19:20:18 elliptic: the amazing thing is that one of those links to actual serious crawl fanfiction 19:20:18 eb: ? 19:20:26 eb: do share 19:20:29 wheals: it is a magical thingy that makes some stuff in the code work properly 19:20:30 -!- ToastyP has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90.1 [Firefox 28.0/20140314220517]] 19:20:40 -!- alefury has quit [] 19:20:43 https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=8915&p=122101#p122101 19:21:27 -!- OCTOTROG has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:27:43 Nice, salamander firebrands can create flame clouds directly under you if they hit one of your allies 19:27:47 maybe good to fix in 0.14? 19:27:58 assuming this means what I assume it means 19:28:38 yeah I think I've run into that - didn't realize it wasn't intended behavior 19:28:47 Well, what was the *intended* behaviour? 19:28:58 ??salamander firebrand 19:28:58 salamander firebrand[1/1]: The new top-tier lava monster added in 0.14. Stronger than a regular salamander, and their melee causes clouds of fire to appear around you (but not directly underneath you). They never spawn with a polearm because of this. Unlike every other N, firebrands move faster than an unhasted human. 19:29:06 it looks like it is intended if you are next to your ally 19:29:09 As far as I understand AF_FIREBRAND is supposed to surround its target with flame clouds regardless of what's actually standing there or not. 19:29:18 -!- notluie has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:29:52 -!- bitsailor has quit [Quit: bitsailor] 19:31:08 there have been several bugs with new monster effects with stuff happening to the player when it should be happening to an ally, so I assumed this was one of those 19:31:19 but the code looks okay, so 19:31:38 -!- ciph has quit [Quit: »¶Ó­TRPGerÏÂÔØmIRC for TRPGÌرð(²âÊÔ)°æ~ÇëÊäÈë!get mirc,ÀÏÓû§Éý¼¶°üÇë!get mircupdate] 19:31:46 (The curare-tipped needle hits Sonja! You are poisoned[...]) 19:31:50 -!- tkappleton1 has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 19:31:52 (probably my favourite!!) 19:33:06 :( 19:33:11 ??love 19:33:11 love[1/3]: You miss Sonja. You feel sick. You die... 19:33:12 wheals: rip 19:38:24 -!- Eonwe6 has quit [Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de] 19:39:59 -!- OCTOTROG has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:41:20 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 19:41:30 -!- Reign_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 19:46:07 -!- SteampunkDuck has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 19:50:13 -!- UncertainKitten has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 19:57:13 -!- Whistling_Beard is now known as Z_LAMP 19:59:50 -!- tkappleton has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 20:00:54 -!- jeanjacques has quit [Quit: quit] 20:01:25 -!- OutworldRelay has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:03:11 -!- wheals has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:03:23 -!- Zermako has quit [Quit: goodnight] 20:04:48 -!- notcluie has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:05:32 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 20:06:53 -!- Vizer_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:07:32 -!- SamB_ has joined ##crawl-dev 20:10:08 -!- SamB has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 20:12:45 -!- ackack has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 20:17:17 guzonghuiren (L27 HEWz) ASSERT(!actor_at(newpos)) in 'spl-tornado.cc' at line 431 failed. (Pan) 20:18:53 guzonghuiren (L27 HEWz) ASSERT(!actor_at(newpos)) in 'spl-tornado.cc' at line 431 failed. (Pan) 20:18:58 o_O? 20:19:10 (wonder if this is Lomnado) 20:19:10 !crashlog 20:19:10 No milestones for crash. 20:19:14 !crashlog guzonghuiren 20:19:15 8. guzonghuiren, XL27 HEWz, T:150923 (milestone): http://dobrazupa.org/morgue/guzonghuiren/crash-guzonghuiren-20140409-011851.txt 20:19:48 oh 20:19:51 It actually has Tornado. 20:20:57 !crashlog guzonghuiren -2 20:20:58 7. guzonghuiren, XL27 HEWz, T:150906 (milestone): http://dobrazupa.org/morgue/guzonghuiren/crash-guzonghuiren-20140409-011713.txt 20:21:10 is that tornado killing a rakshasha illusion? 20:21:36 looks like it has something to do with rakshasa illusions, at least 20:21:39 Yeah. 20:21:45 maybe tornado kills the real rakshasa and then tries to kill an illusion 20:21:48 but it is already gone? 20:22:09 though that ASSERT doesn't really make sense for that 20:22:23 oh 20:22:25 I know what it is 20:22:32 The injured rakshasa weaves a defensive illusion! 20:22:58 ...which immediately spawns two new things in the middle of the damage code, I bet. 20:23:07 oh, that isn't an action? 20:23:15 I assumed it had to take a turn to do that 20:23:27 that's really weird IMO if it doesn't 20:23:28 so you end up mutating an iterator while traversing it? 20:23:31 It's in monster::react_to_damage 20:23:32 that sounds like fun 20:23:37 (of all places) 20:23:39 maybe it shouldn't be there 20:23:43 yeah, I was going to say 20:23:46 It should be a fineff at the very least. 20:24:16 it should take a turn to be consistent with all other things that sound like casting a spell 20:24:25 That too. 20:31:18 -!- Klightning has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:31:33 (I'm on it, for the record.) 20:31:42 -!- SamB_ is now known as SamB 20:34:36 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 20:34:54 -!- varmin has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:34:54 -!- Sequell has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:34:54 -!- greensnark has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:35:48 -!- Lightli has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:36:26 -!- SamB has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:36:51 -!- SamB has joined ##crawl-dev 20:37:03 ??love [2 20:37:38 03Grunt02 07* 0.15-a0-97-gf56ece6: Make rakshasa defense cloning a fineff and take energy (elliptic). 10(87 seconds ago, 3 files, 44+ 9-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=f56ece6c5f98 20:37:39 -!- greensnark has joined ##crawl-dev 20:37:48 -!- conted has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:37:56 ...should I pick that back to 0.14? It does prevent a crash. 20:38:08 I'm just not sure how good the code is >_> 20:38:41 -!- varmin has joined ##crawl-dev 20:39:09 -!- Sequell has joined ##crawl-dev 20:39:14 I was thinking more of just having the rakshasa cast the spell normally during its next turn 20:39:17 is that feasible? 20:39:49 (if so it feels like it might be more stable code, too) 20:39:58 -!- rast has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:40:01 Well, the spell does something completely different when it's cast normally. 20:40:26 -!- rast has joined ##crawl-dev 20:41:02 well, I really just mean the timing of it 20:43:08 I guess you could make this a special case in handle_monster_move, but I really hate doing that. 20:43:23 like, the timing will still be weird here if the player is taking fast actions 20:45:04 This approximate learnDB determination is hilarious sometimes. 20:45:05 ??fine 20:45:07 fine ~ fire ~ sticky flame[1/5]: Causes constant fire damage (2d4 - 1 per turn) to an adjacent target. Can also burn carried scrolls. When your character is covered in sticky flame, it shows as "Fire" on your HUD. Takes a number of turns to extinguish, during which your scrolls are in peril. 20:45:32 Sticky Flame is fine. [When was this term guessing added?] 20:46:16 Grunt: well, I mean, bears manage to go berserk with reasonable timing when they get injured, no? 20:46:26 I guess that is probably a special case 20:46:29 somewhere 20:46:37 It isn't; it's an emergency spell for them. 20:46:59 well, can't this just be an emergency spell for rakshasas? 20:47:31 This behaviour would need to be a spell itself for that to happen, and it's apparently intended to happen with different timing than normal emergency spells anyway (and be guaranteed??) 20:47:54 well, I'm questioning that intention I guess :) 20:48:11 but such a change isn't 0.14 material I suppose 20:48:33 for 0.14, if you think your commit just now fixes more bugs than it creates, cherry-picking it seems reasonable to me 20:49:37 Cherry-picked 1 commit into stone_soup-0.14 20:49:39 -!- wheals has joined ##crawl-dev 20:58:15 -!- Krakhan has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:03:50 -!- Krakhan has quit [Changing host] 21:13:25 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 21:15:17 -!- Yllodra has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:15:47 -!- PleasingFungus has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 21:16:43 -!- ayutzia has quit [Quit: Page closed] 21:17:34 -!- the_glow has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:19:03 -!- Arkaniad has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 21:19:18 -!- Daekdroom has quit [Quit: Saindo] 21:25:31 03elliptic02 07[nostalgia] * 0.14-b1-61-g429ec3a: Nerf gnomes. 10(2 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=429ec3afd8ba 21:25:40 elliptic: rip 21:25:45 elliptic: gnerf 21:27:06 -!- Lasty1 has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:28:52 ooh nostalgia 21:28:59 no wonder rebuilding wasn't doing anything 21:29:00 doh 21:32:33 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:32:34 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: CADENZA-CLASS CLOCKWORK KNIGHT--OPERATION TERMINATED] 21:34:44 -!- bitsailor has joined ##crawl-dev 21:35:04 -!- nrook has joined ##crawl-dev 21:37:08 -!- bitsailor has quit [Client Quit] 21:37:36 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 21:39:35 why would you nerf gnomes 21:39:54 they were Too Good 21:40:00 playing a gnome was a no-brainer 21:40:07 a 21:40:09 gnome-brainer 21:40:21 GNOME_BRAINER_NO_MORE 21:41:47 !send wheals GOLEM_NO_MORE 21:41:48 Sending GOLEM_NO_MORE to wheals. 21:42:11 hm 21:42:50 it would be cool if dgl showed whether a player was tiles or console 21:43:20 i suppose there isn't much room on the games in progress menu, though, and i don 21:43:29 't want to look at the dgl code 21:43:34 !send wheals code 21:43:35 Sending code to wheals. 21:43:38 I still want a chat-only webtiles client, so console players could still be harassed easily in a nice interface 21:43:46 dammit, I just remembered I program for a living 21:43:54 !send nrook code 21:43:54 Sending code to nrook. 21:44:03 augh no 21:44:03 !send Grunt !send Grunt code 21:44:03 Sending !send Grunt code to Grunt. 21:44:08 I just looked at code all day 21:44:10 !send wheals !send wheals !send Grunt code 21:44:11 Sending !send wheals !send Grunt code to wheals. 21:44:12 worse... it was JAVA 21:44:20 !coffee nrook 21:44:28 ahhh 21:44:31 ... 21:44:33 !cmd !coffee 21:44:34 Command: !coffee => .echo /me hands ${1:-${user}} a $(sub 0 1 $(sub $(rand $(length $(split & $(=coffee.containers)))) $(split & $(=coffee.containers)))) of $(sub 0 1 $(sub $(rand $(length $(split & $(=coffee.coffeelist)))) $(split & $(=coffee.coffeelist)))), brewed by $(=tea.brewer). 21:44:36 this coffee implements the delicious interface 21:44:40 !coffee wheals 21:44:42 * Sequell hands nrook a mug of cappuccino, brewed by the Shining One. 21:44:44 * Sequell hands wheals a mug of café mocha, brewed by Vehumet. 21:44:45 mm 21:44:48 ok laggy 21:44:53 (i don't like coffee) 21:44:54 !coffee Sequell 21:44:55 !tea 21:44:56 * Sequell hands wheals a cup of lapsang souchong, brewed by Nemelex Xobeh. 21:45:01 !tea wheals 21:45:03 * Sequell hands wheals a cup of Darjeeling, brewed by Cheibriados. 21:45:14 * Sequell hands Sequell a pot of latte macchiato, brewed by Nikola. 21:45:17 looks like !tea is much faster for whatever reason 21:45:25 !cheers Sequell 21:45:25 * Sequell slides a shot glass of whiskey across the bar to Sequell, on the house. 21:45:26 odd, you'd think it would have to steep 21:45:40 !cmd !tea 21:45:40 Command: !tea => .echo /me hands ${1:-${user}} a cup of $(sub 0 1 $(sub $(rand $(length $(split & $(=tea.tealist)))) $(split & $(=tea.tealist)))), brewed by $(=tea.brewer). 21:45:47 I've been getting sporadic slow queries with sequell all day 21:45:56 not that I query sequell all day... 21:46:01 oh 21:46:05 * Grunt gestures. Sequell seems to speed up. 21:46:06 where does Sequell run, anyway? 21:46:16 !tea just uses cup, it doesn't have a list of containers to look through 21:46:23 * Sequell hands just a cup of Earl Grey, brewed by the royal jelly. 21:46:23 !send wheals containers 21:46:24 Sending containers to wheals. 21:46:41 !cmd =coffee.containers 21:46:41 Command: =coffee.containers => .echo cup&mug&pot 21:46:56 carafe 21:46:57 <_< 21:47:00 thermos 21:47:42 -!- tksquared has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:47:48 !cmd =cheers.containers 21:47:49 Command: =cheers.containers => .echo glass&pint&flagon&stein&shot glass&cask&boot full&briefcase full 21:48:34 i wasn't able to reproduce the lower weights of boot and briefcase when i ported it from builtin to Sequellese 21:49:03 !send wheals boots 21:49:03 Sending boots to wheals. 21:49:10 !boot Grunt 21:50:01 !cmd !boot .echo /me gives $* the boot! 21:50:02 Defined command: !boot => .echo /me gives $* the boot! 21:50:04 !boot wheals 21:50:05 * Sequell gives wheals the boot! 21:50:24 !cmd !boot .echo /ban $* 21:50:26 Redefined command: !boot => .echo /ban $* 21:50:30 rip 21:50:38 -!- ZChris13 has joined ##crawl-dev 21:50:39 1boot Sequell 21:53:35 !boot Grunt 21:53:36 /ban Grunt 21:54:03 !cmd !boot .echo /kick $* 21:54:04 Redefined command: !boot => .echo /kick $* 21:55:12 !boot wheals 21:55:12 /kick wheals 21:57:34 -!- hurdos has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 22:00:59 -!- UncertainKitten has joined ##crawl-dev 22:04:17 -!- stuntaneous has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:04:28 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 22:06:30 -!- OCTOTROG has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:09:39 -!- ZChris13 has quit [Quit: This is not a desk. It is not being flipped.] 22:10:06 -!- Lasty has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:14:41 -!- Lprsti99___ has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 22:21:28 -!- PleasingFungus has joined ##crawl-dev 22:22:31 -!- MaxFrost has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:23:47 -!- ToastyP has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90.1 [Firefox 28.0/20140314220517]] 22:32:36 -!- Fhqwhgads_ has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90.1 [Firefox 28.0/20140314220517]] 22:33:18 -!- trystero has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:35:13 03wheals02 07* 0.15-a0-98-g0c58811: Remove a misleading, purely cosmetic message (tank, ChrisOelmueller). 10(20 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 3-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=0c58811758e3 22:36:26 -!- rossi has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.3] 22:40:08 -!- rast has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:40:18 -!- tank has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:40:37 -!- rast has joined ##crawl-dev 22:44:51 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 22:45:54 -!- tgcid has joined ##crawl-dev 22:53:57 -!- Foamed has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 22:56:59 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 22:58:41 -!- Lawman0 has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 23:09:23 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 23:10:38 -!- demiskeleton has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:14:28 -!- bonghitz has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 23:15:46 -!- rchandra has left ##crawl-dev 23:24:49 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 23:24:58 -!- Red_Bucket has quit [Quit: Page closed] 23:29:25 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 23:32:14 -!- gammafunk has joined ##crawl-dev 23:34:52 -!- Bcadren has quit [Quit: Me fail English? That's unpossible.] 23:36:01 -!- ayutzia has quit [Quit: Page closed] 23:38:31 -!- Krakhan has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:39:36 -!- johnstein is now known as Rotatelljr 23:40:35 -!- gammafunk has quit [Quit: leaving] 23:54:31 -!- OCTOTROG has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:59:23 -!- OCTOTROG has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:59:23 -!- eb has quit [] 23:59:23 -!- Cheibriados has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]