00:00:02 -!- ssteam has quit [Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- Wibbly Wobbly IRC] 00:01:32 Stable (0.13) branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.13.1-25-g341c717 00:05:22 -!- master_j has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.2] 00:07:05 Unstable branch on rl.heh.fi updated to: 0.14-a0-1969-g2c76abe (34) 00:07:33 Unstable branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.14-a0-1969-g2c76abe (34) 00:08:44 Where are the startup splash images stored in? 00:09:16 dat/tiles 00:10:13 Thanks haha, was searching through rltiles 00:10:16 -!- eith has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 00:10:31 yeah i dunno why they're in a different place 00:10:40 -!- AlphaQ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:11:51 I think it's related to them not being generated? 00:12:26 probably 00:13:55 they don't get put in the proper place in the webserver folder after a clone 00:16:29 Unstable branch on crawl.beRotato.org updated to: 0.14-a0-1969-g2c76abe (34) 00:17:05 well, all tiles used by the game go to dat/tiles/ 00:17:30 it's only sources that reside elsewhere, this allows installing everything in one go 00:18:14 johnstein: You mean make doesn't copy them to webserver/static/ or what? 00:18:27 yea 00:18:28 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 00:18:46 I had to manually copy them over 00:19:14 I know there is a bug where you sometimes have to run make twice, could be that. 00:19:27 ah okl 00:19:29 ok 00:19:33 Happens at least when switching between 0.13 and master. 00:19:48 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 00:19:48 I really don't want to try to fix any Makefile stuff though :P 00:20:35 i assume that the Makefile was created by sacrificing 13 black-haired virgins on the winter solstice 00:22:34 ontoclasm: you don't have to sugar-coat it like that 00:23:28 03Medar02 07* 0.14-a0-1970-g24603a6: Disable two WebTiles debug messages 10(3 minutes ago, 1 file, 4+ 4-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=24603a622792 00:24:10 ontoclasm: don't forget the goat, too 00:24:26 ontoclasm: not sure if the goat needs to be virgin, though 00:24:45 lol @ virgin goat 00:25:22 -!- SamB_ is now known as SamB 00:27:04 The goat needs to be fed virgin olives 00:27:12 You know, that they use to make virgin olive oil 00:27:30 EXTRA virgin olives 00:32:42 -!- heteroy has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 00:32:43 -!- heteroy_ is now known as heteroy 00:33:47 -!- asdflkjh has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:39:51 -!- WalkerBoh has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:45:25 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 00:48:03 -!- Piginabag has quit [Quit: Page closed] 00:49:15 -!- heteroy has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 00:51:50 -!- Piginabag_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 00:57:42 -!- minqmay has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:57:47 -!- KurzedMetal has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:57:59 -!- MP2E has quit [Quit: leaving] 00:59:07 -!- Pacra___ has quit [Quit: welp cya] 00:59:57 -!- Blazinghand|Work has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:02:05 -!- DracoOmega has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:03:06 -!- ProzacElf has joined ##crawl-dev 01:06:32 -!- OCTOTROG has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:11:22 -!- Hailley has quit [Quit: Petra is closed!] 01:20:28 03bh02 07* 0.14-a0-1971-gc908b75: Show inventory weights by default. 10(8 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=c908b75f16fc 01:20:30 -!- ProzacElf has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:23:39 -!- Hailley has quit [Quit: Petra is closed!] 01:29:15 -!- master_j has quit [Client Quit] 01:31:16 \o/ 01:31:36 wait 01:31:52 im not sure if hes aware that theres an issue with it and its the reason why its not enabled by default 01:31:55 -!- bh has joined ##crawl-dev 01:32:17 bh: are you aware theres an issue with default inventory weight to true and tiles? 01:32:36 simmarine: ... :( 01:32:45 that was oddly worded but hopefully understandable. the only reason why its not enabled by default is because something tiles something bug something nontrivial fix thing 01:33:10 simmarine: that line of code hasn't been touched in 8 years. While there might be a problem, I don't think the relationship is causal 01:33:53 is there a bug on mantis? 01:34:03 there probably is 01:34:20 this definitely isnt the first time the suggestion has been brought up, but every time its because of some issue with tiles 01:34:23 as far as I remember, the option was off primarily because of dpeg's protests 01:34:41 that we shouldn't be showing numbers 01:34:58 kilobyte: then we should remove AUM at the top of the inventory page :) 01:35:34 players shouldn't need to test-drop inventory items until they solve the knapsack problem 01:35:58 i find it a little silly since you can see the item weights already 01:35:59 -!- ChrisOelmueller has joined ##crawl-dev 01:36:23 -!- gnum has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 01:37:21 03Medar02 07* 0.14-a0-1972-ga7d1977: Reflect show_inventory_weights default change in options guide and init.txt 10(8 minutes ago, 2 files, 2+ 2-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=a7d197752cfb 01:37:49 Medar: thanks 01:38:07 simmarine: unless it's actually breaking something, I think on is a much better default than off 01:38:18 oh sure i certainly agree 01:38:24 and have asked for it in the past 01:38:56 kilobyte: There's a world of difference between "These numbers should be immaterial to the player" and "The player shouldn't be shown these numbers" 01:39:30 %bug 950 01:39:30 https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=950 01:39:49 That has some discussion that I'm not going to read right now. 01:40:19 typically whenever this issue was raised, I shouted that it should default to yes the loudest :p So I'm not one to advocate for dpeg here. 01:40:25 -!- LiquidKrystal has quit [Quit: Page closed] 01:41:09 these numbers are relevant and the alternative (old default) is pretty much useless 01:41:13 dpeg: show_inventory_weights, It's all my fault. I think you got this one wrong. We're still friends, right? :) 01:42:14 Now change sort_menus while you are at it 01:42:28 what does that do? 01:42:34 It sorts menus 01:42:40 go on? 01:42:41 sort_menus = true : equipped, identified, basename, qualname, curse, qty 01:42:44 Is what I use 01:42:47 ah 01:42:58 So equipped at top, unidentified at bottom. Others alphabetically pretty much. 01:43:14 So your two wands of tele are actually next to each other 01:43:39 does it change the lettering? 01:43:46 No 01:44:03 Just gives useful order instead of random useless one 01:44:39 i'd heavily oppose such a change 01:44:47 Why is that? 01:44:58 -!- ebarrett has quit [] 01:45:26 as for the inventory weights, it'd be very nice to recolor the aum counter according to burden state 01:46:00 ChrisOelmueller: As in "If you drop this, you'll become unburdened"? 01:46:10 that, and the reverse in pickup menu 01:46:29 -!- archaeo has joined ##crawl-dev 01:47:20 (which show_weights also applies to, and which has a rather stupid and wordy "unencumbered" etc. right now) 01:47:25 cf. _menu_burden_invstatus 01:48:32 the best case (and really the only players ever want) is the one drawing most attention because of string length, and there's no warning color coding at all for the bad states 01:49:25 of course the discussion might just be moot with the default's change and the approximate amount of players wanting to use `false` but hey, as mentioned above it'd be nice to have colors with the aum counter also 01:51:54 can we make characters automanage chunks by default? :) 01:51:59 and then remove chunks. 01:52:11 ChrisOelmueller: So why no sort_menus? 01:52:58 bh: well the several options related to former are bugged sometimes, i'd prefer easy_eat, confirm_butcher=never and friends (which of course also is bugged but less so) 01:52:58 Medar: "random useless" is not the same as "by letter" to me at least, but maybe i'm special in that regard and the default should be something else indeed 01:53:38 I usually want to find a letter certain item has. Not item that has a certain letter. 01:53:42 i do reletter some of my stuff and i'd be seriously (visually) confused by items jumping around without me asking for it, so to say 01:53:48 But maybe I'm missing something obvious. 01:53:57 random uselessness is surprisingly not useless 01:54:06 it's not very useful, but it can summon butterflies 01:54:13 that one should just 50% reassemble 50% sputterflies 01:54:30 I'd say they jump around less or at least less surprisingly with that sort_menu line 01:54:32 (and not be considered useless no more) 01:54:47 numbers at your disposal 01:54:48 Every game curing is near the top of the list. 01:55:00 But without sorting, it can be anywhere. 01:55:12 And if you run out and pick up some more, it can be in some other position again. 01:55:27 as i said, for me relettering in-game works better than that, but you might have a point still 01:55:48 i don't know how incredibly desperate i would have to be to read random uselessness in the hope of it casting sputterflies 01:55:57 i think even eating might be a better use of my turns 01:56:39 Unstable branch on crawl.lantea.net updated to: 0.14-a0-1969-g2c76abe (34) 01:59:39 -!- morik has quit [Quit: Page closed] 02:00:33 mikee_: if you really need to block LOS and have no other option 02:01:17 hookyspooky (L8 TrMo) ASSERT(i > (unsigned int) min_unbuyable_idx) in 'shopping.cc' at line 2934 failed. (D:7) 02:01:45 butterflies block line of fire 02:02:35 i don't know. it's just never been something i've ever wanted to use at a low chance of it doing something, and i use butterflies a lot 02:02:51 50% would not be that low 02:03:02 i guess it is a decent amount of them 02:04:29 !tell MarvinPA imo you should totally look at all the ?/ code and improve its awesomeness but that might be hard because it is incredibly awesome already 02:04:29 ChrisOelmueller: OK, I'll let marvinpa know. 02:05:21 -!- nixor has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:06:09 -!- bh has quit [Quit: Page closed] 02:13:45 -!- SkaryMonk1 has joined ##crawl-dev 02:16:18 -!- Fortescue has quit [] 02:16:41 -!- DaneiTHREE has quit [Quit: Those who tell the truth shall die, those who tell the truth shall live forever.] 02:17:04 -!- thug_lessons has quit [] 02:17:15 maybe when a phantom hits me then blinks away (all while i'm nagamoving), the message should not be worried about an info leak (it says Something hits you.)) 02:18:55 -!- conted has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 02:19:50 I just learned about ^r to pull up reverse history in bash 02:19:51 that's nice 02:19:54 also can someone telnet termcast.org and tell me what's going on here :P 02:20:02 this doesn't look right 02:20:14 -!- SkaryMonk2 has joined ##crawl-dev 02:20:59 -!- SkaryMonk1 has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 02:22:03 johnstein: bash interface is much like crawl's! 02:22:26 :) 02:22:31 does that work in crawl? 02:23:04 i hope not :) 02:24:11 heh. wasn't sure if it could be used with ctrl-f 02:24:16 to pull up old searches 02:31:35 -!- tabstorm has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 02:36:16 only the up arrow, and it doesn't get saved ... 02:40:50 SamB: you don't happen to know about a recent bug breaking features? 02:40:59 termcast at telnet termcast.org 02:41:40 I haven't really been on lately 02:41:49 or pulled either 02:42:12 -!- TehIce has quit [] 02:42:26 okay i'll just keep this thing up and idle then 02:44:15 -!- archaeo has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 02:46:09 -!- ELRanger has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 02:50:53 -!- Zeor has quit [Quit: g'bug] 02:50:54 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:55:27 -!- ProzacElf has joined ##crawl-dev 03:01:33 -!- magicpoints has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 03:05:55 -!- mong has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:07:30 -!- Quashie has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:12:05 -!- Twinge has joined ##crawl-dev 03:12:24 -!- ProzacElf has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 03:17:54 -!- Rotatell has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:18:08 -!- Rotatell has joined ##crawl-dev 03:21:09 -!- Egglet has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 03:26:45 -!- Foamed has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 03:30:45 -!- simmarine has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:32:59 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:37:53 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 03:45:06 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 03:48:26 -!- bschlief has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:48:45 -!- amatsu has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 03:56:45 -!- NekoRex has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:03:58 -!- dagonfive has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 04:07:38 -!- Cerpin has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 04:10:59 -!- Amy|Sonata has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:11:45 join ##crawl 04:12:20 no! 04:16:15 -!- BlastHardcheese has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 04:19:50 -!- SkaryMonk2 has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 04:19:55 -!- BlastHardcheese has joined ##crawl-dev 04:19:57 -!- SkaryMonk1 has joined ##crawl-dev 04:21:38 -!- Bodrick has joined ##crawl-dev 04:22:10 -!- oberstein has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 04:27:42 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 04:39:57 Dithmengos appreciates your removing a source of fire...for a mottled dragon zombie 04:52:17 -!- oberstein has joined ##crawl-dev 04:55:28 -!- dagonfive1 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:04:09 -!- Fortescue has joined ##crawl-dev 05:16:33 -!- agenius has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:20:55 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 05:21:22 guys, in the next few weeks I'd like to consolidate 2 servers 05:22:08 means I'll move the crawl infrastructure to another host, and I won't be able to move the IP 05:22:27 which means downtime 05:25:02 -!- _D_ has quit [Quit: leaving] 05:32:54 -!- angry_point has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:00:51 -!- bmfx has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:04:21 -!- Vizer_ has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 06:05:33 -!- Mateji has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 06:17:04 -!- Vizer has quit [Quit: bye] 06:19:04 -!- SkaryMonk2 has joined ##crawl-dev 06:21:11 -!- SkaryMonk1 has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:21:29 -!- bonghitz_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:31:28 -!- Bloax has joined ##crawl-dev 06:32:37 -!- darkschneider has joined ##crawl-dev 06:35:50 -!- ainsophyao has joined ##crawl-dev 06:35:59 -!- darkschneider has left ##crawl-dev 06:45:25 -!- ackack has joined ##crawl-dev 07:06:09 -!- mikee_ has quit [Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- It'll be on slashdot one day...] 07:06:13 -!- Basil has joined ##crawl-dev 07:07:05 -!- eith has joined ##crawl-dev 07:11:19 -!- Brokkr has quit [Quit: leaving] 07:16:32 -!- Sgeo has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:16:32 -!- st_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:16:58 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 07:23:34 -!- Crehl has quit [Quit: qqqqqqq] 07:27:48 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 07:42:33 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 07:43:35 if hiding item weight is what's prompted by a "make str relevant" goal (and it fails at even that), i'm inclined to support kilobyte's stat removal wholeheartedly 07:46:23 -!- Bodrick has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 07:48:24 making folks unable to pick up things while burdened would be a nice solution if not for stat drain (so how about removing that first) 07:48:51 or rather when they'd become burdened 08:04:18 -!- gnum has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 08:09:30 -!- Bodrick has joined ##crawl-dev 08:12:38 -!- MaxFrost has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 08:17:56 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 08:19:31 -!- Barahir_ has joined ##crawl-dev 08:19:34 -!- SkaryMonk2 has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 08:19:47 -!- SkaryMonk1 has joined ##crawl-dev 08:21:22 -!- gnum has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 08:26:00 -!- Basil has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 08:30:48 -!- Barahir_ is now known as JoelMt 08:41:12 -!- asdflkjh has quit [Quit: Leaving] 08:44:04 -!- wheals has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:45:16 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 08:48:11 -!- JoelMt has quit [Quit: Page closed] 08:48:57 -!- Amy has quit [Disconnected by services] 08:50:42 -!- Basil has joined ##crawl-dev 08:54:45 -!- AreBrandon has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 08:54:58 -!- MIC132 has joined ##crawl-dev 09:02:21 -!- Venter has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 09:04:11 -!- MIC132 has quit [Quit: Leaving] 09:08:17 -!- tensorpudding has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net] 09:09:26 -!- tsohg_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:15:21 -!- wheals has joined ##crawl-dev 09:40:56 -!- bh has joined ##crawl-dev 09:41:00 shucks, no dpeg 09:41:35 !send bh dpeg 09:41:36 Sending dpeg to bh. 09:41:48 !abyss grunt 09:41:48 bh casts a spell. grunt is devoured by a tear in reality! 09:41:54 * bh casts Grunt into the abyss. 09:41:57 * Grunt escapes from the Abyss! 09:42:05 !send the_shadow bh 09:42:06 Sending bh to the_shadow. 09:42:11 The shadow knows. 09:42:12 s/shadow/&s/ 09:42:13 :( 09:42:28 -!- bug_sniper has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 09:42:49 -!- JaGGedTK has quit [Quit: Page closed] 09:43:33 -!- lukano has quit [Quit: brb] 09:46:35 -!- bh has quit [Quit: Page closed] 09:47:09 -!- bug_sniper_ has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 09:47:23 -!- radinms has quit [] 09:47:45 -!- _D_ has quit [Quit: leaving] 09:49:55 -!- lukano has quit [Client Quit] 09:50:42 -!- lukano has quit [Client Quit] 09:52:03 has anybody already drawn the nethack card for showing weights? 09:52:58 you have to do the same drop/pickup dance in crawl as in nethack if you are burdened 09:53:20 -!- lukano has quit [Client Quit] 09:56:05 -!- bug_sniper_ has quit [Client Quit] 09:58:54 -!- bug_sniper__ has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:02:17 -!- thedefinite has quit [Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- Chicks dig it] 10:03:20 -!- ackack has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 10:04:00 -!- SkaryMonk1 has left ##crawl-dev 10:04:10 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 10:13:10 -!- ainsophyao has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:15:09 -!- ainsophyao has joined ##crawl-dev 10:17:38 -!- morik___ is now known as morik 10:17:44 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 10:17:51 -!- DrinkMachine has quit [Changing host] 10:17:51 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 10:29:02 -!- Matejii has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 10:33:21 -!- monty__ has quit [Quit: monty__] 10:34:04 -!- LexAckson has joined ##crawl-dev 10:35:08 -!- Insomniak has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 10:41:03 -!- Staplefun has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:41:20 -!- HellTiger has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.2.0 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/] 10:43:00 -!- lukano has quit [Quit: brb] 10:45:18 -!- evilmike has joined ##crawl-dev 10:45:46 -!- ldf has quit [Client Quit] 10:47:40 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: ["Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com"]] 10:47:53 -!- ldf has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:50:25 -!- ldf has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:54:12 Webtiles server stopped. 10:54:15 Webtiles server started. 10:56:40 -!- Kromgart has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:00:24 -!- ldf has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:03:57 -!- Venter has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 11:05:37 -!- ldf has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:08:02 -!- ProzacElf has joined ##crawl-dev 11:15:11 -!- ystael_ has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:15:28 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.14-a0-1972-ga7d1977 (34) 11:24:16 -!- rast- has joined ##crawl-dev 11:25:25 -!- ldf has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:26:29 !messages 11:26:29 No messages for TZer0. 11:34:25 !tell TZer0 Feeling lonely? 11:34:26 Grunt: OK, I'll let tzer0 know. 11:34:52 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 11:35:22 i made an effort post on noise conduct for d. in case anybody wants to point out how dumb it is 11:35:29 -!- ldf has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:37:07 -!- ldf has quit [Client Quit] 11:37:19 We don't need more conducts for Dith IMO. 11:37:43 well it would replace fire 11:38:01 since fire seems like sort of a weird conduct to me 11:38:04 what's wrong with fire 11:38:05 fire is probably better, because what evilmike said 11:38:36 banning fire sort of doesn't do anything other than make the god worse for random races 11:38:44 you can always just use ice instead 11:38:59 i mean, it's thematic, sure 11:39:13 yes, if you have ice you can use ice 11:39:24 but it's like having a god that hates maces and flails 11:39:48 -!- Morg0th has quit [Quit: leaving] 11:39:48 the fire thing is more relevant earlier, the high level conjurations would mostly be relevant later in the game 11:40:02 i don't like noise as a conduct since being noisy is already a bad thing 11:40:08 and it's already additionally bad under dith since you can't shadow step to things when you wake them up 11:40:16 noise: very transparent in crawl 11:40:22 almost as transparent as ranged combat 11:40:25 i think spell noise is pretty transparent 11:40:38 ChrisOelmueller: what ontoclasm suggests is actually very clear 11:40:49 https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?p=145851#p145851 11:40:49 oh it's about spells only? 11:40:53 yes 11:40:59 well, and things like the gong 11:41:01 also some items and shouting 11:41:05 random noisy stuff wouldn't matter 11:41:16 but it's just an idea 11:42:29 -!- ProzacElf has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 11:45:25 -!- HellTiger has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:46:09 -!- neuwiz has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:47:33 marvinpa raises a very good point about how noise wakes stuff up and weakens shadow step. it's already peanlized, but in a much more organic way than anything to do with piety 11:47:58 well, obviously noise is bad, but people still cast firestorm 11:48:49 they generally dont when trying to sneak up on stuff though 11:49:06 if you want to be loud, fine, but you lose out on a nice stealthy cblink-like ability 11:49:12 well... you don't generally use fire when sneaking either 11:49:33 -!- Garhauk has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 11:49:34 the simplified version of mainly looking at spells for noise could work in that it'd be reasonably clear and would stop you casting high-end conjurations, yeah 11:49:56 regardless, fire's fine, i'm just offering it as an option 11:49:56 the problem then is that it stops you from casting high-end conjurations 11:50:27 i tend to prefer conducts that affect the whole game. I guess it would block some mid level stuff like ligtning bolt 11:51:18 well, it blocks meph at least 11:51:26 not a huge deal i guess 11:51:42 ooooh it blocks meph? okay make this thing happen i'm all in 11:52:10 meph, fireball, lightning bolt. I'm not sure what other good spells there are which are loud and midlevel 11:52:23 there's a bunch of good high level spells which are loud, but thats very late game stuff usually 11:52:44 ball lightning :v 11:53:04 especially in shadow form of taking surprising amounts of punishment 11:53:27 i should totally try that 11:54:24 -!- rast has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:54:37 -!- rast-- is now known as rast 11:54:49 lrd 11:56:51 so basically all but the midlevel conjurations and ice conjurations 11:57:00 and probably poison too 11:57:34 -!- MIC132 has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:01:33 -!- Mattias has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:08:05 -!- Bloax has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:08:24 -!- Bloax has joined ##crawl-dev 12:08:26 -!- Foamed has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:11:35 -!- Piginabag has quit [Quit: Page closed] 12:12:53 -!- KurzedMetal has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 12:17:02 -!- Bloaxor has joined ##crawl-dev 12:17:02 -!- Bloax has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:18:15 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 12:18:54 -!- tsohg_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:20:01 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: CADENZA-CLASS CLOCKWORK KNIGHT--OPERATION TERMINATED] 12:20:21 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 12:21:05 -!- sprort has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:22:57 -!- Daekdroom has quit [Quit: Saindo] 12:25:55 -!- DrinkMachine has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 12:27:57 -!- Sequell has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:31:47 -!- Crehl has quit [Quit: qqqqqqq] 12:33:45 -!- NekoRex has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:38:25 -!- Bloaxor has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:38:33 -!- Bloax has joined ##crawl-dev 12:39:52 -!- Morphy has quit [Quit: Page closed] 12:41:20 -!- Bloaxor has joined ##crawl-dev 12:41:21 -!- Bloax has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:42:13 -!- Bloaxzorro has joined ##crawl-dev 12:42:13 -!- Bloaxor has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:43:34 -!- Sequell has joined ##crawl-dev 12:45:49 -!- Jens_from_denmar has quit [Changing host] 12:46:39 -!- alefury has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90.1 [Iceweasel 26.0/20131215102647]] 12:51:50 -!- Cheibriados has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:52:59 -!- Cheibriados has joined ##crawl-dev 12:52:59 -!- The topic of ##crawl-dev is: Crawl Development | Logs: http://s-z.org/crawl-dev/ | People with +v have commit access. | Please keep general Crawl-related chit-chat to ##crawl. | Dev wiki: http://crawl.develz.org/wiki | Long stuff to pastebin.ca please | Immortal Warwalrus and Crazy Yiuf forever. 12:53:00 -!- The topic of ##crawl is: Check out new European server at ??clan! | Play Crawl online now: type ??cao, ??cdo, ??cszo, ??clan, or ??webtiles for instructions | http://crawl.develz.org | FooTV: termcast.develz.org | ##crawl-offtopic: You got your gender in my peanut butter! Xom thinks this is hilarious. 12:53:01 -!- Jens_from_denmar has quit [Quit: Page closed] 13:02:52 -!- floatboth has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:03:16 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 13:05:41 -!- Foamed has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 13:08:59 -!- master_j has quit [Quit: quit] 13:10:21 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 13:13:11 -!- quazi has quit [Quit: leaving] 13:16:16 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 13:17:07 -!- TangoBravo has quit [Quit: Page closed] 13:17:57 -!- Garhauk has quit [Changing host] 13:19:29 -!- NeremWorld has quit [] 13:22:08 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 13:23:17 -!- Morphy has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 13:23:59 -!- Bloax has joined ##crawl-dev 13:24:34 -!- Bloaxzorro has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:28:36 -!- HellTiger_ has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:29:42 -!- ackack has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:31:14 -!- Bloaxor has joined ##crawl-dev 13:31:14 -!- Bloax has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:32:48 -!- Bloaxzorro has joined ##crawl-dev 13:32:48 -!- Bloaxor has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:37:14 -!- Bloaxzorro has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:37:15 -!- Bloaxor has joined ##crawl-dev 13:38:25 -!- simmarine has joined ##crawl-dev 13:41:16 -!- Bloaxzorro has joined ##crawl-dev 13:41:16 -!- Bloaxor has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:41:35 -!- chewymouse has joined ##crawl-dev 13:41:41 -!- _D_ has quit [Quit: leaving] 13:43:18 -!- master_j has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.2] 13:44:21 -!- Bloaxor has joined ##crawl-dev 13:44:21 -!- Bloaxzorro has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:44:28 -!- Ladykiller69 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:49:05 -!- chewymouse has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:50:45 -!- Zermako has quit [] 13:52:51 -!- Quashie has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:57:21 -!- gammafunk has joined ##crawl-dev 14:00:46 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 14:01:54 -!- DrinkMachine has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:02:50 -!- blabber has joined ##crawl-dev 14:05:34 I should have probably asked a question like this a while ago, but 14:06:14 |amethyst, TZer0, Napkin, and anyone else running a server: what kind of specs do you have? 14:06:30 -!- TangoBravo has quit [Quit: Page closed] 14:08:16 -!- halv has quit [Client Quit] 14:10:01 CDO is Intel(R) Core(TM) i7 CPU 930 @ 2.80GHz with 12gb of ram, disks with ~75mb/s. Stopped hosting WebTiles, because with apache (wordpress, mantis, tavern, wiki) & mysql & console games the server became too laggy. 14:15:32 -!- Brokkr has quit [Quit: leaving] 14:16:32 -!- Brokkr is now known as NuTzLoS 14:19:41 johnstein, I'm reminded of something else I meant to ask you about, even if it's not immediately relevant. 14:19:53 -!- Aryth has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:20:13 johnstein, most of the current Crawl servers are set up to allow devs to download save backups for debugging purposes; I'm wondering if cbro has been set up for that. 14:20:35 hm 14:20:36 !lm * crash src=cbro 14:20:37 1. [2014-01-11 23:47:46] Change the Devastator (L23 FeCj) ? (Abyss:1) 14:20:40 !lm * crash src=cbro -log 14:20:41 1. Change, XL23 FeCj, T:127018 (milestone): http://crawl.berotato.org/crawl/morgue/Change/crash-Change-20140111-234746.txt 14:23:46 -!- Bloaxzorro has joined ##crawl-dev 14:23:46 -!- Bloaxor has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:24:05 -!- Escalator has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 14:24:19 -!- Escalator_ is now known as Escalator 14:25:45 -!- Bloaxor has joined ##crawl-dev 14:25:45 -!- Bloaxzorro has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:26:56 -!- waspmonolith has quit [Quit: leaving] 14:27:19 does that mean it's set up ok? 14:27:28 I haven't added all the appropriate admins 14:27:54 just me and |amethyst. I wasn't sure ho else needed it 14:28:52 Well, I'd need to get someone to do a save backup to be able to tell if we can access it :) 14:29:08 My normal account name is SGrunt, btw. 14:29:26 -!- LordSloth has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:30:56 -!- yxhuvud has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:35:19 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:35:22 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 14:37:03 -!- elliptic has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:37:11 -!- Kellhus has quit [Quit: Page closed] 14:38:02 -!- blabber has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:39:26 -!- Morphy has quit [Quit: Page closed] 14:40:45 -!- Bloaxzorro has joined ##crawl-dev 14:40:45 -!- Bloaxor has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:41:36 Grunt: And the "S" stand for...? 14:41:44 s/stand/stands/ 14:43:15 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 14:43:15 -!- DrinkMachine has quit [Changing host] 14:43:15 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 14:44:38 -!- ackack has joined ##crawl-dev 14:45:20 gammafunk: SGrunt, obviously. 14:47:54 -!- tsohg_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:53:12 -!- tsohg_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:56:14 -!- Lightli has joined ##crawl-dev 14:56:50 Book acquirement still ignores first level of Spellcasting skill by minmay 15:01:53 Ammo acquirement checks inventory for blowgun by minmay 15:03:35 -!- yalue has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:17:39 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 15:20:58 -!- Egglet has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.2.0 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/] 15:24:43 -!- Tux[Qyou] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:35:56 Medar: Do you have any further reservations about araganzar's linkify patch? 15:39:49 -!- blabber has joined ##crawl-dev 15:40:28 -!- blabber has quit [Client Quit] 15:43:19 Bug in auto_drop_chunks by morik 15:43:35 -!- twelwe has quit [Quit: Page closed] 15:44:54 -!- OneEyedJack has quit [Quit: Page closed] 15:47:28 -!- nixor has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:50:21 -!- DrinkMachine has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:52:43 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 15:52:51 -!- DrinkMachine has quit [Changing host] 15:52:52 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 15:57:16 -!- Bloaxor has joined ##crawl-dev 15:57:16 -!- Bloaxzorro has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:05:25 -!- DrinkMachine has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:08:35 -!- Krakhan has quit [Changing host] 16:16:40 so, I just sent the mail. tenofswords is in the dev team! 16:17:17 does this mean we have to change our mailmap now? 16:17:30 the new_dev_checklist is going to be a nightmare with all his aliases :/ 16:17:39 mailmap? 16:17:51 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 16:17:51 -!- DrinkMachine has quit [Changing host] 16:17:51 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 16:17:56 I mean since you said tenofswords rather than the name we have in Chei's mailmap currently 16:18:06 which is? 16:18:15 i think he just uses tenofswords these days. the namechanging habit seems dormant, at least 16:18:29 the name we see whenever a patch of his gets applied? 16:18:51 I guess you'll have to ask him about that :) 16:19:30 -!- ackack has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:19:31 !lg * kmap=~hangedman s=kmap 16:19:32 2130 games for * (kmap=~hangedman): 392x hangedman_cross_stitches, 223x hangedman_fish_farm, 164x hangedman_cross_cluster, 149x hangedman_cross_veins, 141x hangedman_ranch, 121x hangedman_feature_mirror, 72x hangedman_minor_gate_pass, 70x hangedman_pestilent_swarm, 66x hangedman_tree_tricks, 62x hangedman_stone_soup, 60x hangedman_lair_in_review, 59x hangedman_pleasuredromes, 54x hangedman_screame... 16:19:39 %git 188663e25 16:19:39 07HangedMan02 {|amethyst} * 0.14-a0-1437-g188663e: Update special_room_morgue, special room depths/weights 10(5 weeks ago, 1 file, 31+ 31-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=188663e25cb1 16:20:32 the mailmap is what Cheibriados uses to print out HangedMan and |amethyst there instead of the names from the git commit object 16:23:16 <|amethyst> %git 188663e 16:23:16 07tenofswords02 {|amethyst} * 0.14-a0-1437-g188663e: Update special_room_morgue, special room depths/weights 10(5 weeks ago, 1 file, 31+ 31-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=188663e25cb1 16:25:28 <|amethyst> !tell tenofswords changed Chei's nick-mapping for you to tenofswords; let me know if you want it changed back 16:25:28 |amethyst: OK, I'll let tenofswords know. 16:25:42 <|amethyst> agh, I must be off 16:26:36 The |amethyst dissapears in a puff of smoke! 16:27:47 -!- schistosomatic has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:30:07 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 16:30:40 -!- Guz has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.2] 16:30:49 -!- Aryth has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:31:10 !tell tenofswords Regarding your forest proposal, perhaps a mention of what to do with wellsprings? 16:31:10 gammafunk: OK, I'll let tenofswords know. 16:33:32 -!- LexAckson has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:36:43 -!- CryptoCactus has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:43:01 -!- VolteccerJack has quit [Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <-] 16:47:22 -!- Chris7 has quit [] 16:49:59 wait 16:50:06 was hangedman not a dev? 16:50:49 -!- DrinkMachine has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:51:37 nope, just a vault designer 17:00:12 -!- Ladykiller69 has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:06:15 -!- robbje has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:07:17 -!- Hypereia has quit [Quit: Page closed] 17:12:27 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 17:16:14 -!- CyberSandwich has joined ##crawl-dev 17:21:36 -!- Quashie_ has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 17:21:43 -!- robotcentaur has quit [Quit: Page closed] 17:22:08 -!- Turgon has quit [Client Quit] 17:24:10 wheals: if someone doesn't have + preceeding their name in irc, they aren't a dev 17:24:21 well unless it's "dpig" 17:25:11 oh and sometiles Sequell is not a robot but a dev 17:25:20 *sometimes 17:27:03 -!- ProzacElf has joined ##crawl-dev 17:31:24 -!- TARBALLPYTHON has joined ##crawl-dev 17:31:38 what do y'all think of merging bullseye and shield of the gong? 17:31:51 -!- Garhauk has quit [Quit: Page closed] 17:32:38 -!- Zilis has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:32:42 It's really the same thing except Gong does the job of being impractical better. 17:33:03 Glorious impracticality, needs a buff. 17:34:28 specifically, I was thinking of the +27 shield of the gong {rElec rN+ MR+ EV-5} 17:34:30 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: CADENZA-CLASS CLOCKWORK KNIGHT--OPERATION TERMINATED] 17:35:52 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 17:36:12 i mean, it would still be bad, because wow 40 noise every time you block something, but bullseye is both totally boring and also almost always bad so getting rid of it seems good 17:38:57 -!- asdflkjh has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:39:31 also, 27 17:40:01 would it be a large shield or a normal shield 17:40:26 It should clearly be a buckler 17:40:33 -!- tenofswords has joined ##crawl-dev 17:40:47 i would say it should stay a normal shield 17:41:17 since you know, the idea is to actually make it better :P 17:41:45 i think bullseye is large now 17:42:25 -!- Morphy has quit [Quit: Page closed] 17:42:53 -!- Guillome_renard is now known as qoon 17:42:58 !tell gammafunk they're thus Depths monsters and thus technically not part of my proposal, which is good since I'd rather not comment on them :P 17:42:58 tenofswords: OK, I'll let gammafunk know. 17:43:40 -!- Zilis has joined ##crawl-dev 17:44:31 03galehar02 07* 0.14-a0-1973-g12a8f03: Fix the transifex interface broken by e8b8e78b. 10(66 minutes ago, 1 file, 31+ 5-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=12a8f0311761 17:44:31 03Translators02 {galehar} 07* 0.14-a0-1974-gdb6e453: [Transifex] Sync. 10(78 seconds ago, 67 files, 795+ 708-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=db6e4539e645 17:44:36 Come to think of it, why is shield enchantment so irrelvant? 17:47:55 because SH is so irrelevant 17:48:14 less flippantly, because shield skill gives lots and lots of sh 17:48:27 also because increasing it means using ?EA, which is bad because AC is better 17:49:53 yes 17:50:37 I mean I almost never go shields in Crawl anyways, but maybe if enchantment raised SH by 3 points it would be relevant? 17:51:23 I think it's less that SH is bad and more that AC is better 17:51:26 AC plus enchanting dragon hides 17:51:33 (yes, that would mean Bullseye would before factoring anything else in like being a large shield or shield skill would give 45 SH) 17:51:35 SH isn't bad. 17:51:41 It's just that 1 SH is absolutely nothing. 17:55:22 -!- Nightbeer has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:55:52 Lightli: a more natural way to go about that would be to make each point of SH worth more 17:56:10 that doesn't take care of shield skill being that much more important than enchantment, if it is 17:56:13 (and reduce the number you get from non-enchantment appropriately) 17:56:14 but that also just requires changing a formula 17:56:16 yeah 17:57:38 Except increasing the efficiency of SH would be pretty problematic considering that low SH values do exist already, and what would you do about those? 17:58:33 12-20 SH is pretty low for serious usage, and that's not even dipping into <12 territory. 17:59:26 And if you'd have to make 1 SH worth 3 or 4 as now, things would look a bit silly. 18:05:45 -!- Quashie has quit [Quit: Leaving] 18:09:07 -!- ldf has quit [Quit: ldf] 18:10:36 uh 18:10:37 how 18:10:38 SGrunt (L16 KoHu) ERROR in 'tags.cc' at line 3288: Invalid item: crossbow (D:13) 18:10:44 uh 18:10:49 rip xbows 18:10:57 lots of characters have 2 EV for some period of time, what's wrong with having 2 SH 18:11:03 !lm sgrunt -log 18:11:03 7782. SGrunt, XL16 KoHu, T:35429 (milestone): http://crawl.berotato.org/crawl/morgue/SGrunt/crash-SGrunt-20140117-001037.txt 18:11:11 (not to mention that you already get super low SH values from bone plates) 18:11:19 wait nevermind, I just remembered it's bloax I'm talking to 18:14:38 -!- JoelMt has quit [Quit: Try HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <-] 18:15:01 (when was the last time bone plates were useful) 18:15:34 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 18:16:05 -!- tensorpudding has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 18:16:56 -!- DracoOmega has joined ##crawl-dev 18:18:28 -!- Undo has quit [Client Quit] 18:18:37 -!- Undo has joined ##crawl-dev 18:19:09 -!- Kenran has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:19:20 qoala pointed out to me that maybe our new shadow god maybe doesn't *actually* like Dazzling Spray? 18:19:36 -!- Pacra has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:20:47 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 18:21:47 -!- Bloaxor has quit [Quit: Error: Bloax not found] 18:22:03 it could be arguyed that it does not produce light, it makes its targets see fake lights instead of reality 18:22:08 -!- NeremWorld has quit [] 18:22:24 Heh, perhaps. 18:23:00 the illumination conduct was deliberately made simpler, it only cares about corona and haloes, things that make significant amounts of light 18:23:14 Since those are actually intuitive to the player that they are making lots of light 18:23:22 Instead of little subjective things like dazzling spray 18:24:04 Ah, I see. 18:24:16 but Fire magic in general is offlimits, right? 18:24:35 So basically... no Fire Storm x2 XD 18:25:01 -!- st_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:25:12 even flame tongue is a bit more than just flicking a lighter at something 18:25:24 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 18:26:40 yeah that's why the two conducts are slightly separated 18:28:20 -!- Pacra has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:28:24 So, while working on some forest dispersal stuff, I have ended up finding my way down a rabbit hole of quirky and unexpected behaviors relating to monsters being feared (and then not acting like it) 18:28:35 Some of it seems obviously like bugs, some might be intentional, and sometimes it's hard to tell 18:28:49 -!- sprort has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.1] 18:28:57 I'm going to try cleaning some of it up, but I need to decide what actually SHOULD happen in some cases 18:30:32 Probably some of you have noticed that, at some point in the past, fear seemed to become way less effective against centaurs and such? With them appearing to basically unfear almost immediately? 18:31:12 <|amethyst> I thought it had always been like that? 18:31:20 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 18:31:25 Had it? I thought it was definitely more reliable a while back. 18:31:32 <|amethyst> It was the same thing that made fleeing dragons breathe 18:31:34 <|amethyst> hm 18:31:39 Either way, it's seemed odd to me that it was so unreliable in these cases 18:31:48 But there are a few quirks that definitely don't seem intentional either way 18:31:58 <|amethyst> now that I think about it, I think the problematic behaviour was missing for a few versions? 18:32:17 As far as I can tell, ENCH_FEAR doesn't seem to really DO anything. When it is added, the monster is set to fleeing behavior. When it is removed, they stop and reevaluate their behavior. But simply HAVING the enchant does nothing. 18:32:20 Mostly 18:32:30 Which is notable that monsters stopping to fire ranged weapons doesn't actually REMOVE ENCH_FEAR 18:32:42 Though it no longer displays that status visably 18:32:46 <|amethyst> now that dragons don't flee naturally, I think we're more free to tune that stuff 18:32:53 This has the effect of making them invisibly immune to fear for a while until it invisibly wears off 18:33:09 But only player cast fear (monster-cast fear will still affect them again) 18:33:20 -!- Basil has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:33:20 it's also annoying that using fear makes you randomly lose scrolls of blinking because monsters read them 18:33:51 Also, the moment a monster reaches a corner or somehow cannot take a step away from what it's running from, it also stops fleeing (while keeping ENCH_FEAR) 18:34:05 So it could hit a wall next to you, then immediately charge back at you with fear immunity 18:34:52 wait, what, DracoOmega? 18:34:53 :D 18:34:54 Like, I understand monsters not just sitting in corners letting you wail on them, but it's a bit more silly if you're nowhere near them and the corner is far safer than charging back across a room to melee you again 18:35:29 Hey :P 18:35:54 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 18:36:06 DracoOmega: did you know that fleeing monsters know exactly where you are even if you are invisible 18:36:15 So they know which way to run, yes 18:36:21 Forgot that, but I remember reading the comments 18:36:35 I suppose it makes sense enough for magical fear, anyway 18:36:40 They could be scared of the spot that you are in 18:37:08 DracoOmega: in that case, why do they continue running away from *you*, not the spot, if you move? 18:37:17 ??it[12] 18:37:17 it[12/36]: An aura of fear fills the air! You are terrified of it! 18:37:30 I guess maybe the spot moves with you? 18:37:32 -!- Pacra has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:37:32 still seems kinda weird 18:37:34 Maybe? 18:37:40 I think it's probably very rare that this is noticable 18:37:52 well yeah, I just thought, as long as we're listing weird things that fear does 18:37:52 (And maybe it was hard to figure out how to get them to flee sanely otherwise?) 18:38:48 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 18:39:04 Anyway, I'm wondering what the sanest overall behavior ought to be 18:39:05 -!- Pacra has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:39:41 Since presumably you shouldn't be able to corner something that's afraid and then just hit on it over and over again while it does nothing, but also things shouldn't invisibly become immune immediately either 18:40:51 Maybe have them path away from you with better intelligence if they are intelligent? 18:40:56 Maybe the most sensible thing would be for things to only flee and not take offensive action unless they both become cornered AND you hit them? 18:41:09 DracoOmega: also, I think that if you are invisible and something stars fleeing, and then it stops fleeing, it will actually know your position for that turn, but this is annoying to test so I am not sure 18:41:15 Or they are cornered and have a ranged attack they can use from there? 18:41:45 But simply being cornered won't prompt action if you aren't messing with them and they won't stop in the middle of an open path to fire back at you? 18:42:15 DracoOmega: my impression was that fear already timed out naturally after some number of turns, so that may not even be necessary 18:42:18 TARBALLPYTHON: I think you might be right. On both counts. 18:42:34 Um, about the first thing 18:42:38 It does time out, yes 18:42:56 You could still theoretically use it on some cornered monster and still get quite a few free turns to do stuff to them without reprisal, though 18:42:58 DracoOmega: i mean, if you can cast cause fear to kill something in a corner, you are also capable of casting confuse and doing the same thing 18:43:01 This may or may not be a problem 18:43:13 That is true 18:43:15 It would be far simpler 18:43:17 though maybe cause fear has a higher success chance? 18:43:31 It probably has a higher chance than single-target confuse, but the same as mass confusion 18:43:38 (in which case getting rid of the higher success chance is also an option :P) 18:43:55 It's not about fear but mass enchants in general get a global power boost 18:44:11 The scrolls have extremely high power, but I don't worry about anyone using them offensively, since they're so limited 18:44:18 but I think monsters that are unable to move away from you turning around is fine; it's pretty transparent, unlike the behaviour with ranged attacks, and doesn't really make fear significantly weaker 18:45:12 Well, say you used fear on a ranged attacker on a tiny island 18:45:15 I definitely think the 1/8 chance per action for centaurs to shoot you anyway should go away though, it's silly that fear is basically useless against a big list of monsters you'd expect it to be fine against 18:45:19 It can't move, so it just keeps shooting? 18:45:31 -!- HellTiger has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.2.0 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/] 18:45:42 That might make sense, but I don't know 18:46:16 DracoOmega: clearly the correct behaviour is for it to flee into the water and drown 18:46:21 Hahaha 18:46:53 XD 18:47:41 this popped up as a mundane milestone for SGrunt on CBRO: [19:10:39] SGrunt (L16 KoHu) ERROR in 'tags.cc' at line 3288: Invalid item: crossbow (D:13) 18:48:02 Well, if there are any bugs you can be sure a dev is aware of, it's one's that happened to a dev 18:48:06 <|amethyst> !lm sgrunt cbro crash 18:48:07 -!- Basil has joined ##crawl-dev 18:48:07 1. [2014-01-17 00:10:37] SGrunt the Sharpshooter (L16 KoHu) ERROR in 'tags.cc' at line 3288: Invalid item: crossbow (D:13) 18:48:09 ya 18:48:10 <|amethyst> !lm sgrunt cbro !crash 18:48:10 42. [2014-01-17 00:47:26] SGrunt the Sharpshooter (L18 KoHu) killed Norris on turn 47600. (Spider:5) 18:48:23 <|amethyst> johnstein: crashes get milestones, yes 18:48:39 -!- ackack has joined ##crawl-dev 18:49:08 do they get auto reported? or is that something that needs done manually? 18:49:26 <|amethyst> the bot announces them 18:49:28 They're auto-reported. 18:49:28 meaning, not sure if I need to periodically check for these 18:49:28 <|amethyst> here 18:50:58 cool. thanks 18:51:06 which was annoying that one time lightli was scumming staff of bugginess crashes 18:51:20 !lm crashscumming 18:51:20 11. [2013-10-31 18:06:44] Crashscumming the Magician (L1 DsWz) ERROR in 'libutil.cc' at line 1022: screen write out of bounds: (1,8) into (80,7) (D:1) 18:51:22 !lm crashscumming 1 18:51:23 1/11. [2013-10-30 03:21:13] Crashscumming the Magician (L1 DsWz) ERROR in 'libutil.cc' at line 1022: screen write out of bounds: (1,8) into (80,7) (D:2) 18:51:24 !lm crashscumming 2 18:51:25 2/11. [2013-10-30 03:21:40] Crashscumming the Magician (L1 DsWz) ERROR in 'libutil.cc' at line 1022: screen write out of bounds: (1,8) into (80,7) (D:2) 18:51:27 !lm lightli crash 18:51:28 57. [2013-06-25 17:36:05] darkli the Invulnerable (L22 LOBe) ASSERT(wp->sub type == WPN BLOWGUN) in 'throw.cc' at line 864 failed on turn 60098. (Forest:3) 18:51:30 hey, I apologized: v 18:51:42 !lm race=yak 18:51:43 No milestones for geekosaur (race=yak). 18:51:47 !lm * race=yak 18:51:48 15. [2013-06-01 04:24:51] darkli the Shield-Bearer (L1 MDFi) ERROR in 'species.cc' at line 355: player of an invalid species (D:7) 18:51:59 It took me forever to die in that game 18:52:05 we noticed :p 18:52:18 -!- mutantrogue has quit [Quit: Page closed] 18:54:28 johnstein, just on a whim, I decided to see if I could do a save backup. 18:54:41 johnstein, it pointed me to http://crawl.berotato.org/crawl/saves/[...] which doesn't exist. 18:55:08 johnstein, I suspect if you create that directory and flag the appropriate accounts as devs that save backups will work :) 18:55:15 Devs are crashing crawl now. Where have all our heros gone? 18:55:16 gammafunk: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 18:55:23 !lm . crash 18:55:23