00:00:53 -!- ophanim has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:01:59 -!- Lawman0 has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:03:07 Unstable branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.14-a0-1474-g1105da3 (34) 00:05:48 Unstable branch on rl.heh.fi updated to: 0.14-a0-1474-g1105da3 (34) 00:06:35 !greatplayer . 00:06:39 Unwon species for kilobyte: Deep Elf, Demigod, Djinni, Formicid, Gargoyle, Naga, Tengu 00:06:45 !lg kilobyte ke won 00:06:46 1. KiloByte the Meteorologist (L27 KeAE), worshipper of Ashenzari, escaped with the Orb and 21 runes on 2011-04-06 10:58:48, with 10325965 points after 169363 turns and 19:06:54. 00:06:56 ...so DE, Dg, Na apparelty. 00:07:05 *apparently 00:07:18 yeah, Sequell probably should include Ke as crace of Te 00:07:23 it was a pure rename 00:07:35 Makes sense. 00:07:37 I don't think trunk races should be excluded, though 00:08:15 Gr is in stable, too 00:08:23 Oh, right. 00:16:03 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.14-a0-1474-g1105da3 (34) 00:16:21 i guess 'easy trunk win' is a good incentive to get people to test trunk 00:19:38 -!- VolteccerJack has quit [Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- Like it? Visit #hydrairc on EFNet] 00:21:23 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 00:33:40 Hey, how do I report a bug? 00:33:42 Just a minor one 00:34:09 https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/ 00:35:49 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 00:37:15 Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.14-a0-1474-g1105da3 00:39:01 -!- pelotr0n has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:40:57 -!- hurdos3 has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 00:45:57 -!- _aardvark has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 00:51:17 -!- johlstei__ has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 00:54:14 -!- Arkaniad has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 00:58:03 -!- johlstei has joined ##crawl-dev 00:59:38 -!- djanatyn has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:01:51 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 01:01:55 -!- Marbit has quit [Quit: Page closed] 01:08:09 -!- _dd has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:08:45 -!- _dd has joined ##crawl-dev 01:12:34 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 01:17:50 -!- simmarine has joined ##crawl-dev 01:21:30 -!- Yermak_ has joined ##crawl-dev 01:22:31 -!- gammafunk has joined ##crawl-dev 01:22:47 I'm standing in miasma and trying to drink lignification potion. Game gives message "You can't become a tree right now." Is miasma the reason? 01:23:32 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 01:26:34 -!- Roarke has quit [Quit: Page closed] 01:26:39 apparently 01:27:04 seems like you can't become a tree if you are in a damaging cloud 01:27:12 not sure why 01:27:28 I guess because you won't be able to move away from it, but it still seems weird to me 01:33:23 shouldn't that just be a prompt? 01:34:59 Can active stoneskin be reason for that message? 01:35:47 SamB: well, it applies even to unintentionally transforming into a tree at the moment 01:35:55 see _transformation_is_safe 01:36:15 that seems unusually forgiving 01:36:45 -!- iasov has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 01:36:51 yeah... the intention of _transformation_is_safe is to stop stuff like instadeath from drowning after a transformation 01:37:19 and clouds don't really seem to fit 01:38:33 yes, instadrowning *is* a thing we try to avoid :-) 01:46:30 -!- Tarragon is now known as Basil 01:49:11 -!- nht has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:53:53 -!- Arkaniad has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 02:01:15 Unstable branch on crawl.lantea.net updated to: 0.14-a0-1474-g1105da3 (34) 02:02:58 -!- asdu has quit [Quit: Page closed] 02:05:38 -!- Arkaniad has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 02:08:27 -!- Lawman0 has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:08:53 -!- Hailley has quit [Quit: Petra is closed!] 02:13:42 Mantis 0007858 reports that the ring of sustain abilities does't auto-id upon protection from stat loss 02:13:54 This isn't quite true, it only auto-ids when it completely protects stat loss 02:14:18 But auto-id when even partially protecting seems a good idea 02:14:30 Perhaps also with a "you resist" message 02:14:47 Or you partially resist, I suppose 02:18:01 -!- Bege_ has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 02:20:56 -!- Zeor has quit [Quit: unt] 02:21:02 -!- eith has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:21:42 -!- yogaFLAME has quit [] 02:29:25 -!- tksquared_ has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 03:03:35 -!- Giomancer has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:03:45 -!- lobf has quit [Quit: lobf] 03:15:16 -!- blabber_ has quit [Quit: leaving] 03:16:56 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:23:08 -!- RedFeather has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90.1 [Firefox 25.0.1/20131112160018]] 03:25:40 -!- Zephryn has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 03:32:47 -!- simmarine has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:35:18 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:35:33 -!- dtsund has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:41:52 gammafunk: that would probably be a good idea, yes ... 03:44:42 -!- ZChris13 has joined ##crawl-dev 03:48:35 -!- conted has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 03:52:48 -!- ZChris13 has quit [Disconnected by services] 03:52:51 -!- ZChris13_ has joined ##crawl-dev 03:52:59 -!- ZChris13_ is now known as ZChris13 03:55:31 Dazzling spray self-target is buggy by pubby 04:05:19 -!- nubcakes has quit [Quit: Page closed] 04:05:41 -!- tabstorm has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 04:09:23 -!- tkappleton has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 04:11:49 -!- minqmay has quit [Quit: Leaving] 04:11:52 -!- ZChris13 has quit [Disconnected by services] 04:11:57 -!- ZChris13_ has joined ##crawl-dev 04:12:06 -!- ZChris13_ is now known as ZChris13 04:32:02 -!- dagonfive has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 04:33:39 -!- mikee_ has quit [Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- The alternative IRC client] 04:40:34 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:49:17 elliptic: in my testing, getting transformed into a tree by a cloud of chaos effect means certain death, and this happens pretty often 04:50:08 same inside clouds of cold or flame, although it's pretty hard to get zapped by polymorph while going through a cloud 04:50:50 this check did not have intentional transformation in mind, though 04:53:03 -!- eith has joined ##crawl-dev 05:13:50 -!- Basil has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:14:56 -!- djanatyn has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 05:28:16 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 05:41:06 -!- magicpoints has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 05:45:24 -!- gammafunk has quit [Quit: gammafunk] 05:46:54 -!- dpeg has joined ##crawl-dev 05:48:15 -!- heteroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:53:11 -!- heteroy has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 05:58:31 03kilobyte02 07* 0.14-a0-1475-g6956961: Teach tiledef_lint about TILEG_ defs. 10(29 minutes ago, 2 files, 45+ 11-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=695696114f0d 05:58:31 03kilobyte02 07* 0.14-a0-1476-gc0f1bd7: Delete the tile and def for Extension. 10(22 minutes ago, 2 files, 0+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=c0f1bd7098a5 05:58:31 03kilobyte02 07* 0.14-a0-1477-ge167506: Link the tile for Trog's Hand. 10(19 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 0-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=e16750637c0e 05:58:31 03kilobyte02 07* 0.14-a0-1478-ge60c47f: Rename the tile for dragon to fire_dragon. 10(15 minutes ago, 4 files, 2+ 2-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=e60c47f81cf4 05:58:31 03kilobyte02 07* 0.14-a0-1479-g479134f: Move the tavern tile to UNUSED/, drop spell school "tiles". 10(8 minutes ago, 16 files, 0+ 15-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=479134f87f10 06:12:53 -!- scummos__ has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 06:20:38 -!- ldf has quit [Quit: ldf] 06:30:51 -!- jeanjacques has joined ##crawl-dev 06:32:37 -!- conted has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 06:36:29 -!- Bege__ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 06:38:49 -!- evilmike has joined ##crawl-dev 06:44:55 -!- st_ has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 06:45:32 -!- Hailley has quit [Quit: Petra is closed!] 06:50:22 Daniel (L5 DjGl) ERROR in 'tileweb.cc' at line 215: Socket write error: Resource temporarily unavailable (D:2) 06:50:23 thowas (L16 SpEn) ERROR in 'tileweb.cc' at line 215: Socket write error: Resource temporarily unavailable (Lair:2) 06:50:24 ghwc (L12 HEFE) ERROR in 'tileweb.cc' at line 231: Socket write error: Interrupted system call (Lair:2) 06:51:50 -!- maahes has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 07:04:38 -!- poopfist42 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:08:16 -!- dpeg has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 07:20:20 -!- Bloax has joined ##crawl-dev 07:23:38 -!- Kaput has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 07:38:50 -!- yxhuvud has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:45:49 -!- athos is now known as Guest70147 07:50:31 -!- Guest70147 has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 07:53:01 -!- dagonfive1 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:55:13 -!- Wahaha has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:15:19 -!- magicpoints has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:15:50 -!- sprort has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:20:43 -!- Marbit has joined ##crawl-dev 08:22:53 -!- Porost_ is now known as Porost 08:30:10 New species: insectoids by Marbit 08:31:21 not yet there, I still need to upload the tile 08:34:51 -!- sdurant has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 08:36:07 -!- Marbit has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 08:37:26 -!- Quashie has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 08:37:37 -!- heteroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:40:12 -!- tensorpudding has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 08:42:46 -!- heteroy has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 08:47:05 -!- dondy is now known as dondy|afk 08:47:19 -!- tsohg has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:47:36 -!- heteroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:50:04 -!- Kellhus has quit [Quit: Page closed] 08:50:31 -!- heteroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:52:21 -!- tsohg has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 08:56:53 -!- heteroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:59:49 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:02:46 -!- heteroy has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 09:10:33 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 09:18:19 -!- ackack has joined ##crawl-dev 09:27:53 -!- Koolguydude has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90.1 [Firefox 26.0/20131205075310]] 09:30:51 harmless warning building with gcc 4.8 by geekosaur 09:33:34 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 09:33:43 -!- DrinkMachine has quit [Changing host] 09:33:43 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 10:05:11 -!- heteroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:05:15 -!- tsohg has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:09:23 -!- heteroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:10:44 -!- tsohg has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 10:12:40 -!- Giomancer has joined ##crawl-dev 10:13:30 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 10:15:16 -!- heteroy has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 10:17:38 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 10:17:43 -!- Cerpin has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 10:17:46 -!- dtsund has quit [Client Quit] 10:18:39 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 10:23:36 -!- heteroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:26:14 Monsters are able to open sealed doors 10:32:54 -!- pelotr0n is now known as pelotron 10:35:41 -!- heteroy has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 10:35:58 That's apparently intentional. 10:40:58 03kilobyte02 07* 0.14-a0-1480-gd6e826f: Delete / move to UNUSED/ a bunch of tiles. 10(4 minutes ago, 6 files, 0+ 0-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=d6e826f6ea82 10:40:58 03kilobyte02 07* 0.14-a0-1481-g3a094f2: Deuglify and enable a tile variant. 10(68 seconds ago, 2 files, 2+ 2-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=3a094f233596 10:41:25 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 10:41:43 -!- slitherrr has joined ##crawl-dev 10:42:34 where would i look for a function exposed to the lua available in rc files for a way to get a list of visible monsters? 10:43:27 -!- ackack has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:47:21 -!- heteroy has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 10:47:57 -!- DrinkMachine has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 10:54:58 -!- bh has joined ##crawl-dev 10:55:13 !seen kilobyte 10:55:14 I last saw kilobyte at Sat Dec 14 10:50:50 2013 UTC (6h 4m 23s ago) saying 'this check did not have intentional transformation in mind, though' on ##crawl-dev. 10:56:27 bh: meow? 10:59:24 -!- xnavy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:59:48 -!- xnavy has joined ##crawl-dev 11:00:31 -!- heteroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:07:06 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 11:08:36 -!- heteroy has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:09:01 -!- ZChris13 has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:11:20 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.14-a0-1481-g3a094f2 (34) 11:11:36 -!- ZChris13 has quit [Client Quit] 11:14:51 03kilobyte02 07* 0.14-a0-1482-g812152b: Enable two apparently forgotten pan lord variants. 10(18 minutes ago, 1 file, 2+ 0-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=812152b0f22f 11:14:51 03kilobyte02 07* 0.14-a0-1483-g89593df: Move sources for floor sigils to UNUSED/ 10(3 minutes ago, 78 files, 0+ 0-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=89593df69989 11:16:00 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 11:16:04 kilobyte: oh, right, chaos clouds... I knew I was forgetting a reason (probably guarding against this should be implemented in some other way though?) 11:17:21 -!- heteroy has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:18:07 or, perhaps this should guard only against involuntary transformations 11:18:48 -!- st_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:19:12 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 11:21:36 -!- oberstein has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 11:24:53 -!- Morg0th has quit [Quit: leaving] 11:41:04 -!- simmarine has joined ##crawl-dev 11:42:37 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 11:43:56 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 11:43:59 -!- DrinkMachine has quit [Changing host] 11:44:00 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 11:45:08 -!- Bloaxor has joined ##crawl-dev 11:45:29 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 11:47:02 -!- Bloax has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:47:44 -!- heteroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:48:31 -!- oberstein has joined ##crawl-dev 11:49:47 -!- Yermak_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 11:52:04 -!- UseBees has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:56:06 -!- heteroy has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:56:54 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 12:00:46 -!- Ragnor has quit [Disconnected by services] 12:01:57 -!- xnavy_ has joined ##crawl-dev 12:03:30 -!- Pacra___ has joined ##crawl-dev 12:04:54 -!- greensna1k has joined ##crawl-dev 12:05:34 -!- Pacra has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:05:34 -!- Zermako has quit [Ping timeout: 263 seconds] 12:05:37 -!- greensnark has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:05:37 -!- Kromgart has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:05:38 -!- Nakatomy has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:05:38 -!- atrodo has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:05:39 -!- Vbitz has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:05:42 -!- rossi_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:05:42 -!- bmfx has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:05:45 -!- xnavy has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:05:46 -!- Mandevil has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:05:46 -!- morik___ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:05:46 -!- Porost has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:05:50 -!- Pacra___ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:06:28 -!- greensna1k is now known as greensnark 12:07:33 -!- Pacra___ has joined ##crawl-dev 12:10:31 Changing armour is not interrupted by monsters coming into view by minmay 12:17:05 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: ["Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com"]] 12:17:10 -!- bh has quit [Quit: Page closed] 12:19:26 -!- heteroy has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:20:19 -!- xnavy_ is now known as xnavy 12:21:21 -!- Yermak has quit [Quit: Page closed] 12:21:57 -!- eith has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 12:25:33 -!- TAS-2012v has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:30:23 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 12:32:33 -!- heteroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:34:46 -!- Pacra___ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:35:41 -!- Pacra___ has joined ##crawl-dev 12:36:44 -!- Tux[Qyou] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:40:31 -!- Kromgart_ has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:41:57 -!- Pacra___ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:43:20 -!- Pacra___ has joined ##crawl-dev 12:43:38 -!- Marbit has joined ##crawl-dev 12:43:58 -!- Pacra___ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:47:26 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 12:48:43 apparently tarantellas can confuse undead/poison immune things, that seems wrong 12:48:43 -!- DrinkMachine has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:49:24 also this seems awkward to fix because AF_CONFUSE is already special-cased to work differently if the attack type is AT_SPORE, and then this would need another special case to check that it's a tarantella attack and not from chaos brand or something 12:49:44 their confusion attack isn't supposed to be poison, I don't know about spores or fungi though 12:49:54 yeah, I just assumed that they weren't using poison 12:50:04 tarantellas were meant to just have a magical confusion attack. maybe you're just confused because they are dancing spiders 12:50:05 "A small but greatly-feared spider whose venom causes even resistant victims to break into a frenzied dance. 12:50:05 " 12:50:15 i thought it was just super-poison or something 12:50:19 i guess that should be reworded 12:50:19 well whoever wrote that desc got it wrong 12:51:30 i remember that wording being chosen specifically to make it clear that it ignores rpois 12:51:44 i guess "whose attacks cause victims to break into..." will do 12:52:42 this is a pun isn't it 12:52:52 the thing about it being venom is, even if it was potent, rpois would at least reduce the duration I think. Which would maybe be ok 12:54:39 I'd prefer to just have it not have anything to do with rPois 12:54:53 better to have more monsters in spider that don't check rPois 12:55:27 -!- Ladykiller69 has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:56:09 -!- Kellhus has quit [Quit: Page closed] 12:56:32 Ignoring rPois makes (enough) sense theme wise. Ignoring poison immunity/being undead not so much. 12:56:47 %git ac0c93165 12:56:47 07Keskitalo02 * 0.8.0-a0-493-gac0c931: Implement tarantella for Spider's Nest. 10(3 years, 5 months ago, 8 files, 32+ 8-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=ac0c93165220 12:56:58 "The confusion bite is non-poisonous" 12:57:07 haha 12:57:33 i always thought it was rpois confusion too, thinking undead were immune 12:57:43 (that's also the commit that added the current description though, so who knows) 12:58:07 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: CADENZA-CLASS CLOCKWORK KNIGHT--OPERATION TERMINATED] 12:58:48 rename it to hypnospider :p 12:58:58 as it works currently it's (slightly) more consistent with spore AF_CONFUSE at least, too (the only difference is messaging and that unbreathing makes you immune to spores) 12:59:31 (and spore attacks reducing the monster's HD for whatever on earth reason that happens) 12:59:54 -!- RedFeather has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90.1 [Firefox 25.0.1/20131112160018]] 13:00:40 MarvinPA: well, that happens to make wandering mushrooms disappear after enough attacks 13:01:07 03Medar02 07* 0.14-a0-1484-g31eb132: Support show_game_turns in WebTiles 10(21 hours ago, 5 files, 20+ 4-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=31eb1322e61a 13:01:07 03Medar02 07* 0.14-a0-1485-g4fae1cc: Fix HP/MP being displayed as increase on join 10(9 hours ago, 1 file, 4+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=4fae1cc02d97 13:01:07 03Medar02 07* 0.14-a0-1486-g37fbb75: Remove remaining traces of tile_force_regenerate_levels 10(9 hours ago, 3 files, 0+ 9-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=37fbb7547085 13:01:15 right, it sort of retroactively makes sense now fedhas exists but i don't understand why it existed in the first place :P 13:01:37 oh, it predates fedhas? 13:01:39 I didn't know that 13:01:41 i'm pretty sure, yeah 13:07:20 wait I don't think tarantella bite ignores poison immunity... 13:07:36 oh wait I'm wrong, I read that wrong 13:11:16 -!- NilsBloodaxe has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.2.0 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/] 13:16:43 -!- SkaryMonk1 has joined ##crawl-dev 13:16:58 -!- SkaryMonk has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 13:17:58 -!- Guest97056 has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 13:18:05 -!- Wensley has joined ##crawl-dev 13:18:29 -!- Wensley is now known as Guest74017 13:26:30 -!- Sequell has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:27:02 -!- Sequell has joined ##crawl-dev 13:27:11 -!- djanatyn has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 13:29:40 -!- Nightbeer is now known as Ladykiller69 13:30:25 -!- kryft has joined ##crawl-dev 13:31:10 Should no_dark_brand be in the options guide? 13:32:19 -!- ShadeTornado has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:32:22 -!- popx has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 13:32:22 -!- imantor has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 13:32:23 -!- kryft_ has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 13:33:37 any option that does anything should be in the options guide 13:35:08 -!- rossi_ has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.2] 13:36:56 -!- kekekela has quit [Quit: Page closed] 13:36:59 Well, hopefully someone who understands that one will add it then :) 13:37:46 Looked through them all really fast, and couldn't find anything else that wasn't just for development. 13:38:06 (suppress_startup_errors, map_file_name, fsim_*) 13:38:26 Oh, and arena options... 13:40:07 -!- ophanim is now known as maxmay 13:40:29 -!- dtsund has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:41:07 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 13:41:33 -!- dtsund has quit [Client Quit] 13:41:56 -!- Sky__ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 13:43:10 -!- dondy|afk is now known as dondy 13:44:54 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:44:57 -!- MaxFrost has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:46:41 -!- eith has joined ##crawl-dev 13:46:58 the tarantella discussion reminds me of the sleep/frenzy/etc. needle discussion 13:47:15 since we opted to make those poisons not relate to rpois at all, it makes total sense for tarantellas to do the same 13:47:33 do the needles work on undead? 13:48:20 well, undead can't sleep or frenzy anyway 13:48:31 i guess they can be paralyzed 13:51:29 -!- bh has quit [Client Quit] 13:53:19 -!- st_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:53:45 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 13:59:10 -!- Zermako2 is now known as Zermako 14:02:41 and confused 14:05:34 what do the undead do instead of sleeping again? 14:12:58 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 14:15:33 -!- DrinkMachine has joined ##crawl-dev 14:18:26 -!- ackack has joined ##crawl-dev 14:18:30 dormant 14:19:27 -!- RiotInferno1 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:21:36 you know dormant isn't a verb 14:21:44 ITYM "lie dormant" or so 14:22:30 They procrastinate. 14:23:34 no, no, that's *us* 14:25:54 03Medar02 07* 0.14-a0-1487-gd1286f7: Run game_data JavaScript in strict mode 10(6 minutes ago, 18 files, 48+ 67-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=d1286f78e36e 14:26:06 ??rebuild 14:26:06 rebuild[1/1]: http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rebuild/ https://dobrazupa.org/rebuild/ http://crawl.lantea.net/rebuild http://rl.heh.fi/rebuild/ Bug kilobyte, |amethyst, or Napkin for CDO. Use your powers wisely. 14:26:25 -!- reaverbot has joined ##crawl-dev 14:26:44 Let's see if I broke things. 14:32:12 Unstable branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.14-a0-1487-gd1286f7 (34) 14:33:47 -!- bonghitz has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 14:34:33 -!- heteroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:37:02 -!- djanatyn has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:38:30 -!- pelotron has quit [Quit: ~Internet()] 14:42:31 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 14:45:18 -!- pythonsnake has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 14:46:30 SamB: dormance 14:46:45 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 14:49:10 -!- heteroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:49:56 I'm thinking about making a patch to make handle_time() not stupid. Any objections/better suggestions to just writing if (one_chance_in(20)){ in front of everything that's currently handled every twenty turns? 14:51:08 reaverbot: if it were that simple, we would probably have done it already :) 14:51:23 getting hell effect 2 turns in a row is probably not acceptable 14:51:42 So I'll need to add something to make sure the time is spread out. 14:51:47 yeah 14:52:28 need some kind of scheduler, which keeps track of when each thing happened last or when it will happen next 14:52:57 I'm thinking that each time a effect is called, there's 5d7 delay, before it's called again. 14:53:00 and use random_range to randomize the frequency within some reasonable margin 14:53:27 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 14:53:49 yeah, 5d7 can work too 14:54:08 Any suggestions on how to implement this? I think I could do it with classes and such, but it doesn't seem like the best tool. 14:55:10 a class might be overkill, unless you want to redesign all the time system :) 14:55:38 -!- dpeg has joined ##crawl-dev 14:55:43 !seen MarvinPA 14:55:43 I last saw MarvinPA at Sat Dec 14 19:01:41 2013 UTC (1h 54m 2s ago) saying 'i'm pretty sure, yeah' on ##crawl-dev. 14:55:51 galehar: That's what I thought too, but I don't know C++ well enough to see the non-overkill option I should be using. 14:56:10 MarvinPA: competent thread handling on tavern :) 14:56:24 Marbit: I think your species has potential. 14:56:38 or not. if you like OO programming a simple class can work too. 14:57:58 maybe a queue of events. Each event has a trigger time and an enum to identify it 14:58:05 that is quite nice to hear dpeg 14:58:18 I'm open to sugestions : ) 14:58:36 <|amethyst> priority queue that is 14:58:44 I've always wanted to contribute a little to this game that I love so much 14:59:10 reaverbot: now that I think about it, using an event class would make it easier to expand it to handle more stuff 14:59:22 what happens if insectoid mutations take your stats negative 14:59:31 -11 int would kill a berserker I think? 14:59:52 evilmike: yes, that's the first thing I thought too. Killed by level up :/ 15:00:45 maybe the bad stat should get a divider instead 15:01:41 basing it around stats might not work anyway as long as stats in crawl are imbalanced. The +int ones will be the best 15:02:59 galehar: So I'll build a class, have the effects be class inheriting from it, than call a function on each effect which handles checking if the effect should trigger and setting the delay until it triggers again? (Or use a min priority queue to figure out which effects need to be called next) 15:03:00 as far as I know negative stats don't kill you but give you a lot of negative stuff. 15:03:31 negative stats cause random paralysis and cripple you. that's not survivable in the long term 15:04:49 there's no random paralysis anymore but they halve your speed and definitely aren't something you could live with, yeah 15:05:47 reaverbot: something like that. Although if your queue is a priority queue, you don't have to go through it all. Trigger events until you find one which trigger hasn't expired yet. 15:06:17 galehar: Yeah, that's what I meant. 15:06:19 Well some dangerous classes like berserk should not be recomended 15:06:33 anyway, you don't get to -7 until lvl 15 15:06:45 at that point you should be able to join chi 15:06:48 chei 15:07:17 or use items that help you 15:08:16 Players can also prevent stat death by droping points in the dangerous stat 15:08:21 it doesnt solve the problem of gaining penalties as you level up though. a +str -int insectoid is going to get weaker unless you happened to roll a berserker. str is nice but int is gamechanging 15:08:59 if you look at other races that can get some drawbacks as they level, they generally come early and are minor (draconians) or are always offset by something much stronger (draconians, demonspawn) 15:09:04 or if you roll that combination go for trog 15:09:09 Marbit: There's also this problem: +Int on a fighter? ^qyes . I don't think 3 levels are enough to prevent start scumming, particularly when this species levels up extra fast. 15:09:16 i don't think adapting to -11 int on a spellcasting background is likely to be interesting 15:09:46 no, at the third level you get the bad mutation, not the good one 15:09:59 you won't know the good stat until lvl 6 15:10:23 but at lvl 3 you know what you shouldn't invest at 15:10:31 adapting to a a bad apt on a draconian or a certain mutation on a demonspawn is one thing but huge stat penalties are a lot bigger than those 15:10:44 using stats here just isn't going to work. if you want a caste based mutation system like this, consider splitting it up into mutations that explicitly affect spellcasting, melee, evasion, etc 15:10:51 Marbit: Currently your OP on the Tavern thread says this "Right now the player knows which is going to be the low stat at level 3 and the bad stat at level 6." I was confused. 15:10:55 insectoid mutations? 15:11:04 for draconians the thing you might have to avoid investing in is maybe one school of elemental magic 15:11:07 waps, mistake 15:11:08 is this about formicids? 15:11:09 sorry 15:11:18 it doesn't matter when the player finds out, or how they can adapt, etc. The problem is that crawl stats aren't balanced and can't really be used in this way 15:11:29 Lightli: New species Marbit made. https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=10209 15:11:51 oks, corrected 15:12:08 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 15:12:12 MarvinPA: sorry for the mistake 15:12:23 Marbit: No it isn't, look at it carefully. 15:12:26 so anyway, instead of int, you could have a "pro magic" and "anti magic" castes. as you gain levels you could get mutations that reflect that 15:12:35 e.g. +mp or whatever 15:12:55 Perhaps also grab some stuff from monstrous demonspawn. 15:13:44 hahaha those dam extra fast careless edits 15:13:48 corrected now 15:13:56 Marbit: Ok 15:14:35 Using stats is a very crude approach, but I think there is design space for "requires some flexibility" species beyond Dr and DS. 15:16:03 -!- pythonsnake has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:17:25 -!- Nakat0my has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 15:20:22 My best recommendation right now is to try the species with a flexible background and see what happens. My experience so far is good. 15:21:26 -!- heteroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:24:22 -!- Marbit_ has joined ##crawl-dev 15:25:15 -!- Marbit has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 15:25:42 Marbit: you should consider something other than a non-magic/magic split, that happens to correlate somewhat with whether a character is a magicuser. 15:26:36 -!- maxmay has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:26:36 -!- Roarke has quit [Quit: Page closed] 15:27:14 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 15:27:24 for example, permanent antimagic kicks in for that caste, with the same effect on MP. however, they now regain MP when they cause MP damage, potentially a huge amount of it relative to other mana regen sources 15:27:27 -!- Pepe has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:27:52 -!- UseBees has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:28:18 so being a pure caster as the antimagic caste is hard, but a caster that evolves into one could aim for summons, or go hybrid with charms, etc. 15:30:11 yes, other mutations can come with the castes but I'd be warry of steping on the toes of demonspawns 15:30:36 the magic imbued caste gets a blink shield; if they're about to be hit, they might translocate away. but EV-heavy melee might actually like that, and other fighters could adapt by wearing stasis or learning to telecontrol 15:32:30 Marbit_: ds have a bunch of muts, and while each is interesting, the interactions are also pretty significant. also many of them are 'extra stuff' and won't alter how your build works too much. castes should probably just have one core build-changing effect 15:33:52 i did some thinking earlier about an elementalkin race with modes it could shift between 15:35:23 so you might be 'stuck' in the fire mode for 4 or 5 dungeon levels, and it would play differently enough from other modes that you might even need to go pick up a new skill to cope with your new mode for long enough to survive 15:36:17 mmm adding existing mutations to a caste is quite easy, I might try that latter. I'm still worried about creating a redundant demonspawn and losing the insectoid feeling. 15:37:24 Marbit_: back in the dark days of sourceforge, there was an insectoid species proposal 15:37:29 it had not just castes, but life stages 15:38:05 I'd have to locate it... perhaps I'd be able to scavenge ideas. 15:38:50 Anyway, I got to go (meal is ready). I leave this thing open to save mesages. 15:39:08 it's probably impossible to find now, but the rundown: at D1 you're a larva. maybe you can't even use weapons, but get fastmove and a poison attack. later you become a nymph. this might rule out a caste, but it doesn't decide your final one. eventually you become an adult - one might be fast and agile, one might be big and armored and slow. 15:39:35 03galehar02 07* 0.14-a0-1488-g669c75b: A french quote for simulacrum. 10(3 minutes ago, 1 file, 6+ 0-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=669c75b86331 15:40:18 it did have the interesting idea that your caste could, like bees, depend on how much royal jelly (or food more generally, or some other resource) you managed to consume 15:40:55 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:41:54 Marbit_: Insect proposal is here: http://sourceforge.net/p/crawl-ref/feature-requests/849/ 15:42:38 -!- reaverbot has left ##crawl-dev 15:43:57 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 15:44:15 this reminds me of my draconian proposal actually... back when we were considering revamps, I suggested that they should get a "hoarding" disad. you get an easily accessible stash, but you can't use consumable items until you have at least one stored in it 15:44:50 and there was the question of whether the contents of your hoard would affect what type of draconian you became 15:46:21 perhaps at L13+, you get the ability to pupate into a much stronger form, but you need to sacrifice a lot of items to do so? 15:49:25 -!- themonkeybob11 has quit [Quit: Page closed] 15:49:27 reaverbot is awesome for finding that vintage eronarn 15:49:56 probably best thing from there: 15:49:58 I think that the abilities that this race gets should be something that grow over time, but are not constant. Some insect species lose capabilities at a certain stage. I don't think we should be afraid of giving a starting ability and then taking it away eventually as long as something is given in exchange. 15:50:04 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 15:53:03 Marbit_: If you're serious about the caste idea, then development of an insectoid shouldn't be a linear progression (in either direction), imo. Rather, at certain (known) points there should be drastic changes (again in both directions). 15:55:45 -!- elliptic has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:56:24 -!- Quashie_ has quit [Ping timeout: 241 seconds] 15:56:37 dpeg : That would be quite easy to modiffy, I think it is in player-stats.cc any sugestions of how the mutations should affect the stats are welcomed. 15:57:08 @dpeg : ^ 15:57:27 Marbit_: i'd suggest trying to make the race be interesting/fun without touching stats at all. there is no race for which stats are the primary reason they're interesting 15:58:50 oh, another random reminiscence 15:59:12 <|amethyst> Eronarn: DS? 15:59:18 <|amethyst> Eronarn: err, Dg I mean 15:59:43 <|amethyst> (not to dispute your point) 15:59:57 i still 100% believe that felids should start out as frail kittens, and every time they die, they get a bit bigger until they're tremendous leonine powerhouses on their last life 16:00:23 <|amethyst> well, we have the first half of that :) 16:01:38 |amethyst: different abilities, tho. like excellent stealth early on, vs. a roar breath weapon and leaping later 16:02:27 -!- ackack has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:02:37 as for Dg, I'd say no god is the primary reason they're *interesting*, and high stats/hp/mp is secondary 16:03:12 if they had some other drawback, like elemental vulns or something, they'd be good but not nearly as interesting 16:03:25 <|amethyst> true 16:04:54 -!- tsohg has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:07:43 -!- tsohg has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:08:14 -!- heteroy has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 16:21:31 -!- ColdPie has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 16:22:38 -!- flappity has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 16:33:15 -!- WalkerBoh has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:35:08 -!- RedFeather has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90.1 [Firefox 25.0.1/20131112160018]] 16:35:13 -!- ackack has joined ##crawl-dev 16:36:31 also one hour late but thanks for finding that crazy insect propossal reaverbot : ) 16:41:15 -!- Marbit_ has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 16:43:28 03ChrisOelmueller02 {|amethyst} 07* 0.14-a0-1489-g45d68be: Remove another vestige of racial ammunition. 10(2 hours ago, 1 file, 0+ 31-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=45d68bea2490 16:44:05 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 16:45:43 03|amethyst02 07* 0.14-a0-1490-g557b64f: Fix compilation (oops) 10(31 seconds ago, 1 file, 0+ 2-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=557b64fc5d47 16:45:46 <|amethyst> sorry, should have compiled before committing that 16:45:54 <|amethyst> s/committing/pushing/ 16:51:28 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 16:52:05 -!- vansteen has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:55:35 -!- jameyd has quit [Client Quit] 16:58:03 -!- tsohg_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:58:38 -!- jameyd has quit [Client Quit] 16:59:56 -!- jameyd has quit [Client Quit] 17:00:07 -!- Basil has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 17:00:16 -!- Stelpa has quit [Changing host] 17:00:39 -!- jameyd has quit [Client Quit] 17:00:43 would anyone object to letting octopodes wear helmets? i was the only person in favor of that when they were being designed, and it was purely based on whether i thought it made sense for one to fit them. in retrospect, this was dumb as heck 17:01:35 they could balance one on their head just as easily as a hat if you want to think of them as wearing them that way, and if you want to think of them as squeezing into a cap, they can certainly do that for a helmet too 17:01:54 OpWz nerf! 17:02:19 -!- jameyd has quit [Client Quit] 17:02:25 ??octopode[2] 17:02:25 octopode[2/3]: For four days in 2012, octopodes had eight times the normal squeeze damage (96 instead of 12), allowing them to one-shot greater mummies (among others) with ease. Introduced, and then ruined, by |amethyst; rest in peace. 17:02:28 ??octopode[3] 17:02:28 octopode[3/3]: http://robertbowenart.com/wp-content/themes/RobertBowenArt/images/The-Guardian.jpg 17:02:46 -!- tsohg has quit [Ping timeout: 241 seconds] 17:03:22 -!- jameyd has quit [Client Quit] 17:03:38 i originally envisioned octopodes as being large enough that ^ wouldn't work, but in retrospect, the proportions i gave for them were ridiculous 17:06:34 -!- evilmike has quit [] 17:19:54 -!- CKyle has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:21:08 -!- gammafunk has joined ##crawl-dev 17:22:26 -!- tsohg has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:23:37 03ChrisOelmueller02 {|amethyst} 07* 0.14-a0-1491-gd685df5: Simplify 10(12 days ago, 1 file, 10+ 12-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=d685df519251 17:23:37 03ChrisOelmueller02 {|amethyst} 07* 0.14-a0-1492-g5cab4ca: Remove message that was special-cased for little gain 10(2 days ago, 1 file, 1+ 4-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=5cab4caea261 17:23:37 03ChrisOelmueller02 {|amethyst} 07* 0.14-a0-1493-g27cf72f: Shorten a colour tag in hints mode formatted string 10(31 hours ago, 1 file, 1+ 4-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=27cf72f2aed1 17:23:37 03|amethyst02 07* 0.14-a0-1494-gf2f48c5: Comment an unintuitive backslash. 10(12 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 0-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=f2f48c583932 17:23:37 03ChrisOelmueller02 {|amethyst} 07* 0.14-a0-1495-g033cea4: Whitespace (cherry picked from commit 90afa1c4158637a5295dd5acd33c680158db0885) 10(2 days ago, 3 files, 4+ 4-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=033cea43e675 17:24:04 <|amethyst> oops 17:24:12 <|amethyst> forgot not to use -x on the last one 17:24:49 For 0007858, which is sustain ab not auto-iding when resisting stat drain, the issue seems to be that it only auto-ids when it fully resists stat drain 17:24:55 But not when e.g it reduces it 17:25:09 Would a good fix be to print a 'you resist' message and auto-id in that situation as well? 17:25:18 From forum: let noisy weapon only make noise when (un 17:25:32 )equipped or hitting. (evilmike) 17:25:59 I think the Singing Sword should still give no-tension messages at times, but these should generate without noise. 17:26:09 Any opinionS? 17:28:45 -!- nubcakes has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 17:28:52 <|amethyst> gammafunk: also, didn't we remove the "only unided ring" requirement from other things? 17:29:20 |amethyst: I'm not sure what you mean. 17:29:30 -!- st_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:29:54 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 17:29:58 <|amethyst> gammafunk: see lose_stat... besides any other issues, it only identifies the ring if it's your only unided ring 17:30:16 <|amethyst> gammafunk: but IIRC we removed that check for other things 17:30:25 <|amethyst> maybe I'm misremembering though 17:31:38 |amethyst: Well I do see that the only call to get_only_unided_ring that exists is in lose_stat 17:31:50 And that does seem like an unecessary restriction 17:31:56 <|amethyst> yeah... there does seem to be a similar check for amulets of warding still 17:32:23 <|amethyst> (it doesn't ID if you're wielding staff of summoning) 17:33:21 <|amethyst> but the corresponding checks were removed from _maybe_id_jewel 17:33:56 Yeah, it seems to me that allowing the amulet to id even with staff of summoning is fine 17:34:11 "Your amulet sparkles briefly!" 17:34:41 !seen evilmike 17:34:41 I last saw evilmike at Sat Dec 14 23:06:34 2013 UTC (28m 7s ago) quitting. 17:34:46 !seen elliptic 17:34:46 I last saw elliptic at Sat Dec 14 21:55:45 2013 UTC (1h 39m 1s ago) quitting, saying 'Quit: Leaving'. 17:35:09 Although I don't know if that violates conventions for other identification situations 17:35:16 <|amethyst> gammafunk: I don't think I'd even print a message 17:35:23 <|amethyst> gammafunk: since you'll get the ID message anyway 17:35:41 Yeah, that makes sense 17:35:44 <|amethyst> gammafunk: and you probably don't want to add an extra message *every* time it wards 17:36:05 Right, I was thinking more for sustab, which triggers much less often 17:36:45 But even with sustab I could also see not printing anything 17:37:24 I think for the elemental resists it's probably more important to remind the player consistently since, those elemental attacks can be very common 17:38:21 dpeg: The proposal is to make noise with noisy weapons only when wielding, unwielding, or attacking with it? 17:40:24 -!- Marbit has quit [Quit: Page closed] 17:41:00 -!- Marbit has joined ##crawl-dev 17:41:25 -!- MaxFrost has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 17:43:09 -!- jameyd has quit [Quit: leaving] 17:47:35 gammafunk: yes! 17:47:44 gammafunk: so that players don't have to swap them all the time 17:48:19 Yeah, that does seem like a good change. I suppose the ones that are always noisy could labeled Noisy++, but that doesn't work well 17:48:59 yes 17:49:43 anyway, it's evilmike's suggestion -- I just present it here 17:49:56 anyone care to pick it up, else I turn it into an implementable 17:50:05 -!- Tux[Qyou] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:51:27 -!- ShadeTornado has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:51:39 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 17:52:17 |amethyst: Looks like Wahaha issue is missing var on game.js:202 17:52:33 Only happens if you have cookie settings 17:53:02 I'm not on the right computer, so can't commit 17:53:06 dpeg: i had a look at the singing sword earlier after seeing that thread (making the noises only actually be noisy when there's tension), can probably push that in a bit 17:53:18 i agree that it'd be good for noisy to work that way in general too 17:53:37 <|amethyst> Medar: ah, for (var key...) you mean, right? 17:53:45 Yes 17:55:25 03Medar02 {|amethyst} 07* 0.14-a0-1496-g7c3aa6d: Fix a client-side webtiles error. 10(88 seconds ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=7c3aa6d53738 17:55:37 Thanks 17:56:06 -!- bmfx has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:56:33 MarvinPA: thanks for looking into this! The forum produces a number of good ideas, and I am often not competent enough to reply. For example, what do you think about Singing Sword damage? 17:56:34 Unstable branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.14-a0-1496-g7c3aa6d (34) 17:57:04 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 17:57:14 I know that kilobyte is worried about overpoweredness... then I read how players say it is unusable :O (I realise that one problem is with players always expecting stuff to last until you go for the orb.) 17:57:27 i'm not sure about the damage, yeah 17:57:54 at a glance it looks like it ought to be pretty okay in high tension but i'd have to play with it a bit to see really 17:58:09 <|amethyst> dpeg: Not to be a jerk, but kilobyte's ideas about balance are as bad as mine sometimes :) 17:58:34 I wouldn't mind changing the base type or enchantment, or add an ego -- I just have no clue :) 17:59:04 |amethyst: same for me! It's really good to have folks like MarvinPA, elliptic and evilmike around. 17:59:27 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:59:34 <|amethyst> dpeg: even if it does mean we get accused of catering to elite players 17:59:54 <|amethyst> really we cater to elite players who have shown a good undertanding of the game's balance 18:00:28 one vaguely notable thing is that you can run into the singing sword in a fairly early vault (unless the vault has changed, i don't think it has) 18:01:05 so it's more likely than most unrands to show up early and hopefully be useful, even if it's no use very late 18:01:16 <|amethyst> MarvinPA: yeah, I think that was one of the reasons kilobyte mentioned for it being OP 18:01:32 <|amethyst> MarvinPA: that it didn't need nerfed if it appears so early 18:01:41 <|amethyst> s/nerfed/buffed/ 18:01:45 <|amethyst> (so early so frequently) 18:03:40 |amethyst: no, the point is that these three are not just really good players, but they do design. That's the difference to top players ranting on the forum. 18:03:54 <|amethyst> Medar: hm... Wahaha got a stale process message when e reconnected; not sure if it's because Crawl kept running after the client-side crash but that would be my guess 18:04:06 Sounds about right 18:04:14 <|amethyst> dpeg: that's what I meant 18:04:39 Or he just forgot to close it in another browser first 18:05:28 <|amethyst> dpeg: They're good players *because* of their good understanding of mechanics and game design 18:05:29 -!- nubcakes_ has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 18:05:54 <|amethyst> dpeg: other people may be good players for different reasons 18:06:51 <|amethyst> (and conversely people with a good understanding may have other reasons for not being a good player) 18:08:12 <|amethyst> dpeg: but I think there is at least some positive correlation, which is part of the reason that perception (that we cater to elites) exists 18:08:31 <|amethyst> I don't know how widespread a perception it actually is 18:08:36 I don't really think that we cater to our best players :) 18:09:14 <|amethyst> I don't either 18:09:25 In some ways, the game got easier. Sure, in others it got harder, but I think that for someone who is unable to abuse things (e.g. an unspoiled newbie), it is easier than it used to be. 18:09:29 But I really hope that Formicids make it into the next release! 18:09:44 oops, that was unintentional (but I do hope it) 18:10:09 <|amethyst> I'm just trying to understand why some people think that, without doing what I'm inclined to do and call them "whiners" 18:10:49 -!- Brokkr has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:12:07 -!- bonghitz has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 18:12:17 just call them whiners -- players are bound to be unhappy about nerfs, and one way to express this is "they only have top players in mind" (another fave is "now they really lost it") 18:14:38 <|amethyst> you're right, that probably is most of it 18:15:16 -!- reaverbot has joined ##crawl-dev 18:15:30 has nothing to do with Crawl, I've seen it elsewhere too 18:15:56 -!- nubcakes has quit [Quit: Page closed] 18:16:00 <|amethyst> on a mostly unrelated note, Extra Credits is in the middle of a three-part series on how the U.S. political system is broken (in the game-design sense) :) 18:16:08 <|amethyst> part 2 is on Tuesday I think 18:16:38 Yeah, I love Extra Credits. 18:16:50 -!- Nakalein is now known as Nakatomy 18:20:02 |amethyst: Doesn't Extra Credis update on Wenesday's? 18:20:10 <|amethyst> maybe it was Wednesdays 18:24:45 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 18:25:31 -!- Ladykiller69 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:29:23 -!- Guest_41 has joined ##crawl-dev 18:32:03 -!- CKyle has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:32:19 -!- magicpoints has quit [Client Quit] 18:33:01 -!- Nakatomy has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 18:36:20 -!- halv has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:36:24 -!- caleba has quit [Quit: caleba] 18:36:40 <|amethyst> Eronarn: it looks like A! and the actual player_spec_fire core have slightly different ideas about when you get the fire boost (or one's looking at this turn's temp and one last turn's ?) 18:38:31 <|amethyst> Eronarn: FaMott noticed and I verified that at 16 = in the temperature bar, he got a fire boost but A! showed that in darkgrey not lightred 18:38:46 -!- tenofswords has joined ##crawl-dev 18:41:12 gotta go, see you later 18:41:26 MarvinPA: thanks for Singing Sword stuff, I have a tight bond with that item :) 18:41:31 -!- dpeg has quit [Quit: leaving] 18:41:39 <|amethyst> Eronarn: can't figure out from the code why that would be so though 18:41:55 <|amethyst> Eronarn: and it's kind of hard to test because you don't stay at the same temperature for very long 18:44:03 -!- Leafsnail has quit [Quit: It's a dud! It's a dud! It's a du...] 18:45:18 have people seen enough of the latest abyss incarnation (the one with grabbing floor layouts the player's been to and random grouped monsters from other places) 18:46:29 I think it's gone overboard in trying to address the prominence of some strategic-damage demons by injuring the identity of abyss in the first place 18:46:55 !tell dpeg eh, the Singing Sword is far closer to uselessness than overpoweredness, unless you scum the situation. And the scumming issue is bad enough to warrant a redesign or even removal, I think. 18:46:56 kilobyte: OK, I'll let dpeg know. 18:47:50 <|amethyst> tenofswords: what would be cool is if those monsters had a chance of turning into abyssal native monsters while in LOS 18:47:56 <|amethyst> tenofswords: that would be super creepy 18:48:15 <|amethyst> "the orc suddenly sprouts tentacles!" 18:49:36 yeah, I tried for something like this in putting awake shapeshifters into the set so they could become a lot of different things while wandering 18:49:58 <|amethyst> tenofswords: problem is shapeshifting doesn't cross holiness :( 18:50:16 clearly need sandestins 18:50:50 03gammafunk02 {|amethyst} 07* 0.14-a0-1497-gd0d9e2d: Remove an extra newline in death descriptions under certain conditions. 10(22 hours ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=d0d9e2db77f0 18:51:14 could have wretched stars do something more to monsters than the debilitating thing 18:52:00 fr: Allow training necromancy while having a pain weapon in your inventory. 18:52:11 but regardless the indescriminate outsiders can produce a lot of excessive things compared to sneaking them into the monster set, like the orbs of fire before the branch selection and convokers at the moment 18:52:18 tenofswords: there's just a placeholder currently; this means it waits for something to take its place 18:52:43 FR: allow training skills, full stop. 18:53:13 kilobyte: presumably only the skills you could actually see 18:53:26 also why do we list removed skills in crashdumps 18:53:51 -!- Wahaha has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:53:51 <|amethyst> kilobyte, SamB: did you see #7863 btw (redundant decl for strlcpy)? 18:54:16 hard to fix that without some configure checks 18:54:31 noisy weapons only being noisy on hit sounds great. for dpeg's singing sword comment: there are various levels of noise, so make singing sword noise level scale with tension 18:54:56 we should probably report the stuff with curses.h upstream ... 18:55:04 <|amethyst> kilobyte: hm, I guess there are no #defines for "this is a BSD system" ? 18:55:14 (I suppressed them with the "#pragma GCC diagnostic" dance) 18:55:15 Eronarn: the less we use tension for, the better -- it's inherently gameable 18:55:28 |amethyst: ugh system zoology 18:55:54 also can we fix tension so that we don't have to worry about stuff like 'is singing sword damage OP' 18:56:13 <|amethyst> kilobyte: "zoology" implies they're all the same kingdom. We support Windows too 18:56:18 <|amethyst> kilobyte: :) 18:56:39 kilobyte: hah, I was reading backlog while typing my last line :) 18:57:10 I think the pulling of branch populations is going to be problematic regardless of implementation and I would like to some more default-abyss-set tweaks followed by cutting the idea 18:57:23 it's fine if tension is gameable. consider that something as fundamental as our LOS metric is gameable - and not even evenly across characters, but benefiting some more than others 18:57:27 fr: the ability to lock in a spell that veh offers you because missing good spells is terrible 18:57:38 yeah, Windows doesn't belong to the same continuum. A question "is this system BSD" is pretty fuzzy: you have OS X on one side, and GNU/kfreebsd on the other. 18:58:00 it just needs to have clearly defined limits on what is achievable by gaming it, and how much effort you'd have to put in to get there 18:58:26 <|amethyst> kilobyte: yeah, I meant "is this a BSD libc" 18:58:40 <|amethyst> which is still somewhat fuzzy 18:59:02 |amethyst: not sure what's up with the temperature bar - maybe there's a rounding error in the display? or maybe i have a > vs. >= somewhere? 18:59:07 and the only reason glibc doesn't have strlcpy() is Ulrich Drepper's irrational hatred towards it 18:59:18 <|amethyst> Eronarn: I didn't see either of those, which is the weird thing 18:59:44 |amethyst: perhaps for wizmode, there should be lock/unlock current tension + set tension commands (both 0-time) 18:59:58 er, temperature, not tension (i guess it'd be good for tension too though) 19:03:56 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 19:05:25 -!- reaverbot has left ##crawl-dev 19:07:12 <|amethyst> kilobyte: Any reason not to put it into our current configuration script? 19:07:21 -!- scummos__ has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 19:07:35 <|amethyst> kilobyte: For now I mean, until we find a real solution 19:07:50 <|amethyst> Unfortunately I don't have any relevant systems to test it on 19:12:21 <|amethyst> kilobyte: we do still have a few uses of strncpy (and one I added recently) 19:12:47 <|amethyst> kilobyte: the one I added in cio.cc places a nul, the other two don't 19:13:08 <|amethyst> kilobyte: I hadn't realised we had our own strlcpy 19:15:45 -!- tsohg has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:17:35 -!- heteroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:18:44 -!- jameyd has quit [Quit: leaving] 19:19:40 <|amethyst> Thoughts on renaming "fighter" to "knight" ? The idea being that it is more descriptive to new players, and in particular implies they are a more defensive class than gladiator? 19:19:44 <|amethyst> s/?$/ 19:19:48 <|amethyst> / 19:20:38 -!- tsohg has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 19:22:41 -!- UseBees has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:25:58 -!- johlstei_ has joined ##crawl-dev 19:26:22 why would a knight be more defensive? 19:28:15 -!- johlstei has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:28:53 -!- Crehl has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:31:26 -!- dondy has quit [Quit: ninja kapow] 19:31:43 -!- CampinSam has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.8] 19:39:46 more heavily armored 19:40:02 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: CADENZA-CLASS CLOCKWORK KNIGHT--OPERATION TERMINATED] 19:40:17 just make the commit "Remove Fighters. Add Knights in their place" 19:40:56 why not just modiffy the description of the class 19:40:59 ? 19:41:20 |amethyst: what about all the other knights 19:41:30 Atheist Knight 19:42:03 -!- Aryth has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:42:11 warlord :p 19:42:49 -!- gammafunk has quit [Quit: gammafunk] 19:42:58 actually I think it is fine as it is. It says that gladiators use light armour whereas fighters use armour and shield 19:43:53 -!- master_j has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.2] 19:47:16 -!- tsohg has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:49:17 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: ["Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com"]] 19:51:01 -!- Daekdroom has quit [Quit: Saindo] 19:52:26 -!- tsohg has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 19:53:57 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:00:48 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 20:10:56 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 20:18:33 -!- myrmidette1 has quit [Client Quit] 20:20:46 -!- gammafunk has joined ##crawl-dev 20:26:52 how many different possible DL1s are there? 20:27:21 huh 20:27:24 is it something low like 32768 or is it more like billions? 20:27:36 what counts as the definition of dl1 20:27:58 assume im playing the latest stable release 20:28:02 like, layouts plus vaults? that'd be pretty ridiculous 20:28:06 yeah 20:28:10 and i make a human fighter 20:28:41 what rng does crawl use? 20:29:34 219 entry vaults, 20:29:50 (ignoring any randomization inside said vaults) 20:31:18 oh, this is what i was looking for: https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=6871&p=96209#p96085 20:31:43 25 regular vaults, 6 serial vaults... 20:31:58 oh you just mean rng bleh 20:32:07 Many vault clouds fail to autoexclude by minmay 20:32:32 Is it 0-2 regular vaults each gen? Or 0-1 because it includes the entry? 20:33:02 some of those regular and serial vaults are tagged as extra so that's not an easy question to answer 20:33:14 -!- clouded_ has joined ##crawl-dev 20:33:39 -!- st_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:33:47 -!- clouded_ is now known as st_ 20:36:30 tenofswords: what i was really wondering is if it was possible to predict level layout after seeing only a small portion of the level 20:36:40 i geuss the answer now is: probably now 20:36:44 *not 20:36:50 oh, pff 20:37:06 you could predict a few things from just understanding layout code, strictly speaking 20:37:42 such as? 20:37:59 ...said level layout 20:38:26 example? 20:39:13 not that it's valid on d:1, but one can guess the rough shape of the simplest layouts aside from vaults: the cross levels and the octagon levels 20:39:38 unless you think you can memorize every single vault in the game 20:39:46 * tenofswords coughs 20:39:54 -!- wheals has joined ##crawl-dev 20:40:03 There aren't /that/ many of them. 20:40:03 would be much harder to memorize the randomization for each vault 20:40:05 rast: there are patterns in some layouts 20:40:27 even the not-too-patterned ones have certain tendancies 20:40:30 tenofswords: well sure but that doesnt count 20:40:38 then i'm stupid and who cares 20:41:02 -!- Zermako has quit [Quit: good night and good night to all!] 20:41:15 i was thinking more of the rng having a very small state 20:41:20 pfff 20:41:32 how insulting! 20:41:41 so you could realistically generate every single possible dl1, then figure out which you are on just by matching 20:41:46 (though *I* didn't write it) 20:41:59 you can't 20:42:03 but according to that post it is 160-bit 20:42:04 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 20:42:27 I'm not sure if it's as hard as predicting chess, but 20:42:42 on that mantis issue: I'm tempted to suggest that ice caves should have teleporters at the end rather than placing a pile of autoexclusions throughout every ice cave 20:42:46 rast: we didn't even mention the POSITIONING of vaults, or the randomization of the layout 20:43:07 did we even cover the number of layouts possible? 20:43:08 did anyone mention subvaults 20:43:22 d:1 vaults don't really go for subvaults 20:43:27 well d:1 no 20:43:30 all of that wouldn't matter if crawl was using a 16-bit RNG or whatever 20:43:33 but if you want to predict d:1 20:43:40 you'll probably also want to predict d:2 20:43:54 "sorry people looking for a crawl TAS" 20:43:56 rast: oh, well, sure 20:44:22 with 16 bit, you'd only have about 65536 different layouts to memoriz 20:44:46 per floor 20:45:00 obviously youd pregen them all and use a computer to match 20:45:25 tenofswords: (Don't most TAS of RPGish games make heavy use of rng manipulation?) 20:45:27 im pretty sure official nethack has bad randomization problems 20:45:29 yes, and THAT would probably be practical, true 20:45:40 though the public servers have fixed it 20:46:04 it's possible that crawl has in fact used such a pathetic RNG in the past 20:46:07 yes, there's a favourite super-short TAS of mine that best shows this 20:46:19 Which one? 20:46:19 well generating every floor in the game at once would be a huge waste of resources 20:46:35 Bloaxor: but youd only have to do it once, ever 20:46:45 where the game has this one hidden item that is put anywhere in the map and you do dungeons to get hints and what not to find it 20:46:50 rast: how many times do you die on d:1-5 20:46:57 compared to d:6-zot:5 20:47:00 rast: not really, there's other state that affects the generation post-D:1 20:47:05 and thus of course the rng is exploited to make the item be right in front of the start 20:47:07 Ah, King's Bounty? 20:47:24 yes, that 20:47:34 I remember playing that a few years ago. 20:47:39 rast: including the secret plan regarding branch/altar placement 20:47:44 did you beat it in a minute 20:47:56 secret, what 20:48:04 SamB: secret plan to remove temple? 20:48:18 I beat it in an absurdly low number of turns because of Time Stopping early, but no, no miraculous human TAS. 20:48:31 (Apologies for the contradiction.) 20:48:41 if you made the actual temple be the temple vaults then sure 20:48:42 rast: I mean Crawl plans out what floors to put stuff on, and which branches to place 20:48:44 me accidentally revealing overflow temples didn't properly spawn was part of a mass conspiracy 20:48:53 but it does not tell the player any of this 20:49:33 I wonder if converting temple into large vaults to place on temple-depth levels would be better or worse 20:50:33 it would be more work for the dungeon generation 20:50:53 it would be a little bit of a nerf since usually temple is more shallow 20:50:57 It'd also make its position more obvious. 20:51:08 Because a big temple vault is pretty hard not to stumble upon. 20:51:36 "but there's more early D variety" 20:51:46 anyway, I only mentioned altars because crawl plans where to put most of them out ahead of time 20:52:32 I think it also plans which Temple to use? 20:53:12 it plans how many altars are in the temple, which restricts it because the code doesn't let you randomize altar numbers per temple 20:53:24 yeah 20:53:38 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 20:53:38 (which is a dumb restriction that causes annoying vault duplication but I have no idea how plausible it'd be to change that) 20:54:09 it *should* be doable but probably a lot of work? 20:54:23 "never" :P 20:54:29 -!- SteampunkDuck has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 20:55:39 I'm thinking it wouldn't so much randomize the number of altars in a temple but just allow one temple to offer several different numbers of altars 21:03:31 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 21:06:18 Is there a reason why electricity spells that will hit the player don't warn that they are going to hit you? 21:06:47 I just had the stupidiest death 21:08:23 -!- Marbit_ has joined ##crawl-dev 21:09:03 <|amethyst> which electricity spell? 21:09:27 <|amethyst> lightning bolt and shock definitely give warnings 21:09:58 <|amethyst> and static discharge would be very annoying if it prompted you about hitting yourself 21:10:48 chain lightning hits yourself a good part of the time too, CBL is well-known to be uncontrollable 21:10:53 <|amethyst> perhaps it is one particular situation where it doesn't warn... what happened exactly? 21:11:07 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 21:11:26 <|amethyst> disc of storms likewise 21:11:41 -!- Marbit has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 21:12:28 -!- Stelpa has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:14:45 -!- CKyle has quit [Quit: CKyle] 21:22:29 HarmlessChicken (L18 OpEE) ERROR in 'mon-movetarget.cc' at line 111: ZotDef: monster Khufu failed to pathfind to (39,26) (the Orb) (Zot (ZotDef)) 21:22:54 ...reminds me of 21:22:55 ??it[8 21:22:56 it[8/35]: Monster it failed to pathfind! 21:23:23 -!- jeanjacques has quit [Quit: quit] 21:25:09 it was the spark 21:25:27 the card from the deck of destruction 21:26:12 I'm submiting a report at mantis... it may be trivial but nontheless 21:26:28 cards don't know which spell you'll use 21:27:03 and indeed, the Spark card can be nasty 21:27:05 !hs . race=fo x=dam 21:27:08 62. [dam=102] KiloByte the Fetichist (L18 FoAr), worshipper of Nemelex Xobeh, killed themself with a badly aimed orb of electricity on Elf:1 on 2013-11-11 12:28:04, with 140098 points after 33798 turns and 3:04:07. 21:27:10 -!- Marbit has joined ##crawl-dev 21:28:49 -!- _oink_ has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:30:36 it was an orb of electricity 21:30:44 "Killed themself with a badly aimed orb of electricity" 21:31:19 -!- Marbit_ has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 21:32:46 hilarious self kill with no warning by Marbit 21:32:56 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 21:33:01 probably you were pinged out but: 21:33:12 <+kilobyte> cards don't know which spell you'll use 21:33:28 -!- Neuromancer has quit [Quit: Page closed] 21:33:51 so... it is ok that there is no warning or is it a bug? 21:33:53 But yeah just in general it is intended that you do not know what effect a card will give before it gives the effect 21:34:13 hmm, why do we color un-IDed potions the same as IDed ones? 21:34:28 I mean, the same as some IDed ones 21:34:34 SamB: an interface screw 21:34:38 SamB: you mean why do _you_ color un-IDed potions the same as IDed ones 21:34:40 SamB: and hysterical raisins 21:34:47 i fixed my rcfile 21:35:00 could at least mention in the description of flame and spark, as is done for pain and venom 21:35:01 wheals: well it might be nice to do it in the default rcfile? 21:35:10 wheals: how did you fix it? 21:35:11 I don't get what's the point in randomly colouring unknown potions, wands, rings or amulets 21:35:34 -!- sdurant has quit [Quit: Page closed] 21:35:35 anyway I guess the it was part of the randomness of Nemlex 21:35:36 kilobyte: I actually meant the names, in the inventory list 21:35:36 i coloured unid'd potions, wands, and scrolls brown (only other thing brown in inventory is chunks) 21:35:49 one moment 21:36:05 menu_colour ^= brown:^unidentified .*(potion|scroll|wand).* 21:37:09 -!- CKyle has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 21:38:58 -!- debo has quit [Quit: debo] 21:43:01 wheals: why ^ ? 21:43:05 I mean, why ^= 21:43:15 hm, not really sure why 21:43:28 i think crate advised it 21:43:38 iirc he has something similar 21:57:15 03Grunt02 07* 0.14-a0-1498-gabb0503: Consider potions of beneficial mutation to be "good items". 10(2 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 0-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=abb0503b622a 21:57:32 SamB: thanks for reminding me that I intended to do that <_< 22:00:43 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Client Quit] 22:00:43 -!- tenofswords has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:00:54 -!- Node_880 is now known as Weeksy 22:02:32 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 22:09:32 -!- asdu has quit [Quit: Page closed] 22:18:28 -!- alefury has quit [] 22:18:32 -!- heteroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:23:53 -!- Roarke has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 22:26:00 %bug 7863 22:26:00 https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=7863 22:26:24 SamB: woah, didn't know you could do that 22:28:51 -!- soundlus has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:33:23 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 22:43:24 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 22:46:42 -!- hurdos has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:47:51 -!- ackack has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:47:59 -!- CKyle has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:54:23 -!- mizu_no_oto has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 23:02:07 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 23:15:49 03SamB02 07* 0.14-a0-1499-g388a102: Color un-IDed potions/scrolls/wands brown. Thanks wheels & crate! 10(28 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 0-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=388a1026f42f 23:16:20 -!- Bloaxor has quit [Quit: Error: Bloax not found] 23:20:54 -!- Fhqwhgads_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:26:58 -!- kekekela has quit [Quit: Page closed] 23:30:49 -!- battleguy01 has quit [Quit: Page closed] 23:30:51 -!- Lawman0 has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:31:04 -!- Marbit has quit [Quit: Page closed] 23:32:32 -!- the_glow has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 23:34:39 SamB: why would you exclude unknown jewels? 23:35:36 uncertainty 23:35:51 I mean, if you think we should do them too, by all means 23:36:20 wait 23:36:22 why brown 23:36:27 because id'd jewels are all green 23:36:30 heres a cool idea: make it lightblue 23:36:32 to kb 23:36:38 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:36:39 because thats the unid color for ego 23:37:09 I've never thought about highlighting potions and such, but I do so to unknown decks 23:37:17 lightblue, incidentally 23:37:24 i highlight unid items lightblue 23:37:49 I don't particularly care about the color either 23:38:10 well imo lightblue is perfect since there is already precedent! 23:38:14 and we cdo like $unIDd 23:38:21 +ould 23:38:53 i mean its good that this change is happening since i always found it silly this wasnt a thing... but brown?????? 23:39:21 it's my fault 23:39:26 i chose brown at random 23:39:43 yes 23:39:45 brown is a great color 23:39:55 well okay so we have a consensus that nobody who matters really likes brown 23:39:58 ;-P 23:40:11 -!- CKyle has joined ##crawl-dev 23:40:11 crate uses lightblue, fwiw 23:41:20 i color unid decks lightblue while under nemelex too 23:41:22 %rc simm 23:41:23 http://dobrazupa.org/rcfiles/crawl-git/simm.rc 23:42:11 also i color unid jewellery! 23:42:23 i didnt click the commit maybe i should but the message doesnt mention jewellery 23:42:31 "nobody who matters"? I'd say the person bothering to do the work is the only one who matters. 23:42:52 I told you I don't actually care 23:42:57 I was just copying off wheals 23:43:05 haha that is a pretty great development philosophy 23:43:13 i say sincerely 23:43:14 heck, maybe I'll even prefer lightblue! 23:43:21 lightblue sounds good 23:43:32 i like lightblue, also don't use an alias for it 23:43:33 MarvinPA: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 23:43:33 i'll have to get used to it, but so will everyone else!! 23:43:34 imo i put up a good argument for lightblue "the correct color" 23:43:51 brown is incredibly arbitrary, wheals even said he just picked it at random... chunks are brown so thats weird??? 23:43:52 since aliases in the defaults just mean that you can't actually define that alias in your config 23:44:09 i think i was going to remove all the default aliases but then i didn't, not sure why 23:44:10 how do you spell unIDed 23:44:19 unidentified? 23:44:25 MarvinPA: you can't? 23:44:27 i usually go unid'd 23:44:31 that seems bad 23:44:33 unID'd 23:44:38 yes it does/is 23:44:57 should we not fix that rather than removing them? 23:45:25 (perhaps we need more passes?) 23:45:41 do we really need :^= or something to redefine aliases :/ 23:45:56 simmarine: why decks only under Nemelex 23:46:06 i dont care about decks otherwise really 23:46:15 hmm 23:46:17 if i find legendary/wonders and i have scrolls to spare i will use them 23:47:57 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 23:51:21 hmm, seems almost like a clash to use the same color for IDed armour/weapons and unIDed other things 23:51:38 but I guess it's not really a big deal 23:56:05 03SamB02 07* 0.14-a0-1500-g6a017cb: Switch to lightblue, also do jewels (&decks w/Neme) (1KB, simmarine) 10(67 seconds ago, 1 file, 4+ 1-) 13http://s-z.org/neil/git/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=6a017cbd812b 23:56:32 waaait 23:56:38 i dont necessarily agree on the nemelex thing being standard 23:56:45 since after all its just a preference thing for myself 23:56:55 you.god() has some problems 23:56:58 yes 23:57:00 i would really not do that 23:57:02 hmm 23:57:05 the decks will change colour when you load the save 23:57:06 fine 23:57:08 yes 23:57:09 not when you convert 23:57:13 point 23:57:17 i assume it only checks your rc when you start/resme a game 23:57:19 u 23:57:36 yeah 23:58:53 good change btw, now maybe i can play on a robin without having to include += simm.rc 23:59:58 so I'm commenting that part out now