00:02:06 Unstable branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.12-a0-3162-g06c605c (34) 00:04:49 -!- rast has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90 [Firefox 19.0.2/20130307023931]] 00:05:46 03dolorous 07* 0.12-a0-3163-g720f7a6: Change Xom inner flame message; imitating Vehumet just doesn't seem right. 10(3 minutes ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=720f7a6c4db3 00:05:48 -!- CampinSam has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 00:14:16 -!- danharaj has quit [Quit: ~ Trillian Astra - www.trillian.im ~] 00:14:48 giant leech looks just like a berserk worm 00:15:04 -!- Wah has quit [Quit: IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIT'S BACON!] 00:20:57 03dolorous 07* 0.12-a0-3164-g4bdaa9d: Add a Screaming Sword message. 10(6 minutes ago, 1 file, 3+ 0-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=4bdaa9d9e369 00:25:19 -!- maarek has quit [Quit: maarek] 00:25:35 -!- WalkerBoh has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:29:13 -!- syraine has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:32:20 ontoclasm: what is that thing of yours on pastebin? 00:32:20 -!- dcssrubot917 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:32:20 is that top killer by level? 00:34:00 ontoclasm: scroll up ;-P 00:34:19 SamB: you mean me, right? 00:36:58 yeah. (Sorry that took so long, I had to wait for a pathologically slow blit ...) 00:37:46 ok. most common killer. nice. 00:38:09 centaurs are nasty 00:38:11 except for Abyss it's restricted to xl>5 00:38:19 makes snese 00:38:21 sense 00:38:30 you don't have to tell *me* that centaurs are nasty 00:40:07 SamB: I'm thinking of god gifting the player a deck, but there's a scumming issue :-\ 00:41:43 -!- syraine_ has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:42:33 well, would you rather add a menu? 00:42:55 depends on how laborious implementing one is 00:42:57 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 00:44:46 ontoclasm: do you have a worn tile to go with that cap? 00:45:25 could be nice to have a custom robe, too, but looking at some jester outfits, something workable is within even my drawing skills 00:45:39 kilobyte: he said it's trivial 00:45:54 (a four-part red/black one would suffice, probably) 00:46:16 cool 00:47:08 newgame_make_item(4, EQ_NONE, OBJ_MISCELLANY, MISC_DECK_OF_WAR) -- is dying somewhere in the guts of tags. Is my invocation wrong? 00:47:55 bh: mon-gear.cc has examples, although if you hate tile builds, I can do this for you 00:48:14 it's not that I hate tiles, it's that I sort of ignore tiles 00:48:29 item slot numbers can be tricky sometimes 00:49:37 ah no, should work 00:51:27 mumra: well, I didn't notice when I got to Orc:4 so I guess it's fine 00:51:41 good! 00:57:02 bh: newgame_make_item() sets item properties directly rather than going through items(), it lacks some processing 00:57:33 (why the function is named items() rather than makeitem() or so is beyond me) 00:57:44 and now I died 00:58:59 do decks rely on evoc? 00:59:20 yes 00:59:35 but nemelex abilities use invoc? 00:59:39 er 00:59:42 nevermind :) 00:59:50 why do you think nemelexes evocations are ... 00:59:58 too slow :-( 01:01:23 03bh 07[jester] * 0.12-a0-3134-g00a0082: Jester Tweaks 10(5 minutes ago, 3 files, 6+ 7-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=00a0082d11a6 01:01:43 bh: to create a deck, setting item.plus to #cards, item.special to DECK_RARITY_COMMON then calling init_deck(item) _should_ be enough, I hope 01:02:09 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.12-a0-3164-g4bdaa9d (34) 01:02:14 kilobyte: should I give a deck of desturction or let the player pick? 01:02:18 (or war) 01:02:46 ??deck of war 01:02:47 deck of war[1/1]: Randomly per-card {deck of destruction}, {deck of enchantments}, {deck of battle}, {deck of summoning}, {deck of transport}, {deck of emergency}. 01:03:07 ??deck of destruction 01:03:08 deck of destruction[1/2]: Cards include: {vitriol card}, {flame card}, {frost card}, {venom card}, {hammer card}, {spark card}, {pain card}, {torment card}, {orb card}. Sacrifice weapons, ammunition, and magical staves and rods. 01:03:10 deck of war might be more thematic ... 01:04:21 which of those are in the mundane deck? 01:05:14 branding the darts with chaos could be an option, but then, that's a wand of random effects by a different name 01:06:03 ??wand 01:06:04 wands[1/2]: Yay for wands. Wands use {evocations}. Higher evocation skill allows you to identify remaining charges and increases wand power. See also {wand_identification}. Can be recharged with scrolls of recharging. 01:06:58 Frobos (L8 DEWz) ERROR: range check error (35 / 35) (D:6) 01:07:12 !lm Frobos type=crash -log 01:07:13 1. Frobos, XL8 DEWz, T:6286 (milestone): http://crawl.develz.org/morgues/0.11/Frobos/crash-Frobos-20130329-060657.txt 01:08:03 CDO 0.11 webtiles, I don't even bother to look at it 01:08:22 not updated since original 0.11.0 01:11:13 Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.12-a0-3164-g4bdaa9d 01:15:05 kilobyte: maybe it's the benadryl talking, but I don't quite grok items() 01:15:35 the return value is an item slot? 01:16:56 -!- clinew has quit [Quit: leaving] 01:17:06 * SamB is pretty sure that if bh thinks he doesn't understand items(), bh doesn't understand items() 01:17:46 (At least, judging by most stuff in Crawl ...) 01:18:03 it returns an index into the items array in env 01:19:12 oh 01:20:22 -!- faz has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 01:21:03 kilobyte: so, I couldn't find the x86-64 psABI 01:21:46 and I think I got distracted from finding the i386 answer to your question 01:23:00 SamB: I mean, in general 01:23:28 passing such structs by pointer sounds wrong to me 01:23:57 and if the compiler won't pass them in an efficient way, perhaps changing two ints to two shorts would let it do so 01:24:29 oh, but I can say that if there's a non-trivial copy constructor or destructor, it can't really be passed by value anyway 01:26:22 (because the Itanium C++ ABI says *that* much; most of the rest seems to be up to the System V supplement for the processor in question) 01:27:42 (The calling convention section from the gABI basically says "see the psABI".) 01:28:03 er, sorry, calling sequence 01:28:22 I'm thinking about coord_def, level_id and such 01:28:53 especially coord_def::operator - shows prominently on profiling runs 01:33:10 grumble. grumble 01:34:57 -!- Melum has quit [Quit: Was eaten by a grue.] 01:37:31 okay, the i386 psABI says that structure/union arguments are padded out to a multiple of the wordsize 01:38:25 "word" meaning "machine word" or "word size a far ancestor used to have"? 01:38:56 meaning 4 bytes 01:39:24 cool 01:40:24 someone else can add this darn deck. 01:40:25 which is what I would have expected anyway, and actually couldn't we have just used objdump -S for this or something? 01:41:51 03kilobyte 07* 0.12-a0-3165-g561403f: Hush an -Og warning. 10(8 minutes ago, 1 file, 4+ 2-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=561403f68198 01:43:15 kilobyte: oh, and empty classes take 1 byte according to the Itanium C++ ABI 01:44:00 SamB: objdump -S ... duh! 01:44:08 whoa. xom's a dick. I started a jester and he immediately wrathed the character for three mutations. 01:44:31 but then, "bother someone with more clue about post-1990 compilers" works too :p 01:45:21 who said anything about post-1990? 01:45:26 -!- VolteccerJack has quit [Quit: Page closed] 01:47:14 when I took the Compiler Design class, we used 8086 real mode DOS in the only short exercise that was not on an abstract stack machine 01:47:41 Hmm, the copyright dates on this thing are 1990-1992 for AT&T and 1990-1996 for SCO... 01:48:28 <|amethyst> SamB: things can't take zero bytes in C++ 01:48:38 <|amethyst> SamB: it's part of the language spec I believe 01:48:56 |amethyst: jester :) 01:48:56 |amethyst: I know, but still find it a bit bewildering 01:48:57 <|amethyst> SamB: because of issues with pointer arithmetic in templates 01:49:55 |amethyst: the new() operator at least explicitely allows 0-length stuff 01:50:01 <|amethyst> hm 01:50:19 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:50:25 kilobyte: that's probably 0-length arrays? 01:50:44 not sure 01:50:52 probably, yeah 01:51:01 do you call that operator new[]() ? 01:51:05 <|amethyst> yeah, you can allocate a zero-length array (dereferencing it is undefined) 01:51:13 -!- iasov has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:51:27 you can, unless you're using gcc-4.7 (or possibly newer, too) 01:51:35 <|amethyst> but a struct/class always has at least one byte, so that templates involving pointer arithmetic don't turn into infinite loops 01:51:36 http://gcc.gnu.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=53330 -- still unfixed 01:51:36 kilobyte: hmm? 01:51:50 they broke libc++ ? 01:51:59 03bh 07[jester] * 0.12-a0-3135-gaaf4ebc: More Jester Tweaks 10(4 minutes ago, 1 file, 5+ 3-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=aaf4ebcdb822 01:52:01 er, libstdc++ 01:53:26 for once, I'd actually appreciate gccbot interpreting that as a reference to GCC's bugzilla ... 01:53:58 -!- QQQ has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 01:54:18 (it's always misinterpreting links in #gdb, usually to sourceware's main bugzilla, as being to gcc's ...) 01:58:24 -!- syraine has quit [Quit: Page closed] 01:58:24 -!- nonethousand has quit [Quit: ugh] 01:58:25 back to coord_def: interesting: on -O0 profiles, coord_def::operator-=(coord_def const&) and coord_def::operator-(coord_def const&) show up on prominent places, in -Og they're in the 0.00 ghetto 02:01:06 -!- monqy has joined ##crawl-dev 02:01:23 kilobyte: they actually show up in -Og ? 02:02:12 oh wait, that's indeed a different operator-, I'm blind 02:02:20 -!- dcssrubot236 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:06:05 -!- bh has quit [Quit: Xom thinks this is hilarious.] 02:07:09 03bh 07[jester] * 0.12-a0-3136-gfcd0753: Jester god tweaks 10(3 minutes ago, 1 file, 3+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=fcd075344d39 02:08:05 <|amethyst> I feel bad that I never got time to do my April 1 thing 02:08:31 <|amethyst> maybe next year 02:09:53 -!- Poncheis has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90 [Firefox 19.0.2/20130307023931]] 02:10:52 * kilobyte still thinks about making "stty olcuc" more, uhm, useful. 02:11:43 -!- adam__ has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:12:06 probably not worth the effort, though, if replacement strings are of different length than source 02:12:57 <|amethyst> someone should make stty olcuc locale-aware 02:13:10 -!- BloodDrum has quit [Quit: Page closed] 02:14:53 my idea is to make http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/G/Great-Runes.html literal 02:19:14 "ae", "ng", "ph" and "th" contract, "x" expands. Expansion is nearly impossible, even in design, so I'd need to use wrong-period "x"; contraction can be filled by spaces after the end of the string or before the first non-printable (slightly bad with colours, but blah). 02:24:41 <|amethyst> kilobyte: even ignoring that, everything expands if you're using UTF-8 encoding 02:24:59 <|amethyst> I guess you're talking about columns, though, not bytes 02:27:10 -!- raskol has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:27:12 <|amethyst> but line disciplines commonly do CRLF conversion, so expansion isn't impossible 02:27:35 -!- Thalfon has quit [] 02:28:07 yeah; that's expansion of the string measured in bytes, not in screen space 02:28:47 <|amethyst> change the locale as well, to say that "x" is double-width :P 02:29:19 the tty driver has no concept of locales 02:29:23 -!- Xelf has joined ##crawl-dev 02:29:23 <|amethyst> I know 02:29:26 * SamB didn't know we'd had TTYs for over a century ... 02:29:51 <|amethyst> but if ".UTF-8" can be part of your locale name, so can ".RUNEZ" 02:30:13 -!- G-Flex has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 02:31:03 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:31:27 <|amethyst> SamB: a century and a half according to Wikipedia 02:31:36 <|amethyst> Baudot dies 110 years ago 02:31:41 <|amethyst> s/dies/died/ 02:32:01 making yourself sound like a timetraveler 02:32:46 <|amethyst> Baudot will have been having died 02:33:19 <|amethyst> Where can I get scrod? 02:33:21 now you sound like a confused foreigner, possibly a time traveler 02:33:23 -!- Wehk has joined ##crawl-dev 02:34:01 <|amethyst> A confused foreigner from yesterday's XKCD 02:35:29 <|amethyst> "You're as cold as... something / You're willing to sacrifice... guys, do you remember the words? what am I doing here?" 02:48:14 * SamB is way overdue for bed ... 02:50:54 -!- syraine has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:52:26 -!- raskol has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 02:56:26 -!- santiago has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 03:01:31 -!- _dd has joined ##crawl-dev 03:02:58 -!- dcssrubot490 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:06:29 -!- simmarine has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 03:15:44 -!- Krakhan has quit [Read error: Connection timed out] 03:16:10 -!- Krakhan has quit [Changing host] 03:23:42 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: CADENZA-CLASS CLOCKWORK KNIGHT--OPERATION TERMINATED] 03:31:13 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 03:34:57 -!- _dd has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:36:00 -!- _dd has joined ##crawl-dev 03:36:16 -!- SkaryMonk has joined ##crawl-dev 03:40:03 -!- syraine_ has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:49:07 -!- ystael has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 04:03:09 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 04:10:39 -!- ShadeTornado has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:12:59 -!- kwel01 has quit [Quit: Page closed] 04:15:14 -!- Dixlet has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:20:20 !tell bh a scummy workaround for jesters: you can convert to Xom for a moment then rejoin Nemelex, you'll lose 10 piety and 150 penance 04:20:21 kilobyte: OK, I'll let bh know. 04:23:21 -!- minqmay has quit [Quit: Leaving] 04:32:18 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 04:33:02 -!- dcssrubot438 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:42:31 -!- faz_ has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 04:52:35 -!- scummos_ has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 04:53:40 -!- DracoOmega has quit [Quit: Leaving] 04:54:06 -!- Egglet has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.2.0 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/] 04:54:36 -!- Zaba has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 04:55:20 -!- Zaba has joined ##crawl-dev 04:57:28 -!- alefury has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:58:37 -!- s951 has joined ##crawl-dev 05:04:33 -!- nooodl has joined ##crawl-dev 05:18:44 -!- Vizer has quit [Quit: bye] 05:21:33 -!- ktgrey has quit [] 05:36:03 -!- quest has quit [Quit: Page closed] 05:43:44 -!- ToBeFree is now known as SoulOfTheInterne 05:44:07 -!- SoulOfTheInterne is now known as ToBeFree 05:44:10 -!- voker57 has quit [Changing host] 05:44:38 -!- popbob has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:46:10 -!- popbob has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:54:41 -!- Wah has quit [Read error: No route to host] 05:56:52 -!- MaxFrost has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 05:57:41 -!- nonethousand has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:00:32 -!- mikee_ has quit [Quit: Want to be different? 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MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 08:57:13 03kilobyte 07[jester] * 0.12-a0-3137-gb9a82cc: Give jesters a deck of war at start (bh) 10(4 hours ago, 1 file, 8+ 0-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=b9a82ccac7dd 08:57:13 03kilobyte 07[jester] * 0.12-a0-3138-gf713325: Fix wtile: not working on anything other than shields. 10(2 hours ago, 1 file, 18+ 0-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=f7133256f765 08:57:13 03kilobyte 07[jester] * 0.12-a0-3139-gf5ccecb: Make jesters' caps look like jester caps. 10(2 hours ago, 3 files, 10+ 0-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=f5ccecb397b6 08:58:53 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 09:03:33 -!- Nakatomy has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:29:20 -!- stopit has quit [Quit: Page closed] 09:32:24 -!- GuraKKa has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:39:26 -!- madreisz has quit [Quit: Page closed] 09:42:43 03MarvinPA 07* 0.12-a0-3166-g2bf0346: Remove some problematic aura vaults 10(7 minutes ago, 2 files, 0+ 90-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=2bf0346599f2 09:46:05 -!- ark__ has joined ##crawl-dev 09:46:16 MarvinPA: <3 09:46:50 -!- Arkaniad|Laptop has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 09:48:03 -!- ark__ has quit [Client Quit] 09:48:49 * Grunt nods in MarvinPA's general direction. 09:50:16 (also, hi everyone) 09:51:47 hellohello 09:54:46 -!- blackcustard has joined ##crawl-dev 10:01:49 -!- Arkaniad|Laptop has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 10:02:52 -!- Namey has quit [Quit: Leaving] 10:02:55 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 10:04:12 -!- pelotron has quit [Quit: Leaving] 10:06:06 -!- eith has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:09:15 -!- Dixie has joined ##crawl-dev 10:09:17 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:10:32 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 10:11:08 -!- TAS_2012v has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:11:37 -!- Psyknux has quit [Quit: My work is end \(^o^)/] 10:12:23 -!- Elynae has quit [Quit: Page closed] 10:13:42 -!- dcssrubot600 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:15:24 -!- ark__ has joined ##crawl-dev 10:29:08 -!- santiago has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 10:30:28 -!- ryansee has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 10:31:16 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 10:36:26 -!- morik has quit [Disconnected by services] 10:36:29 -!- morik_ is now known as morik 10:38:42 -!- Jolly_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 10:45:14 -!- santiago_ has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 10:45:23 -!- tcjsavannah has quit [] 10:49:53 -!- rarzip has quit [Quit: Page closed] 10:49:53 -!- Egglet has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:51:54 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 10:58:36 Orb of Zot disappeared from apportation by anestheticheart 11:01:26 -!- Nightbeer has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:02:00 -!- absolutego has quit [Quit: leaving] 11:02:46 -!- scummos_ has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 11:09:41 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 11:13:19 -!- Arkaniad|Laptop_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:19:38 -!- madreisz has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:22:20 -!- simmarine has joined ##crawl-dev 11:34:15 -!- Kellhus has quit [Quit: Page closed] 11:36:24 -!- Mandevil has quit [Quit: leaving] 11:40:28 "0 at (48,39): Orb of Zot" 11:42:14 nooodl: that coordinate is a wall 11:42:20 indeed 11:42:56 if you shatter in, the orb of zot is inside permarock 11:43:00 it even gets an item stack brand 11:43:06 haha yes 11:43:08 and you can apport it out 11:43:18 i'm xray visioning it 11:43:47 -!- dcssrubot526 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:43:50 so, the game can be recovered if the player picks up earth magic :P 11:44:09 that. is. awesome XDDD 11:44:09 i really really hope this happens 11:45:44 -!- s951 has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:57:05 so, would this be an accurate thing to say in syntax.txt: 11:57:08 ][ - Stone stairs, set 3 - minivaults often fail to get this pair if 11:57:09 the level isn't very interconnected or if any larger vaults are using 11:57:09 any stairs. 11:57:50 -!- Arkaniad has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:59:54 ??rock wall 11:59:55 rock wall[1/1]: The basic fabric of ordinary dungeon levels (Pan's weird stuff is functionally identical, too). Unlike other kinds of wall, it can be removed by wand of digging, wand of disintegration, Summon Elemental, stone of earth elementals, boring beetles, Dissolution, IOOD and bolts of energy. LRD, Shatter and Corruption also destroy them easily. 12:00:06 ??stone wall 12:00:07 stone wall[1/1]: Tougher than rock wall. Lee's Rapid Deconstruction, Corruption, and Shatter can destroy it; or just teleport around. 12:01:23 -!- Dixie has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 12:02:24 -!- Dixie has joined ##crawl-dev 12:05:43 Stable (0.11) branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.11.2-11-g28dacbe 12:08:04 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:08:17 -!- blabber has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 12:08:17 -!- TAS_2012v has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 12:08:36 -!- scummos_ has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 12:12:50 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.12-a0-3166-g2bf0346 (34) 12:26:14 -!- blabber_ has joined ##crawl-dev 12:28:24 -!- quazi has joined ##crawl-dev 12:28:25 -!- Arkaniad has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 12:35:56 -!- bmfx has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:36:24 -!- remyroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:37:10 -!- Flun has quit [Client Quit] 12:39:33 -!- Egglet has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:11:26 Melded armour can't be enchanted by ldf 16:11:26 -!- Cheibriados has joined ##crawl-dev 16:11:26 -!- The topic of ##crawl-dev is: Crawl Development | Logs: http://s-z.org/crawl-dev/ | People with +v have commit access. | Please keep general Crawl-related chit-chat to ##crawl. | Dev wiki: http://crawl.develz.org/wiki | Long stuff to pastebin.ca please | Immortal Warwalrus and Crazy Yiuf forever. 16:11:27 -!- The topic of ##crawl is: CAO has telnet again. Let rax know if there are problems. | Play Crawl online now: type ??cao, ??cdo, ?cszo, or ??webtiles for instructions | http://crawl.develz.org | FooTV: termcast.develz.org | ##crawl-offtopic: You got your gender in my peanut butter! Xom thinks this is hilarious! 16:11:31 <|amethyst> I forgot I had that one bound to Super-Ctrl-F not Super-Shift-F 16:16:35 -!- Cheibriados has joined ##crawl-dev 16:16:35 -!- The topic of ##crawl-dev is: Crawl Development | Logs: http://s-z.org/crawl-dev/ | People with +v have commit access. | Please keep general Crawl-related chit-chat to ##crawl. | Dev wiki: http://crawl.develz.org/wiki | Long stuff to pastebin.ca please | Immortal Warwalrus and Crazy Yiuf forever. 16:16:35 -!- The topic of ##crawl is: CAO has telnet again. Let rax know if there are problems. | Play Crawl online now: type ??cao, ??cdo, ?cszo, or ??webtiles for instructions | http://crawl.develz.org | FooTV: termcast.develz.org | ##crawl-offtopic: You got your gender in my peanut butter! Xom thinks this is hilarious! 16:17:49 -!- Cheibriados has joined ##crawl-dev 16:17:49 -!- The topic of ##crawl-dev is: Crawl Development | Logs: http://s-z.org/crawl-dev/ | People with +v have commit access. | Please keep general Crawl-related chit-chat to ##crawl. | Dev wiki: http://crawl.develz.org/wiki | Long stuff to pastebin.ca please | Immortal Warwalrus and Crazy Yiuf forever. 16:17:49 -!- The topic of ##crawl is: CAO has telnet again. Let rax know if there are problems. | Play Crawl online now: type ??cao, ??cdo, ?cszo, or ??webtiles for instructions | http://crawl.develz.org | FooTV: termcast.develz.org | ##crawl-offtopic: You got your gender in my peanut butter! Xom thinks this is hilarious! 16:18:43 -!- VolteccerJack has quit [Quit: Page closed] 16:18:44 <|amethyst> okay, cron job in place 16:19:29 crontab as a service manager? :/ 16:19:32 -!- fooobarrr has quit [Quit: leaving] 16:20:17 <|amethyst> elliott: what would you recommend for a normal user who wants to start a program on boot? 16:20:45 good question :) 16:21:11 -!- gluop has quit [Read error: Connection timed out] 16:21:54 |amethyst: there's that supervisord thing, maybe? 16:22:42 -!- nooodl has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:25:58 -!- nooodl has joined ##crawl-dev 16:26:26 -!- minmay has quit [Client Quit] 16:29:09 -!- inspector071 has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 16:31:33 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:36:49 -!- Archibald has quit [Client Quit] 16:36:54 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:38:13 03dolorous 07[jester] * 0.12-a0-3140-g9d2f85a: Fix spacing. 10(5 hours ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=9d2f85a58a7f 16:38:55 -!- Kalir has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:41:08 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 16:42:10 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 16:46:15 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 16:47:53 -!- danharaj has quit [Quit: ~ Trillian Astra - www.trillian.im ~] 16:50:48 -!- Killerpretzel has quit [] 16:51:17 -!- orelius_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 16:51:36 * SamB thinks it's a bit silly for the i386 ABI supplement to say that the VM flag is unspecified at process startup: that flag is normally not visible to any code that executes with it set, and doesn't think protected-mode code can run with it anyway ... 16:52:03 -!- DainDwarf has quit [Quit: Dain's default quit message] 16:53:03 -!- Nightbeer has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:53:24 -!- madreisz has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:53:34 -!- flowsnake has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:53:53 * SamB thinks it should probably just say "none of your beeswax" about the priviledged flags, anyway 16:54:24 <|amethyst> SamB: you can do virtual 8086 + protected 16:54:52 * SamB sighs and opens volume 3A 16:54:53 <|amethyst> I have a feeling that would have other incompatibilities with the ABI though 16:55:22 |amethyst: you can't use VM86 without actually being in protected mode, of course 16:56:09 <|amethyst> I mean, a process running in v8086 mode might still have protection enabled... so it has 8086-like segments, but with protection 16:58:54 well, underneath you still have all the protections, sure 16:59:53 (well, except segmentation-based protection won't really apply) 17:00:13 does lua code inside an rcfile have to be indented? 17:01:00 but as far as the code that is actually executing with VM set is concerned, it's running in real mode and the VM bit isn't set (unless you've a very strange monitor that exposes the VM flag, I guess) 17:03:26 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 17:04:13 -!- Krakhan has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:07:33 <|amethyst> hm 17:09:33 (Except obviously you might have some special drivers that talk to the virtualization software) 17:10:56 protected mode stuff you can run in protected mode, assuming it doesn't need ring 0 itself 17:10:59 -!- faz_ has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:11:08 or, well, any ring but 3 probably 17:11:31 That's how DOSEMU does it, anyway. 17:13:49 <|amethyst> oh, I'm looking at the supplement now 17:14:16 <|amethyst> I guess it's just saying "if you do happen to be handed your flags, you shouldn't make any assumptions about the value of VM" 17:14:54 I think it's just trying to say "the only flag we're telling you the initial value of is DF" 17:15:51 -!- Yen_ is now known as netmonmatt 17:16:48 -!- ystael has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 17:18:40 <|amethyst> yeah 17:19:15 <|amethyst> If they said 0 for VM then people might think they can do something useful with that bit 17:21:12 -!- rkd has quit [] 17:21:14 which is why I think they should have just marked the supervisor-only flags as "irrelevant" or something 17:21:51 faze: not as far as i can tell. i unindented a few statements at various block levels in my rc and it worked fine 17:25:05 -!- blabber_ has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 17:25:14 faze: the indentation police will come after you if you indent your lua code in a nonsensical manner, though 17:25:25 -!- dcssrubot631 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:26:08 especially if you use *less* indentation for inner levels 17:28:02 -!- Snigir has quit [Quit: Page closed] 17:34:30 -!- clouded_ has joined ##crawl-dev 17:34:37 -!- st_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:39:37 -!- blabber has joined ##crawl-dev 17:43:43 i've written a patch for https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=6841 17:43:52 and it possible fixes a few other bugs i've seen as well 17:44:13 where you're allowed to select inventory items by letter even when they're not in the list 17:44:46 obviously there are two exceptions where this can be allowed: throwing and wielding 17:44:53 can anyone think of any others? 17:46:21 btw, I think you should be able to enchant melded stuff 17:46:34 there doesn'ts eem to be any reason to disallow it, and it means you want to end transmutations to get a better shot at identifying scrolls 17:46:40 = tedious and kinda spoilery 17:46:58 do you think you should also be able to identify/vorpalise melded stuff? 17:47:47 sure 17:47:52 well, you could argue vorpalise 17:47:56 and I guess enchant weapon 17:47:59 at the moment there is code that specifically prevents you enchanting melded (once you've identified the scroll they won't come up in the menu) 17:48:00 for realism reasons or whatever 17:48:07 but I don't think being able to do this will actually bother anyone 17:48:23 sure, I can see why someone would code it in the first place 17:48:34 I think the fact that people thought this was a bug for a few minutes in ##crawl is telling though 17:48:46 (a bug as in, having no idea why reading the scroll wouldn't id it) 17:49:28 well if it was gone from the menu completely that would also be solved 17:50:20 the point of melding is kind of to make items unavailable so i don't see why they should be available for this purpose... 17:51:40 well, I see melding as a tactical thing 17:51:54 I don't see why it should affect strategic items, especially when doing so makes identification more tedious, but that's just me 17:52:52 if someone read-id'd a scroll in an emergency while transformed they could waste a scroll; so it doesn't have zero effect 17:53:24 that seems incredibly marginal :P 17:53:39 anyway, it going from the menu wouldn't solve this particular confusion, btw, since the scroll was unidentified at the time 17:55:16 %git f499e23cede8ad97a11f1bbb08ad422bed9fe928 17:55:16 03jpeg * rf499e23cede8: Melded equipment may no longer be cursed, uncursed, or enchanted. I'm still dithering on identify. 10(4 years, 5 months ago, 2 files, 6+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=f499e23cede8 17:55:46 4 years is a long time :p 17:55:49 identify was never disabled for melded items 17:56:00 sure 17:56:14 so then, melding already doesn't make items totally inaccessible 17:56:15 elliott: what i'm proposing is to not allow any scrolls to be used on melded items, so it could be gone from the menu for all of them 17:56:26 oh, I see 17:56:47 -!- eeviac has joined ##crawl-dev 17:57:27 in fact, that's what i've coded (but it would be easy to allow the scrolls as well and still fix the other prompt bugs) 17:58:16 i won't push it yet anyway 17:59:25 -!- alefury has quit [Quit: Stay sane inside insanity!] 18:09:46 maybe i should look at this infinite acquirement bug instead 18:10:12 ummm you have to give ragdoll 40 hours first 18:10:17 -!- ldf has quit [Quit: ldf] 18:10:35 luckily it's only reproducible locally 18:11:57 where is this infinite acquirement bug 18:12:14 i just noticed it's marked as private 18:12:17 so i can't tell you 18:12:39 there are /private bugs/? 18:13:22 all the cool bugs are private 18:13:24 yeah, you can set them private when you report them 18:15:14 surely that's meant to be for things like security issues rather than more mundane bugs like that :P 18:16:28 well, if it _did_ turn out to be reproducible online that is kind of a security issue 18:16:51 security issue? 18:17:00 there are worse things that have been on the servers 18:17:03 not really - you can't compromise the server 18:17:27 a very loose sort of "kind of" 18:18:00 think of the highscore securities 18:18:05 think of the children 18:23:26 when is the bonus background going to be pushed? 18:24:54 ssh there are definitely no bugs that allow elliptic to win every other game 18:25:54 not sure if anyone say this earlier 18:26:03 saw, rather 18:26:04 [07:14:14] "a bush (sick)" 18:26:04 [07:14:16] is this in any way intentional 18:26:16 bushes have feelings too!! 18:26:37 a bush (raging) 18:26:55 -!- Svendre has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:27:29 plants can be sick irl 18:27:41 so i don't see any problem with it 18:27:54 ?? 18:28:18 plants can get diseases. a gardener might literally say "that bush is sick" 18:28:20 this isn't going to end well 18:28:24 you need more shield 18:28:53 woops wrong channel 18:29:32 G-Flex: did you notice i did something about orc connectivity btw? 18:29:47 plants can do nasty tricks on skateboards. a fan might literally say "that bush is siiiiiiiick" 18:30:24 i saw this bush do a holly once boom boom 18:31:09 handplant 18:31:15 zing 18:31:17 yess 18:32:55 aw yeah 18:33:24 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 18:36:33 -!- scummos_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:37:13 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 18:37:54 -!- _D_ has quit [Quit: leaving] 18:38:02 this is worrying; i can't see why the acquirement bug _isn't_ reproducible online 18:39:37 tell me how to do it and I will test :) 18:39:52 -!- Zifmia has quit [] 18:43:10 -!- syllogism has quit [] 18:45:19 mumra: I noticed the commit, yeah 18:45:31 also bushes being sick is a problem because "sick" means something specific in crawl 18:45:34 that doesn't apply to bushes 18:45:37 unless bushes heal now 18:46:44 so deep dwarves don't get sick? 18:47:02 doesn't it also block regeneration effects, some of which apply to deep dwarves? or no? 18:47:19 if sickness doesn't do anything to deep dwarves, then no, deep dwarves shouldn't be able to get sick 18:47:31 i don't know 18:47:32 well it causes stat loss on players 18:47:51 so it's still relevant for DD 18:47:55 of course 18:48:13 -!- Cerepol has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:49:22 -!- inpho has quit [Quit: inpho] 18:50:20 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 18:50:52 -!- tensorpudding has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 18:55:31 -!- dcssrubot687 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:56:18 <|amethyst> for DD players, but for DD monsters it is irrelevant 18:57:30 -!- alefury has quit [Quit: Stay sane inside insanity!] 18:58:11 -!- santiago_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:58:51 mumra: does it require setup 18:59:05 if it needs like an existing acq scroll to reproduce and is tedious then it's not really an issue imo 19:00:47 no it's very easy 19:01:03 i tihnk it's because on the server the hups signal is handled correctly and your inventory is decreased 19:01:04 <|amethyst> We fixed mauricescumming, I don't see why we wouldn't fix this 19:01:29 <|amethyst> tedious things giving infinite rewards is pretty much the distilled essence of scumming 19:02:02 it probably only applies to local windows 19:02:06 <|amethyst> mumra: and what happens locally? 19:02:15 <|amethyst> mumra: the process crashes? it's killed with a signal? 19:02:16 |amethyst: I didn't say it shouldn't be fixed 19:02:31 just close the game window when you're at the acquirement prompt 19:02:32 |amethyst: I was referring to the secrecy/worry surrounding it and the bug being private and whatnot 19:02:40 <|amethyst> elliott: aha 19:02:45 <|amethyst> mumra: oh 19:02:46 then open the game; select your item from the prompt; your inventory hasn't decreased 19:02:58 but you got the item :) 19:03:05 <|amethyst> mumra: is there any reason that "just closing the window" couldn't call the HUP paths exactly 19:03:24 <|amethyst> for that matter, even raise(SIGHUP) 19:03:39 this is a whole area of things that i don't really understand 19:03:54 kilobyte mentioned the other day that it was problematic in a few ways 19:04:00 you can raise sighup on windows? 19:04:06 <|amethyst> oh, I was about to say "ask kilobyte" 19:04:13 e.g. the intra-level travel by closing the window during off-level viewing with X 19:04:36 <|amethyst> mumra: what happens if you send a SIGHUP in the same situation? 19:04:59 <|amethyst> elliott: I don't see why not 19:05:11 <|amethyst> elliott: I mean, unless it's not called SIGHUP there 19:05:24 * Grunt glances in. 19:05:25 |amethyst: is the problem that windows doesn't have a concept of sighup? 19:05:30 What are we talking about? 19:05:39 <|amethyst> mumra: I have no clue 19:05:46 #6486 19:05:48 <|amethyst> mumra: I haven't looked at the signal handling code on Windows 19:05:58 <|amethyst> but windows certainly has signals and handlers and raise 19:06:04 <|amethyst> those are ANSI C 19:06:16 |amethyst: it must be possible to do something to quit sanely sure 19:06:23 Oh, that. 19:06:40 <|amethyst> Grunt: I was asking, why can't closing the window take the same code path as SIGHUP 19:06:47 <|amethyst> Grunt: or even raise a SIGHUP 19:07:05 Windows doesn't really know about SIGHUP, AFAIK. 19:07:51 <|amethyst> Is there no way to cleanly about crawl in Windows? 19:07:56 <|amethyst> a/about/abort/ 19:08:00 s/crawl/anything/ 19:08:46 pressing the close window button certainly runs a code path, crawl saves the game and stuff 19:09:18 <|amethyst> right, but for some reason that's different from what happens in case of a SIGHUP 19:09:29 <|amethyst> or, at least, you said it appears to be so 19:09:39 but i can start crawl from a command prompt, then if i press Ctrl-C in that command prompt it terminates the process and doesn't even save (probably nothing can be done about that in any instance) 19:10:12 -!- Jayrays has quit [] 19:10:15 out of interest has anyone tried reproducing #6486 on unix? i don't actually have a unix install here to test 19:10:19 (note to self: set up a vm) 19:10:44 <|amethyst> hm 19:11:15 actually can someone recommend a distro for that? 19:11:28 debian or xubuntu? 19:11:52 <|amethyst> mumra: hrm 19:12:00 <|amethyst> look at console_handler in libutil.cc 19:12:37 <|amethyst> mumra: it looks like it's *trying* to do the right thing 19:12:44 hrm 19:12:45 <|amethyst> mumra: but I don't know the windows API so 19:13:57 <|amethyst> (it doesn't handle ctrl-c because of the issue mentioned in the next comment; sounds like it would if launched from cygwin?) 19:14:24 <|amethyst> or maybe this is if the console is closed 19:14:36 that's what i was just trying to work out 19:14:38 <|amethyst> mumra: if you close the console instead of the GUI, that still exits, right? 19:14:46 yep 19:14:54 <|amethyst> mumra: does the bug occur if you do that? 19:16:05 |amethyst: was just checking that. behaviour is completely different, as though i'd never read the scroll 19:16:53 <|amethyst> mumra: so it sounds like it is in some sense *possible* to handle correctly 19:17:27 <|amethyst> mumra: that's the same behaviour as online, right? 19:17:38 <|amethyst> mumra: or is there a restartable online? 19:17:51 online when i go back into the game it's at the acquirement prompt 19:18:08 <|amethyst> that sounds like bug #2 then 19:18:44 but online the inventory has been correctly decreased of course 19:19:24 <|amethyst> closing the console is neglecting to save the uncancellables it sounds like? 19:19:40 <|amethyst> oh, the inventory isn't decreased 19:19:53 <|amethyst> it it going back to the last save? 19:19:54 <|amethyst> hm 19:20:13 in local tiles, closing normally, you're still at the prompt but inventory doesn't get decreased 19:20:39 in local tiles, closing by closing the command line, it's gone back to before you were at the prompt (maybe just not saved at all) 19:20:49 i haven't tested local command line tho 19:20:52 <|amethyst> how bizarre 19:25:15 -!- DracoOmega has joined ##crawl-dev 19:26:58 it seems SIGHUP isn't defined for MVSCRT 19:29:25 Terminating tiles Crawl from a normal windows command line actually crashes it for me, but that's probably my own problem 19:29:43 Since it randomly crashes with memory errors on startup for me all the time (but not that I've heard anyone else complain of) 19:31:48 -!- blabber has quit [Quit: leaving] 19:32:04 i get random crashes on startup all the time but i thought it was filesystem problems 19:32:26 Well, it's a 'memory at address X could not be 'read'' error 19:32:50 Which seems to happen quite commonly at startup, but the game is otherwise fine if it gets past that. I am not sure it is even Crawl's fault directly 19:32:55 i either get crawl spitting out loads of "blah.lua" could not be found errors 19:32:56 Since I don't see it happen on other computers I have used 19:33:17 or the windows "Crawl has stopped working" error 19:33:48 Hmmm... don't think I've encountered that 19:34:00 It's perfectly stable once it actually gets past the loading screen 19:34:16 me too, this is all prior to or during the loading screen 19:34:41 Unhandled exception at 0x00C9A8B1 in crawl.exe: 0xC0000005: Access violation reading location 0x02AFF000 19:35:14 That sounds similar 19:35:17 i'm pretty sure it's file system related, it's probably my fault for deciding to install Windows 8 when i got my new pc 19:35:25 Well, I'm still on XP here 19:35:39 ah 19:35:56 there are various other vague reports of similar types of things happening on random windows machines 19:36:13 but i can't see any pattern 19:36:54 -!- WalkerBoh has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:36:56 tried using WinDbg to get a backtrace? 19:37:04 Well, the fact that it doesn't ALWAYS happen (yet seems to reference the same locations when it DOES happen) makes me curious 19:37:15 I don't think I have anything configured that can do that here 19:38:02 or actually I guess GDB could help if crawl actually contains the triggering instruction 19:38:03 Unhandled exception at 0x00C9A8B1 in crawl.exe: 0xC0000005: Access violation reading location 0x02C4F000. 19:38:24 exception is at the same place in the exe but difference location causing it 19:38:49 Mine seems to be in the same location just about all the time, I think 19:39:24 well i have an idea which bit of code is causing it because there are these missing file errors as well: 19:39:25 Lua error: d:/Projects/Crawl/CrawlTrunk/crawl/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/builder/layout_caves.des:9: ...n_overwrite minivault /../dat/dlua/layout/hyper.lua:22: C 19:39:25 an't find "dlua/layout/hyper_debug.lua" 19:39:46 Well, I don't get any of those anywhere that I can see them 19:39:49 and weirdly a piece of the contents of the file sometimes shows up in the error like that 19:40:05 it sounds like yours is a completely different error 19:40:30 "The instruction at "0x00c9aa01" referenced memory at "0x2a61000". The memory could not be "read"." 19:40:49 I like the quote marks 19:42:11 Yeah, I got the same address for both instruction and memory three times in a row then 19:42:22 the memory could not be black, white, and read all over 19:42:22 I believe you guys don't have proper MinGW installs, just msysgit? 19:42:38 That's true for me, anyway 19:42:40 yep 19:44:10 Huh. This time clicking on 'debug' actually did something 19:44:31 (I have a truly ancient version of MSVC++ installed from many years back) 19:45:02 -!- syraine has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 19:45:07 Though this call stack is not very enlightening to read 19:45:19 CRAWL! 00c9aa01() 19:45:19 CRAWL! 00c9c13d() 19:45:19 CRAWL! 00581819() 19:45:19 CRAWL! 00582fe0() 19:45:19 CRAWL! 004afe38() 19:45:20 CRAWL! 004b2e30() 19:45:22 CRAWL! 004b3087() 19:45:24 KERNEL32! 7c80b729() 19:45:28 CRAWL! 19:45:31 Yeah, haha 19:46:05 Not that the assembly code is very enlightening either 19:46:11 well, it works here and I have a proper MinGW install 19:46:32 DracoOmega: addr2line 19:46:52 What? 19:47:07 takes addresses, tells line numbers 19:47:27 -!- s951 has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:50:51 fr steel arrows so oka can gift non-elemental arrows please 19:59:24 -!- morik has quit [Disconnected by services] 19:59:27 -!- morik_ is now known as morik 20:00:31 -!- clouded_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:00:53 -!- clouded_ has joined ##crawl-dev 20:01:09 hey mumra I'm probably going to play around with your new layouts branch on the weekend to check out the new stuff, is there anything in particular you want feedback on? 20:02:11 -!- Zermako has quit [] 20:02:43 -!- Egglet|2 has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 20:02:51 evilmike: awesome! i'll try and push another couple i've been working on tonight. maybe i should bump a load of weights so the new ones come up a bit more often? 20:03:18 for testing, it's fine to have skewed weights in trunk to get more testing, just make sure you fix them before release 20:03:33 In any case, it seems I currently have no idea how to do anything useful with this 20:03:48 in the actual branch itself though, it's not really meant to be played is it? I'm just going to be generating the levels with &P 20:04:27 evilmike: well it can be played, new layouts show up maybe 30-40% of floors in D 20:05:25 I'm interested in checking out the potential gameplay, amount of variation, etc. This stuff seems really interesting to me, because we can eventually have every dungeon branch get its own unique layout with the amount of work that you're doing 20:05:27 there's a lot of new stuff in D, Lair, Snake, but most branches have one or two new things 20:05:35 that's cool 20:05:51 evilmike: that's exactly the sort of feedback i'm interested in, what sort of layouts play out well, how they fit the branch theme 20:06:10 if anything looks out of place take a screenshot so i can tune parameters 20:06:39 most of the generators create a massive variety of stuff at the moment and i need to go "ok, this set of parameters work in this branch, but that set of parameters work better in that other branch" 20:06:59 I'd also say, for when these do go into master, the ones with more variety should get a higher weight 20:07:17 also, if anything works particularly well and looks awesome, let me know about that as well 20:07:24 sure 20:07:52 evilmike: that's how it's already set up with weights 20:08:45 There are also some current layouts which should have a lower weight once that all happens... should do a full review of that stuff sometime for 0.13 I think 20:08:52 it could basically go in master as is; the only thing i'd change is there's a cave_city layout that's slow to generate, i'd put that on 0 weight in master until it's better 20:09:10 would be nice to have a table that breaks it down by branch, showing the probability of each layout 20:09:54 well, is there any talk of freezing 0.12? I'm a bit out of the loop these days, I have no idea what the release plans are 20:09:57 evilmike: definitely; some of the obvious ones (e.g. roguey, cities) will be fairly redundant since my generators will sometimes produce very similar ones anyway 20:10:00 I am a little reluctant to put anything new into master now, when we're supposedly basically frozen, though probably new layouts won't cause many real problems either... 20:10:53 -!- Nightbeer has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 20:11:20 my concern with this stuff would be to give enough time for playtesting 20:12:06 yeah 20:12:07 Yeah 20:12:08 it's like that with vaults too... not likely to cause bugs, but the policy is usually to commit them and then remove later if they turn out to be objectionable, and this can take a while to become evident 20:13:23 there are already some new D layouts that slipped in with the orc/slime/swamp fixes because the commits were slightly tangled 20:13:31 heh 20:13:38 they can easily be set to 0 weight tho ;) 20:13:41 don't worry about this, I seriously doubt its a problem 20:21:59 -!- SkaryMonk has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:22:21 Hi evilmike. 20:22:33 Sorry if I stepped on your toes a bit while going through the mantis vault queue <_< 20:22:40 -!- Arkaniad has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:24:53 -!- AriaB1 has joined ##crawl-dev 20:25:37 -!- dcssrubot159 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:26:15 -!- Dixie has joined ##crawl-dev 20:28:11 -!- voker57 has quit [Changing host] 20:30:13 -!- morik has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:32:49 -!- bh has joined ##crawl-dev 20:32:52 hai 20:32:53 bh: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 20:32:55 !messages 20:32:55 (1/1) kilobyte said (16h 12m 34s ago): a scummy workaround for jesters: you can convert to Xom for a moment then rejoin Nemelex, you'll lose 10 piety and 150 penance 20:33:12 !seen kilobyte 20:33:12 I last saw kilobyte at Fri Mar 29 14:46:16 2013 UTC (10h 46m 56s ago) saying 'MarvinPA: <3' on ##crawl-dev. 20:33:33 !tell kilobyte elliptic suggested setting jester penance at 50 because it'll last for 50k turns. 20:33:33 bh: OK, I'll let kilobyte know. 20:33:56 :| jesters don't seem all that crazy anymore 20:34:00 bh: yeah, part of that was to eliminate the workaround kilobyte mentioned 20:34:18 and I think 50k is enough penance 20:34:35 can Sequell tell us the average game length by level at death or win? 20:35:00 !lg * cv>=0.10 won x=avg(xl) 20:35:02 1845185 games for * (cv>=0.10_won): avg(xl)=3.91 20:35:04