00:01:09 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.12-a0-2244-g0ff3a51 (34) 00:01:23 -!- m__ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:01:26 Unstable branch on crawl.s-z.org updated to: 0.12-a0-2244-g0ff3a51 (34) 00:09:05 Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.12-a0-2244-g0ff3a51 00:09:18 -!- remyroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:10:13 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:13:32 -!- Chapayev has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:17:08 -!- pelotr0n has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 00:17:56 -!- m__ has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:21:24 -!- dagonfive has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:21:40 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 00:22:00 -!- rwbarton has quit [Quit: leaving] 00:28:27 -!- kekekela has quit [Quit: Page closed] 00:29:27 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 00:39:14 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 00:57:02 -!- elliptic has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:57:51 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 01:08:48 -!- ontoclasm has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 01:09:12 -!- timbw has quit [Quit: Page closed] 01:14:50 -!- Sequell has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:15:50 -!- Sequell has joined ##crawl-dev 01:29:41 -!- GuraKKa has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:29:53 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 01:43:57 -!- nicolae- has joined ##crawl-dev 01:47:24 -!- bh has quit [Quit: Page closed] 01:52:50 -!- st_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:53:15 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 01:57:03 -!- elliptic has quit [Read error: No route to host] 01:57:41 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 02:05:33 -!- nicolae- has left ##crawl-dev 02:07:24 -!- Serfuzz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:09:55 -!- Serfuzz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:18:34 -!- Serfuzz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:22:51 -!- Serfuzz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:29:10 -!- mikee_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:31:37 -!- mikee_ has joined ##crawl-dev 02:33:23 -!- omnomnOMINOUS has quit [Quit: Page closed] 02:35:31 -!- ruwin has quit [] 02:38:06 -!- ponies_ has quit [Quit: Trillian (http://www.ceruleanstudios.com] 02:38:28 -!- kittykai has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 02:47:29 -!- Celsitudo has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:49:02 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 02:49:15 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: CADENZA-CLASS CLOCKWORK KNIGHT--OPERATION TERMINATED] 02:50:52 -!- m__ has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 02:51:09 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 02:52:03 -!- simmarine has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:57:49 -!- elliptic has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:05:07 -!- clinew has quit [Quit: leaving] 03:11:56 -!- Wehk has joined ##crawl-dev 03:12:30 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 03:23:22 -!- Jafet has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 03:23:40 -!- hart has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:31:10 -!- st_ has quit [] 03:33:23 03kilobyte 07* 0.12-a0-2245-g19dc60c: Fix a couple of cases that could remove Slow by Haste. 10(2 days ago, 2 files, 0+ 17-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=19dc60cbfcdf 03:33:23 03kilobyte 07* 0.12-a0-2246-g52a44fa: Purge the desc link for lich demonologists. 10(25 hours ago, 1 file, 0+ 4-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=52a44faace69 03:33:23 03kilobyte 07* 0.12-a0-2247-ge9eaefb: db_lint: don't warn about the animated tree dummy. 10(24 hours ago, 1 file, 3+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=e9eaefb3eca4 03:33:23 03kilobyte 07* 0.12-a0-2248-gf8d36cc: Document (describe) both flavours of debugging chocolate. 10(23 hours ago, 1 file, 15+ 0-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=f8d36ccedbc5 03:33:23 03kilobyte 07* 0.12-a0-2249-gad22f2c: Mark win64 builds as -win64- rather than -win32-. 10(19 hours ago, 2 files, 8+ 2-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=ad22f2c098fb 03:48:35 03kilobyte 07* 0.12-a0-2250-g301d917: A typo (syraine). 10(87 seconds ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=301d917d5bbd 03:52:33 -!- Harms_ has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:58:55 -!- WalkerBoh has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:59:41 When I fight wile transformed in a spider or bear, what skill is used ? unarmed ? my weapon skill ? 03:59:59 oops wrong channel sorry. 04:06:26 -!- _dd has joined ##crawl-dev 04:10:24 -!- Nightmare is now known as Guest56013 04:15:26 -!- edlothiol has joined ##crawl-dev 04:16:11 -!- syllogism has joined ##crawl-dev 04:21:23 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:28:15 -!- russianslayer229 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:29:11 -!- russianslayer229 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:35:32 -!- monqy has quit [Quit: hello] 04:39:06 03kilobyte 07* 0.12-a0-2251-g4beca49: Manual sync from the wiki. 10(5 minutes ago, 1 file, 55+ 61-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=4beca49326e2 04:39:06 03kilobyte 07* 0.12-a0-2252-g602483c: Give wisp form fail-proof conservation. 10(4 minutes ago, 1 file, 5+ 0-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=602483c40aa8 04:48:36 -!- Guest56013 has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 04:52:34 -!- edlothiol has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:00:42 -!- russianslayer229 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:02:01 -!- minqmay has quit [Quit: Leaving] 05:02:29 -!- POOPYBUTT has quit [Quit: Leaving] 05:02:29 -!- BOOPYPUTT has quit [Quit: Leaving] 05:09:00 -!- russianslayer229 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:10:53 -!- russianslayer229 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:13:39 -!- Elkan has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 05:14:36 -!- russianslayer229 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:20:50 -!- russianslayer229 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:25:02 -!- russianslayer229 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:27:33 -!- Yermak has quit [Quit: Page closed] 05:35:12 -!- Zifmia has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:43:33 -!- chuchuchu_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 05:45:46 -!- edlothiol has joined ##crawl-dev 05:46:23 -!- Zifmia has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 06:05:56 -!- scummos has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 06:17:08 -!- kek has joined ##crawl-dev 06:25:24 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 06:49:12 -!- magicpoints has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:56:37 -!- nooodl has joined ##crawl-dev 06:59:31 -!- mikee_ has quit [Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- Organize your IRC] 07:01:10 -!- Jafet has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 07:06:44 -!- syraine has quit [Quit: Page closed] 07:13:08 -!- kwel01 has quit [Quit: Page closed] 07:25:09 -!- russianslayer229 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:26:44 -!- yogidabear has quit [Quit: Page closed] 07:32:16 -!- Kellhus has quit [Quit: Page closed] 07:36:23 !tell bh I have some questions about ProceduralSample. Basically I want to generate a layout in Lua (so there will be a map_def and a vault_placement) but then use it as an Abyss sample instead of directly placing it on the grid. I have half an idea how to do this but I'm not sure the best way to go about integrating it in _abyss_grid and occasionally regenerate the layout so could use some advice. 07:36:23 Maximum message length is 300 characters. Eschew verbosity, Gladys! 07:36:35 !tell bh I have some questions about ProceduralSample. Basically I want to generate a layout in Lua (so there will be a map_def and a vault_placement) but then use it as an Abyss sample instead of directly placing it on the grid. 07:36:35 mumra: OK, I'll let bh know. 07:36:47 !tell bh I have half an idea how to do this but I'm not sure the best way to go about integrating it in _abyss_grid and occasionally regenerate the layout so could use some advice. 07:36:47 mumra: OK, I'll let bh know. 07:38:28 !tell bh (Or am I going about this the wrong way and is it already possible to place a vault so it dissolves in and dissolves out again like other abyssal features?) 07:38:29 mumra: OK, I'll let bh know. 07:43:24 -!- Roarke has quit [Quit: Page closed] 08:02:06 -!- Bromine is now known as Iodine 08:02:08 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 08:14:13 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:21:21 -!- Serfuzz has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 08:22:53 -!- Sorbius has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 08:23:07 -!- russianslayer229 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:23:29 -!- magistern has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 08:26:48 -!- casmith_789 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:33:42 -!- HangedMan has joined ##crawl-dev 08:36:09 -!- elliptic has quit [Quit: Leaving] 08:39:38 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:43:26 -!- Vizerr has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 08:51:25 any and all devs interested, a nearly done special rooms revisions patch: http://sprunge.us/PFWH 08:52:49 possibly big changes in here, I don't know 08:59:00 -!- alefury has quit [] 08:59:09 HangedMan, the reason the special room vault always places a door is that it's placed as a minivault, and therefore is already very close to the level, so no long corridor is ever built, which in turn means monsters wander pretty freely if it's just floor 08:59:42 -!- Iodine has quit [Quit: brb] 09:01:12 long corridors are pretty often built even with the door 09:02:06 st_ and elliptic both liked no door because the wandering freely with noise was "a natural result" or something and it's not a runed door or anything so spare lightnign bolts/fireballs/dragon roars/whatever would already do this if the contents could open the door 09:02:06 in altogether too many cases it won't be, though, and you'll possibly get the monsters all over the level before the player even locates the special room 09:02:48 would be so much easier if right angle corridors to connect vaults were just gone 09:03:12 I distinctly remember making it always build a door for that reason after making special rooms vaults 09:03:36 -!- jwkldfdsd has quit [Quit: Page closed] 09:04:09 did autoexplore exist back then? 09:04:09 ChrisOelmueller: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 09:04:16 ChrisOelmueller, of course 09:04:27 it's a relatively recent change 09:05:02 there's also the fact that without doors it's much less plausible for the whole ignoring parts of the level because there is probably a special room behind this door 09:05:17 HangedMan: how to add special rooms to V... 09:05:32 mumra, just subvault them like layout_roguey does 09:05:38 HangedMan: at the end of mini_monsters.des there is a vault called "special_room" 09:06:11 ...if it still does that 09:06:14 Zaba: V doesn't technically use subvaults and I don't want to modify V code 09:06:46 um, it's hardly intrusive 09:06:51 look at how layout_roguey does it 09:06:52 Zaba: I want the special rooms to be able to inject themselves into V, but this special_rooms vault in mini_monsters already does this; it does work by using subvaults 09:07:12 yes, please don't invent other mechanisms to do this 09:07:14 Zaba: V doesn't _and can't_ use subvaults, at least not right now 09:07:45 Zaba: I'm not inventing anything, I'm pointing HangedMan to an existing example that already does the right thing ... 09:08:19 oh, I had forgotten about making V use stuff because I had focused on the rooms looking good everywhere else 09:09:11 HangedMan: have you seen this special_room vault in mini_monsters? (it seems to already place special rooms in layout_basic) 09:09:31 -!- edlothiol has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 09:09:44 HangedMan, also, are you sure you really want to list all those layout_* tags instead of just letting it place in any layout? :P 09:10:02 it easily looks really bad in cross and octagon 09:10:04 hang on, it will be quicker to just alter the code and post it rather than explaining what to do ... 09:10:33 -!- blackcustard has joined ##crawl-dev 09:10:43 could work in city and chaotic city if somebody else does brief code to make the vault have a border of floor 09:10:50 there's also the fact that without doors it's much less plausible for the whole ignoring parts of the level because there is probably a special room behind this door 09:11:00 yes yes runed doors 09:11:00 HangedMan: if you want this to be a thing then autoexplore must stop for special rooms at least 09:11:44 you haven't actually looked at the floor spawns and in the layouts chosen it's actually rather difficult to tell where a special room is from the sides without being paranoid about flat wide walls 09:12:06 HangedMan: by "this" I mean avoiding parts of a level because there is probably a special room behind a door 09:12:15 well there's no door! 09:12:20 if you want that to be a tactical consideration then it'd be awful to make autoexplore open them 09:12:45 again, no door 09:12:55 HangedMan: http://pastebin.com/WSeCfJq6 09:13:11 <|amethyst> I'm confused 09:13:19 I left in bits that I commented out so you can see what I changed, but you can delete all the comments 09:13:26 HangedMan: I don't understand 09:13:33 That will place special rooms properly in vaults 09:13:35 elliott: look at the bloody patch 09:13:42 I understand there are no doors in the current patch 09:13:46 <|amethyst> you want an open room so monsters can wander out... but you want to somehow convince the player they might not want to go through the room, even though it's empty 09:13:49 <|amethyst> ? 09:13:58 I mean if you wanted doors and "ignoring parts of the level because there is probably a special room behind this door" to be a tactical consideration then they would have to be runed doors 09:14:28 (otherwise you'd have recognisable special rooms (by necessity, or it would be impossible to guess there's a special room behind a door) that act as autoexplore traps, denying someone using autoexplore the tactical possibility to avoid it) 09:14:50 monsters will wander out in all but bee rooms extremely easily regardless of the door or not because of how loud later D gets 09:17:03 I had no idea @ and + even make different connections to the rest of the floor because the vault docs imply that +s on the border of a vault act as @s and in most ways they probably do 09:18:04 yes, + acts as a connectivity point 09:19:26 HangedMan: do you follow what I've done in that pastebin? 09:19:39 mumra: yes, was just this debate thing 09:19:42 HangedMan: the only issue was the outer wall, because V adds outer walls and doors automatically 09:19:49 cool 09:22:19 now i can carry on working on this awesome crypt layout : http://pbrd.co/12R9hsW 09:26:42 could work in city and chaotic city if somebody else does brief code to make the vault have a border of floor 09:27:02 if I understand right you can just tweak the coords of make_box to achieve that 09:27:35 I do not even begin to have much control over anything short of hyper-limited lua 09:27:47 nice question mark spell icon in that screenshot 09:28:17 i was screwing around seeing what happened if i gave myself monster spells :) 09:28:35 teleport self? 09:28:43 no, silver blast 09:28:49 mm 09:29:23 hmm, just noticed the phase shift icon looks misaligned 09:29:44 said crypt layout looks good 09:30:19 again I have to ask about vaults because I can only do one thing 09:30:35 the little boxes are supposed to be coffins. need to get the rooms bigger and put more coffins in them 09:31:16 -!- friendlybee has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:32:03 HangedMan: vaults do kind of screw with this layout but the coffins block them 09:32:23 but if you're talking about ORIENT vaults I have a really good solution for that now but I haven't implemented it yet 09:33:11 and for FLOAT vaults I also have a bit of an idea 09:33:56 the thing is, vaults can screw with any layout *sometimes*. sometimes they work well though (and the same here) 09:34:17 1learn add 09:34:33 the more random and chaotic a layout is, or conversely if a layout has tons of open space, the less noticable it is 09:35:03 unless it's a giant box cutting a third of an octagon off 09:35:03 so for stuff I'm doing with quite defined architecture it tends to be a problem more often 09:35:11 yeah exactly 09:35:18 -!- magicpoints has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 09:35:50 but even then, that kind of thing sometimes works, because it's a chaotic magical dungeon and we expect things to look a bit out of place sometimes 09:37:14 hehehe 09:37:37 here's another example of that same layout: http://pbrd.co/12Rd8G9 09:38:15 two vaults have placed but they _basically_ work 09:38:42 yeah that looks fine 09:38:44 i mean, if i was placing them by hand i'd have done something different but i wouldn't call it broken 09:40:53 is there any reason all layouts don't use the spotty level connector that avoids right angle corridors except with float/orient:direction being dumb 09:41:09 i have a good level of control now, when i'm drawing shapes i can set a bool property that will end up applying MMT_VAULT on that shape so vaults stay away, i can protect important bits of geometry and leave everything else as bait :) 09:41:50 it is getting more and more tempting to see what happens what happens if mumra's vault code replaces current vault placement code 09:42:22 haha 09:42:51 the problem is my code is in lua and it'd be hard to tie into normal level building 09:43:08 but once all layouts use hyper anyway that won't be a problem ;) 09:43:10 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 09:43:48 i'm thinking i can add an api function that i can call from lua that basically says "give me a list of vaults to place" and then the dungeon builder won't place any itself 09:46:46 the problem is there are some things my code doesn't do that means i can't reliably place all vaults like normal vault placement: 09:47:36 : 09:47:49 e.g. the fact that i'm very restrictive about what can be overwritten, i don't draw connecting corridors (they have to already exist), 09:48:36 i don't check connectivity (the way i construct the layouts attempts to guarantee connectivity to begin with) 09:49:06 life, imperfect 09:49:36 and the fact that it places walls around literally everything. actually that one i'm going to fix soon but anyway ... 09:51:58 it would be really interesting to see how it handled normal vaults though. it definitely creates the illusion of placing things more intelligently (even though the actual mechanism is essentially extremely dumb) 09:53:18 as opposed to apparently inscrutable 09:54:06 well yeah that is an advantage of the simplistic approach 09:55:14 it's nice being able to manipulate things with lua callbacks which is how that crypt layout works. e.g. the corridors are just long thin floor vaults, and the callback goes "are these corridors joining perpendicularly? if not, veto this position" - for every random position that placement picks 09:55:48 and then there is a callback that turns the connecting cells into floor instead of carving doors like the other rooms 09:57:11 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:57:15 some day I need to make elliott's floor vault 09:57:25 except ruin it by making it have a lot more floor and empty space 09:59:15 hehe 09:59:19 the mighty floor vault 10:10:03 floorvault!!! 10:10:03 -!- edlothiol has joined ##crawl-dev 10:10:27 I swear that I will get the chance to look through hypervaults sometime in the next day or two :| 10:10:46 And that encompass vault. 10:15:05 -!- Ellandar has quit [Quit: Page closed] 10:15:33 -!- m__ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:15:41 -!- Stelpa has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:16:28 np 10:18:25 -!- Stelpa has quit [Changing host] 10:18:46 at some point i will be submitting hyper mk III with all these layouts for other branches so you probably want to get this one out the way first :) 10:20:27 i am done tinkering with V now at least 10:20:42 oh, i do still need to sort out these wall material weights; 10:21:16 is the consensus: remove rock altogether, make metal increasingly likely towards V:$, make green crystal increasingly likely towards V:$ (but less so) ? 10:21:34 super vaults alpha turbo the world warriors the new champions new age of heroes 120% burning fest 10:21:55 probably should have no green crystal possibility for v:1 10:22:56 I like your earlier suggestion: 100% stone on V:1, rapidly increasing chance of metal for deeper depths (probably 100% on V:5 except for green crystal probability), much smaller chance for green crystal. 10:23:15 -!- russianslayer229 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:23:20 that works, sure 10:23:35 -!- hoody has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:23:50 That said, I think a small chance of metal on V:1 is acceptable. 10:24:01 I think once you go to a "deeper" material it should never go back, or something? 10:24:05 as in once you get metal there's no stone levels 10:24:10 and one you get crystal there's no metal levels 10:24:18 elliott, I'd love for that to happen, but I can't think of a good way off the top of my head to make that happen. 10:24:44 could be done with whatever that way is of saving lua state between floors 10:24:47 I guess you could set a dgn.persist, but that might not work too well with shafts. 10:24:51 but i don't really see why it needs to be so complicated 10:24:57 that's it, dgn.persist 10:25:44 i prefer setting up randomness and letting patterns occasionally emerge thru clustering illusion tbh 10:27:00 -!- bmfx has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 10:28:18 could decide on V:1 what the progression is going to be and persist that; but since there are only 4 floors we might as well then just fix it as stone->stone->metal->crystal 10:28:27 it also wouldn't make sense then that V:$ isn't crystal 10:28:34 -!- hoody has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 10:28:50 V:$'s logic should be kept, or you're going to confuse a lot of people. 10:29:21 -!- rkd has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 10:29:23 well I meant that seeing a crystal V:n would imply that V:$ would be crystal, but yeah it's probably not worth the effort 10:30:40 -!- Stelpa has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:30:49 proposing stone > stone > metal > metal > metal with a small chance for crystal on otherwise metal levels 10:30:59 it shouldn't be part of the regular progress imho 10:31:21 progression* duh 10:31:26 what ChrisOelmueller said sounds good 10:33:42 -!- rkd has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:33:54 <|amethyst> could make one of the boundary floors stone/metal for randomness while keeping progression 10:34:20 -!- rkd2 has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 10:34:22 sure, making v:3 either of those also is fine 10:36:05 -!- blabber has joined ##crawl-dev 10:36:57 what is a good probability for crystal n V:4 10:37:05 1/10? 10:37:08 ...less? 10:37:16 (What's V:$'s chance?) 10:37:18 1/16 10:37:31 erm, for the chance, not v:$'s chance 10:40:01 if there are 2.5 levels where it'd be eligible and it should happen at most once per 8 to 10 games, i'm approximating that as 1/20--1/25 on average 10:40:47 ok i have written this as: http://pastebin.com/1uMDUGdX 10:41:23 which makes 1/20 chance for V:4 crystal 10:41:38 1/30 chance on V:3 10:41:46 and 1/3 chance of stone on V:3 10:41:56 with stone always on V:1-2 and no rock 10:42:08 so v:5 uses code located elsewhere to decide? 10:43:12 yes, V:$ existed long before newvaults so that code was never touched 10:43:18 also `(depth-1) * 20 - 20` is `20 * (depth - 2)` 10:43:47 and the same applies to the next line :) 10:44:26 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 10:44:32 oh yeah thanks, that's because i started with different numbers then kept adjusting the equation as people wrote more comments ;) 10:50:20 -!- hoody has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:51:48 ok i've pushed that after a quick test, seems to work well. it's pretty clear how it works anyway if anyone needs to adjust the numbers, it's all at the top of dlua/v_layouts.lua 10:59:06 -!- crate has quit [Quit: Leaving] 10:59:06 -!- WalkerBoh has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:02:22 <|amethyst> does this mean we can remove vaults from _fixup_walls? 11:02:26 <|amethyst> or have you already done that? 11:02:43 Hmm? 11:02:57 oh ... good point 11:03:11 <|amethyst> dungeon.cc has some code for Vaults wall probabilities 11:03:18 <|amethyst> if it's handled in lua now that's not needed 11:05:15 you know i was looking at that function last night for unrelated reasons and didn't even twig 11:06:00 Oh, right. 11:06:00 _fixup_walls won't actually be doing anything here because it only substitutes rock walls, and there are now guaranteed to be no rock walls 11:06:15 <|amethyst> mumra: including in vaults? 11:06:18 <|amethyst> err 11:06:20 <|amethyst> rooms 11:06:35 |amethyst: yeah that's handled immediately after each vault gets placed 11:06:51 -!- russianslayer229 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:07:05 rock walls get substituted but other types of wall are left alone, in case vault designers want to use fancy walls for any reason 11:08:17 -!- caleba has quit [Quit: caleba] 11:08:35 ok i pushed that as well 11:14:45 -!- hoody has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:15:32 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 11:18:27 -!- Poncheis has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 11:19:54 <|amethyst> mumra: btw, I haven't looked, but how do you handle uniques? 11:20:10 <|amethyst> mumra: Do their vaults still place normally on top of rooms? 11:21:05 -!- Vizer has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 11:21:06 -!- Vizer_ has joined ##crawl-dev 11:34:35 -!- kittykai has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 11:41:25 -!- blabber has quit [Quit: leaving] 11:51:21 -!- tsn has quit [Quit: leaving] 11:54:11 -!- bmfx has quit [Quit: leaving] 12:06:16 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:07:28 -!- voker57 has quit [Changing host] 12:13:21 -!- Poncheis has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 12:15:41 -!- Naruni has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:20:01 -!- Naruni_ has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:20:49 |amethyst: normal vaults are still allowed to place on corridors, empty rooms, walls. so uniques are placed by the normal vault logic, and bazaars and other stuff still show up. 12:21:58 -!- Roarke has quit [Quit: Page closed] 12:22:10 <|amethyst> ah, okay 12:22:17 -!- MarvinPA_ has joined ##crawl-dev 12:22:21 -!- simmarine has joined ##crawl-dev 12:23:10 actually that reminds me, infiniplex removed Depth: V from a bunch of places when newvaults happened. those should all be restored (worrying things like wizlab entrances are probably not placing) 12:23:22 -!- russianslayer229 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:24:26 wizlab entrances don't ever place monsters so they should be fine 12:24:31 i think newvaults had its own logic for placing wizlab entries, bazaars and loads of other stuff. i didn't like how so many things had to be done in a different way just for V, so a lot of that didn't make it into newnewv. 12:24:31 if usually large 12:24:44 HangedMan: the problem is that wizlab entries have default-depth: Crypt, D:22-27, Elf:3-5 12:24:57 because Depth: V was removed by infiniplex 12:25:00 right 12:25:04 elf:3-5 12:25:05 wow 12:25:13 yes, I know 12:25:13 -!- Naruni has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:25:14 and i forgot to go through and revert everything (it affected quite a number of .des files) 12:25:15 -!- russianslayer229 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:25:47 do they actually have elf:3-5 12:25:49 can we perhaps change that to elf:2-3 or something 12:25:51 the first things that come to mind are the god-themed vaults evilmike did near the bottom of large_themed.des 12:25:55 elf:2- 12:25:58 save a character 12:26:02 yes, fine 12:26:20 the only things that can't be re-enabled for V yet are serial vaults 12:26:28 tragic 12:26:30 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 12:26:30 -!- MarvinPA_ is now known as MarvinPA 12:27:23 well, actually; serial vaults _can_ be re-enabled, i just have no idea how much it would trash the layout placing numerous serial vaults 12:28:17 elliott: ice caves have that too 12:28:26 well magic_research is pretty straightforward in level placement but elliott would kill me if more gimmicks to V so 12:28:36 none of the others are really suiting 12:28:56 also not_door_vault_due 12:29:51 evilmike_ambush as vaults_hard? 12:30:13 also there's some great cloud traps with Elf:4-5 12:30:16 imo don't change those 12:30:24 "DEPTH: D:5-12, Elf" 12:30:42 who possibly made this change and thought it was fine that a non-depth-adjusting vault would go into those two places 12:31:14 nothing wrong with cloud traps! i am still upset that chaos clouds didn't make it in 12:31:15 maybe I should leave the last bit of level-integration with this patch up to devs and start the bloody fix up random vaults patch 12:32:48 uh, i meant mutagenic clouds, chaos traps are clearly there 12:33:15 HangedMan: should i go and fix those elf thingies and should i replace those 3-5 with 2- and what about 4-5 and 12:33:28 wow there's even 2-5 12:33:28 chrisoelmueller: basically replace all of those with 2- 12:33:35 screw being any more accurate 12:33:48 what with 2-4 12:33:57 DEPTH: D:2-26, Elf:2-4, Crypt:2-4, Zot:2-4, Tar:2-6, Dis:2-6, Geh:2-6, Coc:2-6 12:33:59 mm 12:34:00 "who cares" 12:34:09 seeing a pattern there 12:34:16 Elf:2-, !Elf:$ 12:34:25 -!- Naruni_ has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:34:30 hah 12:34:31 Elf, !Elf:1, !Elf:$ 12:34:36 "clearly perfect" 12:34:52 I wanted to say Elf:2-3x 12:34:54 but I forgot what x is 12:34:59 and apparently the games are no longer in Sequell's database 12:35:03 life is pointless 12:35:07 36 12:35:10 ty 12:35:13 Elf:2-36 12:35:27 yes, got to be careful to not interrupt the majesty of elf:37 12:35:49 !lm * place=elf:38 12:35:50 No milestones for * (place=elf:38). 12:35:52 :( 12:36:09 ??elf 38 12:36:09 !lm * place~~^Elf s=place 12:36:10 elf 38[1/1]: 1. [2008-12-18] evktalo the Shatterer (L17 MiPa) killed Boris on turn 46521. (Elf:38) 12:36:11 vaults that come to mind from reading through the newvaults commit 12:36:13 109113 milestones for * (place~~^Elf): 42711x Elf:1, 17764x Elf:5, 15698x Elf:3, 11764x Elf:2, 10001x Elf:7, 8606x Elf:4, 2567x Elf:6, 2x Elf:36 12:36:17 ah there we go 12:36:19 !lm * elf:36 12:38:05 2. [2008-12-18 13:20:22] evktalo the Bludgeoner (L16 MiPa) is cast into the Abyss! (a Zot trap) (Elf:36) 12:38:32 evilmike_marble_ring, evilmike_cross, hangedman_cross_stitches, grunt_death_spiral_small, door vault as a non-vaults-room-vault, minmay_stuff_in_corners, _iron_armoury, minmay_pinched_square, lots of other minmay vaults in float.des here, kb_rosetta, why am I not just making this an example patch thing 12:38:49 -!- Naruni has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:43:43 Grunt: do you mind if i remove those entracey bits off grunt_vaults_funnel and grunt_vaults_trifunnel? i think they'll work more as expected just letting the layout place the doors 12:45:24 -!- Naruni_ has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 12:48:35 HangedMan: are you reverting everything or just specific ones? i'm just wondering if somehow using git to revert it all is the way to go 12:50:40 those were all nonobjectionable vaults using 098 12:50:41 -!- MaxFrost has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 12:50:59 aside from evilmike_iron_armoury but I doubt anybody thinks that particular vault doesn't fit V 12:51:50 mumra: "git revert " 12:52:07 also that won't get newer vaults that'd fit 12:52:28 also I'm not sure about this anyway unless those count as the vaults_hard for the level and are rare and blah blah blah 12:54:18 HangedMan: for vaults that would fit in rooms anyway you can use vaults_hard / vaults_room tags, otherwise if you're using Depth: V then i wouldn't worry about whether it's hard or not, it doesn't matter if some levels get a bit harder via floating vaults 12:55:49 HangedMan: also I don't think it's a problem now if there are some vaults using non-098, the important thing is most of the room vaults are sticking to those; st_ was being very strict but e.g. dpeg commented the rules don't need to be _that_ harsh 12:56:14 elliott: need to just revert specific files from the commit, not everything 12:57:33 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: CADENZA-CLASS CLOCKWORK KNIGHT--OPERATION TERMINATED] 12:57:41 <|amethyst> mumra: could use git revert -n (to not make a commit) then git reset --hard the other files 12:58:29 <|amethyst> and git add them before you commit 12:58:42 <|amethyst> (them = the files you reset, that you don't want reverted) 12:59:01 well with that principle 12:59:13 well, doing it by hand is better for reasons as stated by HangedMan, especially if HangedMan is doing it not me ;) 12:59:38 hahaha 12:59:42 I've tortured you enough 13:02:20 heh :) 13:02:42 -!- rossi has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.4.0] 13:04:59 -!- hoody has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:07:54 -!- bmfx has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 13:17:48 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 13:22:41 h - the ring of Ampu {rF+ Str-2 Dex-2} 400 gold 13:22:41 i - an uncursed ring of protection from fire (unknown) 400 gold 13:23:56 you are paying extra for getting to have identified that type of ring from now on 13:29:23 -!- bmfx_ is now known as bmfx 13:32:21 -!- scummos has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 13:34:28 -!- GreatOrbOfEyes has joined ##crawl-dev 13:36:42 -!- HangedMan has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 13:57:56 -!- home has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 14:06:57 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 14:10:27 <|amethyst> Napkin: looks like artefact value is capped below at zero 14:13:39 -!- GreatOrbOfEyes is now known as TenOfSwords 14:14:28 Elf (1/3) Orc:4 Lair (5/8) D:11 Spider (0/5) Lair:3 14:14:28 Swamp: Lair:3-6 Shoals: Lair:3-6 Snake: Lair:3-6 Vaults: D:14-19 14:14:30 --- 14:14:32 <|amethyst> Napkin: I don't see any technical reason that couldn't be changed. The final price is also capped below 14:14:45 After spectating someone on WebTiles, it doesn't center on the player before his next move (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=6654) by Medar 14:14:45 <|amethyst> "floored" I guess 14:14:46 i thought that having found Spider Nest, there is no chance to have Snake Pit anymore 14:14:51 <|amethyst> "shod" 14:14:55 <|amethyst> Napkin: one's a mimic 14:15:03 <|amethyst> Napkin: oh, unided 14:15:06 -!- rwbarton has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 14:15:10 <|amethyst> Napkin: well, spider *could* be a mimic :) 14:15:20 -!- Lemm|2 has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.3.1 Aria http://www.kvirc.net/] 14:15:25 <|amethyst> Napkin: otoh, that might be a leak that it actually is 14:15:36 yeah 14:16:17 <|amethyst> https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=6109 is relevant 14:20:14 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:20:46 <|amethyst> Napkin: currently it only removes the extras when you have discovered both 14:20:59 <|amethyst> Napkin: I'm not sure what happens if the second one you discover is a mimic 14:22:14 <|amethyst> oh, apparently it still cuts off the undiscovered ones then 14:25:05 -!- st_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:25:29 <|amethyst> btw, does anyone see a problem with Goncyn's patch at merge_requests/25? ( https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=6651 ) 14:25:30 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 14:26:01 <|amethyst> it changes prefixes, which could be a regression for users (and particularly bots) 14:26:48 -!- russianslayer229 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:28:03 -!- Chapayev has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 14:28:28 <|amethyst> OTOH, the changes to the prefixes are reasonable 14:28:40 <|amethyst> I'm not certain about unintended consequences though 14:29:06 merge and find out? :) 14:29:14 <|amethyst> good point :) 14:29:18 nothing that can't be reverted 14:32:27 -!- Zermako has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:37:34 |amethyst: that looks unproblematic for parabolic at least 14:37:52 <|amethyst> hmm 14:38:01 <|amethyst> applied and pushed 14:38:11 <|amethyst> but now "known" doesn't seem to be working right for wands 14:38:45 <|amethyst> hm... or for jewellery 14:40:23 03Goncyn 07* 0.12-a0-2253-gf4eaa46: Fix 'identified' name prefix logic. 10(24 hours ago, 1 file, 4+ 27-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=f4eaa463848a 14:40:25 -!- crate has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:46:05 <|amethyst> okay, fixed that (either item_ident(item, ISFLAG_KNOW_TYPE) *or* get_ident_type(item) should be sufficient for "known" 14:46:08 <|amethyst> ) 14:50:31 03|amethyst 07* 0.12-a0-2254-g07ab552: Prefix wands/jewellery as "known" again. 10(4 minutes ago, 1 file, 4+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=07ab5522b504 14:50:53 hehe, gj, |amethyst 14:51:59 |amethyst: 14:52:00 -!- jday_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:52:10 Elf (1/3) Orc:4 Lair (6/8) D:11 Shoals (0/5) Lair:5 14:52:10 Spider (0/5) Lair:3 14:52:10 Slime: Lair:6-8 Vaults: D:14-19 14:52:19 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 14:52:28 now, that she just found shoals, snake & swamp disappeared 14:52:46 :-O 14:54:43 <|amethyst> Napkin: yeah, once you find two (even if one of those is a mimic) the rest go away from the overview 14:54:55 weird 14:58:27 how about removing branch entrance mimics and thus fixing this crap 15:00:06 -!- yxhuvud has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 15:00:24 i actually thought they are a real nice surprise 15:01:06 especially an early temple entrance mimic 15:01:32 i started thinking twice before approaching an temple entrance now 15:01:40 temple doesn't exclude other branches from a rotation 15:02:05 and it's kind of bad that ^O cannot be trusted in some cases 15:02:09 true 15:02:23 how about just listing the entry there if you confirmed it's not a mimic? 15:02:28 that late in the game such mimics are not dangerous anymore anyways 15:04:00 -!- some12fat2move has joined ##crawl-dev 15:06:51 -!- clinew has quit [Quit: leaving] 15:11:34 -!- Alucard__ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 15:15:00 All right is this a good time to discuss the strength-evp formula? 15:16:33 Having a not-empty channel would be a good start... 15:18:46 Guess I'll try later 15:19:20 not empty, just slow 15:19:26 i don't see anything i should reply to either 15:19:44 ...well I asked is this a good time 15:20:09 then no 15:20:30 the criteria being? 15:21:23 I mean when is a good time? 15:21:44 or is there no such thing? 15:21:57 any time whoever you want to talk with is around, presumably :P 15:22:11 hmmmmmm 15:22:18 just bring your arguments and see if someone joins 15:22:33 oh okay 15:22:40 so I guess I can just do that now :| 15:22:53 "asking if you can ask" is not working so good in IRC 15:23:07 -!- magistern has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 15:23:31 is that so? I never used irc until I found out it was necessary for some things in crawl 15:23:50 I've spend about a total of 15 minutes on irc :| 15:23:50 -!- axlexk has quit [Client Quit] 15:24:09 but anyway 15:24:10 hence I'm saying ;) 15:24:18 yeah lol 15:24:38 but anyway the problem with the current strength-evp formula is breakpoints 15:24:45 or magic numbers or whatever you want to call it 15:25:13 breakpoints being bad is kind of a given so I don't think I have to explain the current problem deeper than that 15:25:49 is it much of a problem 15:25:57 bad is not the same thing as problem 15:26:35 okay, but I think I have a better formula 15:27:03 and in fact considering the recent overhaul of minimum delay there may be a war on breakpoints going on (but I'm not sure about that) 15:27:35 the overhaul didn' 15:27:39 that overhaul isn't actually in trunk (and isn't going to be in trunk without changing) 15:27:45 less breakpoints is certainly good though 15:27:46 basically that yes 15:27:52 I see, thank you 15:28:03 well, proposed overhaul of minimum delay then :) 15:28:08 (https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=6944 is the relevant thread for people who don't read tavern; not sure if the formula is still the same) 15:28:43 right, that is the thread I made to discuss the armour formula proposal on tavern 15:29:32 basically the new formula keeps the str*3=base evp as standard level 15:29:55 if your strength is triple the armour's base evp, you get that evp 15:30:15 however if it's half the amount needed for base evp, the evp is doubled 15:30:27 and conversely if you have double the strength needed for base evp, the evp is halved 15:30:50 the formula would be aevp=(3evp^2)/str 15:31:30 the cool thing about this is there's no magic number or breakpoint at which strength doesn't matter 15:31:45 -!- Serfuzz has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 15:31:52 it gives diminishing returns but there are always returns (as long as you're wearing armour with evp>0) 15:32:25 so strength will be a stat that anyone in armour will always want 15:32:31 even if they already have a lot 15:32:55 basically it...gets rid of the breakpoints. Sound good? 15:34:58 Is this something you would like to implement? 15:36:59 ... 15:38:17 erm is there another etiquette here I'm not aware of or something? 15:38:38 yes, not everybody is waiting for messages in here 24/7 15:39:02 ah well of course but I expected maybe somebody would have something to say 15:41:37 -!- monqy has joined ##crawl-dev 15:42:03 it sounds better than the current formula (note: I am not a dev) 15:42:16 I see 15:42:44 Well, I'm glad not everyone hates the idea 15:43:25 But I think there's supposed to be some dev feedback here before moving on to mantis 15:45:48 doesn't really need a mantis issue if a dev likes it, I don't think 15:46:37 -!- scummos has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:48:14 Okay well...I guess I'll just check back here every so often and see if a dev says something? 15:49:26 sure 15:49:44 meanwhile, I re-did a list: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjXhStQL2U2fdGZIZWNoaUhhRVB5R3RTUGJBLVQ5aEE#gid=0 15:54:58 -!- Poncheis has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 15:55:03 -!- rast has joined ##crawl-dev 15:55:45 -!- axlexk has quit [Quit: Page closed] 15:55:47 -!- Stelpa has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 15:56:13 Jiyva can heal 300 HP in one turn with a 300+ arrow/bolt stack (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=6655) by Psieye 15:57:26 isn't that intended behavior 15:58:01 should i also report that beogh is underpowered 15:58:04 in exchange 16:03:53 -!- neunon has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in] 16:04:15 -!- Serfuzz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:06:15 -!- russianslayer229 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:10:11 -!- DracoOmega has joined ##crawl-dev 16:11:30 -!- TenOfSwords is now known as HangedMan 16:11:35 -!- Aryth has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:21:20 -!- noppa354 has quit [Quit: Page closed] 16:24:27 -!- mumra_ has joined ##crawl-dev 16:24:36 -!- mumra has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:24:52 -!- Wehk has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:26:43 -!- morphy has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:27:26 -!- mumra_ is now known as mumra 16:38:27 some12fat2move: I like the idea :) 16:39:35 or galefury's 3.5 variant, I'm not sure. But the formula is pretting good I think 16:39:42 pretty 16:41:03 anyone looking into #6646? 16:41:22 seems like an important fix 16:42:16 maybe we should give DracoOmega commit rights, he makes too many patches :) 16:42:37 Hehe 16:42:55 -!- WalkerBoh has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:44:12 sorry, DracoOmega needs to make a nethack variant before he can get commit rights 16:44:28 Dang 16:44:41 oh, that's why st_ isn't a dev either 16:45:49 you mean all this time i should have been working on elliotthack?!?!?! 16:46:20 how's that vehamut patch 16:47:04 -!- nicolae- has joined ##crawl-dev 16:47:36 that's elliptic's problem 16:49:32 -!- anidude has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:51:12 -!- eeviac has joined ##crawl-dev 16:51:35 some12fat2move: don't worry if you don't get immediate feedback. Some devs read the backlog, so you may get some later 16:52:08 okay, should I keep checking here? 16:53:01 -!- eeviac has quit [Client Quit] 16:53:19 -!- eeviac has joined ##crawl-dev 16:54:17 you can check the logs (linked in the topic) 16:55:53 oh that's cool, thanks 16:56:18 (I have a lot to learn about iirc) 16:56:30 (er, irc) 16:57:49 so there's no need for me to bring this to mantis? 16:58:03 -!- Namey has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:02:38 -!- st_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:03:05 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 17:03:09 -!- Cab_ is now known as Guest84458 17:03:29 you would post on mantis if you'd written a patch, or if you were reporting a bug 17:04:43 sometimes devs have posted "implementables" on mantis if a feature has been agreed on and just needs somebody to implement 17:05:48 but really, what are you looking for? are you wanting someone to give the go-ahead for you to write the patch? or are you wanting someone to say "ok i like this enough to code it"? 17:06:17 -!- Guest84458 has quit [Client Quit] 17:07:05 (i mean, you don't need someone to give you permission to write a patch, but it could be a waste of your time if it didn't get accepted for any reaason) 17:07:47 -!- Elkan has quit [Quit: Quitte] 17:08:20 well I wouldn't really know how to code it so I guess this is wanting someone to do so 17:08:31 therefore this wouldn't belong on the mantis 17:08:46 okay thanks for the explanation 17:08:56 no, i wouldn't post on mantis 17:09:20 you could write something up on the dev wiki, since tavern threads tend to get lost and forgotten after not very long 17:12:11 but there isn't like a set process for "submit an idea, get it implemented" -- either someone will see your idea here / on the wiki / in the tavern and think it's good enough and worth it to code it; 17:12:13 or at some point in the future someone might be looking in general at stat reform and take all available ideas into consideration 17:13:11 in which case they would probably at some point read through this wiki page: https://crawl.develz.org/wiki/doku.php?id=dcss:brainstorm:mutation:stats 17:13:23 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 17:14:39 so i would at the least add your proposal under Str on that page 17:16:13 Hmmm okay, so basically it gets implemented when a dev feels like implementing it, with the suggester's role being to put the idea in the various repositories of ideas 17:18:42 yeah, nobody gets "assigned" features, and it's not like anyone is getting paid for the work ... stuff will get implemented if a dev thinks it's important enough, or just likes the idea enough to spend time on it 17:19:19 and stat reform is a fairly big thing both in terms of the time it will take to implement, and the potential effect it could have on game balance 17:19:31 or if the implementable is "fix something that needs to be fixed before trunk with something that was added in trunk" 17:20:31 yeah, usually in that case someone has already taken responsibility for the thing by implementing it in the first place 17:20:42 well, actually, some12fat2move's proposal takes 5 minutes to code, so the issue isn't really the implementation 17:21:25 what's the proposal? 17:21:55 change the str requirement for armour 17:22:17 https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=6944 17:22:18 https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=6944 17:22:26 aevp=(3evp^2)/str 17:22:39 oh, right, that thread 17:23:28 that sounds pretty good to me, I think it's worth testing 17:23:59 So far nobody seems to have a problem with it 17:24:47 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 17:24:57 -!- bmfx has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 17:25:00 I think minmay's objection is reasonable but I still think it sounds better than the current system (and apparently he does too) 17:25:16 IIRC elliptic had some suggestions about the aevp formula a while ago, maybe he has a comment? 17:25:40 oh, I haven't heard about that, sounds interesting :) 17:26:20 -!- syllogism has quit [] 17:26:27 despite what I said on the tavern, I think I like Galefury's 3.5 version a bit more. Makes str a bit more significant. 17:27:12 or maybe 4 :) 17:27:22 -!- Serfuzz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:27:27 how about 27 17:27:42 you can't go wrong with 27 17:27:43 well, that sure would make strength significant lol 17:28:35 -!- SurpriseTRex has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 17:30:46 btw did you see the attack delay formula I posted in the fighting reform thread? 17:31:42 yeah, I did 17:31:48 probably not very good 17:32:15 Well, my latest proposal goes in the opposite direction by increasing the differences between weapons 17:32:42 http://fooplot.com/#W3sidHlwZSI6MCwiZXEiOiJtYXgoNy14LzIsMykiLCJjb2xvciI6IiMwMDAwMDAifSx7InR5cGUiOjAsImVxIjoibWF4KDEzLXgvMiw3KSIsImNvbG9yIjoiIzAwMDAwMCJ9LHsidHlwZSI6MCwiZXEiOiJtYXgoMjAteC8yLDcpIiwiY29sb3IiOiIjMDAwMDAwIn0seyJ0eXBlIjowLCJlcSI6IjcvKDErMip4LzI3KSIsImNvbG9yIjoiI0ZDMDMwMyJ9LHsidHlwZSI6MCwiZXEiOiIyNS8oMSsyKngvMjcpIiwiY29sb3IiOiIjRjcwNTA1In0seyJ0eXBlIjowLCJlcSI6IjE1LygxKzIqeC8yNykiLCJjb2xvciI6IiNGQzBBMEEifSx7InR5cGUiOjEw 17:32:49 wow 17:33:02 That's a rather long hashg 17:33:06 the heck? 17:33:11 -!- nooodl has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:33:16 sorry 17:33:17 https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?p=93648#p93648 17:33:22 -!- ldf has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:33:39 my idea with that formula was basically to take the fast-weapons-at-low-skill, big-weapons-at-high-skill idea and take it to the extreme 17:35:24 does that make the choice very obvious then 17:35:27 doesn't* 17:35:45 well, not when you're at medium skill 17:35:50 I don't see why weapon choice needs to be made highly different than it is now, frankly. It feels dynamic enough to me 17:36:00 With plenty of room for different characters wanting different things 17:36:02 yeah I like it too 17:36:09 except for the problem of breakpoints 17:36:16 I don't see any problem with it either 17:36:19 -!- russianslayer229 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:36:47 i'd be much happier with just communicating said breakpoints to players than with reinventing this wheel 17:36:56 saying "you hit minimum delay with this weapon at 12 skill" in the description is a better solution that throwing everything out and starting again 17:37:03 since it probably will break game balance for several major releases 17:37:34 Yes, I agree on both counts 17:38:12 How conservative 17:38:15 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 17:38:21 we're ##crawl-dev 17:38:22 are we doing a nethack variant here? 17:38:23 :) 17:38:46 yes. lets instead do change for the sake of change 17:39:18 Well, I am not inherantly opposed to any change, but also do not see a compelling reason for change here, currently 17:39:20 well, idc about change or status quo but I will say that the delay formula makes for some interesting tossups in gameplay 17:39:24 /topic Official GruntHack development channel 17:39:49 let's spend a lot of time changing something that doesn't need changing rather than work on things that do 17:40:25 the new formula looks like it would make weapon choice way simpler 17:40:26 in a bit more urgent case, what about the Traps skill? I'm not sure we want 0.12 to have it guarantee non-blink safety with a magic value of 8.3 skill. 17:40:27 ok well, I'm not really surprised about the reaction to the weapon delay change, that's long term indeed 17:40:55 anyway, the armour str requirement change on the other hand is much less controversial 17:41:20 st_: mindelay _does_ need changing, str not really IMO 17:41:52 kilobyte: what implications prevent removing the skill? 17:41:54 27 str for GDA still feels unreasonbale IMO, it's not good enough to demand that 17:42:12 -!- Pthing has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:42:13 the str requirement for armour can really be improved easily I'd say 17:42:26 ChrisOelmueller: good question. What would you propose as a replacement? 17:42:37 give everyone set 5 skill 17:42:54 and don't let it be trained 17:42:57 kilobyte: I can dig up my patch to remove traps skill (and spawning of mechanical traps) if it's urgent 17:43:00 if Traps is to stay one more release, the detection formula needs to be tweaked sure 17:43:20 ChrisOelmueller: XL? Stealth? Removal of traps other than shaft/teleport/alarm and making them undetectable? 17:43:37 (I wrote it according to elliptic's advice on the matter) 17:43:55 there's good reasons to not use xl, stealth, or dex 17:44:27 st_: ie, any trap has a fixed (/Ashenzari) chance to be detected, some just getting detected from a distance? 17:44:49 removing mechanical traps and giving everyone the equivalent of 5 current skill levels might be worth a try 17:45:14 galehar: what do you mean by _armour_ str requirement changes? (Your proposal so far mentions weapons) 17:45:17 I'd vote to tie detection to XL but that seems difficult to relay ingame 17:45:20 this might be a bit radical but what if traps didn't exist in the ground, and instead every step you take has a chance of saying "you stumbled into a trap!" 17:45:44 that would be a good way to get me to quit this game 17:45:47 eeviac: perhaps XL/race, like MR or the baseline for stealth? 17:46:11 kilobyte: another proposal from some12fat2move discussed a bit earlier 17:46:13 kilobyte: https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=6944 17:46:47 we could show trap detection skill with @ 17:47:01 generally, like MR 17:47:24 then we could have trap detection enhancing gear! 17:47:28 (please no) 17:47:44 eeviac: how would step-generated traps be less fun than current system? 17:47:49 galehar: ah, thanks. Sounds less sucky than current state, where you're an idiot if you wear armour without meeting the requirement. 17:49:09 eeviac: +1000 to no trap detection gear 17:49:28 fr wand of secret door detection 17:49:30 I think it's worth testing in trunk, maybe with a higher factor than 3 17:49:50 eeviac: what is a secret door 17:49:59 it's a joke :( 17:50:18 not for me (playing stable) 17:50:43 can we roll stabbing into shortblades someday soon 17:50:45 please 17:51:03 Is there anyone opposed to that? 17:51:21 because I don't see why there would be 17:51:30 sounds good to me. 17:51:54 There's the question of what to do with Felids, but just remove stabbing from this is a simple answer. 17:51:54 eeviac: or perhaps stealth instead 17:52:01 *them 17:52:10 I think the simple answer is best here 17:52:11 eeviac: so stabs with other weapons would still work 17:52:18 hmmm that's an idea 17:52:47 !apt stealth 17:52:48 Stealth: Vp: 5!, Sp: 5!, Na: 5!, Ha: 4, Op: 4, Ko: 4, Fe: 4, DE: 3, DD: 3, HE: 2, Mf: 2, SE: 2, Gh: 2, Te: 1, Hu: 1, Dg: 0, Ds: 0, Dr: 0, HO: -1, Mu: -1, Mi: -1, Og: -1, Ce: -3, Tr: -4* 17:52:54 that' would be a signficant buff to vpen 17:52:59 and it doesn't really need one 17:53:00 current formula already makes short blade (especially dagger) stabbing worlds better than other weapons, so that's probably enough 17:53:25 eeviac: or, even better, min(weapon skill, stealth) 17:53:31 !apt stabbing 17:53:31 Stab: Sp: 4!, Fe: 3, HO: 2, Mf: 2, Ko: 2, Vp: 1, Te: 1, DE: 1, Ha: 0, Op: 0, SE: 0, Dr: 0, Hu: 0, Na: 0, Gh: 0, HE: -1, Mi: -1, Dg: -1, Ds: -1, DD: -1, Mu: -2, Tr: -2, Og: -2, Ce: -3* 17:53:40 how would you explain that ingame 17:53:49 stealth is cheaper 17:53:49 eeviac: so you can't switch to a dagger you don't know how to use for a perfect stab 17:54:15 it would be a balance problem just to merge it into sbl without changing apts I think 17:54:18 shortblades makes more sense in that regard 17:54:27 since stabbing is already very powerful with the good apts that exist there 17:54:40 "min()" may be some other function without a sharp cutoff 17:55:01 I think I'd rather merge stabbing into small blade rather than stealth 17:55:06 do we really want stabs with other weapons to still work? 17:55:13 do other weapon types really need stabbing 17:55:15 yeah 17:55:16 I mean it takes away a bit of the uniqueness of sBl 17:55:30 It's not really normal for anyone to train stabbing a bunch and then use a non-shortblade 17:55:30 some12fat2move: it's strange you don't get any bonus for attacking someone from behind 17:55:37 -!- mumra_ has joined ##crawl-dev 17:55:38 i've been stabbing with a long blade before 17:55:58 yeah that's a good point 17:55:59 the current trend is to have weapon type specific features :) 17:56:49 axes getting magical area attacks is bad enough already 17:56:51 trouble is that without the half-stabs of other weapon types, stealth's usefulness greatly diminishes if you're not using a shortblade 17:57:06 -!- mumra has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:57:37 could keep a stabbing factor for other weapons, and make it depend on the weapon skill 17:57:48 just make it much better for sb 17:58:07 so that would effectively roll stabbing into every weapon skill 17:58:17 yes 17:58:31 but you might adjust some stabbing bonus to compensate 17:58:40 yeah since you'd be getting 2 skills for the price of 1 17:59:05 not entirely 17:59:13 because you still don't get to use the stabs without stealth 17:59:41 well I'm saying you get a level in stabbing skill and a level in weapon skill but only pay exp once instead of twice 17:59:44 well, you don't train stabbing if you don't use a sb anyway 17:59:52 yeah that's true 17:59:59 and there's not much incentive to train sb 18:00:00 adapting sbl apts can just happen 18:01:23 rolling stabbing into every weapon skill seems like a good idea (it would get rid of a skill that's just menu clutter for a large portion of characters) 18:02:12 however it could be instead rolled into just sb, which would make sb more unique but then you have kilobyte's complaint about realism 18:02:14 Well, I don't think the apts necessarily need a whole lot of adjustment if stabbing isn't 1-for-1. (ie: you don't get the equivalent of 10 stabbing skill with 10 short blades skill). Of course, that might reduce the max possible stab from what it used to be, but that also mightn't be a real problem 18:02:35 hmm, let's use the average of the two ideas then: stabbing = (weapon skill + stealth) / 2; we nerf everyone's Sbl and Stealth apts by 1 to compensate. 18:04:20 -!- SurpriseTRex_ has quit [Quit: SurpriseTRex_] 18:10:31 -!- st_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:10:57 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 18:12:10 I like that 18:12:53 can Tr and Ce perhaps keep their current apts 18:12:57 reducing stealth for everyone by 1 sounds great, it would bring it back to 0 for Hu 18:13:03 they're not very likely to suddenly stabdudes 18:13:16 and -5 apts suck 18:13:20 for Sb maybe do it case by base 18:13:29 (as do +5 ones) 18:14:11 -!- Nakatomy has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 18:15:42 wrt ##crawl: do we want "You feel a lump in the pit of your stomach." in troll descriptions, with a hacky way to append it? 18:16:10 or "It is strange and repulsive." for nagas, or "It wants to suck your blood" for vampires 18:16:27 why are they there? 18:18:05 03kilobyte 07* 0.12-a0-2255-gfabc30f: Unremove rock trolls. 10(9 minutes ago, 2 files, 21+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=fabc30f25216 18:18:18 -!- bmfx has quit [Quit: leaving] 18:18:36 i like those descriptions 18:18:50 especially the vampire one 18:19:34 kilobyte: wood golems need the same treatment, don't they? 18:20:00 Well, that would imply some save exists with a wood golem in it, and as we all know, they don't exist :P 18:20:00 obviously nobody had wood golems to convert 18:20:54 nobody had wood golem corpses at least 18:20:56 imo the naga one is kinda weird 18:21:05 rock trolls are especially bad because of zombies 18:21:07 I mean there are stranger and more repulsive things in the dungeon 18:21:56 -!- HellTiger has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.2.0 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/] 18:29:28 -!- mumra_ is now known as mumra 18:33:29 newsflash: local tiles on dual screen still suck halfling ass 18:34:50 so, re-enabling jelly rooms (with ruined walls) in Slime and increased effective depth is cool except for how the jiyva altar can be out of sight and unknown to unspoiled/mapping/whatever people 18:34:51 I somehow thought dual screen (vastly overrated, BTW) is what all cool kids do these days, but as no one seems to scream bloody murder about tiles, it doesn't appear so 18:35:34 kilobyte: what's wrong with it? works for me 18:35:34 HangedMan: you may want to just use regular vaults instead 18:36:00 that is tempting but most of the stuff is already there blehhhhhhhhhhh 18:36:35 probably will just cut jiyva altars out of slime for these blobs 18:40:38 -!- WalkerBoh has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:40:47 mumra: http://angband.pl/tmp/dual_crawl.jpg 18:41:49 kilobyte: oh right. i just have it on one screen. and something else on the other one. 18:42:05 did you configure it by hand? 18:42:09 no 18:42:19 but this is windows 8 (it worked fine on 7 as well) 18:42:20 hmm, that's using the defaults for me 18:43:38 on early Win8 the window tended to go under Windows' taskbar (had no dual screen then), it doesn't seem to happen anymore 18:43:50 quite a bit of the screen is wasted there, though 18:45:06 !tell zaba would a "." instead of "@" and the transparent tag for the vault equate to old doors for special_rooms for the purposes of level connectivity? 18:45:06 HangedMan: OK, I'll let zaba know. 18:45:59 hmm, it seems all programs go under the taskbar if you drag them down. crawl is sized right so that it doesn't matter. 18:46:24 should have F11 for fullscreen which would eliminate the taskbar, e.g. how firefox/chrome do 18:46:45 sadly, Crawl doesn't support any resizing currently 18:47:00 -!- motorbit has quit [Quit: Page closed] 18:47:30 I tried allowing resize, which _instantly_ fixes all issues with dual screen, allows maximizing, etc, but there are some crashes and visual corruption here and there 18:47:38 s/some/many/ 18:54:05 -!- nicolae- has left ##crawl-dev 18:54:32 -!- ontoclasm has joined ##crawl-dev 18:56:50 -!- vidiny has quit [Quit: [19:23] don't they have refill machines in ikea [19:24] bet those muricans took their vases to those straight away after paying] 18:58:52 -!- Koolguydude has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90 [Firefox 18.0.2/20130201065344]] 18:58:58 -!- eeviac has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90 [Firefox 15.0/20120830123745]] 19:01:53 -!- Arkaniad has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 19:04:56 -!- NekoRex has quit [Quit: "All the people will look up and shout 'Save us!', and I'll look down and whisper... 'Nyo.'"] 19:05:49 -!- animegra1pa has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 19:06:25 -!- russianslayer229 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:08:37 -!- anidude_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:10:13 -!- some12fat2move has left ##crawl-dev 19:12:22 -!- eXcel has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:20:50 -!- rast has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90 [Firefox 18.0.2/20130201065344]] 19:23:11 -!- FaMott has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:35:27 -!- Kellhus has quit [Quit: Page closed] 19:36:15 -!- Poncheis has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:44:23 options: is there any reason anyone would disable easy_open? 19:44:42 as it breaks autoexplore and travel, I don't think so 19:44:44 some folks do that, yes 19:45:06 I know absolutego does 19:45:13 specifically for the autoexplore behaviour 19:45:18 so you can buff up etc. before opening doors 19:45:34 I think it should really just affect autoexplore/travel and not the actual opening 19:45:44 (I might even use it then) 19:46:01 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 19:46:23 * kilobyte mutters something about a bunch of masochists. 19:47:01 well if there was an option to make autoexplore stopping in front of doors, then another hit opening it, i guess many players would want that 19:47:07 easy_armour/easy_unequip then (disabling means you need to take off armour/jewelry before changing them) 19:47:08 so it's definitely feasible 19:50:55 -!- Fhqwhgads_ has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:51:08 can you think for any use case for forcing manual removal? 19:51:10 -!- Fhqwhgads__ is now known as Fhqwhgads_ 19:51:59 items where it matters (Contam, inscribed) already have a question 19:52:05 for the unequip stuff? no idea, sorry 19:52:11 not even sure what it does 19:52:44 you can't W or P if the slot in question has something else worn 19:56:08 -!- Froggeryz has quit [] 19:56:49 -!- nicolae- has joined ##crawl-dev 19:59:32 -!- scummos has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 20:00:02 -!- kek has quit [Quit: Kicked by KickServ] 20:03:34 -!- nicolae- has left ##crawl-dev 20:04:52 -!- yxhuvud has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 20:08:13 -!- edlothiol has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 20:13:55 -!- home has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 20:15:14 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:22:52 -!- Zermako has quit [] 20:25:06 -!- Arkaniad|Laptop is now known as Arkaniad 20:25:21 -!- Arkaniad is now known as Arkaniad|Laptop 20:27:23 -!- pelotron has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 20:36:32 -!- russianslayer229 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:38:22 -!- Arkaniad|Laptop has quit [Quit: I've killed the senator.] 20:38:45 -!- crate has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:40:32 -!- sbanwart has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 20:42:08 -!- morphy_ has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:45:03 -!- Fhqwhgads_ has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 20:45:08 -!- Fhqwhgads__ is now known as Fhqwhgads_ 20:46:27 -!- bmfx has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:46:55 -!- jday_ has joined ##crawl-dev 20:49:28 -!- Beamed has quit [Quit: Page closed] 20:51:54 -!- SamB has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:05:43 -!- SamB has joined ##crawl-dev 21:13:21 -!- SamB has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:15:27 -!- MarvinPA_ has joined ##crawl-dev 21:15:33 -!- SamB has joined ##crawl-dev 21:18:57 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 21:18:57 -!- MarvinPA_ is now known as MarvinPA 21:22:39 -!- sbluen has quit [Quit: Page closed] 21:23:00 -!- remyroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:25:37 -!- Leafsnail has quit [Quit: Give a man a fish and he will eat for a day. Teach him how to fish, and he will sit in a boat and drink beer all day] 21:27:26 -!- caleba has quit [Quit: caleba] 21:29:01 -!- Yermak has quit [Quit: Page closed] 21:32:41 -!- MaxFrost has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:40:10 03mumra 07* 0.12-a0-2256-g12fe981: Implement code rooms. There is an occasional problem with how rooms place. 10(3 weeks ago, 7 files, 286+ 254-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=12fe98179f3e 21:40:10 03mumra 07* 0.12-a0-2257-g5255a7f: Room analysis more fully implemented. Rooms still not placing. 10(2 weeks ago, 2 files, 128+ 91-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=5255a7fa718b 21:40:10 03mumra 07* 0.12-a0-2258-gd99ad1f: Mostly get layout working 10(2 weeks ago, 3 files, 175+ 196-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=d99ad1f1310c 21:40:10 03mumra 07* 0.12-a0-2259-gdce5add: Mostly finish layout. Multiple doors and windows now get carved, in incidental walls too. Still a problem with inverted normals on some open rooms. 10(2 weeks ago, 3 files, 74+ 44-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=dce5add5357a 21:40:10 03mumra 07* 0.12-a0-2260-g23e4131: Disable debug prints 10(2 weeks ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=23e413170183 21:40:10 03mumra 07* 0.12-a0-2261-g341bf52: Adding various methods to improve and make new layouts. Callbackify wall decorators. Start restructuring some methods into namespaces to clear up global namespace. 10(8 days ago, 4 files, 266+ 54-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=341bf52f362c 21:40:10 03mumra 07* 0.12-a0-2262-gc6b3472: Edit a slightly odd wall in a vault 10(8 days ago, 1 file, 1+ 1-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=c6b34721ed78 21:40:10 03mumra 07* 0.12-a0-2263-g57c76e2: Fix a bug preventing recognising some connectable walls. 10(8 days ago, 5 files, 60+ 19-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=57c76e25e977 21:40:10 03mumra 07* 0.12-a0-2264-ga2e6731: Refactored and cleaned up code to fix bug. Didn't fix it but the code is improved (fixed potential bugs anyway). Tweaked a couple of vaults that caused VETOs. 10(3 days ago, 2 files, 23+ 31-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=a2e673149837 21:40:10 03mumra 07* 0.12-a0-2265-gbf84feb: Actually fix the layout (and disable debug flag) 10(2 days ago, 3 files, 19+ 16-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=bf84feb8576d 21:40:10 ... and 12 more commits 21:40:12 -!- MarvinPA_ has joined ##crawl-dev 21:42:56 -!- glow has quit [Quit: Page closed] 21:42:59 -!- Nightbeer has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:43:11 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:43:11 -!- MarvinPA_ is now known as MarvinPA 21:45:15 03Grunt 07* 0.12-a0-2278-g6218614: A tweak to the just-added vault missed on the first pass. 10(5 minutes ago, 1 file, 2+ 2-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=62186145deed 21:49:58 -!- Chase is now known as ChaseSP 21:50:20 03Grunt 07* 0.12-a0-2279-g50f0ea9: One more tweak to hangedman_ per request of author. 10(4 minutes ago, 1 file, 5+ 5-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=50f0ea988eff 21:52:37 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:57:45 -!- Arkaniad has quit [Quit: I've killed the senator.] 22:00:29 03mumra 07* 0.12-a0-2280-g4d57a08: Tweak some vaults to solve placement problems 10(74 minutes ago, 2 files, 21+ 18-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=4d57a08ff663 22:00:29 03mumra 07* 0.12-a0-2281-gc8febb1: Randomly place stairs in 80% of floor vault rooms. Probability can be tweaked in v_layouts.lua (stair_chance). This fairly well guarantees that stairs will never place in the corridors, even if vaults don't have them. It should overall reduce the likelihood of stairs being placed in chokepoints since vault stairs are actually more likely to have chokepoints! 10(20 minutes ago, 5 files, 47+ 19-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=c8febb1209de 22:00:29 03mumra 07* 0.12-a0-2282-gf524965: Some vaults vaults 10(9 minutes ago, 5 files, 224+ 34-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=f5249656dcfb 22:00:29 03Grunt 07* 0.12-a0-2283-g14445a6: Whitespace fixes. 10(5 minutes ago, 6 files, 31+ 35-) 13http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=commitdiff;h=14445a6abf23 22:06:31 -!- lobf has quit [Quit: lobf] 22:06:40 -!- russianslayer229 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:06:40 -!- GuraKKa has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:13:23 -!- magistern has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 22:22:47 -!- hoody has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:31:37 -!- bonghitz has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:45:03 -!- scorchgeek has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:48:20 -!- DracoOmega has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:52:57 -!- iasov has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:53:15 -!- Sequell has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:53:42 -!- Sequell has joined ##crawl-dev 22:55:38 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 22:58:12 -!- HungryBG has quit [Quit: Page closed] 23:00:26 -!- HangedMan has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:02:06 -!- _dd has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:12:47 -!- bonghitz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:16:15 Doom Cacodemon cameo? (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=6656) by Bloax 23:19:32 -!- shirish has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 23:25:08 -!- dtsund has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:26:52 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: CADENZA-CLASS CLOCKWORK KNIGHT--OPERATION TERMINATED] 23:30:12 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 23:31:14 -!- hangedman has joined ##crawl-dev 23:31:27 -!- shirish has joined ##crawl-dev 23:32:32 -!- blackcustard has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:36:48 -!- russianslayer229 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:46:14 -!- ToastyP has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:47:41 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 23:48:27 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 23:50:11 -!- Pedjt has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 23:51:31 -!- SurpriseTRex has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 23:52:06 -!- Arkaniad has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 23:54:34 -!- clinew has quit [Quit: leaving]