00:00:23 -!- tollymain has quit [Quit: tollymain] 00:05:23 -!- codrus has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 00:06:37 -!- remyroy has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:07:48 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 00:15:55 -!- kittykai has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:24:08 -!- bh has joined ##crawl-dev 00:26:18 ??toxic radiance 00:26:19 olgrebs toxic radiance[1/1]: Poisons everything in sight (including you). Does not work on things that are resistant to poison or are invisible (including you), or enemies that are submerged. Inflicts stronger poison half of the time (not including you). Level 4 Poison spell, not very good. Stacks now! Still not very good! 00:27:38 -!- jeanjacques has joined ##crawl-dev 00:27:58 monqy: so far this spell meets dpeg's "high level spells should be flashy" criterion, but it so comically over powered 00:29:36 how does it compare to the other level 8 spells, and also similar differently-leveled spells 00:29:48 It's the most powerful spell in the game. 00:30:02 I retrieved the orb of zot without fighting. 00:30:12 how does it compare to ddoor 00:30:25 don't know. I've never played a high level necro. 00:30:40 probably better because there's no real downside 00:31:29 o 00:31:59 I could make the duration very low and make it only probabilistically blink targets 00:32:33 make it blink stuff close to you 00:32:48 exactly. The closer it is the more likely it is to blink 00:32:57 I suppose it should also make you glow 00:32:58 no i mean 00:33:05 make it blink stuff that's far away from you 00:33:07 such that it gets closer 00:33:14 oh. That's gross :) 00:33:24 that's a chei power isn't it 00:33:27 sshhhh 00:33:35 elliott: I should know. 00:34:52 -!- voxxik has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:34:54 -!- Pingas_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:34:55 -!- antrees_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:35:10 -!- Pingas_ has joined ##crawl-dev 00:35:36 -!- voxxik has joined ##crawl-dev 00:37:19 is controlling time allowed to fall under tloc? "time stop" is always a fun spell in games that have it... also probably impossible to balance 00:37:31 -!- us17 has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:37:43 a long time ago there was a patch that gave chei something like that, but it just worked like a weird version of cBlink 00:37:50 that would be a good chei power imo 00:37:51 -!- Miron has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 00:38:31 evilmike, elliott: Freeze time, make everything invicible and give the player 3-5 turns to do whatever? 00:38:46 it sounds totally wrong for a spell though, just flavour and mechanics-wise 00:38:53 seems really much more like a god power 00:38:54 sure 00:38:59 it would be interesting though 00:38:59 well. my internet is going to sleep 00:39:00 note that with chei 3-5 turns are not much, assuming you go by real time 00:39:06 -!- tw_ has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:39:20 -!- bh has quit [Quit: bye] 00:39:29 bh: something like that yeah 00:39:33 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 00:39:44 or maybe it could freeze time except for a small "bubble" around you, where you could fight monsters 00:41:40 no reason it couldn't be a god power, really. I just dont think this concept works as well when you include slow movement 00:42:55 it would work well if chei's theme was just "time" 00:42:58 rather than time and slowness 00:47:38 -!- lexackson has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:00:49 -!- Cryp71c has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:07:30 -!- zell65 has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.89 [Firefox 16.0.2/20121024073032]] 01:10:07 -!- evilmike has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:10:43 -!- Shovelmint has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 01:13:01 -!- ophanim has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:14:19 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: CADENZA-CLASS CLOCKWORK KNIGHT--OPERATION TERMINATED] 01:18:55 -!- Idontexist has quit [Client Quit] 01:19:18 -!- dtsund has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:21:55 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 01:27:49 -!- wasd22 has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:43:54 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 01:45:51 -!- tensorpudding has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 01:47:21 -!- whog has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 01:58:00 -!- thened has quit [Quit: thened] 02:03:33 -!- cosh has joined ##crawl-dev 02:03:40 -!- elliott is now known as enlightening 02:03:58 -!- enlightening has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:05:53 -!- Roarke has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:06:02 -!- BirdoPrey has quit [Quit: BirdoPrey] 02:08:44 -!- Yen has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:10:45 Pac the Merfolkian Porcupine (L27 MfAM) (Zot:4) 02:11:00 sigh 02:11:30 -!- Transfusion has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 02:12:37 -!- Transfusion has quit [Changing host] 02:19:55 -!- lexackson has joined ##crawl-dev 02:22:03 -!- SkaryMonk has joined ##crawl-dev 02:24:33 -!- Zaba has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 02:33:11 -!- Zaba has joined ##crawl-dev 02:34:46 -!- SkaryMonk has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:35:51 -!- monqy has quit [Quit: hello] 02:49:45 -!- bonghitz has quit [Quit: bonghitz] 03:03:23 -!- ChrisOelmueller has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 03:04:22 -!- ChrisOelmueller has joined ##crawl-dev 03:04:37 -!- ChrisOelmueller is now known as Guest41192 03:13:38 -!- domiryuu has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 03:16:06 -!- virigoth has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 03:30:24 -!- Tenaya has quit [Quit: Page closed] 03:31:59 -!- phyphor has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:32:17 -!- phyphor has joined ##crawl-dev 03:33:57 -!- Zaba has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 03:38:22 -!- Zaba has joined ##crawl-dev 03:45:03 -!- edlothiol has joined ##crawl-dev 03:54:31 -!- Ragdoll has quit [Quit: Page closed] 04:10:03 -!- myp has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:21:39 -!- SkaryMonk has joined ##crawl-dev 04:33:28 -!- Noom_afk has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 04:35:31 -!- Nomi has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 04:38:04 -!- Silurio has quit [Quit: Page closed] 04:38:06 -!- Sab0t has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:38:28 -!- dtsund has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 04:40:05 Hey, how long has ';' been partial pick-up? That's brilliant! 04:40:48 Ah, I was confused. I thought it solved a problem from user testing, but the problem was with partial drop, not pick-up. 04:41:34 -!- pointsofdata has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 04:54:40 -!- wasd22 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:55:22 -!- yogidabear has quit [Quit: Page closed] 04:57:05 -!- nooodl has joined ##crawl-dev 05:00:22 -!- bmfx has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:04:13 -!- Vandal has joined ##crawl-dev 05:07:16 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 05:19:21 -!- DracoOmega has quit [Quit: Leaving] 05:20:07 -!- SkaryMonk has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:20:52 -!- SkaryMonk has joined ##crawl-dev 05:28:14 -!- SkaryMonk has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:28:20 -!- Sab0t has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 05:30:18 -!- SkaryMonk has joined ##crawl-dev 05:32:31 -!- pointsofdata has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 05:37:18 -!- lexackson has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:38:31 -!- Blazinghand has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 05:39:10 -!- popbob has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 05:40:50 -!- DainDwarf has quit [Changing host] 05:44:43 -!- yogaFLAME has quit [] 05:50:59 -!- smeea has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:55:16 -!- ark____ has joined ##crawl-dev 06:00:04 OSX builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.12-a0-941-gd0e6560 06:13:39 -!- Rewans has quit [] 06:13:47 -!- _D_ has quit [Quit: leaving] 06:31:27 -!- Blazinghand_ has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 06:32:23 -!- tollymain has quit [Quit: tollymain] 06:42:54 -!- Miron1 has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:49:13 -!- ketsa has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 06:51:52 -!- Miron has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 06:57:04 Keskitalo: it's been a while. partial pick-up has been added to ; to maintain interface parity with tiles in which you can partial pick-up with ctrl-click 07:03:14 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 07:06:54 -!- keszocze has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:07:11 -!- dagonfive has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:13:14 -!- tollymain has quit [Quit: tollymain] 07:14:34 -!- Porost has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:17:07 Keskitalo: I hate the new ; -- it overloads a pretty useful command, "look here", with some totally unrelated functionality 07:17:20 that, even worse, creates a prompt 07:21:36 there's a new base key free: 's'; with searching doing nothing now 07:25:34 -!- PowerWord has quit [Quit: Oops. My brain just hit a bad sector] 07:26:52 -!- dosman711` is now known as dosman711 07:27:20 -!- smeea has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:29:10 except people used it as wait 99% more often than they used it to search 07:29:11 st_: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 07:29:11 st_: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 07:30:53 yeah, how has 's' changed? it still does the exact same thing as '.' and some people use one and some the other 07:31:57 -!- dpeg has joined ##crawl-dev 07:32:04 last time I took a census of which one people used to wait, it seemed pretty equally divided 07:32:36 so I'd be reluctant to mess up 50% of players by changing either of them 07:32:58 same with g, 07:33:33 st_: great c-r-d mail btw, many thanks 07:35:53 With searching gone, we could use a new mnemonic for 's'. 07:36:37 "stay in place" 07:37:14 -!- Cryp71c has joined ##crawl-dev 07:37:34 elliptic: good one 07:37:39 searching gone? 07:38:03 bhaak: While you are discussing the merits of Sokoban on r.g.r.n, progress goes on in Crawl land :) 07:38:30 butbutbut secret doors! you can't remove one of the biggest annoyances eva! 07:39:35 dpeg: it's actually a reverse psychology discussion. discussing things one of the participant doesn't know have been implemented in modern forks already :) 07:39:45 c-r-d should be linked in the sidebar I think+ 07:39:46 ? 07:39:48 Well, you can't remove Sokoban it seems (although I remember a Sokoban-free Nethack), whereas Crawl goes and removes searching. 07:41:30 * kilobyte can't still get what was the point of _adding_ Sokoban. 07:41:35 ; don't only do look here, it also autopickup, which was the reasoning to add partial pickup to it 07:41:43 dpeg: but you can remove LUCK PENALTIES 07:42:11 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:42:12 I follow kilobyte: imo, Sokoban was a bad idea in the first place, and then riddled with a horrible execution on top of it. 07:42:48 I use ; 07:42:51 that's the nethack spirit. don't remove what's broken, try fixing it with more broken stuff. sometimes that cancels out 07:43:26 I love the vorpal idea! 07:43:45 staves could get a trip-effect maybe? 07:43:55 Short term stun? 07:44:28 So it'd be good to attack differnet enemies around you, and it'd keep them all stunned a lot of the time. 07:45:02 ghallberg: something like this has been proposed for M&F on the forum 07:45:11 hmm yeah 07:45:23 I think I was against it back thn... 07:45:31 Didn't think about being able to spread it out. 07:45:50 But I guess the optimal tactic is still standing in a corridor stunning one monster, 07:45:58 ghallberg: in contrast to cleaving, you'd still prefer 1-on-1 07:45:59 galehar: autopickup works fine, and in line with "look what's here" since it works same as if you stepped on the square. It never inconsistently leaves you with a prompt some time, and without one the rest. 07:46:02 so it's just damage reduction... 07:46:20 dpeg: Yeah I realized that after thinking it through. 07:46:26 kilobyte: i think they thought it was a neat idea and at a cursory glance it fits neatly into nethack. but all the spoily bits are just horrible. it does fill a hole of content in the early game but that's about it what can be said in favor of it 07:46:39 I'm still thinking attack behind and in fron could be cool... 07:46:54 bhaak: the freebies are big part of the problem, imo 07:47:26 bhaak: also gameplay: you need to memorize solutions, or you risk making errors that cost you luck. In most cases there's just one solution, so no thinking is involved. 07:48:11 kilobyte: that's why i removed the luck penalties 07:48:13 that is the curse of fixed content, yes 07:48:43 dpeg: Any comments on attacking both behind and in front on staves? 07:48:57 dpeg: and that's one of the reasons why i removed one level so you only have 3 to the top. the other was ofc that sinking feeling "oh no, not ANOTHER level" 07:49:05 ghallberg: that'd probably be alright, but it's a lot more niche than cleaving, of course 07:49:18 bhaak: Derek was radical. I liked that =) 07:49:27 dpeg: But it'd be useable in corridors. 07:49:30 yes! 07:49:35 * kilobyte has a counterproposal: reaching is tedious interface-wise, cleave has balance issues. What about making basic compat simple? 07:49:47 s/compat/combat/, duh 07:50:39 dpeg: derek was radical? not with sokoban! he only randomized the sokoban prize, that's all he changed 07:50:43 kilobyte: could be done, but melee is a large part of the game, and many would be happy to have actual options there (beyond "should I take this weapon with paraters A,B,C or that with A',B',C', a choice which doesn't matter in the end anyway) 07:50:49 kilobyte: It's simple now, and pretty boring. 07:50:56 bhaak: ah, sorry. I thought he cut it. 07:51:02 bhaak: can't you just remove it completely and put a themed mini-branch of some kind instead? 07:51:20 dpeg: he wanted to but he didn't find a good replacement 07:51:35 there was no replacement in 3.2.3 either 07:51:48 ghallberg: boring only if you think about every blow, something you'd have to do if complex moves are involved 07:51:58 Also, tab helps with reaching, and cleaving balance can be addressed - it's far from hopeless 07:52:01 dpeg: they didn't know then what they were missing ;) 07:52:27 dpeg: even if these two stay, we don't need to make situation worse by adding more 07:52:33 more complexity, I mean 07:53:05 kilobyte: I would certainly agree that no move goes in until cleaving is sorted out (or gone, which I don't hope happens) 07:53:20 kilobyte: as it is now in unnethack, it IS a completely normal mini-branch. if you don't want to do the puzzles you can invest some resources to quickstep up to the top level. 07:53:23 even relatively simple moves add complexity: stun means you want to alternate blows between monsters who are not stunned at the moment 07:53:32 I think the reason it's boring now is that you just hti a monster until it dies. 07:53:45 tab is a symptom of melee being boring. 07:53:52 ghallberg and kilobyte speak about the same thing: two sides of the coin 07:54:16 Alternative: remove melee, only way to damage thigns is spells. 07:55:02 ghallberg: hitting it until it dies is not that bad if it costs you negligible time and mental effort -- mainly keeping track of your hp 07:55:20 ghallberg: there's an enum for SPELL_MELEE :) 07:55:29 you can still do that even with weapon effects 07:55:56 if you want to mindless tab stuff then do that 07:56:20 -!- kek has joined ##crawl-dev 07:56:45 tab is mindlessly stupid, could be improved. Like, its insistency to keep beating that slightly wounded ufetubus instead of the ancient lich next to it. 07:57:00 I don't see a ton of flaws in the current melee system, aside from the massive advantages yielded to corridor fighting. 07:57:09 s/flaws/crippling flaws 07:57:34 Another pet peeve of mine, that ufetubus shouldn't even be there! 07:57:54 Monsters still spawn after they become completely irrelevant. 07:58:52 wasn't there guy in 10th century England who kept a whole army for an hour on a bridge? They had no archers, and finally someone went under the bridge and speared him through a hole. 07:59:12 I mean, corridor fighting _is_ realistic. It still doesn't make for good gameplay. 07:59:17 ghallberg, are you talking about a ufetubus spawning naturally, or the ancient liche summoning it instead of doing something more dangerous? 07:59:28 Cryp71c: I meant normal spawning :) 07:59:50 Though i guess the summoning is pretty boring too. 08:00:28 kilobyte, I'd say that an improvement for corridor fighting would be to have monsters who are blocked in the back search for a path to the rear of the player, but then players would just lure monsters to a dead end they can back up into. 08:00:38 (ancient liches do not summon ufetubi) 08:00:39 yeah. And note that _all_ end-game enemies other than Antaeus are summoners. 08:00:45 kilobyte: gloorx 08:00:51 kilobyte: orbs of fire 08:00:54 (Lom Lobon has ball lightning which is some kind of half-summon) 08:01:02 right, gloorx, sorry 08:01:07 kilobyte: electric golem 08:01:26 electric gloorx 08:01:29 orbs don't really spawn as single enemies, just rarely in Zot:1-4 08:01:54 so they're mostly a part of a team rather than bosses of their own 08:02:47 usually there are multiple monsters around at once, yes 08:03:47 I don't think that corridors are really that big an issue... if we want to see people using them less, then we should change level generation to have fewer of them 08:04:06 I think it'd be kind of neat to have a boss who did not depend (or actively prevented) anything but a 1v1 fight (so once you entered its chamber, it would lock the doors (turn them into iron gates?). He would have abdjuration and wouldn't summon anything. 08:05:03 * dpeg whispers something about Zig arena levels 08:05:04 elliptic, I'm not sure that's a complete fix, since many lair layouts have very few 1-wide corridors (Though it does have many chokes) and you can still get by without too much trouble. 08:05:12 Cryp71c: ? 08:05:27 IMO players should be able to "get by" :P 08:06:15 lair does have occasional choke points, but usually a single elephant is enough to trample you out of them 08:06:19 lol, well I'm certainly not meaning that we should royally screw players who corridor fight, but I think there should be an inherent risk to fighting in a corridor indefinitely 08:06:40 ancient liches: oh right, because cacodemons lost summons. Especially in the Abyss, there's always some hellwing or neqoxec nearby, though. 08:06:52 "ok, I can corridor fight, but if I'm here too long, I'm almost certainly going to get hopelessly surrounded" 08:07:07 kilobyte: I mean, you can get an ancient lich -> shadow demon -> ynoxinul -> ufetubus chain still 08:07:13 dpeg, I'm not good enough to be in zigs regularly, are there 1v1 zig levels? 08:07:18 er, ynoxinul 08:09:07 Cryp71c: I don't really understand the "hopelessly surrounded" bit here... in a corridor there are at most two adjacent monsters, so that's never going to be the case 08:09:33 elliptic, as hopelessly surrounded as one can be in a corridor. 08:10:35 Take for example around d:22 or 23, when frost and fire giants become regular occurrences (especially with ogre packs, for whatever reason)...even as a stabby-char (SpEn) with good gear, I can sword-of-speed (or just EH+stab) my way through a pack like that one monster at a time, requiring a few casts of EH for each monster (because of resists). 08:10:53 anyway I still don't really understand the corridor hate... sure, it usually makes sense to fight in one if it isn't too hard to get to one, but I see this as a good thing (there are interesting decisions about whether to try to run past those monsters and give free hits so that you can fight in a corridor) 08:11:18 combat would be boring if every level was completely wide open, we want variety... and this means some corridors 08:11:53 note that we also have lots of monsters who can attack through other monsters in a corridor, either with reaching or smite-targetted attacks 08:12:35 I'm not saying we should reduce corridor generation, but at present, once you reach a corridor (which is almost always done without compromising any degree of safety), there is absolutely no penalty for remaining there indefinitely, since monsters line up to be carefully and procedurally slaughtered. 08:13:14 sure there is a penalty... the monsters are hitting you, your HP might get low, a whole line of monsters can see you and smite you, etc 08:13:43 in many situations you should stay in a corridor, sure, but it isn't this mindless autowin thing you seem to think it is 08:13:47 That's not a penalty or inherent risk of corridor-combat, that's an unavoidable aspect of combat in general. 08:13:53 how about making dodgeing more dwarf fortress like? where you actually take a step in a random direction, maybe even swapping position with the monster? :) 08:14:10 that'd surround you eventually 08:14:13 :9 08:15:25 Cryp71c: but there are non-corridor situations that have other advantages... for instance, the ability to easily break line of sight with monsters, the presence of stairs, and so on 08:15:57 or maybe you are a caster with fireball... then corridors are actively bad 08:16:12 because you can't hit that adjacent monster without hitting yourself as well 08:16:26 or maybe you have a friend who wants to fight also 08:19:06 yeah, i think corridors are mostly okay 08:19:08 and again, getting to a corridor in the first place often has some cost 08:19:34 elliptic: not against normal speed melee enemies 08:19:45 elliptic, so those sorts of PCs would actively avoid fighting in corridors (in general) since its not beneficial to their archtype...that's fine (even desirable). But for bolt-casters (to a slight degree), but primariliy for melee fighters (which is 1/3, maybe 1/2? of PCs) who want to engage a non-trivial group of monsters (so they're not running, they're not fleeing to stairs or trying to avoid LOS, they want to kill a g 08:19:45 roup of monsters) 08:19:47 (haha, food and piety) 08:19:47 alefury: sure it does, if they are between you and the corridor 08:19:54 but why would they be? 08:20:01 -!- Mottie has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 08:20:17 of course it happens sometimes, and if there is only one monster around corridors are irrelevant anyway 08:20:27 They will never chose anything but a corridor engagement and they will remain there indefinitely until either the monsters are dead or they need to flee (low hp, etc.). 08:20:30 if theres more than one, there is very often a cost to getting to a corridor 08:20:34 -!- G-Flex has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:20:34 what are these groups of melee-only fighters anyway 08:20:39 these things are pretty rare in crawl 08:20:40 battle of Stamford Bridge, by the way. The guy used an axe; the typical Viking axe at the time had a very long shaft though. 08:20:50 orcs have wizards and priests, gnolls have reaching, etc 08:20:58 Cryp71c: that's simply not true 08:20:59 alefury: also, after the early game relatively few levels are rich in corridors 08:21:07 roughly 90% of lair, which has few corridors 08:21:12 Cryp71c: please stop making blanket statements like that, crawl is a much more complicated game 08:21:20 alefury: many lair monsters are fast 08:21:21 ugly things are pretty common 08:21:50 also ogre packs (minus the mage, who can or will usually not shoot through allies) 08:22:15 corridors ALWAYS give advantages, with NO EXCEPTIONS. Especially slime creatures! 08:23:07 i dont really mind the corridors, but i also wouldnt mind there being a few more smiters, or monsters with "blink behind" or something 08:23:12 slime creatures, smiting, and reaching, any other crawl aspects which specifically discourage corridor fighting? 08:23:13 (with Agony just so even this blanket statement is not absolute :p) 08:23:34 area spells 08:23:48 allies 08:24:00 giving lrd to monsters would be neat btw 08:24:01 other smite-type attacks 08:24:05 someone should put that to use already 08:24:15 needing to stay in one place 08:24:43 (like, it's really common that you want to run away, even when you already have a perfect corridor 08:24:44 ) 08:25:29 anyway, to get back on topic, i think it is fine if some combat moves are just as good in a corridor as they are in the open, or even if they are better than in the open 08:25:31 oh, also berserk is less good in corridors 08:25:52 because you will likely have to make a lot of non-attack steps forward, and then it will wear off 08:25:56 the carrot gets people only so far, and imo what crawl lacks in the tactical diversity department could use more stick 08:26:17 s/could use/is 08:27:13 -!- dosman711 is now known as dosman|meeting 08:27:26 Perhaps I'm biased, I regularly abuse corridors because I know I'm more or less safe in them, since monsters don't try to find alternate paths when they're blocked...even if a random monster wanders, its still only one and if I need to flee its not a huge impediment. 08:27:45 I can stay in a corridor for hundreds of turns, if necessary (and life permitting) 08:27:50 trying to find alternate paths would usually be the wrong strategy for monsters 08:28:28 because it means they are nowhere in sight when you are injured after killing the monsters that stayed 08:30:56 -!- rchandra has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:33:13 -!- imantor has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 08:33:33 -!- Vandal has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 08:34:27 -!- keszocze has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:37:26 -!- Vandal has joined ##crawl-dev 08:40:35 -!- greensnark has joined ##crawl-dev 08:45:26 elliptic: i think there are some cases where it would make sense to go around 08:46:12 two columns that are diagonally adjacent already make a great chokepoint in crawl 08:46:48 in that case monsters actually do go around, but if the columns are two wide instead of one, they dont 08:47:23 alefury: well, I meant for actual corridors... in situations like that it might be good to make the monsters take the three steps to go around, yes 08:48:13 -!- Tijol1 has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 08:49:02 it's actually sometimes the case that a monster won't take a step that will take it next to you because it wants to step around the pillar on the other side but there is a monster there 08:49:06 and that's a clear bug IMO 08:49:24 -!- bhaak has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 08:49:37 -!- bhaak has joined ##crawl-dev 08:50:00 -!- cosh has quit [] 08:50:21 incidentally, can we bring back bow bashing? it is really infuriating how a toadstool will block autoexplore if you are wielding a bow 08:50:39 it will even block autoexplore from picking up arrows under the toadstool 08:52:36 -!- keszocze has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:54:12 as in, some really weak attacks but big enough to whack a toadstool? 08:54:48 for realism, it should do more damage than unarmed :p 09:00:51 -!- kek has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:02:26 -!- dosman|meeting is now known as dosman711 09:03:09 -!- kek has joined ##crawl-dev 09:06:48 -!- Vandal has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 09:10:32 kilobyte: well, you do have to take care not to damage your bow with the attack 09:10:37 hands heal, bows dont ;) 09:11:02 -!- Vandal has joined ##crawl-dev 09:16:08 -!- syllogism has joined ##crawl-dev 09:16:08 back 09:18:01 -!- kek has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:18:41 -!- kek has joined ##crawl-dev 09:18:52 BTW, why does DCSS call it magic dart when it behaves the same as "magic missile" from DnD/other games ? 09:19:07 because DnD 09:19:11 I guess.. 09:19:13 I was curious if there was a specific reason, or if it was just by chance that someone thought magic dart was well suited. 09:19:20 And to signify that it's small damage? 09:19:20 -!- Elynae has quit [Quit: Page closed] 09:19:53 MM also has the property of creating more missiles as you level up right? 09:22:15 -!- Tijol has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 09:22:42 <|amethyst> Magic Dart's been around since Linley, right? 09:25:25 -!- erisdiscordia has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 09:31:50 -!- ixtli has joined ##crawl-dev 09:32:28 an issue with wretched stars: magenta * looks too similar to the targetting UI, beam animation, etc 09:34:11 could replace either the colour or the glyph 09:34:45 not sure about colour, for glyphs, Unicode has the following: 09:34:48 ٭ ⋆ ★ ☆ ⚝ ✡ ✩ ✪ ✫ ✬ ✭ ✮ ✯ ✰ ✱ ✳ ✴ ✵ ✶ ✷ ✸ ✹ ✺ ⭐ ⭑ ⭒ 09:35:52 ghallberg, I think that's just WoW that turned MM into multiple-missiles, the spell in DnD just shoots one missile. 09:35:59 kilobyte: the largest one, imo 09:36:02 on gnome-terminal, everything but ٭⋆✶ spills out of it's cell, at least with fonts I have installed :( 09:36:10 oh :( 09:36:38 also, not sure if any are safe to use, because of crippled terminals that can't substitute glyphs 09:37:19 Cryp71c: I know it shoots multiple in Baldur's Gate... 09:37:33 I'm pretty sure it does in DnD 3(.5) at least? :S 09:37:40 ur right http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/magicMissile.htm 09:38:16 I was 2 clicks away from that, thanks :) 09:39:08 -!- Pepe[netbook] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:39:57 <|amethyst> it's one missile in 4e (2d4 + intmod, 4d4 + intmod at 21st level) 09:40:05 <|amethyst> but who plays 4e? 09:41:01 |amethyst, :P 09:41:06 my friday-night group is FR 09:42:11 <|amethyst> Mine was Pathfinder for a long time, now is Savage Worlds 09:42:20 -!- Vandal has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 09:42:53 <|amethyst> (Torg setting, Savage Worlds mechanics) 09:43:24 Who would be unable to spell TROG properly??? 09:43:41 <|amethyst> :P 09:44:59 <|amethyst> "Torg" was apparently originally an acronym for "The Other Roleplaying Game" 09:45:01 |amethyst, how do you like savage worlds? 09:45:13 the mechanics, obviously. 09:45:18 -!- Vandal has joined ##crawl-dev 09:45:32 <|amethyst> I'm still getting used to it, but combats seem much faster-paced 09:45:49 <|amethyst> OTOH if you don't have a healer or access to a healer it's very bad 09:46:08 <|amethyst> because healing checks take wound penalties 09:46:23 <|amethyst> so it's easy to end up permanently crippled 09:47:49 -!- Nightbeer has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 09:51:26 -!- Tijol has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 09:51:58 -!- Mottie has joined ##crawl-dev 10:02:08 -!- Ilirion has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 10:06:33 -!- Zicher has quit [Quit: Page closed] 10:07:31 Not sure if this is a bug, I opened a door, then when I go to close it, I get "There's a thick-headed creature in the doorway" 10:08:26 oh, nvm..I was standing on one of the door squares. 10:10:06 -!- magistern has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 10:12:04 Haha 10:12:04 greensnark: You have 6 messages. Use !messages to read them. 10:12:04 greensnark: You have 13 messages. Use !messages to read them. 10:12:58 !learn add Cryp71c <+Cryp71c> Not sure if this is a bug, I opened a door, then when I go to close it, I get "There's a thick-headed creature in the doorway" <+Cryp71c> oh, nvm..I was standing on one of the door squares. 10:12:58 cryp71c[3/3]: <+Cryp71c> Not sure if this is a bug, I opened a door, then when I go to close it, I get "There's a thick-headed creature in the doorway" <+Cryp71c> oh, nvm..I was standing on one of the door squares. 10:13:19 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 10:13:43 Cryp71c: That was brilliant :) 10:14:29 -!- SkaryMonk has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 10:17:34 -!- Vandal has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:18:55 greensnark, lol, I'm glad I could entertain...one hopes their learndb entries are at least not too embarassing. 10:19:49 -!- Tijol has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 10:19:57 -!- Vandal has joined ##crawl-dev 10:20:00 greensnark: are you going for a new !messages high score? :) 10:21:47 <|amethyst> ??neilrobin 10:21:47 neilrobin[1/1]: Play for as long as you want, then kite as many enemies at once and die surrounded by them. Password 'robin'. See {neil} for an example game 10:21:48 -!- Shockeh has quit [Quit: Page closed] 10:22:05 ??neil 10:22:05 neil[1/1]: !lg neil 3512 -tv 10:24:14 <|amethyst> greensnark: thanks for adding CAO 0.11 to sequell btw... I wasn't around last time you were here 10:25:03 !lg neil 3512 -tv 10:25:05 3512/4859. Neil, XL7 DEEE, T:4768 requested for FooTV. 10:25:52 ColdPie: Having two message bots is vexing 10:26:02 |amethyst: No worries, happy to help 10:27:36 -!- kek has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:31:58 -!- dosman711 is now known as dosman|lunch 10:35:57 -!- Ruby has quit [] 10:36:31 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 10:36:49 -!- Poncheis has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:46:23 -!- Poncheis has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:50:36 -!- kek has joined ##crawl-dev 11:05:38 -!- Daekdroom has quit [Quit: Saindo] 11:06:30 -!- Vandal has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 11:07:09 -!- kek has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:11:39 -!- chexuma has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:13:10 -!- elliott has joined ##crawl-dev 11:17:32 -!- Kalir has quit [Changing host] 11:26:19 -!- popbob_ is now known as popbob 11:28:30 !seen Napkin 11:28:30 I last saw Napkin at Sat Oct 27 21:45:24 2012 UTC (2d 18h 43m 6s ago) saying told you its a bad idea to remove your permissions :-P on ##crawl-dev. 11:28:31 I last saw Napkin at Sat Oct 27 21:45:24 2012 UTC (2d 18h 43m 6s ago) saying told you its a bad idea to remove your permissions :-P on ##crawl-dev. 11:37:08 -!- Mandevil has quit [Quit: leaving] 11:48:02 he told you 11:49:06 -!- st_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:51:14 BlastHardcheese: He did, so I need to pledge for one more chance. 11:52:04 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:56:48 Able to 'awkwardly throw' scrolls through clouds of flame (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=6347) by sixtypoundsofvan 11:58:47 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 12:04:43 -!- Moredread has quit [Quit: leaving] 12:06:35 -!- Cryp71c has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:08:08 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 12:09:57 dpeg: set you as "developer" in mantis, please check :) 12:09:57 Napkin: You have 9 messages. Use !messages to read them. 12:09:58 Napkin: You have 4 messages. Use !messages to read them. 12:15:41 -!- nooodl has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 12:23:46 -!- djanatyn has joined ##crawl-dev 12:28:32 -!- tensorpudding has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 12:31:48 -!- Menkaure has quit [Quit: Page closed] 12:31:50 Napkin: just back 12:31:52 -!- alefury has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.85 [Iceape 2.0.11/20120715100958]] 12:32:13 Napkin: check! Many thanks! 12:33:12 sauber :) 12:33:16 und wb :) 12:33:25 p�h! ;( 12:33:28 ernm :) 12:33:33 -!- Vizer0 has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:33:36 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 12:33:42 ;) 12:34:24 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 12:37:28 -!- dosman|lunch is now known as dosman711 12:44:57 -!- bonghitz has quit [Quit: bonghitz] 12:45:14 -!- Yen has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 12:49:23 -!- tw__ is now known as tw_ 12:50:48 -!- serge_ has quit [Quit: Page closed] 12:58:57 -!- Xares has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:59:05 -!- SkaryMonk has joined ##crawl-dev 13:00:23 -!- eb has quit [Client Quit] 13:10:35 -!- Vizer0 has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:15:25 -!- bonghitz has quit [Quit: bonghitz] 13:35:52 -!- Fhqwhgads has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 13:37:39 -!- erisdiscordia has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 13:38:31 -!- jj99 has quit [Quit: Page closed] 13:39:48 -!- SatanicMechanic has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 13:42:17 -!- Ragdoll has joined ##crawl-dev 13:44:19 -!- Wolfechu has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:44:37 -!- kek has joined ##crawl-dev 13:54:35 -!- Wolfechu has quit [Client Quit] 13:56:44 -!- Roarke has quit [Client Quit] 13:58:54 -!- CeleryMan has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:01:52 -!- Kalir has quit [Quit: CADENZA-CLASS CLOCKWORK KNIGHT--OPERATION TERMINATED] 14:05:10 -!- Wolfechu has quit [Client Quit] 14:15:01 -!- _D_ has quit [Quit: leaving] 14:20:14 -!- SurpriseTRex has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:20:34 -!- jeanjacques has quit [Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- Like it? Visit #hydrairc on EFNet] 14:24:05 -!- Tijol has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:26:36 -!- keszocze has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 14:28:02 -!- johnthebear has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 14:32:23 -!- Vizer0 has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:32:49 -!- Ragdoll has quit [Quit: Ik ben weg] 14:39:57 -!- Sab0t_ is now known as sab0t 14:42:39 -!- codrus has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:46:51 -!- AlphaQ has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 14:47:06 -!- AlphaQ2 is now known as AlphaQ 14:47:06 -!- ZRN has quit [Client Quit] 14:52:55 -!- nooodl has joined ##crawl-dev 14:58:56 -!- Tijol has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:03:46 -!- N78291 has quit [Quit: null] 15:08:32 -!- Ilirion has quit [Quit: Page closed] 15:09:28 -!- ToastyP has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.89 [Firefox 16.0.2/20121024073032]] 15:19:01 -!- Shovelmint has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 15:23:46 -!- bob___ has quit [Client Quit] 15:24:44 -!- syllogism has quit [] 15:27:56 -!- _D_ has quit [Quit: leaving] 15:29:19 -!- Isvaffel has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:31:45 -!- Froggeryz has quit [] 15:33:53 -!- Adeon\SIGSEGV is now known as Adeon 15:38:44 -!- kek has quit [Quit: gonna suicide, brb] 15:41:36 -!- Serfuzz has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:44:45 -!- kek has joined ##crawl-dev 15:45:18 -!- ZRN has quit [Quit: Page closed] 15:45:59 -!- Solberg has quit [Client Quit] 15:46:11 -!- Sequell has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:47:17 -!- Sequell has joined ##crawl-dev 15:48:13 -!- DainDwarf has quit [Quit: Dain's default quit message] 15:51:08 -!- Sequell has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:51:25 -!- Sequell has joined ##crawl-dev 15:51:50 -!- Namey has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:57:33 -!- CeleryMan has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:00:23 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:04:54 -!- Implojin has quit [Quit: Page closed] 16:06:59 -!- Nightbeer has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:07:22 -!- Arkaniad has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:10:04 -!- dosman711 is now known as dosman711` 16:12:05 -!- BirdoPrey has quit [Quit: BirdoPrey] 16:20:06 -!- yxhuvud has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:20:44 -!- sildraith has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:21:31 -!- Flun has quit [Quit: Page closed] 16:23:48 -!- Vandal has joined ##crawl-dev 16:26:47 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 16:31:48 -!- antrees_ is now known as antrees 16:34:51 -!- Zackv2 has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:36:14 -!- kittykai has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:37:34 -!- Aryth has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.0.4 Insomnia http://www.kvirc.net/] 16:37:47 -!- evilmike has joined ##crawl-dev 16:42:36 -!- keszocze has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:45:42 -!- Wensley has quit [Client Quit] 16:51:51 With Fedhas, oklob autoexclude claims bogus exclusions (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=6348) by raskol 16:52:01 -!- rphillips has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:52:06 -!- tollymain has quit [Client Quit] 16:54:22 incidentally, can we bring back bow bashing? it is really infuriating how a toadstool will block autoexplore if you are wielding a bow 16:54:37 +1 to this. although keep it weak, and dont apply slaying imo 16:54:48 currently slaying is applied to bow bashing i think 16:54:53 you can kill stuff with a berserk launcher 16:54:58 heh 16:55:10 so maybe just make it do a fixed base damage that ignores slaying?? 16:55:13 elliott: iirc that was removed but I could be wrong 16:55:18 toadstool (04f) | Spd: 0 | HD: 1 | HP: 2-4 | AC/EV: 1/0 | 03plant | Res: 13magic(immune), 03poison, 12drown, 13neg+++, 13torm | XP: 0 | Sz: tiny | Int: plant. 16:55:18 %??toadstool 16:55:19 elliptic: i did it like weeks ago 16:55:24 the important thing is killing this 16:55:29 elliptic: i think MarvinPA said he would remove it on tavern and then didn't or something 16:55:38 another solution would be to keep bashing as it is, but autoswap during autoexplore. this is way more complicated though and there are probably annoying edge cases to deal with 16:55:41 remove what 16:55:43 wouldn't the easier solution be to remove toadstools from corpses 16:55:50 MarvinPA: slaying applying to bashing 16:55:50 evilmike: I don't much like that, yeah 16:56:01 i don't remember saying anything about that ever 16:56:25 maybe it was someone else 16:56:58 there is an auto_swap option, but I'm not sure it works for autoexplore with a bow. And it probably doesn't switch back anyway 16:57:13 bow bashing sounds fine for dealing with toadstools 16:58:26 besides, monsters seem perfectly capable of bashing your face in with launchers 16:59:31 bowbashing is easiest, imo 17:00:01 as for toadstools from corpses, I'm alright with those, I think they can make levels a bit more dynamic feeling. I do find it very weird how they sprout from fresh corpses, though 17:00:05 centaurs are quite pro at bow bashing 17:00:08 since they do it at like speed 15 17:00:15 I would like it if fungi were made so they can only grow from rotten corpses 17:00:45 evilmike: but then you see them less often! (I don't care very much, but I'd like to keep toadstools from corpses in some form) 17:01:27 well seeing them less often might be good :P 17:01:30 I think you'd still see them often enough 17:01:42 toadstools don't bother me normally, though 17:03:03 it's just strange how meat with mushrooms growing out of it is still fresh enough to eat :P 17:03:17 evilmike: you only eat the good part 17:05:18 heh 17:06:18 Mushrooms like good food as much as the next man 17:06:37 -!- LordSloth has quit [Quit: Using leafChat 2] 17:08:06 -!- Daekdroom has quit [Quit: Saindo] 17:08:21 -!- ajikeshi__ has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:08:40 -!- Nomi has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 17:08:49 -!- keszocze has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:10:35 -!- lexackson has joined ##crawl-dev 17:16:14 -!- edlothiol has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:17:37 -!- _159 has quit [Client Quit] 17:23:48 -!- Flun has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:29:57 -!- virigoth has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 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by services] 19:00:02 -!- nooodl_ has joined ##crawl-dev 19:00:36 -!- nooodl has quit [Disconnected by services] 19:00:43 -!- nooodl_ is now known as nooodl 19:07:38 -!- qpzil has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:14:43 -!- _dd has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:16:23 -!- Sequell has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:16:43 -!- Sequell has joined ##crawl-dev 19:19:27 -!- Daekdroom has quit [Quit: Saindo] 19:19:43 -!- dtsund has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 19:20:28 -!- Flun has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 19:27:39 -!- scummos has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:29:43 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 19:37:25 -!- Wah has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 19:42:55 -!- wasd22 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:46:18 -!- Roger_ has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 19:47:24 -!- faketrog has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:49:14 ebarrett the Invulnerable (L27 HOAr) (Zot:2) 19:57:35 -!- alefury has quit [] 20:04:12 -!- thighhigh has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.89 [Firefox 16.0.2/20121024073032]] 20:06:30 -!- dpeg has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:25:21 -!- Poncheis has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.89 [Firefox 15.0.1/20120905151427]] 20:29:31 -!- Nightbeer has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:35:24 -!- HangedMan has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:39:46 -!- Kellhus has quit [Quit: Page closed] 20:39:54 -!- DarthXaos has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:45:25 -!- Cryp71c has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 20:48:11 -!- ZebTM has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:53:54 -!- Chozo has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:56:22 -!- bonghitz has quit [Quit: bonghitz] 20:58:34 -!- ToastyP has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.89 [Firefox 16.0.2/20121024073032]] 21:00:39 -!- Arkaniad has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:01:16 -!- minqmay has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:05:27 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 21:06:02 Crash when inspecting rod of venom in inventory (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=6349) by jeffqyzt 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host closed the connection] 22:36:53 -!- magistern has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 22:39:02 -!- ZebTM has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 22:40:16 -!- Wahaha_ has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 22:41:14 -!- Rebthor has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:42:09 -!- Sequell has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:42:50 -!- Sequell has joined ##crawl-dev 22:44:04 -!- TAS_2012v has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 22:45:33 -!- bonghitz has quit [Quit: bonghitz] 22:47:24 -!- bh has joined ##crawl-dev 22:47:28 hullo 22:48:09 -!- Guest42069 has quit [] 22:52:22 hi 22:53:26 -!- Heteroy has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.89 [Firefox 16.0.1/20121010144125]] 22:54:17 I'm going to tone down "Mass Blink". I also want to add a 'light show' effect 22:54:37 oh? 22:54:57 monqy: I was thinking a purple pinwheel effect 22:55:08 like orb glow meets tornado? 22:55:14 -!- same has quit [Client Quit] 22:55:32 something like that 22:55:42 add laser lights 22:55:48 I could also do concentric rings 22:56:14 elemental, except each keypress redraws magenta lines from random points to other random points, criss-crossing 22:56:38 Eronarn: thanks, but no thanks 22:57:48 I couldn't actually locate the code that checks to see if a square is visible from another square 22:58:37 isn't there a .can_see() function 22:58:50 that should call the more basic cell visibility function 22:59:58 can_see consumes an actor. I guess that works 23:02:42 -!- Sapz has quit [] 23:04:46 I like Zannick's 'superposition' idea. Create a bunch of fake players, like Mara illusions, that can soak up attacks 23:05:31 mirror image 23:06:07 bh: ask dtsund about "illude" 23:07:28 dtsund: tell me about "illude" 23:07:50 monqy: Is that the story of brad Odysseude trying to find his way home from Illiude? 23:08:07 no but close 23:12:41 grid_distance is manhattan distance and distance2 is king's distance? 23:13:16 p. sure distance2 is fakeeucldiean 23:13:19 *fake euclidean 23:13:35 gross. circular los sucks. 23:13:51 -!- wasd22 has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:13:56 pretty sure grid_distance is chebyshev distance not manhattan 23:14:59 bh: imo implement squarelos in inception branch to sneak it in 23:15:15 yeah grid_distance is chebyshev 23:15:27 -!- wasd22_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:15:47 elliott: I already snuck in a giant bear with a bowtie. 23:19:04 elliott: eronarn asked me to sneak in Lava Orcs :) 23:21:36 -!- wasd22 has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 23:25:39 -!- Flun has quit [Quit: Page closed] 23:26:24 -!- eb has quit [] 23:28:03 -!- wasd22_ has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 23:28:05 -!- Mottie has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 23:32:42 -!- wasd22 has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 23:35:25 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 23:36:42 -!- Rebthor has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 23:37:03 -!- BirdoPrey has quit [Quit: BirdoPrey] 23:38:07 -!- ophanim has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:39:33 monqy, elliott: Do you think it would be unreasonable to blink close friendly monsters? 23:39:55 with what rationale 23:41:33 get your meatshields close? 23:43:45 -!- wasd22_ has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:50:06 -!- hoody has quit [Remote host closed the connection]