00:01:29 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.11-a0-2285-g35c9e60 (33) 00:04:16 03evilmike * re7ae22a2309e 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/variable/grunt_fire_pits.des: A bunch of vaults featuring innocent creatures dying in a fire. (Grunt) 00:04:22 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 00:08:05 03evilmike * r93261e876b42 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/variable/grunt_fire_pits.des: Remove ORIENT: float from the grunt_burning_victim subvault. 00:08:06 03dolorous * r6451c23974d6 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/descript/monsters.txt: Fix wording and punctuation in new descriptions. 00:08:47 Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.11-a0-2286-ge7ae22a 00:14:08 -!- ussdefiant_ has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:55:46 -!- eeviac_ has joined ##crawl-dev 01:12:05 -!- MarvinPA_ has joined ##crawl-dev 01:12:44 ur services upgrade and database prune is scheduled to start at 2pm GMT, which is just slightly less than 7 hours away. There will be no chanserv or nickserv for around an hour. Consider opping up on your channels in advance of the outage. More messages to follow. 01:13:42 -!- G-Flex has quit [Quit: Time for us to bug out.] 01:15:55 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:15:55 -!- MarvinPA_ is now known as MarvinPA 01:16:26 -!- evilmike has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:19:52 he observant ones noticed that my last message contained an error, it's 8 hours away from how. Remember also that this outage will contain our database prune. Nicks older than 150 days unused will be dropped from the nickserv database. Remember to identify to your accounts and use your alt nicks. THanks! 01:22:37 is there any particular reason why ash doesn't boost armour skill when you're wearing mda 01:54:41 because it has EV of -1 01:55:55 and ash only looks on EV for the purpose of armour boosts 01:56:42 but even leather benefits from armor skill 01:57:00 does it? 01:57:10 yeah, not much, but it does 01:57:47 not that I'm saying ash needs a buff, I love ash as is, but I don't understand this 01:59:32 eeviac_: even if you aren't wearing body armour, armour skill still does something... 02:00:09 is this a good time to complain about Dr body armor :P 02:00:09 currently you get dodging/stealth if wearing light armour, dodging/armour if wearing medium armour, and a larger armour boost but no armour if wearing heavy armour 02:00:14 just tried it in wizmode, and for me Ash doesn't boost armour in leather armour 02:00:37 er, s/no armour/no dodging/ 02:01:11 yeah I understand that 02:01:38 it's just that with my last game I was using faerie dragon armor and ash's boost would've given me 2-3 more ac 02:01:57 so you got some stealth instead 02:02:14 it would give characters in a robe 1-2 more AC in some cases, should it boost that too? 02:02:18 not sure what the problem is 02:02:29 wait, light armor actively boosts stealth? or just doesn't penalize it 02:02:38 non-elven 02:02:45 ash boosts stealth if you are wearing light armour 02:02:49 really 02:02:51 huh 02:02:58 ??ash skill boost[2] 02:02:59 ash skill boost[2/2]: Low: staves+evocations (evoc staff), shield, dodging+stealth (evp < 2 armour), dodging+armour (evp 2 or 3 armour), all magic+evoc (jewellery). Medium: weapon, spellcasting (non-evoc staff), evoc (rod), armour (evp > 3 armour). Weapon bonus increased if 2h (or 1.5h with no shield), armour and jewellery bonuses increased if fully bound. 02:02:59 I didn't know that 02:03:22 I only noticed that my armor skill wasn't big and blue 02:04:05 Ahhhh I think this was my first ash game since the always-train-armor skill change 02:04:14 I never noticed before because I was in robes 02:06:51 possibly skills that would be boosted by ash should be in blue even if they are at 0 (and thus unboosted) 02:09:46 my confusion came because my armour was cursed yet armour skill wasn't blue - it looks like something's wrong 02:10:31 -!- greensnark has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:11:07 -!- greensnark has joined ##crawl-dev 02:20:14 -!- joosa has joined ##crawl-dev 02:28:44 -!- Ragdoll has joined ##crawl-dev 02:32:38 eeviac_: wrong? as I said multiple times, cursed MDA will boost dodging+stealth, not armour 02:33:03 oh you mean it seems weird... well, the same thing is true in leather armour 02:33:44 and fighting skill isn't boosted by cursing weapon, spellcasting skill not boosted by jewellery, etc 02:34:13 yeah I'm taking the position of the uninformed - they see a cursed weapon boosts skill, but not cursed armor? 02:34:30 is there a better way to communicate this 02:36:01 well they'll see some skill get boosted 02:36:44 My specific situation was going from FDA to Faerie DA 02:37:03 so I lost the boost but it took me a while to remember why 02:37:52 I don't know whether the ash skill boost has any documentation in-game currently... maybe a little more could be said about it in the ^ screen 02:38:48 maybe a line explaining the armor boost that changes depending on what you have equipped 02:39:19 the weapon boost also changes if you have a staff or rod, btw 02:39:29 what if Ash would boost dodging/stealth according to evp, and armour according to AC? Or rather the total boost is fixed and split between those skills according to evp/AC proportion? 02:39:44 probably not a good idea 02:40:49 honestly I think it might be okay to just make armour give a "low" boost to dodging/armour/stealth regardless of body armour type 03:05:28 -!- blabber has joined ##crawl-dev 03:26:33 -!- moxian has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:27:45 -!- eeviac_ has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88.2 [Firefox 13.0/20120601175215]] 03:42:25 -!- moxian has joined ##crawl-dev 03:46:41 -!- clouded_ has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 04:01:47 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: zzz] 04:17:38 -!- ToBeFree has joined ##crawl-dev 04:34:05 -!- monqy has quit [Quit: hello] 04:49:50 -!- Mottie has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 05:00:06 OSX builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.11-a0-2288-g6451c23 05:06:02 -!- ToBeFree has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 05:09:58 -!- ToBeFree has joined ##crawl-dev 05:59:53 -!- ToBeFree has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:01:23 moxian: your idea about auto-weighting the boost based on armour stats sounds tempting 06:02:04 although that uniform boost would follow the KISS principle... not sure if hurting the primary boost of AC chars is a good idea, though 06:02:47 never played an Ash char for long since he lost the xp bonus, though 06:04:21 -!- moxian has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 06:32:16 -!- mikee_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:35:47 -!- mikee_ has joined ##crawl-dev 06:44:43 Autopickup misbehaving on potions (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=5783) by Scalding Steam 06:45:00 -!- ark____ has joined ##crawl-dev 07:30:43 -!- GreatOrbOfEyes has joined ##crawl-dev 07:32:06 -!- hangedman has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 07:34:15 -!- GreatOrb1fEyes has joined ##crawl-dev 07:35:27 -!- ainsophyao has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:39:23 -!- GreatOrb1fEyes is now known as HangedMan 07:50:29 -!- greensnark has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:01:30 -!- GreatOrb1fEyes has joined ##crawl-dev 08:02:53 -!- GreatOrb1fEyes has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:16:11 -!- ussdefiant_ has joined ##crawl-dev 08:19:31 -!- Wensley has joined ##crawl-dev 08:33:36 Global Notice] Hi all. We'll begin the services upgrade in half an hour so services will be down for a while. Staff will be present in #freenode and able to help in case of channel emergencies but please consider opping before services disappear. Thank you for using freenode. 09:14:28 -!- blabber has quit [Quit: leaving] 09:18:24 -!- Grunt has joined ##crawl-dev 09:27:06 -!- ussdefiant_ has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 09:36:56 -!- frogbotherer has joined ##crawl-dev 09:37:15 rings and amulets use-ided by monsters don't get picked up (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=5784) by KiloByte 09:38:42 Hooray, I'm causing bugs. 09:39:01 <|amethyst> Thoughts on how to fix it? 09:39:38 there's now autopickup per item, right? 09:39:51 Global Notice] Hi again. The services upgrade and database pruning is all done now. There's a number of new features that you can familiarise yourself with using /msg nickserv help and /msg chanserv help. Thank you for your patience and thanks for being part of the freenode community. 09:39:58 why not make it so the autopickup for such items turns itself off when you pick up one of them 09:40:04 hacky but it'd get you the right behaviour most of the time 09:40:25 <|amethyst> that would make it impossible to override that behaviour from the config file though 09:41:20 Is this a problem only with jewellery? 09:41:25 Does it happen with, say, wands as well? 09:41:46 <|amethyst> only jewellery: see settings/autopickup_exceptions.txt 09:46:34 -!- blabber has joined ##crawl-dev 09:52:39 <|amethyst> Unless someone comes up with something better, I think Patashu's suggestion might be reasonable 09:53:41 <|amethyst> I'd prefer to keep the handling in the config file (and changeable by editing the config file), but I suspect that won't be possible 09:55:08 <|amethyst> In particular, the list of particular jewellery items affected is debatable (teleportation, hunger, ...) 09:55:49 <|amethyst> Maybe a general autopickup_avoid_duplicate := ring of (see invisible|levitation|...) 09:56:32 <|amethyst> which could, as Patashu suggests, mean "set these to force_autopickup when picking up the first" 09:57:10 <|amethyst> then again, once you have that option, you could handle it using the option rather than setting force_autopickup 09:57:33 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.11-a0-2288-g6451c23 (33) 10:01:16 <|amethyst> ... and in fact you probably should, because someone out there is going to do something like autopickup_avoid_duplicate := \+0 dagger and accidentally turn off autopickup for all daggers 10:01:41 -!- Patashu has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 10:06:33 -!- GreatOrbOfEyes has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 10:24:58 Q: when is Spider no longer going to be a guaranteed branch? 10:25:06 <|amethyst> Grunt: 0.11 release 10:25:22 <|amethyst> possibly slightly before that 10:25:46 <|amethyst> so a month, month and a half probably 10:25:51 I do think it would be a good idea to allow some time prior to the release to see how things balance out. 10:25:53 <|amethyst> no idea when we're freezing 10:26:01 ...with the pairs of branches and all. 10:26:31 <|amethyst> Honestly, I think it's reasonable to do now 10:26:42 I agree that it's probably reasonable to do now. 10:27:01 -!- evilmike has joined ##crawl-dev 10:27:13 <|amethyst> evilmike: I was just abou tto send you a !tell 10:27:14 I think players have a pretty good feel for the branch now, and the one major complaint that I've been made aware of (bad generation of web traps) has been dealt with, courtesy of that guy who just came in <_< 10:27:19 nice timing 10:27:23 <|amethyst> evilmike: Do you think it's time to remove the Spider guarantee? 10:27:43 <|amethyst> so we'll have at least a month of feedback about the pairings 10:27:44 i think it would be fine to do so 10:28:22 no supmoths in 0.11 10:28:27 yay? boo? 10:28:33 those might wait until 0.12 10:28:40 <|amethyst> they still need monster item suppression 10:28:52 <|amethyst> and I don't know if there's enough time to balance them 10:29:03 i don't think there's enough time either 10:29:37 <|amethyst> we should enable them as one of the first things in 0.12 though 10:29:42 <|amethyst> 0.12-a 10:30:03 <|amethyst> even if there are still bugs/infelicities 10:30:36 weren't they going to be placed in the spider:5 vaults 10:31:55 <|amethyst> FR: vault with a supmoth, a silent spectre, and maybe a siren 10:32:02 HangedMan: not quite, they'd need to be redesigned to allow them to be used there 10:32:43 and actually, i dont think they should be guaranteed in the vaults. it's an enemy that would work better as a regular spawn 10:32:51 oh right 10:32:59 wasn't the idea to place them like crypt curse skulls 10:33:27 i mentioned that, it's a silly idea though 10:33:55 but hyper-controlling everything foreverrrr 10:34:42 crawl places curse skulls as vault monsters because it would be weird to have them spawn over time, and it would be bad to have them block corridors 10:34:58 there is no reason whatsoever to do that with a monster that can move 10:35:00 fair point 10:35:48 hello 10:36:10 hello 10:36:12 <|amethyst> Wensley: hope you don't mind 10:36:32 not at all 10:36:38 don't need to rush them 10:36:50 03|amethyst * rf90c9975bc72 10/crawl-ref/source/ng-init.cc: No longer guarantee Spider. 10:36:56 it's my own fault for having a full-time job and owning many captivating video games :) 10:37:11 we've also revamped their design a whole lot 10:37:19 I bet there are still some devs that are not sold on them 10:38:24 they are definitely ready for testing, but perhaps not this close to the release 10:38:49 I mean, given that they would mostly (exclusively?) spawn in spider, the not-suppressing monster items thing would only apply to uniques 10:38:59 although that is one of my favorite things 10:39:01 but sprint abuse 10:39:33 ...things with auras in sprint would probably be a pretty bad idea in general though so 10:39:50 i still say the effect could work fine as a nasty monster spell 10:39:51 <|amethyst> the supmoth aura would have to be much smaller in sprint 10:40:05 could get multi-level sprint working 10:40:07 the aura is really not that big :P 10:40:09 what about making area effects not go through permarock? 10:40:17 I like evilmike's idea 10:40:24 <|amethyst> Wensley: I forget, what is the radius now? 10:40:40 |amethyst: about LOS+3, I believe 10:40:47 same as spectres 10:40:49 I also support permarock blocking auras, they already block sound 10:41:03 <|amethyst> yeah 10:41:10 <|amethyst> that way you can use supmoths in zigsprint 10:41:15 I do *not* want them any lower than LOS+1 10:41:41 <|amethyst> actually, the permarock thing and keeping the current radius would make them fine for sprint I think 10:41:50 I'm all for permarock blocking it 10:41:57 -!- mikee_ has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 10:41:58 -!- capablanca has joined ##crawl-dev 10:42:13 afaik it wouldn't affect anything in the game currently, unless there are permarock vaults in crypt 10:42:18 <|amethyst> The issue is that sprint levels are usually pretty tightly packed, so a supmoth is likely to spill out into unrelated parts of the sprint 10:42:26 |amethyst: I think that is delightful 10:42:48 Wensley: there shouldn't be any... if there are they should probably be changed 10:43:19 <|amethyst> Wensley: it may be delightful, but that should be up to the sprint designer to decide 10:43:27 it would also mean that players can't use silence through walls in zot:5, though I don't know why that would ever be a good idea 10:43:31 just give it patrolling ai 10:43:53 <|amethyst> evilmike: I mean the aura, not the moth itself 10:44:14 |amethyst: aren't sprint levels all permarock anyway? 10:44:34 even if they are stone, you could blaze a trail with devastator 10:44:41 <|amethyst> right, which is why I said that "the permarock thing and keeping the current radius would make them fine for sprint" 10:44:50 not all bits, sprint_mu is pretty free-form 10:46:02 <|amethyst> btw, is someone going to add the gossamer rune to sprint_mu ? 10:46:23 <|amethyst> I am not much of a level designer, so not me 10:46:55 sprint_mu is a snapshot of a simpler, earlier time 10:47:02 where would it go? replace one of the lair subvaults, I guess? 10:47:11 <|amethyst> evilmike: there's already lair roulette 10:47:25 also mu is horrible because you can lrd into gehenna from swamp 10:47:42 that sort of thing makes sprint fun 10:47:57 <|amethyst> evilmike: so that could match the new lair roulette instead 10:48:23 well you can also go from lair into gehenna for some lair and after killing geryon 10:48:51 the dislike is more "man it'd be impossible to give appropiate tiles for the walls" 10:48:58 -!- capablanca is now known as mikee_ 10:53:28 <|amethyst> FR: walls that have different tiles depending on which direction you see them from 10:53:41 yay 10:54:11 fr: : and = work properly for ftile so I can randomize the snake floors to the three current different sets without introducing twenty million new variables 10:54:42 |amethyst: those are called "Walls that are two tiles wide" :P 10:54:54 <|amethyst> evilmike: but space is so limited! 10:55:00 <|amethyst> solution: 100x100 levels 10:55:11 solution: multi-floor sprint 10:55:15 <|amethyst> yeah 10:55:47 <|amethyst> I also think it would be need to have a game mode that starts in, and ends when you leave, say, lair or hell 10:56:14 <|amethyst> no clue how to balance such a thing, though 10:56:22 <|amethyst> s/need/neat/ 10:56:32 <|amethyst> it is certainly not need 11:00:58 -!- Mottie has joined ##crawl-dev 11:06:25 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 11:12:23 78291 (L10 FePr) ASSERT(smc) in 'mon-util.cc' at line 1072 failed. (Lair:4) 11:14:08 <|amethyst> 78291 says that's from a pacified rolling boulder beetle: "I pacified it while rolling and it rolled onto the stairs" 11:14:28 <|amethyst> !lm @78291 crash -log 11:14:29 19. 78291, XL10 FePr, T:21309 (milestone): http://crawl.develz.org/morgues/trunk/78291/crash-78291-20120616-161215.txt 11:15:38 |amethyst: maybe you could do it by giving a selection of pre-made characters? 11:15:51 -!- eeviac_ has joined ##crawl-dev 11:16:04 <|amethyst> evilmike: that was one thought I had 11:16:05 I'm not sure if the point is to let players do a sort of "trial run", or if it's supposed to be a special challenge mode 11:16:18 if it's a challenge mode, just throw them some extra starting xp and let them fend for themselves 11:16:28 <|amethyst> evilmike: hm 11:16:36 I'd actually really love pre-made characters for wizmode 11:16:45 <|amethyst> Wensley: you can do that with skills etc 11:16:48 premade characters would be good for automated testing too 11:16:51 <|amethyst> by loading a character 11:16:53 saves 11:16:58 every time that I make a change to something and it invalidates my save, I have to go through all the damn wizard commands again 11:17:01 <|amethyst> s/character/morgue/ 11:17:11 <|amethyst> you have to do equipment yourself, though 11:17:14 -!- petete has joined ##crawl-dev 11:17:21 how do you check the name of the vault you are in? 11:17:29 and it would be better to have a character that is actually representative of (for example) a mid-game character rather than me bullshitting stats and equipment 11:17:32 petete: die in it :P 11:17:38 i just got stuck on a forest 11:17:43 <|amethyst> petete: in wizmode? 11:17:48 petete: alternatively, take a screenshot and ask ##crawl 11:17:48 HangedMan: for some reason supmoth changes corrupt my saves all the damn time 11:17:52 no regular play 11:18:05 <|amethyst> Wensley: look at &# 11:18:18 <|amethyst> Wensley: it lets you load a character from a morgue .txt file 11:18:22 <|amethyst> Wensley: or a dump 11:18:24 cool 11:18:29 <|amethyst> Wensley: it doesn't handle equipment I think 11:18:30 will look at that 11:18:38 just don't name your character "Gold" 11:18:51 FR: character dumps in json 11:19:22 <|amethyst> FR: copy out the you and chr (and related) chunks from the save 11:19:28 petete: change your .rc, win, check your log 11:19:32 <|amethyst> and store those somewhere in the morgue 11:20:23 <|amethyst> of course it would make cheating easier, but anyone who can figure out crawl -edit-save can also figure out save scumming 11:20:27 there: http://pastebin.com/rRin43kL 11:21:03 petete: oh, i'll fix that 11:21:06 went down a one-way stair 11:22:07 petete: well I'll fix the vault. Can't do much to help your character though 11:22:28 np 11:22:31 thanks evilmike 11:22:55 <|amethyst> petete: I'd recommend trying out those scrolls unless you've already IDed teleportation 11:24:00 <|amethyst> this is local? 11:24:32 <|amethyst> it's possible to fix using save-scumming, save editing, and wizmode 11:24:38 <|amethyst> but it's a little involved 11:26:00 <|amethyst> and honestly probably not worth it for a L4 character 11:35:20 had a teleport scroll in there 11:40:18 03evilmike * r278f67d0d29e 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/branches/lair.des: Fix a few cut-off areas in recently added vaults. 11:43:51 <|amethyst> maybe a vault tag check_connectivity ? 11:44:14 Bad mons_shouts() call (maybe from a pacified rolling boulder beetle leaving the level?) (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=5785) by neil 11:45:25 <|amethyst> or even something like CHECK_CONNECT: 2-3 to say "there should be two to three disconnected regions in this vault, and veto or warn if there are more or fewer" 11:45:56 <|amethyst> I'm going to make that an implementable 11:46:01 <|amethyst> well 11:46:06 |amethyst: that could be useful, certainly. Mainly for highly random vaults 11:48:14 Not sure why you'd want 2 or 3 though... it seems like it's either ok to have as many as you want (like in old cerebov's castle) or none at all 11:49:09 <|amethyst> For example, if you have a vault with a (deep) river, @ on both sides of the river, and forest on both sides 11:49:27 <|amethyst> you'd want to say "expect two regions" 11:49:31 ahh, I see 11:50:11 <|amethyst> well, in that case if you're talking about the whole level it would be one 11:51:14 <|amethyst> but with loot boxes like that, I think it would be nice to be able to specify the number of loot boxes (plus one) there, so if a different part of your map becomes disconnected you'll know about it 11:54:43 -!- ainsophyao has joined ##crawl-dev 11:59:56 -!- varmin has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:00:05 -!- varmin has joined ##crawl-dev 12:00:09 -!- varmin has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:00:21 -!- varmin has joined ##crawl-dev 12:10:14 -!- mikee_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:14:41 Want more connectivity checking for vaults (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=5786) by neil 12:18:29 -!- greensnark has joined ##crawl-dev 12:28:01 anyone here have access to the cdo wordpress? someone should write a short 0.10.3 announcement post 12:31:15 due: ^ 12:34:29 -!- ToBeFree has joined ##crawl-dev 12:36:30 -!- ainsophyao has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:49:49 -!- Dixbert has joined ##crawl-dev 13:15:53 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 13:17:26 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 13:43:28 -!- monqy has joined ##crawl-dev 14:01:42 <|amethyst> Grunt, evilmike: I wonder how many people are going to die on D:2 to octopode (burning) or spriggan (burning) 14:02:19 not many... it's neutral, and they tend to die by the time you open the door 14:02:20 03MarvinPA * r49722d770230 10/crawl-ref/source/food.cc: Improve wording of sickness messages 14:02:25 <|amethyst> oh, neutral 14:02:27 <|amethyst> missed that 14:02:28 there's always going to be the amusing chance of being shafted, though 14:03:54 <|amethyst> MarvinPA: isn't fresh meat also hard to stomach while nauseous? 14:04:19 i think that has a different message already 14:04:37 hmm 14:04:56 "You force it down, but cannot stomach much of it." for permafood 14:05:45 if anyone has a better wording for raw meat making you sick then feel free to change it :P 14:06:06 <|amethyst> oh, right 14:06:35 (permafood you get half nutrition, chunks you can get sick) 14:06:36 <|amethyst> if fresh meat is going to make you sick, contam is already set 14:07:35 anyone know when (and why) octagon levels were removed from pan? 14:08:03 they have "DEPTH: 4-22, !Vaults". Oddly enough there's still pan-related code in them 14:09:48 <|amethyst> was it recently? 14:10:01 doesn't seem to be 14:10:24 <|amethyst> %git 8181c35 14:10:24 Vsevolod Kozlov * r8181c35602f0: Choose dungeon layouts by picking a vault with tag "layout". (1 year, 3 months ago, 4 files, 186+ 237-) https://gitorious.org/crawl/crawl/commit/8181c35602f0 14:10:46 <|amethyst> wait 14:10:57 <|amethyst> 0ce59bb added !Pan for a number of layouts 14:11:10 <|amethyst> but octagon doesn't have it, so presumably it can occur now? 14:11:44 <|amethyst> yes, it has WEIGHT: 1 (Pan) 14:11:54 yeah, but the DEPTH line is only 4-22 14:12:23 03MarvinPA * r97789c14a285 10/crawl-ref/source/melee_attack.cc: Don't let minotaurs headbutt rock worms in walls 14:12:29 <|amethyst> oh, and pan is always 0 now? 14:12:33 <|amethyst> err, 1? 14:12:35 <|amethyst> or what? 14:12:43 <|amethyst> I guess much higher 14:13:08 it's 25 14:13:09 if it had a tiny depth wouldn't depth-appropiate trap-work effect it 14:13:14 I think it's 25, anyway 14:13:24 you can change that 1 (Pan) to 99999, it doesn't matter 14:13:35 <|amethyst> aha 14:13:40 I'm just going to re-add pan to that layout, this seems to be a bug 14:14:29 obviously more important question is where should layout_loops be set 14:15:04 infiniplex set the values a bit too high for pandemonium but they seem fine otherwise 14:16:13 <|amethyst> how about something that calls the worley code for a static abyss-like layout 14:16:45 <|amethyst> might be a pain to make that accessible to lua, and it certainly opens the door for CPU abuse 14:20:14 03evilmike * r3c139b94d87f 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/builder/layout.des: Re-enable octagon levels in Pandemonium. 14:20:48 <|amethyst> evilmike: what about cross? 14:21:04 <|amethyst> oh 14:21:08 <|amethyst> it had it already, nm 14:21:10 all the other layouts look fine 14:22:14 except maybe layout_spotty. I can't remember if that one was ever possible in pandemonium 14:23:06 I'd guess no, since it would be lousy there anyway 14:25:46 -!- eeviac_ has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88.2 [Firefox 13.0/20120601175215]] 14:42:13 -!- G-Flex has joined ##crawl-dev 14:54:55 HangedMan: tar 14:55:30 controlled specific layouts for the hells would be nice, yes 14:55:52 bloody dis and cities of infinity 14:55:57 or put delve in tar 14:56:03 hah 14:56:13 put swamp in cocytus 14:56:20 but do something to it so that it doesn't look like a dungeon 14:56:21 it is supposed to be hell 14:56:26 because in lore it very much was not 14:57:43 labyrinth gehenna 15:06:54 <|amethyst> put lemuel_lake_of_fire in gehenna 15:06:56 These new layouts will be elegible for hell (except dis) but none of them are hellish enough to make them exclusive 15:09:07 various branches could use their own layouts. Maybe give snake something snakey, give each of the hells (except dis) something more unique, give vaults something unique, maybe crypt and elf too 15:10:31 I'm not sure what tartarus would be (something cave-like, I guess), but cocytus is supposed to be a river, and gehenna is a burning valley 15:11:15 using a labyrinth for gehenna doesn't make sense to me. As far as I can tell the only justification is "that's how nethack does it" 15:13:34 loops_misc looks snakey imo 15:14:47 it has a lot of corridors, but it builds a fairly normal level 15:14:50 -!- ZChris13 has joined ##crawl-dev 15:15:29 copy the layout from the nethack lethe patch, it has lava caverns :> 15:15:53 the corridors are quite straight, with hard angles. "snakey" would be something where the corridors have a more "wavy" shape (and they'd have to be wider than 1 square) 15:16:50 "snakey" was what came to mind when I first read through .des files and saw the name of serial_curves 15:17:48 single layout and only four vaults kind of make it look... sparse, I guess 15:20:14 evilmike: "re-enable"? Pan never could possibly spawn layout_big_octagon 15:20:30 I've had it in past versions 15:20:41 uhm, how? 15:21:01 I checked in 0.10, it's "DEPTH: 4-22, !Vault" there 15:21:37 maybe by entering pan from d:21 or d:22? 15:24:08 -!- Ragdoll has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:24:11 hmm right, yeah. Entrances are unlikely to spawn there, and most folks use a stash in the Vestibule, so it would be unlikely to appear, though. 15:26:19 03kilobyte * r58b17f9ba673 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/descript/monsters.txt: A desc for IOODs themselves. 15:26:20 03kilobyte * r24492d94a557 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/descript/pl/spells.txt: Round a skewed dot. 15:26:20 03kilobyte * rd1c42361e74e 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/descript/monsters.txt: An ugly desc for Wucad Mu. Please improve or replace! 15:26:20 03kilobyte * rc83b32ee6372 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/descript/features.txt: Descriptions for the rest of traps. 15:28:08 could give it a lower weight in Pan, I suppose. It's weight 1 in pan (this was the case before I added pan to the DEPTH line), but I guess all the other layouts could have their pan weights increased 15:37:07 -!- Textmode has joined ##crawl-dev 15:46:05 -!- st_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:46:18 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 15:50:55 -!- clouded_ has joined ##crawl-dev 15:51:07 -!- st_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:55:42 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 15:57:21 -!- clouded_ has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:02:49 evilmike: uhm, oklob_transplants is a vault that makes no sense whatsoever 16:02:56 it works only due to a bug, too 16:03:18 ...what bug 16:03:51 mons->no_tele() and mons->check_stasis() are called from inconsistent places 16:04:21 oh right, immobiles aren't supposed to teleport 16:04:32 that's the teleporting one? I'm fine with removing it, especially since it relies on a bug 16:05:23 (also, that new check_stasis() will break emergency teleports/blinks for code that tries to place the player in a spot already occupied by a monster who can't be displaced) 16:05:28 -!- G-Flex has quit [Quit: Time for us to bug out.] 16:07:08 is there any reasonable use for the vault? Or should I remove it outright? 16:07:26 Oh, I just did. Just haven't pushed yet 16:12:57 also, when digging in a random spot in a game, I suddenly found an escape hatch, disconnected from the rest of the level 16:13:34 any idea what could cause that? IIRC if it was a vault, there would be no hatch. 16:17:02 I've seen weird disconnected rooms before, but never 1 square 16:19:23 maybe the level generator places hatches in arbitrary locations and doesn't care if they're connected to anything? 16:20:11 copied the game from CDO, it turns out it's basic_loot_grate_trap 16:20:21 and no bug but a secret door :p 16:20:29 ah 16:23:03 although, the save file is 15MB big, 91% slack space 16:23:22 wtf... I picked that commit into 0.10.3, not good 16:29:36 -!- res has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:34:19 what do you think of infiniplex's layout_loops_cross having loot subvaults? The one he uploaded has a 1/3 chance of the map placing treasure in some side rooms (generated as part of the layout, although they have a vault-like appearance) 16:34:52 I'm thinking that if the loot rooms get placed, they should also have monsters guarding it. Maybe 1/3 is too high as well, (the layout has a normal weight) 16:37:01 maybe if it cuts into the item generation for the floor (is that even possible?) it could just be pushing contents around rather then giving explicit risk and reward in specific incarnations of layouts 16:37:41 it has nothing to do with regular item generation 16:38:29 basically, the layout is cross-shaped, with distinctive rooms on each of the four sides. Sometimes items will get placed in the rooms 16:38:40 if it has loot, it should be an encompass vault, not a layout 16:39:17 because layouts are supposed to be the background that then has actual vaults and monsters placed on top of it 16:40:17 it would 16:40:27 ...blaeurgh, nevermind 16:43:33 aside from the chance of loot, it's a typical dungeon layout. the thing it's doing makes me think of how layout_roguey can get a special_room subvault. The difference is that one only has monsters 16:44:55 monsters themselves can have some loot: kobold rooms often provide poison brand, needles, and a chance of elec brand early on 16:50:02 whew, the save file leak is not in 0.10.3 16:50:21 03kilobyte * re941e3923542 10/crawl-ref/settings/autopickup_exceptions.txt: Remove a commented out function to disable autopickup in the Abyss. 16:50:21 03kilobyte * r08f2be7a1ae6 10/crawl-ref/source/package.cc: Fix save files leaking space. 16:54:29 updating CDO to make sure no one goes wild on this bug 16:54:29 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.11-a0-2299-g08f2be7 (33) 16:54:51 Leaking space? 16:55:03 up to 160KB per keypress 16:55:12 o_o 16:55:27 when moving between levels, that is 16:57:54 actually, it's not that nasty by itself, you can use ttyrecs for a similar effect 16:57:55 -!- petete has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:02:40 looking at this more closely, I'll just remove the loot / extra monsters from that layout. The effect seems too small to really notice in play, unless you get a particularly orderly version of the layout (even then it's hard to notice) 17:02:51 compare that to special rooms, which spam monsters everywhere and are kind of hard to miss 17:04:17 03dolorous * r63f3b94aa807 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/descript/ (features.txt monsters.txt): Fix wording and punctuation in new descriptions. 17:07:46 -!- jpt9 has joined ##crawl-dev 17:16:58 -!- shiweera has joined ##crawl-dev 17:30:12 -!- Textmode has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 17:33:26 can special rooms be tweaked to not so readily hand out death oozes in lair yet give d:10 undead trash in crypt 17:44:30 -!- Textmode has joined ##crawl-dev 18:02:18 -!- Patashu has joined ##crawl-dev 18:06:49 -!- Patashu has quit [Disconnected by services] 18:06:49 -!- PatashuXantheres has joined ##crawl-dev 18:17:41 hi, I wrote a small (probably hackish) patch removing constriction _damage_ from mimics in trunk. If you are interested: http://pastebin.com/nAbid6Gg. I tested that it compiles, and briefly checked in wizmode that it does what it says. Feel free to ignore it though, if it doesn't fit in. 18:21:36 shiweera: it should then be displayed differently. Best to talk to galehar, though. 18:21:42 since he's the mimic guy 18:22:19 03evilmike * r22770bb6fc79 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/builder/ (layout.des layout_loops.des): Three new level layouts (infiniplex). 18:22:19 03evilmike * raa65f5f49256 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/branches/lair.des: Stonehenge is not made of wax. 18:22:20 03evilmike * r2c3e595755e2 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/ (des/variable/float.des descript/monsters.txt): Remove nicolae_oklob_transplants. 18:22:20 03evilmike * r35861d6a803d 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/builder/layout_loops.des: Don't place extra loot/monsters in layout_loops_cross. 18:22:20 03evilmike * r2f0d09b7bfd2 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/builder/layout_loops.des: Allow layout_loops to rarely be made of stone/metal, as with other layouts. 18:22:20 03evilmike * r4f30efc5123f 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/builder/ (layout.des layout_loops.des): Simplify and tweak some Pan layout weights. 18:24:18 03kilobyte * r452cc7e590e7 10/crawl-ref/source/ (mon-stuff.cc monster.cc monster.h throw.cc): Don't let stasis block emergency monster teleport/blink. 18:24:18 03kilobyte * rb712ff15c6f9 10/crawl-ref/source/spl-damage.cc: Remove blink frogs' immunity to the Dispersal spell. 18:24:19 03kilobyte * ree38ebdd969e 10/crawl-ref/source/ (15 files): Fix monster no_tele not being heeded in a number of places. 18:24:23 -!- blabber has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:24:56 -!- st_ has quit [] 18:25:26 -!- alefury has quit [] 18:26:16 -!- blabber has joined ##crawl-dev 18:30:10 kilobyte: thx for the answer. I guess this really needs a bigger change then (if you even want to change it). 18:33:29 -!- blabber has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:34:22 -!- blabber has joined ##crawl-dev 18:52:53 -!- PatashuXantheres has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 18:55:28 -!- Patashu has joined ##crawl-dev 19:01:38 -!- Fa has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:07:32 -!- Patashu has quit [Quit: MSN: Patashu@hotmail.com , Gmail: Patashu0@gmail.com , AIM: Patashu0 , YIM: patashu2 , Skype: patashu0 .] 19:17:13 -!- Fa has joined ##crawl-dev 19:18:07 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 19:20:36 -!- Patashu has joined ##crawl-dev 19:22:02 -!- frogbotherer has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:41:23 -!- eeviac_ has joined ##crawl-dev 19:43:17 -!- ToBeFree has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:44:53 -!- ark____ has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:45:00 -!- ToBeFree has joined ##crawl-dev 19:52:50 -!- ToBeFree has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:57:38 -!- Patashu has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:57:45 -!- Patashu has joined ##crawl-dev 20:16:12 -!- Patashu has quit [Disconnected by services] 20:16:13 -!- PatashuG1LD4 has joined ##crawl-dev 20:19:21 -!- PatashuG1LD4 is now known as Patashu 20:24:57 Fannar (12e) | Spd: 10 | Int: high | HD: 10 | HP: 80 | AC/EV: 0/13 | Dam: 8 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, spellcaster | Res: 06magic(80) | Chunks: 07contam | XP: 1261 | Sp: b.cold (3d18), armour, ice beast, refrigeration, blink. 20:24:57 %??fannar 20:25:31 ??fannar 20:25:31 fannar[1/2]: Ice-casting unique elf, new in 0.11. Summons Ice Beasts and casts Refrig, Bolt of Cold, and Ozo's Armour. 20:25:34 :o 20:25:37 ??fannar[2] 20:25:38 fannar[2/2]: The reason why monsters can now wear jewellery. Send your regards to Grunt! 20:30:29 03evilmike * r4e020003590b 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/builder/layout.des: Increase the weight of layout_basic in Geh and Coc. 20:31:20 200 (Geh), 200 (Coc) instead of 200 (Geh, Coc)? 20:31:36 eh, whatever, does the same thing 20:36:34 -!- Textmode has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 20:49:33 Hey. I'm having some trouble compiling DCSS 0.10.3 on Cygwin. Any chance someone could take a look at the output? http://pastebin.com/qsZFgfk5 20:50:01 I've gotten it to compile before; I'm not compiling the tiles version, so I'm not entirely sure why it's compiling the RLTiles stuff. 20:51:17 -!- Textmode has joined ##crawl-dev 20:52:49 Or rather, I've gotten 0.10.2 to compile, and if I copy over the rltiles directory from *that* version, I can get 0.10.3 to compile fine. (That being said, if I run make clean on 0.10.2, I end up with the same error.) 20:54:16 -!- eeviac_ has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88.2 [Firefox 13.0/20120601175215]] 21:00:18 -!- HangedMan has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:09:08 -!- G-Flex has joined ##crawl-dev 21:09:11 -!- Chapayev has joined ##crawl-dev 21:09:31 hey, i've got a question about what to do with a game in some kind of hung state on CAO 21:10:09 -!- omnirizon has joined ##crawl-dev 21:11:43 greetings. my game on CAO froze up. I disconnected and reconnected, and was asked if I wanted to force quit, which was strange. I said yes and now... 21:11:53 I get "another game is already in progress using this save" 21:18:38 Whoops. 21:18:41 Huh... think my problem has to do with the version of 21:19:19 Huh... think my problem has to do with the version of g++ I'm using... if I roll it back to an earlier version, the rltiles stuff compiles fine (but not the rest of DCSS)... 21:19:22 Strange. 21:20:27 03evilmike * r3a36c4273bd4 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/branches/hells.des: Fix gehenna_fire_generator. 21:21:45 that one seems to have been a pretty old bug 21:22:03 it had PLACE: Geh:1 for some reason 21:24:44 i'm getting the same message as omnirizon 21:32:53 -!- Fa has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 21:33:02 -!- Mottie has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 21:41:51 -!- Textmode has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 21:43:03 -!- blabber has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:50:50 -!- Dixbert has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:56:37 -!- Textmode has joined ##crawl-dev 22:15:46 -!- omnirizon has quit [Quit: Colloquy for iPad - http://colloquy.mobi] 22:21:55 -!- omnirizon has joined ##crawl-dev 22:25:59 -!- ussdefiant_ has joined ##crawl-dev 22:28:13 -!- Textmode has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 22:29:37 Rune apparently not spawning in the shoals (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=5787) by nomoreoxygen 22:32:23 -!- Patashu has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 22:32:43 -!- jpt9 has left ##crawl-dev 22:33:47 -!- Patashu has joined ##crawl-dev 22:39:28 -!- joosa has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:41:12 -!- Patashu has quit [Disconnected by services] 22:41:13 -!- PatashuG1LD4 has joined ##crawl-dev 22:43:34 -!- PatashuG1LD4 is now known as Patashu 22:51:34 -!- omnirizon has quit [Quit: Colloquy for iPad - http://colloquy.mobi] 22:51:47 -!- ZChris13 has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 22:57:21 -!- Nomi has joined ##crawl-dev 22:57:38 can i use @?? here? 22:57:44 you know, for Fannar 22:59:03 -!- omnirizon has joined ##crawl-dev 22:59:55 -!- Textmode has joined ##crawl-dev 23:01:02 Fannar (12e) | Spd: 10 | Int: high | HD: 10 | HP: 80 | AC/EV: 0/13 | Dam: 8 | 10weapons, 10items, 10doors, spellcaster | Res: 06magic(80) | Chunks: 07contam | XP: 1261 | Sp: b.cold (3d18), armour, ice beast, refrigeration, blink. 23:01:02 %??fannar 23:01:18 elliptic: thanks 23:01:26 now i'll annoy Cheibriados in pm 23:02:23 says: Take it easy. 23:03:07 -!- moxian has joined ##crawl-dev 23:08:15 -!- Patashu has quit [Disconnected by services] 23:08:15 -!- PatashuG1LD4 has joined ##crawl-dev 23:09:37 omnirizon the Conqueror (L27 MiMo) (Slime:6) 23:09:38 snoopy the Ruinous (L1 TeCj) (D:2) 23:09:38 Serge the Carver (L13 MiFi) (D:14) 23:09:41 russell the Chucker (L3 TrHu) (D:3) 23:09:46 Tenaya the Peltast (L26 HOGl) (Vault:8) 23:09:51 rundle the Talismancer (L27 DEFE) (Pan) 23:09:54 Maahes the Skirmisher (L6 DsSk) (D:5) 23:14:35 -!- Textmode has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 23:20:40 -!- omnirizon has quit [Quit: Colloquy for iPad - http://colloquy.mobi] 23:23:20 -!- eeviac_ has joined ##crawl-dev 23:29:05 -!- Textmode has joined ##crawl-dev 23:31:25 -!- ussdefiant_ has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 23:40:12 -!- joosa has joined ##crawl-dev 23:44:50 -!- Pacra has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 23:52:24 -!- Textmode has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 23:58:35 -!- Grunt has quit [Quit: leaving]