00:01:35 -!- blabber has quit [Quit: leaving] 00:01:47 -!- blabber has joined ##crawl-dev 00:03:22 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.11-a0-54-gee6dc2c (32) 00:05:32 -!- mikee_ has quit [Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- Po-ta-to, boil em, mash em, stick em in a stew.] 00:19:02 Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.11-a0-54-gee6dc2c 00:26:20 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:50:46 -!- blabber has quit [Quit: leaving] 01:34:50 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 01:57:03 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 02:03:32 -!- ainsophyao has joined ##crawl-dev 02:19:37 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:22:13 -!- jeanjacques has joined ##crawl-dev 02:28:08 -!- Textmode has joined ##crawl-dev 03:12:33 -!- syllogism has joined ##crawl-dev 03:29:21 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 03:40:38 -!- ixtli has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 03:41:46 -!- paxed has quit [Quit: brb] 03:43:19 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 04:00:46 -!- ainsophyao has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:04:36 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 05:51:48 -!- evilmike has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:17:13 -!- st_ has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 06:26:36 -!- edlothiol has joined ##crawl-dev 06:45:06 -!- ainsophyao has joined ##crawl-dev 07:09:54 -!- HangedMan has joined ##crawl-dev 07:14:49 so while adding a note about eldritch tentacles breaking from dispersal brand (that swap card can also break them as such), should I mention the dispersal spell and distortion blinking removing eldritch tentacles from play without any message or is that a seperate issue 07:14:54 ...on mantis 07:19:18 hm, it's probably all somewhat related i guess 07:20:28 i think i reported teleport/golubria traps breaking them ages ago, tentacle code is scary and i have no idea how to fix it unfortunately 07:21:13 hehehe 07:21:59 presumably they should just be completely immune to teleportation somehow 07:22:09 but i don't think there's any existing way to do that for non-players 08:07:18 so let's move notele to actor 08:30:17 You guys should really have someone feel responsible for c-r-d queries. 08:31:04 c-r-d? 08:31:16 crawl-ref-discuss, the mailing list 08:31:29 ah, okay 08:31:35 from time to time, there's a proposal or bug report getting there and someone should answer 08:43:05 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 08:52:53 -!- Textmode has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 09:04:53 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 09:26:53 -!- dpeg has quit [Quit: leaving] 09:37:27 -!- Textmode has joined ##crawl-dev 10:02:52 -!- Pacra has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 10:22:31 reference to the removed giant toads (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=5265) by nagdon 10:47:54 Can't train weapon skill of a cursed weapon under certain circumstances. (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=5266) by psch 10:48:17 -!- ainsophyao has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:49:34 -!- ainsophyao has joined ##crawl-dev 10:50:58 -!- ainsophy_ has joined ##crawl-dev 10:51:04 -!- ainsophyao has quit [Read error: No route to host] 11:27:26 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 11:28:14 -!- Pacra has quit [Client Quit] 11:33:15 -!- Ragdoll has joined ##crawl-dev 11:54:51 -!- Xiberia has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 11:57:24 -!- Xiberia has joined ##crawl-dev 11:58:26 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:15:32 -!- iasov has joined ##crawl-dev 12:16:22 -!- upsy has joined ##crawl-dev 12:18:52 -!- Suga_H has joined ##crawl-dev 12:19:54 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 12:24:53 -!- ais523 has joined ##crawl-dev 12:27:54 -!- ais523 has quit [*.net *.split] 12:27:54 -!- iasov has quit [*.net *.split] 12:27:56 -!- blueDave has quit [*.net *.split] 12:27:57 -!- the_glow has quit [*.net *.split] 12:27:57 -!- Henzell has quit [*.net *.split] 12:27:58 -!- cbus has quit [*.net *.split] 12:27:59 -!- CIA-135 has quit [*.net *.split] 12:27:59 -!- HangedMan has quit [*.net *.split] 12:28:01 -!- cbus has joined ##crawl-dev 12:28:09 -!- blueDave has joined ##crawl-dev 12:28:15 -!- iasov has joined ##crawl-dev 12:28:15 -!- the_glow has joined ##crawl-dev 12:28:29 -!- Henzell has joined ##crawl-dev 12:29:05 -!- ais523 has joined ##crawl-dev 12:30:26 -!- CIA-46 has joined ##crawl-dev 12:35:38 -!- the_glow has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 12:47:10 03kilobyte * re7e38d6bae71 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/descript/monsters.txt: Don't talk about removed giant frogs in the desc of spiny frogs. 12:47:20 03kilobyte * rbec4bdd95687 10/crawl-ref/source/artefact.cc: Give artefacts a miniscule chance of being distortion. 12:47:21 03kilobyte * ra69a7e39820f 10/crawl-ref/source/acquire.cc: Don't acquire blunt vamp or distortion (artefact or not) if you need to butcher. 12:58:13 03kilobyte * rb231c63186a3 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-abil.cc: Disallow mute (from recite) orc knights to battle cry. 13:11:27 -!- iasov has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:11:42 -!- iasov has joined ##crawl-dev 13:16:27 -!- iasov has quit [Client Quit] 13:16:42 -!- iasov has joined ##crawl-dev 13:16:58 -!- iasov has left ##crawl-dev 13:18:14 03kilobyte * r80186d560df4 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-behv.cc: Berserk monsters shouldn't flee. 13:21:02 -!- the_glow has joined ##crawl-dev 13:41:02 -!- ainsophy_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:11:00 should curse toes be able to summon mushrooms if you worship Fedhas? They immediately get converted. 14:11:12 i don't think they should be able to summon them at all 14:18:31 is a curse toe supposedly smart enough to tell what god you worship? 14:18:33 or care? 14:18:48 rather is it supposed to care? 14:28:57 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 14:31:47 curse toes... 14:31:51 I don't.. 14:31:52 another, bigger question: how exactly plants can feel torment? 14:31:54 I just don't.. 14:36:26 MarvinPA: you edited torment code some time ago, exempting firewood. Is there a reason any plants can be tormented? 14:37:27 this goes contrary to descriptions that speak about "pain": messages, ability desc, DS mutation 14:37:58 kilobyte: are you sure plants can't feel pain? several have a pain response 14:38:09 normally involving injecting chemicals into the ground to warn other nearby plants 14:40:46 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 14:41:26 interesting... but googling around says it's a defense against some types of fungal infection 14:42:46 could you tell me more? At least the common understanding of pain requires a nervous system. 14:46:12 kilobyte: I'm afraid not, it's a vague memory from something from ages ago 14:50:15 Wikipedia's article says in a quite authoritative voice (which doesn't mean it is necessarily correct) that most invertebrates, all plants and fungi have no pain receptors 14:50:27 molluscs do feel it so sorry, octopodes :p 14:52:26 the article "pain in invertebrates" quite contradicts the claims of no pain in "pain" 14:54:59 -!- blabber has joined ##crawl-dev 14:55:10 comparing other necromantic effects: in Crawl, plants are immune to draining and until recently were immune to rot (I changed the latter -- parents house has a garden so you see why) 14:56:12 monsters resist torment IFF they're undead, nonliving or demonic 14:57:26 demons are quite contrary to any fiction I've read, though -- and angels which are a type of demon (but of a different allegiance) somehow suffer torment 15:03:43 game balance implications of making plants immune are clear: Fedhas. In a 3-runer, you don't see torment except possibly by a summoned fiend on Zot:5 or Elf:5, then the real endgame tends to have torment in every hard place 15:11:47 perhaps make it so that non-active plants are immune to torment? 15:11:57 specifically bushes, plants, and trees 15:12:09 and fungii 15:12:21 but keep wandering fungii and oklobs succeptable to torment? 15:13:19 kilobyte: that just means they don't have a specific kind of neuron 15:13:37 er, receptors, rather 15:13:49 they may be capable of feeling pain in a different way 15:15:45 "specific kind of neuron"... given a complete lack of neurons, that's quite a given 15:16:42 though, do Pain and Torment work on the nervous system specifically, or living tissue in general? 15:18:18 plants experience acute biological stress, nobody knows if it is pain, it doesn't really matter because there are almost no threatening plant monsters in crawl and their odds of running into torment are low anyways 15:18:49 IIRC Pain doesn't affect plants. 15:18:59 "You feel a strange anaesthesia." 15:19:01 I don't think Pain and torment are the same? 15:19:25 Pain and Agony are related though? 15:19:54 agony is resistable single-target torment 15:19:55 Hmm, badwiki says I'm wrong... 15:20:09 "Sacrifice a cadaver to make everyone in sight, including you, experience all the pain that being suffered in its life." 15:20:12 Also says that torment doesn't affect plants though... 15:20:16 does Agony get resisted by rN+? 15:20:20 does torment still do that, for that matter 15:20:25 you can't experience something without some kind of a nervous system 15:21:00 Eronarn: both: partially, -5% damage (starting from 50%) per level of rN 15:21:19 kilobyte: we don't know that 15:21:25 well, we know the latter, i meant the former 15:21:28 :P 15:25:29 Eronarn: I've spent the last half an hour reading various pages, and generally, it's like: plants can respond to certain stimuli (sunflowers moving towards light, flytraps closing their traps, some plants release anti-insect or anti-fungal substance when bit), but these are all localized non-coordinated responses 15:27:19 the big argument against any claims of having some hidden "feel": it would give the plant no gain (as it can't utilize that knowledge), and thus would be a waste of energy. Wastes are quickly evolved against (and wouldn't evolve in the first place). 15:29:01 kilobyte: plants can release compounds that cause other plants to take action (in fact, there are some plants that release chemicals that hijack those signals and cause them to die off) 15:29:41 it's closer to reflexive, but we don't know whether that is different qualitatively 15:29:45 just checked the Pain spell: it checks torment resistance (the other check is for Deep Dwarves who would shave the damage anyway) 15:30:48 as in for casting the spell? 15:30:56 are you planning a plant that casts pain 15:30:58 that would be silly 15:32:15 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 15:38:08 Suga_H: treefolk 15:40:31 -!- jeanjacques has quit [] 15:44:14 kilobyte: i think that was just to hide the messages for firewood, right? since they were spammy and annoying 15:45:03 but yeah, i wouldn't be against plants being tormentproof, if you think that fits better 15:45:16 when will the holy gods accept mummies 15:45:39 i find their racism most discriminating 15:45:43 !lg race=mu god=tso 15:45:43 No games for Eronarn (race=mu god=tso). 15:45:48 !lg * race=mu god=tso 15:45:48 No games for * (race=mu god=tso). 15:45:50 it was a ds 15:45:54 there was a mummy too 15:46:05 the MuPa isn't in the db iirc 15:46:05 !lg * race=mu god=the shining one 15:46:06 No games for * (race=mu god=the shining one). 15:46:12 how did that happen 15:46:15 bug 15:46:33 there's a milestone 15:46:36 ever since i heard about the tso ds thing i pray for the holy gods when i have the chance but no-ope 15:46:40 !lm * race=mu god=the shining one 15:46:42 30. [2008-01-03] syllogism the Farming Worldly Agent (L20 MuPa) entered Tartarus on turn 834509. (Tar:1) 15:46:48 !lm * race=mu god=the shining one -log 15:46:49 syllogism, XL20 MuPa, T:834509 (milestone) has no matching game. 16:18:37 -!- petete has joined ##crawl-dev 16:20:22 -!- Pacra has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 16:20:55 -!- santiago has joined ##crawl-dev 16:23:13 -!- petete has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 16:25:44 -!- santiago has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 16:26:16 -!- petete has joined ##crawl-dev 16:26:32 -!- HangedMan has joined ##crawl-dev 16:27:10 teleporting tentacle segments: the trivial way would be to make them non-teleportable, but I wonder if it'd be better to teleport the whole kraken 16:41:38 shouldn't curse scrolls id instead of failing when wearing a cursed something? 16:49:22 not sure... there's no obvious abuse that would allow you to id them freely 16:49:30 -!- Ragdoll has quit [Quit: Up, up and away!] 16:49:45 (this was the main reason for auto-id changes) 16:54:15 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 16:55:16 Cerebov the Ruffian (L1 TrMo) (D:1) 16:56:22 !lm Cerebov type=crash -log 16:56:25 1. Cerebov, XL1 TrMo, T:2 (milestone): http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/Cerebov/crash-Cerebov-20120127-225516.txt 16:57:32 something about how crashes are a few seconds behind or something 16:57:51 Cerebov the Ruffian (L1 TrMo) (D:1) 16:58:24 nothing obvious in this one: no idea if it was an infinite loop or something else 16:58:48 -!- heteroy has joined ##crawl-dev 16:59:09 kilobyte: he apparently pasted a huge amount of text into the terminal at once, if that helps 16:59:36 oooh, thanks 16:59:51 (still no real clue but it's at least something) 17:15:13 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 17:17:47 -!- iasov has joined ##crawl-dev 17:18:28 -!- heteroy has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 17:23:06 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 17:46:28 -!- ais523 has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:47:41 -!- heteroy has joined ##crawl-dev 18:12:23 03kilobyte * rc19ef6ca7b7f 10/crawl-ref/source/ (7 files): Stop plants and tentacles from being teleported. 18:12:28 03kilobyte * re1e6d9096d03 10/crawl-ref/source/monster.cc: Stop tentacles from being affected by mutagenic fog. 18:12:28 03kilobyte * rcc6e23a2ee0d 10/crawl-ref/source/ (effects.cc monster.cc): Plants have no means to feel pain -- so torment shouldn't affect them. 18:13:36 that also stops mutation brand from effecting them 18:13:50 but hooray more bugs being fixed 18:46:06 -!- evilmike has joined ##crawl-dev 18:52:18 03kilobyte * r2e8ce956d08f 10/crawl-ref/ (licence.txt source/ng-input.cc): Update the copyright year. 18:52:18 03kilobyte 07stone_soup-0.10 * r357542c90946 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/entry/small.des: Don't teleport Op and Mf into D:1 aquaria. 18:52:18 03elliptic 07stone_soup-0.10 * ra7a445239f4e 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-stuff.cc: Fix Yred enslavement not recording that you killed the monster too. 18:52:19 03MarvinPA 07stone_soup-0.10 * r0ce05e4f747a 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/branches/tomb.des: Prevent getting outside Tomb:2 and 3 with Shatter 18:52:19 03MarvinPA 07stone_soup-0.10 * r9c52cf747956 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/branches/hells.des: Prevent Shattering outside tar_minmay_river too 18:52:19 03evilmike 07stone_soup-0.10 * rc277481c1b87 10/crawl-ref/docs/changelog.txt: Mention Dispel Undead and Alistair's changes in changelog. 18:52:19 03evilmike 07stone_soup-0.10 * ra1cc470ccaee 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/sprint/sprint_fedhas.des: Identify the guaranteed ring of invisibility in Sprint IV. (N78291) 18:52:20 03MarvinPA 07stone_soup-0.10 * r0cad001f683d 10/crawl-ref/docs/changelog.txt: Update spells section of changelog 18:52:20 03MarvinPA 07stone_soup-0.10 * r326dd3e6a66b 10/crawl-ref/source/ (art-data.txt art-func.h): Mark the Black Knight's barding as evil, since it makes you partially undead 18:52:30 03MarvinPA 07stone_soup-0.10 * r9d62996bf314 10/crawl-ref/source/spl-miscast.cc: Let Divination miscasts drain the stats of undead players 18:52:30 03kilobyte 07stone_soup-0.10 * rdd6b69f836a9 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/descript/monsters.txt: Don't talk about removed giant frogs in the desc of spiny frogs. 18:52:30 03kilobyte 07stone_soup-0.10 * r6f1478ae07bd 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-abil.cc: Disallow mute (from recite) orc knights to battle cry. 18:52:31 03kilobyte 07stone_soup-0.10 * r372fdf356f13 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-behv.cc: Berserk monsters shouldn't flee. 18:52:32 03kilobyte 07stone_soup-0.10 * r57424405474c 10/crawl-ref/source/ (effects.cc monster.cc): Plants have no means to feel pain -- so torment shouldn't affect them. 18:52:32 03kilobyte 07stone_soup-0.10 * rfa33216b1b8d 10/crawl-ref/source/ (7 files): Stop plants and tentacles from being teleported. 18:53:30 03kilobyte 07stone_soup-0.10 * rbacc046c0bde 10/crawl-ref/source/monster.cc: Stop tentacles from being affected by mutagenic fog. 18:53:30 03kilobyte 07stone_soup-0.10 * recb935401a1b 10/crawl-ref/ (licence.txt source/ng-input.cc): Update the copyright year. 18:55:33 -!- syllogism has quit [] 18:55:41 I could swear I've seen some of those changes posted here before. 18:56:23 yeah, cia is announcing them for trunk and for 0.10 18:56:34 Oh, that makes sense. 19:08:22 -!- blabber has quit [Quit: leaving] 19:21:02 -!- Textmode has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 19:40:19 03kilobyte 07stone_soup-0.10 * r00ccddc797c8 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/database/quotes.txt: Drop typographical niceties for 0.10. 19:50:24 kilobyte: the what ? 20:14:02 -!- ainsophyao has joined ##crawl-dev 20:20:56 -!- edlothiol has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:40:29 -!- dtsund has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 20:57:22 "--4" on skill screen, misaligned (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=5267) by ortoslon 21:13:46 -!- upsy has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:17:33 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 21:43:04 Targeting has ONE T. (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=5268) by XuaXua 22:03:46 -!- HangedMan has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:17:34 -!- HangedMan has joined ##crawl-dev 23:14:14 -!- heteroy has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87 [Firefox 3.6.25/20111212142243]] 23:19:37 -!- Red_Bucket has joined ##crawl-dev 23:30:08 03evilmike * r074e2b78c7b8 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/builder/food.des: Improve spriggan bakers.