--- Log opened Fri Dec 09 00:00:49 2011
00:03 < Wensley> bmh: +10000000
00:04 < bmh> Wensley: if anything, I love to see the catoblepas because I know that stuff won't kill me when I'm turned to stone
00:04 < Wensley> bmh: actually, the catlobe is quite dangerous. it is especially effective against beserkers, spens, and tabspam
00:04 < Wensley> bmh: even with the recent nerf to petrify dr?
00:06 < bmh> Wensley: last time I ran lair I was stupid overpowered.
00:06 < Wensley> bmh: how recently was this
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00:07 < bmh> Wensley: uh... ask the bot when I had my highest XL
00:07 < bmh> (on CDO)
00:07 < Wensley> !lm bmh place=lair:8 source=cdo
00:07 < Sequell> Unknown selector: source
00:07 < Wensley> !lm bmh place=lair:8
00:07 < Sequell> 5. [2011-11-27] bh the Severer (L14 HOPr) reached level 8 of the Lair of Beasts on turn 23982. (Lair:8)
00:08 < Wensley> hopr sounds like an interesting match for the catlobe
00:08 < bmh> really easy. Your orc followers just eat it
00:08 < Wensley> but catlobes are notoriously weak against summons, and this is acceptable
00:08 < bmh> ok :)
00:08 < Wensley> all summons will overcome slow things :)
00:08 <+evilmike> the catoblepas lair ending seems deadly enough
00:09 < Wensley> !lg * cv=~0.10 place=lair:8 s=map
00:09 < Sequell> 150 games for * (cv=~0.10 place=lair:8): 80x , 20x evil forest, 18x due jungle book, 12x evilmike catoblepas cave, 7x wormcave, 4x minmay lair end enchanted forest, 3x jungle book, 2x minmay lair end frog pond, dpeg oklob 1, worms lemuel, slime altar 2, minmay slime entry pillars
00:09 < Wensley> wish there was a way to normalize deadliness by weight
00:09 < Wensley> in sequell
00:09 < bmh> as my abyss vaults in? And if so, have they killed anyone?
00:09 < bmh> %s/as/are/
00:09 <+evilmike> !lg * place=abyss s=map
00:09 < Sequell> 13986 games for * (place=abyss): 13940x , 5x minivault 13, 5x lemuel flamethrower hall, 3x evilmike abyss exit smiterflies, 3x minivault 20, 2x minivault 23, 2x minivault 25, 2x onia ninara dug in and dangerous, 2x lemuel flamethrower 2, 2x evilmike abyss exit kraken, 2x due exit kobolds, minivault 27, minivault 5, evilmike abyss exit 1, evilmike abyss exit vortex, minivault 4, evilmike abyss exit...
00:10 < Wensley> !lg * map=~bmh
00:10 < Sequell> No games for * (map=~bmh).
00:10 <+evilmike> your abyss vaults are small (like all abyss vaults), so they tend not to get kills. You need to actually die inside the map, as far as I know
00:10 < Wensley> !lg * place=abyss cv=~0.10 s=map
00:10 < Sequell> 656 games for * (place=abyss cv=~0.10): 648x , evilmike abyss rune siren, evilmike abyss exit 1, minivault 1, evilmike abyss exit 17, evilmike abyss rune ettins, evilmike abyss rune shrine, evilmike abyss exit 10, evilmike abyss exit kraken
00:10 < bmh> evilmike: ah. We should fix it so that a kill is attributed if done by a monster from it
00:11 <+SamB> evilmike: why are yours so deadly
00:11 < Wensley> SamB: his are just listed first :P
00:11 < bmh> SamB: his name is *EVIL*mike
00:11 <+SamB> Wensley: not so
00:11 < Wensley> no?
00:11 < Wensley> oh hey, that's all of them
00:11 <+evilmike> SamB: when I made those abyss vaults, there were only 3 currently existing
00:11 < Wensley> evilmike must make bigger maps, or ones that are more alluring to draw people in to die to them
00:12 <+SamB> Wensley: also, in descending order of kill count
00:12 <+evilmike> so mine have been in crawl for a good deal longer than most others
00:12 <+SamB> also, what's the stupid one ?
00:12 <+evilmike> also, probably about half (or more) of the abyss vaults were made by me
00:12 <+SamB> also, that's only 0.10
00:12 <+SamB> evilmike: well, okay, that's a good reason
00:12 <+SamB> the "minivault 1"
00:12 <+SamB> that's stupid name
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00:12 <+evilmike> oh
00:13 <+evilmike> minivault 1 is a classic minivault. one of the first ever added to crawl
00:13 <+SamB> oh
00:13 <+evilmike> there's also a vault 1
00:13 <+SamB> that would explain the number 1
00:13 < Wensley> !vault vault_1
00:13 < Henzell> Lines pasted to http://paste.scsys.co.uk/165516
00:13 <+SamB> I still think the name is stupid, though
00:13 <+evilmike> !source dat/des/variable/float.des
00:13 < Henzell> Lines pasted to http://paste.scsys.co.uk/165517
00:14 <+evilmike> maybe its in large.des, whatever
00:14 <+evilmike> A lot of the classic numbered vaults were renamed, but a lot weren't. It's kind of hard to give them names in a lot of cases
00:15 <+SamB> you could give them a classic_ prefix!
00:15 <+SamB> you know, instead of the creator's nick?
00:16 <+evilmike> almost all of them were made by linley afaik
00:16 <+SamB> or you could use linley_
00:16 <+SamB> if you're sure that a specific one is such
00:16 <+evilmike> the main reason I tag vaults like that is for feedback purposes though, makes it easy to query for them and if there is a problem with one, people know to blame me
00:16 ۰۰-- capablanca is now known as mikee_
00:17 <+evilmike> that's not so useful for ancient stuff
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00:18 < Henzell> AlphaQ the Farming Meteorologist (L27 DsAE) ASSERT(smc) in 'mon-util.cc' at line 1405 failed on turn 215148. (Pan)
00:18 <+SamB> true
00:19 <+SamB> how come minmay doesn't use that name here? trying to avoid blame?
00:19 < Henzell> AlphaQ the Farming Meteorologist (L27 DsAE) ASSERT(smc) in 'mon-util.cc' at line 1405 failed on turn 215052. (Pan)
00:19 < bmh> evilmike: I always just assumed you were an egomaniac who put his name on everything ;)
00:19 <+evilmike> minmay is in ##crawl all the time, might be better if he stays there
00:20 <+SamB> the joke has to do with the letter q
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00:20 <+evilmike> oh, right, that
00:20 <+SamB> by "here" I meant "on freenode"
00:20 <+SamB> bmh: actually, that's suggested in the docs ...
00:24 <+evilmike> It's mentioned in a guide to entry vaults, I'm not sure if it's anywhere else though
00:24 <+|amethyst> hm.... I'm not having any luck finding it, but *something* is causing trees around the edge of a vault to want to be next to floor, while rock in the same location is happy being rock
00:25 <+|amethyst> s/being rock/being surrounded by rock/
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00:42 < Henzell> AlphaQ the Farming Meteorologist (L27 DsAE) ASSERT(smc) in 'mon-util.cc' at line 1405 failed on turn 215961. (Pan)
00:48 <+|amethyst> yeah, if I surround the outer trees with rock, everything works fine
00:50 <+|amethyst> well, I still get occasional vetoes, but much much less frequently than with trees next to DNGN_UNSEEN
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00:59 <+|amethyst> okay, I'm giving up on this for now
01:02 < Gretell> Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.10-a0-2627-g8180956 (32)
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01:18 < Gretell> Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.10-a0-2627-g8180956
01:26 < Henzell> AlphaQ the Farming Meteorologist (L27 DsAE) ASSERT(smc) in 'mon-util.cc' at line 1405 failed on turn 218819. (Pan)
01:36 <+|amethyst> okay, so I lied about giving up.... experimenting with different features, it appears that any kind of wall at the edge of the map is happy being completely surrounded by wall, but any other feature (grates, trees, statues, water, open sea, ...) is likely to be placed next to floor.
01:37 <+|amethyst> but I've looked through every occurrence of 'wall' in dungeon.cc and maps.cc to no avail
01:37 <+|amethyst> this map has a @ so it's not the "connect a passable square" thing, and anyway trees aren't passable
01:41 <+|amethyst> oh... maybe it's _ruin_level
01:41 <+SamB> lol
01:41 <+SamB> it's ruining the level, huh?
01:47 <+|amethyst> it is
01:53 < Henzell> AlphaQ the Farming Meteorologist (L27 DsAE) ASSERT(smc) in 'mon-util.cc' at line 1405 failed on turn 219961. (Pan)
02:01 < Henzell> AlphaQ the Farming Meteorologist (L27 DsAE) ASSERT(smc) in 'mon-util.cc' at line 1405 failed on turn 220669. (Pan)
02:05 <+|amethyst> haha
02:05 <+|amethyst> seems to work
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02:43 <+|amethyst> In a .des, is it possible to substitute to space (DNGN_UNKNOWN)?
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02:50 <+|amethyst> hm, looks like  SUBST E = t:10 :10 works
02:51 <+|amethyst> hm, or maybe it doesn't
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03:01 < CIA-54> |amethyst * rc15aa3ff8ac1 /crawl-ref/source/dat/des/branches/lair.des: De-rim the enchanted forest.
03:01 < CIA-54> |amethyst * rfd214dbdb767 /crawl-ref/source/dungeon.cc: Don't create disconnected floor when ruining levels.
03:02 <+|amethyst> in your FACE, stupid bug!
03:03 <+|amethyst> as a side effect, that's one fewer XXX comment :)
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06:00 < Gretell> OSX builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.10-a0-2629-gc15aa3f
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07:19 <@dpeg> |amethyst: ah, I see the + :)
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08:34 < Gretell> Zicher (L18 MiFi) ASSERT(smc) in 'mon-util.cc' at line 445 failed. (Shoals:2)
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08:48 < alefury> possibly logging is broken
08:49 < alefury> last entry of http://tozt.net/crawl/ is 20111207 for me
08:51 <+kilobyte> 20110916 for me :p
08:51 <+kilobyte> no 08 and 09, indeed
08:52 <+Zaba> Ashenzari seems to be down - isn't it he who does the logging?
09:00 < alefury> so where does it run? cdo? cao?
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10:06 <+|amethyst> /home/neil/text/irc/freenode/##crawl-dev/2011-12-08.log:00:33 ۰۰-- Ashenzari [~Ashenzari@tozt.akrasiac.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
10:06 <+|amethyst> so CAO
10:07 <+|amethyst> also, CAO hasn't updated since 2011-12-06
10:08 <+|amethyst> !tell rax Any idea why Ashenzari is down?  Also, possibly, updates
10:08 < Henzell> |amethyst: OK, I'll let rax know.
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10:13 < tobiasjs> Hi. I'm making a small mod to crawl for a birthday present for a long-time crawl fan. Would it be possible to ask a couple of (hopefully quick) questions?
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10:14 <@rax> no, not cao
10:14 < Henzell> rax: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it.
10:15 <@rax> ashenzari != crawl
10:15 < HughBorg> Hey so if I wanted more variables to script with, how would I port them from c++ to lua outside of the l_you.cc file? Is that possible?
10:15 <@rax> What about CAO hasn't updated sine then?
10:15 <+|amethyst> rax:  oh, I thought tozt and crawl were the same machine
10:15 <@rax> No, they're all different VMs
10:15 <+|amethyst> aha
10:15 <@rax> tozt is... doy's personal machine, I think
10:15 <+|amethyst> there hasn't been a rebuild since 2011-12-06
10:15 <@rax> Of trunk?
10:16 <+|amethyst> yeah
10:16 <+|amethyst> it was every day, then it was at a different time on 2011-12-06, and that was the last update
10:16 <@rax> Looks like one started but didn't finish...
10:17 <+|amethyst> tobiasjs:  ask away
10:17 <@rax> Tried to kick off another, we'll see what it does
10:17 < tobiasjs> Thanks.
10:17 <+|amethyst> rax:  thanks
10:17 <+|amethyst> rax:  So I guess doy is the person to talk to about ashenzari?
10:18 <@rax> ...looks like one is running as of right before I logged in again
10:18 <@rax> I am confused
10:18 <@rax> Yes, or at least, I'm not :P
10:18 < tobiasjs> I guess first up, I've added a few items and a monster and unique - largely by grepping for the sections of code that related to a similar item. But one thing that I didn't see along the way was what determined where items would be randomly generated.
10:18 <+|amethyst> HughBorg:  well, only you.foo goes in l_you.cc, but I'm not sure I understand what you're asking
10:19 < tobiasjs> Is this something that needs to be configured per item, or is it inferred from item stats?
10:20 < HughBorg> Sorry that was pretty confusing. So like l_you.cc defines a bunch of variables that you can use in lua scripts
10:20 < HughBorg> Unless I'm mistaken and that's not actually where that happens
10:21 < HughBorg> But if I wanted to access another variable that existed somewhere in the source, but was not listed in that file
10:21 < HughBorg> Would there be a way to get to it short of editing the source?
10:21 < HughBorg> if you get what i mean
10:22 < tobiasjs> Similarly for monsters. [Thus far I've added a foil (dagger-like behaviour in the long-blade class) + artifact, an ultimate wheel (he's a keen unicycler) misc item, and parrots (with associated unique)]
10:23 <@rax> build appears to be running on CAO, I'll keep an eye on it
10:24 <+|amethyst> tobiasjs:  maybe look at the _generate_* functions in makeitem.cc (for weapons there is also weapon_rarity in itemprop.cc) ... for monsters see mons_*_level and mons_*_rare in mon-pick.cc
10:24 <+|amethyst> rax:  thanks a lot
10:24 <@rax> No problem. It looks like two got started at about the same time and it got confused? If it happens again I may need to dig more. But right now it should be OK, fingers crossed. :)
10:25 < Ragdoll> drat, in wizmode, how can i get a monsters to pick up a weapon, or tweak the monster's weapon
10:25 <+|amethyst> rax:  all right; if you run into more problems I could take a look at it maybe
10:26 <+|amethyst> though you probably don't want to give root to more people than absolutely necessary :)
10:26 < tobiasjs> |amethyst: why doesn't MONS_RAVEN (which is what I based the parrot on) turn up in that file?
10:26 <+|amethyst> tobiasjs:  it's not randomly generated :)
10:27 <@rax> |amethyst: I could send you an error log without giving you root :) But I think this might be an "I did cron wrong" problem and if so that's easy enough to fix
10:28 <+|amethyst> HughBorg:  you have to edit the C++ source to do so.  In you it is you_clib[] that actually has the mapping from methods/members of the lua structure 'you' to C++ implementations
10:29 < HughBorg> thanks very much
10:29 <+|amethyst> Ragdoll:  get the item in your inventory then do  xo
10:29 <+|amethyst> (well, x=o)
10:30 < tobiasjs> |amethyst: That would explain a lot. But if it's not randomly generated, then I've also missed where it's generated non-randomly.
10:31 < Ragdoll> amethyst: that works, thanks
10:32 <+|amethyst> tobiasjs:  It's used in a few vaults;  due_tower_of_silence, roderic_ravens_nest, and evilmike_haunted_forest
10:33 <+|amethyst> tobiasjs:  (those are in dat/des/variable/large_themed.des, dat/des/variable/mini_monsters.des, and dat/des/branches/crypt.des)
10:34 < Ragdoll> so it seems abyss is BANNED in zotdef
10:34 < Ragdoll> i only have to try lugonu ability, but for some reason offline crawl refuses my &^-ing
10:35 < tobiasjs> |amethyst: got them, now, thanks. For uniques, an entry in dat/des/builder/uniques.des is enough to allow the unique to be generated?
10:36 <+|amethyst> tobiasjs:  yes, and you can do something similar for non-uniques, though you'd probably want TAGS: allow_dup in that case
10:37 < CIA-54> |amethyst * rb1781bfcfa09 /crawl-ref/source/dungeon.cc: Don't use a map where a vector of pairs will do.
10:37 <+|amethyst> tobiasjs:  also, uniques that use items would usually get some starting equipment in mon-gear.cc
10:37 <+|amethyst> (and many non-uniques, but probably not a parrot :)
10:38 < tobiasjs> |amethyst: I've assumed that parrots can't use any items.
10:39 <+|amethyst> Ragdoll:  &^ works for me, but the banish ability is disabled
10:39 < Ragdoll> ah, any reason why?
10:39 <+|amethyst> to prevent you from going to the abyss
10:39 <+|amethyst> I would assume
10:39 < Ragdoll> my reason for being interested in it it to try and find fedhas, but alas
10:39 <+|amethyst> fedhas is banned in zotdef
10:39 < Ragdoll> yes, such a shame 
10:40 < Ragdoll> as in never any single chance for a fedhas to be there
10:40 <+|amethyst> I don't think going to the abyss would help anyway
10:40 < Ragdoll> or would a hypothetically fedhas altar in a bazaar provide me with fedhas
10:40 < tobiasjs> |amethyst: can monsters use misc items, though, if there isn't code specifically for it? the wheel acts like more powerful boots of running, but there's a constant chance per turn of falling off (with blink and possible confusion). Doing that involved a few methods added to player, and so I was concerned that odd things might happen if a monster could use it.
10:40 < Ragdoll> altars randomly generate in the abyss, plus the altar vault
10:41 <+|amethyst> Ragdoll:  nope, the altar gets replaced in dungeon.cc
10:41 <+|amethyst> if the god is unavailable
10:41 <+|amethyst> same as jiyva altars when it is dead
10:41 < Ragdoll> thats a shame :(
10:41 < Henzell> Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.10-a0-2629-gc15aa3f (32)
10:41 < Ragdoll> i dont see why as i am the only one playing zotdef, anyway :P
10:42 <+|amethyst> tobiasjs:  I doubt the monster could use something like that at all.. I'm not even sure about boots of running
10:42 <+|amethyst> I mean, without a lot of work
10:43 < tobiasjs> |amethyst: ok - I was mostly just concerned that there was a route for monsters to evoke misc items, and it would end up applying the status to the player.
10:43 <+|amethyst> rax:  thanks, it worked!
10:44 <+|amethyst> I've never seen a monster use a misc item; I don't think it's possible
10:44 <+|amethyst> they'll pick them up (in Elf:5 you often find elves carrying decks), but won't use them
10:46 <+|amethyst> Ragdoll:  that's not to say you shouldn't try... your abuse^Wcreativity has led to bugfixes in the past :)
10:47 < Ragdoll> ha. i reported quite a few at a earlier time but there doesnt seem to be much interest in it
10:47 <+|amethyst> A general guideline: if Ragdoll is doing something, it's probably an exploitable bug :)
10:48 < Ragdoll> haha
10:48 < Ragdoll> if i can finally get a zotdef game running i got 3 bugs on my mind to abuse
10:49 < tobiasjs> |amethyst: thanks a lot. that's all been really useful. this stuff is all meant for humour's sake, really, so there's no wider use for it. if there's something useful that comes out of it, though, is there a patch submission process?
10:53 < Ragdoll> my excuse is that zotdef is broken 
10:53 <+|amethyst> tobiasjs: you can submit a patch on Mantis; or if you know git you get a gitorious account, create a clone of the crawl repository, push your changes there, and make a merge request
10:54 <+|amethyst> Ragdoll:  it has definitely had less testing than sprint and dungeon crawl, so probably :)
10:54 <+|amethyst> tobiasjs:  if you want to do that you should be working from trunk, not 0.9
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10:56 < tobiasjs> I'm currently working off the git trunk.
10:57 <+|amethyst> ah, good :)
10:57 < tobiasjs> I had a terrible time getting 0.9.1 to compile with tiles on OSX.
10:57 <+|amethyst> tobiasjs:  there's like one person working on OSX, so that's not entirely surprising
10:57 < tobiasjs> I had to add USE_TILE_LOCAL (a guess, but seemed to work) to get the trunk version compiling.
10:58 <+|amethyst> tobiasjs:  (neunon, that is)
10:58 < alefury> wasnt zebu also sometimes doing osx stuff?
10:59 < tobiasjs> I'm not convinced that I've got all the tile stuff right in the version I'm working on - I've added the switch statements for tiles, and I *hope* that I'll get compile errors if I haven't updated the .txt files correctly. I'm testing with the ascii version at the moment.
11:00 < greatzebu> tobiasjs: I can help if you
11:00 < greatzebu> 're having trouble compiling on osx
11:00 < tobiasjs> Actually, on that note, is there any way to give a misc item a symbol other than '}'? it looks like it might involve significant hacking, so I've ignored it for the moment.
11:01 < Ragdoll> wasnt there a possibility of just changing the glyps in the rcfile?
11:02 < tobiasjs> greatzebu: thanks. once I'm done, I'll clone the repo and recompile from scratch. If I have problems then, that I can't cope with, I'll ask again.
11:02 < greatzebu> it might help to know that the osx nightlies are compiled using "make -j4 APPLE_GCC=y EXTRA_FLAGS='-DWIZARD' TILES=y NO_PKGCONFIG=y CONTRIB_SDL=y mac-app-tiles"
11:03 < tobiasjs> greatzebu: I have to deliver him a windows version (somehow) anyway, so the OSX stuff is just a personal convenience for me. I've been using the xcode project files, which I guess lag behind the makefile.
11:03 <+|amethyst> greatzebu:  maybe you should add yourself to "Noteworthy Non-Devteam People" on dcss:help:devteam
11:03 < greatzebu> probably a good idea
11:04 <+|amethyst> tobiasjs:  how up-to-date are you?  neunon added a lot of Xcode fixes about a week ago
11:04 < greatzebu> but yeah, the xcode project files are way out of date, and as far as I know not used by anyone regularly
11:04 < greatzebu> ahh, I guess I missed that
11:04 < tobiasjs> up to date as of 2 days ago.
11:05 < tobiasjs> i started off with the makefiles and 0.9.1, but trying to compile a tiles version with the contrib libs caused gcc to choke building libz.
11:06 < tobiasjs> i've built ascii only versions with the makefile plenty of times on osx before, though.
11:09 < Ragdoll> i like how the centaur kept shooting at me while i was berserking him being right next to him
11:11 <+|amethyst> really?  centaurs don't have AT_SHOOT or AT_WEAP_ONLY
11:12 < Ragdoll> !lg . xomscummping sprint -log
11:12 < Sequell> 508. xomscumming, XL1 MuCK, T:5531: http://crawl.develz.org/morgues/trunk/xomscumming/morgue-xomscumming-20111207-160012.txt
11:12 < Ragdoll> how did it catch that
11:12 < Ragdoll> oh right, zotdef.
11:12 < Ragdoll> !lg . xomscumming zotdef -log
11:12 < Sequell> 89. xomscumming, XL10 MuCK, T:3615: http://crawl.develz.org/morgues/trunk/xomscumming/morgue-xomscumming-20110322-174708.txt
11:13 < Ragdoll> !lg . xomscumming zotdef killer=centaur -log
11:13 < Sequell> No games for Ragdoll (xomscumming killer=centaur).
11:14 < Ragdoll> !lg ragdoll zotdef -log
11:14 < Sequell> 1203. xomscumming, XL4 HuSu, T:361: http://crawl.develz.org/morgues/trunk/xomscumming/morgue-xomscumming-20111209-160915.txt
11:14 < Ragdoll> that one.
11:15 < tobiasjs> greatzebu: those make flags appear to do the trick. much appreciated.
11:15 < greatzebu> great, glad to help
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11:18 <+|amethyst> Ragdoll:  hmm
11:20 < Ragdoll> a possible excuse for that happening could be because i am in the direct line of the orb
11:20 < Ragdoll> or that a berserked 1 tile away from the centaur, but i cant grasp the logic behind that
11:22 <+|amethyst> Ragdoll:  aha, it's the first thing
11:23 <+|amethyst> they'll melee you if you're on the orb, but shoot you if you're between them and the orb
11:23 <+|amethyst> I guess it's because the orb, not you, is their target, and it's not in melee range
11:24 < Ragdoll> i see, that would make sense, yes
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11:32 < CIA-54> |amethyst * r717b9867f213 /crawl-ref/source/wiz-mon.cc: If wizmode polymorph fails, try to force it.
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11:45 < Gretell> nht (L8 DDHe) ASSERT(smc) in 'mon-util.cc' at line 1123 failed. (Orc:2)
11:51 <+|amethyst> !lm nht crash -log
11:51 < Sequell> 39. nht, XL8 DDHe, T:4943 (milestone): http://crawl.develz.org/morgues/trunk/nht/crash-nht-20111209-164511.txt
11:54 <+|amethyst> that one is not ucc-related at all: changing levels, expiring ENCH_CONFUSION on a monster, looking for a habitable grid, and failing when checking inventory to see if the monster can fly
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11:55 <+|amethyst> no message about the monster dying, though
11:56 <+|amethyst> I'm not familiar with the level-changing code, though...
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12:12 <+|amethyst> nht's crash is at https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=5030
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12:40 < greatzebu> I've posted a patch to fix issue #5025 if someone with commit access wants to take a look
12:42 <@dpeg> fun stuff going on here
12:42 <@dpeg> the |amethyst having three conversations at once :)
12:43 < greatzebu> demonstrating some high-level conversation-juggling skills
12:43 <@dpeg> absolutely
12:49 <+|amethyst> heh, you're too kind :)
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12:57 <+|amethyst> greatzebu:  looks good.  I'm a little concerned about the Blork case; while he is currently the only creature with " the " in his name, the polymorph code would treat new such creaturee the same
12:57 <+|amethyst> greatzebu:  on the other hand, I don't want to mess up vault-redefined monsters
12:57 < greatzebu> the problem is just that he's special-cased in the polymorph code
12:58 < greatzebu> so he'll end up as "Blork the centaur" or whatever
12:58 <+|amethyst> right, but that would also happen for a unique named "Joe the kobold"
12:58 < greatzebu> hmm, yeah that's a good point that I didn't notice
12:58 <+|amethyst> (he is explicitly special-cased in name_zombie though)
12:59 <+|amethyst> I don't know that it's safe to just look for "the" because of vault redefinitions like Foo the cloud mage
13:00 < greatzebu> right, seems like there a lot of edge cases here
13:00 < greatzebu> but this particular code should only get called on uniques
13:00 < greatzebu> so redefined monsters shouldn't be a problem
13:01 <+|amethyst> true
13:01 < greatzebu> on the other hand, since it's just uniques it's easy enough to just say "if you add a new unique along the lines of Blork", the annotation code needs to be updated
13:01 < greatzebu> "
13:02 <+|amethyst> i'll push it as-is, and if you want to make and test a second patch to make it more general that's fine :)
13:02 < greatzebu> ok, great
13:02 < greatzebu> thanks :)
13:02 <+|amethyst> hm
13:03 <+|amethyst> there seems to be a problem
13:04 <+|amethyst> if the renamed monster follows you off-level there is no annotation at all anymore
13:04 < greatzebu> hmm
13:04 < greatzebu> that is a pretty big problem
13:05 < greatzebu> but I'm not sure why that would happen
13:06 <+|amethyst> Hm... it's not unique anymore, right?
13:07 < greatzebu> does polymorphing remove the monster's uniqueness? I didn't know that
13:09 < Zannick> probably a problem with annotation
13:09 < Zannick> they're still a unique
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13:10 < greatzebu> ok
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13:10 < greatzebu> instead of just testing mons_is_unique, we also need to test mons->props["original_was_unique"]
13:10 < greatzebu> argh
13:14 < Zannick> mons_is_unique stops working after being poly'ed?
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13:14 < greatzebu> apparently so
13:14 < greatzebu> there's a note about it in mon-stuff.cc
13:18 <+|amethyst> are you writing a patch for that or should I?
13:18 <+|amethyst> if you are, I've already applied your first one so make it a new patch
13:18 < greatzebu> I've got a fix, give me a second and I'll make a patch up
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13:21 < greatzebu> ok, new patch uploaded
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13:24 <+SamB> |amethyst: who was it who used the " at " address in their patches before?
13:27 <+SamB> hmm, is skill training scriptable from clua yet ?
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13:28  * SamB kinda feels like it ought to be in a new you.skill table or something
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13:29 <+SamB> oh, I forgot to list "X?" in the "no &" section of the wizmode help
13:29 < alefury> what do you mean? keypresses work from lua, right?
13:30 <+SamB> alefury: that would be a horrible way to do it
13:30 < greatzebu> |amethyst: XuaXua just pointed out that I set the name for the serpent of hell to "Lernaean hydra" in that patch on accident. Could you fix that for me? Sorry for the trouble
13:30 <+SamB> the letters are always changing!
13:30 < alefury> oh, true
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13:30 <+SamB> and I'm pretty sure lua can't actually look at the screen, even if you wanted it to
13:31 < alefury> bots can just rely on automode :P
13:31 <+SamB> you do call an important point to mind, though: it would be necessary to somehow expose the SK_ enum values
13:32 <+SamB> alefury: I was actually thinking more about potentially setting up some presets in my init file for some specific combos
13:32 <+SamB> i.e., what skills to focus
13:32 < alefury> oh
13:32 < alefury> well, for that keypresses are actually enough, right?
13:32 <+SamB> hmm, well, I suppose
13:32 < alefury> of course a better system would be better
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13:33 <+SamB> but I can imagine wanting to set up some macro-y stuff for use later in the game
13:34 <+SamB> say, if you wanted to temporarily focus on a specific skill at the exclusion of all others...
13:34 <+SamB> actually, there are many enums that we ought to somehow expose to lua
13:35 <+|amethyst> SamB:  that was tukkek (Alex Henry)  https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=4907
13:36  * SamB realizes he could have checked the git log
13:36 < alefury> i would prefer some actual documentation, and maybe some organized place where people can put useful init file snippets
13:36 <+SamB> alefury: documentation would be nice!
13:36 <+SamB> alefury: you can help with this!
13:36 < alefury> i know nothing about lua or rcfile scripting
13:37 <+SamB> ah
13:37 < alefury> and when i say nothing, i mean it
13:38 <+SamB> well, if you were to find yourself delving into any of the l_ files to figure out what some function does at some point, it would be great if you could write a comment above it (preferably in luadoc format) describing your findings, regardless
13:38 <+SamB> l_you.cc has some examples of luadoc comments
13:38 < alefury> sure. not likely to happen, but ill keep it in mind.
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13:43  * SamB wonders again why the lua version of item_def has such idiosynchratic method call syntax ...
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14:18 <+SamB> edlothiol: you were right, magit *is* pretty convenient
14:21 < CIA-54> SamB * r55fc70b4c7b2 /crawl-ref/source/command.cc: Reference "X?" (level-map help) from wizmode help.
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14:22 < CIA-54> GreatZebu * rf789c54d63a5 /crawl-ref/source/dgn-overview.cc: For unique annotations, check whether monster has ever been unique.
14:22 < CIA-54> GreatZebu * r84c4991a6dc7 /crawl-ref/source/dgn-overview.cc: Fix unique annotations for polymorphed royal jelly, Blork the orc, etc
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14:26 < CIA-54> GreatZebu * r94f00e13313b /crawl-ref/source/dgn-overview.cc: Fix annotation name for Serpent of Hell.
14:26 < greatzebu> thanks, |amethyst 
14:26 <+|amethyst> greatzebu:  there we go, thanks..   sorry it took so long, I have a very talkative coworker
14:27 <+|amethyst> I'm not getting any annotation for the serpent of hell, even before polymorphing
14:27 < greatzebu> no problem, I know exactly what that's like :)
14:27 <+|amethyst> oh wait
14:27 <+|amethyst> sorry, I was testing the old version where it annotated as the lernaean hydra
14:28 < greatzebu> ah, ok
14:28 <+|amethyst> yeah, it works fine now
14:28 < greatzebu> excellent
14:31 <+|amethyst> greatzebu:  he went through a map of the US naming all the states, then India (where he is from).   Surprisingly, he did better with the US than with India :)
14:31 < greatzebu> hah :)
14:31 <+|amethyst> but it makes it hard to get my procrastination done :)
14:32 < greatzebu> that's the problem with work
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16:47 < Ragdoll> is there a place where i can see crawl 4.1 sources?
16:48 < Ragdoll> i tried http://gitorious.org/crawl/crawl-ancient but checking that online with "source tree" seems to result in a endless loop firefox is not too amused about
16:50 < greatzebu> I tried to check it out, and got this error message: "warning: remote HEAD refers to nonexistent ref, unable to checkout"
16:51 <@dpeg> Ragdoll: ask kilobyte when he's around
16:52 < Ragdoll> will do, thanks
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17:01 <+SamB> Ragdoll: try using git itself ?
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17:10 < greatzebu> SamB: the repository is broken, see my message above
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17:17 <+edlothiol> greatzebu: git checkout ancient after cloning the repo works
17:17 <+edlothiol> HEAD probably still refers to master, or something like that
17:18 < greatzebu> thanks, edlothiol--I think you're right
17:19 < greatzebu> I'm not sure why git branch wouldn't list ancient as an option, but it's nice that there's a simple solution
17:21 <+edlothiol> it doesn't list it because it doesn't yet exist as a local branch
17:22 <+edlothiol> the git checkout ancient creates a new remote tracking branch for origin/ancient
17:22 <+edlothiol> git branch -r should show it, I believe
17:22 <+edlothiol> not sure how to fix the repository, though
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20:55 < Henzell> minmay the Thaumaturge (L12 MuCK) ASSERT(t != NON_ENTITY && t < MAX_TRAPS) in 'traps.cc' at line 1098 failed on turn 36361. (Lair:7)
20:55 < Henzell> minmay the Thaumaturge (L12 MuCK) ASSERT(t != NON_ENTITY && t < MAX_TRAPS) in 'traps.cc' at line 1098 failed on turn 36361. (Lair:7)
20:55 < Henzell> minmay the Thaumaturge (L12 MuCK) ASSERT(t != NON_ENTITY && t < MAX_TRAPS) in 'traps.cc' at line 1098 failed on turn 36361. (Lair:7)
21:09 < Henzell> minmay the Thaumaturge (L12 MuCK) ASSERT(t != NON_ENTITY && t < MAX_TRAPS) in 'traps.cc' at line 1098 failed on turn 36361. (Lair:7)
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21:18 < Henzell> minmay the Thaumaturge (L12 MuCK) ASSERT(t != NON_ENTITY && t < MAX_TRAPS) in 'traps.cc' at line 1098 failed on turn 36361. (Lair:7)
21:22 <+kilobyte> !tell Ragdoll ancient branches are in a separate repository now to reduce bloat.  It's a matter of adding a new remote if you want them.
21:22 < Henzell> kilobyte: OK, I'll let Ragdoll know.
21:27 < Henzell> Johan the Conjurer (L11 OpVM) ASSERT(t != NON_ENTITY && t < MAX_TRAPS) in 'traps.cc' at line 1098 failed on turn 10271. (Lair:3)
21:28 < Henzell> Johan the Conjurer (L11 OpVM) ASSERT(t != NON_ENTITY && t < MAX_TRAPS) in 'traps.cc' at line 1098 failed on turn 10271. (Lair:3)
21:28 < Henzell> Johan the Conjurer (L11 OpVM) ASSERT(t != NON_ENTITY && t < MAX_TRAPS) in 'traps.cc' at line 1098 failed on turn 10271. (Lair:3)
21:28 < Henzell> Johan the Conjurer (L11 OpVM) ASSERT(t != NON_ENTITY && t < MAX_TRAPS) in 'traps.cc' at line 1098 failed on turn 10271. (Lair:3)
21:30 < Henzell> minmay the Thaumaturge (L12 MuCK) ASSERT(t != NON_ENTITY && t < MAX_TRAPS) in 'traps.cc' at line 1098 failed on turn 36361. (Lair:7)
21:35 <+|amethyst> !lm minmay crash -log
21:35 < Sequell> 68. minmay, XL12 MuCK, T:36361 (milestone): http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/minmay/crash-minmay-20111210-023015.txt
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21:40 <+|amethyst> oh, I bet that crash is my fault
21:44 <+|amethyst> can someone grab a CAO save for me?  I don't have permissions on CAO yet it seems, or I don't know my password
21:45 <+|amethyst> https://crawl.akrasiac.org/saves/dumps/minmay-crawl-git-c15aa3ff8a-111209-2143.tar.bz2
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21:45 < greensnark> What's your CAO username?
21:45 <+|amethyst> neil
21:45 ۰۰-- mode/##crawl-dev [+v greensnark] by ChanServ
21:46 <+greensnark> Ok, let me see if I remember the knobs
21:46 <+|amethyst> thanks
21:46 <+greensnark> @s-z?
21:46 <+|amethyst> yes, neil@s-z.org
21:47 <+greensnark> Try accessing the URL now?
21:47 <+greensnark> Use your CAO username+password
21:47 <+|amethyst> nope
21:48 <+greensnark> You may need to capitalize Neil
21:48 <+|amethyst> aha, that's it
21:48 <+|amethyst> it works, thanks
21:48 <+greensnark> Yay
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21:59 < Henzell> minmay the Thaumaturge (L12 MuCK) ASSERT(t != NON_ENTITY && t < MAX_TRAPS) in 'traps.cc' at line 1098 failed on turn 36361. (Lair:7)
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22:12 <+|amethyst> I have a fix for the bug but it won't fix the two broken games
22:12 <+|amethyst> I have a fix for that, too, but that means papering over the assert
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22:15 <+|amethyst> so the question is, which is the bigger obligation: to fix the saves that I broke, or to keep the codebase clean and avoid hiding bugs?
22:18 < Wensley> it's okay to nuke trunk saves
22:18 < Wensley> that's the risk of playing trunk
22:19 < Wensley> people who want stability can sit in 0.9
22:20 <+|amethyst> I guess, really, anyone who hits that assert has lost their save, short of using a hex editor, modifying their source, or something
22:21 <+kilobyte> I'll break major save tag soon so such shims won't pollute the code for long
22:22 <+kilobyte> and its nice to fix games... hours of life lost
22:23 <+kilobyte> would it be a quick thing to do during loading the save?
22:25 <+|amethyst> maybe?  I don't know that code
22:25 <+|amethyst> the fix I was testing it to replace the trap with floor when the assert fires
22:25 <+|amethyst> s/it/is/
22:26 <+|amethyst> s/fires/would fire/
22:26 <+|amethyst> which seems to fix the games
22:26 <+|amethyst> I guess I can wrap it in an #if TAG_MAJOR_VERSION == 32
22:29 < Wensley> when was the last time save compat was broken? was it 0.7?
22:32 <+evilmike> there was a change in 0.10 a few months ago that broke save compat iirc, it was reverted though
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22:32 <+evilmike> it was a portal vault
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22:41 < CIA-54> kilobyte * r2755063a1aaa /crawl-ref/source/dat/des/builder/food.des: Bring hangedman's food vaults into line for nutrition values.
22:41 < CIA-54> kilobyte * rdca224407ace /crawl-ref/source/ (items.cc items.h mapdef.cc): Simplify.
22:41 < CIA-54> kilobyte * r8a7e2c413937 /crawl-ref/source/ (mon-place.cc mon-place.h): Make enslaved/raised corpse-based undead hate Fedhas worshippers.
22:41 < CIA-54> kilobyte * re9a451d2a36e /crawl-ref/source/mon-project.cc: Don't waste a turn when IOOD can't be placed.
22:48 < CIA-54> |amethyst * rb6cde024db23 /crawl-ref/source/dungeon.cc: When ruining a wall, don't copy traps, stairs, etc.
22:48 < CIA-54> |amethyst * r65e37b49fed7 /crawl-ref/source/traps.cc: Unbreak games broken by bad ruination.
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22:57 <+|amethyst> theoretically ruination can still cause disconnection, if a cut-point door is adjacent to a statue or tree and decides to copy that feature
22:59 <+|amethyst> that seems quite unlikely, though, and the worst consequence is map veto... it can't cause an infinite loop because eventually it will happen to pick a passable adjacent feature
23:01 < Wensley> does that make level generation an undecidable problem
23:02 <+SamB> Wensley: ... we'll get back to you on that ;-P
23:03 <+|amethyst> not undecidable, but it does have unbounded runtime
23:03 <+SamB> but does it halt ?
23:04 ۰۰-- jeanjacques_ is now known as jeanjacques
23:04 <+|amethyst> with probability 1, but not guaranteed :)
23:04 < CIA-54> SamB * r1891c187da61 /crawl-ref/source/dbg-asrt.cc: Make crash dumping for ASSERT failures work under debuggers on Windows.
23:04 ۰۰-- HangedMan [63e6725f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.99.230.114.95] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds]
23:04 < CIA-54> SamB * r6334b1898c35 /crawl-ref/source/crash-u.cc: Webtiles presumably needs to shutdown "console" IO before crashing now.
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23:09 <+|amethyst> worst case: if the map is required and has a cut-point door adjacent to six statues and two floors, and the map is on lair:8 or has the 'ruin' tag, there is a 8/12 chance to select the cell for ruination, a 1/2 chance to actually replace it, and a 6/8 chance to pick a statue.  That's a 1/4 chance to disconnect the map and cause a veto
23:10 <+|amethyst> so there's a one-in-a-million chance of it taking more than 10 tries
23:10 <+|amethyst> I guess in the worst case, though, someone could make a map with many such doors
23:10 <+SamB> say, why can't I train swimming on my Mf?
23:11 <+SamB> |amethyst: if we've so clearly identified the pathological case, you'd think it would be simple to avoid it, too
23:11 < Wensley> merfolk already have max swimming
23:11 <+|amethyst> yeah
23:11 <+|amethyst> I think I should also avoid copying statues
23:11 <+|amethyst> let them hold the wall up
23:11 <+SamB> oh, I already have 27 of a joke skill? cool.
23:12 < HangedMan> how much swimming skill does ice form give?
23:12 < Wensley> SamB: it's useful for going ash and transferring all that xp into another skill, but then you run the risk of drowning
23:12 < HangedMan> and do octopodes have less swimming skill then merfolk because they don't get the bonuses?
23:12 < Wensley> HangedMan: ice form is the equivalent of water wings
23:12 < HangedMan> hah
23:14 <+SamB> hmm, is there some way we can ensure that lemuel's elevator always appears next to some floor?
23:15 <+|amethyst> SamB:  put an @ around the outside somewhere?
23:16 <+SamB> hmm. That seems somewhat restrictive, seeing as we don't particularly care *which* square is floor...
23:17 <+|amethyst> you could be even more restrictive and surround it with floor
23:17 ۰۰-- Wensley [~chatzilla@ewire21-18.allegheny.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
23:17 <+|amethyst> so it's always this glass tube in the middle of a room
23:17 < HangedMan> nsubst: . = 1 : @ / . and surround it with . , maybe?
23:17 < HangedMan> or in the middle of nowhere
23:18 <+|amethyst> if you surround it with floor you can just use TAGS: mini_float
23:18 <+SamB> what's that do ?
23:18 <+evilmike> there are a lot of minivaults that do that which lack mini_float, strangely
23:18 <+|amethyst> randomly picks one passable edge square and makes it an exit
23:18 <+evilmike> I'm not sure why. They still work well enough
23:18 <+evilmike> I've wondered if they should be given mini_float
23:18 ۰۰-- Lohen is now known as Vandal
23:19 <+SamB> |amethyst: does it make the other edge squares impassible?
23:19 <+|amethyst> if they don't have an @ I think they should
23:19 <+SamB> often?
23:19 <+|amethyst> SamB:  no
23:19 <+SamB> well, there's no need to have hallway totally surrounding the elevator!
23:19 <+|amethyst> it just makes sure one of them is connected to the level and otherwise leaves them alone
23:20 <+SamB> doesn't that usually have to happen anyway ???
23:20 <+|amethyst> no, the elevator could be placed in the middle of a wall
23:20 <+|amethyst> since it has stairs
23:21 <+|amethyst> (even if it didn't, an escape hatch would be placed if there was somewhere to put it... otherwise I guess it would be vetoed)
23:22 <+SamB> well, I mean, if we surrounded it with floor, wouldn't that floor have to be connected to somehing ?
23:23 <+SamB> I guess not, actually
23:23 <+SamB> since there are plenty of vaults that don't connect stuff to the main CCs...
23:23 <+|amethyst> for regular vaults but not for minivaults
23:28 < CIA-54> dolorous * r424206862b0f /crawl-ref/source/mon-place.cc: Tweak the Fedhas "enraged" message, taken mostly from a comment in godabil.cc.
23:29 <+SamB> so, I discovered that deliberately triggering SIGSEGV on Windows doesn't work too well under the debugger, if we are actually interested in the handler getting run...
23:30 <+SamB> ... which is why I was having so much trouble trying to set a breakpoint on our crash dumping code ...
23:30 <+SamB> so, yeah, we're not doing that on Windows anymore
23:31 <+SamB> (deliberate SIGSEGV, I mean.)
23:32 <+SamB> I couldn't figure out WHY this is so, though, even by looking at the MSVCRT sources ...
23:37 ۰۰-- edlothiol [~edlothiol@81-64-155-196.rev.numericable.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
23:38 < CIA-54> dolorous * rf106e6eec663 /crawl-ref/source/mon-place.cc: Tweak the Fedhas message again: "support" rather than "perversion".
23:43 <+SamB> hmm, we could use some better handling of interrupted butchery...
23:43 <+SamB> (with non-cutting weapons)
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--- Log closed Sat Dec 10 00:00:57 2011