00:00:06 -!- Brannock has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 00:00:21 and for some reason the identify status of a vp-bottled potion of blood is different from a scroll-identified potion of something else 00:00:42 what the heck ? 00:01:12 is it like a wizmode IDed-but-not-really scroll or something ? 00:01:26 and the status of missiles whose enchantment was discovered by use is different from missiles whose enchantment is scroll-IDed 00:01:32 no, this isn't in wizmode 00:01:42 I meant, is it similarly odd 00:01:49 but the effect is similar... I seem to remember getting really confused by this in the past 00:02:12 scroll of identify sets different flags than identifying by use or by creation, or something like that 00:02:22 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.10-a0-1554-g85cd492 (32) 00:02:30 one of the two wizmode item creation methods gives you stuff that you know what it is, but leaves you clueless about what that kind of thing looks like... 00:03:01 and somewhere the training code might be looking at this, which worries me... unless it is just because some variable was uninitialized because the game was transferred 00:06:21 well, that doesn't explain the wierd stuff I've seen when playing several games in the same run of crawl ... 00:08:12 oh, hey, I guess I can reproduce this bug in a non-transferred game 00:08:13 great 00:14:03 Item type, pluses, properties, and curse status are the four things. 00:14:21 It's not "fully" identified if you don't know all the applicable for that item. 00:14:25 Isn't identify a mask? 00:14:40 Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.10-a0-1554-g85cd492 00:14:56 ISFLAG_IDENT_MASK is a bitmask with those four bits sets. 00:15:47 well, I'm not sure exactly what is going on 00:15:57 but here's how to reproduce the strange behavior I'm seeing 00:16:38 1. Start a hunter and pick one of the non-throwing options. 00:16:56 2. run around until you find a non-melee weapon 00:17:26 er, that's any item that isn't a melee weapon 00:17:36 3. wield that item 00:17:51 this will almost certainly disable training of the ranged skill you started with 00:18:23 however, suppose the item was something identifiable, like a scroll 00:19:00 if you identify it (by scroll), then it will no longer disable your slings skill 00:19:47 also, items that were identified through use (like stones that you threw until learning that they were +0) still behave like unidentified items for this 00:20:06 whereas if you scroll-identify the stones, they behave like identified items (i.e. correctly) 00:20:49 there are also things like the following: wielding your starting bread ration does not disable the skill, but wielding permafood that you find in the dungeon does disable the skill 00:21:35 why is identity even relevant here ? 00:22:01 samb: I don't know, but it seems to be 00:22:38 I assume that the training code wants to know the curse status of items, at least; maybe that is the bit that is not getting set properly 00:23:15 like, maybe items that aren't curseable are only set as uncursed if you scroll-identify them or start with them in your inventory 00:23:15 It does check curse status, item_skills in itemprop.cc 00:23:25 that might explain things if true 00:23:31 why is it even in question whether or not you know the C/U status of a wielded item, though ? 00:23:45 samb: because you can't train slings if you are wielding a cursed item? 00:23:54 a cursed non-sling, that is 00:23:58 I mean, you can't not know 00:24:03 when it's wielded 00:24:04 can you ? 00:24:22 samb: right, what I'm saying is that the code is bugged :) 00:24:34 yes 00:24:44 that was clear from the start! 00:26:01 item_skills checks _item_is_swappable, which checks item_known_cursed, which doesn't care about the type, it just checks the known cursed field. 00:26:08 So if you're right, that's what to look at. 00:26:59 so, _item_is_swappable is also buggy then? 00:28:33 ISFLAG_KNOW_CURSE should be set to true for any item of certain types, and I'm guessing it isn't, yeah 00:29:44 In the fully identified check, it ignores the bits that are not relevant to the item type. 00:30:11 So it looks like the intention was to not check them. 00:30:25 _item_is_swappable is used in only two places, the other place is checking if slots are blocked. 00:31:31 Random stuff like food doesn't have a slot so it doesn't matter there. 00:33:18 what? the whole issue is that it thinks that the weapon slot is blocked 00:33:48 not even, say, cinamon rolls? 00:33:52 It doesn't block the slot. 00:33:54 I guess the simplest fix to this is just to repair _item_is_swappable though 00:33:58 It doesn't think it's swappable. It's... not the same. 00:34:17 mmm cinnamon 00:34:19 If it was blocked, it wouldn't let you wield a weapon after holding the food. 00:34:35 I mean, aren't those valid headgear ? 00:35:11 fyren: _slot_blocked isn't used for that 00:35:35 it is only called by item_skills 00:36:33 elliptic: Okay, but slot_blocked still doesn't matter. For has no slot, so that's not the check that fails. 00:36:39 Food has no slot. 00:36:50 fyren: so? 00:37:12 _slot_blocked(sling in pack) calls _item_is_swappable(item you are wielding) 00:37:44 which returns false because item_known_uncursed(cinnamon roll) returns false 00:37:58 which is likewise bogus 00:38:09 cinnamon roll cannot be cursed; this is not nethack! 00:38:14 indeed 00:38:15 And item_is_swappable is called independently before that. 00:38:29 if (!equipped && (!_item_is_swappable(item) || _slot_blocked(item))) 00:38:42 that's calling _item_is_swappable(sling in pack) 00:38:43 which is fine 00:38:47 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 00:38:52 I yield. 00:39:32 oh, so we can't be training skills with possibly-cursed items that aren't slotted in, eh? 00:39:41 samb: even if item_known_uncursed was right, though, this would still give bogus behavior for wielding a possibly cursed ring, say, though 00:39:53 true! 00:39:59 samb: that's also true, though not the issue here 00:40:14 the curse status of the sling is known 00:40:17 that probably ought to be in the documentation 00:41:27 this confusion with curse status for uncurseables has caused trouble before, yeah 00:41:34 I mean, that weapons have to be either equipped or known-uncursed to be elligable for training ... 00:42:01 ah, yes 00:42:11 so, it seems, that we need to be checking if the item in the slot already is in the slot for which it's cursed status is even applicable, if any 00:42:41 right... it is sort of a mess 00:43:07 because _item_is_swappable is used both to determine whether it is safe to swap the item in and to determine whether the item can be swapped out 00:43:21 and these are two different checks really 00:43:52 indeed 00:44:22 I guess splitting the function into _item_is_swappable and _equip_slot_is_emptyable might be reasonable 00:44:46 though that isn't really good enough either, hm 00:45:15 this sort of thing makes me wonder whether being so strict about the training restrictions is really worth it 00:45:50 like, would it be so terrible if you can train evocations with a +Lev amulet while wearing gourmand? 00:46:03 or polearms with a possibly-uncursed spear? 00:46:09 er, possibly-cursed 00:46:20 or even a definitely cursed one :) 00:51:26 probably not 00:54:27 -!- valrus has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:56:45 FUCK 00:57:01 wrong channel? ;) 00:57:03 Wait 00:57:04 Yes 00:57:05 D< 00:58:47 -!- ainsophyao has joined ##crawl-dev 01:02:07 -!- ixtli_ has joined ##crawl-dev 01:02:49 * SamB finally gets the "like an onion" joke ... 01:02:59 -!- ixtli has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:02:59 -!- ixtli_ is now known as ixtli 01:21:09 -!- ixtli has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 01:25:25 ugh, also the training restrictions don't take into account that vampiric weapons are swappable for certain races 01:26:07 seriously I'm tempted to just scrap all the swappability checks 01:38:02 -!- Mottie has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 01:44:08 I can fix the curse thing pretty easily if you want, but the branch checks are weird. 01:45:24 branch checks? 01:45:34 sdglkjlks 01:45:39 Brand, my brain isn't working right. 01:45:45 Note the "for" instead of "food" easier. 01:45:48 EARLIER 01:47:10 Acute aphasia, apparently. 01:47:52 if you think you can fix the curse part of that code in a relatively easy manner then please do so... but remember that it also really should handle stuff like players wielding a cursed ring correctly (i.e., wielding a cursed ring shouldn't stop you from training a weapon skill) 01:48:13 not that there is any reason for players to do that, I guess 01:49:14 for the brand checks, probably it is sufficient to just make vampiric weapons unswappable when the player is not undead 01:53:03 Is there an easy way to get a cursed ring in wizmode? 01:53:23 Since curse jewellery will require me to wear it, so it doesn't help. 01:54:51 Guess I'll just look up the flag value. 01:54:52 worship ashenzari and read lots of acquirement for jewellery 01:55:16 I think my idea is easier, heh. 0x100. 02:14:48 -!- syllogism has joined ##crawl-dev 02:18:57 elliptic: http://pastebin.com/NJuJBtAG 02:19:38 Fixes wielding unknown non-curseable items and cursed non-weapons. 02:20:21 Didn't see any regressions, but I can't say I tested very hard. Didn't touch brands. 02:24:13 ah, that looks like a reasonable way of going about it :) thanks! 02:38:13 Fyren: make an item by name 02:38:21 then enter an item spec that makes it cursed ... 02:39:16 (same syntax as in levels) 02:40:12 also, doesn't wizmode have a curse/uncurse arbitrary item command? 02:40:35 -!- ais523 has joined ##crawl-dev 02:40:36 -!- ais523 has quit [Changing host] 02:40:36 -!- ais523 has joined ##crawl-dev 02:54:52 Huh, I missed &C. 02:55:18 you know what really lacks tiles? pandemonium? right now it just uses a small selection of wall_zot tiles, and floor_tomb (or rarely floor_nerves, which is the abyss floor) 02:55:28 and 1/3 levels have fleshy walls 02:55:34 also I didn' tmean to use that second ? 02:56:47 i dont see anything available that can really go in its place though 02:57:13 good news is, at least it doesn't look exactly like zot any more... 02:57:30 Can the tiles code do shading or something along those lines? 03:01:19 I'm pretty sure the only choices are in the tilesets in dat/tiles. A lot of those are tinted versions of stuff in the rltiles folder 03:03:11 it seems like it would be pretty easy to just make two new tiles (one floor and one wall) and then make a bunch of colour variations, that would give pan a unique look from other branches (instead of just recycling from others like it does now) 03:05:54 evilmike: 4683489754896734689 branches use floor_tomb 03:06:00 yeah :P 03:06:20 -!- Torokasi has joined ##crawl-dev 03:06:23 -!- ainsophyao has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:06:29 walking on a layer of skulls gets boring after a while... 03:07:30 ober (L27 HEAE) ERROR in 'dungeon.cc' at line 5827: Can't any place to put the player on. (Pan) 03:07:36 Pandemonium, Tartarus, Crypt(fixed), Tomb, Dis(fixed), Zot, Lab(fixed) 03:07:46 I kept getting that crash just now... 03:08:01 I thought I must have screwed something up when messing around, I guess not 03:08:12 uh... I changed the message yesterday but didn't touch any actual code 03:08:12 Can't any place? The whole thing? 03:08:23 (and yeah, that sentence no verb) 03:08:44 this error happens if there's not a single floor cell on the map 03:09:16 Any place to put the player on or any habitable place to put then mon? 03:09:30 Fyren: hm, wielding a cursed club doesn't seem to be disabling bow training (after applying the diff you posted) 03:09:32 player 03:09:58 also, dis was fixed? I still see floor_tomb 03:10:10 I think tar, dis, tomb, pan are the ones that still use that floor 03:10:15 in all cases I've seen this bug it was on 80x70 rock -- if no vault was placed 03:10:18 elliptic: Hrm, do they have different get_item_slot results? I'll look at it. 03:10:26 -!- Keskitalo has quit [Quit: leaving] 03:10:38 evilmike: err... Dis, Zot(fixed) 03:11:00 and I don't like the new Zot that much either... violet on violet is kind of hard to see 03:11:37 ober (L27 HEAE) ERROR in 'dungeon.cc' at line 5827: Can't any place to put the player on. (Pan) 03:12:53 there's a bit more contrast now (light magenta on dark floor) 03:13:20 same hue and saturation, only lightness changes 03:14:00 I don't play tiles myself though so your opinion matters more though 03:14:00 !lm ober crash -log 03:14:00 5. ober, XL27 HEAE, T:129367 (milestone): http://crawl.develz.org/morgues/trunk/ober/crash-ober-20111028-081136.txt 03:15:25 ... I'm an idiot 03:17:24 I kind of go back and forth between tiles and console. I think I don't mind (or don't notice) the zot thing as much because there are areas where the floor tiles have similar issues.. for example gehenna is red on red, with even less contrast 03:18:15 * kilobyte whips CIA. 03:18:43 03kilobyte * r6b9eb66eb13f 10/crawl-ref/source/dungeon.cc: Fix a message with no verb. 03:18:48 03kilobyte * r2cbe0d8b210c 10/crawl-ref/source/dungeon.cc: Don't crash on every level of Pan. 03:19:11 (updating CDO won't pick up any commits until announced by CIA, since they use the same repository -- which pulls from Gitorious on a cronjob (no push notifications)) 03:19:19 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.10-a0-1556-g6b9eb66 (32) 03:22:03 Napkin: /home/services/crawl/bin/update-mingw-tiles-trunk.sh: line 16: cd: source/mingw32/crawl: No such file or directory 03:32:15 -!- monqy has quit [Quit: hello] 03:35:07 elliptic: Sooo. Line 1928, move the parameter to the right place. 03:37:11 oh, heh 03:37:50 Stupid comma operator. 03:38:41 hey, what's wrong with it? No one seems to use it, prefering clumsy {foo;bar;} instead 03:39:51 I forget where, but somewhere in the crawl source someone used it to avoid having to put braces on an if body. 03:40:31 So I can't tell if what you said is a joke or... if it was you. 03:41:05 the latter, of course :p 03:41:09 -!- ainsophyao has joined ##crawl-dev 03:42:33 -!- alefury has joined ##crawl-dev 03:45:43 ugh I hate this curse knowledge code 03:45:54 Darken floor_rough_red (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=4823) by evilmike 03:46:32 looking at it makes me think that maybe crawl light's idea of making everything auto-ID has merit 03:46:48 those tiles should improve the contrast in zot (and geh) a bit 03:52:10 Fyren: currently it seems that reading a scroll of curse weapon and killing a mummy and having that curse your weapon can have different effects on skill training... which puzzles me because they both just seem to call do_curse_item(item, false) 04:17:41 -!- mikee_ has quit [Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- IRC with a difference] 04:18:07 03kilobyte * rd8ac04cb04ca 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/zotdef/zotdef.des: ZotDef: Colour the "battle heart" in a map by that name red. 04:18:17 03kilobyte * rfaa967ab043c 10/crawl-ref/source/rltiles/dc-dngn/floor/ (rough_red0.png rough_red1.png rough_red2.png rough_red3.png): Darken Gehenna floor tiles (evilmike) 04:22:51 elliptic: &C also goes through do_curse_item if you can reproduce a problem? 04:24:22 &C on wielded weapon also doesn't seem to update training, yeah 04:24:35 scroll of curse weapon is the only thing that is correctly updating it 04:40:27 -!- jeanjacques has joined ##crawl-dev 04:41:35 -!- ainsophyao has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 04:49:37 -!- st_ has quit [] 04:52:53 -!- ais523 has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 04:57:12 I guess maybe_change_train is wrong and the scroll goes through some other path? 04:57:54 Or I dunno, I don't see why it'd be wrong. 05:00:15 I guess item_skills doesn't consider that cursing an item can make a different item untrainable. 05:01:17 Or maybe_change_train isn't called at the right time, argh, I dunno. 05:04:05 03kilobyte * r9f02356ec154 10/crawl-ref/source/describe.cc: Don't claim elven armour for most slots has benefits other than reduced weight. 05:04:05 03kilobyte * r05cae9679c05 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/database/godspeak.txt: Game restore messages for Chei and Fedhas penance. 05:04:05 03kilobyte * rd4447905c967 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/database/godspeak.txt: Fix a doubled period. 05:04:27 fyren: oh, I just figured it out 05:05:10 the stop_train and start_train lists are only actually processed after a player action 05:05:32 I haven't checked exactly when, but using &C or getting mummy cursed and then waiting a turn works right 05:14:53 -!- evilmike has quit [Quit: something happened] 05:29:02 elliptic: Yeah, I won't try to fix that. 05:29:10 It probably doesn't even matter. 05:29:32 yeah, I'm not worrying about it right now at least 05:30:15 about to push your changes and also an improvement of the brand-handling 05:34:14 03elliptic * r76d8b1bbb12d 10/crawl-ref/source/itemprop.cc: Improve handling of curse knowledge for skill training (Fyren). 05:34:16 03elliptic * r33e4a7d3bc6e 10/crawl-ref/source/itemprop.cc: Improve brand-checking when determining which skills are trainable. 05:34:25 -!- Mottie has joined ##crawl-dev 05:39:16 -!- ais523 has joined ##crawl-dev 06:02:57 -!- ais523 has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 06:07:19 -!- ais523 has joined ##crawl-dev 06:27:27 yeah, using gold rather than lfd does make a difference. I've kept cursing "why it's do damn slow"... and turns out I uninstalled it to compile some broken junk some time ago. 06:27:40 so, guys: "apt-get install binutils-gold" just to make sure :p 06:32:43 Hmm, gold... 06:32:47 Not available in arch :( 06:33:14 Well, it's in AUR but... 06:38:19 binutils-gold? 06:38:40 ohhh 06:38:43 goLD, right. 07:05:32 elliptic: for Tiamat's cloak, would 50% rF+, 50% rC+, 50% rPois (rolled every time you're hit) be ok? 07:11:27 kilobyte: tome has an item based on a multihued dragon - the way they do it is to have a % chance to shuffle color every time you use it. this might feel better than just random resists 07:12:02 (in their case, a weapon. in this case, 'use' could be 'take an elemental attack it could resist') 07:12:40 ps, when are we going to add set items? ;) 07:12:54 why make it way weaker than the GDA, though? 07:15:05 MarvinPA: added 50% rStickyFlame, 50% rSteam and 50% rElec too 07:16:14 hmm, i guess that fits with the colour-shifty draconian-ness quite nicely 07:16:14 no pearl draconians so rN+ is not on my list (but can be added) 07:16:14 acid? 07:16:14 also possible 07:17:56 what's the justification for it being a cloak? 07:18:34 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:18:47 i actually liked the proposal that someone had where you could turn hides into cloaks (or wear them as cloaks directly) but with everything else being armor that would be kind of weird 07:18:56 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 07:20:02 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Client Quit] 07:20:10 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 07:23:08 Eronarn: that'd be 1/6 resistance, and would make some players try to scum it somehow 07:24:23 -!- ais523 has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 07:25:21 kilobyte: i don't see scumming as an issue with that because if you're getting any benefit from the cloak's resists, it's going to be at risk to switch away 07:25:51 i'm sure some players would do it, but it would just amount to always starting out favorable (but in any difficult combat, you can't just throw flame at yourself) 07:27:10 (though, to again draw a tome comparison: they have one item that lets you do a really crappy throw flame ability. people keep it to use it on themselves because there's a skill that gives you a global speed boost (!) whenever you're hit by fire damage (!!!). so glad we have better balance than they do...) 07:27:41 anyone capable of killing tiamat will probably still wear a cloak of conservation 07:28:50 with the amulet slot being occupied by rmut/clarity for most builds 07:29:28 -!- Cryp71c has joined ##crawl-dev 07:29:35 maybe gove the tiamat cloak pretty high enchantment? 07:29:42 *give 07:29:52 that's the second question 07:33:20 on one hand, it does replace a good_item GDA; on the other -- if you're in Zot, you're likely to have access to gold dragon hides already, so the cloak would be in addition to other gear (unless preservation) 07:34:16 tiamat is very rare and harder to kill than quite a few pan/hell lords 07:34:18 i would probably just wear it as a trophy if the stats are at all good 07:34:28 because what jeanjacques said 07:36:05 I don't want a power spiral 07:36:47 even unreliable, 50% to resistances is a big thing 07:36:47 kilobyte: well, GDA in zot can actually be a hassle, unless stuff has changed 07:36:51 tiamat is really rare, so if her cloak doesnt randomly generate i dont think it matters much how strong it is 07:37:06 there are gold dragons there, but they don't always drop hides 07:37:10 -!- Torokasi has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 07:37:16 and as long as it doesnt offer conservation it still presents a significant choice 07:37:20 if you actually found conservation 07:37:43 alefury: you just answered the question of it having rCorr, by the way :p 07:37:50 rCorr is fine imo 07:38:02 or well, yellow dracs dont get it, right? or do they know? 07:38:05 reduces the choice 07:38:23 why does preservation offer rCorr :P 07:38:23 non-item preserving rcorr? 07:38:26 yellows dracs get rCor++ 07:38:40 so that got changed? 07:38:46 they used to just get rA++ 07:38:48 in the drac revamp, i think 07:38:51 no 07:39:11 ??resist corrosion[2] 07:39:11 resist corrosion[2/2]: Yellow draconians(rA++) and others mutated with yellow scales >1 (-/rA+/rA++) also resist acid *HP* damage: 50% at rA+, 34% at rA++, 27% at rA+++. 07:39:46 there was some tavern discussion about yellow dracs not having rCorr recently 07:40:06 (basically yellow dracs suck in every regard) 07:40:20 but i dont know if anything got changed following that 07:41:05 anyway, putting rA on the cloak should be fine, not putting rCorr is probably best 07:44:12 merge yellow and sticky dracs 07:44:21 they spit gooey sticky acid 07:45:32 (actually, have we considered having yellow drac spit be immobilizing? most of the other dracs have side effects on their spit now - destroying armor is an acid thing, not a yellow drac thing) 07:45:34 that would make them so much worse enemies 07:45:45 worse as in stronger 07:46:12 net effect might be too strong, but temporary ponderousness could be cool 07:46:35 or maybe a temporary -Acc (spit acid into someone's eyes) 07:47:22 yellow dracs = hate hate hate hate hate 07:48:39 unless you're decked for Slime, you dive in Zot or end up with -4 on all corrodeable slots 07:49:16 its usually not that bad for dex chars 07:49:20 yeah 07:49:30 letting dracs breathe at you is a bad idea in any case 07:49:47 white drac monsters are probably pretty terrifying, huh 07:50:05 i find all of them quite terrifying 07:50:11 you can stash potions so it's mostly ok 07:50:30 white breath ignores ac :) 07:51:20 without rC it tends to hurt pretty badly 07:51:43 didnt enemy dracs recently get breath timers? 07:51:57 time to ramp up the damage! 07:53:42 -!- MarvinPA_ has joined ##crawl-dev 07:56:28 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 07:59:32 Morning 07:59:39 ooh, breathing monsters finally have breath timers? 07:59:41 or is it just dracs 07:59:51 -!- MarvinPA_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:00:21 the commit said dracs and dragons 08:00:24 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 08:00:40 maybe it was only a patch on mantis, i dont remember 08:01:57 530f894 08:02:07 03Cryp71c 07unified_combat_control * rf4862466a87b 10/crawl-ref/source/ (actor.h melee_attack.cc player.cc player.h): Generalize player_fights_well_unarmed 08:02:17 03Cryp71c 07unified_combat_control * r8b7d827af708 10/crawl-ref/source/ (actor.h melee_attack.cc): Fix whitespace, cursed Windows! 08:03:20 awesome <3 i've wanted that to go in for years 08:03:24 -!- valrus has joined ##crawl-dev 08:27:04 perhaps draconians should have their AC nerfed but get some GDR? 08:28:08 03kilobyte * r1ce7a0ef2df5 10/crawl-ref/source/makeitem.cc: Assert on invalid missile types. 08:28:08 03kilobyte * r4eff48b48af3 10/crawl-ref/source/ (itemprop.cc itemprop.h player.cc): Externalize the function to determine the player's item race flag. 08:28:08 03kilobyte * ra1465943dde9 10/crawl-ref/source/ (acquire.cc makeitem.cc makeitem.h): Somewhat prefer racial items during acquirement. 08:28:08 03kilobyte * r699ebe1dff5d 10/crawl-ref/source/ (art-data.txt art-func.h mon-gear.cc output.cc player.cc): Give Tiamat an unrand cloak instead of her GDA. 08:30:05 03kilobyte * r976349fd8c48 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-data.h: Give Tiamat a bit more AC. 08:36:32 -!- edlothiol has joined ##crawl-dev 08:46:05 -!- Brannock has joined ##crawl-dev 08:49:20 -!- jle_ has joined ##crawl-dev 08:51:14 -!- valrus has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:53:23 kilobyte, you mentioend yesterday you quickly ran into a bug in the combat branch? What was it, do you recall? 08:58:32 -!- ainsophyao has joined ##crawl-dev 09:02:16 -!- ainsophyao has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:30:30 Cryptic: started a game, walked to the first hobgoblin, boom 09:32:32 lol 09:32:40 feature? 09:32:49 Xiberia, definitely 09:33:03 Someone FR'd an unplayable unstable crawl...FR complete. 09:33:28 cool 09:33:36 sounds like it's time to ship it 09:34:39 DCSS: Roguelike for pacifists 09:39:21 Cryp71c: why is Windows to blame for the whitespace ? 09:40:00 and does "fix whitespace" include zapping all those nonstandard-width-tabs? 09:40:34 SamB, the default configuration of most windows IDEs (or at least eclipse, netbeans and a few others I regularly use) use tab chars instead of spaces by default. 09:40:46 And fixing it involved removing the tab chars and replacing them with spaces, yes. 09:41:05 I suppose I could have just done a "git pull" and looked ... 09:48:29 Cryp71c: are you still getting those trivial crashes? 09:48:41 I fixed one of em 10:00:12 -!- Mu_ has joined ##crawl-dev 10:28:38 muuuuuuuuuuuuu 10:29:51 * SamB was inspired by the CIA commit hook 10:30:24 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 10:36:16 -!- ainsophyao has joined ##crawl-dev 11:10:41 -!- ainsophyao has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:16:21 -!- pointless_ has joined ##crawl-dev 11:21:17 -!- blabber has joined ##crawl-dev 11:21:40 -!- MarvinPA_ has joined ##crawl-dev 11:25:50 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 11:27:31 -!- Pingas has joined ##crawl-dev 11:31:04 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 11:34:00 -!- MarvinPA_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:41:35 -!- BlastHardcheese has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:49:46 -!- blabber has quit [Quit: leaving] 11:50:30 -!- blabber has joined ##crawl-dev 11:50:32 -!- Torokasi has joined ##crawl-dev 11:53:23 -!- pointless_ has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87 [Firefox 3.6.7/20100713130626]] 11:54:57 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 12:05:33 kilobyte: any particular reason why crawl is using the very top of the Console buffer on win32? 12:09:49 -!- monqy has joined ##crawl-dev 12:15:33 SamB: everything does unless you scroll down 12:17:01 -!- Keskitalo has joined ##crawl-dev 12:24:08 akaean the Executioner (L21 HOGl) (D:17) 12:50:21 -!- BlastHardcheese has joined ##crawl-dev 12:54:13 Mhmhm, I need to update the tiles improvement page and check out kilobyte's spectral tile branch.. 12:54:56 Unfortunately, at the same time my week off from work started, I also got the flu.. :/ 12:57:49 Keskitalo: s/spectral/simulacra/ -- and not really worth looking at, not without changing source tiles to use real black 12:58:05 (most zombies apparently came from the same source, so they share this problem) 12:58:14 yeah, I could do that 12:58:35 it's more about the process rather than individual tiles 13:00:03 -!- dpeg has joined ##crawl-dev 13:00:09 Good evening, ##crawl-dev. 13:00:34 Hi dpeg! 13:00:39 moi 13:00:48 -!- ais523 has joined ##crawl-dev 13:01:05 beh, without proper contours most look abysmal 13:01:17 * kilobyte sniffs dpeg. 13:01:53 The MD axing caused a good discussion on the forum, but it went as expected on SA. Including some really funny statements, like "They're removing the most popular/highest win rate species one by one." 13:02:07 I'd write something for the devblog? 13:02:55 I'd certainly enjoy reading a post :) 13:03:20 Is someone here who could add a link to SA afterwards? I think I've seen evilmike post there... 13:03:28 sure 13:03:44 cool, will have something later this evening 13:04:42 kilobyte: two things: Would you mind if I try to get the hive vaults (not bee rooms) to work with larva eating? And may I bother you once more for the sick -> naus? 13:06:27 1. why not? You'd have to overhaul them basically from scratch, but it's nothing not doable. 2. Sure, got distracted again. 13:06:58 although what I currently have resembles not just flu but some Black Death or other bigpox 13:07:19 Keskitalo must have infected me... or it's another part of The Plot against me 13:07:19 kilobyte: I want to store some food in niches, and place larva away from them 13:07:32 kilobyte: ouch 13:07:45 I had my near-death-experience for this year already. Wish you luck! 13:16:25 -!- Keskitalo has quit [Quit: off to bed] 13:22:14 -!- Danei has quit [Quit: Holy shit, this is going to be awesome.] 13:38:03 !apt MD 13:38:04 MD: Air: -2, Armour: 3!, Axes: 2!, Bows: -2, Charms: -2, Conj: -1, Xbows: 1, Dodge: -1, Earth: 2, Evo: 1, Exp: 130, Fighting: 2!, Fire: 2!, Hexes: -2, Ice: -2, Inv: 0, Long: 0, Maces: 2!, Nec: -3*, Poison: -2, Polearms: -1, Shields: 2!, Short: 1, Slings: -1, Splcast: -3, Stab: -2, Staves: -1, Stealth: -3, Summ: -2, Throw: -1, Tloc: -2, Tmut: -1, Traps: 1, Unarmed: 0 13:38:08 !apt Mi 13:38:09 Mi: Air: -3, Armour: 1, Axes: 2!, Bows: 1, Charms: -3, Conj: -3*, Xbows: 1, Dodge: 1, Earth: -3*, Evo: -3*, Exp: 140, Fighting: 2!, Fire: -3*, Hexes: -3, Ice: -3*, Inv: -1, Long: 2!, Maces: 2!, Nec: -3*, Poison: -3*, Polearms: 2, Shields: 1, Short: 2, Slings: 1, Splcast: -3, Stab: 0, Staves: 2!, Stealth: -2, Summ: -3*, Throw: 1, Tloc: -3*, Tmut: -3, Traps: -1, Unarmed: 1! 13:38:37 These are the old ones, right? Is there a place on the web from where I can copy the new ones? 13:43:52 -!- bhaak is now known as clippy 13:43:52 dpeg: you might want to wait to write a blog entry until Mi apts are finalized 13:43:59 since the magic apts haven't been changed at all 13:44:02 -!- clippy is now known as bhaak 13:44:10 elliptic: ah, was not really around this week 13:44:16 ok, so will just save a draft 13:45:15 on the other hand, I think kilobyte would prefer to just keep the flat -3 magic apts, and I decided I don't really care that much one way or the other, so maybe they are finalized :) 13:47:06 elliptic: nonetheless, is there some place from which I can copypaste the new numbers? 13:47:12 http://git.develz.org/?p=crawl.git;a=blob;f=crawl-ref/source/aptitudes.h#l892 13:47:18 you're good :) 13:51:24 I was considering giving them something like -2 earth and tmut, -4 charms and hexes 13:51:51 will get back to you once I've properly table-ised these numbers 13:53:17 elliptic: did anything happen to HP/MP/exp for Mi or HO? 13:53:34 marvinpa buffed HO spellcasting in a few ways 13:54:05 can you give details, or is it too complicated to explain? 13:55:05 spellcasting apt -3 -> -2, starting intelligence is 3 higher (and strength 1 lower), MP is human-level now 13:55:18 thx 13:55:31 elliptic: I'll have your read over my draft, okay? 13:56:07 oh, also minotaur xp apt changed from 140 to 130 13:56:26 I have to leave now, but I'll be back later and can look at things then 13:56:42 cool! 13:56:43 many thanks 14:01:15 -!- elliptic has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:08:03 a great post on SA: 14:08:06 ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 14:08:06 Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup 0.10.0 - Changelist 14:08:06 - High Elves, Mountain Dwarves, and Halflings removed; uninteresting 14:08:06 - Zot branch replaced with Slime Pits 14:08:06 - DL:1 entrance vaults removed; all characters now start in The Abyss 14:08:08 - New Ecumenical Temple vault (all alters are Xom) 14:08:11 ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 14:08:14 yes, I saw that 14:08:24 these guys are on it :) 14:08:37 "alters" 14:08:54 also, that is an interesting yet terrible idea for a temple layout 14:09:05 Zannick: I noted that many Americans have trouble with words like "definite" and "altar". Why is that? 14:09:22 dpeg: poor education? ;) 14:09:28 hey, I did that with Lugonu before a number of other god altars got added back :p 14:09:38 You cannot blame everything on Reagan and Bush :) 14:09:49 Obama is bad too :p 14:10:00 true, but different direction of bad 14:11:06 i don't really know who to blame for poor education, it's not that new 14:11:17 not really, the difference between the two american parties is just flavour. Details like religion vs gay marriage. 14:11:25 and guns 14:11:37 easy enough to blame the people who don't care enough to be correct :P 14:12:00 but yes, the rift among the US does not really come from utterly different principles of the two parties 14:15:34 their platforms are pretty much the same: "bribes^Wcampaign donations are a human right!", "banks need to be helped at all costs from taxpayer money", "patent reform -- but only if Monsanto and Apple benefit", "free speech? That's hurt RIAA and MPAA!". 14:15:57 pretty much the only country that _legalized_ corruption 14:16:00 better apts are a minotaur right! 14:16:06 Zannick: :p 14:16:11 shops need to be helped at all costs from player money 14:16:17 >.> 14:16:20 heh 14:16:55 fr: new class abbreviated AA and new races abbreviated RI and MP 14:17:15 kilobyte: yes. And their democratic system does not really allow for innovation. Well, you say that the Tea Party is a kind of innovation :| 14:17:35 things are going this way on our side of the pond too (like bailing out banks in Iceland or those who granted money to Greece), but it's nowhere as bad yet 14:17:39 dpeg: yeah 14:18:20 meanwhile, we socialists in sweden are enjoying our welfare and our ikeas 14:18:47 kilobyte: but I think more input is possible. It seems as if poor Americans still seem proud of their country and everything. The East bloc would have been happy about this stage of church-like brainwashing. 14:19:12 Xiberia: kilobyte and I come from Poland and the GDR. What is socialism? :) 14:19:24