00:03:18 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.10-a0-602-g0167331 (32) 00:15:57 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 00:17:50 -!- Wensley has quit [Quit: Page closed] 00:18:43 Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.10-a0-602-g0167331 00:26:29 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 00:29:08 -!- Twilight13 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:30:10 -!- Twilight13 has joined ##crawl-dev 00:54:48 Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.10-a0-602-g0167331 (32) 00:59:10 -!- galehar has joined ##crawl-dev 00:59:17 -!- galehar has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:00:56 -!- Twinge_ has joined ##crawl-dev 01:02:57 -!- Twinge has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 01:15:17 -!- syllogism has joined ##crawl-dev 01:54:12 -!- dtsund has quit [Quit: dtsund] 02:00:09 -!- ais523 has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:09:36 -!- galehar has joined ##crawl-dev 02:56:14 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:56:37 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 03:19:44 -!- Chousuke has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:21:13 -!- Chousuke has joined ##crawl-dev 03:33:24 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 04:05:18 -!- RichardHawk has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 04:06:58 elliptic: what about "stick"? 04:07:26 (since the obvious name for half-a-quarterstaff, "one-eight staff", won't probably pass :p) 04:09:59 kilobyte: I think "staff" is better and it actually seems to be working fine now that I've followed due's suggestion of changing the item_class_name for OBJ_STAVES to "magical staff" 04:10:24 "knobkerrie" 04:10:34 "shillelagh" 04:10:48 (although this is not exactly the same thing) 04:22:59 I'm currently considering the following change to enhancer staff damage: chance of getting the damage = (2*evoc+magic skill)/30, amount of damage = random2(magic skill + evoc/2) 04:23:02 thoughts? 04:25:12 what are the current formulas? 04:25:36 currently (evoc+1)/15 and random2(5*(magic skill + evoc)/4) 04:26:41 I kind of wonder what's the reason evoc is stressed there. 04:27:08 kilobyte: right, I wanted to stress it a bit less 04:27:09 it seems to be not related at all to either melee or using the magic school in question 04:27:32 ok 04:28:58 the idea is that evoc helps you use magical items better, I guess... 04:29:59 you're reducing the damage to only 60% though, not sure if a nerf that big is warranted 04:30:08 but isn't it supposed to be a nerf? It seems with good skills it would do more damage 04:30:33 oh right, sorry 04:30:56 kilobyte: yes, I'm not sure... most chars do have higher magic skill than evoc, so it isn't quite so large a nerf usually 04:32:11 the extra damage is still strictly better than, say, pain brand 04:32:13 it is easy to get that 14 evoc by midgame though, 14 is before skills start costing really a lot 04:33:01 I wanted to make enhancer staff use less a matter of "pump evoc to 14 at all costs" 04:33:19 yeah 04:33:46 pain is a brand rather than basically a sole damage dealer, though... you still get a decent weapon and enchantment 04:34:28 yes 04:34:52 I could toss the 5/4 factor back in to the damage calculation 04:35:02 -!- MarvinPA_ has joined ##crawl-dev 04:35:17 marvinpa_: hey, want to comment on enhancer staff damage formulae? :) 04:35:21 ie, nerfing to 75% rather than 60%? 04:36:18 still massive, but hey, magic users are supposed to use magic mostly 04:36:29 they are massively overpowered as is, so... 04:36:29 and I'd like to see lajatangs actually used 04:36:34 yeah 04:37:23 lajatang = dire flail. And dire flail = strictly weaker than 1-handers of the same weapon class. 04:38:25 currently I'm thinking lajatang at 16 or 17 dam/-3 acc/15 delay 04:38:29 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 04:39:58 and quarterstaff at 9 or 10 dam/+3 or 4/13 04:40:27 elliptic: I think we might use that 4.1 double-ended idea though 04:40:28 and staff (and enhancer staves) at 5/+5/12 04:40:37 -!- RichardHawk has joined ##crawl-dev 04:40:56 but you can do that for now, just in a separate commit so it can be reverted without touching the other changes 04:42:57 kilobyte: I think HANDS_DOUBLE should go anyway, double-ended can be added as a staves weapon effect 04:43:01 but sure 04:46:42 galehar: if I added a possibility of redefining appearances of items (item_glyph = lajatang : lightmagenta |), would it cause problems for new mimics? 04:47:07 galehar: (it would have required a significant amount of work for old ones, at least) 04:47:37 I'm constantly annoyed by skeletons looking like corpses, corpses like food, etc 04:48:12 moin 04:48:51 elliptic: not sure about dire flails -- theme-wise they should get that property as well, just like whips can be reaching like polearms 04:48:55 kilobyte: should be easy to implement if it's similar to monster glyph override 04:48:55 Zaba: meow? 04:49:23 galehar: I was thinking of copying exactly that interface, yeah 04:50:28 kilobyte: well, they can be special-cased if they still exist when this is implemented, just like whips are... I'd prefer that to having a separate handedness type just for a few weapons 04:50:31 It might be even simpler since for item mimics, we store the actual item in monster_info 04:51:40 elliptic: ok, this is a code cleanup matter really 04:51:47 galehar: nice 04:52:30 kilobyte: I should also mention that I want to make quarterstaves and lajatangs two-handed for real instead of effectively two-handed (nobody uses them with a shield currently, for good reason) 04:53:10 I can just leave everything double-handed I guess though, that isn't really important 04:53:11 galehar: also, you talked about improving reaching AI. Does your code have all polearms do reaching already? 04:54:19 no it doesn't 04:54:47 it just makes monster flee when you hit them and they can't retaliate (because you're in water for example) 04:55:14 flee with some differences to conditions to stop fleeing (which I'm still sorting out) 04:58:38 -!- Textmode has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 05:00:03 OSX builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.10-a0-591-g9f67c7d 05:13:35 !tell mumra what's the point in duplicating the documentation for .des files on the wiki? These versions will end up obsolete and/or divergent. 05:13:36 kilobyte: OK, I'll let mumra know. 05:33:33 kilobyte: https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=2519 05:33:33 mumra: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 05:34:18 the idea is to have a minimal text documentation with releases that will rarely change 05:34:52 and have a slightly more complete LUA reference (which is easier to maintain on the wiki) 05:35:01 -!- evilmike has quit [Quit: something happened] 05:35:32 a hard to access documentation is worthless 05:35:55 is the wiki harder to access than text files ? 05:36:11 by a lot 05:36:39 you see, there are such little details like "grep" 05:36:55 or any other automated tools, you can't apply that to a wiki 05:37:16 is that for searching, or for editing? 05:37:35 both 05:37:39 the wiki has a search option 05:38:08 you're seriously comparing it with standard Unix tools? 05:38:13 no 05:38:20 -!- monqy has quit [Quit: hello] 05:38:36 but, if you want to search for something, the wiki search is perfectly good 05:38:46 not to mention it takes ten seconds to navigate per page, compared to two or so to type a command 05:39:38 most of the original information is still on several big pages 05:40:05 yeah, and you can start searching them in a fraction of second 05:40:11 the lua function reference is split up into smaller pages (but the txt documentation didn't *have* function reference and was seriously out of date) 05:40:35 not so much with having to fire up/switch to a browser, navigate to the page, and only THEN you can start searching 05:40:43 kilobyte: why do we care? we don't exactly have an obligation to keep it up to date. 05:41:01 due: especially the clua is important 05:41:09 I suppose. 05:41:33 kilobyte: the lua reference was incredibly out of date; so having it in txt files hasn't been encouraging anyone to update it 05:41:36 due: and, it's the part that is accessed by actual users, so it needs to be shipped rather than stored on some obscure wiki somewhere 05:42:01 kilobyte: did you see dpeg's plan to ship a cut-down core syntax reference? 05:42:04 kilobyte: my point is more that we don't have an obligation to keep the wiki up to date, and someone placing it on the wiki does not force us into this model. 05:42:16 if people want the latest information and full LUA reference, they can look at the wiki 05:42:47 the manual is targetted to new players, so having it easily accessible from outside the game's help browser isn't important 05:42:55 due: as it stands, the text docs weren't kept up-to-date anyway, so i don't see how that's any different ;) 05:43:05 due: yeah, but I find it duplicating and wasting a lot of work 05:43:12 kilobyte: not work that you are having to do? :) 05:43:18 due: part of this effort is to actually get the documentation up to date, and put it somewhere where *everyone* can update it (not just devs) 05:43:29 kilobyte: trying to control what everyone does is futile, in my experience. 05:43:37 due: I actually started a clua documentation, but did too little to actually commit 05:44:07 kilobyte: well, i won't do any more for now, both dpeg and galehar encouraged this, and neither raised any objections 05:44:22 I don't see a problem with it, myself 05:44:23 due: yeah, but it'd be good to have the results be actually useful. A wiki page can't be reasonably converted to text -- we had enough trouble with the manual than it was worth :( 05:44:57 mumra: doing documentation work is great, and the old format was useless 05:45:16 mumra: I just don't want a repeat of the manual disaster 05:45:22 kilobyte: it wouldn't be incredibly hard to pull text from a wiki (there could be a plugin already) 05:45:29 * due laughs. 05:45:38 we did have problems with rst. 05:45:55 compounded by the fact that I never seemed to have/had the time to write an rst2text writer for docutils. 05:46:33 that silly doxygen thingy due came up with sounds for example like a better way to me 05:46:37 kilobyte: it's a fair concern, but as mentioned in that thread, design documentation is somewhat different to a manual; e.g. you will *always* want the latest information if you're going to be designing vaults, whereas a manual has to tie in with the release 05:48:16 dlua includes clua, and documentation for the latter (sorely needed!), is something that needs to be versioned 05:48:24 yes 05:48:30 auto-generated would be so much better. 05:48:32 * due sighs. 05:48:48 i have /so many/ things to do and never enough time and it is so frustrating. 05:49:34 due: i've been working with self-documenting code for a long time, it's way neater 05:49:35 due: is there a way to have separate doxy "domains" in the same file? Ie, documentation for lua and documentation for C functions, and have them produce separate files. 05:49:52 kilobyte: I...'m not entirely sure. I /think/ so, potentially. 05:50:00 kilobyte: that seems like the best option 05:50:13 * due google.s 05:50:20 kilobyte: what exactly is the difference between dlua and clue ? 05:50:24 s/clue/clua 05:50:43 mumra: clua is available to the client 05:51:02 mumra: dlua is only available to the dungeon code. 05:51:39 ok i get it, clua is all the autofight, stash etc. 05:52:17 yes 05:52:29 clua runs under your account when you ar eplaying the game, it lets you do macros and shit. 05:53:02 dlua is what runs the map engine and all that part of the back-end. 05:53:15 triggerables, fog machines, etc. 05:53:35 ok 05:53:54 uh oh... mumra, have you actually read the code you're documenting? Because some stuff you just wrote is pretty wrong. The first function I looked at, add_colour(), reads as if you could just add arbitrary colours that way, without inferfacing with rest of the code. 05:59:25 kilobyte: that example was copied from elsewhere in the existing documentation 05:59:25 hm 05:59:25 if add colour is what i think it is 05:59:25 it shouldn't be documented 05:59:25 mumra: ah, so it's that what should be fixed, yeah 05:59:25 it adds a colour pattern function 05:59:25 at least not externally 05:59:25 mumra: it allows elemental colours to access lua 05:59:25 kilobyte: a lot of lua stuff was scattered around the rest of the documentation, by getting everything into one place (and using links to cross-reference it), mistakes like that are easier to spot 05:59:25 -!- Ashenzari has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 06:00:12 -!- Ashenzari has joined ##crawl-dev 06:00:21 -!- The topic of ##crawl-dev is: DCSS Development | Logs: http://tozt.net/crawl | People with +v have commit access. | Please keep general crawl-related chit-chat to ##crawl. | Dev wiki: http://crawl.develz.org/wiki | Long stuff to pastebin.ca please | Immortal Warwalrus and Crazy Yiuf forever. 06:02:48 it's referenced from [[dcss:help:maps:syntax:headers#colour]] 06:03:16 needs a link back there to put it in context 06:04:58 -!- ortoslon has joined ##crawl-dev 06:08:55 -!- ainsophyao has joined ##crawl-dev 06:08:56 -!- Ashenzari has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 06:09:39 -!- Ashenzari has joined ##crawl-dev 06:09:40 -!- The topic of ##crawl-dev is: DCSS Development | Logs: http://tozt.net/crawl | People with +v have commit access. | Please keep general crawl-related chit-chat to ##crawl. | Dev wiki: http://crawl.develz.org/wiki | Long stuff to pastebin.ca please | Immortal Warwalrus and Crazy Yiuf forever. 06:11:14 what happened with crawl light? 06:11:30 *happened to 06:19:37 -!- Ashenzari has quit [Ping timeout: 253 seconds] 06:20:41 -!- Ashenzari has joined ##crawl-dev 06:20:41 -!- The topic of ##crawl-dev is: DCSS Development | Logs: http://tozt.net/crawl | People with +v have commit access. | Please keep general crawl-related chit-chat to ##crawl. | Dev wiki: http://crawl.develz.org/wiki | Long stuff to pastebin.ca please | Immortal Warwalrus and Crazy Yiuf forever. 06:25:50 -!- Mu_ has joined ##crawl-dev 06:29:41 -!- Ashenzari has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 06:30:33 -!- Ashenzari has joined ##crawl-dev 06:30:38 -!- The topic of ##crawl-dev is: DCSS Development | Logs: http://tozt.net/crawl | People with +v have commit access. | Please keep general crawl-related chit-chat to ##crawl. | Dev wiki: http://crawl.develz.org/wiki | Long stuff to pastebin.ca please | Immortal Warwalrus and Crazy Yiuf forever. 06:39:58 -!- Ashenzari has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:40:55 -!- Ashenzari has joined ##crawl-dev 06:40:55 -!- The topic of ##crawl-dev is: DCSS Development | Logs: http://tozt.net/crawl | People with +v have commit access. | Please keep general crawl-related chit-chat to ##crawl. | Dev wiki: http://crawl.develz.org/wiki | Long stuff to pastebin.ca please | Immortal Warwalrus and Crazy Yiuf forever. 06:41:00 commit log on github ends in august 06:42:42 https://github.com/dtsund 06:42:47 dtsund pushed to cl-trunk at dtsund/crawl-light 1 day ago 06:43:02 it seems to have got a rename 06:43:08 ah 06:43:27 should have removed the old one 06:43:45 i also think you can rename your project in the admin settings 06:49:34 -!- Ashenzari has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:50:20 -!- Ashenzari has joined ##crawl-dev 06:50:20 -!- The topic of ##crawl-dev is: DCSS Development | Logs: http://tozt.net/crawl | People with +v have commit access. | Please keep general crawl-related chit-chat to ##crawl. | Dev wiki: http://crawl.develz.org/wiki | Long stuff to pastebin.ca please | Immortal Warwalrus and Crazy Yiuf forever. 06:54:59 03kilobyte * r4f6f50a08aaf 10/crawl-ref/source/ (8 files): Make reaching more extensible. 06:55:00 03kilobyte * rc6e3ef7774a8 10/crawl-ref/source/ (dat/des/builder/uniques.des mon-data.h): Nerf Ignacio. 06:55:00 03kilobyte * r9337bd298546 10/crawl-ref/source/ (dat/lua/autofight.lua l_item.cc): Let autofight use the new reaching code; fix attempts to reach while berserk. 06:57:32 -!- ortoslon has left ##crawl-dev 07:01:33 -!- elliptic has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 07:10:12 -!- galehar has joined ##crawl-dev 07:27:57 -!- ainsophyao has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:31:31 galehar: would it be ok to make all polearms reaching? 07:31:33 -!- hoody_ has joined ##crawl-dev 07:31:49 yes 07:31:52 or would you prefer to discuss it more and/or explore your ideas for AI improvements first? 07:31:55 ok 07:32:24 5 roguelikes we want to play on mobile: http://www.pocketgamer.co.uk/r/Multiformat/Top+5+charts/feature.asp?c=32517 07:32:24 I'll finish my AI patch and push it later, no need to wait for it 07:32:31 Nr 1: DCSS 07:32:55 No. 2: The Larch 07:33:26 "maybe with a new tileset" ? 07:34:00 there's already an angband port on android 07:34:05 "since ASCII graphics are not ideal in the handheld world" 07:34:18 hehe, somebody doesn't know the tiles version :-) 07:34:34 bhaak: webtiles would prob be the best bet on android 07:35:19 and, i'm sure there's a free terminal app already 07:35:44 mumra: i tried webtiles a few weeks ago on the iOS. killer issue: no keyboard :-) and even watching randomly stopped on it. i guess memory issues 07:35:57 mumra: easier to port, but for a decent touchscreen interface, a real port would probably be much better 07:36:12 hmm, that reminds me, i didn't try it in the dev emulator. must do that once i hook my mac back up to a monitor 07:36:13 hmm, true 07:36:24 hmm, I got an idea... it would be easy to have über-reaching of a yet longer range... for a brand or a randart. Would that be a good idea? 07:39:31 galehar: I guess porting webtiles to something other than websockets would be easiest 07:40:33 -!- Xiberia has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:41:44 -!- monqy has joined ##crawl-dev 07:47:40 -!- ainsophyao has joined ##crawl-dev 07:48:00 well, we can certainly experiment it (the über reach) 07:48:31 also, if we give reaching to Oc, would they have an even longer reach with a polearm? 07:52:04 possibly! 07:52:39 due: what brand should Grum get? He's your fault IIRC. 07:53:51 actually Grum is keskitalo 07:55:44 Keskitalo: 08:00:12 -!- cesium has joined ##crawl-dev 08:03:44 -!- valrus has joined ##crawl-dev 08:07:19 -!- hoody_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:07:57 -!- hoody_ has joined ##crawl-dev 08:11:09 -!- Xiberia has joined ##crawl-dev 08:19:04 due: ok, going to push soon, please pretend you're him :p 08:25:08 Compile failure tilereg-dgn.cc (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=4524) by vonbrand 08:26:00 -!- valrus has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:26:38 -!- Pingas has joined ##crawl-dev 08:27:20 -!- ussdefiant has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:29:25 hmm. Someone hasn't checked tiles compiling... 08:30:39 I did! Except this one is GL tiles only, and I can't check them here, so I did webtiles :p 08:30:50 turns out this wasn't enough... 08:35:52 -!- hoody_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:40:17 03kilobyte * r1c27e005856c 10/crawl-ref/source/ (9 files in 5 dirs): Give all polearms reach. 08:40:27 03kilobyte * rb89925ca1c82 10/crawl-ref/source/ (tag-version.h tags.cc): Drop the reaching brand on polearms in saved games. 08:40:27 03kilobyte * r0bb64e39701e 10/crawl-ref/source/tilereg-dgn.cc: Fix local tiles compilation. 08:40:39 -!- ZorbaTHut has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 08:46:34 !tell dpeg idea: über-reaching: range sqrt(10). Could be either a polearm brand (probably too good), randart only, or perhaps stacking with natural reaching on some users (monsters, octopodes?) 08:46:35 kilobyte: OK, I'll let dpeg know. 08:52:58 bug: can reach through statues 08:52:59 https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=2527 08:53:50 galehar: I guess parts of test/monplace.lua that deal with mimics are obsolete beyond repair, right? 08:53:57 galehar: why would that be a bug? 08:54:27 DNGN_ enum names say this was coded this way intentionally 08:54:53 a statue of an orc is just as big as a live orc 08:55:03 if reaching through statue is intentional, then it's the targetting which is bugged, because the monster isn't auto targetted 08:55:48 ah yeah 08:57:15 I already removed some mimic stuff from monplace.lua, I just missed the rest 08:57:52 and yes, it's compleley obsolete since mimics aren't placed like monsters but replace existing features and items 09:02:25 -!- ortoslon has joined ##crawl-dev 09:03:13 -!- ncampion has quit [Quit: Linkinus - http://linkinus.com] 09:18:14 03kilobyte * rdcd794926d28 10/crawl-ref/source/l_you.cc: Allow querying runes by name rather than by number. 09:18:19 03kilobyte * rc8a3aaadc9d4 10/crawl-ref/source/test/monplace.lua: Remove obsolete mimic checks. 09:20:09 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 09:26:42 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 09:30:37 -!- hoody_ has joined ##crawl-dev 09:31:22 -!- hoody_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:34:46 -!- hoody_ has joined ##crawl-dev 09:38:06 03kilobyte 07demons * rba33e35591f0 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-gear.cc: Revert the reaper nerf. 09:41:09 -!- dtsund has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 09:41:27 -!- elly has joined ##crawl-dev 09:47:02 -!- Cryp71c has joined ##crawl-dev 09:47:31 -!- Cryp71c has left ##crawl-dev 09:54:46 -!- ainsophyao has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:56:04 -!- hoody_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:56:06 03MarvinPA 07demons * raa610981ccdf 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-data.h: Make Lorocyprocas normal speed 09:56:17 03MarvinPA * r4121537e98d7 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-util.cc: Add some missing dangerous spells to the xp modifier 09:57:27 -!- hoody_ has joined ##crawl-dev 09:59:55 -!- ainsophyao has joined ##crawl-dev 10:03:37 what about shadow creatures? Shouldn't it be considered as a dangerous spell? 10:03:43 @?? boggart 10:03:43 boggart (06g) | Speed: 12 | HD: 2 | Health: 6-16 | AC/EV: 0/12 | Damage: 5 | Flags: spellcaster, see invisible | Res: 06magic(18) | XP: 21 | Sp: confuse, slow, invisibility, blink, shadow creatures. 10:03:51 oh hm, maybe 10:03:56 i didn't want to add too much stuff 10:03:58 because 21 XP seems a bit low for them 10:04:08 but yeah, shadow creatures should probably qualify 10:04:21 or we can adjust their XP modifier. Who else has shadow creatures? 10:04:27 marvinpa_: speaking of shadow creatures, are you going to nerf it or should I look at it sometime? 10:04:41 oh hmm 10:04:50 if you'd like to take a look at it that'd be cool 10:04:52 blue death, giant orange brain 10:05:09 @?? blue death 10:05:09 And yeah it's ridiculous on both player and monster end 10:05:09 Blue Death (021) | Speed: 11 | HD: 12 | Health: 49-86 | AC/EV: 10/10 | Damage: 20, 20 | Flags: 05demonic, see invisible, fly, !sil | Res: 06magic(144), 02cold++, 10elec++, 03poison, 04rot, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 04fire, 08holy++ | XP: 1525 | Sp: b.lightning (3d18), b.cold (3d21), shadow creatures, teleport other. 10:05:27 @?? giant orange brain 10:05:28 giant orange brain (04G) | Speed: 10 | HD: 10 | Health: 36-72 | AC/EV: 2/4 | Flags: evil, see invisible, lev, !sil | Res: 06magic(106), asphyx | Vul: 08holy | Chunks: 06mutagenic | XP: 787 | Sp: brain feed, cause fear, shadow creatures, confuse, blink, teleport self. 10:05:28 blue deaths don't have shadow creatures in the future 10:05:32 i toned it down on the monster end in the demons branch 10:05:33 I'm currently still finishing up stuff with staff reform, so I won't be looking at it immediately at least 10:05:45 they're blizzard demons in demons, and blizzard demons don't have shadow creatures, iirc 10:06:08 and I remember I was finding it tricky to figure out how to change the duration of a summon after it has been created 10:06:10 MarvinPA: Demons branch summoners can't summon multiple 1s at once, I would hope 10:06:20 indeed they cannot 10:06:24 anyway, if the spell is being nerfed, then I guess there's no need to add it to the dangerous spell list 10:06:24 also: speaking of boggarts: I noticed in a game I was watching that they were darkgrey on the monster list, which seemed a bit peculiar, them being dangerous and all 10:06:41 galehar: this is about the player side of the spell 10:06:55 monster side is pretty separate really 10:07:07 It shouldn't be able to summon bands as a player spell 10:07:16 I also noticed some other somewhat notable monsters got darkgreyed, such as item-destroying ones, but maybe I'm missing the point of mlist colouring? 10:07:31 summoning bands is fine, it just should have lower duration when it does 10:07:53 monqy: the threat level is based on XP value, and they are worth 21 10:08:17 I guess giant eyeballs go darkgrey fast then? 10:08:18 -!- ZChris13 has joined ##crawl-dev 10:08:19 hence my suggestion of either adding shadow creatures to the list of dangerous spells or adjusting their XP modifier 10:08:31 @?? giant eyeball 10:08:31 giant eyeball (16G) | Speed: 3 | HD: 3 | Health: 9-24 | AC/EV: 0/1 | Flags: lev | Res: 06magic(12), asphyx | XP: 3. 10:08:46 seems so 10:08:52 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 10:08:52 anything that scales in threat level will be a bit wonky I imagine 10:08:55 i was also wondering why teleport self and teleport other act as an xp modifier 10:09:03 and giant eyeballs are the master at that 10:09:09 more xp because of annoyingness? seems weird 10:09:47 Teleother is legit dangerous in Snake:5 10:09:55 Not really much of a concern anywhere else 10:10:11 i guess, not sure it's a spell that should automatically qualify a monster for being worth more experience though 10:10:38 then again experience calculations are just really crazy and complicated :P 10:10:43 SHadow creatures would be more worthy of that, yeah 10:11:01 removing them seems fine to me. If the spell is only relevant in snake:5, then raise the XP modifier of guardian naga to compensate 10:12:19 -!- elliptic has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:14:12 -!- Twilight13 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:25:50 -!- Twilight-1 has joined ##crawl-dev 10:30:33 -!- ainsophyao has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:31:30 -!- galehar has quit [Quit: Page closed] 10:35:01 -!- ussdefiant has joined ##crawl-dev 10:47:48 -!- Zaba has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:53:20 -!- Zaba has joined ##crawl-dev 11:11:05 -!- evilmike has joined ##crawl-dev 11:11:49 -!- Twilight-1 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:12:53 -!- Zaba has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:13:48 -!- Zaba has joined ##crawl-dev 11:16:05 Octopode miscast message: Your Bones Ache doesn't make sense biologically. (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=4525) by heyboots 11:25:59 -!- Twilight has joined ##crawl-dev 11:26:07 -!- dtsund has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 11:26:24 -!- Twilight is now known as Guest98311 11:26:27 -!- ortoslon has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:31:43 !tell greatzebu hey there :) i think the osx tile builds are failing 11:31:44 Napkin: OK, I'll let greatzebu know. 11:38:39 -!- hoody_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:39:59 -!- hoody_ has joined ##crawl-dev 11:40:48 MarvinPA_: i came up with a list of new undead for yred :D 12:04:15 SpEn skeletons? 12:04:18 set to wander, rake in xp 12:15:45 -!- ixtli has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 12:28:38 -!- Guest98311 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:32:49 -!- ZChris13 has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87 [Firefox 6.0.2/20110902133214]] 12:37:36 TSO is unplayable with that blindingly bright "Glow" glaring into your eyes on the HUD, outshining actual information 12:38:53 the status glow or the halo effect? 12:39:24 ... and it was added deliberately 12:39:38 status glow, the halo is just a different colour of the floor 12:39:55 that's what i thought you meant 12:39:55 :/ 12:40:31 have you ever seen what tso's halo looks like in tiles? 12:40:33 it's atrocious 12:41:29 s/what.*in // 12:41:55 heh 12:41:57 I wonder, what about drawing it as, you know, halo? 12:44:53 -!- Twilight-1 has joined ##crawl-dev 12:49:16 evilmike: well it was that or have it not even display properly at all in tiles for 0.9 :P 12:49:31 i didnt mind it so much when it didn't display 12:49:44 having a yellow grid cover everything isn't exactly nice 12:49:55 sure, but it's a pretty big information discrepancy between tiles/console 12:50:10 non non-player haloes 12:50:15 for non-player* 12:50:20 yeah, i can't say i actually have an idea on how to improve the way it looks 12:50:30 other than it would be nice to have an option to disable it 12:50:52 maybe i should edit the tileset in my offline copy and make it invisible. can you do that without recompiling? 12:51:47 evilmike: you could edit the png, just replace that tile with transparency 12:51:50 evilmike: what would you say about a slight yellowish glow over tiles in range? 12:52:09 03kilobyte * r1deab284a58d 10/crawl-ref/source/status.cc: Don't consider own halo to be newsworthy enough to blind the player's HUD. 12:52:09 kilobyte: quite a bit more reasonable than the "grid" look 12:52:11 somehow no one remembers that PNG allows more alpha values than 0 and 255 12:52:22 another thing that might work is just recolouring floor tiles, I dunno if you can do that though 12:52:52 evilmike: have you seen the new orb glow in tiles? I'm thinking something like that, just a lot more discreet. 12:53:07 haven't seen what the orb glow looks like in tiles yet 12:53:24 lemme compile tiles 12:53:30 kilobyte: If the question is about überreaching whip for Grum, I like it. 12:53:45 I haven't actually won a tiles game since 0.5, I just use it for messing around with offline stuff 12:53:48 Also, we should make the dogs stick with Grum. That should be possible ith the herd code. 12:54:39 evilmike: CDO tiles run an ancient version so online tiles are not an option either 12:58:13 hmm, orb glow looks kinda like fog 12:58:27 the effect is a lot more tolerable looking than the tso overlay though 12:59:36 -!- elly has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:01:00 -!- elly has joined ##crawl-dev 13:17:28 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev 13:18:43 -!- hoody_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:26:54 -!- purge has joined ##crawl-dev 13:36:28 -!- hoody_ has joined ##crawl-dev 13:40:00 kilobyte: thanks for that, i forgot entirely that TSOites would have it all the time 13:41:22 Have what? The halo? 13:41:54 yes 13:42:34 if they had a debuff all the time, this woukld be worth noting, but it was changed so that they aren't getting an EV penalty from their own halos 13:43:23 evilmike: Do you think Light's version of the halo is more tolerable? 13:44:02 For reference, http://i869.photobucket.com/albums/ab252/dtsund/halosample3.png 13:44:13 yeah that's pretty good 13:44:34 (3 in the filename because that was the third one I tried) 13:45:50 can we render it as something non-tile? 13:45:56 tome does lighting as actual lighting and it looks rather nice 13:46:05 and i hate tiles 13:46:10 -!- hoody_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:49:28 -!- ais523 has joined ##crawl-dev 14:00:01 -!- st__ has joined ##crawl-dev 14:02:28 -!- st_ has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:03:28 FR: Replace "Hunger" with "Hunger x5" in the spell menu. 14:03:49 "Hunger (5 casts)"? 14:03:51 -!- st__ is now known as st_ 14:04:05 I don't think there's room for that string. 14:06:41 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 14:07:57 i'd still rather just have small/moderate/large/very large or something instead of trying to explain the weird food link 14:09:27 that would certainly be better than the weird food thing 14:12:33 +1 14:12:48 current status is ridiculously misleading, yes 14:13:51 the food link reminds me of when monster sizes were given in terms of monsters ("as large as a rat") 14:14:19 except that here it is "as large as 20% of a rat" 14:14:45 "A goblin. It is as large as a goblin." 14:23:33 this sort of thing is why I wrote the comparisons out by hand rather than generating them automatically 14:50:17 Qoradim (L17 DsDK) ERROR in 'mon-movetarget.cc' at line 104: ZotDef: monster it failed to pathfind to (40,43) (the Orb) (D:1 (ZotDef)) 14:52:13 potion of experience does not always raise skill level to indicated level (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=4526) by cesium 15:01:15 -!- RichardHawk has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:06:05 -!- ainsophyao has joined ##crawl-dev 15:34:16 -!- dpeg has joined ##crawl-dev 15:35:08 mumra: hi! 15:35:09 dpeg: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 15:35:13 !messages 15:35:14 (1/1) kilobyte said (6h 48m 40s ago): idea: über-reaching: range sqrt(10). Could be either a polearm brand (probably too good), randart only, or perhaps stacking with natural reaching on some users (monsters, octopodes?) 15:36:43 kilobyte: I like some cool polearm brand... but uberreaching sounds problematic (also interface). What about having a brand that allows to target as per reaching, but potentially impales two guys (the guy you target, and the one in between you and the target)? 15:37:27 dpeg: hello! 15:39:01 mumra: I hope you don't mind me editing the wiki design stuff a bit. 15:39:34 dpeg: no, that's great, it all needs a lot of sorting out 15:39:51 i hope you don't mind me slightly restructuring things ... 15:40:07 mumra: I have the feeling that "DCSS Map Design" is a bit too long 15:40:13 mumra: no, go ahead 15:40:21 do you think it's better having sections more split up, rather than huge pages? 15:40:41 just done with "advanced topics" 15:40:43 good call 15:41:00 when you say it's too long, d'you mean the titles? 15:41:03 I wondered when I read the HEADER page... it is long, and people generally look for SUBST, ITEM, etc. 15:41:07 mumra: yes, could be shorter 15:41:09 i started removing "DCSS Map Design" from them 15:41:15 good! 15:41:25 also, we usually refer to the maps as "vaults 15:41:28 i was thinking of reordering the HEADER page 15:41:37 uber-reaching would be a fun tmut effect 15:41:38 not so good, but it is all over the place 15:41:44 mumra: yes, thought about that too 15:41:59 the obscure stuff (LFLOOR etc.) should definitely at the bottom 15:42:10 no idea where TAGS should go 15:42:34 dpeg: the original docs were called "level design", i changed it to map to be more clear for beginners, but yes i can just change it vaults; the introduction explains the terminology anyway 15:43:07 dpeg: i was going to add subsections on the HEADER page to break it up a bit 15:43:23 -!- ainsophyao has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:43:26 mumra: that will help already 15:43:29 group similar functionality together; e.g. ITEM and KITEM could be next to each other 15:43:33 and so on 15:43:45 I think I am going to remove the documentation files from the trunk -- any objections? Shout now! 15:43:52 kilobyte raised some concerns earlier 15:43:57 about the whole wikification thing 15:43:58 kilobyte: around? 15:44:04 mumra: did you explain? 15:44:09 yes 15:44:14 mumra: what did kilobyte say? 15:44:19 elliptic: wasn't Delayed Fireball supposed to be one level higher than Fireball? It appears to me whoever reduced the latter forgot about the former... 15:44:36 kilobyte: yeah, I don't know whether that was intentional 15:44:40 ask MarvinPA 15:44:44 doeg: yeah, just came back to IRC literally a few seconds ago, halfway in the sentence :p 15:44:49 kilobyte: Hi! :) 15:45:48 dpeg: documentation as a text file is orders of magnitude faster to access and search 15:45:53 kilobyte: I'd like to keep enough vault making documentation in trunk so that players can go at it completely locally. But we have _never_ made attempts to keep the finer points up to date, a lot of it is rotten. Having these on the wiki will be good (also makes for easier reading, I sometimes have to refer to stuff). 15:45:58 ok, one order I guess, but still 15:46:25 kilobyte: because of grep, you mean? 15:46:41 grep, being one command away from it, etc 15:46:42 mumra: that is the one disadvantage of having many pages 15:47:27 kilobyte: but the thing is a lot more readable now, trust me on this one (I made almost all of the documentation) 15:47:39 also, getting to the browser takes a few seconds while when editing vaults you're already in a terminal. And it's not enough to just switch to a browser, you'd have to navigate to the page, wait until it loads, etc. 15:48:19 but wikifying has already helped with up-to-date and correctness 15:48:27 is there any way to turn wiki pages into text? 15:49:20 technically wiki pages *are* text, at least that's how they're stored 15:49:29 I wouldn't whine if there was 15:49:33 well, we don't want html blurb 15:49:40 I'd be willing to make a txt file before releases. 15:49:55 i mean the wiki markup; it's not hugely different than the original text files anyway 15:49:55 (I.e. to be responsible for it.) 15:50:48 delayed fireball could probably stay at level 7, it's certainly worth two slots if you already know fireball 15:51:26 dpeg: the other thing kilobyte and due discussed, was using doxygen for making the code self-documenting, which could possibly be used dually for c++ and Lua reference 15:51:50 which would be a clear advantage over maintaining wiki reference for Lua 15:51:56 I can only speak for me... I make vaults much less frequently than I used to do, which means that I need the documentation more, though. Most of my questions are answered by the syntax file, which can be left almost as is in trunk. For all the rest, it's so complicated I prefer to read it in a nice form on the wiki before proceeding. Other may differ, of course. 15:52:24 mumra: I have no experience with this. If you know what it means and can give it a shot, show me. 15:53:15 dpeg: i agree, i find browsing a TOC on a web page much friendlier than searching text files (but then i'm on windows so no grep :P ) 15:53:28 mumra: ah, I see. This is about not documenting lua via text at all. 15:53:39 ah, this explains your behaviour :p 15:54:06 as they say, a word is worth a thousand pictures :p 15:54:10 mumra: grep exists for everything. Back when I coded 80286 assembler, there was grep. 15:54:14 (really, a command mouseclicks) 15:54:15 lol 15:54:45 mumra: you're not used to a command line, this is what you mean :) 15:55:18 you can click once per, say, a couple seconds, and even that only if the computer reacts infinitely fast 15:55:19 well, i'm used to command lines; i've used unix terminals a lot in the past; but my windows habits are all mouse-based 15:55:22 kilobyte: have a look at https://crawl.develz.org/wiki/doku.php?id=dcss:help:maps:advanced 15:55:34 if you think that is not okay, we will revert 15:57:32 kilobyte: a single click can still be faster than typing a whole command ... and you'd be surprised how fast i can click :P 15:58:16 I think these comparisons are besides the point. 15:58:54 there's like ~10 possible buttons to click on a screen at a time on the average -- there are over 2000 commands on a basic Unix system. And a single line of shell can do a number of things the whole Windows GUI could never do. Or, for a crushing argument, Perl :p 15:59:36 The question is how the documentation is accessed. Frequently, in small chunks (like it is for syntax.txt) -- here clearly a text file is quicker. Or more rarely in larger batches (e.g. for triggerables or portal vaults). Here the more readable and better structured wiki may help (for example, you have links). 15:59:37 dpeg: that page looks just the same as the old text doc 15:59:47 It is a lot better readable. 16:00:03 * dpeg is a great friend of the compromise. Can't we get one here? 16:00:22 FWIW I think the page looks more readable as well, and we'll get more people keeping it up to date in the wiki than in the repository. 16:00:28 what about generating both from common source? 16:00:36 if we can... 16:00:44 kilobyte: Sounds excellent. 16:00:47 ReST does not seem the easiest choice 16:00:53 (one of them could be the source, of course) 16:01:23 i was having a look at docuwiki plugins ... there's a disctinct lack of *import* options (although it has output filters e.g. plain text, html, pdf) 16:01:39 Well, actually I think we should generate the text files from the wiki, because I believe there'll be more contribution from there. 16:01:42 mumra: so we use it as the source? 16:01:51 fits with that as well 16:01:51 Could we merge changes from both? :) 16:01:59 no 16:02:39 kilobyte: Perl works pretty well on Windows too 16:03:09 kilobyte: for Lua documentation, source makes absolute sense, since you can document each function where it's defined, and use a doc generator. but all the other arbitrary stuff that's not tied to particular functions - i'm not sure the best way to approach that. 16:04:52 as Keskitalo says, the real advantage of the wiki is it's very approachable for anyone to make updates, without having to learn a new syntax (which doxygen, luadoc, etc. all have their own versions of) 16:05:22 ais523: without all the support tools, it's useful only for proper programs... and for me Perl's strength is in one-liners that use pipes 16:05:39 mumra: possible, yeah... 16:05:48 mumra: is docuwiki what we use? 16:05:52 kilobyte: i have msysgit running on my windows box; so i have a fully work unix command line ... 16:05:59 mumra: can you investigate how good its txtx output is? 16:06:00 s/work/working 16:06:05 kilobyte: I suppose so; you can get most of the pipe components from CPAN (which surprisingly, actually works on Windows although it doesn't really on Linux) 16:06:06 mumra: if you could keep a piece of reference that's usable without a browser, it'd be enough for me 16:06:09 dpeg: yes it's docuwiki 16:06:11 but that's awkward 16:06:58 ais523: I'm not talking about pipe support in Perl, I'm talking about mixing Perl and shell 16:07:02 ais523: to build crawl on windows you basically need msysgit ... which is effectively a complete unix environment 16:07:27 I'm off to bed, cheers! 16:07:29 kilobyte: oh, fair enough, I do that too someimes 16:07:37 a tiny subset, but it has the essentials, yeah 16:07:38 mumra: and has to be, because git's so UNIXy it hurts 16:07:50 anyone here who has been editing the Constriction page? 16:08:02 I killed someone's edits and would like to apologise :( 16:11:17 Doesn't the dev wiki save history? 16:11:19 speaking of, i envisioned some new monsters for yred (or late crypt, etc.), one of which constricts :) 16:11:41 a good old fashioned chain-rattling ghost 16:12:29 dpeg: who might have admin access to the wiki who could test this text plugin? ( http://www.dokuwiki.org/plugin:text ) 16:13:37 dtsund: no, this was a case where there were two edits, I got the choice between Save (my changes) and Cancel, I did Back which was interpreted as Save. 16:13:47 mumra: not sure I can do this. 16:14:02 mumra: much rather replying to your DG comments anyway :) 16:14:20 i thought the dev wiki used a locking system? 16:14:30 !tell Napkin Can we get the http://www.dokuwiki.org/plugin:text for the wiki? 16:14:32 dpeg: OK, I'll let Napkin know. 16:14:40 Zannick: yes, I have never seen the Save/Cancel thing before. 16:17:48 Ah. Pity it doesn't work like a proper VCS and let you merge... 16:18:48 * kilobyte mumbles something about documentation and git :p 16:19:41 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 16:19:45 it'd be cool to see a wiki where everything is in git 16:20:25 mumra: replied 16:20:40 Eronarn: http://atonie.org/2008/02/git-wiki 16:20:54 kilobyte: there are always advantages and drawbacks... have to weigh them. 16:21:08 aargh, git 16:22:09 03kilobyte * r4909908f1cff 10/crawl-ref/source/mapdef.cc: Forbid wizmode commands from spawning skeletons of monsters without one. 16:22:15 ok, so what format do we want clua docs in? 16:22:20 03kilobyte * rb13e90a38036 10/crawl-ref/source/spl-miscast.cc: Better necro miscast messages for octopodes and monsters. 16:22:50 kilobyte: the same as the lua documenation... which is unsettled for now :) 16:22:51 note that this is the part that needs to be shipped with Crawl (supposed to be read by users for their own use) 16:23:09 If docuwiki produces somewhat decent text files, I suggest to go with that. 16:23:38 -!- MarvinPA_ has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:26:46 dpeg: kilobyte is referring to the clua (e.g. stash code, autofight, scripts that can be modified on the client). having code self-documenting is extremely neat and powerful; it makes code easier to understand because each function is properly commented, and has the dual function of exporting readable documentation. 16:27:17 this is the part where due could enlighten us... 16:27:17 how do admin accounts work with dgamelaunch-crawl? 16:27:22 due: awake? 16:27:25 hm, I'm probably still forgetting something with staff reform 16:27:33 but maybe it is sufficiently complete to push 16:28:10 * dpeg cheers elliptic 16:28:36 did you put the signs in the restrooms that say they have to wash their hands before returning to work? 16:29:05 mumra: I never have occasion to use these things. Use what's best for you. I think you and kilobyte know what will work. 16:29:18 and what with polearms? How much should they be nerfed to make up for reaching? 16:29:51 (so far I've cut 1 dam from those which are 1-handed for human-sized races) 16:30:21 -1 dam is a good start... I'm not really sure how good reaching is when it isn't replacing another brand 16:31:10 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.10-a0-614-g4909908 (32) 16:31:18 kilobyte: yes, leave it at that. We have mixed experiences with pre-emptive nerfs. If everyone starts using polearms, we know what to do. 16:31:49 dpeg: demigod piety titles "Nobody", "Heroic", "Reknowned", "Fabled", 16:31:49 "Legendary", "Exalted", "Godlike", "Sublimed" 16:32:17 oops, meant to format before paste 16:32:59 mumra: and Forgotten for negative 16:33:08 that is Sublimed? 16:34:07 no, i think "Nobody" is negative (at least, < 5) 16:34:28 ah 16:35:15 "sublimed" is similar meaning to "ascended" 16:35:49 "sublimed" sounds meh to me 16:36:15 I don't like sublimed either 16:36:22 03elliptic * r799295fabd31 10/crawl-ref/source/ (fight.cc item_use.cc): Make regular staves be penalized less for use with a shield. 16:36:25 03elliptic * r56ed2f7a0f0c 10/crawl-ref/ (7 files in 3 dirs): Give gladiators the option of starting with a quarterstaff (and no buckler). 16:36:25 03elliptic * rca7fa5815977 10/crawl-ref/ (8 files in 4 dirs): Artificer changes. 16:36:25 03elliptic * r6fffb44cead7 10/crawl-ref/source/ (itemprop.cc shopping.cc): Buff quarterstaves and lajatangs. 16:36:26 03elliptic * r04beebb0b6c5 10/crawl-ref/source/fight.cc: Nerf enhancer staff melee. 16:36:30 "One True God"? 16:36:32 03elliptic * ra249a58695be 10/crawl-ref/ (26 files in 10 dirs): Split quarterstaff into "staff" and "quarterstaff". 16:36:51 mumra: One True God is out of place 16:36:56 mumra: heh, nice 16:37:02 also reknowned -> renowned :) 16:37:12 the DG is never a god like the one of the pantheon, just something worshipped by may superstitious humans 16:37:22 oh yeah 16:37:24 hey, most RL religions claim that 16:37:34 dpeg 16:37:51 dpeg: perhaps Godlike could be max piety? *almost* a god (but not actually one) 16:38:59 yes 16:39:18 kilobyte: of course, that is part of the charm of the whole idea, at least for someone godless like me 16:41:06 -!- ZorbaTHut has joined ##crawl-dev 16:47:59 There's no point quarrelling about words (titles) right now, but in German we have Abgott fitting really well with (not being) Gott. The translation seems to be Idol, Tin God. 16:49:06 "Idolised" is good, but perhaps not for max piety 16:49:10 sounds cool 16:49:55 mumra: yeah, could be inserted. For example by kicking out "godlike" and shifting. 16:50:30 -!- galehar has joined ##crawl-dev 16:50:40 kilobyte: i removed "sublimed" (and added "forgotten" at the start) so godlike is currently max piety 16:52:11 idol is great 16:52:20 "Forgotten", "Nobody", "Heroic", "Renowned", "Fabled", "Legendary", "Exalted", "Idol" 16:53:27 elliptic: great work with staves and artificier! 16:53:48 mumra: looks good to me 16:53:55 Who wouldn't like to be an idol? 16:53:59 galehar: thanks, some of it will certainly need tweaking of course :) 16:54:05 DCSS Idol 16:54:19 sounds like a terrifying idea for a game show 16:55:25 dpeg: hey, I have a question about your food reform design 16:55:33 galehar: fire away! 16:56:02 mumra: if you give DG a shot, perhaps make a quick note on the Mantis item. 16:56:05 in the permafood table, mild dislike (-1) gives 3/4. Shouldn't it be 2/3? 16:56:28 no wait 16:56:30 aieee.... a bunch of early gnolls what would be trivial without the polearm change proved to be helluva more deadly 16:56:58 galehar: could be, but at least it is monotonous :) 16:57:08 kilobyte: yes! 16:57:24 * kilobyte makes a note to equip a bunch of HOPr warlords with polearms for corridor exits of death :p 16:57:32 kilobyte: right, -1 dam hurts them a lot less than it does players 16:57:53 sometimes they get good polearms, right? 16:57:53 I mean everything else works in thirds, but maybe it's intentional to give less penalty for disliked permafood than chunks 16:58:30 galehar: I think that's inherited from vintermann. Permafood is more valuable than chunks (may have been the idea). 16:58:56 galehar: but you can change the numbers to 1/3, 2/3, 1, if you like. No big deal. 16:59:16 I might do that. Would be simpler. 16:59:23 galehar: good job on sniping the forum offenders, many thanks for that. 17:00:00 strong language is one thing, insulting people is another 17:00:09 agreed 17:00:23 I didn't even note that one, was too busy checking labs.des :) 17:01:00 :) 17:02:25 -!- cx1213 has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:03:20 -!- cx1213 has joined ##crawl-dev 17:03:20 -!- cx1213 has quit [Changing host] 17:03:20 -!- cx1213 has joined ##crawl-dev 17:05:39 hmm, was there anything else i've missed that was planned for the demons branch? it currently has demon tier shuffling, buffs for a couple of weak/boring 2s, abjuration split, and some toning down of monster summon spam 17:06:55 MarvinPA: remove shadow demons (or shadow wraiths). umbra to shadow demons 17:06:59 maybe halo to sun demons? 17:07:16 MarvinPA: do you change tentacled monstrosities? 17:07:20 remove shadow demons and then give them umbra? 17:07:30 MarvinPA: well you should remove one of shadow wraiths or shadow demons imo 17:07:32 @??shadow wraith 17:07:32 shadow wraith (06W) | Speed: 10 | HD: 10 | Health: 38-72 | AC/EV: 7/7 | Damage: 2013(drain) | Flags: 07undead, evil, see invisible, lev | Res: 06magic(106), 03poison, 12drown, 04rot+++, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 824. 17:07:33 shadow wraiths are my favourite, don't remove them D: 17:07:35 @??shadow demon 17:07:35 dpeg: no, didn't do anything with them 17:07:35 shadow demon (063) | Speed: 11 | HD: 6 | Health: 21-45 | AC/EV: 7/12 | Damage: 21 | Flags: 05demonic, see invisible | Res: 06magic(56), 02cold++, 03poison, 04rot, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 198. 17:07:52 btw, did you already hear about the n900 port of dcss 0.9.1? http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=76235 17:07:52 was there a proposal for them? 17:07:58 MarvinPA: ok, they may get constriction at some point and have most HD among constrictors, by far 17:08:00 unnecessary hating on Blue Deaths... shadow creatures is a fun spell when used by monsters, a balrug mirror is not 17:08:03 shadow wraiths and shadow demons generate in different places 17:08:25 elliptic: yes but they're still two monsters with basically the same gimmick/flavor 17:08:34 ah yeah, and blue death -> blizzard demon 17:08:58 i like blizzard demons but it might be nice to find something else that could get shadow creatures, yeah 17:09:48 shadow... demons? :P 17:09:51 shadow demons could move up to a 2 and get shadow creatures i guess! although maybe not if they stay permainvisible 17:09:53 heh 17:09:56 I didn't like the original blizzard demon proposals, I don't know what they currently have though 17:10:14 freezing cloud, airstrike, bolt of cold, lightning bolt 17:10:18 ouch 17:10:32 lightning bolt seems weird though 17:10:39 sounds boring to me still 17:11:10 like antaeus the titan with extra potion destruction and presumably much worse melee :P 17:11:27 dpeg: wiki / mantis commented 17:11:42 give them refrig? 17:11:45 or something new? 17:11:55 shadow demons becoming visible and getting shadow creatures sounds sort of good maybe 17:12:00 well, refrig would be a bit good for a 3 17:12:10 isn't ice fiend a sufficently icy demon? 17:12:15 not sure why we need another one 17:12:50 solution, as always, is to add more spells :P 17:12:51 how nerfed is shadow creatures? They might be better off as 2s if it's strong on them 17:12:54 to balance out all the fire type demons? 17:13:02 tempest might fit better than blizzard i guess. i somehow prefer the name blue death though :P 17:13:05 elliptic: exactly... if there was an interesting idea like refrig, it could go in, but a near-exact copy of balrugs, I don't see a point 17:13:22 oh, talking about the 1 17:13:31 I slightly prefer blue death over blizzard demon 17:14:00 on one hand, colour-thing is bad, but on the other, so is thing-demon 17:14:10 blizzard death 17:14:14 and blizzard death is clunky :( 17:14:17 heh 17:14:18 or maybe not clunky 17:14:18 come up with a completely new name? 17:14:24 a suggestion: keep blue death as is, change name by means of cat 17:14:29 maybe I just haven't adapted to it 17:14:36 elliptic: :p 17:14:37 cat names are always good 17:14:42 elliptic: <3 17:14:59 New crawl devs are too afraid of old-style names. 17:15:04 unfortunately I'm not currently in the same location as my cats :/ 17:15:18 roll d26s 17:15:21 name 'em after wendigos! 17:15:33 or python random.choice('abcd...z') 17:15:42 and just do that a bunch :P 17:15:49 zannick: cats are better at picking names than that! 17:15:54 (that's really bad, fyi) 17:16:15 Zannick: or use the whole Unicode :p 17:16:35 What would Linley say could he see this mess? :) 17:16:38 Zannick: a cat name with Chinese, Georgian, Thai and what not letters 17:16:57 name comprised purely of nonalphabetic symbols 17:17:54 mumra: regarding conducts: if you can compile a task list for conducts (as specific as possible), please do. Concentrate on the other stuff... someone will be able to help. 17:18:02 kilobyte: yikes 17:18:59 sky demon? :P 17:18:59 the demon formerly known as blizzard demon 17:19:23 unnameable undemon 17:19:29 demon blizzard 17:20:13 mumra: also, keep it real simple for a start! 17:21:16 conducts? like illiterate? 17:21:37 elliptic: tracking how you behaved for the gods. 17:22:01 Counting numbers of books burned/destroyed, cannibalistic performances etc. 17:23:25 elliptic: I'd like to use this for flavour (TSO will still take you if you have a bad history of chasing angels, but he should at least remark on on how you'd better change your ways) and for the DG changes. (The gods who you offend most are more likely to send minions). 17:24:05 dpeg: yep, gonna leave the other gods alone for now. it's probably not worth tracking *every* god conduct, just the 1 or 2 things each god cares most about (otherwise it'll get really complicated for the player to understand) 17:24:13 I see, sounds cool for flavour 17:24:18 mumra: exactly 17:24:21 i'll start making a list on the wiki 17:24:37 trog hates spellcasters :) 17:24:42 elliptic: there will be immediate queries to have gameplay implications, but I am not really into that. 17:25:20 good gods should probably be "I'm glad you repented" or whatever 17:26:08 03galehar * r114d259e5c2e 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-stuff.cc: Fix the can_go_straight function not checking the destination cell. 17:26:19 03galehar * recda794cf5b5 10/crawl-ref/source/ (7 files): New monster behaviour: retreating. 17:26:31 Zannick: trog might hate it when you learn new spells; so say if you destroy a spellbook to free up slots to then learn a new spell, you manage to annoy both trog *and* sif in one shot :) 17:26:50 Zin: "It was about time, mortal! Take these virgins as sign of my appreciation. Damn, I misplaced all my virgins. Take this sausage instead!" 17:26:52 dpeg: yes, that was my first reaction too before you explained it was for flavour... such things can easily become spoilery/gameable if they affect gameplay, I think 17:26:59 dpeg: haha 17:27:23 elliptic: exactly. But just with messages we can create so much flavour, and also make the world more consistent. 17:27:29 mumra: would Trog like it when people broke spellbooks to free up slots? 17:27:32 mumra: i would like to see trog just reject you if you know spells. or he tries to kill you. 17:27:48 or does he prefer people to set them on fire? 17:28:03 (whatever happened to that burn-bookshop idea?) 17:28:04 Zannick: this is _not_ about rejection or any god killing the player, see elliptic's comment. 17:28:18 dpeg: no, i realize that 17:28:25 elliptic: perhaps, but it could in a fun way if the conducts are obvious; you could intentionally annoy sif by destroying every spellbook you find, so you're more likely to encounter sif's wizard minions 17:28:32 (which will be carrying books of their own) 17:28:53 monsters carrying books? 17:29:08 elliptic: that was one suggestion on the wiki 17:29:17 sounds potentially abusable... 17:29:17 elliptic: the DG will fight minions of the gods, who can bring an item as loot. 17:29:36 elliptic: don't worry. All gods get their turn, this is just about the order. 17:29:40 ais523: i don't think under any circumstance a god will *like* a demigod's actions; it's all about how much more they *dislike* you 17:29:50 mumra: oh, I was talking about in general 17:30:08 ais523: if you're a trog follower, destroying books is par for the course 17:30:26 oh i see what you mean. of course trog hates learning spells. 17:30:30 I suppose if this ever does become gameplay-effecty, it might make sense to be able to rip pages out of a book even if you didn't know the matching spell in order to appease Trog wrath or whatever 17:30:38 ais523: nope 17:30:39 dpeg: hm, I hadn't heard the proposal after loot crept in :) but if it just affects order that doesn't sound bad... I was envisioning a line of sif minions all giving out free books ;P 17:30:40 he hates learning spells; but what's his opinion on unmemorizing spells? 17:31:03 a sif library 17:31:04 trog doesn't care about unmemorizing spells 17:31:08 elliptic: if you've had to destroy a ton of books to get that line of minions ... then it's kind of give and take anyway 17:31:29 mumra: not really... lots of junk books out there, especially once you've memorized what you want from them 17:32:16 elliptic: the idea is that DG have a minor conduct (this is the only gameplay aspect of my proposal): if you do heroic (cowardly) things like killing uniques instead of running from them, getting runes, the number of worshippers grows. Gods send minion to show your place, and you may get items from this. 17:33:04 the idea being that the reward for DG is that god minions drop corpses/exp/equipment as a reward for beating them, as a reward for doing the things that made them turn up in the first place 17:33:27 mumra: it is good flavour if a caster gets Trog's minion first ("Kill the caster, [name]!"), but after that, all gods will send someone. 17:33:51 For example, because the DG might want a book instead of an axe :) 17:34:38 dpeg: we should work on getting these priestly types for all gods in the game - we have no sifites right now, for example. good flavor even if DG proposal isn't ready 17:34:52 I don't see why Trog's minions necessarily wouldn't have books 17:34:57 huh? 17:34:57 that they were using as grenades 17:35:01 no no 17:35:11 Trog followers typically carry around books for the purpose of setting them on fire 17:35:13 why wouldn't minions? 17:35:21 too much code 17:35:39 This is a minor aspect of the game, no need to simulate everything. 17:36:14 Also, a true worshipper of Trog burns books on sight. 17:36:32 hmm, I tend to favour player/monster symmetry because it helps to avoid spoilers 17:36:37 you don't have to learn the rules both ways round 17:36:42 but I suppose that's relatively minor 17:36:43 I typically only keep one or two book grenades ever 17:37:04 who cares if the minion just happens to have no book? That's not really asymmetric. 17:37:31 the trog minion can have good loot without it being a book 17:37:41 Is Nethack particularly symmetric? (I don't know.) 17:38:06 Smaller Brand / Ego Icons (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=4527) by ontoclasm 17:38:06 Zannick: yes, weapon, armour and perhaps a non-standard armour item. 17:38:07 nethack is not very symmetric, i think 17:43:56 -!- dpeg has quit [Quit: zzz] 17:45:22 Zannick: indeed, it isn't 17:45:46 dpeg: NetHack tries to look symmetric (and AceHack does even more so), but it really isn't behind the scenes 17:45:56 if it were, it'd probably be about a quarter of the code 17:46:09 and implementing multiplayer wouldn't be so painfully ugly 17:46:12 (make that a third) 17:47:54 hmm, symmetry would mean that monsters have to dip potions into fountains to id them 17:48:02 that would be extremely ugly 17:48:33 only if they didn't know them already 17:49:16 exactly; each monster would need to track which potions it knew, and make intelligent decisions regarding quaff id vs other methods 17:49:25 i don't see how that would be less code ;) 17:57:42 -!- galehar has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:07:29 -!- Textmode has joined ##crawl-dev 18:08:54 -!- syllogism has quit [] 18:29:06 -!- hoody_ has joined ##crawl-dev 18:33:49 -!- cesium has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 18:36:08 03MarvinPA 07demons * rf7dde33c0ab2 10/crawl-ref/source/ (7 files in 4 dirs): Upgrade Shadow demons to 2, give them some summoning spells 18:36:09 03MarvinPA * r506fcf92ad72 10/crawl-ref/source/ (25 files in 5 dirs): Merge branch 'demons' 18:36:37 yay 18:36:40 now make gretell update 18:36:44 oh 18:36:45 I can do that 18:40:01 updating :D 18:40:21 yaaay fail 18:40:29 monster-main.cc: In function ‘std::string colour(int, std::string, bool)’: 18:40:32 monster-main.cc:89: error: ‘is_element_colour’ was not declared in this scope 18:40:35 monster-main.cc: In function ‘std::string monster_symbol(const monster&)’: 18:40:38 monster-main.cc:403: error: ‘const struct monsterentry’ has no member named ‘showchar’ 18:40:41 monster-main.cc: In function ‘int main(int, char**)’: 18:40:44 monster-main.cc:901: error: ‘CE_HCL’ was not declared in this scope 18:40:44 did something change significantly in trunk recently to break gretell? 18:40:47 make: *** [monster-main.o] Error 1 18:40:55 CE_HCL changed 18:40:59 in that it doesn't exist anymore :P 18:41:02 ah 18:41:02 it's renamed to CE_ROT 18:42:14 and is_element_colour is gone? 18:43:51 ah, it's now static. 18:44:00 we need that! 18:46:14 Napkin: what is the license of gretell-monster anyway? I'm thinking we could possibly think of merging it into the main codebase. 18:46:30 which would prevent it from decaying as quickly 18:48:11 * due copies that functionn into monster. 18:48:13 brb 18:55:06 okay, a relatively straightforward fix 19:00:32 -!- ainsophyao has joined ##crawl-dev 19:00:35 -!- ais523 has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:02:32 -!- ncampion has joined ##crawl-dev 19:13:02 -!- hoody_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:17:40 -!- Pingas has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:24:23 -!- BlastHardcheese has joined ##crawl-dev 19:35:29 i've got most demigod conducts 19:35:40 does anyone know how i could tell when a new branch has been entered? 19:37:10 mumra: like, when you've successfully moved to a new branch? git branch -l 19:37:22 no, not git 19:37:31 i mean, when the player has entered a branch for the first time 19:37:40 mumra: it makes a milestone... just go find where that is called 19:37:46 you could create an eevent 19:37:51 wich would allow you to hook a function in somewhere 19:39:03 other conducts just call did_god_conduct when something happens ... i think the milestone would be easiest 19:41:59 mumra: grep br.enter, you want the one in notes.cc probably 19:43:22 elliptic: thanks, found it already 19:43:55 cheers for the pointer 19:58:39 @??shadow demon 19:58:39 shadow demon (062) | Speed: 11 | HD: 10 | Health: 36-72 | AC/EV: 7/12 | Damage: 21 | Flags: 05demonic, see invisible, !sil | Res: 06magic(93), 02cold++, 03poison, 04rot, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 728 | Sp: shadow creatures, demon. 19:58:56 Gretell is updated to the latest trunk! 20:07:16 -!- ixtli has joined ##crawl-dev 20:14:16 Was CE_HCL gone in master too? 20:15:07 Ah. 20:15:10 0.9, rather. 20:15:56 elliptic: Seems to be compiling 0.9 for @? :) 20:16:07 :) 20:17:49 Napkin: ping 20:20:02 @?shadow demon 20:20:03 shadow demon (063) | Speed: 11 | HD: 6 | Health: 21-45 | AC/EV: 7/12 | Damage: 21 | Flags: 05demonic, see invisible | Res: 06magic(56), 02cold++, 03poison, 04rot, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 198. 20:20:04 @??shadow demon 20:20:05 shadow demon (062) | Speed: 11 | HD: 10 | Health: 36-72 | AC/EV: 7/12 | Damage: 21 | Flags: 05demonic, see invisible, !sil | Res: 06magic(93), 02cold++, 03poison, 04rot, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 728 | Sp: shadow creatures, demon. 20:20:08 @?ignacio 20:20:09 Ignacio (131) | Speed: 20 | HD: 18 | Health: 250 | AC/EV: 10/15 | Damage: 30, 15, 15 | Flags: 05demonic, evil, see invisible, !sil | Res: 06magic(216), 05fire, 02cold, 10elec, 03poison, 04rot, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 15000 | Sp: agony, pain (d17), haste, torment symbol. 20:20:10 @??ignacio 20:20:11 Ignacio (131) | Speed: 20 | HD: 18 | Health: 250 | AC/EV: 10/15 | Damage: 20, 10, 10, 5 | Flags: 05demonic, evil, see invisible, !sil | Res: 06magic(216), 05fire, 02cold, 10elec, 03poison, 04rot, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 15000 | Sp: agony, pain (d17), haste. 20:21:01 due: great, you are the best :) 20:21:10 elliptic: :) 20:21:13 -!- hoody_ has joined ##crawl-dev 20:24:03 @?ignacio 20:24:03 Ignacio (131) | Speed: 20 | HD: 18 | Health: 250 | AC/EV: 10/15 | Damage: 30, 15, 15 | Flags: 05demonic, evil, see invisible, !sil | Res: 06magic(216), 05fire, 02cold, 10elec, 03poison, 04rot, 13neg+++, 13torm | Vul: 08holy++ | XP: 15000 | Sp: agony, pain (d17), haste, torment symbol. 20:24:07 Okay, just double checking. 20:26:19 @??profane servitor 20:26:19 profane servitor (05A) | Speed: 15 | HD: 18 | Health: 133-174 | AC/EV: 10/20 | Damage: 2505(vampiric), 1013(drain) | Flags: 07undead, evil, see invisible, fly | Res: 06magic(192), 02cold, 10elec++, 03poison, 12drown, 04rot+++, 13neg+++, 08holy, 13torm | XP: 5585. 20:26:20 @??angel 20:26:21 Angel (16A) | Speed: 15 | HD: 12 | Health: 84-119 | AC/EV: 10/20 | Damage: 25, 10 | Flags: 08holy, see invisible, fly, !sil | Res: 06magic(128), 10elec++, 03poison, 04rot, 13neg+++, 08holy | XP: 2087 | Sp: minor healing. 20:27:31 @??mennas 20:27:32 Mennas (15A) | Speed: 15 | HD: 19 | Health: 150 | AC/EV: 15/28 | Damage: 30, 20 | Flags: 08holy, spellcaster, see invisible, fly | Res: 06magic(202), 10elec++, 03poison, 04rot, 13neg+++, 08holy | XP: 6578 | Sp: confuse, silence, minor healing. 20:28:00 so yeah i guess they aren't as far off from mennas as i thought 20:28:51 !tell Napkin I've updated @? to point to 0.9 and @?? to poin tto currnet trunk. So ther'es now a new branch in monster for dcss09. bleeding-edge-crawl is updated for current trunk. there's no push/pull target set up so I haven't been able to push; can you push them through? also, I added a README for other people 20:28:51 Maximum message length is 300 characters. Eschew verbosity, Gladys! 20:28:57 ESCHEW ANNOYANCE HENZELL. 20:29:03 !tell Napkin I've updated @? to point to 0.9 and @?? to poin tto currnet trunk. So ther'es now a new branch in monster for dcss09. bleeding-edge-crawl is updated for current trunk. there's no push/pull target set up so I haven't been able to push; can you push them through? 20:29:03 due: OK, I'll let Napkin know. 20:45:03 -!- hoody_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:51:40 -!- valrus has joined ##crawl-dev 20:54:04 -!- ZChris13 has joined ##crawl-dev 20:58:16 -!- hoody_ has joined ##crawl-dev 21:00:02 -!- hoody_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:07:47 -!- Mu_ has quit [Quit: Defecator, may everything turn out okay so that you can leave this place.] 21:16:01 -!- Wensley has joined ##crawl-dev 21:19:14 -!- hoody_ has joined ##crawl-dev 21:19:55 -!- valrus has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:20:19 -!- valrus has joined ##crawl-dev 21:25:13 -!- valrus has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:31:31 -!- hoody_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:37:16 moin 21:37:16 Napkin: You have 2 messages. Use !messages to read them. 21:37:41 well, not sure.. we should probably clean-up the monster repository 21:38:30 and name the branches similar to crawl 21:39:55 Napkin: hello! just wake up? 21:41:25 -!- valrus has joined ##crawl-dev 21:41:35 -!- Textmode has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 21:44:01 -!- purge has quit [Quit: .] 21:44:50 -!- valrus has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:46:16 trying to, Wensley ;) 21:46:57 hi 21:47:05 Napkin: yes, that would be a good idea 21:47:26 Napkin: are you okay with me pulling it from the repo on CDO and merging it into standard crawl git as a branch? 21:47:39 which removes any issues with submodules, etc 21:47:49 i suppose it depends on licensing 21:48:28 oh.. but if you take it into standard crawl repo, i can no longer do changes 21:48:42 well, yo ucan 21:48:51 I can pull from CDO and merge them in :) 21:49:05 nah, let's not duplicate 21:49:32 ok 21:49:39 btw, why do i have voice in here? 21:49:45 I'm not sure 21:49:53 wondered about that recently 21:50:54 I can remove it if you want? 21:51:46 -!- Napkin has left ##crawl-dev 21:51:46 -!- Napkin has joined ##crawl-dev 21:53:57 not too important ;) 21:54:24 btw, you have read/write permission to ssh://git@git.develz.org/monster.git 21:54:46 awesmoe thanks :) 21:54:46 but you did the changes as user crawl@cdo, huh? 21:54:54 I did it on CDO but I changed the --author 21:54:57 oh, it was already in place, i didn't change it 21:55:25 * due nod 21:55:33 it was easier to tweak on CDO and recmopile than trying to do it locally 21:55:34 i need coffee first! 21:55:39 I've also started work on an update script 21:55:54 great 21:56:08 would be really useful for the knowledge bots website :) 21:56:24 i suggest, we branch current master to 0.8 21:56:57 then merge bleeding-edge and the changes you did to 0.9 and name it 0.9 21:57:02 good idea 21:57:08 and use master for trunk/master of crawl 21:57:16 dcss06 can probably go, too 21:57:17 and remove the bleeding-edge afterwards? 21:57:27 sounds good! 21:57:51 would you like to do it? i'm still waking up and you seem eager :) 22:00:07 hehe, i'll try! 22:00:15 i'm editing text at the minute though 22:01:04 sure, no hurry 22:01:23 -!- Wensley has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:17:53 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 22:18:33 -!- elliptic has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 22:35:19 -!- Textmode has joined ##crawl-dev 22:37:16 !tell dpeg Demigods - easy bit is done. Written up the rest on wiki; needs some gaps filling in... 22:37:16 mumra: OK, I'll let dpeg know. 22:47:02 -!- Kek has joined ##crawl-dev 22:48:05 i coded an auto-offering option for crawl.. anyone can guide me towards contributing it? 22:48:41 for uploading patches, we use the mantis bug tracker, kek 22:48:56 to make it more public, you could additionally write about it in the wiki or the tavern 22:50:03 ok, so ill have to create an account? 22:50:24 yes, but the mantis account is valid for all three services 22:50:37 so, at least you need to register only once 22:52:32 well at leasst that.. also, i coded at 0.7.1 (easier to fetch source from debian stable), is this a major issue? 22:53:05 depending on what changes you did, it might be 22:53:28 but should be able to port your changes to current dev version quite easily 22:53:52 um, 0.7.1 is two major versions ago :) 22:53:54 just run git clone git://gitorious.org/crawl/crawl.git 22:54:04 so yes, please try merging your changes into our currnet trunk before submitting 22:54:15 (as you know what you want it to do, and can therefore better judge if it worked) 22:55:26 afterwards apply your patched, then do a "git commit -a", then a "git format-patch -1" should provide you with a valid, cleanly applying patch file 22:58:55 i really didnt wanna spend much time w/ that.. tehre are few changes, would i be too unkind to just post a patch for 0.7? also im not a c++ dev, so it would be nice anyway to have a reivew 23:00:03 you can try - but you know how it.. people are less willing to check out a modification, that won't work with the current version 23:00:10 *how it is 23:03:44 hmm. is there a screen that normally shows which gods you're under penance with? 23:04:33 Kek: not unkind, but the chances of someone sitting down to make it work with currnt code is very low 23:07:28 ctrl-o 23:08:42 it shows penance too now? 23:09:50 if ctrl-o is supposed to - then it's either a bug or a feature of my demigod patch 23:10:15 because right now i'm under penance from nearly every god, but none of the screens say anything 23:10:45 but i'm not too sure how much information it's good to give away anyway ... 23:11:38 -!- ainsophyao has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:15:40 didnt want to create an acc nor, specifically, have 2 versions on my box. not planning to code a lot. i understand 100%, but crawl could have an email for contribs or somehing :) 23:19:11 btw, is there anyway to prevent "loading maps" after every recompile? 23:19:42 no; map defs have to also be recompiled when crawl starts, to check syntax 23:28:05 -!- valrus has joined ##crawl-dev 23:29:50 Guten MOrgen! 23:30:52 morning :) 23:32:18 -!- Kek has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 23:41:27 -!- monqy has quit [Quit: hello] 23:46:23 -!- st_ has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:56:35 -!- dtsund has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 23:59:44 -!- dtsund has joined ##crawl-dev