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00:03:20 <Gretell> Pre-release branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.9-rc1-6-gc780f77 (32)
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00:14:53 <Henzell> Unstable branch on crawl.akrasiac.org updated to: 0.10-a0-221-g319ca4e (32)
00:18:46 <Gretell> Windows builds of pre-release branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.9-rc1-6-gc780f77
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01:44:54 <Henzell> BirdoPrey the Grappler (L14 TrTm) ASSERT(t != NON_ENTITY && t < MAX_SHOPS) in 'shopping.cc' at line 2085 failed on turn 26137. (Abyss)
01:45:00 <Henzell> BirdoPrey the Grappler (L14 TrTm) ASSERT(t != NON_ENTITY && t < MAX_SHOPS) in 'shopping.cc' at line 2085 failed on turn 26137. (Abyss)
01:45:04 <Henzell> BirdoPrey the Grappler (L14 TrTm) ASSERT(t != NON_ENTITY && t < MAX_SHOPS) in 'shopping.cc' at line 2085 failed on turn 26137. (Abyss)
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02:37:41 <ortoslon> does spell_slot affect spell tab display in tiles?
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02:39:12 <galehar> no it doesn't
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02:58:38 <Ashenzari> MP minibar is hard to read (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=4385) by ortoslon
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03:08:32 <kilobyte> hrmblah, beautiful: Napkin says he'll be able to do this Tuesday.
03:11:58 <galehar> do what?
03:12:17 <kilobyte> install 0.9
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03:12:48 <kilobyte> I'll mail greensnark WITH ALL CAPS then
03:13:08 * kilobyte sniffs Zaba.  Meow?
03:13:35 <Zaba> moin?
03:13:54 <galehar> elliptic said tournament scripts can work with 0.9-trunk. So I guess it means that tournament will be console only until tuesday.
03:14:22 <cbus> do tiles get any benefits?
03:14:27 <cbus> they used to :)
03:14:44 <galehar> what?
03:14:57 <elliptic> galehar: CAO still needs 0.9 though
03:15:26 <galehar> right
03:15:40 <bhaak> don't despair, a tournament can be successful even if not everything is perfect. junethack doesn't even track everything it claims it tracks on the website and it ends on sunday :)
03:16:52 <Zaba> kilobyte, yes?
03:18:30 <kilobyte> Zaba: nothing, just saw you connect in a way that seemed to be manual
03:18:56 <Zaba> ah, well, I've just triggered a reconnect when I figured my connection is broken.
03:19:10 <Zaba> and I also happen to be awake ;p
03:20:53 <kilobyte> saying "meow" in place of "hi" indeed loses some information :p
03:22:07 <Zaba> so hm... still so many crash bugs in pre-0.9
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03:24:05 <Zaba> I forget, what username/password does one need to enter when downloading save backups from cao?
03:24:58 <due> I think it's your dgl info?
03:26:43 <kilobyte> no, I checked that already
03:27:59 <Zaba> I tried, but it didn't let me in
03:28:18 <due> oh hm
03:28:52 <Zaba> (I'm trying to get a save from #4378)
03:29:32 <galehar> yeah, couldn't get it either
03:47:09 <galehar> so, how about using } to show runes? This obscure command currently show current/primary/secondary/firing. Let's remap it to "|" ("_" is also available)
03:48:17 <kilobyte> could work
03:50:31 <CIA-34> 03kilobyte * r06e48cddf12c 10/crawl-ref/source/tilemcache.h: Repair saves with bad saved mcache values.
03:53:43 <galehar> hmm. _ and | are already used actually :(
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03:57:36 <galehar> / is free
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04:03:59 <Letchik1> hey guys.
04:03:59 <Letchik1> I have an idea how to improve webtiles user-friendliness
04:05:42 <cbus> any plans on making webtiles able to handle tiles that are ascii?
04:05:43 <cbus> :)
04:05:48 <kilobyte> upgrade it to console! (*duck*)
04:05:59 <cbus> kilobyte, yeah!
04:05:59 <kilobyte> cbus: p
04:06:00 <Letchik1> If i have more than 1 computer and if I left webtiles opened on 1, i won't be able to open it on another until i close 1st
04:06:00 <Letchik1> Pls make it so that if I open webtiles on 2nd computer, the 1st one just gets error and I can play without need to close the tab on 1st
04:06:02 <cbus> its an upgrade :)
04:06:31 <Letchik1> This system is used in most messengers, in steam, jabber and in everything
04:06:50 <cbus> kilobyte, you used to be able to do that in nethack tiles
04:06:50 <cbus> btw
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04:26:56 <Wah> Letchik1: There are huge differences between things on the web and standalone applications, you know that right?
04:27:07 <Letchik1> Wah: yep
04:31:30 <ais523> hmm, NetHack typically deletes the old savefile and starts again in that situation, but dgamelaunch (possibly just the NAO version of it) attempts to cause the first session to save so that the second session can load it
04:31:32 <ais523> I'm not sure what CAO does
04:31:42 <ais523> but if NAO can do that, so can CAO; and if CAO can do it, presumably webtiles can again
04:31:50 <ais523> webtiles can also
04:32:01 <ais523> as the technique doesn't seem to have much to do with the actual roguelike
04:33:33 <galehar> '/' isn't free. It's used to emulate ctrl. So that leaves ^m and ^v
04:34:22 <ghallberg> Is it possible to bind backspace to something?
04:34:45 <galehar> ais523: deleting your save because you left the game running on another computer doesn't sound very nice
04:35:03 <ghallberg> Because ^H is interpreted as backspace, which makes removing traps behave wierd.
04:35:04 <galehar> ghallberg: yeah, should be possible
04:35:06 <ais523> well, it asks you whether you should or not
04:35:16 <ais523> but yes, most people think it isn't a very sensible recovery mechanism
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04:35:35 <ghallberg> I was under the impression that crawl saves automatically when it's closed?
04:36:07 <ghallberg> I guess CAO could just forcibly tell the old process to shutdown and then start a new one
04:37:40 <kilobyte> this is what console does
04:37:49 <kilobyte> (asking first)
04:40:54 <ghallberg> Ok, cool. guess it should be doable in webtiles too then, maybe add an issue to mantis?
04:42:09 <monqy> I'm not positive, but when I'm observing games, and someone starts a second session, the message seems to indicate that something sent it SIGHUP, so yeah it is the same behavior as when the terminal is closed???
04:43:08 <monqy> which causes it to save, and then the new session uses that save, I guess
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04:48:41 <monqy> and I don't see any reason why webtiles wouldn't be able to do the same thing (though this may just be due to my complete lack of knowledge on how the webtiles server works)
04:48:51 <monqy> oh and the webtiles client too
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04:49:26 <monqy> I guess what I'm saying is it generally seems viable, so unless something is really crazy there, I think it should work?
04:50:06 <ghallberg> I'm in the same boat as you, never lookd at webtiles or CAO-code but it seems doable.
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05:04:10 <Vbitz> i'm trying to setup webtiles on a lan and my when i try to register it keeps saying my websockets connection was closed
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05:11:52 <Vbitz> i have checked opera, firefox and google chrome, all atleast latest
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05:12:28 -!- The topic of ##crawl-dev is: DCSS Development | Logs: http://tozt.net/crawl | People with +v have commit access. | Please keep general crawl-related chit-chat to ##crawl. | Dev wiki: http://crawl.develz.org/wiki | Long stuff to pastebin.ca please | Immortal Warwalrus and Crazy Yiuf forever.
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05:44:37 <Vbitz> any help at all
05:45:29 <monqy> maybe edlothiol would know?
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05:48:00 <Zaba> yeah, he would
05:48:23 <Zaba> edlothiol, hey, Vbitz has a webtiles question
05:48:30 <edlothiol> VBitz: it says that when you try to register, or immediately when you try to connect?
05:48:43 <Vbitz> when i try to register
05:49:17 <edlothiol> ah, you probably need to set up a user database
05:49:34 <Vbitz> how would i do that?
05:50:09 <Vbitz> the passwd db is fine, i think
05:50:37 <edlothiol> it would be a sqlite3 database with one table dglusers with columns username, email, password, flags, env
05:52:26 <edlothiol> sqlite3 webserver/passwd.db3
05:52:57 <Vbitz> i have tried .tables and nothing
05:53:21 <edlothiol> create table dglusers(username varchar(20), email varchar(20), password varchar(20), flags smallint, env varchar(10))
05:53:49 <Zaba> don't forget a semicolor at the end
05:53:53 <Zaba> semicolon*
05:59:06 <edlothiol> yeah
05:59:07 <Vbitz> alight i can now login but i can not connect to a game
05:59:07 <Vbitz> i have checked and crawl is running
05:59:07 <edlothiol> what does it say? and what does the webtiles.log say?
05:59:07 <Vbitz> nothing
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06:00:10 -!- The topic of ##crawl-dev is: DCSS Development | Logs: http://tozt.net/crawl | People with +v have commit access. | Please keep general crawl-related chit-chat to ##crawl. | Dev wiki: http://crawl.develz.org/wiki | Long stuff to pastebin.ca please | Immortal Warwalrus and Crazy Yiuf forever.
06:02:31 <edlothiol> do you get any javascript errors (check ctrl+shift+J in chrome)?
06:02:59 <ais523> same key combo in Firefox, IIRC
06:03:23 <Vbitz> loads of errors
06:03:57 <edlothiol> such as?
06:04:58 <Vbitz> this is the version it is using 0.10-a0-216-g265c843
06:05:15 <Vbitz> this is right off git
06:06:05 <Vbitz> but errors such as Error in message: [?1051l[?1052l[?1060l[?1061h[?1049h(B[?7h[?1h=[?25l(BHello, welcome to Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup 0.10-a0-216-g265c843! - SyntaxError: at index 0: unexpected character: U+001B
06:06:05 <Vbitz> console.assert
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06:06:23 <edlothiol> ok, you need to compile with WEBTILES=y
06:06:39 <Vbitz> so just make WEBTILES=y
06:06:45 <edlothiol> exactly
06:09:42 <edlothiol> oh, and if you still want to have user registration, you probably need to change dgl_mode to True in config.py
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07:08:54 <due> edlothiol: boo.
07:10:06 <edlothiol> due: er, ok ;)
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07:48:28 <due> galehar: thanks for the email!
07:48:34 * due off to bed, will deal with it tomorrow.
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08:16:12 <CIA-34> 03galehar * r3e97dfd541d8 10/crawl-ref/source/shopping.cc: Don't show unknown for artefacts in shop (#4384).
08:16:23 <CIA-34> 03galehar * r875129a2f91a 10/crawl-ref/ (10 files in 2 dirs): Add a new "show runes" command: "}"
08:16:23 <CIA-34> 03galehar * r604a43a1c2ac 10/crawl-ref/source/shopping.cc: Formatting fix.
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08:32:41 <galehar> !seen rax
08:32:42 <Henzell> I last saw rax at Thu Aug 11 19:32:02 2011 UTC (18h 40s ago) saying Nistenf: Messaging rax works. on ##crawl.
08:32:55 <galehar> rax: around?
08:34:26 <rax> Yo.
08:34:33 <galehar> what kind of credential you have on CAO? Can you create account? Can you give rights?
08:34:45 <rax> Uh, it's my box :)
08:34:57 <galehar> cool
08:36:38 <ais523> rax: are you both the server's sysadmin and the dgamelaunch admin? at least on some setups, the two are different people
08:37:30 <galehar> How can I download save files on CAO?
08:38:30 <galehar> Maybe you should give admin rights to some devs so they can install 0.9 for the tournament too.
08:38:57 <galehar> kilboyte do you know how to install it if you have rights?
08:39:03 <rax> galehar: I have given admin rights to greensnark and Napkin; I'm generally not comfortable handing out root to folks who I don't know well.
08:39:22 <rax> ais523: I used to be both, but now am just the sysadmin; greensnark's done all the crawl stuff for a while.
08:39:32 <ais523> hmm, makes sense
08:39:41 <rax> I would not mind sharing a terminal and getting help from folks to install 0.9, as I have said here like five times. ;)
08:40:08 <rax> I can get you a particular save file if you need it. I ahve no idea how greensnark's savefile widget works.
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08:40:54 <galehar> rax: but greensnark is really active anymore, and Nakin is a bit less available too. So maybe it would be convenient to give some rights to someone more availabe. Not admin, just enough to install crawl and maintain it.
08:41:14 <rax> galehar: Which requires root. :)
08:41:26 <ais523> because setting up a chroot requires root, presumably
08:41:39 <galehar> oh ok then
08:41:42 <rax> Which I know, because it's my server, and I set it up. I'd be happy to take more of an active role, if I could get some instruction or a manual or something.
08:42:02 <galehar> i don't really know dgamelaunch, I just assumed there was some way to sudo it somehow.
08:42:34 <galehar> oh, if you want to learn and admin it yourself, that's good too :)
08:42:45 <ais523> you can set up sudo to only be able to run particular commands, but it's incredibly hard not to leave loopholes in that
08:42:48 <rax> I mean it's a computer, it's turing-complete, I could probably do something Complicated to give exactly the right set of sudo rights, but that seems fragile and also full of effort.
08:42:49 <galehar> I'd teach you right away if I knew how :P
08:43:02 <rax> galehar: A lot of people say that! I think the problem is the low bus factor.
08:43:31 <kilobyte> any updates other than setting up a new branch don't need root anymore
08:43:41 <rax> What I really want is a manual --- if that existed, the backup folks who have CAO access (iainuki and violetj) could both step in in a pinch too. Right now they have root in case I get hit by a bus or something, God forbid, but other than that...
08:43:48 <rax> kilobyte: How do the new binaries get into the chroot?
08:43:50 <kilobyte> and new branches _might_ not need root too
08:44:14 <kilobyte> rax: there's a setuid script which carts them over
08:44:24 <ais523> well, a chroot from the outside can be changed very easily
08:44:29 <ais523> the issue is escaping from inside
08:44:36 <kilobyte> yeah
08:44:40 <galehar> if any new instruction needs to be written, then it should go right into docs/develop/release.txt
08:45:08 <ais523> (escaping's easy if you have root access, but meant to be impossible otherwise)
08:45:11 <rax> I'm a little nervous about "how to change things on my server" being public docs.
08:45:26 <rax> kilobyte: Cool.
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08:45:56 <kilobyte> ais523: not really, chroots are for building stuff or messing with emulation, they don't provide isolation
08:46:12 <ais523> kilobyte: they only provide filesystem emulation, which is normally not enough
08:46:18 <ais523> but it certainly helps
08:46:23 <ais523> *filesystem isolation
08:46:41 <rax> (for example, I have instructions on how to change passwords on my system saved, and while I think they should be handed out to folks who might need them, I don't think it's a good idea to advertise where the CAO password db is)
08:46:48 <kilobyte> ais523: for the latter, there's vserver, lxc, openvz, BSD jails / Solaris containers (OS-level) -- and heavy-weight virtualisation like xen or kvm
08:46:54 <galehar> rax: the documentation is about "how to install crawl on some server", not specific to CAO :P
08:47:09 <rax> galehar: Well, that is fine. :) But that is not the documentation I need.
08:47:11 <ais523> kilobyte: I've actually been writing something similar myself
08:47:19 <rax> I need to know what the heck greensnark did so I don't break it. ;)
08:47:24 <kilobyte> galehar: generic DGL docs are already public, but greensnark's scripts work differently
08:47:34 <ais523> on Linux, you can do tricks like putting everything in a separate mount namespace, so that the filesystems everything else is stored on aren't accessible without mknod
08:47:49 <galehar> and who knows about those scripts besits him and Napkin?
08:48:03 <rax> kilobyte seems to have at least some idea. Other than that, I don't know.
08:48:06 <kilobyte> no one I know
08:48:08 <rax> That's why I want docs for them. :P
08:48:17 <ais523> although you need to separate the PID namespace too to prevent open files being accessible via /proc
08:48:38 <kilobyte> I mailed greensnark again, with caps lock stuck, but no answer
08:48:46 <rax> Like, if the goal is just "get an 0.9 build running on CAO," I can do that, with a little help for whatever mistakes I make in trying to figure out the newfangled build process, and that's no big deal.
08:49:03 <kilobyte> ais523: yeah, you're describing vserver and lxc :p
08:49:21 <galehar> what's running on CDO? The same scripts?
08:49:22 <rax> But I don't know how to play along with what's already there. I'm pretty sure I can at least not step on it, but greensnark will have to fix it into autobuilds when he gets back, because that part I don't know how to do.
08:49:26 <kilobyte> galehar: yup
08:49:41 <galehar> and Napkin set them up, right?
08:49:45 <rax> And unfortunately I don't think anyone has access to CDO except Napkin and greensnark.
08:49:55 <kilobyte> what if you'd copy the 0.8 scripts and sed s/0.8/0.9/?
08:50:19 <rax> That's the sort of thing I would try if I had a non-production box to test on.
08:50:26 <ais523> they might end up stepping on each other
08:50:32 <rax> But on the running server, makes me a little nervous. Would worry that they ==ais523
08:50:34 <ais523> if you tried to leave them both there at once
08:51:28 <galehar> kilobyte: do you know anything about the scripts? Like where they are?
08:51:31 <ais523> hmm, and this is why I have more confidence in CAO than in ASI (one of the AceHack servers, with a rather incautious admin)
08:52:21 <rax> ais523: Oh don't get me wrong, I'm a terrible sysadmin, my only virtue is that I know I am terrible.
08:53:42 <rax> So, while we are hoping for greensnark to swoop out of the sky, is 0.9 actually ready?
08:53:45 <ais523> well, you know not to mess with production software unless you know what you're doing
08:53:59 <rax> ais523: That seems like a necessary life skill :)
08:54:05 <ais523> indeed
08:54:06 <kilobyte> galehar: the automated version is in git somewhere but no idea where
08:54:22 <kilobyte> hmm, there's probably a clone on CAO :p
08:54:26 <rax> because if 0.9 is done, I could just get help with git, build it, and install it the old way.
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08:54:52 <kilobyte> I checked CDO, it's not in the public repository, but it's not like you can hide stuff on CAO from rax
08:54:56 <kerio> anything ais523 said about me is false
08:54:57 <edlothiol> kilobyte: do you mean https://github.com/greensnark/dgamelaunch-config ?
08:55:09 <Adeon> kerio: you were never mentioned! at least not by name
08:55:13 <Adeon> kerio: but now you blew it
08:55:23 <ais523> bhaak: way to troll ##crawl-dev remotely
08:55:28 <kerio> well, it was false anyway
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08:56:17 * bhaak swivels the gun round his finger and blows the smoke off
08:56:54 <kerio> somehow i think bhaak used me
08:57:15 <kerio> meh
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08:57:53 <rax> In terms of time limits: At 1 PM my time, which is in six hours, I go to the airport to pick up my girlfriend. So I'm gonna care about y'all a lot less. So if you want me to install 0.9, we should probably do it soon. :)
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08:58:39 <ais523> I can help with git, but don't know much about dgamelaunch, and only know how to compile Crawl in the abstract (I do it myself, but don't tweak it for servers or anything like that)
08:59:17 <rax> I can deal with the server build options, worst case with trial and error, and dgamelaunch has a new version but I more or less understand the config.
08:59:48 <paxed> rax: and i might be able to help with dgl.
08:59:57 <galehar> rax: I can't help you install crawl, I don't know how to.
09:00:00 <galehar> Maybe kb can figure it out.
09:00:21 <ais523> galehar: aren't you a dev?
09:00:30 <ais523> or at least code-writer?
09:00:38 <galehar> rax: I am, but I don't know about dgamelaunch :P
09:00:41 <ais523> I assumed you'd need to be able to compile Crawl in order to test coding
09:01:02 <galehar> I know how to compile and run it locally
09:01:15 <kilobyte> hrm, the repository edlothiol pointed to doesn't seem to have a means of adding a new branch
09:01:22 <galehar> but setting up dgamelaunch is different
09:01:22 <rax> paxed: Is /etc/dgamelaunch.conf still the file of art? There's an /etc/dgamelaunch.conf.newdglconf that's a symlink to something in greensnark's scripts, but it was modified less recently. ...I guess I could also just check and see how dgl is invoked
09:01:30 <rax> Unless it's daemonized these days?
09:01:53 <rax> Nope, still invoked through inetd.conf, and doesn't point to any special file.
09:02:02 <rax> So unless there's a build-time option, it's /etc/dgamelaunch.conf
09:02:14 <paxed> rax: right, then there's a compile-time option ...
09:02:33 <paxed> which defaults to that.
09:02:36 <galehar> rax: do you know how to give some rights? I'd like to be able to update CAO, delete buggy versions and download save files.
09:03:19 <rax> galehar: With all due respect, I do not know you from Adam, sorry.
09:03:30 <rax> I am not comfortable handing you an account on my server.
09:04:20 <rax> paxed: The dgl file format got way more complex, and way nicer. :) I think I can figure this out.
09:04:27 <rax> I'm gonna set up a termcast...
09:04:29 <kilobyte> I'm personally really busy in the next couple hours (and shouldn't be sitting here), so if we're to use the manual way, I'd need some help
09:04:45 <kilobyte> galehar: could you make sure the changelog and other docs are up to scratch
09:05:16 <paxed> rax: heh. it should be pretty easy to understand. note that how the menu screens look are now external files
09:05:37 <galehar> kilobyte: not today, but I may have some time tomorrow
09:05:39 <kilobyte> I can't check windows versions from here (my set of fresh Windows virtual machines of various versions, locales and bitness, is at home), but I did check them a few days ago
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09:07:01 <rax> So, to confirm, is 0.9 set? Can I get it from git and install it?
09:07:05 <rax> No one has answered that question.
09:08:09 <kilobyte> the rc -- mostly, there hasn't been many updates since
09:09:00 <kilobyte> I did check portability before, seems to work, so I'll prepare the pdfs and what not and tag it, doing the rest of the release in the evening
09:09:16 <kilobyte> no BSD tiles or Mac anything, that is
09:09:25 <rax> Does the tournament not start this afternoon?
09:09:40 <kilobyte> 2am
09:09:43 <kilobyte> !time
09:09:44 <Henzell> Time: Aug 12, 2011, 02:09:43 PM, UTC. The 2011 tournament starts in 9 hours, 50 minutes and 16 seconds.
09:09:55 <rax> Okay, I didn't know what time zone you were in.
09:10:10 <kilobyte> Windows and Mac builds are not needed for that
09:10:16 <rax> Nine hours! That is cutting things close. :)
09:10:32 <ais523> you're overlapping with our NetHack tournament!
09:10:57 <kilobyte> holy crap, TeX junk (needed for the pdf) is huge
09:11:31 <kilobyte> and I doubt anyone ever reads it
09:13:10 <rax> ...ok so is it possible to do a git checkout of what there is now, and do a practice build, and set up a dgl file aside that I can test against?
09:13:23 <rax> Such that when you are done, I cna run some git command, rebuild, and hopefully be good to go?
09:13:34 <kilobyte> yeah!
09:13:50 <rax> I mean, I really do want to help here. :)
09:14:18 <rax> Okay, I'm termcasting to termcast.org.
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09:15:25 <ais523> ah, now you're there
09:15:30 <ais523> it took me a moment to see
09:15:30 <rax> ttrtail hung :/
09:16:11 <ais523> when termcasting, I like to put a # at the start of the line when typing comments, so that a) the shell doesn't interpret it as a command, and b) NetHack doesn't interpret it as a command
09:16:21 <Ashenzari> Extra % in HUD after quafting ! of experience (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=4386) by argonaut
09:16:24 <ais523> it doesn't work in Crawl, though, even though my fingers keep trying it
09:16:34 <rax> Heh. :)
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09:16:51 <ais523> hmm, it's collapsed again
09:16:52 <rax> Is there a way to get just the 0.9 branch?
09:17:05 <rax> ok maybe I need to rebuild a newer ttrtail
09:17:07 <ais523> you can pull just one branch
09:17:15 <ais523> I don't use ttrtail for termcasting, I use a oneliner sorear wrote
09:17:18 <ais523> let me dig it up for you
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09:17:44 <rax> oh cool
09:17:45 <ais523> script -f >( cat ./ratry_login - | nc -q5 noway.ratry.ru 31337 > /dev/null ) "$@"
09:17:54 <ais523> the file ./ratry_login needs to contain "hello username password"
09:18:00 <ais523> and a newline
09:18:23 <rax> So I just run that and then start doing stuff?
09:18:26 <ais523> yep
09:19:06 <paxed> i can sees you
09:19:07 <rax> ok shazam!
09:19:28 <ais523> yep, it's working
09:19:36 <rax> OK so the thing I most need help with is "git wtf wtf wtf wtf I don't get it."
09:19:40 <rax> In the long term I need to get it.
09:19:51 <rax> In the short term, if you know what I type in to get code that I can work with, that would be boss.
09:20:13 <rax> (I have seriously tried git tutorials like four times and they just bounce off of my head like so many rubber balls)
09:20:27 <paxed> rax: don't worry, same here :)
09:20:43 <rax> "Note: The repository addresses in this section seem to be out of date and should be updated to the gitorious addresses. TBD, after seeing if it works… ;-)" is in the docs
09:20:52 <paxed> i need to google for "svn command-foo is git command-what?" or something every time ;)
09:20:52 <rax> Which means I can't even use those, I think.
09:20:55 <ais523> do you have an existing repo you want to update? or want to start a new one?
09:21:05 <rax> ais523: That is like asking me if I like to ahlkhalkjrhas cats.
09:21:07 <ais523> paxed: git doesn't really work like svn, so I'm not entirely sure that would help well
09:21:10 <rax> I want to build crawl. ;)
09:21:12 <ais523> rax: fair enough
09:21:23 <ais523> do you have a copy of Crawl at the moment that you want to update?
09:21:23 <paxed> ais523: i am aware of it. but like, git reverse?
09:21:40 <ais523> or do you want to start completely from scratch?
09:21:43 <rax> ais523: I would like to start from scratch because I don't want to step on greensnark's stuff.
09:21:48 <ais523> fair enough
09:21:51 <rax> That seems like the safest way to go.
09:22:08 <ais523> to start off, you'll need a copy of the 0.9 branch in Crawl
09:22:15 <rax> Okay, that is what I figured.
09:22:16 <ais523> so you use "git clone -b branchname reponame"
09:22:25 <ais523> now, I need to look up the branch and repo names for Crawl 0.9
09:22:51 <rax> The doc I'm looking at has a branch name but says the repo is wrong.
09:22:52 <ais523> stone_soup-0.9 seems to be the branch name
09:23:26 <edlothiol> repo should be git://gitorious.org/crawl/crawl.git
09:23:44 <ais523> that's probably more up to date than CDO's copy, which is the one I follow
09:23:44 <rax> Unknown switch -b
09:24:12 <ais523> my manual page for git doesn't believe you
09:24:14 <ais523> try --branch
09:24:23 <ais523> and if that doesn't work, try --version, in case it's a really old version
09:24:27 <paxed> old git on the server
09:24:28 <ais523> as in, check git's version
09:24:39 <rax> 1.5.6.5
09:24:43 <ais523> hmm, mine's 1.7.0.4
09:24:52 <ais523> you could check out the whole thing and only focus on the one branch
09:25:03 <ais523> that'll use a little more disk space, but it'll let you build Crawl
09:25:29 <ais523> I'm not sure if that's the best option or not
09:25:29 <rax> How much is a little more? I am actually low.
09:26:20 <ais523> well, git will try to copy the entire history of Crawl, by default
09:26:24 <edlothiol> if you really want to just check out 0.9, you can probably do git init, git fetch (repo) stone_soup-0.9
09:26:34 <ais523> you can use the --depth option to tell it only to pull recent patches
09:26:40 <ais523> edlothiol: ooh, that's a good idea, I think
09:26:53 <ais523> probably init, pull would work better
09:27:06 <rax> So just git init?
09:27:16 <edlothiol> yeah
09:27:19 <ais523> but I'm not sure you can avoid grabbing the history in that case
09:27:35 <ais523> the thing with git, and other DVCSes, is that they assume everyone has the complete history
09:27:37 <edlothiol> I think the fetch should just get the 0.9 branch
09:27:42 <ais523> and the option to grab only partial history seems to be recent
09:27:56 <ais523> the 0.9 branch still has a lot of history behind it, it only diverged from mainline recently
09:27:59 <rax> Well this could be exciting!
09:28:03 <edlothiol> ah yeah, ok
09:28:19 <rax> Looks like it won't hit a gig so that's fine.
09:29:16 <ais523> then after fetch, you merge so that the version you just fetched becomes the "official" version
09:29:16 <ais523> normally people use pull rather than fetch, it automates the process when it can be automated (which is usually)
09:29:43 <rax> So I want my version to be official? What does that mean?
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09:29:59 <ais523> well, it's the version you operate on
09:30:07 <ais523> git fetch doesn't do anything visible to the directory you have
09:30:08 <CIA-34> 03kilobyte 07stone_soup-0.9 * rc6b3ea00df76 10/crawl-ref/docs/changelog.txt: Update the release date for 0.9
09:30:11 <Zaba> "official" is not a git term, though
09:30:21 <ais523> it just fetches a copy of the source, and doesn't do anything with it
09:30:27 <ais523> you need to use git merge to actually put it on your filesystem
09:30:31 <rax> Oh so I have to make a checkout from a local repository?
09:30:40 <rax> That's sort of like svk
09:30:41 <edlothiol> exactly
09:30:41 <ais523> it's more, git can track a number of versions
09:30:48 <Zaba> yes, you need to git checkout
09:30:51 <ais523> git fetch copies it internally to one called FETCH_HEAD
09:31:12 <ais523> and then you need to use merge to put it somewhere more permanent
09:31:20 <edlothiol> I think if you do git fetch (repo) (branch) it merges it automatically?
09:31:23 <edlothiol> maybe not
09:31:33 <ais523> checkout's used to switch between versions, but you don't want to operate directly on FETCH_HEAD
09:31:35 <rax> Well, it didn't put any files anywhere, so.
09:31:35 <ais523> edlothiol: you're thinking of pull
09:32:11 <ais523> I think it's "git merge FETCH_HEAD stone_soup-0.9"
09:32:18 <ais523> not sure if the last argument's needed/useful
09:32:22 <edlothiol> no, but I may have misunderstood the git-fetch man page
09:32:53 <ais523> ah no, I know what's happened
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09:33:08 <ais523> git checkout -b stone_soup-0.9
09:33:10 <edlothiol> git checkout -b stone_soup-0.9 FETCH_HEAD
09:33:20 <ais523> and... ok, you combined them into one command, even better
09:33:39 <ais523> what you need to do is create and switch to a new branch called stone_soup-0.9, then copy FETCH_HEAD into it
09:33:57 <ais523> you can use my command plus an explicit merge, or edlothiol's command, which is probably simpler
09:34:06 <rax> I am on a branch YET TO BE BORN
09:34:15 <ais523> yep, there weren't any yet
09:34:21 <ais523> there is now
09:34:29 <ais523> and hopefully, the files should be there now
09:34:42 <rax> Oooh, awesome.
09:34:54 <rax> OK, so now I have to look at the new build system. :)
09:35:48 <ais523> now, when updating it, you don't generally want to go through all that, but instead to tell it just to fetch and merge the changes, which would be "git pull git://gitorious.org/crawl/crawl.git stone_soup-0.9"
09:36:08 <ais523> git tends not to like you doing that if you've changed anything, though (I consider this a bit of a failure of git)
09:36:13 <rax> ......
09:36:20 <rax> but I have to change things to build :<
09:36:29 <rax> How much does it not like doing that?
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09:37:16 <ais523> what you can do is to tell it to temporarily undo your changes, then do the pull, then tell it to redo the changes again
09:37:25 <rax> So is there a set of commands for that?
09:37:30 <rwbarton> it should be fine as long as none of your changes are to files that got changed upstream also
09:37:38 <ais523> yep, but I can't remember them, I'm just looking them up
09:37:46 <rax> 'Kay. I will keep working on build.
09:37:51 <edlothiol> git stash stashes the current changes
09:38:00 <ais523> git stash save; then do the pull; then git stash pop
09:38:02 <edlothiol> git stash pop gets them back
09:38:46 <rax> Do I want new abyss?
09:39:17 <rwbarton> no
09:39:18 <edlothiol> no, it's disabled for 0.9 as far as I know
09:39:30 <Eronarn> rax: you want lava orcs
09:39:35 <Eronarn> everyone wants lava orcs
09:39:46 <rax> Eronarn: <3
09:39:48 <ais523> Eronarn: I don't think they're stable enough for 0.9 yet
09:39:59 <rwbarton> no =
09:40:00 <ais523> maybe in 0.10
09:40:08 <Eronarn> ais523: they aren't :) probably more like .11 at earliest
09:40:17 <Eronarn> octos will be .10
09:42:08 <rawrmage> hey what are we watching
09:42:19 <rax> Wow this has changed a lot
09:42:37 <ais523> we're watching rax try to update CAO to 0.9 even though the people who actually know how that stuff is meant to work aren't here to help, and the documentation is many versions out of date
09:42:43 <rawrmage> i'll watch that!
09:42:56 <ais523> go on termcast.org
09:42:58 <rawrmage> i am
09:44:24 <rax> work call
09:45:13 <kilobyte> still terribly busy, but just tagged 0.9.0
09:46:09 <rax> okay back for a bit
09:48:01 <kilobyte> could you pull again so the version shows right?
09:48:36 <rax> Sure, let's try those commands from earlier.
09:49:36 <rwbarton> I am not sure that rax's repo has the tag
09:49:43 <rwbarton> due to how he pulled it?
09:49:45 <ais523> that looks like it worked at rax's end, at least
09:49:48 <rwbarton> sorry, she
09:49:52 <ais523> also, rax is female, fix your pronouns
09:49:57 <rax> "whatever"
09:50:34 <ais523> presumably, the only reason the tag is needed is so that Crawl reports its own version as a released 0.9.0 rather than a development version?
09:50:39 <rwbarton> right
09:50:46 <rwbarton> well kilobyte can answer
09:50:57 <rax> Well, let's get this built, and we can always fix that later.
09:51:37 <rawrmage> that didn't work very well
09:51:50 <ais523> it's missing a dependency on lua, it seems
09:52:09 <rax> At least it told me what to do! :)
09:52:09 <ais523> hmm, the git submodule init thing will download the latest source for all of Crawl's dependencies
09:52:16 <ais523> I'm not entirely sure if that's what you want or not
09:52:20 <rwbarton> it's probably easier to install the distro lua libraries
09:53:04 <rax> I'm guessing they are too old; they should already be installed.
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09:53:33 <rwbarton> oh, that could be.
09:53:36 <rax> (you don't even want to know how old some of this machine's software is, it really needs to be burned down and rebuilt)
09:54:48 <ais523> hmm, 0.9.0 is producing build warnings?
09:55:21 <rax> These look familiar actually.
09:55:26 <rax> I remember ignoring these. :P
09:55:57 <rwbarton> there was a comment in AppHdr.h about how commenting out the definition of CLUA_BINDINGS there was probably not enough to disable it
09:56:07 <rwbarton> looks like the makefile also includes -DCLUA_BINDINGS
09:56:49 <rwbarton> so this should be harmless
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10:11:53 <rax> Hrm, do I care about those int/double warnings in player.cc?
10:13:12 <ais523> converting from float to int is safe if the person who wrote the code knew what they were doing
10:13:22 <ais523> it's just that you have to be careful about rounding errors
10:13:24 <rax> Well! I will assume they did.
10:14:03 <rax> Crawl builds take a long time these days.
10:19:37 <rax> ...feh
10:20:12 <rax> So, "GEN build.h ; No Git, and util/release_ver doesn't exist."
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10:20:21 <rax> Uh, I got nothin'.
10:20:48 <rwbarton> it's looking for a git tag to figure out what version it is, but there isn't one
10:21:11 <rax> How do I give it one? :) Or can I just put a file there that tells it?
10:21:14 <ais523> the file implies that util/release_ver is a text file that just contains the version number
10:21:19 <rwbarton> git tag 0.9.0
10:21:25 <rwbarton> should do it
10:21:45 <ais523> rwbarton: hmm, doesn't that mean that there are now two separate 0.9.0s going around, rax's version and the core devteam's version?
10:22:05 <rwbarton> I think rax is on the same commit as the real 0.9.0 tag
10:22:30 <ais523> rax: you almost certainly don't want to install systemwide
10:22:36 <ais523> rwbarton: so do I
10:22:42 <ais523> so hopefully git can figure it out
10:22:44 <rwbarton> oh I guess there is a separate tag, yeah
10:22:46 <rax> I have always previously installed onto the non-chroot, tested, then copied the relevant files
10:23:01 <rax> This gives me a sanity test before I touch the chroot.
10:23:38 <rax> Aaaaand since I can't install things I can't do that here? Feh. Hrm.
10:24:20 <ais523> well, the problem is that it's installing into the root directory of the system
10:24:26 <ais523> rather than some directory you set up for testing in
10:24:33 <rax> ...it is installing into / ?
10:24:35 <ais523> yep
10:24:37 <rax> But I told it /var/games/crawl09
10:24:40 <ais523> ah, I see
10:24:41 <rawrmage> where's the chroot?
10:24:41 <ais523> there, then
10:24:49 <ais523> I just saw the /var at the start
10:24:50 <rwbarton> actually perhaps you should delete the tag and pull again
10:24:57 <ais523> and thought "it must be installing into /"
10:25:08 <ais523> because it didn't start /home or whatever, and /var is common inside a prefix
10:25:14 <rax> I mean, maybt I told it incorrectly?
10:25:19 <rax> The new makefile is confusing.
10:25:21 <ais523> normally you use somewhere in your own homedir as the prefix
10:25:28 <rax> rawrmage: /chroot
10:25:31 <ais523> so you don't need to have root powers
10:25:47 <rawrmage> rax: and you don't want it to install there yet though, right/
10:25:48 <rawrmage> ?
10:25:57 <rax> Okay, but I want to be able to say cp -a /var/games/crawl09 /chroot/var/games/crawl09 once I know it works
10:26:02 <rawrmage> yea
10:26:04 <rax> And have all the config go
10:26:09 <rax> rawrmage: Correct
10:26:28 <rawrmage> then you'd need to have a testing directory that you have all the permissions to
10:26:33 <rax> rwbarton: Do I actually care in terms of making the tournament go?
10:26:41 <rawrmage> like something in ~
10:26:48 <rax> rawrmage: ...or I'd need make install to just drop the files into /var/games/crawl09
10:26:50 <rawrmage> yea
10:26:51 <rax> and to run it with sudo
10:26:54 <rawrmage> that works too
10:26:55 <rwbarton> I only worry that a future pull might fail in a confusing way
10:26:56 <rax> like I did
10:27:25 <rwbarton> probably not worth worrying about right now though.
10:27:29 <rawrmage> ah
10:27:33 <kilobyte> how come there are warnings?  The only one that can appear is one in tiles builds (harmless, would take too much ifdefs to silence)
10:27:48 <ais523> possibly different compiler settings
10:27:49 <rax> rwbarton: Yeah that's something I should do if I have time, but tier 1 goals are "make software go, make it playable" :)
10:28:00 <ais523> implicit float to int casts aren't warned about by every compiler
10:28:03 <rwbarton> yes.
10:28:10 <CIA-34> 03galehar * r93511114acce 10/crawl-ref/source/beam.cc: Digging beams reveal secret doors (#4369).
10:28:17 <CIA-34> 03galehar 07stone_soup-0.9 * r25664291ba83 10/crawl-ref/source/output.cc: Fix extra % in XL progress after quaffing XP potion (#4386).
10:28:21 <CIA-34> 03galehar * r8ac47b0a6053 10/crawl-ref/source/output.cc: Fix extra % in XL progress after quaffing XP potion (#4386).
10:28:42 <rax> Where even _are_ the data directories?
10:28:44 <rax> I could just do it by hand
10:29:39 <ais523> the directories for saving in are where you put them
10:29:50 <ais523> what's happening at the moment is that you've set the makefile to put saves, etc, in /var/games/crawl09
10:29:57 <ais523> but not installed anything else
10:30:11 <ais523> so you're trying to run Crawl from the current directory, and it's trying to write its saves in /var/games/crawl09
10:30:13 <ais523> but it can't
10:30:14 <rax> So /var/games/crawl09/ tends to have both data and saves
10:30:29 <ais523> well, the saves are where you tell them to be in the makefile
10:30:34 <ais523> and apparently that's where you've set it too
10:30:35 <rax> Well, in the past, when I ran "make install" it made that directory with the correct permissions
10:30:41 <ais523> as for where the data is, the makefile doesn't know
10:30:45 <ais523> and that's why make install isn't working
10:30:48 <ais523> because it has no idea where to put it
10:30:56 <rax> I tooooold it
10:30:59 <rax> I told it _right there_
10:31:04 <rax> Why doesn't it know?
10:31:06 <rwbarton> what was the make install error again?
10:31:26 <rawrmage> rax: can I see that section again in makefile?
10:31:41 <rawrmage> did you literally define DESTDIR or prefix?
10:31:54 <rax> Oh this was that thing where that dude came and changed the makefile and no one liked it! And Napkin had some workaround but I don't remember what it was.
10:31:57 <rax> Goddamnit.
10:32:10 <ais523> rawrmage: you've told it dirs for the save and data, but not for everything else (such as, for instance, the executable)
10:32:13 <ais523> that's what prefix is about
10:32:15 <rawrmage> rax: i think you need prefix=/var/games/crawl09/
10:32:25 <ais523> DESTDIR is something else, used in automating build systems, you shouldn't worry about it
10:32:38 <rwbarton> where do you expect the crawl binary to end up?
10:32:41 <rax> Well the executable goes in /usr/games/
10:32:49 <ais523> it goes in prefix/games
10:32:53 <ais523> whatever the prefix is
10:33:05 <rwbarton> so you want prefix=/usr
10:33:05 <rax> So I need to set the prefix to /usr ?
10:33:17 <rax> ...and build all over again? :/
10:33:24 <ais523> the prefix is typically /usr or /usr/local for a systemwide install
10:33:24 <ais523> but those are bad ideas if you're just testing something out, and in that case you typically use your home dir instead
10:33:26 <rawrmage> shouldn't need a rebuild, imo
10:33:32 <rawrmage> er
10:33:45 <rwbarton> how about just try make install again?
10:33:48 <ais523> it doesn't need a rebuild (unless the build system is insane), just a reinstall
10:33:54 <rawrmage> it shouldn't, but my opinion doesn't matter on whether it actually will :)
10:33:57 <ais523> but I'd recommend against using /usr
10:33:59 <rwbarton> oops
10:34:07 <ais523> because it makes systemwide changes for no good reason, and they can be nontrivial to reverse sometimes
10:34:25 <ais523> also, /usr is often used by your distro's package manager, meaning /usr/local is preferable to avoid clashing with it
10:34:31 <ais523> although it depends on the distro
10:34:56 <rax> "unless the build system is insane" <3
10:34:59 <paxed> all of the NAO stuff lives under /opt/
10:35:16 <paxed> /opt/nethack.alt.org/ actually.
10:35:20 <kilobyte> the /usr vs /usr/local split has like 30 years, every sane distribution works that way
10:35:32 <rwbarton> from the sound of it, the distro package manager on this machine is functionally equivalent to /bin/true
10:35:56 <rax> The distro package manager on this machine is over in a corner crying. "Why don't you love me?"
10:36:40 <rax> Really, after the tournament, we should spin up a new VM and start over. It's still running _etch_
10:36:53 <rawrmage> i wonder exactly why it needs to rebuild for a new prefix
10:36:59 <rax> But, like, full-time job (which I am punting right now) and full-time grad school = cutting corners on hobbies
10:37:11 <rax> rawrmage: I'm guessing because the build system is insane.
10:37:30 <rawrmage> or something, yes
10:38:34 <rax> Anyway, hopefully it will work this time. I'm poking at dgl in another window in the meantime.
10:39:37 <kilobyte> uhm, etch is not only out of security support but even removed from mirrors -- I guess you tried to install some package, you'd have to point apt sources to archive.debian.org
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10:41:56 <kilobyte> or just upgrade, twice.  I can't think of any breakage that applies to a system inside a VM, but direct upgrades from a version that old are untested and not recommended.
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10:43:49 <rax> kilobyte: I know that, which is why I haven't done it
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10:44:35 <rax> If I got paid to maintain this server, I would do it very differently!
10:45:04 <ais523> hmm, I find it quite hard to mentally order toy story characters
10:45:31 <paxed> ais523: you're not the only one!
10:48:46 <rwbarton> at least we only have to remember a new one every 2-3 years
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10:50:20 <rawrmage> connection problems, ais523 ?
10:50:23 <ais523> yes
10:50:23 <kilobyte> hey, I upgrade my home machine 2-3 times a day, depending how many dinstall runs go while I'm awake
10:50:31 <ais523> this is my work connection, it's pretty unreliable
10:50:40 <ais523> (there's a more reliable wired connection but it doesn't work for IRC)
10:51:57 <kilobyte> and servers within a month of release -- some only after testing it on other ones, some (less important ones) well before the release itself so I can hope for bugs to be fixed
10:56:54 <rwbarton> well that looks promising
10:57:30 <rawrmage> it does
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11:01:53 <Gretell> Pre-release branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.9.0-1-g2566429 (32)
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11:05:55 <rax> Hrm, that looks good
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11:06:20 <rax> kilobyte: I am glad you are a better sysadmin than me! I hope it serves you well.
11:06:47 <rawrmage> rax: /usr, remember?
11:07:00 <rax> Fucking A! I told it to put saves and data in /var/games
11:07:01 <rax> Specifically
11:07:03 <rax> by name
11:07:11 <rawrmage> huh
11:07:46 <rwbarton> perhaps those variables you set got overridden by the following makefile code
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11:08:44 <rawrmage> that's not very good looking
11:08:47 <ais523> that's a bizarre strace output
11:09:01 <rwbarton> is this sqlite's doing
11:09:21 <kilobyte> rax: I don't claim I'm "a good sysadmin".  Using unstable at home is because of developing stuff, not because of it working well ("un"stable)
11:09:24 <rax> That is in fact kind of terrifying
11:09:33 <rawrmage> ld.so is enoent
11:09:34 <rawrmage> what
11:09:42 <ais523> I wonder if the save files are at /usr/var/games/crawl09/saves
11:09:44 <kilobyte> but for stable releases, you don't save any time by delaying upgrades
11:09:53 <ais523> rawrmage: ld-linux.so is the actual modern one
11:09:59 <rawrmage> yea
11:10:02 <ais523> ld.so is for a.out-format executables, which is an obsolete standard
11:10:06 <rawrmage> hm
11:10:07 <ais523> and so it's not surprising it isn't there
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11:12:06 <rax> oh good god
11:12:08 <rawrmage> motivating
11:14:05 <rwbarton> I don't think this will work
11:14:07 <rawrmage> interesting option
11:14:09 <rax> why are savedir and datadir definable in the makefile if they don't work
11:14:45 <ais523> and why is the makefile redoing dependencies just because you changed the installation locations?
11:14:55 <ais523> that makes no sense at all, it implies its dependencies are really screwed up
11:15:08 <ais523> (towards the side of caution and slow compiles rather than towards the side of not working, but still...)
11:15:48 <rwbarton> see makefile around lines 366-369
11:16:21 <rwbarton> it will override your DATADIR and SAVEDIR there so you need to set them afterwards
11:17:17 <rax> OK what do I actually do to fix that?
11:17:19 <rax> Just delete those lines?
11:17:23 <rax> What in the hell are those there for?
11:18:03 <rwbarton> apparently someone decided that if your prefix is /usr (or a few other things) you must want save games in ~/.crawl
11:18:22 <rwbarton> maybe this makes it easier for distros to package crawl or something
11:18:23 <rax> I should have complained louder when the new build system went in place. Oh well.
11:18:39 <rwbarton> yeah, deleting those lines should work
11:19:06 <rwbarton> oh you already killed them my bad :(
11:19:11 <rwbarton> well now they are extra dead
11:19:30 <rax> Doubly dead!
11:19:41 <rwbarton> dead and buried
11:20:32 <kilobyte> rwbarton: is there any other sane default?
11:21:10 <rwbarton> well not overriding things specified on the command line would be nice
11:21:18 <kilobyte> rwbarton: and that's just a default... in DGL builds you have to specify the directories anyway
11:21:19 <rwbarton> which is what it appears to do if I'm not mistaken
11:21:42 <rwbarton> or is := "assign if unset"
11:21:52 <Zaba> no, that's ?=
11:22:16 <rax> It overrided a manual specification both in the makefile and on the command line. I don't see how that's sane.
11:22:18 <rwbarton> it's a good default, it should just be that, a default
11:22:42 <kilobyte> := is "assign unless it came from an external source"
11:23:14 <rwbarton> oh, then it might be okay
11:23:55 <rwbarton> Well, the makefile still suggests you can specify SAVEDIR and DATADIR by uncommenting and filling out those first two lines
11:24:14 <Zaba> kilobyte, that's ?=
11:24:26 <Zaba> := sets a simply expanded variable
11:25:30 <Zaba> (variables set with := expand at the time when they're set, whereas ones set with = expand whenever they are used)
11:27:44 <kilobyte> you'd need to say "override" to change an externally set variable
11:28:32 <kilobyte> this is used if prefix is set, per the usual conventions
11:30:02 <rwbarton> yeah, overriding from the command line does seem to work
11:33:36 <kilobyte> (I do agree with the build system being terrible in general, just this part seems to work ok)
11:34:56 <rwbarton> it might be nice to move the commented-out lines for overriding SAVEDIR and DATADIR to after the place where they could be overwritten
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11:37:54 <rax> Hi dpeg_! We are trying to get 0.9 installed on CAO.
11:38:01 <dpeg_> Hi!
11:38:05 <dpeg_> More power to you!
11:38:10 <dpeg_> !coffee everyone
11:38:12 * Henzell hands everyone a mug of black coffee, brewed by Snorg.
11:38:30 <ais523> it's going slowly, because the build system randomly spends half an hour recompiling whenever even slight details are changed
11:39:14 <kilobyte> ais523: ah yeah, this is the part that does not work well
11:41:52 <rax> YESSSSSSS
11:42:15 <rawrmage> yay
11:42:17 <rax> hrm
11:42:49 <dpeg_> who is "we" and why is everyone in the know?
11:42:59 <rax> I'm termcasting.
11:43:25 <ais523> dpeg_: telnet termcast.org, choose "rax" from the menu
11:43:52 <dpeg_> ah
11:43:58 <rawrmage> is crawl in group games?
11:44:08 <rax> oh, the makefile might not have done that! good point!
11:44:13 <rax> uhhh, how do you do that manually *thinks*
11:44:21 <ais523> sudo chgrp games filename
11:44:29 <rax> ais523: done
11:44:30 <ais523> you might want to chmod g+s as well
11:44:41 <ais523> to mark it setgid, so people running it will also be in group games
11:44:42 <rawrmage> rax: edit /etc/group?
11:44:49 <rawrmage> that works too
11:44:51 <ais523> rawrmage: that'd do the wrong thing
11:45:01 <rax> Yeah, /etc/group is different
11:45:04 <ais523> it'd change rax personally, not everyone who loads Crawl
11:45:07 <kilobyte> rawrmage: it should be already set (0.8 and 0.7)
11:45:11 <rawrmage> ah
11:45:14 <ais523> and rax personally is not normally the person playing on CAO
11:45:22 <rawrmage> dgl doesn't run as games:games?
11:45:36 <rax> It should, but it's good to do it this way just in case I think?
11:45:42 <rawrmage> probably
11:46:12 <rax> okay name is always specified
11:48:18 <dpeg_> First thing we should do after 0.9 is gather all of these steps and put them in some place.
11:48:27 <rax> I'm working on them in a text buffer
11:48:34 <rax> I'm a bit behind, but I will fill in
11:48:39 <dpeg_> <3
11:48:48 <rax> Also this is not the "right" way as per greensnark's scripts, but it is a way that should make the tournament able to go
11:48:54 <kilobyte> starting with "grab Napkin and greensnark or wrestle access and knowledge from them"
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11:49:06 <dpeg_> kilobyte: yes!
11:49:58 <kilobyte> unofficial Debian builds are in, I'm preparing an official upload for Guus Sliepen, and then I'll do the Windows stuff
11:50:02 <Zaba> how come both greensnark and Napkin are absent exactly when they're needed :P
11:50:11 <kilobyte> including testing on win2k, unlike 0.8.0
11:50:39 <dpeg_> Zaba: if we keep releasing long enough, it had to had happen at some point. Law of large numbers etc!
11:50:50 <Zaba> I guess it makes sense
11:51:31 <dpeg_> Zaba: also, the pre-tournament release hits holiday season in some sense, that makes it even more probable.
11:51:36 <dpeg_> kilobyte: awesome!
11:51:56 <dpeg_> kilobyte: we still have no one with apple access apart from greensnark?
11:54:08 <rwbarton> rax: you missed a 9, crawl-0.-adv
11:54:22 <rax> thanks!
11:55:41 <rawrmage> this could take a while to list, huh
11:56:14 <kilobyte> dpeg_: I have a huge farm of versions of Windows: 98, 2000, XP Home pl, XP Pro en, Vista 32 bit, Vista 64 bit, 7 pl 32, 7 en 32, 7 en 64...  then, two versions of FreeBSD, two Ubuntu, Solaris, even Hurd.  Because I can and that's useful.
11:56:25 <paxed> you might eventually have to put those user files into alphanumeric subdirs ...
11:56:45 <rawrmage> paxed: what's the limit on files in a dir?
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11:57:36 <kilobyte> rawrmage: depends, but no sane filesystem has it below 32000
11:58:00 <paxed> we hit the limit on NAO a while back.
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11:58:31 <rax> paxed: Any idea why the last ifnxcp line returns a syntax error and the one before it doesn't?
11:58:42 <rax> Am I missing something obvious?
11:58:48 <paxed> rax: comma
11:58:54 <rawrmage> ra---
11:58:55 <rawrmage> yea
11:59:08 <rax> Thanks!
11:59:17 <kilobyte> what filesystem do you run?  The only on recent Unices with such a limit that I know is ext2/3/4: 32766 hardlinks (but not individual files!)
11:59:20 <rax> "answer: yes!"
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11:59:57 <rawrmage> rax: did you change the banner file?
11:59:58 <ais523> well, a hardlink limit would be a hard limit to the number of subdirs in a dir
12:00:02 <ais523> which is presumably what paxed hit
12:00:03 <rax> rawrmage: Not yet
12:00:12 <paxed> ^ what ais523 said.
12:00:34 <rawrmage> don't you have to change the banner file for the menu text to update
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12:00:36 <rax> But I am confused about why the menu popping up is the old menu
12:00:43 <rax> rawrmage: ...no? I don't think so?
12:00:46 <rax> I could be wrong though
12:01:00 <paxed> rax: you need to edit the text file that defines how the screen looks.
12:01:03 <rawrmage> yea
12:01:23 <rawrmage> something like chroot /dgl_menu_...
12:01:28 <rawrmage> at least in the setup I have
12:01:31 <rax> oh god you have to edit it in two places
12:01:43 <rawrmage> that's the file, yea
12:01:44 <paxed> see the bannerfile = "blah.txt" or something in each menu.
12:01:48 <paxed> yes, unfortunately.
12:02:02 <rax> ugh, didn't that used to be automatic?
12:02:17 <paxed> yes
12:02:28 <Zaba> is there a reason to keep 0.7.2?
12:02:56 <rax> because removing it takes time
12:03:01 <rawrmage> good answer!
12:03:04 <ais523> there are people who refuse to play 0.8 for various reasons
12:03:07 <Zaba> I see
12:03:14 <kilobyte> [greensnark] "I don't have root on CDO. I probably won't have the time to install 0.9 on CAO either; this week does not look good free-time-wise."
12:03:28 <ais523> someone I know actually stayed on 0.7 purely because of Mennas
12:03:39 <Zaba> @??Mennas
12:03:40 <Gretell> Mennas (15A) | Speed: 15 | HD: 19 | Health: 150 | AC/EV: 15/28 | Damage: 30, 20 | Flags: 08holy, spellcaster, see invisible, fly | Res: 06magic(202), 10elec++, 03poison, 04rot, 13neg+++, 08holy | XP: 6578 | Sp: confuse, silence, minor healing.
12:03:44 <kilobyte> <3
12:03:51 <rwbarton> that is the strangest possible reason to do so :P
12:03:56 -!- ais523 has quit [Read error: No route to host]
12:04:10 <Zaba> seems reasonable to me
12:04:17 <Zaba> all things considered
12:04:21 <rax> oh wait shit these are the production files
12:04:28 <rawrmage> yea
12:04:32 <rawrmage> it says .9 now
12:04:49 <rax> OK, only the admin is updated for now
12:04:54 <rax> that should only affect people reading here
12:04:59 <rawrmage> that's probably a good idea
12:04:59 <dpeg_> Zaba: there was a concern that special rooms (like the ones with bees) could have stairs, and that that was a new phenomenon.
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12:05:24 <Zaba> dpeg_, I've fixed that one
12:05:36 -!- ais523 has joined ##crawl-dev
12:05:57 <dpeg_> Zaba: great
12:07:14 <rax> hrm
12:07:46 <rax> Shouldn't there be milestones and logfile here?
12:08:52 <rwbarton> were you playing inside the chroot just now?
12:08:56 <rax> In theory
12:09:04 <rax> In practice maybe not though
12:09:28 <rwbarton> all the files in there are old too
12:11:15 <rax> Definitely was recording ttyrecs, so it was in the chroot
12:11:23 <rax> where on earth was it writing milestones to?
12:14:08 <rax> that was a bug I think
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12:15:09 <rax> oh god where is it actually putting saves
12:15:31 <dpeg_> can't you grep for a save? They must be somewhere
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12:15:47 <Eronarn> rax: find -name *.sav -mtime?
12:15:54 <Eronarn> or whatever the flag is for modified in the last x minutes
12:16:08 <rwbarton> what's in that saves directory
12:16:13 <rwbarton> is that supposed to be there?
12:16:48 <rax> the things from when I ran it outside the chroot, and the files I touched
12:16:53 <rax> nothing's been touched since
12:16:55 <rwbarton> I mean the saves directory inside this one
12:16:59 <rwbarton> is that normal?
12:17:09 <elliptic> yeah, why is there crawl09/saves/saves/
12:17:11 <rwbarton> I guess it is
12:17:14 <rax> I think that's standard broken behavior
12:17:19 <rwbarton> anyways it's not the answer
12:18:34 <rax> ok, not just going into 0.8
12:18:54 <rwbarton> pessimism suggests /chroot/home/crawl/.crawl
12:19:15 <rax> the heck was going on there
12:19:17 <rwbarton> or perhaps /chroot/home/.crawl
12:19:27 <rwbarton> hmm
12:21:57 <rwbarton> another idea, try making a character dump with #
12:22:42 <rax> where are those these days?
12:23:00 <rwbarton> !dump reid
12:23:01 <Henzell> http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/reid/reid.txt
12:23:05 <rwbarton> if that helps
12:23:19 <rax> It does, thank you!
12:23:24 <rwbarton> I guess that must be somewhere separate though
12:23:54 <elliptic> I don't know if this means much but henzell can detect this HaAE game with !whereis
12:23:55 <rax> OH GOD IT IS PUTTING EVERYTHING IN THERE
12:24:04 <Eronarn> even the bees?
12:24:10 <rax> http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/rax/scores
12:24:30 <rax> nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
12:24:43 <rax> what the fuck, crawl
12:25:33 <rax> it's reading that -dir argument as overriding the savedir?
12:25:43 <rax> And that's a change from 0.8 as far as I can tell?
12:26:33 <rax> Is that true?
12:26:46 <rax> Maybe I can find the 0.8 source tree and see how that does this
12:27:28 <elliptic> oh, I think greensnark encountered this issue with 0.9 trunk a couple months ago
12:27:32 <elliptic> things were going in the wrong directory
12:27:47 <rwbarton> yeah there was a patch around that long ago that changed how save_dir gets initialized
12:27:47 <elliptic> so I think it is a change
12:28:46 <rax> .......
12:28:53 <rwbarton> or hang on
12:29:22 <rwbarton> mm, never mind
12:30:25 <rax> So if I could find the sources for 0.9 unstable, that might help
12:30:50 <rwbarton> what happens if you just don't pass that -dir option
12:30:52 <rwbarton> what will go wrong?
12:31:06 <rax> ttyrecs won't go to the right place, or dumpfiles
12:31:20 <rax> actually ttyrecs might be covered, but dumpfiles will go to the savedir I think.
12:31:49 <rax> So in a half hour I ahve to work, like, for my job
12:32:08 <rax> I'm not sure that I'm going to be able to make this happen.
12:32:55 <dpeg_> Uh!
12:33:51 <rwbarton> I don't see how you can not set the morgues to go to the same place as the save files now
12:34:03 <rwbarton> so I would suggest giving up on that for now
12:34:31 <rax> ...where'd the dumpfile go?
12:34:34 <rwbarton> (also I'm not really following what you are doing, trying to figure out how these paths get set)
12:35:30 <rax> Wait, it... works?
12:35:32 <rax> why does that work
12:35:35 <rax> why on earth does that work
12:35:40 <elliptic> 19:55:36 <greensnark> Oh, it looks like Crawl's handling of the -dir option has changed 19:56:18 <greensnark> I wonder if I can just dispense with the -dir without torching the setup 20:04:44 <greensnark> Ok, I think cao trunk should be fixed now, thanks for reporting that 20:04:59 <greensnark> Looks like the -dir option was making crawl dump saves and logfiles to each player's ttyrec directory
12:36:17 <rwbarton> yeah so probably he removed the -dir option
12:36:21 <rwbarton> is that what you did?
12:36:25 <rwbarton> !dump rax
12:36:26 <Henzell> http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/rax/rax.txt
12:36:45 <rax> Yes.
12:36:49 <rwbarton> !log rax
12:36:49 <Sequell> 984. rax, XL3 DSFi, T:2083: http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/rax/morgue-rax-20110602-221542.txt
12:37:09 <rax> ...I think we might be good
12:37:09 <rwbarton> !lg rax
12:37:09 <Sequell> 984. rax the Skirmisher (L3 DSFi), slain by an iguana on D:3 on 2011-06-02, with 220 points after 2083 turns and 0:04:23.
12:37:14 <rax> I want to find a milestone
12:37:24 <rwbarton> abandon a god
12:37:27 <elliptic> easiest way to get one is abandoning a god, yeah
12:37:46 <rax> SHAZAM
12:37:50 <rax> uhhhhh
12:38:02 <rax> Anything else I should test?
12:38:10 <rwbarton> !lg rax
12:38:10 <Sequell> 984. rax the Skirmisher (L3 DSFi), slain by an iguana on D:3 on 2011-06-02, with 220 points after 2083 turns and 0:04:23.
12:38:23 <rwbarton> it would be great if that worked
12:39:19 <rax> Sure would be! :)
12:39:22 <rwbarton> me either :P
12:39:56 <rax> I think I will poke at Henzell seocnd, but I want to give players a few hours to break things
12:39:57 <rwbarton> /home/henzell/henzell/def.stones perhaps
12:40:02 <rax> YES
12:40:20 <elliptic> I think maybe all that needs to be done to get sequell working with this is adding a couple of lines to def.logs and def.stones
12:41:01 <rwbarton> !log rax
12:41:02 <Sequell> 984. rax, XL3 DSFi, T:2083: http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/rax/morgue-rax-20110602-221542.txt
12:41:08 <rax> Is there a good henzell restart mechanism or should I just kick it oldschool?
12:41:17 <rax> I think those get loaded at startup
12:41:20 <rax> Though it's been a while
12:41:22 <rwbarton> no idea
12:41:46 <elliptic> don't know, you are probably right that a restart of some sort is needed though
12:41:48 <ais523> kicking it won't make it leave the server
12:41:48 -!- Henzell has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
12:41:55 <ais523> you'd have to ghost it to do that
12:42:02 <ais523> or turn it off from the other end, like you did there
12:42:17 <rax> "kick" was not meant in an irc context there :)
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12:42:42 <ais523> ah, OK
12:42:44 <rwbarton> !log rax
12:42:44 <Sequell> 984. rax, XL3 DSFi, T:2083: http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/rax/morgue-rax-20110602-221542.txt
12:42:50 <rax> Well fiddlesticks
12:42:55 <rwbarton> oh that's sequell
12:43:15 <rwbarton> or I guess I don't know how that works exactly
12:43:18 <rax> I dunno where sequell lives
12:43:21 <rax> !lg rax
12:43:22 <Sequell> 984. rax the Skirmisher (L3 DSFi), slain by an iguana on D:3 on 2011-06-02, with 220 points after 2083 turns and 0:04:23.
12:43:27 <rwbarton> is there a taildb running
12:43:31 <rax> dunno
12:43:44 <rax> major job work in like 15 minutes, going to set 0.9 live so that people can find problems
12:43:50 <rax> !help
12:43:50 <Sequell> !help: Displays help on a command. For a list of commands, see !cmdinfo.
12:43:51 <Henzell> !help: Displays help on a command. For a list of commands, see !cmdinfo.
12:43:57 <rax> 'Kay, henzell is alive, good
12:44:05 <elliptic> !whereis rax
12:44:07 <Henzell> rax the Cutter (L1 KoCK) last saved on D:1 on 2011-08-12 after 8 turns.
12:44:11 <rax> weiiiiiiiiiiird
12:44:19 <rwbarton> no that makes sense
12:46:11 <rwbarton> elliptic: this should be enough for the tournament scripts to work right?
12:46:40 <rwbarton> since the logfile and milestones files exist
12:46:54 <elliptic> are they in /chroot/var/games/crawl09/saves/logfile and such?
12:47:02 <rwbarton> yes
12:47:11 <rwbarton> does the tournament keep all its own databases?
12:47:24 <rwbarton> I think it must right?
12:47:30 <elliptic> and rcfiles in /chroot/dgldir/rcfiles/crawl-0.9 hopefully?
12:47:40 <elliptic> yes
12:48:48 <elliptic> so long as logfile and milestones aren't being lost, the tourney scripts can always be fixed later if there are problems anyway
12:48:50 <rax> 'kay guys that's most of what I can do for a couple of hours, I hope it works
12:49:09 <rwbarton> thanks so much rax!
12:49:23 <elliptic> rax: thanks!
12:49:44 <rax> You're welcome. I'm sorry I couldn't do more.
12:50:21 <ais523> well done everyone
12:50:40 <elliptic> rax: oh, by the way, if you could put the logfile and milestones on the website that would be great
12:50:50 <elliptic> but if you don't have time for that until later that's fine
12:51:09 <elliptic> (I need to be able to wget them to run the scripts locally)
12:51:32 <rwbarton> hmm, it seems that 0.9 games don't show up in the games in progress list
12:52:22 <rax> dunno
12:52:23 <elliptic> rwbarton: which games in progress list?
12:52:26 <rwbarton> maybe permissions issue
12:52:30 <rax> dgl I assume
12:52:31 <rwbarton> like when you try to watch a game
12:52:34 <elliptic> ah
12:52:34 <rwbarton> yeah
12:52:54 <rwbarton> that's me
12:52:56 <rax> permissions look fine
12:52:59 <rwbarton> yes
12:53:14 <rwbarton> check the dgl conf again?
12:53:37 <rwbarton> oh my bad
12:53:41 <rwbarton> probably I have to log out
12:53:54 <rwbarton> yes that was it
12:54:11 <rax> wheeeeeeeeeeee
12:54:13 <rwbarton> it doesn't have the location information but whatever
12:54:17 <rwbarton> good enough :)
12:54:19 <rax> i love fixing bugs by doing nothing!
12:57:44 <paxed> the best kind of bugs.
13:02:31 <kilobyte> ok, so who among you has a literary talent?
13:03:18 <dpeg_> rax!
13:03:23 <dpeg_> and due!
13:05:19 <kilobyte> stuff to write: »a shiny new 0.9 (with bugs inside), Debian's in, Windows in, Mac is not; tournament is starting, ignore CDO saying "trunk" as it's "stable 0.9", no tiles for the first several days of the tourney«
13:05:52 <dpeg_> kilobyte: should I make the rgrm announcement?
13:06:50 <kilobyte> yeah, you being our Glorious Leader means I can shirk this kind of responsibility onto you :)
13:07:13 * dpeg_ bends under the pressureship
13:08:22 <elliptic> by the way, when napkin comes back and stuff on CDO gets sorted out, we need to avoid accidentally transferring games from 0.9 "trunk" to 0.10
13:10:50 <dpeg_> should I give the standard (CDO) download button?
13:12:19 <dpeg_> it won't work until Napkin is back, so maybe not so good
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13:12:45 <kilobyte> saves are compatible both ways
13:13:14 <dpeg_> kilobyte: ^
13:13:26 <dpeg_> or should I say that players cannot download 0.9 as of now?
13:13:47 <kilobyte> there's that "rolling boulder beetle" patch we might want to take in once dust settles, but so far, there's no risk as it's enough to just move them
13:14:09 <kilobyte> dpeg_: stable downloads go to SourceForge, CDO just links to them
13:14:58 <kilobyte> and, after 59766359853897 failed attempts (SF's upload thingy sucks), all the files are finally there
13:15:16 <dpeg_> kilobyte: but CDO does not link to the 0.9 files
13:15:21 <kilobyte> dpeg_: are you updating the front page?
13:15:21 <elliptic> kilobyte: 0.10 milestones and games will not count for the tourney, though... all I'm saying is that we should try to avoid letting people accidentally remove their games from the tourney
13:15:50 <elliptic> it is good that accidents can be fixed though :)
13:16:00 <kilobyte> elliptic: the game WILL warn you if you go from a stable version to unstable
13:16:08 <CIA-34> 03galehar * r9d0b45ccfc29 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-act.cc: Fix a crash with step from time and reaching monsters in the top left #4216.
13:16:18 <CIA-34> 03galehar 07stone_soup-0.9 * r257eac943fdb 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-act.cc: Fix a crash with step from time and reaching monsters in the top left #4216.
13:16:50 <elliptic> kilobyte: oh, that's good
13:17:30 <dpeg_> ??tournament
13:17:31 <Henzell> tournament[1/3]: The Aug 2011 tourney will be 00:00 Sat 13 Aug - 00:00 Mon 29 Aug. See http://crawl.akrasiac.org/tourney11/ for the rules.
13:17:41 <kilobyte> dpeg_: Wordpress goes to hell if two people edit the same page -- are you (or elliptic or whoever) editing the download one?  (You kind of sounded like that)
13:17:49 <dpeg_> I am not
13:18:14 <elliptic> (I'm not either)
13:18:22 * kilobyte takes the Edit Pumpkin.
13:18:30 <Zaba> !time
13:18:31 <Henzell> Time: Aug 12, 2011, 06:18:30 PM, UTC. The 2011 tournament starts in 5 hours, 41 minutes and 29 seconds.
13:24:57 <dpeg_> kilobyte: still around?
13:25:18 <kilobyte> yeah, just finished editing the downloads page
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13:27:07 <dpeg_> ah!
13:32:43 <kilobyte> !tell bmh you see, about Mac builds of 0.9 ...
13:32:43 <Henzell> kilobyte: OK, I'll let bmh know.
13:33:08 <dpeg_> rgrm sent
13:33:57 <kilobyte> sis is here, I'll be thoroughly AFK
13:34:12 <rax> 4I have a 15 minute break between meetings and am eating lunch, is anything horribly broken?
13:34:43 <kilobyte> !time
13:34:44 <Henzell> Time: Aug 12, 2011, 06:34:44 PM, UTC. The 2011 tournament starts in 5 hours, 25 minutes and 15 seconds.
13:34:57 <kilobyte> no, it will for sure break two minutes before the tourney
13:35:16 <rax> Awesome.
13:35:31 <elliptic> rax: only thing I've seen broken is the location information in the list of games doesn't list anything for 0.9 games... not major at all
13:35:36 <rwbarton> sequell still doesn't have the 0.9 games
13:35:38 <kilobyte> <3 rax for getting 0.9 up and running
13:35:39 <rwbarton> but I have no idea why
13:35:49 <rwbarton> actually could you take a look at henzell's log file?
13:35:56 <rwbarton> if you have a moment
13:36:05 <rax> I think Sequell runs on another machine
13:36:16 <rwbarton> oh
13:36:24 <elliptic> people seem to be able to play and the tourney scripts are recognizing the games/milestones, so it looks good
13:36:35 <ussdefiant> oh, is 0.9 released now?
13:36:44 <rwbarton> churnbox.com = greensnark?
13:37:15 <rax> Probably.
13:38:07 <CIA-34> 03kilobyte * r0c651b2887d5 10/crawl-ref/docs/changelog.txt: Update the release date for 0.9
13:38:18 <CIA-34> 03kilobyte * r4aa764df8d42 10/crawl-ref/source/makefile: Use xz rather than bz2 for source tarballs.
13:41:38 <dpeg_> SA figured that 0.9 is out
13:42:07 <CIA-34> 03galehar * rb53b019b4c26 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-act.cc: Generalize the bound check for reaching.
13:42:09 <CIA-34> 03galehar 07stone_soup-0.9 * r2fc8852715f4 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-act.cc: Generalize the bound check for reaching.
13:42:44 <elliptic> hm, getting morgue links right in the tourney pages is going to be a bit tricky for CDO games if CDO 0.9 gets moved
13:42:54 <elliptic> something to worry about a little later, I guess
13:46:06 <dpeg_> back later
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14:13:19 <Henzell> BirdoPrey the Grappler (L14 TrTm) ASSERT(t != NON_ENTITY && t < MAX_SHOPS) in 'shopping.cc' at line 2085 failed on turn 26137. (Abyss)
14:24:37 <Henzell> BirdoPrey the Grappler (L14 TrTm) ASSERT(t != NON_ENTITY && t < MAX_SHOPS) in 'shopping.cc' at line 2085 failed on turn 26137. (Abyss)
14:33:02 <Ashenzari> Font used for inventory has uppercase i look like lowercase L (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=4387) by XuaXua
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15:50:04 <dpeg_> ??tournament
15:50:04 <Henzell> tournament[1/3]: The Aug 2011 tourney will be 00:00 Sat 13 Aug - 00:00 Mon 29 Aug. See http://crawl.akrasiac.org/tourney11/ for the rules.
15:55:35 <bhaak> !time
15:55:36 <Henzell> Time: Aug 12, 2011, 08:55:37 PM, UTC. The 2011 tournament starts in 3 hours, 4 minutes and 22 seconds.
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15:59:58 <dpeg_> everything a bit shaky this time
16:00:45 <bhaak> probably not as shaky as our website was when we started it
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16:01:16 <bhaak> i'm currently coding the last bit of some tracked stuff :)
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16:11:50 <dpeg_> bhaak: do you have a rule sheet?
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17:52:41 <blueDave> !time
17:52:45 <Henzell> Time: Aug 12, 2011, 10:52:45 PM, UTC. The 2011 tournament starts in 1 hour, 7 minutes and 14 seconds.
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18:34:02 <kilobyte> From: Debian FTP Masters <ftpmaster@ftp-master.debian.org>  Subject: crawl_0.9.0-1_amd64.changes ACCEPTED into unstable
18:35:29 <Wensley> awesome! so does crawl have/has crawl always had debian/red hat packages?
18:35:35 <due> oooh nice
18:35:48 <Wensley> s/red hat/rpm
18:35:48 <due> Wensley: dcss has been in the ubuntu repos for a while, but i think it was aaancient
18:36:15 <Wensley> very cool
18:36:46 <Wensley> I've been thinking about that the past week, I want to make a linux distro my primary install on my new computer
18:37:05 <kilobyte> well, that's because Ubuntu takes 99% of its packages from Debian
18:37:15 <due> Wensley: if you use ubuntu try avoiding Unity
18:37:22 <due> because /it is fucking completely horrendously /disgusting//.
18:37:24 <Wensley> due: I was actually leaning towards kubuntu
18:37:42 <due> good good
18:37:50 <Wensley> so that isn't a terrible choice? :D
18:38:00 <Wensley> (so new at this)
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18:38:47 <due> Wensley: well, I despise KDE and GNOME myself and prefer fluxbox/openbox.
18:39:57 <galehar> wow
18:40:09 <galehar> so you guys managed to release 0.9 in time
18:40:13 <galehar> congrats
18:40:29 <Wensley> due: interesting, I hadn't even heard of alternatives to kde/gnome
18:40:42 <Wensley> wait, are both servers up to date, sans webtiles?
18:40:48 <Wensley> wasn't napkin's involvement required?
18:41:20 <elliptic> well, CDO already had the correct version of 0.9 on it really
18:41:40 <kilobyte> except it's labelled "trunk"
18:41:48 <kilobyte> and in another place "pre-release"
18:41:55 <Wensley> I figured that might be the case :P
18:41:59 <elliptic> yes
18:42:14 <Wensley> does someone make to make a last-minute blog post to explain the details?
18:42:23 <galehar> https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/search.php?project_id=1&severity_id=70&sticky_issues=on&sortby=last_updated&dir=DESC&hide_status_id=80
18:42:25 <elliptic> the fact that current CDO 0.9 games are still marked as cv=0.9-a is slightly annoying
18:42:38 <elliptic> but at least the tourney can start on time
18:42:43 <galehar> hmm sorry
18:42:45 <monqy> Wensley: the details concerning tourney are in the important note at the top of http://crawl.akrasiac.org/tourney11/
18:42:50 <monqy> Wensley: er, near the top
18:43:23 <Wensley> ah, good
18:44:37 <Wensley> still think a blog post might not be the worst idea, just because I'm afraid people either won't see that page or will gloss over it
18:44:57 <Wensley> although I suppose if someone's trying to play on cdo and realize there's no 0.9 option, that's probably the best guess for where they'll go
19:02:10 <CIA-34> 03galehar * rbd588f05e0c7 10/crawl-ref/source/terrain.cc: Don't move stairs on traps (#4110).
19:02:20 <CIA-34> 03galehar 07stone_soup-0.9 * rf823fc094d3f 10/crawl-ref/source/terrain.cc: Don't move stairs on traps (#4110).
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19:19:32 <Ashenzari> This warm blood tastes delicious! - should be different message for non-warm blooded things? (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=4388) by wolfechu
19:27:15 <Eronarn> 'this cool blood tastes refreshing!'
19:29:35 <Wensley> non-warm-blooded things still have warm blood, right? just not warmed from internal sources
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19:38:14 <CIA-34> 03kilobyte 07stone_soup-0.9 * r8f13223cd87a 10/crawl-ref/source/fight.cc: A cowardly workaround for trample into shaft crashes.
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20:19:56 <blueDave> piety seems to be adding up pretty fast
20:20:19 <blueDave> HOPr, I'm ** with just a few kills turn 360
20:20:54 <MarvinPA> priests start with fairly high piety, i think
20:22:50 <blueDave> don't remember it doing this before though -- but you could be right
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21:39:54 <Zannick> can overflow altars be generated in portal vaults or orc?
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21:49:12 <Zannick> i've found two zin altars, but no tso
22:04:37 <stabwound> oh boy 0.9
22:04:42 <stabwound> time for my yearly game
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23:03:54 <Zannick> hm.
23:04:24 <Zannick> i backed up my save, but i guess i can't access it
23:04:35 <Zannick> i want to know where to find my tso altar :(
23:11:34 <rax> No one called me! That means it's still working, right?
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23:12:02 <elliptic> yes, no new issues afaik :)
23:12:31 <elliptic> it would still be nice to teach sequell about CAO 0.9 sometime, though
23:16:38 <elliptic> rax: any chance you could put the 0.9 logfile and milestones files on the website like the other versions? so http://crawl.akrasiac.org/logfile09 = /chroot/var/games/crawl09/saves/logfile and similarly for the milestones
23:17:42 <Zannick> well, anyone who wants to sanity check that tso's overflow altar wasn't replaced by zin, the save is backed up to https://crawl.develz.org/saves/dumps/jokeserver-2566429-110813-0403.tar.bz2
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23:22:44 <rax> elliptic: Send me email? I am not going to touch the sevrer in my current mental state <3
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