00:03:06 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.9-a1-344-g2149496 (32) 00:03:16 -!- ion has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:03:24 -!- ion has joined ##crawl-dev 00:06:05 Monster appears in wall (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=4094) by nubinia 00:18:21 Windows builds of master branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.9-a1-344-g2149496 00:30:05 03dolorous * rf01cbcc3e828 10/crawl-ref/source/religion.cc: Properly handle statue form for Yred in transformed_player_can_join_god(). 00:31:14 -!- valrus has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:43:49 -!- Wensley has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:46:04 03dolorous * r743135f991f8 10/crawl-ref/source/religion.cc: Properly handle petrification for Yred in transformed_player_can_join_god(). 00:46:14 03dolorous * r9d89d7d4eca5 10/crawl-ref/source/player.cc: Add formatting fix. 01:12:40 -!- evilmike has quit [] 01:20:30 moin 01:23:41 -!- Twilight13 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:24:00 -!- Twilight13 has joined ##crawl-dev 01:26:31 oh basilisks. Lovely. 01:31:58 it'd be cool if Veh granted an ability at 5 stars of piety, that fully restores mp at a cost of hp and/or stat drain - sort of like borg's for mp instead of hp, and it's thematic of a god that supports destruction 01:36:53 veh already gives an MP-restoring ability 01:49:30 -!- Twinge has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:50:48 -!- Twinge has joined ##crawl-dev 03:00:34 -!- syllogism has joined ##crawl-dev 03:06:09 03kilobyte * r3e1095ba84be 10/crawl-ref/source/fight.cc: Nerf dragon form damage, nerf statue unarmed but boost all melee. 03:06:15 -!- elliptic has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:06:19 03kilobyte * r09b4a3b351e1 10/crawl-ref/source/player.cc: Give dragon and statue form GDR. 03:06:19 03kilobyte * r89eebd9c29fe 10/crawl-ref/source/religion.cc: Comment that the petrified check when taking on Yred is rather academic. 03:06:20 03kilobyte * r283ba9d15e5b 10/crawl-ref/source/ (effects.cc player.cc): Reduce statue form torment resistance from immunity to 50%. 03:24:05 03kilobyte * rba70dfab3530 10/crawl-ref/source/decks.cc: Fix insane power of level 1 and 2 Orb cards. 03:24:15 03kilobyte * r4a7ccd8de6bc 10/crawl-ref/source/decks.cc: Fix cards of destruction often doing nothing, reduce variance, boost the average. 03:26:42 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.9-a1-353-g4a7ccd8 (32) 03:34:04 03kilobyte * r6edb4f9eca59 10/crawl-ref/source/fight.cc: Fix a dumb =/== bug causing spam about returning to fleshy form. 03:35:31 -!- galehar has joined ##crawl-dev 03:36:07 03kilobyte * r91e8751bab7e 10/crawl-ref/source/fight.cc: Fix statue form reducing damage rather than increasing... 03:36:36 Unstable branch on crawl.develz.org updated to: 0.9-a1-355-g91e8751 (32) 03:46:49 torment resist, 40% GDR, better melee damaga. Huge boost to statue form. I like that it's good to non-Tr. 03:47:23 ???? 03:47:41 you buffed statue form? that sounds unbalanced 03:47:55 kilobyte just did yes. 03:48:13 unarmed is nerfed a good deal though 03:48:22 ah 03:48:45 rip centaurs and trolls 03:49:02 and yet another felid nerf :) hehe 03:49:40 casmith789: probably needs adjustment, but since the spell was useless, the pendulum had plenty of way to swing 03:49:48 ...what 03:50:00 statue form isn't useless 03:50:08 or wasn't 03:53:04 casmith789: no one bothered with it during the tournament 03:54:52 you lost AC and suffered debilitating slowness, getting rPois and an unarmed boost in return 03:55:46 I see a problem with my new version: it grants plate armour at no spellcasting loss (outside the 1.5x casting speed reduction) 03:56:57 can give some casting penalty like blade hands 04:05:00 reducing torment resist seems like a big nerf 04:05:22 reducing from 0% to 50% resisted 04:05:32 (100% damage taken to 50% damage taken) 04:05:51 i.e. the reduction is relative to the buff that actually gave it rtorm in the first place 04:06:00 i.e. it originally didn't have it 04:12:05 03kilobyte * r1a07a0d97ff2 10/crawl-ref/source/ (fight.cc player.cc): Reduce dragon and statue damage further, reduce hp, increase statue EV penalty. 04:23:04 -!- ZorbaBeta has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:23:17 -!- ZorbaBeta has joined ##crawl-dev 05:17:17 kilobyte: you gained hp as well 05:17:35 and just because no-one used it in the tournament doesn't make it bad 05:17:57 well no-one won with it 05:18:31 have you considered people learning & forgetting it or that people preferred OP styles of play to balanced styles of play see: 30% trog wins or something ridiculous 05:18:51 why would anyone learn statue form when LRD exists and was so overpowered 05:27:51 -!- monqy has quit [Quit: hello] 05:38:07 -!- Twilight13 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:38:29 -!- Twilight13 has joined ##crawl-dev 06:40:28 -!- Cryp71c has joined ##crawl-dev 06:41:05 Morning, don't suppose I'm lucky enough for any other devs to be up ? 06:42:16 Cryp71c: no real ones at least. 06:42:22 ghallberg, :P 06:42:57 Cryp71c, I'm around 06:43:46 Zaba, yay! I don't suppose you know the purpose of passing defer_rand into a method and using it to call random methods vs calling the random methods directly? 06:44:32 defer_rand is explained in random.h 06:45:19 I don't really know the theory behind it, but I suppose there's a good mathematical reason for it to be used :P 06:45:33 you should ask whoever wrote it 06:46:04 I believe that'd be sorear 06:46:44 Well, I knew it yielded the same results for the same call using the same parameters, but in one instance where its being used (vs just calls to the random.h methods), the values are never referenced again. 06:47:12 I just didn't know if it produced a more randomized set of numbers (somehow) vs a series of calls to the random methods that were independent of a defer_rand object. 06:47:17 git blame and ask whoever wrote that specific code? :P 06:47:28 Yeah, I'll have to. Was just curious. 06:47:47 The other thing is combat-code / stabbing related. Have you ever looked into that code? 06:48:05 I've only glanced over it, don't know any details, sorry. 06:48:18 hrm. k. 06:48:58 Last question - at the moment - is merely opinion. Right now monster to-hit has a 5% chance of hitting (regardless of the to-hit and ev rolls) or a 5% chance of missing (regardless of to-hit rolls). 06:49:23 Player combat doesn't behave like this, and I'm unifying the two code-paths which determine whether a melee attack hits. 06:49:43 I'd say get rid of that weirdness and see if anybody notices 06:49:50 Should both players and monsters have a 5% chance to miss, 5% chance to hit, regardless of rolls, OR should neither have them? 06:49:54 not sure how suitable that is for combat code, but it worked very well for dungeon code 06:50:52 Removing the chance is "better" since theres less code to maintain, but the principle behind it seems reasonable. 06:51:42 (eg, vs a super powerful monster, there should always be either a chance to evade where circumstances are too low to otherwise warrant not being hit) 06:52:02 definitely better to have the chances 06:52:28 otherwise, you'd be fully safe in some cases, and we don't want this 06:52:51 kilobyte, do you have any info on the former question I asked about defer_rand ? 06:54:02 it is there so it's possible to tell that you would hit but didn't because you are wearing encumbering armour, the monster has phase shift, etc 06:54:40 of course, this could be implemented a much faster way, but I guess this is not a hot code path 06:56:21 kilobyte, k. I've got other things I'm unifying which - like the 5% hit/miss thing - will result in tweaks to how combat works for players vs monsters, primarily as it matters to - at the very least - stabbing. 06:57:25 Well, I'm not quite ready to delve into stabbing yet. Not sure even where the current monster stabbing code is. 06:59:11 I did - however - have a question to see if you were familiar with some of the code which determines when a player stabs. I believe its in fight.cc near 1520 (ish) the first line looks like "if (to_hit >= ev && ev_nohelpless > ev" 07:00:17 There are a series of or conditions which check stabbing skill and whether the defender is sleeping but - as near as I can tell - for players stabbing confused, distracted, sleeping, or netted mobs, helpful_ev is ALWAYS > ev, so all the or conditions are unnecessary. 07:00:31 kilobyte, do you know what purposes those or conditions may serve? 07:01:29 s/or/"or" 07:09:16 -!- cesium has joined ##crawl-dev 07:12:13 -!- Cryp71c has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 07:19:54 helpful_evasion can be equal to evasion, if the monster isn't helpless. 07:20:49 but maybe it should be something like to_hit >= evasion && to_hit < helpful_evasion 07:21:39 this code was written by Arxale (a patcher), and I commited it. Maybe I didn't thoroughly checked it. 07:22:26 about the 5% hit/miss thing, it's a pure D&D thing (1 or 20 on a d20). 07:26:47 -!- Cryp71c has joined ##crawl-dev 07:29:12 -!- ortoslon has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:30:19 -!- ortoslon has joined ##crawl-dev 07:30:34 -!- ortoslon has quit [Client Quit] 07:45:31 -!- ZorbaBeta has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:45:45 -!- ZorbaBeta has joined ##crawl-dev 07:53:19 -!- Cryp71c_ has joined ##crawl-dev 07:54:13 03galehar * r2becf17f23f2 10/crawl-ref/source/stash.cc: Show waypoint number in search result. 07:54:31 03galehar * r6443c2a9130e 10/crawl-ref/source/ (clua.h pattern.h stash.cc stash.h): Waypoint search. 08:00:13 -!- galehar has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:00:35 -!- galehar has joined ##crawl-dev 08:03:50 -!- galehar has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:04:56 -!- galehar has joined ##crawl-dev 08:07:01 -!- Eurtek has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:37:26 -!- cesium has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:37:45 -!- cesium has joined ##crawl-dev 09:11:53 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 10:14:07 -!- ais523 has joined ##crawl-dev 10:15:04 -!- ophanim has joined ##crawl-dev 10:24:16 03dolorous * r1ba19e687c18 10/crawl-ref/source/art-func.h: Tweak the Undeadhunter melee message to "disruptive energy". 10:37:16 -!- Cryp71c_ has quit [Quit: Leaving] 10:46:07 03Cryp71c 07unified_combat_control * r92aab5ba766d 10/crawl-ref/source/melee_attack.cc: Fix remaining player-attack runtime crash 10:46:18 03Cryp71c 07unified_combat_control * r54de09ab4a40 10/crawl-ref/source/ (melee_attack.cc melee_attack.h): Begin to unify player_attack and monster_attack 10:58:46 !tell dpeg I'd really like to start cleaning out some old wiki pages, starting with the demonspawn ideas one that's full of stuff we've either already done or aren't doing. 10:58:47 Cryp71c: OK, I'll let dpeg know. 11:25:37 -!- evilmike has joined ##crawl-dev 11:28:55 -!- Textmode has joined ##crawl-dev 11:37:42 I'm going to be submitting a patch along with zot entry vaults (D:27) some time in order to limit the number of portals (it currently converts all stairs _and_ escape hatches to portals). But I'm wondering which of two options I should go with. One is still allow it to convert the stairs, so there are always 3 portals 11:38:10 Another is to convert all stairs and hatches to floor, and only place zot entries via vaults (possibly a dummy vault). This would mean only 1 portal per level, and would make it like other branch entries 11:38:38 any thoughts as to which would be better? The second one is a bigger change gameplay-wise 11:38:58 -!- cesium has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:39:32 -!- cesium has joined ##crawl-dev 11:40:25 I also know what to do in either case, so it doesn't make a difference to me. I just want to know which way is better, since it affects the design of the vaults a bit 11:40:44 !won Eifel 11:40:45 Eifel has won once in 2244 games (0.04%): 1xKoBe 11:40:54 Congratulations, Eifeltrampel :D 11:41:37 !won Napkin 11:41:38 Napkin has won 5 times in 961 games (0.52%): 1xHEFE 1xKoAs 1xKoHe 1xMDFi 1xTrBe 11:44:03 -!- upsy has joined ##crawl-dev 11:44:13 !log Eifel 11:44:13 2244. Eifel, XL27 KoBe, T:160717: http://crawl.develz.org/morgues/0.8/Eifel/morgue-Eifel-20110603-163950.txt 11:50:30 evilmike, the latter sounds better to me. 3+ entries into zot makes it feel less special. 1 entry imo and if we can start to use the vaults as an easy way to decorate (or, hell..even guard) the entry with something cool or spectacular, that's even more reason to do it in this fashion) 11:59:37 evilmike: you can also place multiple exits in a vault 12:02:04 Yeah, placing them as zot_entry rather than stairs gives more flexibility 12:04:47 I'll just go with converting all the down-stairs on d:27 to floor then, thanks for the feedback. 12:07:12 evilmike, yeah, placing it using the general branch entry placement mechanism would be best IMO 12:36:07 03galehar * r0ef6d45de877 10/crawl-ref/source/stash.cc: Simplify. 12:37:33 -!- neunon has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:39:46 evilmike: a single portal to Zot would be much better IMHO. 12:42:59 -!- neunon has joined ##crawl-dev 12:42:59 -!- neunon has quit [Changing host] 12:42:59 -!- neunon has joined ##crawl-dev 12:53:15 alright, with that in mind, here's my first shot at a layout in case anyone wants to have a look (I'll submit it on mantis once I've made more): http://pastebin.com/GzGL7c0K 12:57:26 evilmike, looks quite nice! I don't like vague oval shapes, but that might be just me, though. 12:57:57 (well, vague circle shapes that end up being vague ovals in ascii) 12:58:40 yeah, its hard to get things that look good in both ascii and tiles 12:58:42 I tend to either fix them into more exact approximations of circles, or into some kinda crosses 12:59:16 the thing is, if you make it look more like a circle in ascii, it looks like an oval in tiles :P 12:59:24 evilmike, indeed, don't do that 12:59:45 even a more exact approximation of a circle should still assume square tiles :P 13:01:54 I once looked for a square-proportion font just to make editing vaults a bit easier 13:02:26 things always come out wider than I expect they are, since I make a vault in ascii and then test it in tiles 13:03:21 I've never tested vaults in tiles 13:06:17 I always do both... I play online so I hardly ever see tiles, but from what I can tell, more people play tiles, so it's worth making sure it looks good 13:08:14 -!- Zaba has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:14:06 -!- Zaba has joined ##crawl-dev 13:19:18 -!- monqy has joined ##crawl-dev 13:59:09 -!- ortoslon has joined ##crawl-dev 14:00:51 nice, that zot vault looks pretty awesome 14:01:16 i got a pan entrance generated inside it though, i guess that's a consequence of how those are placed? 14:10:55 -!- ortoslon has quit [Quit: bye] 14:22:16 !gamesby swinepaste 14:22:16 swinepaste has played 68 games, between 20110505 and 20110603, won 0, high score 171932, total score 308473, total turns 302418, total time 30:25:09. 14:23:08 oopps, wrong channel sorry 14:28:16 Pikel's minions stay hostile if not at the depth where Pikel dies (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=4095) by rriegs 14:35:01 MarvinPA: that's really weird 14:35:23 I put vault in zot.des as it is in the version I linked, went to d:27 and it put a zot portal just as it should... 14:35:35 oh there was a zot portal, yeah 14:35:46 i just meant that randomly in the middle of the vault was also a pan entrance 14:37:33 I guess those types of things can just show up inside vaults. Reminds me of a related thing... a few days ago someone got the entrance to lair inside that archer statue vault with bushes 14:37:50 meaning the stairs were guarded by 2 archer statues, and blocked by a bush. He made it in though 14:43:35 there isn't a flag like no_item_gen or no_monster_gen to prevent unspecified stairs and portals from appearing? 14:44:33 (or perhaps we could have vaults for pan entrances) 14:45:18 -!- Cryp71c has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:46:08 03rburnham 07unified_combat_control * r831b5bd36338 10/crawl-ref/source/melee_attack.cc: Remove unnecessary stabbing check 14:46:08 03Cryp71c 07unified_combat_control * r51151779283a 10/crawl-ref/source/melee_attack.cc: Remove unnecessary conditional checks on player stab 14:48:42 from what I can tell, it works the other way 14:48:52 certain vaults are tagged with can_overwrite, which lets them be placed inside other vaults 14:49:06 and this includes pan entrances 14:50:02 ..although the lair entrance isn't tagged as that, so I have no idea how that one works 14:50:47 right, i think it has to be the case for pan so you don't get no pan entrance if you have a full-level d:24 vault 15:05:36 -!- Cryp71c has joined ##crawl-dev 15:23:31 kilobyte, if you're still there, I was asking you about defer_rand earlier, that was with the intent of finding out why test_melee_hit uses it instead of just calling the random.h methods it needs? In the monster_attack code, I don't see r's values being used again and again anywhere. If you can shine any light, I'd appreciate it! 15:23:36 I may be going soon, so please !tell me 15:28:36 Killer Bee Larva Zombies should use Worm Zombie tile (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=4096) by XuaXua 15:28:38 Cryp71c: I never investigated it, it just struck me as needlessly complicated when I gave it a brief glance some time ago 15:30:03 kilobyte, guess I'll grep around for other usages of test_melee_attack, maybe its used elsewhere. Seems quite unnecessary...if you were interested in storing the random values, you'd just store them yourself...eh, anyways. 15:33:35 yeah... it's a matter of saving the roll and comparing it to what would be necessary to clear EV, clear phaseshift, etc 15:36:06 yeah, it does'nt do that though, it just else if calls to test_melee_hit over and over again, checking for hit / dodge / phaseshift-dodge, etc. 15:36:10 Anyways, heading to other job. 15:36:10 -!- Cryp71c has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:51:03 DrkPaladin (L9 TrCK) ASSERT(you.wizard && !you.did_escape_death()) in 'xom.cc' at line 3836 failed. (D:9) 15:52:01 DrkPaladin (L9 TrCK) ASSERT(you.wizard && !you.did_escape_death()) in 'xom.cc' at line 3836 failed. (D:9) 15:56:38 being in an unviable state (negative stat, etc), I bet 15:56:50 !lm DrkPaladin type=crash -log 15:56:50 3. DrkPaladin, XL9 TrCK, T:8875 (milestone): http://crawl.develz.org/morgues/0.8/DrkPaladin/crash-DrkPaladin-20110603-205157.txt 15:57:27 of course 16:43:59 Websocket Timeout (Chrome Beta/Firefox Beta MacOSX 10.6.7) (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=4097) by Vanan 17:06:35 -!- neunon has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:15:37 -!- ais523 has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:38:05 -!- Twilight13 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:38:32 -!- Twilight13 has joined ##crawl-dev 17:40:53 -!- b0rsuk has joined ##crawl-dev 17:40:59 !seen Lemuel 17:40:59 I last saw Lemuel at Sun Sep 19 18:20:33 2010 UTC (36w 5d 4h 20m 26s ago) quitting with message Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.9/20100824153629]. 17:53:22 kilobyte: boosting the effect on undeadhunter sounds good, i didn't intend for it to be weaker than plain holy wrath, just didn't really crunch the numbers 17:54:22 and was going off ##crawl's description of the disruption brand rather than actually going back and looking up exactly how it worked :P 17:57:32 Undeadhunter... weak ? 17:57:54 I have a recent win with it, it felt nothing but weak. 17:58:08 was it recent as in yesterday? because it just changed :P 17:58:29 changed the holy wrath brand to a disruption-style effect that only works on undead 17:58:30 It's a shame Lemuel doesn't come here, he has very interesting ideas backed with reasoning. 17:58:58 Not that recent. Who needs undead killers anyway ? 17:59:20 Demons are what matters. Liches are the only worry in Zot. 17:59:26 The only udnead worry. 17:59:32 sure, but the weapon is called undeadhunter, not demonhunter 17:59:41 just meant to be a flavour tweak and a cool unrand effect 17:59:53 Do you change the name to fit the mechanic, or mechanic to fit the name ? And why ? 18:00:20 there's already plenty of holy wrath branded unrands, so i went with changing the mechanic to make it a bit more unique 18:00:22 b0rsuk: you could have just taken an ordinary great mace of holy wrath, it'd be enchanteable by an extra +2,+2 18:01:13 I never burn so many scrolls on a single weapon. In some games I don't even find that many scrolls. I'm happy with +5/+5 for slime pits. 18:01:39 what do you do with your scrolls then? 18:01:52 disruption-style effect ? Could it, I don't know, slow undead you hit ? 18:02:05 Enchant two, sometimes three weapons. 18:02:22 Sometimes an axe of returning. 18:04:02 b0rsuk: there was a disruption brand in 0.3 and earlier 18:05:08 and it just multiplied damage. I assumed you couldn't have meant something as boring. 18:05:24 I thought maybe some modification of distortion. 18:06:09 03galehar * r194fea965b6e 10/crawl-ref/source/ (godpassive.cc godpassive.h stash.cc travel.cc): Improve and simplify Ash on sight identification. 18:06:14 03galehar * re57a6fb94e8f 10/crawl-ref/source/menu.cc: Fix help screens not taking commend when easy_exit_menu is false. 18:16:08 03alpha.dev * r8bbd35465170 10/crawl-ref/source/ (mon-stuff.cc notes.cc notes.h): Add a note when an interesting monster is banished (fixes #4058). 18:17:45 lua:restrict_door() stops wandering monsters from opening doors before the player does, right? 18:17:57 I'm pretty sure this is the thing i'm looking for but can't find where it is, or where it might be documented 18:17:58 evilmike: it stops any monster from opening a door before the player does, yes. 18:18:03 yeah ok, thanks 18:18:16 evilmike: check the syntax in wizlab.des 18:27:02 -!- degroves has joined ##crawl-dev 18:28:40 setting a floor tile for a secret door seems to crash 18:29:06 I understand why setting the tile for a secret door itself is bad, but should it be doing that for floor tiles as well? Not a big deal in any case, just seems weird 18:29:08 -!- degroves has quit [Client Quit] 18:29:12 evilmike: floor too? I fixed a related bug recently but it seemed to affect only the wall. 18:29:35 (ok, worked around rather than fixed) 18:30:17 -!- degroves has joined ##crawl-dev 18:30:20 hmm, the version I'm using is a bit out of date, I'll download the latest one 18:32:55 still doesn't like it when I use FTILE to set the floor tile 18:34:16 -!- b0rsuk has quit [Quit: leaving] 18:38:04 -!- galehar has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:51:03 -!- degroves has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 19:16:10 -!- petete has joined ##crawl-dev 20:07:14 -!- Cryp71c has joined ##crawl-dev 20:07:34 Evening 20:36:29 -!- syllogism has quit [] 20:37:29 -!- Cryp71c has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:08:53 -!- Textmode has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 21:11:41 -!- Wensley has joined ##crawl-dev 21:52:03 -!- monqy has quit [Quit: cant see a thing] 21:55:10 -!- monqy has joined ##crawl-dev 22:12:43 -!- unexpected has joined ##crawl-dev 22:40:27 -!- unexpected has quit [Quit: stuff] 23:00:15 -!- Wensley has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 23:19:18 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev