00:23:03 -!- purge has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:26:50 -!- valrus has joined ##crawl-dev 01:01:22 moin! 01:01:32 hey napkin 01:01:33 and.. omg, we do need linux trunk builds, huh? :D 01:02:00 you do the webpage http://crawl.develz.org/trunk/ right? 01:02:20 we all do, yes 01:02:24 oh 01:02:29 what's up with it? 01:02:31 well someone ought to edit out the Dungeon Crawl Reference, the home of the Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup project. link 01:02:36 its dead 01:02:44 and just points to crawl.develz.org 01:02:55 and theres another link to that at the bottom 01:03:08 history! 01:03:20 it's not dead - it takes you to crawl.develz.org ;) 01:03:34 but... theres another link to that 4 lines down 01:04:00 o.O 01:04:16 yeah, a bit recursive :) 01:04:26 I guess it doesnt matter, I figured no one noticed though 01:05:25 i did, but thought that many ways lead to.. CDO ;) 01:05:33 lol 01:07:18 but the Download link on http://crawl-ref.sourceforge.net/ should be changed 01:07:54 since we have screenshots in the wordpress now 01:09:02 !tell jpeg hey jpeg, could you adjust the "Download" link on http://crawl-ref.sourceforge.net/ to point to http://crawl.develz.org/wordpress/downloads instead? thanks! 01:09:02 Napkin: OK, I'll let jpeg know. 01:10:04 you mean dpeg? 01:10:32 could have messages dpeg too, but he would just have told jpeg ;) 01:10:39 oh 01:10:48 different people? 01:11:02 https://crawl.develz.org/wiki/doku.php?id=user:jpeg 01:11:24 yes :) 01:11:30 ah 01:11:39 suitable name then 01:11:44 hehe 01:12:25 i think she didn't know by then when she chose that nick ;) 01:13:20 and hey, our tiles are in png! :D 01:13:28 haha 01:14:22 time to run.. 01:14:25 later o/ 01:40:02 -!- enne has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:49:37 -!- Textmode has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:00:11 -!- valrus has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:25:53 -!- upsy has joined ##crawl-dev 02:44:51 -!- galehar has joined ##crawl-dev 03:40:06 hi 03:44:52 hi 03:44:59 god, I'm tired 03:45:04 galehar! how ye? 03:51:09 -!- eith has joined ##crawl-dev 03:52:37 03due * r754172b4fb72 10/crawl-ref/source/ (crawl_all.doxy crawl_simple.doxy): Doxygen: include static and private members and functions. 03:53:15 moin guys 03:56:45 I'm fine :) 03:56:58 also, thanks for doxygen 03:57:09 I promise I'll document my code soon :) 03:59:29 that's fine :) 04:04:05 vampires can produce potions of decay at will (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=3281) by galehar 04:13:44 -!- violetj has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 04:13:58 -!- violetj has joined ##crawl-dev 04:27:41 -!- eith has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 04:28:47 Ooooh 04:28:54 Someone suggested giant beetle -> goliath beetle. I like that. 04:29:56 But I think I've reached my alotment of "giant" renaming. 04:30:47 needs to be punnier imo 04:30:54 to match boring beetles 04:31:25 True. 04:31:43 boring beetle is one of the best names 04:32:27 !tell dpeg Your forum replies are amazing. How do you stay so composed and focussed? I admire you. 04:32:27 due: OK, I'll let dpeg know. 04:34:46 due: dolorous is fixing pillars of salt to be named after things! :D 04:38:07 Eronarn: :D 04:43:10 bhaak: Is there a way to have "@var x This variable is set to true if otherwise false" for variables that are in a function but are not parameters? 04:43:27 bhaak: It would help to explaain some of the variables used in larger functions. 04:45:58 You know, It's been less than a year since I've played, and I don't think I'll even recognize it anymore when I play again :O 04:48:59 Twinge: it still kills you, dead 04:56:33 Yeah, I'll still recognize that! 04:57:40 Hey it's Twinge! 04:57:49 -!- dpeg has joined ##crawl-dev 04:57:54 !seen galehar 04:57:54 dpeg: You have 2 messages. Use !messages to read them. 04:57:54 I last saw galehar at Mon Jan 24 09:57:09 2011 UTC (1h 45s ago) saying I promise Ill document my code soon :) on ##crawl-dev. 04:57:55 dpeg! 04:58:04 ##crawl-dev!! 04:58:19 due: btw awesome about code doccccccccccccumentation! 04:58:30 baby in lap hard to type 04:58:31 much later! 04:58:51 hi dpeg 04:59:58 due: you want to document variables inside functions? 05:00:37 hmm 05:02:13 item id talk, and latest @play gave me an idea: a RL where there are no safe moments for item id - you are always in combat; after winning, you get aloot automatically (a separate screen perhaps); and are immediately thrown into the next battle 05:02:30 bhaak: yes 05:02:32 due: if you write a block of text that explains the inner workings of a function and you need or want to document something that isn't reachable with \var or \property, I think you can just use \code for that 05:02:53 bhaak: Hm, so I can't get it to do a nice table? 05:03:01 bhaak: (like the parameters table) 05:03:12 due: I don't think so 05:04:03 also i have a similar idea, a rl which has several dungeons (or adventures/scenes) but you can only enter each once, and the between time is spent in menus, where you pick out the next challenge from several 05:04:24 in other words, imagine crawl with just portal vaults 05:04:49 and no exploration? 05:08:35 If you're documenting the inner workings of a function in any detail your comment is going to bitrotexplode very soon 05:08:54 yeah, no D 05:09:28 due: if you really need to document a variable that's inside some block inside the function, that screams for refactoring of that function :) 05:09:30 greensnark: I was just thinking specific functions like monster_dies. 05:09:38 bhaak: if I refactor it it will break ;) 05:09:39 damn work, keeps one from doing the important stuff 05:09:45 erm 05:09:48 your point is valid 05:09:52 that screams for hitting the programmer? 05:10:00 -!- galehar has quit [Quit: Page closed] 05:10:14 a lot of the "ew" code is really oold, 4.1 or earlier 05:10:24 4.0 or earlier 05:10:33 ah 05:10:39 yes, 4.0 or earlier, i should say 05:10:39 The 4.1 imports were all pretty decent 05:11:01 well, it's a fork of 4.0 though, init? not 4.1? 05:11:11 greensnark: I bought a new elephant box today :D 05:11:19 0.1 was mostly 4.0 + selected body parts from 4.1 05:11:30 Elephant box?! 05:11:40 How many elephants does it contain 05:12:22 no, no, it is wood with a carved elephant on the loid 05:12:28 -!- monqy has quit [Quit: hello] 05:14:39 hehe, 940 lines of code :) 05:14:58 coolio's idea to rename giant ant to worker ant is so brilliant it feels blindingly obvious 05:15:28 Keskitalo: also goliath beetle <3 05:15:39 Keskitalo: unfortunately i have used up my quota of monster renaming for the month. 05:15:41 yeah that was from SA iirc 05:15:47 Keskitalo: oh wow that is a good idea 05:15:49 ouchie :/ 05:15:58 thoguh i have one request for ants 05:16:02 should post implementables 05:16:11 make them fulsome into acid potions 05:17:39 ooh 0.8 plan update <3 05:18:05 Whoa, dpeg actually updated the plan?! 05:18:20 dpeg hath on honey-dew fed. 05:18:49 where? 05:19:07 a plan :O 05:19:49 https://crawl.develz.org/wiki/doku.php?id=dcss:planning:0.8_features 05:19:50 He calls it a sweeping update :) 05:22:48 summons cap!!! 3 05:22:48 <3, even 05:23:12 * Eronarn is very tempted to edit in octopodes on that list and see if anyone notices 05:26:06 Eronarn: we will now 05:28:48 It seems like all joke monsters make it in eventually... 05:29:37 Too bad some eventualities are slower than others :'( 05:29:51 I'm still waiting for an opportune moment to add walruses 05:30:09 greensnark: right now, while everyone's peering at megabats 05:30:14 greensnark: that's how i got turtles in! 05:30:19 oh wait, we alread have turtle,s nm. 05:30:28 (it was actually ninja pirates in shoals but don't tell dpeg) 05:30:56 greensnark: add them to that ice cave with the river 05:31:04 and a sickly one in sewers 05:31:13 'bloated walrus' 05:31:18 I think it's supposed to be an alliterative name 05:31:30 Wasted walrus? 05:31:30 wounded walrus 05:31:43 withered! 05:32:02 "Like a withered plant, but different." 05:32:09 waistcoated-walrus 05:36:55 :D 05:39:14 -!- galehar has joined ##crawl-dev 05:43:33 -!- cw_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:53:19 -!- syllogism has joined ##crawl-dev 06:02:22 Eronarn: you coded but commented out sleep as a recite effect because "it doesn't really work well. This should be more forceful." 06:02:29 1. did you meant to remove that for some reason? 06:03:27 2. falling asleep is the most popular effect of sermons in RL (save for being ignored) 06:06:04 -!- galehar has quit [Quit: disconnect] 06:45:14 ortoslon: Encouraging raising several skills is not a direct goal. Thanks for the Linley new game link! 06:45:34 ..and it looks damn good already! 06:48:29 A Crawl mention: http://forums.tigsource.com/index.php?topic=16704.msg495531#msg495531 :)) 06:54:22 -!- Mu_ has joined ##crawl-dev 06:56:20 -!- cw_ has joined ##crawl-dev 07:14:42 heh. Why does the 0.8 plan say that I've rewritten the dungeon builder? :P 07:14:53 I don't remember doing that :P 07:20:30 -!- galehar has joined ##crawl-dev 07:48:50 -!- Zaba has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 07:59:14 -!- Zaba has joined ##crawl-dev 08:06:57 Mm, Steven Erikson is pretty decent 08:07:20 Gardens of the Moon took about half the book to get started, but not bad at all once it does get started 08:16:13 Zaba: That's the best code, the one that you do not remember. 08:16:42 The code that bursts out of your chest like an alien 08:19:25 most of malazan books take a while to get started 08:19:49 also some of the subplots seem pretty unnecessary and I'm frequently tempted to just skip them :P 08:20:27 of course had I done that I would have regretted it a few books later 08:20:45 Heh 08:23:00 how are minmay's and mrmistermonkey's attitudes in the forum? 08:25:42 minmay seems rather opinionated 08:25:47 haven't read the forums much though 08:27:40 thanks 08:28:43 danr is taking a baby break soon and suggesting futher moderator material ;) 08:30:01 danr is opinionated as well :P 08:31:02 yeah, that's another reason why I enjoyed writing about how important friendly neutrality between the two sides is ;> 08:36:09 03kilobyte 07recite * r24a406a18daf 10/crawl-ref/source/ (godabil.cc godabil.h): Refactor recite effects. 08:42:11 -!- OG17 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:43:26 03MarvinPA * rd2e0d5b4439f 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/descript/spells.txt: Improve silence spell description 08:43:42 yay babies 08:45:25 Napkin: minmay's been quite courteous, but also said at some controversy that he hoped people would rather have thicker skins than exclude people if they didn't like them (or something like that) 08:45:43 I'm more of a BAN THE JERKS ALREADY kind of guy ;) 08:45:57 you've become that, yes ;) 08:46:09 usually only takes a few years ;> 08:47:15 but sounds ok - just wouldn't like extremes 08:47:37 I think minmay would be good yeah 08:47:37 Zao, heh.. yeah.. 08:47:49 Zao, looking at dungeon.cc, I don't really see any signs of a rewrite, though :P 08:47:51 monqy's been cool too 08:48:12 Of course, I only read the game design section (and contributions, but there's not much traffic) 08:48:43 Zao, I've only rewritten some bits---like vault connectivity---and refactored other stuff.. 08:49:04 hehe, same here, Keskitalo ;) 08:49:40 -!- OG17 has joined ##crawl-dev 08:54:52 I think Jeff Vogel's post best summarises pretty well why devs shouldn't be arguing in forums at all http://jeff-vogel.blogspot.com/2011/01/three-reasons-creators-should-never.html 08:55:13 awesome link 08:55:20 You can argue about "neutrality" forever and get nowhere. I'd rather all the moderators are non-devs and devs don't get involved in arguments 08:55:24 But dpeg is enthusiastic :) 08:55:38 for now he is :> 08:55:56 but I heard there is at least one person the so-called Foe-list already ;D 08:56:06 *on the so-called 08:57:01 That chart on constructive feedback minmay posted was awesome :) 08:57:10 cliking on a wielded weapon behaves as ' instead of w- (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=3282) by petete 08:57:13 agreed :) 08:59:08 I also loved Pat Rothfuss' post on the Wise Man's Fear delay, even if it's not directly comparable: http://blog.patrickrothfuss.com/2009/02/concerning-release-of-book-two/ 08:59:49 I hadn't actually heard of Pat Rothfuss before reading that post, but I had to go buy Name of the Wind after that and it was awesome :) 09:02:15 hehe 09:02:31 got lost reading about linley's new game: http://quote-un-quote.tumblr.com/post/2178789666/interview-with-shmup-legend-linley-henzell 09:11:30 nice post, greensnark 09:23:10 no one seems to be awake in ##crawl, so could anyone here give me the exact wording for the portal out of the abyss? 09:23:39 'You pass through the gate.'? 09:23:52 no the name of the gate 09:23:58 ah 09:24:08 -!- cw_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:24:09 I want to set it up to fore_more_message 09:24:34 cause I swear I've walked past a portal before clicking too fast 09:24:52 "a gateway leading out of the abyss" 09:24:57 thanks 09:25:38 i can't remember whether force_more_message is case-sensitive, it might be 09:25:50 in which case it's actually Abyss 09:28:14 will that message pop up at all? 09:28:24 unless you walk onto it? 09:28:37 i mean.. there is no auto-explore possible to cause that message 09:28:40 i'm not sure actually 09:28:44 Napkin: Ooh, thank for the Linley interview link! 09:28:51 yeah, is it just autoexplore that outputs those messages? 09:28:53 :) 09:29:00 i thought maybe it was changed for normal travel to output them too 09:29:29 oh darn 09:29:32 I didnt think of that 09:29:48 actually the abyss does give you messages about items coming into view 09:30:18 ill just go do a wizmode game and test it 09:30:22 You get the messages even if you walk around now 09:30:30 yeah, it probably works 09:30:41 Napkin is still playing 0.7 ;) 09:30:54 Wise Man's Fear is still not done? 09:31:07 syllogism: It's been handed off to the publisher 09:31:43 yay stone soup gets a cheer in the interview 09:31:45 Pub date is March, not too far off 09:31:48 of course! no unstable (even if very luring!) games anymore, thanks ;) 09:31:48 yay 09:32:19 how about adding the exit as example to the force_more_message in init.txt? 09:32:28 my dad could definitely make good use of that ;) 09:34:32 i heard in tiles it's rather difficult to see 09:35:14 Well, tiles! 09:35:23 Lots of things are rather difficult to see in tiles :P 09:37:31 its not that hard to see in tiles 09:37:47 sometimes in abyss though you start mashup buttons though and going too fast 09:37:52 mashing* 09:39:23 oh I see tornado got changed again 09:42:51 Angry moth hmm, sounds familiar 09:43:18 -!- cw_ has joined ##crawl-dev 09:56:18 Angry moths portal vault 09:56:32 Where you shoot moths at death yaks 09:56:44 Or possibly at Kirke 10:16:03 -!- Cryp71c has joined ##crawl-dev 10:27:17 Yeah, should suggest "Moths of Wrath" for the name 10:28:42 !tell dpeg http://crpgaddict.blogspot.com/2011/01/nethack-23e-final-ranking.html 10:28:42 bhaak: OK, I'll let dpeg know. 10:29:35 I certainly like Viridian's comment. 10:30:14 You know you've done something not only when people love your work but also when they hate it with passion. :) 10:37:22 uhh, unnethack goes unicode? :D 10:37:40 in parts 10:37:50 nice, gogogo, bhaak :) 10:38:36 shouldn't it be called uninethack for that? 10:39:33 I'll do a posting about it probably tomorrow 10:40:41 and the iphone version would be iuninethack? 10:46:17 sounds good 10:46:35 bah 10:47:41 also, it's not general unicode, it's only a utf-8 hack and utf8nnethack looks ugly 10:48:05 why ugly? 10:48:27 I mean.. you can make it look the way you want, considering you have a lot more glyphs available 10:51:35 currently, it's only the map that got utf-8. no monsters, items or general text 10:51:52 although _I think_, monsters should be easy to do 10:57:48 DS tweaks, remove breath weapons (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=3283) by MarvintheParanoidAndroid 10:58:18 -!- galehar has quit [Quit: Page closed] 11:03:37 -!- enne has joined ##crawl-dev 11:12:30 moin enne 11:14:19 bhaak: uni-nethack means sleep/dream nethack in Finnish 11:55:57 -!- petete has joined ##crawl-dev 12:05:50 how come 53x46 is the max for vaults in orc? 12:07:04 Keskitalo: :) 12:09:46 st_, maximum in what sense? And what kind of vaults? 12:10:12 oh hm I didn't put an orient, that might be it 12:10:21 would anyone mind if I added a new category of links in the wordpress? 12:10:44 i'd like to link to unnethack's and glarn's blog 12:10:48 st_, such a large minivault could be troublesome, I guess 12:11:10 * bhaak doesn't mind 12:11:12 dpeg? 12:14:12 Keskitalo? 12:14:14 greensnark? 12:21:39 sorry, nlarn 12:33:46 Napkin: Sounds good to me. 12:38:03 done. 12:49:40 -!- monqy has joined ##crawl-dev 12:52:53 -!- ZChris13 has joined ##crawl-dev 13:03:28 -!- Textmode has joined ##crawl-dev 13:17:10 -!- ZChris13 has quit [Quit: Page closed] 13:24:38 * bhaak likes Napkin 13:34:50 kilobyte: the problem with sleep is that things almost immediately wake up - and that was *before* i added noise to recite 13:35:22 what it probably needs is something like a "forced sleep" effect, that lasts only several turns 13:40:01 Napkin: why not doomrl? 13:41:08 i don't have too much experience with it.. and the close-source nature made me not link to it 13:41:43 I linked to bhaak's project (open-source) and to the project jpeg is working on (open-source too) 13:42:36 didn't sorear work on doomrl? 13:42:48 but we do link to roguelikedevelopment.org and roguetemple.com, where all should be easily found 13:43:18 i don't know 13:50:40 -!- Giomancer has joined ##crawl-dev 13:51:23 yes he did http://forum.chaosforge.org/index.php/topic,1927.msg15571.html#msg15571 13:59:28 http://www.8bitfunding.com/project_details.php?p_id=65 - seriously? $6000? 14:00:50 the "Champion of the Land" title is interesting 14:02:22 1 claimed 10, 1 claimed 25, 1 claimed 50 -> total of $60 :-O 14:05:11 "5% or 10% of the profits" 14:05:24 if the game sells well you might get your investment back :) 14:05:52 unless you build it for the smartphone market, there is no change for that, i believe 14:08:52 as a flash game, you don't get the iOS market 14:09:24 android market is also promissing 14:23:57 toadstools stop click-travel (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=3284) by Galefury 14:28:31 -!- Giomancer has quit [Quit: I used to think I was indecisive, but now I'm not too sure.] 14:31:31 haha "if funded, we will be able to work full time (we live cheaply)" 14:33:27 -!- cw_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:36:20 -!- syllogism has quit [] 14:37:12 -!- galehar has joined ##crawl-dev 14:41:18 -!- cw_ has joined ##crawl-dev 14:44:44 Twinge: hi, wb 15:00:08 ok, and where is the morgue dir? 15:00:30 ahh, i think i found it 15:00:49 in whatever your working directory is 15:00:52 would anyone care if ignite poison were made to not affect the player/their inventory? right now it's a powerful effect, but extremely hard to use due to skills and conflicting with evaporate 15:01:05 for windows at least 15:01:21 the spell itself is okay, it's just that it requires synergy to be really useful and that synergy is being hampered by the schools / the side effects 15:01:37 i think making that change would be better than trying to reduce the level of the spell or alter its schools 15:02:01 i found the save dir 15:02:31 (it'd also give non-earth transmuters something to do that's not a form and is higher level than Evaporate) 15:02:34 but on vista+ users can't write on the programs directory 15:03:06 oops, i meant to ask this on ##crawl, sorry 15:04:12 Eronarn: I think it's a good move 15:04:33 well that's enough confirmation for me, time to make a patch 15:06:34 was it always L6? I thought it was L5 15:06:46 galehar: it might've been L5 tri-school before? 15:06:54 not sure if it got a level bump when it became dual school 15:07:06 maybe 15:07:20 i would rather see it L6, and maybe bump power if needbe, tbh; we need more spells in the 5 to 8 range 15:07:24 good spells, that is 15:07:35 lots of great low level ones, not enough interesting midlevel ones 15:07:58 that's right 15:08:17 -!- jbenedetto has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 15:08:34 although I don't see any reason why it should be fire and not poison (nor the opposite) 15:09:12 unknown mimics stop click-travel (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=3285) by Galefury 15:09:14 galehar: there was much discussion over that 15:09:20 personally, i favor an 'any two' approach 15:09:30 tmut + fire, fire + poison, or poison + tmut 15:10:21 however, tmut + fire will work okay if it now works with evaporate 15:10:30 right, dual school is probably better 15:10:30 since that is also tmut + fire 15:10:43 yes 15:10:53 though imo evaporate badly needs to be affected by power 15:11:19 -!- jbenedetto has joined ##crawl-dev 15:11:36 for that, we need to add spell power to clouds which would also allow use to scale MC better 15:12:20 reduce duration of cloud effects and tie cloud duration to spell power 15:12:25 which is possible with current code 15:13:06 static int _ignite_poison_objects(coord_def where, int pow, int, actor *) 15:13:06 { UNUSED(pow); 15:13:12 cool i love spells that don't use power 15:13:36 galehar: i am actually going to be mucking around with the cloud struct anyways, so i might add it in 15:14:10 that would be great 15:15:03 the way i am looking at handling swarms is: they are clouds, and clouds now contain a struct of monster stats 15:15:06 if you just reduce effect duration then the cloud's length will actually matter because you'll need more power to keep something confused 15:15:59 this would also let non-swarm clouds have some monster stats, for other cloud-like monsters 15:16:29 and then have stuff like cloud->as_monster() 15:17:05 i don't know if this sounds excessive, but it's the best way i can think of to handle something that generally works as a cloud but needs to show up on @?, have resists/HP, etc. 15:18:23 I think I missed something. What are swarms? Have you proposed that on the wiki or something? 15:19:05 galehar: swarms are clouds of insects, tiny animals, etc; there is not a wiki page for them yet, i want to code them just to code them 15:19:23 oh ok 15:19:55 i have spent far too long posting ideas for crawl, so now that i'm coding, i want to take a code-first, discuss-later approach 15:19:56 but then, maybe you could make a derived class, so as to not burden all clouds with a monster structure 15:20:13 nice policy :) 15:20:48 we have much more ideas floating around than available coding power! 15:21:00 can one just have in the cloud struct, struct MonsterStats = NULL, and only put something there if there is monster stats needed? or does that eat up a bunch of resources 15:22:24 it doesn't eat much ressource, but I just think it's an inferior design. I like beautiful code :) 15:23:47 if you can point me to an example in the crawl code that's like how you'd do it, i'd be glad to look at it, but i don't know enough C++ to do anything sophisticated without copying someone else 15:24:57 ok, let me look for something that illustrate inheritance without being too complexe 15:25:22 i know the basics of OO, have done it in java and PHP 15:25:26 i just don't know how it works in C++ 15:30:25 there is the player and monster classes which are both derived of the actor class 15:31:31 but if you don't feel like messing with inheritance, do it with the tools you know, and we'll refactor it if we feel like we need to. 15:32:06 i don't mind inheritance, i just don't want to dig around crawl code for weeks 15:32:16 it has a large codebase 15:32:47 -!- purge has joined ##crawl-dev 15:33:12 indeed :) 15:34:43 does anyone know why clubs are throwable? 15:35:05 clubs are actually good throwing weapons 15:35:13 historically, they have been used for such 15:35:33 there are many examples of throwing sticks from hunting cultures 15:36:06 hmm... ok 15:37:06 that's essentially what a boomerang is - the real ones don't return, you just whack something with them 15:37:40 http://www.metmuseum.org/toah/works-of-art/1978.412.870 oh, here's a great example 15:37:55 except a club isn't really shaped like a boomerang and must be quite clumsy to throw effectively 15:38:52 oh, this is *great* for photos: http://www.metmuseum.org/toah/hi/hi_armsarmor.htm 15:38:57 when I play a caster type, I usually mass hoarde clubs for the first few xl 15:39:02 and throw them 15:39:08 this was especially the case on a FE 15:39:17 well realistically, no, you can't throw most kinds of clubs 15:39:26 but there are also many spears that aren't balanced for throwing 15:40:12 I think crawl's clubs are just random chunks of wood 15:43:31 ooh, cool http://www.metmuseum.org/toah/works-of-art/1978.412.865 15:47:22 clubs have a base damage of 5. Thrown stones of 2. I don't think throwing random chunks of wood should hurt more than stones... 15:48:13 So basically, it's quite unrealistic, but a big part of the "throw random junk" early levels strategy. 15:51:04 stones are like pebbles 15:51:10 clubs are big pieces of wood 15:51:14 they're big enough to club things with 15:52:28 I don't think the argument of "unrealistic" should ever be used, but from a gameplay perspective i don't think most players would expect throwing random clubs to do much 15:53:16 does apply_area_visible hit your own square? 15:54:41 purge: well yes, that's the point. It's kind of spoilery, nobody expect thrown clubs to be that effective. 15:57:47 also, hmm... should ignite poison be KILLED_BY_MONSTER, KILLED_BY_BURNING, KILLED_BY_BEAM? 15:57:53 not sure which is appropriate 15:58:42 isn't KILLED_BY for monster spells? 16:00:22 yes, i'm implementing monster ignite poison too :3 16:01:11 it would've been a shame to chuck out all the logic for self-affecting 16:01:43 so i've moved it into its own function, which normal ignite poison won't call, but monster ignite poison will 16:03:39 ok, so maybe tweak the inventory destruction so that it doesn't destroy all the potions of transmuters 16:04:29 galehar: at the moment i am just making it not touch the player or their inventory at all (but it does still affect their square, so if they're standing in a poisonous cloud, etc.) 16:04:39 if that becomes too powerful it can be toned back down 16:05:38 so if you're poisoned, it doesn't turn into sticky flame :) 16:06:47 -!- Zet has left ##crawl-dev 16:07:22 yeah, and you can't unpoison yourself with it... but really, nobody used the spell for that purpose 16:07:34 and the self-damage if you are poisonous has always been trivial 16:10:43 it'd be nice if someone, after i submit this patch, gets one that hits monster inventories :) 16:18:50 oh cool, i was going to do ignite poison at some point soon 16:18:56 glad you beat me to it though :P 16:19:26 MarvinPA: well you beat me to like 3 spells, so :P 16:19:45 :) 16:20:17 i'd have done pretty much exactly the same though, reduce or remove the whole potion-destroying thing 16:20:29 maybe lower a level, definitely tweak the schools 16:21:02 def. lower a level 16:21:03