00:01:58 -!- valrus_ has joined ##crawl-dev 00:34:38 -!- enne has joined ##crawl-dev 00:36:17 -!- valrus_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:38:41 -!- enne has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:49:11 -!- valrus has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:55:29 -!- Pseudonut has joined ##crawl-dev 01:01:38 -!- upsy has joined ##crawl-dev 01:38:34 neutral mennas 01:38:40 _Mennas says, "Carry on, mortal." 01:38:57 isn't mennas' flavourgimmick lack of tongue 01:39:00 also: 01:39:05 offscreen mennas casts silence at stuff 01:39:06 monky: yes, bug: file. 01:39:09 _Everything around you gets eerily quiet. 01:39:12 should I file that too 01:39:16 Both bugs. 01:39:19 File individually plz! 01:39:29 will do 01:44:42 offscreen monster silence prints message (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=2862) by MrMisterMonkey 01:44:42 neutralizing Mennas contradicts flavour (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=2861) by MrMisterMonkey 02:00:50 -!- Noom has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 02:14:02 -!- enne has joined ##crawl-dev 02:23:05 -!- galehar has joined ##crawl-dev 02:29:57 -!- gamefreak264 has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 02:30:32 -!- monky has quit [Quit: hello] 02:35:19 -!- Kurper has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:46:15 -!- gamefreak264 has joined ##crawl-dev 03:08:19 moin! 03:08:55 hey napking! 03:09:08 hey due - how's it going? :) 03:25:14 -!- Pacra_ has quit [Write error: Connection reset by peer] 03:25:33 -!- Pacra_ has joined ##crawl-dev 03:39:29 -!- Pseudonut has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:47:03 03kilobyte * rf5a7919ee86d 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-pick.cc: Remove unfitting monsters from Dwarf, sanitize rarities. 03:47:31 03chriscampbell89 * r9417dd15793d 10/crawl-ref/source/spl-util.cc: Don't incorrectly mark Lev/Flight as useless 05:27:16 -!- Mu_ has joined ##crawl-dev 05:30:30 -!- gamefreak264 has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 05:55:18 -!- OG17 has quit [Quit: OG17] 06:08:25 -!- OG17 has joined ##crawl-dev 06:26:52 -!- Pacra_ is now known as Pacra 07:01:59 -!- syllogism has joined ##crawl-dev 07:33:07 -!- enne has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:10:47 -!- enne has joined ##crawl-dev 08:18:17 hey, I have a pure C++ question 08:18:21 let's sat 08:18:35 let's say I have an object with a member of type std::vector 08:19:17 I create several TextItem. If I clear the vector, are the objects automatically deleted, or do I have to do it? 08:19:35 you will leak 08:19:49 if you reserve them with new but do not delete them 08:19:55 and lose the pointer while clearing the vector 08:20:10 ok 08:20:41 I guess I also need to delete them in the destructor 08:50:20 -!- valrus has joined ##crawl-dev 08:55:05 -!- valrus has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 08:57:12 "Found *" messages for cleared levels (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=2863) by st 09:14:47 -!- Pacra_ has joined ##crawl-dev 09:14:47 -!- Pacra has quit [Write error: Connection reset by peer] 09:16:42 -!- Pacra__ has joined ##crawl-dev 09:16:43 -!- Pacra_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:17:39 -!- Pacra_ has joined ##crawl-dev 09:18:37 -!- Vandal| has joined ##crawl-dev 09:24:36 -!- Sequell has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 09:24:36 -!- Vandal has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 09:24:37 -!- Pacra__ has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 09:25:17 -!- Sequell has joined ##crawl-dev 09:29:53 -!- stabwound has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:30:15 -!- jld has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 09:30:57 -!- ivan has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 10:11:32 -!- ivan has joined ##crawl-dev 10:14:07 what's the difference between #define FOO 1 and const int FOO = 1; 10:16:03 -!- jld has joined ##crawl-dev 10:17:24 -!- valrus has joined ##crawl-dev 10:21:21 -!- dpeg has joined ##crawl-dev 10:21:25 Cheers 10:22:37 -!- Textmode has joined ##crawl-dev 10:24:21 hey 10:32:15 03dolorous * r166ec74f3d3a 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-cast.cc: Fix Mantis 2862. 10:44:12 -!- galehar has quit [Quit: Page closed] 10:51:23 -!- valrus_ has joined ##crawl-dev 10:56:52 -!- Textmode has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:02:17 03dolorous * rebcdfd4a62f1 10/crawl-ref/source/ (godabil.cc mon-cast.cc): Fix collateral damage problem with Yred's Drain Life. 11:03:09 -!- Textmode has joined ##crawl-dev 11:15:30 03dolorous * r1aa0a81f8389 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-stuff.cc: Fix apostrophization in monster equipment corrosion message. 11:18:56 -!- Textmode has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:23:13 -!- Elvashi has joined ##crawl-dev 11:23:47 03dolorous * r76feaa5447e3 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-act.cc: Simplify. 11:24:27 03dolorous * re65715a652e1 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-cast.cc: Fully fix collateral damage problem with Yred's Drain Life. 11:24:51 -!- elliptic has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:26:58 -!- Noom has joined ##crawl-dev 11:42:21 !seen Eronarn 11:42:22 I last saw Eronarn at Tue Nov 23 10:21:53 2010 UTC (7h 20m 29s ago) saying oh well, bedtime on ##crawl. 11:48:32 -!- Elvashi is now known as Textmode 12:02:43 -!- valrus_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:04:36 -!- monky has joined ##crawl-dev 12:08:28 -!- valrus_ has joined ##crawl-dev 12:35:06 dpeg: sup? 12:42:53 -!- valrus_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:42:58 Hi there 12:43:08 Eronarn: I asked dolorous to commit on the new Recite. 12:43:31 I want to have him say something up front, else we may not get his honest opinion- 12:43:38 thanks 12:46:01 I'll comment afterwards (nutshell: idea has potential and patch should be used; only potential issues are overlaps with E or TSO, which can be worked around). 12:46:39 well, patch needs some rewriting first... i am a worse coder than you!! :P 12:47:09 and the balance is definitely able to be improved; the duration/power values are basically filler right now 12:47:53 the overlap is an issue, but i think it is possible to differentiate by restricting what it's useful on & with the zin conducts 12:49:59 * dpeg seriously doubts there are worse coders than him. 12:51:27 then you never saw code from a musician 12:51:52 -!- valrus_ has joined ##crawl-dev 12:53:06 well, "musician", he's just a lead singer of a band 12:55:15 -!- valrus has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:56:02 bhaak: i am a social science major ;) 12:58:24 Eronarn: that means I would wanna read what you write in prose, but I don't have any prejudices about social scientists doing programming :-) 12:58:57 some of them are actually okay... but, i am not so good (especially as i am just learning C++) 12:59:34 the current recite code works in isolation but probably is buggy/overly expensive/crash-prone 13:04:21 bhaak: which are you thinking of? 13:11:36 -!- gamefreak264 has joined ##crawl-dev 13:13:21 -!- valrus_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:16:25 -!- valrus has joined ##crawl-dev 13:17:40 sorear: the musician? just one mildly popular in switzerland, formerly working at the company I'm at now 13:18:27 DJ Bobo! 13:19:19 I didn't say, mildly popular in switzerland, but more popular in germany than david hasselhof 13:20:03 david hasselhof is wildly popular in Germany 13:20:20 "I am looking for freakdom..." 13:20:21 dj bobo is more popular 13:27:36 -!- valrus_ has joined ##crawl-dev 13:32:41 -!- gamefreak264 has quit [Excess Flood] 13:39:20 -!- Zaba has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 13:42:19 -!- Zaba has joined ##crawl-dev 13:44:14 -!- valrus has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:44:21 !tell galehar Next time we're both around, please remind me to talk about - and * dropping commands. I'll also try to think of it. 13:44:22 dpeg: OK, I'll let galehar know. 13:51:09 -!- Kurper has joined ##crawl-dev 13:52:55 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:53:59 -!- valrus has joined ##crawl-dev 14:02:31 -!- TGWi has joined ##crawl-dev 14:02:58 -!- hashc has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 14:17:02 -!- Noom has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 14:23:40 Eronarn: the "easily resists" etc. messages are awesome, aren't they? 14:24:04 -!- valrus has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:25:16 yes 14:25:23 but a little buggy I think 14:25:30 feature (or at least portal) mimic oddity: they twitch on attempted apportation just like item mimics 14:25:34 I get easily resists, then it works on the next try 14:26:27 sorear: it only resisted easily that one time... a matter of dice rolls, I think. 14:26:48 monky: bug report! 14:27:08 -!- valrus has joined ##crawl-dev 14:28:27 sorear: I also like the messages how easily the monsters (or the player) evade. 14:29:30 agreed 14:34:08 feature mimics twitch and identify on attempted apportation (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=2864) by MrMisterMonkey 14:44:15 -!- valrus has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:51:25 sorear: that's a matter of the MR check die roll being ridiculous :P 14:52:34 -!- stabwound has joined ##crawl-dev 14:52:56 -!- valrus has joined ##crawl-dev 14:56:09 so, thought: we already have Ereshkigal, we should have Gilgamesh and Enkidu 14:59:22 and a quest to find and tame Enkidu! 14:59:33 but then you also need to implement sex 15:00:30 bhaak: isn't there some way to achieve the same with pyromancy? 15:00:39 Also, +1 to Gilgamesh. 15:01:08 One of the CDO players is called Ereshkugel, I have to smile every time I see him play. 15:01:32 i'm thinking they could be a pair of holies or something 15:02:55 dpeg: (a)pply wand of fire to edible animal, (e)at cooked meat 15:03:10 uses cooking skill 15:03:57 oh, by the way, i had a cute idea 15:04:04 demonic crawlers: bloated bodies on spidery legs 15:04:13 i think they should be bloated because they are filled with more demons 15:04:18 -!- syllogism has quit [] 15:04:43 kill 'em, or maybe even land a very strong single blow, and they pop open 15:05:44 -!- valrus has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:05:51 all hail Marduk the creator! 15:09:37 in good games Marduk has been replaced by random creators! 15:11:28 -!- valrus has joined ##crawl-dev 15:12:47 -!- valrus has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:13:08 by the way, with the Unicode rewrite, we should name an unique "π’‚—π’ƒΆπ’Ίπ’€­π’ˆΎ" 15:13:17 (blah to those of you without proper fonts) 15:13:20 bhaak: <3 15:16:23 dpeg: the idea of shedu comes from you, right? 15:16:50 no no 15:17:12 * dpeg washes his hands in a large tub filled with innocence. 15:17:17 -!- Guest82750 has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 15:17:36 I bet you'll claim it's not you but those pesky Sumerians. 15:18:42 I just wonder where the part about shedu coming in pairs comes from. Wouldn't it be better to have one shedu one lamassu in each pair? 15:18:47 kilobyte: I encouraged people to think of holy monsters, but I never came up with the shedu. 15:19:03 same species, shedu is male, lamassu female 15:19:04 kilobyte: I cannot possibly answer. But due should! :) 15:19:35 right, he'll wake up and come here in 2-3 hours 15:20:52 yes 15:21:30 interesting that two spellings are lammasu and lamassu, but never lamasu or lammassu 15:22:11 but then, I don't claim I have a clue about Sumerian/Babylonian/Akkadian mythology 15:22:21 implement lamasus and lammassus 15:24:20 at least there's no doubt about the 300 years rule here :p 15:24:53 kilobyte: :) 15:25:05 They might meet the 3000 years rule. 15:25:31 anything younger than 300 years isn't fantasy? 15:25:39 is bad 15:25:49 not good enough for Crawl 15:26:44 how many fights did you have about vampires? :) 15:26:48 except for obtuse rick astley and electric six references right 15:27:46 bhaak: usually you can argue that the true, proper,original version appeared much earlier in some obscure publication :) 15:28:06 monky: Rick Astley does not feature in Crawl. 15:28:07 * bhaak wonders how he could have died to an electricity spewing nikola 15:28:35 dpeg: ally speech references "never gonna give you up" 15:28:45 dpeg: in case of vampires, the original form is MORE boring than stoker's :-) 15:29:01 -!- upsy has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:29:11 bhaak: doesn't matter. The timestamp counts :) 15:29:22 monky: yes, but this is implicit -- we don't have a Rick unique. 15:29:32 -!- bmh has joined ##crawl-dev 15:29:32 -!- bmh has quit [Changing host] 15:29:32 -!- bmh has joined ##crawl-dev 15:29:50 oh I see 15:29:51 "deep dwarf unborn" sounds plural to my native English ears 15:30:11 heck, it also sounds singular. 15:30:29 it sounds like a classification 15:30:56 hm? 15:31:13 it's also a really disgusting mental image 15:31:20 :( 15:35:01 -!- Pacra_ is now known as Pacra 15:35:39 deep dwarf ratcatcher 15:38:27 Gilgamesh is 5.7k years old... 3k means we can include David's rule but not Solomon's. 15:38:51 kilobyte: sorry? 15:39:00 Full changelog for Crawl 1.2: "Made all parts compatible with the 4k rule." 15:39:08 Crawl 40k! 15:39:12 :) 15:39:21 All names must be older than 3k/4k to be used? 15:39:26 I foresee a stream of Neanderthal uniques. 15:39:41 Gilgamesh should *not* be used. People are familiar with it. 15:39:59 bmh: we're making fun of the alleged rule (generally attributed to me) that outside content must be older than 300 years to be used in Crawl. 15:40:01 where as Pliny is about 1950 years old and most people don't know who Pliny is. 15:40:03 bmh: referencing things we talked about just before you logged on. Ie, Mezopotamian stuff. 15:40:19 bmh: Which Pliny? Younger or Elder? 15:40:39 dpeg: most people. You're a university professor, you don't count. 15:41:29 what about dinosaurs? 15:41:40 I suspect that Roman History is not particularly fancied these days... although it does have all the good bits: lots of violence, lots of drama, lots of sex. 15:41:55 bhaak: we generously leave the dinosaurs to you. 15:42:03 There's always Priapus 15:42:03 Velociraptor Paladin 15:42:41 * dpeg hands bhaak a hypsilophodon, a deinonychus and a rhamporynchus. 15:43:02 how about geometric dinosaurs? 15:43:10 I was expecting a dpegosauros 15:43:22 The iscoahedrosauros? 15:44:08 I bet the dinosaurs didn't realise how lucky they were: no cat allergies. 15:44:11 dpeg: I think since the tv series "Rome" people know about all the good bits 15:44:32 dpeg: what do you think was the real reason they went extinct??? 15:44:36 Not everyone watched that 15:44:46 everyone should have 15:44:50 bmh: there should be Geometricians to go with Geomancers. 15:44:51 I've never owned a television. 15:44:55 bhaak: what do I know? I just happened to read a billion dinosaur books with my son. 15:45:21 bhaak: it is interesting that this was not the first large scale extinction period in Earth's history. 15:45:25 dpeg: at the end of the dinosaurs there already were little, furry mammals around 15:45:33 Also, why did the trilobites have to go? I am still bitter. 15:45:47 dpeg: there were many extinctions 15:45:53 bhaak: yes, mammals existed for quite some time actually. I think we can agree that the cats are to blame. 15:45:56 -!- galehar has joined ##crawl-dev 15:46:00 galehar: hi! 15:46:02 at least we still have the noble nautilus 15:46:05 hi 15:46:05 galehar: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 15:46:07 how about a unique called Hippasus? 15:46:15 !messages 15:46:16 (1/1) dpeg said (2h 1m 53s ago): Next time we're both around, please remind me to talk about - and * dropping commands. I'll also try to think of it. 15:46:18 No hippies in my game. 15:46:25 also, hey, add trilobites to shoals 15:46:34 after the cambrian explosion ended, everything went downhill 15:46:35 dpeg: I bet you think sqrt(2) is rational. 15:46:48 bhaak: <3 15:47:06 galehar: tell me when you got a moment... it's not much. 15:47:21 we can talk now 15:48:45 Cool... so after your birthday present I immediately set out to update the pickup help screen. Turns out there's misinformation on there: while - and , probably work as advertised for dropping (i.e. only apply to useless items), * does not. 15:49:11 birthday present? 15:49:14 So this is a bug. But I would suggest to remove the drop_filter from the - command when dropping, I don't think it is useful. 15:49:36 (I don't think that - is useful at all, though.) 15:50:57 so what's missing is * to select all when dropping? 15:51:07 Definitely, yes. 15:51:23 And there's the question about whether drop_filter should apply to - when dropping. 15:51:55 galehar: actually, * is supposed to invert selection... so ** would select all. 15:53:13 pickup menu works fine, right? 15:53:18 yes 15:53:28 drop_filter doesn't apply there :) 15:53:50 for the drop menu, ',' select all useless, and * should invert 15:54:09 - could deselect everything, just like in the pickup menu 15:54:29 yes, I'd think that's best although I am not sure anyone uses - at all 15:54:44 -!- bmh has quit [Quit: bmh] 15:54:48 also, I have been thinking it would be great to have a "drop last pickup" command 15:54:56 galehar: oh, that's level 2 15:55:01 Did you see my ^ proposal? 15:55:25 which one? 15:55:40 For all actions, ^ should be a short cut to the item last picked up. E.g. d^ would drop the item last picked up. r^ would read the last item etc. 15:55:56 oh yes 15:56:08 The point is that you don't have to bother with whatever key slot the item got assigned if you want to drop/apply it just yet. 15:56:29 It's slightly sad that ^ is a shifted key on US keyboards, but hey :) 15:56:39 but in the case of picking up and dropping, ^ could refer to several items 15:57:04 That's true... we should find a solution. 15:57:23 well, I think that's fine 15:57:38 for pickup and drop 15:57:44 ok 15:58:19 but if you pickup several potions and then q^, maybe you get a prompt with all the potions you've just picked up 15:58:26 galehar: good idea 15:58:40 this isn't gonna be easy 15:58:46 ok, stop 15:58:57 We could also make D = drop item(s) last picked up 15:59:22 No need for submenus and stuff. Also one keystroke less for the most important application. 15:59:38 I'll start by fixing * and '-' in drop, I'll think about ^and D later 15:59:42 :) 15:59:58 I'll commit the help screen then 16:04:08 -!- Cryp71c has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:04:18 -!- MakMorn has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:05:48 -!- MakMorn has joined ##crawl-dev 16:10:41 actually, in the pickup menu, both , and * invert selection, so that needs fixing too 16:11:46 galehar: ah, I only use ,,, to select all items when picking up, so I never tried 16:12:37 shouldn't * select everything? seems more intuitive 16:14:51 Erik once mentioned that * does this XOR thing (invert selection) also in other contexts... I forget which. 16:18:30 -!- Pacra has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:18:33 , is pickup everything 16:18:35 or g 16:18:52 not sure when you'd need invert selection but I don't see any problem with it 16:20:55 Erik has been using all kinds of things... for example Ctrl-F for pickup/drop, I've witnessed this. 16:21:54 ...how does that work? 16:22:24 Siber: try it! 16:22:49 There's a help screen for pickup/drop, by the way. Accessed via _ as ? was obviously out of the question. 16:23:11 help screen access should probably be made more consistent 16:23:45 not possible 16:23:50 too few keys 16:23:59 anything is possible with enough time and effort 16:24:38 telepathic help screens 16:24:50 smart help 16:25:10 "Hi! You seem to be trying to find a wand. I can help!" 16:25:11 I think Crawl's pretty good when it comes to helping the unsuspecting player. 16:25:16 surely there's a character that nothing uses for non-help 16:25:30 Siber: along comes a goblin with a wand? 16:25:40 hehe 16:26:05 -!- paxed has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 16:26:05 a wand of death! 16:27:15 ein Gobelin an der Wand ist doch nicht schlimm 16:27:34 What happens when you have both Fast and Berserk statuses? If they stack, that's crazy. If the berserk overrides the Fast, the Fast should probably be darkgrey to avoid confusion. 16:27:38 Unsere Schweizer :) 16:28:01 I'm collecting horrible puns for nethack-de :) 16:29:40 I support that. Cannot go wrong with puns. 16:43:41 I just saw the electricity in water effect for the first time. Very nice. 16:45:35 -!- paxed has joined ##crawl-dev 16:46:17 the color choice is a bit weird 17:02:07 -!- Pacra has joined ##crawl-dev 17:03:36 We should really try to get those piety **** on the main screen. 17:04:23 maybe make it share a line with the god 17:04:40 stealing lines from the monster list = bad 17:05:46 of course 17:05:52 yes, the *' 17:05:59 s should come after the god 17:06:23 This just needs a little rearrangement, as the second line may be too short. I think the "Level 12" piece has to move to the first line. 17:06:37 have we considered doing AC: XX EV: XX SH: XX 17:06:39 on one line 17:06:44 you could get another line by putting defenses and attributes in -- what eronarn said 17:06:45 yes, doy did 17:06:47 I've already suggested that 17:06:52 hey, no, I did :( 17:07:06 TGWi: could it happen that sometimes different people have the same idea? 17:07:16 let's not be crazy here 17:07:22 Didn't you claim authorship of another idea yesterday? 17:07:31 we have to read all the irc log to find out! 17:07:39 galehar: :) 17:08:08 AC: ... EV: ... SH: ... saves a line, but looks odd with the Str: ... Dex: ... Int: ... beneath it. 17:08:24 there's plenty of room to line them up 17:08:25 dpeg: yes, he claimed the automagic behaviour of the cursor 17:08:30 ST: ... IQ: ... DX: ... 17:08:35 like, leave a space before AC/EV/SH 17:09:07 how many spaces are available horizontally with default settings? 17:09:34 galehar: righto! 17:10:32 I could actually go for an option to eliminate the titles 17:10:46 Quite often, I present ideas which turn out to be originating from someone else; this process can be subconscious. Only, in contrast with TGWi, I don't complain about that, I like a good idea no matter where it comes from :) 17:10:52 TGWi: no way! 17:10:55 -!- dpeg is now known as titlepeg 17:11:01 print 13 / 12 / 0 on one line, then 11 / 20 / 9 on the next 17:11:34 this is if horizontal space is inadequate 17:11:51 but AC/EV/SH and Str/Int/Dex are really ingrained in me 17:11:51 TGWi: and what about the Dex, AC etc.? 17:12:18 oh, I didn't mean the "Petrodigitator" type titles (except petrodigitator) 17:12:26 TGWi: ah, what else? 17:12:57 an option to print defenses and stats horizontally with no "Str" explicitly said 17:13:28 (again, only if it looks weird with the stat names; not sure how much space is there 17:13:39 I don't think that's desirable... first, we should be stingy with new options. Second, think of spectators, they should get as much information as possible. 17:13:56 Health: 13/15 ====================---- 17:14:08 I assume " AC: XX EV: XX SH: XX" "Str: XX Int: XX Dex: XX" would fit fine 17:14:18 absolutely 17:14:24 yeah, the health bar is way longer than that 17:14:27 but it looks a little odd either way, trust me 17:14:33 it might be nice to move the location and xp 17:14:39 they don't really fit in currently 17:14:50 exp pool on main screen is hyper-necessary 17:14:51 There's a Mantis item about this, btw. 17:15:02 place is hyper-necessary, too, now that I think about it 17:15:04 Eronarn the Conjurer 17:16:02 TGWi: we have removed gold and turncount, don't think we can cut more 17:16:02 can someone put an entire 80x24 screen on pastebin somewhere? 17:16:05 Level 16 High Elf (Lair:2, 4252 XP) 17:16:18 XXX of Okawaru (***...) 17:16:33 Eronarn: if like this, it should be "Level 16 High Elf at Lair:2" 17:16:39 Eronarn: Level 16 Yellow Draconian (Ossuary, 20000 XP) 17:16:44 I cannot find this Mantis item 17:16:50 Mottled Draconian 17:17:05 yeah, there's probably something longer than ossuary, too 17:17:17 ice cave 17:17:18 Vaults:8 17:17:22 vaults:8 yeah 17:17:34 i think this is more of a problem with draconians though tbh 17:17:40 i don't think they need to list their colour there 17:17:49 https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=1139 17:18:01 I'm not a fan of listing exp pool up with the relatively static and less useful information 17:18:07 Eronarn: again, for spectators it's interesting 17:18:25 TGWi: yes, but unavoidable for now... in the future, there may be a chance to get rid of it. 17:18:45 -!- titlepeg is now known as dpeg 17:18:52 I mean what Eronarn's suggesting (lumping it with your XL) 17:20:30 i wonder if we could move the xp pool / location to the right of str/dex 17:20:45 location should be prominent 17:20:46 not a huge fan of three col, but i also don't like having those two as a row 17:21:33 If I would design a game from ground up, I'd avoid almost all of those numbers altogether. 17:21:46 Exp Pool probably wouldn't fit unless it were "XP:" though 17:22:45 but, we could then go: XP: xxx \n Gold: xxx \n Place: 17:23:09 (or something else, if we don't want gold back) 17:23:46 be aware that we need space for Str: 17 (23) 17:23:51 -!- galehar has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.12/20101026210630]] 17:24:11 could be displayed as 17/23 17:24:17 (which has the added bonus of being clearer) 17:24:34 Eronarn: show_gold_turns is an option 17:24:38 ah 17:24:47 since neither of those things are important 17:25:14 ac/ev/sh never have parentheses right? 17:25:26 nope 17:25:27 wizmode 17:25:37 you get something in parentheses next to AC (gdr?) 17:25:42 we could make the gap between them smaller maybe 17:25:50 that eats up a lot of space atm 17:25:58 wizmode: an important interface consideration 17:28:15 hmm... two digit str lines up nicely with three digit HP (unrotted, no stat damage) 17:28:58 and it would free up a TON of space for a third column 17:29:09 3 lines almost the size of the HP bar 17:30:19 oh, here's a radical option: move the status lights there 17:30:43 then they'd be right next to your HP/MP bars 17:30:47 you should make a mock up, I've no idea what you mean 17:31:00 henry cipolla is henryci? 17:31:12 yes 17:31:23 also, please use the Mantis item I've linked ^ 17:31:38 he has no aliases listed on the devteam page 17:32:05 i'll make a mockup, one sec 17:35:50 i don't like having the monster list in the middle on doy's suggestion 17:36:23 Mu_: hi! 17:36:25 imo, take all the information and remove the empty space 17:36:27 all of it 17:36:30 for maximum efficiency 17:36:33 hey 17:36:48 TGWi: a maximally compressed status area will look intimidating. 17:37:27 overhaul exp such that there is no need for exp pool; remove exp pool 17:38:02 AC12EV23SH0Str11Int18Dex8Exp2 17:38:11 000PlaceVaults8 17:38:14 that's what it should look like 17:38:33 i'd love having piety stars on the main display 17:38:34 we would have like fifteen lines for the monster list! 17:39:43 Mu_: will come 17:39:57 Folks here are not as determined to be constructive as they could, however. 17:40:12 Mu_: I find myself looking up % for the stars so often... 17:40:18 same here :) 17:42:42 Eronarn is exempt, he's been constructive... but the obstructors!!! :P 17:43:12 my suggestion about the exp pool is serious :( 17:43:34 TGWi: it'd be cool if the monster list were two lines 17:43:40 er columns 17:43:48 monky: we will not hurry and come up with a premature xp revamp only to free one line from the status section. 17:44:02 half a line :P 17:44:02 Eronarn: hm, that could often work 17:47:16 just hiding the pool might stop most victory dancing :) 17:47:29 -!- Kurper has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 17:47:40 Mu_: that's the Nethack approach to balance :) 17:47:44 haha 17:49:38 dpeg: yes, lots of monsters have short names... we can have options for the sorting 17:49:53 like: let one of the columns be for items instead of monsters 17:50:13 or always show uniques first 17:52:41 -!- TGWi has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:54:18 item list would be so nice, yes 17:54:34 I made proposals for that... let items grow from bottom upwards, for example 17:55:44 -!- TGWi has joined ##crawl-dev 18:00:57 mmm, i've got something *really* different looking 18:00:58 but i like it 18:01:04 will link in a few 18:02:03 cool 18:05:20 Multiple malign gateways (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=2865) by Mu 18:13:32 there's a crash with malign gateway: if a pan lord/ghost/... casts it and the portal expires, the tentacle assumes it's you who called it 18:14:06 which fails an assertion on the arena -- and is wrong elsewhere, too 18:14:57 odd, i didn't experience a crash while playing around with it 18:15:14 what about making severed tentacles neutral, ie, hostile to both you and monsters? 18:15:32 kilobyte: so attacking anyone? Sounds good. 18:15:41 that sounds like the intended behaviour 18:20:15 oh, darn, dinner 18:20:25 Eronarn: not now! 18:20:29 We need the screen :) 18:21:18 So, um, the output from Sequell for "!lg * ckiller=~pandemonium min=xl x=ckiller" is a little strange. 18:22:31 In particular, I do not think that Sigmund The Iguana is actually a pan lord. 18:23:46 the bots assume that everything unknown is a pan lord 18:24:01 I vaguely recall greensnark fixing that, but I may be wrong 18:24:12 !lg * ckiller=~pandemonium min=xl x=ckiller,cv 18:24:13 107. [ckiller=a pandemonium lord;cv=0.8-a] Eronarn the Insei (L2 DSTm), blasted by Sigmund the iguana (puff of flame) on D:3 on 2010-09-24, with 206 points after 2733 turns and 0:06:22. 18:24:41 0.8, so I am wrong 18:24:55 Oh right. I don't need to religiously avoid doing bot queries in here like for ##crawl. (-: 18:25:55 you can talk to Sequell privately if you want 18:26:51 Well, I was, but I meant I could also have just done the query in here to demonstrate. 18:27:41 yeah, of course... but I don't understand your previous line then 18:29:04 That could have been clearer. I meant that I'd gotten so used to doing bot queries in /msg that it didn't occur to me to just ask Sequell in here instead of summarizing the result. 18:29:31 hii people 18:29:45 Hi due! 18:29:47 We 18:29:49 have 18:29:50 been 18:29:52 talking 18:29:53 about you! 18:30:04 ban dpeg, he's spamming 18:30:06 Of course, now I've dumped all kinds of text in here explaining the nature of my confusion, so the whole conciseness thing kind of goes out the window. /-: 18:30:18 :) 18:32:18 hmm... i'm stuck on the piety, XP, and place 18:32:32 03kilobyte * r74f1df85ae81 10/crawl-ref/source/monster.cc: When a malign tentacle gets severed, make it neutral (hostile-all) rather than hostile. 18:32:33 Eronarn: don't optimise to death, show us what you've got! 18:32:45 yes, just gotta neaten it up a bit then upload 18:33:24 would it be possible to make all of these elementals customizable? i could specify the basic positions of things in my rc? 18:34:06 elements not elementals 18:34:07 haha 18:34:21 dexterity elemental 18:34:49 Eronarn: [name] the XL 27 [title], and then the next line God: The Shining One [*****.]? 18:35:09 xp/place should stay where they are 18:37:16 Mu_: yes, but who should code it :) 18:37:49 TGWi: second line better as [species] [of god [piety]] 18:37:51 now, this is pretty different, so don't all spaz out: http://i56.tinypic.com/25juzbd.png 18:38:12 * dpeg passes out. 18:38:20 * TGWi vomits 18:38:35 omfg what?!?!?!?!?!?! 18:38:48 I like it. 18:39:08 the wp: line might be a bit short but I'm not sure how much it matters 18:39:14 * dpeg barely solidifies himself to type. 18:39:22 status lights should go below Wp: and Qv: imo 18:39:25 do people actually use the health/magic bars? I never look past the numbers 18:39:28 TGWi: i intentionally cut it off, because i realized: weapon names can get absurdly long and it never matters 18:39:31 OG17: yes 18:39:38 OG17: it's the only thinkg I look at. 18:39:43 Eronarn: maybe not show the inscription at all 18:39:47 OG17: Yes. Especially the red parts. 18:39:47 Eronarn: looks very good 18:39:48 OG17: the health bar shows you how much damage you took 18:39:55 which is very useful 18:39:56 OG17: I keep dying in angband because it doesn't have a health bar 18:40:11 due: this is because you shouldn't play Angband! 18:40:12 TGWi: i think some weapon base names are long enough to be cut off, even 18:40:22 Eronarn: that might be problematic 18:40:33 mana bar doesn't need to be as large as the health one imo 18:40:48 can you move the leftern column a few spaces over? it looks like that space is just empty 18:40:51 numbers show damage too! But okay, looks like people use it 18:40:59 I for one really prefer seeing what randart I'm wielding 18:41:02 maybe the piety meter could fit next to a mana bar somewhere if it was smaller 18:41:08 or details of a rod of destruction 18:41:16 or the kind of ammunition 18:41:21 dpeg: unfortunately, I'm too heavily involved in crawl and crawl development to get my nostalgia hits out of it. 18:41:27 kilobyte: yes, I think Wp and Qv need more space. But Eronarn's approach contains a number of good ideas. 18:41:30 Eronarn: could give Wp: two lines 18:41:39 TGWi: i considered that but i thought it'd look weird 18:41:47 i don't really look at the health bar but i play very quickly and notice a large change with the health bar when i suddenly start dying 18:41:59 note though 18:42:03 we could just move weapon to a new line 18:42:20 mine is currently 2 lines shorter 18:42:24 eronarn's seems backwards in that stats and hp/mp numbers are better on the left 18:42:37 and status lights should be below that 18:42:42 right makes people move their eyes across the entire screen 18:42:45 Eronarn: I think we need only two title lines. 18:42:57 OG17: you need to look at AC etc only very rarely 18:43:03 and yeah, showing the religious title as well as the regular one is kind of excessive 18:43:08 same with weapons 18:43:21 this moves stuff you need to look at most often (hp bar, mp bar, status effects) to all in one place 18:43:21 OG17: not really the same with weapons at all 18:43:30 but the numbers are more useful than the bar to me 18:43:32 Eronarn: yes, that's awesome 18:43:32 other stuff, to the right of that 18:43:36 "Level 16 " takes a lot of space, and wouldn't need an explanation as a part of Xp: as it currently does 18:43:37 I noted it right away :) 18:43:39 Eronarn: I like the whole thing. 18:44:09 kilobyte: the problem is actually the top line 18:44:14 I'd want an option to reverse the hp/mp numbers and bar with this, or to just hide the bars altogether 18:44:14 longplayername the merry demonspawn, etc. 18:44:20 I can't be the only one that doesn't use them 18:44:25 [name] the level [XX] [title] 18:44:26 [species] [of god [*****]] 18:44:27 Eronarn: Name the Level N Title 18:44:30 dpeg: damn you 18:44:31 does it look unbalanced if the HP/MP numbers are to the left of the bars while the ac stuff is on the right 18:44:39 stealing my ideas again :( 18:44:51 TGWi: could you please stop that? 18:44:54 dpeg: titles are far too long to work 18:45:07 Eronarn: no, it does work, I counted it once 18:45:22 Eronarn: what's longest, middleweight champion or whatever? 18:45:22 Longplayername the Level 27 Merry Demonspawn will, i am almost certain, not fit well 18:45:38 TGWi: there's super-heavyweight isn't there 18:45:39 names are 14 letters only, I think 18:45:46 "Victor of a Thousand Battles" is the worst offender 18:45:56 well that's a religious title isn't it 18:46:07 if we cut those it is less bad 18:46:11 it's used if your highest skill is invo 18:46:16 Eronarn: yes, religious titles are used as your normal title if your skill is invo 18:46:19 you could move the viewport down and print it right along the top :P 18:47:17 oh, right 18:47:19 breaking name/race/etc into three lines instead of two sort of defeats the point, could be grouped and condensed better 18:47:31 i'm gonna go do another iteration 18:47:33 back in 5 18:47:35 what are the current two lines? 18:47:47 seems like those would be fine 18:47:48 name the title, level x race of god 18:48:31 not sure what the character limits are though 18:48:35 isn't that already cut off for mottled draconians of TSO? 18:48:40 Remember that we want the piety ****'s to show up. 18:48:43 TGWi: yes 18:48:48 lovely 18:49:39 "Mottled Draconian", "Jiyva 8letters" 18:49:48 name the level x title, race of god *** looks like it could work 18:49:51 just eyeballing it 18:49:59 Mottled Draconian of The Shining One ****** 18:50:00 does fit 18:50:11 though it's strange for adjective titles 18:50:28 adjective titles could be "the title level x" 18:50:33 though I guess those are strange in themselves 18:50:35 also that 18:50:45 that would be more code but whatever 18:51:03 ??titles 18:51:04 titles[1/2]: Slightly outdated spoiler available at: http://www.dtek.chalmers.se/~salman/titles-0.4.html 18:51:04 indeed, TSO is longer 18:51:17 kilobyte: Jiyva Jijijiji is shorter than The Shining One 18:51:20 didn't the level used to be before the xp pool 18:52:02 st_: originally, we had "Exp: 20/12347238947 (18430)" 18:52:07 alternatively, you could ditch grammar concerns and do the title parenthetically 18:52:14 xl, total xp, pool 18:52:14 erm the level 18:52:20 Name the Title (level N) 18:52:24 would using that minus total xp be so bad? 18:52:35 and turns, that's vital too 18:52:41 :) 18:52:42 st_: it's kind of confusing, I think 18:52:55 dumps still do that and that throws me off 18:53:27 some people may fail to enable turns in their config, but that's allowed only because using a razor to cut yourself is allowed too 18:53:55 kilo is on a mission :) 18:53:57 kilobyte: turns and gold are not actually useful information about your character :\ 18:54:02 only thing worse is people who don't use clear_messages 18:54:18 What turncount display is good for are multiturn actions, especially resting. 18:54:19 st_: aye! 18:54:30 turns and gold are a lot more relevant than having your title constantly displayed, at least 18:54:44 maybe if you check before resting (and are really good at subtraction) 18:55:20 it could print the number of turns completed of a multiturn action if you're interrupted, if that's useful 18:55:34 You found a trap! (5 turns) 18:56:00 anyway 18:56:44 TGWi: the point is that without turncount, there is no feedback how often you've been searching. 18:56:50 You can press 555 without really noticing. 18:57:00 what about a third column, with: Xp, Place, Turns? 18:57:25 to the right of AC/EV/SH and Str/Int/Dex 19:00:15 sounds sort of cluttered, and I'd put it on the left again because it's the more immediate information 19:01:00 next iteration: http://i51.tinypic.com/v45w10.png 19:01:38 is that what you meant it to look like 19:01:56 that empty space is pretty ugly 19:01:59 with that big em 19:02:00 yeah 19:02:31 yes i agree it's pretty ugly, i mostly just made changes to the top 2 lines 19:02:40 it looks like your god has an expletive in its name 19:03:02 Eronarn: the brackets are not needed around the * 19:03:12 hmm 19:03:16 then in that case, we can make everything fit 19:03:19 Mu_: even better, the expletive becomes stronger as you go on! 19:03:21 if we eat up some of the viewport margin 19:03:27 if TSO needs abbreviating, just TSO would be better 19:03:38 :) I'd make them a different colour to the text 19:03:41 it's 4 spaces, we can take up 2 to make The Shining One ****** fit 19:03:41 than truncating 19:03:46 Eronarn: I would try not to reduce the column between viewport and status 19:04:13 dpeg: what if we take up one and rename him to The Shiny One 19:05:06 Then Kikubaaqudgha comes around :) 19:05:46 hmm... you know, it will actually work 19:05:47 some titles are over-long 19:05:52 if remove the L17 19:05:56 Eronarn: yes 19:05:59 and put it in the currently blank third line 19:06:03 L17 is not so good 19:06:05 with... place, maybe/ 19:06:52 le shineh 1 19:07:01 Level 17 (space padding) Lair of the Beasts 2(right side) 19:07:14 though level 17 is still too short, even 19:07:44 that sort of confuses character level with location level 19:08:04 well, there'd be a lot of padding - but Level 17 by itself would look weird 19:08:12 I think that only the religious titles pose problems... if need be, we could have shorter versions for the main screen 19:08:31 do they need to appear there at all? 19:08:34 is there a way to fix exp needed to level on there? :P I check E a lot in game 19:08:41 Eronarn: "Of level 17, at Lair:8" ? 19:08:55 -!- gamefreak264 has joined ##crawl-dev 19:09:01 dpeg: having species and god and piety on the same line is a problem 19:09:02 Mu_: me too, but I think that's a personal deficit (unlike checking piety status) 19:09:15 it just barely fits, with just that, and nothing else 19:09:25 which means we need a third line of the 'header' 19:09:27 oh well :P 19:09:27 Eronarn: sure? "Mottled Draconian of The Shining One ******" fits. 19:09:29 -!- Mu_ has quit [Quit: Defecator, may everything turn out okay so that you can leave this place.] 19:09:44 dpeg: right, but that = adding a third line in again 19:09:49 which we have the room for, granted 19:10:04 Eronarn: my proposal was [name] the [level] [title] 19:10:20 which can lead to occasional problems, no question (but the current setup can as well) 19:10:32 I agree that getting location up to the top is worth it 19:12:22 bars are 24 segments, you could probably halve that without losing any usefulness 19:13:00 or go with tenths 19:13:03 if the title gets cut, nothing bad happens 19:13:29 and the longest non-religious seems to be Cruiserweight Champion 19:14:40 OG17: not true 19:15:27 24 gradations is a lot more useful than 10 19:16:36 kilobyte: is cruiserweight champion the longest taking into account the ones that replace genus? 19:16:44 demonspawn barricade and such 19:17:35 than and merfolkian seem to be the longest 19:17:45 the actual values are more useful still, and they're displayed right there. I'd think 10'd be just as useful to see ratios at a glance 19:18:00 because if so, we can solve this by replacing ' the ' with ', ' for the long ones 19:18:01 30% and 35% health doesn't seem to be a big difference like that 19:18:07 cruiserweight is only 2 too long 19:18:19 'Eronarn, L27 Cruiserweight Champion' doesn't sound too bad 19:18:49 and merfolkian is just dumb :P 19:18:56 is there any reason you couldn't shrink the gap between the view window and the stat area? 19:19:06 OG17: i think we could by 1 easily personally 19:19:14 my attempt: http://pastebin.ca/2000601 19:19:17 2 is cutting it, 3 is too much 19:19:17 the gap was shrunk already 19:19:37 OG17: the default setting cripples the viewport 19:20:00 if you're using a larger viewport, you can use a larger terminal with it 19:20:31 if that's not automatic 19:24:29 http://sprunge.us/DfED 19:25:23 s/ the /, / for three letters for the title 19:25:56 l17 would fully fit 19:25:56 kilobyte: great title + species combination :) 19:26:07 but otherwise that is similar to what I had in mind 19:26:36 I'm taking the worst case for every line 19:26:36 Pandemonium is cut? 19:26:39 yes 19:26:53 no 19:27:08 there's one column free past the bars 19:27:31 how many lines does this gain? 19:27:58 looks like just one if you have show_gold_turns = false 19:27:59 from current+Turns, two 19:28:11 kilobyte: so one :) 19:28:14 or one from current w/o Turns, yeah 19:28:23 Eronarn's approach has the advantage that it's (a) less crowded (at a price, I know) and (b) moves the afflications to the top 19:28:37 moving status lights to the top is a bad thing 19:29:01 aha 19:29:03 at least imo, having them next to the monsters is nice 19:29:12 it's tactical information (although I guess so are hp/mp) 19:29:44 BTW, why do we waste a column on the right side? 19:29:57 kilobyte: often looks bad if stuff is at the very edge 19:30:09 I once wondered whether we could use vertical bars... 19:30:10 ah 19:30:42 kilobyte: with the screens we're making up, the last column is very rarely used 19:31:42 AC/EV/SH never extend themselves, Str/Int/Dex do 19:31:57 http://i51.tinypic.com/286u2xt.png 19:32:06 this is with viewport border => 3 instead of 4 19:32:19 I like kilobyte's a lot, I'd swap it like http://pastebin.ca/2000610 though 19:32:56 OG17's is good 19:32:59 Eronarn: Tsatthoggua? 19:33:06 dpeg: the name of my laptop 19:33:28 one of the Great Old Ones 19:33:52 I see.. there was a German black metal band by that name. 19:34:47 OG17: long name dpeg the Merfolkian Porcupine (17 19:34:59 http://sprunge.us/SQVO -- with drained stats and marked screen border 19:35:02 really don't like how eronarn has this big gap under the bars, or the bars left of the values 19:35:21 yeah 19:35:24 OG17: oh, your version is better 19:35:26 it'd be merfolk I guess 19:35:30 merman 19:35:38 does no one like mine 19:35:40 OG17: i don't like the gap either but also it's still missing XP and place and any other stuff 19:35:42 or for normal titles, long name dpeg the Necromancer (17) 19:35:42 OG17: it doesn't suffer from the gap wildly changing for drained/undrained stats 19:37:07 putting XL at the end means you don't have to work the grammar around it (long name dpeg the level 17 ruinous) 19:37:39 I like how st turns draconian into drac, and like the first four lines on the top left, but everything else feels off 19:38:07 fractional stats are cool too 19:38:19 though not if they're full 19:38:24 hmmm hey 19:38:29 yes? 19:38:37 what if we move weapon to the top, right under title 19:39:05 it's something that changes a lot 19:39:44 also something that has a large gameplay effect 19:39:54 you'd put weapon and quiver before health and magic? 19:40:12 seriously, use OG17's but with XL at the end of the line 19:41:30 hm, nah, doesn't work because the bar / HP # end up on different lines and that looks bad 19:41:40 you could also put cl in the exp display, like 200000/17 or something 19:41:50 don't know how intuitive that is but it's pretty easy to grasp 19:42:46 you could also fit exp pool: 11111 CL: 27 19:43:00 in kilobyte's 19:43:19 mine rather, I guess 19:43:43 I looked at other religious titles, the Victor is far longer than anything else 19:43:47 might crowd the ac columns 19:44:14 kilobyte: you could truncate to "the Victor" for the character pane 19:44:16 if it really matters 19:44:40 the only other long religious title of which I know is "Luminary of Lethal Lore" 19:44:53 could turn "exp pool" into "exp" for that 19:45:06 Disciple of Annihilation 19:45:21 ely has one really long one i think 19:45:23 still not sure why titles need to be constantly displayed really 19:45:35 though all of those could work with one noun 19:45:53 TSO disables invisibility even after losing religion (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=2866) by SlyShy 19:45:57 I don't like that because omitting "exp pool" makes it unclear what the number actually means 19:46:37 people seem to have trouble with it currently, not sure if it'd make things worse 19:46:39 "Exp: 27/10000" is not intuitive 19:47:02 (17) isn't really intuitive either I think 19:47:44 if there is enough space in the top line, it should read "Hugo the Level 3 Conjurer" 19:48:07 could just omit or shorten the title if there's no room 19:48:09 when the line gets too long and the abbreviation is used, everyone will know what is meant 19:48:19 or that 19:48:51 you'd have to take care of "the Level 3 Ruinous" 19:50:03 "Hugo the Conjurer, Level 3" 19:50:22 ok 19:50:28 where did fourteen-character names come from? Could that be shortened? 19:50:40 Mottled Draconian Conjurer / Ruinous Mottled Draconian is nicer to me 19:50:54 Linley Henzell 19:50:57 14 letters 19:51:02 dpeg: haha 19:51:14 I'd expect 27 then 19:51:38 * Siber tabs over to one of the screenshots earlier, eyes cross lines, reads +11,+6 katana (explode) 19:51:48 Fr, exploding katanas 19:52:14 st_: [name] of [god + piety] 19:52:26 st_: [species] the [title] ? 19:52:55 [species] the [title] just sounds weird 19:53:05 no one online now has a name of more than nine, a ten-limit would seem reasonable if it'd help anything 19:53:10 mottled draconian the draconian of death 19:53:22 monky: that's easy 19:53:25 mottled draconian of death 19:53:27 it would be "Mottled Draconian of Death" 19:53:29 yesw 19:53:56 so this change implies changes in title formatting? 19:54:13 only a little 19:54:41 okay, let's just count: if I did it right, then: name=14, species=17, god=22 19:55:31 total space available: 33 19:55:47 erm, 43 19:55:47 here's another one that's a departure: http://i54.tinypic.com/245di4g.png the monster list starts showing up right below the status lights, and if there's enough room for an item list, it shows up below the monster list 19:56:37 Eronarn: that looks pretty cut off 19:57:15 TGWi: i think it would look better if the order were reversed, but the sidebar would have to move to the left side of the screen for that 19:57:21 I don't care for it at all, yeah. If there's a column that might not be there, it should be on the right 19:57:27 sidebar? 19:57:48 Eronarn: you could switch the entire right side with the entire left size 19:57:50 side* 19:57:50 OG17: as in, if i moved the text stuff to the left, the health bars would be on the right, but the health bars should be next to the viewport 19:57:56 no they shouldn 19:57:58 't 19:58:00 they shouldn't, though 19:58:07 the numbers should be 19:58:32 hmm 19:58:42 actually, i guess you're right that it doesn't matter that much since it's a smaller screen anyways 20:03:36 it's just "Draconian of Death" 20:04:30 it is now, but I suggested the title be after/before the race instead of god being after 20:05:44 Mottled Draconian Cruiserweight Champion fits with 1 space to spare, but the level would have to go somewhere else 20:05:46 level 27 necro title for dr should be "dracolich" 20:06:11 Linley Henzell of The Shining One ****** also fits fine 20:06:24 draconians could turn to dracs when limited 20:06:33 dwarves though 20:06:38 TGWi: I'd use that for transform 20:06:56 actually dwarves would be fine 20:06:57 for felids it should be "felich" 20:07:18 lichggan 20:08:21 name/level/title, race/god/* seems to fit a lot easier 20:08:31 especially if name drops a couple characters 20:09:05 true, I just love the titles that have the race name in them 20:09:13 what's the cap for DGL? 20:10:18 cao is 10 cdo is 20 iirc 20:10:18 btw, I could just take "123234234 ferfd sd sd svs" as name :) 20:13:56 http://i55.tinypic.com/zujxc0.png 20:14:47 21:05 < TGWi> level 27 necro title for dr should be "dracolich" 20:14:57 their genus should change to 'Dragon' at 27 20:15:00 Dragon of Death 20:15:34 death dragon 20:15:45 stealth title should be "shadow dragon" 20:15:49 hahaha 20:17:34 i really do think we should find a way to have the status lights be next to the HP bars 20:17:57 if eronarn's subtle hinting is any clue, I'm thinking there should be an option to swap the hp/magic number and bar positions 20:18:08 no reason to have them under each other though 20:18:34 OG17: i can see why you want it number / bar, i would just also like status lights to show up next to the bars 20:18:39 it is hard to accomplish both 20:18:45 03dpeg * r81432e9f0ae2 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/database/help.txt: Mention cursor mode in pickup/drop help screen. 20:19:03 status lights seem best on the bottom I think, they stand out plenty and always shift around 20:19:09 03kilobyte * r241da4658730 10/crawl-ref/source/describe.cc: Get rid of Romanian titles for Ashenzari. 20:19:34 your last would have trouble fitting them, probably 20:19:56 i think probably the closest i've come to what i want is http://i54.tinypic.com/245di4g.png but flipped 20:21:14 I'm for mine/kilobyte's 20:22:47 your extra space for lists is nice but it's distanced from the play window and it'd make a big gap when they extend past the static info 20:31:03 -!- Pseudonut has joined ##crawl-dev 20:36:42 this could still use some work but is probably my favorite http://i53.tinypic.com/inx4ih.png 20:39:14 it feels a bit too spacey, but maybe I'm weird 20:40:56 yes, i agree 20:41:06 some of it is the lengthy titles at the top though 20:41:10 they throw it off balance 20:49:18 -!- gamefreak264 has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:50:00 -!- valrus_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:56:50 -!- gamefreak264 has joined ##crawl-dev 21:07:13 -!- dpeg has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:11:55 -!- Noom has joined ##crawl-dev 21:40:33 -!- gamefreak264 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:22:17 bugger 22:22:26 sorear, i forgot my termcast password. any ideas on how to get it reset? 22:30:14 -!- Noom has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 22:35:06 -!- gamefreak264 has joined ##crawl-dev 22:37:33 -!- valrus has joined ##crawl-dev 22:41:13 -!- gamefreak264 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:41:23 -!- gamefreak264 has joined ##crawl-dev 23:10:22 -!- valrus has quit [Remote host closed the connection]