00:01:13 -!- Fangorn_ has quit [Quit: Fangorn_] 00:01:55 Hii dpeg. 00:02:16 -!- Fangorn_ has joined ##crawl-dev 00:06:28 Hi! 00:06:35 I've fnished spirits! 00:06:47 * dpeg bows to the due. 00:06:47 Values possibly need to be tweaked, but they're coded exactly as intended. 00:07:11 !tell kilobyte I have added a specific proposal for base hunger as a function of size. Could you live with that? 00:07:11 dpeg: OK, I'll let kilobyte know. 00:07:52 yay size 00:08:33 still need growth/shrink ray spells, of course 00:08:40 one step after the other 00:08:43 (would make a good potion, actually) 00:08:58 mushrooms, as b0rsuk mentioned 00:09:10 cute :) 00:09:19 I'm for this. 00:09:41 Could we dump potion of agility in favour or a"smmall" effect which gives you a massive EV boost 00:09:47 But all the negatives of being small lsized? 00:10:04 Don't you like agility? 00:10:18 I think on its own it's pointless. 00:10:21 i'm not a fan of agil / bril, personally 00:10:25 Unlike might, I just drop them. 00:10:29 might works much better than either 00:10:33 Exactly. 00:10:42 Brilliance is all right for memorising spells 00:10:44 They're both useful. 00:10:50 Not as useful as might, though. 00:10:59 That depends... 00:11:28 ? 00:11:29 Brilliance is nice for when you have a spell you can't really cast but you want to, like a troll with Haste at Fair 00:11:36 yes 00:11:42 they're useful, but they're a) boring b) not effective enough to make up for being boring 00:11:50 Agree with Eronarn. 00:11:55 or you can cast it a little bit, but want it to work NOW 00:11:58 unlike might, which is really boring, but so powerful that it's fun anyways because it lets you smash stuff 00:12:25 Eronarn always says "this is boring", "that is boring". 00:12:31 Sure. 00:12:38 but in this case I actually agree that it is borig. 00:12:51 "Potion of Shrinking" which has a better effect than agility, a better boost to things, but provides some negative offsets, would be much more attractive. 00:13:05 and be a lot more fun to quaff-ID 00:13:07 You just never used the new potions properly. 00:13:27 I've used agility 00:13:31 i don't think that's a fair statement to make 00:13:34 what is 'properly' 00:13:34 But it didn't give asmuch of an effect as I expected 00:13:37 and I died. 00:13:40 are you only using them 'properly' if you have fun? 00:13:43 So I decided that it sucked and I wouldn't try it again. :) 00:14:06 i carry agil around, and i use them, but they're not that good and they're boring and i stop carrying them when i find better potions to carry (like might) 00:14:33 I have no time for this, sorry. 00:14:45 It's cool 00:14:49 I don't either, actually. 00:15:51 -!- Fangorn_ has left ##crawl-dev 00:21:53 i carry agility around, it's saved me a few times 00:21:57 not brilliance though 00:22:04 but i don't usually play marginal spellcasters, so 00:26:49 doy: hi! 00:28:51 -!- Fangorn_ has joined ##crawl-dev 00:28:51 -!- Fangorn_ has quit [Client Quit] 00:51:31 -!- felirx has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:17:14 agility is strong enough; I'd rather say we're giving players too many ways to buff 01:23:24 -!- felirx has joined ##crawl-dev 01:23:26 by: Hi! ALso thanks for injecting a dose of sanity :) 01:23:50 by: buffs from potions are mostly harmless. 01:25:20 I think agility and brilliance are fine 01:27:14 I use them in a variety of circumstances and they don't seem too powerful 01:27:33 elliptic: where they useful still? 01:28:06 i wouldn't go as far as to say that buffs from potions are harmless 01:28:27 they can potentially affect the amount of xp you can gain at certain points in the game pretty strongly 01:28:52 dpeg: yeah, they seem useful without being too powerful 01:29:41 doy: in mean in terms of brokenness, potions cannot compete with spells. 01:30:33 well, obviously 01:30:37 and brilliance has interesting uses like making it safer to victory dance your first spell to gain some skill, if you don't have any low-level spells 01:31:03 or to make key spells reliable in a pinch later on 01:31:30 agility is less interesting to use, but it feels like a defensive version of might 01:31:36 which seems fine to me 01:32:34 also it helps when you want to approach something for stabbing 01:32:47 how large is the stealth boost? 01:32:58 it felt significant, though it's hard to tell 01:32:59 ??agility 01:33:00 agility[1/1]: Provides temporary Dex, EV, and stealth bonuses. 01:33:02 I used it for stabbing mara once I think 01:33:15 50 01:33:15 but who knows whether it actually made a difference 01:33:36 50 is fairly significant 01:33:37 hm, 50 is a nice amount I guess 01:33:37 that's more useful early game than later 01:33:58 Might is probably much more straightforward in use, but that's just a reflection that melee is simpler than stabbing or casting (to perform as player, not to win). 01:33:58 where "early" includes mid-game 01:34:05 dpeg: yes 01:34:20 using agility for EV alone is also straightforward 01:34:24 yes 01:34:26 and usually how I use it 01:34:40 same 01:34:45 elliptic is a simple-minded evader :) 01:35:01 :) 01:35:10 the dex boost from agility is basically along the same lines as the strength boost from might 01:35:11 I also use phase shift more than most people I think... 01:35:12 -!- stabwound has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net] 01:35:26 more to indicate its purpose than anything else 01:35:30 i use phase shift 01:35:32 !learn add elliptic Uses positive curvature and agility to evade trouble. 01:35:33 elliptic[5/5]: Uses positive curvature and agility to evade trouble. 01:35:33 doy: it is much more useful, can give you 3ish EV easily 01:35:50 elliptic: i suppose 01:35:59 what's the direct ev boost? 01:36:03 5 01:36:31 so late game on a dodgy character who isn't at the stepdown yet, agility is often 8 EV 01:36:43 !learn del elliptic[4] 01:36:44 Deleted elliptic[4/5]: KeVM MuNe OgWz | AM,Ar,EE,Pr,Wn 02:17:28 by: thank you 02:17:39 I lacked the energy to trim the overly long spell comments. 02:19:51 some people are quite verbose :) 02:20:17 indeed 02:20:38 dpeg: Should we give some indication that there's a spirit on the level? 02:20:46 maybe it's good to summarize excessive comments particularly briefly for pedagogical reasons 02:21:02 but mostly it's just less work to cut them really short 02:21:03 Agreed. 02:21:16 BEst effect to do it immediately after the crime. 02:22:30 nice, there's a question mark branch in git now :) 02:22:46 I noticed that. 02:23:00 ?/m seems to crash now, for some reason 02:23:09 Us ? readers are behind the times, eh? 02:23:20 looks like boxes here(: 02:23:24 03due * rc0ab6dfc74df 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-death.cc: Finish implementing spirits and their death-summons. 02:23:27 (i imagine that's the unicode rewrite) 02:23:31 yes 02:24:26 03by * rc150a30e6606 10/crawl-ref/source/status.cc: Fix confusing touch status display (missing "break;"). (#2598) 02:26:38 Is anyone here objecting to the idea of tortured humanoids in the hells? 02:26:46 ("Hells" on wiki.) 02:27:02 ah, looks like it's crashing in the #ifdef DEBUG_DIAGNOSTICS section 02:27:11 which is probably why it hasn't been reported 02:48:41 !seen felirx 02:48:41 I last saw felirx at Fri Sep 17 06:23:24 2010 UTC (1h 25m 17s ago) joining the channel. 02:59:58 !tell felirx Did you make progess with the menu structure? (Happened to read the interface wiki page.) 02:59:58 dpeg: OK, I'll let felirx know. 03:05:21 haven't had time yet 03:05:21 felirx: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 03:14:36 those extra spectral_orcs flags on mon-gear.cc:give_{item,weapon} seem suboptimal 03:22:17 -!- syllogism has joined ##crawl-dev 03:34:51 by, doy: what terminal emulators do you use, so they are unable to handle letters I used in the branch name? 03:34:52 kilobyte: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 03:35:28 gnome-terminal doesn't handle it 03:35:51 Which is strange because normally it does 03:35:53 uhm... how come? It works perfectly on me. 03:35:59 kilobyte: my guess is the terminal is fine, but the font isn't 03:36:06 hm 03:36:08 possible 03:36:10 let's try in IRC: 𝓤𝓷𝓲𝓬𝓸𝓭𝓮 03:36:31 remotes/origin/𝓤𝓷𝓲𝓬𝓸𝓭𝓮 03:36:50 by: gnome-terminal uses system font handling that will substitute missing glyphs from other fonts 03:36:52 DejaVu Sans Mono Book 03:37:18 I don't have "use system font" checked 'cos it's ugly. 03:37:32 and even when I do, it still shows up blocky. 03:39:04 I'm using xterm here 03:40:38 Moin guys 03:41:00 worth a read: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/184618/what-is-the-best-comment-in-source-code-you-have-ever-encountered/482129#482129 03:44:32 due: uhm, that "system font" thingy merely changes font to Gnome's default 03:44:39 it has nothing to do with font _handling_ 03:44:46 okay 03:44:54 well it certainly isn't handling it the way you're descriibg 03:45:01 however, I am using fluxbox, so that's possibly making a difference 03:46:13 I guess you might have only minimal fonts installed, without one with a decent coverage of the "Mathematical Letter-like Symbols" block 03:46:38 Yeah, that's possible. 03:46:41 Recommend a font? 03:47:44 it's not about the primary font selected, merely having one present on your system is enough 03:48:13 I'm not sure which one has these... I checked in fontforge, DejaVu lacks these 03:49:31 Ah. 03:49:52 03by * r86ea48af2bb4 10/crawl-ref/source/ (5 files): Pass weapon into monster generation code for Tukima's Dance. 03:49:52 03by * r61026d4aa93a 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-place.cc: Add a fixme comment. 03:56:12 03by * rada405a88877 10/crawl-ref/source/religion.cc: More correct Vehumet range extension description. (#2599) 04:08:29 I installed unifont. 04:23:41 I wonder what to work on next. 04:23:43 Shedu? 04:25:58 -!- dpeg has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 04:34:06 shedu are the most novel one among the holyhaul ideas, so they could be interesting 04:34:36 I did think about implementation details a bit, here's the main issue: 04:35:53 how are you going to keep track of the corpse? The alive mate is easy and can be done in several ways, but the corpse will not stay put -- it may be moved, picked up by monsters, or worse, by the player, which moves it outside env 04:36:30 and, of course, how the live shedu should handle you running around carrying his mate? 04:40:00 yeah, corpses are confusing me. 04:42:29 I think checking the player's pack is a good idea. 04:43:07 corpses can be in one of two places and still be on the level: mitm (on ground or in a monster's inventory), or in the player's pack 04:43:16 yeah 04:43:22 mitm is easy to track 04:43:25 until mitm and menv go away 04:43:28 in which case i cry :( 04:43:40 are they going to go? 04:43:54 it has been suggested 04:44:43 you can't really code for a system you don't know, especially one that hasn't even been designed yet 04:44:53 yeah 04:45:00 i wasn't suggesting that 04:50:01 shedus can never leave the level while their mate is still alive, right? Or are you going to let them both descend stairs at the same time? 04:50:42 I'm not too sure 04:50:47 I think both descending is a good idea 04:51:22 a tidbit: if you banish both Dowan and Duvessa, then happen to meet both in the same section of the Abyss, they will act as if the other twin was gone 04:51:40 yeah. 04:52:15 hmm, with D&D, they can get shafted, which is more likely 04:52:29 yeah, *that's* annoying. 04:53:34 for D&D, since they have a chance to avoid traps, we may cheat and make them always succeed the saving roll -- a kludge, but not a too nasty one 04:53:59 agree 04:54:01 shedus fly, so abyssing is the only way for them to be separated and still alive 04:54:09 i hadn'tt thought to consider shaft traps 05:12:26 03kilobyte * r1c7acef3b685 10/crawl-ref/source/actor.cc: Make Dowan and Duvessa cheat about shafts. 05:12:37 in the spirit fading code, you have holy dragons with a weight of 2, then a comment that says "no holy dragons" 05:15:21 yes 05:15:24 I'v eno idea where that came from 05:15:32 I just copied it straight out of the SUMMON_GREATER_HOLY weight 05:26:26 -!- elliptic has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 05:26:42 -!- stabwound has joined ##crawl-dev 05:27:07 kilobyte: you might want to use mons_is_dowan/mons_is_elven_twin from mon-death. 05:27:17 Otherwise polymorphed D&D will fall through shafts. 05:28:59 oh, right! Thanks! 05:31:56 -!- monky has quit [Quit: GOODBYE] 05:32:21 perhaps it would be the right time to track monsters globally, instead of piling on another layer of hacks? 05:32:35 by: strongly agree 05:33:13 how big of a memory impact would a global map of monster id to place have? 05:33:27 not sure 05:34:43 the straight forward thing would be to have a map of all existing monsters 05:35:15 (place could include things like "banished", and maybe "dead but we might need the monster for death messages") 05:35:34 we don't have a monster id yet... but adding one that's globally unique for all monsters ever spawned is a good idea 05:35:45 right, that would be included there 05:36:12 perhaps we can have a flag "needs to be tracked"? 05:36:46 do you think tracking all living monsters is too expensive? 05:38:33 03kilobyte * r0f2125cfd38a 10/crawl-ref/source/ (actor.cc mon-death.cc mon-death.h): Use mons_is_elven_twin() to handle polymorphed D&D. (due) 05:38:57 if we decide to do that, it might be simplier to simply make menv global 05:39:29 in that case it might easily get too expensive, though, considering memory footprint of a monster, I would think 05:42:23 -!- Siber2 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:42:31 -!- Siber has joined ##crawl-dev 05:59:26 I've written the suggestion above up at dcss:brainstorm:internal:global_monster_index -- I'm sure there's things missing 05:59:51 -!- Textmode has joined ##crawl-dev 06:00:26 if we stored monsters independently of level, we could probably do the attitude change thing more simply, too 06:01:48 it depends if we want to add more functionality, the current one is handled quite well, I think. 06:02:12 yes; it's just something we might want to think of here 06:02:22 the only action that triggers often is good god piety change, but holy reactions have to be rethought anyway 06:03:50 currently, if you have an 80% chance of conversion, the 80% will start beating on the remaining 20%. And even if we gave them a new faction, it'd still be weird that one angel wants to kill you while the one next to it does not 06:03:59 -!- valrus has joined ##crawl-dev 06:04:41 it might be simplest to just make 100% of holies peaceful if you worship a good god 06:05:17 but that's mostly up to due and dpeg to decide, as it's their garden 06:28:37 03kilobyte * rde7f74c9d947 10/crawl-ref/source/package.cc: Document the limitation of save chunk name length of 4 characters. 06:50:13 -!- valrus has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:35:02 -!- Zaba has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 07:37:20 -!- upsy has joined ##crawl-dev 07:45:32 -!- Zaba has joined ##crawl-dev 07:49:24 dpeg_entry_water_fire vault can trap player (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=2600) by Core Xii 08:19:35 Spells in memorization screen change slots between games (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=2601) by Core Xii 08:24:47 -!- Twinge has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:25:03 -!- Twinge has joined ##crawl-dev 08:25:15 -!- gamefreak264 has joined ##crawl-dev 08:37:16 03dolorous * r1f937b8e6055 10/crawl-ref/source/status.cc: Add missing spaces to the Confusing Touch status message. 08:44:42 training dummy tile (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=2602) by Denzi 08:45:02 Denzi! <3 09:12:51 -!- galehar has joined ##crawl-dev 09:29:47 kilobyte: yes, i'm pretty sure it's just a font issue in my case, i use standard x11 bitmap fonts for terminals 09:29:56 Spell/ability miscast/failure targeting inconsistency (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=2603) by Core Xii 09:33:42 doy: well, there are two reasons this could fail: 1. mathematical letters see quite little support, and 2. I deliberately used Plane 1 characters, as they break certain buggy programs (screen, putty and most of Windows stuff) 09:34:04 I guess I should stop this experiment and use plain ascii for the branch name :p 09:35:44 assuming that the branch name is seven characters long, tmux/urxvt seems to handle it fine(: 09:35:58 just get missing glyph characters is all 09:48:50 -!- eith has joined ##crawl-dev 09:53:06 -!- Mu_ has joined ##crawl-dev 09:55:34 03dolorous * r81597d3a4205 10/crawl-ref/source/artefact.cc: Treat randart demonic weapons with the holy wrath brand as conflicting. 10:01:34 -!- elliptic has joined ##crawl-dev 10:22:39 -!- gamefreak264 has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 10:24:10 -!- gamefreak264 has joined ##crawl-dev 10:28:50 -!- blue_anna has joined ##crawl-dev 10:29:35 03dolorous * rbde7c3c00732 10/crawl-ref/source/artefact.cc: Add minor cosmetic fixes. 10:32:54 -!- blackpenguin has quit [Quit: Yes, Virginia...] 10:46:50 -!- blackpenguin has joined ##crawl-dev 10:55:51 -!- galehar has quit [Quit: Page closed] 11:14:04 -!- lorimer_ is now known as lorimer 11:45:11 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 13:38:18 -!- gamefreak264 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:39:14 -!- Zannick has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 13:40:03 -!- Zannick has joined ##crawl-dev 14:14:04 -!- valrus has joined ##crawl-dev 14:17:23 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Quit: Page closed] 14:43:20 -!- gamefreak264 has joined ##crawl-dev 14:54:00 -!- gamefreak264 has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 14:55:27 -!- gamefreak264 has joined ##crawl-dev 15:21:04 -!- Zaba has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 15:31:39 -!- Zaba has joined ##crawl-dev 15:48:22 -!- monky has joined ##crawl-dev 16:06:49 -!- galehar has joined ##crawl-dev 16:07:12 hi guys 16:07:20 I'm trying to write my first patch 16:07:43 it was working ok under linux, and then I tried to move my dev to windows (faster machine) 16:08:04 but the submodules didn't update 16:08:27 I did "git submodule update --init" 16:08:41 but nothing happens 16:09:07 all the dirs under contrib are empty 16:09:19 you did that from the crawl-ref directory? 16:10:02 put linux on the faster machine 16:10:13 ok, I was just in the wrong dir :) 16:10:15 sorry 16:10:18 :) 16:10:28 glad to help 16:10:43 monky: I might do that someday 16:20:53 doesn't windows need more horsepower to not suck 16:42:38 -!- gamefreak264 has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 16:43:04 -!- gamefreak264 has joined ##crawl-dev 16:53:18 -!- eith has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:13:52 -!- morik_ has joined ##crawl-dev 17:17:04 -!- morik has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 17:23:10 -!- gamefreak264 has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 17:32:57 The +5,+5 "Eos" {elec, -TELE rElec SInv 17:33:01 randart morningstar on trunk 17:33:08 won't show that it's a morningstar in shop or in desc in shop 17:36:40 done 17:36:47 just submitted my first patch :) 17:37:42 added noise level to spell description (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=2604) by galehar 17:38:18 that's nice 17:39:02 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 17:40:08 -!- blue_anna has quit [Quit: Saliendo] 17:41:56 03doy * rc8737ab24233 10/crawl-ref/source/art-data.txt: mark Eos as being a morningstar (Eronarn) 17:51:17 -!- galehar has quit [Quit: bedtime] 17:58:57 -!- valrus has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:10:11 -!- gamefreak264 has joined ##crawl-dev 18:23:55 -!- gamefreak264 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:27:59 Canceling teleport does not identify ring of teleport control (https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=2605) by minmay 18:45:57 -!- mechblox has joined ##crawl-dev 18:46:27 -!- mechblox has quit [Client Quit] 19:45:33 -!- stabwound has quit [Ping timeout: 271 seconds] 19:45:44 -!- stabwound has joined ##crawl-dev 19:45:44 -!- stabwound has quit [Changing host] 19:45:44 -!- stabwound has joined ##crawl-dev 19:51:22 -!- kilobyte_ has joined ##crawl-dev 19:52:21 -!- due has quit [Write error: Broken pipe] 19:52:28 -!- kilobyte has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:56:58 -!- due has joined ##crawl-dev 20:02:50 -!- Jude has joined ##crawl-dev 20:03:14 -!- due has quit [Write error: Broken pipe] 20:06:02 -!- syllogism has quit [] 20:06:37 -!- Jude is now known as due 20:16:03 -!- enne has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:24:23 -!- upsy has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:26:49 -!- Textmode has quit [Quit: Over the ages, man has been certain of a great many things. some of these things were even true.] 20:51:26 -!- Mu_ has quit [Quit: Defecator, may everything turn out okay so that you can leave this place.] 20:56:12 -!- evilmike has joined ##crawl-dev 21:22:22 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:44:23 -!- gamefreak264 has joined ##crawl-dev 21:44:39 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 22:25:44 -!- gamefreak264 has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 22:30:21 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.10/20100914125854]] 22:50:20 -!- enne has joined ##crawl-dev