00:09:14 -!- permagreen has joined ##crawl-dev 00:46:58 -!- Zaba has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 00:57:53 -!- Zaba has joined ##crawl-dev 01:02:20 morning 01:02:29 sorear, has transmig getting fixed for the RC? 01:02:35 no 01:02:46 so 0.6 will have broken tmig? 01:03:34 broken? nah, working exactly as designed ;p 01:03:53 yeah, a patch with no thought on consequences :) 01:08:16 train it by wearing heavy armour and miscasting constantly for 0.6 :P 01:09:07 yaeh, and bring alot of rings with negative int 01:09:14 so you can dumb the char down for practise :) 01:09:21 heh 01:10:45 http://youtu.be/PsPX0nElJ0k?a 01:14:03 ixtli: as an aside, the automatic captioning for that vid is amusingly flawed :) 01:14:13 Hahah. 01:14:14 Yeah. 01:14:30 Interesting, though. Someone should make a real IDE out of it. 01:14:40 "Clinton dropped on the list of content" 01:15:29 You know, one that is written in a real language and not obviously running on the JVM 01:15:30 ;-) 01:15:43 "theres you know this is something about a function as a flexible to remind him of his support" 01:16:13 I wonder what it is about things that run on java, do they imply some sort of weird, badly beveled interface design paradigm? 01:17:33 "the zulus above all by reckless traqcking and perform they find all references operation" 01:18:02 ixtli: yeah, you'd think by some point they'd just give up and use the native widgets? 01:18:55 (1:12 in that video, if you are wondering) 01:19:00 Hahahah 01:19:01 :D 01:19:54 -!- GrimmSleeper has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:20:52 I sense a new generation of misheard lyrics comming on :P 01:22:38 1:43 - "when the fear that has run the campaign over tax that the large virtual war" 01:23:27 ahahaha 01:23:57 i just saw a good one but im eating cheeze rings, so its too hard to transcribe XP 01:26:33 heh 01:43:45 -!- purge has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 01:50:49 -!- GrimmSleeper has joined ##crawl-dev 02:14:07 -!- Spads has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 02:17:03 -!- Vandal has quit [] 02:27:09 ixtli: "you did it take advantage of the package a florida panther movement of the knife"? 02:27:20 hahahahhaha 02:27:24 I don't think i got that far. 02:27:29 I'm going to have to rewatch this. 02:27:30 XD 02:28:58 "Clicking it I think it opens a second job the death of all on the class" 02:30:36 "as the chinese protest will put off to form a seperate bubble" 02:38:02 -!- by has joined ##crawl-dev 02:38:15 hello 02:38:31 'lo by 02:40:40 -!- felirx_ is now known as felirx 02:43:25 -!- permagreen has quit [Quit: Welcome to the real world] 02:52:22 ixtli: "the new math nothing at nineteenth out at which point the music in the range bubble" 02:52:29 by: Hey 02:52:38 Textmode: You're really getting a kick out'a that, huh? 02:52:39 :D 02:52:57 by: http://youtu.be/PsPX0nElJ0k?a It's interesting, but Textmode has been having fun with the automatic captioning XD 02:53:32 its awesome, since unlike translation it doesn't even try to make sense. 02:53:45 I löve the complete lack of punctuation, too. 02:53:57 its just one long stream of nonsense! :D 02:56:40 that translation feature seems to have been rolled out a little prematurely 02:57:15 just a little :P 02:58:02 "don't and also the years can edit it wasn't working" 02:59:41 "when jim dowd each bubble as a key overlay pressing that he was a man on the corresponding bubble giving you thing the key boy method for navigating the workplace" 03:00:17 yeah...this might as well be a travesty generator (aka disassociated press) 03:01:33 -!- ais523 has joined ##crawl-dev 03:03:05 -!- GrimmSweeper has joined ##crawl-dev 03:05:06 -!- GrimmSleeper has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 03:05:06 -!- GrimmSweeper is now known as GrimmSleeper 03:30:46 by: My ipad branch is probably ready to be merged into master pending final acceptance by Enne (we've been talking via email.) You should have a look. 03:30:56 Textmode: You too, if it interests you. 03:31:42 Main changes are the addition of cgcontext.h cgcontext-sdl.cc, glwrapper.h glwrapper-ogl.cc, and uiwrapper.h uiwrapper-sdl.cc 03:32:56 ixtli: ATM, there is no ipad SDK for leopard available, only for snow leopard, or am I mistakten? 03:36:13 bhaak: Nope. I'm pretty sure it requires 10.6 03:36:22 bhaak: How come? 03:36:33 bhaak: My changes have nothing to do with the ipad yet. 03:36:58 I've modularized SDL and OpenGL from the tiles source so that one could implement drawing using other libraries. 03:37:05 ixtli: just curiosity. You might be better informed about the SDK than I am 03:37:12 :) 03:37:26 ixtli: sounds good; not too familiar with the tiles code so can't offer deep insights :) 03:37:40 and as I most certainly won't buy an iPad, I nevertheless would like to try it in the simulator 03:37:46 bhaak: :D 03:38:13 I think I'm going to try and remove dependency on FreeType2 now. 03:38:23 It's probably going to be the most challenging to do properly. 03:38:36 ixtli: that`ll make it very snappy to implement a dx-renderer for windows platforms too 03:38:49 felirx: Please take a look at my source, you could do it right now. 03:38:56 or have you just abstracted it so it works on different ogl versions? 03:38:57 But the native OS X/iPhone OS text rendering is a lot better, as Apple owns the patents. 03:39:21 http://github.com/ixtli/crawl/tree/ipad/crawl-ref/ 03:39:30 Take a look at glwrapper.h and glwrapper-ogl.cc 03:40:03 felirx: There are no direct calls to OpenGL outside of glwrapper-ogl.cc 03:45:01 with a quick look, looks like one might be able to just inherit that and override the interface 03:47:51 felirx: Would it be easier just to make a glwrapper-dx.cc and make an option in the makefile to set USE_DX ? 03:48:22 felirx: look at the ipad branch's makefile, line 251 03:49:27 woah, 360k hits on CDO last month! that's +60k compared to January :D 03:49:35 :O 03:49:37 Congrats! 03:52:40 :) 03:53:00 used up 54gb of traffic 03:54:08 heh 03:56:39 you managed to indirectly take the Crawl Let's Play on gamespite offline, by linking to it and using up all its Photobucket bandwidth, by the way 03:56:50 possibly the first time that CDO has slashdotted anything 03:57:10 what? 150 KB per Hit? 03:57:59 damn 03:58:04 Napkin: Who's hosting it? 03:58:05 xD 03:58:19 you should activate Last-modified or ETag 03:59:14 ais523 :D 03:59:25 I see 03:59:26 xD 03:59:35 I do, ixtli 03:59:45 :o ! 03:59:47 Cool. 03:59:53 It's fun, yes :D 03:59:58 Maybe when I get better at crawl I'll start playing online x 03:59:59 xD 04:00:10 join in! :) 04:00:19 no need to get better first ;) 04:01:07 Napkin: How does the server monitor everyone's gamestate? 04:01:07 i'm a newbie myself :) 04:01:34 Napkin: So that we can query it in here? 04:01:35 ixtli: it doesn't, it just records the tty stream 04:01:39 Oh nice :D 04:01:50 crawl writes milestones to a file 04:01:55 I see. 04:01:59 oh. uhm.. there's a software called dgamelaunch running - it "manages" the games (recording, watching, savegames) 04:02:52 ixtli: grep for DGL_MILESTONES in the source 04:02:57 yes, Gretell is reading the milestones for announcements and dgl's "inprogess"-recordings to show player list 04:03:00 @players 04:03:00 moq (L16 @ D:17, T:60026), MarvinPA (L13 @ Orc:4, T:27380), Aimeelou (L8 @ D:7, T:9547), Moorlo (L6 @ D:5, T:3346), Donatan (L3 @ D:2, T:1989), unreal (L3 @ D:2, T:2074), lomarcan77 (L1 @ D:1, T:0) 04:10:09 Hmm, anyone know how I can reach "Boojum" from gamespite? 04:10:13 03by * r45e47af3b99b 10/crawl-ref/source/ (format.cc format.h): Remove obsolete formatted_string::movexy. 04:10:23 03by * rae14e36f5794 10/crawl-ref/source/ (describe.cc format.cc format.h tutorial.cc): Replace formatted_string::parse_block by display_tagged_block. 04:10:25 I should offer to host his images.. 04:10:28 03by * r080c5b0c3efc 10/crawl-ref/source/spl-book.cc: Don't use formatted_string::cgotoxy in spell book display. 04:10:34 03by * r1e8095ba07af 10/crawl-ref/source/ (format.cc format.h tilefont.cc): Remove FSOP_CURSOR and formatted_string::cgotoxy. 04:10:50 love removing code 04:11:04 ais523, do you know him? 04:11:18 by: <3 04:11:20 Napkin: do I know who? the person who runs the LP? 04:11:35 no, but I was reading it before cdo linked to it, and the reasons it went down were posted in the thread 04:11:53 his "Boojum" who has the thread on that gamespite forum 04:12:02 *this 04:12:24 anyone registered there? I don't want to register just to suggest to host his images.. 04:12:34 I'm registered there 04:13:09 strange, windowse console defines EOL as "\n" apparently 04:13:17 is that to be expected? 04:13:59 by: yes, Windows has "text-mode" and "binary-mode" streams in C and C++, and \n gets translated to and from \r\n by the libc for a text-mode stream 04:14:09 ah 04:14:12 which means that writing \r\n would give you \r\r\n 04:14:17 it's a bit of a hack, really 04:14:48 manual doesn't include changes in ranged combat skills (http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=1044) by galehar 04:14:52 especially if you're coming from a UNIX-like system and don't have the distinction between text and binary streams ingrained into your mind 04:15:39 everything is a file! no, everything is an objecT! not everything is something almost the same but subtle different! <- there you go 04:16:03 for Windows programming, there is indeed a consistent rule: everything is a mess 04:16:15 (I was burned by the Win32 API when I was younger...) 04:19:09 No need to justify that statement. 04:19:12 It's an objective truth. 04:20:08 It's too bad the alternative (apple's apis) are a wondrous, clean and beautiful eden, because if you ask about the world outside you get your head chopped off. 04:20:16 :( 04:20:32 that's vendor lock-in :) 04:20:44 there's the POSIX API, you can get that to work on Linux, UNIX and Mac OS X without trouble, and even on Windows with considerable trouble 04:20:45 You know that as of 10.5, Darwin's readline lib wasn't built with tabcomplete ? 04:20:46 :'( 04:21:20 ais523: Don't get me wrong. It's better to use apple's stuff if you have to, but it's still ... annoying. 04:21:43 the real problem with programming for OS X is that things that don't use their APIs "feel wrong" to Mac users, because they don't act the same way 04:21:53 much like the Java imitation of a GUI is not the same as the GUI itself 04:22:09 ais523: Textmode and I were just talking about this. 04:22:30 Has Apple sued wx yet? 04:22:41 No. 04:22:44 I don't think they will. 04:22:54 They don't go after non-profit oss, as far as I've seen. 04:22:58 I don't really follow it though. 04:22:58 sorear: how? last I checked they simply mapped to the underlaying widgetset... 04:23:00 They sued HTC. 04:23:25 Textmode: that's never stopped a determined lawyer before 04:23:41 especially an apple lawyer 04:23:42 toolkit abstraction is anathema to anyone whose business model relies on lock-in 04:24:22 sorear: The issue is that suing arbitrary OSS people usually gets the EFF and random google lawyers involved 04:24:23 I'm not convinced that Apple's business model, at least on Macs, does rely on lock-in 04:24:37 all they really care about is selling more Macs; OS X is a means to that end, and people writing software which runs on it likewise 04:24:39 They never pursued anyone in the iPhone Dev team at the beginning. 04:24:53 ais523: Agree. 04:25:05 As long as people are buying macs it doesn't matter what you do with their software. 04:25:11 true, but even a lawyer would find that a hard case, you still need their tools to actually build for their platform, you just happen to be using an additional layer. not to mention that the entire case would have a "and the implications of this are...?" air about it. I dare say that any software company would be more afraid of winning that case than loosing it... 04:25:18 Confirmed by their movement /away/ from serial numbers for iWork. 04:25:24 No one does that. 04:39:55 uniformly use '\n' for end-of-line (http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=1045) by rob 04:41:03 how hard would it be to make DOS cprintf convert "\n" to "\r\n" on output? 04:43:06 DOS cprintf is a library function 04:43:20 But I thought we stopped worrying about DOS 04:44:54 you could wrap cprintf, then it would be relatively easy 04:45:18 (presumably, you'd use vsprintf, then putch()-loop on the resulting string) 04:46:02 but then it would be a pain to work out what length of buffer to use, you could mess with vsnprintf but unfortunately it's C99 (and thus not necessarily going to be around in C++ distributions) 04:53:38 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 05:09:17 greensnark: there's a difference between not worrying and deliberately breaking, and I'd like to get rid of all the weird EOL handling 05:15:03 does anyone here use the windows console (even not for crawl)? 05:15:36 me, sometimes 05:15:37 I have used it on occasion 05:15:39 I'm having trouble understanding what's up with the horizontal scrollbar in #1038 05:16:02 apparently, the terminal has width 80, but the window only displays 75 columns, so text wraps? 05:16:32 by: That's the user's fault 05:16:39 Crawl cannot mess with the terminal window 05:16:48 The user is responsible for using broken windows :P 05:17:13 Windows cmd.exe allows for a screen buffer which is what the program knows about and a window that is <= screen buffer 05:18:42 ah; but maybe we could make it not wrap the text using some flag? 05:19:05 Actually I think we do detect window size 05:19:20 Because I remember messing with it when doing the sigwinch emu for w32 05:20:58 No, we use GetConsoleScreenBufferInfo, so sucks to be someone who's using a weird window size 05:22:10 -!- Spads has joined ##crawl-dev 05:25:29 I'd say it's Windows' console emulation's fault, rather than the user's or Crawl's 05:26:44 I would have hoped that a smaller window doesn't change linewrapping, but just lets the text run off to the right 05:27:04 It takes active work by the user to screw up their window size :P 05:27:12 by: I thought that's what it does? 05:28:03 then I don't understand that screenshot again :) 05:28:51 Ah, I hadn't looked at the screenshot 05:28:54 Yeah, that's weird 05:29:28 I have never used a window with width < screen buffer width, so I'm not familiar with this kind of behaviour :P 05:30:23 Close it with our Windows-is-lame rsolution 05:31:19 It could also be that he resized his window with crawl open 05:31:54 The game only tries to handle that in the main play screen 05:32:06 do you get many bugreports about the underscores? 05:32:33 The underscores look odd, I'm not surprised they're BRed :P 05:32:47 * greensnark uses the underscore-free option. 05:33:17 bug-report-reducing default options would be great! 05:33:22 * bhaak ducks 05:33:30 underscores are great 05:33:50 only if they come in pairs! 05:33:57 greensnarking! 05:34:17 :) 05:34:31 when I first saw the underscores, it was obvious what they were for 05:34:58 keeping the sentences from bumping into the left edge? 05:35:21 no, separating messages from previous turns from messages from this turn 05:35:52 Hey Napking! 05:35:54 !coffee 05:35:55 * Henzell hands greensnark a mug of cappuccino, brewed by Ijyb. 05:36:02 oh, really, they do that? 05:36:14 you have to do it that way in Crawl, I think, because the more intuitive method of graying out old messages (as used by some automoring NetHack interfaces) doesn't play nicely with coloured messages, which are much more important 05:37:07 * greensnark is a staunch supporter of clear_messages=yes forevermore 05:37:37 there's a FR for greying out old messages 05:37:40 clear_messages=no is for lobsters and people who put their message pane on top :P 05:37:57 Yegods, message pane on top really gives me the creeps :P 05:38:00 does anyone do that besides me? 05:38:07 I was thinking of you :P 05:38:16 I did see someone else with that though 05:38:18 by: yes, but not in Crawl 05:38:20 crepe, I think 05:38:21 I do in other roguelikes though 05:38:37 I might do it in Crawl too, now I know it's possible 05:40:31 We should have message-pane-endianness wars 05:41:02 I know, let's put the stats on the left! 05:41:02 nifty, messages_at_top = true let crawl look much more familiar and cosy 05:41:12 stats belong on the bottom! 05:41:18 Apparently bhaak is also a minion of Sauron 05:41:37 oh, and is there an option for a turn-counter? 05:41:43 greensnark: no, minions of Sauron would put the stats on the left Angband-style 05:41:53 show_gold_turns = yes, which should be the default :P 05:41:57 whereas bhaak's trying to emulate NetHack, and thus is presumably a minion of Rodney 05:42:20 show_gold_turns=true 05:42:24 Has bhaak changed his HUD caption color to green? 05:42:38 bhaak: you should tell dpeg you like show_gold_turns 05:42:45 bhaak: You should rename UnNetHack to OzNetHack 05:43:00 greensnark: err no, some places are best avoided by everyone but krystal 05:43:09 (who famously plays NetHack green-on-black with colour off) 05:43:20 ais523: bhaak comes pretty close :P 05:43:50 oh, and why didn't anybody tell me about pickup_mode = multi 05:44:05 bhaak: All the good options are non-default, didn't you know? 05:44:13 Especially clear_messages = yes and show_gold_turns=yes 05:44:16 so, where's nethack = true option? 05:44:25 Also default_target=no and target_unshifted_dirs=yes 05:44:46 greensnark: I use shift-direction a lot, but not always 05:44:46 Anyone who does not use this combination of options is set up for eternal damnation :P 05:44:59 in fact, default_target=no and target_unshifted_dirs=yes both seem to make a lot of sense individually, but together? 05:48:19 Actually the new 0.6 targeting behaviour makes combining both annoying 05:48:19 by: dpeg doesn't like it? 05:48:19 it's nice being able to tap . to hit a default target that isn't in NetHack-LOS of you, and being able to aim in straight lines if monsters happen to be there 05:48:19 Because the meaning of 'f' at the targeting prompt was changed, and you have to explicitly map it back to the way it Was Meant To Be 05:48:19 greensnark: what was that way? 05:48:19 ais523: I map 'f' to use the previous target 05:48:19 oh, I thought that's what it did 05:48:19 No, current 'f' is pretty idiotic :P 05:48:19 I mean, I'm sure it was changed for good and noble reasons 05:48:19 what does it do? 05:48:19 !tell dpeg I like show_gold_turns! but the positioning could be improved. everything's crammed into the upper right corner 05:48:19 bhaak: OK, I'll let dpeg know. 05:48:19 It fires at the target, but it doesn't do anything if the cursor is on the player 05:48:19 Whereas the old 'f' would fire at the previous target if cursor is on the player 05:48:19 ah 05:48:19 03kilobyte * r22df51d7af60 10/crawl-ref/source/effects.cc: Tone down acquirement of rare items somewhat. 05:48:19 I'm too ingrained with the habit of using . to fire at everything 05:48:19 because that's what you have to do in NetHack, which has no knowledge of function keys 05:48:19 I use bindkey = [f] CMD_TARGET_MAYBE_PREV_TARGET to get 0.5 'f' behaviour 05:49:01 -!- by has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 05:49:14 Also you can't use target_unshifted_dirs without default_target=no 05:49:26 Because once the cursor leaves the player, you can't use unshifted dirs :P 05:49:51 ais523: '.'? 05:50:06 bhaak: I don't type the apostrophes! 05:50:18 clear_messages=false rules! 05:50:21 -!- by has joined ##crawl-dev 05:50:41 clear_messages encourages playing too quickly; I'm not sure whether or not that's a good thing 05:50:52 umm, clear_messages=false I mean 05:50:55 ais523: that wasn't the question :) I don't understand why you use . because of the way nethack does targetting 05:51:15 yes, I play quicker - because i don't have to press ctrl+p all the time ;) 05:51:18 bhaak: because NetHack doesn't accept any key but . to finish a targetting prompt from something that's "smite-targeted" 05:51:40 so because Crawl controls are so superficially similar to NetHack controls, it's obvious to try that key there too 05:51:41 Napkin: Your term size damns you already, so your immortal soul is in no further peril from clear_messages=no :P 05:51:52 \o/ 05:52:04 I escaped the cave, you mean? ;> 05:52:21 Cave? 05:52:28 can I finally set DGL to use 100x30 by default? :D 05:52:47 Ick :P 05:52:49 Napkin: it should be 80x26 05:52:58 ais523: oh, understood, not the normal targetting with its 11 directions, but the "where do you want to center the stinking cloud" targetting 05:52:58 or maybe 81x25 05:53:03 just slightly different enough that people don't notice 05:53:06 bhaak: yes 05:53:34 by: are you changing the EOLs? 05:56:43 bhaak: more importantly, farlook targetting 05:56:46 um, targeting 05:58:24 ais523: yeah, I know, it's so annoying. got it on the TODO-list, of course :) 05:58:43 bhaak: hmm, farlook-on-hover, Crawl-style? 05:59:13 just making , work inside ; the same way as it does inside / would be nice, too, although this is getting offtopic 05:59:30 actually, that would be great in Crawl too 05:59:42 instead of repeatedly casting at a monster with za.za.za.za.za. 05:59:45 ais523: that's on way to improve it, but also that you can speed-select the monster (although with saner default keys than in crawl :) 05:59:51 it would be great if you could do za,,,,,,,,,, 06:00:03 kilobyte: yes 06:00:47 03kilobyte * r381a63b150f4 10/crawl-ref/source/ (wiz-item.cc wiz-mon.cc): Fix doubled newlines -- mpr() shouldn't be given EOLs. 06:00:49 ais523: I have a patch almost ready, that let's you press f twice to fire in the previous fired direction. way better than ctrl-a 06:01:16 by: ok, so I removed only places where they should be axed and not replaced with "\n" 06:01:23 ok 06:02:30 I also ran into end-of-line handling in description handling... wow 06:03:55 -!- Vandal has joined ##crawl-dev 06:04:49 by: The magical $ munging? :) 06:05:07 yes, it's wonderful 06:05:55 bhaak: Incidentally, it would be nice if ';' would give one-line descriptions of the thing under the cursor without needing further keypresses 06:06:02 In UnNH 06:06:27 Or is there some other key that does what I mean 06:06:38 03kilobyte * r3d74578157b5 10/crawl-ref/docs/crawl_manual.txt: Don't list Darts skill in the manual. 06:07:29 greensnark: more than : does? 06:07:44 I have to check what : does, hang on :) 06:08:31 : describes current square? 06:08:59 yes 06:09:27 Ok, when I use ;, I have to cursor to item and then hit . to get info 06:09:34 It would be awesome if just cursoring would print that info 06:09:40 Like Crawl x does 06:09:58 And without breaking out of ';' mode 06:10:05 that's what ais523 meant 06:10:24 yep, that's what I was thinking of 06:10:51 but there are also no monster or items selecting shortcuts 06:11:25 Those would also be nice, yes 06:15:39 greensnark: for looking at several squares, you can use / (; and / have overlapping functionality but that should be resolved at some point in the future) 06:19:56 -!- syllogism has joined ##crawl-dev 06:28:11 03by * r17940946e038 10/crawl-ref/source/ (output.cc stuff.cc): Fix unescaped printf % uses/workarounds. 06:28:12 03by * ra35bce8c2918 10/crawl-ref/source/ (31 files): Remove EOL. 06:28:13 03by * r6e8bdc215da3 10/crawl-ref/source/ (abl-show.cc chardump.cc command.cc describe.cc tilereg.cc): Get rid of $ to EOL munging. 06:38:33 help screen chapter titles inconsistent (http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=1046) by rob 06:41:42 03by * r9b85c6db619c 10/crawl-ref/source/describe.h: Get rid of some more $ EOL. 06:41:45 03by * r025b866eef34 10/crawl-ref/docs/changelog.txt: changelog: add wizard mode Lua REPL 06:58:34 03kilobyte * rd21c3a445457 10/crawl-ref/docs/develop/levels/syntax.txt: A missing s/trees/tree/ that escaped my sed. 06:58:35 03kilobyte * rf4f0cf5d0b90 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/des/branches/pan.des: Let people catch a glance at Cerebov's loot. 07:18:32 -!- purge has joined ##crawl-dev 07:19:52 -!- by has quit [Disconnected by services] 07:19:53 -!- by_ has joined ##crawl-dev 07:19:58 -!- by_ is now known as by 07:34:06 bhaak: / has that hilariously obstructive series of prompts before you can get down to the business of getting descriptions :P 07:34:38 It's like trying to get into a restaurant with a sumo wrestler maitre d helpfully filling up the entrance 07:34:51 greensnark: yes, I know. isn't nethack funny :) 07:35:01 "Would you like to use the cursor? LOL?" :) 07:36:16 I like best that the help is wrong resp. doesn't tell you everything :) 07:36:19 And I forgot the More info (y/n) madness when selecting one :P 07:37:32 not everybody likes flavour text ;-D 07:38:24 Would be better to say (hit 'v' for more info) or such instead of a y/n that blocks cursor movement :P 07:38:33 greensnark: you can avoid that by using : for more info, rather than . and then answering yes/no 07:38:38 but that's a feature even most NetHack veterans don't know 07:39:06 The part I object to is having to answer yes/no at all :P 07:39:22 no, I mean : avoids the second yes/no 07:39:32 the first one can be avoided using ; but annoyingly ; then : doesn't work 07:39:49 Ah, I get it 07:39:57 And ; is one-thing-only 07:40:01 to me, it's annoying because obviously they've tried to make the interface sane, just failed spectacularly 07:40:03 greensnark: yep 07:40:36 It would also be very nice to not have to space past the bloody more with /: 07:40:39 sensible interface: ; to look at things on the map, / to search the database, followed by . for short info, : for long info, , for short info and look again, ; for long info and look again 07:40:59 it's funny how you gain armour skill in a robe in sprint 07:41:49 the secret door near the start leads to a really stupid tradeoff, actually; search for it and waste loads of exp in T&D? or ignore it and miss the gold? 07:42:01 by: That happens even in regular Crawl, no? 07:42:16 it does 07:42:27 I guess, but you don't suddenly gain two levels while waiting for berserk slow to wear off 07:42:31 :P 07:42:42 yes, just one :P 07:42:56 actually, the interaction of enslavement and monster invis feels really off to me, somehow, but I'm not sure how 07:43:16 it's like, you zap a /oEnslave at Sigmund while he's invisible, and you can't see if it worked (sensible so far) 07:43:31 but then, you press a key to move towards him, and either swap places or attack him depending on whether he's tame or not 07:43:37 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 07:44:03 this probably never comes up in vanilla Crawl, but it happened ten times in a row in Sprint 07:46:43 Hey, Stone Soup is officially vanilla Crawl now. DCSS has arrived. 07:47:07 All we need now is SlashCrawl, featuring hot Slash involving Sigmund and Menkaure 07:48:01 -!- Mu_ has joined ##crawl-dev 07:48:24 As featured here: http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3155652&userid=0&perpage=40&pagenumber=171#post373617038 07:50:04 please, no slash in my RL, I like it more in fanfiction 07:50:39 greensnark: whoops, sorry 07:51:00 at least with Hack/NetHack you can talk about "vanilla NetHack" because it has a different name; I suppose I should get used to saying "vanilla DCSS" 07:52:32 by farming mutations 07:52:41 yes, it's funny 07:54:51 !tell dpeg Heizölrückstoßabdämpfung 07:54:51 greensnark: OK, I'll let dpeg know. 07:58:33 -!- eith has joined ##crawl-dev 08:00:28 there's clearly something wrong with monsters and doors 08:27:44 jesus is that one word? 08:27:49 "Heizölrückstoßabdämpfung" 08:28:56 yes 08:29:43 a compound word, really. 08:30:43 don't discriminate words because they're different 08:31:07 that's nothing, lentokonesuihkuturbiinimoottoriapumekaanikkoaliupseerioppilas 08:31:39 syllogism: you will note that in your word, there are duplicate letters :) 08:32:01 Google Translate refuses to admit that it's a real word 08:34:12 -!- ortoslon has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:35:01 syllogism: this word even got a wikipedia page: Donaudampfschiffahrtselektrizitätenhauptbetriebswerkbauunterbeamtengesellschaft 08:42:08 ixtli: http://www.crossmyt.com/hc/linghebr/awfgrmlg.html 08:45:09 greensnark: it should be noted that there's an entire Japanese poem which uses each letter in one of their alphabets exactly once 08:45:48 in English, the best you can do is along the lines of "Zing! Vext cwm fly jabs Kurd qoph.", which I know off by heart but which isn't particularly meaningful 08:45:58 although I can imagine a vext cwm fly in Crawl 08:46:29 english doesn't meaning in poem -> jabberwocky 08:46:34 *need 08:49:12 snick snack 08:51:16 hmm, you'd just need a cwm fly (i.e. one who lives in a crescent-shaped valley) with a nearby moth of wrath 09:07:35 ais523: いろはにほへと 09:07:38 ちりぬるを 09:07:46 わごやおたれぞ 09:07:47 ... 09:07:50 thats all i remember of it 09:07:51 XD 09:08:03 ixtli: ah, didn't realise you were doing it from memory, that's quite impressive 09:08:19 I don't know it at all 09:08:29 isn't it used to order the alphabet? 09:12:48 it was used to teach the alphabet back in the day 09:13:03 i memorized it with the old kana in a edo period manga class 09:18:11 1f2t99 09:18:13 grr 09:18:28 i still haven't gotten the hang of clips 09:18:36 for the mac :( 09:41:02 -!- Cryp71c has joined ##crawl-dev 09:46:42 -!- ortoslon has joined ##crawl-dev 10:04:28 03by * r4cdaf99143c1 10/crawl-ref/source/ (5 files): Fix monsters not using doors. 10:04:33 -!- karmatic has joined ##crawl-dev 10:10:52 -!- timecircuits has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 10:14:38 In SlashCrawl will monks get the #technique chained blitz? :D 10:15:03 and be able to dual-wield guns? 10:16:24 there should be a unique in crawl of a space marine that got trapped in the crawl diminsion! He went through the CrawlGate on a space hulk! 10:18:23 -!- karmatic has quit [Quit: Leaving] 10:18:53 You see a space marine named Hudson. He is wielding a pulse rifle. He is wearing a nanothread vest. He says "Game over man, game over!". 10:20:13 -!- karmatic has joined ##crawl-dev 10:34:40 Butchering interface improvement proposal (http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=1047) by qui 10:40:34 -!- murphy_slaw has quit [Quit: Colloquy for iPhone - http://colloquy.mobi] 11:04:49 -!- nrook has joined ##crawl-dev 11:38:09 D: 11:38:18 Why would he want to butcher interface improvement?! 11:38:32 he wants to improve the butchering interface 11:38:43 ;) 11:40:05 I wanted one 11:40:22 (if you have a corpse picked up and press c it should tell you what slot the corpse is on) 11:40:35 instead of just the normal "maybe you should drop it first and then butcher you stupid retard" 11:40:38 ;) 11:40:40 greensnark: I think my dad told me to read that once a long time ago 11:40:49 lol 11:41:13 * greensnark <3 Twain forever 11:42:25 ais523: greensnark: since Japanese has to few sounds they have cool things where entire sentences use only like 2 sounds 11:42:41 にわにわにわとりがいる 11:43:09 in English, you only use a tiny subset of the pronouncable sequences of characters as words; presumably other languages are different 11:43:10 "There is a chicken in the garden" literally 11:43:25 Yeah. Japanese is hilariously limited. 11:48:14 ais523: But it has the most complicated written language ever. 11:48:18 Provably. 11:48:45 perhaps it should be used for a roguelike, you could fit a huge number of commands on those letters! 11:48:59 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lion-Eating_Poet_in_the_Stone_Den 11:51:29 ais523: There was a game on the Super Famicom a long time ago where you made spells by mixing kana. 11:51:50 い　ろ　は　に　ほ　へ　と, for example. It's their syllabary. 11:51:50 into kanji? or just into spells generically? 11:52:00 Nope, you just mixed them. 11:52:06 And it made different effects. 11:52:13 Lemme see if i can find it. 11:52:17 It was actually pretty cool. 11:52:25 meh, I'm not that bothered, and it's rather offtopic 11:54:06 -!- nrook has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 12:19:50 -!- ais523 has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:35:23 Anyone around know about how C++ handles dynamic dispatch? 12:35:43 yes 12:36:11 doy: Ok, do me a favor and help me out with how to best handle the following: 12:36:50 doy: http://github.com/ixtli/crawl/blob/ipad/crawl-ref/source/uiwrapper.h and http://github.com/ixtli/crawl/blob/ipad/crawl-ref/source/uiwrapper-sdl.cc 12:37:44 what about it? 12:38:02 doy: Theoretically, if I wanted a native windows implementation of uiwrapper, i would make uiwrapper-win.cc that implemented uiwrapper.h a different way and just add class members in #ifdefs in the header file. 12:38:06 But that seems hacky. 12:38:46 just make UIWrapper an abstract base 12:38:46 I could also do the OO way and make a factory, and have all of the methods in uiwrapper be virtual, and have the constructor hand you back an object specific to your installation. 12:39:03 yeah 12:39:15 why would you not do it that way? 12:39:30 Well, because I would end up doing the same for glwrapper. 12:39:36 ? 12:40:00 This makes the compiler use dynamic dispatch, yeah? It's a small amount of overhead. 12:40:28 Maybe i'm optimizing, but I wanna make sure it's ok to do for drawing code thats gonna be called a lot. 12:40:28 sure, but i can't imagine it being incredibly noticeable 12:40:35 -!- by has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 12:40:37 ok 12:40:43 Just wanna make sure. 12:40:44 i'd say start doing it that way, and we can profile it later 12:41:10 but the factory with subclasses way is definitely the most correct way 12:41:58 then the only place that needs ifdefs is the factory constructor 12:42:31 (really, you don't even need a separate factory class... just a static method in the abstract base class) 12:42:37 Yeah. 12:42:45 I'm not going to make a separate factory class. 12:42:53 good 12:42:53 (: 12:43:03 ill just do virtual ... const = 0 12:43:12 then implement in another pair of .cc/h files 12:43:16 yes 12:43:35 just have uiwrapper-sdl.cc, uiwrapper-osx.cc, etc 12:43:38 which are subclasses 12:43:54 and the makefile can decide which of those to compile 12:44:43 more useful for glwrapper, since you could have glwrapper-opengl.cc and glwrapper-directx.cc, and compile both of them under windows 12:44:51 and let people switch drawing methods using the same binary 12:46:09 Awesome. 12:46:11 Will do. 12:50:33 doy: Do I have to restate virtual method definitions in a subclass' header file? 12:53:42 Therefore, a virtual function is a member function you may redefine for other derived classe 12:53:51 http://publib.boulder.ibm.com/infocenter/comphelp/v8v101/index.jsp?topic=/com.ibm.xlcpp8a.doc/language/ref/cplr139.htm 12:54:01 emphasis on _may_ 12:55:51 felirx: Right, but do I have to declare it in the subclasses header file? 12:56:00 nah 12:56:00 I would think so, but I wanna make sure. 12:56:03 ok 12:56:07 if you declare it, you have to define it 12:56:51 probably mm 12:57:33 -!- Xardas-3 has joined ##crawl-dev 12:59:28 not 100% sure what happens if you just type it in the .h 12:59:32 but never de anything in .cc 13:01:47 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 13:03:02 yeah 13:03:08 felirx: I'll just try it. 13:06:15 night all 13:06:18 Night! 13:07:01 -!- Textmode has quit [Quit: Over the ages, man has been certain of a great many things. some of these things were even true.] 13:07:40 ixtli: you mean the word 'virtual'? 13:07:53 it's optional, but good for documentation purposes 13:08:03 Oh really. 13:08:04 Ok. 13:08:45 doy: One more thing, if you look in http://github.com/ixtli/crawl/blob/ipad/crawl-ref/source/uiwrapper-sdl.cc i'm declaring UIWrapper wrapper; as a global. 13:08:52 the 'virtual' declaration in the base class is the only one that's meaningful 13:09:11 doy: How can I intelligently select the right one with ifdefs? 13:09:23 I don't know how to 'cast' a non pointer ... 13:09:25 ixtli: the global should be a pointer 13:09:29 you can't cast a non-pointer 13:09:49 doy: =/ That means lots of changes to the source, but I guess indirection is never a bad thing.. 13:10:02 Sounds good. 13:23:57 doy: What should I do to silence "warning: ‘class UIWrapper’ has virtual functions but non-virtual destructor" 13:24:05 Just make a protected destructor? 13:24:38 It makes the warning go away and seems to be accepted as a legitimate way to silence a warning that doesn't occur in g++ 4.3 13:28:23 never mind, apparently if you make a protected destructor it's not called by delete. 13:28:30 I'll just make a virtual destructor. 13:29:16 yes, there's really no reason at all for non-virtual destructors to even exist 13:40:31 Saving loses data about shops in bazaar (http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=1048) by qui 13:47:09 -!- Twinge has joined ##crawl-dev 13:58:05 -!- Spads has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:02:55 -!- by has joined ##crawl-dev 14:04:02 -!- Xardas-3 has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:08:33 doy: I've defined the UIWrapper destructor virtual, but now I'm getting undefined symbol errors for ~UIWrapper() from SDLWrapper::~SDLWrapper() 14:09:03 I remember being very frustrated by this virtual destructor thing with c++ last time I had to deal with it =/ 14:11:07 virtual ~UIWrapper() {} ? 14:11:54 yes 14:12:14 I've tried it both with and without the empty {} and no change. 14:13:49 Use an explicit definition outisde the class declaration 14:14:04 virtual ~UIWrapper(); and UIWrapper::~UIWrapper() { } 14:14:21 Ok. In the impl. file? 14:14:26 Aye 14:14:37 uh 14:14:40 No need. 14:14:44 It worked once i put in {} 14:14:48 I needed to make clean 14:14:48 Hehe 14:14:59 because i wasn't actually removing the offending .o 14:15:01 :'( 14:15:06 Sigh. 14:15:14 s/removing/recompiling 14:15:18 dependencies not set up right? 14:15:25 * ixtli shrugs 14:15:41 make clean leaves some *.o files behind (http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=1049) by jpeg 14:15:44 I don't know much about the makefile. I just added extra objects in the same way other people had. 14:15:50 ... 14:15:51 lol 14:15:55 Was that a coincidence? 14:16:35 I seem to suck at NH now :P 14:16:42 Got killed by a lynx in the Mines :P 14:16:58 heh 14:16:59 greensnark: play some MuPr instead 14:17:03 And the sight of a shop just filled me with a weariness that prevented me from even trying to price id :P 14:17:25 Woo. Crawl running using dynamic dispatch. 14:17:27 xD 14:17:28 I mean, the shopkeeper could at least call out the prices automatically 14:17:40 But nooo, I have to #chat for each one 14:18:08 by: MuPr shelved until the weekend, I'm only playing throwaway games until then :P 14:18:16 If someone else wins it first, it takes the pressure off 14:18:21 ah 14:18:22 @whereis Grimm 14:18:22 Grimm the Cruncher (L13 MuPr), a worshipper of Yredelemnul, saved on D:14 on 2010-03-11 after 34567 turns. 14:18:42 muwahaha, I have a very high-potential SpEn..perhaps I'll have 2 wins in 1 week 14:18:59 I forgot how thorny NH's interface is 14:19:01 saying stuff like that is a sure way to jinx yourself and die =p 14:19:09 It's like the death of a thousand cuts 14:19:17 And I keep hitting 'o' :P 14:19:56 eith, lol I totally almost did. 14:20:07 Was chasing a Ice dragon and I had like 40hp 14:20:20 and instead of continuing to flee it turned and breathed me foor 35 dmg 14:21:42 I wanted to drop by because I had an idea for stealth, I think it would be much more interesting if stealth detection factored in your distance from the monster. 14:24:13 greensnark: interhack! 14:24:16 (: 14:28:44 I should totally try interhack 14:29:08 I #chatted for two items then got bored and dove into the Mines instead :P 14:32:44 -!- ortoslon has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:58:46 -!- Spads has joined ##crawl-dev 15:07:17 -!- Cryp71c has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:07:20 -!- Cryp71c has joined ##crawl-dev 15:10:28 -!- EroN1 has joined ##crawl-dev 15:18:48 -!- keithburgun has quit [] 15:25:51 -!- timecircuits has joined ##crawl-dev 15:43:58 -!- timecircuits has left ##crawl-dev 15:47:48 -!- EroN1 has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:50:33 -!- EroN1 has joined ##crawl-dev 15:54:28 ah jeeze. textures get unloaded after SDL :'( 15:55:13 -!- EroN1 has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:00:29 -!- murphy_slaw_ has joined ##crawl-dev 16:08:13 -!- by has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:27:20 -!- permagreen has joined ##crawl-dev 16:35:44 allo 17:15:48 -!- murphy_slaw_ is now known as murphy_slaw 17:16:41 -!- Cryp71c has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:35:20 -!- karmatic has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 18:16:35 -!- purge has quit [Quit: .] 18:18:15 -!- pointless_ has joined ##crawl-dev 18:41:27 -!- karmatic has joined ##crawl-dev 18:47:27 -!- syllogism has quit [] 19:05:16 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 19:15:04 -!- karmatic has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 19:17:00 -!- felirx has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:21:15 -!- Iainuki_ has joined ##crawl-dev 19:30:03 -!- Ero has joined ##crawl-dev 19:50:58 03pointless_ * r60df31737c4a 10/crawl-ref/source/ (fight.cc melee_attack.h): Fix the remaining case of enslaved spores producing friendly ballistos 20:01:24 -!- murphy_slaw has quit [Quit: Colloquy for iPhone - http://colloquy.mobi] 20:03:06 -!- murphy_slaw has joined ##crawl-dev 20:03:10 -!- karmatic has joined ##crawl-dev 20:05:33 -!- pointless_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:07:03 -!- neunon has joined ##crawl-dev 20:08:18 -!- pointless_ has joined ##crawl-dev 20:09:21 -!- murphy_slaw has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:14:45 03pointless_ * r203e7c72201d 10/crawl-ref/source/describe.cc: Change some Fedhas religion titles 20:19:35 -!- murphy_slaw has joined ##crawl-dev 20:21:36 -!- TGWi has joined ##crawl-dev 20:22:13 03pointless_ * r869f80f3f46d 10/crawl-ref/source/abl-show.cc: Adjust Fedhas ability food costs 20:24:46 -!- murphy_slaw has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:25:39 -!- murphy_slaw has joined ##crawl-dev 20:29:16 -!- Mu_ has quit [Quit: Defecator, may everything turn out okay so that you can leave this place.] 20:31:17 03pointless_ * r7c3208722052 10/crawl-ref/source/ (abl-show.cc mon-abil.cc): Adjust piety costs for Fedhas' spores 20:37:21 -!- karmatic has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 20:40:42 -!- murphy_slaw_ has joined ##crawl-dev 20:43:31 -!- murphy_slaw has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:43:31 -!- murphy_slaw_ is now known as murphy_slaw 20:45:10 -!- karmatic has joined ##crawl-dev 20:52:14 -!- TGWi has left ##crawl-dev 20:58:19 -!- CIA-91 has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 20:58:31 -!- murphy_slaw__ has joined ##crawl-dev 21:00:23 -!- CIA-22 has joined ##crawl-dev 21:02:32 -!- murphy_slaw has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 21:12:27 -!- eith has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 21:48:22 -!- Lubaf has joined ##crawl-dev 22:00:42 -!- Iainuki_ has quit [Quit: Iainuki_] 22:40:39 -!- murphy_slaw__ has quit [Quit: Colloquy for iPhone - http://colloquy.mobi] 23:07:07 -!- permagreen has quit [Quit: Welcome to the real world] 23:19:29 -!- Lubaf has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6/20100115144158]] 23:32:18 -!- pointless_ has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6/20100115144158]]