00:00:27 'mornin 00:00:28 ixtli: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 00:00:46 I watched all of this british tv show Fourtysomething last night. 00:00:48 Pretty good. 00:00:56 !messages 00:00:56 (1/1) Enne said (3h 12m 11s ago): Looking great! Are you planning to do a similar abstraction for OpenGL/OpenGL ES? 00:03:44 !tell enne Yeah, I'm going to have to. Then you can do DirectX :D Also, thanks for checking it out. I've realized there's an issue with the union I defined, though. I'll probably have to add 'unsigned char padding' to the top of MouseEvent to fix it. :D 00:03:44 ixtli: OK, I'll let enne know. 00:17:29 Since the distinction between heavy and light armour has been removed (or lessened at least), how does the armour skill affect "light" armour? 00:24:05 03greensnark * rf1a4b1c0547b 10/crawl-ref/source/travel.cc: Fix overview not reporting D:1 as explored correctly. 00:26:59 -!- Vandal is now known as Vandal|Gone 00:38:46 -!- hashc has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 00:49:21 03doy 07stone_soup-0.6 * r27adc1134548 10/crawl-ref/source/dgn-overview.cc: fix hiding nonexistent lair branch in overview 00:49:22 03doy 07stone_soup-0.6 * rb377e5c856bf 10/crawl-ref/source/travel.cc: fix travel cache not being initialized until the X map is viewed 00:49:23 03greensnark 07stone_soup-0.6 * r5747b8b8f934 10/crawl-ref/source/travel.cc: Fix overview not reporting D:1 as explored correctly. 01:01:22 what, only three patches in a cherry-pick? 01:02:04 -!- by has joined ##crawl-dev 01:08:39 !tell enne kbhit() in libgui.cc seems to return 1 only if there is exactly 1 kb event: return (count == 1 ? 1 : 0);. Why is this so specific? 01:08:40 ixtli: OK, I'll let enne know. 01:10:09 Penetration brand is hilariously overpowered :P 01:11:22 And the greater naga nerf is really quite sad 01:11:29 They're pretty pathetic now 01:11:45 ixtli: Macros 01:12:07 sorear: In response to my !tell ? 01:12:10 yes 01:12:20 So it can only return 0 or 1 ? 01:12:23 When you press a macro key, the entire expansion is forced into the key buffer, followed by a "reenable macro expansion" key 01:12:45 if kbhit returned true for >1 key, then it wouldn't be possible to use interruptable actions in macros 01:12:46 Why doesn't the function return a bool, then? 01:12:52 oh oh oh 01:12:55 I see. 01:13:00 I might just be making this up 01:13:03 * sorear checks 01:13:05 sorear: That doesn't sound right 01:13:21 kbhit is supposed to return true for "keyboard input available" 01:13:24 sorear: The thing is that I think it's due to how SDL_checkevent or whatever that function is that counts the queue 01:13:29 returns a value 01:13:44 (ie. it returns -1 for error, but that's checked by an ASSERT() ) 01:14:32 sorear: kbhit shouldn't be used to deal with the queue itself I don't think ... just to see if a key has been pressed. 01:15:06 "You hear an explosion." <--- one of my zombies found Margery, presumably :P 01:15:20 I love the monster LOS fix that lets them fight normally outside player LOS 01:15:35 -!- Twinge has joined ##crawl-dev 01:15:35 oo nice 01:16:32 greensnark: A set of spells or abilities that lets you get env. messages directly from a controlled monster would be cool. 01:16:45 Or like, to see through their eyes or something. 01:16:52 I mean, this might exist already :) 01:18:40 -!- Twinge- has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 01:20:34 ixtli: I like the idea of being able to see things through a monster's eyes if you control them. It'd be a nice little bonus for learning necromancy or similar 01:21:00 permagreen: Yeah, and I think you could do interesting stuff with how skilled a player was at doing it. 01:21:45 permagreen: For instance, if they were bad, they would slump to the floor and be effectively paralyzed for X turns. 01:21:55 permagreen: Else, they might be able to do an action to break out of the trance. 01:21:56 Etc.. 01:23:07 Heh, yeah that'd be pretty good punishment for trying that when they aren't experienced enough for it 01:25:34 permagreen: You could go really far with it and make a whole character based around possession of other entities. 01:26:10 permagreen: Like a high level one might be able to possess an enemy. This would make for hilarious results if you were to do it to something mindless or very angry at you. 01:28:47 Might be a decent idea for a class. Sort of a combination of Summoner and Necromancer. It might also be interesting if monsters could also have these abilities, though that might be difficult to code 01:29:07 !tell dpeg if you go around telling people that I believe nethack will stay rl nr 1 for a long time, please add the phrase "despite the gameplay". Otherwise they might get a strange opinion of me :) 01:29:07 bhaak: OK, I'll let dpeg know. 01:30:25 Ha ha 01:31:56 bhaak: I agree with you on that. Nethack will remain one of the most popular roguelikes mostly because Nethack is one of the most popular roguelikes 01:36:03 yeah and it could be that the nh variants don't get as popular because they just don't get what makes nethack really popular 01:37:58 Hard to compete with 'popular because it is popular' in a small niche like this :) 01:38:22 So basically nh variants aren't popular because they aren't popular? 01:41:25 greensnark: did your @ just lose the cursor for a while, or is it just my terminal? 01:42:31 Hm, didn't notice it if it did 01:45:13 permagreen: It would be difficult, though you could simplify it by making the monster that controls you use you as if you were a pet. Like that slave master unique. 01:46:02 permagreen: But then, I guess you'd have to give monsters a general directive that is more complicated than "kill the player" 01:46:03 :d 01:47:24 Maybe a powerful enough player could just slip into the monster entirely and temporarily control it as the player character 01:47:35 also, the monster and player code is sufficiently irreconcilable that you couldn't do that 01:47:52 Oh, darn 01:47:59 it's easy in a game like POWDER where all mobs are created equal 01:48:10 but here, 90% of the logic is unshared 01:50:17 Oh well, It's something I can keep in mind for if I ever write my own rl 01:52:48 -!- Cryp71c has joined ##crawl-dev 01:52:50 permagreen: no :) they aren't as popular because they might only appeal to the critical, vocal part of the rl community (people who are content with nethack are far less likely to play a game that fixes or improves nethack. they read "fixes" and hear "make it even harder" even though that's not the intention) 01:53:22 -!- Enne has joined ##crawl-dev 01:53:24 -!- Enne has quit [Client Quit] 01:53:35 bhaak: really. 01:53:39 :/ 01:53:41 crawl's probably already more popular in the rl community than nethack, but not in the whole gaming community 01:53:49 permagreen: Maybe we could work on that one day. 01:54:13 permagreen: But yeah, controlling the enemy like it was you would be the ultimate goal. 01:54:28 permagreen: It would add the strategic element of making sure that you're in a safe place, etc.. 01:57:41 Yeah, I imagined it being kind of like a rl variation on the guided missles in Descent 2 (if you ever played that game) and similar 01:58:12 Yeah :D 01:58:16 Totally. 01:58:21 Or in Metal Gear. 01:58:22 :D 02:01:02 speaking of which... where is descent 4! 02:01:03 :) 02:01:45 At the moment, it's mostly a rumor. :-( 02:02:54 there was another game just like it, but where you drove on "space motorcycles" instead of in ships 02:03:00 through the corridors 02:05:16 ah it was called forsaken 02:06:12 I'm kind of surprised there haven't been more Descent-like games. The concepts that made it popular don't seem that difficult to my mind. Zero gravity, decent AI, and lots of explosions. How hard can that be? 02:31:08 nethack is popular because of the history 02:31:17 the gameplay doesn't matter at all 02:31:41 Inertia is a powerful thing 02:31:46 nethack is just "that game that you have to play if you want to be a *real* elite nerd/whatever" 02:32:06 and that's not something that you can take away by making a game that's actually more fun 02:37:29 purge: A demo of it is on the Duke Forever DVD, I hear ;-) 02:38:10 Heh. Duke Nukem Forever actually WAS being worked on all that time, but it has officially been canceled as of a few months ago. 02:38:22 yeah 02:39:14 A sad story, really; the guy running the show simply could not accept less than perfect. So they rewrote everything like 4 times, had plenty of good ideas, etc. but it never came to fruition -- and all the employees can say is 'I worked on Duke Nukem Forever for a decade and have nothing to show for it' :/ 02:39:47 Yeah it's sad. 02:39:49 The founder of BoardGameGeek.com was one of the programmers there for a while until he saw it going nowhere and quit 02:39:58 "Just fucking release it" :P 02:40:09 -!- Spads has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:40:54 Duke Nukem Forever is a tragic story indeed 02:41:32 Maybe they'll make a movie about it 02:42:08 not as tragic as the death of greensnark's MuPr 02:42:17 (still to come) 02:42:24 ;) 02:47:02 -!- Spads has joined ##crawl-dev 02:56:53 -!- Cryp71c has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 02:59:36 !lm greensnark 02:59:39 2221. [2010-02-27] greensnark the Slicer (L16 MuPr) killed Agnes on turn 64750. (D:13) 02:59:46 !lm greensnark type=rune 02:59:47 137. [2010-02-27] greensnark the Slicer (L16 MuPr) found a serpentine rune of Zot on turn 60573. (Snake:5) 02:59:50 !lm greensnark type=rune -2 02:59:50 136. [2010-02-27] greensnark the Slicer (L14 MuPr) found a barnacled rune of Zot on turn 44303. (Shoals:5) 02:59:59 clearly shoals is too easy 03:00:03 !lm greensnark type=rune -3 03:00:03 135. [2009-12-25] greensnark the Necromancer (L15 KeNe) found a barnacled rune of Zot on turn 36340. (Shoal:5) 03:05:53 -!- Spads has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 03:07:20 I think there are a lot of reasons why something gets popular. In the case of nethack I think gameplay plays some part in it but by now it's not the main point (dunno if it ever was it). 03:07:58 unfortunately most people don't know why their game/movie/$anything got popular. Otherwise we wouldn't have so many bad sequels 03:08:30 I thought nethack was fun way back when i was first playing it. 03:08:31 bhaak: It's a puzzle game. 03:08:38 Some people really, really like to play puzzle games. 03:08:45 Regardless of the overall quality. 03:08:51 Look at most non-action console games. 03:08:57 Especially from the PSX era. 03:09:29 I'm beginning to believe that nh and crawl are not in the same genre 03:10:05 Crawl is tactical and nethack is a random puzzle game. 03:10:24 To be fair, i don't have even half the experience with these games as most of you guys, but i've played a bunch of video games in my time :) 03:10:26 ixtli: I don't think the explanation is that easy. 03:10:38 i've said that for years 03:10:44 It never is 03:10:50 Yeah. 03:11:27 bhaak: I mean, sure it's an over simplification, but I think you're making the discussion harder for yourself when you start with the premise that NH and crawl are in the same genre. 03:11:41 I dunno. I'm beginning to think that "roguelike" is a poor descriptor. 03:11:53 Because it basically refers to the presentation of the state of the game. 03:13:57 Yeah; 1) High difficulty, 2) Dead characters = dead, and 3) Random generation oesn't exactly describe a genre unto itself =) 03:15:56 complexity and hack'n'slash are two additional points from the berlin interpretation that I think are important for a rl 03:17:22 Complexity... Eh, I think you can have a rogue-like that isn't terribly complex. And even that varies widely in the group; Crawl is much less complex to the player than say ADOM 03:20:26 ixtli: someone I know recently did a horrible hack which allowed a server administrator to hack into ADOM games and control monster behavior 03:21:28 Wow, what magnificent bastard 03:22:14 sorear: Geeze. 03:22:37 sorear: How? Like, give it AI directives? 03:24:30 sorear: on this note, I think more variation in monster behavior might be interesting to see in crawl. 03:25:22 like if monsters could be more or less likely to attack on their own, if less likely then they would run to something friendly 03:25:24 etc. 03:28:14 ixtli: you get a map with the monster on it and can press arrow keys to move. 03:28:24 wow 03:28:33 This is all there is. You do not, for instance, get walls on the map. You cannot control any innate ability. 03:29:04 There's also a bug where occasionally your choice gets ignored 03:29:13 most commonly in melee range 03:31:58 Complexity is a bad term. IMHO Complexity implies you can't figure something out without studying it. Depth is what you want. 03:31:58 So does the server wait for the admin to make a move before letting the player do so? 03:32:18 purge: Agreement. 03:40:10 -!- Textmode has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:41:58 -!- Xardas-3 has joined ##crawl-dev 03:46:37 ixtli: yes 03:46:48 interesting 03:47:06 basically, this program attaches to the user's process using the Linux debugger API, and then breakpoints the AI 03:50:38 -!- ortoslon1 has joined ##crawl-dev 03:53:35 how do i change the key that toggles inv/spell/mem tabs in tiles? don't see it in keybind.txt 03:57:31 Hi ortoslon1! 03:58:18 That's an excellent question. I'm not sure it's intended as a "proper" key, it was there as a shortcut before the clickable tab icons were implemented. 03:58:33 But I'll try to check the source.. 03:58:40 Hi. 03:58:45 No messages? yay! 03:58:49 Hi due! 03:59:18 Hi Keskitalo! 04:00:32 i still want a key, i mostly look at those icons rather than click them 04:01:30 i think i only use mouse for looking at map and autotraveling 04:03:22 ortoslon1: CMD_TOGGLE_SPELL_DISPLAY 04:03:53 how about using the tab key for that? 04:03:58 moin guys :) 04:04:08 moin Napkin 04:04:09 crawl doesn't have the notion of a secondary weapon? (just discovered switching by ' and was surprised how it worked) 04:04:11 use for quiver selection already :) 04:04:12 moin Napkin 04:04:36 I miss the days when the quiver worked the same 04:04:53 ortoslon1: Could you file that it's missing from documentation? 04:05:03 yes 04:05:08 Thank you! 04:05:12 sorear: It changed? 04:05:40 look here, due: http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=354 04:05:53 but johanna says, it has always been like that 04:06:00 hm 04:06:19 due: back in ye good old days, 'f' always used the lowest-lettered compatible ammo stack 04:06:25 you configured shooting with '=' 04:06:39 Sounds delightful. 04:06:46 it truly was 04:06:52 and what would it switch to when that slow was empty? 04:06:58 now I've got this 'quiver' thing constantly confusing you 04:07:13 *slot 04:07:20 Napkin: there is no 'switch' - it simply used the lowest item at any given instant 04:07:22 I like this way better 04:07:29 if you have any a, it uses a 04:09:52 -!- ortoslon1 has left ##crawl-dev 04:10:17 but yes, ( and ) should cycle in the same way 04:11:19 CMD_TOGGLE_SPELL_DISPLAY not documented (http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=959) by ortoslon 04:12:47 thank you, ortoslon :) 04:13:16 oh, and please ignore my !tell-message - it was a bug on my end in parsing the links from learndb 04:21:38 -!- Twinge- has joined ##crawl-dev 04:25:38 -!- Twinge has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 04:28:55 Napkin: Nice, the top news item on the welcome page 04:29:07 !tell nrook Monster silence!!! <3 <3 <3 04:29:08 Keskitalo: OK, I'll let nrook know. 04:29:41 We need !tell --amend :P 04:29:44 omg, Keskitalo - that was a haxy thing to add :D 04:29:58 !tell nrook Submit the patch alredy, we need silent sceptres for Crypt!! 04:29:58 Keskitalo: OK, I'll let nrook know. 04:30:31 Napkin: Is something planned for the About page? 04:30:47 -!- syllogism has joined ##crawl-dev 04:31:04 yes 04:31:17 I have received the feared email from Johanna ;) 04:31:23 But I'm a bit slow this morning :D 04:31:34 Why doesn't she hang out on IRC anyway? 04:31:36 ixtli: Should/could we start pulling your refactoring into master branch? 04:31:46 Napkin: What'd it say? :) 04:32:41 ah, you know - the usual: "Oh, the new page is awesome! :D - How about we change this and that and this and that and why is this and how about that and ...?" :D 04:32:51 <3 04:32:55 Heh heh 04:33:10 love her love for details :) 04:34:29 Oh, greensnark is hhere. 04:37:07 Twinge-: looking at her mails she would spam IRC more than the bots do :) 04:52:32 03due * rc7e232387f1b 10/crawl-ref/source/misc.cc: Milestones for Labyrinths. 04:53:21 due: Hooray! 04:54:46 I haven't properly tested them ;) 04:55:35 But there's no reason why it won't work. 04:58:55 Yeah, it's a bit hard to test them without dgl. :) 04:59:09 Egad, it's play-testing post day again. 04:59:10 Well - I guess not! Just need to define DGL being used and it'll write the milestone.txt 04:59:42 Yeah. 04:59:44 But that's a full rebuild :9 05:00:00 Evenin uee 05:00:05 Er, Evenin due 05:00:09 Heya greensnark :) 05:00:27 http://sprunge.us/ZQNa 05:00:29 I was debating that one :) 05:00:33 But I went with the lazy option instead. 05:01:44 What is the lazy option? :) 05:02:30 c7e232387f1b :) 05:02:42 http://sprunge.us/FJEK 05:02:48 * greensnark miaows. 05:03:02 Is it time to fix milestones to appear on the correct source level? :) 05:03:13 "entered the Lair (D:9)" for instance 05:03:20 Instead of the current bletchery 05:03:24 !lm * br.enter=Lair 05:03:25 Good idea. 05:03:38 It'll mean changing all the portal vault epilogues though :) 05:03:46 bah, why? 05:04:13 Oh look, bikeshed painting on the mailing list, tada! 05:04:15 22939. [2010-02-27] b0rsuk the Cloud Mage (L10 DrAE) entered the Lair of Beasts on turn 11329. (Lair:1) 05:04:46 We'll need to pass some flag to mark_milestone to say "report origin level" 05:05:09 the other alternative is to report the milestone just before the player users the stair, but that doesn't help with portal vaults that can have different destinations 05:05:17 Like wizlabs 05:05:25 -!- dpeg has joined ##crawl-dev 05:05:42 We have a peg from Angband! 05:05:42 Yeah. 05:05:48 The wolf from the gates of Angband? 05:06:54 roar 05:06:55 dpeg: You have 2 messages. Use !messages to read them. 05:06:55 Woo! Silmarillion references! 05:07:10 !messages 05:07:10 (1/2) sorear said (2d 15h 13m 53s ago): all I know about contacting D.brodale is that he's active on Wikipedia. Could leave a comment on his Talk: page 05:07:14 !messages 05:07:15 (1/1) bhaak said (3h 38m 8s ago): if you go around telling people that I believe nethack will stay rl nr 1 for a long time, please add the phrase "despite the gameplay". Otherwise they might get a strange opinion of me :) 05:07:39 dpeg: Newbiews can't become seasoned players who kno individual item weights unless they turn show_inventory_weights on. ;) 05:07:42 dpeg, greensnark 3 hell-rune speed run on CDO (wasp) :) 05:07:43 But I see your point. 05:07:44 greensnark: did you know that bhaak seriously believes that Nethack will be the most popular roguelike even in 100 years? 05:08:32 due: this is not true. Item weights are shown in item descriptions. And you *do* get a feeling for weights simply by playing. I never used item weights and I got seasoned. 05:08:38 sometimes I start to wonder... 05:08:58 dpeg: That might happen if people stop playing roguelikes and regard them merely as musem pieces to be observed from a safe distance :) 05:09:22 In which case Nethack will definitely be one of the most illustrious pieces of dead history :P 05:09:29 yes! 05:10:14 dpeg: And trying to work out in a hurry what's the heaviest item to drop while enccumbered means either pre-knowing, or going through each item individually to work out the heaviest (is this wand heavier than this potion, or this scroll? etc). 05:10:26 I don't disagree with your idea that the information is overloading. 05:10:32 dpeg: Shoals are actually rather too easy :P 05:10:38 !lm . rune=barnacled 05:10:42 4. [2010-02-27] greensnark the Slicer (L14 MuPr) found a barnacled rune of Zot on turn 44303. (Shoals:5) 05:10:51 What?! Too easy?? :o 05:10:53 I had much less trouble than in Snake :P 05:10:56 due: you can always patiently check the item descriptions 05:10:57 !m . rune=serpentine 05:11:08 This is absolutely not an issue, I should prune the whole damn discussion. 05:11:13 !lm . rune=serpentine 05:11:14 39. [2010-02-27] greensnark the Slicer (L16 MuPr) found a serpentine rune of Zot on turn 60573. (Snake:5) 05:11:36 greensnark: I will add your comments on c-r-d to the 0.7 wiki page. 05:11:36 Of course, I had to banish Ilsuiw :P 05:11:43 And I had to leave Margery behind on Snake:5 :/ 05:11:56 But I'll be going back to say hi to Margery at some point 05:11:57 I don't care enough about inventory weights to involve myself any more, to be honest. 05:12:26 due: I can live with the fact that most players and developers are not able to think for/like new players. 05:13:10 * due is still a relatively new player. 05:13:15 no :) 05:13:22 I mean *really new* players. 05:13:29 He means players like me 05:13:32 yes 05:13:35 Hehe 05:13:41 Someone told me three weeks into playing that I could turn on inventory weights--and I slapped my forehead and went "duh, that's awesome!". 05:14:04 I said several times already that a toggle is the best solution. 05:14:12 definitely. 05:14:18 toggle > option > default on 05:14:18 It's currently too obfuscated. :) 05:15:19 Since we don't have toggles right now, we have to choose the newbie friendly option. That's all. 05:15:55 dpeg, 10k? now :( 05:16:09 cbus: what's bad about this? 05:16:14 dpeg, the questionmark :) 05:16:25 ah, I see 05:16:31 gotta do some housework 05:17:39 * bhaak slaps dpeg around the solar system -- just out of spite! 05:17:54 stop it or I'll pull out the logs!!!!11 05:18:17 -!- purge has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 05:18:47 oh hey, moin guys! 05:19:03 Yay, Napkin is here 05:19:17 Wazzzup? :D 05:19:21 greensnarking! 05:21:14 I've been playing :) 05:21:16 -!- ortoslon1 has joined ##crawl-dev 05:21:19 * due adding debug commands for troves. 05:21:24 excellent :) 05:21:54 armor acquirement for an ogre just gave me -2 wizard hat. is it a bug? 05:23:04 randart, isn't it? 05:23:24 it was filling a slot you didn't have filled 05:23:30 Keskitalo - I hope you are ok with me moving most of the landing page to the "About" link in "The Game"? 05:23:38 haha ok 05:25:27 the slot fill acquirement was implmented by someone very afraid of power creep 05:25:35 it hands out negatively enchanted items 05:26:43 ...specifically? 05:26:55 yes 05:27:14 well, random2(5) - 2 enchanted 05:27:35 but it's a special case, acquirement plain goods are normally +2 05:28:17 I think it's a good idea. 05:28:30 And everybody should be afraid of power creep! 05:28:52 * permagreen is terrified of power creep 05:29:04 At least I think I am... 05:29:05 Still seems off, especially going all the way to -2. Maybe random2(4) -1 instead? 05:29:18 Twinge-: powergamer! 05:29:20 -!- dpeg has quit [Quit: BEWARE THE P O W E R C R E E P !!1!!] 05:33:20 * Twinge- files the idea away in his lsit of 'giood stuff to implement sometime' 05:39:04 A lsit of lsits. 05:40:05 It'd probably be more efficient to implement it as a hsah of lsits though 05:41:05 -!- bmh has joined ##crawl-dev 05:41:42 morning, dev 05:42:01 lsit is a pretty common typo for me. Maybe almost as common as jsut. 05:42:11 greensnark: I'm thinking of a debug command for portals where you can e'x'amine over and hit D or whatever, and it checks env.marker_at(pos, MAT_ANY).property("debug"),which then either returns a string or uses unmangle to run a debug function that prints other strings. 05:42:16 greensnark: Comments? 05:42:17 * due skedaddle for a bit. 05:42:30 due: Sounds useful 05:42:35 !message dpeg I'll write something about playing Jiyva as soon as I win a game... I invariably seem to die by level 15 or so. YASD. 05:42:49 I did that wrong, didn't I? 05:43:46 use !tell 05:43:50 ah-ha 05:44:00 !tell dpeg I'll write something about playing Jiyva as soon as I win a game... I invariably seem to die member:by level 15 or so. YASD. 05:44:00 bmh: OK, I'll let dpeg know. 05:44:47 How does one die member:by 05:44:47 Where did the 'member:' come from? 05:44:55 ha 05:45:06 my irc client poisoned my cut and paste. 05:50:38 by is a nickname here 05:50:45 -!- Xardas-3 has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.0.17/2010021501]] 05:50:46 -!- Ashenzari has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 05:51:30 -!- Ashenzari has joined ##crawl-dev 05:51:30 -!- The topic of ##crawl-dev is: DCSS development channel! | Logs: http://tozt.net/crawl | People with +v have commit access. | Please keep general crawl-related chit-chat to ##crawl. | Dev wiki: http://crawl.develz.org/wiki | Ashenzari source: http://github.com/doy/crawlbot | due is semihere for the next few days. 05:51:31 New "minor" Link "The Game -> About" - we might want to make that a "major" Link... But the more big links the more unclear the page will become, I think 05:53:52 It seems pretty clear as is to me 06:05:14 xom's mutation just healed me. i was like 26/82, then i'm "suffused with distortional energy", gain three mutations and become 41/82 06:05:27 what? 06:06:13 Xom sometimes does good things. Or bad things with good outcomes 06:06:36 but is it supposed to reset me to half health instead of just tormenting me? 06:07:43 xom should really mutate less now that we have jiyva. 06:07:55 And Jiyva, I believe, should not give state modifying mutations. 06:16:52 Portal vaults do not always return the player to the correct level (http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=960) by greensnark 06:17:38 Oh. There's a crazy vault idea: A mini-branch that rejoins with the main dungeon at the bottom 06:18:43 That'd be kind of neat 06:26:33 It's doable. 06:28:27 I was also thinking about the possibility of having "wide stairs" where more monsters follow you up than normally 06:39:51 looking at 78291's vehu game on cdo, light green empowered spell colouring seems to be too intrusive 06:42:58 Isn't that gone? 06:43:15 empowered is still in 06:43:36 I thought that was uncontroversially useful enough with vehumet 06:44:37 can still remove it, though; or change colour to green or white? 06:46:16 hm. 06:49:30 Well, green would overlap with favored, but white might work. Assuming I'm reading the code right 06:49:39 Keskitalo: no point quite yet. Gimme a few more days. 06:49:46 favored is disabled anyway 06:49:57 Oh, nevermind then 06:50:16 Also, be back in a bit. Someone is making hand-made pizza downstairs. They are Japanese. This should be good >=] 06:50:25 (I'm italian and live in Japan atm) 06:50:43 * permagreen wonders if pizza and sushi would go well together 06:50:53 dude it so does. Sashimi pizza. 06:50:58 Anything on top of the right crust. 06:51:01 mmmm 06:51:05 -!- ixtli has quit [Quit: pizza] 06:51:15 Oh man, I have to try that some time! 06:52:50 "Illegal instruction" crash, nice 06:54:58 Oh, forgot to .c_str() a std::string in mprf. 07:03:37 -!- ortoslon1 has left ##crawl-dev 07:07:20 -!- Twinge has joined ##crawl-dev 07:07:46 Napkin: This change makes the "Welcome" page be more of a project home page, than a game home page. I'm not sure which we want! 07:09:23 yeah, I am not sure either yet ;) 07:09:34 For the player, the most important things should be: The short blurp about the game, the screenshots, the downloads, and the online playing instructions. 07:09:52 ..and the news. 07:10:23 For those more deeply interested, the blog, the links to wiki and tracker and maybe short instructions are important. 07:10:37 -!- Twinge- has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 07:10:39 true 07:10:47 so, we need to find a middle way 07:11:04 The project history and devteam info could go from "About" under The Game, to "About" under The Development. 07:11:18 There sure is a lot of info I'd like to push to the visitor. :) 07:12:23 well.. I'd like to have the text in "About" more prominent 07:13:09 New visitors will probably stop reading those links when it comes to "Development" 07:13:47 oh, you mean 2x About? 07:13:51 Yeah.. but the Origins and devteam are not essential information. The first section of the about page certainly is! 07:14:00 greensnark or sorear, ping. 07:15:19 well, I don't agree completely - especially since there is the confusiong about "Dungeon Crawl" and "Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup" - I think the Origins should be mentioned close to that section with the description. 07:15:41 *agree fully 07:16:07 Hmm, that's a point.. 07:16:12 +good 07:16:30 How about... 07:17:07 Showing the content of current "About" when clicking the "Welcome" button? 07:17:57 isn't it confusing that "Welcome" "Game News" and "Dev Blog" redirect to (essentially) the same page? 07:18:10 they don't, bhaak 07:18:31 on the other hand - it's all wordpress - so yes, they all do ;) 07:18:59 greensnark, sorear: I'm pretty sure adding to the command keys enum doesn't break save compatability, I could be wrong, though. Please feel fre eto revert the commit I'm about to make if it causes trouble. 07:19:03 Napkin: I was actually thinking going back to the old crf-page contents and structuring, except for new. 07:19:07 news 07:19:22 Keep the news in the same spot, but - this includes an FR - only show headers of the news 07:19:50 irgs 07:19:51 oh, only "Game News" and "Dev Blog" do. "Welcome" only includes the last news. but with my screen size, I didn't notice the one lien that's different :) 07:20:07 So; the game blurp / submitting BRs and FRs / news (headers) / origins of soup / devteam on the Welcome page, and the About page wouldn't be needed. 07:20:11 03due * r70f0ac54e5f8 10/crawl-ref/source/ (6 files in 2 dirs): Framework for debugging portal vaults using 'x-d'. 07:20:16 Keskitalo: ---^ :) 07:20:30 due: Ooh, sounds nice! 07:20:50 Game News and Dev blog kind of look the same because currently they both have the same news item on top 07:21:10 I tried that, eino - and Having the news-excerpt on the third place is like not showing them at all 07:21:27 yes, but it's unusal for a blog to have such disguised category links 07:21:35 Napkin: Ah.. 07:21:46 we're ok with unusual, I think :D 07:22:12 Goodnight folk 07:22:22 Keskitalo: I'm hoping it'll be really useful for sorting out annoying issues 07:22:49 I had them at second pleace, which was a bit better.. but I'm afraid to run into jpeg's "I liked to have the 'File a bug report/Propose a new feature' link on first sight when visiting the website!" 07:22:55 g'night due :) 07:23:46 Napkin: good luck and good plooging ; 07:23:48 *;) 07:23:53 hehe 07:23:58 Thanks :D 07:24:20 somebody should tell jpeg what bookmarks are for :) 07:25:07 Napkin: Heh, yeah.. that's the game/dev site problem :) 07:25:19 excatly :) 07:25:19 Second place sounds good to me! 07:26:19 Hmh, it *will* drop "Submitting Bugs" etc out of sight. . May I fiddle around? 07:26:25 well.. hmm.. ok... I started to like to see that first news line at the very top 07:26:45 sure - but be careful with this [include] thingy - it's tricky ;) 07:27:01 Perhaps we could display the latest news headline at the top - there's a huge GAME NEWS button to the right after all! 07:27:29 what do you mean? 07:28:36 On the top of the Welcome page, we could display: "Latest news: Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup's New Official Page (2010-02-26)" 07:28:38 re bug report link, how about a "BUG REPORTS" button at the top right? 07:29:37 by: Could work! 07:29:48 arg! 07:30:21 -!- scarf has joined ##crawl-dev 07:32:25 But.. I think displaying just one news headline would leave the "Submitting Bugs" header visible on most window sizes and resolutions. 07:36:27 IMO it would be sufficient if the submitting bugs link would be in the right column. or a generic link to contributing page. But yes, you're revolving currently around "what should a visitator see first: game-related or dev-related or generic-news-related stuff?" 07:38:06 * Napkin shuts up and takes a break * 07:38:12 Too many cooks :-P 07:38:16 o/ 07:41:18 you don't have to shut up. You just have to please EVERYBODY! I think the optimal solution would be to make a per-user page. Probably quite easy with the telepathic-show-me-what-i-want wordpress plugin ;-D 07:44:34 napkin, many cooks -> alot of food 07:44:35 :) 07:45:02 -!- Enne has joined ##crawl-dev 07:45:26 Alternatively, many cooks -> a lot of broken dishes 08:04:45 -!- Mu_ has joined ##crawl-dev 08:23:04 if it's clear that EV needs a step down, why don't we do that for 0.6? 08:24:31 Napkin: Are you around? :) 08:30:59 by: I agree, actually 08:31:23 Especially with Cheibriados handing out stat boosts like cheap toffee :P 08:31:34 Even without Cb, spriggan EV used to be brokenly strong in 0.5 08:31:39 And 0.6 is just ridiculous 08:33:01 A stepdown should also be quite safe to put in even at this late stage 08:33:20 But: dpeg's call 08:33:36 Another aspect of EV brokenness is the silly to-hit monsters get for archery 08:33:50 So players say: "EV is useless, this yaktaur captain keeps hitting me" :P 08:33:57 Although nothing can touch them in melee 08:34:59 ev is useless, yaktaur captain keeps hitting me even with 150 ev :P 08:36:32 I tend to disagree with the "let's have players have fun with overpowered stuff" 08:36:51 but that's because I tend to have less fun it things are overpowered 08:37:50 Well, one aspect is that EV has been called useless for so long that players were just blindly going for heavy armour 08:38:26 Going in the other direction is bad, but at least it will shake things up 08:38:38 I'd like it fixed in 0.6, or 0.6.1 if 0.6 ship has sailed 08:39:01 0.6 is bound to have a short shelf life, so I'm not terribly worried if it gets pushed to 0.6.1 08:39:34 the AC nerf probably does enough to discourage heavy armour 08:39:39 Yes 08:39:44 It's pretty one sided now :P 08:39:57 I tried to do a concept line of MuPr in heavy arour :P 08:40:04 Didn't work very well :P 08:40:15 The moment I went with light armour I had a XL 16 MuPr :P 08:40:32 !hs . MuPr 08:40:32 15. greensnark the Spear-Bearer (L14 MuPr), worshipper of Yredelemnul, blasted by Aizul (bolt of poison) on Swamp:3 on 2010-02-24, with 57868 points after 46830 turns and 3:28:08. 08:40:53 That was the best mostly-heavy-armour attempt :P 08:41:24 greensnark 08:41:28 what's up? :) 08:41:31 03greensnark * r3340529f1d77 10/crawl-ref/source/ (21 files in 3 dirs): Report parent level in branch entry milestones. 08:41:44 Napkin: CDO will run master again after 0.6 release, right? 08:41:51 yes 08:41:55 the nerf is probably pretty noticeable on d1 08:41:57 Excellent 08:41:59 0.5.2 & 0.6.x and master 08:42:16 you think we should keep 0.4.5? 08:42:18 since you don't get a guaranteed one damage reduction anymore 08:42:19 Once that's done I want to test the new milestones and the timestamp file 08:42:24 Napkin: No, toss 0.4 :) 08:42:28 agreed :D 08:42:30 0.4 belongs in the dim dead past! 08:43:23 hehe 08:43:32 I've been updating the posts about releases 08:44:11 http://crawl.develz.org/wordpress/new-crawling-server-up-and-running <- 0.3 trunk :D 08:48:51 -!- eith has joined ##crawl-dev 08:50:13 ok, Keskitalo - I have reverted website to this: http://crawl.develz.org/wordpress/ 08:51:13 I generally liked the full news on the top best - but I put it to second place now. Once I'm back from the garden I'll try to make it show up as summary instead of the full article. 08:51:22 this wizard mode spriggan gains 9 EV from a +5 ring of dexterity 08:52:39 Additionally, I think removing the section "Submitting Bugs and Feature Requests" would be the way to go - but Rob's idea to add it as big link - we'll have to remove some other button then. Maybe remove the big "Knowledge Bots" button? 08:53:17 anyways, later 08:53:29 Napkin: Thank you! Later. :) Sorry, I disappeared again. 08:53:34 Napkin: I like the plan. 08:53:45 Keskitalo: this time you closed the editor, so no problem ;) 08:53:49 hehe :) 08:53:50 Yeah! 08:54:17 Knowledge Bots could be in The Game link list. It's a neat feature though! 08:54:58 I do like the BR/FR stuff on the front page itself myself. 08:55:21 it somehow doesn't fit in the first page, I think 09:01:14 -!- permagreen has quit [Quit: Welcome to the real world] 09:04:33 -!- eith has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:06:27 -!- eith has joined ##crawl-dev 09:14:46 -!- pointless_ has joined ##crawl-dev 09:16:49 Does use_fake_cursor work in master 09:16:55 It seems righteously broken 09:20:30 Looks like the guilty commit is 55f480d00c "Simplify the handling of the background_colour option." 09:21:16 it seems to work for me on cdo... 09:21:21 CDO is 0.6 09:21:34 ah 09:23:40 sorear: Was there a bug in background_colour handling? 55f480d00c breaks use_fake_cursor 09:27:30 -!- ixtli has joined ##crawl-dev 09:28:26 Keskitalo: There? 09:30:17 This is a cool crash: http://crawl.develz.org/morgues/trunk/Eifeltrampel/crash-Eifeltrampel-20100107-035021.txt -- Nikola cast chain lightning and killed himself, then killed the player 09:30:49 Nikola oozes style 09:36:14 awesome 09:49:42 -!- Twinge- has joined ##crawl-dev 09:52:35 03j-p-e-g * r20ae8d6639e9 10/crawl-ref/docs/changelog.txt: Remove demonspawn overhaul from the change log. 09:53:04 -!- Twinge has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 09:58:03 -!- bmh has quit [Quit: bmh] 09:59:01 -!- Twinge has joined ##crawl-dev 09:59:04 -!- Xardas-3 has joined ##crawl-dev 10:02:16 -!- Twinge- has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 10:09:33 !tell permagreen no sushi pizza :'( 10:09:34 ixtli: OK, I'll let permagreen know. 10:24:32 03j-p-e-g * r08171f070a66 10/crawl-ref/docs/changelog.txt: Fix typo in the change log. 10:50:02 is there a good reason for poisoned ammunition to be pre-identified? 10:50:10 or just tradition? 10:50:27 03pointless_ * rb821ea7bd520 10/crawl-ref/source/hiscores.cc: Don't crash if dying to a beam whose thrower is already dead 10:53:12 -!- Spads has joined ##crawl-dev 11:00:44 Enne: made a wrapper for SDL_image called GraphicsContext, and factored SDL out of tiletex 11:01:31 ixtli: Sounds great. :) 11:01:31 Enne: You have 2 messages. Use !messages to read them. 11:01:36 !messages 11:01:36 (1/2) ixtli said (10h 57m 52s ago): Yeah, I'm going to have to. Then you can do DirectX :D Also, thanks for checking it out. I've realized there's an issue with the union I defined, though. I'll probably have to add 'unsigned char padding' to the top of MouseEvent to fix it. :D 11:01:45 !messages 11:01:45 (1/1) ixtli said (9h 53m 5s ago): kbhit() in libgui.cc seems to return 1 only if there is exactly 1 kb event: return (count == 1 ? 1 : 0);. Why is this so specific? 11:02:26 -!- ortoslon has joined ##crawl-dev 11:03:10 is the devblog searchable? 11:03:10 ortoslon: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 11:03:15 !messages 11:03:15 (1/1) Napkin said (1d 4h 23m 14s ago): Hey, would you please re-enable http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acwbr8yrrc4&fmt=22 ? the {sigmund must die} entry of Henzell is liked to from the main-website. Would be cool, if your video would still be available somehow :) 11:04:59 Napkin: video's still there http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acWBr8YrrC4 looks like youtube changed its url format for forcing HD 11:05:27 nono, it didn't, ortoslon 11:06:00 It was a bug on my end 11:06:05 ixtli: re: libgui, I think it was just sanity checking? It only asks for one event from peep events, so if you get anything but one or zero, something went wrong? Maybe that should just be an assert. 11:06:22 parsing learndb entries caused everything to be lower-case :-$ 11:06:30 ahaha 11:06:33 :) 11:06:41 and yes, devblog is searchable 11:06:50 Enne: That's cool, I just needed to know because i'm getting the feeling that if i make a subtle change here or there the effects wont be visible for .. a while :/ 11:07:02 when was stunning with clubs introduced? 11:07:03 whole site will be, just let me finish and i'll add that feature again ;) 11:07:18 ok 11:07:26 *finish with porting the old news from SF 11:10:21 -!- TGW has joined ##crawl-dev 11:18:59 http://crawl.develz.org/wiki/doku.php?id=dcss:feedback:magic:spell:blade_hands 11:19:06 I like how b0rsuk doesn't know what level BH is 11:26:51 SA not happy about the DS revert 11:29:45 -!- MarvinPA has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 11:37:59 Syll: Oh well. Can't please them all, right? 11:41:11 Well, they seem confused about what actually happened 11:41:22 It was only backed out in 0.6 branch, not in master 11:41:45 The message on SA seems to be "DS change scrapped, possibly redone in 0.7" 11:41:55 yes :P 11:46:50 Maybe we should flag down trunctu or someone else with an account to clear it up a bit then? :P 11:47:25 I already did 11:47:32 K 11:48:22 Wrong message order when monster appears (http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=961) by qui 11:49:15 Yay, "comes into view" bugs 11:51:34 you can enslave mara clones with control demons :P 11:51:51 Is that as awesome as it sounds? :D 11:52:01 in 0.6 at least 11:52:12 How useful are the clones :P 11:52:17 not very 11:52:20 not as awesome as enslaving Asmodeus in 0.1 :P 11:52:21 except against mara I guess :P 11:52:33 Someone "fixed" berserk ghost hp, didn't they 11:52:42 That prboably affects Mara illusions as well, grr 11:57:15 someone trying to argue DS was reverted in trunk as well :P 11:58:32 he is probably reading http://crawl.develz.org/trunk/changes-0.6.txt 11:58:53 Want to enlighten them? :) 11:59:05 The raw changelog is always going to be confusing :P 11:59:24 Tell them DS will be completely removed in 0.7 :P 11:59:55 tempting :P 11:59:59 "nerfed" 12:00:19 ds mutations were overpowered so the easiest solution was to axe the race 12:00:37 Haha 12:01:19 Wow, there's a lot of places in the code where things can appear out of thin air; trivial bugs like that are never super-trivial to fix are they? :/ 12:03:26 Show rune number in highscores (http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=962) by qui 12:04:06 "comes into view" is not a trivial bug :P 12:04:18 Well, in terms of severity yes :P 12:04:36 Fixing it is extremely non-trivial :P 12:04:43 There's been some variant of it since b26 and before 12:05:01 -!- Xardas-3 has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.0.17/2010021501]] 12:05:09 But I think it's closer to fixable now since by's changes to message handling 12:05:27 Not flushing messages immediately was an important first step 12:05:41 Now all we need is to associate actors that produced each message with the message :) 12:10:13 Will not be noting that one as one I'm planning on making a patch for, at any rate ;) 12:20:55 -!- Xardas-3 has joined ##crawl-dev 12:22:05 03Enne * r74e6c3340636 10/crawl-ref/ (7 files in 3 dirs): [653] Redraw screen less when resting in tiles. 12:22:15 * Enne pokes Napkin. 12:22:34 Alright! 12:22:35 :D 12:22:48 * Napkin pokes doy. 12:22:49 :> 12:29:58 What's all the poking 12:30:18 * Enne pokes greensnark. 12:30:20 :) 12:30:34 :) 12:33:58 03Enne * r97bdc6f6f596 10/crawl-ref/ (4 files in 2 dirs): Rename tile_runrest_redraw to tile_runrest_rate. 12:37:37 -!- DrPraetorious has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 12:38:06 03Enne * r6e482f8a0866 10/crawl-ref/settings/tiles_options.txt: Revert accidental settings commit. 12:38:07 * Enne blushes. 12:38:14 I need more coffee. 12:39:40 03due 07stone_soup-0.6 * r404e5186fb51 10/crawl-ref/source/misc.cc: Milestones for Labyrinths. 12:39:41 03j-p-e-g 07stone_soup-0.6 * r022dc60a4ab1 10/crawl-ref/docs/changelog.txt: Remove demonspawn overhaul from the change log. 12:39:43 03j-p-e-g 07stone_soup-0.6 * rdb8c1513ec7b 10/crawl-ref/docs/changelog.txt: Fix typo in the change log. 12:39:44 03pointless_ 07stone_soup-0.6 * r42c4ffd24122 10/crawl-ref/source/hiscores.cc: Don't crash if dying to a beam whose thrower is already dead 12:39:46 03Enne 07stone_soup-0.6 * rf8ff305c72c7 10/crawl-ref/ (4 files in 2 dirs): Rename tile_runrest_redraw to tile_runrest_rate. 12:39:47 03Enne 07stone_soup-0.6 * re643c9ec1ec5 10/crawl-ref/ (7 files in 3 dirs): [653] Redraw screen less when resting in tiles. 12:39:48 03Enne 07stone_soup-0.6 * r716925a64b92 10/crawl-ref/settings/tiles_options.txt: Revert accidental settings commit. 12:42:15 !coffee Enne 12:42:17 * Henzell hands Enne a cup of irish coffee, brewed by Ijyb. 12:42:26 Heh. :) 12:46:09 "Coffee is mine! All mine!" 12:46:18 Master branch on CDO updated to: 0.6.0-a2-448-g716925a (16.6) 12:46:54 \o/ 12:49:03 Keskitalo? Are you in? 12:49:24 Enne? You wouldn't happen to be interested in helping with the Wordpress - would you? :) 12:50:17 Napkin: Is there anything in particular you'd want me to write about? 12:51:52 well, the immediate short-comings currently are the "Downloads", the "How to play Online" and the (not yet existing) "Screenshots" Pages 12:52:46 We do certainly need more screenshots. :) 12:52:56 But of course, there is always needs for nice articles about.. development, games, tiles, everything! :) 12:53:37 Johanna has already uploaded a bunch of screenshots - they just need to be reviewed and organized in a nice way :) 12:53:50 and of course, the more the merrier ;) 12:54:57 It would be my pleasure to create a wordpress account if you would like to look around, Enne 12:55:01 Sure. :) 12:55:21 I can't promise I'll have time to do anything with it, but I can take a look around. 12:56:13 cool :) 12:56:16 -!- TGW has left ##crawl-dev 13:00:04 -!- Xardas-3_ has joined ##crawl-dev 13:01:39 -!- Xardas-3 has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:01:46 -!- Xardas-3_ is now known as Xardas-3 13:04:12 -!- Xardas-3 has quit [Client Quit] 13:15:58 -!- Eronarn has joined ##crawl-dev 13:25:11 -!- Zaba has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 13:29:06 -!- Zaba has joined ##crawl-dev 13:32:42 -!- ogaz has joined ##crawl-dev 13:33:51 Altar repeated in the same level (http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=963) by reaven 13:43:53 message for self-electrocution outside LOS (http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=964) by rob 13:47:13 I'm noticing foes go into wandering mode really easily lately. Such as when an ogre is a few spaces away and I duck around a corner, it will come around wandering or not come around at all 13:49:42 -!- ortoslon has left ##crawl-dev 13:50:40 I haven't noticed that, though some buggy behaviour caused that to happen some months ago 13:51:09 greensnark: How broken is righteously 13:56:18 -!- DrPraetor has joined ##crawl-dev 14:08:28 -!- Cryp71c has joined ##crawl-dev 14:20:47 -!- Cryp71c has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 14:32:12 Is the button "Bugs & Requests" in a single line for everybody? http://crawl.develz.org/wordpress 14:33:30 yes 14:34:27 ye 14:44:23 yes 14:44:27 -!- Textmode has joined ##crawl-dev 14:44:45 meow 14:44:45 kilobyte: You have 1 message. Use !messages to read it. 14:45:13 kilobyte! 14:45:28 thanks for testing, guys :) 14:46:44 morning all 14:47:16 Moin Textmode :) 14:49:34 Xb#n 14:50:02 woops 14:50:13 I disagree, bhaak 14:51:05 Napkin: just generally, or was my argument just to condensed for you :) 14:51:21 hehe 14:51:31 always both ;) 15:14:00 -!- purge has joined ##crawl-dev 15:15:51 -!- Enne has quit [Quit: Enne] 15:17:50 -!- Xardas-3 has joined ##crawl-dev 15:29:10 -!- MarvinPA has joined ##crawl-dev 15:44:18 03j-p-e-g * r433a4fa2a3d3 10/crawl-ref/source/ (dat/lua/autofight.lua l_travel.cc): In autofight.lua, check for traversable features. 15:44:22 03j-p-e-g * ra4138c893d44 10/crawl-ref/source/ (dat/lua/autofight.lua l_moninf.cc): Use mons_is_safe check for autofight.lua. 15:54:28 Strange wooden shield tiles shown for walls when magic mapping (http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=965) by LoginError 16:05:28 -!- Xardas-3 has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.0.17/2010021501]] 16:05:58 -!- raydarken has joined ##crawl-dev 16:17:11 -!- permagreen has joined ##crawl-dev 16:25:15 -!- [1]GrimmSweeper has joined ##crawl-dev 16:25:16 -!- GrimmSweeper has quit [Disconnected by services] 16:25:17 -!- [1]GrimmSweeper is now known as GrimmSweeper 16:25:38 -!- DrPraetor has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 16:39:40 -!- TGW has joined ##crawl-dev 16:45:10 morning 16:45:15 Moin Due! 16:45:28 hi due 16:45:59 hello 16:46:39 duey 16:50:41 -!- TGW has left ##crawl-dev 16:55:02 -!- st_ has quit [] 17:01:06 i wonder if a more general "simple/advanced" toggle for the interface might be a decent idea 17:04:22 03pointless_ * r6e22aa597e80 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-speak.cc: Fix an unsafe dereference in mons_speaks 17:05:12 doy: yes, but I agree with dpeg now. 17:05:27 due: dpeg was arguing in favor of a toggle 17:05:41 doy: yes, me to 17:05:56 doy: I used my crystal ball and foresaw the discussion was going to turn into a bikeshed painting argument. 17:05:59 I could be wrong. 17:06:02 (: 17:06:11 feel free to read scrollback, it got pretty heated in here 17:06:12 (: 17:06:21 Yes, I got a bit rarghy with dpeg earlier. 17:06:38 !tell dpeg For what it's worth, I'm in complete agreement with you now over inventory weights, now that I've slept on it. 17:06:39 due: OK, I'll let dpeg know. 17:07:09 Okay, back in a bit. 17:07:20 i'm not in complete agreement, but i think that as we get more improvements to how the interface works, we'll arrive on something that's acceptable to both of us 17:07:23 so i'm not worried 17:22:45 nessos does not use ranged attacks currently 17:22:52 if he did, i think hes OP :| 17:22:57 he already beats ass in melee 17:23:09 he rarely does, he just seems to blink everywhere instead 17:23:10 ? 17:24:21 huh 17:26:08 -!- permagreen has quit [Quit: Welcome to the real world] 17:26:29 that should probably be fixed 17:27:00 poisoned flame arrows are like his signature attack 17:28:19 !lg killer=nessos 17:28:20 1. bookofjude the Thaumaturge (L11 SpFE), worshipper of Vehumet, shot by Nessos (bolt of poison flame) on D:12 on 2009-12-29, with 10202 points after 24850 turns and 1:01:51. 17:28:28 poisoned poison arrows of flaming flame! 17:28:28 !lg * killer=nessos 17:28:29 13. ajhager the Marksdemonspawn (L14 DSHu), worshipper of Fedhas, mangled by Nessos on D:16 on 2010-02-07, with 51554 points after 27492 turns and 3:14:51. 17:28:34 !lg * killer=nessos s=kaux 17:28:34 13 games for * (killer=nessos): 8x Shot with a bolt of poison flame by Nessos, 3x , 1x a -1,+0 orcish club, 1x wand of disintegration {zapped: 6} 17:28:43 He should get no wand, I think. 17:28:47 Isn''t he M_ARCHER? 17:29:54 Adjust elemental monsters' glyph colors (http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=966) by OG17 17:31:41 !lg * killer=nessos -2 17:31:42 12. wasp the Nimble (L8 SpBe), worshipper of Trog, slain by Nessos on D:12 on 2010-02-04, with 1057 points after 2227 turns and 0:27:46. 17:31:44 !lg * killer=nessos -3 17:31:45 11. Solvent the Conjurer (L12 KoAE), worshipper of Sif Muna, slain by Nessos on D:15 on 2010-02-03, with 17094 points after 21757 turns and 1:20:08. 17:31:47 !lg * killer=nessos -4 17:31:48 10. quincunx the Bewitcher (L13 SpEn), worshipper of Sif Muna, shot by Nessos (bolt of poison flame) on Snake:1 on 2010-01-25, with 37297 points after 22040 turns and 2:11:53. 17:32:04 -!- DrPraetor has joined ##crawl-dev 17:32:14 so what happened between 1/25 and 2/5 17:32:31 -!- st_ has joined ##crawl-dev 17:32:35 i can't get nessos to shoot at all in wizmode 17:32:45 Hm 17:33:13 -!- TGW has joined ##crawl-dev 17:33:33 portal projectile interface is sort of ehh 17:33:34 he doesn't even wield the bow 17:34:29 zpi* space v northeast north north . is ten strokes, for example 17:34:55 Extra selection cursor appears stuck to tile (http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=967) by LoginError 17:35:31 -!- scarf has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:40:37 doy: check the changes to mon-gear and ammunition? 17:40:44 ? 17:40:49 doy: he might not be pre-wielding his bow. 17:41:03 shouldn't he wield the bow anyway? 17:41:55 I'm not sure. 17:41:58 are centaurs? 17:42:13 centaurs switch between weapons based on your range 17:42:51 hm, so there's a piece of code missing somewher. 17:46:51 -!- by_ has joined ##crawl-dev 17:46:52 -!- by has quit [Disconnected by services] 17:47:48 -!- by_ is now known as by 17:49:59 Azrael has no flame trail (http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=968) by OG17 17:51:25 Huh. 17:51:27 He used to. 17:53:10 * due fixes. 17:55:02 -!- Vandal|Gone has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 17:57:27 03due * r198deb0eb0af 10/crawl-ref/source/ (mon-act.cc mon-util.cc): Give efreeti flame trails. (#968). 18:00:07 heh 18:00:28 wizmode teleport lets you teleport on top of a monster 18:03:56 does it lead to a telesplat or something? 18:04:08 oops, compile error of 0.6 in Linux? 18:04:16 make TILES=yes wizard 18:04:18 nope, just leads to it being not really clear what's going on 18:04:30 -- 18:04:31 tilepick.cc: In function ‘int tileidx_monster_base(const monsters*, bool)’: 18:04:34 tilepick.cc:389: error: ‘TILEP_MONS_BABY_ALLIGATOR’ was not declared in this scope 18:04:37 tilepick.cc:391: error: ‘TILEP_MONS_ALLIGATOR’ was not declared in this scope 18:04:40 tilepick.cc: In function ‘int tileidx_monster(const monsters*, bool)’: 18:04:43 tilepick.cc:1180: error: ‘TILEP_MONS_STATUE_GUARDIAN’ was not declared in this scope 18:04:46 -- 18:04:57 ogaz: we handle monsters sharing a tile with the player for air elementals already, so it doesn't actually mess things up 18:05:19 that error didn't show up, when you cross-build the windows binaries, doy? :-O 18:05:23 Napkin: nope 18:05:44 Eifeltrampel is building it on his debian.. 18:05:49 didn't realize that players and air elementals can share a tile with players 18:06:10 @??skeletal warrior 18:06:10 skeletal warrior (10z) | Speed: 10 | HD: 10 | Health: 50-80 | AC/EV: 15/10 | Damage: 25 | Flags: 07undead, evil | Res: 06magic(93), 02cold, 03poison | XP: 814 | Sp: animate dead. 18:07:36 "It seems like the anti-scumming business is a massive kick in the balls to new players, who won't know that a giant lizard will buttrape you, but a giant newt is free food" 18:08:55 hence the giant lizard -> crocodile rename! 18:09:01 -!- Twinge has quit [] 18:10:05 nessos doesn't use his bow (http://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=969) by doy 18:11:01 monsters getting tougher the longer you stay on a level is ... not exactly unusual 18:11:07 -!- Eifeltrampel has joined ##crawl-dev 18:11:13 nethack, adom, rogue and powder do it 18:11:18 Hi! Hoi! Bonjour! Hola! Alô! Hallå! Helas! Mahlzeit! 18:11:53 @?? aizul 18:11:53 Aizul (13N) | Speed: 15 | HD: 14 | Health: 142 | AC/EV: 8/18 | Damage: 25 | Flags: spellcaster, see invisible | Res: 06magic(112), 03poison | Chunks: 06mutagenic | XP: 2602 | Sp: b.venom, sleep, poison arrow, blink other. 18:12:22 नमस्ते! 18:17:19 Napkin: compiles normally here 18:17:39 told him to do one try again after a distclean 18:17:44 no other idea 18:18:28 -!- TGW has left ##crawl-dev 18:19:46 Ok, compiled without any errors after distclean 18:19:55 oh, hey Eifeltrampel :D 18:19:59 great :) 18:20:18 probably didn't recreate a certain file 18:20:50 btw wohoooo! 18:21:03 ;) 18:33:18 -!- by has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 18:49:00 @?? jozef 18:49:00 Jozef (13@) | Speed: 10 | HD: 11 | Health: 90 | AC/EV: 0/9 | Damage: 18 | Flags: spellcaster | Res: 06magic(73) | Chunks: 07contaminated | XP: 1666 | Sp: teleport other, minor healing, b.venom, slow. 19:00:55 @?? louise 19:00:55 Louise (02@) | Speed: 10 | HD: 13 | Health: 106 | AC/EV: 0/10 | Damage: 17 | Flags: spellcaster | Res: 06magic(86) | Chunks: 07contaminated | XP: 2251 | Sp: stone arrow, sting, blink, b.lightning, banishment, minor healing. 19:05:24 03j-p-e-g * r2ea9d2e9c2da 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-util.cc: Fix #969: Nessos not firing his bow. 19:05:42 -!- Cryp71c has joined ##crawl-dev 19:28:05 -!- timecircuits has joined ##crawl-dev 19:33:04 -!- syllogism has quit [] 19:58:11 03due * r8a4ce5da4fc4 10/crawl-ref/source/ (cmd-keys.h command.cc): Change portal debug command to x-" (jpeg). 19:58:12 03due * r27048d13d17f 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/clua/lm_trove.lua: Test suite for debugging Trove portal vaults. 20:18:09 -!- Cryp71c has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:01:17 -!- Eifeltrampel has left ##crawl-dev 21:25:59 Dungeon sprint? 21:26:57 -!- Enne has joined ##crawl-dev 21:27:10 heya enne 21:27:24 Hey, due. :) 21:27:50 Once again I am restructuring lm_trove.lua. Bah. 21:28:20 -!- purge has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 21:28:37 What's wrong with it? 21:29:02 Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. Haven't worked out what yet. 21:29:22 Is there any way for me to directly modify a property of a marker via C++ or the ingame Lua interpreter? 21:29:56 I suppose I could hack something in with a global varible and ". 21:30:18 Or just what's on the ground, excellent idea. 21:33:09 ...AAAAAA. 21:33:29 BBBBBBBBBBBBBB... 21:33:33 Oh wait, wrong channel. 21:33:45 I added another one, now all my tabs are messed up. 21:34:23 Enne: You fixed up tileslag! 21:34:26 YAY! 21:34:30 Apparently so. :) 21:34:50 -!- purge has joined ##crawl-dev 21:34:55 What do we think about green/brown for earth elementals? 21:35:01 The current brown/lightred is disgusting. 21:35:18 let's make them brown # for maximum confusion 21:37:01 Er, no. 21:56:52 -!- Enne has quit [Quit: zzz] 22:04:33 -!- Mu_ has quit [Quit: Defecator, may everything turn out okay so that you can leave this place.] 22:08:48 -!- ogaz has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.5.8/20100202165920]] 22:16:54 03pointless_ * r71131cef3554 10/crawl-ref/source/mon-info.cc: Fix occasional crashes when updating mpane with zombies in view 22:27:19 'afternoon. 22:27:54 hi ixtli 22:28:15 hey 22:28:20 Hows it goin? 22:29:11 tiredly :) 22:34:29 lulz 22:34:46 brb messing with ethernetz 22:34:58 hi 22:35:18 hey :) 22:35:19 brb 22:35:27 -!- permagreen has joined ##crawl-dev 22:36:35 -!- ixtli has quit [Read error: No route to host] 22:37:08 -!- ixtli has joined ##crawl-dev 22:37:26 back 22:37:33 sorear: how goes it? 22:41:19 -!- Textmode has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:42:19 what 22:50:02 is there something i can add to the makefile to have it compile two files at once? 22:50:14 One of my processors is going completely unused :P 22:51:09 -j2 22:51:17 make debug -j2 = <3 22:52:39 oooh right 22:52:41 :D 22:52:45 thanks :D 22:52:58 Also, how do I turn off debug messages in wizard mode? 22:53:01 Im testing drawing code. 22:53:17 there's a mute: line you can use, I forget it 22:53:41 hmm ill just & ? 23:04:29 -!- Twinge has joined ##crawl-dev 23:05:16 doy: Hm, troves seem to be mostly working. 23:05:22 I just wish I could fin da way to see d the stash tracker. 23:07:09 03due * rf6f5a2ea24e5 10/crawl-ref/source/dat/ (clua/lm_trove.lua des/portals/trove.des): More test suites for sorting out issues with troves. 23:08:47 due: Seed the stash tracker? 23:09:32 My efforts to get dgl to run in a Mac chroot have been frustrated by dyld being a jerk :P 23:16:12 -!- raydarken has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:16:40 -!- ogaz has joined ##crawl-dev 23:19:21 \o/ 23:19:26 Napkin: Got dgl working at last :P 23:19:48 Apparently the chroot didn't have /dev/random and dyld was pining for the fjords without it 23:47:11 -!- TGW has joined ##crawl-dev 23:50:38 -!- ogaz has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:52:09 ixtli: generally speaking, it's recommended to use make -j(N+1) or -j(2*N) on a N core machine where N>1; that way you can have 2 busy CPUs and 1 busy hard drive 23:53:27 sorear: Cool. I'll do -j3 and see how it works. 23:54:46 sorear: I have an SSD, though, so ... i imagine it would be hard to peg it.